#anti Grant Morrison

[spite-and-waffles]

Talia "aggressively groomed" Jason – did you actually read Lost Days or are you trying to find a convenient scapegoat for his choices? Jason can't be held accountable because "Pit Rage", but the woman who was killed and dunked in the Pit one hundred times until her mind broke enough to brainwash is 100% culpable for every misogynistic plot point hung around her neck. You can find a way to rationalize and ignore Jason's indiscriminate killing at Nicieza and Morrison and even fucking Winnick's hands as OOC, but Talia acting out of character cements her as a groomer and abuser.

It's amazing how people bend backwards to whitewash their little uwu white boy because the narrative is so meeeean to him, but have no problem throwing the woman of colour subjected to every kind of racism and misogyny in the trash.

#show me in Lost Days where this woman had any control over this kid #she couldn't even keep him from trying to kill Bruce #or did you just see a teenager and an older woman and decide what the dynamic is #and that she wasnt acting out of character when she slept with him #Winnick has a problematic history with women of colour but even his point was that this woman was not well #she had a case of raging ptsd and literal brainwashing #the idea that you can just throw out Winnick's BnR arc but not that gross ass moment in Lost Days #talia al ghul #jason todd #red hood: the lost days #batman and robin: the streets run red #anti grant morrison #anti fabian nicieza #judd winnick #jason todd meta #racism #misogyny #dcu #tw grooming mention #batfamily #bat meta #spite waffle #talia al ghul meta

[redwiccanrobin]

I see people try to frame Morrison’s mischaracterization of Talia as a good thing because it brings light to male victims. Which, yes, we should be talking about male victims but that’s not what they were doing. Morrison has this sort of habit you could say of using very upsetting and traumatizing situations as a way to shock readers. I’m sorry, I just don’t believe that they had any good intentions about writing that in. They wanted people to just gasp at their comic.

#dc comics #batman #talia al ghul #anti grant morrison

[wesavegotham]

Sometimes I wonder if Grant Morrison fanboys don't know or don't care just how weird this guy is. Not just the racist and sexist way they handled Talia in general, even though the way seem to think that their retcon with Damian's conception was fine because:

giving someone drugs without their consent is apparently fine in their mind if the other person is into them is just...really fucked up.

But Morrison also seems to think that the Invisible Woman and her brother the Human Torch over at Marvel secretly want to bang each other:

Oh and Morrison compared Magneto (a holocaust surviver) to Hitler and also wrote him that way in their X-Men run:

Can we please all agree that, maybe it's not the characters that are messed up, but Grant Morrison who probably is.

#grant morrison #talia al ghul #bruce wayne #damian wayne #Anti grant morrison

[introspectivememories]

my family: heaven gained another angel </3 fly high

me in hell:

#morrison watch your back #i'll never forgive you for what you did to my girl talia #talia baby get behind me #anti grant morrison #dc #talia al ghul

[augustheart]

it is absolutely Nuts to see people still upholding morrison's older writing as some kind of bastion of progressive representation even though it is often deeply antiblack. both the depictions of rebis and especially the way that frenzy is written in doom patrol are racist. these trends continued into their creator-owned work like the invisibles, where the only black main character is written in even worse antiblack ways right down to the codename that she uses and black side characters are treated equally poorly.

there is also the transmisogyny of rebis' character and the absolutely horrific transmisogyny of as of yet unmentioned hilde's appearances in the invisibles including her very first appearance in the comic. morrison's transphobia, though now handwaved away by the fact that they have come out as genderqueer meaning that these things must for some reason be forgiven, is utterly sickening to read in these comics. i will not give brownie points for "representation" in a time when there were barely any trans characters in comics to characters who are made the butt of the joke by the narrative, are treated awfully by the characters around them, and are subjected to nauseating levels of violence.

these are not the only problems in morrison's late 80s/early 90s work, far from it, but they are the issues that i see handwaved away most frequently. grow a spine—if you can rightfully condemn the way they retconned talia and bruce's relationship as a product of racism, you can condemn their other racist and misogynist works.

