#i have a lot of Thoughts about raphael crowley

[varyathevillain]

on one hand, I still don't love the "Crowley is Raphael" idea, because I feel like it's more impactful for him to be an important angel, but like, not on the Highest Levels Of Them, like Ariel (Earth's great Lord in Heywood, a name "both of angel and a demon", association to early pagan religions where children and livestock were sacrificed by immolation, reference to s2e2) or Kokabiel (the angel of Stars, fallen angel, the burning light, teacher of astrology).

I would, however, accept it on one big condition: it's heavily implied he's Raphael, but every time someone tries to address him as such there's a blaring NOISE going off. because Gd said "no" to deadnaming, because Crowley would rather have a name that came out of a nickname that turned into a soft love word, than something that was ASSIGNED to him in Heaven.

#Crowley is a trans name don't @ me #Good Omens S2 #Good Omens Season 2 #GO S2 #Good Omens #text post #Varya rambles #Good Omens S2 spoilers #Good Omens Season 2 spoilers #GO Crowley #also the only thing I'm stepping my foot down is that he's NOT Barachiel #bc why would a fallen angel. a demon. be in the CURRENT ANGELS book. and it being Crowley #I personally remember a lot about how people used Barachiel for angel!Beelzebub and thought this was a nod from a prop artist so #have a soft spot for 'Crowley is Ariel' because of how me and Alex have been talking about him and his legacy in '19 #and also because the little mermaid parallels of him sacrificing so much for love 🥺😭 #i also like the Kokabiel one at least in part because he's supposed to be of Raphael's host as well and to be one of makers of the stars

[haljathefangirlcat]

Crowley: *already hates the whole idea of the Apocalypse before there's even an Earth with Queen songs and James Bond car stickers and people to lose, starts questioning and getting into trouble when told all the beautiful things he may not have come up with the concept for but still worked hard on will be destroyed before they can even reach their full potential just because Heaven doesn't really think they have value in themselves rather than merely as part of some greater plan and he can't even suggest that's a ridiculously dumb idea* Also Crowley: *literally gets tasked with making sure the Antichrist gets to the right family so the Apocalypse can start and be as big and destructive as possible some 6000 years after he started hanging with the wrong crowd and vaguely sauntering away from the 'right' one and its ridiculously dumb decisions in the name of greater plans*

#good omens tv #good omens season 2 #good omens 2 #good omens spoilers #crowley #... okay maybe all the spoiler tags are little much *now* #but i've FINALLY been able to start it just tonight #and i'm so excited and also having lots of Feels #seriously with the few spoilers i couldn't avoid i thought this scene was gonna be like #some fanfic-y thing about crowley being really raphael and he and aziraphale being essentially married before the Beginning and whatnot #but instead rn i'm just like #'oh this does fit rather well if maybe not perfectly' #and also #'HEY REMEMBER THAT THING IN THE BOOK WHERE HE WANTS TO DRAMATICALLY THROW BABY ADAM AWAY LIKE IT'S A HAMMER THROW COMPETITION OR SOMETHING'

[woodchuck019]

Crowley was Raphael?

WARNING: MAJOR GOOD OMENS 2 SPOILERS

Ok, so in the last few years we all enjoyed the headcanon that Crowley was the Archangel Raphal pre-Fall. To be completely honest, in season one this theory didn't make a lot of sense because we knew basically nothing about Crowley as an angel except for the fact that he helped create the stars and fell because he asked too many questions. So, even though it was a nice and interesting theory, I thought it would remain that, a theory.

Well, seems like this theory is basically confirmed now at the end of season 2. But let's start at the beginning.

First, we have to talk about the Hierarchy of Angels in Christianity. This Hierarchy was theorized by Pseudo-Dionysius the Areopagite in his book De Coelesti Hierarchia (On the Celestial Hierarchy). Dionysius described nine levels of spiritual beings which he grouped into 9 orders.

Highest orders:

Seraphim

Cherubim

Thrones

Middle orders:

Dominions

Virtues

Powers

Lowest orders:

Principalities

Archangels

Angels

Now, a lot of people asked Neil why the Archangels have so much power if they are so low in the Hierarchy and he said that he and Terry actually tought of archangels and Archangels as different beings.

So we have the arch-angels, in thre sense of being just above the lowest Choir of angels, and then we have the Arch-angels, in the sense of being above all angels.

Actually, the term archangel itself is not found in the Hebrew Bible or the Christian Old Testament, and in the Greek New Testament the term archangel is used referring to Michael, who is called 'one of the chief princes,' and 'the great prince'.

The idea of seven archangels is most explicitly stated in the apocryphal Book of Tobit when Raphael reveals himself, declaring: "I am Raphael, one of the seven angels who stand in the glorious presence of the Lord, ready to serve him."

In Judaism the Archangels are given the title of śārīm, meaning "princes", to show their superior rank and status, so they are also called "Princes of Heaven".

In season 2 episode 6, when Crowley is in Heaven trying to find any info on Gabriel, Muriel gives him the missing Archangel's file explaining that even if they wanted, they couldn't show it to him, since only angels above the rank of Dominions could access it. Immediately after, without putting in any effort, Crowley opens the file, saying that he was an angel once and they never bothered to change passwords. (I totally read a fic like this btw).

When the Archangel Saraquel meets them and recognises Crowley, she says that they worked together on the Horsehead Nebula. So Crowley must have been pretty high up in the ranks if he worked with an Archangel.

When they show us the scene of the trial, Gabriel is ready to be cast down to Hell, but the Metatron stops him and says:

"You are not going to hell. For one Prince of Heaven to be cast into the outer darkness makes a good story. For it to happen twice makes it look like there is some kind of institutional problem."

So we know that one of the Seven Archangels has Fallen, and it could be Lucifer, even though in the bible it is never stated that he was an archangel, but wouldn't they have said so if it were the case?

Also in episode 2, when Shax tells Crowley that Heaven and Hell think Aziraphale has something to do with Gabriel's disappearence, she says:

"A miracle of enormous power happened last night. The kind of miracle only the mightiest of Archangels could've performed".

Reminds you of something? Raphael, one of the mightiest of Archangels?

I really hope they will confirm the theory in season 3.

#go2 spoilers #good omens spoilers #good omens #crowley was raphael #antony j crowley #ineffable husbands #neil gaiman #good omens 2

[marley-manson]

Could you expand on your dislike for the Raphael!Crowley headcanon? I'm fairly certain I know why but your meta posts are always so thoughtful and articulate and I would love to hear your thoughts on the topic

Thank you, I really appreciate it! And fwiw I always enjoy reading your thoughts as well!

And yeah I'm happy to! I mean first I should say that I don't actually like, hate-hate it in fanfic, it's not like an instant back-button for me if it comes up, and I feel like I've seen one or two fics after season 1 where I thought it was fine and it didn't take me out of the story.

But yeah in general I just don't like Crowley being special lol. I like the book vibe where Crowley and Aziraphale are just two... not quite nobodies, given their roles in Eden and the spy allegory of the present day, but certainly not particularly powerful or impressive demon/angels. Crowley and Aziraphale's "superpowers," such as they are, are just their adaptability thanks to living on Earth so long. That's what defines them compared to the rest of Hell and Heaven and sets them apart as uniquely capable of giving a fuck and doing something about the apocalypse. Eg Hastur and Ligur are explicitly more powerful than Crowley, but Crowley escapes them by the skin of his teeth because he's able to break convention by weaponizing holy water, and he's familiar with technology, and more capable of thinking on his feet in general.

I like that all their uniqueness comes from living on Earth with humanity. It resonates with the thematic core of the story, it's fun, and it's interesting. Crowley now being able to perform super impressive miracles and casually resurrect people (something presumably not every angel can do since Aziraphale can't resurrect Edinburgh girl) and read heaven's secret files and potentially stop time in season 1 because he's a former archangel diminishes that vibe to me.

Another con of Raphael!Crowley as a headcanon is that a lot of the time, ime, it feels similar to lost scion of royalty headcanons in other fandoms in an unpleasant way - the way that kind of leans into the idea of someone being inherently superior and worth more by birth (or creation I guess in an angel's case lol). I don't think this is necessarily inherent to the headcanon, or an aspect I think Gaiman will definitely emphasize, but there is that worry lol, especially considering how gary stu-ish Crowley felt to me this season.

Like, why is him being a former archangel meaningful or significant at all? Why does the headcanon exist? What makes Raphael!Crowley different enough from Random Angel #2398!Crowley that it's even brought up as a character detail or plot point that excites people? And I'm not implying that there are no valid reasons (eg exploring why a high ranking angel specifically would fall, or to add some drama for Aziraphale if he finds out and it matters to him, or to add drama between Crowley and the other archangels, etc), but quite often the vibe I get from this headcanon is that Crowley's just inherently more interesting and cool if he used to be a high ranking angel instead of some rando, which is a vibe that puts me off.

Ultimately I just tend to prefer mundane origins to surprise significant origins, and stories about average people (at least in their own context, as angels or w/e) moulded by life who make interesting plot-driving choices rather than inherently unique and special people. And Crowley being Raphael doesn't necessarily make him special, but it does lean in that direction, especially if it's treated as a surprise significant reveal and yk, a source of superpowers.

