#I don't have npd but I support narcissists | Explore Tumblr Posts and Blogs

kindnessoverperfection · 9 months

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Please, if you can, take a moment to read and share this because I feel like I'm screaming underwater.

NPD (Narcissistic Personality Disorder) stigma is rampant right now, and seems to be getting progressively worse. Everyone is using it as a buzzword in the worst ways possible, spreading misinformation and hatred against a real disorder.

I could go on a long time about how this happened, why it's factually incorrect (and what the disorder actually IS), why it's harmful, and the changes I'd like to see. But to keep this concise, I'll simply link to a few posts under the cut for further reading.

The point of this post is a plea. Please help stop the spread of stigma. Even in mental health communities, even around others with personality disorders, in neurodivergent "safe" spaces, other communities I thought people would be supportive in (e.g. trans support groups, progressive spaces in general), it keeps coming up. So I'm willing to bet that a lot of people on this site need to see this.

Because it's so hard to exist in this world.

My disorder already makes me feel as if I'm worthless and unlovable, like there's something inherently wrong and damaged about me. And it's so much harder to fight that and heal when my daily life consists of:

Laughing and spending time with my friends, doing my utmost best to connect and stay present and focused on them, trying to let my guards down and be real and believe I'm lovable- when suddenly they throw out the word "narcissist" to describe horrible people or someone they hate, or the conversation turns to how evil "people with narcissistic personality disorder" are. (Seriously, you don't know which of your friends might have NPD and feels like shit when you say those things & now knows that you'd hate them if you knew.)

Trying to look up "mental health positivity for people with npd", "mental health positivity cluster bs", only to find a) none of that, and b) more of the same old vile shit that makes me feel terrible about myself.

Having a hard time (which is constant at this point) and trying to look up resources for myself, only to again, find the same stigma. And no resources.

Not having any clue how to help myself, because even the mental health field is spitting so much vitriol at people with DISORDERS (who they're supposed to be helping!) that there's no solid research or therapy programs for people like me.

Losing close friends when they find out, despite us having had a good relationship before, and them KNOWING me and knowing that I'm not like the trending image of pwNPD. Because now they only see me through the lens of stigma and misinformation.

Hearing the same stigma come up literally wherever I go. Clubs. Meetings. Any online space. At the bus stop. At the mall. At a restaurant. At work. Buzzword of the year that everyone loooves loudly throwing around with their friends or over the phone. Feels awesome for me, makes my day so much better/s

I could go on for a long time, but I'm scared no one will read/rb this if it gets too much longer.

So please. Stop using the word "narcissist" as a synonym for "abusive".

Stop bringing up people you hate who you believe to have NPD because of a stigmatizing article full of misinformation whenever someone with actual NPD opens their mouth. (Imagine if people did that with any other disorder! "Hey, I'm autistic." "Oh... my old roommate screamed at me whenever I made noise around him, and didn't understand my needs, which seems like sensory overload and difficulty with social cues. He was definitely autistic. But as long as you're self-aware and always restraining your innate desire to be an abusive asshole, you're okay I guess, maybe." ...See how offensive and ignorant that is?)

Stop preventing healthcare for people with a disorder just because it's trendy to use us as a scapegoat.

If you got this far, thank you for reading, and please share this if you can. Further reading is under the cut.

NPD Criteria, re-written by someone who actually has NPD

Stigma in the DSM

Common perception of the DSM criteria vs how someone may actually experience them (Keep in mind that this is the way I personally experience these symptoms, and that presentation can vary a lot between individuals)

"Idk, the stigma is right though, because I've known a lot of people with NPD who are jerks, so I'm going to continue to support the blockage of treatment for this condition."

(All of these were written by me, because I didn't want to link to other folks' posts without permission, but if you want to add your own links in reblogs or replies please feel free <3)

#actuallynpd #signal boost #actuallyautistic #mental health awareness #narcissistic personality disorder #people also need to realize that mental health professionals aren't immune from bias #(it really shouldn't come as a shock that the mental health field has a longstanding pattern of misunderstanding and mistreating ppl who ar #mentally ill or otherwise ND)#the first therapist i brought up NPD to like. literally pulled out the DSM bc she could barely remember the criteria. then said that there'#no way I have it because I have low self-esteem lmaoooooo #anyway throwback to being at work and chatting with a co-worker. and the conversation turning to mental health. and him saying that #he tries to stay informed and be aware and supportive of mental health conditions & that he doesn't want to be ignorant or spread harmful #misinformation. and then i mentioned that i do a lot of research into mental health stuff and i listed a bunch of things. which included #several personality disorders. one of which was NPD.#and after listening to my whole ass list he zeroed in on the NPD and immediately started talking about how narcissists are abusive and #he knew someone who had NPD and how the person who had it had an addiction and died from the addiction in a horrible way and he #was glad he did #fun times #or when i decided to be vulnerable and talk abt my self-criticism/self-hatred bc i knew my friends also struggled w that and i wanted to #support them by sharing my own coping methods. and they both(separately!) started picking and prodding at my npd through the lens of stigma #bc i'd recently opened up to them abt having it. they recognized self-hatred as a symptom and still jumped on me for it. despite me #trying to share hurt vulnerable parts of myself to help them and connect with them.#again..... fun times

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a-sip-of-milo · 8 months

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NPD Resources Masterlist

[BPD]

The official resources masterlist for NPD. Includes all the links I've shared in the past and stuff I haven't.

