#honestly that's how A LOT of people get into a certain character or fandom | Explore Tumblr Posts and Blogs

hephaestuscrew · 10 months

Text

"With a goddamn harpoon": The significance of Minkowski's weapon of choice within the narrative and characterisation of Wolf 359

TL;DR: Despite its initial comic role, the harpoon becomes a important symbol of Minkowski as a character; it is particularly associated with her desperate need for control, her desire to keep her crew safe, her stubborn determination, and her occasional unpredictability. These associations add to the narrative significance when Minkowski kills Cutter with the harpoon.

[Tagging people who said they wanted to be tagged: @browncoatparadox @captain-lovelace @goblincaveofvibes ]

~~~

Ep21 Minkowski Commanding

First appearance

We first encounter the harpoon in Minkowski Commanding, which is a significant episode for Minkowski's characterisation because it's the first big departure from Eiffel's point-of-view into Minkowski's. It's arguably the most Minkowski-centred episode in the whole show, so it stands out when we think about her as a character.

EIFFEL (over comm) Um, Minkowski? Why is the armory wide open, and also, apparently, robbed? Where's the tactical knives kit? MINKOWSKI Don't worry. I've got that. EIFFEL Oh. And the M4 carbine? The, like, really-dangerous-in-space, select-fire M4 carbine? MINKOWSKI Yeah, I've got that too. EIFFEL And this empty rack I'm looking at right now with a label that says "harpoon" suggests that... MINKOWSKI Yes. I have it, Eiffel.

The harpoon is introduced as part of a list of over-the-top weapons that Minkowski takes on her plant-monster-hunting mission. It's initially just a funny moment to emphasise how seriously she's taking this mission. The weapons arguably increase in unlikeliness as Eiffel lists them, and it's a comic image to think of Eiffel deducing the situation from the empty rack labeled 'harpoon'. It could have been an entirely throw-away joke that was never brought up again. The M4 carbine never comes up again. The tactical knives kit is mentioned in Knock, Knock, but not in a plot-significant or symbolic way.

'Goddamn harpoon' speech

So why does the harpoon become such an iconic part of Minkowski's brand (and I'm pretty certain it was seen as significant by fans long before the finale)? It's got to be because of the next time it's mentioned, when Minkowski talks to the plant monster in the same episode:

MINKOWSKI (getting psyched up) You wanna play with me, huh? You wanna run rings around me? The joyless, boring, predictable old Minkowski? She can't stop you, right? Not someone as smart and powerful as you. You've got her pegged. Good. Get complacent. Get smug. That's right when you'll find me waiting for you. With a goddamn harpoon.

There's so much to say about this speech and what it reveals her character. For one thing, it's all projection - we have no real indication of what (if anything) the plant monster thinks of Minkowski. We don't even really know how much understanding it has when listening to her talk. She imagines that this silent adversary would call her "joyless, boring, predictable". I suspect that these are all things that she's been called a fair bit in the past. (To be honest, I wouldn't be surprised if they are all things that Eiffel called her at one point.)

But the harpoon is proof against - if not the accusation of joylessness - the idea that Minkowski is boring and predictable. Boring and predictable people don't opt for a harpoon for fighting on a spaceship when plenty of more conventional weapons available. A harpoon is unexpected, and there's a kind of power in that.

Another interesting thing about that speech is that the whole thing would make at least as much sense - if not more - if it was directed at Cutter. In Sarah Shachat's episode commentary on Minkowski Commanding (part of the bonus material available to buy here), she says that Minkowski "is really speaking to Cutter in this moment". It's made clear that Minkowski's behaviour in Minkowski Commanding is not just about the plant monster itself. She tells Eiffel, "I have to take it seriously! If I can eliminate one threat, just one, then we are that much closer to going home!"

The specifics of the plant monster's location, abilities, and origin are mysterious, but - unlike many of the other forces threatening the safety of Minkowski's crew - it is at least tangible and harpoon-able and not light years away. Hunting the plant monster is a way for Minkowski to assert control when so much is outside of her control. It's an attempt to demonstrate that she is - as she puts it - "in charge of this disaster". Minkowski treats the plant monster as a physical symbol of all the threats her crew are facing, and so the harpoon becomes a physical symbol of her fierce (if sometimes misguided) determination to take control of the situation and fight back against those threats to protect her crew.

The line "you'll find me waiting for you. With a goddamn harpoon" is one that sticks in the mind, especially since - with one notable exception - 'goddamn' is about as potent as swearwords get on this show. And it's the harpoon that she uses to give specificity to the threat.

Absurdity

A harpoon is powerful and threatening, which is exactly what Minkowski is trying to convey to the plant monster, but in this context - not only on dry land but on a spaceship - it's also kind of absurd. From the way we hear it fire in the finale, we can tell that it's more like a speargun than a hand-thrown harpoon spear, but it's still an out-of-place weapon for space-based combat. Minkowski's already been shown to have a penchant for archaic weaponry, after her drunken enthusiasm over the cannon during the talent show incident, which is largely played for laughs. Similarly, in the episode commentary for Minkowski Commanding, Sarah Shachat says that the harpoon was introduced mostly just because it was funny; "[including a harpoon] was me sort of embracing the Moby Dick of it all. And I had no idea at the time how much importance that silly harpoon would take on."

Eiffel makes a Moby Dick reference himself ("10 days of Captain Ahab's Space Walkabout"). I haven't read Moby Dick so I can't properly analyse the significance of this reference, but the initial prominence of the harpoon (traditionally a whaling tool) enables that connection. It feels like a good example of the classic Wolf 359 thing where something comedic has the potential to take on a deeper significance. It conjures an image of Minkowski as a Captain with the potential to be consumed by a single-minded mission to destroy... A potential that she resists in the conclusion to Minkowski Commanding when she chooses to leave the plant monster alone. The harpoon also fits with the sprinkling of nautical imagery and language in Wolf 359 (e.g. the repeated use of the word 'boat'), as well as the retro-futuristic feel of the Hephaestus.

We never learn why there's a harpoon on the Hephaestus. It seems like yet another of those bizarre unexplained quirks of the station, like the items in the storage room where Eiffel finds Box 953. Even when the weird mysterious features of the Hephaestus are depicted in a comedic way, these features are still a demonstration of the fact that the characters are in an environment that they don't understand and that their surroundings have been shaped according to the whims of Command.

I think we can assume none of the members of the Hephaestus crew brought a harpoon up with them. For whatever reason, someone at Goddard Futuristics must have decided to put a harpoon in that armory. Like most things in the crew's lives, the harpoon is owned by Goddard Futuristics. So the way Minkowski uses the harpoon could be seen as an instance of reclaiming something from Goddard and their control over her surroundings (in a similar way to how her crew are able to utilise the maze-like structure of the Hephaestus to their advantage when hiding first from the SI-5 and later from Cutter and the crew of the Sol).

Other mentions of the harpoon

The harpoon doesn't actually make another physical appearance until the finale, when it truly comes into its own. But there are a couple of little hints before then that it has become a part of Minkowski's brand amongst the other characters as well as to the listeners. These mentions remind the listener about the harpoon, so we don't forget about it before its big comeback in the finale.

Ep27 Knock, Knock

EIFFEL [to Minkowski] Like getting rid of all the weapons, for a start. We should gather up all the guns, the tactical knives, your harpoon. Put it all in the arms locker, seal that sucker up, and put the key in one of Hera's service canisters.

In this quote, Eiffel refers to it as "your harpoon" - the only weapon he ascribes ownership to here. He sees it as something she's laid claim to. He also thinks the harpoon is worth mentioning specifically, which suggests that he thinks that Minkowski would reach for it first if she was feeling particularly violent. This reinforces the idea that the harpoon has become a symbol of Minkowski's character. This connection is also strengthened by the fact that the harpoon is also never mentioned in relation to anyone other than Minkowski using it.

Ep45 Desperate Measures

LOVELACE [to Kepler] Yeah, right. Nobody knows this station like Alexander Hilbert. He knows every nook, cranny, hidden room - everything. And as back up he's got the only woman's who's ever turned outer space monster hunting into a recreational sport. You'll never see them coming... until all of a sudden there's a harpoon in your face, and you end up on the operating table of the finest medical sadist that Goddard Futuristics ever produced.

Lovelace mentions the harpoon and specifically refers to Minkowski's plant-hunting exploits, even though she didn't witness them. So we know that someone has told her that story. And what she's taken away from hearing the story is an emphasis on Minkowski's harpoon and an admiration for her determination. I don't think Minkowski was the one to tell Lovelace about her plant-monster-hunting mission, because I don't think she's necessarily proud of it. I suspect it was Eiffel who told her - he's the most natural storyteller of the group. In Mutually Assured Destruction, soon after meeting Lovelace for the first time, he says "Nobody's told you about the Plant Monster yet? So, funny story..." And I believe Eiffel would have told the story of Minkowski's plant monster hunt in a way that conveyed both the ridiculousness of her behaviour but also a kind of awe at her boldness and persistence.

The tone of "all of a sudden there's a harpoon in your face" is pretty similar to "That's right when you'll find me waiting for you. With a goddamn harpoon". Once again, the harpoon is portrayed as something that the Hephaestus crew's adversary won't expect, something that will play a key role in that adversary's defeat. You might almost think something was being foreshadowed here…

Characterisation through Weaponry

When we think of the harpoon as a symbol of Minkowski as a character, it seems worth drawing a comparison with the only other Wolf 359 character who I think has a form of weaponry as a big part of their brand: Jacobi and his explosives. While a harpoon certainly has a lot of potential for violence (a potential which Minkowski utilises), it is targeted and intentional in a way that bombs don't tend to be. It's harder to have collateral damage with a harpoon, and I think that reflects a difference between Minkowski and Jacobi's approach to conflict.

A harpoon isn't really designed for combat - it's for hunting whales and other marine animals. It feels significant that Minkowski's key weapon of choice - the one she threatens the plant monster with and kills Cutter with - isn't the weapon of a soldier. She took an assault rifle with her to hunt the plant monster, but that wasn't the weapon she held onto. She's not a natural soldier, even if she'd sometimes like to think she is.

