#Like this is what I'm talking about when I say Tim isn't the best Robin | Explore Tumblr Posts and Blogs

oifaaa · 1 year

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Tim watches ben Shapiro

Now hang on there Tim used to watch Ben shapiro we gotta recognise the little growth Tim has had as a character it reinforces good behaviour

#Ask #Anon #I'm still annoyed from reading that new batman issue ngl #It's just frustrating #Like this is what I'm talking about when I say Tim isn't the best Robin #If the only reason he's the best #Is bc you say the others were actually shit #With bullshit claims #Then your not developing what actually makes Tim Tim #And this is why #I would love to see more of #Tim only says he's the best #Bc if he stops telling himself that #He'll realise how average he is #And I love that #Cocky characters who actually use the bravado to hide their insecurities #Mmmm yes gimmie gimmie gimmie #But that's not gonna happen #When the very same writers are buying into the bullshit

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celaenaeiln · 2 months

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who do you think each bats' favourite sibling is canonically? i haven't seen much about this outside of super fanon stuff so i'm curious

Let's start with the easiest one!

Tim - Dick

Tim's favorite sibling but also favorite person ever is unquestionably, undoubtedly Dick. This boy adores his big brother. He's full-on obsessed with him.

His thoughts on Dick are just a compilation of praises about him and his inner dialogue simply consists of a series of hero worship.

Robin (1993) Issue #32

Red Robin Issue #23

Sometimes I ponder about Dick and Tim's relationship because I feel like what Tim wants from Dick isn't just a brother, I feel like he wants him to be a parent which is part of the reason why Tim and Damian don't get along.

Because the truth is, before Damian came along, Tim was Dick's robin first. And Tim loved it.

(This post was on hold for months because I needed that exact panel where Tim says to Dick "It's obvious he wants us to be the new batman and Robin." BuT i CaNt FiNd It. I literally give up, if anyone know what panel I'm referring to people reblog it with the panel and I'll upload it with the post)

Dick was Tim's Robin and everything he did he wanted to live up to him

Batman/Catwoman: The Gotham War: Scorched Earth

Look at what he says about Dick:

Batman: A Lonely Place of Dying

Even before Dick and Tim met again, Tim started working out just so he could be like his idol. Tim literally says to Dick "My grades are okay but I studied because I wanted to just like you."

You know what they say about idols and pedestals and never meeting your heroes? The opposite is true for Tim about Dick. After meeting Dick for the second time, his idol worship grew so much it shattered every ceiling in existence.

Tim loves him so so much. People sometimes misunderstand and think that Tim hated Dick when he fired him from Robin but it wasn't hate that Tim felt. It was jealousy. Jealousy over Dick choosing Damian over him.

Tim even solely used the Red Robin persona for the mere reason that he didn't want to dirty Dick's Robin by stigmatizing it with his less ethical actions.

Damian - Dick

Obviously. The only reason I said Tim was the easiest is because Tim's inner and outer thoughts about Dick can be complied to create volumes of fanbooks of flowing poetry about him. Damian on the other hand is more of a tsundere, but there's still only one person who he loves aside from his father and even more than.

Robin War Issue #1

If there were any doubts, I don't think this panel could be any clearer about who Damian's favorite is.

Stephanie - Cass

Batgirl (2000) Issue #38

Cass - Stephanie

Batgirls (2016) Issue #14

Damn.

Steph and Cass are each other's favorites

Detective Comics (1937) Issue #945

Duke - noone? everyone?

Like actually I can't pick out one person Duke likes the best. You're either on his wavelength or he's snarking you off it. He's the type of guy where everyone likes him and he's chilling by himself, doing whatever he wants.

Jason - Dick

Out of the batkids who did deal with Jason during his worst phase, Dick is unilaterally his favorite. Sometimes when I think about Jason's relationship with Bruce, I'm reminded of how much Jason and Bruce are alike sometimes because Jason's view on Dick is almost identical to Bruce's view on Dick and they even have similar reactions. We all know that Bruce hero-worships Dick. Time and time again, Bruce emphasizes, stresses, and talks about how amazing Dick is and how he's so much better than him, and constantly places Dick on a pedestal. The issue comes when Dick doesn't want to do what Bruce wants him to do because he believes that Dick is an extension of himself, his better half, and he's furious when Dick doesn't follow or accept what he's doing because Dick should know what Bruce is trying to do because he's supposed to be better than him, how dare he stop him, etc.

Jason acts in similar ways to Dick. There's a whole issue where Jason gets fear gassed and one of his biggest fears is Dick. More specifically, it's about how amazing Dick is and never living up to him because in Jason's eyes, Dick is absolutely perfect. There is no one better than him because he is the peak of everything. He places Dick on the highest pedestal there is and he kind of safeguards Dick there in his heart. He used to get really angry because he believes Dick is the best but also refuses to let Dick be anything other than the best. The best way I have to explain them is Jason holding Dick prisoner as a result of his hero worship.

Once Jason is slightly calmer, his relationship dynamics with everyone became really clear, as well as what he thinks of them and it's shown how the way he treats Dick is just different.

Task Force Z Issue #8

Grayson Issue #12

"You don't do that to your--you don't do that to another Robin!"

He was going to say brother 🥺🥺

In this scene, it's pretty obvious that Jason loves Dick a lot but he's obviously not going to be all fuzzy feelings about it because he likes to be edgy. Jason's a little confusing in general for people to understand because they expect him to be nice and open but Jason's not nice, he's just nicer to the people he likes. Once we start understanding that, he becomes clearer.

And to Dick -

Nightwing (2016) Issue #15

-He's exceptionally nicer.

DC's Ghouls Just Wanna Have Fun Issue #1

Another example of why Jason loves Dick the most is because in the comics, Jason doesn't work with anyone in the family unless he has to unless it's Dick because he chooses to work with Dick by choice.

Dick - Tim or Damian

Dick adores Tim so freaking much. He loves him so, so much.

Nightwing (1996) Issue #139

Catch me crying behind my sunglasses at Dick kissing Tim's head lovingly 😭

Robin (1993) Issue #12

I just love these soft touch moments Dick has with Tim. It's so incredibly sweet.

He was Tim's mentor

The New Titans (1988) Issue #65

and a really good one too.

He loves him-

Detective Comics (1937) Issue #696

-so much.

(I'd add more panels but I ran out of image space :'0)

I genuinely cannot say who he loves more at all. I can't even pick. I really do think he loves them evenly because when I think about leaning one side, more evidence comes to mind for the other side like a pair of counter weights.

Damian...I don't really need to say any words because the pictures speak for themselves

Batman (2016) Issue #34

Grayson Issue #12

aldskjdhkdjfhldfah;dh. Look at what he gave his son! A souvenir from the first time his dad met his mom because Dick knows how much Damian loves his parents <333!! There's nothing I can even say more.

Here's my previous post on Dick and Damian's relationship.

