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fallen-elytrian · 1 year

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Okay, okay, I’m going to start this by saying I haven’t actually watched the lore yet, I’ve only seen people screaming about it

But, but. Apparently. Sam and Phil knew each other. Really knew each other. Before the Dream SMP. But had a falling out because of Sam’s clones

I feel like that adds a LOT of layers to the interaction Sam and Phil have in that one Tommy stream. The one right after dream escapes prison (link timestamp- 41:51)

They have this interaction:

Sam: Oh, Philza

Phil: Sam

Sam: it’s good to see you!

Phil: I wish I could say the same

And I know, I know it’s mainly because the prison break literally just happened but. I can’t help but feel. There’s a lot being unsaid there. That it goes deeper than that

“I wish I could say the same” I wish I didn’t know this was a clone. I wish you were who you were before all this. I wish you listen to me when I told you to stop. I wish I was looking at the original you

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hopalongfairywren · 2 years

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Crimeboys

-holy shit. after two years. It’s done. Soft ending crimeboys guys. Now I’m sure this isn’t the end of c!dream’s plans for the server. But I think this marks at least the start of that green, wretched poison finally fading from Tommy’s sight.

-And their story doesn’t end with this. It only just begins. C!Tommy and c!wilbur will heal. They will grow. They will laugh and cry, and be human. Be alive. Their isn’t a happy ending for them because their is no such thing as a happy ending. Life is just an endless cycle, and it takes us all to do our part to make ourselves and other’s happy. It’s time for c!Tommy, who is the universe, the one who made this SMP what it is, to wake up. Because he played the game well. He is love. And it’s time for him to start a new dream.

#dream smp #dsmp #tommyinnit #c!tommy #wilbur soot #c!wilbur #dream smp lore analysis #dsmp lore #crimeboys #c!crimeboys #finally #peace for the inniters #(I think)#and wilburians #(I hope)#the wren hops #post lore discussion

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bleue-flora · 17 days

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What's often interesting to me, is Dream spells it out in the finale and people often still don't get it, so I thought it'd be interesting to see what he was actually referencing here. To see where it all started.

[24:27] Tommy: “That first war, me and Tubbo versus you–how it should have ended–why’d you take it?” Dream: “Tommy, you ambushed me and killed me. You stole all my shit! You tried ambushing me in a little cave–you don’t remember that? I feel like you just–your memory is just–gone.”

So here is the ambush Dream is talking about, where Sapnap and Tommy basically decide to just kill Dream and then kept all of his shit. [Death 1]

He gets killed again when he tries to take back his stuff. [Death 2]

Tommy kills him for fun right after he respawns with nothing. [Death 3]

Then after Dream gets his stuff back (via our boy Punz) and he takes the discs to get Tommy to stop, he gives Tommy back his items. But unsatisfied, Tommy goes after Dream, gets one of his discs back and hides it in the little cave. Dream tries to find it, while Sapnap and Tommy try to stop him. They are unsuccessful until, Tubbo brings them axes and they sneak up and corner Dream in the little cave, ambushing and killing him. Once again, taking all of his shit, (including, yes, the other disc.) [Death 4]

[27:58] Tommy: “Think about that, we could’ve been friends but no because you have to figure out the reason you have to get–” Dream: “Yeah we could’ve but you–you ruined the chance of that long ago. It was you.” Tommy: “I ruined it?” Dream: “You ruined it!”

And I don’t think it’s unfair for Dream to say that in the finale, because for Dream it’s this stream early on, these moments that started it all. It’s these instances of of Dream getting murdered and robbed and made fun of over and over. Him, trying to not just make peace for everyone, but also reclaim respect and peace for himself. It’s Tommy chasing after Dream when he has nothing to kill him and rub it in his face. It’s Dream, even after all of that, giving back their items. It’s these instances of violence taken too far to the point they clearly pissed Dream off and didn’t care or follow his very simple request of just giving an apology and his belongings back that shape my distaste for Tommy and sympathy for Dream. It’s these moments that I feel like are gone from Tommy’s and our memory that highlight a different story.