#this is something i have been thinking about for awhile. the antiblackness in morrison's works is not some big secret #it is Extremely blatant. it is Right There. i remember all of that shit from the invisibles. i remember all of that shit from doom patrol. #this is not something they've grown out of with time--while they have apologized for talia's writing as they should-- #their other work goes unquestioned by fans #i cannot stress enough how much you should not look into the things in the invisibles because of how deeply deeply upsetting some of it is #the racism and transmisogyny in that comic runs insanely deep and is not helped by the other bigotry present (namely antisemitism) #racism / #anti grant morrison #transmisogyny / #antiblack racism / #transphobia /

[wanderingmind867]

Based on a wikiquote article about John Byrne, he does seem like a man with some shockingly out of touch opinions. But we do seem to agree on one thing: I think we both hate Alan Moore, Grant Morrison and Neil Gaiman. So that's something, I guess. At least I know we might share some of the same tastes, even if I'm actually not the biggest fan of him either.

#I think I'm #anti john byrne #but at least I respect this #anti alan moore #anti grant morrison #anti neil gaiman #comics #comic books #john byrne

[armed-with-a-waffle-iron]

"That was the 21st century Batman and Robin, THEY'VE BLOWN IT! Those guys were IT."

"My favourite part of [my run of Batman] is when Dick Grayson took over [as Batman], I could've written that for 10 years!" -Grant Morrison on Dick and Damian as the Dynamic Duo.

Source: Fatman on Batman

#dc really did fucking blow it #dick grayson never felt more unique a character ironically than when he was wearing the cowl #watching damian grow under dick's wing was an amazing experience #dick and damian's relationship is also so special to me like damian just isn't bruce's robin #dick grayson #damian wayne #grant morrison #batman #dickbats #batman and robin #dc comics #comics #bat family #batfam #anti new 52 #anti dan didio #kevin smith

[evilhorse]

First appearance of the Anti-Spawn

#spawn #anti spawn #Jason Wynn #first appearance #hmmmm #grant morrison #greg capullo #image comics #comics #90s comics

[spite-and-waffles]

I feel like neither the pro-Talia Al Ghul camp or the anti-Talia camp really care to delve deeply into the fact that she has been abused and used by her father her whole life, and is as tragic a character as Jason. Her fixating on a man as emotionally distant and obsessed with his mission as Ra's, knowing full well that he will never choose her or his children over it, is a completely accurate showcasing of the way people perpetuate their own trauma cycles.

And while I hope more people refuse to take anything Grant Morrison wrote about Talia to account, making her a good mother in reaction to it also just does not make sense. Just like Bruce, she's an example of someone who loves her child fiercely but is too traumatized and emotionally stunted to express it in healthy ways. Unlike Bruce she grew up in a literal terrorist cult and raised Damian in it as well. Her being exacting and teaching Damian to be ruthless and trust no one were all incredibly damaging and abusive, but it's also the only fucking way he could have survived the League or Ra's. Yes, she could have sent Damian to his father and keeping him by her side was selfish, but this woman, who had been starved of love and had never been anyone's priority since her mother died, finally had a person to be hers and only hers. It's horribly, tragically human to guard that love jealously and possessively.

The Tiger Mom as a trope is racist, but the emotional effects on women made to prove their worth as humans via motherhood is very much a reality that women of colour can relate to, and one not confined to just Asians. I'm only going to speak for my own people here, but the way Asian mothers make their sons their whole reason for being stems directly from the oppressively patriarchal cultures we grow up in, where a woman's worth is predicated on being a wife and mother and the highest honour she can aspire to is having a son. Ra's is the original patriarch who drilled into his daughters that they could never inherit his legacy no matter how much they proved their love, and that they owed him male heirs. Damian's very existence is tied up with Talia's idea of her own personhood and worth and achievement, which is why she piles on so many contradicting expectations on him - that he's fiercely independent but also stays by her side, become his father's perfect heir but take only her values, never be a pawn like she was, but align with her own wishes.

However you want to negotiate the racism of the way Talia is written is up to you obviously, but I feel that there's no realistic way that Talia can be a good mother (even in Son of the Demon she acted in Bruce's best interests, deceived him and abandoned her child, which actually might have been kinder than attempting to raise him in the LoA). I feel that making her one is an extremely simplistic way of dealing with the racialized misogyny her character is subjected to, and a disservice to real-life children of mothers like her, who love their children fiercely but perpetuate abuse cycles because of that very love.

