wolf-queer-discourse

[wolf-queer-discourse]

[wolf-queer-discourse]

Biomes of Biphobia #1

Biphobia these days is so normalized and so everywhere. To be a bi person online is to constantly navigate through biomes of sticky, biphobic goo and have to pretend you can’t see it or don’t care about it, lest the gays turn on you and swallow you whole.

Here’s a common thread in biphobic gay people; they don’t believe biphobia exists. It’s almost always that simple. Gay people will tolerate the bis so long as they only talk about homophobia. That’s fine with them. It doesn’t annoy them because they experience homophobia too. But bring up biphobia, and feathers get ruffled. Biphobic gays shout from the rooftops that they’re being attacked!

I’d like to start this series off with a thread of casual biphobia. For context, this is a comment thread under a post made by a lesbian that says this:

Now that’s problematic enough, but here’s the comment thread I will be addressing which is under the post.

So, oof, where do we start? 

Here’s the thing, and I’d dive completely into it but we don’t have all day: bi women complaining about their relationships with men is a real issue. However...the issue is internalized biphobia. These complaints being normalized doesn’t harm gay people. It harms bi people. It’s incredible that the gay person in this comment doesn’t feel any pity for their bi women friends, but instead makes themself the victim! Their logic, I assume, is that bi women have it so good and they're so lucky to be with a man, so their complaints are insulting to the real gays who actually struggle. The comment following, from the original poster, seems to affirm this. That gay people are the victims of bi people’s internalized biphobia. Okay.

Then, later in the thread, a different commenter explains that she was married to her husband then realized she was bi but has no intention to date again. Totally makes sense. She’s explaining why she’s never dated a non-man nor is likely to because she’s in a committed relationship.

And what does the original poster say to this?

“Ok?”

And I just...wow. I hate that I have to explain why this is biphobic.

There’s something just so nasty about a bi commenter sharing a small personal experience only to be told by a monosexual person, “Ok?” It's silencing. It says "Who cares? We didn’t ask. No one cares about a privileged bi person’s experience. You should feel embarrassed for having even said this.”

It’s this kind of casual silencing of bi voices that’s all too common online. The sad part is, tons of bi people are okay with being treated this way. They just want to be accepted so badly. That’s the thing about all of this. The original commenter doesn’t seem to acknowledge the reason her bi friends are saying these things. They want to be accepted by gay people so badly. These women may very well not realize that's what they're doing, but they likely are. Gay people who love and affirm bi people can and do make such a difference. It doesn't take any effort not to make dismissive comments like this. 

This type of behavior from biphobic gay people is so often tolerated, but it shouldn’t be. And bi people and allies alike shouldn’t be afraid to call out biphobia even if it’s other queer people perpetuating it.

#discourse #queer discourse #lgbt discourse #bisexual #bi discourse #bi #biromantic #queer #lgbt #biphobia #biomes of biphobia #rant #response #queerphobia #bisexual discourse

[wolf-queer-discourse]

Adventures in Aphobia #4

I am sad to announce another addition to this series. I stumbled on an account with a whole catalog of aphobic posts, so the real hard part was choosing just one to respond to! Here it is:

I’m starting to think aphobic allos are incapable of holding their tongue. “Not to discourse, but—” Own your bigotry, coward. You are making an active choice to create this post that you know ace people will see and feel bad about themselves. Revel in it. Enjoy it for all I care, but don’t lie about it.

Like the last post I covered, this poster seems to think asexual labels are just “too complicated” and “too specific” to exist. Can aphobes stop burdening ace people with their lack of basic comprehension? My patience wears thin. If they wanted to understand asexuality, they could.

Yes, attraction can feel different for everyone. There’s a difference between experiencing attraction in slightly different ways and not experiencing it at all. I’m going to break this down as simply as I can.

Sexual attraction is looking at a person and seeing their body/parts of their body as sexual. This most often leads to the urge to have sex with someone. However, since humans are not crazy sex animals, many secondary motivations cause people to wish to make the choice to abstain from sex in certain contexts. Perhaps they are sexually attracted to a person (again, seeing their body as a desirable sexual thing), however, do not yet trust the person enough to be intimate. Maybe the person has chosen to be celibate for religious reasons, which supersede their instinctual sexual desire.

While these secondary motivations absolutely vary from person to person, they do not erase the fact that the people in these situations are allosexual and experience sexual attraction. Being ace has nothing to do with these secondary motivations. It means no gender or person is sexually appealing.

Asexuality has many harder-to-understand nuisances, of course, I want to be careful not to lambast people who genuinely misunderstand, but honestly, the definition of asexuality in itself is not a hard concept to grasp at all. Aphobes repeatedly use definitions of asexuality that have been called inaccurate dozens of times, just to make the argument that ace and allo people are actually all the same. There is nothing “pathologizing” about the simple acknowledgment that you do not see people sexually. It’s absurd how much aphobes try to pretend that most people seeing other people as sexually appealing isn’t a huge part of society. If you’re not ace, you are very easily blind to that reality because it’s so normalized through your own eyes.

