#discourse that no one asked for | Explore Tumblr Posts and Blogs

firein-thesky · 1 month

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Why is it that dc such as r@pe, sa, and incest is totally okay to write about and romanticize but y’all draw the line at racism, fat phobia, and homophobia *talking about the writings creators make, not personal beliefs*? Whats the difference between these things? All of them are hurtful and affect people in real life, so why is everybody on here choosing and picking one and not the other? Do writers on here think that they are not comparable or that one is okay to romanticize and the other is going way too far?

Im just genuinely curious as I have seen this topic be brought up again and again, which has made me realize this and Id like to see it from someone else's pov.

hi! there is a lot to answer and unpack here and i have every intention of doing so underneath the cut. forgive me if this gets long, but you’ve asked me 4 very massive questions that i think warrant detail, nuance, and thought. there is a lot i’d like to say here.

that being said, mind the content warnings and protect yourself.

cw: mentions of rape, incest, racism, homophobia, fat phobia, discourse in general

firstly, i am going to choose to give you the benefit of the doubt in assuming you are actually curious in hearing another side and you are not simply looking to stir a pot or pick a fight with beliefs you have no intention of changing or having an open discussion on. your accusatory tone in the first half indicates otherwise and kindly, i am not an idiot. but i want to earnestly talk to you about this and again, will think better of you than you perhaps have indicated you think of me.

secondly, you do not have to censor words like rape in my inbox. that sort of censorship has become wildly popular because of tik tok and other money-hungry social media that also desperately want to silence people. do you know why you have to censor words like that on tik tok? or words like genocide? suicide? racism? 1. so that they can make money and market and push their squeaky clean algorithms but 2. and perhaps worse, so they can silence victims. if social media platforms and capitalism and the systems of powers had it their way, you would never utter these words again—whether to call someone out for justice or to have an open discussion like this one. i encourage you greatly to think critically about this and how you choose to use censorship and why.

now, to your questions.

to preface, i am interpreting this ask as being anti-dark content in fiction as you state that ALL these subjects harm people in real life. or at least, you are being critical of all dark content in fiction and the way writers engage with them, effectively ‘picking and choosing’ which are deemed acceptable and which aren’t, when they are all hurtful. i apologize if that wasn’t your intention/what you believe, but regardless, i’ll endeavor to answer you.

i personally have drawn no lines about dark content nor spoken about any of these topics specifically really, which indicates to me you have a different narrative and/or are coming from more inflammatory arguments that are always circling fandom lately. in the post i most recently reblogged, i spoke mostly of violence. which, of course, all of those things can be. but i didn’t name one of those topics in particular.

regardless, i don’t believe in the censorship of any dark content in art, but rather advocate strongly for critical analysis on a case-by-case basis. in general, i encourage thinking critically about every aspect of the world around you.

i do not believe that rape, incest, and sa are okay to write about or create art about but racism, homophobia, and fat phobia are not. i believe all of those topics are ones that can, should, and will be explored in the safety of art. all to varying degrees of success, earnestness, impact, and intent. you’re right that these are real things, that can hurt people, and the fictional work about them can have impact on our society that is tangible but the actual art or fiction created is not real. and again, this is all to varying degrees on a case-by-case basis.

art and fiction also historically and massively do discuss these dark content topics and have actively swayed the public’s opinion on matters, whether for better or for worse. throwing away all dark content in art and fiction because it is ‘harmful’ is deeply, deeply dangerous and reductive. a lot of art that engages with dark content actually makes very succinct points about it—i think of vladimir nabokov’s lolita or octavia butler’s bloodchild or speak by laurie halse anderson.

this is where we must exorcise critical thinking. some pieces of work will handle dark content poorly—white saviors making art on racism. men making art about a woman’s experiences that (as you are so interested in) romanticize her pain. etc. etc. and some art will handle it’s dark content incredibly and be transformative, perhaps even revolutionary in how we talk, perceive, or acknowledge systems of oppression, violence, and dark content in this world. some dark content in fiction will have damaging beliefs and effects on society, some will not—we must also look at scope for this, at the writer perhaps, the historical moment, their audience etc.

