WAVERLY: “We’re really worried about you. You’re hunting all the time. You’re not really sleeping.”
WYNONNA: “I’m totally sleeping.”
NICOLE: “No, you’re passing out. That’s not the same thing.”
WAVERLY: “You’re isolating yourself.”
WYNONNA: “No. I’m hunting alone. So until a new Chosen One rolls into town,
*directed at Rachel who’s watching from the stairs*
who’s old enough to drink…”
WAVERLY: “Wynonna! You’re… so… you seem so-“
WYNONNA: “Dedicated to keeping my friends and family safe?”
WAVERLY: “Really sad. And lonely.”
WYNONNA: “Well, we don’t all have the luxury of happily ever after.”
WAVERLY: “Doc loves you.”
WYNONNA: “Shut up.”
*moves to grab Peacemaker but Waverly covers her hands over it*
WAVERLY: “And so do we.”
WYNONNA: “Just keep the stupid gun.”
*walks off out of the house and Waverly runs after her*
NICOLE:
*tries to get her attention*
“Hey, babe.”
WAVERLY:
*outside the house*
“Wynonna, stop! Please!”
WYNONNA: “You want me to admit I have a problem?! Okay, well, here’s my problem, it’s a big one. Uh, if I stop killing demons, everyone I love, like you, gets eaten.”
WAVERLY: “Or maybe that’s what you’ve been telling yourself, Wynonna. Because you like it! A little too much.”
WYNONNA: “I don’t hear anyone else complaining about being too not dead because I’ve taken out too many demons.”
WAVERLY: “What about Holt? He was human.”
WYNONNA: “Why is it that when you kill a Clanton, it’s the right thing to do, but when I do it, it’s a problem?”
WAVERLY: “You know, I really thought we’d have a couple more years before your transition from fun drunk to mean alcoholic.”
WYNONNA: “Have fun planning your wedding, you sanctimonious asshole.”
WAVERLY:
*walks back into the house crying and into Nicole’s arms*
NICOLE: “Hey. Once she’s done being defensive, she’s gonna realize you’re right.”
WAVERLY: “Am I? I’m not judging her. I’m just trying not to lose her.”
NICOLE: “Hey.
*hugs her tight and kisses her head*
You want me to stay?”
WAVERLY: “No. You gotta go.”
Finally! We’re dealing with Wynonna’s inner conflict with believing that she needs to shut off the world and kill everything that threatens it. This episode must be her breaking point. This was what I was waiting for after the whole killing Holt situation and Doc left her.
Let’s see them try to make this one into a comedy. Something like this should only be dealt with in drama. I hope they handle this narrative seriously. It looks like they will from the intervention opening but you just never know. There may be some tonal shifts.
This is the narrative I wanted for Buffy Summers. They touched on it but they never went all out with it. They never made it clear how much of a demon she was becoming from having to constantly kill the demons. What that was doing to her mind, body and soul. How much of a price that she was paying to be The Hand.
I wanted a proper narrative undertaking for Buffy like Wynonna seems to be getting in this episode that showed that being a hero doesn’t always require being a killer. Whether it’s of the evil supernatural or not. And in the last season they should have done this since they made it canon that she was made from a demon and therefore her instincts were just the same. But they didn’t do that. They didn’t play morally grey. And it’s part of the reason why I just lost all interest.
See it’s been bubbling under the surface all throughout the show but Wynonna’s inner conflict was that she was afraid that she was a killer - a murderer for killing demons or human bad guys. In this season especially, she’s resigned herself to that objective because she doesn’t have a partner in crime with it anymore. There’s no Clyde to her Bonnie basically. And it’s tearing her apart that she cannot connect with someone that literally sold his soul to a demon because he is not okay with what she’s become from having such a defensive attitude towards the problem.
And everybody’s worried about her because she doesn’t communicate how she’s really feeling. What she’s really struggling with inside that’s eating her up. And something like that is one hell of a narrative to not only explore thoroughly, but also conclude and close.
