#ML Syren

[theerurishipper]

So, as a child abuse survivor and someone who has been sexually assaulted by men who think they're entitled to take what they want Adrien is canonically a god damned dick.

He sexually harrasses Ladybug. When told NO he once let 2.161 million people drown because he was busy throwing a tantrum

Being a victim of abuse does not excuse the abuse of others.

He might not mean any harm but you know who else doesn't mean any harm? Gabriel. My goddamned mother.

Not meaning harm- lacking malice- does not mean harm is not caused.

People are going on about him being a rich white guy because anyone else acting like that in public would be considered an antagonist (in fiction), in jail, or have an active warrant for their arrest. And that's assuming they aren't killed for it.

First off, I am truly very sorry for your experience. No one should have to go through that.

But I still do disagree.

Adrien's pushiness when it comes to expressing his affections for Ladybug are in the same boat as Marinette being a stalker or Chloe being pushy with Adrien: it's a joke. You may find it to be a poor one, certainly, but it's a joke nonetheless. Miraculous relies on this kind of humor, it's not meant to be taken seriously. You can have issues with it, but imho acting like it's any kind of legitimate criticism of his character probably makes people like me less inclined to listen to any actual criticisms you may have.

I don't say this to trivialize your experiences, and if the joke is hurtful to you, you are well within your rights to dislike it or talk about how it's in poor taste to make jokes about these things, but that's all it is, a joke. It's absurdist humor. It's not meant to be taken at face value. It would be creepy if Marinette seriously had Adrien's schedule mapped out, tried to break into his house, or stole his personal items, but it's not supposed to be that way because it's a joke.

And as for your complaint about Adrien leaving people to drown, you can go ahead and blame Master Fu for that one. It's stated quite clearly in the show that the heroes couldn't do anything because everything is underwater. And he's staying there because he's waiting for Ladybug. Making up imaginary civilians who are drowning now isn't a good criticism. Ladybug spends a good amount of time underwater, but there's no-one there. There's no civilian begging for Chat Noir's help as they drown while he ignores them, so suffice to say that we're supposed to assume everyone is safe and sound. This is a kids show, so unless we're shown that people are in danger, we aren't supposed to assume they are.

And then let's talk about Adrien almost quitting.

I'll say it straight: he has every right to quit. He's a 14-year-old kid. This isn't his job. He's well within his rights to quit if he feels like this is detrimental to him. And it isn't about Ladybug not returning his feelings like you seem to be implying. This is about Ladybug keeping secrets from him and leaving him in the dark even though he's supposedly her partner. It took a situation like this for Master Fu to pull his head out of his ass and come give Adrien the tools he needed to do the damn job you're accusing him of not doing. How is he supposed to do anything if he isn't given then necessary tools and knowledge to do it? Should he just accept that he's being ignored and left in the dark? Accept his new role as Ladybug's unquestioning lapdog?

This is not Ladybug salt btw, this is Master Fu salt only, in this house we don't like Master Fu.

Anyway.

Literally look at why he tries to quit.

Adrien:(grimly) If you don't tell me what Ladybug is hiding from me, I'm done! Plagg: You can't do that! Adrien:(bitterly) Why not? No one'll know if I quit. No one'll care!

He doesn't think he's needed. He doesn't think anyone would care if he quits.

This isn't because of any entitlement. It's because he's being cast aside and left in the dark. It's because his partner (it's not her fault either, to be clear, it's Master Fu's fault) is keeping secrets from him even in this time, so he assumes he isn't needed and decides to quit because he feels like he's unnecessary and unwanted, and that no one will care if he quits. Adrien already has very low self-worth, and this is just adding onto all that already. If it is detrimental to his mental health, then he definitely has the right to step aside and quit.

So yeah. If this ask was to get me to change my mind, I'm sorry, but it didn't. You're entitled to your opinion, of course, but I think I've made my opinion on the matter clear.

#MLB #Adrien Agreste #Marinette Dupain Cheng #Wang Fu #Meta #My meta #Asks #Adrien deserves better #Master Fu Salt #Anti Adrien Salt #ML Syren #Syren #SA tw

[bittersweetresilience]

Adrien Agreste and Borderline Personality Disorder

DISCLAIMER: I've been a bit low on spoons this week, so I haven't gathered as much evidence as I probably could have. Also, I am but a humble student in clinical psychology. This is mainly a thought compilation for @moonieratty!

To introduce the topic, without going into it too much, personality is described by features and behavioral patterns, or traits, consistent across situations and across time. Personality disorders are therefore enduring patterns of highly maladaptive traits evaluated in personal and sociocultural context (Dozois, 2019, p. 290).

Like other disorders, personality disorders have diagnostic criteria. The DSM is used primarily for diagnosis in the US and Canada while the ICD is used more widely in Europe and other places. I'm more familiar with the DSM, but I've included a brief section on the ICD to be comprehensive. It ended up a bit longer than anticipated, so let's go below the cut. Warning for discussions of abuse, self harm, and suicide, and a brief mention of substance use.

Overview of Borderline Personality Disorder

BPD is prevalent in a small percentage of the population, about 1-2% by varying estimates, and is characterized by instability across domains of emotions, identity, interpersonal relationships, and behavior. Its onset is usually in late adolescence or early adulthood and symptoms may diminish with age, after one's thirties or forties, especially with therapeutic intervention. Along with ASPD, it has been the focus of a lot of clinical research; it is unfortunately associated with high rates of non-suicidal self-injury and suicide (APA, 2022, pp. 754–755; Dozois, 2019, pp. 308–309).

Etiological factors for BPD include both biological and environmental disturbances. Of note to our discussion is the heightened risk for BPD in cases of child abuse or neglect, as well as growing up with another family member with a serious mental health condition (NHS, 2022). It's been well established that Gabriel is emotionally neglectful if not outright abusive toward Adrien in multiple ways, so this is a clear risk factor. In addition, although I won't argue definitively for Gabriel having a psychological condition, he did keep Emilie's body in the basement, so there is clearly some kind of disturbance going on.

From a cognitive-behavioral perspective, Linehan argues that BPD stems from families who consistently invalidate childhood emotional experiences and "oversimplify the ease with which life's problems can be solved," which may cause children to learn to seek attention and communicate with others through emotional outbursts (Dozois, 2019, p. 297). This rings true for Adrien and Gabriel as well.

I have to apologize for my son, Ladybug, he's like his mother. Way too overly dramatic. (Jackady)

It doesn't seem like this is the first time Gabriel has thought this, and labeling an emotional reaction as being overly dramatic is very much invalidation of it. As for emotional outbursts, Adrien has had quite a few, mostly as Chat Noir. More on this later.

To round out this first section, attachment theory proposes a connection between poor parent-child attachments and BPD relationship difficulties. Specifically, maladaptive behavior in relationships may stem from childhood development of an anxious-ambivalent attachment style, where intense fears of abandonment interfere with a strong desire for intimacy (Dozois, 2019, p. 310). You can clearly see this in Chat Noir's relationship with Ladybug, and I'm sure other people have discussed Adrien's attachment style more in depth, but suffice to say I think this is an apt description.

