#his s1 arc was the START of change | Explore Tumblr Posts and Blogs

forpiratereasons · 7 months

Text

all right. i'm ready to talk about izzy.

izzy is a great character. in s1 he sits in this great position as an antagonist that's close to the main characters, and in s2 he sits in this great position as an antagonist who's gotten everything he wanted, and found that actually - fuck! - that's not it at all. the world changes enough in s1 that there's no satisfaction in izzy getting what he wants out of blackbeard. and it's not just ed that's changed, it's not just the crew, izzy himself is fundamentally changed too. even before s2, and that change continues to grow and flourish through the series.

in reality, death is cruel. and death is senseless. and death is unfair, and shitty, and it happens to the wrong people at the wrong time, too early, with too much to live for, who mean too much to too many. it happens.

maybe izzy's death is all of those things, but i don't think that's the point. it's not meant as a lesson in mortality; it's not meant as retribution for past crimes; it's not meant as a commentary on who deserves to live and who deserves to die. it's not about deserving. if anything, it's about the fact that deserving doesn't come into it at all.

the point is that izzy healed.

a lot has been made of the fact that izzy is the only character who bears visible scars from the kraken era - the scar on his head, as well as the leg. but i don't think they're meant as a reminder of the injury, or as a sign that izzy is "damaged" post-kraken era. they're representative of the fact that izzy healed. the scar is there to remind you that izzy survived. you see it heal over multiple episodes because that's the work izzy is doing - he's healing from blackbeard's actions, from his own actions, from his history, from his constraints.

it's not too late to heal. it's not too late to find your place. it's not too late to come out. it's not too late to let people in. it's not too late.

and all those things are worth doing despite the fact that our time here is limited. we are all going to die. but we are here right now, which means it's not too late, and it is worth it to free ourselves to be who we need to be regardless of who we have been and who we are now and what time we might have left.

izzy isn't suicidal in ep 8. he's healed from that. izzy isn't abused or depressed or alone in ep 8. izzy is strong, and competent, and respected, and loved.

and some folks have been disappointed it's not romantic love. i get that. but i think it's super important too that izzy's healing is worth it without romantic love. familial, platonic love is so fundamentally important to the queer community. found family. friends. solidarity. the look when some stranger sees you and you see them and you both know the other is family, that they're safe. the way we fight for each other - for our rights to love who we want, fuck who we want, to marry, to adopt kids, and also for housing, for jobs, for healthcare. for our rights to use the bathroom, for our rights to choose our own names and our own bodies and our own families. we're fighting for our right to exist and that, guys, it's not romantic. the foundations of our community is about - well, i'll let izzy say it:

it's not about glory, it's not about getting what you want. it's about belonging to something when the world has told you you're nothing. it's about finding the family to kill for when yours are long dead. it's about letting go of ego for something larger. the crew.

ed and izzy, following s2e3, interact and communicate on izzy's terms, and that's made clear. that's the last relationship for izzy to heal. when izzy finally approaches ed in ep 6, it's - not great. it's a start. you gotta start somewhere. he lets ed apologize, in their very closed, guilty way of speaking to each other, but then goes back to the crew, back to his safety.

he finally finishes his healing arc with the drag performance and la vie en rose, and then he and ed DO have good moments. he teases ed about stede. he directly reverses his previous actions in s1 and tells ed to listen to his good feelings. that's where djenks is getting this (imo, still a bit weird) father-figure business. the scene in the republic where ed's watching fishermen and izzy comes to say hey, it's all right, hey, listen to your gut. they don't need to directly come out and have some deep serious conversation about their relationship because that's just not like them, man. they're doing their healing their way. i think it would be nonsensical to expect these two to be open and honest with each other regardless of how they are with everyone else because their relationship is not like their relationships with anyone else.

until they run out of time.

and this, i think, is important. izzy controls this last conversation because it's what ed needs to hear, because izzy no longer needs to hear it. izzy doesn't need to hear that ed's sorry, izzy knows ed's fucking sorry. ed's whole arc this season is about the guilt he's carrying. izzy says what he says because he knows ed needs to hear it. ed, you weren't a monster all on your own. ed, i saw you. i saw you outgrowing him, and i didn't want that to happen because i was worried about what it meant for me, but i see now that it could have meant this all along - family. balance. something to die for, sure, but something to live for.

you could argue that ed and the crew don't think of each other as family. i think it's a bit more complicated than a yes or no on that one, but when izzy says, ed, you're surrounded by family, maybe it doesn't matter whether that's fact. maybe it's a statement of possibility. look at this family who can love you if you let them. look at this family who will forgive you even when you don't deserve it. look at all the ways you can still heal. look at how worth it it all is.

just be ed, izzy says, there he is.

he says it to ed because izzy already knows he can be just izzy. izzy already knows he's dying surrounded by family. izzy already knows that love and belonging and family are worth it, and he uses his dying moments to make sure ed knows it too because despite everything, despite everything he did and despite everything ed did and despite not being ed's romantic choice, he loves ed. it's worth it to use his dying moment to make sure ed knows this because izzy loves him.

it's worth it.

izzy is the stand-in for the stereotypical pirate, the villain - the representative of how repression and oppression work together, of how race and class and colonization interact with each other, of the lines between love and obsession and power and rage and fear blurring beyond recognition - and he heals. guys, the point of his story is not that he was all those things and paid that price. the point of his story is that he could grow beyond all those things and that growth and healing was all worth it despite the fact that yeah. our lives will inevitably end.

historically, israel hands is said to be one of the only major pirates who survives the golden age of piracy, and he doesn't survive it well - according to the contemporary account of "captain charles johnson" (almost certainly a pseudonym) in A General History of the Robberies and Murders of the most notorious Pyrates, published 1724, hands dies a beggar in london sometime between 1719 and 1724. it has been suggested by some pirate scholars that hands may have actually been the source for much of the information johnson is able to relay regarding blackbeard - and that johnson's apparent wealth of information contributed significantly to the legacy blackbeard left behind and his lasting fame. i had actually really hoped to see this play out in ofmd - izzy protecting ed and stede through perpetuating stories about blackbeard's 'death' (fake, i'd hoped) and legacy.

but i think - he is. in his way. he's there on the hillside, keeping watch. he's there to hold all the stories and all the memories of pirates and what it meant to belong to something, even as the golden age of piracy sets. he's there to show what it is to love and to be loved in return: eternal.

i don't like that izzy died. i think he's a great character, i think he's great fun to have in the ensemble, i think his dynamics with ed and stede are so fucking chewy and delicious. i think con o'neill has done the work of a lifetime on this character and, i hope, had and continue to has the experience of a lifetime with this fandom. my heart goes out to those of you who are devastated; i've been there in past fandoms, i know how achingly difficult that is. i'm so sorry.

but izzy's story is worth telling. izzy's story is worth celebrating. izzy is about making mistakes - bad mistakes! - and finding your way back to something better. izzy is about healing, and about community, and about hope that even when things are shit and people are shit - they can change. things can change.

and maybe - yeah. it's about the role stories play in our lives. about using fictional little scenarios to deal with our traumas. we're here. we're alive. we're coping. we will heal.

not moving on is worse.

#ofmd #our flag means death #ofmd s2 #ofmd s2 spoilers #izzy hands

725 notes · View notes

bookshelfdreams · 7 months

Text

That is certainly - a statement.

What about Jim, who both metaphorically and literally discovers a path for themself beyond what they were raised to be? What about Pete, who learns to overcome his toxic masculinity, his posturing and self-importance? What about Ed, whose entire story is about deconstructing the performance that is expected of him?

What about, oh, idk, our main fucking character Stede Bonnet, whose arc starts with him literally breaking out from the hetero marriage he was forced into despite never fitting in? Who tries (and initially fails) to build a community where he can be himself? Whose entire story is about discovering his own queerness! He starts out not even able to put a finger on WHY his marriage made him feel so suffocated, and then journeys through s1 until he reaches the emotional climax - "His name is Ed"!

Contrast that with Izzy, who has to be dragged into a supportive community kicking and screaming. Who rejects care and compassion, even at his worst, who has to be forced to accept help. He receives the leg and calls the crew a homophobic slur for it, ffs. Only after that, only when people refuse to let him push them away, is he able to poke his nose into something approaching positive human connections. And that's a powerful narrative, sure, in it's own way; but it's hardly the Ultimate Queer Experience, and it's definitely not the "only queer arc".

And Izzy never lets go of the old ways. He never abandons the Blackbeard-era pirate lifestyle for something more positive, not fully. And that's okay, because ultimately, his arc isn't even about himself.

It's about Ed.

