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#never showing themselves ever

enluv · 11 months

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— just a thought.

the excessive amount of hate writers have been getting lately is actually terrible?? it blows my mind that people can be so bold and mean on anon but if that anon button was not available they’d NEVER think to send that hate. it’s actually crazy to think that people believe writers owe them anything, yes we’re thankful that you support and read our stories but we are also human, we have feelings and lives too!! please remember that and remember to be kind to your favorite writers (all writers at that) because they work hard to provide you with amazing stories and writings everyday!!

#this is a bit random but I’ve seen so much hate towards writers lately??#it’s so frustrating to see because no one ever deserves that #and they’re almost always on anon asks #never showing themselves ever #if you really have a problem with a writer maybe block them or just don’t engage with their writings?!#it’s very simple and easy #if you’re a writer on and have been getting hate please don’t for a second think any less of yourself!!#you’re amazing and the writing community loves you #chit chat with coco <3

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haunted-xander · 3 months

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Sometimes I think about Urianger's role in and feelings on the Thancred-Ryne dynamic and I think watching it kills him a bit inside. For several reasons.

Like, to begin with there's the guilt he's been carrying with him since he ushered Minfilia to the first, how he effectively killed the person Thancred cared about the most in the world and who's "death" ended up causing Ryne's entire Situation. He looks at what's happening between them and can only think "I caused this" even though that's not really true. No one person is responsible for this outcome, it's a culmination of several circumstances and the consequences of them. Logically, Urianger knows this. But it doesn't matter, because his guilt is overpowering his logic.

And also, like. What Thancred is doing here, the way he's knowingly letting Ryne be and stay hurt because he literally cannot bring himself to tell her his feelings, is the exact same mistake Urianger made with Moenbryda. Of course, the circumstances are vastly different, and the potential consequences to Thancred telling Ryne the wrong things or her misinterperating it is far greater (being a matter of literal life or death), it's still the same sort of paralysis they are trapped in.

And he knows it. He sees it. But he can't say or do anything about it, he doesn't have the right to. He acknowledges the mistake, but he hasn't really improved upon it yet. He still doesn't voice his thoughts and feelings as he should. He's also non-confrontational by nature, he doesn't argue or try to change peoples minds, he probably doesn't think he has any place to.

So, he tries to help in what little ways he can. Because he doesn't want it to become Monebryda again, he doesn't want to know he stole not one but two people from Thancred. So he does what he can. He tells Ryne little tidbits about Thancred, things that help her understand him but are safe to share. Nothing too deep, nothing too personal. Just small things, things that are purely factual, because he can't afford to give her a false image of who Thancred is. He teacher her fun and interesting things, because Thancred isn't in the mindset to provide her with non-essential skills.

I like to think Urianger has brought it up with Thancred at least once, during one of his stays. But nothing would've come of it. Not really. Unlike Y'shtola, Urianger isn't pushy, he'll bring it up once or twice and when he sees this won't go anywhere, he gives up. He wants to help, but he knows that persistance only does do much, and he is not the person who has the resiliance needed to push and push until Thancred finally budges (because he won't budge, it won't help anything but to sour things further by adding aditional stress to an already strained dynamic).

And like. Urianger gets it. He gets it because he's been the same way- not saying what he should to someone he loves more than anything else because she was meant to figure her life out herself, and 'steering' her in any direction by telling her his feelings (regardless of if the 'steering' is intention or not) will go against that. He gets it. He gets it and it's all the more painful for it. He knows it can't just be fixed by acknowledging it or with encouragement, something needs to happen to break the stasis.

I think this is probably why he stayed behind while they went off to Nabaath Areng. This is the very last chance they have to say what they want to, and he can't afford to be the anchor anymore. This is about them, not him, he can't let their resolution be buffed by his presence, so he stays behind. Which was probably for the best. Ryne got nervous when Urianger said he's staying behind, probably not too excited about being alone with Thancred (well, not alone, but WoL doesn't count) so soon after she had ran away crying. But she needs to be nervous. For anything positive to come out of this Thancred and Ryne both can't afford to be too relaxed. As sad as it is, the stress is necessary for anything to happen. He knows it. Does he like it? Absolutely not, but nor does he like his other plots. At least no one dies this time if it goes right.