Any posts I've linked about supporting those with NPD have been put in the misc section because I do not want to take away from what this post is really about, which is helping people with NPD, not the people around them.

Diagnostic criteria

NPD diagnostic criteria, rewritten by someone who has it

Official diagnostic criteria

An explanation of the diagnostic criteria

Recovery resources FOR the narcissist

NPD recovery resources

How to find therapy for NPD, common types of therapy and signs of an abusive/toxic therapist

Narcissist supply

What is narc supply?

Things that can give a narcissist supply

NPD stigma

The perception of NPD symptoms vs. how a narcissist might actually experience them

Why those with NPD have a hard time seeking help (spoiler alert: it's not because they're unaware)

A plea from someone with NPD (and some resources debunking common misconceptions)

Narcissism is not abusive / abuse is abusive

Debunking common myths on NPD

Common disproven myths about NPD

Miscellaneous

How to support someone with NPD

NPD Carrd (What is NPD, dpt skills and self-help)

Unravelling the connection: npd as a trauma response

NPD terminology (do's and dont's)

NPD safe blogs

@empath-abuse-awareness

@enigma-in-reality

@loverofmirage

@the-npd-culture-is

@nicepersondisorder

@theegosystem

@mischiefmanifold

NPD positivity so you don't have to go looking

Reblog to kiss a narcissist on the forehead

Reblog to tell your local narcissist that they're the best ever

Happy NPD appreciation day

Positivity for systems with NPD

Be normal about narcissists unless it's to give them love

NPD should be EPD (Epic Personality Disorder)

Of course I have a praise kink, I have NPD

Narcissists are so beautiful and handsome and wonderful

Positivity for narcissists who like sex

I love my narcissists

Aromantic narcissists are amazing

Narcissists I love you

Easy ways to spot a narcissist (it's not what you think <;3)

Narcissists deserve to be loved

As usual, if something needs to be deleted because it's wrong/comes from a toxic author/etc. please let me know. I tried to look on Google but all I found was ableist shit, so these are all found by your fellow narcissists on tumblr :)

Edit: If you have any resources, please send them to me through an ask or DM and i'll check it out/add it!

#npd #npd safe #cluster b safe #actually narcissistic #narcissistic personality disorder #narcissism #npd positivity #npd stigma #npd resources #npd things

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npdmonoma · 4 months

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No amount of rational arguments are going to sway narcissistic abuse believers, because their beliefs aren't logical to begin with. They're emotional. Their abuse wasn't taken seriously, they weren't protected, they weren't treated with kindness, and that's devastating. I won't downplay that, because I know exactly what it feels like and it's torture.

But they're still wrong, and that matters.

To them, belief in narcissistic abuse serves two functions. The first is that it legitimizes their pain. If they can position their abuser as somehow worse than "normal" abusers, they can garner more sympathy. It's an understandable impulse, and one that I ironically heavily relate to as a narcissist. But I also know that just because something feels good to me emotionally, that doesn't necessarily mean it's okay for me to do. If I have to hurt others, then I need to find another way to get that validation. This is literally a skill I'm learning to cope with my NPD.

The second function it serves is to give them a sense of safety. If all the Bad People are easily identified by a checklist of narcissistic traits, then they can easily spot any potential abuser and escape further abuse. But it doesn't really work like that. Not only do they end up targeting a ton of people who aren't abusers, they also leave themselves open to abuse from people who don't fit their idea of narcissism. It's a lose/lose situation.

Ultimately, the emotional needs underlying the belief in narcissistic abuse need to be addressed so these people can get rid of these toxic beliefs and become better people. They need to do a lot of work on themselves, but they also need support systems that can give them the validation and comfort and safety they crave without having to hurt others to get it. If that sounds familiar, it should. It's the kinder version of what everyone keeps demanding from us narcissists.

If you're a narcissistic abuse believer and you've read this far, this post probably didn't make you feel very good. Maybe it made you angry, or made you doubt yourself, or even triggered you. If that's the case, you probably aren't ready to listen to me right now. That's fine, I get it. But once you've calmed down, you won't have any more excuses. Come back and read it again. Think about it. Internalize it. And then you need to fix your shit, because I can't do it for you

#narcissistic soliloquizing #actually npd #npd safe #actually narcissistic

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brf-rumortrackinganon · 14 days

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Personally, I don't think Harry has gone for the spouse visa/green card route yet. Simply because his entitlement, and Meghan's entitlement, about his royal status would not allow them to show Harry as being dependent on Meghan in any way

They would both, much rather prefer to lord it over people, family, governments (both UK and US) that he is royal, the kings son (late queens grandson) and hence very very imp in his own right.