(for example, there is a significant difference in a main stream male writer, writing of a woman’s experience with rape in a published book in a way that makes it sound romanticized, sold to thousands and thousands of general public vs. a woman using fanfic to explore rape, take control of it, or whatever in a fanfic for a small online community where there are warnings on it. indicating she is aware of its potential damage in a way her male counterpart is not…)

but i still believe in dark contents’ existence in art. of course there is differences between all of these topics you brought up, but i don’t think their differences matter in this answer. i believe in their right to be explored in art. i am talking broadly of media/art here, which i think is the more relevant conversation, but i think you are actually more interested in a much smaller scale of people. ie. fandom. ie. mostly marginalized people in small communities online writing and creating dark content.

people will choose and pick which ones they’d like to create art over and which ones they don’t, which ones they read and which ones they don’t. there’s no ‘hard line’ drawn anywhere. and i can’t control it and neither can you. perhaps you think violence is okay to be explored in fanfic, but racism isn’t. someone else will have different preferences. i do not believe in its censorship.

now, let’s move onto your interest in romanticization and what i think you are more pointing to, which is fandom. you are specifically referring to people in fandom who write about rape, incest, etc. and ‘romanticize’ it—ie. they write about it in a way that is a fantasy. it is perhaps supposed to be horny or sexy. so let’s talk about it.

i must remind you that these topics you’ve brought up (rape, incest, sa) being written are fiction and it is (most often) done by someone marginalized who has either experienced this or is in threat of experiencing this under a patriarchy. i assure you, they are aware of its harm. hence the copious warnings in fandom spaces.

if i can be candid, sometimes i think that people forget how systems of oppression work when discussing fandom and whether dark content being created should be allowed or not.

for example, i sometimes think people who are anti-dark content in fandom believe that a woman or afab person writing a fictional fanfic about rape or sexual violence then influences people to go out and rape people or that women actually like it. when the reality, in fandom spaces, is that rape and sexual violence happen frequently under the patriarchy and then these women in fandom write fictional fanfic in response to cope, explore, take control of, etc. etc.

to insinuate that women or afab people (which fandom mostly is) exploring dark content safely in fiction then causes their own oppression and harm or trauma is rather victim-blame-y to me. fandom exploring dark content does not cause these things to happen in our society….these actions (rape, incest, sa) happen in our society or systems of power and fandom reacts to them in their art by exploring it in dark content. do you understand what i’m trying to say?

it’s not a matter of what is ‘okay’ to romanticize and what isn’t. i do not think the romanticization that fandom does with dark content (ie. my kidnapper actually loves me! or this sexual act that i did not consent to…maybe feels good) is not actually romanticizing but coping because of the systems of power that i described above. and this can be coping with anything—shame of sexuality, shame of fantasies, trauma, fear, etc. etc.

as i said in my tags in that post i reblogged and as plato said, dark content in art is a safe place to explore what would otherwise be harmful and dangerous in real life. it is cathartic. potentially even, a purging.

and even if it isn’t all that—maybe it just is trashy fantasy. it is still playing pretend. it is still fiction and in fandom spaces, it is still most likely being created by a marginalized person. and again, even if it isn’t, we don’t get to censor it. we can be critical of it or wary or whatever, but to censor it, is a slippery, slippery slope. do deem some topics as “acceptable” and others as “unacceptable” is dangerous.

just like kids play pretend where they ‘fight’ or ‘kill’ or ‘kidnap’ or ‘shoot’ each other in games of cops and robbers or heroes and villains, they are safely exploring adventure, dark content, fantasy, tragedy, and higher emotions. adults can do the same in fiction and with adult topics like sex.

and at the end of the day, we don’t get to demand the credentials to do so either. we don’t get to censor them or control them and nor should we be allowed to. i cannot stress enough that i encourage you to be critical of censorship or the absolute disgust in dark content and at those (again—often marginalized people) who engage with it in fandom. i believe it is deeply puritanical, conservative, and dangerous.

you don’t have to like dark content or consume it at all and fandom makes it easy not to with all the warnings and tags, but you cannot control others or police them. nor should you want to.

and at the end of the day, i have some questions for you. you don’t have to respond to this, perhaps they’re just things to think about. what is the end goal here? what is the point in harassing, shaming, attacking, criticizing, or interrogating people in fandom spaces who create or support dark content? do you believe that if it is purged from fandom, it will be purged from our society? if you want it purged from society—shouldn’t you start there rather than in the inbox of marginalized writers in fandom? people in fandom did not create rape, incest, and sa nor do they in their exploration of fiction…they are merely reacting to a world that did create it.

i hope at no point i came off as rude to you, as was not my intention. i intended to stand up for myself and respectfully state my opinions and thoughts on this matter. i’m sorry it got long, but also i don’t believe in being brief on such complex matters. i am a writer who engages critically with the world around me and sometimes, things cannot be made into short, snappy answers. sometimes, we must unpack.

genuinely wishing you well.

#i cannot guarantee that i’ll have the time patience or energy to answer every ask like the one above in such detail #going forward #but i do support open discussions and i wanted to be kind to this anon #these are just my 2 cents on all of this #cw: rape #cw: incest #cw: racism #cw: fat phobia #cw: homophobia #discourse

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pinkcultgirl · 2 months

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ok but marcille is a groomer of falin. but go off i guess!!!!

I was originally just going to ignore this ask, but I honestly want to try to articulate why this way of thinking about farcille is a huge disservice to your enjoyment of dunmeshi-

I don't feel the need to really explain why two consenting adult women with an age gap doesn't equal grooming, but in an effort to empathize with your pov, let's dissect the assumption Marcille is "too old" for Falin.