And to be fair I actually have been thinking about directions this concept could go in season 3 that wouldn't annoy me, and one is to emphasize that archangels aren't inherently special at all and it's an arbitrary designation, and Crowley doesn't give a shit and anyone who does (like other archangels or w/e) is going to be painted as naive and silly and too into hierarchies.

And/or, yk, emphasize that "Anthony Crowley" is emphatically NOT Raphael, regardless of who God created him as. Choose your own destiny. All that jazz. Especially if the Metatron is offering him angelhood again I could see former identity and status being brought into play and held up as extra significant by the antagonists and treated as something to be shut down and dismissed by the narrative, which I would enjoy.

So yeah, at the end of the day I just prefer Crowley as just some guy who happened to get the Earth Agent assignment, rather than the mysterious only fallen archangel.

#also it begs the question of why no one recognizes him since he looked the same as an angel #but that's easily handwaveable. god anonymized the fallen angels in everyone's memories or whatever #or maybe they do recognize him and no one mentions it lol #marley on good omens #text post #good omens spoilers #(lol this is probably longer than it needs to be but enh)

[scarlet6rose]

Soo just wanna talk a bit I guess

It's about good omens I know, I know. Half of the fandom is in mourning 'cause of Aziraphale and Crowley in s2 ep6 but I just want to do a character analysis of both for some more added information (ig). Now, I don't know if someone has already done this analysis or not, but fuck it, I'ma just do them anyways. I think we can look at Crowley first since most people do relate to him more than anyone else. In season 1, we are introduced to the fact that Crowley is the snake from Eden. That in itself makes him very important, but in season 2 episode 1, his importance rises so much. We find the fact that they were the ones who geared up the universe, "Let there be light" and stuff, he also said that he worked very close with upstairs. In the final episode of season 2, he could also open a confidential file that could only be accessed by a throne, a dominion, or above. This means; that before falling, he was extremely important/had a high status (whether he was Raphael or not doesn't matter). Again, in the last episode of season 2, during their breakup, he says, "I understand it a lot better than you do." to Aziraphale when he suggests that Crowley go up to heaven with him. Crowley, in this scenario, knows what's going on. He has clearly seen what heaven is like, top to bottom. From Crowley's point of view, both heaven and hell do not understand that there doesn't need to be a war. That Armageddon doesn't need to happen. He has always seen things in grey, from the beginning. Questioning God and her plans; not fully abiding with hell, like, ever; doing whatever the fuck he wants. Now, before I continue, I think I should give Aziraphale's character some more context. I have been hearing about the coffee theory in the fandom. in simple words: Metatron put something in the coffee and manipulated Aziraphale to become the supreme archangel with it. it definitely is an interesting theory, but there isn't much proof I can see. Mainly because, we see their conversation (in bits a pieces, sure), and you can see Aziraphale acting normally. He's wary and concerned. But from the beginning, Aziraphale has always (mostly) seen in Black and Whites (contrary to Crowley). Even if he denies it, he does (it's hard to forget what you believed since you existed). The only person who's shown Aziraphale that, "Hey, there can be more than one option" is Crowley. Only with Crowley has he ever had the choices (not just good and evil). Even then, he believed Heaven is always good and hell's always evil (he has made multiple remarks about him being good and Crowley being evil, for example, in the flashback of the Edinburgh surgeon, he has made that remark. Even when they met in season 1, he said, "Well obviously, you're a demon." after Crowley said that hell just said to go up there and make some trouble). This in itself proves that Aziraphale always thought in black and white even when he tries to divert himself to not think like that. In his eyes, Heaven is good, and Hell is evil. But the angels and the demons can be in between those shades of grey. That Heaven is currently corrupted, and Hell, even more. He doesn't want another Armageddon, he wants heaven to understand what it means to be "good" (good in atleast his eyes). In very simple words; Aziraphale believes that Heaven isn't working properly/is corrupt and wants to/thinks that he can infact fix it, and Crowley believes everything is working the way it's supposed to since he has seen it personally displayed infront of him, since he has been a high ranking angel in Heaven. Or in much simpler words: THEY DON'T FUCKING TALK TO EACHOTHER.

If the both of them could've had a heart-to-heart talk earlier, it could've ended so much differently. Neither of them knows what the other feels and just assumes what they think the other one thinks. It in itself is a toxic mindset to have. They both didn't "break up" because Metatron manipulates Aziraphale or because Aziraphale couldn't return Crowley's feelings (man's (non-binary) literally fell first). It was because neither of them understood eachother. Aziraphale sees Crowley as a demon who wants desperately to be an angel (many indirect remarks have been made like in Job's arc and such) and someone who accidentally fell (which is true at some level). AND Crowley sees Aziraphale as a simple-minded angel who needs rescuing from time to time (which, again, is true at some level). They both are literally forgetting their own nuances and beliefs, and assuming what the other thinks because, say it with me, THEY DO NOT TALK. The reason Crowley felt betrayed was because he didn't realize that Aziraphale wasn't exactly who he thought he was. After all, Aziraphale isn't a simple character, he's a complex character with very strict (too strict) morals. And Aziraphale realized that Crowley really didn't want to go to Heaven OR Hell, since he always thought that Crowley only hated Hell, not Heaven aswell. So it was a shock to him. WHY? BECAUSE THEY DON'T FUCKING TALK TO EACHOTHER. So, when people say that it's because of the coffee, it pisses me off a little. It practically refuses the idea of nuances existing within these characters. Listen, if it's actually because of the coffee or Metatron doing/saying something sinister to Aziraphale, I'll take my L. But for now, I wholeheartedly believe that it was fully Aziraphale's decision to go to Heaven.

so yeah, that's all, I might add to this later, might not.

#good omens #neil gaiman #coffee theory #aziraphale #crowley #aziracrow #ineffable husbands #fan theory #discussion #ineffable idiots #my mind works in mysterious ways #criminal minds gone wrong #i dont need sleep i need answers #there is so much more to add #season 2 episode 6 good omens #crowley is raphael #doesn't matter in this context #season 3 speculation #good omens season 2 #Good omens season 1 #SEASON 3 PLEASE

[drconstellation]

More Half-and-Half-A-Miracle Thoughts

Part 3: The Third Archangel

Updated 10 Nov 2023

Part 1: Miracle Power Ranking is here Part 2: The Dark side of Aziraphale is here.

Before I try to put the full picture of the mighty miracle together, there is one other Archangel I want to talk about first, because yeah, if the "little" miracle had an Archangel x an Archangel x (ex-)Archangel in the equation, all working in synergy, that's some pretty serious potential power right there.

S2 has given us much to discuss about Crowley and his past. We know he is different in that he has an imagination. We know he is the only ethereal entity, angelic or demonic, who can stop time, which is no mean feat. I have a list of at least nine, possibly thirteen clues (it keeps growing! 21 clues And yes, I'm counting,) that he was once a

senior Archangel, one of the seraphim, before his Fall (but not which one in particular, for sure, alas. We can debate that later, its not important here. Really. Don't @ me about it, I'm not going to engage in this post.) They (updated link to a new discussion: the idea of Crowley previously being a very powerful angel) have all been mentioned already, none of them are new. This implies there is a huge amount of potential power that Crowley could pull upon to put into the miracle performed on Gabriel. So he is our obvious ex-Archangel in the equation.

And we already have Gabriel, in the middle.

Which just leaves us with Aziraphale, and his green-paneled waistcoat...

I've led you all on thinking he's somehow connected to Hell? Or been associating too long with Crowley? No. (Or maybe, yes? To hanging around a demon, I mean.) On one hand it does show us he is not like the other angels. On the other, it tells us something else altogether.

For all that I've been recently rabbiting on about dark horses pointing mainly to Crowley and Saraqael, we have perhaps been deftly misdirected from the biggest dark horse of all: Aziraphale as our 'missing" seraphim, Archangel Raphael, incognito.

Now, I'm certainly not the first person to suggest this at all. There have been multiple metas about it, even way back from S1. I agree with them, fwiw.

Why am I saying this now? I think this recent post about Aziraphale being present at Sodom and Gomorrah sealed it for me, especially since I had made a recent note about Raphael being the one to be assigned to escort Lot from Gomorrah. And for all that I've just discussed how dark Aziraphale can be, he is still clearly affected by what he witnessed that night, so long, long ago.

"Oh Lord, heal this bike."

Green is also the color primarily associated with Raphael, the healer. I've seen a few other colors mentioned as well (in fact, the more you search, the more confusing it gets) but mostly the color you'll see mentioned is green. And its the color Aziraphale conceals on the back side of his waistcoat. Plus he did heal Anathema (and her velocipede) back in S1 after they collided with the Bentley.

Finally, in the Islamic tradition, Raphael is known as Israfil, and he is essential to announcing the Day of Judgement, with a trumpet constantly poised at his lips, ready to blown when God so orders.

Guess who just got taken back to Heaven to start the Second Coming?