Argument from DSM-5-TR

In the DSM, personality disorders are primarily diagnosed on a categorical model. There are a few general criteria which I won't be going into, but I will highlight that personality disorders are stable and pervasive, and would be diagnosed only if they were leading to significant distress or dysfunction. Adrien's mental state is not great, so the latter shouldn't be a problem, but this show does not always pay attention to consistency, so I'm going to be speculating some. Everything in this section is cited to the relevant DSM entry unless otherwise stated.

The DSM characterizes BPD with instability in relationships, self image, and affects, as well as marked impulsivity. It has no exclusion criteria, so BPD can be and frequently is comorbid with other disorders like mood disorders, PTSD, and ADHD. Of the below criteria, five need to be met in order for a diagnosis to be made.

Frantic efforts to avoid real or imagined abandonment

Hey, where're you going? . . . So you're allowed to know her true identity, but I'm not? (Syren)

You're not really replacing me with a turtle, are you? (Anansi)

A lot of people have delved into Adrien's abandonment issues, which feature most prominently in his relationship with Ladybug. His fears of being replaced result in him seeking reassurance from Ladybug, and he can lash out if he does not receive the response he hopes for. Ladybug is his world, and he wants to be hers, so anything infringing on that feels to him like a threat of being abandoned, and he does not like it very much.

Impulsive behaviors like giving up his ring can be interpreted under this lens: he can avoid abandonment by doing the abandoning first. Then it will be him leaving, and not the other way around.

I also interpret Adrien's nightmare (Le Marchand de Sable) as being a fear of being alone as much as it is a fear of being trapped.

Unstable and intense interpersonal relationships alternating between extremes of idealization and devaluation

We'll be united, more powerful and free. We'll defeat Hawk Moth, then we can both run away to an island! Far away from everything. We will live off nothing but fruits, and we will have a little pet hamster and we will name it— (Le Patineur)

I just can't do this anymore. I give up… on everything. Even you . . . If I become Chat Noir again, Ladybug will just end up rejecting me, over and over. (Kuro Neko)

Even though Adrien mostly keeps his head on straight regarding what he's owed and not owed by other people, his relationship with Ladybug is full of highs and lows. He thinks Ladybug is the most amazing girl, but this can recoil quickly into feeling as though Ladybug doesn't care about him enough or isn't meeting his needs.

Furthermore, he developed this idealization of Ladybug as a potential lover or caregiver at one of their first meetings (Cœur de Pierre), and continually sought to spend time together and share the intimate details of their secret identities early on. These are all common to individuals with BPD, as is the switch from idealization to feeling as if the other person "does not care enough, does not give enough, or is not 'there' enough." Ladybug is the only person Adrien consistently projects this instability and intensity on, which might be something interesting to explore.

Identity disturbance: unstable self image or sense of self

When I was a kid, I always wanted to be what my parents wanted me to be! (Exauceur)

But, does that mean Chat Noir is who I really am? Deep down inside? (Kuro Neko)

With all the secret identities, it isn't surprising that Adrien fits this criterion, but canon even explicitly draws a link between Adrien's unstable sense of self and his childhood experiences. He doesn't know who he is, and he distracts from this by being Chat Noir, only to struggle even more when he feels useless and underlooked as his hero self. His behavior shifts dramatically between trying to prove himself with grand gestures and refusing to participate or lashing out. There is definitely something to discuss on this front.

Impulsivity in at least two potentially self-damaging areas

Giving you some extra time . . . I trust you to bring me back, m'lady. (Gamer 2.0)

There are only two liars left in Paris and one of them knows the ultimate way to catch her attention . . . Crazy about you, m'lady. (Mensonge)

This is walking a thin line between impulsivity and suicidal behavior, which would be excluded from this criterion, but I'll list self sacrifice here because I can see an argument for Chat Noir's impulsive behaviors being out of love or the desire to be useful. There may still be some self injurious intent or euphoria, but Chat Noir does have faith in Ladybug to bring him back eventually. Nevertheless, this is impulsive and unhealthy. Chat Noir jumps too quickly to this option to have thought it through.

I can't think of another area, because Adrien isn't old enough for reckless driving, spending, substance use, or sex. This is also a kids' show. Just presenting these options for fanfiction writers out there.

Recurrent suicidal or self mutilating behavior, gestures, or threats

I... I don't know what to do! (Chat Blanc)

This is all our fault . . . Cataclysm. (Culpabysse)

By itself, what happened in Chat Blanc would not be solid evidence, as that was an unprecedentedly traumatic situation. Combined with Culpabysse, though, there is a strong case to be made for at least passive suicidality for this to be able to come up as an option.

You could also interpret the self sacrifice in this category. Suicidal behavior in individuals with BPD is often preempted by fears of rejection or abandonment, so an interesting analysis could be made on this front.

Affective instability due to marked reactivity of mood

He's still only thinking of himself! I just want this terrible day to be over and done with! I hate Christmas! (Pire Noël)

Sorry! Sorry! I didn't mean to make you so mad. I get it. You're sick of me . . . No one can help me, Kagami. (Glaciator 2)

Adrien's prolonged episodes of anger and despair reflect a high reactivity to emotional stressors, especially interpersonal ones. In general, he just doesn't feel very well unless something is actively bringing him joy. Most of his outbursts are brief, though, and I will discuss them as part of a later criterion.

Chronic feelings of emptiness

I'm not Adrien, so I wouldn't know if this is the case, but I can say he has experienced at least one depressive episode (Kuro Neko) and emptiness would not be unfamiliar. You can look at him and decide.

Inappropriate, intense anger or difficulty controlling anger

How was your amazing evening with your "friends"? . . . What do you think? (Glaciator)

Why not? No one'll know if I quit. No one'll care! (Syren)

A two-person plan?! There's only one two-person plan, and that's Ladybug and me! (Sentibulleur)

Give me a break, Miss "I can't even come up with a superhero name"! (Hack-San)

Anger in individuals with BPD can manifest as bitterness, sarcasm, or recurrent verbal outbursts, which Chat Noir absolutely exemplifies. These outbursts are often followed by feelings of shame or guilt and contribute to a feeling of being bad. Chat Noir apologizes after being harsh in Glaciator, and I wouldn't be surprised if he felt badly about the other times. Again, these outbursts are often precipitated by interpersonal fears and perceived threats of abandonment. Unlike other symptoms, this specific one tends to be unique to BPD.

Transient, stress-related paranoid ideation or severe dissociation

I cannot recall any evidence for this but headcanon away, my friends.

All in all, I think Adrien has a strong case for BPD presentation according to the DSM. Canon is not always consistent, but I think it presents an interesting and mostly coherent narrative for this lens. From this perspective, Adrien's behavior reflects a deep intolerance of being alone and a dependence on other people to define the self.

