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27-royal-teas · 1 year

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Analyzing the meaning of the song 27 when we line it up with what we know about the 27 club

So, for context, nobody thought pete would really live past 27. the 27 club is a group of celebrities in the arts that died at age 27 (Amy Winehouse, Jimi Hendrix, Kurt Cobain, etc), usually from their own self-imposed destruction. But fall out boy and their history is so inexplicably tied to this number that I absolutely had to write an essay about it. this song is a complete masterpiece in its own right and it's definitely up in my top three fob songs of all time

The song starts like this:

“if home is where the heart is then we’re all just fucked

i cant remember, i cant remember

And i want it so bad id shoot the sunshine into my veins

I cant remember the good old days”

The first line feels almost like begging. Hes wondering where he belongs, because he doesnt feel safe at home, and this song was during the time where the band was fighting a lot, and they were kind of his home as well. so if home is where the heart is and he doesnt feel safe at any of his homes, if he cant belong, then will he ever? Anywhere? A kerrang feature interviewing pete said that this song was him trying desperately to hold the band together, which is expressed with this first opening line (“if home is where the heart is then we’re all just fucked”). Clearly he is clinging on with a single thread, and this was shown when the band went on hiatus not long after.

‘And i want it so bad id shoot the sunshine into my veins’ obviously a drug reference, of being so desperate that youd do anything to get the good feeling back, and here it is linked to ‘i cant remember the good old days’ because it feels almost like a desperate kind of longing. this might relate to the line ‘you were the sunshine of my lifetime’ which repeats multiple times through fob’s eighth studio album, So Much (for) Stardust. In the context that this is referring to a person (anyone, but likely patrick; pete keeps his lyrics vague for a reason) it would be overexposing yourself to something that gives you temporary happiness but in the long run can kill you. hm just something to consider but i know they probably didnt plan that far ahead lyricwise lol

“And it’s kind of funny,

The way we’re wearing anchors on our shirts

When being anchored aboard just feels like a curse”

A lot of folie is actually linked to this sort of nautical theme (what a catch especially) and i think this references ‘they say the captain goes down with the ship’ because anchors are usually on nautical themed shirts or the shirts of sailors, but pete is saying he hates being tied down to the ‘ship’ which can be interpreted as the band maybe possibly. either way hes definitely pointing out the irony of wearing something that symbolizes stability when he is DEFINITELY not stable (who ever looked at pete wentz and thought ‘this man is stable’?) (i digress)

then comes the chorus. i love this chorus so fucking much it is interpretation goldddd

“My mind is a safe, and if i keep it then we all get rich

my body is an orphanage, we take everyone in

doing lines in dust and sweat

on last night’s stage

just to feel like you”

ok so obviously petes referring to his mind as the safe because hes the one who makes the lyrics and thus hes the one who earns the band the profit. Its a safe because he is inscrutable. It is also a safe because he only takes out what he wants, and only he has the key. ‘My body is an orphanage, we take everyone in’ COULD refer to how hes kind of promiscuous but more than that fall out boy was known for being the band that didnt really care who their fans were. They were marketed towards teenage girls and for that they were looked down upon. His body could be a metaphor for the band itself, and taking everyone in could mean that they accept the people that other bands dont typically want as fans.

‘Doing lines in dust and sweat on last night’s stage just to feel like you” this is a reference to the 27 club, and refers to stars doing drugs to be able to function/feel normal and human again. Idk. i just really like this line its so great

“The m-m-milligrams in my head burning tobacco in the wind

Chasing the direction, chasing the direction you went”

Im going to break this verse in half specifically because patrick fucking does NOT ENUNCIATE and also its long (how many times did i think ‘and youre a bottled star’ was ‘and you’re a bathroom stall’ rip)

The milligrams and the tobacco are pretty self explanatory- more drugs. 27 club connections via the drugs. burning tobacco gives way to the vision of trying to cling on to a high with desperation, and he’s chasing it- chasing the direction it went.

“youre a bottled star, the planets align, youre just like mars

You shine in the sky, you shine in the sky”

pete uses a TON of star and sky metaphors in his writings, this song included. A bottled star would mean a person who is repressing their talent. It could also mean a celebrity who is drowning their problems in liquor. Mars is the roman god of war and often a symbol of masculinity (although im not sure how relevent the second part is). It means raw, unbridled energy. here pete is saying (in his vague, vague writing voice ://) that when the person he is talking about drinks, they lose all control and are pretty much unstoppable. drawing this to the 27 club, a lot of the members died by alcohol or drug abuse, so it makes sense.

The use of star and sky metaphors throughout this song really bring it home- yes, the stars may be bright and pretty, they might shine and sparkle, but at the end of the day they will burn away and self combust. So we have to hold it together if we want to keep our own worlds in once piece.

“Are all the good times getting gone

they come and go and go and and come and go, oh yeah

ive got a lot of friends who are stars but some are just black holes”

For this verse lets work our way backwards. more space and star metaphors. stars clearly refers to his friends in the industry, but black holes could mean they have an almost deafening energy, or are on their way to becoming a part of the 27 club itself. The good times coming and going represents the sort of panic thats felt in the entertainment industry as a whole; the competition against time itself, for fear that when youre old people wont want to know what you have to say. So often the people who act and sing are so unbearably young, and once they pass thirty two they arent marketable anymore. pete is putting to words the worry and the scramble to get things done- to make a name for yourself- before your time is up. And AGAIN relating to the number 27, its quickly approaching 30, so you better move fast if you want to become famous.

The rest of the verses from here are just chorus repeats, so let’s talk about how tangled fall out boy is with the number twenty seven. other than the 27 club, what’s so important about it? It’s not a prime number. Theres really nothing out of the ordinary about it.

Except, there is.

Everyone celebrated when pete made it past his 27th birthday. In 2011, patrick wrote his Confessions of a Pariah blog post. He and joe were both 27 at the time, and i think that might have been a deciding factor in what inspired pete to reach out. He didn’t want his best friend to give into depression, much less when he was 27.