“micromanaging the particulars of our sexual orientation (the term deriving from sex as a word for gender at the time it was created, not sex as the act)”

Ah, the feeling when an aphobe was right for half a second but immediately dropped that idea. Let me slow anyone down who missed it. Yes, the “sexual” in a person’s orientation refers to the gender of the attraction, not the sex act itself. This person has just recognized that someone’s sexuality is about sexual attraction, not literally the act of having sex. Surely this supports ace people, no? Did the poster not just argue that other people are “basically ace” due to not wanting sex in certain contexts? Would the attraction part not disapprove that this isn’t the same thing?

The poster says gay, lesbian, straight and bi are all the labels we need, and that no qualifiers are ever necessary because attraction is more than just the urge to have sex with people. Ah, yes. The Holy Four sexualities. No one has any labels outside of that… Also, this completely excludes aroace people. Most people who argue this are at least willing to acknowledge that some people aren’t attracted to anyone in any way at all. This poster probably forgot to consider this, to be honest, but it’s a pretty big oversight either way.

Yes, attraction as a whole is more than the urge to have sex with someone. But sexual attraction is only about, who’d have guessed it, attractions that are sexual. When we have labels such as heterosexual, bisexual, homosexual, is it any wonder people who don’t experience the sexual part don’t identify with the label?? I have no clue why people against the split attraction model will die on the hill that heterosexual attractions don’t have to be sexual. Of course they do. It’s in the WORD. Why on earth would a heteroromantic ace person identify as a word that so evidently does not match their experience? Why are aphobes obsessed with forcing ace people to choose a word that blatantly suggests the existence of their sexual attraction? Not every hetero attraction is under the heteroSEXUAL umbrella. That’s why separate words, such as heteroromantic, are clearly useful and not hard to understand. The name is exactly what the word means.

“it’d be also super neat if we could stop pretending that it’s somehow more inclusive or easier for people with a fraught relationship to sex to split sexual orientation into Ace and Non-Ace”

Literally blatant aphobia. People with “fraught relationships to sex”? Why the fuck are you refusing to say the word asexual? Aphobes do this so much. They’ll be like “people with sexual disorders...people who are afraid of sex...people who are weirdos”. No. Asexual people. People who do not experience sexual attraction. Get that in your head. And yeah, it’s absolutely easier for ace people to split their orientation when they don’t match. No one is forcing everyone to split their attractions if they’re not split. If yours all fit neatly in one box, good for you. It’s still absolutely more inclusive to allow people to define their sexual orientation in two halves if that’s how they experience their attraction.

It is true that most people’s sexual and romantic orientations are deeply intertwined and not easily ripped apart. But there are exceptions. Clearly alloace people are those exceptions. They exist, and there’s legit no reason to keep crying about how they experience their attraction differently than you.

“As if it’s any help at all to shove e.g. lesbians who struggle with the sexual aspect of lesbian identification off into their own restricted zone away from Normal Lesbianism that requires a special prefix before lesbian.”

Lesbian means sexual and/or romantic attraction.  The and/or is very important. And again, the poster does not say “lesbians who don’t experience sexual attraction”. They instead resort to using insulting language such as “struggle with the sexual aspect of lesbian identification”. What the actual fuck. Ace lesbians are not “struggling” to do anything. They are perfectly healthy and valid the way they are. Funny how the poster accuses ace people of segregating people and pathologizing others when they instead insinuate ace people are struggling to experience something they ought to. Talk about pathologizing. Ace lesbians get to talk about being ace because they are ace, and it matters to a lot of them.

“That their way of feeling attraction is just as much a normal part of lesbianism as anyone else’s, no qualifiers needed.”

What is this projection? Identifying as ace means you’re...not normal?? Jesus, I hope no ace lesbians had to read you saying that they’re not normal lesbians and that they should stop using a useful label to describe themselves.

“The idea of a split romantic and sexual orientation is an unhealthy, pathologizing way of looking at sexual orientations that’s just gonna end up alienating people who feel lost in mainstream depictions of sexuality even more and I am done with pretending that I am okay with that kind of rhetoric being spread.”

Lmao. This person wrote an entire post filled with insulting stands-ins for asexual and repeatedly insinuated there was something wrong with them, but yes, ace people are the ones pathologizing themselves. Okay. And people who feel lost in mainstream depictions, hm. Sounds like you may be referring to a lot of ace people. You really think a word is such a terrible thing, don’t you? Aphobes who think they’re polite really do be like “of course it’s okay not to want sex! Not everyone feels sexual attraction!” Then the person is like, “Yeah, I’m ace,” and suddenly all hell breaks loose.

This person sounds like they’d be against all sexuality labels, since it’s all too CoMplICated, yet...they’re not. This is just something they’re slapping onto ace people, like they’re the ones a step too far.

And of course they end the post decrying themself as the true victim. They’re just so done letting ace people peacefully exist? “Omg, guys ace people existing makes my one brain cell overheat! They need to stop for meeee!”

