#hazbin alastor meta

[alastors-antlers]

a brief take on the whole "Alastor's smile is permanent" discussion

hello all!

I've seen a lot of people theorizing lately that Alastor actually smiles all the time because his smile is magically, physically fixed onto his face. All of this seems to come from the fact that he's practically grimacing rather than smiling during the scene where he breaks down in ep8:

As well as this frame of his deal with Charlie: (lower res sorry)

I will say, I do like some of the implications of this theory. The sheer spite of his creditor forcing him to smile as an addition to their deal, almost like a sort of forced silence, is a neat concept. It's fun and dramatic. Plus, of all things, of course Alastor would claim the "smile at all times" policy and make it his own to pretend that it was his decision all along lol.

To be fair, though, I don't think we even need any magical compulsion to explain why he's smiling while he's having a mental breakdown. Actually, if we assume magical compulsion, I think we lose a bit of dimension from Alastor's character. (No judgement to anyone's take though, of course -- I just think this works in the direction of his established characterization, but obviously all personal takes <3)

Hear me out:

Alastor's persona is not just for others to see.

"A smile is a valuable tool, my dear. It inspires your friends; keeps your enemies guessing; and ensures that whatever comes your way, you're the one in control."

That makes sense given what we know about him. If he's always smiling, he seems like he has it together. You can't read him very well, especially not when he's actively trying to keep up appearances.

Now consider that when you think about ep8's fight with Heaven, we see that he's already been through so much in this one day.

He fights an army of angels, presumably not even at his own whim (if we go by his blurb about freedom in the Finale song); he loses to Adam, who he considers sloppy and mediocre; his staff, which we can assume holds some part of his power, is snapped; he comes close to being Angelic-power-killed; and to top it all off, he knows that others watched him get injured and then apparently die or flee, all of which would ruin the public image that he's trying to maintain. It wouldn't even be unreasonable for us to assume that he knows Vox was watching, given that Vox kind of has eyes everywhere.

In a moment like this, in the finale, you could say that Alastor has lost (at least on some level) everything that we know matters to him. He doesn't have access to all of his magic, and it's limiting him. He's reminded that he doesn't have freedom or control over his own destiny. He certainly has taken massive hits to his powerful, composed persona. But he's desperate, and furious, and terrified, and clinging on.

That's why he's smiling.

It's not that he can't stop because he physically can't. It's that he can't stop because to him, the smile is the last thing that is still within his power. When there are so many moving parts that he can't predict what happens to him next, he can control how he responds to it. In these last fragments of autonomy, there is solace.

He needs to keep telling himself that he has it together and that he'll eventually scheme his way free, that there's a solution, that he won't be in chains forever; because letting his pretense slip would be admitting that it's all starting to actually get to him. That maybe this time, he doesn't have an escape plan.

In addition, if you read his interactions throughout the series, we also see something else: Alastor's reputation is of paramount importance to him. At multiple points throughout the series, when others disrespect him by discounting his power or presence, he gets visibly annoyed. And in the battle, we see a glimpse of the part of his personality he seems to be trying to leave behind - a normal Alastor, who's just some guy from Louisiana. No transatlantic accent; no unflappable malice; no sharp wit waiting at the ready. Maybe even unremarkable.

Dropping his smile - arguably the most prominent part of his brand - would be admitting that in reality, he's not the Radio Demon of legend that he aspires to project. And if he doesn't have that... where would he be?

#alastor meta #alastor analysis #hazbin hotel #hazbin alastor #alastor #alastor hazbin hotel #hazbin hotel alastor #hazbin alastor meta #hazbin meta #hazbin alastor analysis #bro I love this guy so much

[villainsposting]

Alastor being aroace makes his dynamic with Vox like 100% funnier. It's a villain rivalry, you immediately know people will look at these two and think "they crave each other carnally", except only one of them has the capacity for it. Which is the perfect set up for a ridiculous one-sided obsession, but then Alastor is shown to be acting way more unbothered by Vox than he actually is. Dude is walking the streets of Hell menacingly staring into cameras and doesn't even have the excuse of homosexuality. Both of these fuckers are goofy as hell.

#hazbin hotel #alastor #vox #they have everything wrong with them #tv or radio #original post #hazbin meta #aroace alastor

[nunalastor]

WE DONT TALK ABOUT THESE SCREENSHOTS FROM THE PILOT ENOUGH

1. HE'S USING HIS STAFF ON THEM

2. MUSIC NOTES??

3. LIL DEMON SKELETON DEER?

4. ALLIGATOR SKELETON??

5. LIL DEMON HAS A KNIFE

6. HIS ROBES ARE TAKING THEM DOWN

7. HIS DEMONS HAVE HATS LMAO

#hazbin hotel #alastor #meta

[metalatias5]

Lucifer, calling up Heaven after discovering that this is not even that rare of an occurrence: WHO THE FUCK MADE DEER BE LIKE THAT??!!?

Also yes, Lucifer spontaneously dematerialized both his hat and coat in shock/anger XD

#Hazbin Hotel #Hazbin Charlie #Charlie Morningstar #Alastor #Radio Demon #Vaggie #Hazbin Lucifer #comic #Meta #MetaTheTrifox #MetaLatias #MetaLatias5

[prince-liest]

More thoughts on Alastor and why I don't think he's actually outdated:

I totally understand why many thoughts are going in the direction of him disliking Vox and TV as a whole because it is the technology that more or less replaced radio in the public eye, but I also think that we (so far, as of episode 4) have never really been given any evidence that he dislikes TV on principle rather than because he dislikes Vox and Vox is TV. Like, yes, he maintains a very dated aesthetic and does things like call TV "picture shows."