Isn't that watering down one of the main characterizations of what makes Marcille, i dunno, MARCILLE? She's literally spent her whole life not knowing peers or friends that see her on an equal level. Of course Falin, the one girl she meets and falls for once her maturity has stablized, would be incredibly important to her.

To water down her backstory to "groomer" is such a perversion of the complexity Kui shows through Marcille, and dungeon meshi as a whole.

#my take on the farcille “discourse”#i miss wen this bad take was confined to that one twitter post #as always nuance!! Nuance saves lives yall!#please engage in more critical thought..#dunmeshi #dungeon meshi #farcille #falin touden #marcille donato #yuri #character analysis #fandom meta #asks

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bixels · 3 months

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So i have a small nicpic i wanted to share with you about your interpretation of spike in the au and i want to make two things clear before i talk

1) i havent watch the series for a little while as of now so i might be misnterpreting a aspect of this chatacter that might have never been there and only apeared in fan content and personal interpretation (since that whats been keeping me on the fandom)

2) this is not a big problem about the au i matured enough to not get angry at a interpretation of a fictional charater

Now here i go

I feel spike being the same race as the rest of his familie makes him lose a part of his character that might have not been central but was still something interesting about him and is the idea of not mayhering how diferent he looked from his adoptive family (and his cominty as a whole) he was he was still seen as part of it

Again this isnt a big problem with the au as a whole its just a small nicpic that i have about the au and its not going to make me hate the au

This was just my opinion that i wanted to share and im interested to know your opinion about what i said

I understand this criticism and agree that having Simon/Spike be a different race than Thea could speak to their relationship in the original show.

My reasoning for designing them both to be African American is this. I believe Simon's adoption is enough to explore the feelings of separation and exclusion he may have with Thea and her family. The original show doesn't bring up Twilight and Spike's racial differences much because they originally didn't consider Spike to be a part of Twilight's family. As far as I know, there's no moment where someone says, "Wow! You're telling me you're related to Twilight Sparkle? But you look nothing alike!" because Spike was more so Twilights... familiar than anything.

Later episodes that explore their familial dynamic poses the conflict through Spike's adoption. There's one episode where Spike's "biological father" returns, and Spike accuses Twilight of not being his real family, which breaks her heart. There's another that delves deep into Spike's feelings of exclusion from Twilight and Shining Armor's siblinghood. Basically, in discussions of family dynamics, the show places more emphasis on Spike's identity as an adopted sibling rather than a dragon.

I really do believe a multiracial family would be good representation, but the racial dynamics would not be something I'd be interested in getting into. That's not to say I find real multiracial families problematic or uninteresting or unappealing or unimportant. I just wouldn't be interested in having to explain in-text that Simon (non-black) and Thea (black) are related over and over; it would grow tedious. It adds an extra level of writing complication and opens up racial discourse (discourse that I feel is unrelated to their relationship in the original show) that I don't want to concern myself with, especially because I have no experience in navigating such discourse.

#ask me #anon #i hope this makes sense #tldr i think having human twilight + spike be different races is a good idea #but the decision to do that would complicate their relationship in ways the og show didn't regard #and would start in-universe racial discourse that i don't think is necessary to get into #i think the struggle is a valid and real struggle. but i personally don't have much to say about the social politics of multiracial familie #because i know nothing about what it's like to be in one #also you can 100% bring up moments that touched on race/multiracialness between twilight and spike in the show #because i know they're there #there's a lot of casual racism in the show overall #but it's not something i'd want to explore in this particular au #it's not a conflict that i think is necessary between twilight and spike #but you're more than welcome to disagree

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boyquiet · 6 months

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i think that we need to get over the narrative that you can’t have gay villains because that’s a harmful stereotype because there’s a huge difference between “this character is gay and a bad person” and “this character was written specifically to equate being gay and being evil/depraved/degenerate”. it’s just such a narrow minded view of fiction that leads to people afraid to write queer characters as anything less than morally perfect and then to a bunch of palatable but bland and boring queer characters that are arguably worse representation than a gay villain because they are not allowed to do anything wrong. while it is important to write all types of gay characters a work isn’t instantly “problematic” because the villain is queer and the hero isn’t. I think this is also related to the idea of subtext vs text in gay media and how I see a lot of people get mad bc the homoerotic subtext isn’t made canon without considering the context of it at all—sometimes creators make artistic decisions for reasons other than that they didn’t want the gay people to kiss because they’re homophobic. well written queer subtext can be better than a canon gay couple with no personality or relevance and a queer villain can be a better queer character than a gay hero because the characters in-universe morality isn’t inherently tied to how much care they are written with and the quality of “queer representation” isn’t determined by the amount of times they kiss on screen.