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avisisisis · 1 year

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DC headcanons but you can tell who's my favorite

For some reason Wally cries everytime he eats chicken nuggets with the Titans

Not even Wally knows why this happens

It's only with the original Titans. No one else. They have a rule that says Wally isn't allowed to eat chicken nuggets when he's around them because they all hate to see him cry

Iris sleeptalks. Barry sometimes has full conversations that make no sense with her at four in the morning

Hal has a video that lasts 40 minutes saved on every single piece of technology he has. It's about Iris (who was asleep) and Barry (very much awake, but probably delusional) arguing about whether koalas are evil or not

Tim had a Tumblr blog where he posted photos of Batman and Robin that looked like they were taken from very close angles

Jason follows it. One time he was complaining that his favorite blog hadn't posted anything in years. When Tim asked him to show him what account it was, he panicked, tried to run away, hit his head and passed out from exhaustion

Jason is still confused about that, but no matter how much he insists, Tim refuses to give his secret away

Wally has a deep hatred for Dora the Explorer

The Young Justice once ran away to a different country for a whole month and refused to acknowledge it when they came back

Iris, Barry and Hal are all dating. Barry didn't realize it at first though (Hal didn't either)

Barry was really panicking over the fact that he seemed to be in love with his best friend when he's already married

Hal was really panicking over the fact that he was in love with his best friend who is already married

Iris thought they were all just poly. They had a very long conversation after she realized none of them knew about polyamorous relationships

Wally and Dick, even though they both have their own romantic partners, are soulmates in every universe (can be seen as romantic or platonic)

Wally once got both him and Dick (as Flash and Nightwing) banned from a cafe. Dick wasn't even there

He accidentally knocked a candle and burned the table down

But what actually got them banned was commenting to the very homophobic owner that “I don't have a major opinion on that Nightwing guy besides of the fact that he gives some really good blowjobs” (they never even fucked)

In Wally's defense, he was really unstable at the moment, and he panicked

Of course, people filmed it. And, of course, it went viral. Now all of his friends quote him on that all the time

Technically they're not banned anymore because the cafe's owner changed, but he's still too embarrassed to go so he ignores that

All speedsters are constantly vibrating, some being more obvious than others, due to the fact that being still is... really fucking difficult because of everything being slower for them

Bart's the most noticeable one. If you pay enough attention you'll notice that you can sometimes see a little bit of lightning coming out of his body

The vibrations causes them to do a low rumbling sound that isn't exactly snoring when they're sleeping. What I'm saying is that they purr

Linda was thrilled when she found out

None of the speedsters are aware of this and no one plans on telling them

One time the YJ were talking and Bart interrupted them so Tim turned around to face him and said “Cerra el orto” (shut your mouth in Spanish. The literal translation would be “shut your ass” but that sounds weird in English) in a really high pitched voice. Now the entire team quotes him on that almost everyday

Diana almost dropped a car on Bruce once and now she sometimes says stuff like “I should've let that car kill you” when he's doing something particularly stupid

The rest of the JL quotes it too. It is very common to hear the phrase “I wish Diana had dropped that car” in the Watchtower

Kori once blew up the kitchen because she thought something was climbing on her leg. It was her hair

The original Titans have a monthly meetup. It doesn't matter what kind of beef some of the members have with each other at the moment, they'll still meet. It's an unspoken rule

Hartley was Linda's best man in her and Wally's wedding

That's where him and Dick met

They now share embarassing stories about Wally. They're not really friends and they don't talk, like, at all, but they still send each other videos of Wally falling on his face almost everyday

Depression, just like ADHD, is something that almost all speedsters have, but it's almost unnoticeable because they always hide it, mostly using their superspeed to do it

Green lanterns and speedsters bond over starting to glow at the worst possible moments

Wally absolutely despises the smell of cinnamon

His parents's house smelled like that due to his mom being obssessed with adding cinnamon to every meal they ate, so it reminds him too much of the terrible childhood he had because of them

You can't really blame him for leaving social events when he smells cinnamon

Bruce has a video of Hal starting crying after Barry said “I think giraffes shouldn't be real” that he uses as blackmail sometimes

Barry's actual weakness is puns, he can't stop saying stuff like “I'll be there in a flash” and then winking like he knows something you don't. It's gonna get him in trouble someday

The YJ all have Tumblr accounts

Dick and Donna used to call each other the “Wonder Twins” so now Cassie and Tim are the Wonder Twins of their generation

The og Titans once followed Batman everywhere playing Superman by Eminem because he made Dick upset

Barry looks like he's about to cry all the time and he has no idea why

When the League revealed their identities to each other everyone was confused over why he was crying

It took him a while to convince everyone that that's just what his face looks like

He always looks like he's about to cry so when he's actually going to cry it's pretty obvious. And he hates it

When Wally and Barry first met and Wally started to talk about the Flash, he made a joke about how he always came to help “in a flash”. Now Barry repeats that joke all the time

Wally hates himself for being the reason why the ‘in a flash’ jokes started

When Barry makes a joke and Wally complains, Barry answers with “You were the one that created the joke, Wally. Live with the consequences”

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sicariodechinchulines · 7 months

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Damijon headcanon: Dami doesn't flirt, he COURTS.

•We tend to forgot WHERE and HOW Damian was raised. He just doesn't get the concept "Highschool sweetheart". when he first mentioned that, they were at a gala.

"-Im not interested on playdates, that's a waste of time.-" and they nodded because that's SOOO him, but then... "-If someone is interested on my being and dare to ask for my hand, I expect them to be ready for marriage. If not, then is just to be mean a ephemeral game that I won't even bother to remember, they shouldn't either."

Unnecessary to say that reporters we're so fucking excited with that response, so much that they didn't notice Dick Grayson hanging from a chandelier.

• and yes, he had a girlfriend before, even shared some kisses with other ladies and acted like a gentleman for them, but the truth is: he didn't take them seriously.

• Dami was ready for living alone and single, that's not the big deal, but Jon appeared again, and things started to get weird... in an amusing and warming way. Jon was now a mature good looking man, strong and good-natured as always. The little naive and childish boy was gone, and now was a man; a man worthy of his attention, in any areas.

• Without saying ANYTHING about his feels, he started to court Jon in the way he learned was appropriate, the problem is: Jon Kent is not a lady.

AND IS NEITHER SINGLE.

• Flowers, luxurious gifts and expensive jewelry. People started to suspect if Jon became some type of sugar baby for Damian, but when is questioned, Jon unsuspecting, answer "I don't know, rich people are weird"

• yes, people, Damian does HOLD the doors open for Jon, while ignoring the people behind, usually ending on them smashing their faces with the door.

• They rarely travel on cars, but when they do, Dami open the door for him; the bats are BEWILDERED by that.

• Needless to say that Jay DOES want to beat the shit out of him. (I don't blame him, if a sort of Arabic prince- heir of one of the biggest fortune in the world- a fucking Robin is trying to conquer MY boyfriend, I would love to beat the shit out of him too.)

Even if he's mad at him, don't see the point on competing with a child, because after all he's not even 15.

• Everyone knows that this boy is weird in SOOO many ways, but waiting 4 years until the object of your courtship is legally able to touch you, is little to much... even for Superman, who lost his virginity in his late twenties.

• Clark never say anything about that matter, first because he doesn't want to feed rumors, and second..

Because if he ADMIT that he would be okay with Damian marrying his son, Batman will KILL HIM.

•Even if he is worried about the future that Damian and Jon hold as best friends or partners, he can't denied that Damian devotion to Jon is cute.

Sorry but Clark is a hopeless romantic who loves his wife DEEPLY

(and he doesn't like Jay at all, he doesn't knows him as much he would like, neither is happy with the amount of info about his son that is on internet now thanks to jay's activism... but this ray of sunshine don't talk about that because, wHAT IF HE IS BEING HOMOPHOBIC OR SOMETHING?? Don't want to stress his boy with that.)

• after the SHOW Damian Wayne gave at that gala talking about his expectations on a partner and the PROPER way of courtship, the rumors about the younger Wayne being a heartbreaker like his father were over. NOW, they love to talk about how amazing and romantic Damian would be as a boyfriend.

When in an interview, a reporter mentioned Tim Drake-Wayne the titular "The teens dream: A prince like Damian Wayne. His thoughts about dating and how court a lady" he dissociated for 1 whole minute.

• the worst-best come now. Still hanging from that titular a journalist did DARE to ask about PRE-MARITAL SEX. (yes, Bruce demanded that journalist, yes, Bruce won.)

"- Isn't obvious? I'm against it, at least for myself. I don't find shame on waiting the proper person to lost your virginity with... even if I fall in love with SOMEONE who isn't virgin anymore, I'll wait anyway."

And yes, that was a hint for Jon. Jon didn't get it, but the press did.

It was funny how teen boys were so spiteful towards him and how teen girls were so delighted. Damian set the bar so high for Gotham boys.