Ed keeps repeating toxic relationship patterns, and Izzy is a part of that. He's linked (on purpose, and I wish it had been done more explicitly) to Ed's father; because Izzy represents the poison that was instilled in Ed from a young age, and that has become so entrenched in his system that he can't imagine a life without it. He keeps Izzy around despite being hurt by him because Izzy is predictable, and in that, is safe, even though he hurts Ed; at least it's a hurt Ed is familiar with and can rely on.

When Izzy slowly changes it's to show that Ed is growing beyond the little voice in his head telling him to reject softness, that he can never be loved, that We're just not these kinds of people. If Izzy can evolve from someone spitting boyfriend at Ed like it's a slur to someone congratulating him on getting laid by that same person, Ed can overcome his inner demons telling him the same thing.

That's the point of Izzy's arc. And this is why he has to die, because Ed can never be truly free as long as Izzy is around. So Izzy goes, quietly, peacefully, and releases Ed of the poison; apologizes to him, tells him I was so wrong, and I am so sorry, because that's what Ed needs to hear to move forward.

And that's such a kind, positive way to end the story of Izzy Hands.

#'izzy has the only queer arc' get the fuck out of here #this is such a baffling take what fucking show did you watch #izzys is not never has been and never was going to be the protagonist. he was only ever a device to tell the story of ed.#sorry ik yall dont like to hear this but its the truth.#god forbid a fictional white man die in a television series #our flag means death #ofmd s2 spoilers #thoughts #izzy hands #if you want to pick a fight w me over this I am simply not going to respond to that <3

695 notes · View notes

genericpuff · 16 days

Note

ten storylines u think could have been amazing in lo if they had been handled better?

10 already feels like so much for a story like LO buuttt:

1.) the act of wrath plotline, seriously this one felt like it had some of the most lost potential as one of LO's more unique plotlines (and it lost that potential as soon as it was turned into some "oopsy" committed by persephone due to her wrath being a 'gift' from eris when she was a baby??? still bugs me so much ugh) give me back that dichotomy of Persephone and her internalized wrath, dangit.

2.) the Eros and Psyche plotline. it started off so promising as a parallel B-plot to H x P and then seemed to just get dropped halfway through S1 when Psyche got turned into a nymph.

3.) Echo's involvement as a double agent for Zeus. that was clearly the intention when she was introduced but then she was promptly dropped and only showed up again to say "fuck you Zeus" with zero build-up or implication that she had a change of heart. Like imagine if we actually saw her leaking info back to Zeus but then also getting closer to Hera on a personal level and realizing that she didn't want to keep snitching on her. it would have also made the 'big reveal' of Hera kissing Echo a lot more impactful because then they would have had an actual story arc.

4.) Persephone's character development into becoming the Dread Queen. Right now the story wants us to think that Persephone is somehow "better than ever" despite the fact that her version of the "Dread Queen" is being an absolute Karen. But think of how it could have been if her character de-evolution was the point, to show how Hades had corrupted her. Or if they were meant to be actual shitty people and not shitty people that the narrative was trying to convince us were good.

5.) Hades' and Minthe's relationship. It goes without saying that Minthe was wrong to turn to physical violence, but I'll die on the hill that Minthe wasn't being treated fairly by Hades, either. Those three flashback episodes in S2 leading up to Minthe getting turned into a plant were such a missed opportunity to showcase how Minthe became as bitter as she did towards Hades and what their relationship was actually like in the beginning (and why they liked each other in the first place which they very clearly did) but instead it just dragged its heels because obv Rachel didn't want people empathizing with Minthe.

6.) Ares being used as a tool for war by Zeus. It's clear being sent off to these wars is taking its toll on him and it's created a steep divide within the family, especially concerning how protective Ares is of Hera esp when it comes to how Zeus treats her.

7.) The Aphrodite / Hephaestus plotline. Good god I have no idea what the thought process was behind this one, some of the myths she kinda got away with flipping but this was the one that made the least sense to flip. There was so much potential there that was squandered, a lot of it at the expense of Aphrodite and Ares as traditionally powerful and respected gods.

8.) Hades' alcoholism. Minthe was right, simply falling for Persephone and dropping the cigars and brandy to make himself look better for her doesn't make him a changed person. If the alcoholism was linked to his trauma, why didn't we explore that more? Why couldn't we have seen him actually pursue proper recovery and have it not just be "I'm hot for the 19 year old girl but if I'm drinking constantly that'll make me look bad so I'm just gonna put on the best fake persona I can to make her fall in love with me" instead of actually getting to the root of his issues?

9.) The SA plotline. As much as I talk about how shitty it is, I have zero issue with the original depiction of it, I think it was very accurate especially when it comes to coercion. A lot of people assume SA has to be violent, kicking and screaming, begging for help, but coercive assault is often a lot quieter and more about manipulation which that scene nailed in depicting. It's just everything after that that feels completely misfired and more so for the purpose of making Hades look like a better person simply by comparing him to Apollo on the basis of "he never assaulted Persephone!" and it drives me nuts.

10.) Demeter's winter. In the most recent FP episode, while discussing it with pals, all I could really say was, "This was supposed to be a retelling of the Abduction of Persephone". And Demeter's winter is a core part of that story, one of its biggest purposes in Greek culture was using the myths to explain the creation of the seasons. Despite this being a "retelling" of the Abduction of Persephone / Hymn to Demeter, one of the most important characters in the entire myth has been reduced to, at worst, a Mother Gothel Disney villain, and at best, a pointless NPC.

#ask me anything #ama #anon ama #anon ask me anything #anti lore olympus #lore olympus critical #lo critical

180 notes · View notes

thoughtlessthinkythoughts · 9 months

Text

I think the key to understanding show!Aziraphale is in some lines that are in the book but not the show. Because these lines represent a place that our show Aziraphale hasn't hit yet.

Before I get into this, let me explain why I think things that aren't in the show can be so important to understanding where the show will go.

For another example, let's look at the ending of the book/s1. In the book, Adam is not impressed with Aziraphale and Crowley. There is no pep talk. He actually has a pretty stern message to them about "not messing people around."

A lot of s2 might not have worked the same way if they had gotten that message. It would have cut off room for growth. The whole plotline with Nina and Maggie for one would have been much less likely. So by holding off the stop messing with people message to the end of s2 (and then only giving it to Crowley), it provides more room for the characters to change at a pace befitting a multi-season show.

So what else do I think will end up working this way?

Well, there's a scene I love in the book that hasn't made it into the show yet. It happens after Aziraphale is discorporated. In the show, he goes to heaven, then to Madame Tracy. In the book, he bounces around possible hosts first, including a televangelist. The televangelist is going on about the rapture and such, and Aziraphale cuts in with this:

"Well, nice try...only it won't be like that at all. Not really.

"I mean, you're right about the fire and war, all that. but that Rapture stuff well, if you could see them all in Heaven - serried ranks of them as far as the mind can follow and beyond, league after league of us, flaming swords, all that, well, what I'm trying to say is who has time to go round picking people out and popping them up in the air to sneer at the people dying of radiation sickness on the parched and burning earth below them? If that's your idea of a morally acceptable time, I might add.

"And as for that stuff about Heaven inevitably winning...Well, to be honest, if it were that cut and dried, there wouldn't be a Celestial War in the first place, would there? It's propaganda. Pure and simple. We've got no more than a fifty percent chance of coming out on top. You might as well send money to a Satanist hotline to cover your bets, although to be frank when the fire falls and the seas of blood rise you lot are all going to be civilian casualties either way. Between our war and your war, they're going to kill everyone and let God sort it out-right?

"Anyway, sorry to stand here wittering, I've just a quick question-where am I?"

Because even this more cynical version of Aziraphale is adorable, the scene ends with "Gosh," he said, "am I on television?"

We didn't get this in the show, but I can't help feeling that it might be in season 3, assuming we get a season 3. It might even fit in better there, assuming we are going with a "second coming" plot. In the show, Aziraphale hasn't reached this level of cynicism (yet). I can't picture s1 or s2 Aziraphale giving this speech. Sure, he's seen what a mess the archangels are, he was willing to go against heaven to stop them from starting the end of the world, but I'm pretty sure show Aziraphale still believes in the goodness of God if not the goodness of the way heaven is run. It makes sense that show Aziraphale sees heaven as a fixable mess, an organization that isn't living up to what it should be. Because the show is taking Aziraphale's struggle with morally complex situations and questioning God and making it a longer arc.

My guess it that, as his tenure as archangel is likely to go terribly and not give him any more answers (or at least not answers he likes), he will get to the point where he could give this speech in season 3. My guess is that he's likely to also end up in a horrendous mental state once he reaches these conclusions (a perfect opportunity for some hurt/comfort). He's likely to build himself back up after that, but with a clearer look at the world.