But also.

He throws around phrases like, "And now he's pissy, that's the tea!" and speaks with a permanent transatlantic accent (commonly used for TV and radio during his era but not actually naturally-occuring) at literally all times. This guy is not clueless - he's putting on airs. He knows modern lingo and he uses it comfortably and naturally.

There's a fanfic that, to save my life, I cannot remember the name of, where Angel Dust asks Alastor something to the tune of, "So what I'm getting out of this conversation is that you know it's called a cell phone and you just talk like you've never seen one on purpose?" and Alastor responds with, "Naturally!" that I think hit the nail on the head.

Especially when Alastor's anachronisms are so pointed. He calls Vox's TV show a "video podcast," which, 1) a podcast is a pretty modern term for him to know, originating at some point in the early 2000s and 2) deliberately reframes Vox's entire thing in terms of an audio format. It's not television. It's a podcast (a form of audio media that originated in the desire to download online radio broadcasts) with some video tacked on, he guesses.

Anyway, the tl;dr is that while I'm sure Alastor prefers his own era, I don't think Alastor is actually outdated, I think he's being fucking annoying on purpose.

Look at him. Look at his smug knifecat face. Bastardous. I love him.

ETA: The fanfic I mentioned is Anguish of the Marrow!

#and good for him!!!! #hazbin hotel #alastor #vox #hazbin hotel vox #hazbin hotel alastor #personal #meta #he very well might hate TV for TV's sake but also I really don't think he's actually stuck in the past #he's just being disrespectful lmao

[saltwatersweets]

i think it’s really funny how many people say that alastor is ace, not aroace, just because viv has only called him ace.

love you guys but you are GRAPHICALLY overestimating people’s knowledge on aromanticism and asexuality and how they are different. they have been confused with each other since their existence, and just because someone is queer doesn’t mean they’re incapable of confusing the terms or using them interchangeably. alastor is clearly shown to not have romantic feelings, just take a look at some of the official jokes.

both of these are explicitly non-romantic. not just non-sexual, they are both jokes and comments about being aromantic, not asexual.

yes, rosie only mentions him being asexual in episode seven, but again, this is a joke made about the idea of him being in a ROMANTIC relationship. unless rosie was implying that she knows alastor and charlie wouldn’t fuck? which 😭😭 i don’t think she would do that??? it was definitely a joke about him not wanting romance because of his romantic and sexual orientation. and yes, i understand how annoying it is that asexuality and aromanticism are being used interchangeable in this instance, and this is an issue ace/aro people have been facing for years, but this is clearly a joke about him being aroace, not just ace.

again, you guys are giving alloromantic/allosexual people WAY too much credit on how much they know about ace/aro people, when most of their knowledge (if any) is “asexual people dont want sex, aromantic people don’t want romance” and that’s it. vivziepop, despite being queer herself, is still allo as far as im aware. allo people BARELY know anything about asexuality or aromanticism or care to learn the difference, and it’s clear that aro/aceness is being used interchangeably here. alastor is portrayed as aroace, and is clearly meant to be seen as aroace, even though he’s only ever been explicitly called ace by viv.

#this isnt even mentioning that his va called him aroace and viv never corrected him lol #(in front of her i might add) #hazbin hotel #hazbin hotel alastor #hazbin alastor #alastor the radio demon #asexual #aromantic #aroace #aroace alastor #aromantic alastor #asexual alastor #hazbin hotel meta #hazbin meta

[chaoticace2005]

Vox’s Rivalry with Alastor: Need for Control

The whole thing with Vox is control. He’s the embodiment of modern technology and surveillance. The privacy issues we face? In Hell that’s all Vox. And when you think of it like that his whole rivalry with Alastor makes so much sense on a logical level.

Things Vox Controls:

-The public: constant surveillance, brainwashing, and further control over media content they consume. He doesn’t just control what people watch but he watches people.

-This partners (to a degree): we see this with how he interacts with Valentino. He isn’t the one in CHARGE, but the thing with Valentino is he tends to be very explosive, and Vox is able to direct the blast in a direction that won’t harm him (offers to bring up employees for Val to kill so he won’t make a public display about Angel)

-Himself: We see how he puts so much energy on to be publicity ready and have a smile on his face. Talking very much like a businessman or politician. He acts completely different in front of camera.

Even his smile. Both Vox and Alastor use smiling as a mechanism to hide their true selves. But with Alastor it works as a way to keep people guessing, to inspire a level of fear oftentimes.

Vox isn’t like that. He puts on a fake, plastic smile. Alastor tries to make himself off putting on purpose, Vox doesn’t. He does it to keep them complacent. Alastor smiles so people won’t figure him out. Vox smiles so people trust him enough not to try.

We see that the second Alastor is brought up that smile vanishes. His self control is gone. Throughout the song we see him lose more control over his public persona, getting more visibly angry, while at the same time the public turns more to Alastor. Meanwhile Alastor also butters his partners up and publicly announces to the world that “no, Vox can’t control me. Trust me, he tried.”

Every single thing Vox controls is threatened when Alastor is involved. Vox has no way to control him.