[28:34] Dream: “Yeah, we could have been friends if you weren’t a little shit.”

#c!dream #dsmp #don’t worry I’m also covering what Tommy next to be fair…#dreblr #dream smp #dsmp finale #dsmp analysis #dsmp lore #dishing up lore #lore thoughts #c!tommy #interestingly enough it is actually tubbo who kills him here in the cave which is an interesting parallel to tubbo killing him in the final #c!tommyinnit #dsmpblr #c!discduo #discduo #c!dream and c!tommy #I sometimes like think that maybe these three or at least on of these deaths was canonical for Dream since it is plot relavent #and how interesting that would be to shape the story because then the gravity of it becomes that much more real #this of course only works if Dream and punz could later revive people back to fill lives which unclear if that’s true or not…#I did consider this more before I saw a post highlighting that punz and dreams tests on themselves happened after the staged finale

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10piecechickenmcnugget · 1 year

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Okay i NEEEED to rant about Pogtopia because I know it was a ravine and shit but I need people to consider: lava caves

(all photos taken by me cause I explored one the other day and that’s where I got this idea)

Lava caves or lava tubes are HUGE super long caves that were carved out by literal lava flows and now just sit there and they’re cool as fuck

they’re cold as shit and the roof can vary from being dozens of feet above your head to being so low you have to crouch

there’s piles of rocks and ice formations and sand gardens and they are PITCH BLACK if you don’t have any lights and they paths can be crazy wide or super narrow and the ground is full of drop offs

ones that are made for people to explore have railings and stairs in certain places too and some even have built in lights or like the one I explored let you rent a flashlight

also a fun sidenote the ground is super hard packed sand full of holes from water dripping and it’s so hard packed that you don’t leave footprints (this would not help with Wilbur’s derealization)

anyways I think this would all work SUPER well for pogtopia cause cold/dark/shifting atmosphere/adding railings and pathways is already a thing in pogtopia

some more images that I yanked from google:

anyways PLEASEEEE consider spreading my vision Pogtopia lava cave/tubes for the win I’ve never been more right about anything in my life

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arctasy · 2 years

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i will never get over the way c!wilbur's character explored themes revolving around perceiving yourself through a narrative and projecting conventions of storytelling and media onto your own life out of a need to become part of something greater and more “beautiful” than yourself. the complicated relationship between life and art: which imitates which? the attempt to aestheticize your own suffering in the hope of creating a “masterpiece” that makes it all somehow worth it. convincing yourself that you are a character on a stage and must play your part so you don’t have to admit to yourself that you’re tired and hurting and it’s easier than putting in the work to heal. just. god. c!wilbur’s story means so much to me

#was working on notes for my english class and it touched on some of this stuff #and now i am overcome with the lore brainrot #i have yet to see another piece of media that explores it as well as wilbur though #wilbur soot #c!wilbur #dsmp analysis #dream smp #og post

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piningpebbles · 9 months

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the dream smp journey: attempting to make the lore of the dream smp more accessible.

so back when i first wanted to get into the dream smp i had absolutely no idea where to start. i asked some people and they told me pretty much “look up dream smp + [insert youtuber name] and start there” and so i did, but i quickly came to realize how much i was missing from the story by not seeing all the different points of view.

so i decided to make my own playlist.

it was just for myself at first, but as i got more obsessed with the story, i also gave the link to some friends of mine so they could have the full experience, and they loved it. so i kept updating it.

my goal was to try and make a capsule of the entirety of the lore on the dream smp across almost every single POV, because while i do appreciate those who make recap videos, they always miss something and it’s usually with peoples’ POV who aren’t considered to be “main characters” which sucks because one of my favorite things about the dream smp was how everyone was their own main character with their own individual storyline you could get invested in.

i’ve seen every single video in the playlist, and did my absolute best to discern what should be included and what didn’t need to be.

