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temnurus · 1 month

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LWJ POV Fic Recs

I've done a WWX rec list, so I thought it was about time I made one for Lan Zhan, whom I adore & can never get enough of. The fact that we couldn't see into his head during canon will forever drive me mad, & if this bothers you as much as it does me, boy do I have good news for you! There are not one but two series re-writes from LWJ's POV in this list for your reading pleasure, along with 8 other not-quite-so canon compliant fics that are nevertheless out of this world good. Not gonna lie, people, several of these would make my top 20 if I redid my favorites list today, so I wish you some very happy reading. 😉

he comes in colors by ilip13 (M, 63,596)

Thoughts: The prose was absolutely gorgeous. I loved the author’s writing style, & the way they portrayed how Lan Zhan viewed the world was breathtakingly beautiful. I appreciated the nod in the author’s note about him possibly being read as neurodivergent because I picked up on that, & it felt both familiar & comforting in an I’m-not-so-alone-after-all way. I outright sobbed at some points due to the intensity of the emotions, both Lan Zhan’s & others’.

Wei Ying’s care & consideration for Lan Zhan was very gratifying & lovely to see. The depiction of grief was deeply moving, & the dynamics between all the characters in the story were rich, deep, & very meaningful. This is a new favorite of mine, & I couldn’t stop thinking about it for days after I finished. Fic hangover is very much a possibility with this one, but it will be 100% worth it; I promise you that.

paint smears on sunny days by SnowshadowAO3 (E, 53,808)

Thoughts: Barely anything hurt in this. Like, you could blink past a minimal amount of anxiety. It was mostly an adorable kid fic in which Lan Zhan very quickly found himself falling for his son’s art teacher. Wei Ying being so desperate to spend more time with both of them was heart-meltingly cute, & I loved how he just slotted so easily into their lives it was like he could’ve been there all along. If you like domesticity & gratuitous fluff, then I urge you to give this one a go. I was thoroughly charmed & added it to my favorites list immediately.

The Price of Old Wishes by SoManyJacks (E, 67,793)

Thoughts: This was absolutely fantastic. I crave Lan Zhan POVs, & a fic that was basically canon from his perspective was very much on my wish list. I was so excited when I found it, & I devoured it in a day. The tags that serve as trigger warnings are all referring to events in canon, so there’s not really much that’s going to be a surprise in that respect. If you handled canon, then I think you’d probably be fine to read this fic. I loved the explanation for Lan Zhan’s difficulty with words being selective mutism. It’s the second fic I’ve read with that idea, & I’ve loved both of them. I highly recommend this. It’s definitely been added to my favorites list.

leave all your love and your longing behind by ScarlettStorm (E, 143,609)

Thoughts: This was one of the best modern AUs for Wangxian I’ve ever read. It hooked me from the very beginning, & I absolutely melted at how sweet & caring Lan Zhan was when Wei Ying invaded his house in a panic while trying to escape from the dog that was chasing him. His cat Bunny (so cute) was a love muffin & such a comfort in the moment. The dynamics between the neighborhood help squad Lan Zhan contacted to assist with the dog & its overwhelmed owners were also incredibly heartwarming. This fic expanded beyond a love story into a lesson on the importance of community & treating each other with kindness. I can’t recommend this highly enough. I already know it’s going to be a consistent reread for me. It really is just that good.

When the Lights Come Up by brooklinegirl (E, 50,012) Thoughts: This is more Notting Hill inspired/adjacent than strictly following that story, for which I was actually quite grateful, as there were parts of Notting Hill I wouldn’t have cared for or felt fit Wangxian’s dynamic. I loved Lan Zhan’s characterization in this so, so much. Actually, I enjoyed pretty much everyone’s characterization, even down to side characters like Lan Huan & Nie Huaisang. Wangxian’s chemistry in this was spectacular, & the yearning was FELT. I got so anxious & heartbroken during the angsty bits, but as always, brooklinegirl delivered on that happy ending with aplomb. As someone with ADHD, I lamented the lack of chapters for good stopping places, but this is a minor personal quibble & by no means takes away from the overall brilliance of the work.

Where You Fell by Sweet_William (E, 63,596)

Thoughts: The angst was REAL in this fic, y’all. The intensity of Lan Zhan’s feelings is one of my favorite things about him, & that aspect of his character was fully realized here. I cried like a baby several times in this fic. I probably lost count, to be honest. Wei Ying being homeless & begrudgingly allowing Lan Zhan to help him in small ways at first nearly broke my heart, & then it absolutely shattered into a million pieces when the story hit peak angst later on. Tissues were a necessity, but I promise you that it was all worth it in the end. The slow burn was fantastic & so, so satisfying when they finally got their happy ending. They certainly deserved it. It was very overdue!

to hold the wind by androids_fighting93 (E, 62,474)

Thoughts: I was very excited to read another Wangxian soulmates AU, & this one was particularly interesting with the execution. The first time soulmates touched they remembered a scene from their past lives together. This of course offered a wealth of opportunity for angst with the quality of the memories Wangxian would have of theirs, & it delivered exactly that.

The slow burn was torture, & I cried at a couple of different points, particularly at Lan Zhan stifling his own feelings in order to respect Wei Ying’s boundaries regarding not wanting to remember. This fic also made me incandescently angry at Jiang Fengmian & Madam Yu for being such shitty foster parents & utterly failing Wei Ying (not that it was a new feeling, heh). He got his happy ending eventually, thank fuck, because we all know I couldn’t possibly accept anything less.

And He Knew Those Silver Eyes Were Trouble by PieceofLove

Thoughts: This is basically a series rewrite of The Untamed from Lan Zhan’s POV, though the author does mix book canon in as well, like the Phoenix Mountain kiss, etc. It’s the second I’ve read, though much longer than the first & not quite as well written but only because the bar was set so high by the first! I very much enjoyed this fic. I binged it within a few days, & that’s not bad for a little over 300k. The author clearly adored Lan Zhan (as they should), so it was fun to get their take on his side of the story. I’d absolutely recommend it as worth reading, even if I still like The Price of Old Wishes best of all the Lan Zhan POV rewrites of the series I've read so far.

Adventures in Pet Sitting by raitala (E, 63,003)

Thoughts: Wei Ying was a surprise extra roommate for Lan Zhan when he showed up to his brother’s apartment to pet sit. This was the first fic I’ve read that featured Lan Zhan as the one who was under the misapprehension that he was straight due compulsory heterosexuality. Usually I see Wei Ying placed in that position, so it was an interesting change of pace.

I loved how awkward things were at first & how it built up over time with the intense sexual tension between Lan Zhan & Wei Ying. One of my favorite scenes pre Lan Zhan’s self realization earned the light dom/sub tag, & I was very jealous of Wei Ying for the experience. That’s all I’ll say so that you can find out for yourself. Nie Huaisang was another highlight of the fic. I loved his meddling & the comic relief he provided amidst the Wangxian shenanigans.

varied my velocity by fantasiavii (E, 58,876)

Thoughts: I adored Lan Zhan in this. I have a soft spot for Lan Zhan POV fics, & this one was really well done. His characterization was just perfect. My heart went out to him for the shame he carried surrounding his sexuality. It made me cry at one point. I also really enjoyed the author’s dance background & how it came through in the fic with Lan Zhan’s love of ballet. The banter & intimate moments between Lan Zhan & Wei Ying as they got closer were absolutely fantastic. I really can’t rec this highly enough. It’s a new favorite.

*Edit: So I goofed & had to replace Scales & Arpeggios in this rec list because I forgot it was an alternating POV fic, not strictly Lan Zhan's. I do promise that the brooklinegirlfic is just as good. She's one of my very favorite Wangxian authors, after all.

#mdzs #the untamed #cql #wangxian #lan zhan #wei ying #lan wangji #wei wuxian #wangxian fic rec #Temnurus rec list #this one's for you lwj #bc we love a petty bitch #he's so funny y'all #i love him so much #we goofed but we fixed it!

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fincalinde · 1 year

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Mama Lan

Oh now this is challenging and you are a fiend who will someday pay for your crimes.

a song that reminds me of them

Going to have to pass on this one, I can't think of anything really.

what they smell like

We know so little about her it's impossible to speculate pre-confinement, but post-confinement I presume it would be sandalwood like all the Lans. Let me take this opportunity to raise a point that has also bothered me for several years: unless someone knows more than me about this particular variety (entirely possible!), blue gentians have little if any scent. I believe the roots and other parts of the plant have a stronger scent when processed for extracts or similar, but a mass of blossoming gentians actually wouldn't smell that strongly.

an otp

N/A, we just don't know enough about her for me to have any shipping preferences in that regard.

a notp

While I know there is technically room to speculate that she did come to love QHJ, I don't think it's the most likely conclusion based on the information we have. The idea isn't something that charms and delights me either. I quite like not knowing the details because, although I'm not totally on board with LXC's desire not to know the truth, I think we know enough to be sure that it is not good. The world of MDZS is not a world where a woman who didn't return a man's love somehow conveniently came to fall for him during or after being consigned to solitary imprisonment for the rest of her life.

Reading between the lines I think the most likely sequence of events is that she chose this life over death and therefore her consent to things such as sexual activity is technical at best. I'm sure there's some good work out there around that, but it's not something I would read whether consensual or nonconsensual or ambiguous; the entire situation makes my skin crawl.

Gun to my head I find coercion less distasteful than a theoretical attempt to sell me on a genuine loving relationship existing between these two particular characters.

favorite platonic/familial relationships

Hands down LXC, mostly because this is another example of how LXC's needs are always treated as secondary to LWJ's. I'm fully aware that LXC tells the story of his mother's life and death to WWX specifically to try to communicate something to him about LWJ (I wonder what that could be), but it is still heartbreaking to me that this man describes his brother's grief in detail and doesn't spare a word for his own.

It's even worse to think of how traumatic it must have been to lose his mother, when he loved her just as much as LWJ did but had the additional burden of worrying about and caring for his didi. Both Twin Jades are raised under unfathomable pressure, but LXC's burden is still the greater and he bears it with such grace that no one ever even notices. This is why it's important to note the lengths JGY goes to in order to ensure LXC's comfort and remove as many burdens and stressors from his life as possible.

I also love the little touch that LXC often visits his mother's house—a thing that unless I've forgotten something is not mentioned in relation to LWJ, and that I therefore choose to read as being unique to him. It's nice to imagine that he has his own genuinely private space, even if being in that space is bittersweet. Clearly he feels closer to his mother there than at the family shrine, which is another nice touch emphasising how their love for each other had to exist outside orthodox spaces.

a headcanon that is popular in the fandom but that i disagree with

I am deeply weary of fandom's steadfast conviction that the yassification of any and all female characters is a powerful feminist statement. I think I will just leave this one here.

the position they sleep in

I hope she sprawls all over that damn bed every night, and I hope QHJ never stays long enough to fall asleep in it.

a crossover au i’d love to see them in

I'm not saying never, but my instinct is that I really prefer her to remain as mysterious as she is in canon and not feature directly. That doesn't really lend itself to crossovers.

my favorite outfit they’ve ever worn

The one covered in the blood of QHJ's teacher. I don't even care whether or not said teacher had it coming.

#ask #xiyao-feels #roquen meta #she functions quite well as a nebulous figure #it's funny because we know so much more about ms #despite ms also not featuring directly #and having died before the narrative proper begins #i realise there are explanations for all this #where qhj comes off slightly better #but not better enough for my money #it's just so damning that we know she didn't return his affections #with that as part of the puzzle #there are still multiple ways to fit the pieces together #but without exception all the resulting pictures make my skin crawl

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runespoor7 · 4 months

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nmj/wwx or jgy/wwx or lxc/wwx

Oh, interesting!

I answered under the cut, all three options and a surprise.

NMJ/WWX

don't ship it

Why don't you ship it?

lack of history in canon, I think. never really thought about it, they both die early without much to do with one another, I don't feel like I see what's going on there. I'm very busy shipping them with their respective it's-complicated.

What would have made you like it?

More history between them would have been a good start.

Despite not shipping it, do you have anything to say about it?

ok see the Draw for me here is that I think the in-universe RPF game for these two was insane. Probably unwarranted! Lots of LWJ or JC stuff being given to NMJ for some reason and some Meng Yao stuff given to WWX. But there was a time it was the big YLLZ-era ship. Righteous Chifeng-zun calling out and going to to war against the fallen Yiling Laozu! Action! Drama! Lots of possible captive scenarios! Some stories have WWX be secretly a spy for the Wens during the war and NMJ being unable to prove it, and realizing only after the war that WWX is trying to set himself up as the new WRH! Some stories have WWX save NMJ during the war, only to be corrupted by his demonic cultivation later on! It's definitely the Hot ship at the time.

It falls off in popularity after NMJ's death - it's taken over by WWX/JC (which had started becoming real popular since JC killed WWX; JC gets a lot of the darker versions of RPF!Chifeng-zun's personality traits in those stories) - but it probably leaves a decent smattering of heirs in non-RPF stories. The most popular romance story in the present is from an author who wrote NMJ/WWX, they're not quite expies but iykyk.

(the YLLZ's actual most common ship is YLLZ/Ghost General, in stories where YLLZ is the villain and not part of the main pair. These stories are overwhelmingly NMJ/JYL after she's been widowed by the YLLZ.)

JGY/WWX

don't ship it!

Why don't you ship it?

I have never seen a protagonist and a "main(?) antagonist" care so little about one another and be so perpendicular to each other's stories. The Venn diagram between WWX and JGY is "WWX's sidekick/boyfriend's brother is JGY's bestie" and "the person who wants JGY destroyed threw ideas at the wall and WWX stuck."

It's very interesting. It kind of makes mdzs into the kind of case fic where the case is less important than the emotions. For me, "the emotions," "the plot," was the mystery question of: "how come wwx died? how did it end up that way?"; I suspect ardent wgxn shippers see "the plot" as "how do wwx and lwj get together". In either case, it's got nothing to do with JGY.

What would have made you like it?

so if they did have interactions/history/something I might be into it, but otoh it's such a fun thing that they're just incidental to one another that it would almost be a shame.