Also, the paperwork and forethought required to submit a greencard application means that both harry and meghan would need to do a lot of work - fill out applications, gather documents, aquire and submit bank data, proof of dates, proof of financials, taxation etc - all of which they are both incapable of doing. Not to mention that their narcissistic discordered tendencies would make them think this is below them.

(I know we can't actually diagnose them, but this is Tumblr, not CNN, and as a psychologist I know that filling out paperwork is the absolutebane of an NPD persons existence. These little quirks of the NPD are not talked about much but they are nearly universally observed.)

Another issue would be hiring an immigration lawyer for the spouse visa. The expenses and the process of actively listening to what the lawyers says is required procedure would put HnM on the backfoot and hate the process.

I have assumed that Harry is either on -

1). A1 Visa - diplomatic/head of state/official representative of a country

2). O1 Visa - specialized skilled worker/Einstein visa given to artists, actors, models, investors in specialized fields, highly skilled academicians, persons contracted by a sponcer for a special skill etc

Now, there is some evidence to support both these. So I'll list those reasons and my conclusions from those below.

Option 1.- A1 visa

Harry moved to US in March 2020, just before pandemic. Most people focus on this, but forget that when the couple moved they both were still, officially, Full Time working royals for the BRF and embarking on the 1 year trial period to see how things pan out for them. This trial period lasted till March 2021, upon the conclusion of which the BRF promptly officially announced there demotions. So, they were working royals when they moved to US, albeit on a leave of absence.

So, what does that mean? That his (and her) diplomatic status was still intact. They did their last royal engagement for the UK in mar 2020, but they hadn't retired. Hadn't resigned. His royal patronages, commonwealth role etc were only taken back in 2021. Both parties had agreed to a separation period till then.

Another factor is that they had already asked Canada to provide him (them) with full time security, ie., treat him like a full fledged royal. But Canada said only till March 2020, and not after that. Trudeau actually released a statement about this.

So this tells me that they (may have). actually asked for full time royal treatment ie., security and diplomatic status for the trial period lasting upto March 2021 and were told no.

(I think that's what Harry means when he says the BRF took away his security, I thiy he means that the BRF pricipals personally prevailed upon Trudeau and made him refuse security)

So Harry's only option was to take his fancy diplomatic status passport, hope on a private jet and fly to LA without telling anyone.

People think this was because the lockdowns were imminent. But I think it was also timed in a way that they were out of Canada before the promised security period expired.

After this, during pandemic, Harry consistently did nonsensical "commonwealth" related zoom calls. Till the president/head/chairperson of the CW youth org (I forgot who exactly but one of main people of the org) publicly distanced themselves in late 2020.

Another thing that was odd was that Trump official said he will not be giving the couple security. Which means that his govt was asked, maybe repeatedly asked and Harry made his case, till the time Trump had to release a statement saying he won't. Makes me think, Harry made his case using his A1 status. Because otherwise, if he was there as a private citizen, this request was absurd and the govt would dismissed this without a second thought. But if they had permitted someone to enter based on their A1 status as representative of a head of state, they had weigh the pros and cons of this request and it could have caused a potential diplomatic incidence. So the president himself had to be face of this decision.

(this is irrespective of anyones thoughts about who the president was, or what kind of person the president may or may not have been. This was an executive decision)

So,

All this leads me to speculate that Harry initially, and until end of 2021 at least, made use of his status as a representative of the head of status, which he already officially had, and was on paper, to enter the US.

The duration of permit of this initial stay could have been 2 or 3 years. So, 2022. Or 2023, when curiosly, Heritage Foundation suddenly took interest in the status of his visa.

Option 2 - O-Visa

This is a bit funny and farfetched, but I think Harry could also have entered on his British passport, which allows a stay upto 6 months (tourist visa). And then applied for O- Visa status a couple of months later.

By June 2020 Harry had forged some sort of investment+partnership with Betterup. This likely involved an initial investment into the company. For enterpreneurs and/investors into a US based company, a minimum investment of 250k or 500k is required to be shown. If he did this, then Betterup could have easily sponcered his application and he could used his very imp, very skilled, very unique position as CHIMPO as a means to get a visa.

A lawyer and the company could have helped him. Plus his high profile status due to his work as a philanthropists, patron of various international organisations etc would definitely be an asset as it is proof and documentation of his years of work.

We may laugh and debate about the "quality" of his work all his life but when it comes to govt paperwork, this is still documented proof. And it's verifiable. So, noone is going to get into the nitty gritty of it, and getting a stamp is easy for him.

Another avenue could have been that he was immediately listed as a high in demand, much sought after international speaker or much renown. He did a couple of onscure, forgettable speaker gigs. But that's all he would need for proof.

He was also listed as the executive producer for oprahs documentary, he was earning his producer certification and the Apple documentary was under production.based on that, he could have applied for an O-visa and it would have been approved.

The duration of stay for O-visa status is 3 years at a time, after which you have to apply again for the visa. It is not eligible for renewal. All paperwork and applications have to be submitted again and will be scrutinized as new.