-Methods he uses on the public? Surveillance and media? Won’t work because Alastor can’t be captured on camera well and hates modern technology. Brainwashing the public? Won’t work if they’re paying more attention to Alastor than him.

-His partners? Alastor declined his partnership and is willing to poke at the relationship between the Vees. All the Vees carry some weight in the relationship, but Alastor could make Vox seem obsolete. He’s able to control their public perception, yes- but one of them could easily go rogue and blow that to bits.

-Himself? Demolished. Gone. He has a public breakdown. He glitches out. Fully cries at the end of the song. Maybe it’s the fear of what Alastor could do, maybe it’s their past, maybe it’s Vox’s weird hate boner, maybe it’s unrequited feelings. Who knows. All logic and control goes out the window when Alastor is involved.

And the thing Alastor seems very much the same. He hates being under someone’s leash. He needs to be in control. When he’s reminded he’s not he lashes out. The first time we really see their masks break is when they’re reminded of the fact there is someone out there that is a threat to the control the have. The “What did you say?” they both do before lashing out.

I’m interested in seeing how they’ll interact in the future. Because they really do seem like two sides of the same coin. The only difference is we know who Vox is afraid of, we don’t fully know who Alastor is of yet. They need power over others, but more than that they need power over themselves. (Alastor being controlled by whatever the deal he made was. While Vox is controlled by his emotions towards Alastor. And both being controlled by their fear.)

( @gabrielsbubblegumbitch I’m curious on your thoughts? I’ve read some of your analyses 1’s would love feedback.)

#hazbin hotel #hazbin hotel meta #hazbin hotel analysis #hazbin hotel vox #hazbin vox #vox hazbin hotel #alastor hazbin hotel #alastor #radio demon hazbin hotel #staticradio #radiostatic #one sided

[cheeseanonioncrisps]

I really want the show to go into more detail about Husk's backstory as an overlord, partly because I feel like it's something the fandom is kinda glossing over and partly because it's lowkey one of the biggest obstacles that a Husk/Angel relationship would have into overcome.

'Loser Baby' emphasises the similarities between Angel and Husk's situations, but it also (probably deliberately, since Husk is the one leading it) brushes aside one of the most major differences between them.

Namely that when Husk tells Angel that he's not the only one who sold his soul, he's not just singing about himself.

Husk sold his soul to Alastor, yeah (or lost it at least, which amounts to the same thing), but he also traded in souls. He was that “psychopathic freak”, and was operating fro long enough to achieve Overlord status.

And, honestly? Having your soul owned by Husker back in the day probably sucked.

The one benefit of soul contracts for the person selling their soul is that they seem to get a fair amount of say in how the contract is written.

Angel's contract, for example, apparently has a clause stating that he's only under Valentino's jurisdiction when he's in the studio. (Which, btw, puts a whole other spin on why Val is so pissed when he moves out of studio accommodation and into the Hotel.) And Val is apparently bound to that. Even though he's pissed off and actively wants to put Angel in his place, he can't make any moves against him in the club.

Equally, since most overlords seem to be associated with a specific location/industry, you can generally choose who your working for and therefore roughly what kind of stuff you're gonna be doing.

In practice there seems to be a lot of manipulation and coercion going on on the part of the Overlords making these contracts— they're not fair by any means— but the sinners signing them are theoretically at least guaranteed the right to a (somewhat) informed choice and some control over the deals they make.

Having an Overlord who uses human souls to pay his gambling debts, however, completely undermines all that.

Imagine going into work for your job running the roulette games at the casino only to be told that the boss played a bad hand in a game with Valentino, and so you're a sex worker now.

Or being traded to someone who has you fighting turf wars for them, and realising that your contract doesn't have any clauses to protect your personal safety because you only signed up to be a bartender.

Or selling your soul for a job near your home and family so you can guarantee their protection, only to be traded to someone whose territory is on the other side of the pentagram.

Husk is a victim of his own addiction, yeah, which is one of the reasons why Angel relates to him. But his backstory implies that there must be a significant number of people out there who were also victims of Husk's addiction, and may not be as sympathetic. Dude basically owned other people as property (… we have a word for that) and then literally played games with their lives.

And like, I'm not saying he hasn't changed. He seems more empathetic on the show than his backstory would imply, and apart from anything else, he's had a pretty clear object lesson about what it's like to be on the receiving end of that sort of thing. (Ngl, I'm pretty sure one of the reasons Alastor keeps him around is because he's the type to find the irony amusing.)

But like, he's in this place where he can relate to Angel Dust's situation, while at the same time probably also being able to relate to Valentino and Alastor's perspectives (although I doubt he was quite as bad as Val to work for).

And I'm curious as to what would happen, later in the series, if the gang met someone who had sold their soul to Husk at one point. Someone who would also be able to relate to Angel's situation, but with Husk as their version of Valentino.

#hazbin hotel #angel dust #husker #huskerdust #meta #hazbin hotel meta #yeah i just got thru watching this series and I have Thoughts #alastor hazbin hotel #hazbin hotel headcanons #valentino #hazbin hotel spoilers

[aspoonofsugar]

Hi! Where do you think Alastor's arc is going? Redemption or villainy?

Hi!

Thank you for the ask, I loved watching Hazbin Hotel and I am happy I can write for the series :)

As for now, I think Alastor will spiral and hurt Charlie very badly, but he will eventually redeem himself (probably in a key moment). That is because Alastor is framed as Charlie's Jungian shadow.