I’m done pretending I’m okay with this person’s rhetoric being spread. Don’t like the split attraction model? Great. Then don’t use it. Feel like ace people’s experiences are just like yours? Awesome. Sounds like you might be ace! Just do us all a favor and don’t make your shallow mind ace people’s responsibility. 

#btw this post had a lot of likes on it #crazy how aphobes eat up these mindrotting takes #discourse #queer discourse #LGBT discourse #Adventures in Aphobia #ace discourse #asexual discourse #aphobia #ace discrimination #asexual #asexuality #LGBT #queer #ace #rant

[wolf-queer-discourse]

I have yet to see an argument for aroace exclusion that isn’t rooted in the highly biphobic notion of passing privilege.

[wolf-queer-discourse]

monosexuality/monosexism are incredibly useful terms for bisexuals and I’ll die on that hill. And I say this because plenty of people who have either deliberately or accidentally aided in our alienation are all underneath the mindset we face discrimination for simply being “half gay.” They don’t think our violence/exclusion is contributed by being bisexual and this is the issue. Let’s also not forget plenty of people don’t think biphobia is real, but just homophobia. It’s reverting back to saying bis only face violence for being “half gay,” and if they do think biphobia is real they think it stops at “bis are sluts/aren’t real.” While the violence is ONLY labeled as homophobia and nothing more

it’s incredibly weird how people from our own community are creating fear mongering lies that the term monosexual was created to insult gay people and label them as our oppressors. I don’t understand how people could look at the statistics of abuse bisexuals face (esp how bi women are far more likely to face sexual violence), how we’re more likely to be closeted, and not comprehend how maybe these terms help us label our painful experiences and aren’t meant to be used as weapons for whatever “us vs them” y’all are making up

[wolf-queer-discourse]

I'm curious to know your perspective/opinion on the following statements, both of which have been taken from asexual people;

"Voluntary celibacy is not asexuality." "Trauma-related sex repulsion doesn't make you asexual."

From what I understood as an observer, these statements were based on the perspective that asexuality is a genetic or inherent component, rather than one that can be 'caused' or 'triggered.'

(In the sense that; you are born asexual, you cannot be 'turned' asexual, which is of course different to merely discovering or coming to understand that you are asexual.)

An example of voluntary celibacy would be for religious purposes. E.g; abstinence before marriage. An example of trauma-related sex repulsion would be the disgust/fear of sexual contact after SA.

I think it’s important to recognize that it’s very hard to prove the exact “cause” of someone’s sexual orientation. What we know in this respect is pretty limited, and most of this research has only been about gay people (so not even bisexuals are included in this). All we really do know is that a person’s sexual orientation seems to be pretty set in stone pretty early in life and is not a choice or something that can be successfully altered. This would leave me to generally believe that asexuality, like any other orientation, is likely a complicated soup of factors that has someone as asexual at a very early age.

Asexuality is defined as having no sexual attraction (I’m not referring to aspec-identities here, that’s more complicated and deserves its own post).

So voluntarily celibacy, such as for religious reasons, would not be considered asexuality. I suppose you could be both asexual and celibate, but that doesn’t change the point of the statement, which is that someone’s actions do not make them an orientation. Most celibate people do say they are sexually attracted to people, just that they wish not to act on it.

As for sex repulsion caused by trauma, this can be more complex depending on the circumstance. Many and most people who have this trauma would not call themselves asexual, as they do still find people attractive in a sexual way, they just have a fear of acting on that attraction. I would definitely agree that those people are not asexual. The complication is that there are some of these people who do believe they are asexual, as they say they’ve lost all sexual attraction due to the trauma. I think any cases of this are pretty rare if they are a thing because people rarely lose sexual attraction, they just lose the desire to act upon it (these are different things). Despite my belief that a person “becoming asexual due to trauma” seems very unlikely, I don’t think gatekeeping is helpful. If a person truly believes they are asexual, then they have the right to identify that way and be a part of the community.

We should still generally be fighting the belief that trauma causes asexuality. By recognizing sex-favorably and asexuality as two different, but often related scales, we can avoid this issue.

#ask #asexual #asexuality #ace #queer #celibacy #sex-repulsion #tramua #LGBT #sexuality #sexuality issues

[wolf-queer-discourse]

Adventures in Aphobia #3

My last two Adventures in Aphobia both took on similar flavors of eye-rolling at shameless, obvious bigotry to anyone willing to look or care. But today, I found a different type of aphobia, and I’m actually eager to talk about this one. Have a read of this first.

Look, the bar of respect for ace people is so low it’s all the way in hell, but I mean, to many people, especially allosexual people, they may look at this post and think, “No, this isn’t aphobia. The poster wasn’t blatantly cruel.” But what some fail to realize is that politeness can be the thinnest of veils over the ugliest of takes. Polite bigotry gaslights the victims into thinking they can’t be upset about this.

So what’s the deal with this post?