Let's assume he applied 2/3 months after initial entry, so that's June. His application would have been approved by July end Aug latest. (this is based on my personal experience with the same visa, in this the same time period).

With COVID restrictions, he gets approved but doesn't have to immediately go back to his home country to get it stamped at immigration. I got mine stamped end of 2021 from my country. Till then I stayed in US and worked. So he could have stamped his in April 2021 when he went back for his grandfather's funeral.

If he got his O-visa in 2020, then it would expire in 2023. This is the time heritage foundation started creating a fuss about his visa.

Now, with all of that, an important question we need to ask is- why did the heritage foundation start their crusade in 2023?

This could be because Harry's first visa stay (likely) expired in 2023 and he reapplied for a visa. And was (most likely) approved for the same type of visa again. This process would have gone quite smoothly with Harry's pull. But this second time it is quite clear that he got special treatment. And the heritage foundation wants to expose this special treatment.

Orr more likely, someone in the know tipped them off, and wants this exposed for whatever reason. I DO NOT think the BRf want this exposed, I don't think they care.

I do think someone in the US govt or maybe even a journalist wants to make a big deal out of this. And rightly so.

Anyway, that's my dissertation on Harry's visa. I don't think it matters to anyone outside of Tumblr, but I do feel his entitlement is mind-boggling and he should be held accountable for the person that he is. And if this visa issue is what does it, then so be it.

It is based on my personal experience with these 2 types of visas. And my theoretical and observed knowledge about how entitlement is one of the driving forces for most classical NODs. But the reality for him may be different. And you Rumour, being a fed, would probably know more and know better.

*********

I agree with you. I’ve been reading up about the visa issues (and also spoke to a few other fed friends).

I think Harry is here on an O-1 visa, for extraordinary/outstanding talent. Meghan doesn’t seem invested enough into the marriage to be willing to do the paperwork so if he’s here on a spousal visa, a lawyer would’ve done the paperwork. Additionally, I can see the financial requirements being a major concern for the BRF; the BRF goes to a great length to protect their financial information from other countries and the general public. They’re not going to let the US (no matter how special the relationship) take a peek at their books. So I suspect they squashed the idea of a spousal visa unless it was done *exclusively* on Meghan’s own savings/net worth. Which she balked at doing because it implies she’s financially responsible for Harry and that’s not what she signed up. She signed up to spend Charles’s money. Not her own. So that’s off the table.

Next is the diplomatic visa. Harry doesn’t actually have a diplomatic passport. He has a regular passport. He may have had a second passport for work that he traveled on UK business for, but he never had diplomatic status in the BRF; only The Queen and Charles did.

And that’s something government officials are really strict about, that people travel on official business use official papers. Officials traveling on personal business use personal papers. Or, that’s how it works here in the US. Not sure about the UK.

Now for Harry to have come to the US on a diplomatic passport for a diplomatic visa, he would have had to present his credentials for being here, and those credentials would have explained clearly and succinctly what he was in the US for and what official business he had with us. They would’ve looked into it.

So I don’t think he’s here on a A/diplomatic visa. Or perhaps not anymore, when it was made clear following the one-year Megxit review that he no longer represents the UK or works on behalf of The Queen/BRF.

Which leaves the O visa, for talent. But I don’t think it’s Better Up. I think it’s Invictus Games. Not only would it explain why they still stick with Harry despite all the expenses and criticism they cost the Foundation. And that’s what Harry is known for, outside of the BRF - his military support and support for veterans. It would also explain why Harry continues to try so hard to collaborate with the US military and warfighter community. Because he needs the military to support his visa.

Maybe it’s transferred to Better Up now since he seems to do more work for them.

As to why the government is trying so hard to keep his visa papers buried? I think they know we know Harry isn’t qualified to be here on a diplomatic or an O visa, so the BRF greased the wheels a bit in some way, shape, or form to help him get through the system.

But also if he’s here on a O-1 visa connected to Invictus Games, it could imply government or DOD support; if not DOD directly, then close partners or contractors…aka military lobbyists.

So that’s where I am right now.

And fingers crossed this gets posted in full. 🤞

#submission

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defiantsuggestions · 11 months

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I can't be a part of a support group without fear that most of the people in that group are going to be violently ableist toward folks with NPD.

I can't feel community with other traumatized people without the knowledge that, at any moment, I'm going to find out that one of them has been sending death threats to someone for the crime of having an NPD diagnosis.

I can't...trust, a lot of the people, who've been through the same things as me, for fear that they want to wipe out an entire group of people.

The sheer hate that I keep smacking my head into when I look for people who are like me.

Hate for people who haven't done anything wrong, who are merely trying to exist and live out their life.

These same people who will instantly turn on me and try to rip me apart when I say, "hey, maybe we shouldn't be assholes to people for no reason."

I feel like half the survivor community has decided that their abuser must be a narcissist, and therefore every narcissist is an abuser, so therefore it's okay to lash out and threaten and hurt random strangers. They can't hurt their abuser, so they hurt innocent folks they don't even know, and they think it's okay to do that because "it's fine, this person has the abuser disease, so it's okay if I harrass them for no reason."

