#anti spn hunters

[crowleys-bastard-angel]

New Anti-Hunter SPN Discord Server!

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Are you someone who likes SPN but hates Hunters/the concept of Hunting?

Do you think that their mass-murdering of Monsters is wrong? Do you hate how the show and the fandom always push them as "good/heroic"? Do you think that Jacob Pond should have been allowed to get revenge on Dean for killing his mother? Do you want to do an SPN rp where the Hunters aren't glorified for once?

If your answer to any of these is "yes", then you've come to the right place! SPN: The Real Monsters (18+) is, to my knowledge, the only Anti-Hunter SPN rp server on Discord!

We offer the ability to rp SPN without dealing with Hunters/Hunting being glorified, and without Supernaturals/Monsters being demonized and treated like shit! We also offer OOC channels to talk with like-minded people about SPN and other topics, share pictures and memes, and more!

If all of this sounds good to you, then come join us now, and fight back against the Hunters today!

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#spn #supernatural #anti hunters #anti spn hunters #anti monster hunters #pro supernaturals #pro monsters #pro angels #pro demons #anti dean winchester #anti winchesters #sam winchester critical #castiel critical #anti charlie bradbury #anti claire novak #anti john winchester #anti mary winchester #anti bobby singer #anti mick davies #anti arthur ketch #anti bmol #anti mol #anti british men of letters #anti men of letters #anti jody mills #anti spn #anti supernatural #spn critical #supernatural critical

[soullessjack]

I have a special amount of hatred for jack content where he’s kept as his canon-adult self but has all remnants of his actual personality bludgeoned out of him and is still infantilized to the point where he’s basically just portrayed as having the actual mental capacity of a child. “Jack can’t drink beer he orders apple juice and drinks sippy cups at bars,” “Don’t swear around Jack or he’ll repeat it,” “Jack can’t handle scary movies, he likes [insert silly non-scary media like animal crossing].” etc etc.

obviously I can’t speak for what the actual intent and appeal is, but it. honest to god just feels like a way for spn fans to keep infantilizing jack and get away with it bcit’s more covert than the usual de-aging/normal-baby aus and they think “look, he’s still an adult, we’re not infantilizing him!” is enough to avoid criticism. I don’t know how to tell you this, but if you are registering Jack as an adult and still going out of your way to give them literally infantile traits like sippy cups and not being allowed to say bad words and still fundamentally treating them as if they are a child, that is still infantilization and it is still horrendously ableist—whether the intention was there or not.

It’s not even a matter of ppl “personally seeing” Jack as a child, because he isn’t one regardless of personal opinion and it’s just stupid to insist on something that isn’t there. If you can watch this character basically become a military leader and flirt with a girl and do a whole slew of other things that a child cannot do and still “personally see” them as a child, then maybe you should reconsider why exactly you see them that way when the show very clearly does not, ask yourself if the “childlike” traits you think you’re picking up on aren’t just autistic traits and why you’re so uncomfortable with seeing this character as an adult.

#spn #supernatural #jack kline #spn fandom #jack spn #autistic jack kline #cw ableism #tw infantilization #the way some jack antis think he’s a coddled manchild and then spn fans are like hey wait that sounds awesome! let’s do that! #both of y’all go fuck yourselves Please #fandom ableism #just something I’ve been thinking about a lot…like #even when he isn’t a literal child he’s still seen and treated like one. #‘Jack can’t handle scary movies he needs someone to comfort him and say it isn’t real’ HE IS A FUCKING HUNTER AND HE LOVES HUNTING #HE FOUGHT A FUCKING WAR AND GOT LITERALLY JADED BY HOW MUCH DEATH HE SAW #I cannot fully express how much I fucking hate it here #truly

[hobbitual-psychick-art-stuff]

Suptober22 Day 18: Tattoos

The man pointed to the sign that said ‘Hunter’s Parking Only,’ with a scowl. “Gonna have to ask you to move that Chevrolet of yours buddy. The parking here is for real men.”