What is the Jungian Shadow?

According to Jung, the shadow is what a person represses, both positive and negative. So, it can be one's violent tendencies, but also one's potential and energy. It really depends on the person.

So, why does Alastor fit the Shadow Archetype? Well, first of all:

Alastor's powers make use of shadows. Not only that, but Alastor's own shadow is very expressive and shows the demon's repressed feelings. In other words:

On the one hand Alastor embodies the shadow, in the sense he represents what Charlie refuses to face

On the other hand Alastor himself represses his emotions behind a smiling face:

Alastor: Just because you see a smile, don't think you know what is going on underneath. A smile is a valuable tool, my dear. It inspires your friends, keeps your enemies guessing and ensures tha no matter what comes your way, you're the one in control.

This is a good characterization for a jungian shadow because the shadow grows stronger and more dangerous, when it's ignored. So, the most one refuses to face their feelings, the most these feelings fester and grow powerful and dangerous. This fits Alastor both when it comes to others and to his own character:

He takes advantage of an emotional unstable and vulnerable Charlie to strike an abimguous deal with her. Similarly, he uses Husk's gambling addiction to steal his soul. He uses people's weaknesses an unsolved problems to take over.

He suffocates his feelings, which symbolically manifest in his powerful shadow-tentacles. His design and abilities are representative of his psychological coping mechanism, which is nothing, but repression.

As written above, though, the Jungian Shadow can be both negative and positive depending on what one hides. This duality is shown in Alastor's two roles in Charlie's arc:

He is a demonic archetype (even moreso than Lucifer, the titular devil), as he waits in the shadows for a chance to manipulate Charlie

He is an evil mentor, as he genuinelly likes Charlie, sees her potential and wants to guide her towards greatness:

She's filled with potential that I could guide

This isn't a contradiction, but complexity. Alastor is chaotic and mixes negative traits and intentions with positive ones. Just like what people repress can be both bad and good, usually at the same time.

This is clear when it comes to the Princess of Hell:

Charlie to Alastor: What's that you said about smiles?

Charlie is similar to Alastor in how she represses herself behind her pollyanna persona and her smile. This doesn't mean she is faking her altruism and generosity, but that she is using these traits to hide something else:

Lute: The only reason you're still here is that Daddy gave you and your Hellborn-kind a pardon from an exorcist's blade. How does that feel? To know how little you matter.

Deep down, Charlie invests herself in the Hazbin Hotel project because she wants to matter. She feels powerless and unimportant, as a result of her parents' neglects and of Hell's difficult situation.

So, our protagonist has strong self-issues that she refuses to face:

Husk: Princess is a bleedy heart who wants to solve everybod else's problems, 'cept her own.

That said, this isn't the only thing Charlie represses. The Princess of Hell hides:

Every negative emotions she feels, like her self-hate or her anger at Vaggie for hiding her true identity:

Rosie: How does that make you feel? Charlie: Just... angry? Because we share everything! Because she always supported me, and my ideas, and now I don't know whether or not that was just more of the lies... Oh no, that's a horrible thing to think! Do I think that? Yes! No? Kinda?

Her most violent and aggressive side, which makes so she is unable to make full use of her powers:

Vaggie: Well, I mean... You're the princess of Hell, but you don't really use the power that comes with that. Mybe you can, I don't know? Command a little more... authority. Charlie: But that's so mean.

In short, by repressing her negative feelings, she also represses her potential. It is only by facing herself as a whole, that she can fully grow and bloom into her most powerful and complete self:

This is made clear in Charlie's quest in Cannibal Town. There, our girl is at her lowest, but she is pushing herself forward for the sake of her loved ones. She is trying to imitate Alastor by smiling, even if she is sour inside. However, things do not go well and it is only through her heart to heart chat with Rosie, that Charlie is able to pull herself together and inspire her people. Symbolically, she gets through them not with a 100% optimistic song like "Inside of every demon is a rainbow". Rather she opens her speech, by showing vulnerability and honesty:

It's a feeling like a rumbling in your gut That you could finally be faced with A billion needy faces I guess what I mean to say is For the first time in my life I might have to be ready for this Ready to be the one who's leading from the front Gotta come into my own Gotta come into my throne Gotta take charge and defend my only home And although I kinda feel unsteady Now I need to be ready for this

She affirms who she is and her willingness to grow into herself:

For the first time in my life Maybe I can be ready for this I can be the marshal leading the parade I can come into my own And I think I've always known My destiny could never be postponed When Adam brings the battle here I must appear like I'm ready for this

So, it is only by tapping into her own shadow that Charlie can be successfull. It is through expression and not repression that she can reach her goals.

What about Alastor?

He is the same, but so far he has been refusing to open up to others:

Angel: He's been here a while and he's still a big, creepy mystery.

That said, his time at the Hazbin Hotel has had an impact on him. He is forced to deal with others without killing them:

Vaggie: Pentious's eggs are all over the place. I need you to get rid of them. (...) Humanely!

He is shown cutting ties with a poisonous friend:

He openly admits he likes the people of the hotel:

Alastor: Ah, an enjoyable collective to be around. I admit one could get accustomed.

However, he still refuses to openly show vulnerability and ends up like this:

Let's highlight that Charlie and Alastor are foiled in The Show Must Go On song.