PARAGRAPH #1 starts off innocently enough, saying ace discourse wouldn’t exist if people recognized complex relationships to sex and relationships. Even taken on its own, I do not agree with this. Ace discourse ranges all the way from outright denial of asexual existence to the strong hatred for and exclusion of aces from the queer community. Nearly everyone recognizes people have complex relationships to sex...that...that doesn’t mean ace people won’t be discriminated against. In fact, it’s an argument aphobes use constantly to try and gaslight ace people into erasing themselves. Ace discourse comes from a lot of places, but at the end of the day, it all stems from people’s refusal to acknowledge ace people and their unique experiences. This poster absolutely does not get to say “IT’s CoMpLicAteD”, and expect ace people to just disappear. Honestly, it’d be better and more honest if they said “Lol, ace people should go fuck themselves and hop to the back of the line with everyone else.”

PARAGRAPH #2 and #3 are not very objectionable on their own. Everything said is true. Society has very complicated views on sex, and life happens to all people. The ugly part of this is that the poster is setting up an argument here in which they will hand wave ace people into the “everyone else” crowd and pretend as if we’re all just too similar and no labels should even exist.

This is literally what enby-phobes do. They say “Well, gender is COMPLICATED”, which is true, but then they say “So like...aren’t we all really nonbinary when we think about it? Why should enby people label themselves?” I swear we’ve all seen this. The poster is agender. This argument could easily be whipped in their face. Different forms of bigotry can share very clear overlaps, and it’s very important to acknowledge where these arguments come from and why they exist. It exists as a way to shut people up. It happens to bi people too! Every day, people come out as bi and someone tells them “pff, everyone thinks girls are hot. I had a crush on my best friend once, that doesn’t mean I’m not straight! All people are like this!” Let’s call out this erasure where we see it. It’s not the same thing, and if anyone saying stuff like this truly believes what they’re saying, maybe they’re the ones who need to reevaluate their own identity.

PARAGRAPH #4 dips its ugly toes straight into blatant aphobia, having the gall to call ace and aro people “obsessed” with pretending their relationships with sex and romance are wholly unique and different. Nah, fuck right off with that bullshit. The poster even goes on to say ace people have created entire new social classes. Uh...WHAT? Is there some secret ace society with a caste system living in the shadows?? What is this person talking about?? I suppose you can’t be a true bigot unless you have some vague grievance to weakly hand-gesture at that you couldn’t prove given 20 years to do so. For the love of my sanity, just say you hate ace people! It’s okay! (I mean, not actually, but Jesus Christ does it save us all some time). They also say things like “somehow excluded from”. Replace asexual people with nonbinary people and take a joyride through this section, because the arguments are scarily similar. What would it take for this poster to acknowledge ace and aro people have their own experiences? Seriously, what? What holds you back from doing this?

It’s also funny to note the actual lack of substance to this argument. The poster is not giving any specific examples or even bringing up what being ace and aro mean. Yes, there is a pretty noticeable difference between feeling sexual attraction and not feeling sexual attraction. How many “allo” people do you know that say they’ve NEVER experienced this? Come on. The poster reduces asexuality and aromanticism down to allo people’s, in their own words, hyper-specific contexts where they don’t want sex or love. At least the poster admits any circumstance that allo people are comparable to ace people are extremely specific. But for real, are we hinging a whole argument on a few very specific examples of allo people having some similarity to ace people?

“Nothing about your relationship to sex or love makes you more or less LGBT. If you are gay and don’t want to have sex, ever, you are still gay. “

Mini strawman alert for the idea any ace person thinks you’re less gay if you’re also ace. And bonus points for an aphobe who refuses to use the definition of asexuality: not experiencing sexual attraction, and instead goes for “don’t want to have sex”. For the last. Fucking. Time. Not wanting to have sex and being asexual are NOT the same. Don’t make me pour gasoline in my eyes every time I see this.

After this, the poster goes on a tangent, which by the tone, seems to think it's very inspiring, and says no matter how you want to have sex (including only certain days of the week), you’re still straight! It’s so fucking condescending and gross to talk ace people out of their own identity like this.

“EVERY person who is heterosexual is different in how they perform or experience.”

Oh. My. GOD. THEY DIDN’T EVEN SAY STRAIGHT. THEY SAID HETEROSEXUAL. WUGGYUEGYUG. God help me. Can one be both bisexual and heterosexual? No…? Okay. So then. How is one both asexual AND heterosexual? What single brain cell in this poster’s head was responsible for this Chad of a sentence? I—

*deep breath* 

So. It’s interesting how the poster says “perform or experience it”. Asexuality is an identity. It is not a performance, and it is not defined by your actions. A straight person not having sex does not become asexual. And sure...people with the same label can experience their sexuality differently, but...to a point, guys. You can’t experience your sexuality out of the DEFINITION of the label. Heterosexual: Sexual attraction to the opposite gender. Asexual: Sexual attraction to no one. If a “heterosexual” isn’t sexually attracted to anyone, they are by definition, not heterosexual. It takes insane mental gymnastics to make this argument, so A for flexibility, I guess? 

