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#very aware of valid criticism of the show btw !!
guacamoleroll · 4 months
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bestieeee whe'res the fyodor death analysis
i'm sorry anon !! i've become very caught up in incredibly important business (totally not watching the season finale of hazbin hotel).
on a completely unrelated note, may i introduce you to the man who miraculously cured all my daddy issues:
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(bsd content will resume shorty! i've just been very distracted.)
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imaginative-123 · 5 months
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This might be my Last Post regarding Vivziepop
I'm just going to say this as a longtime fan since 2019 I was extremely disappointed, before all of this I started following her since 2019 and watched Hazbin Hotel and I thought it was good alongside Helluva Boss which I rewatched in the past of my Youtube Downloads bec the PLDT internet during the Coronavirus that started in 2020 was not great. I used to listen to her different music genres of her speedraws while I'm drawing and I also watch her speedraws and was amazed by the process on how her artworks was made. I even made a fanart about her for my college project
This is my fav Die Young music video that I made fanart for
Artwork I Made for Technicals in History of Graphics Subject in First Year College for my favorite artist and animator Vivziepop.
Although despite Vivziepop's success as an Indie animator and for running Spindlehorse, I cannot deny she's a very controversial person to any video or tweets about her is always related to her past controversies, while I do see that there are unfair accusations thrown against her I still wish she addressed her other controversial stuff that she didn't addressed whether she's aware of what she did or not and I'm not going to mention any names bec I do not want to be involve deeper in the drama bec I've seen there are other tumblr and twitter posts calling her out, not to mention the fanbase is divided with diehard fans, neutral fans, haters, stalkers and critical fans. Also the reason why I'm really dissapointed with her bec any controversy that is meant to call out her attention she blocks people on Twitter whether the person is criticizing her show and her actions and not to mention she started becoming unprofessional lately. I can understand if blocking is meant to avoid harassment, if that's the case, but when it comes to criticism she was acting unprofessional and not to mention not addressing in a professional manner can make people go unprofessional against the creator, if I'm being honest she needs a PR Manager or Assistant to guide her. At the end I'm disappointed, I expected better from her, being a longtime fan since 2019 deeply hurts me, for me this might be my last post including the tumblr fanart works I liked related to the show. I just hope she won't get the worst Cancellation that might make her leave the internet and cancel Hazbin Hotel and Helluva Boss and her other projects, bec that is the worst thing to happen and I wish she needs to step up her game and try to improve her behavior including the writing of her shows. Only time will tell until she realizes this, and I don't follow Viviziepop or Ayy Lmao anymore, and I'm all for valid criticisms for Vivziepop just as long as the people were not harassing her or sending death threats and also making false accusations against her and just because you may not like her as a person does not give it a free pass to make up false accusations and lies against her and is not acceptable, the fandom should do better. Until then, goodbye Hazbin Hotel and Helluva Boss fandom, I used to be a fan of the show but I cannot support Vivziepop anymore, and it's time for me to leave.
BTW the art that I made for college will not be removed despite my mixed feelings about Vivziepop it would be a shame for me to delete it with all the hardwork I made it. So it will not be deleted from my Deviantart and my tumblr post including my other Hazbin Hotel redesign edits and Beelzebub redesign edits in my Deviantart account if you guys also want to check out my work there.
If Charlie Morningstar the Princess of Hell will redeem sinners by making Hazbin Hotel a place to rehabilitate sinners and make them become better people, then I hope Vivienne Medrano who uses her creativity through her artworks and being an indie animator to inspire her fans and artists like me, but she needs to grow up and become a better person.
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the-badger-mole · 1 year
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There's A Difference
I think I've said this before- in fact, I'm almost certain I've said this within the last few months- but the reason I can't let Aang's actions be dismissed by his age is because his worst traits are never addressed in canon. The reason why I personally find him very incel-ish is because the grown men who created him and project onto him strike me as incel-ish (and yes, I'm aware that at least one of them is/has been married. Incel is more of a frame of mind than an actual state of being). Aang could have had a growth arc, but instead Bryke chose to either ignore his flaws or make them out to be virtues. I'm judging Aang as a character, not a child. Because Aang is not an actual child. An actual child might have been confronted on the things Aang did. Aang is a character whose creators want fans to think is perfect, even when they themselves introduce the idea he might not be (Aang's being a terrible father is not that surprising to me, but even then Bryke had to scramble to tell us he wasn't actually that bad 🙄)
I am a lot less harsh with Zuko because he actually faced the consequences of his poor decisions. He worked to make amends not only for himself, but for his family. I empathize with his losses and his personal tragedies because the narrative actually cared about how those things affected him in just about every episode, unlike Aang, whose devastating losses are only touched on when they're convenient to that episode's plot. Otherwise, he is the picture of unbothered to the point that I question if he even knew most of the time that he was in a war (the answer, it would turn out in the penultimate episode, was no, apparently not). There's not much I can criticize Zuko on that wasn't already touched on within the show. Why would I judge Book 3 Zuko based on Book 1 Zuko (who btw, I still think was a much better rounded character than Aang in any of the series)?
When it comes to Katara and the misogyny inherent in how she was treated in her canon ship? Well, I can only point to canon and aks to be proven wrong. Katara had very little to do with the development of Kataang during the series, and that little was usually prompted by someone or something outside of her own thoughts and feelings bringing the idea up. Meanwhile, we know from the beginning that Aang likes Katara (well, he likes how she looks anyway). His feelings matter to the narrative: Katara's not so much. Then the disastrous comics where Katara's character from the show is completely stripped from her and she ends up being the cheerleader girlfriend of the Avatar. I know some of that is walked back in the more recent comics, but we already know how it ends for Katara and her kids. Also, the post LoK scramble to give Katara more agency honestly just makes me think that my original assessment of her relationship with Aang was spot on.
Zutara, in my opinion, would have been a great relationship for them both. They would've been just about perfect together, because as hot tempered as they can both be, they also both get really good at communicating with each other, which is something that Katara never really has with Aang. That's why it doesn't surprise me to find out how dysfunctional their family is. Katara and Zuko know how to work together as a team. In a relatively short time, they got comfortable opening up to each other. They are both passionate to the point that they can be really hot-headed, but they are both also extremely empathetic and compassionate. They are a couple that would've helped each other grow, and would have been so much more interesting than anything that happened with their actual canon relationships.
I get that there are people who would rather believe that Aang could outgrow his selfishness. That's totally valid, and has made for some great stories. However, I don't think saying the way he was written in canon has shades of incel is wrong. Especially by Book 3. I could see that guy growing up to be a viciously obnoxious narcissist. I bet those of us who know an "Aang" IRL can picture that, too.
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literaphobe · 3 years
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dude so sorry about the weirdos :( i was super excited to see ur post-mcc takes and i hate to see people being ableist dicks for no reason hope ur doing ok !!
yeah honestly i just think most of them are so goddamn dumb n have no fucking reading comprehension and some of their attempts to ‘counter’ me are so bloody goddamn stupid that i am praying for themmmm i don’t wanna directly interact bc they’re dumb n they’ll probably cry about how they’re getting cyberbullied by anons (VERY ironic how some of them said i shouldn’t have posted a ‘bad take’ if i wasn’t ready to get ‘clowned’ like ok then don’t dogpile someone if ur weak ass doesn’t want anon ‘hate’? lmfao) but i remember one of them being like ‘ughhhhh 🙄 op ur so dumb if people are short in basketball that doesn’t mean we make the basketball hoop easier to reach!’ and that’s such a lousy comparison to make that completely LACKS compassion too like damn i’m sorry but when people have adhd or they’re colorblind schools that aren’t EVIL will be like oh i see! do you need extra time to complete assignments and exams? is there are anyway we can assist you on questions that have color identification involved?
and yes, mcc isn’t school but they are run by people with COMPASSION. and the willingness to make changes if they see how badly affected some of their players are? like, they’ve made changes to buildmart before, notably the subtitle that pops up n shows what the name of a block is when u go near to it! and that’s great! but some of you are acting like it’s laughable to want different/further changes upon review? its like giving someone a monocle and then laughing when they say ‘these help, but i think having something like prescription glasses can help even more’ and when people say shit like ‘god, x just affects a minority of the players. most of them are just fine’ DO YOU HEAR… YOURSELF
i don’t think i need to recontextualize that sentiment to show how devoid of awareness that is. who cares? who cares if the only issue w buildmart is how it disproportionately affects people with colorblindness and the only colorblind player was george? (he isn’t. btw. but he arguably has the worst case of colorblindness) or that buildmart disproportionately affects people w adhd n there was only one player who had it? scream and cry about how it’s not that deep all you want, i KNOW so many of the people who tried to mock me didn’t watch any of the povs i was talking about. like didn’t some of y’all cry about how parkour warrior supposedly gave someone a panic attack? if that’s valid criticism then (which i think it is! i do think that parkour warrior became flawed after all the difficulty reworks and if it was so upsetting to certain people then a rework of the game is needed) why isn’t any of this stuff valid now? and why is it so hard to believe that someone also had a similar reaction playing build mart?