Edit: Since I first posted this, some additional information has come along to add to this. I finally bumped into a post about the wonderful golden collars in the Job minisode (It's so, so important to put at least one or two relevant tags for meta-writers like me to help find your posts readers! Then you can shit-talk in the tags all you like.) and that lead me to a webpage on basic angel symbology and the major angels, which helped to firm up a few things I'd been wondering about. One observation is angels usually go about bare-footed, but Raphael wears sandals when on Earth, as he is chief of the guarding angels, and is the guardian of the young, and watches over pilgrims and travelers. And who was wearing golden sandals during the Job minisode?

Doing some guarding of the young as well...

And Raphael is assigned to the direction of the East.

Now we have three Archangels, three seraphim, no less, side by side.

That's a mighty shitload of potential miracle power, whichever way you want to look at it. No wonder the ol' Metatrash got a bit nervous about what happened and decided to take a personal hand in things.

If your sitting there going "'Hang on, op, hang on just a darned minute - Aziraphale hasn't even been promoted to Supreme Archangel yet and Crowley could just be a Dominion, you don't know, and Gabriel's a drooling idiot, how could he contribute to it - " Just stop. Take a breath. Go back to Part 1 where I discuss the problems with our knowledge about miracle powers and their potential. Their potential. And its frustrating that in the end we just don't have enough knowledge to be certain.

So take this as my personal head-canon. I may not have really answered why the miracle was so strong. But as I said at the start, I don't think we can. Too many factors involved, too many unknowns. Too much hidden.

Bring on S3, I say!

#good omens #good omens 2 #crowley #aziraphale #gabriel #the metatron #raphael #sodom and gomorrah #only the mightiest of archangels #anathema #oh lord heal this bike #the second coming

[carrylovescurry18]

About Raphael, Crowley and Aziraphale

I'm very bored at work so I dove into Wikipedia and read some articles about Archangels and the like. I guess there are a lot of people who dove deeper into it and who are way more eloquent than me. However this is what I found. Maybe it's just too obvious, I don't know.

A lot of people believe that Crowley was Raphael as an angel. He was, what we know from S 2, at least a Throne or Dominion. According to Wikipedia Dominions were held to govern the movement of stars, planets and other celestial objects. So I believe he was that.

As for Raphael. I was always a bit confused that he hadn't shown up in GO yet along with the other Archangels (I'm alway surprised how much of my catholic upbringing is still hidden somewhere in my mind).

So I looked him up and Raphael goes by the name Azariah in Tobit. When I read that I went "Huh."

RAPHAEL

AZARIAH

AZIRAPHALE

I remember thinking, when I read Good Omens for the the first time, that Aziraphale was a weird name and why he wasn't called Raphael. There was the implication in my head that he was Raphael, but they didn't want to use his name for whatever reason (probably because possible outrage from the church or something is what I thought).

Also Raphael is supposed to blow the trump at the Day of Judgement. AKA The Second Coming.

Remember what the Metatron said?

He couldn’t think of a better angel to set into motion the next step in the grand plan and he needed one with his talents to direct it and familiar with how they do things on Earth?

Well.

I'm of the firm belief that Aziraphale is going to be Raphael. Maybe not in name, but in function. Who knows, maybe they even change is name short-term for that purpose?

Take it or leave it. But it's interesting to think about.

Edit: I completely forgot. In the german version of Good Omens Aziraphale is called "Erziraphael". The "Erz" is the german word for "arch" as in Archangel. So Erzengel = Archangel.

Now this doesn't necessarily have to mean anything. Names in books were often changed in the 90s in german translations (see Harry Potter), but it still striked me as odd, that they chose that name. I mean yes, Aziraphale is difficult to pronounce for the average german, but why didn't they just change it to "Asirafell"? (the SI here is pronounced like ZI in english). It would almost be the same, especially since he does go by Mr. Fell anyways.

I mean probably they just chose a name that was somewhat familiar. People know Erzengel and they know a Raphael, so they might just have bunched that together and went with it, but still.

#good omens #Aziraphale #ineffable husbands #good omens s2 #Good omens s3 #Crowley #Raphael #Archangel Raphael #sorry for the caps but my german brain just wont stop doing it

[speremint]

Good Omens S2 Thoughts

OBVIOUSLY spoilers for GO S2 below, so if you've not seen, and don't wanna be spoiled, don't read!

The tl;dr of this long post is that I loved S2, it was a lot of fun, and I love that it focused more on Az and Crowley, but I also think it was a little out of pocket and a little messy in writing.

Anyway I fuckin.. am still processing all of what I watched, and am currently rewatching with a friend, too, but here's my jumbled thoughts on S2 and especially the final episode because I'm having many emotions and I need to get my thoughts out somewhere.

Listen. I would like to clarify that I loved S2 and I loved S1, and I think S2 was VERY smart to parse down on supporting characters and keep it stuck to Crowley and Aziraphale for the most part.

I'm assuming that S2 was made with S3 in mind though, esp after this post from Neil Gaiman, bc lord I will cry if there's no S3.

The focus on the story of Job I am being super optimistic in hoping that maybe it's Gaiman punching us in the throat with S2 before offering us a nicer S3... regardless though, I loved the season despite my minor criticisms.

I... do not have anything against Beelzebub/Gabriel, but holy shit was that out of left field for the ending... I just feel that, despite Gabriel having memory loss (it doesn't seem to be COMPLETE since it was kinda touch and go during scenes), they should've sprinkled in some sort of foreshadowing the his relationship or fondness of Beelzebub.

Have him at least not try to decimate that fuckin fly with books, or take an interest in books on forbidden romance, or rebellion against authority, or maybe just flat out have him be interested in Crowley and Aziraphale's relationship, or Nina and Maggie's. Just SOMETHING to set it up a little bit...

EDIT:: while rewatching, I suppose they hinged most of their foreshadowing in Beelzebub's passiveness and interest in Gabriel, but it's a little hard to have a comparison given how little they were in S1

It was only after I skimmed the GO tag that I saw people were pissed about Aziraphale's choice in E6 and I'm kinda just like ??? It's not OOC though... He's always been loyal to Heaven, and the times when he's been questioning, the biggest issue, is that Crowley was an enabler. He kept Aziraphale from REALLY facing the consequences of these decisions because he's acted as a safety net in some of the situations they're put in.

I love the added scenes of the past with Crowley and Aziraphale, they're fuckin great and I like that it continues to expand upon their relationship and "temptations", but I do think it was kinda reiterating stuff we knew from S1... even if it was good fan service, for lack of a better word. I just kinda wish they had sprinkled in more reinforcements of Aziraphale's fealty to heaven. Or, perhaps during the scene when Azira is worried he's going to become a demon, he could take that time to ask Crowley on his feelings on being a demon, and perhaps if he regrets it, just to also set up for the finale desire of Aziraphale in turning Crowley back into an angel.

Regardless though, S3, assuming there is one, will be a big wake up call to Aziraphale when he's left on his own and also under a tighter leash by heaven, especially since Crowley is gone. Also, expanding on Crowley being a high rank when he was an angel made my fuckin night, I still stick to the headcanon that he was the Archangel Raphael, don't @ me

I do think that... some of the stuff that happened in S3 did feel a little like a response to fans as well, since I know Gaiman is on tumblr and Ik the fandom has been really vitriolic over the fact that Az and Crowley didn't kiss or anything in S1... tbh I didn't think it was that big of a deal cause love is shown in many different ways, and I admit I do like that they kissed in S2, but it did also feel uhhh kinda spontaneous.

Not a bad thing, just wasn't expecting it. I did replay the scene bc I'm an angsty bitch. But yeah, I'm like ehhh.

Also Nina and Maggie randomly coming at the end to like.. sit Crowley down and be like "erm youre stupid and in love" felt very weird in a way I can't quite describe, but also felt kinda undeserved. Esp cause Crowley was like "eh I guess". I think the more subtle off handed chat he had with Nina about Aziraphale being his partner was a more elegant way of setting that up, and having him reflect on that instead would've been better. But also tbf he and Azira were being bitches and indeed messing with Maggie and Nina.

I don't like the term of describing content as "fanfic"y because a lot of fanfiction is super well written, but I think S2 was very... fan service-y... rather.

Which tbh I don't mind that much, esp given Gaiman really didn't want an S2 to respect Pratchett's passing as his cowriter. So... meh. I did genuinely dislike the ball scene at the end though. Just... it was really weird, and I'm not sure what they were trying to say with it, other than Aziraphale is fucking demented... and tbh he should've known better since the fucker's been on earth for ages, idk. After talkin with a friend, it just was a really weird scene, and if anything was OOC for him, I think it was that bc his removal of free will, speech, and even actions, was fucking insane.

Also I don't think John Hamm is attractive, so I tbh was just confused for a lot of his scenes that had interactions or alluded to him...

I liked S2, I really did. It was campy, it was a lil sloppy, but it was fun, and it gave a lot more Crowley and Aziraphale being a bitchy little married couple before their fuckin messy ass divorce at the end.