• even with all the gifts and flowers and food, Jon is the ONLY ONE who don't notice. His mother did, his father did, Batman, Redhood, RedRobin and Nightwing DID, even StARFIRE AND THAT'S A LOT. a night after a mission she just said "Correct me if I'm wrong... but the little Robin is courting Superman according his culture standards, isn't?" And the whole Bat Boys just stared.

"That's adorable... a little gentleman!"

• They usually cuddle. It was hard for Jon getting used to it after YEARS gone, but Damian was weirdly okay with it, even pleased Jon can say.

But there was something unsettling. He don't cuddle him as before, instead he do it in a way that makes Jon feel incredibly conscious about himself, but safe anyway.

Damian does it on purpose, holding Jon head close to his chest when they are on the couch, caressing the side of Jon's jaw and lightly touching his temple.

If Jon is being lucky and Damian too tired, he will press his nose against his curls and close his eyes, answering anything with a lazy "mmh"

• Bruce is worried. He's not Clark, he's not tHAT optimistic. He knows his son and how unhinged and dangerous he can be, and see this said devotion as a time bomb. What if Jon is not that good??? Or Damian manage to CONQUER the teen's heart and decide to guide him into a darker path???? Jon probed that he can DIE for him in most of one occasion, Damian is starting to act the same and is unsettling.

Sorry if isn't readable, my mother language is Spanish and i learned English from comics, translator and weirdly poetic AO3 p0rn. If you're that kind, please point out my mistakes or care to give me an advice so I can better my grammar, ty so much!!!!

#damijon headcanon #damian wayne #damijon #jon kent #superman #jonathan kent #damian al ghul #headcanon #dc robin #dc comics #dc headcanon #jondami #jondami headcanon

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suzukiblu · 8 months

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WIP snippets: Tim/Kon!!! :)

"You told Arrowette you'd be a good boy while she was gone, didn't you?" Robin reminds him, licking his lips, and oh no, Kon thinks with no small amount of dread. "So be good for me."

"That is really not what she meant by that," Kon says hopefully not as feebly as he feels like he's saying it. Just–hopefully.

"She did explicitly say you should make out with me," Robin also reminds him. Kon is very, very uncomfortable with this situation. In several ways, is Kon uncomfortable with this situation.

"Yeah, well, that's because you're currently all jacked up on love spell mind control or whatever and think you want me to," he says. "Not actually a great makeout motivator, in my personal opinion."

"I might be. Or maybe I just wanted everyone else to leave the two of us alone for a little while," Robin murmurs lowly, which is admittedly something he would be insane enough to do, actual literal freak that he is, but also Kon isn't completely stupid, thanks.

"You definitely are," he says.

"Don't you like the attention, kid?" Robin says coaxingly, stroking a hand down his cheek, and Kon grimaces a little bit more than he wants to let himself grimace.

"Dude," he says. "I know you're kinda compromised right now but could you not be an asshole about me being–whatever, never mind, just–"

Robin . . . frowns, faintly. His fingers still against Kon's face.

"About you being what?" he asks.

"Just–I know I'm easy, alright, you don't have to rub it in," Kon says just a little tightly, and tries not to grit his teeth. Although yeah, well, that whole thing does explain why bespelled/drugged/whatever Robin picked him of all people to fixate on. Obviously. Bat-training and all, going for the weak link. Just . . .

He wishes it didn't, he guesses.

That's all.

"Superboy," Robin says, still just barely frowning.

"Look, it's fine, I mean obviously that's why you picked me to jump, just–" Kon says, and struggles to say, and just . . . and just . . . "I don't care if you think I'm a whore or whatever. Just please stop saying things you think will get me to be fucked up enough to literally assault you, okay?"

"I picked you because you're my favorite," Robin says.

Kon . . . blinks.

"What?" he says.

"You're my favorite," Robin says. "And I trust you. You'll make it good. You won't hurt me."

"Shut up," Kon chokes, because yeah, Robin lies all the time, but that lie . . .

That's not fucking fair.

Not that lie.

"You're my best friend," Robin tells him softly, stroking his face again.

Kon wants to kill somebody. Ideally whoever fucked up Robin's brain on the mind control maybe-drugs, but maybe he won't be that picky, if it actually comes down to it.

"I don't even know what you look like without that mask on," he says. "Or your name. Or anything about you that isn't superhero shit."

"And you're my best friend," Robin repeats.

Kon might tell him how absolutely fucking depressing that sounds, but it's not like he has room to talk about having a non-hero life. That is pretty much the literal opposite of what he has room to talk about, in fact.

"You're my best friend too," is what he's stupid enough to say instead, even though Robin's just lying to him because he's all fucked up right now and would probably say any stupid thing that'd get him goddamn laid. "And I'm definitely not gonna hurt you."

"I know," Robin says, and smiles, and leans down to kiss him.

Kon lets him.

Then he gets his TTK around the grapple line wrapping him up and fucking snaps it around Robin's body while the other's distracted.

"Ah!" Robin hisses. Kon shoves him off his lap; keeps a grip on the grapple line and Robin both with his TTK. Keeps him still with his TTK.

He fucking hates that Robin smiled at him like that when it was a lie.

#timkon #dc robin #superboy #tim drake #kon el #young justice #rinfic #trashcat813 #dubious consent #wip: love potion number nine

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clementianos-blog · 1 month

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From the beginning, Tim and Steph had a kind of chemistry in their lack of chemistry. They were very different - backgrounds, perspectives, family influences, etc. About all they had in common was that they were only children with family troubles, but even those similarities were abundantly different once you scratched the surface even a tad.

But what I find interesting, and seriously questionable, is how their actual relationship comes about. Steph repeatedly makes choices that aren't the best while "trying to help" and Tim repeatedly has to correct her. He's more-or-less acting like a conscience to her. I guess you could look at this as being that strong part of Tim's personality that drives him to help others. It's why he's Robin. Unlike his predecessors (and successors), the main reason he became Robin was to help Batman; helping everyone else was a secondary (and Batman's primary). To Batman, Tim's Robin is the "I'll help you so you can help everyone else." It's ingrained into him to see the shortcomings of others and he intrinsically wants to help.

There are multiple moments in which Steph is ready to walk away from a lowlife thug who is vulnerably facing certain death - and Tim explains why they need to help. But that's a major theme in the Batman comics in general, so it doesn't really fit the bill of what we're talking about here in a way that is unique to Steph and Tim.

But this does:

Steph is willing to steal two Zesti sodas from a convenience store after she and Tim cleared out the bad guys. He sees no problem in taking the Zestis as long as they will be compensating the store for them rather than stealing. He probably thinks "we COULD go to another, open store, but I'd rather help this one out" or even "best to be seen as little as possible" etc. It doesn't really matter. What matters is that he anticipates that she's thinking about stealing them. He asks "this your treat?" to put the burden on her since she was the one who offered to pick them up.

This could also be his subtle and not-enough way of pushing the "this is not a date" vibes he's been lazily humming out at her lately. Which brings us to the scene that follows this directly:

Tim has been emotionally cheating on Ariana for quite some time, relying on Steph for the emotional pick-me-ups and help-me-outs as well as leading her on. He's reflected on this a few times and even tried to do something about it several times before this point. But here, he is pretty open about his resignation.

This is the kind of thing teens do a lot - really, everyone does it at some point or another. We redefine our understanding of the world, of our morals, of our personal resolve to suit what feels nice. Exactly this is why it's a very good piece of advice to write down your goals in distinct, objective terms and keep them visible to you when you make them. If you say you aren't eating sweets for a month, be specific about what that means. If sugar in your coffee is an allowance, then say so. If desserts, pastries, jams and jellies, and candy are not allowed, then say so. Without being specific... we start to think things like "Well, a blueberry muffin isn't really a sweet (even though this one is covered in sugar crystals and tastes sweeter than the candybar I had last month)."

I'm not really cheating on Ariana. I haven't held Steph's hand. I haven't kissed - er, I haven't intentionally kissed Steph.