“We are hunters!”

The man looked them up and down with a grunt, looking unconvinced. “You don’t look like hunters.”

Dean scowled in response. “We are hunters, surely you’ve heard of us, Sam and Dean Winchester? Not to boast but we’re kind of a big deal in the mid-west.”

The man looked them up and down with another grunt. “Never heard of em. All I know is you look kinda— pretty to be hunters.”

Dean bristled. “Douchebag callin’ me pretty. We’re hunters Sam!”

Sam grabbed his brothers arm and dragged him a few steps back towards the impala, “Dean we can just park somewhere else…”

“It’s the principal of the thing!”

Sam pulled a bitchy face at him, “Good luck proving it. Cas healed us last month, remember? Neither one of us has a single scar.”

Dean grunted in irritation then his face brightened and he started pulling at his shirts. “We don’t got any scars, put we do have ink, anti-possession tattoos Sammy—“ he started back the way they’d come. “Hey man, you want proof we got proof, show him your ink Sam.”

With a scowl Sam copied his brother and flashed the man a look at the tattoo on his chest, above his heart.

Only for the man to bust out laughing. “Ohhh that was classic, of course I know who the Winchesters are, we’ve all read the books! I got you so good!”

#suptober22 #anti possession tattoo #sam winchester #dean winchester #tatoo #supernatural #art post #spn hunters

[scripted-downfall]

Survival of the Fittest

Okay, time out.  I just stumbled across some “anti-hunting” posts and I want to address it.  Before I do, though, I want to make clear my loyalties.  I watch Supernatural and I like the show.  I vastly prefer both Dean and Cas to Sam, while there is very little disparity between my affection for Dean and my affection for Cas.  I recognize that all characters make mistakes, with varying degrees of justifiability.  I recognize that, in some limited ways, hunter-hate can be valid.

But.  I want to address one particular point.  I no longer remember who posted this because I’ve been stewing on it for a while, but I remember that they argued that, “a group of humans going around and killing non-humans for the simple crime of killing a human, even when they were just starving and needed to eat, are the bad guys.”  And just.

No.

And I say no, not because I’m blindly on the side of the hunters — since, as I said, I fully recognize that they’re not always in the right — but because predation exists???  In the natural world???

I mean, put it this way… My family keeps chickens.  Hawks and raccoons eat chickens.  They do not eat chickens because they’re cruel or sadistic; they eat chickens because they’re hungry and chickens taste good.  Shocker of all shockers, the chickens don’t want to be eaten.  If you don’t think the chickens are going to attack any hawk or raccoon that comes into the coop, you’re mistaken.  They will do their very best to attack the predator before it kills them.  Oftentimes, they will fail and they get eaten anyway.

Saying that hunters can’t attack supernatural creatures who are eating humans simply because “the monster is just trying to survive” is like saying that chickens cannot attack the creatures that go to eat them, or that any prey doesn’t have the right to defend itself against its predators.

Also, to rephrase the initial point, it’s basically an argument that hunters have no right to kill supernatural creatures because said Supernaturals are just trying to survive.  In other words, Supernaturals shouldn’t be killed because their mission is survival.  Which… like… sure, I guess I follow the point, but also; the point of hunters is to protect humanity’s survival (albeit on an individual level)?  So the argument is that the Supernaturals’ survival somehow deserves to be inviolable at the cost of human survival?  But that’s deemed illogical by the alleged “logic” of the initial argument; if killing a Supernatural is horrific because they’re just trying to survive, then killing a human is horrific because they’re just trying to survive.

With all due respect… just no.  At this point, the entire human-supernatural conflict should just be a matter of predation and what truly affects the outcome is survival of the fittest.