for instance, while i personally enjoyed streams where they’d just goof off, this is a lore-centric playist so i didn’t include all of them unless one of the jokes or such gets mentioned/becomes important later on. or if there is a lore event happening but two people have almost identical streams to one another then i decided between the two of them which one to keep. or if the cc themself made an edited version of their experience, i would decide whether to go with that or keep the original vod

it’s far from perfect. i tried to keep up with it as long as i could I STILL HAVE VIDEOS IN MY WATCH LATER THAT I PLANNED TO ADD but simply put while the dream smp storyline got longer and longer it became harder to keep up with. i watched pretty much all the streams when they happened but failed to update the playlist accordingly so right now it has almost everything up until ”Hitting on 16.”

i always wanted to finish it before i posted it, but i’ve been seeing people talk about how they miss the experience of watching the dream smp and while i obviously can’t provide the full interactive experience that the dream smp offered as it came out, i knew i couldn’t just keep this in my back pocket and thought i could at least offer a good chunk of the experience for you guys to still be able to keep!

here’s the playlist, spanning over 300 videos.

there’s also a semi-canon playlist (not nearly as thorough) for events that get mentioned by the cc’s a lot or are just cool to have and i wanted to include them somewhere so here it is also!!

to go along with it i also made a masterpost (can you tell i love making lists) which is what every single video on the playlist is supposed to be (and was last i checked, but videos get taken down every so often so there might be a couple missing here and there).

i hope to update this one day and have it fully finished, but with my schedule (full-time college student babyyyy) and simply the hundreds of hours of content i’d need to sift through it just seems impossible (and frankly just really intimidating) to challenge alone right now. so i also wanted to give this to the community to maybe be able to do what i couldn’t!

my hope with this is that if someone in a year or two (or whenever really) is interested in the dream smp they won’t have to sit through recap videos and instead can watch the real thing in a single playlist connected to the doc. my dream is for the masterpost and the playlist to go hand-in-hand, being like a guide people can follow that would also link to other moments and lore that is saved but just not avaliable on youtube, so we don’t have all these moments just lost to time.

i want to make this collaborative, i’m hoping this will maybe spark others to share what videos/moments they have saved and stored with each other for the dream smp and maybe together we could complete this thing somehow!! make the playlist and masterpost i dreamed of (the one right now is scuffed, but at least it’s something). the dream smp is one of my absolute favorite pieces of media out there and i want to share this with people but (as you can probably tell) i have no idea what i’m doing!! any step to help make the story more readily accessible is a good one, though!

i know i’ve missed things but i’ve done my best. and while not the perfectly polished thing i hoped it would be when i sent it out to the world maybe it could be a good building block for the community to use. so please share this!! reblog it!! all that jazz!! i want this to be for everyone!!

anyways, this is a long post. but the whole reason i got into the dream smp in the first place was because of the awesome fan content i saw and this crazy and creative community and i want to be able to give back, if i can.

#dream smp #the dream smp journey #dream smp lore #mcyt #tommyinnit #jack manifold #c!tommy #c!jack #(sorry jack and tommy gotta use you to cross-tag)#(is it even crosstagging if they're IN the playlist?.... lot to think about)#i really wanted to add more to this #my goal was to catch up on all the videos and then go back and transcribe each one (or link pre-existing transcriptions)#and then add content warnings if need be #i had this idea too where say you just finished up the nov.16th lore after that it would be cool to link you to sad-ist's animation!!#just things like that! i had a lot of things i was thinking about #anyways thanks for reading my c!jack analysis posts throughout all this time now you may have my massive lore bank i've been holding onto #cheers!!!#rambling rocks #like.. holy shit #will this even turn into anything? i don't know. i hope so #i want to come back to this and give it the TLC it deserves #but until i find the time + motivation for that i didn't want to keep it just to myself #i just hope this is a good step towards making the dream smp story more accessible to people #pebble post