The problem is often that we don't see the danger of this stage. Just like Steph saw no danger in stealing two Zestis from the convenience store, Tim sees no danger in letting Steph treat their outings as dates. It's just a buck. It's just a game. It's not serious. No one's getting hurt by it.

And this is a problem for the exact reason Tim gives Steph.

What Steph did was so small, so simple, and seemingly so harmless. The shopkeeper probably would have handed them a case of Zestis each for what they did. But the shopkeeper isn't there.

Steph has Tim here to help her understand why it's wrong to compromise even an inch of her integrity.

What Tim is doing is so much worse. SO much worse. There is no justification, no excuse, and no good reason other than "this makes me happy right now."

But unlike Steph, Tim doesn't have a... well... Tim to put it in perspective. To help him see why it's wrong. Why it starts like this, and soon he'll be bending all the rules.

Instead, Tim has a Steph who is the one dragging him into this quagmire where he's blatantly cheating on his girlfriend and cannot see it for what it is.

And yes, it's clear he can see that it's wrong - just like Steph knew that taking the sodas wasn't really right. But just like with the sodas, neither of them recognized the action for what it truly was: stealing/cheating. Once put into that context, Steph immediately pays. If it were simplified like that to Tim, he would cut it off. The end. No more. I'll either say goodbye to Ariana, or I'll say goodbye to Steph.

But he sees something else: he feels happiness, he sees two happy girls, and he thinks, "No one's getting hurt here. It's not really right but it's not like I'm, you know..."

It starts like that. And soon you're bending all the rules.

TimSteph has a lot of positive qualities to it, but the fact that Steph's a project of Tim's - to build into an upstanding citizen from the rough place she's been raised - means that he needs to stay in the role of her pillar of morality. If he doesn't, as we see, then he falls himself.

Tim managed to say no to the Zesti, but the apple was just too tempting.

#timsteph #tim drake #stephanie brown #robin 3 #spoiler #dc spoiler #dc comics #comic excerpts #comic analysis #character analysis #robin 1993

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veryace-ficrecs · 10 days

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Duke Thomas Fic Recs

This list will include all ratings and tags, so read at your own discretion! :)

Stuck-On Sunshine by zodarii_dae - Rated G

The Signal tends to interact with kids a bit more than his nocturnal coworkers. Even in Gotham, there are more kids out at two pm than two am. Those kids want to show their appreciation for the hero keeping them safe. What better way to show that than with stickers?

A Special Expection? No, A Son by Raccoonwriter - Rated T

Duke was excited to meet the Justice League until they start to ask and talk about things Duke didn't want to here.

breathing down your neck by Batbirdies - Rated G

Duke gets sick on Friday. Joker breaks out of Arkham on Saturday. It’s radio silence, until it’s not. — When Duke is benched with the flu the Joker attacks a small Gotham neighborhood with Joker venom. Duke knows he’s not well enough to help, but with stinging memories of his parents still trapped in their own heads—he has to do something. Bruce has a few things to say about that.

Frightening, But Not Afraid by snackbaskets - Rated G

When the family is hit by a new strain of fear toxin, safety is in numbers. Unfortunately, three members of the flock are still out there, afraid and alone. Bruce may not be the best at comforting his children, but apparently, he can let his wings do the talking. ((aka, the classic fear toxin hurt/comfort but with a splash of the classic wings-make-u-feel-safe hurt/comfort))

birds and brothers and other assorted synonyms by hoebiwan - Rated T

Duke isn’t an idiot. He knows it’s a bad idea to go into the underground tunnels of Gotham where people disappear for years on end and occasionally (if they’re lucky) stumble out coated in cobwebs and madness and blood. So he takes a flashlight and a water bottle and a bag of trail mix and lots and lots of beef jerky whenever he goes. If he ends up trapped down there, wandering in hopeless circles (which Duke thinks is important to note having never happened), at least he’ll have food. Also, the weird little kid dressed up like a miniature Talon likes the M&M’s in Duke’s trail mix.

the scientific method by orphan_account - Rated G

5 stupid ways Duke's siblings discovered how his powers worked, and 1 time he figured it out for himself.

"You have no idea," Dick said. "I had to live through all of their teenage years. They were each independently obsessed with Mythbusters at separate points in their life. I'm pretty sure Cass and Tim have wanted a meta to experiment on since they were 14, but Bruce always said no."

Duke Thomas Hates Bullies by Gemini_00 - Not Rated

Everyone loves that Duke Thomas isn't like all those other crazy Waynes. Everyone loves that the Signal isn't trying to get himself killed. Duke may not see Bruce as his dad, but he is definitely part of the bat family. and nobody is going to bully his family. Or, Duke Thomas Kicks Ass.

Keep Your Head, Your Backbone, and Your Heart by MrMich - Rated T

The last thing that Duke expected on what was supposed to be just a regular patrol was being suddenly thrown five years into the past, coming face to face with a darker, more violent Batman than the one he knew, a broken family, and a Tim who was a foot shorter than Duke, and not even Robin yet.

A silent shadow flitted past him, just barely visible on the cave walls. He went rigid, tracking the shadow in the corner of his vision. And then he dropped to the floor, just in time, as a familiar black gloved fist passed overhead. He just barely missed being hit by the punishing blow that would have landed right on his temple for a sure concussion if he hadn’t dodged. “Batman?” Duke yelled. He somersaulted forward, just barely avoiding another strike. “B, what are you doing?!” “Who are you,” came the growled response. A shiver crawled down Duke’s spine at the grim hostility in Batman’s voice that promised violence, and something tightened in the back of his throat.

WHEN EARTH FINDS STARS. by orpheusaki - Rated G

"Let it be known that I completely detest the implications of what this situation is mirroring," Red Hood grumbles to himself and it's the longest string of words Duke has heard from any so-called Gotham vigilante, let alone the one who's known for shooting more than he is talking. "The fuck?" Duke mutters, because if he's already going to die, he might as well try and make sense of it. "I'm not going to care about whatever sob story you have," is what Red Hood replies with instead of explaining, "Where are your parents?" "Gone," is all Duke says, because it's really none of this guy's business. It's also the truth. Somehow, Red Hood sounds even more anguished about this information than Duke is, "Ah shit." (Duke steals the tires off Red Hood's bike and somehow gains a family.)

Leadership by PepperSoniRoni - Rated G

Nightwing offers Signal a chance to lead a small group for a mission. Duke is wary, but accepts the challenge. He proves to be a rather great leader.

Takes place after Season Two of Young Justice, and ignores Season Three (I still haven’t seen it, unfortunately).

You Would Not Believe Your Eyes by Tiptapricot - Rated G

No metas are allowed in Gotham, so what does that mean for Duke?

Dayshift Shadow Work by IzzyMRDB - Rated G

So, when he realised one day once he looked down that he was missing his shadow, the first thing he checked was to make sure he wasn’t also glowing. Can’t have a shadow if you’re the light source after all. Nope, not glowing. Weird. AKA Duke's shadow works like Peter Pan's and immediately chooses violence

Runs in the Family by motleyfam - Rated G

Duke has a migraine and just wants a bit of peace. Tim understands this better than most.

The League of Assassins: An Indepth Exploration of the World's Most Prolific Group of Assassins by Hint_of_Elation - Rated T

Duke Thomas presents a documentary about the League of Assassins. Warning: Bruce Wayne did not approve this film.

Tequila by Sohotthateveryonedied - Rated T

Bruce steps into Duke’s path, blocking him from venturing further into the house. It takes a moment for Duke to register the new obstacle before him. His mouth drags into a lopsided grin. “Bruce! Wha’s—wassup? How’s your night goin’?” “You’re drunk," Bruce accuses. “Me? No way. No way. I would never do that.” Duke hiccups. “Totally sober.”