The band got together again not long after that. the first track off Save Rock and Roll, My Songs Know What You Did In The Dark, dropped February 5th, 2013. The rest is pretty much history.

I don’t know. All speculation. But the number 27 is definitely linked with fall out boy, although it’s not relevant right now, and i just think its so damn interesting

#probably no one will read this its not very interesting but im proud and I had fun #fall out boy #fob #meta #27 #folie a deux #bandom #toby’s metas #Toby speaks #lyric analysis

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faithlesbian · 1 year

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ive been holding off on posting this bc ive been formulating my thoughts (also i never post) but since it seems we're having a racism in the buffyverse/fandom moment (should be every moment!) I figured now would be a good time to vent my feelings on the first slayer.

I do a lot of hobbyist research into the stone age its a long running special interest of mine, and ive just finished writing my dissertation on a number of things including primitivism in contemporary culture. so drawing from that i wanted to expand on the tags I left on the previous post, with the clarification that i am white and european and therefore am speaking from that perspective on this subject.

as far as I can remember, the original Buffy movie had flashbacks to the medieval period, with a white medieval woman in these flashbacks implied to be the first slayer. if that's right and I'm not just misremembering, this would tie in to the pop culture associations of this era with catholicism, witch hunts, gothic castles; all of which further ties into popular vampire lore. however, the tv show leans away from this, with vampires being the only demons vulnerable to christian iconography and most of the worldbuilding drawing from multitheistic (not sure if this is the right word) traditions, preferring pantheons of minor gods, demons as folkloric monsters rather than fallen angels, and the existence of multiple hell dimensions.

the way the show does this is often very primitivist, primitivism here meaning the (often harmful) romanticisation of cultures and eras considered "less advanced", interpreting them as therefore more exotic, interesting, or just plain better than modern western society and in doing so flattening them into solely an appealing primitive fantasy.

examples of this can be seen in the foreign and/or dead languages used in magic and demon research, the appropriated eastern and African imagery used in weapons and costumes, the writing of characters like kendra (who's "people" seem to know a lot about the supernatural but are never actually named), jenny calendar (who carries plot-relevant cultural knowledge from her mysticised "people"), and nikki wood, through whose son buffy learns the ancient - primitive - origins of the first slayer.

the choice to relocate the origins of the slayer from medieval europe to (im assuming, since they never specify) paleolithic africa make a lot of sense in context of the shows de-emphasing of christianity in their vampire lore. this would change the slayer from a warrior chosen by the church to fight unholy creatures, to a defender of humanity at large from folkloric monsters. it also makes the slayer line a lot longer, extending far back into human history.

you'd think.

because the problem is im not honestly convinced anyone writing these episodes knows or cares about the accepted findings that show homo sapiens originated in africa, I can't honestly say it comes across that they were trying to imply that the slayer existed before the first waves of human migration by depicting her as they did. i dont actually know if these characters are intended to come from the stone age or just an ambiguous pre-colonial africa and im being very generous by writing this post the way i have. I think they made the very simple connection of "primitive = cool and mysterious" to "black = primitive". the depictions of the first slayer and first watchers are tangibly racist. their treatment by the narrative is tangibly racist.

the first slayer is depicted as animalistic, brutal, and vengeful, but rather than have buffy empathise with her over their shared experience of being used as a tool of violence, the episode has buffy mock and belittle her down to making a joke about her unprofessional hair. the first watchers are set up as the backward patriarchal villains for buffy and willow to overcome by rewriting the terms of the slayer lineage, in both cases black characters are vilified to make white women seem cooler, more self-possessed, more powerful.

it's not just the treatment of individual characters. its fundamental pillars of the lore. non-european (and some minority european) cultures are consistently used to be spooky, occult, and exotic set dressing, while two whole season finales hinge on abject primitivism and antiblackness.

to clarify, i think in another show with a different writing team, the depiction of scientifically accurate (i.e. dark-skinned) early homo sapiens could be achieved in a wholly inoffensive way if these characters were simply written as people. removing the layers of primitivism from the first slayer reveals a traumatised girl who was forced to fight, just like fandom-beloved characters buffy and faith, albeit from a very different time period. but the layers of primitivism are the reason why she was written in the first place. the "primal" is mysterious, spooky, powerful, and therefore makes for good writing without ever having to clarify what it is you mean when you say "primal".

stone age people were not animalistic manifestations of modern-day people's repressed subconscious. they were people. the refusal to see this is another branch from the same root - that the writers see cultures and people outside of the modern west as less-than. but if their language sounds cool for a summoning chant, then they get to be less-than in a ~cool and mysterious~ way, i guess.

#if ive used any incorrect terms or misconstrued anything here id be much obliged if you could let me know #anyway.#analysis #personal #buffy the vampire slayer

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mrs-monaghan · 10 months

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Hi! I'm new around here (but not new to jikook) and I saw your recent posts where you linked to, among other things, a post where you talked about the 2016 jinmin vlive where they were watching jk on celebrity romance. And I just wanted to say thank you for bringing that up! I think that vlive is wildly underrated. It tells us so much about jikook's relationship at the time. It really showcases how jikook weren't at same place emotionally in the beginning (and how insecure that made jimin) and how their relationship was possibly mostly physical back then. Jk definitely had a lot to work through. I'm sure he was already in love with jm, but had a hard time expressing it. But all's well what ends well, right? :) Very highly recommend that every jikooker watch that vlive if you haven't already!

Okay. First of all, if I have to link this post one more time I'm gonna start side eyeing y'all. I thought I was a pervert till I met y'all. I'm watching you 🧐🧐

He he hee! The video anon is talking about.

youtube

Its like 11 minutes guys. Watch it. You've been in the toilet for longer than that. Don't even 🙄 just watch it.

Anon I think you have put it perfectly. Actually. The last part where I reference on my post about JK not showing Jimin any emotions, I think that caused alot of fighting. Like alot. I joked about JK hitting and quitting but really that's how it comes off. The xes part was good. Probably really good. But after that JK would go back to treating Jimin like he did everyone else. Jimin knew he wasn't just anyone else. They had something going on and he wanted JK to act like it.