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audodd2 · 1 year

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FUCK. Remember when Tommy was hiding with Techno right after exile and Techno had him drink invis to hide from Dream. He is returning to that, back to the security of hiding in plain sight because he's endlessly curious and absolutely terrified of the world around him. He avoided Wilbur/didn't see him for a while and the second he did mans ups and leaves. He's terrified it's going to happen again so he's been watching the people he cares about and the people he hates just so he knows they're still there. Just so he can have some semblance of control. Tommy's limbo was darkness, complete isolation. Does this play into claustrophobia? Absolutely. But it more so plays into the fear of the unknown, of being completely ignorant of your surroundings and defenseless against them. Tommy doesn't wear armor (he hasn't since exile but that's a whole other rant). He's used to being defenseless physically, but if he doesn't know his surroundings he can't react to them, can't mold to them how he needs to in order to survive. He's fine without armor, but without information he is weak, he is nothing. Invisibility makes so much sense. And it makes the fact that his character needs to be seen, needs to be valued, needs to be needed so much more painful. Also, I count this as bedrock bros crumbs and you cannot stop me.

#dsmp #dsmp lore #dsmp tommy #dsmp analysis #tommyinnit #ctommy #ctechno #technoblade #bedrock bros #dream smp

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fernflowerss · 1 year

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Can we PLEASE talk about the parallel between

Wilbur's "Then let's be the bad guys" and

Tommy's "I don't want to be the bad guy"

#i am literally NOT ok #like??????#and then he STILL ask wilbur #well his grave??#for guidance??????#i want tk cry so bad????#he wants to be the opposite of what wilbur is but this whole stream just proved that he is still VERY much under wilbur's influence #dsmp #dream smp #tommyinnit #wilbur soot #c!wilbur #c!tommy #crimeboys #dsmp lore #dsmp lore analysis

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elmhat · 11 months

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I think what makes dsmp lore discourse so different from any other media is just how vague it really is.

For example, one of the most basic parts of any story is what happens. It sounds crazy to specify, because it is, for any piece of media—which makes the dsmp a very strange anomaly. What counts as "lore"? Was this interaction canon, or was it just the content creators messing around? It's especially unclear with the earlier streams, where lore wasn't really considered to be a thing yet. It's hard to debate about the character's intentions behind an action when we can't even agree if that action happened.

Then, say we've decided that it did happen—there's the matter of how it happened. What kind of universe are we in? Are characters participating in global politics, with heavily populated nations under their leadership? Or are there handfuls of people running around waging wars with five fighters to a side? How big is the world? What's beyond the central populated area—other nations, or nothing at all? How does society function? The lack of concrete answers here can cause dramatic differences in the way some events are perceived: e.g. Doomsday.

There's also a lack of clarity about what is or isn't possible. It seems like the content creators relied more heavily on minecraft mechanics in the early days, but drifted away from it later; this is probably the most notable with canon deaths. If a canon death occurred before the canon deaths system was introduced, can it still be considered with the same weight? Does that count as a retcon of the intention behind the death? Where do we draw the line between real-world logic and minecraft logic, and at what point, if any, does this change?

There are no right answers to these questions. We weren't given any. It means that everyone will draw their own conclusions from their own inferences, and will as such view the story through a completely different lens. It's no wonder that the discourse is so extreme.

While all of that is kind of annoying, and while the fights and harassment that have come out of this fandom are undoubtedly the worst part about it, I'd like to offer a more optimistic outlook. In my opinion, the vagueness of canon is what has kept the dsmp fandom alive. No other media has this much opportunity for AUs and headcanons, animatics and fanart and fanfics—because it's easier to play with a flexible world than a rigid one. Because the whole thing is one big blank box for the viewers to fill in themselves. The streams gave us a glimpse into each content creator's vision for their world, and now it's up to us to flesh them out ourselves.