And I am SO HERE FOR IT! I’m more here for this narrative than WayHaught’s because I already know I’m going to get that anyway. More focus on the lead main character at this point in the show is imperative. And I know Season 4 has been more comedy than drama. But there’s always time to change that around. You know it’s not always an equal amount of either in genre shows. Sometimes it’s just on a spectrum depending on what story it is that they’re telling. Which means the vibe and tone always serves the narrative and characters. Not the other way around.
It’s the reason I cannot watch either pure drama or pure comedy. I have to have that balance when it comes to TV art/enterainment. The grey area. And genre shows - particularly supernatural/fantasy - always have that balance. Even if it’s not equal.
But yeah, Buffy would have certainly been a much more interesting character to me than she was if they had went all the way with the “am I a killer?” subject. Like I said - they touched on it. Quite a few times actually. But they don’t make it into a proper arc where she had a breakdown and her team have to come in to help to save her from destroying herself.
Being a hero is fucking hard. Especially when chosen. When you never wanted to be the world’s protector in the first place but you find it’s who you are anyway. You’re eventually going to face up to the price of it. The loss and the grief. But most of all the evolution. And an evolution includes all the highs and lows. The downfalls, the sacrifices, the depression, the loneliness. All of it. You can’t have a true character development without it all. And the thing is Buffy has all of that. Sometimes more than I bear to watch. But the one thing they skip out of truly exploring is - to me - the most important subject that there is to address.
Which is if you’re a fighter - if you have protect and defend through violence - does it make you a killer?
And if you’re a hero - are you okay with not being one and letting somebody else take the reins - including all the pitfalls and burdens you’ve had to bear and overcome. Can you allow yourself to give up heroism?
All of that needed to be addressed with Buffy in the final season. And the way they choose to do it. To wrap up the sap up - is the most insane, nonsensical, confusing, frustrating extremely lazy way ever by her entire team throwing her out of the fucking house and then letting her back in when they realize they’re wrong and they need her and some other character has to be the one to make them face their mistake.
Exploring the extremely strong and substantial subject I’m talking about here is what would have avoided all that ridiculous mess because the take-away from it would have been that there is a necessity to heroism but it comes at the price of being a killer or at least fearing that you are or will become a killer.
So I hope - I fucking hope - that they will do this with Wynonna. Have her face up to her actions and choices because her humanity will not let her just ignore them. Only a demon that feels absolutely nothing would. And that’s not Wynonna. She is such an emotional person when she lets herself be. When she doesn’t block it out. She’s like Faith. The need to shield vulnerability because she fears that letting love in will destroy her. When love and all that love entails is what she needs.
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What are your headcanons about Marcille's mom if you have any? It's interesting that what drew Donato to her was cause she lived the history he studied, or that was said somewhere at least. She must've had an interesting life.
so this was going to be just a normal answer but then I realized I have a Lot of Things To Say. so here goes, a compilation of what we know for a fact from the canon, what I've extrapolated from the visual cues and details, and my theories based on all of that.
Things we know for a fact about Marcille's mother because they were explicitly stated in the manga and supplemental materials:
She was a court mage for a Tall-man kingdom at the southern part of the Northern Continent
Donato, a court historian, fell in love with her because she had lived through the history he was studying, and he courted her for 17 years (age 15 to 32) before getting married
She was a cheerful person who rarely showed extreme emotion and took things as they came
She always cooked a huge meal for Marcille on her birthdays
She remarried a gnome after Donato's death and a short distance away from Marcille's childhood home
Pipi, Marcille's pet bird, was actually older than Marcille and originally belonged to her mother (bird died at 62)
She was extremely heartbroken when Donato died and ultimately ended up instilling a deep fear of mortality in Marcille with her words
the only time she showed extreme emotion in front of her family was when Donato could no longer eat his favourite dish near the end of his life.
She scolded Marcille for being cruel to ants (implying she can have a stern side when needed)
Things that are explicitly shown but mostly through visual cues
She has a very distinctive style of dress always involving a ribbon choker (mirroring Marcille's habit of always wearing a matching choker with any of her outfits that don't cover her neck)
She was almost stereotypically good at housekeeping and traditionally "wifely" things (very frequently depicted wearing an apron or doing some domestic chore when not at work, seems to have been an avid cook).