“Gayness, straightness, and bisexuality are not defined by HOW you do or don’t want sex or HOW you do or don’t want to date, it’s just defined by WHO you want to be with.”

The first part of the sentence is correct, but it also defeats this person’s entire argument. Ace people AGREE with this. Being asexual is not the act of not having sex!! It’s not experiencing sexual attraction! You can google this! The second part of the sentence is mostly correct, depending on your interpretation. The issue is in part with the words the poster used: gayness, straightness and bisexuality. These words are not all equivalents. Gay could refer to sexual and or romantic orientation. Thus an ace gay person. Straightness is not actually an equal word to gayness. This is because straight is an exclusive term for a normative sexuality (in society’s eyes) in terms of sexual and romantic attraction. Some ace people DO call themselves straight, though it’s inaccurate. Ace people can be heteroromantic, but because being straight is so exclusive, you need to be both sexually AND romantically attracted to only the opposite gender.

The post basically ends telling ace people they’re all actually straight and were just confused the whole time. Lovely. And an erasure of gay aces too! Believe it or not, gay ace people do not like having their ace identities erased. Who’d have guessed?

Honestly, if anything this post is just kind of sad. A sad reflection of what people believe and how they truly do not see their own bigotry. They believe they’re freeing ace people from an incorrect label. They’re the heroes.

They’ll say “it’s okay, you’re not asexual” as if they've like...lifted a burden off of ace people. Like, “Oh, you think I’m not asexual? Cool, cool. Glad you cleared that up for me!” It’s sad how aphobes think, some very genuinely, that asexuality is just some high school party that went off the rails, and we’re all just coming out of the drunken haze, ready to go home. Ready to all laugh about it later, tease one another about how wild and silly it all was. 

Having your identity erased like this is fucking horrible, and I hope people like this can take a look in the mirror and see themselves clearly. All ace and aro people have a right to their identity, whether gay, bi, heteroromantic or anything else. End of story.

#discourse #queer discourse #LGBT discourse #Adventures in Aphobia #ace discourse #asexual discourse #aphobia #ace #ace discrimination #asexual #asexuality #aromantic #aro #LGBT #queer #rant #why does this post think it's so intellegent #why did this post try so hard to sound nice at first #it's still aphobia

[wolf-queer-discourse]

Ngl it's rly infuriating how a buncha aspec exclusionists dropped aspec discourse "because it's cringe" instead of doing anything like Actually Realizing that they were constantly harassing and invalidating a vulnerable minority and dropping the discourse because of that.

I've seen WAY too many people saying things like "yeah lol it was really cringe ace discourse doesn't matter I hate that I was involved" and not express a SHRED of regret for the community they decimated, the history they erased, and the people they drove into the closet through harrassment and mocking.

[wolf-queer-discourse]

Adventures in Aphobia #2

It is absolutely tragic that I’m already adding to Adventures in Aphobia, but here we are again! Let’s get a look at the phenomenal post I will be addressing.

Hope you enjoyed reading that as much as I did. You know, the biggest joke of this whole post is the poster thinking ace people feel comfortable on Tumblr. I promise you they do not XD.

It’s funny how when queer sub-groups complain about bigotry faced from the broader community (this happens a LOT with bi and ace people, but I’ve seen it happen to trans people too), the bigoted queer people immediately call YOU the bigot because they’re actually more oppressed than you, which means they get to say whatever they want. I’m not going to even entertain the oppression olympics on this one.

The answer as to who’s more oppressed always boils down to: it depends, in what way, and why does this matter?

There are a TON of transphobic gay people who throw their hands up when they get called out for their behavior and decry, “But I’m gay! You’re not oppressed for thinking you’re a boy!!”

And honestly, some aphobes do want ace people dead, and not all homophobes want gay people dead. Why are ace people one of the only groups in the queer community who has to personally confess to almost being murdered, disowned, r*ped and stabbed all in the same day to have any of their struggles taken seriously?? Do you make gay people do this too, or do you ever just believe them? 

It’s incredible that some people’s entire queer identity is rooted in the fact they’ve been murdered or disowned before, as if the second you’re not being beaten in the streets, do you really face any struggles? There are gay people who haven’t been disowned or killed (obviously). They’re still gay, and they can still talk about homophobia without being mocked for it.

Bonus points for this poster, in what must be purposeful assholery, not even using a standard, accepted definition of what it means to be asexual. “Oppressed for not having sex”. Yes, because “not having sex” is the definition of asexuality. I mean, God, at least be original and come up with a banger instead of this lazy insult.

And if you needed any more proof this poster hates asexual people take a look at their do not follow list!