ANYWAY... I really can't wait to see what happens, and I am PRAYING that there'll be an S3. Until then, I will happily sit in my puddle of tears

#this is word vomit im sorry #good omens s2 #good omens s2 spoilers #personal #i prob will draw go again ngl i am cry

[thesherrinfordfacility]

Enoch in particular is interesting bc of Saraqael. It's the ONLY text that lists Saraqael as an Archangel. Michael, Gabriel, Raphael, and Uriel are identified as the Supreme Princes of Heaven, and Saraquel is one of the "seven holy Archangels", which also includes those four. Sandalphon isn't listed, but I DO think a fun little fact there is that he and Metatron are the only angels whose names end in -on, likely a reference to how they're the only angels who originated as humans. I don't think he and Metatron are 'twins' in the literal sense though? Enoch (pre-Noah) and Elijah (post-Noah) weren't contemporaries. They just happen to be the only humans who become angels.

hi!!!✨ god im so sorry ive taken so long to get to this, anon!!! - tbh, im finding saraqael a bit of an enigma, both from the GO narrative perspective and indeed trying to work out who they were in terms of biblical/apocryphal significance... i hope you don't mind, but im gonna talk about saraqael in general in my response; as seems to be the way, i typically get carried away in answering what seems to be a fairly straightforward ask!!!

edit: further speculation on BOL and saraqael's potential role in it

saraqael theory(?)/analysis:

i think are a couple of crucial bits to saraqael in s2, and not just the ones where they recognise crowley etc. i talked a little bit about what i think their rank is in GO, which i don't think is the same rank as the other archangels, but perhaps a lower archangel like sandalphon. in terms of what saraqael actually does... it feels like they are essentially in charge of earth operations, or something to that effect.

muriel is, by all accounts so far, a (very?) low ranking angel. and yet, when muriel finds the matchbox, it's saraqael that accompanies them to the archangels to report it. now, that doesn't necessarily mean anything - muriel could have gone to a supervisor and then it got escalated, but what saraqael says here:

makes me think that, actually, saraqael knows muriel at least to a greater degree than the separation of an archangel (or whatever tier), and a 'lowly' 37th-class scrivener would have. in fact, this is the only scene other than presenting the matchbox, i believe, where we see saraqael and muriel interact? there is some kind of history there, and potentially even a degree of fondness.

now, let's take into consideration the theory that muriel themself may have been higher-ranking, and got Got by the metatron. they originally were going to demote gabriel to 38th Class; was saraqael similarly the one who wiped muriel's memory, as they attempted to wipe gabriel's? what was the purpose of saraqael being at the trial, other than to fulfil that purpose? and they took muriel directly into their chain of command as a means of keeping an eye on them, protecting them?

this kind of supports my thought that saraqael is somewhat an operations manager (but also...not just that at all*), doing essentially the archangel grunt-work, including keeping an eye on unauthorised miracles:

then we take a look at their interaction with crowley; because i do think there's a lot more to unpack in this bit than that they may have worked on a nebula together, and that crowley doesn't remember them.

summarising a couple of observations:

the seemingly innocent but assertive point made that the trial was in fact real, and didn't take a long time to happen start to finish

the fact that saraqael even notices the interaction between crowley and muriel: he's dressed as an angel (and demonstrated as being a 'bee' when michael/uriel don't fully catch it was him), muriel seems - despite the aesthetic of heaven generally - to be tucked away in the equivalent of a cupboard cubicle, and he accessed a file without, presumably, any alarms - the file recognised his former rank/that he 'knew' the password... so what exactly prompts saraqael to come over in the first place?

saraqael looks happy to see crowley, possibly even a little relieved, but once again like they're... fond?

they use his chosen name (specifically not 'crawley'), and use it with ease despite knowing him pre-fall and therefore, theoretically, not having any cause to use 'crowley' up until this moment

saraqael seems disappointed that crowley doesn't remember them.

where am i going with this bit? well, put simply. i think saraqael had some hand in the mechanics of the fall. i think they were meant to wipe the fallens' memories, but jigged about with the settings. perhaps, now, they regret their part in it, and is working to undo it somewhat, from the inside. i think, where they can, they protect those that get fully wiped (ie. muriel, and gabriel had the wipe gone to plan). and i think, maybe just their favourites, they keep an eye on those that actually fell. and i think that they are trying to break out this information without outright saying it ("well, don't let me interrupt you! show him the trial..."), because they know first-hand the consequences. and they know the consequences, because they are literally metatron's operational right-hand* angel:

this would explain why they seem to remember metatron in the bookshop: exposure to him? seems to fully understand how dangerous he is? not only does saraqael look genuinely apprehensive on behalf of michael, but watch their eyeline movement:

(ok but a moment of appreciation for how adorably derek jacobi says 'piffle' i mean💕)

it almost looks like it goes from michael, and then flips to up beyond michael? as they clasp their hands together? and then after the cut, they're actually breathing so heavily, out of... stress? worry? this is such a tiny thing that may well just coincidental actor-choice on liz's part, but it certainly works in the scene context... that saraqael seems quietly and calmly terrified.

another point, back on the subject of saraqael's role in heaven; i feel like the source of both the earth observation files michael gets in s1, and the fact that metatron says he's "looked back over a number of [aziraphale and crowley's] exploits" may have come from saraqael themself. that's a bit tentative, but it would certainly fit that it would come, at least, from their department. say - metatron has been spying on our boys through the sigil in the bookshop (or something to that effect), has gone to saraqael essentially for intel, and then put the offer to aziraphale to return to heaven in order to split them apart, after seeing the extent to which they're entwined with each other.

we haven't seen a direct, lone aziraphale-saraqael interaction, but their line about, "we'll be keeping a very close eye on you, aziraphale.", doesn't actually feel as ominous as i once felt. in fact, it's muriel that saraqael sends down which - let's face it, by all accounts they are not the angel to send down to earth when camouflage is key - feels actually like saraqael was banking on covering up the miracle for aziraphale and crowley, or at least buying them time.

last little bit: the comment on aziraphale's frisbee halo trick makes me think once again of saraqael's potential role as, essentially, head of operations (declaring war is rather messy, they're right), but also brings me back to the point i made here about the halo toss... somehow, i feel like it signifies something a bit more than just a casual hand grenade.

and now for the bible-y bits

well, i mean, there isn't really a lot to go on, lbr. as anon said (hi, anon, if you made it this far✨), they're described as one of the seven archangels in the first book of enoch (20:6), and if ive read correctly, the second book describes that they brought enoch himself to heaven... so maybe the GO narrative will follow this somewhat? if saraqael feels somewhat responsible for metatron being in the position he is, and having done the hypothetical things he's done? and that's why they might be trying to undo it, or undermine it?

i think the first book also describes saraqael (who i believe is synonymous with sariel and suriel, as well as other different but similar angel names in biblical/apocryphal texts) as being essentially the observer of justice and injustice on earth, "who sin in the spirit", which would also track against them having potential control over earth observations, and them potentially guarding over those that have fallen/have been punished by heaven.

i think some islam and talmud texts also indicate that saraqael may be azrael and metatron respectively, but i doubt that is an arc that the GO narrative will follow, nor indeed other bits and pieces from enoch that ive read through... but certainly there's enough that looks like it could have hypothetically inspired the saraqael story that im interpreting at the moment!

and as for metratr-on, and sandalph-on, iirc that is the meaning of the -on suffix, to reflect being born of man...? i looked at this a little while ago and found zephon as another example... parsing out abaddon kinda drove me a bit insane though, so that's where i left it! i agree that i doubt that metatron and sandalphon are twins, but definitely seems to speak to their origins, perhaps!!!✨

#another theory/analysis noone asked for #im so excited for more saraqael #i need them to be aziraphale's friend pls #good omens #ask #the fall/the great war spec #AWCW spec #metatron spec #memory wipe theory #book of life theory #saraqael spec #s2 meta #s3 narrative spec

[inevitably-ineffable-husbands]

Crowley's Past: Was He Archangel Camael?

With S2 now having been out for a few weeks, and the theories running wild, I think one of the unanimous beliefs within the fandom is that Crowley was SOME sort of Important Angel Before™. I touch upon the MANY clues in the various parts of my initial GOS2 Thoughts Meta, so I won't go into too many of those here, but inevitably this separate meta started out as the pulling-and-expanding-upon of the Archangel Crowley theory, primarily the "Raphael" theory, since I have loved that theory to bits since its inception early post-S1.

That was until my friend Peter finished watching the season early last week, and presented to me an alternative theory as to Crowley's identity that I thought deserved its own post breakdown, since I haven't seen this theory before.

NOW, I should make it clear I haven't been as DEEP in the fandom as many of y'all since S1 aired, so it's probably come up before S2 as just a light mention, but I personally haven't seen anything, so what follows is a joint speculation between my real-life, not-in-GO-fandom-spaces-whatsoever friend Peter, and myself, with my contributions being the expansion of his theory and linking it to what we already know.

The theory is this: Crowley might actually be Archangel Camael.

Please, PLEASE note that I am aware that authors and writers change things for creative liberty and originality, so please take this entire theory with a grain of salt (or go nuts with me, I'm happy either way!).

I'll TRY to keep this concise, but y'all know me. You can skip right to the "Conclusion" for a point-by-point breakdown if you don't want to read everything, but I hope you'll at least give me a chance to explain within the body of this meta.