For me, deconstructing and reaching past the misogyny and racism means humanising her and not making her value and sympathy as a character contingent on how good of a mother she is to Damian and Jason. Trauma and abuse slows or arrests your emotional development and makes it difficult to regulate your emotions and impulses, which is why it's a requirement for traumatized people to cognitively work on themselves in order to be good parents to their own children. Talia cannot. There's absolutely no therapist she can trust, the last time she felt close to someone she was decieved, tortured and brainwashed by her, and not only can't she get away from her father but she received a harsh object lesson from her sister on what happens when you try. This woman is a goddamn victim in every possible way, even more than Jason. It's also one of the reasons I don't buy that she allowed herself to be close to Jason, maternal feelings notwithstanding.

(Also her sleeping with him was pretty gross and unnecessary of Winick, whose writing is far from unproblematic when it comes to WoC, but it makes for a fascinating character deconstruction because afaik it happened right after Nyssa tortured her until she was brainwashed against Ra's and Bruce. So at that point in time she was basically in tatters and locked in the same self-destructive spiral as Jason, and maybe she wanted to nuke her sense of maternal care towards him in a bid to feel less emotionally vulnerable. I love this kind of psychological yarn balls in fiction.)

Absolutely none of this should absolve her choices. None of this means she's a good anything or that she should be seen as a purely sympathetic and wronged character. She's obscenely rich and powerful, ruthless, cunning and manipulative. She's one of the most dangerous people in the world. She's not fit to raise anyone. But if you can't accept all of that and square it with a fiercely loving heart and find a deeply human character then I really can't relate to you.

Let female characters of colour be human, morally grey and complex. Let fictional mothers be traumatized and deeply damaging without demonizing them. And stop moralizing female characters, I am begging you. We're far past Victorian England. Making them be on their best behaviour all the time to be sympathetic is oppressive as hell and not what storytelling is for.

#talia al ghul #ra's al ghul #son of the demon #anti Grant Morrison #parental abuse #abuse cycles #asian representation #women of colour #jason todd #red hood: the lost days #damian al ghul #damian wayne #misogyny #racism #death and the maidens #bat meta #dc meta #batfamily #dc comics #spite waffle

[vertigoartgore]

The final page of 2008's Final Crisis #4. Words by Grant Morrison, art by J.G. Jones (so the creative team behind the Marvel Boy limited series), colors by Alex Sinclair and lettering by Rob Leigh.

#darkseid #final crisis #jg jones #crisis #grant morrison #darkseid is #darkseid says #DC #dc comics #event #underrated #2008 #anti life equation #new gods #gladiator style #sentence #verdict #death #panel #comic books #splash page #Orion #superman #batman #JLA #apokolips #earth #invasion #bad guys wins #villain

[luciferz-morningstar]

my favorite hobby is pissing racists off<333

#stares at lizzie olsen stans #and talia al ghul antis #fuck the mcu #and grant morrison #and the fuck ton of racist writers out there #anti mcu wanda #anti mcu

[augustheart]

grant morrison’s invisibles is easily the most racist comic i have personally sat down to read and it has horrifying transmisogynistic elements and i don’t think we should let people get away with calling it an underrated classic.

the invisibles is morrison’s doom patrol if morrison’s doom patrol was creator-owned; it’s morrison’s doom patrol if they were allowed to make anti-black caricatures and conceits main features instead of just supporting characters (frenzy). it’s morrison’s doom patrol if they were allowed to show graphic sexual violence towards transgender people—though morrison’s doom patrol does, to be fair, show graphic sexual violence toward cis people. it’s every genuinely harmful aspect of morrison’s doom patrol boiled down to its purest essences and presented by someone going “it’s commentary to make one of the first villains of our comic a fat, short, balding man named gelt sacrificing the souls of innocent british children to insectoid overlords, right?”

it’s utterly nightmarish to see these things glossed over by morrison fans. later morrison’s writing was racist. previous morrison writing was racist. but the invisibles is so openly, proudly racist that it’s like chewing gravel.

#anti grant morrison #racism / #antisemitism / #transmisogyny / #anti-black racism / #rape m /

[emrosedeleon]

Every time I learn something about Elon Musk or one of his business, it's like being introduced to a Grant Morrison villain.

#anti capitalism #fuck Elon #anti Elon #Grant Morrison

[nepobabyeurydice]

yeah we made your fav female character an irredeemable bitch because she got in the way of our fav ship, and we just called it being critical and salty instead of bashing because she always had those traits, and we're not warping her into an unrecognizable form.

#fandom #fandom bullshit #looking at you anti-talia fuckers #find a hole and die we both know that grant morrison is a racist pos and all of his talia and ra's writing is shit