She knits? (also, note the affectionate smile as she's looking at Donato and Marcille reading a book together in the full panel)
She was as excited for Marcille's milestones as Donato was.
She didn't tell Marcille much about elven food
(there are a couple things that this panel in particular implies:
She lived a good deal of her life (if not being born and raised) in a mainly elven country in the West, implied by her knowing enough of an elven region's cuisine to prefer Tall-man food over it
seems to have a pretty carefree and casual demeanour overall, if this is how she replied to Marcille asking her about it (sounds like she never gave her culinary preferences that much thought to begin with)
slightly related to number 2, it seems like she and Marcille had a fairly casual parent-child dynamic (especially in comparison to the Toudens' memory of their father)
(local elf tastes Italian food once and never goes back))
However, she seems a lot more... serious in most of the other times we see her? Almost like the very stereotypical archetype of a graceful elf.
Subsequent conclusions about her personality:
Usually pretty carefree and cheerful at home, has been a loving and attentive parent throughout Marcille's childhood (while not being so doting that she didn't discipline Marcille).
Slightly more conjectural theories on her personality:
Had a much more graceful and professional personality at work, which would explain the more serious portraits we see of her.
Given that both she and Donato had positions at the royal court, it seems a little odd that she'd go out of her way to do all the housework herself, so maybe she just enjoyed doing it?
Now taping all the evidence together and toeing the line between analysis and fanfiction:
It's clear that she loved Donato very much and was utterly devastated by losing him. But there's one thing that really stuck out to me in what little we see of her:
Doesn't she seem... angry? The way she's gritting her teeth, clutching the tablecloth, and how this is the first and only time we see her eyes opened that wide. In the following panel, you see her being quiet and dejected after her initial outburst. She's still crying very intensely, but her brows are furrowed, and she's not really responding to Donato's affection in her body language.
We're not told the details of how she felt about losing Donato other than that it upset her. But this, to me, implies that she was angry and resented that he was aging, that the end of his life was approaching. An "it's not fair" type of preemptive grief. And if this was the first and last time she cried like this in front of her family, she was either very good at coping in private... or very bad at letting herself feel unpleasant emotions until they become unavoidable and end up overwhelming her.
It's not too remarkable a detail on the surface. It's even reminiscent of what the audience has seen of Marcille. But... when it comes to the big picture, you'd think an elf who voluntarily chose to marry a tall-man and have a half-elf child would have been better prepared for this.
It kind of recontextualizes her cheerfulness to me.
"I'm sure everything's gonna be okay!" (or some variation thereof, depending on what translation you have).
And this is stated to contrast her extreme grief when finally confronting Donato's failing body and eventual death. But I'm wondering if... maybe this optimism was why she was so upset. What if she went into all of it thinking "everything's gonna be okay"? What if she was a little young by elven standards, and just followed her heart thinking that her own resilience would get her through anything?
Of course, only to get completely overwhelmed when she actually loses Donato. She turns into a completely different person. And that's heartbreaking on its own-- but what the audience sees is the effect it had on Marcille. Can you imagine being her, watching your invincible and upbeat mother suddenly lose all the light in her eyes in one go?
I've already made a huge post about how I think Marcille models her "work persona" off her mother, but another thing that stuck with me as I was looking for more details in the manga was this:
copy pasting from the other post i made about it lmao it's like... the second she resigns herself to lifelong pain and terror, there's another portrait of her mother facing her like this. with their heads bowed, in mirrored body language of resignation and despair and sorrow. Except it's posed like Marcille is still looking at her mother but her mother is looking away.
It took me a second to realize, but I think that it's a visual metaphor for the fact that Marcille's mother was the only long-lived role model she had-- and she failed to model healthy grief for her daughter. I don't say this as an accusation or to disparage her as a character, but just as a matter of fact. In her, Marcille was seeing herself older and losing a short-lived spouse or loved one of her own, and all she saw was hopelessness.