As a corollary, BPD behavioral patterns are frequently linked to self sabotage and self undermining right when a goal is about to be realized, which could manifest as dropping out of school right before graduating or ending a relationship when it seems to be going well. Food for thought. Individuals with BPD may also feel more secure with transitional objects like pets than with interpersonal relationships, which could reflect in Adrien's relationship with Plagg.

To add some subjective understanding to this clinical mumbo jumbo, I've added a source of genuine BPD experiences below (Mind, 2022).

Argument from ICD-11

With the release of the ICD-11, a dimensional model for diagnosis of personality disorders became the new standard. What this means is that individuals are no longer labeled as having 'histrionic' or 'dependent' or, indeed, 'borderline' personality disorders, but are rather assessed as having any form of personality disorder on a sliding scale of severity and with trait domain specifiers (Swales, 2022). To put it more simply, people are diagnosed only with a general personality disorder or personality difficulty which can be optionally specified as deviating on one of the personality traits in the Big Five model, which is well established in personality psychology.

This move has several benefits. Stigmatization related to particular personality disorders can be reduced, and differential diagnosis and comorbidity between personality disorders becomes irrelevant. However, people retain access to treatment and support. Evidence-based treatments like dialectical behavior therapy are particularly well established and crucial for BPD; for this pragmatic purpose, the ICD contains one additional specifier for borderline pattern personality disorder (Bach et al., 2022; Swales, 2022).

The DSM and ICD are designed to be compatible with each other in many ways, and in this case, the borderline specifier in the ICD is directly lifted from the criterion of the DSM (WHO, 2023, 6D11.5). Based on our previous discussion, Adrien would be equally qualified for a diagnosis in France. I would likely describe his personality disorder with moderate severity, where multiple areas of functioning are affected and self harming behaviors may be present, but not all areas or relationships may be equally impacted and traits are not as rigid and inflexible (WHO, 2023, 6D10.0–6D10.2).

Interestingly, the ICD includes three additional manifestations of borderline pattern which are optional and may vary across time (WHO, 2023, 6D11.5).

A view of the self as inadequate, bad, guilty, disgusting, and contemptible

An experience of the self as profoundly different and isolated from other people; a painful sense of alienation and pervasive loneliness

Proneness to rejection hypersensitivity; problems in establishing and maintaining appropriate levels of trust in relationships; frequent misinterpretation of social signals

I'm fascinated by the number of adjectives in here. I simplified very slightly, as I did with the DSM criteria, but I had to keep all these adjectives. Anyway, I won't elaborate for too many more paragraphs, so let's say sentimonster moment and leave it at that. I will spare you my mirrored Félix essay. For now.

Qualifications and Limitations

First of all, Adrien is a teenager. The distinguishing factor between a personality disorder and regular adolescent difficulties would be longevity and identity concerns beyond his developmental phase (APA, 2022, p. 758). Second of all, Adrien has a uniquely terrible home life and magical problems. Some of his behaviors could be normal considering his experiences and sociocultural context, and this matters when it comes to psychological evaluation. Take everything with a grain of salt!

More generally, the categorical model of the DSM has several issues, not to mention diagnostic issues related to culture, gender, and stigma. Some but not all of these issues are addressed by the dimensional model it includes in a later section, which shares theoretical foundations with the model of personality disorders in the ICD. Even so, issues remain. Diagnosis, access to treatment, and political statements are intrinsically linked in complex ways. I won't get into all of the nuances, but be safe, remember this is a fictional character, and keep an open mind.

REFERENCES:

American Psychiatric Association. (2022). Diagnostic and statistical manual of mental disorders (5th ed., text rev.). https://doi.org/10.1176/appi.books.9780890425787

Bach, B., Kramer, U., Doering, S., di Giacomo, E., Hutsebaut, J., Kaera, A., De Panfilis, C., Schmahl, C., Swales, M., Taubner, S., & Renneberg, B. (2022). The ICD-11 classification of personality disorders: A European perspective on challenges and opportunities. Borderline Personality Disorder and Emotion Dysregulation, 9(1). https://doi.org/10.1186/s40479-022-00182-0

Dozois, D. J. A. (2019). Abnormal psychology: Perspectives (6th ed.). Pearson.

Mind. (2022, September). What does BPD feel like? https://www.mind.org.uk/information-support/types-of-mental-health-problems/borderline-personality-disorder-bpd/experiences-of-bpd/

National Health Service. (2022, November 4). Causes - Borderline personality disorder. https://www.nhs.uk/mental-health/conditions/borderline-personality-disorder/causes/

Swales, M. A. (2022). Personality disorder diagnoses in ICD-11: Transforming conceptualisations and practice. Clinical Psychology in Europe, 4(Special Issue). https://doi.org/10.32872/cpe.9635

World Health Organization. (2023). International statistical classification of diseases and related health problems (11th ed.). https://icd.who.int/

#miraculous ladybug #adrien agreste #ml meta #don't worry i read through far more sources than listed here #it's just standard citation procedure to include only in-text references and not readings for general subject comprehension #🌃 #🌖 #i'm using a hybrid parenthetical citation model which i think is most efficient and informative so just note this down #i can't believe i referenced kuro neko three times... what an episode #ml simon says #ml syren #ml anansi #ml sandboy #ml frozer #ml kuro neko #ml stoneheart #ml wishmaker #ml gamer 2.0 #ml lies #ml chat blanc #ml guiltrip #ml santa claws #ml glaciator 2 #ml glaciator #ml sentibubbler #ml hack san

[tempests-bards-and-birds]

Oh, I'm sure there'll be another Chat Noir to give me cheese - but he won't be you.

#i made one of these for marinette and tikki so i figured i'd do one for adrien and plagg too #i would be lying if i said that i didn't tear up while i was rewatching these scenes #i'm a sucker for these two #ml #mlb #miraculous #miraculous ladybug #miraculous tales of ladybug and chat noir #ml gifs #ml gif #mledit #ml edit #adrien agreste #plagg #ml plagg #ml syren #ml kuro neko

[empressofthesunwriter]

Kick the cat out of the bag! Index

Warning: If you like Adrien Agreste/Chat Noir you should turn back because I'm salty at this boy and the creators of this show and I won't hold back.

If you feel the same, enjoy with me this trip down the salty road.

***

Syren Salt AU

Not only did you see how your beloved parents drowned before you, no, but you also hear and see how Chat Noir, one of the supposed heroes of Paris, does nothing to help the people in distress, just sitting and mopping around till you see him detransform into the famous model Adrien Agreste and how he literally blackmails his Kwami that he will quit if he doesn't tell him secrets that are not his to tell. And then he gets rewarded by the supposed guardian of the miraculous with new powers. Not on your watch! After Ladybug restores everything back, you decide to create your own blog with one scoop. To get the whole world to realize what a horrible hero Chat Noir makes and that the people demand that he loses his ring!