#supernatural #spn #beast hunters #vampire hunters #monster hunters #idk how to tag this #anti hunter hate #kinda #this idea would get you killed in spn canon #just saying #i'm not trying to say that all monsters are killers or anything #i'm just pointing out the fact that monsters who *do* kill are predators #you can't just wipe that away by saying 'they're just trying to survive' #it's still killing #and in that case #humans killing the monsters would be too #so it's at *least* two wrongs don't make a right #and at best #it's saving people hunting things #i said it

[mainenorth]

wait how in the goddamn shit did any of the hunters survive from s4 onward??

the angels could all literally just exit their vessels and burn their eyes out

how the fuck you stabbing a literally form of grace while your eyes are set ablaze

#anti winchesters #jacks thoughts from the moon #supernatural #angels spn #every hunter is a disgusting earwig #easily killed #especially the winchesters #because they are the worst assholes ever #and i hate them #bro lucifer could have killed them so many times #im rewriting spn #this is dumb #spns writing is dumb

[dotthings]

I've been so tuned out of spn and spn fandom happenings, I didn't even learn until just now that some weeks back Jared said at a CE con that he wishes they'd done more with Eileen.

Now I'm laughing. The unintentional comedy stylings of Jared P*d*l*cki, everyone!

Not even mad, tbh. Just remembering his disregard for the character and the Sam/Eileen relationship. How he made comments speaking for Dean pov in a way that flatly contradicted every statement Dean himself ever made rooting for Sam and Eileen, but canon, what's that? Dean who? Dean's actual self-evident hopes, the fact that Dean was the #1 Saileen shipper, totally irrelevant when brosonlies are in a panic about Sam or Dean having anyone, anyone at all, anyone whatsoever, besides only each other.

Watching them scramble frantically a few weeks back when Jared dropped this wish for more Eileen to deny that more Sam/Eileen relationship stuff is even possible also greatly amuses me. "Jared only meant Eileen not Sam/Eileen!!!" lmfao okay?? Breathe!!! LOL

I really loved Saileen but I'll be glad either way just to get Eileen back, while the brosonly Sam stans will be screeching with rage because "spn is only about Sam and Dean not SIDE CHARACTERS *raeg raeg*" after they performatively virtue signaled about how much they love Eileen so long as she doesn't get her icky gross cooties breathing too close to Sam.

They also kept slamming all the Saileen shippers, going on and on how anyone who shipped Saileen was only doing it as part of some nefarious plot to keep Sam away from Dean and no other reason. Meanwhile, the Sam and Eileen dynamic was absolutely delightful, it's one of the best relationships Sam ever had, Jared and Shoshannah had lovely chemistry, I enjoyed every Sam and and Eileen moment. Wow yes how monstrous of me, I enjoyed seeing Sam with a layered, good-hearted human who worked well with him and cared about him and they related to each other and they were good together!! What in the evil Sam hatred!!! LMFAO

Anyone who was on twitter at the time may also remember how they spewed hatred against the ship, gatekeeping, romance shaming, and spewing no-romo and anti-romo hatred, because Eileen somehow would no longer count as a badass female character if she's having sex with Sam, and then they tried to dress their ship hate up as progressive because of how it would supposedly "demean" Eileen.

All of which went in full contradiction of the statements of Shoshannah Stern, a deaf actor playing a deaf character, who spoke in interviews at length about how important it was not only that Eileen was a kickass hunter but why it was significant having a disabled character in a romance with one of the lead heroes on a notable genre tv series.

Meanwhile, the Sam stan twitter brigade pretending to be progressive: "ew icky gross"

As for Jared, yeah, this is just COMEDY. He wasn't supportive, now suddenly he's talking about how he's sorry there wasn't more Eileen. Okay, dude.

He also said he was sorry there wasn't more Michael Dean and same thing. Where was he when Jensen needed support, when that storyline was cut off, and when the ending screwed Dean over while Jared got what he wanted, and when most of his base which pretty much hates everyone who isn't Sam and Dean, got what they wanted.