End conclusion: if you are telling a longer story, sometimes you need to hold some things back to give your characters room to grow. So, it isn't a sign something is wrong with a story when partway through a character hasn't hit upon an obvious point.

#good omens #good omens spoilers #aziraphale #good omens meta #good omens season 2

657 notes · View notes

teambyler · 2 months

Text

Will's anti-Vecna song should be David Bowie's "Heroes"

We know from the new BTS pic that he has headphones and a Walkman. Like Max, he might be fending off Vecna:

Max's anti-Vecna song was highly personal to her. It helped her through her guilt and depression and feeling like she deserved to die.

For Will, "Should I Stay or Should I Go" is cute, but it doesn't have emotional weight. It might have helped a child Will in the Upside Down in s1, when it made him think of home and Jonathan, but he's all grown up now. He's changed.

If Byler becomes realized, David Bowie's "Heroes" is the perfect song for Mike and Will's relationship that would help Will resist Vecna. It's canon that Will likes David Bowie: kid Mike prefers the androgynous rock star over Kenny Rogers (s2e1).

@surferbeto on YouTube comments:

This is a heroic love song. Bowie starts out crooning but pretty soon he ramps up and belts it out hard. This song is about risking getting shot by East German border police and dragged over barbed wire for love. This is about young love against impossible odds. It's about that gloriously tragic fantasy... of giving our life in some grandly romantic way to save the life of our beloved. Maybe by taking a bullet for them and dying in their arms in the shadow of the Berlin Wall.

Having David Bowie's "Heroes" in the show would call-back to Peter Gabriel's somber 2010 cover from s1, when Mike hugged his mom thinking Will was dead. But Bowie's original is defiant, triumphant, and bittersweet. (Seriously, if you haven't yet, listen to it before reading further. It's perfect.)

It would play when Mike and Will have their first kiss. Their song of losing each other is now of finding each other.

If Byler is realized, it could play as Mike and Will dare to hold hands in the school hall, as we fade out to the end credits.

Will would put it on his Walkman. If Will and Mike are bullied for their relationship, "Heroes" perfectly expresses their defiance and willingness to love each other despite the harm that might come to them.

It's the song that would most help Will in case he gets Vecna'd. It doesn't just remind him of Mike; it culminates his journey over the five seasons. As a kid he told Jonathan he's not a baby, not just a victim. Despite seeming shy and weak, he has a huge amount of quiet courage, but his struggle in s3 and s4 was largely internal. ("I'm not gonna fall in love.") Show creator Matt Duffer says about s5: "Will's going to be a big part and focus... We're starting to see his coming of age, really... You're starting to see him come into his own." If Byler becomes real, then his fight becomes external, confronting the homophobia in Hawkins and the literal hell threatening his friends. He will rise to the occasion.

"Will really takes center stage again in [season] 5," Ross Duffer told Variety. "This emotional arc for him is what we feel is going to hopefully tie the whole series together. Will is used to being the young one, the introverted one, the one that’s being protected. So part of his journey, it’s not just sexuality – it’s Will coming into his own as a young man."

In s2, Will only allowed Mike to protect him because he didn't feel pitied by Mike; Mike saw his strength. A stronger Will will pay him back and protect him from the twin dangers they face.

It's Will's turn to be the hero. His fight for others is his fight for himself. "Heroes" perfectly expresses his journey of defying all odds to fight for HIS RIGHT TO LOVE.

-teambyler

#byler #will defends mike with a gun #stranger things #vecna #speculation #song #should i stay or should i go #david bowie #heroes #headphones #walkman

167 notes · View notes

percheduphere · 5 months

Text

LET'S TALK ABOUT WHO LOKI CHOOSES

I've previously discussed romantic tropes in the Loki series in my meta here. This meta supports the former by counting each of Loki's decisions with each of Loki's love interests (Sylvie and Mobius) and where those decisions occur in the progression of the overall story of S1 and S2 combined. The end of S1 is the midpoint of the whole story. Bear this in mind as I track how Loki's decision-making shifts. You can even choose to view Loki's decision-making with respect to Mobius as platonic if you want. It doesn't change the plot, count, or character development.

I have to give Sylvie attention and credit where it is due. To not do so would not only ignore her legitimate importance in the series and Loki's development, but it would also undermine my own credibility as an essayist. Feel free to comment, but here are my ground rules: no hate and no yucking other people's yum.

S1E1: Loki chooses himself. We could make the argument Loki chooses to trust Mobius here, but I don't think we see Loki start to like Mobius as a person until S1E2.

S1E2: Loki straddles between choosing himself and choosing to help Mobius because he actually wants to. It helps that the latter serves self-preservation. Loki most obviously chooses himself when he bullshits Mobius at the RenFaire. His choice is more gray when proposing the apocalypse theory. To be conservative, I won't count this in Mobius's favor. However, I feel fairly confident Loki chooses to help Mobius (1) sift through the possible apocalypses because of this genuine reaction:

Loki is starved for praise. He's a centuries-old god for goodness sakes.

When a third option presents itself at Roxxcart, Loki chooses himself and Sylvie (1).

S1E3: Loki chooses to: 1.) help Sylvie through "attempting diplomacy" with the widow (2), 2.) help Sylvie with his "shit plan" disguise (3), 3.) be vulnerable with Sylvie on the train (4), 4.) sing Sylvie a song (5), 5.) help Sylvie get to the arc (6).

S1E4: Loki chooses to comfort Sylvie by holding her hand; their feelings for each other trigger a giant Nexus Event (7). Loki chooses to tell Mobius the truth about the TVA; if he didn't care about Mobius, he would have withheld this information (2). Loki chooses to trust Mobius (3). Loki chooses to reciprocate Mobius’s feelings of friendship (4). Loki chooses, with Mobius, to find and rescue Sylvie (8). Loki chooses to combat Renslayer with Sylvie (9). Loki chooses to confront the Timekeepers with Sylvie and gets pruned (10).

S1E5: Loki chooses to share a blanket with Sylvie (11). Loki chooses to stay in the Void and follow Sylvie to the end of time, "Where you go, I go" (12). Loki chooses to hug Mobius (5). Loki chooses to trust Sylvie's insistence that he intrinsically knows how to enchant (13).

S1E6 (THE MIDPOINT): The confrontation with HWR is tricky. Loki chooses to slow down and think about the consequences because he's learned the value of slowing down and thinking from Mobius (6). Loki chooses to kiss Sylvie back (I realize this is debatable for many Lokius fans, but I'm not going to argue this; 14)

S2 NOTES: For the sake of my own sanity, I am not counting Loki's unconscious and conscious timeslipping. You can refer to the counts for that in my meta here. I will also not be counting the near-infinite number of loops Loki refuses to kill Sylvie for "the good of the multiverse."

S2E1: Loki chooses to seek out Mobius for help (7). Loki chooses to be vulnerable with Mobius in the hallway (8). Loki chooses to trust Mobius's judgment that they only have one shot at stopping the timeslipping (9).

S2E2: Loki chooses to protect Mobius from Brad (10). Loki chooses to help Mobius reverse-engineer Brad's TemPad (11). Loki chooses to comfort Mobius in the pie automat (12). Loki chooses to follow Mobius's intimidation plan for Brad (13). Loki chooses to convince Sylvie to join his and the TVA's cause (Sylvie declines #1; 15). Loki chooses to hold hands with Sylvie to combine their blast power (16). Loki chooses to follow Mobius back to the TVA (14). Loki chooses to ask Sylvie to stay and help (Sylvie declines #2; 17). Loki chooses to comfort Mobius in the Control Room (15).

S2E3: Loki chooses to humor Mobius's sightseeing (16). Loki chooses to try cracker jack (and hates it; 17). Loki chooses to prioritize the Loom per Mobius’s advisement (18). Loki chooses to give into Mobius's tandem bike request (19). Loki chooses to plead with Sylvie to spare Timely and asks for her help (NOTE: this is Loki's 3rd request; writers love the significance of threes and Sylvie turns Loki down all three times; 18).

S2E4: Loki chooses to defend Mobius in the Pie Automat (20). Loki chooses to compare (through implication) Thor's relationship with Jane with his relationship with Mobius (21). Loki chooses to use this same comparison to assure Sylvie that her mercy on Timely was an act of mercy for all people on all timelines (19).

