#but then like. no idea how to account for... whatever’s going on in s4

[extasiswings]

I said this to others already, but to me this finale had a lot of 4x14 vibes tbh. Season 4 was severely hindered in it’s production due to COVID and i am, to this day, convinced that that’s also what made them tie it up with such a neat little bow before (at least in Bucktaylors case) undoing a lot of it immediately as season 5 rolled around. Essentially giving everyone the happiest ending they feasibly could.

And there’s something to be said about how mainstream tv seems to think that “happy ending” always equals “in a romantic relationship” whether or not the relationship itself is developed or healthy at all, but for two characters with character arcs so intertwined with their love life, it does make sense.

The thing is, to me this makes sense. Am I thrilled? No. But I’m excited to see what they do because I understand how this fits with the rest of the season and I’m not worried about it.

There were three big themes circling around Buck and Eddie all season. 1) missing the things that are right in front of you; 2) fantasy vs reality; and 3) Fear holding you back/preventing you from living your life. All three of these themes are tied together and need to be worked through to get to a place of Buddie canon and Buck’s “I’m already Christopher’s father” realization. But the last one is arguably the most important in order to get to the heart of the others and that’s where I feel like Marisol and Natalia come in.

Buck and Eddie both started the season single. But not because they necessarily wanted to be, because they were afraid not to be. Afraid to put themselves out there, afraid of being rejected, afraid of making mistakes. But being single out of fear is not the same thing as wanting to be alone or being comfortable with your life as it is, it’s just letting fear control your life. So the way I see it, if they had ended the season still single, that would have changed nothing from where they started.

For Eddie especially, this is a baby step but a necessary one. Whatever happens with Marisol, Eddie’s going to wind up on the other side with some confidence in himself and his ability to be a romantic partner and that’s what he needs to ultimately be secure enough to put himself on the line and really be honest with Buck. It’s low-stakes, it’s fluff, but I think it’s good for him.

For Buck, I disagree with the idea that he is inherently repeating the same mistakes. Yes, it’s not an auspicious start, but we as the audience see things that Buck doesn’t, and also there are some pretty key differences between Natalia and Taylor. With Taylor, they had a preexisting relationship. Buck knew going in all of the things about her that were dealbreakers for him, and instead of being true to himself, he told himself that he could “learn to live with it” and stayed with her for a year. With Taylor, he knew she was fundamentally a person whose values conflicted with his going all the way back to Dosed. He never should have dated her to begin with.

By contrast, he’s been on exactly three dates with Natalia. He barely knows her, and by all accounts she seems like a perfectly nice person even if someone who isn’t ultimately going to work for him (which is something that has been projected to the audience, but not for Buck). She hasn’t done anything wrong (it was pretty reasonable for her to feel overwhelmed and leave when Kameron crashed their date) and there’s nothing about her so far (in her personality or otherwise) that shows Buck is compromising himself and settling. Right now he’s clinging to a woman he wanted to date and get to know better anyway because she wants to be with him too and he’s feeling vulnerable—okay? He wanted to be with her though, I didn’t get the impression this was just about him being afraid to be alone (the way I felt about BT all through S4-S5). If they’re still together after the hiatus when they’ve known each other for more than five minutes and been on more than three dates, and we have actual evidence of him compromising himself where he shouldn’t? Then I’ll be agree that he’s repeating the same mistakes. But if anything right now I’m assuming this is his chance to prove his growth when he is ultimately put in a position to do better—that when something significant comes up he will be comfortable enough with himself to break things off instead of settling for what he doesn’t want. In the meantime, idk about y’all, but it takes me more than three dates to figure out if someone I’m interested in is going to be a good fit for me in the long run. And in a similar vein to Eddie needing to gain some confidence in his ability to be a romantic partner, I think Buck needs to be able to prove to himself that if he’s put in a situation where he’s settling, he’s capable of walking away. And for both of them I think those are important steps for them to take before they’re ready to be together.

#chapel talks #anonymous

[titlemewickedwonderland]

Tell The World - Joseph Quinn (One-shot)

Prompt: "What's a Soulmate?"

Pairing: Joseph Quinn x You

Genre: After 1 year of dating it's time to let the world know

W.A.C Winner: @reidsog

Auth. Note: Thank you so much for the patience on this one! I had to rewrite it so many times! I hope you enjoy it and thank you so much for the support on my account!

You loved your job as the Stranger Thing's Social Media account admin. You loved seeing the comments that crossed your screen knowing that those reactions from little behind-the-scenes videos and photos you posted would make the day of a fan. What you loved most of all was the fact that you could do all that and more while being surrounded by the people you love and experience those fun memories together with them while posting them for others online to join in on those sweet and fun moments. You've been working for the Duffer Brothers since day one of shooting for Stranger Things. You were highly recommended since your degree was specifically for this sort of work and you had experience doing it for others. You enjoyed watching the kids grow over the years from S1 all the way to S4 which was what was being shot this year. You'd met many people who you'd befriended along the way and still talk to even after they were killed off the show and contract over with. You were just that sort of person. You were, in all senses, part of the family by that point since you've been part of the crew and you would not be boasting when you say you are very much loved by both cast and crew of this series.

You weren't complaining though. You enjoyed working for the Duffer Brothers; there weren't always rainbows and sunshine of course but it made up for the fact that you were around some great kids and then there was the fact that if you weren't working for the brothers then you wouldn't have met your boyfriend. You'd met Joseph Quinn at the beginning when the script for S4 was being looked over and you sort of just clicked during the course of the meeting. You hadn't realized you'd seen his face before on screen until you began talking and discovering the different movies he'd been in over the years. You'd known him for 3 years by now but you guys hadn't made it official to the public yet that you were dating - it has been a year ago when you woke up with a splitting headache in a hotel stark naked under the sheets. It was not as awkward as you guys had thought it'd be and it wasn't until you both realized how natural it felt to the both of you to wake up to each other that you finally sat down to talk about it - the past is history and you couldn't be happier; well, that's a bit of a lie. See, you guys have been keeping your relationship a secret from the world even if Joseph's fellow cast members know already. It was mostly to keep you out of the spotlight as much as possible so that you didn't get overwhelmed and boundaries crossed as Joseph's career sort of rockets off with this show. He wasn't sure how the fans would react if they knew he had a girlfriend and at first, you understood but you wished that you could go out and have dinner together without having to worry about being spotted by paparazzi or be able to post cute selfies together with you're boyfriend without having people jump on it like a pack of hyenas. You didn't mind the thought of it but you weren't sure how Joseph felt about the idea of going public since you avoided the subject - until now.

So, as you trotted down the stairs into the living room; dressed comfy and ready for the night in some gym shorts and one of Joseph's oversized T-shirts, you spotted Jamie and Joseph sitting on the couch laughing together while watching TV late at night when the rest of the kids were off asleep or doing whatever in their rooms. Your bare feet made your approach almost soundless so you enjoyed the little jumps the boys made as you flopped yourself on the couch between the pair of them. You'd grown very close with Jamie over the few years since you met Joseph since the men were very close being both British and on the same show together so it was only natural for you to kick your legs up onto Jamie's lap while you lounged your upper body against your boyfriend's side.

"Watcha watching?" you pipe up tilting your head up to look at Joseph's face.

"Hi, love. I dunno, I don't remember the name of it but it's funny." his dark eyes crinkled at the corners as he smiled down at you and leaned down to press a kiss to your forehead. The tickle of his mustache scratched against the soft skin of your brow as you leaned into the tender press of lips making you smile in return.

"What no love for me? I'm hurt darlin! I thought we had somethin' here!" Jamie teased as his long slender fingers messaged your bare calves drawing your attention to him for a moment.

You nudge his thigh with your foot and give him a cheeky smile. "You know I couldn't forget you if you tried Jamie. You're like an annoying itch that just won't go away." you tease. Granted, it was rather true. There was no getting rid of Jamie anytime soon; he was too much of a sweetheart to forget and just ignore after the show was done filming not that you wanted to shoo the musician actor away.

"Aw thanks, babes." he gave playful kissy noises before reaching over to grab his vibrating phone on the armrest to see his girlfriend trying to facetime him. "Ah! That's my cue to leave! Gotta take this."

You slide your legs off his lap and curled them on the sofa beside you as he rises. "Tell Jess I said hi!" you chirp with a smile as the tall blonde headed out of the room and headed upstairs towards his room with a wave before his voice could be heard as he answered his phone.

Once it was just you and Joseph you guys had enough room on the sofa to fully relax further into the sofa. His frame slinked to lay flat on his back while he watched TV and you draped on top of him as his hand lazily dragged along your spine comfortingly. You loved moments like this when neither of you had work to worry about and could just relax in each other's embraces and be comforted by each other's presence. But tonight, you had something on your mind that you wanted to talk to him about. So once a commercial came on the TV you shifted to raise yourself partly off of him and look down at his sleepy face. He looked up with a curious look as you perch on his waist looking down at him.

"What's the matter love?" he asked softly as he saw the nervous look on your face. His hand raised to brush along your cheekbone as his dark puppy eyes searched your face for signs of distress.

"Joe…I've been thinking," you mumbled softly and lean your face into the warmth of his palm.

"That's never a good sign. Am I in trouble?" the man teased making a smile tug at your lips and you lightly smack his chest before he had the chance to grab your hand and bring it to his lips to give your fingertips a sweet kiss.

"No, you're not in trouble. I've just been thinking about our relationship…and I was wondering…" you bite your lip a little scared to say it. "I'd like to take our relationship to the next level."

His dark brown eyes widened comically and he nearly choked on his own spit as he pushed himself a bit to sit up making you slide from his waist to sit on his thighs instead. "B-babe, I would love to do that…it's just I was hoping you'd give me a chance to get a ring first before-"

You clamped a hand over his mouth and felt a flush grace your cheeks. "I'm not talking about marriage Joe. I-I mean not yet. I know It's only been a year but that's not what I'm talking about…I want to make it public. Our relationship. That's what I mean…I don't want to hide it anymore…I know it was for the best in the beginning but I'd like to think we've already passed the uncertainty stage of our relationship babe…" you look down at his T-shirt as you play with the fabric nervously. "The longer we keep it a secret the more it makes me feel as if something bad is going to happen or that you don't love me or that you're having some sort of doubts about our relationship; which if that's the case you gotta talk-" Joseph's strong arms wrapped around your waist to pull you closer and his nose nudged at your cheek as if he could feel the panic begin to form a ball in your chest.

"Baby hey! Darling breathe it's okay! Look at me, love." his hand raised so that your uncertain gaze fixed on his dark brown ones that looked at you with understanding and reassurance.

"There is no doubt. I don't doubt that I love you. I don't have second thoughts about our relationship. I would love to scream to the whole world that you're mine. I just wanted to make sure that you were comfortable with the idea…I didn't know that it was making you second guess yourself." his face shifted to one of guilt as he stroked your cheek; the press of his palm to your face not giving you a chance to look anywhere but him. Not that you would ever want to with those big brown eyes of his.

"We never really talked about it before after we said to keep things quiet…I just…I'm ready to let everyone know regardless of what will come. I don't want to hide, but I don't want to do it if you aren't ready for what will come afterward; you know there will be some backlash. I should know, I'm the one who sees all the comments on the social media pages as a living." your lips quirked up a bit into a small smile.

Joseph chuckled shaking his head. "I admit we probably should have talked about it sooner. I'm sorry I made you feel that way. But I'm as ready as I'll ever be. I don't care what people say because I fucking love you. Always." he nuzzles his nose against yours and your smile grows larger as you wrap your arms around his neck and squeeze a bit; drawing him closer and allowing your foreheads to press lightly together.

"So you'll tell the internet?" you asked hopefully

"Pick the social media account and the time; I'll be there," he told you with genuine warmth.

This was why you loved this man. He could be goofy as hell, and shy in public, but he was a sweetheart with such a pure soul. You were so freaking blessed to have him in your life. That much you tried to portray as you lean over to kiss him sweetly on the lips for a few seconds before pulling away to look down at his dark eyes as he smiled up at you.

"Let's do it tomorrow. You don't have filming tomorrow." you offer tilting your head and he grinned.

"Tomorrow it is! Just warn me before you start live streaming so I don't make a fool of myself." he joked tickling your sides and making you squeal with laughter.

"Deal!" you say before giggling and launching your weight into his chest and pressing your lips against his knocking both of you onto the couch.

~

You didn't know why you were nervous but you were. You loved going live and interacting with your followers; being on live and posting social media content was what you did for a living but this wasn't for the Stranger Things Fandom, this was for you and Joseph. This was all about the pair of you and god only knows what will happen when you finally allow the news to reach everyone. You chose to go live on your personal account on Instagram since that was mostly what you worked on; a lot of the followers of the Stranger Things fandom followed you because you had added your Insta tag to all of the accounts since you were the admin and mod of the cast's social media just in case there were any issues or messages that needed to be sent through or situated. Not that you minded. You often posted some behind-the-scenes selfies with yourself and other cast and crew. As someone who was with this fandom from the very beginning, you had a large number of followers so you knew as soon as you go live that notification will pop up on so many other people's phones and they'd tune into your live stream. The only difference this time was you'd be with Joseph at your side. You chose to take a walk into the garden that was outside of the boarding house for this part because frankly, you didn't know how you'd react to having your friends watching and making comments about it. So while the sun was still shining high in the sky and the scent of flowers and earth wafted around you; the pair of you chose to take a seat at a picnic table in the shade.

"Are you ready for this love?" Joseph rubbed your back as you fiddled with the phone trying to position it perfectly to center the pair of you as you sat beneath the shade a large tree.

"As ready as I will ever be! We can't hide forever baby," you tell him with a small but nervous smile as you lean yourself against his side. He smelled good; the cologne he wore was a comforting scent that was so familiar as it invaded your senses and you were thankful you weren't doing this alone.

"Then let's do this." a brief kiss to your temple was all you needed before your finger pressed the live button.

It didn't take long for the fans to start popping in and saying hello. At first, it seemed normal; hellos and how are you's up until they realized that Joseph was there too as he shifted a bit beside you to get better on screen. One arm wrapped around your back to grab the bench seat next to your hip as he leaned closer to peer at the comments section.

"Hello, guys! Welcome! I know I haven't gone live on here very often. I do apologize about that." you squint as the comments started coming in quicker "Ah yes, you see I have a special guest! Yep. Say hi to Joseph everyone!" you playfully raise a hand to squish your boyfriend's cheeks as he played along by giving little air kisses as his lips puckered from your fingers squishing his face.

"Hi everyone. How are we?" he leaned closer to look at the comments. So many people were commenting 'hellos' and some asking for a shoutout or to say their names. It was all overwhelming and you could see the video in front of you on the screen as his eyes shifted trying to read every comment that scrolled in; how adorable.

"Sooo. This live stream isn't my usual. I..well technically, we have some news!" you smile at the camera as you see more comments. "Good guess eddie_Munsonlover!" you grin.

"That's right. So, some of you guys have been speculating for a while now due to the posts circulating on the social media pages that Joseph is romantically seeing someone." you began ignoring the other comments in favor of spitting out what you needed to without distractions. "As his personal social media account assistant, I have permission from Joseph to put some rumors to rest and confirm some suspicions." You lick your lips nervously trying to keep that bright smile you usually wear.

The gentle squeeze to your waist from Joseph's hand there made your body subconsciously lean into him for support as well as gratitude as you finally break the news as you see messages commenting about 'look how he's holding her!' and 'omg he's so sweet! I wish I was her right now!' in different formations scrolling through.