#dsmp #dream smp #dsmp analysis #discourse #kind of?#lore thoughts #random elm thoughts

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nomsfaultau · 4 months

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RELIGION? IN MY DSMP? MORE LIKELY THEN YOU THINK

Anyways would you like to have a debate like Ancient Greek scholars about religious imagery on the DSMP

“…and every revival only births a perversion of the original, and yet a return to form and renewal of the mission. Wilbur brought back to ambition, Tommy to fear, Techno to anarchy. This is because they were not properly revived through holy means, instead in symbols associated with satanic imagery; a grimoire, a totem. The revival book’s association with Dream echos ideas of Satan offering power that ultimately corrupts. Other symbols of Christianity show up beyond souls, revival, and satanic imagery, likewise tied to Dream. In the garden of Eden—”

“Golden apple as a symbol of the temptation of power! Of course of course! Knowledge as power, the fall of man from grace. This shows particular on the summit meeting between Techno and Dream, wherein a god apple is given by Dream. This falls neatly into parallel with Eden, where Eve is lured with the promise of having the same wisdom and thus power as god. It is the temptation presented, power promised in the same breath as suffering and conflict…”

#Imma be real I fixated on the characters and not the lore so much but I am so down bc I love silly literary analysis #Crap now I’m thinking of exodus/pogtopia parallels #Trying to find a way to work in cannanite>cain as a symbol of farming v animal husbandry. Brothers. Betrayal. Techno>plants tomy>animal-pet #Aw hell #Apparently I have thoughts about this #Anyway totally down to discuss stuff though warning I’ll probably mess up details bc it’s been awhile #Angel of death Phil…I have Thoughts for you……..#Dsmp #dsmp analysis #dream smp #c!tommy #c!wilbur #c!techno #c!dream #mcyt #dsmp meme #tw christianity #christian imagery #something to nom on

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fallen-elytrian · 2 years

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Okay okay I have some feeling about the Wilbur Fundy lore.

I really don’t like the bad dad Wilbur thing. Like Fundy saying Wilbur made him eat on the floor? REALLY leaves a bad taste in my mouth

That’s not what we’ve seen. That’s not what Wilbur’s been. We’ve seen Wilbur in lmanburg. He was very nurturing to Fundy as well as Tommy and Tubbo. He was constantly encouraging and he was always complimenting Fundy and bragging about him to other people

Wilbur wasn’t a bad dad. That’s the point. That adds to the tragedy of it all.

If Wilbur is a bad father figure, that’s boring. Like oh he’s not nurturing or encouraging and then blows up a nation yup okay whatever that makes sense, we saw this coming, no characters are surprised by this.

But that’s not the case. He’s telling people to do their best and trying to help everyone believe in the cause and he wants everyone to feel safe. He feels a responsibility to lead the people in lmanburg and protect them

I will remind everyone of the moment right after Tommy and Wilbur get exiled where they’re in the in the woods and Wilbur falls to his knees in anguish and yells “my son! MY SON! Tearing down the walls I built to protect him” I’m not saying he was perfect, but Wilbur wasn’t a bad dad

And that’s the point! That adds to the tragedy! We see him in lmanburg. Caring for Fundy. Encouraging Tommy. Helping Tubbo. We see that he’s kind and that he’s trying his best

And then the election happens. And he and Tommy get forced into pogtopia. And suddenly things are hard. Really hard. But he’s still trying! He’s trying to be there for Tommy. And no doubt, it’s worse now. He can’t quite be the encouraging figure he was before. But he’s still trying

And that’s why people still trust him. Why Tommy and Tubbo don’t lose faith. They see he’s trying. They still trust him! They remember who he was before his downward spiral

That’s why they still believe that if they win things will be okay. That Wilbur will be okay. That he’ll go back to who he was before.

But then Wilbur blows up the nation anyway. And none of the characters thought he’d actually go through with it. But he does. That’s gut-wrenching

It just makes the story so, so much more meaningful if we remember that Wilbur was a good father figure. The narrative is much more compelling that way. Wilbur was a good father. Don’t forget that

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hopalongfairywren · 1 day

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never seen you talk about it, but I might’ve missed it. so uh any thoughts on c!eret at the red banquet? I miss her dearly