Maxwell's Death

When Minkowski kills Maxwell, it's with a gun, not a harpoon. She's trying to be a soldier there. She's trying to do what she has to. I don't know much about how a harpoon is fired, but I've a feeling that there's less uncertainty about whether a harpoon was fired deliberately than a gun; the ambiguity around Minkowski's agency in Maxwell's death is a key part of the story that wouldn't work with a harpoon. But perhaps more importantly, I don't think there's meant to be a sense of victory or relief in Maxwell's death, unlike Cutter's. The harpoon - as a weapon that has become strongly identified with Minkowski as a character - is saved for moments when Minkowski is asserting her power in an active way that she isn't conflicted about.

Ep61 Brave New World

About a third of the way into the finale, there's another indirect mention of the harpoon:

RACHEL Y-yes, sir… Umm, we also picked up some chatter on their weaponry supplies… Firearms, explosives, something about a harpoon…

This is a nice little reference which reminds the listener of the harpoon in anticipation of its big moment later on in this episode, while once again playing with its incongruity in a list of more typical combat weapons. Given that Minkowski and co. have guessed that they are being listened in on here, their choice to talk about the harpoon might be seen as their way of having a bit of fun, or it might be seen as their way to imply the same threat that Minkowski made to the plant monster. Cutter had warning, but he didn't heed it.

Which brings us, of course, to the harpoon's most significant moment:

Cutter frowns. Then he hears it: CLA-CLUNK! His eyes widen. MINKOWSKI Let's see you catch this. FWUUUMP! An ENORMOUS THING IS SHOT. A moment later, Cutter COLLIDES AGAINST THE WALL, IMPALED. MR. CUTTER ... a... harpoon? That's not... how this is... supposed... to... He struggles for a few more moments...and then he stops.

This scene is a classic instance of Wolf 359 utilizing the audio medium to leave a significant element of the situation unknown to the listener until the right moment. We don't know that Minkowski is carrying the harpoon. We don't know that she's readying it as Lovelace talks. When we hear something fire, there's a moment where a listener might or might not have realised exactly what just fired. It's Cutter who delivers the glorious revelation. It gives the moment an additional burst of triumph that Cutter's final words are an expression of shock, not just that he has been defeated but at the weapon with which the killing blow was struck.

Human unpredictability

It's not just that Minkowski kills Cutter with a harpoon; it's also that she wouldn't have been able to kill him without it. He can catch bullets after all, so Minkowski and Lovelace's guns are basically useless. Cutter thinks he's therefore invincible, but he hasn't accounted for the possibility that Minkowski might have a less conventional weapon on hand, one which fires larger projectiles that he can't catch so easily. The fact that she's carrying an unexpected weapon - a weapon that might have seemed ridiculous - is what allows her to defeat Cutter and therefore to survive.

It's a repeated theme in Wolf 359 that the protagonists' strength is not that they are the most powerful or they behave in the most logical ways, but that they are complicated and human and unpredictable and very much themselves - all of the things that Cutter and Pryce don't want in their 'ideal humanity'. When Minkowski kills Cutter with the harpoon, it's a victory for human unpredictability and individual idiosyncrasies.

Making good on her promise

Thinking back to Minkowski Commanding, we can see that the threat Minkowski made to the plant monster absolutely came true with Cutter. He got complacent. He got smug. (I'd argue that smugness has always been one of his key attributes.) And he found her waiting for him, with a goddamn harpoon. The return of the harpoon for this moment suggests the defeat of Cutter is a culmination of some of the motivations and traits that Minkowski showed when hunting the plant monster, now channeled in a more suitable direction. She continued trying to get them "that much closer to going home". Her - sometimes absurd - determination provides a throughline from an episode that was mostly comedic (Minkowski Commanding) to a dramatic emotionally powerful finale. As Sarah Shachat put it in her audio commentary, Minkowski "makes good on her promise [that she makes in her harpoon speech in Minkowski Commanding]. That's why she's a hero."

It's significant that Cutter dies from an unlikely weapon that is so strongly identified with Minkowski. It makes that moment feel like truly hers (although she is of course right that she couldn't have done it without Lovelace - that's called being part of a crew).

As the Commander, it feels apt that Minkowski is the one to kill the long-standing 'big bad'. Pryce is arguably the same level of antagonist as Cutter, but he's the one that we've been aware of since we became aware of larger sinister forces at work in this narrative.

And if Minkowski has a personal nemesis, it's Cutter. He's the one who recruited her into the hellscape that is the Hephaestus. He played on her ambitions to get her where he wanted her. She trusted him the way she trusted the official chain of authority at the start of the mission. And that trust was extremely misplaced.

The significance of Minkowski being the one to kill Cutter is highlighted by the fact that she kills him with a weapon that only she uses, a weapon that links us back to her behaviour 40 episodes earlier. The sense of control that she was desperately seeking in Minkowski Commanding might not be completely within her grasp by the end of the finale, but she's reclaimed a piece of it by defeating the man who has been exerting control over her life for so long. And she did it with that goddamn harpoon.

#It's harpoon time!!#Honestly I think there's probably still lots more to say #but this is plenty to be getting on with #Feel free to share your own thoughts #Wolf 359 #w359 #Renée Minkowski #The stuff about human unpredictability was inspired a lot by conversations with my friend @commsroom #so she'd be in my bibliography if I had one #Something that didn't really fit in here but feels relevant is the way that fans #(particularly podcast fans who don't have canon appearances to go off)#will use certain characteristics/ objects/ clothing choices to make a character identifiable in art #Like if I see art of a Wolf 359 character with some combination of cigarette/ headphones/ Star Wars t-shirt #I know it's Eiffel even if it doesn't look like my mental idea of him #And the harpoon is definitely part of that shorthand for Minkowski #because no one else would have it #so lots of Minkowski art features the harpoon #which strengthens the associations that I'm talking about in this post #And that's interesting to me #because it's an unintended way in which fandom has the potential to influence how people perceive a character #but I think in this case it just adds further value to things that are already implied in canon #Renee Minkowski #Commander Minkowski #w359 spoilers #wolf 359 spoilers #the empty man posteth

232 notes · View notes

glimblshanks · 6 months

Text

I understand wanting to ship the lower decks characters (I enjoy shipping the lower decks characters) but also McMahan is very clearly trying to write romantic friendships with the WC4 and I wish more fans could recognize that and just enjoy it for what it is

#venting #idk maybe it's just that my other main fandom is mostly aspec people #but as much as I enjoy Lower Decks and its fandom for the most part #I feel like I've experienced a lot more uh ... casual arophobia in this fandom than in others #and it's mostly through people insisting that certain ships need to be canon #and that certain actions in the show couldn't possibly be read as platonic #it honestly makes shipping less fun for me :/#like I love the relationships in lower decks because they are so much like my own relationships as an aro #it's so nice to see committed friendships that are prioritized above the romantic relationships the characters get into #and even though I enjoy shipping some of the characters romantically #honestly any of the WC4 getting together would really ruin that aspect of the show for me #I don't think McMahan is aro #but he writes relationships in a very aro way #and I appreciate him for that!#like I understand that some people want certain ships to be canon #but I think harping on that too much really takes away from how unique and meaningful his way of writing relationships is already #and it really kind of sucks to see relationships I strongly relate to #critiqued as being poorly written or 'bating the audience' just because they're not romantic

8 notes · View notes

bluegiragi · 7 months

Note

Hello again!

I wanted to ask about how you came to this fandom and how you learned anatomy. Muscular guys are not my thing, but I’m learning to draw them and, to be honest, I often watch how you do it. and one more question. How do you feel about Ghost designs that don't look like yours? do you feel like an important figure in cod fandom?

(Sorry, i like funny pictures)

sdfljaskld you draw me so cute omg im like a spiky accordion...that's definitely how i feel whenever i get up to answer asks that's for sure.

how did you come to this fandom?

i got into this fandom from watching edits on tiktok and im only a little embarrassed about it. there was one that really pulled me in that was just a compilation of all the ghost/soap banter in that 'alone' mission - i sorta instantly fell headfirst into the fandom after that, and didn't look back.

how do you draw muscular men?

it's really flattering to hear you sometimes look at my work as a reference, but im speaking honestly here when i say i have a loooot that i need to work on and my stuff might not be the best resource. I take a lot of my pointers from anatomy studies i find on pinterest, and build on the basics by googling male mannequins in google images. I find that it helps to break things down into sections like this.

i dont include this level of detail in my day to day work though, this is more to try hammer it into my brain how things work at certain angles.

how do you feel about ghost designs that don't look like yours?

i don't feel any which way about different ghost designs tbh :) i think it's a strength of this fandom that ghost's face never gets fully revealed in game, so any of our interpretations could be correct. i like my interpretation of him and konig, but i don't feel any particular possessiveness over them.

do you feel like an important figure in this fandom?

er...not really? i hope i'm not, i think that label comes with a lot of responsibility, and anyway i try not to really think of things that way. i'm just here having fun with these characters and sharing it, and if people like it then i'm glad! but i like to keep to myself and a small circle of fandom friends and that's all i really need :]

thanks for the interview lis :) and the cute drawing <3 i hope this answered your questions alright

#askbox #feral accordion gira #hehe

563 notes · View notes

functioningtrashcan · 6 months

Text

One thing that really bugs me about certain fandoms now (specifically the Spiderverse fandom at the moment) is that it's downright impossible to like certain characters around *those* fans.

Like, I can't say ONE good thing about Miguel's characterization without hearing about how Miguel fans are horny weirdos who condone abuse.

Sure, a lot of Miguel fans are horny as all hell, but liking a character =/= thinking they are perfect and can do no wrong. Hell, even *understanding* a character's motives doesn't even mean we're condoning it.

Yeah, Miguel was 100% wrong for chokeslamming Miles into a train. But, at the same time, I could understand getting pissed and freaking out about one (1) kid who's about to cause the multiversal apocalypse via messed up trolley problem. I can understand feeling like no one else is taking the situation seriously, and that you have to do everything yourself because you can't even rely on more than 4 people in your strike force of probably millions. I, too, would get mad at a hardheaded teenager who seems ready to make the same mistake I made that cost me my family.

I can, at the same time, understand being young and scared, trying to prevent a family member's death, not knowing who to trust, and running for my life because there's not a single person in the multiverse who seems willing to honestly help.

That's the beauty of not being trapped in the narrative: you can simultaneously see and appreciate *every* character's perspective, because all those perspectives influence the characters' actions and the story as a whole. I don't *have* to condone a character's actions to like them or their role in the story.