"Joseph is indeed dating someone." you look up at Joseph and he tilted his head down to look at you with a cute little smile before nudging his nose against your playfully.

When the pair of you looked back down you could see so many people in all caps going wild at the little interaction. "Joseph and I have been dating for the past year!" you finally declare. "Now now please be respectful in the chat. No - I told you so's-." You pointed sternly to the screen before smiling with a little laugh.

"We were hoping to keep it under wraps for a while as I am not someone who often shows my face and didn't wish for the internet to break but Joseph and I have agreed it's about time we let the world know that we are dating and have been for a good bit. You guys are, of course, more than welcome to ask some questions if you'd like. If not we are more than happy to fill in" you stopped speaking when you saw the comments; a grin plastering on your face as people either gushed, screamed in all caps, or straight up emoji cried over the news.

Of course, there were some bad ones in there too but you ignored those; never can please everyone so you focused on the positive. So instead you look to Joseph who was busy grinning at the camera kind of shy as he read and even giggled a bit at the comments below up until you noticed what he was laughing at and turned to see that some of those usernames that you saw were actually…your jaw dropped.

"Jamie! You little shit head!" you laugh covering your face as you realized your best friend had popped on the live stream to watch and was commenting hilarious stuff in the chats that were making the other fans go crazy. You could practically hear his goofy fake girl voice asking questions like an obsessed fan and it only made you cackle even harder because you could only imagine him in your mind acting like a little school girl while he did those voices. The image made you laugh so hard that you were leaning into Joseph to help you upright.

"Oh look hi Maya!" Joseph waved to the camera and you popped your head up to see that indeed Maya's comments were popping in like a straight-up fan girl only causing to rile up the crowd.

"You guys are so dead." you didn't mean it but you were so happy your friends were there to support you. It took a few minutes of bantering before you finally settled down to try and answer some questions

"Alright. Let's get down to the Q&A before we get off track here" you squint reading different questions to see which one they wanted to answer.

"How long have we known each other?" you look over at Joseph who smiled and pretended to think as his dark eyes lifted to the trees above you.

"Technically now about 3 years, I think?" he cocked his head. "Gosh. It felt much longer than that hadn't it?" he smiled thoughtfully. "But we have only been dating a year as you guys already know," he added waving a hand around

"How did you two meet?" you read another comment and looked back at Joseph.

"Just through work, I guess. See, she's been with the Stranger Things cast long before I ever came along. From the very beginning so I sort of just slid in there for the season and we clicked instantly." Joseph shrugged not knowing how to answer in a more entertaining way but the fans seemed to love it anyways

"Oh here's a good one, love. What's your favorite thing about each other that made you fall in love?" Joseph read that one and looked over at you with a big smile that was filled with cheesy warmth and a playful twinkle in his eye. Even with that goofy grin on his face, you could tell he was eager to hear the answer.

Feeling a blush cross your features you looked down at the table and picked at the chipped wood as you felt the urge to hide overcome you. You weren't particularly shy unless it came to be all lovey-dovey in front of hundreds of people after so much of just you hiding away from the public eye when it concerned the British actor. But you loved the question and you couldn't help the way your voice became soft as you answered the question

"Hmm well, that is a good question. I would love to say it's his pretty face, sweet soul, and goofy personality which of course is part of it but the thing you guys don't often understand is that there is so much more to a person than what they let you see on the internet. I think my favorite thing about Joseph is simply how genuine he is and just how much his heart is open to people. He is so caring and loves without apologies. He doesn't have to apologize to anyone for the way he acts and you know just by one meeting with him that he was raised with respect for people." you smile thoughtfully before looking over at your boyfriend.

"He isn't perfect but he knows how to make me feel like I'm the only girl in the world he'll ever need. I used to dream about someone like him. To hold me tight and see me through times that are hard. To love me at my lowest. To stay with me whenever I'm scared and now that I have you I don't know what I would have ever done without you. Sometimes it scares me how much I love and need you. When I look at you my heart melts to the floor because every day I find something new to love about you more and more. I can't deny that a heart like yours is very rare; I feel so blessed to have the chance to know someone like you." you could see the tears glistening in his eyes and you felt your own start to sting.

"Sorry was that too much?" you laugh a little but his head was shaking as he hugged you to his chest and buried his face into your neck.

You hugged like that for a few moments before he pulled away wiping at his face. "I don't know if I can beat that answer." he laughed a bit. "Give me a second will you?" he rose from the picnic table and got out of view.

You giggled wiping your own eyes feeling slightly guilty for making him cry but at least they were happy tears right? While he composed himself you turned your attention back to the phone to see the comment scrolling by quickly. It wasn't until you noticed Joseph shifting behind you through the live stream screen that you turned your head in surprise to see him standing there with something in his hand. You froze a second before turning around on the bench not realizing that the live stream was seeing this real-time in full view as you had shifted away enough to be able to see what was going on.

Licking his lips nervously he slowly knelt down to be level with you. "A few years ago before I ever met you. Jamie and I were just talking the shit like men do, you know? And, at the time he was in this hard spot in his life with his girlfriend back then when he turns to me and asks 'what's a soulmate?' and back then I just froze because…I didn't know. I could come up with so many answers that just didn't fit what that word could possibly mean because it was just so…foreign. Something that people don't talk enough about because it's so controversial. The question stuck with me though…' what's a soulmate?' it was something I thought I'd never truly know the answer to. Until the day you walked into my life with that bright smile of yours." his tongue came out to moisten his lips nervously as he watched your expression; seeing the way you seemed to hold your breath while you stared at him unblinkingly.

"Did you ever figure out the answer to that question?" your voice came out a little shaky and your words brought a smile to his face as if he was glad to have the opening.

Tilting his head his hands that were holding something shifted to open the small black box to reveal a ring resting in the soft silk cushion as he reply. " It's uh… Well, it's like a best friend but more. It's the one person in the world that knows you better than anyone else. It's someone who makes you a better person. Actually, they don't make you a better person, you do that yourself - because they inspire you. A soulmate is someone who you carry with you forever. It's the one person who knew you and accepted you and believed in you before anyone else did, or when no one else would. And no matter what happens, you will always love them. Nothing can ever change that.” He reached out to take your hand in his.

"This isn't a…a wedding ring. It's a promise ring, the sign of my devotion to you and my love for you. I'm willing to wait for as long as you need me to until you are ready to say yes. But, meeting you made me realize that YOU are my soulmate and I will do whatever and everything I can to make you feel cherished and loved to the fullest extent that you deserve. If of course, you will have me that long?" there was a slight twinkle in his dark eyes

You looked down at the silver ring sitting inside the silken cushion-lined box. You couldn't help the tear that ran down your cheek as you felt the trembling of your limbs. You weren't scared or nervous. That was not why you shook and trembled from the nerves. It was because you couldn't believe this man was so perfect. You couldn't speak around the lump in your throat as you nodded. Allowing the actor to place the ring delicately onto your ring finger. You laughed a little when you saw the utter relief on Joseph's face as he finally looked up at you. You welcomed his embrace as his arms wrapped around you and hauled you up off the bench to swing you around in the air.

"I love you." you smile down at him as your fingers sink into his chocolate curls.

His pink lips parted into a large grin as he met your approach with his mouth to kiss the breath out of you. You were sure to have a make-out session if it weren't for a voice shouting from an open window making you break away to peer up at Jamie and Maya leaning out the window with cheeky little smirks and smiles on their faces.

"You're still live streaming babes!" Maya called down at your red flushed faces making the pair of you turn to realize that you'd totally forgotten about the Instagram live.

"Wrap it before you tap it!" could be heard be shouting from Jamie right before you rushed out a goodbye to the fans; face flushed and eyes sparkling as you ended the live stream.

You and Joseph looked up at each other and grinned before he was bending down and threw your body over his shoulder, snatched your phone off the table before he was damn near running across the lawn towards the house while your joined laughter echoed in the morning air and the rays of the sun making your ring glitter on your finger.

If you love my work please consider reblogging to share with others! Thank you!

#joseph quinn #joseph quinn x reader #joseph quinn oneshot #W.A.C Winner #Wonderling

[rubykgrant]

Theory that I saw and hold as true: Yellow Church is Xi. He's just out in Sidewinder now doing whatever. He's the one needed to complete the Meta but was never found. He represents Desire (2 last traits were Love and Greed, this mixes both). Saw this on a YouTube account that also says the ship at the end of the S4 quest was meant to go to Chorus and that Locus is the Great Destroyer.

Oh, that's a good one! Also, very possible, considering Yellow Church existed in multiple ways (as a time-travel alternate Church, an incorrect memory in Caboose's mind, and then on the outside able to exist with everybody... briefly).

A friend of mine also has the theory of Yellow Church, or "Yurch", is the Fragment designated Pi (and we joked that some of the others would mis-pronounce that as "pee", because he's yellow... like PI-kachu. yeah, that's it), and he represents Apathy (since Yurch was just so DONE with everything, and barely had enough energy to get properly angry). I can't find my re-blogs of the posts my friend made right now (because search sucks), but if they're OK with it, I can @ them~

On the one hand, it is possible MANY more Fragments exist, even besides the ones we momentarily see listed within the series... but my theory is, if they were not yet "prepared" to be used as assistants for Freelancers, they weren't moved into their own individual units, and instead were kept "dormant", their data being stored with Epsilon (so, he actually has the memories of ALL the Fragments, even though he doesn't totally know that there is all this extra information to remember. later, this helps him recover/adjust a little easier, and also shows in how he can sort of do what Alpha WOULD have done, working together with all the Fragments as a system; even though some don't always visually show themselves or outwardly verbalize, they're still IN THERE)

I also had a brief and vague AU thought, that never really turned into anything, but still an interesting concept; at some point, after all the other shenanigans in the series, the Reds and Blues meet a new character who joins their group (no specifics for who they are, but I kinda leaned toward them being a girl, just to have a few more). Eventually, they discover this character is actually an AI in a synthetic human body (I've used that idea before, but in this regard, they aren't an almost-clone of the Director OR Allison, but a combination of both DNA samples that created a new person... so, genetically Carolina's sibling). The AI is RO, a missing Fragment from Alpha who represented Love. Like Church, Ro had some memory loss going on, so they others help them figure things out~

#ask #answer #anon #red vs blue #rvb #ai fragments

[aromanticbuck]

What do you mean about fate and FS and Moustead?

Hello! Thank you for falling for my lil trap!

There is so much because I'm longwinded, have fun with this I got too excited getting to put this all into words.

I've been against using "fate" as an argument for FitzSimmons, specifically, since... 2017? Yeah, that's when that half of s4 aired. I'll give you a SparkNotes version, for anyone who didn't watch Agents of SHIELD - Leo Fitz and Jemma Simmons, who I do love as a ship in the early seasons, I have nothing against the ship specifically, just the "they're fated to be together" argument. They met at the SHIELD academy when they were kids, when Jemma sat next to Fitz in a class and they became... friends? They both thought the other hated them and they were gonna be rivals, while secretly admired each other and how smart they were the whole time. Anyway, now they're married and have a daughter, which is cute as shit, good for them, this is not an anti-FitzSimmons post.

I don't think they're fated to be together.

I use the Framework-created alternate reality to make this point every time. In that reality, Ophelia is the one who sat next to Leopold, and that butterfly effects into them being in a relationship down the line. Ophelia specifically set it up to be that way, I get that, I know that's how the Framework arc worked. My username was HoldenDadcliffe across most social media for 4 years, I know what I'm talking about. But the argument could be made that Fitz would have ended up with anyone who sat next to him in class and engaged with him, whether as a friend or a presumed rival or what have you. That's the only point I want to make. It could have been anyone. In the real world, it was Jemma. In the Framework, it was Ophelia. It could have been Matt, my Bruises Verse OC, it could have been anyone. It was the situation that brought them together, not the universe. That doesn't make the relationship any less important or genuine, it's just a fact.

Anyway, I would argue that Moustead is fated to be in each other's lives, especially if we take the possibilities in Bolivia into account. Not necessarily in a romantic way, because soulmates, or whatever you want to call it, don't have to be romantic. I just think they're meant to exist in the world together, and the universe seems to be encouraging that.

For instance, in Afghanistan, Jay did make friends with Knox first. In canon. They were close, they built explosives together, had to rely on each other to survive, the whole nine yards. They were halfway around the world with only their team to count on and trust. They had to be a family to stay alive. And then Knox did everything he did, and that friendship was obviously completely ruined after that, which meant that one of Jay's most important relationships at the time was just... decimated. He had to find someone who he could actually rely on, someone who wouldn't murder civilians because he wasn't taught to handle his emotions in a healthy way.

Mouse wasn't exactly handling his emotions in a healthy way, either, but at least his poor coping mechanisms didn't have a civilian body count, you know? Like, the only person he hurts is himself? It's fine, he gets better, eventually. But the idea of the universe seeing Jay make a friend, and going "wait, no, not that one, come back here" is just so... *chef's kiss* It's just a coincidence, at that point, but there sure are a lot of coincidences, aren't there?

He gets attached to the one other person from Chicago. The one other person who survived that war zone with him. The one person who kept him sane - who he also kept sane - when they got home and had to navigate civilian life again.

They just work, you know? They balance each other out in so many ways. Jay is absolutely driven by his heart - he wants to help people, he wants to put good into the world and take bad out, he wants to fall in love and have a constant presence in his life. On the other hand, Mouse is driven by his head - he's so smart, and he uses that to learn about computers and the world around him, and he has great ideas. They both rely on those opposites so much that it hurts them. Jay holds onto relationships until they tear him apart. Mouse thinks things through so much that he had to turn to drugs to keep himself from unraveling.

They even go so far as to completely reject those opposites in themselves. If Jay used his head, he'd know to let go of relationships and connections long before they hurt him the way the do. If Mouse used his heart, he'd be less untethered, he'd have more connections to his Chicago life than just Jay. Of course, all of my labels for them are just headcanons, but Jay being aspec and Mouse being arospec adds to this so beautifully.

Even if it is all coincidence, that balance is so important to their relationship. If one goes too far, the other can pull them back, and they really make up one fully functional human being together. They share a braincell, for sure, and Mouse usually has it. Jay certainly didn't have it in s5, that's a fact.

I think, with Jay leaving the show - and rehashing the same speech that Mouse gave him with only slightly different wording - the universe might be pushing them together again? Obviously, canon hasn't mentioned Mouse since s4, and we're never going to know if they're actually serving their country together again, but I can pretend. I can pretend that the person Jay called his best friend is still in his life, somehow.

But especially with how s9 went, and that whole year leading up to Jay leaving for Bolivia...

Even just starting with the Knox episode, 9x03, that had to bring up memories that he hasn't thought about in a while. I'm almost certain that he came across a few pictures of Mouse while he was doing his digging, even if we didn't get to seem them on screen.

After that, I want to bring up 9x09. Lovingly, the rushed marriage episode. (I love Upstead, but their romance arc was rushed and if they, the writers, had taken the time to develop the relationship more, they could have navigated the distance much more easily, or at least put off the actual wedding until Jay made his way through his crisis and they were both in a more stable place, but that's just my opinion and not the point of this post, ignore me) I just think about that episode a lot in a Moustead context because of what made Jay panic and rush into it like that. They had to get the FBI off of Voight and Hailey, obviously, but the steps they took had to be personal to him, at least in the context of his friendship with Mouse. A young, queer-coded drug addict, who was the same age that Mouse was when they met, using him and this weakness (that Jay canonically doesn't judge, he literally gave Mouse drug money in s1) and holding that over his brother as leverage, it's... He saw the lowest point of his best friend's life right in front of his face, something that he couldn't fix before and can't fix now, and Jay...