Both stand in the ruins of their homes/dreams.

The Hotel:

I took a hotel, and I destroyed it I know I could have done better Better, instead of letting you down

The Radio Station:

This place reeks of death There's a chill in the air And I barely escaped being killed by a hair

And both decide not to give up and to keep pursuing their objectives. However, Charlie is framed positively, while Alastor negatively. Why?

Charlie sings about her feelings openly and is supported by her father and found family:

Alastor sings about his pain privately and even then he barely shows his desperation before going back to his villanious mask:

Symbolically the moment Alastor reunites with the Hotel Crew, he sings:

And we're doing it with a smile!

He is back in control of himself, ready to hide everything behind his neverchanging smile.

So, Alastor is both Charlie's negative foil and Jungian Shadow. As her negative foil, he is bound to spiral. As her Jungian Shadow he is bound to be saved. Why is that so? Two reasons.

The Jungian Shadow can't be killed, but needs to be integrated with.

The main themes of the series are redemption and love, so it is improbable that Charlie won't help the person, who co-founded the hotel with her.

If anything, it seems that our princess is progressively asked to forgive, inspire and see the good in more and more complex cases.

It starts with Angel, who willingly stays at the Hotel. It goes on with Pentious, who infiltrates the Hotel, but makes no real damage. Then Lucifer, whom Charlie loves, but that has been absent from the majority of her life. Finally, Vaggie, who breaks Charlie's trust.

Each conflict Charlie has challenges her in a different way and helps her discover herself and grow. She is bound to meet new struggles when Lilith becomes a broken pedestal and finally when Alastor betrays or hurts her. Still, she is going to forgive and to understand them.

Charlie is going to see the good in Alastor and to better understand herself as a result. As a matter of fact Charlie's journey is one where she is slowly discovering a world, which isn't black and white:

If Hell is forever, then Heaven must be a lie If angels can do whatever, and remain in the sky The rules are shades of gray when you don't do as you say When you make the wretched suffer just to kill them again

Just like people aren't black and white. Just like she herself isn't black and white. By saving Alastor, she is gonna save herself too. Together with the whole universe.

And what about Alastor? Well, he needs to work on himself, as well. He too must integrate with his shadow, who is embodied by a certain character:

Husk is a powerful overlord, who lost his soul to a demon. Just like Alastor:

Husk: Big talk for someone, who's also on a leash.

Alastor and Husk are both on a leash. Still, Husk admits it and starts working on his shortcoming:

Husk: You're a loser, just like me

Alastor instead affirms his willingness to be in control and to pull the strings:

Once I figure out how to unclip my wings Guess who will be pulling all the strings?

Alastor is a loser, just like Husk. Just like all the characters in hell. Sinners vs Winners. And yet, he refuses to admit it. This is why he makes no progress. Similarly, he wants freedom, but enslaves others. This isn't going to work out, which is why I am fairly certain he will eventually set Husk free. Probably by doing so, Alastor will make the first real step towards his own freedom. He will start integrating his own shadow.

Thank you for the ask!

#hazbin hotel #hazbin hotel meta #alastor #hazbin hotel alastor #charlie morningstar #my meta #asksfullofsugar #anonymous

[darkfire359]

I know that some aros/aces are kind of disappointed with Alastor as representation, what with him being an evil cannibalistic serial killer and all. However, I think that Alastor is not only non-problematic aroace representation, he’s actually GOOD rep. Here’s why:

1. Even if you consider Alastor a villain, there are a lot of character MORE villainous than him—often with their sexuality being part of their scumminess. For instance, Adam would be way less gross if he didn’t sexualize all the women around him, and Valentino wouldn’t be able to be nearly as harmful if he were less lustful.

2. In contrast, Alastor being aroace is portrayed *positively*, often actively humanizing him—something extremely refreshing. Rosie knowing Alastor’s sexuality when he’s unaware of it himself is a huge indicator of their friendship. Along with Alastor’s deer-in-the-headlights responses to Angel Dust’s flirting, it also shows that Alastor isn’t as all-knowing and put-together as he can seem. Plus, it’s clear that even if Alastor is manipulative towards Charlie, he’s not being predatory towards her like THAT.

3. Alastor also breaks several stereotypical aroace tropes in a way that’s nice to see. He’s not a loner. He’s very good at understanding people and navigating social interactions. He’s happy to take on a parental role. He puts his hand on people’s shoulders, gives hugs, and happily engages in partner dancing. I’ve seen some people write Alastor as being uncomfortable with physical contact, but TBH I’ve seen him give (and comfortably receive) more physical affection than most people I know.

4. Alastor lets us get the great ace version of the “Your daughter calls me daddy too,” joke. Which i think is WAY funnier than the allo version.

#hazbin alastor #alastor hazbin hotel #Hazbin Hotel #Alastor meta #aroace #asexuality #aromantism

[alastors-antlers]

Why Alastor is good aroace rep after all, written by an aroace

Hello all! I just want to start off this post by saying that I'm one person who definitely doesn't speak for all aroaces, but I wanted to make a post on this anyway, and maybe some folk would be interested in hearing out another perspective?

I'm not really caught up on everything that's been said over the course of HH's creation - only more recent interviews, since I'm pretty new to the fandom. Apologies if I've missed anything, but also I do not have the time to keep up with all the out-of-canon-material backstory unfortunately. I'm working with what we've got here.