and another thing. like i see ‘oh if it bothers you so much then don’t play mcc? every game gives u anxiety should they remove every game then?’ like look. i have anxiety and adhd. anxiety is Not neurodivergency. there is a big difference between an entire event being a huge trigger and giving you panic attacks at every potential turn and 1-2 games that you physically are unable to play like a neurotypical person because your brain structure prevents from doing things that could be CHANGED to help you and others like you. if someone just can’t handle the pressure of a competitive event like mcc and it makes them crack and suffer bouts of anxiety that is a Health issue. it is a health issue and if they want to step aside from something that hurts them in its Entirety, then that’s fine. but if someone can’t find sand blocks n cracked gold blocks bc they can’t detect the differentials in the shades of the colors n all that would need to be done was perhaps. changing the colors to be much more distinct or the textures of the blocks to be easier to identify without color then… why can’t people Want that. why can’t people ask for that
i understand! that people are being toxic and rude n overshadowing people’s victories n perhaps even shitting on the people that won on like, twitter or something. i get if you’re mad that people on dttwt are sending hate or something like that! but this isn’t twitter! i never once implied that mcc was a bad event or was being run by bad evil mean people who rig the whole thing. don’t take your grievances out on me! don’t interpret my posts in bad faith and then cower and cry wolf when u find out people who see sense are willing to stand up for me! and if u wanted to see if i was complaining about the winners of this mcc like some people were after the last few mccs as well then you could’ve scrolled down my blog and looked at my other posts instead of having weird preconceived notions about what i am or what i stand for. its possible to feel happy for others’ success while still wanting changes to be made to certain games. like. survival games gave mcc15 red rabbits the win. but i still think that the point system needed to be reworked after that bc it gave too many coins. u can be happy and still think things can change/improve to be more fair/make the event better. which is what noxcrew DOES. they want to make changes not because they think they’ll get hate if they don’t but because they care about their event being good and they have integrity about it and that’s why they take feedback on this stuff all the time. ultimately, the decisions they make as event organizers and minecraft developers are theirs, but it doesn’t mean people can’t speak their minds
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carpisuns · 3 years
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thinking abt the lukanette resolution in crocoduel because it allowed for marinette to learn how to address tension and resolve it and talk abt feelings better which are skills she’ll need for the ladynoir conflict when it hits
yes i thought the same! since we all knew that lukanette was not going to be endgame, i feel like its main purpose is to highlight or foreshadow important aspects of the love square. Truth showed us how difficult it is for marinette to maintain a relationship while being a superhero, and throughout the development of lukanette we've seen how her feelings for adrien have hindered her from moving on from him. and now crocoduel has put a spotlight on how marinette's tendency to avoid difficult conversations can end up hurting people she cares about. (this is not intended to be critical of marinette btw—i too would probably go out of my way to avoid an ex; that's very valid lol.)
that's a direct parallel for what's currently going on in ladynoir, with marinette avoiding talking to chat about potentially awkward/painful subjects like her identity reveal, rena's new role on the team, chat blanc, etc. And that is hurting adrien. he's already been more hurt than she's aware of. crocoduel is several episodes behind optigami and rocketear, but it serves as a model/type for the brewing ladynoir conflict. marinette learned in this episode that ignoring problems won't make them go away and that when you're brave enough to talk it out, good things can come of it. so we'll see if she ends up taking the initiative to apply that lesson and speak to chat noir about things or if she'll continue to let it build until an inevitable blow-up. (again, not salting on her at all! just observing.)
and on the adrienette side of the square, luka himself pointed out how it was similar to juleka's situation in crocoduel, telling marinette that she should speak up and be heard (confess to adrien). so we'll see if that goes anywhere too 👀 overall crocoduel was a great and i think it's hinting at a lot of things that could happen in upcoming episodes!
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kitkatopinions · 2 years
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I wanna become a RWDE blog, but I'm worried that if I do I could start getting harassment. I am aware of this happening in the RWBY fAndom and I want to avoid it.
This is a very valid concern, especially since I heard that you got some hate on a recent RWBY post. That always sucks. And btw, what you said in that post was completely accurate. XD
I can give some advice as a RWDE blog, because when I first started out, I used to get so much hate and RWBY megafans were constantly bothering me in the comments of my posts. It was tiring and sometimes really stressful dealing with them, but I've managed to get to a point where I don't see much from RWBY fans.
The block button is obviously the best tool for avoiding toxic RWBY fans. You shouldn't feel obligated to respond to everyone (or anyone,) or to only block when someone 'earns' it. But this is often a painstaking process of getting attacked, harassed, or bothered in order for people to know who to block. If you'd like, I can try to comb through my blocklist, and make up a list of the people I can remember are bad news and maybe should be blocked pre-emptively. Also, you can block hate anons now, and much of the time, there's one harasser sending multiple anons, so the ability to block them is very handy.
Another thing is that tagging extensively is always better than not tagging a lot. To avoid harassment, I would avoid using any character tag and the main RWBY tag, and instead use not only RWDE, but also RWBY hate, RWBY criticism, anti RWBY, so on and so forth.
A way that some people avoid toxic RWBY fans is to do things like spell RWBY as RVVBY or RW/BY. Because of Tumblr's bad system, people might see posts that have keywords like 'RWBY' when they look it up, even if it isn't tagged with RWBY at all. So this is just a way that people try to get around that.
But, if you don't want to deal with any of that, that's more than understandable. Toxic RWBY fans can get to be a lot, and even when you think you've blocked all of them, more will pop up. Some of them are ridiculously persistent, I literally think one or two of them might be following me right now so they can make posts about my content on whatever anti-RWDE blogs they have. I've learned to kind of laugh it off, though sometimes I have to take breaks here and there and some hate gets to me. But the RWDEdom as a general whole is a great way to express how you feel towards the show, and I really enjoy posting here. Before I started posting, I felt super pent up, and even though I could rant to my sisters (who have a lot of problems with RWBY too,) I felt like I was annoying them or talking about it too much. This is a great outlet and a nice place to vent. If you do decide to start up a RWDE blog, let me know, and I'll give you a follow! :)
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weaselbeaselpants · 3 years
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Weird week behind me weird week ahead of me but I’ve done a lot of self reflection and came to the weirdest epiphany. The older I get the more I realize all my ‘problems’ with VivziePop - her thoughts on criticism;  the choices she makes in story telling; some of the people she’s worked with (not that any of that’s my business; I’m not her mom) really aren’t about Viv, but more about her fandom.
I’m speaking of the preHazbin era Viv here and as someone who’s only watch horny fish jump at the surface rather than jump straight into the Hazbin-fandom, but given my ‘noncritical’ fellow fans have told me that the Vivziefandom now is also terrible - I guess I’ll go over my experience and make the most out of what I do know.
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I followed Viv in 2009 and fell off in 2013 cause I kinda just lost interest and found myself wrapped up in other fandoms. I’ve always felt amicable about her content; I could give or take designs or the way in which she wrote characters -- ((Zech represent!!!)) but it’s honestly surreal and really fun seeing this person I recognize make it big and improve so much. Like I’ve said before I am very happy and very impressed with Viv doing all she’s done in the span of TWO YEARS. wow gurl.
Trouble is, there was the particular breed of fan who really made me...uncomfortable. They felt almost possessive of Viv’s attention. They sang praises about her work in a way that just made me want nothing to do with it because I was worried if I drew those characters these people would be like ‘hey, I’M Viv’s fav artist, not you!”. They would  unironically write Viv messages like:
“you are a GOD” -- “I’m so not worthy compared to you” --“I wish I was as talented as you” -- “YOU ARE EVERYTHING AND CAN’T DO WRONG VIV”.
The kind of messages which were meant to sound flattering but, intentional or not, came off as gaslighting, like they were guilt tripping Viv about being better than them. This behavior, treating your favorite artist/internet personality like your superior and groveling like Starscream, it strikes a nerve with me; partly because I was this way with my favorite artists and influences back in the day,  but also because once I got a taste of that treatment myself I realized just how bad it could be:
There was once a girl on dA who was jealous of me because of the attention I got on my art instead of her. I told her that I wasn’t gonna stop drawing but also that there was nothing wrong with her art and she’d find her place. It was weird being put in that position where someone is very clearly upset at you but also looking for your approval.
The second was some scumball who I blocked in 2016. He wouldn’t speak to me, only write condescending, backhanded comments on my art; check on my profile daily; call me a bootlicker (cuz I took commissions) behind my back; redrew my art and would talk about me in his personal artist notes about how I ‘probably wouldn’t see this’ - oh yeah all the while he did fan art of my characters but again never spoke to me when I replied. When I finally messaged him about his behavior he said he thought I was “really overrated” and “bad for the fandom” cuz I took money and kept him from getting the love he deserved. It took messaging another person within our fandom, one I had been in spats with online before, to finally realize I shouldn't put up with that bs....
That guy who was stalking me btw did so while I was well under 1.K watchers and am still pretty obscure. Anyway, I had one guy unhealthily watching me for the wrong reasons. Just one. This is why when Viv says she “hates creeps” I 150% believe this woman and am not about to call her a liar who just can’t take criticism. Like, if you really think that, I’m sorry but you don’t know what Viv’s gone through from both her critics AND fans.
Of course, a lot of people will be like “I bet you’re just jealous and really just want that kind of attention yourself so you’re preaching to the choir”, but like...no. I am envious of just about any creator who’s the social butterfly I’m not, but, like, if I'm jealous of an artist none of that is that artists’ fault. Ever. It’s my own issues with being comfortable with myself are at stake. If I criticize Viv’s work it’s not because I see her as competition or my Squilliam Fancyson; it’s because I’m a critical fan of animation and cartoons and have my own thoughts to share on the cartoons of an artist I’m familiar with.  Jealousy/envy/mixed-admiration/godIwishthatwereme.jpeg feels are totally natural and valid emotions when you’re a creator. Envy becomes a problem when you internalize, weaponize, and scrutinize people on the basis of them being what you aren’t which -yes - some people do in the name of criticism. ((Although, I would hardly say some of the nastiest AntiViv folk are jealous as much as they are angry that this project they think is harmful is getting attention and using that as justification for some really shitty behavior of their own, which no, this post is not a part of by virtue of coming from a critical fan.))
Critique can come from either a good place or bad place; good critique can be used to bad ends and bad critique can come from a well-meaning place, and vice versa.   It’s the difference between many a criticalfan having a sour taste in their mouth regarding the Viv’s base but persisting in a critique+admiration separate of that, and this asswipemonster trying to weasel his way into Spindlehorse while also bashing Viv on a public forum for clearly vitriolic reasons. He was a creep.
So yeah um please stop insisting that every Hazbin critic is just jealous’ because a) there are people who have a past with Viv’s base and that clouds their judgement, but in a lot of cases that doesn’t invalidate their feelings or thoughts on her work separate from that, and b) I’ve seen what clingy gaslighting jealous fans are. Spoiler: they’re not so much Annie Wilkes as much as they are Tommy Wiseaus. You don’t want Tommy Wiseau following you.
Another bad vibe I really picked up on that I can kinda confirm is still probably the case now: people think that they know Viv and the Spindlehorse crew and have the right to send them shit they don’t need or WANT to be seeing.
Like, I talked with Viv once ages ago. I don’t remember what I said other than we were talking about Frankenweenie, I think. She was nice. Outside of that she said “thank you” to my comments on her deviations but that’s it. I DO NOT KNOW THIS WOMAN AND unless you’ve worked with or are a legit friend/mutual of hers, NEITHER DO YOU. But I don’t think every Vivzie stan/critic knows this. Whether it be people assuming she MUST think they’re headcanon is now canon-canon cuz she liked a comment they made; or some critic thinking they must have seriously hurt her pride because they’ve been blocked by her on twitter (or you know, maybe she and the rest of Spindlehorse is tired of getting @s and don’t have to time to read through your analysis so they’re gonna just block and move on cuz they’re busy).