(at this point it may become apparent that my answer to everything is "idk, if they'd been childhood friends and had a falling out?" but what can you do.)

This would have been a cool story: WWX and JGY knew one another as kids. Maybe WWX's parents left him at an inn down the street from the brothel Meng Yao lived in when they left on the night-hunt that would kill them.

Maybe bby Wei Ying boasted about his cultivator parents and gave Meng Yao pointers. Maybe Meng Yao gave WWX food once after bby WWX lost his parents. Maybe they played together/hid together. I see something like at most a few weeks of something that someone older would have called a friendship, and then bby WWX disappearing from Meng Yao's life.

Meng Yao remembers the other boy; WWX doesn't.

Depending on how long they were friends you might need to make up a reason why Meng Yao never learned the other boy's real name; maybe part of a joke during their first meeting that WWX refused to clear up later? fits in with WWX's joke to LQY. Or if they did exchange names, you might need a reason why Meng Yao doesn't try to turn his friendship with WWX into something actionable once he learns WWX is head disciple of YMJ. The reason might be as simple as Meng Yao not knowing what became of Wei Ying until after he tried to reach his father the first time. The rejection, the humiliation, the fear of being a laughing stock and or being rejected again, pride - those might suffice to explain why Meng Yao wouldn't throw himself at the mercy of Wei Ying or the Jiangs. (Especially if their meetings were under the sign of bby WWX bragging about his parents or sth like that.)

Keeping canon otherwise the same, this makes for a starting point for "what if" contemplations I'd be interested in.

Despite not shipping it, do you have anything positive to say about it?

I'm very into JGY having Opinions on WWX. there are definitely cool AUs to be made about them.

LXC/WWX

don't ship it

Why don't you ship it?

most of my ships need some... thing from canon. LXC/WWX is a complete mystery. I would be interested in making up stories about them, simply because there would be many stories to tell depending on your starting point. But I'm probably not going to want to spend effort or time on it.

LWJ and his feelings are also very much something that I'd need to consider, from LXC's PoV at least. And that's a lot.

What would have made you like it?

Hm, I dunno. A very different canon? One where they have more history, or more scenes together. Possibly one where I'm more invested in LXC as well.

Despite not shipping it, do you have anything positive to say about it?

Oh yes, it sounds fascinating!

Are we talking about WWX/LXC post-canon, with wgxn either a thing or having been a thing? How do they navigate LWJ's feelings for WWX? Are they going behind his back? Is it sad, or sordid, is it an unexpected friendship that goes deeper than any of them expected?

Or did LWJ die from his punishment while WWX was dead? Is LXC/WWX the relationship in this story because LXC has been mourning for his brother ever since; how resentful of WWX is he? Did LWJ try to get him to promise not to resent WWX? Does LXC try to understand WWX (for LWJ) anyway, does he try to meet him halfway? Does he end up seeing good things in WWX as well? Or it is a destructive urge that drives them together? (There would certainly be a parallel between LXC and JC in a story where LWJ died for WWX. Is WWX projecting? What kind of relationship do LXC and JC have?)

WWX/NMJ/LXC/JGY

I don't ship it but I think if given the opportunity WWX might joke about performing a 3zun hat trick a lot.

And then possibly commit to the bit, the only sort of commitment he's at ease with. (/cheap shot)

Or panic and not do it, given that he's hugely sentimental deep down, but he would love the joke!!!!

#ask meme #wwx #3zun #mdzs #validate my post i have spent a lot of time rotating this ask and i think it's worth it

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ninjakk · 2 years

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Hi! I really like your Metas about MDZS. I want to hear your opinion about this one in particular. When LXC was revealing all that happened at Nightless City, after the "Get lost!" scene, it mentioned that WWX's eyes reddened. I'm quite at a loss on how to interpret this. Was he mad or overwhelmed with emotion that he was about cry? Actually curious of your thoughts on WWX's feelings fluctuating since JGY started mentioning LWJ's pining.

Hi Anon,

Thank you for the ask! I'm glad to hear you're enjoying my meta 🥰

I'll answer your questions in chronological order as it appears in chapter 99, or it might get a little confusing for everyone ☺️

During the scene you are referring to, WWX was as you said, overwhelmed with quite complex emotions. As we know, WWXs emotions were already extremely raw before he even went near Guanyin Temple that night. WWX had just had a huge misunderstanding with LWJ not that long ago. He was absolutely heartbroken, assuming LWJ did not return his feelings and thought he had taken advantage of him while apparently still drunk.

After WWX was caught at the temple alone without LWJ, LXC and JGY were perplexed as to why LWJ is not with him. Ironically, it was JGYs words that sparked a tiny bit of hope within WWXs heart. Obviously I don't think this was JGYs intention, it was more of a way to manipulate WWX by distracting him enough to lower his guard and simultaneously cause him distress. As we know, JGY is a master at using words as a weapon. But I can't help think JGY was also just being a bit nosey and wanted WWX to spill the tea as well 🤣

Jin GuangYao, “Of course not. I just had to comment. HanGuang- Jun spent so many years in yearning, and even today he hasn’t gotten his happy ending yet. Not only does Sect Leader Lan have a good reason to feel impatient, even an outsider can’t bear watching it.” Wei WuXian whirled around, “What yearning? What happy ending?” Hearing this, both Jin GuangYao and Lan XiChen seemed surprised. They examined his expression carefully, as though trying to see if he was purposely pretending to be oblivious. Wei WuXian’s heart suddenly began to pound, like something that had been dead for more than half the night suddenly bursted alive in his chest again. He forced himself to be calm, “What do you mean?

Although WWX was being held hostage, hearing JGYs words instantly made his heart pound - probably from a mixture of excitement, anxiety and worry. WWX was anxious and excited to find out if LWJ felt the same way about him. He wants nothing more than to hear this finally confirmed! But he is probably also feeling a little worried at how LWJ must be feeling right now, if his feelings are indeed returned. After all, WWX brushed off their romp as nothing more than 'guys helping each other out' because he thought LWJ had just sobered up (he sobered up long before) and regretted the situation. He's so desperate to know the truth, his mind is probably frantic at that moment, full of strong emotions.

Hearing that LWJ might actually return his feelings, he pressed LXC to the point he got uncharacteristically angry. WWX was in quite a lot of emotional distress while LXC had his infamous rant. Which I have to say although rather harsh, was only because LXC cares for his younger brother very deeply.

When we arrived, you sat blankly on a rock within the cave. Holding your hand, WangJi was giving you spiritual energy. He kept on whispering to you. But throughout the whole time, you repeated the same two words at him. “Get lost!” Wei WuXian’s throat was dry. His eyes were red as well. He couldn’t say a single thing.

WWX eyes reddened because he was so upset, in so much emotional pain, he was indeed holding back tears. He's just realised how deeply LWJ loves him. He's just found out LWJ saved him and went against his own sect to try and protect him. He's just been told that after all of that, he said nothing more to LWJ than 'get lost'. Obviously WWX was catatonic and wasn't even really aware what was going on, or what he was saying at the time. I've covered this in a previous post, in case anyone wants to read more into the scene - so I won't go into it too much.

WWX has also just found out that he is the indirect cause of the discipline whip scars on LWJ's back. And finally, the thought of all the pain he has inadvertently caused LWJ (both physically and mentally) over the span of both his lives, is too much for him to bear. Not to mention the pain he must be feeling from trying to recall events that have caused him deeply rooted trauma. So it's no wonder poor WWX is close to crying - something which he very rarely does usually.

It's an incredibly emotional chapter and there are lots of feelings flooding to the surface. But at least we know LWJ and WWX do indeed get their happy ending together at last 💞

#mdzs #mo dao zu shi #wangxian #mdzs wei wuxian #mdzs lan wangji #mdzs wwx #mdzs lwj #mdzs novel #ask anon #answered asks #JGY wanted WWX to spill the tea 💁🏻‍♂️

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edensrose · 3 years

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cool cool

then in the honor of ur new pilot post about mdzs, can u write wangxian x fem reader? modern au dates and life at home? :D

thanks!!

hey darling! of course, it's been awhile since I've written for these two <3

ৎ୭ — summary : domestic, modern au with poly wangxian and f. reader

ৎ୭ — type : headcanons

ৎ୭ — genre : fluff

ৎ୭ — warnings : none

ৎ୭ — word count : 551

Alright, so I feel as though modern Lwj would be a businessman - because why note? Modern Wwx would be an art professor and no one can change my mind

I feel as though they are both equally as affectionate with you - of course in their own respective ways. Lwj is more prone to expressing his affection in actions rather than words; he’ll hold your hand or wrap an arm around you - as for Wwx, he can go for both; be it loving pet names or gentle gestures [ like kissing your cheek or cuddling your side <3 ]

Of course, because of their jobs they do get quite busy and may not always have time to spend with you / lose track of time [ especially Wwx, I’m sure he procrastinates the grading of those art projects ]. Although, they’ll always make it up to you, be it taking a day off of work as reconciliation or spending the night with you

At some point you had all decided to move in with one another. Lwj organised the house, nothing unnecessarily big but with enough space so that all three of you could be comfortable

Mornings with them go one of two ways: you and Wwx sleepily snuggling whilst Lwj gets up to his usual schedule, he’ll often make breakfast for both of you. You manage to drag Lwj back to bed [ with a lot of convincing because he’s a little stubborn about his schedule ] and you all lay there cuddling whilst you talk about anything and everything

Although Lwj makes breakfast sometimes, Wwx is the designated cook of the house. He’ll let the two of you join sometimes in if you wish but other than that? The kitchen is his. You’ve had to make sure he doesn’t go overboard with the spice and kill poor Lwj [ or you as well, if you cannot handle spicy food either ]

Lwj takes care of the management of the house. The cleaning, the maintenance, the bills, he doesn’t mind

Spending time with one another consists of either watching a moving or playing a board game. Wwx detests boredom and will always bring something new for you all to have fun with. Lwj prefers the movies, he likes snuggling up to the both of you

Dates with them would range from fancy restaurants and endless mall trips [ courtesy or Lwj ] or amusement parks adventure activities [ thanks to Wwx ]. Sometimes, you’ll even go halfway and have a picnic outdoors; somewhere nice and quiet where you all can relax and enjoy each other’s company - or get chased by Wwx whilst Lwj watches with a little smile on his face

You usually spend your nights with Wwx if Lwj is at work late, which happens more often than you think considering he’s the Co-Ceo of Cloud Corp. Lwj doesn’t like waking you up so late and would rather slip in beside you, falling asleep with his one arm resting on your waist. If Wwx is up grading papers, he always makes it a note to stay in the room and do it at the desk so that you don’t have to feel lonely

All in all, they both adore you very much and make it a point to show this to you however they can, even if it’s just the little things

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rynne · 3 years

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First of all, I'm a Jiang Cheng stan and the ones that introduced me to MDZS are Jiang Cheng stans, Jin Guangyao stans and Xue Yang stans....I'm quite surprised when I found your blog and end up love reading your metas about WangXian and (especially) Wei Wuxian...Thanks for your hard work...

Do you mind if I ask your opinions on Jiang Cheng, Jin Guangyao and Xue Yang?

Hi there! Thank you so much -- I'm glad you enjoy the meta, because I enjoy writing it. :) I'm sorry this took so long, but I've been both considering what I wanted to say and writing it (it got long).

As for my thoughts on JGY, XY, and JC…

The thing is, I'm not generally personally interested in antagonists. There have been exceptions, but mostly I just don't care about them. I enjoy characters who want to and try to do the right thing, even when it's hard. I usually find characters who prioritize themselves or who enjoy having power over people to be pretty boring. I really only care about antagonists in terms of their impact on the story -- plot, themes, and other characters.

So I don't care about Xue Yang at all. I guess it's tragic that he ended up caring about the person he drove to kill himself, but he otherwise gets a big "meh" from me. What I find more interesting about him is what his story says about the cultivation world -- after Nie Mingjue's death, no one thinks him worth standing up to the Jin Sect about, even though he massacred both the Changs and Baixue Temple. This shows the difference that having someone actually willing to protect a demonic cultivator can make. Of course, there are limits to the parallel given the different circumstances, but I do find it notable.

JGY I find marginally more interesting, but not by a lot. Again, what I generally like most about him is what his story says about the cultivation world. Everyone at Lotus Pier after the Second Siege was very ready to believe everything terrible about him, even though WWX was right there pointing out dubious things about Bicao's and Sisi's stories. WWX himself notices with discomfort the mob getting riled up against JGY, given his own experience with the cultivation sect mob. This kind of thing emphasizes the ways in which "mob justice" is an oxymoron -- a mob wants a target, not real justice.

As for JC -- given the way he polarizes fandom, this will be...rather long.

Right now I am only going to discuss my perspective of his canon character (rather than addressing fanon/fandom). Again, I'm more interested in JC in terms of his narrative roles and the impact they have on the story, themes, and characters than I am in his personality. Given his history with the protagonist WWX, he is a pretty significant character, so he carries multiple narrative roles that can each have a lot of weight.

First, I do consider JC an antagonist for most of the story. His opposition to WWX drives the plot in key places, from the beginning of the novel to the end. The threat of JC is what makes LWJ bring WWX to Cloud Recesses:

Lan Sizhui tried to reason with him. “Young Master Mo, Hanguang Jun actually brought you here for your own good. If you hadn’t come with us, Chief Jiang wouldn’t have let you go. These past several years, he’s caught and dragged countless people back to Lotus Pier and tortured them for information. He’s never let anyone go.”

Lan Jingyi said, “That’s right. You’ve probably never seen Chief Jiang’s methods yourself. They’re downright cruel…”

(Chapter 11, Fanyiyi translation)

Cloud Recesses is where WWX's involvement in the main plot kicks off. MXTX therefore uses the threat of being captured and tortured by JC as a way to place her protagonist where he needs to be.

She does this again towards the end of the novel. When the confrontation in Lotus Pier's ancestral hall drives WWX into pain and unconsciousness, the last thing WWX expresses before he faints is his desire to leave. He had not wanted to leave Lotus Pier immediately until the fight with JC.