And it would DEFINITELY make the fandom space less insufferable to contribute to if half the fans weren't so obsessed with being perfectly moral angels who only support cinnamon rolls who can do no wrong. But that just me, I guess.

#spiderverse #atsv #itsv #miguel o'hara #miles morales #controversial take i know #we can enjoy things guys #its not even that deep #its gonna get resolved by the next movie anyway #oh and by the way #those same fans wanna defend THE SPOT but NOT MIGUEL??#spot is a silly lil guy but hes also way more deranged than miguel???#like babe there are worse antagonists to hate

505 notes · View notes

meatballlady · 8 months

Text

It's time for the fandom to start Looking Where the Furniture Isn't

For a bit of background, one of my irl professional responsibilities is to identify and avoid making undue assumptions. There are a LOT of things that we humans assume. We assume that terminology means the same to other people as it does to us. We assume everyone has the same context of a situation we do. We assume that we aren't missing any information.

We operate on the information we have.

There was an ask before season 2 aired asking whether many of the plot points had been revealed by the clips (which almost all took place during the first half of the first episode). Neil's response was something like "oh you sweet summer children you know nothing yet." And boy was he right.

Neil Gaiman is a master of controlling assumptions. Just look at his Tumblr askbox replies.

Here's a few s2 examples of assumptions we all made (as I'm starting a rewatch):

Why did Crowley do the (very fun and distracting) apology dance? You might say it was because he walked out on Jim, but he never specified, did he? And Aziraphale was surprised that he proposed they would hide him "together"

How did Shax get a rumor about something going down in the Up (presumably) before Gabriel even went downstairs?

Did Jim need to bring Aziraphale something other than the box? He never actually specifies; Aziraphale just assumes it's the box.

Why did Aziraphale assume Maggie could feel [Michael, Uriel, Saraquael] arriving?

Why does Aziraphale say Heaven would notice even a small miracle? Crowley is seen doing a miracle before their large miracle (traffic light), and later Aziraphale makes the guy leave the table at the pub

To go deeper:

Are we assuming that characters are telling the truth? Example: "Miracles don't work like that," "[Extreme sanctions] was just something we said to frighten the cherubs" etc.

Are we assuming that nothing of note happened between apocalypse v1 and s2? (ex. the claims that Crowley didn't tell Aziraphale about the trial in heaven despite him referencing it in s2s1) What if we the audience are just jumping in near the end of this story?

Are these assumptions correct? Or are we just working with the information that we have?

Now that I'm looking for it, there's also SO many corrections of assumptions (usually for the sake of a joke, but still) (these are just the ones that happen while I type them out while watching e2):

"Can I be a blue one?" "You haven't annoyed me yet" "But can I be?"

"You recognized [Michael, Uriel, Saraquael] those people who were in the shop just now?" "Of course, they were in the shop, just now!"

"oh my god!" "blasphemy, angel, that's not like you", "no, oh, my god"

Many of the themes were about hiding things in plain sight: the kids (and kids), Jim, "aim for my mouth but shoot past my ear." Clue (1985) was heavily referenced in the lead-up. The whole point of that film was looking at what was going on elsewhere. Looking where the furniture isn't, you might say.

The more I watch s2, the less certain I am that any of it makes sense on its own.

I'm currently combing through it to see if there are any discrepancies with where people are (easiest example is when Crowley just disappears from the bookshop while they're reviewing the Job story). It'll be a lot of data and might not lead anywhere, but I'll definitely share once I finish looking into it.

I will also honestly admit that these things are all circumstantial, and I could be going insane. But they just keep cropping up all over the place. I've got a lot of time before S3 comes up and I intend to investigate the furniture. And try to not make assumptions.

#good omens #gos2 #good omens spoilers #good omens meta #good omens theory #aziraphale #crowley #s2 wrecked me #it's driving me insane #I'll be completely transparent on that front #looking where the furniture isn't

471 notes · View notes

barblaz-arts · 2 months

Note

HELLOOO!! Im in LOVE with all your Chaggie (and Wenclair obv-) art!! I was wondering if youd be up to share your thoughts on the other hazbin characters? Simply cuz Im very curious and youve been a favourite content creator of mine for a while whose opinions and takes on different things i value A LOT! So id love to hear your thoughts on the rest of the main cast(and more if youre up to it hahha)!

@phantoswordsman15

The main cast huh

Hmmmmm I dont particularly hate them, but I have some opinions that people might not like and I'm aware there's a lot of uh sensitive people in this fandom, so I never said them unprompted

But since you asked!

Alastor

Let's start with the infamous Alastor. I think he's a very entertaining character! His horde of simps annoy tf outta me when they're being misogynistic and homophobic towards Chaggie and Vaggie, but I quite liked him when I make myself forget certain parts of the fandom. He's funny and conniving and intriguing. The fact that he apparently sold his soul is super interesting to me. I'm on board with the people theorizing that he sold his soul to Lilith. I bet he's cozying up with Charlie so that he can use it to break his contract somehow. Feel like he also used the deal with (presumably) Lilith so that he could be strong enough to be the overlord he became.

With that being said, I'm really surprised with the direction they took with him. You'd think that with him being a favorite of the showrunner and the fandom, he would probably be portrayed as the coolest mf in hell. But I really like that it isn't really the case within the show. Certain denizens dont even know him and older overlords like Zestial seems to scare him and Carmilla just dgaf about him. Hell, Alastor's loss to Adam was a lil embarrassing ngl. Like. I know he's one of the oldest human souls and that's why he's powerful but... It's Adam.

Something about him that I noticed is that he seems to be more bark than bite. In particular in his duet with Lucifer, initially Lucifer had the upper hand because he's objectively more powerful, humiliating Alastor with his angel magic, but what Alastor used to his advantage was his words and charisma, as can be expected of a radio host. He's always taunting his enemies, but does it actually make him stronger than them? He "won" that duet with Vox but Valentino said Alastor only"almost beat" him when they had an actual fight. He ruffled Lucifer's feathers but at the end of the day Lucifer is still leagues more powerful than him. He talked big when he was fighting Adam but he almost died and had a breakdown over it.

He's really a lot less "cool" than I expected the show would have him be portrayed as. Kinda pathetic honestly, how he's so insecure and angry whenever he isn't the strongest guy in the room. And i actually really like that! He reminds me a lot of Rumplestilstkin from Once Upon a Time.

Something I kinda hesitate to say tho is... I dont want him redeemed. I dont want him to actually care about the hotel crew and change his ways. I like him as the fucked up man he is and really want to see how fucked up he can be, just so that if he ends up being the huge antagonist, his downfall would be all the more satisfying. Like yunno that moment when Light/Kira was finally defeated? I wanna feel that again.

Angel Dust

I love him! We found his dialogue a lil annoying at first in ep 1 but the writers did a lot better in ep 2. He's a neat guy. His character gives interesting implications for me as to what makes a person a sinner in this show. While you have people like Alastor who obviously ended up where they did because a cannibal murderer, I get the feeling Angel ended up in hell because he was abusing his own body, which is a sad thing to think. If I remember right from my own catholic upbringing, abusing the body is considered a sin because your body is a temple. To think that Angel could be in hell for poisoning himself, not for harming others, is just sad man. I look forward to seeing more of his journey.

I'm not touching on how his SA was tackled btw. While I'm a victim of sexual assault myself, what i experienced was far from what Angel does on a REGULAR basis,so I don't feel like i have any personal or professional right to say anything about it. Not every victim's case is universal anyways. All I can say is, his line about purposefully damaging himself so he could be broken enough to no longer be Valentino's "favorite toy" hit me harder than I ever expected this show to.

Husk

Confession: I... I dont feel all that attached to Husk at all, I am so sorry Husk stans 😭

Okok that feels so mean to say I'm so sorry. I actually hesitated to say anything because I dont want to hurt people's feelings. But since you guys are asking and I dont like not being genuine, I'm telling the truth.

A lot of my feelings about Husk is heavily affected by the fandom anyways to be perfectly fair. Why? Because a lot of criticisms against Vaggie is easily applicable to Husk, maybe even more so, and yet I dont see even the same level of hate towards him that Vaggie received because his chemistry with Angel is so much better than Chaggie... Apparently...

I just dont see Husk as a character outside of being a plot device for Angel's development yunno? I get it, he isn't a main character like the main 4 are(Charlie, Vaggie, Alastor, and Angel), i just find it hard to well and truly like him because of the fandom's double standards. When we found out someone was gonna die in the finale, my brother and I actually thought it was gonna be him because he doesn't have a big enough role to play in the plot to be a HUGE loss, but has a significant enough connection to a main character to have an EFFECT. He very much just felt like the love interest for Angel and nothing else. Which isnt necessarily a bad thing, but is frustrating when i see sooo many people label Vaggie as such(when she isnt!) and hate her SO MUCH for it.

I wanna see more of him tho I really do. Like the man used to be an overlord. He said he wanted to find someone who could relate to "the gruesome ways in which he's damaged" but what does that even mean? Yes i know about the castration but aside from that what suffering is Alastor putting him thru when all he has to do is be a bartender rn? There must be more and I wanna see it and finally feel for him.

Nifty

I love her a lot. That's it. The character ever. Her gremlin energy reminded me so much of Peridot, it's great. Kimiko Glenn did a fantastic job as the comic relief character and I hope she gets her own song next season. Her basically being everyone's little sister was kinda adorable even tho she's probably the scariest person in that hotel next to Alastor. I hope she gets to stab Valentino next. Just kill that MOTHerfucker

#asks #hazbin hotel

177 notes · View notes

randoimago · 3 months

Note

Since Astarion can't see his own reflection, I thought it'd be interesting to ask for a scenario where his painter!S/O surprises him with a hyper-realistic portrait of him that they made.

Fandom: Baldur's Gate 3

Character(s): Astarion

Note(s): I wish there was a way to give him a painting or have him comment on the statue (if it was commissioned of him). I can just imagine the various ways he'd react depending on how his story goes.

Astarion

You mention you got him a present and he's already amused. Gives you a smile as he says something cheeky like, "Buying my affection with gifts? You know me well."

And then you show him the portrait and he just looks at it for a bit. Astarion is a bit confused as he takes in the face he doesn't recognize. Is it a character in some book he mentioned liking at some point? He's typically good at faces (he needed to know who to run and hide from, after all).