I saw something on twitter a long, long time ago so I cannot find it. And its now a blur in my head. But OP was alluding to JK playing video games and ignoring Jimin after xes. I don't recall how OP drew to this conclusion, but it was from something Jimin said. Something about JK and video games. Not sure. Like, we all know when it comes to Jikook its all about reading between the lines.

I remember seeing that and seeing where OP was coming from but I dont remember the context which is a tad frustrating rn. Anygays, it obviously took a while for JK to start acting like Jimin needed him to. Feelings wise anyway.

I am happy Jimin did not give up because look where they are now. (I'm sure the Jungkonda had something to do with it 😂😂) JK basically worships the group Mimi walks on.

We heard it from the man himself so we know it's true, right? He's stubborn, he's hard to handle, and I bet Jimin knows all of it first hand. 🤭🤭

Okay so for some strange reason, your ask made me think about this tweet; (Don't ask me why. My mind is a weird place)

Before anybody freaks out, I would like to advice that u take this with a grain of salt. My friends and I tried to find where/when this could have possibly happened but we couldn't. And we really tried guys, because.... WHAT!?!?!?! Why would Jin say something like this that basically outs Jikook? Right?

But then I think about how BTS used to word vomit alot in the early days so I haven't completely disregarded it. So hopefully one of u have heard of this because I would love to see it. Honestly. It's fucking wild. Like.... it's insane 🤯

That being said, 😁😁😁 the correct members are involved when u really think about it. Right? Like these are the right members for this strange scenario 🤭

We know this is how Jin used to wake JK up. Jin even demonstrated that one time exactly how he used to do it by touching JK's nipples. (I can't with the Tannies sometimes. Honestly 🤦🏽‍♀️) From the huge amount of Jikook nipple play (inside this post is another post about this) we can safely deduce that JK's nipples are sensitive. So to me, yeah? To me it makes sense that a sleepy JK thought it was Jimin touching him. IF this is true and it did happen, the maths adds up. Just saying....

Lord have mercy 🤣😂😂

#if jikook isn't real then neither am i #jikook is real #ask shaz #bts ask #jikook #jimin and jungkook #kookmin #minkook #jimin #park jimin #jeon jungkook #jungkook #bts #jikook theories #jikook theory

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am-i-the-asshole-official · 9 months

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Aita for 'Breaking up' with a friend?

This is going to be a loooong post so buckle up. I have been friends with this person, who I will refer to as Bread, since 2017. They were pretty much my only close friend beside my sister(Who i will call Gamer, she is important later on) but also i always found them kinda annoying, but I never said anything because i would have to see them in school everyday and it would be too awkward. So right before my school shutdown for Covid, like on the last day, I (basically) said "I don't want to be friends with you anymore." I however continued to be their friend because they acted as if nothing had happened and honestly it took me a lot of courage to say the first thing to their face anyways. This is the end to the first chapter in our story.

So skip a few months in which we have no school. When online school starts we did it on google hangouts, and i found a way to reconnect with my school friends, i.e Bread and two other people who will become VERY important to the story. These two people who i befriend i will call Sprite and Pepsi. Sprite and Pepsi are currently two of my best friends, however Bread has had a long running history of issues with Pepsi. Mainly they set these aside for the good of the friend group. I introduce the three of them to one of my outer school friend, who is slightly older than us and therefore i will call Mentor(who actually has a tumblr so if you see this, by now you know this is me so keep scrolling.) The six of us become very good friends(for those who need a reminder, that's me, Gamer(my sister), Bread, Pepsi, Sprite, and Mentor. Cue 2021, the friend group now all uses discord and I have been invited into a side group chat, titled something along the lines of 'plans to remove Bread from the friend group.' Now, during this time skip i have mentioned a few incidents have occurred. 1) Gamer and I have gotten in heated arguments with Bread over silly things, them being really rude about Sprite's art, them not liking a documentary I recommended, several incidents where they 'introduced' us to their online friends who was just them on an alt account. Anyway, back to the group chat. I am filled in on even MORE discourse between Sprite, Pepsi, and Bread. I don't really remember any of it know and the gc has been long since deleted. We talk shit about them behind their back while also pretending to be their friend(this is partly the asshole part because we did this A LOT.) During this time Sprite is our double agent, being the person Bread always rants and vents too, despite Sprite discouraging it. During this time somthing very childish happens that i am honestly embarrased to type, so i will skip it, occurs, acting as the catalyst for all of us breaking our friendship with Bread in favor of Pepsi. During this event many hurtful words were said, mainly aimed at Bread(to their face this time.) Our break in friendship, however, does not last long, as right after we(Me and gamer) are added to a groupchat where Sprite tells us that they were a double double agent and was on NO ONE's side during this entire thing and also kind of telling Bread what was going on. They explain that this friendship stuff is dumb, and we all become friends once more (including Bread and Pepsi.) Things continue as normal. This is the end of chapter two

School reopens. I am in a class with Bread and no other friends. Each day my resentment for Bread grows. (Also a quick context for our school, Bread, Pepsi, and Sprite all use the same bus. Me and Gamer do not. Mentor does not go to our school. Many events transpired on the school bus that i am not fully aware of.) At this point I fucking DESPISE Bread. Its lots of small incidents, that i never addressed with them. Them being too touchy, invading my private space, not understanding that WHEN I PUT MY HEAD DOWN THAT MEANS I AM TRYING TO SLEEP SO FOR THE LOVE OF GOD DONT POKE ME. At this point all of my friends and I use insta, as me and gamer have just gotten it, instead of Discord. My friends never used discord much, so now, I start talking to my friends more. Pepsi and Sprite start filling me in on more and more of Breads misdeeds. It is revealed to me how pushy Bread is, how they ignore peoples boundary's, etc, and how practically everyone in our grade fucking hates them. This is news to me. I start cutting Bread out more and more. The shit talking behind their back returns, but this time with a vengeance. This time more people are involved. This time, the friend group is larger. This time, the exclusion Bread faces is on a larger scale. It is 2023 now. I barely talk to Bread. Their friendship with Pepsi is entirely down, they had a big friendship over haul that i have not gotten into, but we're still friends, only in name, for Mentor. Anyway, I use Pepsi as a human shield. Bread will avoid us if we are near Pepsi, and wont come to a group event if Pepsi is there. Life is great, because i no longer have to deal with Bread and their bullshit.