Don't get me wrong, I'll be thrilled if we can have Eileen back in the revival. I don't know if this means we will or not. But I'm all for it. Yes please let's!!! I just don't think there's substance behind Jared changing his tune. And he did nothing to discourage the hatred from his own base against her and against the ship, and then eagerly went along with how the final eps of spn pandered to their desire for her character and that relationship to be wiped from the story.

#dot trolls fandom #Eileen Leahy #Saileen

[what-do-1000-swords-look-like]

This might be a hot take but I've gotta get this off my chest:

I have seen so many times in the past two years the point being made by a particular section of the fandom that Sam was the hero of SPN, the "Luke Skywalker" of the series as Kripke himself stated, and that the finale ending made sense for not only Sam getting to live but also for Dean's ending. And in the very same breath, it's mentioned that the show was always about the brothers, no one else, that's what Kripke always wanted, etc., but this argument is always made from a very pro-Sam slanted/skewed anti-ship (and sometimes anti-Dean) point of view without taking into consideration of just how much the story of SPN evolved even before Kripke left the show.

Like say what you will about Sam being the hero of the story, and I'm not going to disagree with you about that being Kripke's original intention because you're right. Sam was the main protagonist; that's clear from the outset of the series. The whole first season is everything being told from Sam's POV. It's evident in every single episode in how each case has resolution thanks to Sam. He is made to be the hero. The whole arc of season 1 is about Sam being dragged back into this world due to his desire for revenge for what happened to Jessica which turns into something more aka Sam is naturally a hunter and he wants to help people/help his family->Dean. It's even Sam in the season finale that chooses a different way compared to John's quest for revenge by choosing Dean/his family over his revenge.

So, yes, you're right when you say in the beginning of the series that Sam was the hero/main protagonist. Absolutely. But what is not being mentioned/realized is that somewhere along the way, during Kripke's era, Dean's own story within the series became just as integral to the main story like Sam's as did their relationship as brothers. Kripke developed the story to include both. They both become essential to the main overhead arc of the entire show. The whole reason John and Mary even got together (through Heaven's intervention as per SPN canon) was to bring about both Sam and Dean's existence. Dean becomes the complement to Sam's role. We find out that Sam is the chosen vessel for Lucifer, and then we find out Dean is the chosen vessel for Michael, which leads to the showdown between Heaven and Hell essentially through the two. Both have a decision to make; both are tapped on the shoulders by both sides (i.e. Cas/Ruby); both are essential to the main plot while having their own separate arcs/journeys. Dean is no longer a side character or even the "Han Solo". His story is developed and we not only see his own hero's journey that he has to go on (when physically separate from Sam for example; going into the future though this is still intertwined with Sam's journey itself; going back in time, etc.) but his own desires, thought processes, relationships (outside of Sam), are also brought into the forefront for his story. Can this happen with side characters? Sure. But that's not what happens here because Kripke not only develops/beefs up Dean's story but also interweaves it with Sam's very carefully, to the point that the show doesn't work without both characters. Hence, Sam is no longer the sole main protagonist.

Which is why, for example, Dean is the one to kill the YED even though Sam had been determined to make YED pay for what happened to Jessica. And Kripke masterfully balances the main plot between the two as the show develops, so much so that we get payoff for Sam's journey (which leads up to Swan Song but I'll get to that in a moment), by fulfilling big plot points such as his killing Lillith and setting Lucifer free. He even still gets the hero's end by choosing to sacrifice himself to save Dean and the world in 5x22. Kripke beautifully takes Sam's original journey and tweaks it in such a way that while Sam had his dad's training and a similar quest for vengeance, he made a different decision and he did that while having much more on his shoulders (literally the weight of the world) than John ever did. And we still get payoff for what was initially set up way back in season 1. We get a close out to the Jessica story line, to Sam's powers story line, all of it, before Kripke dipped out.

And in the same fashion, we also got a closeout to Dean's story line. If he would ever get out of hunting, would he allow Sam to go into that dark night alone, would he be the same as John -- all of it.