Jay, who just wants to help people, and put some more good into the world, and fix things because he hasn't had much control in his life and now he's older and stronger and he can do something. He used this intimate knowledge he has of people in that situation for his own personal gain, in a way, and doesn't that make him feel so dirty? But he can't think about it too hard, because he's not the one who uses his head. Mouse is his head, the one who would have actually said out loud how stupid and reckless and horrible that idea was and how they shouldn't do it. Because it was exploiting a literal child, who didn't do anything wrong beyond giving into vices. But Jay... Jay is the heart. He finds someone he cares about and he holds on so tight. And he was already engaged to Hailey, so what's the harm in moving the wedding up?

He'd already lost the person he'd been thinking about for months, and it's not like he could just call and ask Mouse to come back to Chicago, not after how things ended. But he could hold onto the people he loved who were close. He could turn an engagement into a marriage. He could insert himself further into Voight's bullshit. He could cement himself in the team and focus on what he had, not what he missed.

Then there was Adam's undercover thing, and the overdose, and even if November 2011, specifically, is from my headcanons, how many times did Jay worry? How many times did he text or call or pop by to make sure that Mouse was high but not in danger? How much did he check in after Mouse's multiple felonies and other petty crimes and make sure he was okay and alive? How many times did Jay have to worry, over their 10+ year friendship, that he'd lost someone he cares about so much?

And then there's s10, with his exit, and that entire episode doing the exact same thing to me, emotionally. 10x03, my beloved, my ride or die, my defining moment... A veteran is doing his best, getting pulled into crime just to pull himself afloat, getting hurt and getting himself killed through that. Isn't that something Jay has seen before? Just with a less tragic finale? Of course he helped clear up the guy's record, so that his family could still get the benefits, and all of that wasn't done for nothing. And then...

He left. He went back to the army, however loosely, basically quoted Mouse's reasons for why - because how else would he explain it? The logic is sound, of course it is, the head handles the logic. Jay just followed the logic laid out for him six years earlier, when his heart finally caught up with it.

And the idea that they somehow ended up in the same area again? Working together and rekindling their friendship now that they're finally on the same page? What else could that be?

It's fate.

#answered #jay halstead #mouse gerwitz #greg gerwitz #greg mouse gerwitz #moustead #cpd #chicago pd #one chicago #brief discussion of upstead #brief discussion of fitzsimmons #entirely neutral opinions nothing negative just a thought process #because i love both ships that's just not what this was about #also this can be read entirely platonic on the jay/mouse front #however you want to vibe with it #winterbonesthings #alex says things #i'm gonna think about them all day

[kamil-a]

end of s4 spoilers hale fic hiiii

when jacob hale looks up, he sees the sky.

it's a brilliant shade of blue. higher up than any ceiling, crisscrossed by wires here and there between buildings. puffs of white, clouds, float lazily across. it makes him dizzy to look at. he sits down heavily on the concrete before he falls.

concrete, there's another new one. well, technically not new, he thinks, but.... no, new, it can be new. as far as he's concerned he's never ever seen it before. he's seen tile and linoleum and sometimes carpet and metal and the rough, chalky surface of typhon itself, but not sidewalk. it's harsh and scratches his hands.

wind. birdsong. he's behind a building, alone save for a few full garbage bins (aerolith standard, familiar) but he can hear the chatter of people walking around, probably doing a great deal better getting out of their pods than he. the rattle rattle rushing-by of people with stretchers for those who have done worse.

uncontrollably, he starts to cry. the sky blurs. he curls up, buries his face in his knees. the fabric of his pants is familiar against his cheek. he cries even more.

he half-expects (hopes?) any second now to hear a whirr from inside his head, and for the tears to stop like a faucet turned off- do not waste fluids, a lecture on the dangers of dehydration. it doesn't happen, of course. he keeps crying. he can't stop it alone.

eventually- he has no idea how long- there is a sound, a chime in his head. general notice. it is sunset, speaker informs everyone. hale lets the broadcast wash over him. your schedule will be delivered individually. you should be wherever you're supposed to be when the sun goes down.

and then, softer, just to him- i recommend watching.

so he looks, of course.

it isn't the quick dimming of lights he's used to. slowly, the sky begins to change. it's almost too subtle to notice it until suddenly there it is, the sky lit up in pinks and oranges. more colors he's never seen before. it's breathtaking. (every breath he does take smells of something new.) he wants to look away, hide his face in his hands, but it has been recommended that he watch this. so he looks. of course.

when it is finally all dark-

well, what did you think of your first sunset?

there is even more of a smile than usual in speaker's voice.

"i-" hale coughs, unused to speaking. his throat is dry. he tries again. it waits for him.

"it's beautiful," he says, more because he thinks it's what speaker wants to hear than anything else. it's objectively true, though. it is beautiful. he just doesn't know what to think about it.

his stomach twists.

you must be hungry, speaker says, but he really doesn't want to eat right now. well, speaker has all the data. perhaps he is hungry.

i would have you report to the cafeteria, but... in this case, i think your current location is an advantage. you will want to stay inconspicuous, and there is very low traffic to this area until the garbage gets removed tomorrow morning. I'll have something brought out to you.

he sits. he thinks about food. fine, maybe he's hungry. after a few minutes a small construct (is that what he looked like?) rolls out to him bearing a container and a large bottle, before sweeping up some loose dirt and litter and rolling away.

I gave you more than your usual hydration portion to account for the lost fluids, speaker explains. the practicality grounds him. he starts out with a sip of whatever it is- the same electrolyte solution as he's used to. emboldened, he opens the container. vegetables, thats something he knows. instant mashed potato. the protein source is unfamiliar, but the smell makes his mouth water. speaker is thrilled about it, so he's fortunately saved from having to ask.

aerolith dynamics is proud to inform you that that is grilled salmon you've got on your plate! So recently brought back from extinction, and immediately jumped to the top three in favorite protein source surveys among our earth division. go on, have a bite.

he bites. chews slowly, swallows. it's not bad. he couldn't say what's in it. salt, perhaps.... lemon?

you don't get that on typhon, do you! speaker sounds smug.

"I've had fish," he says automatically. he doesn't like the dig at typhon's food. he can't explain why. he just doesn't. he takes another bite so speaker won't ask him about it and he doesn't have to admit that the lab-synthezised "tuna fish" sandwich he and some other brave souls tried out at lunch for a week before it was recalled didn't resemble this whatsoever. and that this probably tastes, objectively, way better. his stomach churns. he feels sick. you dont simply skip a meal at aerolith and waste valuable food, and throw off your nutrition plan. he forces a bite of mashed potato into his mouth.

your brain needs proper nutrition to run. as he eats and drinks he can start to see the shape of what bothers him, and it's so stupid. it's embarassing. he can't tell speaker, can't risk insulting it, but he can think the words at least. speaker is in his head but not, you know, in his head.

he's earthstained.

literally- as in, the gravel in his boots and the dirt on the back of his pants. but also, it has only been a few hours and already he has looked up at the sky. he has seen his first sunset, and tomorrow he will probably see his first sunrise. he knows how dark the night gets, the sounds of birds. every breath he takes smells of earth.

when things go back to normal, he-

they won't. not his normal, anyway. he's going to be "set free".

but- he cant help but imagine going back to the only life he knows- if he did ever go back. he would be like all the others, another resident who sighs and says they miss clouds, they miss birds, that they miss the way the air smells after it rains, the air smells so sterile here. someone would say they miss being able to watch the sunset and he would agree. and he would miss the sunset too.

he- sven-he, not hale-he- had been asked for feedback, that time with the tuna sandwich. he'd been the first to take a bite, and he'd said "it's good", earning various doubtful looks from everyone else (and one the nutrition technician will be delighted to hear that, thank you for your feedback.) the person sitting across from him took a bite next. they chewed it thoughtfully, swallowed, and said "it's not bad, but it's not the real thing."

he forces into his mouth another bite of the real thing.

sayer would probably know a story about this.

#sayer podcast #sayerposting #as ive been saying i dont rly have a grip on hales like....internality #so this is my attempt to like do some metaphorical pottery. Im slapping clay on the wheel seeing what happens #sayer banging on the walls of this fic: THE FRUIT OF KNOWLEDGE OF GOOD AND EVIL!!! PLATOS CAVE!!! LET ME IN I CAN DO EITHER OR BOTH OF THOS

[palmviolet]

could you please tell us more about the eddie s1 fic? what inspired you to write it, what can you tell us without spoiling it.

hi! so originally i had the idea for better by you, better than me mainly because i wanted to see eddie and early seasons joyce interacting (coming from my joyce stan roots lol) and the angle to do that in a meaningful way was have him be involved from the beginning. i then saw a lot of tweets about eddie and s1 steve and what that would look like, so i got to thinking — it's also a very rewarding way to explore eddie's character, because you're looking at him nearly three years before the events of s4, so we can see what's changed, what's the same about him, how he got to where he is.

as for the fic itself, without spoilers, it starts at the very beginning of s1 and proceeds through the events of the show, with eddie getting increasingly involved, roped in by outside forces. each chapter roughly corresponds to an episode of the show, though there will be several chapters spanning the gaps between seasons. i'm at around 25k words so far and i intend to take it all the way to s4, and how that's different with eddie having known everything already (so we're looking at a wordcount of 150k+ lmao)

i've also been wanting to do a really deep, close look at eddie and the world of hawkins more generally for a while. this fic is going to be long and packed with detail and it's going to deal with the central themes of class dynamics and masculinity, specifically father-son dynamics, which are alluded to in the show but frequently neglected. whereas for better by you, better than me, they are the cornerstones.

i've got four playlists for this fic, each corresponding to a season of the show — they're completely period-accurate, so for example vol 1 features exclusively songs released in or before the week of the 6th of november 1983, and take into account what was popular in the charts around then etc. they can be found here: vol 1, vol 2, vol 3, vol 4.

finally, here's an excerpt from the beginning!

Bleary eyes and a clang from the door; Eddie wakes to raw ice in his chest and a gritty feeling in his mouth, like road salt. Padded bench thin and utterly uncomfortable beneath him. It takes a second for vision to meet brain and connect; he says a silent prayer for his neurons, fried by whatever Rick gave him last night, those precious little jumper cables. Maybe something really is listening, because, eventually, they spark. He recognises the room.

“He wakes,” someone says. The guy opposite him, an older guy with a belly, baseball cap pulled down over his eyes like a sleep mask. “Thought you were dead for a second there, kid, how much did you drink?”

i'm so excited to start posting it and i hope you enjoy it!

#bbybbt #my fic #steddie #asks

[grey-sides]

Hi! can u write a harringrove story where Steve is getting lifted up by vecna and billy like cranks the radio up and gets him back? idk the idea just came to my head lmao

Hi!! Yes I can!! Here is it, warnings for S4, of course.

If you send me in a prompt, I will definitely try to get to them, but I'm going to be focusing most of my attention to other projects for a bit. So I may be slower fulfilling ideas for a little while.

Since the thing with Chrissy and Wheeler’s friend Fred, the little group Steve is part of has had a rule about going anywhere alone. No one goes anywhere, except like the bathroom, alone so there’s an accountability buddy. But Steve tends to think he’s above everything, like the Upside Down can’t hurt him because he’s gone toe to toe with a demogorgon. Or whatever those shits call it. 

They’re at the graveyard because Wheeler wants to visit her friend Barbara’s grave. She’s been getting the symptoms, the one Max broke into the fucking school to find because she’s insane and Billy loves her fiercely. Billy is waiting in the car because only Steve wants him there and he was not about to sit in the back of Wheeler’s station wagon on their way here. 

And Billy’s seen the shadow before, has done it’s awful bidding so he shouldn’t be surprised that this fucker has tricks up his sleeves too. If he wears sleeves. Billy would like to find him and punch him in his face either way. 

One minute, the little gang is watching Nancy sob over her friend’s grave and the next Steve is in the actual fucking air. Like one minute he’s on the ground where Billy left him and now he’s floating up near the trees. 

The kids start screaming, Nancy actually tries to jump into the air to grab Steve’s leg and Billy is lost for words. This is insane. He needs to get out there, he needs to do something. But screaming doesn’t seem to be helping and they don’t yet have any leads on how to break people out of this spell. Which means Steve is near to death and Billy is frozen in the car. 

He feels as frozen as he did before watching his own hands and his own body pack people into his trunk, feeding them to the monster. The kids are shouting theories from their fucking dungeons and dragon lore and Billy needs to move. Maybe he could climb a tree and tackle Steve to the ground. 

Billy’s not even certain that will work to pull him out of the trance, but he feels like he has to do something. If he can convince himself to stop staring and act. Just act. His eyes dart over to his hand which is moving of its own accord again, he swears. Billy finds himself turning the music up, blasting it louder than he usually does when everyone is in the car. Loud enough to be heard at the gravesite. 

For a while nothing happens, but Billy does manage to climb out of his car. He walks over to see Steve staring blindly up at the sky and the kids are still shouting at each other and at him, trying to figure out what to do. Nancy is still trying to grab Steve’s feet so Billy reaches up and hooks his fingers around his ankle. It’s a stretch, but it’ll have to do. 

“You’re not dying out here, Harrington!” he bellows, loud enough to be heard over Steven Tyler’s wailing. The song playing is Back in the Saddle, the same song that just happened to come on the radio the first night Steve kissed Billy. Billy hopes it still holds a little magic or something. 

Billy starts to sing along, staring straight up at Steve. His voice is a little hoarse, he doesn’t tend to actually sing along to songs much, but Steve needs him. Needs to know he’s not alone out here in this fucking graveyard. 

The kids start to join in, looking at each other when they don’t know the words. Billy knows the words by heart, practically has them tattooed on the inside of his ribs. This song will always mean something to him. Will always remind him of the taste of Steve’s strawberry chapstick that he swears he stole from Nancy. 

For a while, nothing happens, Aerosmith continues to play and Billy continues to sing along and he thinks about his heart breaking in two if Steve dies like this. Before they even know what to do to fix it. 

But Steve gasps and it’s like his strings are cut, whatever was holding him up has let him go and he falls straight down. Billy catches him, getting to his knees so Steve can roll over onto the grass, heaving great big breaths. 

“Steve!” Dustin shouts, the kid has tear tracks on his cheeks which Billy really didn’t expect. Billy probably has them too if he touches his cheek. “Steve, you’re okay!”

“I’m okay,” Steve pants and nods, he holds out a hand towards Henderson, looking over at Billy. “I’m okay. Aerosmith, the song, it like…punched a hole in the vision I was having. Let me see you all waiting here for me, shouting my name.” He shakes his head and smiles tentatively at Billy. 

Billy reaches for him again, touching his face gently. He’s doing okay, though Billy can feel his heart beating erratically where he has one hand pressed to Steve’s chest. “Glad I could help,” he says quietly. 

Nancy sniffles across from them and drops to the ground to hug Steve too, heedless of her skirt. She’s sobbing nonsense about how she should have paid better attention, but Steve keeps shushing her, he’s too kind like that. To ever think that someone should be looking out for him. But he has Billy now, they can watch each other’s backs.

When everyone has calmed down and they’re making their way back to the car, comparing song choices that might help in case anyone else gets caught, Dustin turns to Steve. “I didn’t know you were an Aerosmith fan.”

Steve flushes a little, curling his pinky around Billy’s where it’s not obvious. Even though it probably is pretty fucking obvious since Billy ended up holding him when he survived. Still, it’s the little things. “Billy got me into them,” he says and he looks at Billy. 