Then you explain that it's him. Astarion just stares at you for a few moments as he processes what he was just told. His eyes go back to the painting as he takes in the details of the face. He honestly doesn't know what emotions to feel. The fact that you put in some much effort for him has his heart skipping a beat. But the fact that it's taken him this long to see his face again.

Yes, he's had opportunities in the past with other artists, but it always felt too intimate with certain people. And with others, he was afraid that having a painting of himself would show him as the monster Cazador turned him into.

But your painting has none of that. His eyes look lighter than he thought. The smile on his face doesn't look as forced as his smile used to be.

"Oh shit." He'd suddenly say and look away as he feels his eyes getting watery. He doesn't want you to see how much this painting is affecting him. How much seeing his face in your eyes is affecting him. In the past, he would've made up some lie or some cheeky comment about his nose not being cute enough. But now that he has actual feelings? It's just a lot of emotions hitting him at once. Vulnerability is still something he struggles with showing, but he wipes his eyes and gives you a small smile.

"Thank you, my sweet," he'd murmur and move the painting aside before pulling you into a hug, holding you tight to his chest. Once he's gotten over the sudden burst of emotions that hit him, then he'd clear his throat and go back to his usual self. His eyes going to the painting as he hums in contemplation.

"Does my nose really look like that?"

Taglist: @reo-the-leo @unhelpfulnpc

#Anonymous #bg3 x reader #baldurs gate 3 x reader #astarion x reader #bg3 astarion x reader

269 notes · View notes

thestrangestthing89 · 1 year

Text

This is going to be ranty and I've touched on this subject before. So if you're a Steve worshipper look away. For the record, I love his character but I cannot stand the constant mischaracterization of him. It turns him into a joke. He's not a mom and the comparison is frankly sexist not to mention shows how much people are willing to overlook with regard to his character. Joyce does triple the amount of work and is an actual mom, so if you want to praise someone for being a mom look to the real one. Instead she gets practically ignored by the fandom. Steve does the bare minimum compared to a lot of people and gets worshipped, and the result of this is that people end up turning him into a 1 dimensional version of himself. He has flaws and it's important to acknowledge them. He's far more interesting and relatable this way. Without doing that he gets turned into a god-like figure who is infallible. But the worst of this is the constant erasure of Jonathan. I keep seeing posts saying that Steve would be such an amazing mentor to Will and how wonderful their relationship will be next season. Be for fucking real. They don't have a relationship and never will and Will doesn't need him. Not to mention the fact that Steve isn't a mentor. He is a peer. And only to Dustin, Lucas, Max, and Erica who are the only kids who are shown to have any kind of relationship with him. And honestly Dustin is the only one that isn't superficial. It's especially notable in the case of Mike that they never developed a relationship. It shows that not only are Mike and Nancy not that close, but her ex-boyfriend never bonded with him. Mike tends to respond to Steve with the same contempt he has for his father in the brief moments we've seen between the two.

It's Jonathan who is an ally to Will. It's Jonathan Will and Mike trust. It's Jonathan Mike has known since he was 5. And it's Jonathan who has constantly protected them. Neither one of them have a relationship with Steve. All of these characters have been on the show since the beginning. If Steve had a major impact on any of their lives they would have shown it by now. And yes, Steve is no longer the bullying asshole he once was. He has gone through a great character arch that has shown him growing and changing in a realistic way. However, he still has a lot to learn and this was demonstrated through his shitty advice to Robin early in the season. Him dismissing her fears of asking Vickie out was not ok and shows he doesn't fully understand her point of view. Just because he ended up being right at the end doesn't excuse the fact that he told her to just ask Vickie out simply because she paused a movie at a certain time. He could have very easily been wrong and it was valid that she was hesitant.

Steve used to bully people for being gay, and again, it's good that he doesn't do this anymore and has grown. But this is the version of Steve that Will, Mike, and Jonathan know. They know the version of him that called Jonathan the f word and said his brother deserved to die. They know the version of him that said their abusive father was right. Mike and Will are not coming out to Steve.

In fact, people should expect them to be afraid of him and expect Jonathan to immediately be on guard and protective. Because this is the only version of him they know. Steve was known around town for being a bully and he still has this reputation - Eddie says this season he is surprised Steve wasn't an asshole even though Dustin insisted.

Mike and Will are two scared kids who live in a town that behaves the way Steve used to. They expect this kind of reaction. It's Jonathan's calm, empathetic support they need. It isn't the guy who used to be homophobic - and honestly has no patience for the kids - to help them out. Quiet, sensitive Will does not need someone loud and impatient who used to act like his abusive father in his life. And it's not on Mike and Will to absolve Steve of his past crimes.

And I absolutely cannot stand all the headcanons that I see of how Steve is going to start a LGBTQ support group around Hawkins for Robin and Will. It's utterly ridiculous. We absolutely do need Robin bonding with Will (and Mike and Vickie) but there is honestly no excuse for the constant insertion of Steve into this narrative. It is not a place he belongs. As an ally, it's important for him to recognize there are spaces that aren't for him. They do not need his permission or approval to talk to each other.

And bonding with Robin does not automatically come with a close bond with Steve. It isn't required. She is her own separate person who has her own separate experiences that Steve does not always need to be apart of just because they are friends. It's far more impactful to see a moment between Will and Robin (including with Mike and Vickie) without Steve randomly being there saying pointless shit. And they aren't wasting a moving coming out moment with Steve and Mike and Will instead of with people they are actually close to. Inserting him into this narrative changes the focus from the LGBTQ character to Steve. It makes it entirely about him and his response instead of them. In fact it's not outside of the realm of possibility that he just never finds out or it's a very quick moment that happens in passing. But erasing his characters actual role on the show completely misses the point of why he's still in this narrative. The cool guy isn't the focus of this story for once. It's not his story. That doesn't mean he isn't important. It means that for once the straight, white dude who's conventionally attractive is taking a backseat and not only that, but he's not resentful about this. He doesn't act bitter that he isn't the focus. And this is such an important role to see.

#byler #mike wheeler #gay mike wheeler #will byers #jonathan byers #steve harrington #anti mileven #anti stancy

599 notes · View notes

epickiya722 · 23 days

Note

Can, I ask, why do you think Yuuji is one of the character that is so underated in JJK? He is the mc, but many people (in fandom) treat him like a side character? At first, I don't think so, but I love many shounen, and somehow Yuuji is one of the mc that is underated in their own story....

Sorry if I'm wrong, just I love Yuuji and want him to get the spotlight he deserve....

I wouldn't say you're wrong, Anon! In fact, I would say he is an underrated character. Yes, fairly popular, but when it comes to how the fandom treats him compared to characters like Gojo, Yuji is Underrated.

I feel exactly how you feel about Yuji. To me, he is the best JJK character. Oh, yeah, I'm being bias, whatever, but it's how I feel.

My guess as to why the fandom treats him like a side character because Yuji isn't like how most older gen MCs are written, let alone the others of the cast.

Let's be real, when the mid-late 2010s rolled around, how fandoms started to treat the new age MCs is opposite of their treatment of other MCs. It's because they're a different formula and honestly, I feel like folks who bash on Yuji and others like Tanjiro and Izuku, just don't want to try something different.

They're used to the MCs who speedruns their training and powerups and suffer little to no drawbacks, "trauma, what trauma" and want to be the best because they got an ego and pride they don't want hurt.

Today's MCs? Pain, not afraid to show a range of emotions, training? Oh, they get the hang of it but still a lot to learn and watch out! They have the scars to prove that they almost lost an arm!

Now focusing on Yuji, as I said he's not like other JJK characters.

He's not overpowered, but he's not weak either. He's a bit of a goof and he's says he's an idiot, but he actually isn't all dumb he makes himself out to be. He's not flashy, but he has amazing moments where he gets to show off.

He has a goal to get strong, not being he wants to be the top or anything. He just wants to help people.

He has a sad backstory, but it's only until later we realize how messed up it is and even still we don't have his reaction to realizing those messed up bits. Yuji was raised by his grandfather and he states he is a loner. But unlike how we see with most characters, Yuji is relatively fine with that. He brushes off knowing about his parents, unlike most MCs who would literally beg for answers. He's a loner, but he's not a loser. Note how people around him in his hometown treats him. They gave him a nickname to reflect his impressive physical prowess that amazes them and yet, he doesn't care for the popularity.

Yuji has this balance to him where he's both spontaneous but also pretty chill. A lot of the cast outshines Yuji be because they are more showy than Yuji, even calm characters.

Unlike Gojo and even Yuta, Yuji is literally what you call the audience surrogate. Through him, we learn about the Jujutsu world while experiencing (growth).

From the start of their stories (referring to JJK 0 and Gojo's Past Arc), both Gojo and Yuta are established as powerful sorcerers from the start. Yuta may have had inexperienced but he was still recognized as a powerful kid. Both are born lucky with having such powers. The most Yuta and Gojo really develop and change is their personalities and attitudes towards certain ideas. That's it. They don't even have to do anything and immediately their auras show who they are.

In contrast to Yuji, how is he recognized?

As just Sukuna's vessel. Most of the time, he is literally called that. When he's recognized by his strength and abilities it's when he actively has to fight. Then it's like "oh, so he does have capabilities". Yuji actually has to show he can be just as capable as the others because when people first look at him it's "Sukuna's vessel" or back in Sendai it's "Tiger of West Middle".

It's not "Yuji".

Hell, he'll even be compared to Maki. It's not "Maki's like Yuji". No, it's "Yuji is like Maki". Megumi is the first character to do this. Maki is unique enough that if someone, in this case Yuji, displays a similarity to her, she is the template.

However, for Yuji, while he's unique it's almost like it's not enough to be acknowledged until he has to show them. Like, he has to prove something when he actually doesn't care to do that. Yuji doesn't care to get stronger than the next person, especially at this point. If anything, he seems to be the only one from the very start recognize that none of this is a test of strength when people are dying. Note how he acts during a fight. Every major to majorly minor character has displayed some sort of enjoyment out of a fight or fights to show they're not weak.

Not a single time has Yuji ever even smiled. Look back at all the fights and you will see that he hasn't done such a thing. He fights not because it's a game. He fights because he has to and only that.

And it's not like it gets better for him because he later identifies himself as "a cog". It's like Yuji never really had his own identity.