Who, Me? by Listentothelittlebird - Rated T

People thought Duke was the responsible one. People often forgot Duke ran with a gang. A gang named after Robin, sure, but a gang nonetheless.

bathtub cookie crumbs by ghostellie - Rated G

Duke finds him in a bathtub on the third floor. It’s an old fashioned thing, a clawfoot porcelain tub settled in an otherwise empty room in a far, abandoned corner of the manor, dusty despite Alfred’s best efforts. Tim’s seated at an awkward angle, sideways in the tub with his head rested on one edge and his knees slung over the other, fully clothed and half covered in dust. A pink box of sugar cookies, no doubt stolen from Jason’s stash, rests on his chest. He meets Duke’s eyes as he enters, shoveling a bat-shaped cookie in his mouth.

Duke Thomas VS The "Good Child" Stereotype by PepperSoniRoni - Rated T

5 Times Duke Tried To Prove To Bruce He Wasn't The Responsible One, and 1 Time His Siblings Knew Better (& used it to their advantage) Because Duke is relatively new, he hasn't opened up completely to the family. He tries to follow Bruce and Alfred's rules, but he doesn't always succeed (nor try to). It's during these times Bruce still manages to pin the blame on someone else. His siblings, of course, see this. And whatever are they supposed to think? Well, Duke's clearly doing it on purpose! (This is really just me being salty about fanon characterization, and an attempt to cram as much Crazy-Totally-Not-Sane-Duke as I can into a single fic)

that which you cannot bear by britishparty - Rated T

There is no backup for the Signal. Duke reminds himself of this regularly, like a prayer through gritted teeth: there's no one to catch him if he slips, to replace him if he stops. So the Signal can't give up. Just can't, like an immutable law, an undeniable truth. He has to win every fight. There isn't any other option. Duke Thomas makes himself invincible. Untouchable. Then he loses.

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temperamentalaquarius · 2 months

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so what do i have to offer to get a post with a scathing comparison of fanon Tim and canon Tim? 😂 this is an official request! the amount of cardboard cutout & self-insert Tim ocs i have found in the fanfics… it’s been really bothering me lately and your “bitch i might wing” posts give me life

I'm glad ur enjoying my descent, I am too ha ha!!

And boy do I agree with you. Tim is juuust white and twinky enough(but not nearly as much as fanon Tim enjoyers seem to think) on first spec for a lot of ppl to project on, so he gets...idk let's call it diluted. Short answer is that canon Tim would drop kick fanon Tim for speaking about Jack Drake the way he does.

Long rambling analysis is that fanon Tim leans into his time as Red Robin(because it's the only Tim comic they've read IF they've read it) which was more supposed to be a story of how someone behaves when they are so deep in their grief that they literally can't see which way is up than a display of how Tim normally behaves and thinks. Everything else is just kind of.. assumed filler based off of what his wiki says. As a result Tim gets written as this shy, spineless, borderline megalomaniac child who is ignored and undervalued when in 85% of canon he's the complete opposite(nu52 Tim is a blight). Where fanon Tim is a genius prodigy, canon Tim is the average smart kid with a big mouth who chose to be a hero. He had to contend with the knowledge and fear that he is not on the level of the other heroes and adapts to it by bringing antagonists to his level instead of meeting them where they are. He's interesting because he literally has to think differently but he's written as Bruce junior for some reason.

Also, unlike most of the batfam, he has(or had) strong ties to his civilian life, and had to find a way to balance them, something that is completely ignored in fanon when that was his appeal in the first fucking place. Instead, fanon warps his parents into these grotesquely neglectful charicatures to justify the truth of Red Robin when again, Red Robin was about grief through the lens of an unreliable narrator. Jack and Janet were just... parents? They were neglectful in the way that any teenage superhero's parents have to be so that they can be a superhero on the DL, and he loved them. Taking that away takes away the impact of their deaths on him, and strips away yet another element of his character. Also, I literally cannot overstate the impact that Steph had in Tim's life. Because ppl want to ship him with other male characters, their formative and thematically integral relationship gets tossed to the side along with all of the nuance that came with it.

Because I can't stop talking I also think that fanon Tim is also probably tied with Dick when it comes to suffering from the poor attempt at TMNTing of the robins- i.e. Dick is the face, Jason's the angry one, Tim's the smart one, and Damian's the fighty one while Steph&Duke don't exist because I guess there aren't any more one word traits to assign them. Tim is very smart, yes, but hes not the smartest(because obviously area of expertise is a factor) or the best detective of the Robins- and DEF not the smartest of the Batfam by any measure of intelligence- and it certainly isn't his defining feature like fandom wants ppl to think. He's got other things to him that are more interesting.

I just blacked out for 15 minutes, is this anything?

#tim drake #bitch i might wing #sorry this may be late I don't know when you sent this and I don't check my inbox nearly as much as I should #but this was rlly fun thank u for the ask!! 💕

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discocandles · 4 months

Text

I know I'm not the first person to say this but if Steve harrington is any popular superhero, he's Batman, right?

Like yes there's the fun shit like haha nail bat, Batman. Both are rich boys who take in a crazy amount of children like it's their favorite hobby, both have a bitchy, playboy personas which they use to keep people from looking too deep, because they have to be that hollow, vapid, and bullshit. Big house, no parents?

I know that it isn't exact given Steve's parents are alive(presumably), but I know for a fact i'm not crazy here. Both guys live in luxury, but for some reason or another, their parents are gone. And the only thing they've left behind is their obscene amounts of riches. Like that makes up for having your parents in your life. It kinda left both of them with this anger that they have utilized, sometimes against other people, and always when they fight legitimate threats. And overall they try to be a good person even if they often tend to be haunted by their mistakes.

If you want to get a little meta with it, both work with a character who was originally planned as a love interest for them but is now canonically a lesbian because it makes their characters more compelling. Though Steve and Robin are on far better terms than Bruce and Kate are(doesn't take much for that. iykyk)

Also they have a partner in crime(read:fighting) named Robin if that counts for anything. Sometimes more than one for Bruce but eh. The guy's been around for 85, almost 86 years now, compared to Steve who's been around for like 7. Im taking liberties here.

Speaking of the role of Robin, trying to fit the party into the batfamily is a task and a half. Like I guess Dustin would have to be dick and max could work as Steph, but would that make Lucas Tim? Suzie could be Babs, that would make sense. Wait, am I making mike jason? It's a mess and my brain is on fire. The only ones i feel a little bit confident about is that Erica would be Damian, el would be cassie and Will would be Duke. Before you ask, no I don't know how Nancy, Jonathan, Alfred, or the other adults would fit in here but I have a side tangent to entertain y'all with instead.

Yes, I do think that this would make eddie Superman. Yes I think it fits quite well.

Listen, from what I do know of Eddie's backstory(I have not read flight of Icarus), it could be matched with Clark's. Boy is sent away from parents to live somewhere else and is taking in by someone who becomes their parent(s) wholeheartedly, no matter the fact he is different from the other kids. And then when they try to live their life as best they can with those differences. Something happens that gets a while city's population looking at them, and a notable member of the community wanting them killed or arrested because of how "dangerous he is".

Listen even if I'm being a little conspiracy board-esque about eddie as clark kent, the parallels of Jason Carver and Lex Luthor are plain as day. Jason is more of a religious bigot compared to Lex's capitalist xenophobia, but these two green and white bitch-asses mirror each other. Also the religious imagery for both Eddie and Superman is off the fucking charts(like Eddie is seen as a demon by the mobs and Superman is seen as a god. And both are feared for it)

I can talk more about this, but I'm already scared that I have said too much.

#like please tell me y'all see it #I keep trying to connect stranger things and dc and this one made the most sense to me. so far #steve harrington #bruce wayne #stranger things #batman #robin buckley #kate kane #batfamily #the party #ngl Nancy would be a way better batwoman than Robin but I had to mention the 'assigned love intrest to lesbian aunt' pipeline #the Byers twins as Duke and cass is something that can be so personal #also the Sinclair siblings as the 2 that are trying to stab each other all the time is so real #eddie munson #clark kent #Superman #also if Eddie were to come back that would be prime Christ figure energy. and Superman gets a lot of Christlike symbolism #lex luthor #jason carver

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kiragecko · 3 months

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What if the reason Tim seems to like Jason is that Jason acknowledges Tim was better at Robin then Jason? Being the second best Robin matters to his pride.