So the ending to 5x22 absolutely makes sense. And we get: Dean surviving and going to live a "normal" life & Sam making the sacrifice (as the hero the series started out with) while also somehow surviving & making his way back to his brother. That's Kripke's ending. Now to be fair, Sam making his way back to Dean more likely had to do with them setting up the next season, but ultimately he wasn't dead after throwing himself and Michael into the pit.

Then in the later seasons, which some fans like to exclude or dismiss (but it's still part of Sam and Dean's official story), their stories were still integral to the main story but they had also evolved to include other characters (such as Cas, Jody, Donna, etc) and they had developed over the next ten years. So when looking at the series as a whole, Dean and Sam's endings in the series finale do not make sense. Kripke already got his ending in 5x22 and the show moved past that, and quickly set out to dismantle it in 6x01. This theme continued and the idea of free will became the center stage even more than it had in the first five seasons. By the time the last season rolled around, Dean and Sam had different desires, their stories had not only been completely intertwined to make both of them the main protagonists but both the heroes, and how their ends/hunting boots were hung up in the end would both matter.

So if you watched all of the seasons, 15x20 doesn't make sense. Because Dean and Sam wanted very different things by that point, they had both built relationships with other characters (Cas and Jack were the biggest ones but those two were not the only ones), and their story had effectively changed.

And if you didn't watch any of the later seasons (or you dismiss it), 15x20 still doesn't make sense because this wasn't the ending Kripke had for the seasons 1-5 Sam and Dean. If anything, it felt like it could have been 1x02 instead of the Wendigo episode, ending Dean and Sam's story in two short episodes with nothing in between.

That does not make sense.

Imagine we were discussing the show Buffy the Vampire Slayer. We all know how that ended (I'm talking TV only, not the comics). Buffy saved the world, she survived (finally!), and she was free from Sunnydale. Now imagine she had been killed off. Not only would it feel redundant but it wouldn't feel like a true ending for the story told over the past 7 seasons. What would have been the point of her being resurrected in season 6 then? What would have been the point of her relationship with Spike, Dawn, and the others? Could Joss Whedon have made it into another hero's sacrifice (instead of Spike doing the heroic/redeeming sacrifice), that she got Dawn, Willow, Xander, and the other Slayers ready to defend the world that she would die saving? Sure. But again, when you compare that ending to her story, it doesn't really make sense. There is no payoff, for the viewers or for the character of Buffy. She had earned that ending, the freedom from the Hellmouth and from the burden of being alone as the only Slayer (aka Chosen One). Which is why we get that great shot in the end:

Willow: "Yeah, the First is scrunched so...what do you think we should do, Buffy?"

Faith: "Yeah, you're not the one and only Chosen anymore. Just got to live like a person. How's that feel?"

Dawn: "Yeah, Buffy, what are we going to do now?"

The hero, who had already made the hero's sacrifice more than once, finally earned the ending that she wanted: freedom and the ability to choose to live her life for herself. The burden of being The Slayer had been removed and spread out to others (effectively building a network, hold that thought for a minute), she was no longer alone, she had defeated the Big Bad (which was effectively the Hellmouth since it kept creating/calling to these other Big Bads she faced over the years as well as the monsters she started out fighting), she might have more to face in the future, but it's up to her now what she wants to do. She is given the choice aka free will and that's what she earned after everything she had gone through during the duration of the show.

That's an ending.

This isn't:

Death wasn't supposed to be their ending. While some might be able to turn to you and say 'but they end up in Heaven together, they're at peace', that doesn't make it a payoff ending, for the viewers (early seasons only or all seasons) or for the characters of Sam and Dean. That's not effective storytelling. Neither ending was heroic or earned.