#mainly this is brought on by mgs discourse surrounding vamp and volgin and ocelot #I was telling a friend who isn’t into mgs about how ocelot is gay and a sadist and they asked if there were any good gay characters in mgs #and I was like um well no one is really a good character in this series. but yeah I guess #and they said ‘then the game is redeemed’#that was pretty disappointing to me im not making a callout for my friend or anything but like. you cant judge a work on its rep #by weighing the number of ‘good’ and ‘bad’ queer characters mathematically #it’s shallow and reductive both to queer rep and the concept of gray morality #never mind that ocelot is one of the most important well written and beloved characters in the franchise. hes gay and evil so that must #make him a derogatory stereotype and ‘bad representation’#anyway I think ocelot should torture and kill more people for fun #queer #lgbtq

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i-made-a-bg3-blog · 11 months

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In honor of the updated release date, it is once again time to make a shitpost no one would ever care about.

Ranking BG3 companions from worst to best cooks:

5. Astarion

You know this motherfucker has never cooked a day in his life, even before he was a vampire. In fact, I have a hard time imagining him eating at all. He's that guy who is perpetually late, always hungover (but like in a chic way), and his diet consists of red wine, cigarettes, and cocaine. Also, he always has an iced coffee, even when there is no conceivable way he could have gotten one. No, I have not thought a lot about this, what are you talking about?

4. Lae'zel

Lae'zel seems like she's a 'food is food' kind of person. Her cooking is edible, but that's about it. She refuses to cater to weak, lesser races by adding any kind of seasoning.

3. Shadowheart

The thing is, has Shadowheart actually cooked for the group? Cause I can imagine Tav asking her, and her questioning why they're asking her specifically, and then Tav worries that they've said something offensive. Mostly she just doesn't want to, and this is a very effective method for avoiding it.

2. Wyll

Wyll is a good cook, but he has a tendency to get a little too creative. Everyone dreads when he starts talking about a new recipe idea he's had because it'll end up being something like watermelon-braised boar meat stuffed into a pumpkin.

1. Gale

Does Gale like cooking? Probably not. However, Gale refuses to be bad at anything. Also, he's one of those super annoying people who act faux-humble about something they are obviously really good at. He'd be like, 'oh no, it's nothing special' after making a souffle in the middle of goddamned woods, but you know he knows. God he's so annoying. I love him.

#another bg3 shitpost #bg3 hot takes???#my place in the discourse is asking the questions no one has ever given a fuck about #and then having psycho opinions about them #astarion #gale #wyll #lae'zel #shadowheart #bg3 #baldur's gate 3

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ingravinoveritas · 1 month

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How did u feel with the age gap question was it pr or do u really think he meant it and this was the truth

This is referring to the question asked on The Assembly last night. I'll post the clip here, for those who haven't seen it yet:

A lot of what I felt while watching this was touched on in this incredibly thoughtful post from @body-face-words, so I encourage folks to give that a read. But I think for me, when it comes to Michael's answer, it's not a matter of whether he lied or told the truth. It's that his response was sweet, but it was also a version of the truth that sounded convincing because it needed to, because this was not a time or place where he could say what he actually felt.

I'm really not sure what people expected him to say, in all honesty, as he was never going to say anything that would make him or Anna look bad, and especially not anything that could potentially negatively impact the kids, so he instead gave a very perfect PR answer. This again does not come as a surprise because we know Michael has scripted his answers about AL/their relationship in the past, but I noticed how careful he was in his response, which seems to contrast with how off-the-cuff he normally is when discussing every other subject. Part of what so many of us love about Michael is how unfiltered he is and always has been, with the exception of how much he filters and edits himself when talking about Anna.

It also seemed like, at least from my perspective, that Michael answered the question without answering the question. What the girl asked wasn't so much about the age gap, but about AL being five years older than Michael's daughter Lily, and it would've been a perfect opportunity for him to mention her, or how the relationship with AL affected his and Lily's relationship. He could've talked about the falling out he had with her (and Kate) in 2019 once AL's existence/pregnancy came to light, and what has happened in the years since, or how Lily now gets along with Anna/her half-sisters. But instead Michael deflected from all of that and talked about everything while saying nothing at the same time.

It was also the things Michael didn't say that stood out as much as the things he did. In the entire answer to the question, Michael never once used the word "love." Prior to the show airing, I saw a lot of people online confident that he would say that he loves Anna, but he never did. He never praised her, never talked about the things he loves about her, or how glad he is to be with her. He never once mentioned her by name. The pivot and focus was on the kids, and there was a clear distinction made between how happy he is to have the family he does, rather than to be in the relationship that he is in. Michael's use of the phrase "very happy" was also identical to the wording of a comment AL wrote on Instagram the other day, which added to the whole "reinforcing a public narrative" feeling of his response.