Chapter 1

Chapter 2

Chapter 3

Chapter 4

Chapter 5

Chapter 6

Chapter 7

Chapter 8

Chapter 9

Chapter 10

#miraculous ladybug #miraculous lb #marinette deserves better #anti adrien agreste #anti chat noir #anti miraculous creators #ml salt #ml syren #ml syren salt au #anti love square #miraclous ladybug salt #love square salt #ml writers salt #adrien salt #ml fanfic: kick the cat out of the bag #luka couffain x reader #marinette dupain cheng x reader #kagami tsurugi x reader #luka couffaine x marinette dupain cheng x kagami tsurugi x reader #lukanette #kagaminette #queerplatonic lukagami #yin and yang chakra #ispirazione from naruto since miraculous sucks at explaining the powers

[emdoddles]

I haven’t worked on Bad Bird AU in a while so I thought I drop some designs of sentimonster.

Desperada: victim trapped on a sticker, the sentimonster is quiet and sneaky.

Princess Fragrance: after making her victim her own personal slave, the fairy flys around and makes more slaves for her army.

Catalyst: the only akuma that won’t speak, for they have no mouth. Their victim is the only one not trapped as well.

Gamer: the little 8-bit monster zaps objects and people to level up. It’s victim is trapped in the second layer of its mecha.

Syren: after crying an ocean and trapping her victim into a bubble she hunts in Paris streets, looking for her prey.

#bad bird au #miraculous ladybug #miraculous tales of ladybug and chat noir #my art #ml art #ml fan art #miraculous #illustration #em doddles art #ml au #ml #ml Syren

[gee-arid]

Syrens awesome i love her. Old sketch digitally coloured cus i remembered my sketchbook existed.

The original sketch, from a loooong time ago.

#miraculoustalesofladybugandcatnoir #miraculous fanart #fanart #miraculous #miraculous ladybug #mlp art #mlb syren #syren #mlb akuma #miraculous akuma #ondine #ml ondine #miraculous lb #miraculous ondine

[celestiall0tus]

Syren Notes - All That Remained

And here we go with another egregious example of bad writing decisions.

So, this is very much a double edged sword. On one hand, I agree with naturegreen that the secret of Master Fu wasn't hers to tell. She was told basically to keep her piehole shut until he was ready. But this really was just to create unnecessary drama and boy does it hurt.

I do agree that Chat should have been in the loop since the moment Lady learned of Master Fu. He is a hero and should know about the other hero bullshit as Lady does. There really is no benefit to keeping him in the dark other than basic ass fucking drama. And that shit is so surface level that it hurts.

Then there is Adrien. So, I see more of the entitlement here. Feeling that he deserves to know. Which, yes, he does. However, there was no need to push Plagg to reveal such things. He honestly does need to learn that no means no and to deal with it.

And, fuck, I hate to get into this because of what we see in later seasons, but I just need to say it now. Adrien doesn't feel like a victim of abuse with how the writers are portraying him. Yes, he has moments in later seasons where we see moments of that. However, all I'm seeing (in season 2) is a whiny average teen with a mildly average life. And I know that people react to abuse and trauma differently, but fucks sakes. This doesn't feel like that in the slightest. And it's bothering the ever living hell out of me.

I know the writers are inconsistent with their characters and having them act certain ways for the plot, but come on! Abuse is something serious and needs to be written well from the very fucking beginning to be believable. In later seasons, taking out these earlier ones, I could possibly believe it. Here? Fuck no.

Personal notes. Ondine is... a far cry from what I remembered her as. I still think she's too good for Kim. Kim is... well, Kim.

SIGH Getting to the end of these. Well, Kuro Neko will be next. Get ready for that dumpster fire.

#miraculous #miraculous ladybug #miraculoustalesofladybugandcatnoir #ml critical #miraculous critical #writing critical #miraculous salt #ml salt #all that remained au #all that remained #syren

[gale-gentlepenguin]

What if Master fu knew who hawkmoth was (let's say around syren before or after isbyour call)

(What if Fu figured out who Hawkmoth was?)

-after the events of Syren, Fu decided to agree with Ladybug and reach out to Adrien.

-Though Fu had an underlying method for going to see Adrien.

-Fu still believed Marinette’s theory of Hawkmoth being Gabriel agreste was possible.

-When he met with Adrien, Fu sent Wayzz to investigate

-After departing, Wayzz returned to him with news.

-Wayzz had found the garden and Emilie.

-Fu had speculated, The only way to explain all the evidence. Gabriel had to be Hawkmoth.

-Fu thought of what to do with this information.

-Fu decided he needed to be absolutely sure of this theory.

-Fu decided to spy on Gabriel.

-Season 2 continued onward. No changes for our heroes.

_______________________________________

-It took some time but heroes day gave Fu the proof he needed.

-Gabriel agreste had to be hawkmoth.

-Fu decided to tell Marinette.

-Marinette said she planned on telling chat noir, but Fu said he would inform chat noir.

-Fu needed to know what Adrien would do.

————————————————————————

-Chat noir arrived in a secret location told to him by fu.

-Fu told Adrien he needed him to hand over his miraculous and pass a test.

-Adrien detransformed and took off his ring.

-Fu described a scenario, one of a man desperate for the miraculous and doing everything he could to bring back his wife.

-“Would you let this man get the miraculous to bring back his wife.”

-Adrien said that he wouldn’t.

-“What if Ladybug had died. Would you use her miraculous to bring her back?”

-Adrien felt his heart tighten… but he answered

-“She wouldn’t want to be brought back that way.”

-Fu smiled. He knew the boys heart. Saying he wouldn’t would be a lie. But he knew Ladybug wouldn’t want that, and chat noir would respect her wishes.

-“what if I told you that the miraculous would bring back your mother?”

-“I do want my mother back… but the wish is dangerous.”

-Fu tells Adrien that his father is Hawkmoth.

-“Do you believe you can fight him, knowing this?”

-Adrien took a moment. He tightened his fist.

-“I’ll do what I must, for Paris and everyone I hold dear.”

#ml #ml what if #Fu figures out AU #alt Syren au #miraculous ladybug

[therealtrashpanda]

So.. I gave derision another chance.

And... I still hate it so much.

#miraculous ladybug #ml derision #derision spoilers #and... they ruined one of my favorite characters #Kim went through his whole character arc. and they erased it all in a single episode #making him some kinda douche on a podcast #I hate this episode so much. I don't even consider it canon in my head #but I know there is always gonna be people now that think of how awful Kim is. because of this episode #ugh it's like they forgot the events of Dark Cupid and Syren completely #ml writers salt #and Marinette #they always played her mannerisms around her crush as a joke #but now they take that back #they change it into a trauma response #sure when they were clearly jokes i didn't find them funny. but now for anyone who did can't anymore because it's now linked to past trauma #chloe even.. i feel like all that happens anymore is demonizing as much as possible to spite her fans #sure she was never perfect and she wasn't great but after season 3it just doesn't stop #sorry for the rant #I'll cut it off now

[mokkamicci]

My issues with Kuro Neko

So this post has been long overdue so I figured I finally said it. I’ve been thinking that the way Chat Noir has been treated in S4 episode Kuro Neko has been incredibly unfair. I know we are in season 5 now, but my grievances about Kuro Neko needed to be said. This is really just me ranting

I had a lot to say about Kuro Neko. The most egregious thing the narrative did in Kuro Neko was how Chat giving up his ring was framed as him being heartbroken over Ladybug.