Lan WangJi, "How do you feel?!"

Wei WuXian didn't answer the question, "Lan Zhan… Let's go."

Go. Right now.

Don't ever come back again.

Lan WangJi, "Yes."

He'd completely lost all intention to continue the fight with Jiang Cheng.

(Chapter 88, ExR translation)

While he's unconscious, LWJ recalls his wishes and takes him away after the golden core reveal. It's the middle of the night, but the clash between WWX, LWJ, and JC is so severe that they just take a boat and go. They don't even have a goal yet -- they just want to get out of there.

And this is what leads them to Yunping in time to catch JGY. (It is further what leads Jin Ling to Yunping as well, since he went looking for WWX.)

In the middle of the story, when the novel flashes back to the events leading to WWX's death, we see what made JC switch from supporting character to antagonist and the impact that had on what happened to WWX. This switch was precipitated by a moral disagreement where the narrative clearly places WWX in the right. In previous moral conflicts, such as JC not wanting to help the other sect heirs in the Xuanwu Cave while WWX wanted to step in, the two of them still managed to come out on the same side. That is no longer the case: JC makes a clear decision not to support WWX so long as WWX will not do what he wants (when what he wants is the morally inferior position of killing or returning the Wen Remnants). JC's decision here places him and WWX on opposite sides.

That decision wasn't the sole factor in WWX's downfall, but as JGY points out, it played a big role.

"Back then, the LanlingJin Sect, the QingheNie Sect, and the GusuLan Sect had already finished fighting over the biggest share. The rest could only get some small shrimps. You, on the other hand, had just rebuilt Lotus Pier and behind you was the YiLing Patriarch, Wei WuXian, the danger of whom was immeasurable. Do you think the other sects would like to see a young sect leader who was so advantaged? Luckily, you didn't seem to be on good terms with your shixiong, and since everyone thought there was an opportunity, of course they'd add fuels to your fire if they could. No matter what, to weaken the YunmengJiang Sect was to strengthen themselves. Sect Leader Jiang, if only your attitude towards your shixiong was just a bit better, showing everyone that your bond was too strong to be broken for them to have a chance, or if you exhibited just a bit more tolerance after what happened, things wouldn't have become what they were. Oh, speaking of it, you were also a main force of the siege at Burial Mound…"

(Chapter 104, ExR)

JC's refusal to support WWX left him on his own, with no one powerful to speak for or defend him. More than that, though, JC specifically named him an enemy of the cultivation world (even though WWX had only suggested announcing his defection). Calling WWX an enemy deliberately and deceptively frames WWX's intentions more negatively. Basically, from that moment until WWX's death, no one except LWJ seems willing to believe WWX might have good or even neutral intentions. Rumors of the time reflect this:

In less than three days, almost all of the cultivators heard a terrifying piece of news: Wei WuXian, the one who defected from the Jiang Sect and made his own home in Yiling, had created the highest level of fierce corpse yet. It was incomparably fast, strong, fearless, and vicious. On top of that, its consciousness was preserved, able to win every night-hunt!

Everyone was in shock: there would be no peace anymore! Wei WuXian would definitely make these fierce corpses on a large scale, in desire of founding his own sect to compete with the cultivation world! And the many young blood of today's age would definitely be attracted by his evil, opportunist path as well, and go to him one after another. The righteous path of cultivation would have a grim future -- dark times ahead!

(Chapter 75, ExR)

People do tend to scare-monger, so we can't say for sure that rumors like these would not have spread if JC had instead said "he and the Wens just want to live on their mountain in peace" or "these Wens helped me, so they and WWX are under my protection." However, WWX's former shidi and sect leader calling him an enemy does give rumors like these more credence. It is possible that this attitude contributed to the willingness of all the sects to come together to pledge to kill him in the end.

JC was the largest contributor to the siege on the Burial Mounds (chapter 7 notes that Jin Guangshan was the second largest, after JC). He didn't kill WWX himself -- as WWX clarifies, he died from a backfire -- but it's pretty clear that the siege led directly to WWX's death.

From the battle at Nightless City, where he was there to participate in the pledge to kill WWX, onwards, JC has consistently opposed WWX and created obstacles for him. The first thing he does upon being presented with someone who might be WWX is, in fact, to try to kill him again:

On the other hand, Wei Wuxian seized the opportunity and ran.

Everyone looked on, shocked. Hadn’t he only avoided the whip because Lan Wangji had stepped in front of him and blocked it? By fleeing, wasn’t he signing his own death warrant?

Indeed, Jiang Cheng seemed to have grown eyes on the back of his head, and seeing that Wei Wuxian had left Lan Wangji’s protection, how could he give up the opportunity to strike? He raised his whip and cracked it aslant. Zidian lashed out at Wei Wuxian like a venomous dragon, landing right in the middle of his back.

[...]

Zidian had a special ability: if it struck a body snatcher, the body snatcher’s soul would immediately be peeled away from the body they had stolen. Zidian expelled the invader without exception. But this person had been whipped, yet behaved just as he did before, bouncing around as usual. Unless he really hadn’t seized the body, there was no other explanation.

Wei Wuxian thought, How useless. Obviously Zidian can’t whip my soul out. I didn’t steal this body, someone offered it to me. Actually, he practically forced it on me!

Jiang Cheng’s expression was surprised but suspicious, and the intention to whip Wei Wuxian again crossed his eyes.

(Chapter 10, Fanyiyi)

The sequence of events here is pretty clear. JC (and LWJ as well) believes that WWX is a spirit possessing Mo Xuanyu's body. JC's spiritual weapon Zidian has the power to expel possessing spirits. By whipping WWX, JC is trying to expel his spirit from his body -- effectively killing him again. This is why LWJ is so determined to protect him here. It's only through a quirk of the sacrifice ritual that JC did not succeed -- and, in fact, WWX knew all of this would be the case and is using it to prove he is not WWX-possessing-MXY. WWX actually relied on JC's intention to kill him here.

He continues to oppose WWX throughout the present-day story of the novel whenever he does appear until the very end.

JC is never the main antagonist, but this is a novel with multiple antagonists who all help drive the plot as they oppose the protagonist. Some of them, like Wen Chao, Wen Zhuliu, Jin Zixun, and Xue Yang, are antagonists pretty much throughout. Some of them go from neutrality to antagonism, like JGY and Su She. JC is, I think, the only significant one to go from ally to antagonist (and then back to just plain supporting character in the very end), but that does not make him less of an antagonist.

And the thing is, his role as antagonist impacts one of his other major roles, which is as foil to the protagonists WWX and LWJ.

A narrative foil is a character who contrasts with another, generally the protagonist, to highlight certain qualities. When both characters have generally equal roles in the story, this contrast is usually pretty neutral, but when one character acts as a foil for the protagonist, it's usually meant to show the protagonist to advantage, though it can also show off some of the protagonist's weaknesses.

When an antagonist is a foil for the protagonist, the antagonist is usually given negative qualities in order to highlight the protagonist's corresponding positive qualities. For instance, an antagonist foil might be cowardly to help emphasize the protagonist's bravery. This isn't always the case -- some protagonists are not meant to be heroes -- but in MDZS, WWX is meant to be the hero (MXTX says, in the postscript, that "[b]oth WWX and LWJ are highly ideal characters, so there wouldn't be too much dispute on their moral standing. They're perfect as the protagonists"), so his foils are generally meant to come off worse in comparison.

So basically...I think JC's role as an antagonist foil means that he was literally created in part to be bad in order to help show off how good WWX and LWJ are.

We see this with LWJ as well as WWX. For instance, both LWJ and JC played a significant role in raising two of the juniors, Lan Sizhui and Jin Ling. The impression WWX gets of both of the boys helps contrast the difference in LWJ's and JC's parenting styles.

Of Sizhui, WWX's impression is:

Wei Wuxian gave this youth a once-over. His demeanor was gentle, refined, and graceful, and the corners of his mouth were lightly upturned, as though they constantly held a slight grin. The flag formation he had overseen was impeccable, and his upbringing was not so bad either. In short, he was a highly commendable young man, and in his heart, Wei Wuxian approved of him, though it amazed him that even in a frightening place filled with uptight fuddy-duddies like the Gusu Lan Clan, there was someone who could bring up such a splendid young man.

(Chapter 2, Fanyiyi)

While the impression he has of Jin Ling is:

Wei Wuxian hadn’t expected Jin Ling to turn up here, much less that Jin Ling would be as arrogant and dictatorial as this. What’s wrong with this child? How did he become so vicious and short-tempered? He’s stubborn and arrogant, and thinks everyone is beneath him. Excellent job picking up his uncle’s and his father’s flaws—but he hasn’t acquired half a speck of his mother’s virtues. If I don’t rough him up a bit, he’ll pay for it big time sooner or later.

(Chapter 20, Fanyiyi)

WWX even draws a comparison between LWJ's and JC's mentoring styles himself:

Jiang Cheng’s next words were wrapped in thorns. “Why are you still standing there? Are you waiting for prey to rush toward you and stick themselves on your sword? If you can’t capture whatever’s living in Dafan Mountain, don’t ever come see me again!”

Jin Ling shot Wei Wuxian a venomous glare, but he didn’t have the courage to glare at Lan Wangji, the one responsible for his forced silence. Placing his sword back into its scabbard, he made polite goodbyes to the two seniors opposite him and retreated with his bow in hand.

[...]

Lan Sizhui smiled slightly at Wei Wuxian and said, “Young Master Mo, we meet again.”

Wei Wuxian pulled on the corners of his lips. But Lan Wangji opened his mouth and issued a command. It was clear and concise, free of any ornamentation. “Complete your task.”

Only then did the flock of juniors remember why they had come to Dafan Mountain. Placing any other thoughts at the back of their minds, they reverently awaited further instructions. A few moments later, Lan Wangji spoke again, “Try your hardest. No recklessness.”

His voice was low and magnetic. The heart of anyone standing near enough would undoubtedly tremble upon hearing it. The juniors obediently followed Hanguang Jun’s orders and walked deeper into the mountain forests, too afraid to linger. Jiang Cheng and Lan Zhan were truly completely different people, Wei Wuxian thought. Even the advice and the warnings they gave their juniors were completely contrary.

(Chapter 8, Fanyiyi)

As we see throughout the story, JC's parenting style towards Jin Ling is rough, angry, and frequently relies on threatening negative consequences. On the other hand, LWJ is more encouraging and prioritizes their safety over results. Under JC, Jin Ling is vicious, short-tempered, stubborn, arrogant, and has picked up all of his uncle's and father's flaws -- but under LWJ, Sizhui is gentle, refined, graceful, impeccable, highly commendable, and a splendid young man.

I have also talked before about how LWJ and JC contrast in what they do with their love for WWX.

But JC is also very significant as a foil to the story's MC, WWX. His choices are frequently contrasted with WWX's to show that WWX has more heroic qualities and a healthier mindset.

In terms of morals, WWX is consistently given the morally superior position to the one advocated by JC:

Jiang Cheng, "It served you right to be bored to death. You shouldn't have played the hero and you shouldn't have cared for such a hell of a thing. If in the beginning you didn't..."

Suddenly, Jiang FengMian spoke, "Jiang Cheng."

Jiang Cheng paused, knowing that he had said too much. He was quiet at once.

Jiang FengMian didn't look as if he was blaming him of anything, but his expression had turned from calm to more solemn, "Do you know in which ways what you just said is not appropriate?"

Jiang Cheng's head hung low, "Yes."

Wei WuXian, "He's just angry and speaking without care."

Seeing how Jiang Cheng's mouth and heart were still at odds, how he still felt defiant, Jiang FengMian shook his head, "A-Cheng, there are some things that can't be said even if you're angry. If you said them, it means you still don't understand the motto of the Jiang Sect, that you still don't…"

(Chapter 56, ExR)

I think there are several major things we see here, but I want to highlight two. First, JC simplifies the Xuanwu Cave situation as WWX "playing the hero." As we see later, with the fall of Lotus Pier all the way through the confrontation at Guanyin Temple, JC seems to have decided that WWX "playing the hero" is what led to the attack on Lotus Pier.

JC is objectively wrong. He acknowledges himself in Chapter 59 that the Wens would have come regardless of what WWX did, while WWX's actions in the Xuanwu Cave were the only effective strategy for actually getting them out of there alive -- JC had wanted to stay out of the confrontation between the Wens and LWJ-JZX, but that would most likely have led to the Wens killing everyone.

More importantly, though, JC's impulses here contrast strongly with WWX's. JC did not want to help LWJ, JZX, and Mianmian. He prioritized self-preservation over helping others. WWX, on the other hand, prioritized helping others over self-preservation, and the narrative validates his choice. JC's priorities would have led to the Wens killing all of their hostages, while WWX's decision to step in allowed all the hostages to live.

The second thing I want to highlight here is JFM's caution that some things should not be said even if you're angry. JFM isn't saying this to be cruel or because he hates JC -- the narrative even says that he did not look like he was blaming JC. But what JFM wants JC to understand is that words said in anger still matter.

JC continues to prioritize self-preservation, and this continues to contrast with WWX's more heroic decisions to help people:

Wei WuXian finally lost his temper, “Jiang Cheng! What- What do you think you’re talking about? Take it back–don’t make me give you a thrashing! Don’t forget. Who was the one that helped us burn Uncle Jiang’s and Madam Yu’s corpses? Who returned to us the ashes that are in Lotus Pier right now? And who took us in when we were chased after by Wen Chao?”

Jiang Cheng, “I’m the one who fucking wants to give you a thrashing! Yes, they helped us before, but why in the world don’t you understand that right now any remnant of the Wen Sect is a target of criticism? No matter who they are, with a surname of Wen they have committed a most heinous crime! And those who protect the Wen are at risk of being condemned by everyone! All the people loathe the Wen-dogs so badly that the worse they die the better. Whoever protects them is against the entire world. Nobody would speak for them, and nobody would speak for you either!”