Just because the creators talk with fans doesn’t mean fans are literally their best friends and have a part in the show’s direction. And yes, critics and reviewers fit that bill as well. Know your damn boundaries people.
If you find/make some kind of contribution as a viewer that’s awesome but you should never expect nor DEMAND the creator see it. The most obvious horror stories involving this and Helluva/Hazbin have been the Instagrams made by the crew being harassed by incestpedo enthusiasts, but it applies even to just @ing creators as well.
I’ve seriously had someone tell me to just take my criticisms directly to Viv and like...no. Why would I do that?
I respect Viv and the artists working with her enough to know that they’re working their asses off on an animated series and should not be bothered. I don’t want them to stop all they’re doing and reply to me. I want them to keep working. Also, that kind of logic makes me wonder how many critics Viv’s found because she found it on her own or if some obsessed fan told her about it - which is really messed up cuz if it IS just good critique you’re, again, just pestering her, and if it wasn’t critique but full on harassment WHY THE FUCK WOULD YOU MESSAGE HER ABOUT THAT ANYWAY? I’m sure she doesn’t need to be reminded that people drew and said really awful shit about her on Tapatalk. My point being I’m sure what people think they’re doing is
“OOOoh Viv lookitwut this person is doing in our fandom we need to ban together against this toxic behavior”
but what they’re actually doing, and sounding like, is -
“Hey Viv I know you are working so hard on the show and you’re trying to figure out where to go from here but LOOKITWHUTTHISHATERSAID. LOOKATIT! VALIDATE ME VIV AND PUT’EM IN THEIR PLAAAAAACE!”
TL;DR Viv’s fanbase back in the day consisted of everyman artists and interests but there was this one breed of fan -who I hope was just a vocal minority- that ruined it for everything else.
Call it stanning or ‘simping’ or as it’s classically known, ‘white knighting’, whatever it was it really soured a lot of people on her because of those fans.
That’s why the DollCreep drama got so bad from what I can tell. Doll and Viv had a falling out and then called out eachother online where people who took it upon themselves to speak for them starting throwing mud.
Back in the day I remember Viv used to get mad at artists for ‘stealing’ her style. I think this attitude from Viv directly has vanished but I remember it happening because one of the people she thought was stealing her style did art for me at some point and they were basically shamed/chased off deviantART by a gaggle of these really nasty Vivfans.
inb4> “VIV WAS AWARE AND STILL WEAPONIZES HER FANS THO”
I don’t know that. And honestly, where I’m inclined to believe she’d do something like that then I think Viv is really different and has improved her business and public image from her college days. I’d be very disappointed in her if she was pulling a Butch Hartman or Derek Savage, but I just don’t think she is one, k?
Viv is more self critical and aware than any of these uber protective-gatekeeping fans give her credit for. She said on the Pizzapartypodcast that she knows the Hazbin pilot wasn’t perfect; she’s been able to identify the problems with old Zoophobia; this woman knows that criticism of all kinds need to exist and from what I see she sounds like she’s trying to get used to that. It’s just, you know, when you have nasty antis badgering you, stalkers, obsessive yes-mam’ fans, opinionated shit posters, r34 artists, entitled shippers and the NDAs of a company alongside your own branded image - all that negativity, even the constructive bits, tend to clump together and you just want to scream at it so you can finish the damn cartoon already!!!!
TL;DR: PART TWO
VivziePop/mind is basically indie Tim Burton.  Her work is fun, shallow and made with love but is marketed as being for everyone when it’s really not. Parts of it I love to watch; parts of it drives me crazy cuz of reasonswhatev this isn’t a review.
BUT any fanbase where people tell me I should just “expect what’s coming to me” when I’m trying to argue against dragging creators into fandrama is troubling. People have a parasocial bond with fandoms and their creators and they need to learn when to back off.
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warrioreowynofrohan · 4 years
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Lord of the Rings Character Thoughts - Gimli
Taking a closer look at Gimli’s characterization and character arc between Rivendell and Lothlórien, what stands out is how strongly it is defined by defensiveness. Gimli’s aware that elves - certainly the wood-elves, who live nearest to Erebor - mistrust dwarves. He is completely unwilling for his people to be seen as less trustworthy, moral, admirable, or knowledgeable than elves are. This comes up in all his arguements with elves, but there are signs of it even before his early exchanges of Legolas. Gimli, notably, is the one who debates with Elrond over oaths when the Company are setting off, whereas many people would be shy of openly arguing with an elven-lord who’s specifically renowned for his knowledge and wisdom.
Their first disagreement between Gimli and Legolas starts up when Gandalf mentions that in Eregion there was friendship between dwarves and elves.
“It was not the fault of the Dwarves that the friendship waned,” said Gimli.
“I have not heard it was the fault of the Elves,” said Legolas.
“I have heard both,” said Gandalf, “and I will not give judgement now. But I beg you two, Legolas and Gimli, at least to be friends and to help me. I need you both.”
(I find this first exchange quite ridiculous - as does Gandalf, clearly. They’re arguing about why their people aren’t friends! If you both recognize that’s an undesirable state of affairs, then just be friends! Which is basically what Gandalf says.)
The second exchange, outside Lothlórien, is similar in its dynamic, when Legolas is telling the story of Nimrodel:
“[The song of Nimrodel] is long and sad, for it tells how sorrow came upon Lothlórien, Lórien of the Blossom, when the Dwarves awakened evil in the mountains.”
“But the Dwarves did not make the evil,” said Gimli.
“I said not so; yet evil came,” answered Legolas sadly.
Both of these interactions are characterized by Gimli’s defensiveness - any time there’s something like even an implicit criticism of dwarven actions, he jumps in. This defensiveness shows up much more strongly in Lothlórien, when the elves insist he be blindfolded: “I will go forward free, or I will go back and seek my own land, where I am known to be true of word, though I perish alone in the wilderness.”
(Legolas, for his part, seems to be actively endeavouring to avoid an argument in both cases. In the first exchange, he says “I have not heard it was the fault of the Elves,” presenting it as a description of his own limited knowledge rather than a statement of fact. In the second one, he avoids arguing and switches to a neutral, non-dwarf-related statement when Gimli objects. I also noticed that it’s Legolas who drags Gimli away from Balin’s tomb in Moria, after the battle. He seems to be trying to heed Gandalf’s urging that the two of them be friends. This makes me think that Legolas does not have any personal animus against dwarves, or dislike of Gimli; what he does have are unthinking biases from growing up in a culture that’s hostile to them, and that’s what comes out under stress during the argument over blindfolds in Lothlórien. I do love the way Aragorn calls him on his racial generalizations, btw.)
Gimli’s defensiveness is the reason why Galadriel’s words are so transformative to both his attitude and to his friendship with Legolas. In the throne room of Caras Galadhon, Gimli is for the first time in a situation that is too overwhelming and intimidating for him to stand up for dwarves, even when he is offended:
“Alas!” said Celeborn. “We have long feared under Caradhras a terror slept. But had I known that the Dwarves had stirred up this evil in Moria again, I would have forbidden you to pass the nirthern borders, you and all that went with you. And if it were possible, one would say that Gandalf fell from wisdom into folly, going needlessly into the net of Moria.”
“He would be rash indeed that said that thing,” said Galadriel gravely. “Needless were none of the deeds of Gandalf in life. Those that followed him knew not his mind and cannot report his full purpose. But however it may be with the guide, the followers are blameness. Do not repent of ypur welcome to the Dwarf. If our folk had been exiled long and far from Lothlórien, who of the Galadhrim, even Celeborn the Wise, would pass nigh and would not wish to look upon their ancient home, though it had become an abode of dragons?
“Dark is the water of Kheled-zâram, and cold are the springs of Kibil-nâla, and fair were the many-pillared halls of Khazad-dûm in Elder Days before the fall of mighty kings beneath the stone.” She looked upon Gimli, who sat glowering and sad, and she smiled. And the Dwarf, hearing the names given in his own ancient tongue, looked up and met her eyes; and it seemed to him that he looked suddenly into the heart of an enemy and saw there love and understanding. Wonder came i to his face, and then he smiled in answer.
He rose clumsily and bowed in dwarf-fashion, saying: “Yet more fair is the living land of Lórien, and the Lady Galadriel is above all the jewels that lie beneath the earth!”
There are several things that stand out here. First, Gimli does not respond to Celeborn’s remark about the dwarves stirring up evil - the first time he hasn’t responded to a comment of that sort about dwarves. Both the surroundings and the company are overwhelming, and on top of that, Gandalf is dead as a result of the balrog being awakened and he may feel unable - emotionally or factual - to dispute Celeborn’s casting of blame for that on the dwarves of Moria. He’s “glowering and sad”, but he can’t manage to muster a defense.
Galadriel’s words are important because they offer both empathy and respect: she expresses that elves would do the same as dwarves in the same circumstances, countering the idea that the dwarves and somehow uniquely wrongheaded in wanting to return to Moria, and she recognizes the beauty and worth of Khazad-dûm and its surroundings (and implicitly, of the dwarven language). She’s defending Gimli at the very moment when he’s run out of words to do so himself.
And it’s that recognition and defense from Galadriel - that dwarves are both morally and culturally the equals of elves - that frees Gimli from his defensiveness and open him up to also appreciate and praise the beauty of Lothlórien. And Lothlórien is the point where he and Legolas first become friends, because he’s now in a frame of mind where he no longer needs the same kind of knee-jerk defensiveness, because he’s recieved recognition and respect and validation. (It may also be a similar turning point for Legolas, in terms of modelling that respect and admiration for dwarven creations and culture is not a fundamentally un-Elvish sentiment, which is the kind of idea one could easily internalize growing up in Mirkwood.)
This is very important to me, because often Gimli’s regard for Galadriel is placed in terms of admiration for her beauty, but it’s not physical beauty that makes him admire her, it’s her love and recognition and respect for his culture and people, and her empathy for them. (I’ve got another post to work on about the use/meaning of beauty in Tolkien’s works.)