Contained in the deep brown of his eyes, there’s a galaxy, Billy is pretty sure. It’s probably why this fucker Vecna decided to target him because Steve is an emotional well, kept under tightly guarded lock and key. But Billy knows the secret now, the same secret that Billy’s known his whole life. 

Billy has found absolution in his music, whether it’s angry metal or soothing soft rock, it’s gotten him through. Through the fear of Neil and the fear of the shadow, through it all. And if music is Vecna’s weakness, well Billy has a whole hell of a lot of tapes and a fucking bone to pick. 

#harringrove #st4 spoilers #greye writes #drabble #anon #stranger things

[purpleheartskies]

If Johnny does make an effort with Robby, how would you like to see it happen? I quite like the idea of a family dinner or something between Johnny, Robby and Shannon where Robby can vent to both of them and Johnny and Shannon can sort their own issues out. Or Johnny having an honest conversation with Robby about his step-dad and how that messed him up and telling him about the he was born and how guilty he feels. Of course, I think both scenarios should include him actually telling Robby he loves him

(This is messymindofmine btw)

I'd love some family moments between Johnny, Shannon, and Robby, like maybe a family dinner or something. But I don't know, I feel like the first one or two of those should be light-hearted so that Robby enjoys them. Or maybe he won't. There is probably so much Robby has to say to them.

I wonder if they'd actually hear him out though.

Shannon has atleast taken responsibility for her neglect and gotten herself help and cleaned up. But in s4 I got the feeling that she didn't really care much about what was going on in his life, "Cobra Kai or whatever". She did raise a red flag about Silver, so there's that. But she wasn't at the avt. Even before the school fight, she referred to Robby as "that kid" because he was rebellious. After the school fight, she used rehab as an excuse not to help look for him and then just handed handling Robby and his situation over to Daniel. I think Shannon has kinda given up on him. She didn't fight for him like a genuinely loving and caring mother would have after the school fight, nor does it seem she made an effort to visit him in juvie. I wouldn't be surprised if, like Johnny, she doesn't even know or care to know the details of what happened.

Johnny has no patience when it comes to Robby pointing out his behavior towards him (let alone Shannon pointing it out his behavior). Johnny just gets offended and angry back at Robby. I think Johnny was only nice to Robby at the end because Robby came to him vulnerable and talked about his own screw up. When Robby came to him earlier in the season, Johnny didn't care what Robby had to say probably because Robby came to him angry. I honestly don't believe Johnny is ready to take true accountability for what he has done to Robby. Johnny has guilt about abandoning him, but that guit is more focused on himself and him continuing to fail, and not about how he has affected Robby's life. After Robby told Johnny how Johnny has made him feel his whole life by abandoning him, Johnny didn't do anything to make Robby feel otherwise, but just continued to abandon him.

Overall, I think Johnny and Shannon don't respect Robby or care about him or how he feels. They're pretty self-absorbed and don't seem to have the patience to deal with him. I'd still give Shannon more credit than Johnny, but I don't see either of them caring about what he has to say to them. They used to leave him to starve and he obviously stole and scammed so that he could survive, and Johnny didn't even care that Robby was homeless for a bit and training with two psychos for months, so that tells us what to expect from them. Robby's life is nowhere and neither of them cares.

Anyway, I think Johnny has to prove himself through actions. Consistent, genuine actions. Robby has said that Johnny doesn't care about him, cares more about his rivalry with Daniel than about him, and chooses Miguel over him. Johnny has to do the opposite permanently because these 3 things have been consistent behaviors on Johnny's part. Robby also said that Johnny now wants a relationship with Robby so that Johnny can feel better about himself, so Johnny's gonna have to prove that he does genuinely want a relationship with Robby. How is Johnny gonna do this? I don't know. Because so far Robby has been putting more effort into their relationship than Johnny has been, and Robby just gave Johnny a free pass with no effort on Johnny's part. So far, S5 Johnny doesn't seem like he cares about how Robby feels. What miracle can get that to change?

I would love to hear Johnny tell Robby that he loves him, and I hope he eventually does... but after he really proves himself. Because so far all Johnny has been is just talk when it comes to Robby, so without the permanent change in Johnny's behavior, the "I love you" or "I'm sorry" will just be more empty words and sharing his own history and trauma will just seem like excuses.

#cobra kai is robby's story #robby keene

[lovecolibri]

SaL anon here friend, hoping that the concert was as spectacular as it looked, even more so in person (if not your outfit definitely was 👍🏽)!! Sorry about not sending an ask earlier, I got sick...again. Anyway I let's talk about 6x11 for a bit because I have a LOT of feeling about it but mostly I'm confused. Nothing about this episode made sense, from the concept itself to its ultimate outcome.

Let's start with concept, which was Buck does "Its a Wonderful Life". So firstly, as I believe you pointed out, Buck isn't exactly comparable to a suicidal business owner. In fact Buck is happier than he's been for awhile, so why this style? His "what if" about Daniel happened last episode after 2 seasons of nothing, he's secure at the firehouse, so what exactly is he questioning? But okay, whatever, this has been on his mind for 2 years (with no indication it was). Buck learns he's happy but others are sad, so he goes back. So ignoring the insult to both Bobby and especially Eddie that their current situation depends entirely on Buck and there weren't other people in their lives that also were looking out for them, how is this progress? First there's the fact that Buck's returning FOR other's to be happy, this is what he does and its not good for him!! Second, the fact that this version of himself isn't particularly appealing to present Buck so he isn't really giving anything up either, so how is this a choice? Finally, Buck himself knows its all in his head!! Its not a given that things will go this way, its just his imagination, logically why put any weight on this at all. The only conflict at the end was does Buck want to live or die and he's not suicidal so its not an actual choice. There is no drama to this and it falls absolutely flat.

So let's say the point is to reconcile him and his parents and understand that it was Daniel's death that made them act the way they did. So are we saying Buck's feelings as a result of that don't matter? Hell, why even have a 2 episode setup in S4 if we're going to magic this issue away with a coma dream (trying to hold back about Chim having a setup with his dad involving similar screentime just for those issues to be waved away as the tertiary plot of someone else's episode)? Wouldn't an actual conversation be more meaningful? The best theory I've seen is that Buck recognizes the significance of his found family while acknowledging he can allow his relationship with his bio family to heal. Great, except the way the episode concluded with the Buckley's being the primary focus doesn't send that message at all. It makes no damn sense!!

And look, as sexy as evil!Buck is, why is he even there. The evil other half trope is to use your insecurities to have you make the "wrong" choice. So how exactly does it work that evil!Buck tries to convince real!Buck that he should stay because "no one needs him", we have half the firefam gone in his dream which immediately negates this idea, AND have Buck say he's going for himself which would hit better if I could figure out when the fuck in the episode he decided this. I mean if its simple I want to live scenario did we need a whole coma dream to get here, Eddie did it over a shortened version of "Carry You". If its to hit the way Eddie's conversation with Ramon hit last season, where the hell is the half season buildup for Buck to realize this?? Sure magic coma dream is fun concept but it fucking needs to make sense and this doesn't!!

Anyway this is way too long and you likely won't have a chance to answer it before next episode but i thought i'd put it out there. Also if your wondering why its one big ask Tumblr stopped letting me post on anon from my phone so I finally made an account (in case you're wondering why someone with a weirdly science specific account is following you).

Hello my friend! The concert was phenomenal! It was like when you run into that super complementary drunk girl in the bar bathroom who tells you your outfit is amazing and you're a beautiful soul, but like, a whole stadium of that. SO many people were dressed up in costume and everyone was just vibing and having a great time. I got a friendship bracelet from a girl who was like, 8. It was a great time even before the show, and then the whole show was just breathtaking! Worth every (considerable) penny. 10/10 would do it again.

I'm sorry you got sick again! 😭 that's no fun! But I definitely wouldn't have gotten to your ask before today anyway since I spent all day yesterday driving and didn't get home until after midnight. But yes, let's talk about 6x11 because "confused" is exactly the right word and how I was feeling and it was soooo frustrating because it kept pulling me out of the episode and then consequently, because of the confusion and messy writing, the emotional beats just didn't land right. And I hate that because Buck learning that he is enough as he is, is SUCH an important theme for him and something I've been wanting for him for a WHILE and I hate that the episode as a whole just...didn't work, and didn't give the firefam care and concern it should have because it prioritized a storyline no one even asked for or wanted and that hasn't come up in like, 2 seasons. (We're supposed to get more firefam care and concern tonight but like, I'm not holding my breath, especially with it being the "fun" part of an otherwise heavy episode.)

"There is no drama to this and it falls absolutely flat" is SUCH a good way to describe this whole thing! Like, right off the bat, Buck knows it's not real so that takes 99.9% of the drama out of the "scary" revelations. No version of an ideal world for Buck includes Bobby being dead, Maddie being trapped with Doug (and unlikely to escape with a child involved and a family that thinks things are fine), and Eddie losing Chris, so there's no question he would even WANT to stay, especially with his parents suddenly being everything he ever wanted anyways! And as you said as well, Buck isn't struggling with his place at work, or his place with the firefam, or even, apparently, with his decision to donate sperm and have a bio child out there in the world that he's just totally cool walking away from! So...what IS he questioning? If they wanted to do an episode about him not feeling like enough why not do it after, say, he tries to donate and it doesn't work, or the family history is a deal breaker, or he decides he can't do this and his old "friend" lashes out at him? OR right after he feels like Bobby doesn't see him as captain material? Put THIS storyline in 6a and it makes far more sense than it does here when Buck is in a really good place! And this was the first of the mixed messages with Buck saying the words he's going back for himself because he's enough as he is, while the whole episode said something entirely different which was that without Buck, no one else would have been happy or even survived, so he's just going back to a world where the people he loves are safe and happy, which is....not really choosing HIMSELF so much as choosing a world were the people he loves are happy.

Which leads to your next point and the next mixed message which was his parents being suddenly the perfect parents in both the coma and real world, while also trying to say that Bobby was his parent and the firefam the ideal family he's always wanted, that are just waiting for him to come back to him. And by trying to do both, the did neither. The firefam got sidelined for the Buckley parents, and the Buckley parents were too busy having to be perfect to actually own up to their mistakes and give their kids a chance to be angry and talk about how they felt! It became a "they're trying so we just need to let it go". Same with Chim and his dad! And all that undercut Buck's choice as well, AND it was his parents only caring about him when he was hurt, all over again! I said in the tags of another post if they had even just dropped hints the past two seasons that Buck was still doing therapy with his parents, and had a good Buck/Maddie convo about how he understands his parents better now and therapy has really helped them communicate better and they understand now how hurt he was by their actions, this would have made more sense, AND given CHIM'S storyline with his dad some time to breathe. Hoping we get more of that but...I doubt it. Again, things that are apparently happening in people's heads but never making it to screen don't count as growth and telling a good story! And it absolutely undermined the WHOLE story of Bobby being a dad for Buck, when he wasn't even in the room for Buck waking up or the one to take Buck home with him when he was released from the hospital, and it undercuts Buck having the family he already wants to NOT see ALL of the firefam taking turns at his bedside to talk to him about what he means to them. (DID WE EVEN GET A BUCKAROO?!)

That conversation at the end between Buck and his mind could have been SOOOO good, because it's something that NEEDED to happen, but the writing was so all over the place all episode and all season that it just didn't land or make sense! Like you said, there's nothing to entice him to stay in the dream world that he already knows is fake and that doesn't have all the people he loves in it, and Buck hasn't been reckless or passively suicidal in ages so it felt like he was fighting so hard for just...no reason. And don't get me started on this being his subconscious and the kind of message that sends about what he thinks about people because while I think it was an oversight by the writers room and not purposeful, surely someone should have caught it? They literally get paid to do this for a living, and NO ONE said anything about that OR about the way the writing contradicted itself the whole damn episode?

I'm just....really disappointed that an episode that COULD have been about the power of found family and the firefam's love for their Buckaroo just for being himself, and about Buck's acceptance of his messy life leading him to the right place and right people and that he doesn't NEED to reconcile with his parents to live a happy life, he can just let that hurt go with some grace and understanding but not a thing he wants or needs to carry for them any longer, turned into...this mess. And the acting was SO GOOD too! Oliver and Peter were just ON IT all episode, and Maddie was making everyone cry, and the brief moments of the rest of the firefam were loaded with the emotion that should have carried the whole episode, but the writing just took the legs right out from under every firefam and Buck focused scene and kept all of it from carrying the weight it should have. And the camera work?! The props?! The flashbacks?! Top tier work! So so good! Literally could have been one of the best episodes ever, but it was just SO let down by the contradictory writing and trying to push this Buckley parents resolution after dropping the plot entirely with no mention for 2 seasons and then pretending that their behavior was normal. And actually having Maddie, Buck, and Chim ALL point out that it WASN'T normal and then just...never following up on that and making it out like THEY are the ones in the wrong! I just...😤😤😤😤😤

ANYWAY

Here's hoping for some good firefam food this week. I wish I could care more about this Wendall storyline but considering we knew he existed for all of 2 minutes before he was killed off I just...don't. 🤷🏻‍♀️

#my sweet nonnie friends #sleeping at last anon #911 #911 spoilers #firefam #evan buckley #this is a buckley parents hate space #the writing was just SOOOOOO messy! when the set up was RIGHT THERE to emphasize the firefam #i don't think the ratings staying super low the rest of the season will get the show canceled #they're not bad enough for that when fox doesn't have a lot else going on #but it could be interesting and lead to some changes which i can only root for #but i feel bad because the cast and crew don't deserve this #and the writers room is trying their best but when the one in charge is the one forcing these opposing stories? #there's not a lot they can do but try their best to make it work #and by golly they put in the WORK in 6x11 but there's only so far that can go #kr go work on a soap opera and leave our weewoo fam alone forever challenge

[starbuck]

This post re: how ‘Dead’ Black Sails characters are was getting long so continuing responses here to break it up a bit! :))

@cptnrackham I’m not considering Treasure Island in a direct sense (re: allotting points) but I do very much have it in mind!

And I also agree that Identity Deaths would be hard to track and would sort of depend on one’s mileage for what “counts” towards that. Like you say, it’s not always a big dramatic moment that we can point to. Additionally, since identity is a very personal, internal matter for each character, choosing to reject one’s identity is always within the control of the character themself. Like, in some situations you could argue that the circumstances forced their hand but idk... I’m more interested in ‘Dead’-ness in a Fate Real sense than I am in the sense of something the characters themselves have control over.

@benjaminagunn Oh absolutely! That’s why I feel like Death Foreshadowing should count for something because Black Sails does not fuck around with that.

Again tho, it would kinda depend on what one’s mileage is for what Counts as death foreshadowing... I get a little creative with it sometimes I think haha

#*MURDER ROPE* #but then like. no idea how to account for... whatever’s going on in s4 #the death foreshadowing just goes off the rails and I no longer know what’s happening #maybe I should just give up and allot points based on Vibes alone lmaooooooo #seriously tho I’ll attempt a recount when I get home #feel like the order won’t change but We Shall See #black sails

[kaypeace21]

Will’s fear of clowns

*Ps -not mine. this is a submission from an anon. tw: for s.a. It’s an interesting submission. ANON-please make a tumblr account already . I’m begging you XD

Hi! It’s me, Lonnie Meth Anon. Back with more depressing thoughts about Lonnie!

I just read your post on Jonathan’s ab*se at the hands of Lonnie, and I second it all. It breaks my heart. But it also got me thinking deeper about Will’s fear of clowns. I think you’re right that part of the horror for Will is that the clown attacks in bed. The bed is, obviously, like you say, a common site for s*xual assault. (Doesn’t El’s picture of “three legged Brenner” also have a bed in it? In a picture with not much else?) The fact that Will needed Joyce to sleep with him for a week suggests he was specifically feeling unsafe in bed, or at night. 