(Chapter 73, ExR)

This conversation further adds "paying debts" to the moral ledger. WWX is not just helping people here, including an innocent toddler and grandmother, he is repaying the debt the Jiangs owe Wen Ning and Wen Qing. JC is the one pretty explicitly saying that he does not care that he owes them a debt -- he acknowledges it ("Yes, they helped us before"), but he still prioritizes his own self-preservation.

This conversation shows that WWX is even more morally praiseworthy. JC explains that there are strong barriers to doing the right thing, and he lets those barriers deter him. JC's decision to give up in the face of potential adversity contrasts with WWX's decision to persevere and do the right thing anyway.

Though in this case, I don't think it was primarily the adversity that stopped JC from doing the right thing, which introduces another contrast. JC does not want to help the Wens, not because it's hard, but because he holds onto his hatred and resentment of them. WWX, on the other hand, generally does not hold onto resentment very much.

How people handle resentment is a major theme in this story, and one where I think JC's position as a foil is used very effectively to illustrate the negative consequences of holding onto resentment as opposed to WWX's healthier decision to let it go and move forward.

Wei WuXian, “Uh, I think it’s best if you…also stop keeping it on your mind. I know you’ll definitely always keep it on your mind, but, how should I say it…” He clenched Lan WangJi’s hand, saying to Jiang Cheng, “Right now, I do really think…it’s all in the past. It’s been too long. There’s no need to struggle with it any longer.”

(Chapter 103, ExR)

JC is a person who definitely keeps his resentments on his mind. His reputation throughout the present-day story is of a man obsessed with finding WWX again, even though WWX died thirteen years ago. He still blames WWX (and even LWJ, because WWX intervened in the Xuanwu Cave in part to protect him) for the fall of Lotus Pier (Chapter 87), and he has passed that perspective on to Jin Ling (Chapter 43). He continues to hate all Wens, even those who weren't actually related to the Wen Sect (Chapter 92). Half of what JC talks about when he confronts WWX about the core transfer is how finding out about it means he can no longer straightforwardly hate WWX for everything he continues to blame him for, even in that conversation (Chapters 102-103).

WWX, on the other hand, does not want to hold onto resentment. As he tells JC, he thinks it's best if they let it go. Holding onto resentment creates a struggle that prevents people from moving forward. We see this when he's talking to the people who came for the Second Siege of the Burial Mounds in Chapter 82 as well -- you can hold onto hatred or you can move on.

The narrative rewards WWX's path and cautions against JC's.

JC has become the kind of person who, as Jin Ling describes him, "had been cold, severe, and gloomy for years and years on end. Not a single lenient or merciful word left Jiang Cheng’s mouth if he could help it, nor was he ever willing to offer charity and kindness" (Chapter 23). He is unpleasant, and he is unhappy. And then he is punished with WWX leaving him behind and no reconciliation. His father told him that words said in anger still matter, and he disregarded that, and so he is punished with the person he consistently lashed out at deciding to stay away from him. He doesn't get a happy ending because he hasn't earned it.

WWX, on the other hand, decides to move forward. If he had wanted to hold onto grudges for everything that happened to him, he could hate almost the whole cultivation world, but he doesn't decide to do that. He could resent the Lans for their part in the siege, but instead he views them as his husband's family and makes a home with them. He decides to focus on the positive, and he is given a happy ending with the love of his life. The narrative rewards him for his choices and his mindset.

So to return to your original question -- what I think of JC is that he is a cautionary tale. He consistently picks the wrong action, the wrong reaction, the wrong priorities. Part of his role in the story is to be wrong.

And there is nothing wrong with having him do that, because he is a character in a story and this is part of why he exists.

#mdzs #mdzs meta #asks #anon #wei wuxian #lan wangji #jiang cheng #canon jiang cheng #xue yang #jin guangyao #quote heavy posts #antagonists #narrative foils #jc exists to be worse than wwx and lwj

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annalacerda17 · 2 years

Text

Madam Yu is a notoriously unreliable character, and this is shown to us every time she appears on the page. In fact, in the novel it's explicitly stated that much of what she says is nonsense, a product of her anger.

Madam Yu, more than any other character in the novel, constantly contradicts herself. She throws blame around, sometimes placing blame randomly, without caring about the reality of the situation. She then proceeds to dish out punishment, and when the scapegoat of the hour is WWX, she does so with a disproportionate amount of violence. Part of the reason for this is just her venting her frustrations on anyone who happens to be nearby, not caring that she's hurting people who are unrelated to her troubles. Mostly, it's because she consistently makes poor decisions and when things don't work out as she wanted, she proceeds to shift the blame to those around her, placing herself as the victim all the while failing to recognize that, in fact, everyone else is her victim. Those are traits she shares with her son.

Madam Yu chose to marry JFM. They knew each other since childhood and JFM didn't like her personality, and thought they wouldn't be a good match. It was Madam Yu and her family who insisted on the marriage and pressured JFM into it even after he'd already refused more than once, and had made it clear why.

What we see of the interactions between Madam Yu and JFM is that while JFM doesn't seem to feel love and affection towards her, he never disrespects her, and he does recognize her as a leader of Lotus Pier alongside him (despite Madam Yu's ineptitude for the role, evidenced by the way she handled the Wens when they tried to make a supervisory office in Lotus Pier). Madam Yu, on the other hand, seems unable to hold one civil conversation with her husband that doesn't end with her disparaging him, often in front of their children. She uses her children, especially her son, who is JFM's heir, against her husband by repeatedly telling JC that JFM hates him, that he'll never measure up, that he's not as good as WWX, etc in front of both JC and JFM. Note that JFM himself never says or expresses anything, at any point in the story that could indicate he dislikes JC. Quite the opposite. When JC was sad, it was stated in the novel that JFM comforted him gently, JFM's last words are literally telling WWX to protect JC.

Now, JFM does try to educate JC, and the novel states that he's tried to teach him about their sect's ideals many times using different methods, but JC still didn't learn. We're shown JFM trying to teach his son when JC gets jealous and says WWX should have left the other sect heirs and disciples to die in the Xuanwu cave, which is something any parent who cares about their child would do should their child say something like that, especially if that child is supposed to inherit a leadership position in a sect that exists for the express purpose of protecting others from supernatural threats. However, Madam Yu goes out of her way to interrupt and obstruct JFM's attempt to teach JC, and then she proceeds to throw a tantrum in which she claims her husband hates her, hates her son, tells her son to his face that his father doesn't like him and claims her husband cheated on her with his best friend's wife in front of both her son and WWX (the child of said best friend and his wife). She reinforces the idea that JFM's attempts to educate his son, which are shown to us in the novel and can only be classified as very ordinary parenting, mean that JFM dislikes his son and, therefore, trying to be better is useless. This idea is deeply ingrained in JC long before WWX arrived in Lotus Pier, which shows that Madam Yu's behavior has always been such. This kind of thinking is also very comfortable for JC himself, who, like his mother, prefers to blame others the the consequences of his own decisions than acknowledge his mistakes and use them to improve himself. This situation also implies that Madam Yu may very well be the reason (or at least a major contributing factor) as to why JFM wasn't able to teach JC anything. If this crazy lady barges in throwing a tantrum and being altogether a toxic person every time JFM tries to teach JC, it's no wonder her son can't learn anything.

The thing is, Madam Yu chose to marry JFM knowing he didn't want to marry her. When her marriage didn't turn out to be what she wanted, she refused to acknowledge that it was the consequence of her own decision to marry a man she knew didn't want to marry her. She never tried to bridge the gap between them. She chose to live apart from him, she chose to keep only her own people from Meishan Yu by her side, she chose to spent more time away from Lotus Pier than in it, she refused to learn about her new sect, she refused to follow it's principles, she actively drove a wedge between her husband and son, she chose to impede her husband from teaching JC about the sect he was supposed to inherit. She chose to be verbally and physically abusive towards her family. The person who's actively making this marriage worse is not JFM, it's Madam Yu herself. We're shown those things in the novel, so when Madam Yu claims it's all JFM's fault (or worse, WWX's even though he was a child who was completely unrelated to herself, her husband or their marriage), we should be able to identify it as a lie, Madam Yu as an abusive wife and mother and her words as gaslighting.

When the Wen sect demands a bloodline member of each sect and some disciples be sent to them for indoctrination, Madam Yu blames JFM for allowing JC to go and not standing up to the Wens (despite it being clear that the reason is that none of the individual sects are powerful enough to stand up to the Wens), blames JFM for not sending WWX and then blames him for sending WWX, then she outright states that of course JC is going, she accuses JFM of hating her son, tells her son that he'll never be as good as WWX so he shouldn't bother trying all the while blaming him for not being good enough, she blames WWX for being better and blames WWX's dead mother for her marital problems despite CSSR having been happily married to WCZ before her death, and accuses her husband of preferring WWX even though he just allowed teenager WWX to become a megalomaniac's hostage when he could have kept WWX safe by forbidding him from going (since WWX wasn't a bloodline member of the sect and was never a member of the Jiang family, legally or otherwise), and then she blames the Wens for sending WLJ to be the go between person, as she didn't like being told what to do by a servant. It doesn't take much reading comprehension to be able to see that she's throwing blame all around without managing to accurately put the blame where it belongs even once.

Yet, somehow, there are still people who are willing to take her words at face value, or assume she pulled her bullshit from somewhere other than her own head. That's not the case. Madam Yu proves time and again that she doesn't need evidence or reason to accuse anyone of anything so long as she can vent her resentment. She doesn't care about the truth and she doesn't need any evidence, because the things she accuses JFM and WXX of are entirely made up by her in order to take the responsibility of her poor life choices off her shoulders.

And no, she doesn't get a pass for treating WWX like her personal punching bag because she "didn't sign up to care for someone else's child", as I've seen some people argue. That's because she did, in fact, sign up to raise other people's children when she married a future sect leader. A sect leader is responsible for the sect's disciples, and although they aren't exactly like parents, they are somewhat like guardians and teachers. And in choosing to be a sect leader's wife and insisting on holding the position of co-leader of Yunmeng Jiang sect, Madam Yu was precisely signing up to care for other people's children. So, really, nothing excuses her physically and verbally abusive treatment of WWX (and to a slightly lesser degree, her own family members).

#mdzs #Madam Yu #JFM #jiang fengmian #jiang cheng #wei wuxian

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robininthelabyrinth · 3 years

Note

Prompt: JZX is more politically aware, but mostly lonely. When he learns that JGY is his younger brother he's determined to be a good dage. His only examples however, are LXC, who hes not sure is human, WWX who- just- NO, and NMJ, who despite being his sworn brother seems to HATE JGY? So hes on his own. It can't be that hard right? Getting his mom to stop beating JGY is a good start, maybe helping catch up in training? (JGY is about to get so much awkward affection, it mightsave everything.)

ao3

When Jin Zixuan heard for the first time that his father was acknowledging one of his (many) bastards, bringing him home to be recognized as the Jin-er-gongzi, his first reaction was not, as his mother expected, overwhelming rage and disappointment, the way it was for her.

In fact, it was mostly delight – delight, and fear.

He’d known from a young age that he was never going to get any siblings from his mother, and while he’d known in a vague sort of way that his father as a notorious philanderer with bastards aplenty, it hadn’t ever been relevant to his life on account of the fact that none of them were ever acknowledged. He’d assumed that it would always be that way, and for the first twenty years of his life, it was.

Until now.

He was going to have a brother – no, worse. He was going to bea brother, a big brother; that was a position that came with responsibilities. He had to be a good role model, a teacher of all things good and righteous and proper, but also needed to care for them and take care of them – it was, to be perfectly honest, a brand new experience. Through some trick of fate, Jin Zixuan was among the youngest of his cousins and cohorts of his peers; there was something of an age gap between him and the next set of shidi in his sect, and anyway he’d never been expected to care for his shidi in a parental sort of manner – the Jin sect was too concerned with class to allow such closeness without a blood tie to excuse it.

So he was starting, essentially, from scratch.

It might’ve been smoother and more straightforward if he’d met his brother immediately, fresh from the battlefield where all such divisions were blurred and vague; they could have been shield-brothers, that way, and Jin Zixuan might not know much about brothers, but he had fought in a war and knew that much. But his father had whisked Jin Guangyao (and why was it ‘Guangyao’ instead of ‘Ziyao’?) away immediately, insisting that he needed his help with setting up the Phoenix Mountain hunt, so they hadn’t had a chance to meet at that stage. Jin Zixuan realized, of course, that organizing the Phoenix Mountain hunt was a big deal and, probably, a way for his father to show that he trusted his newest son, so he stepped back and kept to himself…well, mostly.

There was that incident with Jiang Yanli.

Either way, though, he didn’t have a chance to get to know Jin Guangyao until they were both back at Jinlin Tower, where the strict rules of etiquette and formality reigned supreme, and when they did Jin Guangyao was perfectly polite and gracious and incredibly fake. It was then that Jin Zixuan realized that he really, truly had no idea how to connect with another person if they weren’t making just about all the effort, and furthermore started to worry that he was being a bad big brother.

Naturally, this called for research.

“Yes, dear,” A-Li said, hiccupping with laughter. She’d agreed to walk in the gardens with him again, and since they were engaged now they could even be left alone – in fact, they were left alone a bit more often than they probably ought to be, which was likely his mother’s hint that children would be better obtained sooner rather than later and little things like marriage dates oughtn’t get in the way of that. “That makes perfect sense. Lots of research. Studious, serious research. What else could you possibly do?”

“You’re laughing at me,” Jin Zixuan said suspiciously. “Definitely at and not with. Have I done something wrong?”

“Not at all! I think it’s quite charming that you think this is the most straightforward way to bond with someone, instead of, say, just going and talking to the person directly – really charming. Delightful. Really! Don’t mind me one bit.” She wiped her eyes. “Now, tell me, who are you planning on talking with first for your ‘research’? Chifeng-zun?”

“No, I don’t think that’s a good idea,” Jin Zixuan said. “I mean, I also thought about him first, since his younger brother is a half-brother as well, but they’ve known each other for ages and ages, haven’t they? Chifeng-zun all but raised his younger brother – he’s more of a parent than a brother! And, well, you know, A-Yao and him…”

“They don’t really get along,” Jiang Yanli agreed. “You’re right, he’s probably not the best person to ask. Who else, then? Zewu-jun?”