One of my favorite underrated moments, possibly in the whole server, is when c!Eret was about to be executed and calls the eggpire monsters for betraying everyone's trust. c!Ponk responds 'Okay Eret, you wanna talk about trust.' Obviously referencing the final control room, and c!Eret responds that 'he knew better now not to betray people's trust'. And I just find that fascinating because c!Ponk wasn't involved in the final control room. Yes his lemon tree technically kick-started the lore but he really didn't have anything to do with the revolution arc. And we got him making a snarky comment at c!Eret! I really like hearing characters within universe, react to other characters decisions and bring up their pasts especially characters who don't really interact that often, which the red banquet was kind of the end of the Dream SMP server getting together and having characters who weren't necessarily 'important' to that plot point, show up and interact in what felt like a natural way. (barring the prison break) For a story that became so focused on history, and how our choices impact how other people view us, I feel like that just didn't happen as much as it could have. Or should have, in my opinion.

#thanks for the ask!#the wren calls #dream smp #dsmp #dsmpblr #dsmp lore #dsmp lore analysis #egg arc #egg lore #eggpire #c!ponk #c!eret #I almost answered something about the unused potential of a c!hannah/eret parallel but that's low hanging fruit for me

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bleue-flora · 15 days

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Ok, so can we talk about Punz for a second? Because like when I rewatched that stream the other day, not only did I notice that is was Punz who avenged Dream by killing Tommy and returning all of his stuff, after Sapnap and Tommy had ambushed Dream and refused to return it [details] (making him truly the mvp, who really doesn’t get enough credit). But I also noticed some other fun things.

Specially this.

And this.

Tommy punches Dream -> immediately killed by Punz [clip].

Like okay maybe we could make the point that Dream pays him to kill Tommy and reclaim all of his stuff [clip], but pretty sure Dream isn’t paying him to be so protective.

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anxiouslyextroverted · 1 year

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So a few of my irls were talking about how c!dream never targetted c!tommy and or had a dependency issue and I just wanna correct that.

c!Dream at the start of the series (since now the start is considered canon) constantly went after the discs even when c!Tommy told him he wanted to have a truce and that they were allies even wanting to play them together with c!Dream. c!Dream agreed to those terms but then attacked him 5 minutes later anyway.

Not forgetting the first disc fight where c!Dream targetted c!Tommy the whole time and only gave c!Sapnap and c!Ponk and c!Alyssa a slap on the wrist.

c!Dream spent a good portion of a Tommy stream donating him msgs to play the discs.

A couple of early streams of c!Dream trying to get c!Tubbo o someone else against c!Tommy.

Not really targetting but he said "Tommy is under my protection" which is that dependency thing idk it counts.

c!Dream built a tunnel to c!Tommys base.

c!Dream during L'manberg arc seemed more against c!Tommy than c!Wilbur and the others more often than not.

c!Dream focused on getting c!Tommys friends against him, such as most notably c!Tubbo and c!Wilbur in pogtopia arc.

c!Dream betrays c!Tommy in pogtopia arc after initially helping c!Tommy out. He tells c!Tommy this is due to 'business' he also tells him, 'that he put something better over friendship' (aka the revival book he got from c!Schlatt) (either way, he still betrayed him.)

He tells c!Tommy at the end of l'manberg blowing up that 'everythings just getting started', and makes it out as if c!Tommy was in the wong.

A few weeks before exile. c!Dream and c!Puffy went around destroying everything including c!Skeppys home and then framing it on c!Tommy with signs. c!Dream in particular is excited for people to log on and for them to get mad at c!Tommy.

The above was confirmed canon when during Exile trial, c!Dream says that c!Tommy had blown up c!Skeppys house (or he infers it), showing the damage that he himself did.

In Exile trial, I'm not gonna lie c!Tommy totallyyy fucked up here by burning a little TINY tiny small tiny bit of c!Georges home and then trying to fix it. And then he lied about it. (/sarc) But, c!Dream was provoking him in the whisper chat with ":)" and "have fun on probation :)"

During exile, he focuses on putting all blame for his problems on c!Tommy. Not just saying that to c!Tommys face but on other people's streams, he was there talking about how much of a nuisance c!Tommy is and what not.