#urianger had an integral part in the thancred-ryne situation and i think its very important to remember that #like i think he served as a very important buffer that prevented the dynamic from becoming even more strained than it already was #but also like. ryne NEEDED to have at least someone she can be comfortable around without the stress of her circumstances souring it #urianger is uniquely suited to play that role. even with his guilt regarding minfilia he never showed anything but genuine kindness for her #it helps that she didnt know about his hand in the situation existing to begin with (as shes surprised when he tells her in ahm areang)#THATS ALSO IMPORTANT BTW. like this man had a DIRECT hand in making this happen (even if it isnt fully his fault. minfilia made her choice)#AND LIKE. the parallels between uri-moen and thancred-ryne. they both love these girls so so much but cant bring themselves to say anything #urianger has been through the pain before. he knows. but he hasnt improved much himself. what right does he have to scold thancred?#silent support is all he can give. pushing thancred would make him a hypocrite and risk making it worse. hes not suited for confrontation #y'shtola and uriangers approaches to helping both have their merits but it needs a balance #too much pushing and the dynamic just gets worse but too forgiving and nothing will ever change #and yes i know im just repeating myself but ITS IMPORTANT OK #GOD #urianger augurelt #thancred waters #ryne waters #final fantasy #final fantasy 14 #final fantasy xiv #ff14 #ffxiv #xander rambles #xander being insane about ryne #urianger actually this time but. its related to ryne so. it gets the tag

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aletterinthenameofsanity · 3 months

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Me, to my new date: doctor who thinks it's a sci-fi story because the Doctor thinks it's a sci-fi story and because the companions think it's a sci-fi story, but it's really just a story about ghosts. a story about an ancient creature carrying the ghosts of everyone they have ever loved, meeting new people, and seeing them only as future ghosts. they are haunted by the future and the past and the present because they are the only constant in a world constantly in flux, and they are running as fast as they can to things before they burn and fade to dust but everything will always end, you understand, because this is the only thing the Doctor understands and yet they keep going. they love too much to stop. doctor who is not science-fiction, it's horror and optimism and spiritual more than anything else, it's religious unto itself, the TARDIS is a haunted house and a church and a graveyard and a hospital and the Doctor is the most haunted being in the universe but more than anything, this is a love story, because how can you love something without being haunted by it- hey, what are you doing?

My date, shoving breadsticks in their purse: I have to go-

#more unhinged doctor who meta #doctor who #meta #*into a bullhorn* IT'S A GHOST STORY #ninth doctor #tenth doctor #eleventh doctor #doctor who meta #twelfth doctor #thirteenth doctor #it's abt the time war & dalek & the parting of the ways & doomsday & the last of the time lords & journey's end & angels take manhattan #it's about hell bent and death in heaven and the doctor falls and it takes you away and the woman who fell to earth #it's about the montage of all of the people the doctor has let down #it's about astrid peth and amy pond and rory williams and rose tyler and bill potts and clara oswald and grace o'brien #it's about gaps in memory and memories that live too long to ever heal #the doctor is a haunted house #it's a show about cycles by its very structure #the moment that regeneration became a mechanic for the writers to use and companions began to move out the doctor was DOOMED #but what makes them fascinating is that they see themselves as doomed and blessed at the same time #because they will never ever stop running #clara oswald #amy pond #rose tyler #bill potts #the ghosts are INEVITABLE

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bylertruther-moved · 2 years

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is it just me or does anyone else think it would be more interesting if instead of following the same old tired and sad trope of “small town gay youth falls in love with his seemingly straight best friend during the eighties and ends up dejected and all alone” they flipped the script and gave them a win?

wouldn’t it be more interesting to take the audience’s tired expectations and flip them on their head?

wouldn’t it be more interesting to follow up on the fact that the only person that loves this “straight best friend” the way he needs and wants to be loved is indeed his gay best friend that’s conveniently been in love with him since the very beginning?

wouldn’t it be more interesting to show that the special relationship this “straight best friend” has with his gay best friend was special not only because they were besties but because his feelings were there, too, he just didn’t realize their nature?

wouldn’t it be more interesting to show that there’s a reason why the “straight best friend” effortlessly and naturally treats his best friend the exact way that his girlfriend begs him to treat her?

wouldn’t it be more interesting to finally face and name the reason why this “straight best friend” can maintain his friendships with everyone else while in a relationship except for his gay best friend who has had parallels with his girlfriend from the very beginning?

wouldn’t that be more interesting than ignoring all of the previous seasons and making milkyway, the one dysfunctional and dishonest ship on the show, endgame?

wouldn’t it be more in line with the stranger things shtick to continue to subvert these tropes as they’ve done from the very beginning?

why do people want this to be the one time that they actually fail to do that? like, i know why, but i want to hear them say it.

#byler #like obviously i know my byler brigade agrees. but it's like. the unrequited route would be so boring and expected and sad.#both in the vein of will not ever being allowed to win or be happy AND in the vein of that being hailed as #Super Realistic despite this being a sci-fi show about otherworldly monsters and children with powers.#so it's okay to have powered children and monsters in your show #but when it comes to fantasy you draw the line at gay people being loved and happy? 🤨#IF they give a shit about a coherent story then they would follow up on it. there has to be a reason why they present all these problems for #milkvan and then in the next scene they show you that mike is perfectly capable of doing what eleven needs him to do he just would rather do #that with will than with her. there has to be a reason why byler don't and have never had the issues that milkvan does.#there has to be a reason why milkvan have been on different pages and lying to each other and so insecure abt themselves with relation #to the other while byler are literally confirming on screen that they feel like equals and are a team and honest to e #ach other always [disregarding the car confession which is... a truth/lie]#like. unless they're baiting or being awful they have to be pointing to one thing here...