To go into detail, the narrative uses Plagg as a mouthpiece to say that the reason Chat gave up his ring was because he was upset since he’s in love with Ladybug and not getting enough attention from her. I hated that the episode framed it as that when the real reason was because obviously he was being neglected as Ladybug’s equal and partner. Like this should be obvious right? I’m not just speaking out of my ass?

Plagg literally says it here:

(also this is from YouTube, so the captions are autogenerated)

Like I’m pretty sure Chat Noir was upset not because he’s in love with LB, but because he was being sidelined constantly and not being kept in the loop as a partner should. The fact that Alya knew more about the Miraculous at this point in S4 and about the Miracle box in general is just baffling to me. This does eventually get addressed in Strike Back where Ladybug admits to Chat Noir that she was being a bad Guardian and keeping secrets from him after having had losing all the Miraculous because of Felix.

Anyways, now Ladybug is under the impression that Chat left because of his romantic feelings towards her. So what ends up happening? Marinette has to look for another candidate to take the ring, someone that won’t be in love with her so that there won’t be any problems in their partnership. My dude, that was never the real issue to begin with. I guarantee that if Ladybug did the same neglectful bullshit that she did with Chat, with a new partner, that new guy would have the exact same complaints Chat had all along. Complaints like “why am I being pushed off to the side, why am I not being made aware of all this important Miraculous info, why is Ladybug bossing me around, instead of treating me like her equal, you know, as she should?” (But that doesn’t matter anymore because the new guy ended up being Chat in a different costume anyway. And Ladybug ended up wanting Chat back. Sooo...)

The key lesson here from Kuro Neko is that any self-respecting individual would understandably feel resentful and upset at being pushed to the side and kept out of the loop of important matters that concern them too. Not just because the individual is in love with the person who is doing the sidelining. A person is allowed to feel upset and angry if they’re being left out, especially if the information they’re being left out of is highly important to them too. And if that person is being kept in the dark, it might end up negatively affecting them.

This is what’s happening to Chat. The fact that Ladybug is not only neglecting her partnership with Chat, but also leaving out important Miraculous and Guardian-related information, information that is crucial to him as well. If Ladybug had used her Guardianship duties as an opportunity to not only become closer to Chat as partners, but also free her of the stress of dealing with it alone, we would not have the issue of Chat renouncing his ring.

This same issue occurred in the S2 episode Syren where Master Fu was still unknown to Chat but Ladybug knew of him. Ladybug was bound by Fu to keep secrets from Chat then too. When Chat found this out he threatened to renounce his ring then as well. Adrien salters will justify this as an excuse to say “no wonder Fu didn’t reveal his existence yet to Chat given how much of a hissy fit Chat threw over not being trusted with secrets that he wasn’t ready to know yet.” This is the reason salters give. Unbelievable.

So now we have Ladybug in S4 repeating Fu’s mistakes. Ladybug knew keeping secrets from Chat then was a problem so why oh why did she keep doing that in S4? Keeping secrets from your partner never ends well!

Anyways, I ended up going on a tangent here.

Here’s a TL;DR - basically Kuro Neko was not a good episode because of the narrative’s treatment of Chat Noir. They essentially treated his reasonable depression being caused by him being heartbroken over Ladybug, and not because obviously he was being neglected as Ladybug’s partner and equal.

#miraculous ladybug #ml season 4 #kuro neko #kuro neko salt #syren #ml fandom salt

[stellarlex]

To me I think in Syren if Master Fu witnessed Adrien threatening Plagg to quit if he didn't get his answers, should've been the moment Master Fu took away his miraculous. Cause that's something so immature to do, ESPECIALLY while people's lives are at risk rapidly. What do you think?

I honestly think that if Fu had witnessed what Adrien did, the smart thing to do would have been to leave a note with the power ups to explain what they were and make a noise to get his attention. He’d be very careful about showing Adrien his face. And then later after Syren was defeated, he’d move in to take Plagg from Adrien. After all it wouldn’t be easy to replace Adrien with a good candidate if most people were drowning or together with others on rooftops.

Hawk Moth doesn’t seem to attack every day, so Fu would have had time to find someone else to be Marinette’s partner and at the very least have time to explain and convince her (because this show makes everything her fault when it’s not) that she’s not at fault for getting him replaced and that keeping him when he’s shown to be irresponsible and immature would only be doing everyone, including her a disservice.

#miraculous ladybug #ml salt #marinette dupain cheng #marinette deserves better #adrien salt #master fu #syren

[princess-of-the-corner]

In LadyLuck will there ever be a plant based Akuma...how do you feel about the power ups?

Honestly a plant-based Akuma is one of many on my list of backup 'this canon episode no longer exists' Akumas. (I did have Persephone in Hero Chat, but she didn't do much lmao).

As for the power ups!

In /theory/ I like the power ups. They're good for different environment/terrain challenges. They can add a little extra range to what can be done. Like how sure they could use their weapons as scuba gear in Syren, but they're not able to dart around in the water like they are when they use the powerups. And ofc they're now open to air and even space battles too!

That said, much like a lot of things with ML, the execution is.... not the best. The potions were introduced all the way back in Season 2. It's now Season 5 and we've only seen three out of the seven available.

I'd love to see them worked in more in the future!

[goofygoldengirl]

How I Would Reorganize The Agreste Plotline If Miraculous Ladybug Were For An Older Audience

NOTE: Contains Season 5 Spoilers, Leak References, and Discussion of Mature Topics

I say reorganize instead of rewrite since I’m working with canon and embellish only on a few plot points that haven’t fully been touched upon yet. If you want to see how I reorganize the agreste plot for the show as is check out this post.

Season 1

Show in universe that everyone is aware of Emilie’s disappearance. In Origins, passing news blurb that it has been X amount of days and there are no leads into the Agreste case. This in turn, affects how his peers at school treat him, with some fawning over him like we see in the show, and the more sensitive ones reluctant to approach him due to his situation.

Ladybug is Adrien’s first ever crush. Show instead of implying on twitter that he takes romance hints from anime.

Plagg is aware of Adrien’s situation with wanting more independence and about mom’s disappearance. While he displays a lazy, go lucky attitude, he worries over Adrien. He encourages him to find himself as Chat Noir.