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wayhaving · 3 years
Note
8 & rory/a for the physical affection prompts? 😊
my head’s getting heavy, pressed against your arm
HI!! TYSM!! (i lovvvveeee your writing btw!!!) 🥺😭💕
(again this is so so so old, i’m finally finishing all these like MONTHS old prompts. 😭)
8. brushing hands by accident
she’s not drunk.
she’s not.
the wobble of her too-high high heels, nor the smeared streaks of mascara around her eyes, nor the strap of her deep red dress falling down her shoulder told the story of a drunk woman, which she is not.
at least that’s what she’s telling herself.
what she’s not telling herself, is the all-true story of the night, and the events that unraveled leaving her to her disheveled state—and if she has her way the amount of alcohol she’d consumed would leave it that way, completely unbenknownst to the mistakes she’s made tonight.
the moon shines heavy on her, interrogating and illuminating all that she wishes to hide, and she feels vulnerable. vulnerable to the things that go bump in the night, ones she’s so woefully aware of now, but more so vulnerable to the people.
the people of wayhaven, her friends, her family, her team. and really, just the one specific member that has her turned all inside out, except now she’s completely bare and it’s not his fault (and she almost wishes it was).
they can see her. their eyes are on her. the eyes are watching and they can see her stumble on the sidewalk with her purse clutched lazily in her hand. they can see her with tears in her eyes and messy dark hair that’s fallen out of its intricate updo.
and as much as rory wants to lay the blame on everything but her, (on the night, on the present, on him—adam) she has no one else to blame but herself, and that’s possibly worse than anything else.
she sniffles, running a hand down her face, the cool air of autumn a welcome breeze to her reddened face but a terrifying sting to the rest of her body—the tiny maroon dress did nothing for insulation.
it was a beautiful dress, with ruffles down the side hugging her curves, low on her chest showing everything it needed to and more, held up by thin straps. when she put it on, she didn’t think she was doing it justice, and now, it feels even worse on her skin.
a stupid, stupid mistake.
an expensive one, and now she has to pay.
but even still, the mistake doesn’t live up to the pain, it doesn’t live up to the sting of rejection or the gullibility of her actions. a fool, she thinks, i’m an absolute fool.
to think he was interested, to think he truly meant those apologies, and all they were good for— platitudes whispered like sweet nothings in my ear and i fell for it.
and then she thinks, perhaps, she’s desperate, looking for affection and validation in anyone, because of who she couldn’t get it from. but then fuck that, love is not life and they should never intertwine, and she’s never thought of herself to be so helpless but here she is, wide-eyes rimmed with red, heart dutifully open and on her sleeve. because love is in her heart and she has a lust for life.
but she’s not like this, she doesn’t do this.
she doesn’t dress up like this, drink as if it’s the end of the world like this, cry a river on the sidewalk like this.
but, he’s got her fucked up like this, drunk under a streetlight like this, making critical mistakes like this.
and she hates it, loathes it, abhorred by the choices she’s made to garner attention from the only man she’s ever wanted it from, it makes her skin crawl. that he has such an effect on her. that she brought herself to this conclusion, that... bobby was her salvation.
and she was wrong.
she knew it when he called her late at night asking if she wanted to get dinner soon. she knew it when she bought a sexy red dress from the store at the very same time adam’s patrol was cutting through town. she knew it when bobby was an hour late to the restaurant. she knew it when bobby had called her baby, and apologized, kept his hand on her thigh. she knew it when he left in the middle of date.
she knew it when she found him in the alleyway on the phone.
she knew it when she heard him say, “i’m pulling the information from her now.”
“yea, she’s easy—she has no idea.”
and she knew she fucked up. she knew he could never change, that he’s just the same as he was during her college days. just as sleazy, and just as manipulative, playing on her weaknesses.
and it’s sucks, falling for the obvious. being told there’s a shooting star in the sky, and looking up only to be the fallen victim, laughing-stock. when he said jump, she jumped and didn’t even ask how high.
she decides it doesn’t matter, not now at least. it comes and goes in waves, and right now she’s determined to hold on to a little bit of her dignity. she wipes her hand under her eyes, black-stained tears collect on her fingertips, as she sniffles and takes in a shaky breath of air. it stings as it infiltrates her lungs.
the sky is inky, beautiful purple’s and blue’s, a sky she’s never appreciated before but it offers her some clarity. the stars whisper, a testament to her sins.
high-rising red brick buildings surround her as the town square comes into view, there’s a lack of people wandering around, and for good reason. the clock atop the library reads ‘1:34 am’.
rory doesn’t even see the man across the street, aviators tucked into his shirt, hands shoved in the pockets of his hands. and even though he’s close enough to tell, she doesn’t see the way his brows furrow.
he’s a million miles away and he’s just across the square, hidden behind evergreen leaves and branches sticking out like thieves in the night. and he watches, from afar, wondering, feet twisting. does he go?
there shouldn’t have been a doubt in his mind. that once he saw her in obvious distress, his arms should be around her but things are never cut so clear. things are never left out to dry like this, and feelings are so messy. yet adam wants so badly to get his hands dirty. he’s a white shirt and she’s every bad decision he’ll ever make.
so, even though it takes a second (several, actually) he makes his way over to her. his hands are nervous in his pockets, he can feel the cool air on his face like he’s never felt it before, it freezes, cuts on his sharp jaw. everything is amped up around her.
and it’s dangerous to feel things so intensely—feel these feelings, at all.
when he nears her close enough, she turns her head. immediately, her posture strengthens, she picks up her fallen strap, and forces a smile.
“detective.”
“agent.”
his mouth twitches and he threatens to say something he’ll regret, stops himself from gathering her into his arms, and taking her home. reprimanding her for her decisions, brushing the hair from her face and telling her it’ll be alright. leave her warm and comfortable and say goodnight like all of the good boyfriends do. like real people do.
but he doesn’t even bridge the gap.
he thinks it’s already been burned.
he shouldn’t have said it to her. said that she means nothing to him. that she’s just a causality. a mistake. an error.
he shouldn’t have turned his back. shouldn’t have left her wanting. shouldn’t have kept her tucked in his pocket, folded up in discretion. shouldn’t have held her once and said never again. shouldn’t have left her in the rain standing at the warehouse door. shouldn’t have kissed her and forgot the taste. shouldn’t have told her goodbye and shouldn’t have held her eyes in his own.
he shouldn’t have loved her. love her. he shouldn’t have kept it to himself.
but he did, and he does still. he still feels the ignorance on the outside, terrible sweetness in his veins. someone should’ve told him honey burns more than vinegar.
and somehow his heart never intervenes. but god, it longs to. but he knows irrationality, all too well, and it always stops him. always pulls him back. the draw. he’s never as far along as he wants to be.
an apology is on the tip of his tongue, cliches tipping the scales—its love. it’s love. it’s love. but the words are lost on him, as they always are. if only he could tell her.
so he sheds his coat, and before she can object he places it on her shoulders. he hears a sniffle as she pulls it closer. she doesn’t say anything, but the smile has faded and her lips are tight.
he doesn’t say anything either, instead he walks alongside her, hand dangling at his side. afraid to push her over, push her away. he swears, the trouble his mouth makes.
it’s minutes. or hours. time is malleable between them. it never makes any logical sense, like everything else trapped in their perfect storm. but rory’s apartment comes into view much quicker than either of them likes.
and then his hand brushes hers, and she stops. she turns to him and pulls her hand to her chest.
in the moment she wonders what to say, if there is anything to say. she’s content with the silence, everything has gotten so foggy, distant in her head, it’s all so fucked in her mind. there’s not much left to interpret, thoughts speakinf like tongues,
but adam opens his mouth, and rory cuts him off with the wave of her hand.
crickets scream quietly behind them.
“don’t,” she whispers. “you don’t have to say anything.”
adam wants to speak, by god, he wants to tell her everything he’s held back and all the problems he’s made and all the things he could resolve if only—
if only nothing, no ‘ifs’, ‘buts,’ or ‘whens’.
but then he was never a man of many words.
he waits, waits to gauge her reaction, but she walks past him, gathering her keys in her unorganized purse. stomping up the stairs to her apartment door, and adam follows. for safety, he thinks, but he’s there like a lost puppy.
she jams the key in the door, but she doesn’t turn it.
and then.
her forehead falls heavy on the doorframe. slumping down, and a burst of tears. adam works quickly to hold her up.
“i hate you,” she says, as he cradles her. head pressed against his chest as one arm reaches past her and to the key nestled in the door. he opens it, and pushes through.
“i know.”
he doesn’t bother to turn on the lights. he doesn’t need to. through the living room and through the kitchen, all the way to the bedroom in the back, he carries her, sets her down gently onto her sheets.
“i hate how much i need you.”
she sits up, and before she can protest he helps her with her heels.
“i hate how much i want you.”
he sets the heels by her bed, drops her purse on the nightstand.
and then he leaves into the kitchen, pours her a glass of water with a cup from the cupboard he knows they’re in because he knows her, he knows her space. he knows her home.
and he enters again, with the water, and an ibuprofen for the raging headache he knows she has.
“i hate how much i love you.”
he doesn’t stop, even though the shock should, but all he can do is drag his head across the floor in disappointment, in a somber sadness that only he created for himself.
“i know.”
so, he tucks her in and he kisses her forehead goodnight. he clicks the door shut. and in a whisper as quiet as he can manage—
“i love you, too.”
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Peace! It's nice to meet you, fellow mbti person! I'm so glad to have stumbled upon an ISTJ who is into typology! I have a request. I typed Elsa from Frozen in a post (I'll tag you) and I argued that she is not an ISTJ. I wanted to know what you thought, particularly if I made any mistakes in understanding the ISTJ personality type. Thank you so much in advance! I hope it's not too much of a bother. I'm an INTP btw.
Hi,
I want to start out with the following: for anyone reading, do not make a habit of having me analyze your posts about fictional characters. I am happy to help you type yourself, or answer questions about MBTI. However, in case it was not clear from the fact that I have only typed fictional characters in response to direct questions, that my answers have typically been very brief, and that I’ve repeatedly directed people to blogs that specifically focus on character typing, I’m not really interested. I should note: I had fun because I love picking up my metaphorical red pen and writing “wrong” over every other sentence, but it did also take me like an hour and a half and it’s over 3 pages long, and I don’t have time to do that regularly.