So here's the thing:

Alastor is cruel, he's narcissistic, he doesn't care about anyone except himself, he's a serial killer and a monster.

(That's the argument I've heard - please tell me if that's not really what people are going for lol, in which case I've totally misunderstood?)

The issue with aroace rep when it paints asexual people with those traits is that it aims to dehumanizes them. Sex and love are essential to the human experience, right? So why wouldn't someone be interested? Because they're self-absorbed, and cold, and detached. They don't have the capacity to love others enough to feel romance.

And sure, Alastor is a killer, and a schemer, and prideful, and a monster by hell's standards. But no matter how above it all and stylish and in control and provocative he wants to be, he's a very human character, and his aroace-ness never serves to add to his alienation. You could even say that it makes him seem even more personable.

That's what I think is the key difference.

why he's human

Alastor's whole persona is about control, and he basically straight-up says this. He's controlling what his enemies know, what his public image is like. His goal is to be the Radio Demon -- overlord of Hell, charismatic, Machiavellian, and undefeatable. He's not. Despite that smile plastered over his face (a powerful tool, huh) he's so expressive for someone who's constantly pretending.

You see his exasperation with the Egg Bois and with Charlie's ranting; his nervousness in front of Zestial; his frustration with Lucifer and the petty lengths he goes to to piss off the ruler of Hell.

You see his desperation, making that deal with Charlie. He's surprised by the idea of being vulnerable in front of an enemy like Adam, and so close to danger. He drops the radio filter and the affect out of fear, and runs on broadcast TV to let out panic and anger and bitterness in his hideout, where no one else can see him.

He has a smile that tells us he's genuinely happy to see someone; it's a little wider than his default. You see it with Mimzy's greeting, you see it with Rosie. Rosie, especially, serves to make Alastor more human to the audience. More on this later, but for now, I'm just saying that you can see that he at least seems to respect her greatly. Whatever bond they have, we know that he trusts her to touch him, to share history with him, and with support that he trusts no one else for.

He pretends, but he can't pretend it all away. Loads of these emotions aren't even advantageous for him to show. It isn't necessarily how the typical asexual psychopath acts; he's not emotionless or only capable of anger or brutality.

He's so full of emotion that it leaks through, despite all that he does to avoid it. He's not inhuman and aloof, not really - he's so, so human, even when he tries not to be because he thinks that'll be what keeps him above all the rest. In control, and free from his chains.

(If anyone wants to see images about all this, I'll make a separate post - just let me know.)

(I also have another post, talking about why Alastor is at least a little attached to the hotel's residents too, shown via conversation with Niffty. In what way? different question.)

how the aroace part contributes to that

Now, to be fair, we don't hear much about his aroaceness in canon. It's just not relevant a lot of the time.

In the pilot, Angel's proposition ruffles his feathers so much that Alastor blanks for a moment. It's a joke, sure, but that ace panic face is a pretty popular Alastor moment in the fandom - Alastor, thrown off-balance by a sex joke of all things, after so many years in Hell that he should probably be used to this.

It's a moment that makes him more approachable; his aroaceness shows him unprepared for something someone else does for one of the only real moments in the whole episode.

And the other part: the ace in the hole statement.

Rosie apparently knows Alastor so well that she read that he's aroace. That tells us about their relationship; namely, that it is long-standing and genuine enough that she gleaned a piece of real information from him. It's a casual fact that she knows about him before he even figured it out himself. It lends legitimacy to their bond - this bond that shows us a more comfortable and warm side of Alastor that we don't often see.

If their relationship is purely business, isn't this something pretty frivolous and personal? It's not like he has anything to gain by telling her about his life, but she learned about it somehow. How close are they? That's where it adds a layer of complexity and personality to his character..

thoughts on representation

Overall, Alastor's an interesting character who has a level of depth and care and personality (outside of cruelty) that asexual psychopath tropes lack. Again, the moments where he's being represented as disinterested in sex or romance don't make him seem detached. Again, they don't say "look how hostile toward relationships his behaviour is - how separate he is from our humanity". That's what bad villain ace rep is. That's not what the show's doing.

Also: I'm not saying that we need to lower our standards or anything, but even if you think it's not the best rep, I feel like we should be supporting HH's efforts here. I know that on Tumblr we have a pretty queer-friendly space going, which is honestly an understatement lol but

Aces are incredibly underrepresented in fiction. There's a whole Wikipedia page about asexual characters in media, and it's short as all hell, and even if you consider what's on there you see quite a number of one-off characters who are never mentioned again.

In terms of real life business - before the DSM updated their definition of hypoactive sexual desire disorder (HSDD) in 2013, identifying as asexual wasn't even a recognized thing. If you talked to a clinician about your lack of sexual desire, you could be diagnosed with a disorder. Only in the 5th edition do we now have a little exclusion footnote about it.

The concept of asexuality hasn't been explored nearly as much as other queer identities in our scientific research. We get crumbs in terms of mainstream representation and understanding. House M.D. has an episode where House "disproves" us because he's just so smart.

Alastor isn't going to be perfect representation. There's no such thing as perfect representation, and from the moment he was conceptualized, you could see how people would take him poorly. Still, I think he's a net positive.