He's the odd one out.

It's how I think some of the fandom sees him. Without an identity, without recognizable traits. Hell, go on any post that praises Yuji and Yuji alone and there's gonna be a hater to bring up another character.

To some, I feel like Yuji only exists to them to hate on. Only a tool to bring in their praising of other characters to put him down as if that's all he's worthy of. It's a damn shame, too, that people actually feel the need to bring down a character to build their faves. Oh, feel like your fave can't stand on their own and show their greatness?

#kiya answers #kiya answers questions #jjk #jujutsu kaisen #itadori yuuji #yuuji itadori #itadori yuji #yuji itadori #💖🐯👊#jjk spoilers

110 notes · View notes

antimony-medusa · 8 months

Text

Please Consider The Implications Of Assigning Every Character Dad In The Tag, I Am Begging You

Okay so we have to discuss something here.

I know a lot of people are coming in QSMP from DSMP, where the primary fandom focus, so to speak, was on underage creators. In that setting, and in an environment where people are heavily against shipping, assigning people into a family dynamic makes sense. I have my woes about the flattening nature of family dynamic but seeing a few teens and a few adults and going “siblings and parents” makes sense.

Not every environment in this world is that environment though, and sometimes certain dynamics in an open environment has *connotations*. In the same way that if you have a parent helping a child bathe that’s one thing but two adults in the shower is an entirely different tone, in the same way that an adult threatening to punish a teenager is either corrective or abusive, depending on the setting, but an adult threatening to punish another adult tends more towards “kinky”, if you have Grown-Ass Adults who are like 12 years apart in age and you are insisting they have parent/child pseudo-adoptive relationship, you did not necessarily make it automatically platonic, you just made it kinky. Looking at an older man and going “Dad” and getting the warm and tinglies about that and the idea of them taking care of you when you are an adult— there’s a term for that. That’s a Daddy Kink. That’s where Daddy Issues jokes come from. That’s not a thing where the first or only read is platonic. Platonic reads certainly exist, but for your broad open audience of the whole internet it’s not necessarily the first thing they think of. It’s literally fine but guys. Please. I’m dying here.

I have no problems with a daddy kink, it’s one of the myriad ways to navigate the mysterious knot of impulses that is human sexuality. You can even do kink in a non-sexual way, and plenty of people interact with kinks like fearplay, vore, bondage, hypnosis, predator/prey— I could keep listing them here— you can interact with that in a way that is honestly non-sexual. But that doesn’t mean it’s non-kinky. You are doing a kink. It’s fine to be doing a kink. I am an adult talking to adults about this. Kink is fine. But like, you have GOT to realize at some point what you’re putting in the tag.

I’m fine with shipping! I’m fine with kink! I just would like the kink on my dash to acknowledge that it’s kinking on something!

If you find older people strangely compelling and you want to trust them and you want to call them dad and have them take care of you/a different character you’re focused on, that is fine. If you want to focus on the relationship between a “parent” and their “little” who are both adults, again, fine. Honourable way to navigate the world. We all have fun here.

But I am BEGGING you to realize that certain dynamics have connotations when everybody involved is adults, and constantly going on about how someone is dad-coded or dad-shaped when you are not like, 15, it has a *vibe*. It has a vibe is all I’m saying! And it’s not a platonic vibe!

If you are looking at someone who is 21 fucking years old and you are focused on finding them a dad from an assortment of men who are just over a decade their senior, you are either infantilizing them like whoa or you are doing a daddy kink i am sorry to tell you. If you are constantly talking about how someone who is a decade older than you is dad(dy)— like, please. This is inescapable. My kingdom for people who approach my guys without this lens. If I have to see you doing this to Niki Nihachu I’m going to throw myself into the sea.

#QSMP #philza #fandom meta

265 notes · View notes

torterracotta · 9 months

Text

When I heard Gerry Duggan get asked on Cerebro, white boy to white boy, about the unfortunate optics of announcing and then immediately murdering the least white team of X-Men in years, I knew we'd be in for some shit. Man, did he deliver - after some evasive waffling about how ORCHIS is meant to be fascist, and how the story's point is to put the collective back of mutantkind even more against the wall than it was any of the last six times something like this has happened.

And, honestly? That's fair! This year's Hellfire Gala is ultimately the first part of a larger story, and history shows it's not going to last forever — hell, does anyone remember what the status quo was immediately before HoXPoX? At least this time most of the characters have implicitly just been sucked into Mother Righteous's magical Poké Ball, rather than outright killed; if anything, that's an improvement. I was fully content to just think "hey, not for me," and get back to ignoring everything beyond Immortal and Sabertooth, secure in the knowledge that certain topics are bound to be handled poorly when almost everyone in the room is white, when Duggan said three words that stopped me in my tracks:

"Keep the faith."

See, that struck me, because for a lot of us, this entire era of comics has been about nothing but faith. I've been reading X-Men, and engaging with fans since I was eight, and I've never seen the kind of collective buy-in from other marginalized readers that I have with Krakoa. X-Twitter (or, I suppose, X-X) has been Blacker, queerer, more disabled, less homogeneous than the fandom has ever been, all of us buying in to the implicit promise that this time things would be different. Sure, the line was headed by a presumably straight white guy, but there were other voices in the room for a change, and it really felt like they were going to be listened to. We thought we'd moved past clunky metaphor, past queerbaitimg and awkward racial gaffes. Storm and Kwannon were getting to do stuff, Arakko was full of amazing characters of color, Cyclops and Wolverine were probably fucking, we were hooked, and we turned out.

It's hard to overemphasize just how wild this was to see in real time. X-Men has always been allegory, sure, but it's traditionally allegory by and for the majority. For years, the readers who might really feel that resonance, those of us who have been hated and feared for the unforgivable crime of being who we are, we were afterthoughts, tolerated at best. We got scraps, "representation" from creators who seemed to be offended by the implication that we would ever want something other than being fetishized tokens. We were, as Hickman so succinctly put it, told that we were less when we knew we were more. And then, out of nowhere, Krakoa made us inescapable.

The two biggest X-Men podcasts, X-Plain the X-Men and Cerebro, are hosted by queer people. X of Words has been rocking the Black, queer experience like no one's business, Mutant Watch has been a joy to listen to and to be on. Not just podcasts, either, in everything from criticism to fanart to cosplay, voices have been elevated that were previously silent. I mean, hell, I've gotten paid to talk about comics, that shit never would have happened four years ago.

All of that was based on faith.

Faith that we were being celebrated, for once, instead of just used. Faith that for whatever growing pains there might be, things were going to be better.

And let's not fuck around here, there were growing pains. In the first year alone we dealt with everything from blatant whitewashing, to queerbaiting — any Sunspot fan can go into detail there, assuming you can get one of us to stop crying for long enough. While that was going on, we watched Bryan Edward Hill (the only non-white writer in that initial wave) put out a book that was, let's face it, at worst aggressively mid, only to be excoriated by certain portions of the fandom, and dropped by the office, while significantly worse books managed to hold fast — er, hold on. Not to say that Fallen Angels was without sin, mind you, the book was packed with enough orientalism to make Chris Claremont blush. But, at the same time, Wolverine's first year ended with him doing what he does best: trying so hard to be Japanese that I had to check to make sure he wasn't Marvel's editor in chief.

Through all of that, we kept the faith.

Things didn't really get much better, of course. Arakko was a fascinating concept, and felt like it damn near doubled Marvel's characters of color. And yeah, the ending of X-Factor was one of the most poorly handled racist messes I've seen this side of… well, any given day on Twitter. Sure, the whitewashing has never stopped, to the point where everything from X-Corp to this week's Hellfire Gala has had to be hastily edited between previews and release. Maybe we keep dealing with stuff like butchered AAVE, even more queerbaiting, Kate Pryde's funeral, the genocide of almost all of those Arraki characters, and whatever the hell was going on with Lost in Way of X. Maybe there's a very real argument to be made that there's something insidious about three straight years of voting to determine if characters like Monet (who, by the by, has been retooled from "basically Superman" to "Black woman with anger powers") deserve the honor of being written by a white man who's stayed writing with his foot in his mouth. I mean, hey! All my white friends in the scene say he's nice, just like Williams, or Howard, or any number of other crusty crackers who are still proud of tripping over the bar Claremont left on the floor in the 80's!

And dammit, we kept the faith!

Even before the issue dropped, the Fall of X has had a lot of us wary. After all, all of the promotion leading up to it has been white guys saying the minority allegory has had it too good for too long, which, whatever, press copy. We all know they've gotta sell books — they, in this case, being the almost exclusively white, almost exclusively male creative teams attached to all of the books in the line. Sure, as Duggan said, the 616 has a fascism problem, but it’s hard not to see this as a deliberate step back from the almost double digit number of non-white creators these past few years — almost as if Marvel has realized they can make space for a fourth ongoing by their favorite white boy if they just throw out a Voices special every couple of months as a containment zone for the darkies. And, hey, considering how good ol’ C.B. got his foot in the door, I can’t even fake surprise. At this point, it’s a minor miracle any time a person of color is tapped for anything that’s expected to last beyond one issue.

In this issue, as a reward for keeping the faith, we got to see something astounding, something that'd bring a tear to the eye of even the most cynical reader — a team that was only half white. My god. And sure, their brutal murder in favor of a team with Kate "Hard-Arrr" Pryde and the Kingpin(????) was only a pit-stop between the resurrection of the suddenly ashy Ms. Marvel and Lourdes Chantel being killed off for the sake of a white woman's angst yet afuckinggain, but ain't that the dream that Malcolm Ten or whoever died for?

The Krakoan era, ultimately, has been the same as every other. Empty promises by white men who show us time and again that there was never any point in expecting anything better. Any meaning we've found, everything of worth, has been what we've made for ourselves.

We've spent years keeping the faith, Gerry, while you and yours have continued to let us down. What the hell do we have to show for it?

#xspoilers #Hellfire Gala 2023 #X-Men

358 notes · View notes

twig-tea · 3 months

Note

Lately I’ve been feeling like Thai bl is truly all over the place with so many shows airing at once and some of the best ones flying under the radar while discourse is focused on a couple of the big messy ones. I think you’re the only person I know who is actually watching ALL of them and has been here for the whole evolution of the genre, so I’m curious what stands out to you about this current moment. Do the shows feel different to you? Is the way fandom is interacting with them changing? And what are your current favs?