I apologize in advance if any of my thoughts are a bit scattered. Here we go:

The Initial Text

Here is the initial text Peter sent to me after he finished watching S2 (and this was after I mentioned that the popular running fandom theory is that he's actually Raphael):

Okay… well - disclaimer I did not go to religious school and my biblical studies were a great many years ago. As I recall Lucifer was not one of the 7 archangels - he was meant to be but he rebelled before he was appointed (and there is some wiggle for a fictional story). So, based on what we have seen Crowley was one of the 7 but he hung out with the wrong people and asked too many questions. He never says his real name when we see him as an angel it is comically dodged - for a good reason. Crowley has a login and proves he had clearance way above a level 37th angel. He can see the top most important meetings… like he may have been allowed to attend in a previous life… And one line sticks out to me “one fallen prince has already gone to Hell. Two shows a problem.” As I stated Lucifer was not a Prince - we are not talking about him. Gabriel was banking on going to Hell like his “brother” - I’m guessing Camael, the one who Sees God - who ironically has cursed eyes now as a demon - the Prince of Fortitude (also Love and Charity). He often breaks his demonic spirit in cases of charitable needs or love. Crowley is one of the big Seven to be entrusted with creating the cosmos ;)

Naturally, this had a lot of things click for me, and I'm going to break them down below, with my additional research into the points that Peter made since he mentioned that he was going off memory.

Who Was Cameal?

When Peter mentioned this angel, it boggled my mind that I never actually recall knowing of this archangel. I went to a Roman Catholic school up until Grade 12, and with that comes Religious Ed classes, which also feature World Religions in the later grades. Funnily enough, I found out WHY I never heard of Camael:

Camael is not recognized by the Catholic Church due to the Vatican's decision to ban the veneration of angels not mentioned in the Bible [SOURCE]

Kind of explains why I only heard of Gabriel, Michael, and Raphael (which now adds another layer to a theory I will cover further down in "Does Crowley Remember?"), then.

Reading further:

[He] is the Archangel of strength, courage and war in Christian and Jewish mythology and angelology. [SOURCE] He is claimed to be the leader of the forces that expelled Adam and Eve from the Garden of Eden holding a flaming sword. However, in iconography he is often depicted holding a cup. [SOURCE]

A Flaming Sword, you say??? Interesting. Here's a good place to point out that there IS also a theory that Crowley and Aziraphale are one single archangel that was split into two (and Gaiman has stated that in original drafts of the original book, they were at first one character, so this fact might be an afterthought of that original idea). Also, interesting that this angel is depicted with a cup, traditionally used in Christianity to depict wine, which is Crowley's drink-of-choice. So, there's that.

Another standout point for me is the Adam and Eve bit (which I bolded above). The Snake of Eden is TECHNICALLY the instigator (the "leader") who encouraged the expulsion of Adam and Eve from the Garden. "Forces" in this reading of it could be the metaphorical definition of it; the knowledge of good and evil, and the desire to see beyond the Garden. AND also the Flaming Sword itself BEING the object of force given to the couple for protection.

Furthermore, Crowley's a strong and brave character, given all the shit he endures time and time again. Strength (and bravery for that matter) can mean many things: emotional strength, physical strength, possibly also a strength of character and an unwavering belief in the values one holds dear. I should also note that it's interesting that an angel of war, should Crowley indeed be this character, wants nothing to do with a war and is actively trying to stop one: an angel of War can absolutely NOT want a war, because he knows it's wrong.

And without the Angel of War up in Heaven to PREVENT any war at all? Well, they would just get all willy-nilly crazy on the idea of War without having any pushback on it, wouldn't they?

Kind of like how Gabriel was to be demoted (cast out) for denying Heaven a War. Funny old world, isn't it? Seems the parallels write themselves.

What's in a Name?

Because Peter mentioned the name meaning, I had to look into it myself, and indeed, one of the various meanings of Camael is apparently "he who sees God" in Hebrew.

As Peter stated above, I think this is very significant because it's seemingly only Crowley who has "demon" eyes that he himself cannot change. It's the ONLY part of him that always remains a constant, and why he is forced to hide them. We know from S1 and bits of S2 with Shax that other demons can change their eyes because we see them mimicking other humans time and again without the black eyes if they choose to.

Crowley's eyes could have been cursed specifically because was ordained as "the one who sees God" and possibly was the ONLY angel who ever "saw" a physical God in the literal sense (it's implied in the show that no one actually SEES a physical god). It's possible that Crowley being cast out literally burned his angelic eyes and left a visible scar that can't be fixed or erased – a forever-reminder of what he did and can no longer do. AND as the one who sees God, he indeed was a very high-ranking angel.

In the GO universe, I suspect he was indeed the FIRST Supreme Archangel, tasked with creating God's Vision (HAH) of the Universe. And when Crowley questioned what the point of creating such beauty was only for it to be destroyed, God (or, I suspect more likely, the other Angels) saw it as Crowley questioning their "vision" in the metaphorical sense.

Does Crowley Remember?

In light of Season 2, and some interesting exchanges and moments of Crowley with other angels, some people speculate (and as I watch the series more, I'm starting to also agree somewhat) that Crowley may not remember everything from Before.

Now, while I do like this theory a lot, and it makes sense with the context clues from S2, I don't think it's that he doesn't remember anything at all, however, as many versions of the theory postulates.

My speculation is this: what if, by having his Angelic Name removed from recognition in the Bible, and going through a similar Trial to Gabriel, THEN by Falling the traditional way, the memories are still there, but they're just a bit fuzzy and scattered? It could also explain why some of the other Archangels DON'T remember him... he was removed from the memories of other ranking angels (Saraqael is the only angel to seemingly remember who Crowley was, so I postulate that she WASN'T a top angel until fairly recently, because of the named angels in the next section).

The show brings up the Book of Life in S2 on several occasions, leaving me to believe that this will be an important item in the next season. What if the phrase "it will make it like you don't exist" literally means "don't exist in memories"? Maybe a Book of Life 1.0 existed at one time, and everyone who Fell was forgotten because their angelic names were removed. Because wouldn't that be more awful than never having existed? Remembering that you WERE something or someone, you had a name that you can't remember, that you WERE important to people and events, and having everyone around you who you considered family forget who you are? It's its own kind of personal Hell ... kind of like George Bailey in It's a Wonderful Life, a movie that references angels, funnily enough. And Crowley remembers the furniture being there but not where it all belongs. I think his memory haziness is also a side effect of Falling the traditional way (burning sulfer and all that jazz, possibly causes trauma amnesia?).

It's a stretch here, I know, but I thought I would put this one out there as a possibility as to what it could mean (given that Gaiman and Pratchett tend to "play on words" a lot, I think it is worth mentioning this as an alternative meaning).

In S2, when Gabriel was sentenced, the Trial stated that Gabriel would forget his time as Gabriel, but not his time as an angel. I think a similar thing happened with Crowley, only much more violently with the "burning the eyes out" and "staining his wings black" thing.

My friend Peter mentioned that the show avoided Crowley's Before-Name "to a comical degree". I reckon, rather, that Crowley just simply doesn't remember his Angelic name, and his changing of his demon names is him possibly trying to find an identity. I think he recalls it having started with a "C", maybe? And now he's a snake, so he's kind of crawl-y, must be "Crawley". As time moved forward and as he learned more and more about humanity, he changed is namee to fit in better. Having a full Human-esque name makes him feel more connected to the Humanity he prefers.

And because I'm a romantic sap at heart, I think he enjoys spending time with Aziraphale because perhaps some part of Azzie's presence helps Crowley remember bits and pieces of his broken memory. He is LITERALLY Crowley's Emotional Support Angel – remember Shax can read into people, it seems. Azzie brings comfort to him, and seeing another Angel that also questions the choices Heaven makes allows Crowley to feel less alone.

The Original Seven Archangels

It's brought up a couple to several times in S2 the point that "God loves sevens". I actually couldn't remember why Seven was such a big Biblical number so a bit of quick Googling reminded me that "Seven [...] communicated a sense of “fullness” or “completeness” [...]. This makes sense of the pervasive appearance of “seven” patterns in the Bible." (SOURCE).

And of course, after Peter had mentioned it, I had to look a bit more into who the Original 7 could possibly be. Wikipedia mentions it could be Michael, Gabriel, Raphael, Uriel, Camael, Jophiel, and Zadkiel.

Peter was correct in his assumption that Lucifer wasn't one of the original 7 archangels, so that leaves us with Raphael, Camael, Jophiel, and Zadkiel, if we're assuming that Crowley is one of these top Archangels.

I would also like to speculate that "God likes 7's" could also mean (if you allow me to reach a bit) "God's favourite angels are the initial 7". If Crowley happened to be one of these 7, it could explain why he's able to get into Heaven without raising alarm at all, why he still maintains his immense power that set off alarms in Heaven when it was used purposefully against Heaven, why he was able to access the Gabriel Files, and why Sarqael allowed Crowley to continue watching the Trial (because if God allowed Crowley access even when he's no longer an angel, then Sarqael has no reason to believe that he's still not important to God).