I think what struck me most of all, though, was how somber and heavyhearted Michael sounded while saying how happy he is. It reminded me of the song "I Am a Rock" by Simon & Garfunkel, where the upbeat and cheerful music contrasts starkly with the fraught, angry lyrics. There was no sparkle in Michael's eyes when he said it, no enthusiasm for what he was saying (which is particularly jarring when we know Michael has the capacity for incredible enthusiasm), and his face never lit up while he was talking.

There was one specific moment (which is also highlighted in the body language post) where he seemed to visibly wince and the micro-expressions were in overdrive, and it immediately made me think of a moment from Good Omens:

Time and again, I have seen fans talk about Michael's micro-expressions as an actor and how he uses them to such devastating effect (especially in the role of Aziraphale). And while these two moments are not completely identical, the idea of ignoring how Michael uses those same micro-expressions in real life makes no sense to me at all. In this instance, what we're seeing could be either because he has put so much of himself into Aziraphale that we can now recognize those "Michael" moments...or it could be because in both clips he is performing, albeit for different reasons.

The difference between Michael when he is doing this vs. when he is being genuinely himself is made even more apparent by the question immediately following this one. Unprompted, he brings up David, and the change in his expression and demeanor is swift and dramatic:

Having the mention of David happen so soon after the AL question seemed to highlight so many things. I can't help but feel that David is a security blanket for Michael, something he hides behind when he is feeling anxious or sad or overwhelmed. I wondered if perhaps he was even already thinking of David while answering the AL question, which would explain why he named him so readily--as if his mind needed to drift to someplace else just to finish answering that question.

To me, this made it abundantly clear that David is Michael's safe place. Here was where we saw Michael's eyes sparkling. Here was where we saw him light up from the inside. And it was David he kept returning to and bringing up during the rest of the show in response to other questions. So if that doesn't speak volumes about where Michael's heart seems to be, I'm not sure what does.

So yes, those are my thoughts on Michael answering the age gap question on The Assembly. As always, this is just my interpretation, but I am glad to hear from my followers with your take as well. Thanks for writing in! x

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theminecraftbee · 1 year

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you know sometimes one of the things the fandom does that i like the least is joke about how certain ccs are "lorephobic" because it basically always ignores the lore they actually are really and visibly doing. like, sure, they may not be doing the lore YOU'RE looking at, but, one, lore doesn't just mean "big overarching server storyline" it can also mean solo stuff. it can also mean 'builds that have story built into them'. it can also mean 'fun little storyline between like two guys'. it can also mean character continuity. it can mean many things. two, "this guy doesn't do lore" is NOT the same thing as "this guy doesn't do the specific lore i personally like and want to see them doing" and i don't always think you guys know the difference. all of this, of course, is to say: hey guys did you know zedaph can canonically time travel,

#discourse #sorta. tagging that more for the negativity than for there being actual discourse here #fanfic trope ask game got me into a SHARING OPINIONS mood and i've been sitting on this one for WEEKS #we'll see if i regret this later when i'm less punch-drunk #anyway this post is not just about zedaph this post is about. many people. x zedaph joel off the top of my head #zedaph is just my example here #i don't think you're bad for making these jokes mind (especially with joel given that he leans into it)#but also i think they can be really REALLY dismissive of the guys the joke is made about #especially when those guys ARE IN FACT DOING LORE #they just aren't doing the specific thing you want to see i guess.#this isn't prompted by anyone in specific incidentally do NOT think that i am aiming this at You Specifically i am not #this is just a general vibe #i also do get that these are normally in-jokes that start affectionately within that specific guy's fanbase #rather than intended as insults #it's just that when they spread widely they start to get. grating #anyway don't mind me just. in opinions mood

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assiraphales · 2 months

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So glad for your latest post about zosan because I started 1pc FULLY expecting to be bowled over by their interactions for how prevalent the ship is in the fandom and I’ve just….. been so confused about it… and wondering if I’m missing something…. like it’s not enemies to lovers, they’re not even rivals, they’re just like. Irritable coworkers who sometimes get in each other’s way…. Anyway ur so right about sansopp 🙏🙏

I didn't know ANYTHING about one piece when I watched opla (I didn't even know they were pirates) so I def didn't know about zsn. I walked away from the live action thinking 'damn the captain and first mate are NOT normal about each other' and 'luffy is sanji's little meow meow <3". I didn't even consider zoro and sanji as a dynamic outside of 'they're both trying to be the prettiest belle at the ball so that luffy will look at them'..... but I didn't really actively ship either. not even zolu (surprising I know)

upon learning about zsn I thought ok. this is clearly because I haven't watched the anime / read the manga. obviously there's something i'm missing. I read 400 chapters of the manga and am currently 450 episodes into the anime. there is obviously still something i'm missing because like you said, i'm seeing irritable coworkers. i'm not denying that they respect each other & care for each other as nakama but like...................like..................LIKE??