Imagine...literally being offended by someone believing ace people are oppressed. If you had room for this shit in your bio, you certainly had room for “spineless bigot” somewhere. Alas…

And uh, thinking minors can be ace is also a DNF-worthy offense?? Oh boy. I hate even having to explain this, but...sexual attraction does not ship to your doorstep on your 18th birthday. I know, I’m bummed too, but that’s just how it is. For real though, there’s no argument to saying minors can’t be ace. Trick question, but not really: can minors experience sexual attraction? Obviously yes. Have you met a teenager? It’s insane that aphobes will argue asexual people are sexualizing children by allowing them the right to define their own feelings. And they always use straw men like that there are seven-year-olds identifying as asexual. Bitch, where? Even if you could search the planet and find me one, you wouldn’t be making a point. 

“BUT WHAT IF THEY EXPERIENCE SEXUAL ATTRACTION LATER?”

Gasp, a person changing their label later in life? The horror! How ever will they cancel their subscription? Aphobes, people change labels all the time. None of y’all seem this pressed when a lesbian later identifies as bisexual. I promise it’s okay.

There is literally nothing predatory about acknowledging minors can feel sexual attraction. Not only is it a fact provable but a five-second stint at any high school, but if you really think that’s creepy...that says more about you than anyone else. Just because minors experience sexual attraction doesn’t mean creepy-ass adults can take advantage of them.

Also...love that this poster said “LGBT aces are fine obv”. Is it obvious?? God, I love how aphobes will literally foam at the mouth about how asexual people are a bunch of attention-seeking, pedophiles who are trying to recruit children then immediately tag on a quick “but of course I support LGBT aces!!”. Are these people really so fucking thick they think their words don’t apply to bi, gay and trans aces?? I have yet to meet a single gay, bi or trans ace who feels positively about ace exclusionists. Your rhetoric inherently harms all ace people because it doesn’t give gay, bi and trans aces room to talk about their aphobic experiences. You don’t get to only support one part of their queer identity and expect a pat on the back. You’re a fucking aphobe, and you can’t cozy that up with your empty words of support for only the “good” aces. 

#remember that bigots deserve to be laughed at #they can be the sillest! #discourse #queer discourse #LGBT discourse #Adventures in Aphobia #ace discourse #asexual discourse #aphobia #ace discrimination #asexual #asexuality #LGBT #queer #ace #rant

[wolf-queer-discourse]

Adventures in Aphobia #1

So I was scrolling through Tumblr the other day (a regrettable mistake as always), and I had the great pleasure of seeing this joyous post.

*deep breath*

Not gonna lie, posts like this make me real pissed. Pissed because the person who posted this exists in a space where they feel comfortable enough to post this online. Pissed because these posts are so common and often face little backlash. And pissed because there’s nothing better than allosexuals condescendingly explaining to asexual people why they’re dirty attention whores who invent their own oppression. Ace people deserve to be defended against this horseshit. Young people see these posts, and it’s extremely damaging to have your identity be nothing more than fuel for people in discourse to mock you and demand you bled in order for them to notice your pain.

Anger aside, many people do not see why this post is wrong, so why is it? Let’s unpack this clusterfuck of bigotry:

“would love to see substantive evidence of systematic “aphobia” that isn’t actually just misogyny, toxic masculinity, or rpe culture.”

God damn, we are not mincing our words here XD. A few things: systematic in bold, which tells you if you do not make a blood sacrifice on the altar of queer pain you will not be taken seriously. Potential nitpick, but systemic and systematic are not the same thing. I believe systemic is the word they’re looking for. Systematic implies a lot more intentionality that can be hard to prove. Systemic merely means that systems, in their current state, do aphobic things, which they absolutely do.

“Aphobia” in quotes is absolutely rich. Not only will this person refuse to acknowledge systemic aphobia, which is only one type, but this poster casts clear doubt upon the mere concept of aphobia in and of itself. We love to see it.

There’s a lot to unpack here. The statement, as clearly condescending as intended, is sort of correct, though it doesn’t mean a whole lot. Systemic oppression is about the systems in a society (government, healthcare, etc) discriminating against people. Systemic oppression is not bigotry faced on a person-to-person level. In short, systematic oppression is something a person experiences in their overall life, while personal discrimination is experienced on a personal level by people who are not singularly in control of the systems. This post boils down the negative comments ace people face into being called “weird”, which is an understatement for sure, but calling a gay person weird isn’t systemic oppression either.

It’s still bad and discriminatory.

This is such a snotty way to dismiss aphobia as some mere, insignificant comment with no meaning as if it doesn’t reinforce society’s painful aphobic views in the same way casual homophobic comments reinforce heteronormativity and society’s hostility toward gay people.

Ace people face discrimination in healthcare, most notably, which is systemic discrimination, but the systemic discrimination of asexuals really ought to be its own post if I’m to nosedive into it. Even if ace people faced no systemic discrimination, it wouldn’t make this point anymore correct. Discrimination is a perfectly valid reason to feel disregarded by society, and often only ace people are denied the right to feel this way and are instead gaslit into admitting what they face is no big deal and they’re just making it up for attention.