With all that said, the post had sufficient issues with both basic logical argument structure (I would very strongly recommend you revisit that INTP typing of yourself and look at something with high Fe instead) as well as understanding of MBTI that, because you asked directly, I will go through said issues. I want to make it very clear: this is going to be harsh. For both that and for the length I’m putting it below a read-more such that if you were looking for a brief thumbs up or down and not for extensive criticism, you are welcome to ignore it, block me, or whatever is best for you.
Basic argument structure: you open repeatedly with the most subjective arguments - that she gives off Fi and Ni vibes and you don’t see the Si in her. This will convince no one but yourself.
This argument is also mostly focused on “other people think this, but I don’t” which I find is only useful in a process of elimination argument. We’ll get to the final typing eventually but it is generally stronger to argue in favor of what you believe and then address potential disagreement rather than the reverse; by the time you get to ISFP I’ve read so many incorrect assumptions and subjective asides that I’ve long since stopped valuing the analysis of the work.
Issues with the ISTJ argument
(note: I have, and continue to type Elsa as an ISTJ so this will be the longest section in that I’m both pointing out flaws and arguing in favor of ISTJ; the rest will be solely focused on MBTI misconceptions or logical fallacy).
While it’s true people often mistake trauma for Si, this argument seems to equate trauma with being stuck in the past (people can just be stuck in the past without trauma for whatever other reason - it’s not healthy but it does not necessarily indicate literal trauma). There is also a false opposition here: It’s absolutely valid to argue that Elsa is traumatized, but that does not preclude her having Si, merely removes one argument in favor of Si.
You define Si (gathering concrete details to understand what to expect) but don’t actually argue why Elsa doesn’t do this. I’d argue, in opposition to the statement later in this paragraph, that she does. She is aware from the past that her abilities can harm her sister. She is aware from her past that when she avoided Anna, Anna was safe. She hasn’t been happy with the “conceal don’t feel” line, but it has achieved her goals and her expectation is that she’ll hurt someone if she stops following it.
If you’re referring to an Si-Fi loop (wallowing in self-pity), it doesn’t use Te since that’s how loops work. You don’t explicitly say this is in the context of looping although you introduce looping in the second sentence, but if you are referring to a loop this is incorrect. It’s true that ISTJs are often likely to use Si (preference for familiar/existing structures) and an Fi understanding of morality to direct their energies when they wish to change something (ie, they will change things through existing channels) but the focus on speaking out about injustice here is much more in line with enneagram 1 - a very common enneatype for ISTJs and an enneatype that’s rare for any non-TJ types, but not the enneatype I’d give Elsa nor an inherent ISTJ trait itself.
The part about self-discipline is mixed - a lot of ISTJs are very disciplined in certain areas (particularly professional/familial) but can neglect the self (not getting enough exercise/not eating well, not addressing burnout or more emotional issues) and I’d argue again, Elsa shows this: she’s not addressing the fact that she’s lonely and miserable, but she’s highly disciplined with regards to concealing her abilities and avoiding Anna even though it’s the very thing making her lonely and miserable.
I don’t necessarily think Let It Go is indicative of an Ne grip, but one can make changes outside of a grip, so this isn’t a useful argument, as it argues why an Ne grip is wrong, not why ISTJ is wrong - I would merely argue she’s not gripping at that time. Which is a general issue here: the argument you provide in this paragraph isn’t arguing against ISTJ, it’s arguing against other people’s arguments for ISTJ, which is an important distinction.
The final paragraph of the ISTJ section has numerous issues: ISTJs are not rebellious. They are not as resistant to change as stereotypes indicate, but even a healthier version of ISTJ Elsa would be unlikely to rebel and rather try to understand her parents’ argument, research other options, or look for a way to gain control over her powers while still working within the normal hierarchy. I addressed self-discipline (I should add: I don’t think a child/young woman having difficulty controlling magical powers with no training is an argument against self-discipline; my argument for self-discipline is that she stays in her room and away from her sister despite clearly hating it). It is also, to be blunt, mind-boggling that you (correctly) argue that trauma responses are not inherently Si but then refer to obsessive-compulsive behaviors as Si when that’s also a medical disorder completely divorced from the MBTI framework. Finally, her continuing to follow an order from her parents after they die is first, quite literally the definition of self-discipline (she’s the queen; no one else is going to discipline her for it, after all) and second, entirely in line with Si (this is what she has always done and it’s not great but it works) and is, arguably, if not medically obsessive-compulsive, an obsessive need to follow a compulsion. To be clear: this isn’t healthy ISTJ behavior, but since you’ve acknowledged grips and loops here I think an unhealthy interpretation of the type is very much on the table. You say her behavior is more in line with F types; it’s not and you don’t explain why.
If I may it seems as though, much in line with the argument here being against other arguments but ultimately not debunking the typing, your arguments against MBTI stereotypes focus on what’s incorrect but they tend to merely swing the pendulum to the opposite side (eg, that ISTJs are likely to rebel, in opposition to the stereotype that they’d mindlessly follow orders) rather than find the more nuanced middle ground of how people of a type or with a certain function behave.
Issues with the INFJ and INFP sections:
Ne users can and frequently do go out into the world; simply because Ne can be engaged without external physical stimulation doesn’t mean it never is. I’m also not really a fan of reading being classified as a strictly introverted pursuit; that’s falling into a pretty significant stereotype trap. Going out and exploring is a thing anyone can do but if anything I’d either associate that more strongly with high sensing (either Si or Se) or with extroversion. 
My biggest issue here is the implication that searching for a meaning for existence or a purpose is in itself an indicator of Ni. This is just the human condition. If you’re going to argue that Si users are driven to rebel against injustice I don’t see how you can miss that that might in turn be driven by a belief that this is their purpose. Perhaps Si-Ne users aren’t as invested in having a single purpose, but wondering why you are on this earth and what it is you are here to do is just being a person, and to be blunter than I have been, I am struggling to understand how there has been so much effort made earlier to push away from stereotypes to the point of overcompensation in the opposite direction and then when it comes to the idea that only Ni users have a desire for meaning in life you just accept it without question.
Issues with the ISFP section:
At this point I’ve probably covered most of them though I’d like to point out that I don’t think there was an argument ever made explicitly for introversion; while the structure of the earlier arguments and focus on debunking was, as stated, flawed, I would at least round it out by eliminating ESFP as an option.
The argument here rests heavily on Let it Go, which is interesting because most of the terrible arguments for Elsa being an intuitive also rested squarely on that same brief if admittedly pivotal section of a full movie; in attempting to differentiate itself from those arguments it has in fact replicated the most significant flaws. Anyway, I’ve addressed that I don’t personally think Let it Go being indicative of a grip is how I’d argue for ISTJ, so that becomes invalid; I’ve tried to focus more on issues with logic MBTI than the contents of the movie but I’d add that “she was happy” is open to interpretation and her emotional state was probably fairly complicated. Relieved, sure, but she’s still ultimately isolated. (Also while mentally singing Let it Go, I realized that here’s that rebellion you were asking for in the ISTJ section).
You also outright say that when Elsa tries to reassert control it’s through Te. Yeah. That’s what a high Te user does. An ISTJ in a grip would indeed use Ne, but in quite literally any other circumstance (looping or just existing as an ISTJ not in a grip or loop) would reassert control via Te, so again, your argument does not sufficiently eliminate that Elsa is an ISTJ, just that she’s not a gripping ISTJ, which I’d agree with. 
“She acts out when she is stressed and makes bad decisions” is also the human condition (and why I’ve frequently on my blog argued very strongly against typing via stress behaviors, because in the end most people...act out and make bad decisions when stressed), so this isn’t useful as an argument for anything.
In conclusion: multiple misconceptions about Ni and Si; no argument that I could find presented for high Fi, just Fi in general; inconsistency regarding whether or not Elsa rebels, and an overall reliance not on making a new argument but on arguing why other arguments were wrong. Given the title of the post you asked me to analyze I have to (admittedly this is extremely cynical of me) wonder if there was an underlying goal to come up with a typing that was different from commonly accepted arguments, rather than to simply type for its own sake. 
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illusionsofcontrol · 3 years
Note
are there any tropes you wanted to stay away from with each character or the setting of danganronpa? its a pertty formulaic thing but you made it probably 10x more interesting than the usual game. maybe its because of the depth in charcters or the stakes but wh just seems more engaing than most real dr games! i love your works btw!
I'm really honored that you feel that way about my story! Thank you!
I should warn that my response is going to be somewhat critical of Danganronpa. I want to clarify that I still enjoy the games and it's perfectly fine if anyone disagrees, but these are my opinions and I feel they are important to my response.
First off, I guess I'm not sure if there's any setting tropes I mind in DR. The settings are actually pretty unique to each game and tie into the murders decently. WH obviously has a different setting, but that's more to fit the story rather than avoiding DR tropes.
There are, however, a lot of character tropes I intentionally avoided in WH:R.
Singular Buff Character Who Dies in Chapter 4
WH:R has two buff characters (formerly named Jerome and Ryan) and without going into spoilers, they may or may not have anything to do with Part 04. I don't know, this trope is just so overdone that I saw Gonta's design and instantly predicted that he'd die in Chapter 4. I thought it had to be a red herring, but no. That indeed happened just as expected. I don't want people to be able to predict deaths just by looking at a character design.
Girls Must Wear Skirts
Fun fact, there are only three female Danganronpa characters who don't wear skirts. They would be Aoi Asahina (wears shorts, much like an athletic swimmer would outside of the pool), Hiroko Hagakure (Yasuhiro's mom, wears jeans), and Ruruka Ando (Confectionary girl from DR3, wears very, very short shorts-). Unless there's someone I'm forgetting, every other DR girl wears skirts. Now, I'm aware that this is because most Japanese school uniforms require girls to wear skirts. But given how... bizarre everyone's outfits already are, do all the girls HAVE to wear skirts??? Given the weird fanservice of the games, I feel like it's more to make the girls reveal more skin/slim figure idk :/
I'm getting carried away here. Anyway, WH:R doesn't take place in a Japanese school so I made sure that the women aren't all wearing skirts. And while we're on the subject...
Sexual Fanservice
I'm not against it, but I personally feel like sexual fanservice in a Murder Mystery game (especially involving teenagers) is really uncomfortable. Every game has certain female characters designated to making fanservice moments (DR1: Aoi, DR2: Akane, Mikan, v3: Miu) (Junko for all three I guess-) (Also yes I'm aware that Mikan's fanservice is part of her character/backstory but it doesn't change the fact that the CGs are there for shameless fanservice. They could've drawn the scenes where her back was to the screen or something and conveyed the same message but they made sure to show Everything.)