He isn't a side character or a token ace - he's a core part of the show, whose personality and character motivations we can reasonably presume are going to be explored much more deeply in upcoming season(s). He's loved by the fandom. Right now, given what we know, I trust Vivziepop to write the aroace representation he deserves, because with the way I've heard the cast/directing/etc. talk about him, they're trying to do the aroace community justice, so I wish people would let up just a little on the whole "Alastor is bad rep".

Let's give him a chance, all right?

#hazbin hotel #aroace alastor #alastor analysis #hazbin alastor #hazbin hotel spoilers #asexual #asexuality #hazbin alastor meta #hazbin hotel alastor #hazbin #alastor #hazbin meta #hazbin analysis

[villainsposting]

Favorite aspect of Alastor revealed in the show has gotta be that he loves being the center of attention. He's said to be an enigma, yet he thrives on people being curious about him. He wants to know what people think of his deal with Charlie. He wants people to wonder why he has been missing for seven years. And the majority of the few times we see his smile grow tense is when his mystery is disregarded.

Which explains why he enjoys his rivalry with Vox. Vox's obsession is a reliable source of attention for him. No matter what Alastor does, Vox will be there trying to undermine him. And watching him try is a dual source of enjoyment: it is fun to see his enemy stumble and glitch in frustration, but damn does Alastor also enjoy being in the spotlight, even if in the mind of just one person.

#alastor #hazbin hotel #vox #radiostatic #tv or radio #original post #hazbin meta

[nunalastor]

source

#hazbin hotel #alastor #vox #radiostatic #meta

[metalatias5]

The TRUE reason why they both went missing for 7 years XD

(Also that's totally the big fight Vox and Alastor apparently had where Alastor almost beat him, pff)

#Hazbin Hotel #Alastor #Radio Demon #Vox #lilith morningstar #Hazbin Lilith #Meta #MetaTheTrifox #MetaLatias #MetaLatias5

[prince-liest]

Some thoughts on Lucifer's mental health, relationships, and role as king of hell!

Lucifer’s perception of himself as the king of hell is really interesting to me because he’s very blase about it in canon while totally using it when it suits him.

I think it’s really telling that the first time he actually brings it up himself is when it’s something he can leverage to help Charlie out. He reads to me like someone who objectively knows that he’s the hottest shit in town, but also just doesn’t really think that it matters most of the time because it's not relevant to his personal problems. Being Lucifer Morningstar did not allow him to achieve his goals in petitioning heaven. Being the most powerful person in hell didn’t even un-fuck his family life!

...Except for when suddenly it might in fact help un-fuck his relationship with his daughter.

It's the main thing he can desperately and dramatically showcase as a worthwhile reason for Charlie to maintain a relationship with him, because he as a person is depressed, half-functional, and barely has enough spoons to pay attention to a conversation he's having with her while he's actively having it, nevermind remembering their last one.

He wants to! And it doesn't start with his song at the hotel! It starts with him answering the phone, heavily fumbling actually connecting with Charlie despite clearly desperately wanting to, and then realizing she's asking him for something and promptly choking on his tea before excitedly telling her, "Yeah! Of course! Anything within my power is yours for the asking, you just name it." He knows that there is a great deal 'within his power,' and he's happy and relieved that he can offer her that!

Lilith has been gone for years but he's still wearing his wedding ring. His walls are still covered in family portraits. He's just been sitting in his room making thousands of rubber ducks he thinks suck instead of ruling hell, because his daughter liked that one duck he made one time.

Charlie needed him to support her in her mission, but damn did Lucifer also need Charlie to get him out and moving and actually doing things again.

Anyway, someone get this man on an SSRI.

#hazbin hotel #hazbin lucifer #lucifer magne #lucifer morningstar #meta #personal #text posts #long post #expanding on some comments I made about him in an ask! #can't WAIT to find out what his and Lilith's deal is #my funky little depressed king #Alastor took him not knowing who he was personally #but after his comments about watching TV and not remembering Charlie's hotel #I think it's pretty clear Lucifer is just out of touch as hell because he hasn't got the spoons to function like people think he would #ETA: I tried to write a little rambling meta post failed to get my feelings out and now I'm 3k words into a fic #I NEED TO JUST REMEMBER THAT FIC COMMUNICATES MY FEELINGS BETTER..........

[justanotherhh]

alastor and touch

just a post documenting alastor and touches throughout the show

I didn't include the pilot, but i do want to mention it, because one thing that's quite striking is how they changed that element from pilot!alastor to show!alastor somewhat. might make a separate post for the pilot at some point to compare

I also did a mix of when alastor noticeably doesn't touch someone directly and in what contexts he gets touched, as well as a couple of other related boundaries and moments of interest

ep1 overture: alastor doesn't touch anyone in this episode. also noting that this is the episode where we get him unequivocally turning down angel's advances, and avoiding being filmed several times, with the iconic "this face was made for radio" line, so not only is he not touching, he's also making some general boundaries clear

ep2 radio killed the video star: 1. niffty crawls up alastor and he picks her up and puts her down. she crawls up him again. he clearly doesn't mind 2. sir pentious rips off a corner of his coat. alastor blows him up -- he later burns the piece of coat that sir pentious had kept: "not many people have been able to take even this much off me." 3. the entirety of the vox vs al showdown is of course notably done over radio/tv, so they're never in the same room. just interesting in terms of how it goes down with them generally in s1, they're constantly kept at a distance via screens and airwaves