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quietwingsinthesky · 1 year

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Irks me a little bit whenever Dean torturing in Hell is positioned as his own fault, or even really his choice to do. We get given the solid number, 30 years of torture for him and 10 inflicting it on other people (which was also more torture for him because it’s Hell, the torture evolves, it doesn’t stop), and we get told that wasn’t long enough. That John held out longer. That angels were going to pull Dean out of Hell and if he’d just held on a few years more, the seal wouldn’t have been broken.

But that isn’t true, right? We know Heaven wanted the seal broken, ergo Dean wasn’t getting saved until it was. Until it, and he, we’re thoroughly broken and usable by Heaven to achieve their own ends (ie to make him into a good (obedient) Michael sword.) So, it wouldn’t have mattered how long he held out in Apocalyptic terms because the game (that he didn’t know he was playing) was rigged against him.

But more importantly for Dean, the amount of time he managed not to break literally does not matter. Because it was never going to be long enough. Thirty years, forty, a hundred, a thousand, it does not matter how long he held out because the breaking itself is the unforgivable part to him and the breaking was always inevitable.

Anyway. There’s my Dean meta for the year. Eat up, I guess.

#despite this being brought out by that prev post I’m not like. actually annoyed or anything.#we’re all free to interpret the show however. I just think this way brings out the tragedy of it best is all.#you know it’s like. did Dean & Sam technically both have choices in s4? did they technically make the wrong ones? yes.#but at the same time. there was never a choice. there was never an option to avoid the apocalypse. especially with how little they knew #of what was actually going on over their heads. like. it really is insane to go rewatch s4 and realize how much they don’t understand about #what’s happening around and to them. and that’s the part I like best! it was unavoidable! they will still blame themselves forever!#what’s the thing called where you like both brothers. bibro? that’s me.#samgirl with bibro tendencies.#if you ever see me speak negatively about dean know that it’s because I love those things about him actually.#I like when he’s possessive and self-destructive and terrible. I just think. in this particular instance. this was not him embodying #a character flaw. so much as it was him being forced into his role in the story in a very like. visceral literal sense.#I could go into the Michael-Dean ‘what does it mean that of the two vessels it’s not Lucifer’s sent to hell but Michael’s’ thing but #maybe save that for another day. I have thoughts I’m just tired.#spn #dean winchester

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chirpsythismorning · 1 year

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Hi.what make you believe byler is endgame and how do you think The Duffer will make them endgame?

There's a lot of different factors for why I believe byler is endgame. If it was only one or two or three or a single digit amount of things, then I'd probably be more skeptical. Instead it's so many things that I don't think I can even quantify with any number?

Long post ahead so queue for later if you must!

I used to ship milkvan back in the day, and that's probably because I watched the show once and fell for the whole boy meets girl trope as peak romance, without even thinking about it? Like my first time rewatching the show pre-s3, I remember only focusing on their scenes and even going as far as to skip entire episodes in s2 without them in it, so it's really no wonder I missed details that might have helped me understand the full picture.

I also don't get queer-baited, like ever. I have watched shows like Teen Wolf where fans loved sterek, and even though that show had a gay show-runner, it was obvious to me they were never going that route, despite kind of feeding fans over the years with banter between them. The problem was the details weren't pointing to them being endgame, they were pointing to stydia. With stydia, they were using color coding in their costumes and had the fucking red string of fate in the frame with them multiple times and they were having entire plot lines built up around sort of their feelings for each other. Then there's all the other shows out there like Supernatural and Sherlock, and to me, it just felt like two guys that had chemistry that fans read as romantic and were having fun with it, only for the writers to try to profit off of that hope fans had, just sort of fucking with fans for years without really going for it literally in the text of the story.

And even if they did (albeit extremely subtly) that's when you would see shows tend to kill off the characters. Because after years of queer-baiting, the only solution is to kill at least one off, after tricking a sector of your audience for so long. Because unfortunately, no, they're not going to end up together, so we just have to get rid of one of them to make it clear that it won't happen.

While I don't vividly remember the moment I dropped Milkvan and picked up byler, I do remember watching s3 for the first time and feeling like something was off. And then to humor my confusion, I went online and came across an analysis for the end of s3. Even though it did really made me think like 'woah.. what was that?', in the moment, I was still in a position to not want to fall for it because of all the queer-baiting out there. I'd never fallen for it before and I wasn't going to start now basically.

And then I didn't read any more theories after that, I just basically jumped into rewatching the show for fun again, without really thinking about it even, and without skipping this time. And I vividly remember the shed scene definitely had some romantic undertones going on. When the camera was focused on Mike talking to Will, we didn't get any reaction shots in between of Joyce and Jonathan. Whereas when Joyce and Jonathan talked to Will, we got Mike's reaction and both Jonathan and Joyce's kind of reactions to each others speeches in that moment, which was to obviously convey the familial bond going on. And so in contrast, seeing Mike's monologue to Will be isolated, without any cuts to the others reactions during, with intense close-ups of Mike and Will, with Mike literally having one by one teardrops falling down his face and him repeating softly you said yes, you said yes... That... Like it made me really start to consider it in that moment, based on my new potential understanding of the end of s3 and based on what I had found upon rewatching that time.