But maybe it’s not just the location of the attack in Poltergeist that Will found so harrowing. Maybe it’s the combination of that location with the fact of a clown being the attacker. 

I think Lonnie might have dressed up as a clown for Will’s birthday one year, and something happened. 

In this instance, I don’t think Joyce would know what happened. I think the incident in her mind would be something like “Lonnie dressed up and Will was scared of the costume”. She might even have thought it was cute. Just a typical little kid fear of something mundane. When she teases him about Poltergeist, she doesn’t actually say the movie was the START of his fear of clowns. Just that he was afraid of that particular clown. The general fear of clowns could have been an older one, going back to when Will was even younger.

Maybe Will even liked clowns, before whatever happened with Lonnie turned them into a source of fear for him. Will has a lion plushie (lions are commonly found in the circus) and the circus seems like the kind of vibrant, colorful environment full of outcast, that a young gay kid would really enjoy. If Will did like circuses and Lonnie poisoned that for him, that’s just another reason to hate Lonnie. But it definitely seems possible. 

Lonnie is a deadbeat dad in general, but we’ve seen before that he’s capable of faking the “family man” act in front of Joyce and their neighbors. We’ve also seen that even though he treats Will horribly, he would also try and keep Will on his side with father son bonding activities, like baseball. And Will’s birthday is one of the few occasions Lonnie makes a half-assed kind of effort, even when there’s nothing directly in it for him. He sends that card, even though it’s late. Maybe Joyce made called him up and made him send it, but she always seemed happy to keep Lonnie out of the picture. She didn’t even want to involve him when Will went missing. And we know Jonathan would never try and facilitate more interactions between Lonnie and Will. So it seems like Lonnie did this of his own accord, when he realized he’d missed the day. Kind of weird. And it’s classic abuser behavior, to make contact on an anniversary date, reminding you they exist and you can’t escape them. Reminding you to keep quiet. Or hoping you’ll miss them, remember the “good times” when they made an effort, and let them back into your life. (Ugh.)

So, anyway, back to my theory. Young Will likes circuses, and the Byers family are poor, so they can’t afford to take him to one, or throw him a party at an ice cream parlor or a bowling alley, like other kids. It makes sense that they would have a party at home instead, and that the family themselves might dress up. We know Joyce made Will’s Ghostbusters costume in season two, and a clown is a pretty easy costume. Most of it is just make up. It’s possible the whole thing was Joyce’s idea, and she made the costume, and Lonnie just went along with it to look like a good dad in her eyes. 

Remember how we see Bob (Will’s new father figure) dressing up in costume for Halloween? Joyce loves it. This is a thing good dads do, to have fun with their kids. That’s also the same episode we see Will scared by a guy in a clown costume, and Jonathan is hyper-protective of him that night. School is okay, but he doesn’t want him trick or treating. (Like he knows that school is a safe environment, but in other contexts, costumes and parties might be a trigger for Will.) Jonathan is convinced to leave Will and “let him have fun” and what happens? The clown attacks. Later that night Jonathan goes to a costume party himself, where he finds Nancy upset and takes her safely home.  Maybe this is how Will’s birthday party ended - with Jonathan finding Will upset, and trying to comfort him. The whole night could be playing out like a parallel to that birthday party, from Jonathan’s perspective. 

What actually happened with Will and Lonnie is up for debate. It’s possible there was a s*xual assault, and that’s why the clown scene in Poltergeist was such a trigger for Will. Or maybe Lonnie thought circuses weren’t “manly” enough for his son to like, and actively tried to scare Will, so he wouldn’t like them anymore. It’s hard to know. Something would have happened though, and probably something pretty formative, because the fear of clowns lasts a long time. 

Something else interesting is that when Mr Clarke is talking about the Upside Down in season one, he uses the metaphor of the flea and the acrobat. Acrobats are a main act in the circus, and, well … fleas. Flea circuses. That’s a thing. Maybe it’s a hint that the trauma that created the Upside Down was circus / clown - related?

Kali, El, and their gang wear clown masks too, when they’re going to confront their childhood trauma, and the child-like Alexei is surrounded by clowns when he is killed at the fair. 

Clowns are just so associated with birthday parties and little kids, that it doesn’t seem like a coincidence to me they’re Will’s biggest fear. Especially as the show keeps dropping hints about Lonnie and Will’s birthday. It feels like there’s more to the story. I have a horrible feeling SOMETHING happened. 

RESPONE (kaypeace):

I think it’s very possible-that maybe he did dress as a clown for Will’s birthday and something happened. We have alexi (paralleled to Will) playing carnival games with kids. Then he's attacked by the Lonnie-look alike : and alexi looks at his wound then stares at all the clowns laughing around him. Joyce and Murray find Alexi bleeding/dy*ng next to a clown statue. As joyce looks in horror and Murray says to her, he was “only gone for a second” (which sounds like something you’d say in relation to a kid you were supposed to watch-running off ). We also had sarah at age 7 die while wearing a gown with clowns on it (Will: it was a 7 the demogorgan it got me). Death of innocence symbolism? Hopper also describes his depression as a cave- he goes through the carnival ride where it mentions a "cave of horrors", which had decor of a tiger and a clown painting. So yeah... whatever happened probably isn't good. So- there may be some symbolism there in relation to Will’s past. Not only because (like I and you have mentioned before) Lonnie is highly associated with birthdays. And canonically we know he mentally scarred jonathan on his b-day. But also, s4’s ‘victor creel’ may be an easteregg to the xmen character victor creed- who had a tradition of tra*matizing family members specifically on their bdays

As another alternative:I could also totally see Lonnie “ruining” circuses for Will because it’s not “manly” to him. Like how Jonathan liked thumper the rabbit-from the film bambi. in the film, Thumper is bambi’s bff, and the hunters are the bad guys who k*ll Bambi’s mother and terrorize all the wildlife. SO yeah- making Jonathan become a hunter, and k*ll a rabbit ,despite this fact, is really messed up. And shows Lonnie has already tried to ‘ruin’ things the boys like. By mentally scarring them in one way or another…

I also mentioned how Will’s bday could even be a trigger for jonathan in a diff post.

if the s4 bts calender hinting it’ll be near Will’s bday and easter it could be relevant to Jonathan.we know in s1 el has tra*matic flashbacks when seeing certain things- coke, closet, cat, etc. And Will in s2 has his ‘anniversary effect’ where memories flood back based on the time of year.But like … Easter has bunnies - could seeing rabbits jog stuff up for Jonathan? El seeing a cat made her have a flashback of brenner trying to make her kill a cat. Would Jonathan seeing like Easter bunny decor jog up a flashback of lonnie making him kill a rabbit? (It happened on his bday too). So Will’s b day being around easter would only fuel that memory. (heck even popped balloons may trigger gunshot symbolism idk). And then for Will there is clowns that could be a tr*gger at a party.

The flea and the acrobat analogy (in relation to Will and circuses is very interesting) and could be foreshadowing- it’s even a title for an episode so I feel like it’s narratively an important hint to …something. similar to a s1 ep being called “the bathtub”.  Also, Will was compared to a circus flea- which were placed in an enclosed space, where heat was applied as they jumped  and tried to escape the increasing temperatures as they burned .Which could relate to my theory about Will having a se*zure due his body overheating due to Lonnie injecting him with m*th.

 If Will’s bday is in s4- I feel like Lonnie will come back in some capacity (flashback or literally). The ‘sorry, I forgot you b day’ card from Lonnie in s2, in Lonnie’s shed Joyce mentioning Will’s b day, the rainbow ‘happy birthday cup’ placed next to Will at Mike’s -while Will explains the supernatural, Lonnie already tra*matizing Jonathan on his bday, etc…

#submission #stranger things theory #will byers #lonnie byers

[loudest-subtext-in-tv]

Something I know no one will ever contend with when they just want to write a hit piece about us, but...

When Moffat said on the A Scandal in Belgravia commentary, “If you watch the show carefully, there’s subtext about John’s drinking,” what did he mean? He wasn’t being flippant, he’s said one of his favorite writers is William Goldman and writers should study him because he “knows everything.” Goldman’s Ten Commandments on Writing say to “put a subtext under every text” and not to be too on the nose. 

So what is the “real” subtext to why John drinks, and why does John drink when he’s alone with Sherlock and trying to get him to open up, or otherwise thinking about Sherlock? If the subtext is not about John’s relationship with Sherlock, then like... who else is in the room in those scenes, what’s going on, who is John actually thinking about, and why is it so important to the story that Moffat would include it? What storyline does the subtext of John’s drinking pertain to? It must be pretty big to not have been revealed yet, so it shouldn’t be hard to make a case for.

Similarly: When Moffat and Gatiss say that The Private Life of Sherlock Holmes, a movie noteworthy for depicting Holmes as a homosexual in love with Watson, is the inspiration for their adaptation, what do people imagine they adapted from it? Because it wasn’t the characterization, they don’t much resemble the BBC Sherlock characterizations. Barely any plot points were borrowed, and minor ones at that. Why did they pick the big overtly gay adaptation for the basis of their show from a hundred straight alternatives? Why did Gatiss say the thing he liked about it was that Holmes was in love with Watson?

I mean, I know people who hate us will never actually watch it, but the movie is not subtle. The movie isn’t a bunch of gay gags, the movie makes very clear that Holmes is genuinely homosexual and in love with Watson in a deeply painful way that queer people can recognize and relate to, and the same vibe is heavy in series 3 especially. For example, the endings of TSoT and HLV are not gay gags, they are things that happened in the plot and were not presented as remotely funny.

There are two reasonable perspectives on this:

1) It is not especially weird for people who pay attention to what the writers have said about their stories to think all the gay stuff is intentional, and its not weird to have fun chasing down things the writers have taken care to talk about. That’s what fans do, they try to predict where stories are going. No one made hit pieces ridiculing Jon and Daeneyrs shippers because they recognized what the foreshadowing in Game of Thrones was saying, and they were basing it off almost nothing compared to what the showrunners of Sherlock have said and taken care to include in the plot and subtext. People write hit pieces about us because they deeply believe it’s stupid for queer people to think a gay romance could be depicted, we had the misfortune of having a sense of humor about ourselves (calling it a “conspiracy” and ourselves a “cult”), and were enthusiastic about the show and writers whose fandom we’re a part of.

2) The gay stuff is intentional, but all a big joke despite appearances to the contrary. Most of the antis even argued that the gay stuff was intentional, they just thought it was to fuck with people or be provocative. Some of them were even dreading S4, including while it was airing, because they thought we were going to be proven right and we’d be insufferable. If people who hated us worried we could be right, then how delusional could we be?

I can understand someone thinking it all being a big joke is more likely than a TV show depicting a gay romance, but it does not follow that people deserve to be an object of public ridicule because they recognized a bunch of queer allusions and painful queer life experiences that resonated with them and considered that the writers, one of whom is queer and unabashedly obsessed with the works in question, may have positive motives for including those things. It feels like punishing people for doing their due diligence of actually researching the writers’ feelings about things and their influences, rather than just piling on and calling them homophobes. I’m not trying to invalidate anyone’s opinions if that’s how they feel about Moffat and Gatiss nowadays, I’m just saying it’s not some shameful thing for people to actually investigate these things and conclude differently. It’s okay to think writers are talented and clever, and their fandom should be a place where it’s okay to explore that.

What makes me most sad about this is that there is genuinely no area of life where people can just play around anymore without being hunted down. Like, politics is fucking miserable, the pandemic is miserable, I just had a friend kill himself a few months ago because of how bad life is lately, a close relative who I never thought would have suicidal ideation has it now, I have been fighting wanting to die for years, in the U.S. none of us have any idea if we’re ever getting any sort of pandemic stimulus again -- so many of us are suffering immensely right now, it should be okay to be goofy and creative in a fandom without someone deciding its their prerogative to profit off us because they think we’re weird, or whatever. 

The reason there’s a lot of crazy meta analysis is because this was supposed to be a relatively safe, creative place where people can try their hand at analyzing stories without being graded or made to feel inadequate, so we treat metas a lot like fanfics where it’s not really appropriate to just rip people’s shit apart no matter how illogical it is, and we find things we like about analysis we don’t agree with in that same spirit: it’s a cool idea anyway, it’s artistically inspiring, it got close to a more compelling idea, etc. I have a big packet of fan mails where several people told me they had been scared and self-conscious to share their thoughts on things, and TJLC helped them open up and inspired them to major in literary or film-related majors. People start somewhere and it’s cruel to make fun of them because they weren’t great at something that doesn’t fucking matter. 

FANDOM IS NOT SUPPOSED TO BE A SUPER SERIOUS SPACE. NO ONE PUTS ON A TUXEDO BEFORE THEY LOG IN TO TUMBLR. NO ONE NEEDS SOME OUTSIDER TAKING THE THINGS THEY OFFERED IN THE SPIRIT OF FUN OUT OF CONTEXT TO PRESENT TO A WIDER AUDIENCE THEY DELIBERATELY AVOID BECAUSE THAT AUDIENCE IS MEAN AND SENDS THEM DEATH THREATS AND HOMOPHOBIC AND MISOGYNISTIC SLURS AND SUICIDE ADVICE. IT IS ACTUALLY NOT AN ENORMOUS CHARACTER FAILING TO SHARE BAD ANALYSES OF A TV SHOW, AND SHOULD NOT BE A MATTER OF NATIONAL INTEREST. 

But places where people can open up and try things out increasingly can’t exist anymore, because even in a low stakes environment like a fandom there are busybody ghouls who want to profit off being condescending about how people spend their leisure time. It doesn’t add anything to the world except their bank accounts.

#tjlc #Sarah Z

[tanoraqui]

okay I have to do this today because even I wouldn’t do it after the godforsaken finale airs, and it’s basically my specialty and I did spend like an hour thinking about it last night while washing dishes. Definitely partly inspired by @words-writ-in-starlight​‘s insightful post on everything Supernatural did wrong, and apologies in advance to all the characters for dragging them into anything related to Christian mythology:

Wei Wuxian’s parents die in a house fire when he’s 6(? I refuse to look anything up) months old

Jiangs are a hunter family I guess? That whole disaster of a family dynamic, except WWX dips out at some point to be idk an environmental activist bc at the time, that seems like the larger threat to the whole world. “Mom and Dad went on a hunting trip and they haven’t come back”, “bitch” “jerk”, 2 brothers in a beat-up old car, you know the drill

Jins are also an old hunting family, but more Men of Letters energy - they have a fancy bunker and do research and avoid getting their actual hands dirty. Jiang Yanli ducked out of the active hunting life a few years ago to be happily married to her peacock and settled down with a baby and she’s fine. We’re not going to bother Yanli. She’s safe and happy and doesn’t need to involved in any of this

so, WWX is the demon blood child developing exciting new abilities like telekinesis, mind control, exorcising demons by sheer force of will...etc, and Jiang Cheng is the Righteous Man. Lucifer, Michael, etc.

s1-3 probably proceeds more or less as spn canon...which I more or less remember...by the time they find their parents at the end of s1, Jiang Fengmian is...ugh, we probably shouldn’t kill him offscreen, I mean, we should probably meet him before he dies. I guess. Madam Yu lasts longer because I’m way more interested in her. But we do know that both Jiang parents are totally inclined to fling the boys into a metaphorical or literal escape boat and go hold the line for as long as possible, so...that’s spn energy...