S2E5: Loki chooses to look for Mobius in the Pie Automat (22). Loki chooses to look for Mobius in the Control Room (23). Loki chooses to recruit Mobius (24). Loki chooses to quote Mobius's "form and function" to Don (25), Loki chooses to help Mobius through the time door (26). Loki chooses to promise Don (Mobius) that he can return him to any point in time (27). Loki chooses to recruit Sylvie (20; she turns him down a 4th time). Loki chooses to argue with Sylvie that Mobius should have a choice (28). Loki chooses to listen to Sylvie that his friends are better off without the TVA (21). Loki chooses to let Don go for Mobius’s own good (29). Loki chooses to control timeslipping upon hearing Sylvie say "Do you think what makes a Loki a Loki is that we're destined to lose?" (22). Loki chooses to rewrite the story to save Sylvie and Mobius (23 / 30, respectively).

S2E6: Loki chooses to reenact all of Mobius's small gestures of kindness even though they cost precious time: he chooses to hold Victor's glasses (31), he chooses to compliment OB's "not to scale" model (32), he chooses to recite an abbreviated version of his and Mobius's bickering over "who's in the suit?" (33), he chooses to finish Mobius's joke about taking OB's job (34). He chooses to seek out Past Mobius for guidance and comfort (35). He chooses to shake Mobius's hand (36). He chooses to talk Sylvie out of killing HWR (24). He chooses to sacrifice himself to save Sylvie and Mobius (25 / 37, respectively). He chooses to listen (and watch?) to Mobius say, "Let time pass" (38).

Loki chooses Sylvie: 25

Loki chooses Mobius: 38

If I missed any decision points for either Sylvie or Mobius, let me know and I'll update the meta and counts accordingly.

Ultimately, Loki's sacrifice is for BOTH Mobius AND Sylvie. BOTH ships are important to the narrative and Loki. However, between the two of them, there is only one person who has consistently chosen Loki since S1E1, never rejected Loki and his requests for help, and who has, in turn, unknowingly been chosen by Loki in kind. Need a meta for Mobius’s decision-making? Here it is.

#loki #mobius #lokius #loki season 2 #loki series #loki meta #my meta #loki analysis #my analysis #sylvie

203 notes · View notes

amuseoffyre · 7 months

Text

Since insomnia is kicking my arse of late, I naturally tilted into the thoughts about the nature of the 3-act structure and why S2 of OFMD may have felt off and incomplete to a lot of people.

I am fully in agreement that we lost a lot of valuable time with only 8 episodes and a lot of it did feel rushed, but for the amount of story and set-up and growth and development they needed to fit into 4 hours of television, they did astonishing things.

DJenks has said from the very start that this is a story that has been planned out to take 3 seasons. It's literally a 3-act play and we are currently right in the middle of the worst part of that timeline according to every traditional 3-act structure.

Act one/season one is self-explanatory. Like New Hope in the Star Wars Trilogy or Fellowship of the Ring, this is the set-up. We're introduced to our protagonists and antagonists, the relationships are given a foundation.

The beginning is Stede's journey to becoming a real boy. The inciting incident, the one that actually pushes his change beyond "playing pirates" is meeting Ed. The second thoughts come together in episode 8/9 after his confrontations with Jack and Chauncey and episode 10 is the climax.

Act 2/season 2 is never going to be as smooth and simple as act 1/s1. A big part of the A2/S2 job is set up for A3/S3 and this is what we're seeing and why a lot of story threads seem to have been left dangling.

Again, to call back to Empire Strikes Back and The Two Towers, the structure is much the same: the original batch of people are divided and scattered, the big enemy from A1/S1 is looming, new allies make themselves known. In SW, this meant the introduction of Lando and Yoda as allies plus the hint of the Emperor lurking in the background. In LotR, we have the Rohirrim, Gondor and the Ents as allies and the expansion of Sauron's forces in Helm's Deep, Osgiliath and the winged wraiths.

There's a clear trajectory following the A2/S2 structure:

obstacle 1 - the crews separated and struggling

obstacle 2 - the end of episode 2 and the repercussions of his actions

twist - just when things start to settle, the Ned Low situation happen and Stede kills for the first time

obstacle 3 - Ed's struggle with his identity leading to him leaving

disaster - Ricky's assault on the Republic

crisis - do-or-die battle because they have no other choice

climax - the last 15 minutes of ep. 8 live here.

As with SW and LotR, there's an ending, but weighted with the knowledge of a story that is meant to continue. Each of those act 2 films end with the heroes still aware of the looming threat, some of them heading out on new missions, and some of them resting and healing. There's brief pause, brief respite, a moment to take a breath.

We have all the characters in place now and the battle-lines have been drawn. Luke still needs to confront Vader (I see you, impending Ed and Hornigold confrontation), Frodo still needs to destroy the ring, Aragorn still needs to lead the army against the Black Gate, the second Death Star is still hanging in the sky.

I'm so excited to see what S3 brings because we have so many arcs ready to go: Zheng's vengeance trip, the inevitable enforced out-of-retirement arc for Ed and Stede, Hornigold, Ricky trying to maintain his tenuous control of the republic given how many of his people were killed when the crew escaped, the pirate rebellion gathering forces.

Also how often do we get shows/films where the supporting cast are given this much storyline? We have a named/speaking-role cast of upwards of 15 central characters. That is a staggering amount of people to work with, when most shows would only focus on the leads and a couple of their friends. Six is the average for most TV shows, while comedies can inch higher because ensembles, but most ensembles don't get as much as our crew did.

I know a lot of people aren't happy about Izzy's death. I know I would have liked to see him a lot more, because he's such a grumpy old bitch and I love him and him affectionately roasting Ed and Stede would have made my entire month. But I'm also aware that narratively, as a figurehead of the old ways of piracy and "we were Blackbeard", it was a symbolic death as well - a sign of the death of the old ways of piracy and of Blackbeard as was.

(Also, they Obi-Wanned him. I'm not over that. Gave him the "if you strike me down I will become more powerful" speech. I'm just... guys, your star wars nerdery is showing XD)

So while it was flawed in places and pacing, given the scale of the story they're telling, the number of pieces and characters they had in play, and the arcs they have been setting up while also still keeping the humour, I am giving a standing ovation for a remarkable piece of work.

#ofmd #ofmd s2 #ofmd meta

384 notes · View notes

robynrocksforbrains · 9 months

Text

Mike Wheeler is important and there's nothing wrong with analyzing him

Since y'all wanna be insufferable bitches about it I'm gonna explain to you why he's important, why Will loves him, why his struggles should be acknowledged, and why his character depth is pivotal to byler endgame being a satisfying conclusion for both Mike AND Will. Deal with it!

We are not seeing smoke where there isn't a flame. We are seeing smoke where there is a literal fucking forest fire.

Starting off with something a lot of people aren't ready for but I've seen more people talking about: Mike is the main character of s1 at the very least. He is the character that brings us into the world of stranger things. He is the character that the writers chose for this. Mike is the main character of s1 and it was an instant hit. The writers love Mike. Contrary to popular belief, giving a character an arc where they are struggling and their behavior changes from what is normal for the character we know and love does NOT mean the writers hate that character. It means they deliberately chose to give that character complexity and depth. Your inability to like characters that do anything wrong ever is not the fault of the writers. Your decision to act as if a character is not important is not reflective of the actual narrative because it in fact is in direct opposition to the narrative. So just to be clear, if you genuinely believe that Mike isn't important, or that the writers hate him, or don't care about him, or that his story "takes away" from any other character's - ESPECIALLY WILL'S - you are simply wrong.

In s1 and s2 Mike is established as an extremely caring person. He's loving, loyal, brave, intelligent, and trying his best. He is also established to be hot headed, someone who speaks without thinking quite often, someone who is capable of hurting his friends despite that being the last thing he wants to do. He is all of these things and more. He is a human. He is a kid. So in s3, when suddenly he is entirely different, it is completely logical to assume that there is a reason for that. He did not just wake up one day and decide he wanted to be an asshole, push Will away, make his friends feel abandoned, and echo the same sentiments their bullies held. Something is happening with him. He has so much going on in his head and it is painfully obvious. He's holding something in, he's hiding from everyone and from himself. We see glimpses of what he's trying to hide after Will calls him out on his behavior. Will gets through to him. Mike is usually unresponsive to tough love, except for when it's coming from Will. After their fight, it is obvious that he's trying to be better. But he still doesn't wanna face certain things, and he doesn't know how to navigate that. Because he's 13 years old.