Even still though, I didn't let myself believe it. And maybe in large part it was bc I did like the idea of byler I guess? And so that made me want to be more cautious? Other times when I came across fans shipping queer pairings that weren't canon, it felt like harmless shipping to me, where like I got the appeal, but didn't like feel genuine intentional slow-burn chemistry? It was always a thing that at most I liked merely as fanon. And so I guess I was trying to prepare myself for that inevitable disappointment that it wasn't going to go any further than what it had?

Maybe it was also because I was holding onto this idea of milkvan I had at the beginning? An idea that in large part contributed to my ability to get hooked with the show in the first place? Boy meets girl is like the most universal trope in our society and it was easy to just go along with it when everyone else was.

But more than anything I do think it was because I thought it just had to be queer-bait like it's always has been. At best I thought maybe it would continue very vaguely in the subtext in s4, with like 1 or two scenes at most hinting at attraction? But we all know that's not what happened..

S4 promo dropped, and I remember being like well here goes. It had been over a year, almost two since I'd been exposed to the possiblity of byler, though I was going into it prepared to see Mike and El being perfectly in love and that they were just going to act like nothing had ever happened between Mike and Will.

But then that Cali poster dropped. And that had me reeling. I remember sending a text to my sister like 'QUEER-BAIT?' and she was like yep queer-bait. But that's also because she's in the mindset of someone that hasn't seen anything outside of watching the show, and while half paying attention at that. This is the first piece of evidence she is being presented with and so of course she is viewing it from a don't hope or assume that could ever happen bc it never happens lens.

Even that I took as maybe a reality check, that this meant nothing, but also at the same time, this is the Duffer Brothers? They're smart? Why would they apply the if boy is pointing his feet at you he is in love with you rule via New Girl, with Mike and Will in the Cali poster, for shits and giggles? When the whole point in those posters is to hide foreshadowing?

Regardless of how much it genuinely shocked me they were appearing to really play with this concept of Mike having romantic feelings for Will, I still didn't fully let myself think about it too much...

And then as s4 got closer and more stuff dropped and there was like a lot of promo hinting Will having feelings for Mike, that's when it really kicked in for me. And that's when I went back and rewatched and holy shit it suddenly became clear as fucking day. My excitement for Vol. 1 was insurmountable because I was just about to have all of these recent built up theories confirmed or denied.

When Vol. 1 finally premiered and it turned out Mike couldn't say I love you to El? And Will very clearly had feelings for Mike, staring at him constantly when he wasn't looking and conveniently with Mike's POV missing by comparison? There was just too much at play that perfectly set-up byler.

Mike having a hard time telling El he loves her, while also having a best friend beside him who is in love with him, like, that's sort of what makes it clear that this is them trying to create a conflict that easily transitions into this revelation that the reason why Mike couldn't commit to El was because he was struggling over repressed feelings for his best friend.

And then that doesn't even include all the details along the way that support it. Like closet scenes for example weren't able to be harmless anymore post-s3, they just weren't. That scene at the end with El and Mike in Will's room established this idea that Mike is in the closet, and s4 did not let up on that idea whatsoever.

We were being bombarded with very basic film techniques that any filmmaker would be thinking about to establish the story and setting and create a feeling to convey a message through all of that.

They did not need to have Mike sitting in front of his closet at the very start of s4. They did not have to have a one way sign pointing to it. They did not have to have two dudes with muscles on his walls while most of the other guys either have stuff completely unrelated to the human form or bikini clad woman. They did not have to show Mike in focus more while staring at Eddie fondly as he talks about DnD and getting out of Hawkins. They did not have to have Mike go searching for DnD replacements in the wrestling room and the art room followed by saying, I hate high school.

The I hate high school line is viewed by most of us as a throw away comedic sort of line. But it really isn't. In fact it's arguably as deep as without heart we'd all fall apart, which is why they literally had that be Mike's quote alongside that one being Will's quote for the season.

Mind you, all of this shit in 4x01 is happening after Mike just episodes ago, in the previous season, sort of treated playing DnD like it was something kids did and told Will he felt this way, by essentially saying he assumed they'd be getting girlfriends and moving on from this idea that they can play games for the rest of their lives.

So Mike in s3 went from I want to grow up and have a girlfriend and stop playing dnd bc it is childish, to in s4 Do you want to play with me? I will literally settle for an absolute stranger rn, literally anyone? No? Uh. I hate high school aka I don't want to grow up. Now he thinks that he's the childish one when really, it doesn't have to be, if he just opened his mind to it.