I'm never been a hate shipper, nor am I predisposed to ship things bc 'hot'. nothing against people who do obviously but my track record of otps is the exact opposite of the zsn dynamic. and going into the series not even knowing they were a popular ship. I have tried to see it (and obvi in the hate ship hot sex way I can see it) but other than that I have accepted that I will never get it. luffy x zoro & sanji x usopp on the other hand.....

#shipping discourse #i shied away from this topic bc Discourse #and i couldn't handle it. but i'm a slowly becoming more mentally healthy as spring comes #this also means I will start answering other asks again. sorry its just been too much recntly #zolu #sanuso #one piece

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mueritos · 5 months

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quick lil post about coming back to art full-time while also being a full time MSW student….it can be possible 0.0

anyway ty to everyone who has supported me over the years i wouldnt be able to go back to art without you all

#muertodraws #also becoming a lil more comfy calling myself autistic even tho every autistic person i have ever me is like yea ur us lol #back in therapy and i finished my first sem of grad school off strong #next sem will be crazy but o well #hoping to volunteer at a cat shelter next yr too #i need a cat in my life or else i will explode #i would get one now as an esa but i just dont have the money #so heres to hoping #anyway i know my asks are off and thats cuz i just needed to focus on school #maybe theyll come back on next year but for now if u need to reach me feel free to pm or email me #dm me on instagram too if u gotta reach me #trying to balance being on here and also wanting to be invisible and blend in with the masses and work my 9-5 and act like i dont have like #intimate knowledge about online discourse lmfao #anyway #see u all soon

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its-just-fern · 8 months

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i wanna hear you rate fern ships

#ask #not doodles #i genuinely dont know many fern ships because there arent really any #im not gonna bother discoursing about the last one. ill just block you i dont really care

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zeroducks-2 · 9 months

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I feel like a lot of folks who insist that the rampant purity culture in fandom spaces is "not a real problem", and something "an adult with a job" shouldn't deal with, fail to realize that if you simply engage with a certain ship or a certain trope you are exposed to cyberbullying in the form of insults, death threats, rape threats, suibating, self-harm baiting, attempts at doxxing, loss of your livelihood.

Your traumas will be stepped on if you have any, and/or treated as a joke. Your coping mechanisms will be deemed wrong, bad, harmful to yourself and other people, and you will be shamed for having them. The work you have been doing for your mental health, regardless if you dabble in the hobbies you like because of past traumas or because it's just a past-time you have, will be kicked into the dirt because someone is grossed out by them and they arbitrarily decided you cannot express your interest in them.

It is a real problem. Being an adult with a job doesn't give you an "exempt from this" badge that will protect you from harassment if you engage with anything that antis deem immoral.

And there are no "two sides of the same coin" and "two versions to hear" when it comes to this. I don't care if you think someone liking something is "unhealthy", that's none of your business what another person likes. Antis do not "have a point", they never do, their reaction to seeing a dark trope or an "unhealthy ship" are never justified. Hurting real living and breathing people over fictional content is never justified!

#I understand people who don't want to deal with the so called 'fandom discourse'#I really do because 90% of the times I don't want to deal with it either #but you know what I DON'T HAVE A CHOICE #it doesn't matter if I talk about this or not they will still come into mine and my friends' ask box and send insults #it doesn't matter if I say that I am proship/comship/anticensorship/whatever or if I don't - not saying anything does not protect me #I will still like (and post about) content these fuckers don't like and I will be still harassed for it #ramblings #today I had one mutual being harassed and another being legitimately scared to post things after accidentally bumping into some anti fucker #and I am so fucking tired #proship #anti censorship

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54625 · 1 day

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I know we're all quite disappointed, now, about all of the things QSMP had going that will likely never happen. So I'm curious; what things can you think of, big or small, did we never get to see? A big arc planned, character growth that never occurred, a build never started or finished, a plot point that went nowhere, a question that was never answered, people who never reunited or met, even just a person reacting to/ seeing something.

Feel free to list as many as you can think of, or rant to your heart's content. We could all do with getting some of that grief of missed potential of our chests.