There is a reason for all of that internal conflict. There is a reason it comes pouring out of him at certain times. He's crumbling. He is quite literally falling apart because he's holding on to too much. It's not a stretch to assume that, it just takes basic media literacy. Why would the writers have Mike act this way if he was just supposed to be a one dimensional character? Why would Finn be directed to portray Mike the way he does if there was nothing more going on? There are times where Mike looks like he's in physical pain because of his internal conflict. There is a reason for that. And acknowledging that DOES NOT mean people are taking away from Will. That's the most idiotic thing I have ever heard. Do y'all seriously not understand that more than one character can have emotionally complex storylines? Genuinely asking, is this a new concept for you?

Will's love for Mike

Will is head over heels in love with Mike. That is very much established. So when you're dismissing the emotional depth of Mike's individual arc because you think acknowledging it "takes away from Will" you are actually diminishing the significance of a huge aspect of Will's emotional arc. By taking away the significance of Mike, you take away from the significance of Will.

Let's do a quick recap of the very significant role Mike has played in Will's entire life:

Mike is Will's first friend.

They have grown up together and it can be assumed that they've reached important milestones together.

Mike has always been a safe person for Will. He's been a constant in Will's very chaotic and unfair life. Until the summer of '85, Mike had always been something good in Will's life. (That's not to say he is no longer something good, but it can be assumed that the summer of '85 is the first time Mike has been a causal factor in Will's unhappiness)

When Will went missing, Mike did not hesitate to search for him. It wasn't even a question of if. The moment he knew Will was missing he knew exactly what he'd be doing that night. He spearheaded the search amongst the party. He was the leader.

When Will came back, Mike was the only person that didn't treat him like he was gonna break. He cared for him, and he was there for him, but he didn't treat him differently; Will tells us as much. Which means we can infer that the way Mike was with Will in s2 - how gentle and loving he was - was nothing new. He had just always been like that.

When Will was possessed, Mike stayed by his side. Even when it was scary, even when it could've gotten him killed, he stayed. Because once again, for him, it wasn't even a question. That's just where he knew he needed to be. He was in the shed when they were trying to get through to Will. He was set apart from Lucas and Dustin, but he also wasn't equated to family. And his retelling of the story of the day they first met was the final push Will needed to find a way to communicate.

After a year of things being "weird" between them, Mike tells Will that he didn't deserve to be treated the way he had been. Mike tells him that he wants them to be okay again, and for the rest of the season he puts in the work.

Things get rough in s3, and at the beginning of s4, and despite all of that, Will confesses his love (albeit veiled). In a moment where Mike is feeling awful about himself, he tells him that he loves him and needs him, and he tells him why. And to him it doesn't matter that he's breaking his own heart to do it, because it's Mike. Mike, who makes him feel like he's not a mistake at all, and that he's better for being different. For Will, there was no other option. The person he loves was hurting and he knew how to help, and so he did.

Mike is the first person Will tells about Vecna still being alive. Because they're back to being a team. He knows he can trust Mike, and Mike seems to be very determined to prove him right.

SO.

These are all real and canon aspects of Mike's presence in Will's life. Will falling in love with Mike isn't something that just happened for no reason. Will fell in love with Mike because of who Mike is. When you acknowledge that, and when you acknowledge the reasons they've set out for why Will loves him - the reasons Will literally told us - you can better understand Will. But when you dismiss all of these things about Mike, you are dismissing a large portion of Will's emotional and romantic arc. You aren't being a Will Warrior. You are erasing so much of him and his feelings and his lived experience. That is not the hill you wanna die on.

Will loves a person. Not a feeling. Yes, he says that Mike makes him feel like he's not a mistake and that he's better for being different. But that's not why he loves him. He feels that way because he loves him.

Mike is a fully fleshed out character with his own feelings and struggles and fears and traumas and motivations. He's not a plot device. He's not just an accessory to Will's arc. He's not a character that was written only to be Will's love interest. He's Will's love interest because he's Mike.

If Mike didn't matter, and if Mike didn't play a significant role in byler, then they would be able to write in a love interest for Will in s5 and have it be somewhat satisfying. But they can't do that. Will's love for Mike has so much depth because Mike has so much depth. It is genuinely crazy that this has to be stated and that I have to back up this claim because it is simply a canon fact.

So yes, the rain fight affects Mike's character development and his involvement in it is important. Yes, the van scene literally could not exist without Mike and therefore his involvement in it is incredibly important. Yes, every single byler moment has an impact on Mike, and Mike has an impact on it because they are BYLER moments. Yes, Mike will have a lot of significant moments - with Will AND on his own - in s5 because his arc deserves and needs as much attention as Will's in order to execute byler endgame in a satisfying way.

No, none of these facts negate Will's importance or take away from his story. If anything, they add to it because Mike and Will's arcs are corresponding and intertwined.

Mike's struggles

To name a few

Dysfunctional family

Has been bullied his entire life

Extreme self worth issues

Inferiority complex

Hero complex

Lack of self preservation

Suicidal ideation (has been on display since SEASON ONE)

Internalized homophobia

To get this out of the way: Mike's internalized homophobia is allowed to be discussed. Discussion of it is not the dismissal of Will's internalized homophobia. Surprise surprise, two queer kids in the 80s have internalized homophobia! Who'd'a thunk it?! Their internalized homophobia presents in different ways but it is there for both of them. I personally relate to the way Mike's is portrayed way more than I relate to Will's. So why is it that we can't discuss it without being accused of erasing Will's experience? Or without people saying that we're "copy and pasting" Will's story? Because quite frankly, that feels dismissive of my - and likely many others' - real and lived experience. So please for the love of all things that are good just stop with this talking point because it will never hold up.

Moving on

I'm not gonna do a full breakdown of all of Mike's issues. Because contrary to popular belief, there are a lot. And that would be exhausting and I'd get carried away and it's not the point of this post. The point of this post is to defend the acknowledgement and mere existence of them.

If you're a byler that for some reason thinks Mike only exists to be Will's love interest and his trophy as compensation for his trauma, let me ask you this: Have you considered how awful it would be to have a queer character's individuality and emotional depth completely ignored for the sake of focusing on the queer character that "really matters"?

If Mike's own issues, with his queer identity and otherwise, aren't thoroughly explored... What's the point of all this? If Mike really is insignificant in this storyline and his individuality has no effect on it.. where's the emotional payoff? If his perspective doesn't matter... Why have the writers gone to such great lengths to ensure we don't have that piece of the puzzle yet?

Analyzing Mike and understanding Mike is very important to understanding byler. Once again, I think it's crazy that this needs to be said.

I also think it's important to note that characters can have similar struggles. There's no rule against that. Just like real life. Characters having similar struggles is not a bad thing, and acknowledging that their struggles are similar is not dismissive of either character. We're talking about STRANGER THINGS. Jonathan and Nancy's thing is "we've got shared trauma". They have literal matching scars. Shared experiences are some of the main building blocks for this show's romances. Byler has a TON of shared experience, basically their entire lives. We already know that. So wouldn't it be so beautiful for them to learn that they've been struggling with the same thing this whole time? That the entire time they felt alone in what they were going through when really they had each other and they never even knew it? Wouldn't it be so beautiful for Mike's acceptance of Will and Will's love for him was also a step toward accepting himself? Wouldn't it be beautiful for Will to learn that his love makes Mike feel like he's not a mistake? None of that would be in the realm of possibility if Mike didn't have emotional depth and if his individuality wasn't important.

And that leads me to my concluding point...

A satisfying execution of byler endgame hinges on Mike's individual emotional arc being handled well

God I hope this isn't controversial to say. I sincerely hope most people haven't forgotten that.

Here's a hypothetical:

Imagine season five has been released. You're watching it, and you notice that Mike has been relegated to just a supporting character for Will. We don't get any of his perspective. We don't get any explanation for his s3 and early s4 behavior. His breakup with El doesn't have any real tangible effect on him, it's really just used for El's character development. We never see him pining for Will like we saw Will pining for him. And then suddenly Mike is learning about the painting and then suddenly he's confessing his love and then suddenly byler is canon and official.

Now wouldn't that just be awful? Wouldn't that be unfair to the audience, to Mike, and to Will? For us to never learn just how much Mike had to go through to even be able to say it out loud? For Mike to never get the chance to prove to himself through word and action that he is the heart? For Will to never get an explanation for why things did get so "weird" between them? It would leave us with one big, nagging question: What was the point of everything Mike has said and done throughout the entire show if his conclusion is that lackluster?

Disregarding Mike for a moment (I know that's incredibly ironic given what the entire point of this is but just bear with me) - how would that be a satisfying conclusion for Will? I mean, Will's s4 arc was basically dedicated to showcasing his struggle with his sexuality and with his love for Mike. We were shown just how deep that love is. We were shown how patient, unselfish, unwavering, and beautiful that love is. So how would it be satisfying for Mike's love for him to not be shown with just as much depth? How would it be satisfying for Mike to just be a one dimensional character whose s5 arc is essentially "break up with girlfriend, wait to find out best friend is in love with him, say he loves him back, then they live happily ever after"? I think Will deserves for his love to be returned with the same intensity at which he gives it. And I think it should be clear to the audience and to Will himself.