But her mother didn't mean to instill hopelessness and terror in her. She wasn't really thinking of how it would truly affect Marcille at all (at least, that's how I'm interpreting her looking down and away from Marcille in the metaphor), she was just sad. And she, in her own way, was trying to protect her daughter and help her prepare for future losses.
What she meant was "loss is inevitable, and you have to learn how to be in pain but live on anyway." What Marcille heard was "loss is inevitable, and you will be scared and hurt for the rest of your life."
Again. Marcille's mother doesn't feature explicitly in the story the way her father does -- but in so many ways, her shadow, her silhouette, her reflection is always hanging over Marcille.
All that to say... headcanon-wise (everything from here on is 100% without evidence lmao), I'd like to think that she matured and realized that she failed Marcille. I imagine her being regretful about it, wanting a chance to fix it but never finding a way to insert herself back into Marcille's life when Marcille is so so so busy becoming the most accomplished mage possible. I imagine her being herself again, now, so many years after her loss and after remarrying -- but with her cheerfulness tempered with a lot more wisdom and the pain of having gone through loss like that. I think the second Marcille actually tells her what happened in the dungeon, she'd want to go running to her daughter again -- if Marcille tells her the full truth instead of just being embarrassed she let things get that far. (oh, the tragedy of her wanting to be more like her mother and an accomplished adult who doesn't need to be babied... being embarrassed to actually tell her mother how much she fucked up...)
There's also the tension of her having remarried -- I know that there's at least a little bit of resentment that Marcille harbours about that, because she's childish like that at heart even if she makes an effort not to externalize it. I think that her mother would be aware of that, potentially adding to her sense of guilt and apprehension at trying to reappear/intrude on Marcille's life. I honestly don't think Marcille has met her stepfather -- or even considers him a stepfather rather than "mama's new husband" and kind of a total stranger. I think she and her mother actively don't talk about it in their correspondence, like an elephant in the room.
but, ultimately, I think her mother is on her side no matter what. Ancient magic? Dark necromancy? Sure, she'll feel guilty and like she was partially responsible for setting Marcille down such a painful path, but she wouldn't care. that's her daughter!! she would've moved back west and been petitioning for her at the court, buying a house right next to the Canaries barracks and visiting her every day that she wasn't on a mission. And if her husband had opinions on Marcille becoming a "dark arts user," he either gets over it or it's divorce with him. Yes, she might have had her optimism completely humbled by losing Donato like that -- but she's still headstrong and self-assured and she doesn't care what people think of her. It's her way or the highway and she's always going to be in Marcille's corner.
(She also needs a name lol. I went with Juno, just to be cute about "Marcille"s closest real life equivalent being Marcella, which is the female version of Marcellus, which in turn is a diminutive of Marcus, which was derived from Mars. Absolutely in love with Marcille potentially being named after Ares/Mars the fucking god of war btw)
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please say more about jilypad + diverging parenting styles... perhaps even a possible scenario >:) i imagine harry has very cunning tactics for using this to his advantage
helloooooo <3 thank u for this ask bc i love talking about these three and harry. i went looking thru the archives to find this post; my first foray into this side, and really, i’ve never looked back after that.
so i’ve talked ab this a bit before but i fully think that james was a very overprotective ‘mother hen’ type parent. i tend to read his behaviour in lily’s bday letter to sirius as being scared of his child on a broomstick and i fully, fully think he’ll never be able to let go of that as harry grows up. he’ll be anxious and suspicious and paranoid, and his first instant will always be to wrap harry up in cotton wool and hide him away. (i low-key connect this to his childhood as well; going from being spoiled and sheltered to dropped in the middle of a war, black & white thinking, living in extremes etc etc makes it v hard for him to be Normal about his child. as he shouldn’t be, really, but yeah) that’s why he thrives during the initial years; he never minds the hard parts of being a new parent, loves it in fact, and it makes it better that he can keep harry close to him at all times w/o coming off as a helicopter parent (not that the notion bothers him ofc).