There's also plenty of designs that are overly revealing; obviously anyone can wear what they want and a large chest is not inherently sexual but it's pretty clear to me that a lot of the revealing designs are for fanservice. Once again, these are mainly teenagers, and the older I get the more it unsettles me.
Anyway, I really wanted to avoid doing sexual fanservice for WH:R. Even though all characters but one are adults, it's just not something I want to write in a story like this. It's not my style.
The Rat
I mentioned this in a previous post, but I ended up avoiding the Rat Character trope. It's not that I dislike it, but I quite enjoyed having the characters all mean well (except for the Puppetmaster, of course.)
(But if I were to have a rat character in WH:R, they'd be the Super Diamond Level Griefer haha)
Resident Dumbass
Yasuhiro, Kazuichi, Kaito, and Akane come to mind (yeah the middle two aren't actually dumb but they tend to fall into this trope regardless). Having to do an entire minigame just to convince Yasuhiro that Kyoko wasn't a literal ghost comes to mind... Idk, I guess I just feel like characters like Kazuichi and Kaito are actually smarter than that but because it's "funny" they have to say illogical stuff throughout the games? Perhaps in a game with voice acting it can be a funny aside, but in a novel that kind of stuff would just slow everything down.
I don't know, it's not like everyone in WH:R is super smart, but that's a trope I tried to avoid.
Rude Characters (?)
Okay this isn't really a trope but Danganronpa tends to always have abrasive characters, but given that WH:R has a main cast of friends, it wouldn't make much sense for there to be much rudeness. I guess Ryan would be the closest to that but he still genuinely cares about the group.
This isn't a bad trope, it's just more natural to exist in Danganronpa because the characters there start off as strangers.
Conclusion
I can't really think of other tropes at the moment. Maybe if I think of more I'll reblog this. But I want to clarify that most of these "tropes" are avoided because of personal preference and differences in media, not necessarily because they're inherently bad.
This next part isn't exactly answering the ask, but I'm assuming that I get these asks from people who are interested in making their own fangans. So here are my two cents.
I've seen fangans that are made out of love for DR and I've seen fangans made out of spite and dislike for some aspects. Both reasons are valid (mine is mostly the former with a slight hint of the latter that's grown over the years). Kodaka's writing is definitely flawed; however, making fangans purely out of spite is dangerous. I don't want to name names, but there is one fangan in particular where the writer admitted to hating Danganronpa and only focused on adding what they wanted. But they neglected the most important part: having a solid story and cast.
Whether or not you love or hate Danganronpa, if you're writing a fangan, it is important to consider the many subjective reasons people are drawn to/away the series. I'm a firm believer that every story has something to teach a writer; even if the lesson is simply "I really don't like these tropes", considering why is insightful.
It mostly boils down to style, in my opinion. Danganronpa has a much different tone with its wacky characters and dialogue and scenarios, but that's Kodaka's style. My style is more grounded in reality, with each character having their own depth that comes up in the main plot and not just in Free Time Events. This is because my stories are more character-driven, and I personally dislike important character information that is sidelined to bonus content. I'm the kind of writer that never makes an OC that's not part of a story, cuz my style has every character play an important role.
(However, one can argue that in a visual novel, having more character depth in Free Time Events adds greater meaning because the player gets a special insight from choosing to interact with certain characters. In a regular novel, there isn't really that kind of interaction. Understanding the strengths and weaknesses of the media you're working with is also important.)
I think one of the biggest lessons I learned while writing WH is that forcing yourself to imitate any writer's style when trying to take inspiration is going to fall flat. It's kind of apparent in the beginning of WH, but I used to be feel like I had to follow the Danganronpa style even when I had my own desires for the story.
In reality, every writer is different and has their own quirks that they enjoy but other writers might not. There are many things I dislike about Kodaka's writing, but I know those things are definitely appealing to other people. Likewise, I know my style is not for everyone. It's fine to try and branch out if you want, but one has to recognize what one is comfortable with.
This lesson is still hard for me to absorb sometimes because I don't have much confidence in my storytelling abilities, but I'm gradually accepting that this fangan is my own. I am doing my own spin on the Danganronpa story and that's okay.
And honestly, that's what every fangan should be; a writer's own spin on the Danganronpa plot concept. So while here are the tropes I made sure to avoid, that doesn't mean other writers need to do the same. Figure out what works best for you and what YOU want to see in a Danganronpa story.
(Holy crap this was so long I'm so sorry-)
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cptn-jtk · 3 years
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so punishing Michael for doing what is right, simply because she's a Black woman and doesn't get the benefit of the doubt the way the two white characters do, is fine. like funny how you're calling critique made of how the story shits on a Black woman "hate", while ignoring that the Discovery writers hate Michael. But go off I guess, fandom is being its usual racist self I see.
lmao I like how u think I'm personally attacking Michael's character when that was clearly not the case. I said that she (including Saru and Tilly) weren't ready for command and the post wasn't even primarily about her??? It was addressing the hate directed at Tilly and Saru in the fandom that literally seems to have appeared out of nowhere with the new season. The post was in no way disparaging Michael nor was it dismissing the valid criticism from the fandom about the racist treatment of Michael's character from the writers??
also please point out the part of my post where I said that saru and tilly get a free pass simply bc they're white and vice versa for Michael? I said that Tilly was right for command but that doesn't mean that Michael's not. I said that Saru was right for command but that also doesn't mean Michael's not. In fact, if you actually took time to read the post you would see that I discussed (albeit briefly) about how none of them are READY for command, not that they don't deserve it. What I wrote was a valid analysis of their characters and my own interpretation of the story line so far. also, if u read the post completely u would know that I talked about how Saru needed a first officer that he could trust and rely on, Michael's demotion was bc she directly disobeyed him. Yes, she did the right thing no question about it but the entire premise of the show is "the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few". Her actions were morally right and I agree with her but she also has a history of disobeying her superior officer and Saru, as the captain, can't have an XO that constantly undermines him (which also opens up another entire discussion about the racist treatment of her character but that's for another post). Do I ultimately think that Michael should have been demoted? Absolutely not. But that choice is out of my hands so I'm going to support tilly in her new role (which btw is only temporary and we could hopefully see Michael as either Saru's XO or with her own command, which is what I think the last few eps have been hinting at)
And finally, I'd like to reiterate this point: THE POST WASNT ABOUT MICHAEL. It was mostly about Tilly and Saru but Michael is pivotal to their storyline and development and to not at least mention her in respect to that would do her entire character a disservice. I'm not "ignoring" hate on Michael - I'm very aware of the hate Michael receives simply because she's a black lead but the post wasn't about that- it had absolutely nothing to do with that. I was simply talking about the fact that I kept seeing a lot of hate for Tilly and Saru and I wanted to share my thoughts on it. And yes it is hate - I've seen people shitting all over their characters and actors so let me apologise for stepping in and sharing my thoughts on the issue. It's almost as if that's exactly what this platform is for.
Discovery isn't the Michael Burnham show, whether people like that or not. There are other characters that I like to talk about, there are aspects of their personality that I enjoying exploring and see how other people interpret it.
My post about the hate for Tilly and Saru literally does not take away from Michael's story. It doesn't dismiss the treatment of her character from the writers or the fandom. The simple matter of the fact is that the post wasn't about Michael.
That being said, I would like to apologise if my post caused you offence. That was never my intention and I know the writing of Michael's character is sketchy, that disco has an problem with tokenism, and that the fandom can be racist and toxic. However, at the end of the day my post simply wasn't about Michael. I can make a post about other characters without it being a reflection of her character.
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thisiskatsblog · 4 years
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Hi Kat, I'm feeling sad and sort of mad here so I might rant, I'd like to know what you think I don't know if you're gonna post it or answer it to avoid controversy and negativity in your blog but I appreciate you got to read it bc I needed to vent, tysm in advance...
I see so many people hating on Harry because he said "clothes are fun" without "making any social statement about it and that he doesn't recognize his privilege of wearing what he wants cause he's rich and famous" and can I just say that it's because of that same privilege he's so influential and has helped so many queer fans to be who they want to be, he's using his privilege for good and also, I hate when people try to force activism out of everyone...
I understand being critical but activism should be genuine and intentional. It just seems to me that they're people from the q community who had an agenda against him before this interview got released, sometimes it doesn't even seen this is about social justice. I've seen the most cruel and hateful comments wishing for him to be miserable and unsuccessful (that's not happening anytime sooner, honey, go off)...
And they don't really know him, they don't know he does more than waving flags and putting stickers on his guitar, he has donated to non-profits, spent money on queer artists, he protested and signed petitions for BLM, he has helped fans to come out, he does have talked on social issues, they're just looking for a reason to be mad tbh...
He might not get too deeply political because he has stated that politics divide people and that is 100% true. He has INDEED recognized he is privileged on a RS interview and that he just wants to show people he sees them and he's here for them. Everybody does activism in different ways, and Harry's certainly isn't performative, he's not obnoxious about it but he's not tone deaf either, he's self-aware.Honestly, I don't understand what this people want?...
If they see this cis boy speaking on gender issues and gender expression on a Vogue interview and talking about trans/nb/gnc people who are opressed then they may fill Twitter with comments like "he doesn't do anything for us, why is he talking about it? he's not our icon" but if he doesn't do it then he's pandering? Do they want an ally who leads a movement and speaks on issues or an ally who does acts of service for the movement and doesn't speak for it? I don't understand, idk if I will..
Finally, no one should be a certain sexuality to be allowed to break gender roles, yes, straight people do have privilege even when they dress androgynous but they shouldn't be cancelled for that...
Now, entering hypothetical (basically confirmed) field, can we talk about how problematic is accusing a closeted person of pandering? If someone have ever told artists like Bowie or Mercury to "stop profiting of queer people" while they weren't out in the public eye, then no one would have paved the way for other men to express themselves, break toxic masculinity and help other gender non-conforming kids. Kids like Janelle Monaé, Billy Porter, Lil Nas, P!nk, Sam Smith and yes, Harry Styles.
(that was the end of my rant btw, it was like 8 asks, I think, hope nothing got lost, sorry for the length but this people literally want Harry to fail because of freaking wearing a skirt and not getting too political about it and I was certainly not having it)
----------------------- Hi anon,
They all arrived! 