“I don’t think I could live up to his example even if he sat down and advised me on how to do it,” Jin Zixuan said sincerely. “I mean, he’s just �� you know? He’s perfect.”

“Too perfect,” Jiang Yanli agreed, and that was why he loved her quite so desperately. “Almost like a painting – nice to admire from afar, but a little lifeless up close…anyway, you wouldn’t want Jin-er-gongzi to end up like Hanguang-jun, would you?”

Jin Zixuan most certainly did not want an overly rule-abiding, stiff-faced disciplinarian as a younger brother. No thanks!

“So he’s out,” Jiang Yanli mused. “Who else is left?”

Jin Zixuan coughed. “Meaning no offense,” he said. “But, uh…I don’t think it’d be appropriate…”

“Oh, no, definitely don’t use A-Xian as a role model!” Jiang Yanli appeared mildly alarmed at the thought. “He and A-Cheng love each other, but things were always a little complicated – no, definitely don’t do that.”

Jin Zixuan exhaled in relief: crisis averted.

“Is there anyone else you might ask? I don’t think I know any others of your peers that are older siblings.”

“Not in the Great Sects, no. But anyway, I was thinking…well, I don’t know if it’s a good idea or not –” He wasn’t exactly a strategic genius. “But I was thinking of approaching it from the other direction.”

“Oh?”

“A good older brother is judged primarily by the younger brother, right? If you’re a good older brother on paper but your younger brother hates you, there’s no point. So I was going to ask the younger brothers and see what it was about their older brothers that they liked.”

“An interesting strategy,” Jiang Yanli said.

Jin Zixuan frowned. ‘Interesting’ might be the word most often used when he proposed plans, but it usually didn’t actually mean that the other side agreed with the plan. Certainly Chifeng-zun had said several times that several of his proposed battle tactics were ‘interesting’ and he’d never even once used a single one of them. “What’s wrong with the idea?”

“Oh, nothing, nothing…it’s only…”

“Only what?”

“Think about who you’d be asking,” Jiang Yanli said. “What would Nie-gongzi be likely to say?”

“…probably that a good older brother is one that indulges all his whims, never makes him do anything, and buys him stuff.” Jin Zixuan grimaced. “A-Yao is far too talented for such treatment; he’d think I was being condescending and treating him like a child.”

“Mm, likely yes, I’m afraid. And A-Cheng would probably clam up immediately, refuse to answer, and then, if you did manage to get it out of him, say that a good older brother would be one that was there all the time doing his job.”

“But A-Yao already does his job! If anything, he’s overlyconscientious about it!”

“Exactly.”

“And the only other one to ask is Lan Wangji,” Jin Zixuan realized. “And he won’t say anything at all, because he’s a lump of rock that doesn’t speak!”

Jiang Yanli snorted. It sounded involuntary, distinctly resembled the sound of a pig, and she looked momentarily shocked that the sound had come from her, so he pretended not to notice.

“I’m doomed,” he moaned. “I don’t know how I’m going to do this…A-Li, you must have some other suggestion!”

“Well, I might have one,” she said, and he looked eagerly at her. “It involves you actually having a conversation with A-Yao, though.”

“Oh, well, that’s sure to fail,” Jin Zixuan said, and now she was laughing again. “I mean it!”

“We’ll think of something, I’m sure,” she said, giggling. “Don’t worry. With both of us on the task, I’m sure we’ll get things in proper shape!”

#mdzs #jin zixuan #jiang yanli #my fic #my fics

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gloriousmonsters · 2 years

Note

wen ning for the character ask meme :3c

for you, and the anon that asked for WN!

one aspect about them i love

I really like how on the surface he's like 'i'm a sweet and nervous boy you can push me around no problem' and then underneath it's like 'I Also Have Seething Rage The Likes Of Which You Cannot Imagine'. but it's not really that the top layer is false - he is sweet and caring and socially awkward, it's just there's also The Rage, and sometimes it comes out in hellish undead screaming and sometimes it comes out in kicking jiang cheng's ass verbally six ways from Sunday. love it.

one aspect i wish more people understood about them

honestly just. see above

one (or more) headcanon(s) i have about this character

one of the only things he regrets losing from being alive is his archery ability. mostly his undead angst is pretty low - he's happy to be back in some capacity, his golden core wasn't that great anyway, he's always been sort of awkward and stiff and had a hard time interacting with other people - but he worked really hard at archery and he was good and Wei-gongzi complimented him for it. and now he just doesn't quite have the fine control and coordination to do it :(

one character i love seeing them interact with

Wei Wuxian, obv. TBH ningxian is my main point of interest with both these characters, so I love seeing them together - I especially love how cql chose to adapt some things, like how devastatingly romantic they made the moment where Wen Ning hears WWX's flute again.

one character i wish they would interact with/interact with more

I wish we saw more of Lan Wangji and Wen Ning interacting! I love their vibes of like... they're both people who deeply, obsessively care about wwx and are scarily protective of him, and they never had much cause to meet or know each other before, so it could have gone so badly, but instead they meet and (not counting drunk!lwj's jealous fit in the novel lol) they're just kinda like 'oh this guy's alright' and then they see the other one go crazy for wwx and they're like 'oh this guy's REALLY alright'. and there's that moment - I can't remember the occasion, but wwx gets annoyed because something WN says makes it clear him and LWJ are talking behind his back, and WN is possibly letting LWJ order him around a little bit which. Juicy??? pls show me more

one (or more) headcanon(s) i have that involve them and one other character

wen ning as a teen was 0% interested in medicine but dutifully learned some basics so he could assist his sister bc jiejie was very insistent on how it would be better for him to be her assistant than trying to actually be a fighter (meanwhile teen wn was just like but jiejie i crave violence 🥺). In present day & postcanon, wn clings to the basics he still knows - some that he can perform himself, albeit with a lot of difficulty, some that he can instruct people on how to do - because it's one of the few things that still make him feel connected to his sister. every time he tells the juniors the way to set a broken bone he'll reiterate that it was his sister, the greatest doctor that ever lived, who taught it to him.

#character ask meme #wen ning #wescravings

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antebunny · 3 years

Text

Parent Trap AU Part 2

...with a side of on-the-run hacker!wwx AU and celebrity!lwj AU. Full series here).

“It’s not going to work,” Wei Sizhui says when they corner him after breakfast the following morning.

The three boys fold their arms and block the path, as if Wei Sizhui can’t just walk around them on the grass.

“Why not?!” Ouyang Zizhen wails.

“You don’t understand,” Lan Jingyi wheedles. “This is the most interesting thing that’s ever happened to me. Yeah my uncle is a celebrity, but he’s so boring.”

Jin Rulan huffs. “Why do we even need his help? We can just find him on the last day of camp!”

Wei Sizhui pinches the bridge of his nose with two fingers. He can feel a headache coming on. “Guys. No. They really cannot meet,” he says.

“But why not?” Ouzang Zizhen says again.

“Because,” Wei Sizhui says patiently, “my dad is wanted for kidnapping. Kidnapping me. From my other dad.”

All three of them just stare at him.

“So if your uncle met my dad while I’m there…” Wei Sizhui shakes his head. “That’s really just bad.”

Lan Jingyi plonks himself down on the paved path right there. “Okay, wait, wait,” he says. “Explain this to us again.”

“We have class in twenty minutes,” Jin Rulan complains, but he sits down too.

“Yeah!” Ouyang Zizhen hurries to scoot in between them. “Tell us the story, Sizhui.”

“I told you yesterday,” Wei Sizhui protests, but when none of them so much as blink, he sighs and sits down as well. “My dad was in prison,” he begins, and they all nod along. “Someone hired by the Jins attacked him in prison and he realized that he wasn’t safe, and I wasn’t safe.” They’re still nodding along, so Wei Sizhui continues. “So he broke out of prison,” he finishes, “and took me from my other dad’s house, and we’ve been on the run ever since.”

They stop nodding.

“But that doesn’t make any sense,” Jin Rulan says plainly. “Why didn’t he go to my mom? Or my uncle?”

“Or Jingyi’s uncle?” Ouyang Zizhen puts in. “Why didn’t he go to Jingyi’s uncle?”

Wei Sizhui shrugs helplessly. It seems rather straightforward to him. He doesn’t understand what they’re confused about. “Why would he? That makes no sense.”

“And why wouldn’t Lan Jingyi’s uncle be a target if you were?” Jin Rulan demands. “They were married! That doesn’t make any sense!”

Once again, Wei Sizhui can only shrug in the face of their questions. “Maybe he thought nobody would expect him to care about an ex who abandoned him.”

“My uncle would never,” Lan Jingyi says, face red. “You take that back! That’s–not what happened!”

Wei Sizhui is indeed taken aback by Lan Jingyi’s insistence. His dad doesn’t talk much about his ex-husband, it’s true. Well, his dad really doesn’t ever talk about Wei Sizhui’s other dad, but Wei Sizhui knows that even after they divorced, his dad still carries their wedding photo around every country they go to, so he supposes he just assumed.

“Yeah, why would Lan Wangji keep a photo of your dad in his wallet if he doesn’t care?” Ouyang Zizhen challenges.

Wei Sizhui rubs his eyes with the heels of his hands. It’s too early in the morning for this. He just wants to go to class and stop thinking about his dad’s former love life. “Can we please just go to class?” He begs.

“No!” Jin Rulan refuses. “Until you explain why we can’t get them to meet!”

“Even if everything does go well, my dad is still wanted for forgery and hacking in half a dozen countries,” Wei Sizhui argues. “What would them meeting do other than make them both sad? And even if Lan Wangji didn’t divorce my dad, he can’t be happy that my dad just ran off with me. It’s been nine years! They’re probably both over each other.”

Wei Sizhui has precious few memories of his other dad, and he’s never quite worked up the courage to ask for more from his dad. Lan Wangji is a tall, sturdy giant in his memories. He recalls large, warm, gentle hands, a deep voice that sung him lullabies, and a steady presence that watched him stick his tiny toddler hands through the bars to pet their two pet bunny rabbits.

But the most vivid memory Wei Sizhui has of his other dad is his warm, steady presence carefully lifting Wei Sizhui away from the glass and blocking his view of his dad. His large, warm hand came down to pat Wei Sizhui’s head, but he was talking to Wei Wuxian.

“I am sorry,” he said. “You cannot see Sizhui anymore.”

“Whose decision was this.” Dad’s voice was distorted through the glass, but even then, Wei Sizhui knew he’d never heard his dad so angry before.

Wei Sizhui clutched his dad’s leg. Pat pat, went the hand.

“I am sorry,” his dad repeated.

“Whose decision, Lan Wangji.”

“...Mine.”

Afterwards, after the yelling was over and Wei Sizhui went home with Lan Wangji, he remembers gripping his dad’s hand with all the strength in his chubby little fingers, like he might disappear at any moment, and asking; “When are we gonna see Papa again?”

Wei Sizhui was too small to see his dad’s face at that moment. Too young to remember whether it was sidewalk or carpet he walked on, what shoes he wore or what the name of the city he lived in was. What he remembered was the way his dad squeezed back, even tighter, and said never.

Wei Sizhui remembers never once considering that his dad could be lying. Not even when he woke up months later, in the middle of the night, to find his dad back and in the middle of a very intense game of hide-and-seek.

It’s been nine long years since then, and Wei Sizhui doesn’t think he wants to see his other dad again.

If only his friends could be convinced of the same.

“That…sounds like a whole lot of excuses,” Jin Rulan says, rubbing his eyes as well.

“He’s not guilty of any actual crimes, just cool crimes,” Lan Jingyi asserts. Wei Sizhui wants to scream.

“Your dad doesn’t have to be alone anymore!” Ouyang Zizhen says enthusiastically.

“Hey,” Lan Jingyi says. “Don’t be mean, he has Sizhui.”

Wei Sizhui instantly forgives him for everything. Still, he thinks his dad could be perfectly happy without Lan Wangji. Maybe without the Jins after him, and the FBI, but the idea still stands.

“Guys,” Wei Sizhui intervenes, trying to stave off the coming argument, “it doesn’t even matter, because my dad’s not gonna be here on the last day of camp.”

“What? Why not?” Jin Rulan squawks.

“He’s picking me up two days early,” Wei Sizhui explains. “So that he’s not seen by any of the other parents.”

Summer camps care far less about identification than they do about money, which is a bit of a problem because it’s far easier for Wei Sizhui’s dad to forge identities for them than to open a bank account. If there’s one time that someone actually manages to track down his dad, it’ll be through the money he’s spending on Wei Sizhui’s summer camp. So just in case, they’re disappearing two days early.

The plan is for his dad to break into the camp two nights before the end of camp. Wei Sizhui’s been keeping him updated on the best ways to do so.

The three of them are staring at him again.

“The campus security is pretty terrible,” Wei Sizhui adds thoughtfully.

“So…you’re just going to disappear?” Jin Rulan asks blankly. “When were you going to tell us?”

“Tell you?” Wei Sizhui asks, equally blank. “Why would I–that ruins the whole point of sneaking out two days early! We have to ditch everything. Phones, the fake bank account, the passports, everything.”

“But then how would we keep in touch?” Lan Jingyi asks plainly. “How would we text?”

“We wouldn’t?” Wei Sizhui says uncertainly. “We wouldn’t stay in the country after disappearing from a summer camp. I mean, I don’t know where we’re gonna go, but–somewhere. Probably Thailand,” he adds pensively.

There’s complete silence for one stunning moment.

“Wow,” Jin Rulan says flatly. “Is this is how Jingyi’s uncle felt when Sizhui’s dad disappeared?”

“Probably,” Ouyang Zizhen says.

“No, no, we can work with this,” Lan Jingyi declares. “We just need to get my uncle here two days before camp ends.”

“And how are we doing that?” Jin Rulan asks.

“Easy,” Lan Jingyi says cheerfully. “I do something that gets my uncle called down here.”

“So, expelled,” Ouyang Zizhen says, nodding along.