I don't trust my own community.

I hate that people are like this.

I'm not looking for support because I want to hurt people who haven't done a thing to me.

That's not the point of this. I'm looking to recover, because I don't want to be miserable. I want to help and be helped, because we should support each other.

But over and over I keep running into people who think NPD folks are something less than human.

And I don't want to be a part of that.

#tw: abelism #defiant vent

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narcissisticpdcultureis · 1 month

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npd culture is.... telling your friend you're a narcissist. And they're super supportive and encouraging and "No you're not a bad person!" etc.

And seeing them turn around and spread narc abuse bs like. I don't have the energy to explain that narc abuse isn't fucking real, what they've described is psychological/emotional abuse.

And that I went through the same thing. That's a large contributor to why I have NPD now.

- ⚔️, who is still forever grateful to my qpp who is incredibly supportive and kind and understands this shit.

#npd culture is #npd #actually narcissistic #actually npd #narcissistic personality disorder #cluster b #-⚔

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quitblamingnarcissism · 8 days

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i had to leave a server that i was active in just now

i asked someone to use a different word when they described past bad/abusive employers as "narcissistic" and got reprimanded by a mod who said that people could be narcissistic without having NPD. now, i'm not too sure about this and i was ready to leave it be until another mod came in to support the original person i talked to by saying that they wished that their current job was "NPD-free."

i didn't stick around to see anyone's response. i hope that someone finds problem in that statement, but i don't know if they will. i usually give discord servers two chances but i don't think i'll do so with this server.

Employers are abusive on a regular basis. They only care about the profit that the employees can produce and not about the employees' well being. They only care about money while labeling their employees as "entitled brats" if they do the same. If an employee dropped dead, the employer would only care about replacing them.

Abuse from employers is normal, not narcissistic.

"People can be narcissistic without having NPD" is just a bullshit excuse that ableists use to dodge criticism. If they're not talking about people with NPD, they shouldn't use the same terminology as people who are.

#narcissistic abuse #ableism #npd positivity #surviving narcissism #raised by narcissists

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dramamines · 5 months

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why the fuck does the internet hate people with NPD so much. They are not demons, they are not evil, they are not manipulative attention seeking villains. They are real people, suffering from a mental health disorder. I know that they can cause harm, and it can be hard to be friends with them, but they are not unfixable monsters. Please, instead of spreading hate and anger and lies and awful videos and infographics and having all the NPD resources be about narcissistic abuse victims, help support the people with NPD. They can learn, and adapt, and improve on themselves if you don't just villainise them from the start.

#im just looking for ways to support and interact w my friend w npd #i dont want to be affronted with '5 ways to support ppl with npd' and then the whole list just be 'stay away from them'#ballena rambles #npd #narcissistic personality disorder #cluster b #npd positivity #npd safe #vent

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joficeandwind · 6 months

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Reminder that you can be a victim of abuse, mentally unstable, AND a shitty person! I have seen too many posts and too many people in real life that put ALL of the blame on someone's mental conditions and just ignore that people have agency! I've seen so many people pull the "Well, yes, their mental health didn't help, but, what about Y factor that's out of their control?" When you try holding people accountable for their actions! So I'm gonna fight back on that bullshit here and now! So remember!

DO NOT give them infinite chances! Of course, you should give people struggling with trauma or mental issues room to make mistakes so they can learn and grow. But, you can't let them make fuck up after fuck up after fuck up, never try to improve, and not do anything about it! People can only fix themselves, so if they don't WANT to, and only say they will so they can get out of trouble, call them out for it! Give them a piece of your mind, berate them! Cut them off if you have to!

DO NOT expect people they've hurt to forgive them just because they're mentally ill or suffering with trauma! If someone with an undiagnosed Cluster B Personality disorder is an abusive partner for years, and they get therapy and become a healthier, better person, of course many people will forgive them and not be as outraged at them, even if they were the abused in that situation. But you should NOT force that onto others who wouldn't! A person would have every right to still be furious at them for what they did, especially not the victims! They have every right to blame THEM for what they did, and not their inner turmoil.

DO NOT downplay their shitty behavior caused by their mental health! NPD, BPD, ASPD, and adjacent Personality Disorders DO NOT necessarily make someone a bad person! You should not look at someone struggling with any of those issues and assume they have The Mental Illness That Turns You Into a Shitty Person. BUT! When someone is CLEARLY demonstrating toxic and destructive behavior that lines up EXACTLY with what they are diagnosed with, and they are CONSISTANTLY participating in these behaviors, you can't act like it's completely out of their control or not that big a deal! Do not protect them JUST BECAUSE they are mentally ill!

At the end of the day, just because someone is mentally ill, doesn't mean they can't be a shitty person! I had a neglectful and sometimes physically abusive mother with Bipolar Personality Disorder who was also a victim of CSA, and guess what? We have her CHANCE, after CHANCE, after CHANCE, financially supporting her, letting her live with us, LOVING HER, even after EVERYTHING, including almost TORCHING one of her ex-friends! But after long enough, when she ended up in jail on drug charges for the SECOND TIME, you know what happened? WE CUT HER OFF.