Now i come to the final part. The actual breaking up. Bread has confronted me a few months prior about how i avoid them. I weave my way around the topic of saying I hate them because i am very non confrontational. But now, I have confidence. I just finished hanging out with my friends. Its the middle of the holidays so i can send them a message via discord and not have to think of consequences. So i do. I tell them that I don't like them. I don't exactly outline the problems, but I do tell them this has been a long tome coming. Now, comes the reasons why i could be an asshole.

One, I have been 'soft blocking' Bread for a long time before this and i should have done it ages ago. Two, They have literally no other friends now. They are entering a new school year completely friendless, and i cant completely say its their own fault. Three, Most of what I have heard about their wrong doing is passed down from mouth to mouth, so details may have been twisted and I should just confront them about it instead. Four. As their only friend, it was kinda my job to help them, isn't it? but i didnt . I just abandoned them as soon as i got fed up. Five, even when i was genuinely their friend, i was a really shitty friend, refusing to take their side in any conflict that arised. Six, Bread acts like a genuinely nice person that i don't mind hanging out with in person, its just certain things, and the way they act with others and online that pushed me to this point.

So thats it, thats my story. A few helpful things to keep in mind: This is only an abridged version of events. I will be answering any questions i can on a throwaway account to clear up any confusion, and also add more detail on what exactly Bread has done wrong. Also we are all under 18 in this story and currently, so please keep this in mind. I don't think i did anything wrong but also i am surrounded in an echo chamber of people that hate them so i need an outside view to really understand how bad of a person Bread is. Sorry for any spelling mistakes, and I hope this was, at least, entertaining to you.

What are these acronyms?

#aita #am i the asshole

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hypogryffin · 7 months

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genuinely curious by what you mean by "jewish (factual)" in your tier list. i can assume for a couple what you mean (sophia as an example) but i dont see how the others could be like jewish-coded! interested in hearing your thoughts

link to the first post for claritys sake, but this is the tier in question:

ok so for clarification: i made the tier list a little while ago and then scheduled it for later to keep uploads consistent, something i usually do all the time but am not for this discussion for now. this means that by the day the tier list posted, i was already a few weeks or so divorced from the actual creation of it, so some of my opinions have changed (as i said in the og post, i was unsure on a good portion of the characters even when i first queued the list), and some of my reasonings behind placements have been lost to time and my silly little goldfish memory.

bc of this, as of now as im trying to find a distinct line between "jewish (factual)" and "jewish (based on vibes)", the criteria for "factual" is sort of murky. some placements in the category were serious, but a lot of them were also entirely for joking reasons, and i had moved on as soon as i was done laughing to myself without coming back to it.

all this is to say, i have no idea how to summarise it, so im going to explain everything i can remember about my thought process at the time so you can see where i was coming from.

SOPHIA:

yup 👍.

ok so for the uninformed, sophia is the name of a gnostic figure and the specifics change depending on the context of which ur referring to her in, but in judaism specifically sophia was given as a translated name for chokmah which is like a being thats like really important in kabbalah and considered like. this sort of i guess personification of divine wisdom?

anyways this is a concept that i doubt im anywhere near the first person to bring up, so im not gonna spend a lot of time on it like i will the things i havent heard other people talk about. like the whole "good friend of humanity" thing! judaism puts a lot of emphasis on kindness and care for other people and i think its important that thats so big for her character and for how jewish she can be read as. she is also jewish because i like her :^).

TATSUYA:

suffers endlessly because g-d hates *him*, specifically, and he hates g-d right back. jewish.

that was a joke. ok so right out the gate i think the whole "fighting hitler" aspect of IS should count for something during the discussion of which characters are jewish. like just putting that out there. anyways tatsuya is jewish because of eternal punishment. specifically, you know how hes like super into "atonement" and repentance? bro would really have benefited from going to a high holidays service lemme tell you. and he does it in a specific way thats like. his atonement is actively trying to repair what hes fixed right like hes not doing what hes doing to be redeemed, hes doing it because its his responsibility to fix whats been broken. i just idk how to explain it properly but thats a thought process your rabbi talks you through in jew school yknow?

also theres this thing called tikkun olam, which literally translates as "repairing the world". so it means more like. doing ur best as a citizen to improve community and country, or general social work. but just considering it as taking the literal translation, then its just like... yep. that sure is what hes doing isnt it

also, killed hitler. hashtag work

KATSUYA:

placed here mostly because being tatsuyas brother, theyd probably be at a similar "level" of religiosity. however there are some unique things i want to point out here;

katsuya like embodies the idea of "tzedek tzedek tirdof" like. its unfortunate hes a cop but for a cop hes a pretty good person? hes pretty uncompromising on right and wrong, and in a way that totally lines up w tzedek tzedek tirdof as its described in the torah.

extra emphasis on his compassion, as in theres like that core facet of judaism, the tikkun olam, where people have a moral obligation to help others; not just do good as oneself, but also stop other people from doing bad. that last bit doesnt really matter, cuz im bringing it up so i can talk about katsuya as a police officer to clear his dads name and try and ensure a better future for his brother. he gave up his dreams for them.

i mean, when i say "giving up his dreams", im kinda laughing to myself bc theres no way he ran it past his parents bc if he looked his jewish mother in the eye and said "i want to be a pastry chef" he would not make it out of the room alive. hed go "my dream is to become a pâtissier" and his mom would immediately be like "no its not its to be an accountant" and that would be the end of the discussion

also, i think he would make some of the best fucking challah in the world. hed make matzo ball soup that could make you jizz your pants just looking at it. look me in the eyes and tell me that he doesnt actually go nuts at rosh hashana when he gets to make the round challah with the raisins in it and stuff or whatever else. there is such a crystal clear vision in my mind of him rocking this apron my dad used to have that says "real men make latkes". it was pink and ugly as sin and i think it would be katsuyas most prized possession.