“Wait, what?” Wei Sizhui says, baffled, but nobody’s listening.

“Exactly,” Lan Jingyi says, beaming. “My uncle will forgive me once he learns why I did it!”

“But what is he getting expelled for?” Jin Rulan asks curiously.

Lan Jingyi grins, and a shiver runs down Wei Sizhui’s spine despite the heat of the morning summer sun shining behind him. It's a smile that says there's little he won't do to see Wei Wuxian and Lan Wangji reunite. At least Jin Rulan and Ouyang Zizhen also look a little apprehensive.

“Hacking."

#y'all asked for it #the juniors #lan sizhui #jin ling #lan jingyi #ouyang zizhen #lan wangji #wei wuxian #mdzs #the untamed #mo dao zu shi #my writing #writeblr #antebunny's ficlets

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llycaons · 2 months

Text

ep13 part 2: GOD yes. this scene is somehow even more homoerotic than the manga.

progressively insane things to say about a friend/sister/stranger's skeleton

OUGH this was such a cool panel in the manga. the shock! the jolt of horror! idk if they've captured it as well here. the blood makes it all like quite flat

but overall what a sweet reunion <3 dunmeshi is a very feel-good story. and now it's BATH TIME!!!!!!

holy shit. the warm atmosphere, the full color, the voices. this is so much more real and intimate animated....and I like how her resurrected nude body wasn't sexualized at all. this part here I'm a lot more comfortable being a little hot bc it's in a private place with someone she trusts and cares for a lot. and maybe even..like likes...

oh she's so pretty with her bubbles

MARCILLE BOOB. they're both acting like they're really into each other and like touching each other but also get flustered if the other one is too forward. like they know subconsciously but not quite conciously. this is I think what wwx from the novel was supposed to be like except he was more annoying and less respectful of boundaries so he was mostly doing sexual harassment :/

aww. what a nice scene. i definitely followed all the dialogue

marcille being unashamed of her pursuits and pointing out that even healing magic is used to torture people is really cool. and she's right! magic IS just a tool! also I don't really understand how this resurrection was different from normal ones. is it because she used her own blood in the beginning?

farlyn and senshi even in the same scene has me 🥺

DRAGON PIZZA, cooked in the dragon fueled by the dragon's own fat and on the dragon's own armor, which is of course fireproof. I had forgotten! oh this rules

I just can't stop screenshotting....every scene is more delightful than the last. I love this so much. her enthusiasm, the weird irony of the situation, senshi's kindness

SHE THINKS LAIOS IS COOL AND SO IS EATING MONSTERS. I love them

this is exactly the expression a proud and indulgent older brother would wear when he's impressing his little sister....god I really love them so much. yeah yeah complexity and heartbreak and murder and betrayal are all very compelling but I love their straightforward affection and support for each other. well ig their relationship does involved killing whoops

#dunmeshi anime lb

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danhoemei · 3 years

Note

What do you think of the reconciliation of Wei Wuxian and Jiang Cheng that is confirmed (post canon) in Lan Wangji's letter?

Tbh I just learnt something new from you anon lmao.

First of all, let's establish the post canon here, as I found that it's from cql. I come from the novel so I had no idea about it.

Although all adaptations spring from the same source, all of them have smaller or bigger differences and divergences. Thus, it's not that easy to say what is "canon" here, e.g. something that happens in the drama doesn't mean that it's canon for the novel as well, and the other way around, and as I've seen so far both are quite different in some aspects, maybe even with a few contradictions.

Another thing is the source of the information. For me the strongest will always be the source material, and additional bits of information from interviews, author's posts etc. can be treated with less weight. I had experiences in other fandoms or media where the author started spewing nonsense out of spite, or literally contradicted what was in the original story, so since then I take additional bits added post-release as a free candy which I can take or not.

Now, coming back to mdzs's adaptations. The manhua and donghua are considerably close to the novel, so I consider the novel as the scroll of truth here. However, when it comes to the drama I kind of think of it as an alternate version with its own rights, and I personally pretty much separate these two. So I'd say that the letter could be treated as canon for cql, but not necessarily for the novel.

So now the question is, do I take this candy?

Gods in all heavens, heck yes.

Even though I treat all adaptations more or less separate, there are certain parts which I will fiercely headcanon no matter what, in all of them. And one of these things is that yunmeng bros need each other and will gravitate towards each other whether they want it or not. Initially, the main reason could be only jin ling. They love him and care about him, so even if both of them avoided each other they would still have this connection and possibly bump into each other from time to time. Jin ling is the last part of their family who they loved very much, but both of them are also these last bits of it. And it is very clear how strong a family instinct they have. Yunmeng is also wwx's home, where he grew up and what he longed for many times, no matter how much time passed. He would want to come back there from time to time, even if he was thrown away from lotus pier. What about jiang cheng, who threw him out? Even when he shouted at wwx to leave (before the whole golden core revelation), to me it seemed like another thing he spouted in the heat of the moment when his emotions and grievances took reins, as he instantly froze and tried to stop wwx who complied and turned away. So I don't imagine him taking excessive steps to keep wwx away later on, especially after his approach changed quite significantly towards the end, even towards wen ning who he initially hated with every fiber of his being.

And don't get me wrong - I don't see them as sweet bros longing for each other who just need to sit down once and talk and it'll be dandy. They have a ton of issues (mostly on jiang cheng’s side) and unspoken secrets between each other which are not easy to disclose but which hold them back very significantly. Mostly jiang cheng needs to change for this to happen, let his thick as hell walls drop a bit to be less on guard and be more open, and stop constantly hurting others because of his lack of control and toxic coping mechanisms. All that stems from childhood trauma, severe inferiority complex, pathological parents who didn't give him support and love he needed. But not one thing from these justifies his behaviour and how he compensates or lashes out when anything triggers him. Still, in the root of his being is love and care for his family, which could be seen so many times when he made sacrifices in order to protect his loved ones or the whole sect, each time when he's overprotective of jin ling, also each time he helped wwx despite being very vocal about the opposite. He's a contradictory character with tons of issues, which he unfortunately takes out on others.

So their reconciliation in my eyes is not gonna be easy and fast. It's a long and bumpy road, began with a long period of absence from each other's lives, then featuring arguments or clashes, unsaid feelings, secrets, and sacrifices finally spilling (probably in shouting voices and tears). I like to think that with time jiang cheng could mature emotionally and learn to be healthier, not only thanks to being surrounded by people who love him and care for him, but also because maybe those people could open his eyes on his behaviour and teach him a bit. As jin ling grows older, he could get bolder and more confident, and say what he doesn’t like about his uncle’s way of being or treating others. I also like to imagine wwx being more direct in his grievances or reproaches and basically being done with jiang cheng’s bs, because he is now happy, with lwj by his side, and may learn to prioritise himself instead of constantly giving to others and sacrificing himself and his own comfort. If jiang cheng is like that then why should wwx deal with him, if he doesn't feel like it? So what if it's jiang cheng who needs to swallow his pride and finally make the first move, if he actually wants any kind of contact with his brother? Maybe there is a banquet at yunmeng after a long time passes, and he invites wwx. Maybe it doesn’t go so well but later on they still keep bumping into each other and having smaller or bigger conversations, maybe meanwhile jin ling gets involved in something and they collaborate to help him. Bit by bit, I like to think that they both slowly (and finally) learn and understand each other more. And that at some point they'd be like a true and close family, not the one they were - something different, more grown up and mature. That they can travel to each other, have casual conversations and goof around, maybe steal some lotus pods together again, but this time with more mirth and fun than those competitive teenage years way back.

I just... want these two to be happy and there for each other ;__; They lost so much, but they still have each other and I don’t want them to forget that as well, especially when they clearly have so much love and care in them ;___;

So yes, I am very much into taking the letter as a general canon for me, because this is already what I headcanoned anyway ;d

And just a reminder! This is all my own self indulgent headcanon based on my interpretation of these characters and their relationship (rather from the novel’s perspective, I can’t talk with confidence about the drama). Take what you want from it, or don’t take anything at all. These are stories made for us to enjoy and reflect on, not fight or spread hate over, so go wild with your imagination and headcanons, enjoy and have fun <3

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canary3d-obsessed · 3 years

Text

Restless Rewatch: The Untamed, Episode 22 part one

(Masterpost) (Other Canary Stuff) (Previous Post)

Warning: Spoilers for All 50 Episodes!

Not Quite Like Old Times

We ended the previous episode in daylight, with Lan Wangji putting Wei Wuxian and swordpoint and declaring his undying love lecturing him about his lack of sword skills.

We start this episode in full night, with the two of them sitting on a roof together. Presumably they spent the missing scenes getting dinner in the mess hall, doing some laundry, and definitely not making out. Fic writers, do your thing.

Finally, FINALLY, Lan Wangji has chilled out enough to actually sit and listen to Wei Wuxian, instead of yelling at and/or physically attacking him. The Zoloft is really helping!

Wei Wuxian is indulging in romantic recollections of their first rooftop encounter. Lan Wangji, who has loved him since he first laid eyes on him and who wrote a whole song with an entire music video about their love, featuring that very same rooftop encounter, shuts him down so completely he might as well have whipped out Bichen again.

First he corrects his description of events by pointing out they were fighting, not talking, back then. Then when Wei Wuxian continues in his charming, smiley reminiscing vein, Lan Wangji says "things change, how could they stay the same" with a deep, sad, weariness.

He seems like an old man in this moment, and I feel for him, really, I do. But he's not the one who's carrying the actual essence of death around inside him. Wei Wuxian is being much more generous in this interaction than Lan Wangji is.

Wei Wuxian thanks him for not narkng to Jiang Yanli about the whole talisman/forced suicide/ghost hummer/ghost flaying thing he did back in Yiling. Like there is any way Lan Wangji would ever tell Jiang Yanli, of all people, something like that about Wei Wuxian. He's lying to his own brother to cover for Wei Wuxian, and Wei Wuxian totally doesn't get it.

(more after the cut)

Unfortunately, there's no reason Wei Wuxian SHOULD get it, at this point; Lan Wangji has not communicated anything but disapproval to him since his return, and Wei Wuxian, despite their (apparently temporary) mental linkup in the Turtle cave, is not a mind reader.

Lan Wangji is so hurt here, and Wei Wuxian appears to ignore that, continuing to smile and laugh; he’s still sunny, still happy. Seriously, they are so tonally out of step with each other in this conversation, it's excruciating.

Lan Wangji: I’m feeling good about my tear-holding-back ability Wei Wuxian: do I look more fuckable sitting up? Or leaning back?

But every one of these smiles is an absolute lie. This is Wei Wuxian appeasing an authority figure; baffling with bullshit and skating by on charm. This is not a young man confiding in his soulmate.

Even when the conversation shifts, and they talk seriously about what is going on with him, Wei Wuxian is barely confiding anything. He briefly acknowledges that he was in the Burial Mounds for three months, and shudders at the memory, but Lan Wangji doesn't respond to that other than to look away from his face.

This is almost the last thing Wei Wuxian will ever say to anyone about that experience. He only alludes to it again when Jiang Cheng visits the settlement and talks smack about their corpse turnips. Lan Wangji says he wants to know why Wei Wuxian’s cultivation changed, but he really doesn’t; he just wants to convince him to change it back.

Wei Wuxian explains about using Lan clan techniques to protect his temperament, as well as the flute and talismans, to control the resentful energy. This is a good reminder that Wei Wuxian was never a bad student. He was an outstanding cultivator within the Jiang Clan, and he learned a hell of a lot during his time in Gusu, despite getting expelled for fighting.

His original golden core was stronger than Jiang Cheng's, even though he apparently started cultivating later. Yes, he fell asleep during meditation that one time in Episode 43, but that's not because he's bad at meditating, it's because he was tired from getting railed all night by his boyfriend stabbed in the gut by his nephew.

Lan Wangji eventually manages to ask him a question like an interested fellow human being sharing knowledge, instead of like an authoritarian dick calling him to account.

Side note: I still am flopping around trying to find good-sounding English terms for Chinese philosophical concepts. I kind of like "ghost path" vs "sword path" for the two styles of cultivation - I don't know where I saw that, apologies to the translator. I like "necromancy" for the part where the dead are reanimated and controlled, because we definitely have that in English. But there are many layers of nuance in these conversations that English is not equipped to render in a natural-sounding way.

Lan Wangji tells him, again, that it's dangerous, but this time he does it in a gentler and more poetic way, saying it's like taking grain from a burning fire, and says he's in danger of becoming the novel version of Wei Wuxian a demonic cultivator. Wei Wuxian, also gently and seriously, says he knows.

Then he immediately goes back to his lightest tone and promises, with his three-fingers gesture, that he will not fall into demonic cultivation. This gesture is basically the Wei Wuxian "I am totally fucking lying" salute.

He is totally fucking lying, and he MUST know it. He's baking the Yin tiger amulet every day during his meditation, getting ready to use it against Wen Ruohan, getting ready to take over his army of the dead.

He has the audacity to ask Lan Wangji, "do you believe me?" and Lan Wangji, also totally fucking lying, nods. Their relationship is just as broken right now as it was before their courtyard sparring session.

You can tell it's broken, because after they've reached this apparent place of peace, Wei Wuxian just hops down off the roof and LEAVES Lan Wangji sitting by himself. When has Wei Wuxian ever been like "gotta go!" with Lan Wangji? The last time they were here, he spent the night sleeping on the roof tiles just so he could be near him.

As he leaves, Lan Wanji stands up and says "let me help you." Wei Wuxian is not a fan of that idea, at all, if his expression is any guide.

He agrees, though, and leaves smiling, apparently for real, but maybe just practicing for all the fake smiles in his future.

Hooray for War

In the morning, Nie Mingjue makes an angry speech to the 2 dozen cultivators who apparently make up the army. Extras are expensive, y'all.

The senior cultivators are standing to the right or left of him, with the Lan brothers bracketing the Yunmeng sibs. Lan Wangji and Jiang Cheng are both staking their claim to Wei Wuxian, while Lan Xichen is standing in the spot closest to Nie Mingjue; Nie Huaisang is on the opposite side with the Jins.