Watching s3-4 back to back is actually so real bc it's showcasing Mike's complete shift, a shift that basically got flipped from s1-2 to s3 to s3 to s4, and it's directly related to his relationship with El and Will (along with his parents who all of s2 punished him by taking away his toys when he acted out bc of trauma/called his toys hunks of plastic and to essentially be used as collateral bc he's going to need to grow up eventually anyways). And we see how that is conveyed when he shows up to Cali unlike his true self, he just reverts right back to trying to be someone else like in s3. Only now he's trying to pull off a Cali look on-top of it, wearing sunglasses as he mumbles an incoherent sound, something like, 'eahauw' as he rushes up to kiss and hug El, putting the flowers between them so he had an excuse to separate sooner than later, followed actually voicing words to will, moving his duffel back out of the way to hug will properly, w/out sunglasses, visibly very happy to see Will, only to not even be able to hug him by cutting it short. AND for Argyle to confirm our suspicions by calling him a knock off?? NOW I'M REALIZING IT'S TOO MUCH YELLOW? Come on!?

That's another thing, the end of s3 hug between Will and Mike literally ends with Mike looking like he is in physical pain. Like dude looks like he was burned. He looks like a mixture of angry and heartbroken. And so having that, followed up with Mike barely even being able to properly hug Will properly 2 episodes later..? Gee I wonder why?

And then it just spirals from there.

The entire season Mike is by definition emotionally cheating on El, assuming that they are even technically still together atp. There's a reason they had her say From El, and it's so that there was this sense of maybe they were technically broken up now or even just on a break rn, since they wouldn't see each other for who knows how long? Maybe never again? And so that was a writing choice made in large part to allow all of these moments between Mike and Will throughout the season to feel romantic coded and for us to comfortably view them as such. Same with how they did that with Jonathan and Nancy in s2. They create conflict that is near breakup territory, without outright saying I want to break up, and then they throw them with their other love interest and create tension.

When it comes to like how I think s5 could go down with byler, I have a few different thoughts about how that would play out. Obviously I love byler but there's a lot of other stuff going on so this would just be one aspect of the greater overall story. But for the sake of this post I'm going to focus on Byler possibilities.

Them holding off until Vol. 2, literally 2 weeks exactly after the premiere, to have Noah officially release a statement saying We now know Will is 100% gay and in love with Mike, that is them clearly knowing the gravity of revealing stuff too soon to an audience that might not be ready for it. They saw the reaction to s4 and they waited and then they made that choice to discuss it the way they did. That was the point they decided they were willing to tell the truth of the situation, including Noah admitting for the first time, that they've been hinting at Will's feelings since s1, and so he had to always be vague about things to avoid spoiling the Duffers surprise. And while they're doing this, when they talk about Mike's feelings about the situation, it is always that he has absolutely no idea.

There would be no justifiable reason to hold off on admitting Will's feelings for Mike outside of canon, only to admit they've been hinting at it since s1, if there wasn't actually something yet to see be revealed, making this revelation so late in the game, justifiable.

The main thing that we get from Mike being oblivious of Will's feelings, is that if Mike doesn't know, then technically he hasn't rejected Will yet. Because how can he have rejected Will if he has no idea? Answer, he can't!

And so now there is one season left and they are choosing to hold off on Mike's knowledge about Will's feelings? After they just finally admitted after 4 seasons that they've been avoiding telling us about Will's feelings, despite hints from the beginning because they didn't want to ruin the surprise?

What surprise though bro? Slow-burn unrequited love??? There isn't any such thing. Because that wouldn't be satisfying!

It takes us right back to the line Will makes in s3 (mid-series) to Joyce about how he's never gonna fall in love. It's not that he doesn't want to or even hasn't yet at all, it's that he doesn't believe experiencing mutual love with the person he has feelings for is in the cards for him, bc odds are, that person is going to be straight.

But... How is it satisfying to hold off on even admitting Will's feelings for Mike until the second to last season, only to hold off on Mike's POV of the situation until the last season, just to say at the last minute, Well, Will, you were right!...? Like, no.

And so I genuinely think the same thing they did with Will is happening to Mike in a sense, in that by sort of dancing around the situation with answers that don't even allow you to answer the question, by saying Mike is clueless, they can avoid delving into what exactly Mike would think. They can just say Oh of course he will accept Will and leave it at that.

The thing is, if I'm supposed to be rooting for Mike and El, these choices that they've been making, to practically infect all of their scenes with Will in the frame looking like a kicked puppy, it's not giving endgame, it's giving I should be praying for this kid to get a happy ending who is fully convinced that he won't get it.

The main question I have, is are they going to hold off the slow-burn for as long as they can, or are they going to do something unprecedented and make it happen sooner than anyone expects?