Back to Mike!

Mike has been through so much shit. I don't think anyone that is denying that actually believes he hasn't been through shit. Because you'd actually have to watch the show on mute and with your eyes closed to think this kid hasn't had just the worst time. It's so ignorant to act as if this stuff hasn't affected him. There's stuff we've seen but there's stuff we also haven't seen. There are issues he has that date back to his childhood pre-canon. Just like Will, Mike has been a queer kid growing up in 80s smalltown conservative america. Acknowledging the pain he 100% carries because of that is so important. His perspective has been withheld from us, not because it's unimportant, but because it's the final puzzle piece. If we had Mike's perspective in s4, byler wouldn't be a "will they won't they" (even though we all know they will). If we got his perspective in s4, byler would be a "100% certain without a doubt they will". But the thing about his perspective is that it's so much more than just loving Will. It's fear. It's pain. It's insecurity. It's doubt. It's the belief that his happiness just doesn't matter all that much. All of that has to be explored. All of that has to be laid out in the open for us in order for byler endgame to feel earned. Mike's emotional payoff will lead to byler's emotional payoff.

Mike has known he loves Will. In s5 we will see him make a deliberate and active effort to overcome the things keeping him from doing something about it. And then he will do something about it.

And so when it finally happens. When both Mike and Will finally know that their feelings are requited, and when their arcs end with us knowing that they will face whatever life has in store for them together, that will feel earned. That will feel like the logical conclusion for both of them. Not just for Mike. Not just for Will. For both.

And Mike is just as important to that conclusion as Will is.

And one last thing...

Some people are going to talk about Mike more. Some people are going to talk about Will more. Because newsflash, people have preferences. Some people just relate to Mike more, or they find his emotional arc extremely compelling, or they just like him. It isn't an attack on Will or any other character. No one is saying Mike is more important than any other character (I'm sure there are people that say that but they are a vocal minority and they are simply wrong). We are just saying that he is important. If you wanna engage in media analysis, please understand that "main character" or "central character" does not mean "only important character" and "only character that should be analyzed". If you wanna talk about Will and only Will, that's fine. But you don't get to act like people that talk about other characters are doing a disservice to your fave, because that's not how any of this works.

#mike defenders i need you to back me up on this #i hope my points come across well #anyway #the way people have been talking about mike lately is so infuriating #its called BYLER analysis because its the analysis of BYLER the ship involving will AND mike #st fandom consistently proving that they have absolutely no idea how fandom works #its almost like people wanna talk about things they care about and you dont get to tell them to shut up #if you dont wanna see people talking about mike you can just mute tags about him #but if you dont wanna talk about mike youre missing a huge part of the byler puzzle and thats your loss #please just let people discuss whatever they want to discuss as long as its not ACTUALLY harmful #sometimes i think y'all are allergic to fun #byler #mike wheeler #mike wheeler analysis #will byers #< this is about him too #byler analysis #byler endgame #stranger things

296 notes · View notes

fantastic-nonsense · 5 months

Text

obviously I'd be thrilled to just get the whole PJO series adapted and then end it there. However: Heroes of Olympus as a story can be cleaned up sooooooo much in a way that PJO just doesn't need to be, and a tv adaptation offers the perfect opportunity to do so

like honestly my hottake is that I think Disney could solve both the problem of adapting a long, convoluted sequel series and a lot of the problems HOO as a story has if they a) do The Lost Hero and Son of Neptune in the same season and b) deliberately wait until the PJO actors are in their 20s to do it

Just thinking about this a bit more:

three 12-14 episode seasons, with TLH/SoN in S1, a modified MoA in S2 that deals with some of the Argo crews' HoH subplots, and then HoH/BoO in S3

Percy and Annabeth are in their 20s and newly engaged when he disappears. This sets up the arc of Percy dreaming about settling down with Annabeth in New Rome in a more organic, functional way and also gives us as viewers a chance to see that the aftermath of the Titan War has resulted in tangible, lasting change for the demigods of Camp Half-Blood

Grover replaces Coach Hedge as the Seven's collective Protector+chaperone, which solves the series' problem of Grover's absence and the absence of the PJO Trio's friendship

the whole show/story takes place over ~6 months instead of the year it did in the books, and Percy+Jason's individual quests happen concurrently (simply not letting Percy sleep for 8 months and making an episode where he establishes himself at the Roman camp for awhile before he's forced on the quest with Frank and Hazel would solve about half of the problems on the Roman side of the series)

Season-wise, things mostly sort themselves out:

The first season starts off introducing the Lost Hero trio and we find out that Percy's missing at the end of the first episode. The second episode opens with Percy waking up at the Wolf House and starting his journey to New Rome. We get one episode entirely devoted to amnesiac Jason and Percy integrating into the new camps, making friends, and learning about their missing counterpart before the quest plots start up.

The season then alternates between Jason, Piper, and Leo's "Find Hera" quest and Percy, Hazel, and Frank's Alaska quest, with intermittent jumps to the Greek and Roman efforts to find Percy and Jason. It ends with Percy and Jason regaining their memories and each camp realizing their leader is on the other side of the country in "enemy" territory.

The second season opens around a month later as the Argo II docks in New Rome. Percy and Jason have both been given time to make friends, integrate themselves into the opposing camp, and become adjusted to a different way of life with all of their memories intact. They haven't physically returned to their home camps as they've both independently come to the conclusion that Hera switched them to initiate inter-camp unity and are wary of doing anything that would disrupt that goal. However, Percy and Jason have both managed to get messages to Annabeth and Reyna respectively at some point in that month, so everyone knows everyone is safe when the Greeks finally arrive in New Rome.

Cue MoA's various plotlines, which would be cleaned up and streamlined significantly while also integrating in some of the HoH arcs like Hazel learning how to manipulate the Mist, Frank learning how to use his shapeshifting powers, Piper coming into her own as a daughter of Aphrodite, Leo's seventh wheel arc and the Calypso subplot, Jason struggling to figure out what his place is, the Jason-Nico friendship, etc. Also set up the Greek v. Roman dispute and Reyna following them to Greece. Season ends with the Annabeth-Arachne confrontation and Tartarus fall.

The third season combines HoH and BOO; the season alternates between Percy and Annabeth's journey through Tartarus while the rest of the Seven finish their various character arcs via gathering the elements for the Physicians' Cure and journeying to the Doors of Death. After they rescue Percy and Annabeth and close the Doors, they plan to head straight to Athens to take on Gaea. Reyna reaches them just after, and Annabeth sends her and Nico off with the Athena Parthenos with Grover as their Protector.

The final battle switches between The Seven+Gods vs. Gaea+The Giants at the Acropolis and the Greeks vs. Romans at Camp Half-Blood. The Gaea plotline is resolved at the Acropolis, the Greek-Roman plotline is resolved as Nico and Reyna triumphantly arrive at Camp Half-Blood with the statue, a functional Greek-Roman working relationship, and the gods' blessing. This helps streamline the mess that was Blood of Olympus and actually provides a workable story resolution.

We get a final aftermath/epilogue episode that sorts out and ties up all remaining plot threads, teases Solangelo, and ends with Percy returning home to see his mom and planning out how to move to New Rome after he and Annabeth get married.

Obviously this is the roughest possible sketch of how it could be done, but I genuinely believe doing something like that could fix some of the biggest issues HOO has conceptually while streamlining all of the quest bloat. It'd be interesting to see them try, anyway.