it’s good, then, that he has two partners to even the scales, no? i think lily was the most…balanced out of the three. she had a relatively normal childhood, grew up in a working class family/neighbourhood and had to deal w adversity from a young age so she’s developed a nice, thick skin. she also has a sibling with whom she has a v rocky relationship so she knows that kids are, ykno, a bit unhinged. and a little bit of hardship is not a problem. i hc her as needing time to get used to parenthood, unlike james who stepped into it natural as breathing, or even sirius who loved harry on much on first sight that it made up for everything else. ofc lily loved her son, but it didn’t come w the same blinding intensity of her partners and made her feel really shitty in the beginning. but, i think she’d shine during his teen years actually, because she’s not overbearing or intense and becomes the quiet, calm strength that a hormonal, spotty teen boy would probably need.
and sirius <3 our poor baby falls in love with harry, perhaps even more quickly than james, with such startling speed that it shakes his entire foundation. he doesn’t regret it but he’s constantly discombobulated. i also imagine that…it takes him longer to settle into the role of parent, esp bc he’s not biologically one ykno? not like it matters to anyone, ofc, but it takes him a long time to truly accept his authority and place, to believe that he has just as much right as j&l to be there, to parent harry. this has the consequence of him always being more indulgent than the other two; after all, he considered himself a godfather before a parent and a lot of that thinking stayed. he lets harry get away with stuff the others might not (and the little mf figures this out later); some of it also comes from sirius seeing so much shit, and facing so much shit himself, that he rationalises a lot of stuff as ‘well, this isn’t the worst it can be, so what’s the harm’ (because his life has been such a roller coaster that he’s forgotten that not everyone’s like that, if that makes sense?)
its obviously not this clear cut but i imagine harry looks at it like this: if he needs unconditional love, he goes to james; rationality and logic, lily; acceptance and calm, sirius. when someone has to be beat up for hurting harry, james steps in. if he needs help burying a body, it’s sirius. dealing with some asshole boss/teacher/classmate’s mother who’s making harry’s life hell? lily. i can keep going but,,,u get the idea, right? this makes sense, i hope lol
i actually think harry’s first birthday is a great example. sirius pushes the boundaries by gifting lil harry a broom; james loses his mind running after him; lily places an industrial sticking charm on harry’s butt, leans back with a glass of wine, and enjoys the show. even as he grows up, lily and james act as the disciplinarian, and sirius is the emotional outlet. all of them fill in each other’s cracks so well, and it’s only when harry grows up that he realises how effortlessly they worked off each other to parent him.
also oh man o man. harry being cunning is,,,,,see, i’ve not considered it this far but it makes perfect sense. i think canon harry actually had so much manipulative energy and it’s often overlooked for his goofier traits but! this is the same dude who used his dead parents to trick slughorn into revealing sensitive info! imagine if that could be channelled into his jilypad interactions 😈
it’s like, it takes him a bit, because his three parents r so smooth, but once he realises that all of them have certain weak spots, he does NOT hesitate to exploit them. (it has the unintended consequence of truly strengthening the jilypad relationship into an unbreakable one bc one thing their kid taught them is to have ironclad communication going at all times so nothing they’ve said, or not said, is used against them). so like, he knows if he wants to sneak out to a party, it has to be sirius and in a specific way—‘i’ll be totally safe, papa, plus i really wanna see what it’s like and idk when it’ll get a chance to again’. if he widens his eyes to pitiful levels, pouts a little, and blinks faster than usual, then james is putty in his arms as long as he’s separated from the other two. divide and conquer becomes the main tool in harry’s arsenal, actually. lily’s the toughest nut to crack, purely bc she doesn’t run on emotions or irreverence, but harry soon learns that if he comes up with a solid, logical case that proves his argument has unbiased merit then he has a good chance of getting her to say yes. (this is good, bc u can arrange words in the correct order, but u can’t always control emotions)
so overall yeah, you’d think one kid + 3 parents would be an easy bet, but harry keeps them on their toes all the fkn time.
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