In exile, he proceeds to get c!Tommy dependent on him so c!Tommy will help with his goals later on. But the way he goes about this is to a severe extreme like how he snaps at him and hits him with an axe or arrow, he takes great enjoyment in bullying c!Tommy and getting others like c!Lazarbeam to bully him too, he makes sure c!Tommy is completely lonely even sending c!Ghostbur away who was memory loss so how could he break c!Dreams plans exactly?, he gasights c!Tommy into thinking that c!Dream didn't kill Mexican Dream, he blows up c!Tommys base despite never telling c!Tommy the rule about how he can't have chests underground.

He goes onto track c!Tommy down. And again, its more the way he goes about it.

Once c!Tommy is back in L'manberg, c!Dream blows up the community house and frames it on c!Tommy. Getting everyone against him and he tells c!Tubbo that he is affiliated to c!Tommy based on the disc that he says is 'Tommys most prized possession' which is him getting c!Tubbo to go against c!Tommy once more.

After Lmanberg gets blown up again. c!Dream tells c!Tommy "I'm not done with you. Our stories not over... Our stories not over" c!Tommy says "Our stories not over but it will be... It will be soon" and c!Dream replies "I don't think our story will ever be over, Tommy. I think that you're just too fun. I don't think It'll be over."

In disc finale, he proceeds to act like that c!Tommy is his main target, calling him the key to the server and going after him more than c!Tubbo. And puts the idea in c!Clingyduos heads that he needs all the possesions to control the server. (now even though c!Dream staged this whole thing and wasn't actually saying his motivations, c!Tommy never knows that he lied about that not at this point at least. It further riles c!Tommy up and has him believing that c!Dream really is obsessed with hurting him and since c!Dream never explains why properly, it comes off to c!Tommy that he is obsessed for no reason.) (Also possible for it to be half staged making the motivations semi-true)

Then, c!Dream causes c!Tommy to get stuck in the cell with him by controlling c!Ranboo to do that (which this is confirmed that he really did do this, confirmed in the final lore stream and in dream xds video)

The point of c!Dream allegedly lying to make c!Tommy think c!Dream was after him all the time is further solidified when in the prison arc. c!Dream refers to c!Tommy as a light, and key and keeps going on about studying death with him. I know a lot of this may very well be real and a result from him being mentally ill from isolation, but theres so many lies sprinkled in here like telling c!Tommy that he never tested out the revival book before when he had (btw correct me if Im wrong here, I could of got the dates mixed up)

c!Sam also claims that c!Dream kept going on about c!Tommy in the prison, c!Sam also says that c!Dream was practically manically laughing after he killed c!Tommy. (Obsession, putting on an act of obsession, mentally ill from the prison sure maybe all 3)

After c!Dream escapes prison, he immediately goes after c!Tommy. (Which sure is to scare c!Tommy into no longer going after him or whatever it could be an act) But he's still putting the idea in c!Tommys head that he's obsessed with hurting him, and don't say that he did this unintentionally because we already have the 'you're too fun line' and several other moments to prove otherwise. He also then puts signs around c!Tommys home saying 'watch your back' and ":) I'm watching" and he makes a trap for c!Tommy to fall into playing back a messed up disc. Don't say that this was apart of c!Tommys delusion because c!Eryn saw it too and a few others did from what I remember-unless thats retconned idunno.

In c!Wilburs finale, c!Dream can't stand the idea of the discs being burned. (The discs are affiliated with c!Tommy as c!Dream has said before, and has said that the discs are c!Tommys most prized possesion) He still cares about them even now. He also watches c!Tommy for majority of the time.

In Dreams space, he claims that his character was not solely torturing c!Tommy for the sake of it, but that he still really enjoyed hurting c!Tommy. Its to vague to tell if Dream is denouncing the 'c!Dream is obsessed with c!Tommy' theory or not. I believe he is saying that it is half true- as in that his character is, but that he has reasons to do so, and or that this wasn't his only plan.