One of my first friends here on tumblr suffered from extremely low empathy, speculated to have Narcissistic Personality Disorder by the professionals she was in contact with for short periods of time and herself, and was also SUICIDAL, which I TALKED HER OUT OF COMMITING ONCE. Guess what? She was A-Ok and LAUGHED while being an accessory in spreading completely false accusations of RACISM and PEDOPHILA to onto a MINOR. (Me, who had literally turned 16 like 2 weeks ago at the time of this happening.) Why? She just didn't wanna bother with me or my friends anymore, we gave her a "bad image".

TL;DR, support mentally ill people and people going through tough shit, but don't coddle, woobify, or let them trample on you!

#j rambles #mental health #mental illness #emotional health #j rants #cluster b #borderline personality problems #narcissistic personality disorder #bpd #bipolor #accountability #trauma #alexis don't look

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redtail-lol · 9 months

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Idk how people will be anti self dx and then call sb a narcissist like so I can't diagnose myself based on my lived experiences and research because I don't have the qualifications to diagnose others but you who also doesn't have that qualification can diagnose people with a disorder you probably barely know about?

This post is not about being concerned and telling someone you know personally that they should look into something to see if that might be the case, that's a suggestion. This post is talking about people who are making videos on YouTubers who get exposed and calling them narcissists like... You don't even know them. Besides they usually won't even show signs of NPD, they'll just be manipulative and maybe have a pretty big ego and sense of self importance but none of the other signs, like an unstable sense of self, need to be praised, or a genuine lack of empathy* are present. And that's only to name a few symptoms, others also rarely appear when these YouTubers get called narcissists for being bad people. A narcissist is not the same as being a bad person, you can't call everyone you don't like a narcissist. Despite the people I'm specifically referring to, this post can also be about anyone calling somebody, even someone they know, a narcissist without having a single clue how the person thinks or what narcissism even is.

*A lack of empathy is not the same as not caring about others. Empathy is the ability to understand how others feel, and to feel with them. A lack of empathy is not a lack of compassion. It does not mean you don't care about others. It means you can't really understand how others feel. You can't read their feelings and you don't feel a certain way just because they feel a certain way. People who don't have empathy can still care about others and people who have empathy don't necessarily care about the feelings of other people. Being able to understand the feelings of others doesn't necessarily mean you give a shit about the way they feel, and you may even find delight in someone being upset if you wanted them to hurt.

#narcissistic personality disorder #narcissism #npd #npd safe #npd stigma #I don't have npd but I support narcissists #you guys are safe here #if you don't feel welcomed for any reason please tell me nicely I'll correct it #narcissist positivity #pro self dx #anti armchair dx

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kindnessoverperfection · 9 months

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I want to break down a common point of conflict when addressing NPD stigma.

A lot of hangups people have tend to be along the lines of "but I DO see a lot of people with actual NPD who are acting in toxic or abusive ways".

This will be kind of long, so bear with me.

Point #1: People are way more likely to be diagnosed if they exhibit "stereotypical" symptoms.

There's this image of NPD as a disorder that is only present in those with patterns of destructive behavior towards others. Many therapists have this conception. (Shockingly, the mental health field is not perfect & without stigma.)

Gonna copy-paste this here from my other blog (so forgive me if you've seen it before), because it's a good example.

Three people are criticized at work. Their boss yells at them for their performance in front of everyone. Person A gets mad and defensive. They yell back, using cutting remarks as a way to try and ease the distress they feel. Person B acts really mature and responsible the whole time, nodding along and agreeing and promising to do better, just desperate to maintain and improve their status. Desperate to be liked. Later they go home and handle their distress through self-destructive means, and spend the next few months overworking themself to the point of illness. Person C doesn't seem to respond much at all. They go quiet and seem distant. They don't lash out or lash in, but for the next month or so, their productivity drops. They simply aren't able to focus on work or self-care, no matter how hard they try. The stress is overwhelming. All three of these people have the same root issues, but only the first would be labeled a narcissist. Outwards behaviors and presentations don't reflect the pain, distress, and difficulties with life that are underlying them.

So, three main things happen.

There ends up being a higher rate of people with destructive behaviors who are diagnosed with NPD

The people who don't particularly exhibit behaviors and are considered ""too nice to have it"" are overlooked entirely (and never get any sort of help for their underlying issues, yayyy)

People are more likely to be more honest about "ugly" symptoms / symptoms that are frowned down upon than they are in other mental health communities.

(Also some people decide to act super edgy about it, which is annoying but here we are. Some of them are trolls.)

(And while I'm at it, some people are misdiagnosed with NPD because a psych sees someone who committed a violent crime and is like "uhh slap them with the Evil Asshole™ disorders!! no further thought given.")

Point #2: People who have messed up are not inhuman monsters who deserve no help or support

While I do think it's important for people to understand that patterns of toxic behaviors aren't the ONLY way NPD can present, I'm not going to let the conversation stop at "some of us are nice though!!"