#pjo #pjo tv #heroes of olympus #hoo spoilers #my writing #.......sort of #percy jackson #annabeth chase #percabeth #jason grace

167 notes · View notes

maxphilippa · 7 months

Text

people not getting nickel at all is so funny to me.

dude. what part of "he was acting out of fear because he didn't want to get manipulated by balloon since he did have story with him back then in s1, and wanted to protect his friends/alliance, and EVEN IF HE MESSED UP A LOT WITH SUITCASE AND BALLOON, it wasn't out of malice, but out of misguided fear and lack of proper communication that turned into something worse due to Nickel's nature." you don't get. it's not about forgetting what he did or treating him as likeable or anything. he very much didn't forgive himself over what happened and let BALLOON HIMSELF KNOW that he DIDN'T have to forgive him. he is OKAY with accepting his faults and with balloon not wanting to be part of that change because HE RECOGNIZES THAT HE WAS AN ASSHOLE TO SUITCASE AND TO HIM. CLOVER'S THERAPY SESSION DID SOMETHING TO HIM. HE'S TAKING ACCOUNTABILITY FOR HIS ACTIONS.

of course i can totally get not liking him on s2, he wasn't really one of my faves but hey! he grew and recognized that what he did was wrong! adam himself said that he did care about suitcase and bb, but his lack of EMOTIONAL INTELLIGENCE doomed their alliance. nickel isn't justifying himself with "oh but i was scared of balloon", he is accepting that his fear towards him changed into something else that he couldn't control.

also btw have you considered that they didn't know what to do with nickel on s2. if you deeply analyze him it makes sense as to why he changed so much on s3. "ohhhhh but he was a dick to Suitcase since the start" again. have you considered that nickel's writing has changed a lot over time. he's pure snark there but even then still cared mid-late s2. i could do a whole separate post analyzing his relationship with Suitcase from both of their perspectives but that's not the point. if that was the point of his thing with suitcase it wouldn't made sense for nickel to say "i just wanted to keep what we had".

AS WELL I WANT TO NOTE SOMETHING. His relationship with Balloon getting better WASN'T out of nowhere. On the comics, Balloon sent Nickel a letter when he wanted to fix things with others, and maybe that was also a factor that played for Nickel too. Remember that Nickel is a guy that acts first and thinks later. As well, Balloon references that Nickel and him used to trick Yinyang back at the Hotel. Nickel changed a lot in s3 and didn't have Baseball who was excusing his unhealthy behaviour either. Box helped these two to grow for the better.

tl;dr: nickel has one of those arcs that i need to study like a bug and everyone still treating him like a villain despite wanting to grow and understanding that his actions were terribly wrong is so funny to me. also balloon very much did end up liking the guy genuinely when they were friends as well. people can grow and change. people who had terrible relationships can heal and can get better.

#inanimate insanity #ii #inanimate insanity invitational #ii 2 #ii 3 #inanimate insanity nickel #inanimate insanity balloon #inanimate insanity suitcase #inanimate insanity baseball #inanimate insanity box #ii nickel #ii box #ii suitcase #ii balloon #ii baseball #max overanalyzes characters

154 notes · View notes

goginaporter · 7 months

Text

lyrical analysis of love you forever

or, breaking down ricky's love (confession) for gina

we're a little under three months out from the series finale of high school musical: the musical: the series. I've spent those months freaking out over rina and appreciating the beautiful arc they got in s4 that closed out their story over the course of the series. there are a million special moments that rina has in s4 (I mean, a rain kiss? can I have this dance? a duet together about their commitment to each other despite uncertainty? we really got it all) but one definitely stands out among the rest. love you forever is ricky's declaration of love for gina that he sings to her at her press conference for her new movie that, as far as he knows, is about to send her across the world. this post is gonna be a line by line analysis of the lyrics, as well as talking about everything that brought them to that moment and that made it special. enjoy <33

I've been wishing on a falling star for too long

this line opens the song and is such a beautiful callback to when there was me and you, the song ricky all but serenades gina with in 1.06 (the lines it references: I thought you were my fairy tale / A dream when I'm not sleeping / A wish upon a star / That's coming true). wtwmay is a song that gabriella sings after troy's betrayal in hsm and when ricky sings this line, to me, it represents a callback to his past relationship with nini. he was holding on to nini and that relationship too tight, wishing on a falling star. as gabriella says, wishes on stars just "don't come true" and for ricky, this relationship ultimately ended in failure. however, as much as this line signifies the crash and burn nature of that relationship, it's also a reference to the start of his relationship with gina in that bunker room as he strummed on a guitar, in a similar fashion to love you forever, to these lyrics.

I've been running, I don't know what from

this line references the conversation that ricky had with ej in 4.05 when ej forces ricky to reckon with the fact that he runs away from those he loves when faced with hard realities and that this tendency hurts both those around him, but also hurts him. it's incredibly full circle when you pair this with the fact that ricky is singing the song on the guitar ej gave him after they sang speak out, where ej tells him that "you'll probably get more use outta this than me" (4.05). i think it's really cool that this line also references gina's similar character flaw of running when things get hard, which she also sings about in second chance (Maybe I'm safer when I'm on the run / No time to open up my heart / Maybe I'll hide behind my walls again / Instead of tearing them apart) (also important to note that second chance is non-digetic and ricky has never heard gina sing these lyrics). so fascinating that ricky and gina have the same habit of running, with ricky running back to things that are familiar and gina pushing forward to leave things in the past before they can hurt her.

But you and I've become a sacred kinda home

this is one of my favorite lines of the song, especially because this theme of finding a home is such a critical cornerstone for both ricky and gina's arcs throughout the show. ricky's home life in s1 turns on its head when he discovers that his parents are separating. pairing this with his breakup with nini nearly sends him into a spiral, but he finds a new home of sorts in the theater program, telling gina "it's just nice to have somewhere to go after school every day, y'know" (1.05), which she herself resonates with, affirming his feelings.

of course, at the beginning of s2, we find out that ricky and his dad are moving to an apartment after his mom moves out. this drastic shift, the loss of his childhood home, is again disorienting, and again paired with changes with nini, what with her moving to denver. in 2.02, he tells nini that she is his home, which is really interesting, placing that kind of pressure on her. but what's even more interesting is that he knows he's moving, knows from the beginning of 2.01, and yet nini does not find out about his new home until 2.03 on valentine's day, months later. this is juxtaposed to gina showing up to his apartment that same episode. it's especially special that ricky is placed in the same situation that gina typically faces, the unpacking and getting accustomed to a new space. it is those undertones that serve as the undercurrent for their conversation. the apartment is in disarray when gina arrives, and remains that way for much of the season. gina, however, is endeared by the messy environment of the apartment and jokes along with ricky to put him at ease. by the time we return to it in s4, it's (naturally) much more lived in, with clothes strewn about, pictures of gina, and aptly placed posters lining the wall of ricky's room.

as I mentioned earlier, ricky calls nini his home in s2. this line says that he and gina together have become a home of sorts for each other. singing this to gina is important for ricky, but it also speaks to the unpredictable nature of gina's childhood, where she moved from city to city, never staying in one place for more than a few months, which she tells ricky in 1.05. by the end of s1, we think that she has to move again, something that's harder for her now that she's made connections with the wildcats, namely with ricky. as we see in the flashback scene in 2.06, she tells ricky that she wouldn't quit on them if not for her move, that they would essentially remain close if she weren't leaving salt lake. of course, she doesn't leave and instead moves in with ashlyn. it's her first taste of stability that she can really remember, but as she tells carlos in 2.04, she feels out of place living in a house she doesn't own and with a family that isn't hers. these feelings culminate in gina wanting to leave, a subplot we see primarily in 2.05 and 2.06. after revealing to ashlyn what she said to ricky opening night of hsm, ashlyn sings home from beauty and the beast to gina, telling her that she has a home with ashlyn, not just physically, but within their friendship. there is so much symbolism in that one scene that we don't have time to get into but this moment definitely shifts gina's perception of what a home can look like. in s3, we learn that her mom is moving back to salt lake city where she'll be staying long-term to allow gina to complete her time at east high. in fact, it's in this very house that we get our first scene of rina in s4, with ricky sneaking into her window. one's room is a reflection of oneself, and ricky and gina are all over each other's rooms, both literally and figuratively, throughout the season. combining this with the connection between the two that only strengthens over the course of the season, it comes as no surprise that ricky sees his and gina's relationship as a sacred home.

I'm in love, I'm in love, I'm in love and I know it / No net, no fear, right here in this moment

my twitter account was littered with theories and thoughts and hopes for ricky's love confession to gina, but whether it was public or private, planned or spontaneous, the one thing that I knew I wanted was for ricky to say that he is in love with gina. so on august 9th when ricky got to the chorus of love you forever, tears started pooling in my eyes because the confession, which was already literally perfect, delivered my biggest wish. one of my favorite aspects of the song is how much it reflects their journey because these are all the words that ricky would tell gina in some big speech, evidenced by him practicing all throughout 4.07. but when it comes down to it, after references to moments between them and beautiful metaphors, it builds to him telling gina not only does he love her, but that he's in love with her. there's no doubt in his mind of this fact. the sky is blue, the sun shines, and ricky bowen loves gina porter. so much of ricky's love for nini was tied to fear, especially a fear of change. that his love for gina transcends fear, that he is confident in what he tells her both shows his growth in romantic relationships but also in how much gina has redefined what it means to love someone for him.