Okay, I have to work through a few things before I respond directly.

-

So, everything related to canon resurrected Jason is a problem. Including how canon Tim interacts with him.

There are very few signs that preboot Tim likes or respects Jason after his resurrection. Which is WEIRD. Especially HOW Tim disrespects Jason.

Like, Tim doesn't get the rest of the Titans to watch, walk back to someone, and kick them in the crotch. That ... isn't his form of petty? He doesn't LIKE having an audience! And one of his most unique Robin traits is the respect he shows unstable villains and allies! Like, the way he shut down Jason's 'tenderize the teen gangs' plan is ... wrong. He would be MUCH more likely to seem to go along with it and then slip handcuffs on Jason once he relaxes. Or turn him into a temporary ally against Ulysses.

Tim is consistently out-of-character when dealing with resurrected Jason, and I haven't figured out a Watsonian explanation that works for me. Until I do, I'm forced to rewrite most of canon - the events happened, but MY Tim responded differently.

-

Canon Jason's reactions to Tim make a bit more sense. Jason seems to like and respect Tim. He tries to work with him. He left Titan's Tower impressed and wishing he'd had the same supports. (Though his understanding of what supports each of them had is baffling enough that I suspect some amount of amnesia.) I'm not sure he ever says he thinks Tim is a BETTER Robin, but I can see that being possible.

-

So, your supposition is possible for canon Jason. It seems very unlikely for canon Tim, but canon Tim's actions are even more unlikely, so that doesn't mean much. Our final problem comes with squaring this idea with my FANON Tim.

My fanon Tim draws as much from canon as it can, while still being consistent. And it draws MOST heavily on Tim's early arcs. In those early arcs, Tim was attempting to build Robin out of what he imagined Jason and Dick would want. He dreamed about them, hallucinated them, asked the Case for advice. Jason seemed incredibly important to him, on a similar scale to Dick.

That steadily disappears over the years, and becomes really hard to integrate with later Tim. (The authours' victim-blaming anti-Jason agendas are at fault, but that doesn't work as an in-world explanation.) But I'm keeping it anyways, even if it makes everything harder!

See, everything I've seen from Tim in other contexts suggests that Jason's behaviour wouldn't actually have any bearing on whether or not Tim likes him. Tim is perfectly comfortable idolizing someone who neglects or takes advantage of him. That's kind of central to his character - he's the Robin who sees Bruce's flaws and follows him anyways. Who saw an out-of-control 30-something and decided to parent him. Who rants about his parents' neglect without ever considering he might not owe them everything.

Jason earned Tim's loyalty when he was 13, and Tim doesn't stop being loyal, as far as I can tell.

Jason and Tim should be like Harvey Dent and Bruce. Tim doesn't TRUST him, but he desperately wants to help him.

Not necessarily like the fandom tends to write: "Oh, I'll stop being Robin and do anything possible to get you back into the family because I'm valueless!"

More like deescalation in a hostage situation. More like how Tim talks Poison Ivy down. Vulnerability only as a weapon. Always ready to knock him out and disarm him if he gets the chance.

-

There's also some issues with insecurity. My weak spots are similar but not identical to Tim's. There are areas where he's self-confident that I don't quite get. His pride about being Robin is one area of ambiguity. I think he's been written mostly consistently, but my own issues are getting in the way.

So I'm not entirely sure exactly which ways JASON validating Tim as Robin would be important. I know it would be! But there are some ways where Tim wouldn't believe other people, some where he is entirely reliant on other people ... just, his mixture of self-confident and insecurity is fractal and complex.

-

In conclusion, I think it would make Tim feel REALLY good to think that Jason thought Tim was a better Robin. I don't think it would have much affect on his opinions about Jason, though. Those got locked in the first time Tim saw Jason rescue someone, and Tim couldn't change them if he wanted.

Also, canon preboot Tim DIDN'T seem to like Jason, and I want to ignore that but it's hard.

(Also also, how I write about Tim and Jason sometimes contradicts what I think canon says AND my personal fanon. It's COMPLICATED!)

#gecko's headcanons #these two give me MANY thoughts

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northoftheroad · 9 months

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Hi, new fan here, love your takes on the batfam. Just had quick question, how do other members of the batfam deal with Bruce when he's being particularly frustrating, pain in the ass, uncooperative af, brooding, and stubborn, you know just Bruce being (emotionally constipated) Bruce? And who had to deal with him the most when he's like this, except Dick and Alfred?

Bearing in mind that I haven't read everything with post-Dick Robins, and with the usual caveat about different writers and different eras…

Not Jason, because I think Bruce was pretty content to have a younger Robin to work with again (before things got tense, and he started to be unsure if Jason could be trusted). After Jason comes back is another cup of tea, of course, but they don't live together. So Jason copes by keeping a distance, I suppose.

I would guess Tim has had to put up with a difficult Bruce the most, after Alfred and Dick? Bruce was self-destructive after Jason's death, and the point of Tim as Robin was to change that. And if I remember correctly, Batman had episodes when he put Tim through some weird paranoia test. I'm not familiar enough with Tim's Robin solo to say how he dealt with it, though. He did walk away from Robin for a short while, at least.

I think Bruce was particularly difficult when Stephanie was Robin, too, but it was for such a short time. Damian has had his ups and downs; in the last few years, there has been a lot of conflict between Bruce and Damian, and Damian has also kept a distance (he's far too young for Bruce to let him keep a distance, but that's another story).

Post-Crisis Alfred, working for the Waynes since Bruce was a child, surely has had to put up with Bruce the most. My personal take is that Alfred is mainly written as an enabler… He's sometimes passive-aggressive when he disapproves of Bruce's behaviour but rarely does anything about it. He has left Bruce, or threatened to do it, on a couple of occasions, but from what I remember, it's been because Bruce isn't taking care of himself, not because of how he treats the kids. (That time in Tom Taylor's recent Nightwing, when he orders Bruce to remove the cowl before he talks to Dick after being hurt as Robin, is surely an anomaly…)

Dick has, of course, famously also chosen to distance himself when Bruce became unbearable and fired him as Robin without expressing that Dick still had a place in the family. But he's been known to reach out to Bruce and want to talk even after a rough time – after he had heard about Jason's death and sometime later when he heard that Alfred was worried about Bruce.

Batman vol 1 # 437

Sorry, this is the best answer I can come up with!

#batman #robin #nightwing #bruce wayne #alfred pennyworth #Tim Drake #damian wayne #dick grayson #Jason Todd #the difficult life in a bat-family

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cr1mson5returns · 10 months

Text

Yet another idea I've been tossing around...

Cassie isn't really happy about the whole arrangement she has with Tim when he finally shows his face in Gotham City again. It boiled down to "I know I was an absolute ass to you last time we talked, but I desperately need you to trust me on this one and just let me run wild for a little bit, okay?"

She was not okay with that. But she had to be okay with it in the end, just to avoid losing one of her closest friends. She had been worried about Tim for a while, but the worry levels exploded exponentially after she learned about the Anti-Life Equation. There had been a disturbing lack of Tim during the Crisis, after all, and nobody had really been able to explain it away until then. She knew enough about the whole thing to know that he'd been made to do awful things, things he probably still remembered. And honestly, Cassie starts to wonder if maybe some part of that stuck around in his mind a little longer than it should've, if maybe he's acting the way he is because he was influenced a little too much by the Equation.

After the team effort that goes into besting Ra's al Ghul, Cassie does check in on Tim. Makes sure he's okay and planning to heed Alfred's request of no patrol for a week (under threat of house arrest), and asks Tim to text her sometime. She doesn't want to be overbearing - not sure how he'd react, given their last couple of conversations and everything he's gone through so far - but she wants him to know she cares.