The experience of being pressured to have sex when you’re allo vs ace is very different. The vast majority of allo people do not plan to be celibate their whole lives. Many ace people do not want to have sex, ever. “Waiting for sex” in much of western society and in Christianity is seen as pure and honorable. Yet being asexual and never wanting sex is seen as a deviant disorder and people are accused of robbing their partner of sex forever.

There’s really a specific flavor of sexual pressure that is unique to ace people. Sex being to “fix” someone or because they “just need to try it”.

In this respect, aphobic sexual pressure is better compared to that faced by gay people and lesbians. Lesbians especially often can face this same struggle, men pressuring them to have sex because they think lesbians just need to “try it” or to “fix them”. I can imagine this poster would have no issue acknowledging lesbophobia being the root of lesbians coerced into sex with men, yet she does not give ace people the same.

Imagine if someone said (and knowing our fucked world, someone probably has): “Lesbophobia doesn’t exist. It’s just misogyny. Straight women are coerced into sex too!”

It’d be pathetic bullshit. Toxic masculinity, misogyny and many other issues can all tangle into combined messes with other forms of bigotry. Lesbophobia is an experience that deserves to be recognized apart from misogyny, even if the two are linked. Please stop erasing ace people’s experiences with this when it’s not the same thing.

Honestly, though, this post, as trashy as it is, if anything, is perhaps, really asking: Is there any type of aphobic experience that’s inherently exclusive to ace people?

I still wager to go say, yes, yes there is, but I must make an important point first:

Most experiences of queer discrimination are not limited to queer people.

Homophobia and transphobia are both experienced by cishets in certain instances. Feminine straight men can be victims of homophobic harassment. This does not disprove the fact that it’s homophobia just because a straight man is the victim of it. A tall cis woman with broad shoulders and a lower voice may be the victim of transphobic remarks or comments. The basis of these comments is rooted in transphobia, however, so the fact that the victim is cis does not erase the transphobia.

People who argue that experiences ace people complain about can be experienced by allosexuals are not poking a legitimate hole in doing this. Certain experiences related to aphobia can and are experienced by allosexuals. If you do not acknowledge this, then homophobia and transphobia aren’t real because cishet people have sometimes experienced them.

Despite cishets sometimes experiencing queerphobia, most of us acknowledge that their experience of that bigotry, however unfortunate, is not the same as that experienced by actual queer people. It’d be quite homophobic for a feminine straight man to claim he knew just as much about the gay experience as an actual gay man. Similarly, when allosexual people relate experiences that were rooted in aphobia, it’s overstepping a line when they claim asexual discrimination isn’t real because they experienced elements of it too.

Cishet (cishet including allosexuals) people do not experience their doctors telling them their sexuality might be a disorder or caused by trauma. Allo queer people can experience this with their sexualities too.

“using sex appeal to sell products is misogyny, it is not engineered to gross sex-repulsed people, it is meant to objectify women.”

This is a strawman thinner than my last nerve. Uh, what? What ace people are you seeing that literally think sex appeal was engineered to gross-out sex-repulsed people?? I don’t think this is a core argument??

Yes, sex-repulsed ace people sometimes complain about sex appeal in media being uncomfortable. But that’s it. Every time an ace person shares a discomfort of theirs doesn’t mean it’s the entire basis of their oppression. For the love of God, let ace people discuss their experiences without being blow-torched over not being oppressed enough with an individual discomfort. 

BONUS ROUND

(This was in the tags)

“Completely vilifies celibate individuals” 

...no…? What…? Huh…? 

The most charitable interpretation of this vague accusation is that the poster means celibate people face aphobia as well, due to not wanting to have sex. I have no idea how this “vilifies” anyone, but that aside, as said before: people who are not queer can face aphobia. Also worth noting that society treats celibate people way better than ace people, which is really another example of aphobia. Celibate people can be told they’re missing out (which could be at very least related to aphobic ideals), but they’re rarely called broken. Celibacy is seen more as a respected, controlled ideal in allo people, but when ace people want to do it, they’re just mentally ill.

Anyway, the post was aphobic trash, and it needs to be debunked more often. Mocking ace people online is not a good look anymore, guys. Don't be ugly.

#discourse #queer discourse #LGBT discourse #Adventures in Aphobia #ace discourse #asexual discourse #aphobia #ace discrimination #asexual #asexuality #LGBT #queer #ace #rant #aphobes have no shame but they should #imagine having a brain smoother than a banana peel

[wolf-queer-discourse]

A non-exhaustive list of "Ace Discourse" (Aphobic) topics I've had to deal with:

You can't use #actuallyasexual because the #actually tag style belongs to neurodivergent communities (it doesn't).

The "split attraction model" is bad because it could cause (hypothetical) people to identify as heterosexual homoromantic.

The ace community was invented by David Jay in the early 2000s and asexual people have had no historic involvement in queer spaces.

People who deny their partner sex in a relationship are abusive. People who deny their partner romance are also abusive.

Asexual and aromantic can't be identities (aka nouns) on their own because the words are used as "modifiers" (aka adjectives).