I ended up writing a thesis, sorry friend lol To be fair to me there are 3 questions in there, all of them meaty! I've done my best to give a sense of where I'm at with Thai BL and how it feels like it's changed over time.

Caveating all of this: I am just one fan who I'm sure has had specific experiences that will colour my opinion, also a lot of this is just vibes so I'm open to being told I've forgotten something major or misremembered what it was like! If you are reading this and your opinion or experience is different please share, with stuff like this I'm always interested in hearing about differing opinions because the fandom experience will depend at least partly on where you hang out. For years, my main fandom space for BL was the YouTube comments section (RIP me).

Overall feel

Honestly, things overall don't feel all that different to me in Thai BL in particular, even though I'm about to talk about a lot of changes and ways it actuallyd does feel very different below lol And after reflecting about it, I think it's because these things still feel very much in flux, in a way that they've felt in flux this entire time. Producers are still figuring out the best funding and distribution models and merch models to make money; creators are still calibrating how queer these shows can be and still be popular; actors are still figuring out how to do BGP (business gay performances) without having fans interfere in their private lives off the clock. Writers are still trying to figure out how to write 12-episode arcs that don't drag in the middle or fumble the ending (which is also not new). The tension between established ships, fan expectations, and genre requirements has honestly been there almost the whole time, though the reverberations of missteps is louder now because of the larger fanbase that is (comparatively) more plugged in to live viewing. The core question in BL has always been 'how do we make this marketable', and that unsurprisingly hasn't changed, though the answer to that question has over time, if that makes sense?

Shows

Do the shows feel different? As a whole, I'd say yes. The biggest differences are of course total quantity and overall quality, but the actual distribution of % of shows that have high(er) production values (i.e. quality) feels close to the same--it was close to 50/50 in the late 2010s and now is maybe more like 40/60 with a higher percentage coming from more smaller production companies. But the numbers we're talking about are something like 15 shows in e.g. 2018 and something more like 50 shows in 2023 (being vague because there are shows that people could argue over whether they should count). The quality overall has increased, even the pulps look better, sound better, and tend to feel a little bit more put together than the pulps of even 2020 (please note that these are all relative qualifiers, most of these shows are still not objectively good). 2020 in particular was a watershed moment for high production value BLs; we get colorists and special effects artists, and sometimes decent sound production now!

There has also been an improvement in terms of what is depicted and how certain subject matter is treated very generally, though I think that's still in flux. Things like evil ex girlfriends are less common than they were and the women in BL are more likely (in general, still not always) to be treated as realized characters. We've gotten more and better femme representation in ensemble shows, and the "gay for you" trope is much less common. Consent is now considered sexy and is much more common than it was; non-consent as "sexy" has eroded and is much less common. Things that used to happen in almost every BL now happen in a much lower percentage. I also feel a little bit less worried about some of the actors on pulp sets because there is more general scrutiny about things like minor actors, intimacy coordination, BGP (business gay performance) expectations, and sexual exploitation. Overall, show recommendations these days come with fewer caveats.

The assumption that if you worked with someone on a BL once you would stay with them as an established pairing was surprisingly early in BL; I don't know if it's just because there were a few shows that had side pairings then get main shows, so the actors did work together on a few shows in a row, which made them feel established, or whether it's because the BGP started early to build hype both before and after shows aired, or whether audiences just made homophobic assumptions about how if two actors had chemistry they had to be gay for each other, and otherwise nobody would want to "play gay" more than once, or would want to have to kiss too many other men....in any case, there were huge scandals and blow-ups around this in BL on even the earliest shows, and some early shows were snubbed because of the pairing alone. Similarly, it was established very early in BL (i.e. 2016-17) that an unhappy ending for a pair would result in your show being panned; cheating was also a guaranteed flop in BL circles (though some ensemble shows that had gay relationships in them such as Friend Zone did fine with cheating plots and unhappy endings). Overall it feels like some things were only depicted in early Thai BL and creators have avoided them since due to the audience reception at the time. I will say, generally, that there have now been enough examples of people in a "branded pair" moving on to a new pair or multiple shows, that it feels less like a death knell to a BL career if one of the actors says they no longer wanted to make BLs, or if they switched companies.

I pay a lot of attention to queerness in BL, and that has changed a little bit too, though not in the way I expected. I had been expecting a more clear and steady trajectory in BL, but we've instead had real swings, and I've realized there will just always be shows that feel more or less actually gay or queer than others, and that's ok. Early Thai shows really spoiled us for good queer content, GayOK Bangkok and Diary of Tootsies are still shows by which i measure what we get now, and both of those are from 2016. I would say that more "mainstream" BL (i.e. by one of the major production companies) hit what turned out to be queer saturation around 2020 and that's where I was most surprised not see a more clear trajectory; rather than things getting more queer from there, I'd say a greater percentage of shows overall feel more queer, but we haven't (and I now suspect won't) reach the queerness we had in Thai tv in 2016. That being said, my secret running list of things I want to see in BL gets shorter every year as entries get crossed off, so I would say the range of queer experience is slowly getting captured as more content continues to be made by a wider range of production houses (PrEP being mentioned in a mainstream show is my white whale).

I know some people assume that shows are higher heat now overall, but I don't think that's true. I do think Thai television producers and directors have overalll gotten better at capturing sensuality, and acting workshops have improved chemistry-building overall too. But from what I can tell the ratio of high head and low heat content is still pretty similar to what it's always been, maybe slightly higher (e.g. at a quick glance I'd guesstimate 30% of shows had a sex scene in 2018 vs 40% in 2023).

Fandom

The main differences in fandom from the really early days and now are the ways we, as international fans, are able to engage with each other, with thai audiences at the same time, and with content creators, and the entitlement that comes with that. In the 2010s we were almost always watching after Thai airing, with either fansubs or, later, official subs, trailing online releases by days or weeks, which themselves may have trailed the Thailand airing date by days or weeks or sometimes even months. That became less true around 2019ish, and especially in 2020 when I think Thai producers were desperate to reach audiences during the start of the pandemic (and when audiences were desperate for something to distract us from what was happening in real life).

As a fan in the mid-late 2010s, watching something was either unofficial via a fansubber, or you were wading through hundreds of Thai comments to find anyone else writing about the shows in English. Now, it's actually rare we don't have immediate international distribution, though it may be paid. If the subs are not up at the same time as the official upload, even on free sites, fans get furious. It's a bit surreal to see people complain about waiting a few hours for subtitles, especially on YouTube, when we sometimes waited months for a series to finish being subbed (not to say people didn't complain back then too, because they sure did! But there were fewer international fans overall, and it wasn't an expectation that there would be subs, so fewer people complained when it happened). This meant that a lot of people only watched shows when they were complete, and people were not watching with any kind of synchronicity.

With international fans moving into simultaneous watching with Thai audiences, we suddenly had the chance to talk about shows as they were airing and affect the conversations about them and even, sometimes, the decisions. Folks seem to have differing opinions about what makes a BL, and what makes a BL good, and they are vocal about when a show doesn't meet their standard. This has always been true, but the strong opinions have more of an effect on the discourse when they're expressed in real-time to the show being aired. Also, when we have literally 3x the number of Thai shows being aired (nevermind other countries which have also increased), it seems so much more egregious to me to complain if a single show doesn't meet your particular taste. Just go watch something else! That was less possible in 2016, but now nobody has any excuse lol Please note here that I'm not saying shows should not be criticized. But when you have one loud faction saying shows should have nothing but innocent kisses if any skinship at all and showing more is distasteful and possibly homophobic, and another faction saying a show should be panned if they don't have at least one sex scene and if there is no good kiss it's homophobic, I don't know where that leaves content creators but I see the tension and how it sometimes results in my least favourite tropes like "blushing maiden" even after a couple has canonically had sex. These factions have always existed in BL fandom, this is not new, they just both seem particularly silly now with so much content to choose from.

The shows that get attention and the shows that get snubbed feel the same too, in all honesty. You can ask yourself the following questions:

Is the show a little slower paced?

Are the story beats less melodramatic?

Do its characters feel more human?

Do they feel more queer?

Is it a comedy?

Is there any risk of an unhappy ending?

Do people not think one of the lead actors is hot?

Do people ship one of the lead actors with someone who isn't his costar?

Do people have to do anything other than go to YouTube to watch it?

If the answer is yes to any of those questions, and especially to the last one, fewer people will be watching, even if the show is good. That's always been true. [Shows I'm thinking about when I say that: Make it Right, He's Coming to Me, My Ride, You're My Sky, Oxygen (though the sides in this one are also at fault), YYY, Something in my Room, Ghost Host Ghost House, Dear Doctor I'm Coming for Soul, Cooking Crush.] All this is to say, there have always been shows that have been ignored, though I agree with you OP that with more shows airing, more are being ignored at any given time.

The other thing is that when a show is good, it doesn't necessarily invite discourse. The messes are often what encourage people to dig in, fill in gaps, linger in the adrenaline. The part that does feel different is also related to the increase in genre BLs; genre stuff in general tends to get more attention in fandom spaces, and the way people are functioning as fans feels different in that they're bringing the way they interact with genre content to BL as BL has started having larger and better funded genre content. I'm thinking about those early genre BLs like He She It, My Dream, Love Poison, Golden Blood, So Much In Love, Why R U....we started getting genre shows in BL in I think 2017 and basically had 1-2 a year until 2020ish and then it increased from there; and the ones that had funding and decent distribution got engagement until they started going off the rails, and then they had even more engagement and then fell off. I don't think it's a coincidence that the shows last year that got people to write meta were La Pluie, Be My Favorite, and I Feel You Linger in the Air. When a show is building a world, there's more to say and interrogate about it, and when a genre show fails, it can fail more spectacularly than a regular romance story. The most popular BL shows used to all be straight-up BL bubble romances, but I think genre shows really started to take over a greater percentage of the popular spots in 2022 and 2023. Again, the main difference here is that there used to be 1-2 stand-out shows per year, and now there are closer to 6+ per year, and as we got more stand-out shows the variety of what type of show stood out as popular has expanded. I do think the overall percentage of shows that are more standard romance plots has reduced, partly because Thai production companies are running out of popular y-novels to adapt. So I'm anticipating we'll continue to get more genre content going forward, and maybe a higher percentage of original works too.