It becomes irritatingly apparent that Cassie can't just let Tim be the director of how often they check in with each other. She gets one or two texts in six weeks, and both are sort of vague assurances that he's still alive and will probably be alive tomorrow. But it's sitting wrong with her. She pulls the best friend card and bullies Dick into giving her Tim's new home address before she flies to Gotham.

In this weird little interim period when Tim isn't feeling welcome or wanted at the manor, but doesn't quite have as much money in his own personal bank account as he needs for anything else, he's renting a spot in one of the historic neighborhoods of the city. It's an older building, and Cassie can tell that there's been no effort to fortify this place on Tim's end from how easily the window slides open. Still, she climbs through and finds him sprawled on his back on the bed. He lifts his head to give her a look - puzzled? Mostly annoyed. Cassie doesn't care. She sets a fresh-made smoothie down on the bedside table. "Here, it's black cherry."

And with that, Cassie sits down on the edge of the bed somewhere in the space between Tim's right arm and leg. She doesn't say anything when he expends a little more effort than usual pulling himself up into a seated position. What she does say is: "I didn't forget what you told me, you know. About the Crisis and the Equation."

Tim takes a drink of his smoothie. "I think you should," he tells her.

Cassie rolls her eyes, gulps down a mouthful of strawberry banana. "I disagree. You can't just drop that shit on me and expect me not to wonder if you're okay."

She doesn't turn around but she knows Tim shrugs at that. "It doesn't matter. I've been through worse."

"Have you?"

Tim doesn't say anything to that. "You're about to make me go to therapy."

Cassie snorts. "No. I'm about to make you spend time doing things you actually like for once."

"I like being Red Robin."

"Can I please just have one conversation with you where you're not lying to my face? And besides, you know damn well I'm not talking about that. When was the last time you had a camera in your hands? Went to the skate park? Fuck, when was the last time you did anything that wasn't hero work?"

She does turn, then, to see Tim just looking down at his lap. He's straining not to squeeze the smoothie in his hands, she can tell. "Long time ago," he admits.

Cassie just nods. She figured as much. "Well....it's not too late to start again."

#tim drake #red robin #cassie sandsmark #wonder girl

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rezonan · 11 months

Text

Red Hood, other Anti-Heroes/Villians and the issue with killing in comics.

First here's the thing before you read this, I just wanna say this isn't a post complaining about if killing is good or not, far from it so don't worry.

I also wanna say really like Jason Todd. One of my favorite Robins though I like him more as Red Hood. My only issue with him is that DC is stuck with his direction as a character(Not as much as Tim at least). For a lot of reasons

One of those things is that anti-Heroes don't work in main superhero universes at least in DC, in Marvel killing isn't looked down on much unless you do it like the Punisher(Consistently, no exceptions and extreme)

When I'm talking about Anti-Heroes I mean who don't hesitate to kill, because the definition of Anti-Heroes even include guys like Batman, Spider-Man, Iron man and Daredevil (Classical Anti-Heroes,Disney Anti Hero,) talking about the types like Huntress and Red Hood(Unscrupulous Hero) and Punisher (Nominal Hero).

https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Analysis/AntiHero if you wanna know what I'm talking about.

An issue they have is that they kill criminals consistently, and those criminals include supervillains but in comic books, villians in comics are kinda a commodity. Villians are what makes the heroes. So DC obviously will never let Jason kill the Joker or Riddler or Poison Ivy or Bane, or let Frank Castle kill Green Goblin or Kingpin. That's getting rid of a commodity that writers need for stories.

It's why I laugh when people say why doesn't Batman kill the Joker or something, they won't let him guys. Joker is too popular to kill same with the rest of his rouges, the writers need the villians to continue writing more stories and if time has taught us anything is that new villians don't even catch on most of the time to replenish the old popular ones.

So Frank and Jason and left to keep offing mooks, looking stupid and incompetent for not taking out the actual threats or just offing D-listers, it then brings up the question of why doesn't JASON kill the Joker since he's always talking about how willing to kill he is. yeah sure they'll write Batman like the biggest dick to fight him not too but there has been times when nothing has been stopping Jason to do it, see what I mean?

There's also another thing that DC and Marvel just won't let chracters less popular than the big no kill rule big heroes be more effective (and this is coming from a guy whofor the most part is anti killing). You really think Marvel is gonna let Red Hood have the moral high ground with Batman or Punisher with Spider-Man or Captain America?

But yeah I don't wanna get into the whole 'should heroes kill debate' here just making a point.

This is why they honestly work in outside comic universes like the games or movies. See the 'Superhero Movie Villains Die' trope

Basically they just don't mesh well with the status quo nature of comics.

So now we have heroes/villians(yes I consider frank a borderline villian) who are known for killing but can't kill anyone significant for multiple reasons, like how Red Hood by the New 52 had like 83 kills but no one in there was anyone actually important.

This is why Punishers best run was in an entire different universe where heroes didn't exist so he could kill Kingpin without issues. With Punisher they can always stick with that or just do what they usually do and make him take out mooks and barely developed rouges. They recently made him the head of the hand and gave him superpowers, it's actually interesting in my opinion.

With Jason it's more complicated. There's two sides, he drops guns and killing and joins up with the bat family as a kind of character development or he unrepentantly leaves the bat family behind and starts killing people and using guns then runs into all the issues I mentioned above. The latter side believes that hum dropping killing and guns removes everything that makes him interesting while the former believes it's good character progression for him to drop it. I think both have good points.

Personally I think they should lean into the supernatural side of him, like go all in and make him the dude in the Batfamily that handles supernatural threats, his the only one in the family that has straight up superpowers (Edit: forgot Duke, forgive me but he got them before him so point stands I guess) with his All blades so take those and have him to team up with Zatanna or Constantine, fighting vampires and zombies. (Happy to see they are doing this with Cass kinda I haven't read Spirit World)

Or they lean into the Task Force Z/Outlaws/DCeased aspect of him leading other Mistfits, Anti-Heroes and Villians into becoming better people like with the thunderbolts from Marvel. Maybe hook him up with some kinda of government connection so people he kills aren't illegal during this redemption quests or something.

Well I've got nothing else to ramble about.

#batman #marvel #the punisher #red hood #jason todd #anti heroes #DC

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thatblondeperson · 1 year

Note

I was wondering what are your thoughts on Tim and Ariana's relationship in general with regards to it itself and how it impacted Tim and Ariana herself as a character?

I think what they had was very genuine and sweet.

He definitely liked her right away and they met because he was being a good boy and trying to help her as he would anyone. And look how cute they are tbh.

Talking her up.

But Tim isn't super present even from the beginning. He's hard to get ahold of, he's too busy being Robin to really be Tim it seems, and Ariana is mostly patient with this in the beginning but it eventually piles up.

But she's no saint as she seems to go out with someone else almost to spite Tim for being so unavailable.

But of course we know Tim kissed Steph around this same time though so it's not a...healthy relationship by any means.

Their relationship gets weird fast, and then Ariana does two time Tim again due to his lack of noticing her, which nearly gets her sexually assaulted which...great writing DC.

There is the infamous seduction of Tim which of course comes from Ari wanting to kind of stuff down her trauma and forget it by replacing the memory.

And I've talked about it before but Tim is very respectful and even says he does want to take that step with Ari, when they're ready, alluding to him wanting to be with her for the long haul.

Being a good boyfriend here, we love it.

Tim truly did adore Ari. I don't want to hear anyone say he didn't, or say that their date at the car show was proof that he wasn't into women (shut your biphobic asses up), or that Ari was less than Steph. Their relationship wasn't built on as much trust, that's obvious, which was what killed it, but that doesn't mean Tim didn't love her.

But Tim is flirting with Steph more, and he likes her too and knows its wrong.