Perhaps, in Modern Day, only having four archangels making the decisions symbolizes that, indeed, God's not really calling the shots anymore – and hasn't been for a long time – and that the whole system is all broken and not complete.

It also begs the question: if Crowley was one of the Original Seven (if they are indeed going to go in that direction), what happened to the other three? Did they also suffer the same fates? Were they turned to Scriveners just like Gabriel was to be?

Here is where I will also throw out there that my random thought that Muriel possibly also may have been one of the other three, as my own expansion of this theory, but I digress.

Anyway, I think I found the original Fandom Wiki that Peter quick-referenced when doing his quick message to me, and it's very interesting:

How they were founded as a unit is unknown, but it is said that it happened during Lucifer's rebellion. When Lucifer rebelled against God, one entire choir of angels followed him and was lost. Many angels from other choirs also followed him in his rebellion. It is revealed that Lucifer was meant to be apart of the Seven Archangels as well, however, since his fall he was replaced by Camael. 

Disclaimer here that I understand that Fandom Wiki isn't THE BEST resource, but we're also talking about a fictional story that loosely references actual scripture, so I think it's valid enough, heh.

But I bring this point up because Peter links it to Metatron mentioning the "Prince of Heaven" falling, as Gabriel as being "another" one. "Another one" what?? We have to assume that Metatron means another "Supreme Archangel" as holding the title of "Prince of Heaven", meaning Gabriel was NOT the first and only Supreme Archangel. I don't think Metatron is referencing Lucifer here. In fact, they deliberately avoid saying a name. We just ASSUME that it was Lucifer because that's the "common knowledge".

If GO is going to reference the theory that Lucifer actually fell BEFORE becoming an Archangel, then that means in my theory Crowley became his replacement of the Original Seven. And given that he was possibly the One (and only angel, in my above theory) Who Sees God, he was in-turn given the position of Supreme Archangel, charged with creating, again, God's Vision of the Universe.

I think having Crowley be the one who witnesses Gabriel's Trial is important if we're going on the theory that they are mirrors of each other in S2. What if:

Crowley ALSO had a similar Trial when he questioned God (or the other Archangels) about "what's the point of" the destruction of the universe, then subsequently saying "nah" to having Armageddon 6,000 years before the events of S1?;

In said Trial, Gabriel was a presiding member, and, given that we know his prior cruelty from S1, he voted on Camael being cast out in a vicious and cruel fashion "for betraying God". Thus, his eyes burnt and forever scarred to prevent him from ever seeing God again, had his name and memories removed from the Book of Life, and sent to on a one way trip to Hell. I speculate this because Trial-Gabriel certainly believe he was going to "Fall" that way. I'd also wager Camael/Crowley was the last angel to ever "properly" Fall, which is why the modern angels still think that they do it this way, rather than the way they planned for Gabriel. I realize that this point DOES contradict my theory about the other missing Archangels quietly being erased and reassigned, but perhaps BECAUSE Gabriel is SO High up the chain, they HAD no choice but to make an example of him. Perhaps Metatron just quietly deleted the other Archangels' original names without anyone's knowledge.

We now know from S2 that regardless of an angel's status, the angels will veto against anyone who goes against their interpretation of The Great Plan. We now also know that the "Supreme Archangel" is also a "title only" job that has benefits only if you're going to go with the Majority Vote. And if you don't, they're going to make an example out of you.

And I reckon Camael/Crowley, just like Gabriel after, tried to "go his own way" (as quoted by the Metatron) and got banished for it.

Aziraphale really now has himself in a pickle, and I suspect that he will figure ALL of this out when he gets there.

And finally because this is the "Sevens" section of this meta, I also want to mention these "a-bit-reaching-but-still-plausible-theories" that I came across while I was researching:

This tweet speculates that Gabe is morse coding "7"

Michael tweeted 7 dots after S2 aired

CONCLUSION

While this theory doesn't outright bust the Raphael Theory (since there are some similarities with Crowley and Raphael within the theory), as well as the "he was Lucifer" theory (which I also really like, but Crowley mentioned in S1 he was "hanging out with Lucifer and the guys" before he fell, so... I'm more apt to not really run with this theory). BUT it does tie up a lot more things, and it connects things better than the Raphael one does, in my humble opinion.

The TL;DR of this entire post is this:

I think Crowley was an Archangel, that is the only CERTAIN thing I feel.

I think he was Camael, The One (and only angel) Who (Literally) Sees God. He was the First Supreme Archangel who created God's Vision of the Universe.

I think that Camael questioned the Council of Angels why they need to destroy beauty that God created. It didn't make sense to him.

They told him about Armageddon (the S1 one). As the angel of war, and as the Supreme Archangel who had final say, he said "nah". And he tried "to go his own way" to avoid Armageddon.

The Council and Metatron did not like this, saw it as blaspheming against God. Camael then had a Trial similar to Gabriel's.

I think this all happened shortly after the war that sent down Lucifer and the other rebelling Angels, so Heaven was still VERY tetchy about anyone who questioned God and The Great Plan. Because Camael was a Supreme Archangel, the original Prince of Heaven, this was seen as SEVERE betrayal of the Council. For the record, I think the "Before the Beginning" sequence takes place AFTER the War that created Hell.

My belief about the Book of Life is that its ACTUAL purpose is to remove people from being remembered, which is far worse of an existence for someone banished. A metaphorical interpretation of "removed from existence" simply could mean "and everyone forgot about you", à la It's a Wonderful Life, a movie that references "angels getting their wings".

Camael was sentenced in a way that would make an example of him to other angels to remind them of their place: He was cast out of Heaven, his angelic name erased from the Book of Life which caused his other Council Members at the time to forget him, and for him to have foggy memories in turn, although he KNOWS he was an angel (perhaps as a side effect of being cast out the traditional way, you are forced to remember that you once lived in Heaven). His eyes were burnt out to quite literally leave an unremovable scar so he could no longer "see" God and their vision, which explains why Crowley cannot ever change his eyes regardless of how he presents himself. He has to hide them away.

I think Crowley was the last angel to be cast out in this way. BUT because his ANGEL name was erased, none of the remaining Original Council angels (Gabriel, Michael, and Uriel) recognize him. I suspect Sarqael remembers him because she was NOT an Archangel at the time since she was not one of the Original Seven Archangels.

I also suspect that there are purposely missing Archangels for a reason, and the fact that only 4 rather than 7 seemingly run things symbolizes the problems in Heaven and that God has not been in charge for a long time. I think those missing 3 or 4 are actually Scriveners, who were quietly sentenced and erased by the Metatron, hence why Gabriel thought that he was going to be cast out like his predecessor. But because Gabriel WAS a Supreme Archangel, he HAD to be made an example of, just as Crowley before.

"Supreme Archangel" is a Title-Only job, and if you go against the Council, you are indeed made an example of. I think this is purposeful setup for S3 to show that Azzie is in DEEP shit.

EPILOGUE

I still want to expand upon my Angel Theory section from my S2 Meta, but for now, I am so pleased with how this turned out, and I hope you've enjoyed this Deep Dive into another Archangel Theory. I had a lot of fun with this one; I like learning about supernatural things, it's always interesting.

I am interested in others' thoughts on this theory, especially if your memory of your religious education is a bit better than mine! Feel free to expand upon this more, because I am an interactive blog, so it will be added to the post! <3

I hope you enjoyed, and thank you for reading!

#good omens #good omens s2 #long post #spoilers #archangel crowley #crowley is camael #good omens meta #go meta #my meta #my theories #angel crowley #crowley was an archangel #go speculations #go theories #go s3 speculations

[locationvoid]

AziraCrow

Demon Aziraphale -> Demon name: Zira

Angel Crowley -> Angel name: Raphael

~°~°~~°~°~°~°~°~~°~°~°~°~°~~°~°~°~°~°

You don't have to read this part but this is my take on demon Aziraphale and Angel Crowley

So we don't have a whole lot of context on Crowley's past as an angel but we know he helped create the nebulas, helped out the start of the universe in place, and even participated in the Battle on the Plains of Heaven. We also know angels can have their memories wiped and tampered with and Crowley has stated how he doesn't remember everything about being an angel but he remembers he was high ranking since he had access to Gabriel's files and he remembers making the nebula cluster. He even remembers starting up the universe since he has the same crank tool he used to get everything started for the big bang.

I'm into the shared idea that Aziraphale, upon turning into a demon, will have gone blind for at least the first few weeks of becoming an angel. There's a theory that Crowley HAD to fall to be able to become the snake of Eden, which makes sense but still very f***ed up. But I believe Aziraphale would Still be a snake for there to be a snake of Eden. Snakes are seen as untrustworthy, sneaky, fast, tempting, and deceitful which would go well with my idea that after the first day Aziraphale and Crowley met each other, Aziraphale goes back to his own duties and can't help but think about what Crowley said, about how the angels who are also contributing to working on the Great Plan should be able to have a say in things as well. Conflicted, I can see him going around to other angels, innocently asking them what they think of the idea. Soon enough, instead of Satan and the guys finding angel Crowley, they overhear Aziraphale asking questions and invite him to hang out, so he does, not wanting to be rude but so genuinely curious to hear what Satan has to say. Then I can see Aziraphale slowly forming his own thoughts, wanting to show the other angels and God that they can all work together as equals and all get the credit they deserve.