During the final lore finale, c!Dream claims that he wasn't targeting c!Tommy and that he had left him alone however that contradicts with everything I wrote above, so 1. He thinks he left c!Tommy alone, 2. He was referring to the present where he did leave him alone and purposely/or accidentally ignoring the past, or 3. he knows he didn't and is just trying to rile c!Tommy up. Either way he goes onto admit that he did cause c!Ranboo to get c!Tommy stuck in the prison. He also confirms later on that he genuinely believes c!Tommy is the cause of the ruining of his server. "Why are you ruining everything all the time" "You deserved it (torture)" "I am (a villain), I tortured you."

And not to mention. Out of everyone on the server that gets c!Dream to give up and somewhat open up, its c!Tommy... because ofc it is. No ones surprised.

I think that's everything. as always I'm happy to debate with people and stuff preferably in dms but idm. If anything is wrong, correct it. If anything is missed, let me know. ty

#long ass post #c!primeboys #sorry if Im wrong about somethings please correct me on anything I missed and or anything i was wrong about!#dsmp #c!tommy #im a little confused about the last part of the dot points cuz like i interpreted those scenes in like 10 diff ways help me #im assuming cdream lied about never using hte revival book before when he revived ctommy because the lazarbeam thing but then idk if that #happened before or after prison #but then again it was confirmed in disc finale that henry was revived henry or smth idk #dream smp #analysis #also disclaimer: i am aware that a lot of the c!prime early moments are cc!prime doing things for content and fun but since the first #c!tommy stream is canon then so is all those other streams #And in every cc! moment there is always a little bit of lore when its on the dsmp so it is included regardless ty

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snailsnfriends · 2 years

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there's nothing quite like cphil's "tommy, be nice." and ctommy's "are you joking? phil, you murdered him." tommy knows that he has no reason to respect, let alone listen to phil because of what he did to wilbur and what he did on doomsday, but he continued to stay friendly until he saw the scolding as a push from phil. because tommy doesn't carry his anger constantly, it comes out in frustrated bursts like this one, when he's particularly annoyed or upset. to tommy, phil has a lot of nerve. he took everything from tommy twice. tommy sees wilbur and l'manberg as synonymous, so killing wilbur was the first strike, and blowing up l'manberg was the second. so, in tommy's mind, why does phil think he has any right to scold him, even in a light hearted way? because of this, tommy lays it on thick, leaving phil to stand there and take it, alone in the cold, just as he was left on november 16th and doomsday.

#dream smp #tommyinnit #analysis? fucking finally #dream smp come back please i want to talk about lore so bad #snailtrail.slimes

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brekkiebrakkiebreakkie · 2 years

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One of the things I love love love about the recent lore is showing how much cdream just has other things to worry about. Like, I said this at the time of the prison break, that I'd like if it just became clear that the whole cTommy bit was, at least to dream, mostly over with. Like he'd so a little terrifying for fun and stuff, but primarily he does have other plans to be working towards

Like, cWilbur was talking like the discs and lmanburg (which apparently has an e and I will not stand for that) and having control over specifically Tommy were dreams end all be alls, but we see, literally during that stream and again hours later that that's not true

The discs don't matter to him as much anymore, lmanburg doesn't mean anything to him, people have seen him as a villain for so long calling himself a terrorist is no big deal. Being unassociated with the dsmp gives him the power of not having power, he could declare anything and whats it really gonna do? Who's gonna listen to him?

I 100% get why, but it's so funny to me how far behind Tommy and Wilbur are in dreams personal development, like in the grand scheme of things he's very much moved passed them. Like sure, could this be dream laying low until later to catch them off guard? I mean, yeah, but he has plans that he's putting into place and they don't seem to include the crime boys

He's got the whole Quackity and Sam and foolish thing to worry about. Sapnap's still hunting him, and he probably wants to check out Kinoko just a little bit. And who know what else he gets up to in his private life. Hes a busy man! He can't be expected to feed the fear of everyone on the server all the time, y'know?

#dreamwastaken #dream #dream smp #tommyinnit #wilbur soot #smp analysis #bridge-talks #ahhhh the lore talks are back baby

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