Shit is messy as hell in these 90s comics, I stg. I mean it sounds like he's planning to break up with Ari here...

But then of course after the quake he goes to stalk her a bit looking lovesick as ever.

And they agree to start over...

...only for them to amicably break up one issue later.

And of course Tim's first date with Steph is the next issue after.

The cycle continues of course and if there's one thing to take from this relationship and others after, is that we get consistent Tim characterization all throughout. He's a sweet boy but he's flaky. This relationship ping pongs around and we see it happen again with Steph, only really slowing down when Tim's mask is taken off. That's really the crux of it isn't it? Tim and Ari might have done better if Tim wasn't Robin, or other relationships may have fared better if he was more open. That's why Steph ends up being his longest relationship since the writers allow that to be part of their story.

I think the relationship was sweet natured but messy. Do I want it revisited? Not really. Ariana is hardly featured in the comics and she's either written as very patient and adoring of Tim, or completely done with his BS and ready to date the next guy who asks. It's...not the best.

I'm not mad at it, it's a first love that was written in the 90s though so expectations have to be lowered when forming an opinion.

#aritim #timari #whats their ship name???#tim drake #ariana dzerchenko #timsteph #personal #ask tbp

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horsechestnut · 8 months

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I would love details on the Reverse Robin AU idea, I always adore those. (Though I often feel they miss an opportunity by not having Duke be first. Then again I sort of have a "Either its the first four Robins being reversed, or its all of them and thus Duke is first" system. A lot depends on what swerves the story best.) Sorry for the off topic ramble and no pressure to share, but yeah it'd be cool.

One thing I am notably curious about is how you'd handle the pre death relationship between Bruce & Stephanie. Cos so much of their canon one is filtered through his grief over Jason and projection onto her which led to his awful treatment of her, which led to her desperation to please him. Without that death things would probably be a lot more chill.

Still, I could see a similar death happening if Bruce got to up his own ass with trying to play master mind and it all blowing up in his face (Which I insist would have happened with his crime control plan regardless of Stephanie.)

No apology necessary! I love off topic rambles and am prone to doing them myself (see how long this explanation ended up for reference lol).

Here's a link to a sort of fan-fic/sort of explanation I wrote earlier (Though I think you already found it). I would love to flesh it out into a full fic, but I'm not sure that will ever actually happen.

As for Steph and Bruce specifically though, I think there's still tension between them, but it comes from a different place. Spoiler is a rouge agent, a teenager with no training, no oversight, and a personal score to settle, and Bruce isn't really prepared to handle that. Damian came to him pre-trained and if Tim comes second (which I think he should since he's both before and after Steph in canon) he was doing it because he believed it was the right thing to do. Without Jason Bruce has never had to deal with anyone who's completely untrained before, and without Dick he's never had to deal with a personal grudge as motivation (except his own, and he's really not prepared to get into that), so the combination of them in Steph seems far to dangerous to have in the field. Besides, it sets a bad precedent, he can't just let any teenager start running around fighting crime or he'll have a We Are Robin situation on his hands, and he already has a Robin. I don't think it's really personal for him, it just makes logical sense for everyone if she would stop, but for some reason she won't, even after Cluemaster is dead. (She also reminds him a little to much of himself at that age, but he's not going to think about that).

On Steph's end I think things are a little more complicated. I think the indifference would both drive her insane and give her this sort of false hope. No matter what she does it never seems to be enough, but the parts of her Bruce seems to dislike are all related to Spoiler, not Stephanie, which means she can change them! But there are parts of Steph that are baked into Spoiler, which carry over to Robin in turn that she can't get rid of no matter how hard she tries. Plus there are just enough similarities between the way Batman talks to her and the way Arthur did that sometimes it activates her fight instinct when logically she knows she should just listen to him. And unfortunately Bruce doesn't respond well to being snapped at, but he also never seems to hold it against her for more than a day. So Steph just keeps running in this circle and never knows where she stands with Bruce, and in some ways it's better and in some ways it's worse, because at least with her dad she knew where she stood and could stop trying.

I don't like that answer, trust me I wish I could say things between them would be better, but personally I don't think so. Bruce might be nicer about the way he says it, but I think he'd still want Steph to stop and Steph would still think if she tries hard enough he'll realize he was wrong.

Sorry, that got away from me, but anyway, I think the concept of including Duke is interesting! I just don't really know enough about him to know how it would play out or have thoughts on how We Are Robin could happen without Robin.

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thattimdrakeguy · 1 year

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Frankly if you asked me, all of that unnecessary misdirection and twists that left poor Tim at the ‘make him angsty and edgier’ block for later writers to force upon him was the result of the whole darker and edgier train that permeated not just the Batbooks but the whole industry throughout the decade he was in.

Basically short, in my honest opinion, Tim Drake was the perfect character at the absolutely wrong time.

The 90s edgier nonsense (as foreshadowed by the marvelous competition’s hefty promotion of Venom, Cable and other like minded antiheroes, Early Image having a foundation built on that) made possible with the Batmania (since he’s naturally the perfect candidate for darker and edgier due to both his gothic aesthetic and his insane popularity) unfortunately gave the writers of that era and the 2000s the impression that since it’s Gotham, things in universe are just miserable and sucky

And since Tim lives in Gotham, despite meant to be the counter to that misery that permeates the city he helps defend, it was only a matter of time before that wrong impression got to him too

It’s why to this day, my preferred Tim Drake is that original Fanboy we saw in A Lonely Place of Dying since in the end, that’s what he’s meant to be, beginner or not and why I am still reluctant to get anything Dixon related on both him and Nightwing since those runs are built on that train of thought that says ‘misery in setting and edgier characters means compelling and mature storytelling, especially in Gotham’

I know, long winded, I just needed to vent. You may ignore this if you wish to

Bro, I just asked #cats what a raw potato tasted like, I don't feel like ignoring much.

And, I wouldn't say Tim was in the wrong time. He has his great successes in the 90s. The main reason he's talked about past people's obsession with one story in Red Robin, that has slowly lost popularity 'cause of people realizing it wasn't the best Tim--is 'cause of the 90s.

There was plenty of people who were sick of the big overexaggerated 90s crap even if it did infest Tim a bit when they'd draw him way buffer than he was clearly meant to be.

It's all just a matter of writers with the ability to do better either not advancing to the right places in comics, or throwing their talents down the toilet to be there.

It's all about good writing. That's it, really, that's the big secret.

Why is Dick a massive joke of a character now? 'Cause the writing got bad.

Why did Batman look like a total maniac more like usual for a while? 'Cause the writing got bad.

Why is Damian totally unrecognizable a lot of the time on nearly every single level for over a decade now(Though I have heard some aspects like art have been getting better, or so I've seen thankfully, but I'm still not trusting that all the way because now this fucking fucking hell)? 'Cause the work got bad.

Why is Jason just a fan fic edgy woobie fuck a lot of the time now? 'Cause the writing got bad.

How did Steph go from edgy, determined, "vigilante vixen", who was morally kinda questionable at times go to acting like a 12-year-old sometimes? 'Cause the writing got bad.

No matter what in the end. It's all down to the writing, and also art.

There's always been good movies in every decade no matter the taste, because people with true talent and knowledge, and know-how where out there to make so happen.

Comics being a dwindling medium that's how a down-turn in quality going on for a long time? It's just not a business worth getting into anymore. Passion or not, people just aren't good writers. And that can happen in any era.

But back to the main point, Tim was at his most popular in the 90s in an era you wouldn't think he'd fit into with all the Rob Liefeld stuff. Like he got an 80-page-giant in the late 90s over some characters you think would actually get one because he was so naturally popular.

But what made him work then isn't dated. It's timeless. They just haven't had good enough writers to make him work, and it sucks, but it's how it is.

The reason Tim really got changed so much isn't down to tastes in an era. It's down to the taste of a few people in specific positions. Things that made Tim work were still working wonders in other places.

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