I guess for now I think that it's the most likely they will hold off until 5x07 for like the big obvious endgame moment? Slow-burn tends to thrive in it's true form, aka slow-burn until the very end. So it would make sense to have these barriers in place that prevent Mike and Will from truly realizing they have mutual feelings or something of that nature, and then acting on it. That doesn't mean the audience wouldn't be clued in on those feelings earlier in the season, but I think them both accepting those feelings and coming together and choosing to be together is something that won't be like established fully until the end.

THOUGH I will say there is one scenario I could see them manage to have Mike and Will realize those feelings sooner than we think and it's because of the satanic allegations... If Will and Mike were to ever get caught in a precarious situation, by someone in the town already accusing these kids of being the cause, specifically Mike as a member of Hellfire and specifically Will as the kid who has been connected to all of this, it would be sort of visceral seeing how that could play out with them being viewed as like a symbolic indicator of the incoming apocalypse.

Though then again, they still might not get together until like episode 7, bc with the last couple episodes being like 2 hours long, it's possible the homophobic/satanic aspect of it could come into play around then. I think it would be really critical to see other peoples reactions in the story to them getting together, including their family and friends, but also potentially the community bc that would go full circle with what went down in s1 and how like the whole community had an opinion about Will's sexuality even as a kid.

Early s5 is a big indicator of how everything will go down though. I don't think that they'll get separated and be apart the whole season, bc they made a point to convey in s4 that they want to make sure to give the audience a lot of groundwork to root for them and so I think s5 has to be much of the same for it to end in a way that has most of the audience full-on rooting for them and just screaming at their screen for them to kiss already.

However, I do think it's possible we could see them get separated for like 1 episode, maybe 2 but probably not 2 full episodes, I think the reunion would happen sometime at the end of 1 or 2 episodes.

I think Will is likely going to be targeted by Vecna, arguably already was at the end of s4, and then there's birthdaygate to address. Maybe he gets forgotten by everyone as a result of the memory/time trickery that Vecna has going on. And so we could see that play a role in them being separate for a bit while that is resolved, which would likely be early s5, to sort of mirror early s1. But then I think they would reunite by like the 3rd episode and work together most of the season as a team. And we will probably be aware of Mike's feelings in these moments because we would've just presumably gotten a bunch of parallels to s1 and considering Mike and El are broken up, it's going to be difficult to see Mike be so up in arms about Will after all of that romantic subtext, only to be with him and be looking at him like he hung the stars and shit. Even if Will isn't doing the same bc he's like convinced himself at this point Mike doesn't like him back, that would just make it even more clear bc it would be them finally showing us Mike's POV, after hiding it so much in s3-4. It would also sort of wake up those fans who had insisted Mike couldn't feel the same bc there would be no reason to do all of that for nothing.

Another way I could see it going down is by Mike basically somehow making 'a deal with god' (Vecna) that takes him instead. Maybe it's about saving Will who is trying to sacrafice himself already. Or maybe it's a way to save Max and it's sort of a last minute thing that is intended to cause them a lot of grief. Bc we know Vecna loves fucking with them. This would fit into the whole without heart we'd all fall apart, and the whole how am I gonna survive a whole week w/out you guys and Mike getting out in the DND game at the start of s4, along with like the whole theory about how if a paladin breaks an oath they basically have to go on a mini self discovery journey and can essentially be reinstated and forgiven by a cleric (Will). That would fit very very well into the imagery we got of Mike sitting down on Jonthan's bed with the upside down tapestry behind him, followed by Will sitting down beside him + Mike sitting down on the upside down couch at the cabin, followed by Will sitting down beside him. Meaning basically Mike would end up in the upside down and Will would follow behind him.

And I think in that scenario we might be seeing some things from Mike's POV that we have overlooked before, or maybe even things they have deliberately kept from us for the sake of saving it for later. Maybe that unused footage of him crying biking home after they found Will's body, or maybe they re-contextualize the cliff scene in a way that sort of frames Mike as feeling like he deserved to die that day bc after everything that happened with El, maybe he doesn't feel like he deserved to be saved by her, like Vecna just overwhelms him with the guilt that's been piling up for years, which led him to that failed monologue.

Also I think there is a very specific reason they chose to not use the song Time After Time in Max's memory of the Snow Ball in s4, and that's because they're saving it for s5. Every Breath You Take was regarded by most the fandom as a Milkvan song, and if anything it fit with all of them dancing more than it did specifically with Max's memory from that day. So them bringing that back for s4 felt like a combination of the Vecna foreshadowing and also them refusing to use Time After Time quite yet... Time After Time started playing right when Lucas asked her to dance, they easily could have used that song instead and left Every Breath You Take for s5 for a milkvan montage, hell Time After Time even would have fit well with the whole clock theme going on in s4.

But, I genuinely think it's because they're holding off on fully, in canon, re-contextualizing our understanding of that Snow Ball scene when it comes to Mike and Will's perspective of it. And how that song would fit into that revelation is a little to perfect to pass up, again on a show that has made a big deal about clocks and also has connected Will/Mike to the clock in Starcourt with the Yellow and Blue hands ie you say go slow I fall behind-- the second hand unwinds is fucking clock coded bro???