Minors identifying as asexual automatically sexualizes minors who don't identify as such, which encourages pedophilia.

Talking about sex at all with minors is actually pedophilia.

Asexuals are the same as "incels", or involuntary celibates who feel that they are owed sex. Yeah, that makes sense.

Aspec people can't experience compulsive heterosexuality, because that only happens to lesbians.

Aspec people can't experience corrective rape, because that only happens to lesbians.

All oppression all aspec people experience is actually misogyny, racism, ableism, etc. There is nothing unique about oppressing aspecs.

The term "aspec" belongs to the autistic community! Everyone knows autistic people call themselves aspec!

The upside down triangle used by AVEN is stolen from queer people who were targeted by Nazis. (That's not what it means).

Asexual people are inherently serophobic because we all must think sex is gross and people with STDs are bad.

Aspec people are only aspec because of trauma, and they need to heal from that trauma by no longer being aspec.

Aspec people force minors to identify as aspec.

"Allosexual" is stolen from queer communities in Quebec (it isn't). Or, the term assumes gay and lesbian people hold privilege over aspecs.

[Insert a completely made up narrative of an aspec person ruining someone's experience at their school's GSA]

Finally, 'aphobia is a bad word because it assumes me bullying aspecs on the internet is just as bad as being homophobic. :((('

(Also, assuming that all negative and/or violent phobic experiences aspec people have is only ever on the internet)

[wolf-queer-discourse]

I know this has been said a lot but holy shit has it gotten bad frankly. Straight up homophobia is so common on terminally online baby gay twitter and it's so fucking upsetting, I can't see any content generated by, towards or including mlm (such as tips, ships, or just people existing) without the comments being full of the most horrible stuff and slurs tweeted out by people with stuff like, minor/14/ gay (or lesbian or bi, or any other sexuality) / pronouns (clearly indicating that they too are queer and should know better at least)

The most banal stuff will be posted and the, highly liked, comments will be like (actual examples, so here's a warning, incoming slurs and abusive comments, censored but be warned and know that these are not here to hurt) "look at the mlm toothpastes, 🤮🤮 I'm become homophobic", "shut the fuck up y'all annoying 🙄🙄", "the white f*gsTM", "eww, imagine liking men". They'll use degrading and homophobic terms like "f**got", "limp wristed", "fairies" in the same way homophobes do, just intermingled with performative "woke" terminology and words like "white" (the worse is when the commenter is white as well) or "men" and when called out cry shouts of "IRONY" "I'M GAY/ QUEER/ LGBT TOO" "IT'S JUST A JOKE" like it changes anything for (gay/bi/pan/etc) men or male aligned strangers online who receive the same abuse from homophobes.

Sometimes it can even feel worse then when actual homophobes do it, because at least we know that we have spaces online where we can get away from all that, but when it comes from inside those spaces, alongside the content that makes us feel safe and content with ourselves... It can be just too much...

[wolf-queer-discourse]

Little Introduction to This Blog

Hello world. I did not want to make this blog, but God decided to fuck me personally, and here I am. Queer discourse sucks, but you all are fucking lunatics, and though I hate the world, I begrudgingly want us all to live.

So, you ask, what do I believe?

Well, queer discourse is an ever-evolving monster much like the human race, so who knows what the next hot topic will be. But as an idea of what to expect:

I do not strictly identify as an inclusionist, however, most of my views would generally lean/be considered inclusionist. Exclusionists do a lot of damage to the community, and it needs to be discussed.

Ace and aro people are inherently LGBT.

Bi lesbian discourse makes me want to claw my own eyes out and Ctrl+Alt+Delete myself, but really, I think people just need to calm the fuck down and stop trying to burn down people’s houses over this. Some of y’all would literally growl at a bi lesbian in public and it’s embarrassing.

If you take time out of your day to bully, harass or attack people for their neopronouns or xenogenders, fuck you, 99% of these people are children get a life you rotting sack of milk.

Bi-pan discourse is a minefield of dumbfuckery. Both labels (and other m-spec labels) are completely fine to use as long as no one’s being blatantly biphobic about it. Some of you need to jump into an ice cooler.

You don’t need dysphoria to be trans. Enough said.

Femme, butch and other sapphic labels can be used by bi women too. Stop policing bi women over everything.

Biphobia does not get talked about enough sometimes, and the erasure of bi men and the deranged hatred toward bi women is insane.

I’m open to discussion on my takes, and I hope to make a bunch of posts explaining these bullet points in more depth and nuance. Obviously, I have opinions other than those, but that’s your cheap appetizer version of me to start. I may branch a bit from discourse into general takes + educational content, but expect most things to be queer-related. 

I promise I’m a pretty chill person, so don’t be afraid to interact with me.

#discourse #LGBT #queer #lgbt discourse #queer discourse #ace discourse #aro discourse #pan discourse #bi discourse #lesbian #bisexual #pansexual #sapphic #discourse account #introduction #intro #new account #first post #lesbian discourse