LABRYS:

her name is fucking labrys obviously shes a jewish lesbian. next.

/j i will actually talk about this. like not mentioning the only survivor of her upbringing, which isnt a one to one considering the death match portion of her backstory but still close enough to feel um. relavant to jewish culture. she acts very...stereotypically jewish?

its not entirely the accent, but it is...part of it. so like i know its like a new jersey accent and that the stereotype is new york, i guess? but im not american and i dont rlly know the difference. they look close enough to each other on a map tho so i think it counts

but also shes like kinda confrontational in a way i specifically associate with jewish people or jewish characters? like not really bitchy but argumentative right, shes got this really sarcastic or mocking sense of humour. and girl kvetches with the best of them.

(also, side note: since i made the original list, i found out that the voice actress for aegis in p3 reload, dawn m bennett, is actually jewish! if i were to remake the tier list, aegis would be moved up from "vibes" to "factual" because of this. mentioning that here because of the sister thing :).)

JOKER:

kills g-d which is the jewish dream. this is a another joke.

someone in the replies of the tier list said something abt a possible reason being that he has an "abrahamic figure" as his ult. persona, which could be a good point if satanael was actually an abrahamic figure! but it is not. like ok im not a history guy but satanael is a name used in the 2nd book of enoch, which arguably could be part of jewish "canon" (i know this is actually the term for it but fandom has rotted my brain and it sounds terminally online to use it in terms of real life religiosity) but most rabbis agree it like is not, and theyre kind of who im listening to on this, and quick google search says even in christianity, enoch is debatable? idk

so like satanael isnt in the torah. and if anyone says "oh its just like another name for satan so technically--" shut up i know. satan isnt real in the torah either. ok like "satan" is used as a term, but not as like the specific dude that like rules hell. hes just like at most a specific dude who is not a devil/cast from heaven or whatever, but instead is a lawyer. more often its a concept, something representative of like the urge to go against g-ds will or a kosher life, this "evil inclination" which everyone is born possessing and grapples with when trying to be a good person. NOT THE SAME AS THE CHRISTIAN SATAN. WHICH IS WHAT P5 WAS GOING FOR. SATAN IN JUDAISM IS NOT A "super demon lord" or whatever they call it in the text of the game

satanael isnt an abrahamic figure and i dont think satan is either cuz its so different between religions and honestly i think calling things abrahamic religions, at least w the context i hear of it, is like kind of a misnomer or just kind of generally misleading cuz judaism christianity and islam are all so different and if were talking about this i think whoever invented the term judeochristian should eat a sheet of glass for it because whenever i hear those terms its very clear the person saying it means just christianity but theyre trying to be inclusive without actually putting the work in and thats not the point of this.

ok if im honest, as i think abt it joker isnt like. really... super jewish, in a way that you can point out? its just like... this overall vibe im having trouble explaining which is probably also like super influenced by how much i like him. i want to say that this strict sense of right and wrong that remains uninfluenced by the rest of society is something that clearly creates or maybe just intensifies this like. empathy for other people that reminds me of this concept in judaism which i cant remember the hebrew name of rn but i think its most commonly translated to english as "lovingkindness", one word? or that the whole idea of the phantom thieves can be contributed to tikkun olam. but, on the other hand, even if lovingkindness is what i personally consider one of jokers core character traits, the other one is pure, blinding rage.

im not going to go super into it, because im a few years rusty of torah study bc its only really consistently done in my community for kids preparing for bnai mitzvah cuz of how few people we have in our congregation. but from what i remember, my interpretation of the exact limit between righteous and sinful anger is a bit more... lax than the average jew's, or at least the average rabbi's, meaning mine, lol. either way anger is almost always seen as sinful because its an emotion that can like. turn you from g-d, its the same thing that invokes that "evil inclination" we just talked abt. so, joker textually feels this rage that arsene, his other self, literally refers to as "sacrilegious", something that very clearly states that he is willing to *knowingly* commit sins for this rage and is perfectly capable of causing undue harm to others for it, which is exactly the reason why judaism warns of anger. this means jokers anger is distinctly against jewish teachings.

again, im really lax, my familys reform (/lh) and i think there are some parts of this characterisation that make me feel this rage is overall constructive, especially considering that is what feeds his constant practice of lovingkindness and tikkun olam, but it being such a huge facet of his personality (made worse bc as a silent protagonist, you really have to search to get away from this trait) brings him down on the Jew Scale(tm).

in short, now that im really discussing this id probably move him to incredibly jewish based on vibes or even to just "jewish" no further classification. but even w the undying sinful anger thing i cant not think of him as jewish and i dont think its just bc hes one of my favourite characters of all time.

also that hair texture looking really familiar is all🤔🤔. all im saying that is in the tutorial, instead of "frizzy hair", morgana deffo should have been calling them blondie and jewfro /j /j /j

EDIT AND JOKERS KITCHEN!! JOKERS KITCHEN!! FOOD AS A LOVE LANGUAGE!! IN P5 YOU MAKE FOOD FOR YOUR FRIENDS AND YOU PUT LOVE INTO IT

MORGANA:

i know i put morgana before joker in the tier but i think in order to rlly discuss morgana we needed joker first bc part of my reason for putting them in the same tier is because they really are a pair, do not separate.

anyways, morgana does have a lot of the same problems as joker when it comes to being difficult to pin down. his inclination to tikkun olam is similar, sort of even greater than jokers depending on personal characterisation of joker, but instead of this discrepancy of his jewishness being anger, the ethical conundrum with morgana is sort of. arrogance? like, i have trouble figuring out how to really put into words how i feel abt morganas "lovingkindness", because it is so hard to understand where hes at in terms of empathy?? like. fucking. idk hes definitely a very caring person but its not exactly like

ok i cant figure out how to say it moving on. i used the word arrogance even though i dont really think thats right, because morgana has never seemed haughty. his "arrogance" is really just him making up for an inferiority complex caused by the amnesia thing, its not as if he genuinely totally believes himself to be above the others. but like no matter what it stems from, the way he behaves and his personal pride hurts people. ie the okumura arc, or his entire relationship w ryuuji. he speaks ill of others, belittles them to bring himself up, etc. arrogance and excess pride is as condemned as anger in judaism if not moreso, since its even less useful/constructive to be "arrogant" than it is to be angry. OH ok so what i meant with the hard to figure out his empathy thing is this actually!! hes very caring and has a really notable respect for human life but its always at war with his need to prove himself, so even if when you think about it its like Oh Morgana Is A Really Caring Person, which makes sense because he was created from human desire and as such is really in touch with what people need, the desperation he has to be seen as "worthy" comes off as wanting to be seen as "above", even if it means trying to get the people around him as being considered "below" him.

tldr so if it was just those two traits i think id have to move morgana lower on the list, alongside joker.