Shows I'm Enjoying Right Now

Right now, the Thai shows airing that I'm watching are:

Cooking Crush

Dead Friend Forever

Cherry Magic Thailand

City of Stars

The Sign

Playboyy

PitBabe

7 Days before Valentine

For Him

Of those, I'd currently most recommend Cooking Crush as a generic BL recommendation. Dead Friend Forever is very good, but is not a romance and is difficult for some to watch (there are a lot of dark themes in addition to the gore and scary bits).

Cooking Crush is doing so many things I love. I've written about the way it's set up its major conflict to be amongst the friend group here, and way the show is depicting communication between the two main characters and how they improve their communication with one another as they get closer here. Two of my biggest BL pet peeves are a conflict for the sake of a dramatic penultimate episode that ignores or retcons a character's growth or the building of trust that a couple has already gone through in the series, so the fact that this show is working so hard to establish strong communication between its leads and then setting up the significant drama to actually about friendship rather than romance is something I cannot overstate my excitement about. To tie this back into what I wrote above, this reminds me of Diary of Tootsies and I mean that in the best possible way.

Dead Friend Foreever is, like I mentioned above, not a romance; it's a slasher horror melodrama with a very well established mystery, an ensemble cast of mostly hateable characters (which I admit isn't usually my thing, but since they're likely all going to die as a result of the genre they're in I'm finding that more tolerable than usual, and there is at least one character I like). DFF did a great job of structuring the story for the ultimate payoff of information reveals. There are a lot of shows that have been messing with non-linear storytelling recently, Cooking Crush being one of the ones that actually does this poorly in my opinion, but Dead Friend Forever effectively uses non-linear storytelling so that we find out important pieces of information about particular characters at a time when that information will have the most emotional impact on what is happening in the "present" of the storyline. Every time there is a reveal, it informs what we've already seen, recontextualizes it, and means we understand some of the character motivations and actions differently from when we saw them the first time. I mentioned above that there are dark themes in this show; one of the things that I really like about this show is that the impact of class is not glossed over, and that the consequences of these events feel very real for the characters; people do terrible things in this show, but these actions are not treated lightly by the show itself.

You'd think these two shows would have nothing in common, but there are things that they share that put them both in my top category. Generally, in both of these shows, the character arcs are clear and logical; when a character does something, even if I don't like the action itself, I can understand exactly why they that and can see how it matches where they are in their arc at the time. The shows show change in characters as a result of what they experience, and the relationships in this show really matter. When characters start acting in ways that feel out of character or against their own arc because they have to in order to drive the plot forward, I struggle to remain invested; that's not happening with either of these shows. Both of these shows also treat serious topics with seriousness, and consequences for actions are real and felt by the characters in the show (and if someone gets away with something, the show is clear that this is not just). Nothing has happened that hasn't been signalled or implied earlier. Both shows also have clear class consciousness and represent the disparity caused by classism in a critical/harsh light.

Whew! I think I got to everything you asked. Thanks again for the extremely interesting question!

#ask game #bl meta #long post #typed so that I can stop thinking it #fandom meta #multi bl #thank you for the ask!

140 notes · View notes

42starsintheuniverse · 1 month

Text

Sokka & Zuko- The Invisible Winner of the Kataang/Zutara Debate.

Please don't take this as "Shipping War Bait", I'm doing a character analysis of ATLA about my opinion on which close Zuko relationship makes the most sense!

I feel like fandom treated Zuko/ Sokka as a crack ship but like?? That's never made sense to me.

Firstly I personally think that Aang will always remember how the fire nation destroyed his people. No matter how much he consciously says he forgives Zuko (& the fire nation) I would BET that unconsciously there's still something deeply hurt in Aang that can never truly be healed about that. As a result, Aang would not be able to LOVE Zuko as close as his other relationships. It's one of those hard to swallow pills but it's just how I interpret the characters. Aang's body has that bias, the deepest parts of his mind won't ever forget the horrific fact that his people are dead because of Ozai, and Zuko is Ozai's firstborn.

I know Aang's whole thing is that he preaches forgiveness, but here's the thing... We aren't always aware of how deeply our trauma affects us. Sometimes you don't hold a conscious bias against people... You hold an Unconscious bias. And to me, Aang holding an unconscious bias against Zuko, and not being as close to him, makes sense.

Toph could honestly work with Zuko, I think she's also a good contender for closest relationship. Though I see it in either a platonic or romantic sense (depends on the vibe). I think there could be a bit of 'fandom implicit bias' there in having Zuko and Toph constantly presented as platonic only. Like, Toph is disabled, she's blind... Do we ever question that maybe we don't like putting her with people romantically because she's disabled? Is Katara the one people ship Zuko with romantically- because Katara is more traditionally attractive? Toph is short, stocky, has short hair, is brash, and blind... Like, there's a chance she doesn't get the same treatment as Katara because she's not traditionally attractive in the way Katara is.... Something to think about.

-All that being said, I like Toph and Zuko as having a close bond either romantically or platonically. I think it's funny that they're both born rich kids, I think it's funny that they only have one fully functioning eye between them (and the comedy and hijinks that leads to). And they do work really well together throughout the show, Toph forgives Zuko when he accidentally burns her feet. And Zuko clearly appreciates how chill Toph is- she doesn't have PERSONAL bias towards Zuko as the son of the Fire Lord, in the way that the other three do.

Moving on to Katara, I have a similar sort of feeling there. It's made obvious that Katara SAW her mother die at the hands of the fire nation. It was traumatic, it was horrific, and because she was a child watching it- that is likely a DEEP core memory. In the context of the show, Zuko helps Katara find the man who killed her mother, because it's sort of a levelling of the scales. It doesn't even make Katara LIKE Zuko, it makes her neutral towards him. He helped her to basically right a wrong (that's her perspective). So yeah- for the same reasons, I've just never been convinced that Zuko and Katara could have a strong and intimate relationship because of the deepness of Katara's trauma. It takes a significant amount of time in terms of the show for her to even start talking and trusting Zuko at all. Doesn't FEEL like good romantic potential to me.

But Sokka, Sokka is the best fit of them so far. The thing is, Zuko and Sokka have a lot of different experiences- but shared values. Consider the things they've had to deal with, Sokka had to handle a huge level of grief & pressure as he quickly became responsible for his family and community at a noticeably young age. Then consider how that parallels (it is not THE SAME, but there is a PARALLEL) to Zuko's abuse & exile. They're both young men, they're both conditioned to think they should be a certain way (Sokka a warrior, Zuko a tyrant). Sokka is creative & inventive, which mirrors how Zuko has to create a new emotional source for his fire bending- once again, these are parallel elements of their characters, and demonstrate how they could relate to each other.

Sokka as a character is also slightly more separated from the association between the fire nation and the death of his mother- compared to Katara. Once again, she saw it happen right in front of her as a small child, Sokka was slightly older when the event happened, and didn't see it first hand.

There are some more generic elements of their characters that might suggest gay subtext; such as Sokka's hypermasculinity being a masking behaviour so no-one would think he's attracted to men. (Most people understand why that is; but if you don't know- leaning into very masculine things as a man, can make it feel like people won't question your assumed "straightness").

But I think what I've touched on is more relevant because it's very much tied to THESE specific characters, and how they interact, and how they could relate to each other.

TLDR; Zuko and Sokka work as a ship cos they have less things stopping them (barriers to intimacy & trauma to heal from). And they have probably the highest relatability to each other's lives, allowing them to trust each other and open up, compared to the other characters.

#ATLA #zukka #atla zukka #sokka x zuko #writing analysis #character analysis #character study #shipping #ship discussion #Please don't start huge fights about this #It's not supposed to be an attack #It's supposed to be a deconstruction of the relationships #I just hope people understand that

92 notes · View notes

nyerus · 8 months

Note

Hi! I would love to hear your thoughts about classism in TGCF, but specifically regarding XL. It surprised me to see people hating on XL for not knowing or doing better during his teenage years of luxury as the crown prince and making XL a complete villain because he didn't take down classism and restructure society despite still being a kid himself. It struck me as odd that the fandom is well aware of his 800 years in poverty but also not really addressing the fact that XL, too, is a victim of classism albeit a little different from someone like MQ.

Hi there! So sorry it's taken me this long to get to this ask, I've just been in sort of a funk for a few days haha.

But yeah, this is definitely a topic that comes up from time to time, with lots of discussion about. It surprises me that despite that, there are still people (maybe just newer fans? idk) who still hate on Xie Lian for his naive views as a 17yo. Especially since, despite being a naive 17yo, he still really wanted to help people less fortunate than himself. He didn't quite understand how to do this in the most effective ways (because he was a teenager), so it came off as somewhat patronizing as he was a person in a position of power compared to everyone else. Yet his desire to help people was genuine, and he didn't personally think of "common folk" as being any lesser than "royalty" -- even though in this case, there kind of literally was a difference. (E.g. when Lang Ying goes from being a commoner to a king, he gets a "kingly aura" that protects him!) So it's honestly kind of incredible that Xie Lian is willing to say things like "I think people are equal, even gods and humans, and if the Heavens disagree with me, then it's the Heavens that are wrong" with his entire heart.

I imagine a large part of the hate Xie Lian gets from certain fans is jealousy or resentment, due to the fact that Xie Lian was "born privileged." But on it's own, "privilege" is not "the great enemy" -- it's what said privilege means in the context of society, and what someone does/doesn't do with it that merits judgement. Xie Lian doesn't fully understand the privilege he had until he loses it (again: because he was 17!), but he still understood it enough to use it to protect and help people. That's more than many other characters can say. Him starting out as a prince doesn't automatically disqualify him from class struggles or the horrors of poverty. It's nonsensical to think so, when this is a character who literally spent almost 800 years busking for scraps, while sleeping in dirt outside and eating garbage….

On the flip side, as you mentioned Mu Qing -- yes, he was a victim of classism. But he's a very strange figure to use as the poster boy for that, though he often is by people who are critical of Xie Lian. This may be a controversial take, despite it being something I think that makes the character of Mu Qing really interesting: but he's a very "typical" guy within the concept of classism. He's someone who started off with a bad lot, but then ended up ascending to the highest point you pretty much can in that world/society. Which is great! He did that through hard work, and it paid off! But now, since he got his "happy ending," that's kind of it for him. He doesn't do anything to materially improve the lives of those less fortunate, especially those he has no personal connection with. This doesn't make him a bad person -- it's not really his job to that, even as a god. He's a martial god, so he's there to subdue threats and all that. Yet you can clearly see, that's exactly the type of person society values because such "rags to riches" stories give legitimacy to the whole system, and because they don't rock the boat once they're on top.