Human beings aren't RPG characters who can be sorted into "monster" or "ally". Every single person has done something hurtful, has messed up, exhibits some sort of behavior that puts strain on their relationships sometimes.

So I'll bullet point some aspects of this that need to be talked about.

People without NPD also commonly exhibit toxic behaviors, but people ignore that nowadays. Either they armchair diagnose anyone who's slightly rude, or they only focus on it in pwNPD and ignore it in themselves or others. NTs can be jerks too, and they're probably less likely to acknowledge it than pwNPD who are constantly watching and checking themselves and analyzing their behaviors and attempting to do better.

Assuming that NPD makes someone abusive doesn't help anyone. Can it impact behaviors, and make it more difficult for people to be self-aware? Of course. But an important step in healing from any mental health condition (especially personality disorders, ime) is realizing that you're not inherently ""bad"", and that you can take responsibility for your actions and learn to deal with things in constructive ways. Just going "NPD makes people bad, full stop"- other than being a mean shitty thing to say- absolves people of guilt and asserts that there's no reason for them to try and improve.

Yes, it's okay for people to hate their abusers. Their abuser. Not an entire community of people who happen to (maybe) share a trait with them.

Building on the above point, people tend to go in defense mode when they hear things like "pwNPD who have acted in toxic ways can learn to improve their behavior", "people shouldn't be saying awful things about folks with this condition", etc. because they automatically try to apply this to their abuser. Interpersonal situations are very different from society-wide mental health access. No, don't stay with your abuser expecting them to change, and don't hold onto the hope that they will. No, don't censor yourself or your hatred or anger towards them. Just don't make blanket statements about a disorder that they may or may not have- blame their abusive actions, not their mental health.

"I hate you for your abusive actions and the harm that you caused me." =/= "I hate a group of people because of an inherent unchangeable part of them that's tied directly to severe childhood trauma they suffered. Because of it, they're evil and unlovable and are incapable of change. They're inhuman and will never experience real connection with others." ..........See the difference??

Even if there were a disorder with a 100% rate of toxic douchey behaviors, I'd want the conversation around it to be changed. I'd want different words to be used to divide up the spaces and conversations and resources, so that survivors of abusive or toxic behavior can get help, but that the disorder still has space to be treated. Otherwise, there are zero resources for healing. Nothing is being done to help these people or solve the issue. They're just told they may as well not try. They're blocked from healthcare entirely, despite how the entire point of being diagnosed with a condition is supposed to be to treat it.

There's a wide range of people who have NPD- it presents in many different ways, a person who has it may or may not exhibit harmful behaviors- but no one deserves to be denied treatment or told they're unlovable because of a condition they have that was formed from trauma.

Speak out against abusive behavior. Don't destroy healthcare for a medical condition.

#actuallynpd #npd stigma #narcissistic personality disorder

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compassionatereminders · 2 months

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re: people stigmatising npd

I don't have npd, but I have bpd, and one of the WILDEST phenomenon I've observed in that regard is other borderlines turning around and shitting on npd. it's obviously terrible when people with no mental health conditions do it, but it's baffling to see coming from within the cluster b community. at that point it doesn't even feel like a "the leopards are going to eat your face next" situation, it's a "the leopards are already eating your face and you're still convinced that it's fine as long as they get the other guy too" situation. baffling.

like when I see people with bpd talk about how it makes us "more vulnerable to narcissists" I just want to scream. how can they be so closely connected to people with npd and still completely fail to see them as people whose struggles are just as legitimate and multi-dimensional as their own?

I'm not cluster B myself, but I see something similar in the autistic community where people will advocate for themselves by shitting on people with more stigmatized diagnoses or even just higher support needs. Like by talking about how "autism doesn't make you inherently wrong in the head the way a mental illness does" or how "many autistic people are actually smarter than average." And in all scenarios that type of "advocacy" disgusts me.

#chat with kat #ableism tw #cluster b ableism tw

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cemitadepollo · 1 year

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@tragicallyphosphorescent

You see, the thing about "sociopaths" it's that they're not real. If you open a psychology book, as you apparently hint to have done at some point, you'll discover that the term you're using isn't only scientifically inaccurate, but an outdated and harmful term used to refer to people with ASPD– Anti-Social Personality Disorder. This cluster B disorder is developed as a coping mechanism by people who suffer from childhood neglect, so people demonize literal abuse survivors for their little "serial killer abuser sociopath" fantasy that they saw in their favorite true crime movie. I would love to know where did you get the objective fact that most "sociopaths" don't seek treatment and hurt people.

Narcissistic Personality Disorder, otherwise known as NPD or just "narcissists", is a disorder that's classified in the cluster B category of personality disorders according to the DSM-V, this disorder is also developed because of childhood neglect. People love to armchair diagnose their abusers with this disorder under the ignorant belief that narcissistic people are selfish and that's it, it's used as an interchangeable term, which couldn't be further from reality. So no, I don't believe in "narcissistic abuse". Abuse is just abuse, an abuser is just an abuser, there's no need to slap anything else alongisde that label.