Show that even before Gabriel starts using the butterfly miraculous to get his wife back, he has unhealthy coping mechanisms. In the first few weeks after Emilie falls into a coma, he turns to drinking. Nathalie frequently joins him on his binges since she harbors guilt about Emilie’s illness. One night, they both get drunk and share a heated kiss.

Due to the kiss, and the stress of losing Emilie, there is a heavy tension between them. One day Nathalie snaps.

“What else could we have done? Emilie is gone! There’s no way we can bring her back! And if there was a possibly that we could, she’d hate us for it! Especially if she found out---I’m sorry I should have never brought that up. I’ll be on my way sir.”

Show that both Nathalie and The Gorilla care about Adrien despite their cold exteriors. With the next couple of seasons, he begins to open up to them, and they in turn.

Have Hawkmoth’s reveal that he is Gabriel take place at end of season 1 instead of beginning of season 2 in ML proper 

Flashback 1: It is 2014 and Adrien is six years old. He asks his mother why he can’t go out and play with other kids and go to school like his cousin Felix and Chloe. Emile smiles, cradles his face, and tells him that he can’t because he is a very special boy.

Season 2

Introduce Kagami and Adrien’s crush on her. Tease Ms. Tusguri and Gabriel Agreste’s connection earlier than presented in ML Proper with a business call.

The in universe news about Emilie’s disappearance dies down due to a lack of leads.

Show how Adrien is still naive when it comes to interacting with the world, and why he may not pick up on the fact that Marinette has a crush on him due to the fact that everyone fawns over him.

Show one of Master Fu’s tutoring sessions with Adrien post Syren. Master Fu plants a seed of doubt in Adrien’s head that all is well with his family.

Highlight early on that while Gabriel does love his son, he loves the idea of Adrien the perfect, obedient child more than Adrien the trying adolescent. Make it clear that Adrien is Emilie’s child and that Gabriel found it difficult to connect to Adrien even before Emilie’s disappearance.

Start of Gabriel’s slippery slope into madness due to the constant losses.

Nathalie’s infatuation with Gabriel is teased early on in season 2, then confirmed with the events of Style Queen. She becomes more bold with her feelings. At the end of season 2, they almost kiss but Gabriel hesitates.

The events of Heroes Day play out like in ML proper . However, have Gabriel explicitly mention that it was the peacock miraculous that made Emilie ill. 

Flashback 2: Takes place post Emilie’s “disappearance” but prior to season 1. Amelie and Felix visit. Amelie asks Gabriel for the Graham de Vanilly ring. Adrien and Felix interact. Felix has a mean streak. He asks how Adrien can deal “with such insufferable people.”

Season 3

Adrien and Kagami get together earlier. As a result their break up plays out a season earlier.

Nathalie takes up her role as Mayura. Her health worsens. Gabriel worries, and their relationship deepens to the point where they begin an affair. Gabriel is shown to feel guilty at first, but as he becomes more hellbent on being Hawkmoth, that guilt subsides.

Introduce sentimonsters like in ML proper. Place a hint that Adrien could be one.

Adrien mentions to Plagg that his mother used to have dizzy spells/ coughing fits like Nathalie. Plagg asks what disease she had. Adrien doesn’t know. He then asks Gabriel what type of illness Emilie had. Gabriel tells Adrien to mind his own business.

People drop hints that Marinette likes Adrien. Show that Adrien is in denial of his own feelings for her because of his feelings for Ladybug.

Show how Adrien gets stressed because of his modeling job. He is exposed to the underbelly of the fashion industry where his modeling peers have eating disorders, have drug/alcohol addictions, or are sexually preyed upon or exploited by their managers. Adrien wants out. He pleads with his father to stop modeling but is denied.

Introduce Felix like in ML proper. Show that Felix is knowledgeable about the miraculouses. Have him eye Gabriel’s brooch before leaving.

Have Chat Blanc and Ephemeral take place in this season. Keep plot and outcomes the same.

Gabriel starts to act more like Hawkmoth in real life and less like himself.

Flashback 3: Takes place when Gabriel, Emilie, and Nathalie are twenty years old. In the summer of 2000, they travel the world, in search of adventures and the miraculouses. The three of them have a close but complicated relationship due to the fact that Gabriel and Emilie are dating, Nathalie has feelings for him, and that she is friends with them both. This tension accumulates one night where they engage in a menage a tois. It is an event they vow to never speak of again. At the end of the summer, they have not found any miraculouses. Gabriel reaffirms his feelings for Emilie and rejects Nathalie completely.

Season 4

Love Square reversal. Adrien falls for Marinette. Slowly, they become closer and start dating. Gabriel finds out about Adrien’s feelings for Marinette. He forbids them to date, but they defy him. Gabriel tries to push Kagami onto Adrien.

Keep Felix’s discovery of Emlie’s body in Gabriel Agreste and trade with Gabriel at end of season 4 the same as ML proper.

Have Gabriel’s moral horizon event take place here along with Evolution in ML season 5 proper.

Nathalie and Gabriel’s relationship begins to crumble as he dives headfirst into madness and when she begins to question his decisions. The breaking point is when he does not leave the USB drive in the past like in ML Evolution. Nathalie declares that she will no longer help him, and states that she did everything for him because she loved him.

Adrien starts to look into his mother’s disappearance with Plagg and Ladybug’s encouragement. He discovers that his mother knew about the miraculouses.

The hints that Adrien could be a sentimonster intensify.

At the end of the season the alias rings are introduced.

Gabriel allows Adrien to stop modeling.

Flashback 4: Flashback of Gabriel and Emilie falling in love. Amelie and Colton’s rocky marriage. Same as the leaks. In 2006, Nathalie and Gabriel meet again. He says that he wants to try to find the miraculouses again, in particular the peacock miraculous. When Nathalie asks why, Gabriel answers “because it can create life”.

Season 5 

The cataclysm happens. Gabriel’s subsequent illness is explicitly shown. He loses weight due a loss of appetite and vomiting. His skin becomes pale and gangrened sores on his arm weeps black pus. By the end of the season, he has to rely on IV fluids to keep him alive.

Nathalie actively goes against Gabriel and helps Adrien in any way she can.

Felix is Argos. Events of Emotion take place. It is made clear that he is a sentimonster. It is only hinted that Kagami is one too. In addition, he leads Adrien to Emilie’s body.

Adrien find out his father is Hawkmoth,that his mother is dead, then the final truth that he himself is not human. He wrestles with the guilt of catacylsming his father. However, he does not fall into despair as predicted in Chat Blanc and Ephemeral.

Adrien makes his stand against Gabriel. Gabriel is forced to confront the fact that Adrien is no longer his perfect child.

The final battle and the reveal happens. During the final battle, Adrien pleads with his father to see reason. Gabriel is too far gone and tries to kill Adrien. Gabriel uses the miraculouses to make his wish. As mentioned in the leaks, Nathalie is sacrificed. Gabriel is shocked. This forces him to come to terms that due to his selfishness, he has lost the two most important women in his life. He makes one final wish: to sacrifice himself to bring back balance. He dies. Emilie is still dead, but Nathalie lives.