Xue Yang is the one who’s like “fuck yeah, demon powers” and opens the gates of Hell, because I want him to have nice* things

*nice for Xue Yang

from characterization rather than memory, I’m 90% sure that Dean tried to hide his crossroads deal from Sam, but Jiang Cheng does it...better. I think it does come out, though. Right before the hellhounds do.

here’s where it starts to go farther off from spn canon. Jiang Cheng crawls his way out of the grave, gets stalked by a menacing presence that explodes windows for an episode, incidentally can’t find WWX...*Lan Wangji voice* “I’m the one who gripped you tight and raised you from Perdition” (a baller line then and a baller line now)...and then the next episode starts with them all awkwardly standing around, and JC is like, “ok well let’s go find my brother then”, and you think there’s going to be an mdzs-riffing JC+LWJ Roadtrip To Find WWX...and they’re immediately attacked by like a dozen demons

in fact, the first time we see WWX in s4 is here, wherein he goes toe to toe with an angel and...holds his own. that’s new and terrifying! also is leading a squad of demons??

because here’s the thing: for the last 3(?) months, there’s been war in hell

because unlike Some People Mooses, upon finding out that his brother’s soul was legally nearly-owned by a crossroads demon, heir-apparent-to-Satan!WWX went, “actually fuck that” and kicked open the door of Hell (metaphorically, not loosing any demons this time) and was like, “who do I have to beat the shit out of to get a specific crossroads contract around here”

this did not work, obv. He didn’t know until it was too late, Lilith had already snapped up the contract, etc. etc.

obviously he also tried to offer himself instead, and got rejected for some reason

Since Jiang Cheng died, however, there’s been a war for control of Hell. Leading one side, Lilith, the Original Babe, who wants to break all 666(?) seals keeping Lucifer bound and in the meantime, break the Righteous Man so Heaven won’t even have Michael’s destined host ready for the Final Battle. Leading the other side, Wei Wuxian, infamous upstart, who wants to rescue the Righteous Man and restore him to life, tear Lilith’s guts out through her nose, and also stop her from doing the Lucifer thing because Wen Qing explained that yes, that’s a Thing, and it’s Bad.

Wen Qing! I’ve decided to combine Bela and Ruby’s roles and let WQ be both the cool badass example of how demon deals can go Bad and the demon deliberately leading our heroes astray for most of s3-4. Wen Qing is a very new demon; she used to be some sort of herbalist/witch but then she sold her soul in a crossroads deal to cure her brother of some lingering illness. 10 years of happiness and then boom, hellhounds. WQ is so obviously competent, though, that they (Lilith, I guess?) immediately offers her a job, with the promise threat that gee, that’s a nice brother you’ve got there, even with his Designated Chronic Health Condition getting all relapse-y. It’d be such a shame if something were to...happen to him...

we find this out at some point in last s3 I guess? some Monster of the Week case involves WN as a witness or something, or possible next victim, and WQ shows up to be A Normal Amount Of Invested In This, while desperately trying to avoid actually interacting with her brother (who thinks she’s dead). YES, the truth comes out; YES there’s a tearful reunion

now in s4, Wen Ning is fine actually, health-wise, bc he maybe made a crossroads deal with Wei Wuxian personally, and Wen Qing may or may not have admitted that she’s supposed to be working for Lilith to get WWX ready to host Lucifer? Or potentially that comes out later, idk. Either way, she’s 100% his top lieutenant in this exciting Hell War they’re waging

[insert whatever the hell (ha) happened plot-wise in s4 of supernatural]

we obviously mix up the relationships, too, bc it’s like, *LWJ internal monologue* I’m too young to remember my brother Lucifer as he was before he Fell, but surely Wei Wuxian is his Heir and Destined Vessel in truth, for he is Charismatic and Charming and Makes Me Feel Things, with his Clearly Feigned Righteous Drive and Compassion for All God’s Creatures and - why does heat keep pooling in the lower abdomen of my vessel when I look at his lips, which I am definitely doing a Normal and Not-Weird Amount - I’m just keeping an eye out for the famed Silver Tongue, and not in any way wondering how it would feel in my own mouth -

it’s actually DEFINITELY plausible for Lucifer to still be released even if our designated Heir Apparent is using his demon powers to his full potential and no one’s lying to each other about their motives. You just need to let Lilith be more scary too, and especially bc by “no one” I mostly mean Wen Qing; the angels are still totally hiding the fact that they, too, want to jumpstart the shit out of this apocalypse.  LWJ decides at the last minute that that’s a bad idea actually, gets himself discorporated to send JC to intercept WWX because he accidentally releases Lucifer, etc. etc. Oh yeah, the boys were def fighting before this, bc JC has actually fairly reasonable concerns about the sort of things WWX is getting up to in his quest to become King of Hell...

SO

...I neither know nor care what happens in s5

it does end with both Lucifer and Michael locked in the cage probably, bc I rather liked that solution. Fuck both of ‘em, basically.

I was toying with the idea that WWX also found Madam Yu in whatever hellish torment she was suffering after making a deal so her idiot son(s) would survive, and she was leading forces for him in the war against Lilith as well. If she came back to life somehow, body and all, it’d probably be compelling if she offered her own body to Michael - bc it’s her lineage! - and we’re all led to believe that she’s, uh, being a bitch and actually wants to risk destroying the world in order to destroy all demons...but then she seizes back control and flings herself/Michael and Lucifer into the Pit, because she’s just That Hardcore?

which means we’d actually have had her around and having characterization for most of s4-5, too, which would be fun

More importantly, it ends with newly crowned King of Hell Wei Wuxian appointing Wen Qing as Queen-Regent and ditching to go on an indefinite honeymoon with his new angel boyfriend (they’re going to fuck for like three weeks straight, then roll up their sleeves and go conquer Heaven in the name of free will), and Jiang Cheng gets to live out his hitherto-unknown-to-himself life’s ambition to be the sugar baby of the Queen of Hell. It’s very Hades/Persephone, except he goes back down to the underworld at least once a month. He gets his own demon squad whom he trains up in all the hunting techniques and it’s gr9. Wen Qing is reforming the crossroads deal process to make it more fair to the humans.

the end

Addenda:

it should go without saying but Jiang Yanli is definitely a recurring character, like, at least once a season there’s a filler episode where they go to Jiang Yanli’s for dinner and have to get along as a family, and also do the much easier job of defeating some sort of terrible demon that gets loose in the bunker and turns the evening into a horror movie. She’s their main research/emotional check-in person, a la Bobby, more often appearing in later seasons when there’s, uhhh, more to emotionally check in about.

Jin Zixuan is actually a perfectly competent hunter; he’s just a priss and we don’t Like him

we like Mianmian, though. Oh, I guess the official Hunter’s Guild or w/e tries to declare WWX a public enemy on account of the whole “King of Hell” thing and she’s like “actually what if you’re morons and assholes?” and joins hte team in s4 or 5? Yeah.

idk how the 3zun disaster happens in this ‘verse but I do encourage it to be happening in slow motion as a recurring subplot for several seasons. NMJ is a hunter, LXC is obv an angel, and JGY is...I wanna say one of the more human monsters, like a vampire? Or, you know, something that could be born from JGS sleeping with someone/something he shouldn’t have

#mdzs #the untamed #supernatural #ficlet #my fic #spn #ugh it'll probably fuck up hte bullet points again

[bare1ythere]

Okay I have a lot of feelings about a Martin Theme if TMA had a soundtrack

In season 1 I bet it would be fairly bouncy and light (in contrast to Jon’s more serious theme), but slightly /off/ so that you can tell there’s some anxiety there as well as desperation to impress his boss/crush. (Concept for the title: Not a Fan of Worms I See (MAG22 would be the first time we hear it))

In season 2 there wouldn’t be a major shift in the theme, but maybe the whatever instruments in the theme conveyed anxiety would be slowed down or altered in a way so that it’s more longterm worry than just nerves. The pace of this could be switched over to the s1 theme in scenes like Jon confronting Martin about his CV. (Concept for the title: If I Make Enough Tea Maybe Things Will Be Okay)

In season 3 I feel like there would be a more major shift in his theme, but still keeping the general idea. The bounciness would be turned down a bit so that now the theme is a bit more steady (accounting for Martin’s determination to read the statements in Jon’s absence and challenge Elias in the finale. Maybe he has elements of The Eye motif that wouldve been in Jon’s theme by this point). During Elias’ confrontation the theme would quicken and distort slightly (maybe where a heartbeat could be heard!) and would be subdued as Elias gets arrested. (Concept for the title: Turns Out Tea Doesn’t Solve All of Our Problems)

In Season 4 the theme would be changed A LOT. I feel like Martin’s theme would’ve traditionally involved some strings and piano (eye = piano because its a sucker for aesthetics) whereas in season 4 the tune stays the same but now its more woodwind instruments. His theme would also be slightly distorted (off key in some parts? wrong notes maybe?) so that we all knew Something was wrong. It would be heavily influenced by the Lonely’s regular theme. in MAG159 when Jon brings him out of the lonely, while Martin was saying “I see you, Jon, I see you” the woodwinds wouldn’t fade out but instead elements of his original theme would come back. (Concept for the title: Don’t Look at me I’m Out of Tea (to show the progression from s2 “woo tea” to s4 where he’s changed so much))

In Season 5 Martin’s theme would be a harder version of his S3 theme. Maybe the soft guitar would be switched for a harder more rock-like sound as his determination to turn the world back materializes. There’s elements of the eye and the lonely AND jon’s theme in the full version of S5 Martin’s theme. I guess we’ll have to see where the rest of the season goes before I can say how the theme is used throughout but With the current direction we’re going (mag174 is next) The rock bits are maybe slowing down a bit back to the more classic s3 theme. (Concept for the title: Can’t Trust Comfort My Ass, Let’s Go)

Bonus: A jonmartin song thats a combination of both their themes called “Reversing the Apocalypse: A Love Story”

#martin blackwood #the magnus archives #tma #jonmartin #shut up me #long post #WHOOPS I RAMBLED

[twdmusicboxmystery]

10x21: Diverged - First Analysis

Okay, how did everyone like the episode? Did you see all the symbolism? If not, fear not, I’ll show it to you.

***As always, spoilers abound below for 10x21. Don’t read until you’ve watched!!!***

So let me start by saying this. I’ve said it before, but it bears repeating. The point of the six bonus episodes it retell, symbolically, every facet of Beth’s story. So 10x17 represented Inmates, but also 4b in general. I said HERE that it reminded me of everyone being split into small groups in 4b. But they were also tracking children’s foot tracks (in this case Hershel Jr) which is weirdly specific to what Beth and Daryl did in Inmates.

10x18 retold most of Beth and Daryl’s story through Leah. So there were elements of Inmates, Still, and even Coda in it. But it’s pretty much a play-by-play of Alone. Play. By. Play.

10x19 with Aaron and Father Gabriel can be called a retelling of Still. They get drunk. Playing drinking games. Play golf.

10x20 is all about Grady recalls, with the imprisonment theme and all.

So, where does that leave 10x21? As with all of them, there is lots of symbolism I’ll point out, but it’s kind of a scene by scene retelling of Them. I know others may go through it in more detail to show the exact parallels, so I’ll just go over the broad themes today. Tomorrow, I’ll do my normal details post.

So, it starts with Daryl giving Carol Leah’s knife, which is a retelling in reverse of her giving him Beth’s. She does try to return it to him at the end and he declines, which is super important. I’ll get into that more as we get into the weeds of this, but let’s go over this template first so you can see the broad strokes.

Starting with 10x18 (and I’m following the Daryl/Carol template here, so put Leah aside for the moment), Daryl and Carol get on his bike and leave together. They’re on the outside together for a while, searching for something. Mostly food in this case, though Daryl might have originally been planning to search for Connie. After a time, they come to a place where they spend the night, that has ties to one of their pasts. (In this case, Daryl/Leah.) Then they have an argument. The next day, they part ways.

We’ve actually seen this exact template before, in S5. It comprised 5x02 and 5x06. Daryl and Carol left together in a vehicle (car rather than bike that time). They were out for a while searching for something (Beth). They came to a place where they spent the night that had ties to one of their pasts (in that case, Carol and the abuse center). 

The next day, they have a fight. In that case, it was about Noah and Carol wanting Daryl to help him. Not nearly as big or impactful a fight as in 10x18, but the conflict parallels are there. Then, they part ways. The mechanisms, again, are different. In 10x21, they chose to part ways. In Consumed, it’s because the Grady cops hit Carol with the car and took her into the hospital. But I don’t think the reasons matter. Just the basic events.

So what happened next in S5? Daryl went back to get Rick and TF, but then returned to where Carol (and Beth) were at Grady, right? Well, we’ve already established firmly that Dog = Beth. And notice that in this episode, Dog went with Carol. Are we seeing the symbolism? 

So what follows with Carol is very reminiscent of Grady in some way. Now, unlike Princess, they can’t actually have Carol imprisoned here, because it wouldn’t work for where they need her to be in the story going into S11. So it’s all going to be symbolic.

Carol/Dog/Rat:

I said a few days ago that Rat = Beth. Think of it this way. Rat was minding his own business when Dog suddenly attacks him. So you could see that as Dog and Rat kind of being synonymous symbols. Actually, if we want to get really granular, Rat was in Daryl’s room. We’ll ignore the obvious romantic/sexual pun and just say it represents that rat (Beth) was hanging out with Daryl. Then someone tries to kill Rat. In this case, Carol. 

We even have rat getting caught in Carol’s trap (Beth being kidnapped and taken to Grady) but escaping. Then Carol traps Rat in the wall by plugging up the way in with the scarf. 

At that point, Rat is not only trapped, but kind of entombed behind the wall. And Carol can’t see Rat. (What is not seen theme.)

Now, in terms of Carol herself, I’ll talk about what they said on TTD, because it’s very helpful in deciphering all this. But in terms of the symbolism, we think what she does here probably equates to stuff that happened during the missing 17 days and whatever role she played in leaving Beth behind. Because of that, it’s kind of hard to pin down.

Other clues? Dog = Beth right? And not only is Dog present with Carol here, but he even watches over her while she sleeps, same as Beth did while Carol was unconscious at Grady. And Carol is definitely a “prisoner” of her own past and her own mind here. She’s clearly obsessing about things like Rat and soup and the scarf because she can’t “fix” bigger things in her life, like her relationship with Daryl or that Connie is still missing and that’s on her. I’ll talk more about this theme in a minute.

Daryl/Bike/Walkers:

Daryl’s arc here is also chalk full of symbolism that I don’t think I’ve even entirely pinned down, yet, but I really love it. In Daryl’s case, the bike breaks down, right? There’s a hole in one of the hoses that’s leaking stuff, which makes the bike stall, and he has to go find the tools and resources to fix it.

So, here’s how we’re interpreting this: bike = Beth. Why? Well, I think we can all get behind music box = Beth, can’t we? (If not, I don’t know why you’re following my account.) And remember that I said this was a replay of Them. Just as Daryl fixed the music box in Them, 

he fixes the bike here. 

The train tracks are another clue. He takes the bike to the tracks and leaves it there. You know I think train tracks are indicative of Beth’s path, but I’m also sure they’re a multi-layered symbol with many meanings.

In S4, Beth was the only one who didn’t actually follow the tracks. She crossed them. Daryl did too, initially, but he later followed them to Terminus with Rick and Michonne. Beth was the only one who never did that and therefore never ended up at Terminus. Her path would be completely different. We saw hints of this symbolism in 6x08, when Daryl crossed train tracks on his bike after being hurt, and we see the same thing here.