#its another call to action post! i love doing these because its nice to see what people have to say and to let them vent in a specific space #I'll go first;#I'll always be so so sad that we never got to see Fit and Richas bond as father and son. we got plenty of Ramón and Pac which I'm glad for #but it feels like an entire chunk is completely missing from their family dynamic #it pains me that we'll never know what it would have been like for qFit to treat someone other than Ramón as his child #i remember once Richas asked Fit to promise to take him to a dungeon one day. that was never fulfilled.#qsmp #qsmp discourse #<Just in case #to clarify; reblog THIS POST with your response; i don't mean asks cause that'll just be a bunch of separate posts and get a little messy

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valyrfia · 26 days

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I have to way I'm a bit surprised by all the hate charles gets and all the support carlos gets

I used to think charles was more popular

I guess when it comes to Fandom he does have a bigger one, but I think general audiences seems to support carlos more

Maybe it's underdog narrative idk. Like charles is constantly called spoiled, brat, whiny etc whenever he says ANYTHING that isn't super nice, while carlos can bitch as much as he want and barely gets called out

Fandom is always a bubble. I'd say the top two drivers in fandom are probably Charles, Max, and Lando because they're the ones that are popular with younger audiences. It's certainly not true outside. Sure, there's an RPF to fandom, but I think it's also worth noting as well if you're in F1 fandom, you're probably a more avid viewer of the sport than most casual fans, so things like Max's current domination are made more interesting by knowing the ins and outs of his journey, and it's easier to reject anti-Charles viewpoints because when you watch a drive like Suzuka in real time and look at the data afterwards, you understand why the past four WDCs think him generational, and why Carlos is a GOOD driver, indisputably, but has a deficit of skill in comparison to Charles which is masked with luck.

Also ultimately, it's a difference in what type of PR sells to different generations as well. Charles has carefully cultivated quite a strong parasocial relationship with a very loyal fanbase mainly comprising of the countries of Italy and Monaco and younger fans–he does this through playing into inside jokes online with his fans, making us feel like we have a 'special' understanding with him by liking certain tweets, or using certain emojis, or using pictures for his instagram that sneakily reflect a piece of online discourse that happened on a race weekend. Carlos has gone for the more traditional media approach of an underdog narrative to gain sympathy, but he doesn't have the same legion of loyal fans as Charles and makes no effort to build the same fan backchannels that Charles does, which is why I think that Charles, ultimately, will win the PR game. The support of traditional media is fickle, but the lecfosi would follow Charles into hell if asked. It's why Charles knows ventures like LEC or his music will succeed, wheras can the same be said for Carlos outside of Spain?

#i am always super wary of those who seek to build parasocial fanbases but i think charles has managed it in a taylor swift way ie quite well #lando also has a parasocial relationship with his fans but i think he manages that one worse #max in a weird way does not want anything to do with parasocial relationships at all but him basically being a child star helped build one #also i think he piggybacks off of lando's and charles' a fair bit #carlos also piggybacks off of lando's but in a weird way the positive effect from that one is balanced out by the negative from charles'#anyway thoughts!#f1 journalism discourse #f1 parasocial PR #charles leclerc #anon #asks

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klavierpanda · 9 months

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Bro...aroaces are literally the most represented everywhere. And you're still complaining. Go ask aroallos and aceallos about being recognised lol

The post wasn't even about representation, it's about the fact that even in aspec spaces there is a tendency to leave out the aro part of aroace and just viewing those people as asexual where being aro is an afterthought. Do you not see how that is also harmful for both aroallos and alloaces?

In the case of aroallos it's the fact that they're forgotten about because they aren't asexual and therefore their identity isn't even at the forefront of most people's minds when discussing aspec stuff. Their aroness is erased because it is not accompanied by asexuality.

In the case of alloaces there is the underlying assumption that romantic attraction isn't felt because there is still the assumption that aroace and asexual are the same thing. The fact they do feel romantic attraction is erased by the fact they're asexual.

The underlying issue here is that there isn't a great understanding of how different attractions interact with each other and the different labels we have to describe different experiences, even within the aspec community.

I made the post because an irl aspec group that I'm in were talking about the aroace character in the new series of Heartstopper and almost all of them referred to him as asexual. I have not watched Heartstopper (romance stuff doesn't interest me) but I was informed that there's actually a stronger focus on romantic attraction, i.e. the aro part in his aroace identity. As well as a consistent feeling that my aroness was erased when I identified as aroace and is ultimately one of the reasons I dropped the ace part of the label.

#this really isn't the slam dunk you think it is anon #for one you didn't even get the right take away from the post #(but what can I expect on the awful reading comprehension website)#and for another I have spent years in the aspec community and I am pretty seasoned when it comes to this sort of discourse #it's literally just a distraction tactic so that ultimately nothing gets done #the only reason I've answered is because it provides a nice opportunity for me to explain things in more detail #aro #arospec #aroace #ace #acespec #aromantic #asexual #aspec #ask panda

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burr-ell · 1 year

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"the tendency of this fandom to only engage with what THEY want these characters to be#as opposed to what their creators are trying to do and the stories they want to tell" slap this on a bumper sticker, you just summed all cr discourse (about PCs at least) in 2 sentences

It truly is maddening (and it's not by any means exclusive to the CR fandom). The reason why the discourse always goes the way it does is that at the end of the day, the loud fanwanky people only see what they would do, if they were self-inserted into the story, as a valid choice; and they are, more broadly, fundamentally disinterested in what others think or feel. There are several examples of this, and the variety of spaces within the fandom that produce these ideas is an indicator that this isn't endemic to one specific group of people.