I've never been more sure of what I got, yeah / Cause this is so much more than puppy love, so

continuing with the theme of confidence, ricky tells gina that he's never been more sure of what he's got in their relationship. I know I'm bringing rini up a lot but that relationship is a perfect frame of reference for how much ricky has changed when it comes to love. both his singing of I think I kinda you know in 1.01 and his love confession to nini in 1.10, while genuine, are riddled with stuttering and uncertainty ("I think", "I don't know", etc.). when you compare the ricky of 1.01 and the ricky of 4.08 and how he attempts to use song to profess his love, the differences are stark, and that's the point. as he all but said in 3.08, everything he's known about love has been changed by gina and that is reflected in love you forever. I love the puppy love nod and think it's narratively important for so many reasons. for one, it's a reference to their first date, as well as to gina's childhood. in that vein, it seems to mirror what gina tells ricky in 4.02, that mack was a crush of her childhood. calling what they have "more than puppy love" also nods to their growth, not just over the course of the series, but even throughout the season. from dealing with scrutiny in the fallout of the documentary to gina's increasingly busy schedule to their temporary pause to gina nearly moving across the world, they've been faced with many problems, and while they didn't handle all of them perfectly, they handled them together and came out that much stronger.

I'll say it first, no matter what the cost / Here I am full heart, full stop / I love you

in 3.05, ricky talks to jet following the fallout of the real campers of shallow lake drama. he asks jet what he's running from and tells him that sometimes when feelings are hard to articulate, it helps to sing instead. with love you forever, we see ricky taking his own advice. I love that ricky is insistent that he tells gina "I love you" first, both because he wants to rectify mistakes from his last relationship, but also because gina says, in a talking head, that she doesn't want to be the first to say "I love you," (4.06) further cementing the connection that rina has. it also affirms that there is no doubt in either of their minds that they love each other and want to say it to each other. it's also important to note that ricky understands the risk of singing this song at this point in time. for all he knows, gina is about to board a plane that will be taking her to the other side of the world for six months. however, he sings this song, affirms his love for her, no matter the cost, because he just wants her to know. he loves her in salt lake, he loves her in new zealand, and he loves her forever. ricky sings that he is there with a full heart, full stop I love you. in an interview after s3's finale, tim federle, the showrunner, states that while nini will always have a small part of ricky's heart, gina has a way of making hearts race. this line, to me, symbolizes the notion that gina is his heart, that his love for her encompasses it. there's a beautiful analysis of ricky being gina's heart canonically that I think helps tie all of this together, establishing that gina is ricky's heart, just like he is hers.

of course, I would be remiss to not talk about the full stop of it all. as we see in a flashback in 4.06, ricky opens up to gina in their first meeting about how he struggled saying I love you to nini, his ex. after hearing this, gina presents him with a possibility you can tell he's never considered: "maybe you just don't love her, full stop." ricky stutters in response, but doesn't fully negate gina's statement, in fact telling her that he's "kinda" planning on telling nini through song later that night outside her window (ironic that this plan doesn't pan out for him twice in the show, both here and in 2.03). that he brings up this notion of full stop, where there's no room for doubt, in his confession for gina further proves how deep and real and true their love is for each other. super small thing before I move on but I love how "I love you" gets its own special moment of pause in the song to fully communicate the gravity of such a statement.

I never knew that I could feel so sure and so strong /How can three old words feel so brand new?

Again, this idea of being sure comes up again in this second verse/buildup to the chorus. ricky has done the love confession before. he's been in love before. but again, with gina, it's different. it's deeper, more strong, more secure. and so when he says these words, in a situation that mirrors his audition for hsm, of course it feels different. in that auditon, he was singing nini's words back to her. love you forever, in contrast, is all ricky. those three words do feel new because now he's singing them to gina and for gina, where previously he sang them for himself. also a really cool note about the parallels between ricky's audition and love you forever is that tim federle released the initial script for love you forever, and one of the descriptions writes that ricky "launches into the audition of a lifetime." this song, this confession, is the start of his forever with gina. of course these words feel new.

Mm, so rare, so real right here in this moment / And I'm starin' at the only thing I want, so

I tear up hearing ricky say that the love that he has for gina is both rare and real. both ricky and gina, at different points throughout the show, cast doubt on love. ricky says in a talking head in 1.01 that love is dead (fun fact: ricky is wearing the same denim jacket from that talking head during love you forever teehee). gina, in the 4.06 flashback, calls love lame. their faith in love ebbs and flows throughout the show, but once they are together, there's no question. it's why ricky encourages the seblos reconciliation in 4.06 or why gina tells jet to confess his feelings for kourtney in 4.08. if they've found this beautiful love in each other, where they got a second chance on love in every sense of the words, why wouldn't they want that for everyone else, for the people that they love?

the second half of this lyric, of ricky "staring at the only thing he wants," is my absolute favorite line of love you forever. ricky's eyes are naturally drawn to gina in nearly every episode of the show, whether she's looking at him or not, whether they're speaking or not. even before he recognized those feelings in himself, we could see it because she was always the apple of his eye. this rings especially true during love you forever, where ricky does not take his eyes off of gina the entire song, except when miss jenn turns the lights on. gina is the center of his universe and who he has been drawn to since she entered his life. there was a tweet after s4 aired that stated that ricky looks at gina as though he's falling deeper in love with her every time and this line captures that.

I wanna finish what we started in the stairwell where we met

the bridge opens with this line and it's so fitting. to suggest that committing to loving each other forever is finishing what they started when they had that first conversation in the stairwell is so insane and will always make me spiral when I think about it. this line all but confirms that ricky and gina began to fall for each other in that moment. that their conversation in the stairwell is what catalyzed their respective character arcs also all but confirms that they're soulmates, that there was an invisible string that connected them, inexplicably tying their fates together forever.

I wanna live like I have never even heard the word regret

both ricky and gina have instances that they look back on and wish they had done things differently. gina says so explicitly in 2.05 when speaking to kourtney. she alludes to her goodbye to ricky after hsm's opening night, stating that it was something she wishes she could take back. in 3.06, ricky tells jet that he wishes that he didn't let color war gina slip through his fingers, suggesting that he would've done things differently if he were more cognizant of his feelings for her. ricky never wants to feel like that again, that he's missed his chance with gina due to fear. he wholeheartedly embraces his love for her because he knows what it was like to live without it and doesn't want to live in a world where gina isn't his reality.

I wanna scream what's in my heart and I won't ever take it back

ricky and ej's duet in 4.05 is about speaking your truth and speaking even when it's hard. the song even has a line about "screaming out." where in speak out, screaming out solicits no sound, ricky singing this line in love you forever is him being able to vocalize the feelings in his heart. he also commits to never taking these words back. his feelings for gina are eternal and everlasting. this is important for gina to hear because words have always been unreliable to her. people that she cares about, whether her mom or jamie or even e.j., have made verbal commitments to her at one point or another, and each one of them has later reneged on that commitment, whether intentionally or not. ricky can say these words, can say "I love you" to gina, because he's been saying it through his actions the entire show. gina doesn't always trust words, but she trusts actions. ricky has more than proven his love for her, and it's this continued declaration through his works that allows these words to ring true for her.

'Cause I love you feels a lot like high school and forever after that

I made this observation a couple weeks ago but this line is so fascinating. when the season first dropped and I heard the line, I was a tad confused. what does it mean for love to feel like high school? I was listening to the hsm3 soundtrack when it all clicked for me. in high school musical, the final song they sing in hsm3, the last line is "I want the rest of my life to feel just like a / High school musical" with this line, ricky is basically saying that he will love gina for the rest of his life. throwing in a hsm reference is also incredibly fitting given that they've just completed the first night of their run as troyella, further cementing their legacy as the troyella of the show. i love that, even when the bridge is repeated, ricky and gina are the only ones to sing these lines. when the bridge is sung for the third and final time, ricky and gina are now together on stage singing the words "I"m in love, I'm in love, I'm in love" to each other in between the lines of the bridge. the song closes with ricky singing "I love you feels a lot like high school" with gina singing "and forever after that." I love this ending for two reasons: ending the song with rina singing together re-emphasizes that they're in love, and in love together (for the first time), as tim mentions in an interview. I also love it because even as the wildcats join to sing the bridge near the end of the song, ricky and gina are the only people to sing the lines "I'm in love x3" and "I love you feels a lot like high school." even though their friends step in to sing some lines, ultimately, the song is a love song for gina, about gina, and that's why it ends with her. as tim (love how much I'm referencing him) mentioned in an interview, rina is the beating heart of the romance of the show, and their friends coming in to sing along to ricky's love song for gina fully solidifies this.

162 notes · View notes