I’m glad it helps you just to be able to vent, without expecting to be published, so anyone who needs a vent: do feel free to use the service of my inbox 😊
I will publish because I think you are making a few interesting points.
It’s true that Harry can do the things he does because he is privileged – and I completely agree with you that it’s a good thing he is using that privilege to the fullest and thereby changes things for the better for other queer people.
On the other hand, I do understand the frustration of queer people who are less privileged when they wish he would recognize that privilege. It isn’t true that in this day and age anyone can dress the way Harry does on the cover of Vogue, and it could make his “statement”, which in itself is positive for queer people, all the more powerful if he recognized it and expressed his wish for that to change. To me, it’s a question of gradation. Wearing a ruffled dress is really good and changes lives; saying that you wish everyone had the freedom to wear that dress in the way you now have that freedom is even better and raises awareness of intersectionality (when you are LGBTQ and poor, being LGBTQ is more difficult than when you are LGBTQ and rich).
I don’t think Harry is the kind of person you’d need to force activism out of, I do see him as someone who has been activist as well as political on many occasions. Maybe not as political and activist as I’d like him to be, maybe not in the way I would be in his position, but definitely committed to the same causes that I find important, and not afraid of using the position he has to influence when he feels comfortable to do so. I wish he’d been more vocal on a great number of occasions, but I agree with you in that you cannot look at your idols in music and simply expect them to be fervent and perfect political activists. Art can be activist, but it doesn’t have to be, you cannot expect it to be.
Furthermore, I think Harry definitely has some privilege that he’s shown to be unaware of, and I’ve also seen him take things in, learn, change his position (see the RS interview you also mention), and become more vocal politically. In other words: Harry is human.
I have not seen the criticism you are talking about, and it seems there have been various different ones, so I won’t be going into them, some seem more valid, others are not. In any case I would be very hesitant to put it all aside as “queer people who had an agenda against him” or “they’re just looking for a reason to get mad”. That thinking may put you at ease, and stay on your side of things, but it won’t help the conversation. I think it’s important when you’re on two sides of an argument, to try and understand where the unmet need is on the “other” side.
Since I haven’t seen the original arguments, I am not completely clear on this – but it seems that the common thread in your understanding of the criticism he receives is that Harry’s ambiguous identity (while having amply suggested he may be not cis/straight, he hasn’t been straightforward about it) makes it possible for people to criticize him both ways.
I agree with you that you do not need to be queer to be allowed to break gender norms, and that closeted people should not be criticized for breaking gender norms and paving the way, to come out themselves, and for others. But I do see where the frustration on the other side comes from – I don’t think it’s necessarily evil willed towards Harry. What I see, a strong wish and urgent need to have out and proud role models who do these things; and – guessing that a lot of the people criticizing him suspect he is indeed closeted – an enormous frustration that closeting still happens, and about the mixed messages Harry, as a role model, may implicitly gives to queer kids in this way. It’s okay to dress outrageously and challenge norms but it’s not okay to be explicit about your identity and orientation, do keep that vague. I personally feel extremely frustrated about that, even if I also believe this is outside Harry’s will.
“We don’t talk enough, we should open up, before it’s all too much…”
Anyway, long story short anon: I get you. And I think I get the other side too. In the end we all choose whether we want to see the glass as half full or half empty. And I’m siding with you that it’s half full, and with the critics that I wish it were completely full, but then again with you that you cannot really fault Harry for that not (yet) being the case... But it’s okay for it to be said: I wish the glass were full.
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bitofthisandthat · 4 years
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// To Mun: Did you see the Let's Get Dangerous promo? What did you think of it? Are you looking forward to the episode or no? I know there's a fair share of fans of older Disney Duck media, like yourself, that are disappointed with decisions made in the reboot, and I think it's important for older fans to be allowed to share their opinions without being harassed. Critical thinking is important, and it's important to be able to share opinions, good and bad, especially if you're a long-time fan!
{{ Before I rant, I JUST HOPE I’M WRONG ABOUT THE UPCOMING EP. And if I am, I’ll admit it.
I have a lot to say, so for sanity’s sake a chunk is under the cut, and long story short folks? I am nervous af about the DWD episode. I think it looks pretty. That’s it. I am not looking forward to being upset by all the fanboy changes Frank will have undoubtedly made. He’s made it clear every day behind the scenes that he doesn’t give a fuck about what the seasoned team or original creators want, and he’s well known in the field to disrespect “his elders” as well as his new team naysayers, treating them like shits, and he rules with an iron fist. So I am excited to see the ART, but not the way it’s written.
The art is nice for what it is, not going to deny that I like how DT17 looks. ( I also love the original style too, because cell-art is superior to me ) I guess I differ from fellow “old school fans” in that I DO like how the show looks. 🤷‍♀️ It has polished animation that is much different from the inconsistent styles from 4 different studios hand painting the cells. ( Although I appreciate hand painted-cells!!! It’s fun to see diff styles too!! ) For the most part, the characters and backgrounds in DT17 are consistently styled, and there is a feel of modern western comic mixed with manga art brought to life.  Which is ironic, because the WRITING is  inconsistent, brick-a-bracked, disconnected, and has a multitude of continuity issues in lieu of whatever joke of the day fits the featured character. But, that’s what you get when each 24 minute episode is written by 6-12 people. And, there can be no consistency among those 5-12 writers/scripts between production gaps. One writer may do 1 episode one season, while only contribute a scant amount to 4 eps on another season, and then never write again until the finale, and only contribute ONE scene. Of course, many ideas have been thrown out that promote continuity and loyalty to story arcs and characters by, you guessed it, Frank. The best TV, animated or live, has 2-3 writers per episode at most, and a story editor that actually cares about consistency and the show as a whole. Not several vignettes that don’t connect and appear to look like a meta-gaming wet dream and bad fix-ups. It’s highly sophomoric.
There is obviously a clash of egos going on behind the scenes, and too many cooks ruin the soup.
BTW; I thank you for asking me, but to be perfectly honest, I am well aware of how the tumblr “DT17 only” fans think of us old-schoolers. They are not kind to us, and most of them think we’re overreacting, “problematic,” mean, and should “Just STFU and let them have the show” to themselves.  We never said you can’t enjoy the reboot for what it is, an AU. But we’re the ones told consistently that if we don’t bow down and accept the reboot as BIBLE truth, we’re to be ousted. I KNOW, I play 2 DT17 muses here, but I can bridge the differences just fine. But the flaws are so big for me, I have to cherry pick “DT17 canon” and ignore much of fandom to enjoy it.
What Frank & company are doing is disrespectful. Not just to the majority of Duck fans, but to the original creators, actors, and artists that worked so hard for 30-90 years to make these characters come to be. I know I won’t convince any of the new fans, so I’m going to be brutal. They are only on board with what Frank is doing because he loves to bait the young fandom into disagreements if it means their crack!ships are validated for 1 episode with forced subtext or vague tumblr/twAtter posts. If they actually saw the original content as a whole, they’d be pissed too. 
To those of us that actually grew up with both Ducktales and Darkwing Duck, owned Disney Adventures mags, Don Rosa comics, and respect Tad Stones for not only birthing DWD, but GARGOYLES, our stomachs drop before most episodes begin. We’re preparing ourselves to see a blasphemous take on characters and storylines that DO NOT NEED UPDATING. “Woke is the autotune of art and tv,” folks. It doesn’t make it better, it’s like putting a cup of salt on an already seasoned dish.
SO. Ehhhhhhhhhh I am more cautious than usual about the 1 hour DWD special. I am EXTREMELY nervous about Gosalyn.
She’s aged up “to a sassy teen” like Lena for some stupid reason, when she’s always been 9-10. There’s other issues facing Gos I am not comfortable talking about openly, but basically, I don’t like what Frank’s been doing to old characters to make them more woke and modern, there was NOTHING wrong with these characters. 
Some of his voice actor choices by the way? Not a good match. Don’t get me started on Jason taking over for Steelbeak. Stephanie B is funny/sexy irl, she’s made a career out of the edgelord-deadpan-roughneck routine, but she’s not a voice actress. Christine Cavanagh ( RIP ) had a youthful, spunky, cuteness that Stephanie lacks. So instead of finding an actress that has true Gos “flair” he picks someone that’s deep-voiced and cold, instead of cute and spunky. Frank seems hellbent on making every female dry, rude little edge-lords and it’s PLAYED OUT. I’m finding it very hard to like former female characters I adored growing up because almost all the women & girls in DT17 are bitchy she-beasts, and the men are either bumbling idiots or weak boys that need the women/girls to wipe their tushies for them after potty. It’s so demeaning to these characters. As a grown woman, I am not threatened by men, so I don’t need them to be dumbed down to make me feel big. I just KNOW Gosalyn, a now “Sassy Teen” is going to be a disrespectful ASSHOLE to Drake. Old school Gosalyn was TOUGH and a huge handful, but there was still an endearing charm and sweetness to her that made you forgive all her bullshit, and when she rebelled it was because she wanted to be with her dad, not “put him in his place�� she has canonly stated in the 90′s DWD and comics over and over, that DWD and Drake = her hero.  }}
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senseofmonachopsis · 4 years
Text
@transsexual-power
Just gonna continue on a new post (and if you wanna be done with this conversation that's fine), but I found this article. And here too it supports what you found about Kinsey not being a proven pedophile. However, what I did see from a few places was criticism over his research methods. Such as using one interview subject but claiming the information came from multiple people. And also this:
 Kinsey claimed ninety-five percent of men were really sex offenders and from ten percent to thirty-seven percent were occasional homosexual adventurers. Camille Paglia (a lesbian woman, btw) wrote insightfully about Kinsey’s fraudulent ten percent finding and its service to the homosexual movement:
“The ten percent figure, servilely repeated by the media, was pure propaganda, and it made me, as a scholar, despise gay activists for their unscrupulous disregard for the truth. [Homosexuals were too well aware that one in ten of the men that they met were not ‘gay’.] Their fibs and fabrications continue, now about the still-fragmentary evidence for a genetic link to homosexuality and for homosexual behavior among animals.”
As Pagilia suggests, Kinsey was long ago exposed as a scientific fraud.
So, there were some unsubstantiated claims (the Kinsey institute denied them) and yet still valid criticism for Kinsey's work. Like the fact that he definitely interviewed pedophiles, but maintained their anonymity and his institute denied this. And his overestimating of how prevalent homosexuality and bisexualilty are.