They are 100% saving that clock ass song for the end and that just tells me byler has to be endgame bc that song literally ended right before El entered the gym, it has no association to them, only to either Lucas/Max, Dustin/Nancy, or Mike/Will. That's it.

And so arguably the build up of Mike and Will is the only way to satisfyingly bring that song back full circle.

I guess I'll keep it simple and say that I think one of them are going to go missing/dissapear/be taken (something along those lines) early s5, and the other is going to find them and they're going to be a team basically. I think there could be 1-2 episodes of them alone sort of in the pits of the UD (Hell vibes). Maybe there's an almost kiss in those moments, or maybe even an official one bc them being alone finally is what grants them the courage to do what they haven't been able to do in the real world without the fears of the real world stopping them?

Though I do think that they will reunite with the others after 1-2 episodes alone. And so most of the season will be them teamed up with the og party and also having interactions with other characters along the way as well.

I do think a Murray/Byler confrontation is inevitable. I do think a Will & Robin confrontation is inevitable. I do think it's possible Mike could be exposed to the idea of having a gf then a bf (and vs) by Vickie in the case that Mike finds out bisexuality is real and an option. Bc tbh it's still something people today don't know about. So I don't think Mike Wheeler in 1986 Hawkins, Indiana would, though again maybe an interaction with Vickie could change that. Either that or Robin, Vickie and Steve are going to see Mike call Fast Times overrated and they're all going to share a look and that's when we'll know...

I do think that Will is going to have a hard time believing Mike could feel the same, even when presented with evidence? Not only does he have his insecurities in the way, but he also views El as his sister now (hell she might even actually turn out to be his twin). Even though Mike is his best friend, he's going to want it to be crystal clear that El supports it before Mike ends up being in their family via them being partners at some point. That's just who Will is as a character. He's just going to assume he is wrong for wanting that considering everything that has led up to this point.

And i think El is the kind of character that, no, she wont be like ecstatic about how this all played out and how she didn't need to get her heartbroken, but I don't think that feeling will last forever. I think they might have a little sibling talk about lying, assuming she finds out about the painting and what he said to Mike about her commissioning it. That would be a good parallel to her and Will at Rink-O-Mania when he chastised her for lying to Mike? Essentially an Oh how the turntables moment? Even so, when it's all said and done, she's going to make it clear to Will that she supports him fully.

And I think the same applies to Mike who also is going to want closure that they are okay and still friends and love each other as friends/family.

I think how all of this plays out would be very intricate, yes, but largely keeping in mind that they want us to like this ending and not be bitter about it, and so they're going to have to convince us that we want to fully let go of Mike and El and to root for Mike and Will.

This so called love triangle doesn't have equal stakes to the stancy/jancy one because we're dealing with an audience that has been completely left in the dark, now being bombarded. They have to try really hard to convince the audience to be on board with this, and also avoid homophobia in the process. They're going to have to make it very, very clear there are no more romantic feelings for Mike and El happening. Especially since we're ending the show with them in a sibling dynamic because of their relationships with Will. It would be gross to have this level of well maybe one day he could change his mind I mean he did that once before. Nope. It would be okay to have that sort of left unanswered with the stancy/jancy parallels bc we're not dealing with people being related to each other and swapping back and forth. That's why it needs to be clear in their situation.

And I do think that's why they did the whole I love you 9 times with Mike's monologue. Because it can't go up from there, there is nothing left for them to do after going all out like that, only to reveal Mike meant it deep down platonically? I mean what could they possibly do to backtrack? Have him give her another love confession where he says it 20x and adds no but fr this time?? No. They had to go all out like that to give those viewers what they wanted, the most they could possibly get and then say, sorry it's not happening. It essentially made it impossible to hope for it bc there's nothing left to hope for.

When it comes to byler and like these major moments that are bound to occur between them, I am genuinely most looking forward to them hugging again for the first time since the end of s3. That to me is going to be even more exciting than a kiss honestly (not saying I don't want a kiss but you know what I mean). And it's bc from a hug alone, I think we'll be able to tell that what's going on between them isn't platonic and that will in turn add so many layers to past seasons. I think it's also likely we'll get an almost kiss or two before the inevitable, and that would then make the slow-burn stretching until the end worth it, to me at least? Because just throwing them together never works when the formula has always been to hold off.

And that's also why the show has to end now. We can't have 6,8, 10 seasons of slow-burn, it would be exhausting. 5 seasons is the perfect amount. And having all of that angst and tension and heartache lead to a happy ending is going to make all of those moments in between that fans fought over for being critical of, sort of just dwindle to epic angst that was necessary to appreciate the happy ending.