HOWEVER. speaking directly to the other jews in the crowd, but morgana is totally textually a golem, right? like not exactly, obviously, but think about it. morganas a being of the velvet room because he was created from "the dregs of human hope" (canonical line from yaldaboath that i think about more than what can be considered healthy tbh), whose job is was and always will be to protect and guide the trickster and his community, the phantom thieves. hes a golem right? am i insane? am i seeing things? i dont care, im not giving up on this interpretation, so morgana is factually and canonically jewish cuz of it.

ZEN:

i do not remember.

as of today id probably move him to either jewish no other classification or not jewish. my b guys. anyways

JUN:

life is indescribable torment, and then hes also got additional, mostly unrelated, mommy issues. judaism 101.

also his suspenders when he was a kid are the most young jewish lad shit in the history of ever like i have seen that exact outfit on a young boy every time i go to temple, and each time it is a different kid

ok more seriously, i really do think juns story-- specifically his relationship with memory-- can easily be extracted into a jewish narrative. like nyarlathotep messed with his memories and convinced him that the other members of the masked circle killed maya right. and so the way he fanatically reminded himself of the past was a mix of trauma and active manipulation. but if i think abt it a certain way i also can see it as like. ok so in judaism memory is really important and like a lot of the time during for example passover, youre meant to refer to yourself as being a jew in egypt, saying "we" instead of "them" and such. but im specifically meaning how important memory/remembrance is in grieving. jun in his grief for mayas perceived death "kept her alive" in a way. she was never forgotten, and so she never died. even though the entire masked circle forgot, from trauma or fear or guilt or whatever, jun held on, remembering her, and so she survived. joker took peoples dreams but his actions also caused them to be completely be forgotten. they were alive, but they were robbed of their ability to be remembered at all, and so they were as good as dead even still breathing and talking.

retroactively, this idea enforces tatsuyas jewishness, considering the entire story of eternal punishment. he refused to forget the masked circle, even though it hurts.

anyways back to jun, i also think the whole repentance thing is important too. he hurt people in his anger and sorrow and spends the rest of his life (until the world is reset at least lol) atoning for his wrongdoings.

also, i know i said kid him is super jewish looking, but he has not gotten better as hes grown up. 17y.o him is exactly the guy your bubbe will pull up on facebook and be like "this is the grandson of my friend or whoever! you should go on a date with him, hes your age! he looks a bit gay but hes a very successful doctor! ...and hes JEWISH YAKNOW...." and ur like "ok bubbe"

ERIKO:

i actually do not recall exactly why she is in this tier specifically. the only thing i for sure remember was that i at least partially placed her here bc of her fascination with the occult.

HIKARI:

ok this one was kinda me goofing. its the whole extended family thing like whats more jewish than being actively discouraged from a creative career for something "safe" and "normal?" bro the aunt might as well have dropped the "being a doctor is very respectable" line in the song.

but like even without that, wanting to be a director or associated with film? hitting her with the jew beam. mazel tov babygirl.

#not art #asks & requests

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beardisable · 11 months

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OH MY GOD OH MY GOD okay.

so i watched the 8 hour jack stream(jesus) aka watched genloss top to bottom again and listened to his theories and stuff(i really vibe with the "kidnapped as kids" angle more now) and started thinking about some theories he and chat mentioned and.

now im thinking with like. ok its probably a pretty common theory, this post was what prompted this additional idea of mine actually, but ill explain it a bit: the theory that, since sneeg and charlie can come back over and over again, and they have referenced like, refusing to do the cooking challenge in ep 1, and how charlie was playing the mouse trap but ate the cage, they have obviously done the same kind of scenes we saw ranboo do, right. and then in the Announcement video we see the same kind of "missing poster" type headshots of them, with the caption "Found them!"

i dont remember exactly where it was confirmed that showfall made the missing person posters, but like. yeah. these images are for missing posters like ranboo had. and with sneeg being caught by the security in ep 3, he had tried to escape, just like ranboo and charlie. and i feel like this wasnt the first or last time they have tried this!

also, during that screenshot the announcer says "our hero will meet a cast of crazy characters, who you may recognize", aka the audience has seen these "actors" before in other things! this is their first live show but what have they made before...?

then, with one of the Very first lines Ranboo says in the first episode, "it wasn't supposed to be like this"... showfall/hetch made it seem like this is ranboos first show and he's being tested for how well he does as The Hero.