So then it's odd to be angry at Xie Lian but not Mu Qing (or others) for the lack of some "grand revolution" that some readers seem to want.

Ironically, Xie Lian used what power he had to try and help people -- and he was worse off for it. If he had done nothing, he would have been able to live a happy and carefree life. He would have lived and died as a rich prince/king with no troubles. Like, that's the point! The societies we live in punish those who want to broadly help others or make meaningful change, while rewarding those who quietly play the game for themselves -- because it helps keep the wheels turning. It doesn't matter at "what end" of the spectrum you start out on, the rules apply the same way. If you go against the establishment, there's a price to be paid.

Throughout Xie Lian's long journey, he learns this lesson the hard way. And the fact that in order to change it, he would somehow have to change the hearts and minds of pretty much everyone -- which is an impossible ask. How is he even supposed to that, or restructure society as a whole, without vast amounts of collateral damage? In the end, Xie Lian discovers that he was not wrong in his desire to help people, even if he cannot help everyone. He can still help people he meets in whatever ways he can, and that is still important. To show kindness, mercy, and empathy towards your fellow man is worth it. Helping your neighbors or complete strangers you meet once and then never again -- all that is still worth it.

I wish I had the time to sit down and really talk about this in a more organized way, but these disjointed thoughts are all I can manage at the moment! I hope it was still valuable to you in some way, and thank you for sending in the ask!

(Also, I recently reblogged a post that talked about something similar if you wanna check it out, Anon. It's right under the manhua highlights I think!)

#Anonymous #asks #tgcf #im seeing a LOT of chatter on this topic lately so it makes me wonder if there was some discourse i missed due to being under a rock lol #nyerus.txt

214 notes · View notes

andreal831 · 3 months

Text

Esther "Mikaelson" and Misogyny

The misogyny in TVDU, in both the writing and the fandom, is exhausting. It comes out so much, especially when it comes to complex women versus complex men. Esther (yes, I know her last name is not Mikaelson), is not one of my favorite characters, she's not even a character I particularly like. But to act like she is an absolute villain with no redeeming qualities is a best misogynist, and at worst blaming a victim of abuse.

Most of the hate for Esther tends to come from certain character stans because they don't like how Esther treated their favorite character or want to shift the responsibility of their favs to Esther so that they don't have to deal with a complex, morally grey character.

Esther is a survivor many times over and we cannot talk about her without first acknowledging that. When she was just a teenager/young adult, her entire family was slaughtered and she and her sister were kidnapped. I know there is a lot of debate in the psychology community regarding Stockholm syndrome, but her falling for Mikael screams a manipulated, traumatized, naïve, young woman.

Esther and Mikael

Whether it was Mikael's intent initially or not, he took advantage of the mental place she was at when they met. People recently have wanted to argue whether or not Esther was abused, but this is not a debate. First, there are many different types of abuse, mental, physical, emotional, financial, etc.

During this time period, while Norse communities tended to give woman more power, Esther was from "outside" their community. Her rank in the community would come directly from her marriage. I personally don't know if she went into her relationship with Mikael in order to gain security or if she was just truly that naïve and wanted love and a family. There is nothing wrong with either. It reminds me of why Hayley decided to try and actually have a relationship with Jackson. Woman have historically had to make hard decisions in order to gain protection. And even if she just wanted to get married and have kids, that is fine. Esther reminds me of Meg March. Her dreams may have been different than Dahlia but that doesn't make them less important.

We see very little of their human lives and it is told from everyone else's perspective except for Esther. We also know that everyone's stories are not accurate. Klaus lied about Esther's death for a thousand years. He also has a tendency from not seeing things through other perspectives. Klaus, and even Elijah, when they talk about their human lives, focus on Mikael's abuse on Klaus because the show centers around Klaus and doing everything they can do to redeem him. There is no benefit to making Esther look complex or going into how living with Mikael impacted her. But it is naïve to say she didn't suffer abuse. She lived in a household with a violent, angry man. Even if he didn't physically hit her, which we honestly don't know but I would find that extremely hard to believe, it is clear he verbally, emotionally, and financially abused her.

People love to say she is a powerful witch and could have stopped him or left, but this is shifting the blame from the abuser to the victim. First, abuse isn't about who is stronger. This logic is completely dismissing so much abuse that happens, especially women abusing men. Yes, Esther is a powerful witch, but if she had no other options outside of Mikael, being powerful doesn't matter. We know she would put Mikael to sleep for long periods to protect her and her children. We don't know if she did anything else, but we have at least one example of her using her magic to intervene. We also know she stopped practicing for a long time because of her fear of dark magic and how the community treated Dahlia.

We also have to acknowledge that Esther had very few choices. Sure, she could kill Mikael but she would have gotten sentenced to death for that. Again, her position in the community came from her connection to Mikael, otherwise she was just another enslaved person from a village they raided. We know how Dahlia was treated. Maybe she could have run off with Ansel and they would have protected her from Mikael, or if he was dead, the villagers, but this is putting her, her children, and the pack in a dangerous situation. Potentially starting a war between the pack and the village for aiding and abetting a kin-slayer. She would also be acknowledging her affair and adultery by woman was met by serious punishments, usually death. After committing matricide, she also wouldn't have claims to Mikael's money or land as an outsider. Maybe in the "new world," but she would have to hide her involvement in his death. Esther would have no money or land of her own as her familial land and money would have been claimed when it was raided.

While women in Norse communities did experience more freedom than other areas of the world at that time, they were still far from free. This is especially true considering how Esther came to this community. While she wasn't enslaved in a way Dahlia was, it is wrong to say she wasn't still enslaved. Her entire village was killed and her and her sister were forced to come to their village and live amongst them as hostages. Esther was kept as a way to keep Dahlia in line. She was not welcomed into the community. This was a common practice during these raids.

The reason I get so angry when people attack Esther as if she wasn't a victim is because real-life victims hear this everyday. Esther's situation perfectly exemplifies the "non-perfect" victim and the fandom perfectly exemplifies how many of these victims are treated.

Esther and Dahlia

Dahlia gets way more slack than Esther because she is a "more perfect victim." But again, we are getting the story from everyone's perspective but Esther. Yes, what Dahlia went through was horrible, but what she put her sister through was also horrible. Those two things are not mutually exclusive.

Dahlia had no right to expect Esther to give up her dreams for her, even though she did sacrifice a lot for Esther. She made that decision and took it on. Yes, it was noble, but again, she cannot expect anything for a choice she made. It is just like Klaus expecting his siblings to never leave him and punishing them when they do. Siblings do not owe each other their lives. I would also not blame Dahlia for leaving Esther behind to protect herself.

On top of that, when Esther went to Dahlia and asked for help, she took advantage of the situation and stole her child. I don't care what Esther promised or how much she understood of the situation, clearly at the moment Dahlia came for Freya, Esther did not want to give her up. If we look at it in a modern perspective, a mother who puts her child up for adoption has the right to change their mind because, morally, we understand it is impossible to understand how you will feel until that moment. If a person than steals the child after the mom changes their mind, that's kidnapping. If we look at it from a historical perspective, Norse communities were patriarchal and the children belonged to Mikael. Meaning Esther did not have the ability to "sell" her children.

Dahlia is given a lot of sympathy in the fandom because they relate her story to Klaus, who they spend a lot of time victimizing. So it makes an easy leap to paint Dahlia as the victim and Esther as the "evil" one. But again, we never see how Esther reacted to her sister casting her aside because she wanted love and a family. or how Mikael treated her throughout their relationship. Even if Dahlia ended up being right about Mikael, whether he was always evil or turned evil losing Freya, Dahlia doesn't get to make that decision for Esther. It is hard to watch someone you love get into an abusive relationship, but you can't tell someone what to do with their life. All you can do is try and be there for them when they need help.

Esther and Klaus

Another reason people hate on Esther is because of her relationship with Klaus. I personally think Esther loved Klaus the most because of who his father was. She babies him in a way she never did with the other's. We even see Finn resenting her treatment of Klaus because of it.

Yes, she does give him the necklace which ends up making Mikael target him to "make him strong." But, one, let's blame the abuser and not shift blame to a fellow victim. And two, what would you have her do? Sure the answer is probably, don't have an affair, but then your fav character wouldn't be there. Also, again, she was young and naïve. She also gets more blame for having an affair than Mikael does for beating a child. She made a mistake and did everything she could to protect Klaus from that mistake. Was it misguided, maybe, but her intention was good. She wanted to protect Klaus from Mikael finding out.

The fact that Esther can forgive Klaus for brutally murdering her shows how much she loved him. Her wanting to kill her kids later is honestly understandable. She never knew the side affects of the spell she performed. She watched her children become the worst versions of themselves for a thousand years and felt the guilt for every life they took. She also knew peace existed since she had been on the other side. When she first tried to take their lives, they would have all just gone to the other side. She didn't want them to suffer but wanted the pain they inflicted on the world to end.

The Misogyny of it all

The reason I say it is misogyny, is because every favorite character in this show has done absolutely terrible things. Klaus, and all of the Mikaelsons, are serial killers. It doesn't matter what reasons they had for doing it. Esther had her own reasons for her actions. The fact that people can't acknowledge Esther as a complex character but can do so for Klaus, Damon, Elijah, Stefan, etc. shows that it is based on misogyny. Even the fact that Dahlia, someone who kidnapped and abused a child, gets more love than Esther because Esther isn't a "perfect victim" shows it is rooted in misogyny. Men are allowed to be messy and complex but when it's a woman they are either a victim or pure evil.

I'm not saying there aren't things you can't hate her for. I hated her treatment of Elijah in Season 2 of TO and her plan to harm Hope. But to ignore the complexity of the character and pretend she wasn't a victim is just harmful rhetoric. Women are allowed to be complex and morally grey.

#esther mikaelson #this fandom cant handle complex women #I may not agree with everything she did but ill always defend victims #no one is all good or all bad #stop blaming women for everything #tvdu #the originals #the vampire diaries #tvd #the mikaelsons #klaus mikaelson #tvdu metas #metas #dahlia

75 notes · View notes