All of the random cultivators yell a war chant in response to Nie Mingjue's speech, while the senior cultivators are like, we don't have to do that yelling stuff, thank goodness.

Nie Mingjue's war outfit includes metal (ish) epaulets on his shoulders and a totally not-kinky belt featuring multiple rings with nothing attached to them (yet) and an angry demon face right above his junk.

Nie Mingjue says we're going to storm into Nightless city and I'm going to chop off Wen Ruohan's head! By which he means, I'm going to get captured and get my ass beat, and then my murder-babie ex-boyfriend who had this belt specially made for me is going to stab Wen Ruohan in the back while he's distracted. They do say no plan survives contact with the enemy.

Side note: Baxia makes a loud metallic "shnk" noise when NMJ takes it off his back during this speech, even though Baxia does not have a scabbard. You do you, Baxia.

All the senior cultivators file out down the center while everyone else parts to let them pass. Then everybody does the Electric Slide.

Jiang Cheng tells Wei Wuxian they should go ahead of the main force to get some killing in early, but Wei Wuxian just pulls a face and looks down, staying with Lan Wangji.

Jiang Cheng is disappointed, and no doubt takes this as a sign of WWX choosing LWJ over him. But actually, WWX can't fight side-by-side with Jiang Cheng without showing his weakness.

LWJ and WWX exchange one of their unspoken "let's go" eye touches and get ready to ride out together with the main force.

Lan Wangji is still super, super sad. Wei Wuxian is still fake. But something is starting to knit together between them, and once they can hit a battlefield together, it will get a lot stronger.

On A Horse With No Name

Everyone rides out on horses, which will presumably get eaten somewhere along the way, because they appear to travel on foot after this. While Wei Wuxian practices his horseback-flute-twirling, Lan Wangji asks why Wei Wuxian didn't go with the forward force to fight.

Wei Wuxian says that he has a case of the don'wannas, and Lan Wangji snarkily points out that he used to like fighting. Wei Wuxian reacts, just as he did at the end of their sword fight, with embarrassment, and doesn't answer.

Lan Wangji, sweetie. You are really not helping.

At this point, despite their ongoing fighting, Wangxian are clearly together again. Lan Wangji isn't riding with his brother; he's RIGHT next to Wei Wuxian, and will stay close to him through the rest of the campaign.

Nie Huaisang hollers "Wei-Xiong" from the top of the battlements and tells him to take care. Wei-Xiong lifts his flute in acknowledgement while Nie Huaisang looks worried. He doesn't tell Nie Mingjue or Lan Wangji to take care, just Wei Wuxian. Wei Wuxian is his particular friend, more than Lan Wangji is, but he may also be concerned because he can tell that Wei Wuxian isn't well.

Nie Huaisang hasn't yet developed the deep cynicism that he calls upon in his quest to avenge his brother, but he has always been a voracious collector of information, and he is keenly observant.

Side note: what the fuck is going on with this sculpture? Kudos to the artist. This has beautiful forms, and is weird and disturbing. The main head is wearing a horned skull on its forehead, small ungulates that I hesitate to call “deer” chilling on its horns, and...snakes? biting its ears?

Boring Wen Interlude

Wen Ruohan is waving his hands around. Sigh. This is one of the more boring villain performances ever, and it's not the actor’s fault. They could have given him a sidekick to yell at or something, so we could get more than just hand waving. I’ve given up screen capping any of this; there are more interesting things to look at.

Battle Moves

Jin Zixuan and Jiang Cheng and their forces have an extended fight scene with a bunch of puppet dudes and stuntmen in harnesses.

It's pretty fun to watch. (Fanvid with more over here)

The gist of the fighting scenes is that Wen Ruohan is getting stronger, and Klingons are hard to beat.

Battle Planning

Finally we see a sidekick with Wen Ruohan, although he's blurry so it's hard to tell that he is totally Meng Yao.

The Sunshotters have set up a Battle Camp Playset. It's got chunks of gates and walls that don't connect to anything, like a Duplo set. It's just randomly open for most of the back area so that anyone can walk in.

They've got a cage of hilarious definitely-not-zombies set up, and the rest of the wounded cultivators are lying on the ground.

The main battle trio go chill in Nie Mingjue's incredibly fancy tent. They talk it over and say it's impossible to kill unkillable enemies, "even when we have millions of troops." And by “millions” they mean “dozens.”

Nie Mingjue decides the way to handle it is to kill the leader and everyone else will collapse, because he has watched vampire movies and the last season of Game of Thrones and that's how it works. Watching the last season of Game of Thrones is why he is so angry all the time He says he's going to sneak into Nightless City and assassinate Wen Ruohan.

Okay, first of all, Nie Mingjue can sneak? I don't believe it. Second of all, if that was possible, why didn't he do it as soon as Wen Ruohan attacked his clan?

Nie Mingjue wants to take the biggest risk because he's the commander in chief, which is not how commanding is supposed to work, but okay.

He says if he dies, Zewu Jun will take over. Jiang Cheng starts to protest but Zewu Jun appears as if conjured, and shows them a map that will...dear GOD his hands are beautiful.

It's a helpful map, painted in multiple colors with careful writing on it, so if anyone were to show it to Nie Huaisang he would probably go "oh cool Meng Yao painted that" because anyone who could paint that well probably spent a fair amount of time at it on a regular basis. But, Nie Huaisang isn't here so, nope.

It’s always nice to see Jiang Cheng smile.

Wei Wuxian and Lan Waniji examine some of the puppets to see what's up. It's transmitted by touch, and Lan Wangji says that curing one dude takes three months of spiritual power. Ain’t nobody got time for that.

Writing Prompt: Missing scene! How did they get from the fight in the courtyard to the talk on the roof?

Soundtrack: 1. Shine on You Crazy Diamond, by Pink Floyd 2. Electric Boogie, by Marcia Griffiths

#the untamed #the untamed gifs #wangxian #the untamed meta #canary3d-original #my gifs #wordcount 2379 #restless rewatch the untamed

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ouyangzizhensdad · 3 years

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I just saw a post saying nhs has an inferiority complex and I'm?? Confused?? I always thought he was fine with being weaker in terms of cultivation, maybe I missed something

Hi anon,

I have to say, I struggle as well to figure out where people are getting this from the text. I think, oftentimes, people don't actually pay attention to what the text provides us in terms of characterisation as a whole, but take elements of what makes the character or which happens to them and simply extrapolate how they themselves would feel in that situation as a means of understanding the character. I can easily imagine how a reader would think: wow, if I had low cultivation in a world that values it (and within a clan that values strength even more so!) and a brother who was not only super strong and admired but who wanted me to fit into that role, and then found myself having to fill his shoes after his sudden death, I'd feel some sort of inferiority complex. I think that's the same reason you see so much people insisting WWX has self-esteem issues.

The thing about NHS is that, as a youth, we never saw him value high cultivation or "academic" achievements (not sure how to otherwise call his time at CR but there is probably a better word for it) or brute strength. He's afraid of consequences from his brother for failing at the CR, as we see here:

Although the brothers were not born from the same mother, their relationship was quite solid. Nie Mingjue had always taught his younger brother with extreme harshness, particularly caring for his studies. This was why, even though Nie Huaisang respected his older brother, he was the most scared of Nie Mingjue mentioning his schoolwork.

and here:

Although he didn’t understand a single bit as he listened in class, Nie Huaisang worked as hard as a slave when the date of the test approached. He copied Virtue two times for Wei Wuxian, and begged before the test, “Please, Wei-xiong, if my grade is lower than yi, my brother would really break my legs! Stuff like telling apart direct lineage, collateral lineage, main clan, clan branches… For us disciples from big clans, we can’t even distinguish our relationships with our own relatives, randomly calling everyone who are more than two tiers away from us aunts and uncles. Does anyone have enough capacity in their brain to remember those of other clans?!”

After thinking for a few moments, an expression of envy and yearning appeared on Nie Huaisang’s face, “To be honest, Wei-xiong’s words were quite interesting. Spiritual energy can only be obtained through cultivation and taking great pains to form a golden core (金丹). It would take I-don’t-know-how-many years to do, especially for someone like me, whose talent seems as if it was gnawed by a dog when I was in my mother’s womb. But, resentful energy are from the fierce ghosts. If they can easily be taken and used, it would be beyond wonderful.”

[...] . If disciple from a prominent clan forms the core at a later age, it would be a disgrace to tell other people of it, yet Nie Huaisang didn’t feel ashamed at all. Wei Wuxian also laughed, “I know, right? No harm comes from using it.”

The only moment that I can find that could tangentially be used to suggest that NHS has an inferiority complex could be this one, where NHS wants to avoid LXC's questioning about how his studies are going (and WWX picking up on his cues like a good friend to redirect the conversation). However, when you consider the whole context of the scene, it’s not because NHS feels self-conscious but because he’s afraid LXC is going to report to his brother that he’s not working hard at his studies:

Lan Xichen turned to him, “Huaisang, a while ago, as I returned from Qinghe, your brother asked of your studies. How is it? This year, will you be able to pass?”

Nie Huaisang replied, “Generally speaking, yes…” He seemed like a wilted cucumber, looking at Wei Wuxian in a helpless way. Wei Wuxian grinned, “Zewu-Jun, what are you two going out for?”

[...] Nie Huaisang also wanted to join in, but he had been reminded of his older brother as he met Lan Xichen. Cringing silently, he didn’t dare to have fun, “I’ll pass and go back so that I can review…” With this act, he hoped that Lan Xichen would put in some good words for him to his brother.

NHS seems very industrious at finding ways not to have to do anything that relates to cultivation or to leading a sect, and that is linked once more to the fact that he does not want to do these things (so not a case where we could say he’s self-sabotaging because he fears failure):

Lan Xichen took Nie Huaisang’s saber into his qiankun sleeve, “Huaisang has been using the excuse that he left his saber at home. Now he will have no excuses for lazing around.”

or here

“Nie Huaisang!”

Nie Huaisang fell at once.

He really did fall to his knees from the terror. He only staggered up after he finished kneeling, “D-d-d-da-ge.”

Nie Mingjue, “Where is your saber?”

Nie Huaisang cowered, “In… in my room. No, in the school grounds. No, let me… think…”

Wei Wuxian could feel that Nie Mingjue almost wanted to hack him dead right there, “You bring a dozen fans with you wherever you go, yet you don’t even know where your own saber is?!”

Nie Huaisang hurried, “I’ll go find it right now!”

[...]

In a hurry, Nie Huaisang dropped a few fans on the ground. Jin Guangyao picked them up for him and put them into his arms, “Huaisang’s hobbies are quite elegant. He’s dedicated to art and calligraphy, and has no propensity for mischief. How can you say that they’re useless?”

Nie Huaisang nodded as fast as he could, “Yes, Brother is right!”

Nie Mingjue, “But sect leaders have no need for such things.”

Nie Huaisang, “I’m not going to be a sect leader, though. You can be it, Da-ge. I’m not doing it!”

or here

Nie Mingjue was on the school ground, teaching and supervising Nie Huaisang’s saberwork in person. He did not acknowledge Jin Guangyao, so he stood at the edge of the field, waiting with respect. Since Nie Huaisang was quite uninterested and the sun was bright, he was rather half-hearted, complaining that he was tired after just a few moves. He beamed as he got ready to go to Jin Guangyao and see what presents he brought this time. In the past, Nie Mingjue would only frown at such things, but today he was angered, “Nie Huaisang, do you want this strike to land on your head?! Get back here!”

If only Nie Huaisang were like Wei Wuxian and could feel how great Nie Mingjue’s rage was, he wouldn’t grin in such a bold way. He protested, “Da-ge, the time is up. It’s time to rest!”

Nie Mingjue, “You rested just thirty minutes ago. Keep on going, until you learn it.”

Nie Huaisang was still giddy, “I won’t be able to learn it anyways. I’m done for the day!”

He often said this, but today Nie Mingjue’s reaction was entirely different from his past reaction. He shouted, “A pig would’ve learnt this by now, so why haven’t you?!”

Never expecting Nie Mingjue to burst out so suddenly, Nie Huaisang’s face was blank with shock as he shrunk toward Jin Guangyao. Seeing the two together, Nie Mingjue was even more provoked, “It’s been one year already and you still haven’t learnt this one set of saber techniques. You stand on the field for just thirty minutes and you’re complaining that you’re tired. You don’t have to excel, but you can’t even protect yourself! How did the QingheNie Sect produce such a good-for-nothing! The both of you should be tied up and beaten once every day. Carry out all those things in his room!”

The last sentence was spoken to the disciples standing by the side of the field. Seeing that they had gone, Nie Huaisang felt as though he was on pins and needles. A moment later, the row of disciples really did bring out all the fans, paintings, porcelain from his room. Nie Mingjue had always threatened to burn his room, but he had never actually burned them. This time, though, he was serious. Nie Huaisang panicked. He threw himself over, “Da-ge! You can’t burn them!”

Noticing that the situation wasn’t good, Jin Guangyao also spoke, “Da-ge, don’t act on impulse.”

Yet, Nie Mingjue’s saber had already striked. All of the delicate objects piled at the center of the field erupted in roaring flames. Nie Huaisang wailed and plunged into the fire to save them. Jin Guangyao hurried to pull him back, “Huaisang, be careful!”

With a sweep of Nie Mingjue’s hand, the two blanc de chine antiques shattered into pieces in his palms. The scrolls and paintings had already turned into dust in a split second. Nie Huaisang could only watch blankly as the much loved items that he had gathered throughout the years vanish into ashes. Jin Guangyao grabbed his hands to examine them, “Are they burnt?”

He turned to a few disciples, “Please prepare some medicine first.”

The disciples answered and left. Nie Huaisang stood at the same place, his entire body trembling as he looked over at Nie Mingjue, pupil encircled by veins. Seeing that his expression wasn’t right, Jin Guangyao put his arm around his shoulders and whispered, “Huaisang, how are you feeling? Stop watching. Go back to your room and have some rest.”