ep3 scrambled eggs: 1. taps an egg boi with his staff, while threatening it. generally uses his stick to interact with the egg bois -- pointing, tapping, etc 2. another brief "makes screen fuzzy on a security camera"

ep4 masquerade: notably the episode (with lots of sexual content and specifically valentino) where he doesn't appear, except for briefly in a flashback

ep5 dad beat dad: 1. shakes lucifer's cane, rather than his hand -- he also wipes his hand on his suit afterwards, as if disgusted 2. TOUCHES CHARLIE'S SHOULDER!! notably in front of lucifer in order to piss him off. then goes ONE STEP FURTHER and partially puts his arm around her when saying how proud they all are of her 3. grabs lucifer and spins him out of the way during his part of the song 4. picks niffty out of the toilet 5. during the song: dances with charlie, pats her on the head/tucks her in, and puts his hands on her shoulders 6. during the song: pushes lucifer aside again, including doing a little hip shove 7. lucifer grabs him by his lapels and gets right in his face 8. hugs mimzy 9. grabs charlie and steers her by the shoulders 10. grabs/strokes husk's ear 11. grabs husk via his leash 12. rips the bad guys apart with his tentacles. also picks them up with his hands and eats them 13. mimzy pokes him several times in the chest. he removes her finger in annoyance, and boops her on the nose condescendingly

ep6 welcome to heaven: the other episode that notably includes a sex club (and also heaven and a lot of talk about redemption) that does not involve alastor

ep7 hello rosie: 1. grabs charlie's shoulders, and then her face, forcing her to smile 2. grabs her shoulders again when talking about the angels 3. touches her hair, and then sidehugs her while selling her on the deal 4. DEAL HANDSHAKE 5. more shoulder grabbing, cheek pinching, and patting on head when he's talking about her being charming and capable 6. links arms with her while taking her to rosie 7. rosie joyfully grabs him and spins him around 8. grabs charlie when introducing her to rosie 9. gives charlie his mic in order to help her inspire the cannibals (later replaced with a cane given by rosie) 10. dances with rosie, including a little dip

ep8 the show must go on: 1. more attempted screen voyeurism by vox 2. charlie uses alastor's cane again to speech 3. niffty crawls over him again and places a crown of roaches on his head (possibly his most openly joyous moment) 4. fights adam using his shadow tentacles and creatures, before getting seriously wounded by him (and then has his famous mental breakdown at the idea that his reputation could have been blemished by having been read as altruistic of all things, *spits*) 5. the torn picture of alastor and vox shows them a little apart from one another 6. appears in the middle of the hotel gang and is hugged by charlie, patted on the back by vaggie, and also adorably hugged around the legs by niffty

GENERAL OBSERVATIONS: 1. other characters do initiate more touches, with husk being the other character who's more standoffish, but that's also his general slowly beginning to open up emotionally and he shifts especially with regards to angel after ep4 (although he does do casual pats and the like before that + the massage) 2. generally everyone touches casually in some way or other throughout the show, including in background moments, except for alastor, who always touches very deliberately, whether it's for violence, manipulation, condescension, or affection -- he doesn't seem to engage in casual touch, but does accept it from certain individuals (mainly niffty). for example in dad beat dad in which he initiates the most touches, he's pissing off lucifer and manipulating charlie. he hasn't touched her before this on the show proper, and he's doing it because he has an audience and is trying to convince both lucifer and her of something (that he's a better mentor/support system than lucifer) 3. similarly when he's being very familiar with charlie in hello rosie, he's selling her on making a deal with him, and then on making himself indispensable to her, while also grooming her*** [EDIT: been informed that this could be misread: "grooming" here meant in the general sense of mentoring her in a way that would benefit him, as he says "she's full of potential that i could guide," NOT in a sexual context] -- in true alastor fashion it's hard to say what's sincere and what's self-serving, but it certainly all serves a purpose 4. that being said, i think charlie has become a character he doesn't mind touching, just like he doesn't mind it with niffty, rosie, or mimzy. funnily enough the only time charlie initiates a touch with him is in the finale, when she's relieved he's alive 5. i think the kinds of touches from each of these characters is different. with charlie it's that aforementioned part-manipulation, part-mentor type vibe, where he's very much insinuating himself into her good graces and trust, with niffty it's because She Is A Creature Who Crawls, with mimzy there's a Past (and she clearly crosses a boundary because she thinks she can with him, and he puts his foot down on that), and with rosie there's a respect. before i did this noting down i also thought he touched rosie way more than he actually does, but he only does it once in order to dance (which, if anything else even applies, i think is his main source of actually enjoying touching others, i personally don't think he actually enjoys hugs, it's just a Thing some people expect of you), and simply acquiesces to her grabbing him in the first scene. again, i think he accepts this because he likes her 6. This Deer Does Not Touch Men If He Can Help It

CONCLUSION: if alastor respects you, he will let you touch him to an extent. he's not touchy himself, and mainly does it as a show of power, manipulation, and condescension (lucifer, mimzy, husk, charlie), but he likes dancing. he stays faaar away from sexual contexts in general

I also want to do a separate post on alastor and respect/closeness/familiarity, because i think it's worthwhile analysing how he expresses these things with characters on his terms (for example, giving charlie the mic says far more about his positive feelings towards her than any of the times he touches her), and it's mostly very clear when he's comfortable in a situation and when he's not

#aroace alastor #alastor #hazbin hotel #hh meta #alastor meta #my meta