-Keyleth is an important character whose feelings and choices are validated by the other PCs and cast even if they still disagree with them, in spite of how she and her preachiness get in the way of the Murderhobo Jubilee? It's not because the cast are all friends and they genuinely believe Keyleth is valid and are interested in how these discussions and choices can guide the story. It's because Marisha is the DM's girlfriend, and also here's my totally unbiased theory that my pet favorite players Sam and Travis secretly hate Marisha and Keyleth.

-Vax's presence is still felt and nodded to in the post-canon VM oneshots? It's not because he was an important character who mattered. It's because Liam wants to make everyone talk about his tragedy because he has Main Character Syndrome. Scanlan Wishes for Vax to appear at the wedding? It's not because he cares about Vex or because Sam and Liam wanted a sweet tribute to Vex and Vax's relationship and by extension Liam and Laura's friendship. It's because Liam thinks Vex's life should always revolve around Vax, and Sam wants to enable him and jerk himself off as the one who facilitated it.

-Beauyasha and Fjorester become canon? It's not because the players wanted it and it happened naturally. It's because there was a secret behind-the-scenes push to "force" those ships to become canon instead, and like, Dani Carr is some sort of shipping puppetmaster who made the players do it, and "they" (whomever "they" is) decided to sink Beaujester or Widojest because it was "obviously" going to become canon before the pandemic hiatus gave them time to "make the corporate-approved ships happen".

-Beau and Caleb try to reform the Empire and dismantle the Cerberus Assembly from within? It's not because it makes sense for their stories or that people who would take this position regarding a corrupt government might have a valid perspective that differs from your own. It's because the people at Critical Role Productions LLC are all spineless neoliberal cowards who won't commit to real activism. The best activism, after all, is violent, and violent revolutions have always resulted in stable aftermaths, and the real world has never demonstrated that this mindset is foolish.

-Relatedly: Caleb doesn't kill Trent personally? It's not because the most poetic justice would be to deny Trent the thing he wants most from Caleb. It's because "Limo Brain" is too obsessed with tragedy to have the stones to do "what needs to be done".

-Asmodeus, DnD Satan, turns out to also be CR Satan? It's not because it fits with the cosmology and the lore; it's because Matt Mercer is too attached to the "establishment", and the Prime Deities should have actually turned out to be the bad guys because of my personal baggage about Western religion and Christianity they're a little mean to my blorbo sometimes.

There's a pattern here: fans had expectations that they'd built up for themselves after projecting and building up fanon and deciding what players meant before they explained themselves fully, and when the players strayed from that, they were derided for all manner of reasons. I think we're seeing that same pattern play out in C3 as the story progresses in a way that fans dislike, and in fact we have seen fanwank spread whenever someone does anything that interferes with personally catering to a) the favored ship and/or b) the favored philosophy. (Orym, Ashton, FCG, Percy, Pelor...all valid when they affirm the Fandom Opinions and all disdained when they don't.)

Don't get me wrong, I think there's a place for comfort stories that deliver a personal catharsis. And I'm not going to dismissively say "well if you want it so bad make your own" because, as an artist, I am very familiar with the fact that creating is hard and draining and sometimes you just need to consume instead. But when you become so wrapped up in yourself and your feelings to the point where your perspective is the only valid one, someone else's feels like a betrayal when it isn't. It's always "They aren't doing what we wanted and here's why they're terrible people because of it" and never "Hmm, why is this what the cast wants? Let's examine that."

This isn't a new phenomenon, but I think it ultimately stems from not assuming that other people can differ from you in major ways in good faith. There are a lot of reasons for that (some more understandable than others), but I think you rob yourself of the potential to enjoy something new when all you do is demand what you already want. No matter what you're doing or where you are in life, you tend to become a better and wiser person when you open your mind to what other people have to say, no matter how mundane the subject matter. Sometimes the stories people have to tell are challenging—and the only healthy way to deal with that is to engage with them on their own terms.

#critical role #cr discourse #asks #long post #for the record i think VLD fandom became such a shitshow partially for this reason #but also. and admittedly i'm biased. VLD was basically a show for no one #this by the way is part of why a faction of fe3h fandom capes so hard for crimson flower (which is basically a glorified bonus route)#and absolutely abhors the idea of byleth being religious and enjoying her job as a teacher #and why some cr fans are so vehemently opposed to the prime deities being good and characters being connected to them #religious trauma that leads a character to reject religion and that being framed as a valid choice is okay to want to see #but it is also just as valid for a character to find religion to be a healing and positive experience #seriously 'gods bad' stories are not that difficult to come by. they're just not doing that in THIS story and you're mad about it #instead of doing the work of finding a story that WILL do that meaningfully

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