Nie Huaisang’s eyes brimmed red. He didn’t even make a sound. Jin Guangyao added, “It’s alright even if the things are gone. Next time I can find you more…”

Nie Mingjue interrupted, his words like ice, “I’ll burn them each time he brings them back into this sect.”

Anger and hatred suddenly flashed across Nie Huaisang’s face. He threw his saber onto the ground and yelled, “Then burn them!!!”

Jin Guangyao quickly stopped him, “Huaisang! Your brother is still angry. Don’t…”

Nie Huaisang roared at Nie Mingjue, “Saber, saber, saber! Who the fuck wants to practice the damn thing?! So what if I want to be a good-for-nothing?! Whoever that wants to can be the sect leader! I can’t learn it means I can’t learn it and I don’t like it means I don’t like it! What’s the use of forcing me?!”

I'm not saying he didn't have a hard time during the first moment of him taking over a leadership role in the sect after the sudden death of his brother (ultimately we can wonder whether the yiwensanbuzhi persona originated then, as he could have felt overwhelmed and actually didn't have the answers needed for the position he didn't prepare for--or whether it was always a pure fabrication to serve his goals), but I don't think we can chalk it up to an inferiority complex.

In the past, Wei Wuxian and Nie Huaisang studied together, so there were a few things he could comment about this person. Nie Huaisang wasn’t an unkind person. It wasn’t that he was not clever, but that his heart was set somewhere else and used his smarts on other areas, such as painting on fans, searching for birds, skipping classes, and catching fish. Because his talent in terms of cultivation really was poor, he formed his core around eight or nine years later than the other disciples of the same generation as him. When he lived, Nie Mingjue was often exasperated by the fact that his brother didn’t meet his expectations, so he disciplined him strictly. Despite this, he still didn’t improve much. Now, without his older brother protecting and supervising him, under his lead, the QingheNie Sect declined day by day. After he grew up, especially after he became the sect leader, he was often troubled by all kinds of affairs unfamiliar to him and looked for helpers everywhere, mainly his brother’s two sworn brothers. One day he’d go to Jinling Tower to complain to Jin Guangyao, and the next day he’d go to the Cloud Recesses to whine to Lan Xichen. With the two leaders of the Jin and Lan Sects supporting him, he still barely managed to settle on the sect leader position. Nowadays, whenever people mentioned Nie Huaisang, although they didn’t say anything on the surface, the same phrase was written on their faces—good-for-nothing.

And after NHS pieced together what happened to his brother and set out on a path to revenge, I don't see how someone who is so sharp and deceptive and able to reach his goals while hiding behind a facade the entire time would feel "inferior".

#anon ask #nhs #mdzs #mdzs meta

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redxblueihateloveyou · 3 years

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Hiiii!!! 💫💕🌸🥳

Can I bother with a question... I was (re)watching that zhang qiling edit (not today) - 'cause it's so cool, btw- and I wondered if Reboot Xiaoge’s your favourite one...? And if you're up to answering, what do you think about the other adaptations? Especially (our small bean) xiao yuliang's interpretation of xiaoge?

🤗🌺💐🐰💕

Hey, my precious patootie hehe ILY it always makes me very happy knowing that you rewatch my vids <3

lol dang it, I was kinda hoping to avoid this question, just because I feel like I'd find it hella hard to explain some things, but I'll try my best and hopefully it'll make some sense xD

I'll start from afar bc I wanna try to explain my reasonings, since I don't want to go without arguments into such highly debated question lolz. I talked about this a bit in my previous asks somewhere, but not broadly as to why that one guy hit all the right spots.

So throughout the books Wu Xie always does this wonderful thing, where he very tangibly describes the feeling he gets when Xiaoge is near, I mean like the aura around him. And he always somehow does it so colorful, that this mix of safety, assurance, calmness, composure and some things I can't quite put into one noun, that he brings to him, I think everyone who've read the books can recognize as this almost magical "Xiaoge feeling". It's not just the way he acts in some dangerous situations or smth like that. It's just everything. You either have it or you don't. And here goes my first argument... to me none of them, except for Huang Junjie and Yuliang have it.

I mean it's not even the obvious stuff, it's like the way they move during the action scenes, the way they even stand and hold themselves, the way they touch Wu Xie, the tone of their voices (both of which are like soothing as fuck), little things you'd think wouldn't matter, but when you watch it and all the puzzle pieces are together, you're like... fuck yeah, thats him.

Also not really that weighty of a point, but to me there's always a joy to see that the actor who plays the character not only gets what's he's playing, but also loves it, bc it's always seen on screen. Usually when some asked about the character they play and what they have in common for example they answer with obvious things like if some character is introverted they're like "well I also don't talk very much" or smth like that, you know what I mean. When I was watching interviews of Yuliang and Huang Junjie I was just smiling so much, bc they've said such things that made me go "yeah, Qiling is safe in their hands".

In Reboot case working in such close proximity with the author definitely also played a huge role here. Bc it kinda gets complicated in some aspects since the books are written from Wu Xie's point of view and you can't only base your picture on his perspective, just bc it's coming from a person who after being basically told "you're my whole world" goes "I'm just a person he randomly passes by in his long life" in his thoughts. Not only he's utterly clueless and dumb when it comes to all this, that he wouldn't notice the way Qiling looks at him and other things, its also not that kind of book, that would go "I suddenly caught poker face looking at me like I'm his whole existence" (and I honestly don't want it to be that book lmao). So you have to take into the account here stuff like what author says to get the whole picture, bc if you look at that from the point of Qiling's view for example, this shit takes a whole wild turn. So I really loved that in UN and Reboot ways of showing Qiling's feelings were well thought out and fit the timeline.

Bc it also works both ways, when it comes to other adaptations. Like Qiling is very and I mean ETREMELY hard to win over. We all know that it was a very long process of gaining his trust and even longer for him to fall for Wu Xie to the point of him being his everything. So what I want in those interpretations is for them to get at which point of their relationships what Xiaoge's behavior makes sense. I do not need any fanservice if it ruins the character, I'll just hate it. The thing that their feelings didn't come out of nowhere is what I LOVE about this ship, bc I'm not the kind of person who believes in "we love for nothing" thing and love at first sight thing (only "got hots for each other" at first sight), bc thats bull. Wu Xie became his everything after a long LONG process of getting to know each other. At the beginning tho he was the same stranger to him as everyone else. So what Reboot Qiling feels for Wu Xie is not what UN's Qiling feels for Wu Xie yet and what UN's Qiling feels for Wu Xie is not what Lost Tomb's Qiling feels for Wu Xie (which at that point was nothing). And I feel like not everyone gets the fact that you can totally wreck the character if you make him behave not the way he behaved in that particular time. Like for example, if someone would make a MDZS adaptation where at the very beginning of their relationships LZ treats WWX the way he treated him after the reincarnation just because "who cares, it's still LZ", that would be dumb af, see what I mean. So Xiaoge having a weakness for Wu Xie in part one is automatically not a Xiaoge to me, bc a huge part of his character and the thing NPSS speaks a lot about is just how IMPOSSIBLE it is for someone to catch his attention and how long it took Wu Xie to get there. So let's just say to me UN and Reboot Qilings for the first time didn't feel like some mashup or character summary/parody, they were Qilings the way they are supposed to be in that part of the story, bc it was the only times someone actually bothered to coordinate it.

Now as to why I prefer one to another. Xiaoge has this thing... the way he holds himself with other people, that is sometimes intentionally and sometimes unintentionally suppressing.

Like everyone knows that if you're a passerby, Qiling genuinely doesn't fucking care and would in fact be pretty harsh about it in terms of treating people like they do not deserve their attention. He won't be like "please, don't bother me", he simply ignored them like an empty space. He is also like that with acquaintances who in his opinion do not deserve his respect like that girl who went hysterical, bc she was upset that he was the only one who wasn't drooling on her like all other men on the crew, Chen Wenjin, Wu Xie's uncles and etc. He's not openly disrespectful unless they trigger him in some way (usually by trying to act superior or later on for not treating Wu Xie right), but if they do, he will in fact remind them their place in sometimes a very rude way, at times humiliating them in front of ppl bc he looks younger than them and talking starts.

He's always doing things on his own terms and hates being told what to do. Like he legit scared Chen Wenjin just with a look and the tone of his voice when he said "let go", when she tried to command him on the mission and grabbed him trying to lecture him about what he should or shouldn't do. That's why Wu Erbai didn't even try anything like this and let him do whatever he needed to do and equally lead the mission in Reboot. And why the scene where Wu Xie 'commands' "Xiaoge, come back" and he immediately listens holds another special place in my heart. Bc he NEVER and I mean NEVER allows such things to ANYONE.

So here I came to a point of why despite loving them both dearly, my favorite Xiaoge is Huang Junjie.

I have this dissonance with Yuliang's version when to me in many scenes it felt like he and Wu Xie are the same age. Like if he was Xiaoge, but in his 20s. In his interactions with Chen Wenjin the dynamics was turned upside down, with him being okay with her telling him what to do and just in general the way she behaved with him. Same as like I didn't always quite believe him to be on par with older generation or even Pangzi, it just felt like he was truly younger than them. Some scenes that I do find extremely cute just don't fit book Xiaoge at all, I'm talking about some moments like his face when Wu Xie gave him food, or him pouting and many things he's done, when you were going "uwu he's a baby". He just never gives me this feeling in the books ever, not just bc he's 100 years old, but sad fact here.. bc he's simply unable to behave that way. Like in the books you'll desperately want to shower him with love, but he's just... I can't quite explain, it's very sad.

I guess it's just you know these characters, who are like hundreds years old, but look like they're 18? I think you have to be very careful with how you write those, so you could deliver that. And in UN because of some changed dynamics and scenes I straight up forgot about it, until Wu Xie threw some joke like "he's an old man" in front of a restaurant.

In Reboot Xiaoge could make Wu Erbai stutter with one move, put Yuliang's version in the same scene, I just don't think it would've worked. Like I'm trying to imagine him telling UN's Wu Erbai what to do and having troubles already haha. Same as I don't think he's capable to be genuinely mad at Wu Xie, and HJJ nailed it esp in one of my fav when Wu Xie was laughing at Pangzi's joke about him catching cold. The look he gave him and how ZYL just retreated was priceless xD. And boy could Qiling get angry with him in the books!

Otherwise I didn't have any drastic fall outs there, like with Joseph's Wu Xie and Ah Ning's death, because that was just too much of a difference, but there were still moments where it was once again this the same scene completely different emotion thing. He was more tolerable to ppl in general here, more pliable. And 50% of the time he gave me the cute lost kitten type, which I just cannot connect with the feeling he gave me in the books. His personality is a cat type 100%, but like seriously "cute baby" is the last word combination I would ever apply to book Xiaoge, but with Yuliang's version it's easily applied. So small bean he is indeed. With Joseph and in UN it works incredibly perfect to me, but the way he is in UN is at times too gentle. And there are lots of scenes where Joseph himself looked at him in a way "you're too cute, let me pinch your cheeks" kind of way, or the way he like sat down next to him on the coast, he was a bit babying him at times. I can't imagine book pingxie doing that. It's just a whole different vibe, the way he takes care of him, the way he lets him take care of him... it's...uuuuuuuuu another vibe (see, I'm so good at explaining lmao).

It's also kinda funny to me, bc HJJ who's the smallest and who irl truly a kitten never once gave me that feeling on screen for some reason. The one babied and loved by every crew and old ppl, who was cutely hiding behind ZYL's back on set, who won't sue an ex who almost ruined his career bc of how stupid she is, bc he "didn't want to hurt her", who according to staff can't even step on a fly, whom CMH was petting for several minutes after he had to hit him with a prop brick bc he didn't wanna do it lmao. I was just like.. ok, this is hilarious, bc I in fact didn't expect him to be a small bean, so watching all the bts made me go LOOOOL. Probably ZYL acting like a 3 year old helped him transform and the age difference problem got lost lmao

As for other adaptations. You know I can't watch seriously "Lost Tomb", I think some ppl probably have some nostalgic feeling about it, but I'm sorry, to me it's fucking hilarious. Like I've already said it looks like some type of twilight parody thing or smth. Soft damselle Wu Xie esp killed me, bc 1st when he ever was that, 2nd in the first book he's salty af, I don't even know this dude in this interpretation, I was like who's this. YangYang I know him from other things, I really don't think it's his role. I know the script and everything is bad. I know the costume and hair are horrendously funny, but it's just I was watching him in those action scenes and was like no... just I'm sorry but I'm not feeling it. I simply just don't know what to say about the whole thing seriously, bc I don't even know where to start. 10 episodes of some salad finished with one mutilated scene from book 6 for no reason the fact that characters are weird themselves also I can't quite tell, did they really just meet or they imply smth else lmao.. I'm sorry, but I do not get it.

I've given LT2 another try after finishing all the books and I've dropped it half way through, Cheng Yi wasn't even close to how I pictured Xiaoge in any aspect. He in fact didn't do anything OOC or off the book or anything, I just was like "not my Qiling". Happens sometimes.

Explore with the note you already know how I feel about this lol let's just forget.

P.S. To be fair here also maybe we should take into account the fact that some got luckier than other with "at which point" Xiaoge they're playing. Like for example, "Wrath of the Sea" and "Qingling Tree" books which is LT2 is not exactly you can say much about Qiling there, he trolls them there in the beginning (in a brilliant way that was totally lost in the adaptation) and he is there in "Wrath of Sea", but it's not the part that can make his character shine in any way, there's not much things happening there that would make you fall for him or get to know him; Yuliang grabbed the fattest piece bc it's middle several books, when they're always together and his character shines the most in terms of clues about past, opening up to Wu Xie and Pangzi, and there are many many events where you can get the picture of what kind of man he is; Huang Junjie grabbed my fav piece of utter devotion, where he's already fully and wholeheartedly belongs to Wu Xie, that I'm just weak for. So like... there's also that I guess xD.

#answered #jaecomments #zhang qiling #daomu biji #dmbj #lost tomb reboot #i still feel like i couldn't quite explain stuff lol #its a complicated question xD #do not kill me for my i guess weird opinions haha #huang junjie #xiao yuliang #lost tomb #pingxie

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