The “hole” in the bike hose represents Beth’s gunshot wound, dripping blood. Daryl leaves the bike to go look for something to fix it with. So, this part is kinda non-specific. 

You could say leaving the bike where it was in the woods = leaving Beth behind. But where does he search for the part? 

In a group of 3 cars with a walker inside, which is also indicative of where we think they left her. So, this whole sequence kind of points to the missing 17 days and leaving her behind. With the bike being “dead,” (read: unconscious for a human) Daryl pushes the bike manually, which may parallel him carrying Beth.

My fellow theorists and I discussed the idea that back in S5, Daryl didn’t have the “tools” to fix Beth after she was shot, or the understanding not realize she wasn’t really dead. But at some point, he will. We don’t know what the “fixing” point refers to overall, or how it will manifest in the show. It could be lots of things. Literal, medical, emotional. Who knows? But it’s interesting.

Now, on the one hand, this points backward, to those missing scenes. But I always say every callback doubles as a foreshadow. After all, if Daryl had “fixed” Beth during those missing 17 days, she wouldn’t be missing and presumed dead, right? And in Them, we see him fix the music box, and the next scene is Aaron showing up with “good news” and the music box waking up. Clearly that didn’t happen with Beth in S5. So at some point, this shifts from a callback to a foreshadow of what will happen when he actually finds her again.

Now, in order to understand (as far as we can) this symbolism, I will have to get somewhat granular. Because the whole sequence is very strange. Daryl stops the bike on the tracks and looks through his binoculars. (Binocular Theory). It doesn’t really show us what he sees or what he’s trying to do, but I think the idea is that he sees the military walker and is hoping to find a smaller knife on him that he needs to fix his bike.

Imma come back to the knives, because they’re a theory all their own, but let’s examine the events first. He leaves the bike on the tracks and moves forward. Now, I had to watch this several times to understand it. I think the idea is that there were walkers on both sides of the tracks that hadn’t noticed him. They’re milling around but not focused on him. So he’s hoping to slip, unnoticed, between them. Unfortunately, he snaps a twig under his foot and they all turn toward him.

Everyone’s been asking about the Beth walker. She’s definitely here in this scene. I almost wonder, if she represents Beth, if it’s supposed to be that she’s there, close by, but he’s focused on something else, and doesn’t notice her. I kept thinking he would kill this walker, but he never does, and I think that’s significant. 

Also, these military walkers probably represent the CRM. So, for example, this may represent a future storyline where Daryl has a run-in with some members of the CRM. He manages to get away here, which probably means during that future interaction, he’ll get away, too. But he may not realize Beth is with the CRM. So she’s there, hanging around, but he’s too focused on other things to notice. 

(Disclaimer: I’m not saying this is exactly what this scene foreshadows. As always, the details will probably be wrong, but it’s something along these lines.)

Now, there are a lot of weirdnesses in this scene. He suddenly starts limping, for one thing. He wasn’t limping before this, and he doesn’t have the limp when he returns to Alexandria. So to me, that screams that this is a foreshadowing of something we haven’t seen yet. When whatever this sequence foreshadows plays out, Daryl will probably be dealing with an injury of some kind.

He hurries toward a ravine where a military walker is caught in a tree. (Tree/Trunk symbolism anyone?)

So, in terms of this episode, he obviously saw the military walker and hoped this dude might have a knife on him that Daryl could use to fix his bike. That’s what he’s up to here. And it turns out, he does.

Symbolically, it’s a whole other ballgame. In terms of the binocular theory, I always thought Red Poncho Guy, who Daryl and Aaron looked at through binoculars, represented Beth. Both because of the red poncho (red garment in Beth’s cell in 4x01) and because he was taken by the Wolves. It’s possible the Wolves are the symbolic antecedent of the Reapers or the CRM. Or both.

So, I think this whole sequence where he walks along the tracks, past the Beth walker, and then interacts with these military walkers that probably represent the CRM, is a foreshadow or future telling of how he’ll find Beth. Because of the limp, maybe he gets injured and the CRM take him somewhere—like they did with Rick—and that’s where he find Beth.

How is that represented here? He finds the knife he needs to fix the bike.

And again, we don’t know what the “fixing” will mean in a literal sense when this plays out. Maybe fixing is just finding her. Because that will “fix” the hole she left in his heart when he lost her. Maybe it will mean something else.

But the knife itself is important. Why? Because it’s…kinda cooler than Leah’s knife? It’s bigger. It does more stuff. It’s a better tool and a better weapon. It’s kind of life Knife 2.0. And how many times have we talked about how when Beth returns, she’ll be tougher, stronger, a better survivor. She’ll be Beth 2.0. They even said that in the TTD after Still. Remember the phrase they used? “Raised by Hershel, trained by Daryl, meet the new Beth Green.”

So, remember that Leah represents everything that came before in S4 and S5, so her knife then represents the old Beth. The one that died at Grady, emotionally if not physically. Knife 2.0 then represents the new Beth as she’ll be when Daryl finds her again. And where he did find Knife 2.0? With the military/CRM walker.

See what I mean?

A couple of details that parallel this to Them: When Daryl fights the military walker, he slides down into a dry creek bed. There was a dry creek bed in Them. There’s also a small bridge behind him (Bridge Theory) with a circular opening for water to pass under it. (Beth = Water.)

When he gets out of the ravine, he sort of goes a different way and all the walkers that were coming after him just sort of fall into the ravine. That’s exactly what happened in Them. Remember? TF was on the bridge and they would wait for the walkers to come close and then jump out of the way so they all fell off the bridge? Yeah. Replay of Them.

So then Daryl goes to fix the bike and two more military walkers come at him. Yes, two. At first, you’ll probably only see one because they show it weird. But there are actually two. He pulls ammo off one and food rations off another.

What does that mean? I don’t want to go into too much here, but I think it’s just all part of the CRM story arc, which we won’t truly see play out until the spinoff. I think this lack of food they’re dealing with will continue, and at some point their water will become undrinkable. So, it won’t be a matter of grabbing Beth and Rick and running back to Alexandria. They’ll all die without the CRM’s resources. (Hence why Daryl finds food and ammo on these walkers and is like, “nice.”) Much like with Negan/AOW, they’ll have to find some way to integrate and all live together peaceably. Which is also what Rick’s confrontation with the Governor in 4x08 foreshadowed.

Next clue. It takes Daryl a while to fix the bike and it gets dark before he’s done. I totally didn’t catch it the first time until @frangipanilove clued me in, but we hear a wolf howl in the distance. The subtitles confirm it is a wolf, not a coyote or dog, and Daryl even looks over his shoulder as though acknowledging it. So to me, that’s wolf symbolism, and shows that the Denise/Wolf template will be in play when Daryl finds and ‘fixes’ Beth.

It’s actually way more complicated than that, but this is part of that second rabbit hole I mentioned this morning that I won’t be posting about until after ep 22.

Repeat of Still Theme

Okay, the only other thing I want to draw your attention to today (Details tomorrow) is that there is a theme of letting go of the past in order to move forward. And that’s very much a Still theme. Beth and Daryl burnt down the moonshine shack as a symbol of letting of their pasts and moving forward. And we see that same thing here.

People are going to say this is boring bc Carol makes soup and chases a rat around the kitchen, and Daryl fixes his bike. And on the surface, they’re right. But I’ve already explained the significance of him fixing the bike.

For the rest, not until Carol gave up on the rat did it actually get free and get out of her hair. And I think the scarf represents something that really couldn't be saved, and wasn't worth her time, but she started to obsess over it. She couldn't control or fix the bigger things in her life, so she's trying to fix small things that actually don't matter much. And when she finally made her peace with that, she threw the scarf away because she didn't need it anymore.

Same with Daryl and Leah’s knife. They actually say on TTD (which I’ll post about in more detail on Wednesday) that Daryl letting go of Leah’s knife and letting Carol have it represents him letting go of Leah. So, we still think she’s mostly hallucination anyway, but even if we’re wrong about that, they’ve pretty much confirmed that the Daryl/Leah thing is completely over.

But think about what we’ve said about Leah. She represents his time with Beth IN THE PAST. He has to let that go in order to move forward. And I think he was always going to have to reach this point, emotionally, before Beth could return.

Another way to think about it: just as with Beth’s knife, he probably needed to hang onto Leah’s knife for emotional reasons. It has to do with his guilt and trauma and grief over whatever happened. Now, I don’t think they wanted him to give Beth’s actual knife to Carol because that will probably figure in the plot eventually, but this is a symbol of the same thing. The knife, like the hallucination of Leah, is something he created to get himself through the hardest time of his life. Now, he’s past it, and letting it go. Just as Beth taught him to do in Still.

It's about letting go of small things in order to move forward.

So, I’m really looking hard at knife #1 (Leah’s) vs. knife #2 (leatherman that he gets from the military guy). Because, I think just as we always talk about how Beth from S4/S5 was not only younger, but naïve, innocent, less mature in her character development, etc., when she comes back, we know she’ll be tougher, more badass, Beth 2.0, etc. right? Hence, she just changed. 

And I think the knives represent that. The old model being left behind (by Daryl) and he finds the newer, better knife, which represents him finding the new Beth. Hence the train tracks and the military walkers (CRM). And incidentally (haha not so much) we do see the Beth walker in that same sequence where he finds the knife.

In Still, we learned he has to let his past go to move forward, and he’ll have to let his past go to find Beth. So again, I’m wondering what the knife will represent that he gives Carol when they part before he actually runs into Beth.

I did have one idea: maybe it’s not a tangible object. Maybe he gives her the truth about Leah. That she’s a hallucination. He finally admits it to her, and then later realizes he can’t function without it (just like he needed the knife). But he’s gonna need to let it go and find something better before he actually finds Beth.

And I actually think the scarf/leatherneck thing works with this. I mean, Leah wore the fox scarf. So in that way, it may function similarly to the knife. Something that needs to be let go to move forward, even if it’s kinda painful. And Carol throws away the scarf in this episode.

I was thinking about when Carol went to see him the last time in 10x18, she gave him a scarf, right? But it was kind of a token gift. He didn’t look particularly pleased with it. And she admitted it wasn’t the real reason she was there. First she said something about how she shouldn’t need an excuse to give him a gift, but then she says, “okay, the REAL reason I’m here…” And he took it, but you could tell he was kind of like, “okay, whatever.” And that’s similar to the knife here. She offers it to him, but he doesn’t want it. So yeah, at least in this respect, I think scarf and knife are somewhat synonymous.

Okay, I’ll stop there for today. I have TONS more to say about the specifics and TTD, and plenty about where all this is going. But I’ll leave you with that today. Thoughts?

#beth greene #beth greene lives #beth is alive #beth is coming #td theory #td theories #team delusional #team defiance #beth is almost here #bethyl

[sanoiro]

Lucifer 5x09 - Family Dinner -Spoilers & Speculation

Written by Joe Henderson

Directed by Nathan Hope

Nathan Hope has directed

1x02 - Lucifer, Stay. Good Devil 1x13 - Take Me Back to Hell 2x01 - Everything's Coming Up Lucifer 2x07 - Trip to Stabby Town  2x10 - Quid Pro Ho 3x05 - Welcome Back, Charlotte Richards 3x19 - Orange Is the New Maze 5x07 - Our Mojo He will also direct Episode 2 or 3 of S6

Behind The Scenes Video 

Ignore the fact that I accidentally watermarked it with the number 519... 

The Case & Deckerstar

Now we can start with the case of the week.

The murder happens at Golf n Stuff which is rather popular due to the scenes that were shot there for The Karate Kid. Rafferty was actually giddy over that.

So we have a murder. After over 70 episodes we know that the case of the week is somehow connected to the main plot and that it leads to a resolving of Lucifer’s issues or at least a small or big breakthrough.

The victim in this case was burned to death or at least he was… charred. A bit like how Mum ‘enlightened’ Jared in 2x17 but worse.

(In order to make sure most bts are included I have put them in the same file in their original resolution and you need to open the image and zoom. You can do it from your PC, MAC or mobile)

The mini golf has several fun statues like knights and pirates but what was not supposed to be there was the figure at the hole where nearby the victim was found. To be more You might have guessed it has many teeth by the photo and the answer is, it’s a reddish dragon head.

Back in December I came across the props building it and I thought it was cool but I wasn’t aware it was for Lucifer as the account is not affiliated with our crew or production. So imagine my surprise when a friend told me about what she had seen on the lot and going through the archived bts I found the victim photo as well.

You may have noticed it but in two particular episodes more dragons made their appearance. First it was at the second showrunner’s office in 503. There we see a dragon impelled by a sword, it seemed really out of place but I then correlated it with Baphament’s blade which is a representation of Azrael’s blade.

Later on I saw something else. In 508 Pete’s apartment had shelves dedicated to dragon figures as well as some knights. All along I was wondering can I even meta about that? What can it symbolise if it means anything at all? For some reason all I could think was the movie ‘Dragonheart’.

But let’s assume they have laid some hints, so far we have seen that they go very basic on bible and comic material so it’s funny how dragon-like Lucifer was presented in Series 3 of the black label of DC/ vertigo. But there are also more tidbits.

Now in 1x12 you all remember the Angel who was defeating a very Lucifer-looking Satan?

That was a prop. But it is derived by the work of Guido Reni ‘Michael and Satan’ (1636) Who was in turn influenced by Raphael’s painting ‘St. Michael Vanquishing Satan’ (1518) and if we go to Raphael’s early works... St. Michael (1504-1505)

Anyways!

The investigation of this ‘week’s’ case has its usual suspect chase which leads us to an arcade where we can spot some members of the crew doing rounds with the go-carts on that location. What I do know is that we are looking for someone young as far as guest posts go but other than that not much is known. The case seems to be progressing slowly but at some point the murderer appears to want to skip town so the leads bring us to L.A.’s train Union Station.

We also have scenes at the precinct during the case as we have seen from Aimee’s bts but not much is known there. 

Now the suspect might be played by the elusive guest of this episode John Clover whose appearance was posted on Reddit and had sparked the first speculations over the title of the episode.

We should now wonder whether the theme of this episode’s case which takes us to gaming areas has anything to do with how Lucifer views his Father’s appearance in the mid-season finale and whether it will provide him with a resolution to not act in a rush way. The same after all happened with Mum.

Do not forget that Lucifer in Season 2 and especially at the beginning with Mum and when he thought Earl Johnson was his Father, Lucifer’s plans changed as his vengeance turned to a slow paced questioning over why their relationship deteriorated. 

For an Angel who was ‘forced’ - not yet clarified so let’s not take that for granted- to punish the guilty Lucifer seems to be more merciful, understanding and open to explanations in the long run especially with the people who wronged him. Amenadiel, Michael, Uriel, Azrael, Mum, and Earl ‘God’ Johnson.

As Amenadiel said in the Pilot Lucifer away from Hell showed restrain and mercy… Perhaps it is true that we cannot escape from what we truly are. In any case that’s meta talk!

Back to the Union Station. 

In the train station we have a bts where we can see Chloe and Lucifer chasing the suspect and from the photos and videos outside of it we can safely say they are successful on apprehending the murderer.

Now a funny incident was that during the shooting the area was closed to the actual travelers but somehow a Japanese tourist ended up sitting where the background actors were. No idea if it was her Pizza or it was given by the craft service but the girl was obviously bewildered on what was happening. It’s the little absurdities of life I guess…

It seems though as a lighthearted episode at first...

Do not be mistaken, the writers, cast and showrunners have revealed that in S5P2 we enter the emotional and equally dark (In P1 I missed the darkness aside from Pete of course) part of this season. It means that by the end of 5x09 as we roll on the last minutes of this episode, Lucifer is heavily conflicted and a resolution is needed, one that seems to be somewhat provided.