Adrien obtains his amok. Completely orphaned, he faces an uncertain future.

Flashback 5: It is 2007, Emilie has gone through three years of fertility treatments that have brought nothing but disappointment. Clinging onto her last hope, she, Gabriel, and Nathalie travel to Tibet to find the miraculouses one last time. They find the peacock and butterfly miraculous and find out that in order to create a fully functional human sentimonster, a piece of the wearer’s DNA must be bound to the amok. Emilie allows Amelie to test out the peacock miraculous first with Colt. Their son, Felix, is born healthy. Emilie binds a piece of her hair to a photograph of herself as a baby for the amok, and creates the sentibryo that will become Adrien. She magically implants it in herself to carry out a natural pregnancy. However not long after, she begins to miscarry. Desperate, she dons the peacock miraculous. The power she uses saves the pregnancy, but causes the miraculous to become damaged. Adrien is born in 2008. As the years pass, Emilie grows ill and falls into a coma.

#miraculous ladybug #ml spoilers #ml leaks #agreste family #adrien agreste #gabriel agreste #emilie agreste #nathalie sancoeur

[empressofthesunwriter]

Kick the cat out of the bag!

Warning: If you like Adrien Agreste/Chat Noir you should turn back because I'm salty at this boy and the creators of this show and I won't hold back.

If you feel the same, enjoy with me this trip down the salty road.

Chapter 2: What should you do?

It was night in Paris. You were laying in your bed and staring at your wall. After a few moments, you turned to look at the clock on your bedside table.

3 a.m.

You really should sleep, tomorrow was a school day, but you just couldn't.

It happened so much today.

After the Miraculous Cure swept around Paris and turned anything back to normal, for a long time you kept holding your parents in your arms. They hugged you back just as strong.

Neither wanted to be apart from the other.

So for a few hours, you forgot all about the Adrien Agreste/Chat Noir situation and just were happy to have your parents back.

But now anything was calm and you could think again.

You needed, no, you have to take down Chat Noir. It couldn't go on like that.

But could you really do it?

Would the photos and the video you did be enough?

Should you give them to the news station?

You wrinkle your nose. No, this was not a good idea.

You remembered how Nadja Chamack did her interview with Ladybug and Chat Noir. How she wanted Ladybug to admit that she and Chat Noir were dating, how Chat Noir said maybe someday, and then the kiss that was shown without the permission of the heroes. Well, Chat Noir surely liked it, but Ladybug was offended.

Cleary they would spin it into some LadyNoir bullshit.

You couldn't believe that you haven't seen before how sick it was to ship real people together. You feel ashamed of yourself. Ladybug could have a boy or a girlfriend in her civilian life or didn't want to date at all, but Paris citizens seemed more interested in shipping real people than them finally defending Papillion and ending his terror.

You signed and got out of your bed.

You needed advice, another look into this situation, it was too delicate to handle.

So you took your phone and tipped a message to the only person who could help in your guy's Whatsapp Chat.

Husband <3

Luka, are you awake?

Luka, I know it's late, but I need to talk.

Luka Couffaine!

I won't stop till you answer me!

I won't stop till you answer me!

I'm awake, I'm awake, what's the matter [Y/N]? Your messaging nearly woke up Jules. You know she needs her sleep.

Ups, I'm sorry. Do you think we can meet at the Liberty? I need your advice, I'm going crazy here.

Is everything okay with you? You are worrying me here. That's not you coming over so late at night just for some advice. What happened today?

Besides that, my parents died before my eyes? Luka, really, I need to talk in person with you.

I will be waiting for you then. Be careful on your way over.

Always, see you in a few minutes!

With that, you shut down your phone and searched for your favorite hoodie to put over your night clothes. Like a ninja, you left your home and made your way to the Seine where the Liberty was currently docked.

The nightlife was high up in Paris. You heard singing, screaming and shouting, and loud laughter. You felt some people, manly men, staring at your form and started to walk faster.

A young girl at night all alone had to be wary. Anything could happen.

Thank god, you were nearly there.

You could see Luka standing with crossed arms and a worried look in his pretty blue eyes beside the gangplank.

"Hey.", you called out softly. "Hey to you too.", he answered just as softly.

Luka was wearing his PJs and his favorite jacket. From his messy hair, you could tell he had slept deep before you woke him up.

You felt bad.

Maybe that was not a good idea?

Before you could do anything, Luka opened his arms for you.

"C'mere, I can sense that you need a good hug."

Well, you weren't one to say no to a patented Luka-Couffaine-Hug and snuggled up to your best friend in the whole wide world.

You both were nearly the same height, Luka had only a few centimeters above you, but you could hug easily and comfortably.

You let out a shuddering breath, which you didn't even know you were holding and Luka started to hum a small melody. Clearly, he wanted you to relax.

It started to help and after a few moments you patted is back.

"I'm okay enough.", you told him.

"You sure, Harmony?"

You smiled wide hearing Luka's nickname for you. It gave you comfort. He had given you this because he said he never had heard a more harmonic song in a person's heart than yours. You felt honored.

"Yeah, I'm sure.", you insured him. "Don't worry."

Luka just looked at you for a few seconds, you bet anything he was listening to your heart's song to be sure, and nodded then.

He took your hand and lead you two to two chairs on the deck. You sat down facing each other.

"So, what has you driving you crazy [Y/N]?", he asked worriedly.

You signed. Not time like the present.

You took your phone out and searched for the video you made.

"It's better I show you.", you explained. You gave Luka your phone. "Watch the video, please."

He did as you asked, even if he seemed confused at first, but then you could see how big his eyes got. Then how he frowned and then how his eyes got an angry glimmer.

You watched him in silence. Luka when angry was a sight to be seen, it did take a lot to make him lose his nerves. Seeing how he reacted to the video like this made you feel valid in your own feelings.

"What a piece of shit!", Luka cursed, after finishing the video.

You nodded. "You tell me."

Luka looked up from the phone, and yep, he was really pissed.

"Ma and I took as many people as we could on the Liberty to save them from the waves, cause that's what you do when someone needs help and...and...Chat Noir was just mopping around?! He is a superhero it is his duty to help us. He could, but he didn't! What is wrong with him?"

"I haven't the faintest idea, Luka, believe me. I just wish I could punch his stupid face.", you answered him.

"I will hold him down for you.", he growled.

"Thank you, but there is more."

"Worser then this?!"

So you started to tell him how you were now pretty sure that Chat Noir sexually harassed Ladybug, how he never took his job seriously and how the whole city cared more to ship two people than them defending Papillion.

After that Luka stayed still for a long while. You wanted to ask if he was okay, but he put a hand up, meaning he needed time to process all of this. You stayed silent and watched how he started to meditate to surely get his emotion and thoughts under control.

You keep an eye out for any Akuma that could possibly be on his way.