This is where the war would come in. Originally, Aziraphale became guardian of the East Gate of Eden so I think it's safe to say he had a somewhat important role during the war. And Crowley was said to have ridden Furfur's back during the war which may seem like he did absolutely nothing but mess around during the war but the actual terms used for Crowley's role can honestly be referred to in a way where Crowley also played an important role on the opposing side. But I can say for sure until S3.

The idea for demon Aziraphale is that word would get around about Aziraphale asking questions and hanging out with Satan and he would be "tried" for his treason. But he knew there wouldn't be one and that he would be cast out so he joins the war on the opposing side, knowing how corrupt Heaven truly is. His last ditch effort to stop God's abuse of power and hopefully get someone new in charge but it's no use. I imagine the "war" is more like a civil war instead of a full on world war. And after, all the angels involved were cast out of Heaven, Aziraphale included. One of her strongest, most loyal soldiers betrayed her so when he falls, he's forced into his new life blind and afraid. Aziraphale's hands are now adorned with sharp claws and the whites of his eyes have darkened and his iris has turned to snake-like slits. He's forced to be a snake, not because it means he won't see the stars again but to remind him that he refused to trust Her and the Plan.

I can see Aziraphale still wanting to be an angel but not with Her in power so he accepts his fall to an extent.

Demon Aziraphale would still like his Tartan clothes, just in darker form, with the addition of dark blues. He would still like reading books but would be more open to other hobbies as well.

I can also see him hesitant to fully change his name so he may go by Zira as his demon name or he may use a demon name while in Hell and/or talking to Satan or the other demons but use the name Zira when talking to Crowley.

/////////////////////////////////////////

Angel Crowley will have thought about what Angel Aziraphale said to him, about how he shouldn't be asking so many questions because he wouldn't want to see Crowley (Raphael) fall. He would finish his duties of starting the universe and report back to God. He would try to put it out of his mind and continue on his duties like normal and, with Satan and the guys being occupied with Aziraphale, Crowley wouldn't have the chance to hang out with them.

I believe Aziraphale and Crowley (in the original story) still talked to each other at least every now and again when they were both still angels. This would be the same in this timeline but with some differences.

Every now and again the two would see each other and chat, carelessly, not wanting to talk work with each other, Aziraphale too scared of losing Crowley's friendship to bring up the fact that he's hanging out with Satan.

Then the rumors would start. Crowley will have heard about Aziraphale talking to Satan, other angels would see it as treason but Crowley would be genuinely intrigued with Aziraphale's new life. He would want to ask him questions, try to, but Aziraphale would refuse to answer, not wanting Crowley to get in trouble.

The war would happen and Crowley would be out in an important position (just like Aziraphale had been) and Aziraphale would fight on the opposing side.

Afterwards, upon Aziraphale's fall, Crowley is placed as guard of the Eastern Gate of Eden and given a flaming sword.

I believe the story would play out similarly as it did in the show except Angel Crowley would be a bit more confident than angel Aziraphale and wouldn't second guess giving his sword away. This lack of hesitation would intrigue Zira and it would be the start of a long friendship.

Angel Crowley would also be confident in his clothing style as well, switching up clothes each day/week to satisfy his need for change. Instead of a bookshop there would be a greenhouse attached to an apartment where people can buy plants ranging from decorative flowers and ferns to spices to fruits to vegetables and so on. He would also be a big fan of space and would have many space-themed pictures and objects around the place. Aziraphale would have a library space in his own apartment and a place for his music. He and Crowley both enjoy classical but I can see them both enjoying other genres as well that you wouldn't think angel Aziraphale or even angel Crowley would even like.

//////////////////////////////////

When it comes to the two of them together, I can see them being clingy, like in the books. Angel Crowley wouldn't be as hesitant to touch Aziraphale and wouldn't be as embarrassed to be nice to demon Zira since Crowley's angel side would be more confident in that sense. I can even see demon Zira being quite the passive aggressive demon while Crowley would be a very blunt angel, at least especially after the Garden of Eden when God has fully calmed down from the giving-his-sword-away thing. He will be more confident in his Earth work and thus a bit more blunt regarding what he wants. They would eat together, Crowley happily being introduced to human food by Zira, they would drink together, and they would sit close to each other. They would often show little signs of affection through touches and I could even see Crowley hugging Zira out of excitement sometimes.

I can see, even though angel Crowley is more confident, there are situations where he gets overwhelmed or outnumbered or just stuck and Zira is happily coming to his aid to help in any way he can. Not caring what the mission is, he just wants to be able to be by angel Crowley's side and help him, no matter how dangerous. He does like detective books.

But confessions of love would still be something that would happen later since, well, they're ineffable idiot lovers, they take their time.

(If you're wondering what the tattoo is on Aziraphale's face in the drawing, The Bowl of Hygieia, is one of the symbols of pharmacology, and along with the Rod of Asclepius, it is one of the most ancient and important symbols related to medicine in western countries. Hygieia was the Greek goddess of health, hygiene, cleanliness, and sanitation, and the daughter of Asclepius, who she is often closely associated with e.g. in prayers and hymns. Asclepius' symbol is his rod, with a snake twined around it; correspondingly, Hygieia's symbol is a cup or chalice with a snake twined around its stem. Hygieia was also invoked, along with her father Asclepius, and Panacea in the original Hippocratic Oath.)

#fyp #art #artwork #digital art #good omens #good omens aziraphale #good omens crowley #aziraphale x crowley #crowley #aziracrow #good omens au #demon aziraphale #angel crowley #good omens fandom #good omens art #good omens fanart #good omens fanwork #good omens fic #good omens fanfiction

[ladyamaranta]

where the heck is Raphael

I assume we all agree that the narrative is strongly implying that Crowley was but a common angel (the 25 lazarii miracle, the high rank clearance, what he says to Gabriel about knowing how it feels, how he does not tell Aziraphale his name when they first meet during the galaxy creation scene, the fact he knows The Metatron -an angry and flame surrounded versione of The Metatron, Saraqael having worked side by side with him, and also maybe some too powerful miracles here and there like in S1 when he was able to froze time for himself, Aziraphale and Adam in a sort of Heavenly space in the middle of a Very Important Moment) ...so the point is which not common angel was he.

From my very personal point of view the main thing in favor of him being Lucifer is that I would love that sentence in S1 to be the opposite of what we thought it to be. I'm referrinf to: "I was just minding my business one day and then, oh lookie here, it's Lucifer and the guys"; the last part would therefore be not something Crowley said, but something that was addressed to him. Someone came there, took a look at him and went "ohh, it's Lucifer and the guys" and started to complaing about the food. I appreciate this kind of 'irrelevant subversion' of how you first pictured a told (and not yet shown) scene in your mind. Also it would be fun for Lucifer to be, in this universe, not the mind behind the rebellion but someone who was just minding his business and someone else saw as the right person to go to to give further resonance to some minor issues about the food.

But.

But from the same very personal point of view, I'd love for Crowley to be Raphael because I would love for the Great Raphael to be a fallen angel in this retelling of christian mythology. Lucifer is THE fallen angel, everyone knows he was the first to cast down the pearly gates; most christians associate him with Satan, call him the first sinner, consider him inherently baaad.

But Raphael? One of the greatest angels? One of the saints? To be one of the fallen?

Just. Lovely.

Also I recognize the story has an important hole here:

Where the heck is Raphael?

At least Lucifer was mentioned, also Hell has so far not had the same amount of screentime as Heaven has, so I don't see the absence of Lucifer (given that in this universe Satan≠Lucifer) as deliberate as the absense of Raphael.

Everyone is familiar with Gabriel, Michael and Raphael as they are familiar with Lucifer. Yet Raphael is never shown nor mentioned.

Everyone is familiar with Gabriel, Michael and Raphael, almost no one is familiar with Uriel and Saraqael and no one is familiar with hecking Sandalphon. Yet they chose not to use the famous trio Gabriel-Michael-Raphael to straightforward let the audience know 'this is Heaven's Small Council'. No, they get rid of Raphael like he was a barely known angel, like he was an angel no one knows the name of before reading about angeology, like he was a Sandalphon.

Listen, this is deliberate.

The absence of Raphael is deliberate.

And I would love for him to be the 'angel who fell because he was asking too many questions'.

I would love for him to be the powerful Supreme Archangel that was just minding his business when Lucifer and the boys reached out to.

May I add.

...even if Crowley is not Raphael, I'm sure Raphael would pop up somewhere else, because the narrative has strongly pointed in the direction of a fallen Great One.

I refuse to believe The Metraton said

"For one Prince of Heaven to be cast into the outer darkness makes a good story. For it to happen twice makes it look like there is some sort of institutional problem." about some hecking Sandalphon.