Since P1 I thought it would be weird to have Deckerstar break up for effect, in order to break us, especially since S5 was supposed to be the last season and S6 is effectively from what they imply (again cast and showrunners) an epilogue. So do not expect Deckerstar to break up but on the contrary as we saw Lucifer and Chloe in 507 they pull each other back up. 

It is why I’m wondering what will be unraveled after the arrest of 5x09’s murderer.

The end of the episode takes us at night to L.A.’s Grand Park. The Grand Park is across the City Hall by the way, and for the Christmas season it was decorated with a Christmas tree made out of light bulbs.

In the bts the prominent colour of that tree is deep lilac. That’s where our next Deckerstar moment will unravel. We should also be ready for the Lucifer Universe to acknowledge yet another holiday of the human world, Christmas!

A tiny break here but you should remember that on each side of the elevator we have two bronze plates depicting the transfer of Christ after he was taken down dead from the Cross. So in the most discrete of ways Lucifer’s Universe has acknowledged Christ and perhaps it was because before the Sumerian text set Amenadiel as the favourite son, in Season 1 and for the majority of S2 we knew Lucifer as the favourite one.

On the cross Christ (no I didn’t write Lucifer at first :P) according to the scripts in a moment of lapsed faith “Father, Father why do you abandon me?”. In a way we might meta that for 516 but also for what Lucifer has experienced so far and has so eloquently expressed in 3x11 and in 1x09.  

But back to the Deckerstar moment…

It takes place on the ‘balcony’ above the fountain as the purple Christmas tree is behind them. The setting happens at night and provides the place for our characters to talk, to open up and perhaps even express certain fears but also be urged to take advantage of the current circumstances.

From my perspective is the scene of a couple that talks a difficult matter but at the end of that talk they know each has the other’s back so they can step forward, take that chance and their partner will always be there to catch them if they fall. It is also how we will experience Lucifer finally opening up without Linda probing him. But whatever comes forward also gives space to truths and a realisation which will break our Devil as we have seen from the bts of the next episodes.

We might even have an understanding why ‘I love you’s’ are difficult for Lucifer and for Chloe to also realise that. We might even get Lucifer to say it. Here is to hoping…

On a final note. Maze in this episode seems to have gone MIA but many times we do not see the bts of every scene so all we have is Lesley-Ann’s bts from her trailer during that time. Also do not forget how things ended in 508. Maze did betray Lucifer and with God on Earth... 

The Dinner

This episode is expected to open back to the precinct. The reason is because it is a mid-season finale which means that the in between scenes are not implied but also because of some spoilers we had back in December.

As you remember the actress who played officer Cacuzza had posted on Twitter that she and Lauren were in a ‘very small’ room which had just been painted. That room we can safely say is the ‘evidence room’ and that Cacuzza managed finally to find a way to close the surveillance in order to take a nap.

Now do remember that back in S4 Cacuzza was also the officer who let Lucifer ‘sample’ the drug busts… I’m not sure if that will come back somehow but we do know that Cacuzza will appear later this season, whether alive or not is yet to be seen.

What we do know is from the clues that were given by the actress.

1) She will be in the same room as Chloe meaning we will revisit the evidence room once Dad arrives and perhaps it will be a comic moment? Perhaps a random human will figure things out? But what was interesting is that according to the bts photo we see the actress and Lauren in their own clothes while Dennis is in his ‘Dad/God’ clothes.

2) Both Chloe and Officer Cacuzza were supposed to act distressed and shaken. If we take the ‘I love you’ element from that scene for Chloe let’s remember that the evidence is suddenly a bit of a mess. A glass has broken, the sound and effect will be heard once the time has started running again and they are two cops in a room with no idea of what is happening outside. So perhaps the shaken and distressed effect comes before they open the door (or walk out) and are sure there is no imminent threat.

3) In my opinion in this episode Cacuzza has some lines no matter how brief they might be.

Now the question here is how to proceed.

We obviously have a Family Dinner from which only two bts exist. 

If we assume that the Family Dinner is arranged after the brothers have hid their wings and then Dad has met Linda then the dinner is set up by a very flabbergasted Linda.

I do expect Linda to bow by the way and for this dinner to bring some elements from 1x10 Pops. For this speculation I’ll include the video of the scene from that episode and I’ll try to tie them up with 5x09.

All the episodes in P2 are meant to do a full circle and the writers have based most of their storytelling on the events of S1 and S2.

So first the spoilers of what we know from 5x09 and then the ties we may find with 1x10 and some more past episodes.  

The 11 minutes are quite long but is it really all things concerning? 

Henderson tweeted that there will be 5 actors but as we know know Ellis plays two characters which is why the dinner scene may have taken three days to shoot so we should count six people at the Dinner Table.

The location will be (most probably) at Linda’s house as we have seen from a bts that her main table is full of different varieties of fruits and food in an attempt to recreate an Olympian affluent meal. For Linda is only normal to be out of her element and try to impress God. So far she has been almost killed by his ex, has a child that can be snatched away to the Silver City if she is not deemed worthy perhaps or even because of Charlie’s half genetic code.

Remember there was a stand in actor for Michael 

The problem Linda also faces is that she has supported Lucifer. Yes, he is her friend but how will God react to that? Having a human siding with His rebellious son? Linda as it has been written knows how far pissed off celestials can go and I’m sure she remembers Lucifer’s agony and fear over his Father where Chloe was concerned. So she tries, really tries to present a wonderful setting for the grandfather of her child.

So we do have Linda in the mix. Obviously God, Amenadiel, Lucifer and Michael. That makes us five characters and four actors. Little Charlie also makes an appearance as far as I’m aware as the twin babies were on set and that also contributes on why the scene took so long to be shot. However the babies do not count as the sixth character. Chloe though does.

In short we have:

Linda

God/Dad

Amenadiel

Lucifer

Michael

Chloe

and

Charlie

Another thing we should take into account for this scene is Rafferty’s posted script page of the midseason finale.

While Amenadiel and Lucifer appear shocked and in awe, Michael seems rather pleased. I mean he literally ‘Grins with excitement’.

Amenadiel in 5x03 said that the only one who was talking to the throne meanwhile Henderson as far as I remember in one of the post P1 interviews, revealed that God and Michael have a relationship that Lucifer wishes he had with Him. D.B on one of the virtual cons (or ET interview. I have issues with keeping track of them now) have said that the scene at the family dinner would be gut wrenching and absolutely fall down hilarious’.

So in this dinner we will get to know our characters more and as Ildy and Henderson have said Lucifer will go back being a 14 year old at the Thanksgiving table. That perhaps is the reason why the script episodes 510 and 511were reversed. The last time that had happened was in S1 in order for Lucifer’s vulnerability to not come too soon in the season. In the case of these two episodes I believe it has to do with Lucifer’s emotional state but also the constant collisions he will have with his father in the Family Dinner but also during the Musical episode.

Another aspect to consider is that if 5x09 reminds us a lot of 1x10 -Pops right now and 5x10 the Musical episode is directly influenced by 2x16 - God Johnson.

The next section will now be dedicated to a quick recap of 1x10 - Pops and the possible connection to Michael and his story.

Michael in 5x09 teases Chloe as she is kept captive that there is a bigger plan and ‘Spoiler Alert’ it will be EPIC. That can be left alone as a promise to see more of that plan in S5P2 but before we go forward we should also go back in 2x04 - Weaponiser.

Do you see the parallel? How far Uriel’s view of the ‘Patterns’ could go was always a meta I couldn’t crack. Sure Michael hinted as per one Anon hinted on Tumblr that Michael might have been the one to urge Uriel on Earth to kill Mum and hopefully Lucifer as well. It is also perhaps why we were reminded of Azrael’s Blade in 5x03 - Diablo with Baphament’s blade, the only blade that could kill the Devil. Perhaps that was Michael’s plan back then but it didn’t work out.

But is Michael the big villain? According to the showrunners no. There are more things happening but Michael has a reasoning, has a story, one that explains his deformity and is the hero of his own story as all  the other season ‘villains’ so far were. Mum, Amenadiel, Malcolm, Kinley, even Cain.

What the Interviews say about Michael:

Beginning with the parallel between the dinner we had in 1x10’s dinner and plot, and in what may have in episode 5x09 I would like to remind you- 

- at this point I have censored some spoilers, not speculations, spoilers for episodes of P2 that will not be added in the S&S -

I’ll return to this topic and explore it thoroughly as the S&S are written but for now remember that 1x10 might tell us more than what we think right now and it might take us as a point of reference even up to 5x16.

Between 1x10 and 5x09 we can also wonder what are God’s intentions, can we attribute them all to Michael’s manipulation or it goes beyond that because the showrunners have promised us an emotional P2. I do believe issues are addressed and Lucifer will have to come face to face with some hard truths without that meaning that Dad was always right.

In the Pilot - wait.. Pilot? Yes, 5x09 is an episode that slowly builds us to the very end. There are spoilers and references that need to be addressed from past and future episodes before and after 5x09.

We need to address that in the Pilot, Lucifer told Delilah the very truth he uttered to Linda where he was concerned in S4 (4x08). God has nothing to do with your mess. Like Delilah, Lucifer was putting the blame to others, circumstances and even questioned God. He was wasting his eternal life and his talent, which he eventually found in crime solving.

On cue we get to the scene with Chloe asking God what she is doing to a bar with Lucifer. And what follows is Chloe telling Lucifer how she saw things differently from everyone and she paid for it. That story for me at least rings a bell.

We still do not know why Lucifer was cast out, the actual reason. No matter the sexescapeding with Eve or the rebellion what was the core of all that acting out as Linda called it in season 2? Whatever it was if we go back to 3x11 we will see that Chloe in the Pilot is basically Lucifer in 3x11.

They feel alone, misjudged and while Chloe tries to move on and later in S1 finds what actually happened, in Lucifer’s case he gives up on waiting for forgiveness from his Father until Michael comes, and tells him that even his Fall was a manipulation.

In Pops Lucifer asked something very interesting what did the sous chef wanted? And the answer was to surpass Pops. I do wonder if that’s what Lucifer wanted in a way and of course Michael on Lucifer’s expense. Two ‘children’ fighting for attention but only one was groomed to take over.

Speaking of taking over at the end of the episode of 1x10 we learn that Pops despite what Junior had done still had his son in his mind for taking over the restaurant. Pops believed in his son but allowed him space to grow eventually when everything failed.

If you remember Zadkiel’s spoiler we see that in 5x15 for some reason Lucifer wants to re-join the Host. That aside from a reconciliation shows that like Junior, Lucifer for his own reasons - we do not know what has happened but we will go back to that in the S&S of 5x15 - wants what divine power has to offer.

What happens next is again interesting -censored-. I just want you to see how we do not deal with standalones but everything progresses towards a point, a familiar yet innovative point for the series.

In episode 2x01, Lucifer asks mockingly an offended Chloe who did she thought he took after, his Dad? That happened because Lucifer believed to have taken more after his mother but as we know genetics is a funny thing, Celestial genetics even more so.

God’s absence from Lucifer’s life shaped him. He did drove Lucifer to become something he wasn’t but after 4.5 seasons can we claim that Lucifer and God are nothing alike? 

Maze I believe was spot on on the similarities God and Lucifer held.

Lucifer believes in justice, in truth and is able to love. He has been more of an Angel than any non fallen Angel has ever been so far. 

Amenadiel tricked a dead human to kill Lucifer thus condemning him again in Hell however as we know from Charlotte’s case a redemption was not impossible. 

Uriel wanted to kill his mother and wouldn’t hesitate to kill Chloe in the process. Azrael is basically a liar and manipulator, Remiel would gleefully cut open a human for their half-celestial baby while Michael is really-really messed up.

So what has happened?

Like with Junior, Lucifer was pushed by his Father to become the man he is today. And Lucifer likes what he is, who he is because he sees the change and is even afraid of not being real when that change is questioned or exposed to him.

The same happened with Amenadiel, once he decided to embrace humanity and brotherhood. He changed for the better and became more ‘angelic’.

So yes, Junior’s story does apply to Lucifer on many levels. But Junior didn’t have that dinner with his Father, Lucifer will as they will do two more of his siblings. Some will be hurt, some will feel betrayed and some may walk out.

Which brings us to a very big question. 

Was Mum truthful when she said to Lucifer, his Dad wanted to destroy him? If the answer is yes, how will both deal with that? Because Lucifer may have not totally believed Mum.

If that answer comes to play we should consider it as the common question children come forward to when they learn they were not planned or their parents had opted at first to have an abortion. The fact that they didn’t get on with the abortion or had willingly made a child does affect their feelings towards that child now? Do they regret it? Do they want what that child has become?

These are all tough questions and sometimes the answers are not easy either. Mainly because humans like celestials with human emotions as it seems, are secure and balanced only with the totality of a circumstance. Everything or nothing, the rest in between are not welcome and it’s bound to hurt.

Finally, on this 1x10 weird reminisce. Can we say that Lucifer will be allowed in the end to create something that represents him? I think he may but more about that in 5x16 S&S.

Probably the story will not end with redemption but with Lucifer finally becoming his own person one that resembles a lot of Dad and Dad may accept or even encourage that path. That does not mean he will start anew though

Which brings us back to the adversary of 1x10 - Pops. The sous chef believed that Junior was not worthy of his father’s tolerance and reward so she made sure to destroy his reputation and went as far as trying to kill him. That sounds a lot like Michael.

Michael’s speech towards Maze about what was happening in the Silver City in 5x02 did echo the sous chef words:

So we should wonder if Michael will succeed to a point to ruin Lucifer’s chances and leave Lucifer live with the consequences in the end as our hero learns to move on from whatever injustice happened or the writers will provide a catharsis.

And a final question here… Is Amenadiel really the favourite son? I somehow doubt that, perhaps I’ll be proved wrong as in many interviews Henderson has gone back to Amenadiel’s arc as he learns he is the ‘favourite’ and so far he has not said anything to contradict the belief 2x17 brought to us with so many translated Sumerian words.

But as we said teh Dinner will not be cathartic on the contrary so does that mean that Lucifer eventually walks away? Probably.

At the photos that were posted near Christmas we have two bts one crystal clear and the other more hazy which shows Lucifer at the Penthouse and Dad being there in his white cardigan. I do suspect that meeting at the penthouse happens after the dinner but it does not resolve things between Father and son. it is also possible that it’s why we need the very emotional scene from the musical to be moved forward and 511 script to become 5x10 aired episode.

Perhaps the comment on it’s not just Lucifer who hits the keys was referring to Dad and not Maze in 5x01.

Although we cannot be sure on what will happen in the penthouse and whether Scarlet was meant to join that scene or simply was on set for the day (highly probable) for another scene, we do know that in this episode we had a LUX night. A most perhaps unconventional one.

By this point you know that the writers are ready to address everything or at least make parallels and so somehow we have one with 1x09 - A Priest Walks Into A Bar. This time however it is seems like God Walks Into His Son’s Bar.

If the camera is clear enough we can see God (?) talking to a white person. I would have loved it if it was Dan but I cannot tell for sure.

Whether that visit happens before or after the family dinner I believe it may happen before as the clothes Dennis wore at the lot around that time were different from the white we saw him appear with in the end of 5x08. Of course that does not say much as we will see Dad in the same/similar white clothes in at least three different episodes in Part 2.

Therefore in the conclusion of this S&S we should speculate that the Dinner is placed at the middle of the episode and a resolution is reached for Deckerstar in the end of the episode but Lucifer’s turmoil did fit better through the musical episode hence the change. 

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