I dont think what we saw is Ranboos first time starring in a showfall production.

its the first live thing like the announcement video said but i think hetch lied when he talked about how its a test, i think Ranboo's been here at least a few go arounds, if not tens/hundreds/thousands of times. WHICH MEANS in the end when he gets his memories back... theres an infinite amount of possibility of things they could remember for what they have been made to do in the past :) Bc remember, while this is comedy->horror, it was still relatively tame and non-explicit (at least by my personal standards?) so it is quite possible they have been in more R rated horror stuff, slashers, gore, actual saw, some kind of even worse psychological horror things, but also that they might have had incredibly good experiences like love and joy and community and anything positive too, and to remember all that in a rush... oh boy so i believe it is a circular reproduction, maybe they run through scenes repeatedly over and over while perfecting every little detail and getting different takes of genuine emotion but every time Real and a First experience... some kind of purgatory(omg christian hell reference) or endless torture or such...

ok that got really maybe unneccessarily angsty so heres my other thought:

i love me a fucking colour theory and colour symbolism! it bothered me a bit how like. in the promo game we get ranboo, then green friend/the villain(obviously charlie, tho the villain part still confuses me a Bit since its not quite true?), the blue friend/the taken(obvs sneeg) and then the red stranger/the saviour. and like it would logically follow that the red is hetch right?

jack when theorising said the titles are self descriptive, which i buy into, at least for the first episode context, charlie is the villain role, sneeg was taken(put in a cage and later snatched by the sharkciclester), and hetch was trying to help and save ranboo from this situation! but then in the second ep we also have red puzzler, and red niki? i WISH niki had. any kind of bigger role to build a Saviour type off of her but i dont think she does :( the puzzler is an option, since they make it seem like the puzzler tries to save ranboo? and thats actually a whole other thought like. since we know hetch was not actually helping ranboo, was the puzzler Genuinely helping them, and somehow showfall found out and killed him?? idk ANYWAYS that colour coding falling apart a bit made me think about how ranboo is also red!! rgb trio yknow??

if the titles are self descriptive... well i dont think Ranboo really felt like The Hero much, especcially not in the end...

I think Ranboo is actually meant to be the Saviour.

Esp with the jesus coding! I believe this kind of thing has happened many times before, with sneeg/charlie/ranboo/others realizing that shits fucked, and trying to escape, only to be caught and put back in the production. I think Ranboo(main character syndrome) was in a previous iteration the Saviour, who tried to help sneeg and charlie and others get out of there, to save them, save everyone. but they failed. got captured. once again waking up again with a "it wasn't supposed to be like this..."

and so the cycle continues, and the content wheel keeps spinning.

(ive only been in tumblr tags so feel free to link me any other ppl who arrived at the same conclusion)

#if you actually read to the end of this somehow ily take a cookie #this is giving me prologue/au ideas so i wanted to type it out to anyone who wants inspiration or smth #generation loss #genloss #ranboo #ranboolive #generation loss the social experiments #genloss meta #genloss theory #genloss au #bear.txt #i am bearpat #this post took so long bc i keep having more ideas but adding them all would make this even more incomprehensible i gotta stick to a thesis

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gold-rhine · 26 days

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i swear yall are trying to turn me into the joker asdfghjkl all i said is that its bad to not give players context for the important plot points, which can ruin a plot i even called good

topaz quest was in... checks notes - *October* of prev year. also, neither "stonehearts" nor "cornerstones" were focus of that story,it was about her trying to enslave belobog. so no questions about space amazon doing slavery, i remembered THAT. there were no magical gems that give super powers there. if there was a throwaway line about them, i promise you most ppl are not gonna remember it after FIVE MONTHS

you cannot compare it to genshin, where in the very first archon quest we were told who fatui are, dealt with them even before signora, were explained who signora is by jean bc signora was pressuring her politically (matters bc gives pressure to main plot), then had signora appear on screen and steal venti's gnosis, which she right there in same scene mentioned as his divinity. the "harbringers want to steal gnosis" was very well dramatized in the first quest, so in liyue we already knew that childe will want to steal gnosis. you didn't need to remember any lore about tsaritsa or snezhnaya or delusions to get that. the main intrigue of the plot is "childe wants to get to morax corpse," why? to steal gnosis.

meanwhile, what was dramatized in hsr is that space amazon wants to enslave planets, which, again, we get it, not the "amazon execs have magical stones which give them super powers". when "stones" were brought up in penacony by ratio, it was in same convo as of "gift jewelry" being confiscated, so i personally thought its just bribes literally until the confrontation with christian ayato, when turned out its personal weapons. "aventurine wants to get his stones", why? - idk???? he's useless without moneys???

like when main intrigue of the plot "how will character get mcguffin back??", its vital for players to understand WHY character wants mcguffin

idk how to explain it in other words since i already said it in original reply, but most ppl dont read dictionaries for fun and "go read dictionary" is a very bad way to present information, both in artistic sense and in the sense that again, most ppl are not gonna do that. they have tutorials for a lot of useless stuff that 90% of ppl skip. this is not "could be smoother", this is "most ppl will just not know wtf is happening".

#rhine talks

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sweetescapeartist · 7 months

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My Examination of MasakoX's "Android 18 Made Me SO MAD [ RANT]" Video

youtube

A very good video. Only issues I have is that he (& maybe others) mention scenes from the DBS anime continuity, then talk about the DBS manga continuity as if they connect. They do not. Here are 3 main points I want to address...

MasakoX skipped over the fact that the manga version has always been insulting Krillin & K18. Anime had Ribrianne insult Krillin's appearance and 18's love for Krillin, then 18 proved Ribrianne wrong (& the K18 haters Ribrianne represents) by kicking her butt with the power of love. The manga events have Ribrianne give Krillin backhanded compliments, 18 doesn't defend him, no power of love. All done by Toyotaro just to insult Krillin.

MasakoX misremembers GT (as many do). That one scene where 18 cries over Krillin? Thats nice and all when out of context. In full context, GT 18 (& GT Marron) treated Krillin bad in almost every scene they were in up until that point. Krillin dying after that was more so 18 feeling regret for how bad she treated him.

MakasoX says it is Toyotaro AND Toriyama's fault. In a way it is. But its Toriyama's fault due to him not being very involved in the DBS manga. Toriyama is more involved with the DBS anime while he is mostly hands off with the DBS manga. HOWEVER, Toriyama tried to correct the Ribrianne insult that Toyotaro put in the manga. (The link mentioned previously) The truth is that Toyotaro is a Krillin hater (as MasakoX eluded to). Toyotaro is to blame for the constant mischaractization of Krillin & 18. And Toyotaro being a GT fanboy is the reason for this. GT 18 contradicts what Toriyama wrote in the original manga and what we see in the DBS anime continuity. Toyotaro's innacurate charactization of 18 & Krillin reflects the GT version's innacurate charactization.