The Kinsey Institute denies everything, but I'd expect the institute he founded to be biased and not so willing to be forthcoming about any evidence that shows the guy was at the very least using flawed methodology.
Edit:
It is gut-wrenching to hear Dr. Paul Gebhard,former head of the Kinsey Institute, admit that some of Kinsey’s"trained observers” were nothing more than pedophiles with stopwatches.
One of these “observers,” called “Mr. X,” was later discoveredto be Rex King, a man who raped more than 800 children. These heinous crimes, some related to Kinsey in graphic detail, were transformed into “scientific” data by the demented doctor.
Another Kinsey “field agent” was Dr. Fritz Von Balluseck, a Nazi pedophile who raped hundreds of German children from 1936 to 1956.
Wonder if this is true. I mean, the whole situation surrounding his research seems really gross. Him being an advocate for same sex attracted people doesn’t change that.
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the-archlich · 4 years
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Went back to read some of the old spotlights (thank you btw for all the amazing work you put in it’s the only way tumblr blog I’ve read consistently the past few years), in regards to Guanqiu Jian- how much validity do you think the points in the edict he made were against Sima Shi? For a long time military commander who served in countless battles, he would have had to know his rebellion was going to be a suicide pact without a massive army. Just seems like a terrible error of judgment.
Oh god. Old spotlights. Sorry about those. Y’all deserved better quality articles. But moving on...
On the one hand, it was a very political document, phrased very carefully. All of the criticism is leveled at Sima Shi specifically, sandwiched between effusive praise of other members of his family. It’s possible he hoped to convince Sima Shi’s own family to turn against him. Guanqiu Jian may have even been benevolent enough to spare the rest of the family if they did, although it’s hard to imagine any of the Sima would credit that.
Guanqiu Jian was probably thinking the same thing most rebels are. That when he raised his flag and started to march against the evil usurper, others would join him. But history (even his recent history) shows that’s too idealistic. Just look at how many people were content to sit back and let Dong Zhuo do whatever. Most people find it easier to live under a tyrant than fight one.
As for the accusations themselves:
Now Sima Shi, an official in the prime of his life, feigns ill health while he has no real disease, yet has strong troops under his command; he does not serve the sovereign as is proper to a subject. The court officials criticize him and men of principle jeer at him. It is something of which the whole Empire is aware. This is his first crime.
This, I think, is false. We know that Sima Shi did indeed have a major disease that required ocular surgery. And beyond that I don’t think his reluctance to personally lead armies is really a fault. But it was a marked contrast to his father, and no doubt it offended the soldiers.
In preparing to attack the rebels, Sima Yi would have grain for the army unhusked in large quantities and set definite dates for launching his attacks. Sima Shi, as a high official of the State, ought to eliminate the national calamity (i.e. Wu and Shu); as a son he ought to bring his father's work to completion. But he ceased mourning for his father, and had all his work stopped. As a subject, he is disloyal; as a son, he is unfilial. This is his second crime.
Again, I don’t think this one is a fair criticism. There was a long precedent for ending mourning rituals early, and aggressive campaigns against Wu and Shu were always a risky proposition. This is another charge that I think was intended mostly to alienate Sima Shi from the soldiers.
While the rebels withdrew to Dongguan, he mobilized the troops; the three (jiangjun with the word) zheng (in their titles) advanced simultaneously. But our troops were lost and our army defeated; the military preparations of many years went to ruin in one day, so that the rebels were induced to come. The Empire fell into disorder, the people suffered from death and injury, or wandered homeless. This is his third crime.
Here, Guanqiu Jian criticises Sima Shi for Wei’s losses in February 253; most notably the defeat at Lake Chao; and for Zhuge Ke’s retaliatory invasion. Guanqiu Jian himself fought on that campaign, and the losses at Lake Chao forced him to quit the field without achievement. This is actually a fair criticism. Others, notably Fu Jian, had objected to the campaign in the first place. As its architect, Sima Shi does deserve his share of the blame.
The rebels mobilized the entire forces of their State, and with five hundred thousand men, as they claimed, they advanced towards Shouchun intending to proceed to Luoyang. It happened that we and the taiyu Sima Fu proposed the strategy of blockading key positions without crossing arms, and returning to strengthen the defense of Xincheng. The generals and troops in Huainan rushed against spears and trampled drawn swords, defending their positions day and night. They were engaged in this strenuous work for a hundred days, the dead strewn on the ground. Since its very beginning, the Wei army has never suffered a more severe hardship than this. Yet Sima Shi has arbitrarily made no proposal to enfeoff and reward the heroes in this campaign. Power was in his hands, but he did not use it to record the merits of these men. This is his fourth crime.
Guanqiu Jian is referring to the defense against Zhuge Ke in 253. While Jin Shu says that Sima Shi took command of the overall campaign, SGZ seems to disagree. Guanqiu Jian himself names Sima Fu as the commander, which agrees with other accounts. Guanqiu Jian claims that Sima Shi didn’t grant due rewards to those who earned glory during that great battle. This accusation is likely true, although a closer look at Cao Mao’s annals probably could solve that question.
The late zhongshuling Li Feng and others, considering that Sima Shi did not act as is proper to a subject, wanted to denounce and expel him. Knowing of this, Sima Shi invited Li Feng to come to him, and that evening struck him dead, carried off the corpse and buried the coffin. Li Feng and his associates were high officials and in the confidence of the sovereign. Yet he applied brutal measures to him on his own authority, killing him without first having charged him with a crime. Sima Shi did not respect the authority of his sovereign. This is his fifth crime.
Guanqiu Jian criticizes Sima Shi for executing Li Feng and his conspirators without any sort of due process. It’s a fair criticism. While that group was planning to kill him and some action had to be taken against them, Wei had formal structures for such an event. Sima Shi bypassing them entirely is worthy of criticism.
Sima Yi used to express his admiration of the Prince of Qi and would say that he was worthy of being a sovereign; he thus fixed the relationship between sovereign and subject. Having served as guardian for fifteen years, he wanted to hand the power of government to the Prince of Qi: He inspected arsenals and ordered the bodyguards not to leave their posts without permission. Knowing well his own wickedness and iniquities, which secured blessing neither from the spirits nor from men, Sima Shi dethroned his sovereign under a false command from the Empress Dowager, charging him with crimes. Sima Fu, a paternal uncle of Sima Shi, is by nature good and filial; when he bade farewell to the Prince of Qi, he could not control his grief; and the multitudinous officials were all angry at Sima Shi. But Sima Shi was insensitive and did not pay attention to the cardinal principle governing the relationship between a subject and his sovereign. This is his sixth crime.
This one speaks for itself. Guanqiu Jian is denouncing Sima Shi’s removal of Cao Fang under a forged or forced command from the Dowager. That definitely happened. Even if the details are a bit muddled by contradictory sources, Sima Shi certainly used his power to remove an inconvenient sovereign. This is probably the most significant charge Guanqiu Jian could point at him, and arguably the only one that matters.
Then again, the late guanglu dafu Zhang Qi was innocent of any crime, yet he put him, his wife, and his children to death. Even the mother of the State, the Empress, was affected: he pressed the August Person to send her away. At that time, all were grieved and astonished, there being none that did not lament. Yet Sima Shi called it felicitous and rejoiced. This is his seventh crime.
This, too, is related to the conspiracy with Li Feng, Xiahou Xuan, etc. Seems a little sloppy of Guanqiu Jian to put it here.
Since the accession to the throne, Your Majesty, intelligent and martial, has applied his mind to all matters; he wanted to economize and make things simple. The Whole Empire, hearing of this, rejoiced. Yet Sima Shi would not improve and repent, nor practice the due obligations of a subject; instead of doing this, he levied troops and brought havoc to the palace, the feudal lords taking their own protective measures. At the beginning of Your Majesty's accession to the throne, he did not appear at Court to pay homage. When Your Majesty wanted to visit him at Sima Shi's home to inquire after his ailments, he refused to admit you, thus disobeying the laws of the land. This is his eight crime.
This is discourtesy to the emperor. Certainly a capital offense, though I don’t know if we have any evidence of it beyond Guanqiu Jian’s words. Of course, given the circumstances under which Chen Shou’s records were written, there is reason to be a little cautious about what he might have omitted.
Recently the lingjun Xu Yun had been appointed zhenbei jiangjun. Because he had made a gift of government property, Sima Shi impeached and punished him. It is true that he was merely banished, but he killed him by making him starve on the road. Hearing of this, the whole Empire grieved. This is his ninth crime.
Guanqiu Jian criticizes Sima Shi for his treatment of a respected official Xu Yun. This is all accurate. He committed a minor crime and was dismissed, which (indirectly, as Guanqiu Jian admits) led to his death.
The defense of the three quarters had become deficient, but he selected picked troops in large numbers to serve as his guards; the troops in the Wuying had become deficient, yet he would not supplement their number. Arms and weapons he took in quantities for his own barracks. The whole Empire knows of it and every one resents it; rumors course through the highways of the land, and the Empire is suspicious. This is his tenth crime.
Guanqiu Jian charges Sima Shi with building up his personal guard and resources while neglecting the needs of the state. However it should be noted that Guanqiu Jian speaks in terms of rumors and things “everyone knows” so this charge might not be authentic.
By profusely granting leaves of absence to the troops, he would win praise and make the four quarters empty of troops. He monopolizes power in order to exult his vicious intentions. He drafts men for the military agricultural colonies; he distributes rewards and obstructs the military work. He dares to disturb the ancient laws: he has the various feudal princes and dukes assemble in Ye, his intention being to kill them all. On one day he started a coup d'etat and dethroned his sovereign. Since Heaven does not help the wicked, it made his eyes swell, so that his attempts were frustrated. This is his eleventh crime.
In this last charge Guanqiu Jian says first that Sima Shi is taking measures to make himself popular with the army at the expense of its effectiveness and proper conduct. That’s probably accurate. It also reiterates the criticism for removing Cao Fang, which is certainly fair. However Guanqiu Jian also accuses him of planning to kill all the various members of the Cao clan in Ye, which doesn’t seem to have ever been on the table. That part is probably rumor or slander.
So all in all, I’d say that the charges are more accurate than not. Sima Shi was absolutely guilty of the most serious accusations, even if others aren’t quite so straightforward as Guanqiu Jian suggests.
11 notes · View notes