--

Little addition because I have never seen this Very Valid Point mentioned:

Crowley gives away a lot of younger sibling energy when interacting with Gabriel and Middle Child Michael 😌

#crowley #crowley is raphael #archangel raphael #christian mythology #good omens #meta #good omens meta #talking to myself #theory #good omens theory #the metatron #aziraphale #saraqael #sandalphone #archangel gabriel #archangel michael #the princes of heaven #good omens 2

[aziraphales-library]

Lost Fic #150

1. Hello, wonderful mods! I have lost a fic with a scene that I vividly remember. I think Aziraphale and Crowley accidentally fell asleep with one another (likely on a couch?) Crowley wakes up, is upset about something (to do with feels?) Aziraphale wakes and starts apologizing, something like, "I'm sorry. Was I squishing you? I know I can be quite heavy" and Crowley responds with, "No, don't be ridiculous. Of course you weren't, and you aren't." Thank you so much for all your time and work! :D - anon

2. Hi all! I read a fic a while back that I can't find. It was after dining at the Ritz and Aziraphale says at one point that of course he loves Crowley, he just, needed to wait till they were safe and he thought Crowley knew. It was a short fic, really great, now I can't find it. I know there must be a lot like this one, and it's pretty vague, but that's all I can remember. Hope you can find it, thanks! - @sharklist

3. So I've been looking for this fic for about 2 days now and I think it's deleted, but can you help me find it? All I remember is that after Crowley preened Aziraphale's wings,  Aziraphale kissed him and Crowley said "Never in 6000 did I think you would make the first move." And then poor Aziraphale was like O.o - @humanbeingwithissues

4. hello there, i looking for the fic where A discover that the book of prophecies has been burned and in the same time that C always loved it (romantically) but i don't remember the name - anon

5. Hi, I know that the mods get a ton of requests for lost fics, but I’d appreciate it if anyone could help me find one in particular (I think this is all one fic? but if it’s not, that is probably my problem). (Feel free to reformat however works best): Here are some notable details: Limbo is basically like a sexual health clinic for supernatural creatures? Crowley has an asexual vampire friend that is also his therapist.Aziraphale visits Crowley’s flat and does some protective sigil, but falls ill since Crowley had measures to keep his flat secure post Hastur/Ligur. Crowley used to be Lucifer/Satan’s throne and actually built parts of Hell. Details I think are still part of this fic:Aziraphale was/is Raphael and is asked (by Michael?) to lead Heaven after Gabriel falls, but declines.Limbo also acts as a neutral third party and Aziraphale and Crowley make an agreement with Satan/Lucifer after he realizes Crowley is his old throne. It was an incredible read, and I hope someone can help find it.Thanks for all you folks do! - anon

If you know any of these fics please include the number in your reply! Thank you :)

- Mod D

#good omens #lost fic #ineffable husbands #mod d

[feathered-serpents]

Well this sucks

I deleted my Crowley is Lucifer and Aziraphale is Raphael theory because… Twitter was mean to me

And that’s stupid! I know it’s stupid! I’m 25 I thought I would have thicker skin than this but apparently I don’t.

What happened was I made TikToks about both theories. I thought they were just happy and fun, but, someone felt the need to screenshot the Crowley is Lucifer theory, and mock it on Twitter, confessing they had not watched the video and “didn’t want to know” what my points were. This unfortunately gained lots and lots of traction and hundreds of people were suddenly saying things like “Me when I have no media literacy” “Watch the show” pretty mild things. Then they started to point out things to “disprove” the theory that I address in the video. Proving they didn’t watch it and weren’t there to discuss a theory they were just there to hate it

Still I could’ve handled that. But when it stared to spread to my other videos, it started to become too much.

And then I got a comment calling me f*ggot and to go watch the show and that broke me

I feel childish for this reaction but. Well. Good Omens is close to my heart. It hurts to have this happen.

Luckily the joy of the show has not been ruined, but I find it really hard to post theories or analysis anymore because now i’m just embarrassed. Tumblr has not been part of this in the slightest and yet it’s spread here too

I don’t know. I just needed to vent. I’ve never had something like this happen before and it was. Quite a lot to wake up to ngl

#good omens #personal #vent #discourse #I mean I guess?

[technolesbiana]

Good Omens Theory

now, see, raphael is one of the most important archangels in heaven, tho we'd never see him.

but considering that:

aziraphale got promoted to an archangel;

he is the only angel who name ends up with -ale and not -el;

neither his name nor crowley are biblically (there's no angel named aziraphale and no demon named crowley);

there's "raphael" in "aziraphale".

at first i thought crowley was the raphael, but aziraphale being him makes much more sense.

also, raphael was an archangel, but it seems like crowley was a seraphim!

in the episode crowley and beelzebub talk, crowley says this:

in the angel's hierarchy, cherubs are below the seraphims.

considering that, both beelzebub and crowley might have been seraphims. they were the closest to god before fallen.

i also found this (below) while searching about seraphims. wonder where we've saw a serpent before...

however, while searching what angel crowley was, i found about kokabiel.

kokabiel, the angel of the stars, a fallen angel who rebelled against god.

crowley create the stars. kokabiel was the angel of the stars. it all makes sense, crowley was kokabiel!!

except that kokabiel wasn't a seraphim. he was watcher.

but yet, neil gaiman have made a lot of changes in good omens which are definitely not biblically accurate lmao. so it wouldn't be really a surprise if he takes the liberty to make kokabiel a seraphim.

so in conclusion, i believe that aziraphale is raphael, crowley is kokabiel and they are very much gay, good for them!

#good omens #azicrow #ineffable husbands #ineffable divorce #aziraphale #crowley #good omens 2 #theory #also i saw mostly of this on tiktok lmao

[1000roughdrafts]

Supporting Characters x Reader Master List

Lots of stuff in here - Gabriel x Reader, John Winchester x Reader, Rowena x Reader, Charlie x Reader, Donna x Reader, Crowley x Reader, and more (general/no pairings)

Remember that there are some 18+ explicit works, so please heed all warnings!

Gabriel X Reader

💘Coffee Shop ~ fluff, Gabriel is very much alive and just full of surprises, isn’t he?

John Winchester x Reader 

Mini Series xx 

💚Stop Asking Me To Come Back ~ flangst, kissing; Y/N and John have always had a cat and mouse chase type of relationship, where one runs and the other chases, and vice versa, but typically fall into a Dom/Sub type of relationship. John is tired of the games and when Y/N realizes she wants something more she’s too little too late. 

💚Stop Asking Me To Come Back (2) ~ 18+, smut

Wayward Women x Reader 

Charlie x Reader 

💖Confessions ~ one shot, flangst, heavy topics; You were best friends with Charlie since elementary school. One day, she just vanished. During the years you spent without her, you went down a dark path that brought you onto a road of addiction. Now she has returned to spend a day with you and talk about all the years that have passed without each other.   

Rowena x Reader 

💖What Happens During Research ~ fluff; no plot, just silliness 

💖 You Look Yummy ~ 18+ 100% smut literally nothing but sex

Donna X Reader 

💖Don’t Leave Me, Not Again ~ flangst; When a hunt in Minnesota goes awry and the Winchester’s go silent, you ask your ex-girlfriend, Donna, for help

Crowley x Reader

One Shots xx Both 18+ / Explicit

Hush -  unprotected vaginal penetration, oral sex (female receiving), BDSM, this isnt ddlg but it kinda has that vibe, a bit of an OOC Crowley,

A Night With The King - Request from Anon: Can I have Crowley flirting with a v nervous and quiet reader? Maybe w a splash of Dean jealousy because he’s been pining after her forever?

General:Supernatual x Reader (no pairings) 

💛Cop Car ~ (Dean, Sam, Reader) Drabble; reader stole a cop car and Dean wants to drive it. 

💛Saving Dean ~(Dean, Reader, Sam) imagine 

💛Live and Let Die ~(Sam, Dean, LittleSister!Reader) angstish,fluff; After years of arguing with your older brothers, they finally let you go out and hunt on your own, but it was nothing like what you expected. After killing your first demon, you call them up for some comfort.   

💛Cherry Pie ~ Drabble; Dean loves pie, what else can I say?

💛It’s Time to Let Me Go ~ angst; Raphael has started a war with only one request to end it all: you. Are Sam and Dean willing to let you go to save the world?   

💛Hi Dad ~ Drabble; based off of this prompt -  “She stared at him, holding her favorite teddy bear in one hand and his pistol in the other. “Hi dad,” she whispered.

💛Little Tree Part One | Part Two ~ Being a sheriff in a small town, you were surprised when a body was found, making it the first murder in over 50 years. The alarm bells really went off when the FBI showed up as quick as they did. Despite your initial thoughts, you were lucky that they had. (completed)  

💛 Coming Out - Request from @the-nb-florist "I was wondering if you could make a brotherly sam and dean where the reader comes out as Non Binary? The Reader is like Fem but they identify more with mass stuff. I just want supper fluff and sweet. Thank you so much!!"

#supernatural fan fiction #sam winchester #dean winchester #gabriel x reader #crowley x reader smut #john winchester #john winchester x reader #fluff #angst #charlie x reader supernatural #rowena x reader #donna x reader supernatural #wlw #supernatural fandom #spn #supernatural #supernatural fan fic #fanfic