But it seemed Papillion had enough for today or was in bed since no Akuma came for Luka.

Good.

"Harmony.", called you Luka.

Seems like he was done with his meditation. You turned back to him. Luka had pensive look on his face.

“I just don’t get it.”, he started, biting his lip nervously. “I meet Ladybug and Chat Noir, I have heard their heart songs…but nothing seemed wrong. Why did I not see all of this?”

“It’s like someone took a blindfold off you, right? Or in your case, earplugs.”, you said half earnestly, half joking.

Luka ignored your weak attempt to joke and shoved his hair from his forehead frustrated.

“Yes, it’s just like that. Shit, Harmony, what is going on? This can’t be normal.”

“You mean, it could be Miraculous related?”, you asked wondering.

It would explain why nobody else had said a thing. If a Miraculous was in use in Adrien/Chat’s favor, then it would be hard to take away his hero status. You would have to need first to get rid of it.

He shrugged his shoulders.

“Maybe…or the universe play’s favorite and it took a strange liking to Chat Noir.”

Strangely you imagined the universe as a white-straight guy in his forty’s with a beard.

You shudder.

You had a feeling someone like this would block anyone on Twitter who wasn’t agreeing with him over some fictional character and demand that it should be worshipped because it was perfect and didn’t need to change!

You would have nightmares later, that was sure!

“God, I hope not.”, you answered Luka.

“So, what are we doing now?"

"You will help me?", you asked smiling.

You already had a feeling that he would, but hearing it was nice. Luka smiled back and nodded.

“You will need all the help to get Chat Noir to quit.”

"Right, so okay, that's what I thought.", you started. "We can't give this to a news station because I don't trust them to not turn this into some LadyNoir Bullshit. Remember the interview Nadja Chamack did?"

"Yeah, you are right, we better avoid this. We have to do this."

"But what could we do?", you asked frustrated. "Running around Paris and showing any person we meet the video?"

"Harmony, [Y/N], I think the solution is pretty simple. We do live in a technologically advanced society.", reminds you Luka with a little grin.

"Technologically advanced society...", you parroted thoughtfully.

What could he mean?

Then it hit you! The Ladyblog! Paris number one source for anything Ladybug and Chat Noir related.

"A blog, we are going to start a blog! With the sole goal to reawoke Chat Noir right as a hero and him handing over his ring to Ladybug!", you shouted happily and jumped up.

Luka shushed you and reminded you that his mother and sister were still sleeping. You said sorry.

"So, how are we going to call this blog?", asked Luka curiously.

You grinned mischievously.

Like the cat who got the cream.

"The Kickat-Blog!"

Next

#miraculous ladybug #miraculous lb #marinette deserves better #anti adrien agreste #anti chat noir #anti miraculous creators #ml salt #ml syren #ml syren salt au #anti love square #miraclous ladybug salt #love square salt #ml writers salt #adrien salt #ml fanfic: kick the cat out of the bag #luka couffain x reader #marinette dupain cheng x reader #kagami tsurugi x reader #luka couffaine x marinette dupain cheng x kagami tsurugi x reader #lukanette #kagaminette #queerplatonic lukagami

[acuteobserv4tion]

Did they really write Luka out of the show so they wouldn't have to deal with him knowing the main characters' secret identities? Please tell me that's not what happened. It seems like they're wasting Alya. Please don't tell me they fully wasted snake boy. He wasn't my favorite, but his position holds so much potential for drama as well as comedy.

Update:

I just watched the episode. That's exactly what they did. What is even the point of the magical charms? Why can't Luka be the one for our heroes to confide in? Especially since they're messing up Alya. She's such a flip-flop now, only there to push what the writers want on a whim instead of what the situation demands of her character.

Luka could be the one Adrien confides in, too. Especially since Fu didn't do diddly squat with talking to Adrien in Syren or Party Crasher. Does this count as ml writing salt? Now I'm sad. I wanna play minecraft

On the bright side, Penny's back! Woohoo

You're too good for them.

#miraculous lb #miraculous ladybug #miraculous ladybug and chat noir #miraculous fandom #luka couffaine #snake miraculous #migration #migration spoilers #adrien agreste #alya cesaire #marinette dupain cheng #ml writers salt

[flightfoot]

I don't understand people who only know a character for a few episode/chapter and then decided that "this is it. This is a horrible character and I'm going to tell the world about how horrible they're" that they ignore every nuance, background and motive of that character. Even worse people who only echoing people bad take and decided that is the canon and spread it like fire.

I was a "victim" of this kind of people because my friend is an Adrien salter. That time I don't even know Chat Noir, I only see some fanarts and think his design is cool especially because I always love cat boy or cat in general. My friend saw me liking and share Chat Noir pictures and told me that "he may be cute but he's a horrible and problematic character" which made me raised an eyebrow and she explain more about how he is so "creepy" that he lied to someone who has a girl that he has crush on, saying they're a couple and when the other male get upset he blame the girl for it instead. She also told he that he's a sexual harrasser and tried to force to kiss his crush even though the girl already reject him and the reason people don't mind his problematic action is because he's "cute". Well, that just some among other things that she told me about him and none of it was really positive.

She said she hate the show and already dropped it but sometimes whenever I liked miraculous stuff, she'd tell me some other "horrible thing Chat Noir do" under the post that I share.

I wasn't the type who would back down from watching something just because my friend told me it's horrible but it does make me wonder if the show and this character is as horrible as she made it to be, because this is not the first time she hate on a character that I have interest in.

I'm glad I decided to watch it when it finally aired on TV because what she told me before was a complete BS. Adrien isn't like what she always told me to be and the more I watched miraculous the more I loved him and he's one of my cat boy.

The fact that the Chat Noir that she told me and the actual Chat Noir is like 360° difference just make me wondered, what's her problem? I mean, it's one thing to hate on a character or a show but to spread such misinformation because she hate that character is a horrible act! If you don't like the media or a character then keep it to yourself?? No need to drag others into a black hole full of misinformation!

I myself stopped watching halfway in s4 because I don't like the whole sentimonster theory, Ladybug attitude there and how the show sometimes not acknowledging Chat Noir awesomeness (that giant gallette especially) but I don't make it a habit to tell people the show is horrible just because it's no longer my cup of tea. So people like this make my brain goes brrrr.

Yeah people have an issue of latching onto one or two things they don't like about a character, and then ignoring every bit of nuance and motivation that characters has in favor of blindly hating them. You can still dislike a character, but it should at least be done fairly.

And I know the ML saltdom tends to not just emphasize negative aspects, but flat-out spread incorrect information when bashing on characters - the anon I got awhile ago claiming that Chat threatened Ladybug that he'd give up the ring in Syren unless she dated him comes to mind. People get caught in these echo chambers and don't actually think to check the show itself, nor to look at the actual reasons the characters has for doing what they did, from both a Watsonian perspective and a Doylist one.

#ask #ml fandom salt #leave adrien alone challenge