Just because a manifestation of trauma is different it doesn't mean it's bad. People with ASPD and NPD are as likely to abuse someone as a person without them. Lacking empathy doesn't make someone a bad person, empathy is just the capability to instinctually feel another human's feelings, but it's not the same as sympathy or compassion. A good person is one who's actions do good.

Now, I'm not invalidating the abuse anyone has gone through. If you tell me somebody, anybody, abused you, I believe you. But there's no need to demonize disorders in order to find support or validation.

You can find a free PDF of The Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders. 5th edition (DSM-V) easily on the internet, no need to buy the book itself. I suggest you give it a read to clear up that whole "sociopath" thing and to educate yourself more on the narcissistic personality disorder. As a disclaimer, the DSM-V is highly discussed by the neurodivergent community on a regular basis and some individuals, including myself, have a word or two about certain criteria that needs to be met to get a diagnosis, but I'm advising you to read it as a start.

Sincerely, a borderline with fluctuating empathy that's very tired of watching their cluster B siblings get denied treatment and dignity, because in case you didn't know this, lots of us actively seek treatment but get deemed "too hard to treat" or get actively abused by the medic system IF we are even allowed some sort of therapy. As a neurodivergent person, I'd assume you know of the kinds of horrors people like you and me suffer in psych wards, except people with personality disorders and other demonized illnesses still get thrown around and abused since our disorders aren't deemed as "harmless" as people who suffer from depression and anxiety or people with autism.

#ableism #tw narc abuse mention #aspd stigma #tw sociopath slur #s slur #npd stigma #aspd culture is #npd culture is #bpd stigma #bpd culture #cluster b #cluster b disorders #cluster b discussion #neurodiverse stuff #actually cluster b #neurodivergent

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neopronouns · 3 months

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Thanks for answering my ask, sorry again if I came off as ignorant, I genuinely cannot wrap my mind around not experiencing empathy or compassion. I still don’t really understand how someone could lack those things but I guess it doesn’t matter as long as they’re trying to be kind anyways. You brought up cluster b personality disorders in your answer and I had another question - those personality disorders are generally considered to make people ‘mean’ or ‘unpleasant’, is it ableist to dislike the traits associated with cluster b disorders? For ex, symptoms of npd are a sense of grandiosity and disregard for other people’s emotions - isn’t that something that needs to be fixed or treated with therapy? Or are people expected to just be chill with how they act? None of these questions come from a place of anger or discrimination, I’m just trying to better understand what is acceptable and not when dealing with disorders that affect the person’s behavior. Thanks again for answering my previous ask!

you aren't expected to just 'be chill' with how someone with a certain disorder acts, but you are expected to not be ableist about the way they act. cluster b personality disorders (and other disorders, but we'll focus on those for now) can make a person 'mean' or 'unpleasant', but it isn't their fault that they have a disorder (often caused by trauma) that makes them naturally act a certain way.

importantly, a personality disorder can't just be 'fixed' with therapy — no matter how much therapy one does, they will always have that personality disorder, they'll just be able to better manage their symptoms. also, the symptoms that make a person with a cluster b disorder 'unpleasant' don't just affect those around them, but affect the person with the disorder as well; having a personality disorder is an intense, debilitating experience.

as a narcissist myself (that is, i have npd) i do experience symptoms that are 'unpleasant' to others. my need for admiration and heightened self-importance have damaged relationships in the past. however, my disorder is much more difficult for me than for those who interact with me; for example, when i don't receive the admiration i need, my self-esteem drops to 0 and i experience depressive symptoms, high anxiety, and self-destructive behaviors. if i could change that about myself, i would, but therapy would only be able to give me better coping mechanisms, not 'fix' that aspect of my personality entirely. i'm very lucky to have friends who understand my symptoms and care about me enough to work with me to ensure we're all happy.

additionally, it's ableist to assume that all people with cluster b disorders will be unpleasant to be around or to insist that they should go to therapy to change their behavior for your benefit (using the general 'you' here). compare this to autism: it's ableist to, say, assume that all autistic people are annoying or to insist that autistic people stop experiencing symptoms (stimming, infodumping, not making eye contact, etc.) for the comfort of the allistics they interact with. people with cluster b disorders are just that, people; they need support and understanding just like anyone else, even if you find their symptoms unpalatable.

in general, here's what i recommend:

don't make negative blanket statements about a specific disorder (especially one that you don't have)

don't make negative blanket statements about a specific symptom (especially one you don't experience)

research things you don't understand (i especially recommend reading posts from people who have the disorder/symptom you're curious about along with information compiled by doctors and researchers)

compare the experiences of a person with another disorder to your own experiences (like my comparison to autism in the last paragraph above). if you'd think a specific statement towards your own disorder was ableist, it's almost certainly ableist towards other disorders

and, of course, listen to those with disorders and symptoms you don't have. if a ton of people with a specific disorder or symptom are saying that something is ableist and people without that disorder or symptom are insisting that it isn't ableist, you should probably listen to the people being affected by ableism, not the people perpetuating it.

#long post #discourse

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