#byler #byler ask #this was long but i hope i got the point across #basically i never allowed myself to believe byler until i was fully confident in it #it was never about shipping two characters simply bc it was a queer ship and i always get queer-baited or something #(nothing is wrong with getting queer-baited a lot either bc the problem is showrunners fucking with fans not the fans themselves)#it wasn't about holding onto said queer ship bc i can't let shit go #I never allowed myself to believe it until it was undeniable to me #byler not ending up together wouldn't make me heartbroken or lose sleep #i would just genuinely be confused bc the show would have prioritized building up byler for years all for nothing...#like it would just be the most anticlimatic ending #not only would the gays be pissed #but so would the ga that doesn't even like milkvan anymore and is just dying for something better to come along #but it is happening...#so i'm sat #i'm excited to see how it plays out #i'm excited to be surprised bc the st writers ALWAYS pleasantly surprise me #s4 is a great example of that #most pleasant surprise i have ever experienced #so i am looking forward for them to keep that streak going

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dufrau · 1 year

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Stop saying SHE HAS NEVER DONE ANYTHING WRONG about the Yellowjackets! She* certainly has done things wrong and that is why we love her! She* is incredibly fucked up and fueled and haunted by the things she has done wrong! She* will do more things wrong and we will love her for that too!

*like, almost any of them. almost all of them.

#yellowjackets #LET THEM FUCK IT ALL UP #LET THEM FUCK IT UP SO BAD THEY DONT EVEN RECOGNIZE IT ANYMORE #LET THEM BE THE MONSTERS THEY ALREADY BELIEVE THEMSELVES TO BE #EXCEPT FOR MISTY WHO REALLY THINKS SHE HAS NEVER DONE ANYTHING WRONG BUT IF SHE EVER FINDS OUT HOW WRONG SHE IS???#SHOW ME THAT TOO!#OR DONT BECAUSE SHE IS FUN AND THIS IS NOT ABOUT PUNISHMENT IT IS ABOUT CHAOS #anyway i love these monsters each and every one #except travis

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wecantseeyou · 1 year

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they’re never yours. they never last.

There are a number of lines in s2 that I believe were originally intended for Mary, but were given to various other characters due to their importance to the story and executing the emotional arcs of the season. In particular, I keep coming back to Camila’s intercession to Beatrice’s doubt concerning Ava. The conversation between Beatrice and Camila is lovely - someone offering back to Beatrice what she so freely offers others, whatever she needs. It shows how Camila is more perceptive than she gets credit for, but also speaks to how the normally mission-driven Beatrice has shifted her dedication to Ava in a way that everyone can see.

However, the lines Camila says about the Warrior Nun?

“It’s easy to fall in love with the Warrior Nun. It’s loving the Warrior Nun that’s the hard part. They’re never yours. They never last.”

They have Mary written all over them.

We haven’t seen or heard about Camila having any special relationship with the Warrior Nuns of her time, which is likely just Shannon and maybe Suzanne. She’s the young recruit - new and shiny and still impulsive, not yet a part of the main team at the beginning of the show. She wasn’t even there when Shannon died. It doesn’t exactly make sense for Camila to have this evolved emotional understanding of the pitfalls of a close relationship with the Warrior Nun if she was never close to one herself.

Mary, on the other hand, did. Mary who ignored Ava and the halo in the beginning to find out what happened to Shannon. Mary who trusted her instincts when they told her something was off, something was wrong with how Shannon was killed.

Mary who was the closest to Shannon. Mary alone who was wrapped in Shannon’s arms in the photograph in Shannon’s cell.

Mary who, along with the others, resented Ava for not being Shannon. Mary who understood Ava more than the rest because of her relationship with Shannon. Mary who resented the halo for what it did to Shannon.

Mary who was ready to watch Duretti burn for what she thought he did to Shannon. Mary who ran into a horde of possessed people because of Vincent and Adriel and what they did to Shannon.

It's Mary who knows what it's like to fall in love with a Warrior Nun. What it's like to love a Warrior Nun. What it's like to so desperately want someone who has sworn to give their life to a higher calling.

It's Mary who understands that the duty of the Warrior Nun means she can never give all of herself to you.

It's Mary who loved Shannon.

It’s Mary who would have seen Beatrice laid bare in the aftermath of it all – her devotion to Ava, the cracks in her façade, the arms length she tries to keep between herself and the truth.

It’s Mary who would have seen herself reflected in Beatrice’s struggle and who would have offered her the salvation of truth.

And it’s Mary, the woman who lost Shannon and never gave up on the injustice of her death, who would offer Beatrice this fellowship:

It was easy to fall in love with Shannon. It was difficult to love Shannon. She was never mine. She would never last.

And I loved her anyway.

#warrior nun #warrior nun spoilers #warrior nun meta #shotgun mary #sister camila #sister beatrice #avatrice #ava x beatrice #mary x shannon #also: holding out for s3 and reminding myself that they only ever said mary was lost #meaning the writers gave themselves plenty of room to bring mary back #and we never saw a body #I know we already had the Lazarus moment with Superion #but there are TWO lazarus moments in the bible with two different men named lazarus and this show is already blasphemy #seeking: people to talk about this damn nun show with me! ask is always open

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