So with full understanding...

Toriyama is rarely involved in the DBS manga continuity.

Folks need to remember to point out the continuity differences between the DBS anime & DBS manga.

Toyotaro (a GT fanboy) is a Krillin hater who sabotages Krillin's characterization as well as mischaracterizing 18, making 18 more in line with her out-of-character DBGT counterpart.

Toyotaro has mischaracterized Krillin & called him weak, cowardly, hideous, & now a cheater. And Toyo has innacurately depicted Krillin as weak, unskilled, & cowardly.

For some reason, MasakoX and others refrain to put most if not all blame on Toyotaro. Maybe its because they lack a little information (not an insult to them) or because they know they have DBS manga fans & Toyotaro fans in particular who are subscribed to them so they dont place the blame on Toyo as much? One of the two or a bit of both possibly.

Regardless, good video. If MasakoX was more informed about certain GT scenes & differentiated the DBS anime & manga continuities, it would have been a great video.

Also, I DO NOT hate MasakoX or Geekdom101 or some others. I give constructive criticism which means I point out the problem and offer a solution. If I offered no solution, I would simply be a hater. That's not in my nature. But other content creators who hate on Krillin and blatantly lie then try to cover themselves when I present undeniable evidence that they are lying? I don't hate them either. I just feel nothing for them. Hating is an emotion and shows interest in a person. I have no interest in those people. They are nothing to me. Even less than an gnat.

EXTRA:

Krillin is a pervert who suppresses his desires. So, 18 suspecting Krillin of wanting to cheat makes some sense. Gotta remember that Krillin called Videl cute (twice) & 18 gave him a look.

18 just doesn't want her perverted husband looking anywhere else when she & her infinite energy can provide him whatever he desires. Would Krillin cheat? No. He is a character that is very loyal to not only his friends but his wife too. Plus if he did, 18 would kick his butt. Another reason why he wouldn't is because 18 has insecurities & traumas. Krillin wouldn't want to hurt her in any sort of way. But with how Toyotaro hates Krillin... yeah. That was to make it seem like DBS manga Krillin has another negative attribute about him.

I'm sure some of y'all have watched videos about how the Japanese culture views cheating & how men often cheat or go to a prostitute. With that in mind, 18 hearing Krillin talking to a woman references Japanese culture. But it's just weird that 18 didn't know Sergeant Nutz was his boss after he had worked under her for at the very least half a year. As most things Toyotaro does, it's written without much thought for a wack joke & doesn't make sense.

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maccharliedennis · 9 months

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Charlie is CANONICALLY, IN CONTEXT, some version of trans/nb and it is great

<3 sorry to say but if you disagree with that then you are just disagreeing with literal actual canon and might also be bad at media analysis!

Just because Charlie does not look directly into the camera and say "I, Charlie Kelly, identify as a trans person" doesn't mean that it is not CANNONICALLY TRUE.

He literally identifies as a woman occasionally. Sorry if you don't like that and not sorry if you don't like trans people existing in your media.

Does Charlie look like a complete weirdo when he says he only identifies as a woman when he goes to the bathroom? Uh yeah dude. That is because....Charlie Kelly? IS a complete weirdo. The joke here is not "lol trans women are freaks!" Its "charlie is a weirdo" and also (IN CONTEXT) "charlie is blurring the lines between what the gang thinks to be an Acceptable Trans Person and a Weirdo Trans Person". And in the end, the Gang has to concede to Charlie. They realize that the lines are SO BLURRY and SO UNDEFINIABLE that they determine the only way to make things fair is to create gender neutral bathrooms.

The ending of this episode is meant to be PRO-TRANS.

"But but but!" You may say "the whole point of the show is that they are bad people! Which MEANS that their debate is being framed to be ANTI-TRANS since they end up being accepting!"

Sorry but thats also false! And again, not good media analysis! Yes, The Gang are horrible people. But are they ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS in the wrong??? NO! They are not ALWAYS in the wrong! A stopped clock is right twice a day!!

Here's a great fucking example: The episode "Dee Gives Birth"

Y'all remember THIS MOMENT?

Awwww! This is beautiful, touching stuff! The Gang has their breath taken away by the idea of a baby being added to their weird little family. <3

But if the Gang is meant to be ALWAYS IN THE WRONG, then....this is saying what exactly?? That it's wrong to be emotionally touched by the birth of a child? No. Because that would make no fucking sense. (And also this is another huge pro-trans moment in the show. Dee's baby is adopted by Carmen and everyone agrees that she will be a wonderful mother)

Apply that same logic to The Gang Solves the Bathroom Problem and you can clearly see that the Gang are meant to be WEIRDOS but not CURRENTLY IN THE WRONG.

If your understanding of this show begins and ends with "The Gang is Always Wrong so anything they say and do must also Always be Wrong" then you have an extremely surface level take on it.

And y'know what else? Charlies gender is affirmed AGAIN in "A Womans Right to Chop" during the conversation with the veterinarian! Mac says that "Gender is so old school" and Charlie adds "Like, I dont even identify.,,.," before he trails off.

What could the ending of that sentence be, I wonder? What is the ONLY THING that could make sense IN CONTEXT that has already been confirmed previously about his gender???? If you cannot INFER THAT INFORMATION FROM THE CONTEXT OF THE CONVERSATION, then maybe you are not very good at picking up on subtext.

And again!!! The joke here isn't meant to be "haha they are dumb and so are trans people, dont they sound stupid?" The joke is "Mac and Charlie are having a bizarre debate about this dogs ability to give birth in front of a complete stranger and are forgoing dozens of societal conventions to do so" and "Mac and Charlie are projecting their own feelings about gender onto a dog whom is not even able to conceptualize gender".

Long story short: Charlie is canonically trans/nb and it was confirmed TWICE and it is not meant to be portrayed as a bad thing to be and the creators are all pro-trans so suck my fuck! If you don't like it, you can go jerk off ur friend dumpledore or something!!!

#iasip #charlie kelly #always sunny #its always sunny in philadelphia #moi

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