Dean dying, while again wouldn't make sense given the story, could have been painted as heroic if it happened during the battle with Chuck for example. Their final battle with the ultimate Big Bad. Even though they both died heroically quite a few times before this, it could have been done and while ultimately disappointing, it could have been the hero's end for Dean (just like Sam's end in 5x22 was the hero's end for him). This death wasn't heroic; instead it was from vampire stunt guy #4 who apparently juiced before that scene getting an upper hand on the hero and impaling him on a piece of sharp rebar. During a milk run hunt. Now imagine if that were Sam. Ask these people who think that by the end of the series that Sam was the only hero, ask them if that happened to Sam instead, would they still be praising the finale? Or imagine that was Buffy. That she survived like she does, the Hellmouth in Sunnydale was finally gone, only to be killed by a random forgettable vampire who she had faced off with in the first season and got away, only to suddenly return and take the hero out, thus negating the payoff/earned ending she and the viewers got. Doesn't make sense, right?

Now imagine if say Dawn was killed off in a similar way (though tbf Dawn's role was not the same as Dean's in the story) or during the battle, and we see Buffy living her life through the years, getting out of slaying, having a family which consists of a daughter she names Dawn, wearing her own Party City wig and looking at a picture of Dawn all teary-eyed, dying in her sleep as an old lady, and then reuniting with her in Heaven. It doesn't work. Not only because Dawn had a very different role in the show when it came to the main story but also because it DOESN'T WORK. What kind of hero's end is that? What payoff is that? Is it great that Sam gets to choose to get out of hunting and have a family? Sure. But that's not where his story was headed, in later seasons, or even during Kripke's era.

Going back to the network thing I mentioned with Buffy, Sam had done that. Not only were there strong hints of leader!Sam near the end of the series, but he had effectively built a network of hunters for a time until Alt!Michael killed them all. But he and Dean still had a network going through Jody, Donna, Claire, even Jack until he turned God!Jack. Wayward Sisters might not have taken off when it first aired but the point was made: a hunter network still existed. And these characters, this network, even though not shown in the finale, still survived no matter what happened with Sam and Dean in the end. Why is this important? Because not only does it extend the hunting universe, but it also removes the burden from the heroes' shoulders. So they could have gotten out of hunting if they wanted to, just like Buffy could have laid down her axe (or stake). The heroes had earned it.

So for Dean to die on a random hunt and for those few to say that it was being foreshadowed this whole time with Dean's quotes (from before season 15 btw) and a proper ending to his story...they really don't know what show they were watching or how storytelling works in general. Because when they say that, they negate Dean's whole arc of season 15 (while also negating his whole series arc). Dean was angry in the beginning of the season because he thought not only had his free will been taken from him, but also because he thought he hadn't had any free will this whole time. There's a reason why he says what he says to Cas in 15x02. There's a reason why he was so gung ho on letting Jack sacrifice himself, and only once once Sam and Chuck say what they say in 15x17 does Dean make a different choice: his family (and the world) vs his own desire (his idea of free will, not fully realizing that he's actually utilizing it by making that choice). It's only when he chooses not to kill Chuck in 15x19 that he is completely self-aware and that he is using his free will to make a choice. A choice that affects how the Big Bad is ended/defeated. "That's not who I am."

He was given the hero's choice and he made it. And his decision was the right one that had payoff from not only the events in 15x17 and 15x18 but for his overall story. That's why what Cas says to him in 15x18 about who he is as a character was so important. It set Dean up to not only have self-realization but to also act upon it. Think about how many times over the years Sam and other characters have told Dean this about himself but he never really believed it. Why? Because he hadn't reached that part of his journey yet. Because he hadn't reached the end of it yet. So it makes perfect sense how 15x17, 15x18, and 15x19 play out. This is the appropriate ending battle for not only Dean but Sam as well:

This was the hero's sacrifice they made. They could have been killed from Chuck beating on them as he did. He could have chosen to snap his fingers at any point. They made the sacrifice in order to get Jack the time and energy he needed to power up to overpower Chuck. And they never stayed down no matter the pain, no matter the potential of their deaths at Chuck's hand. They refused to give it up. This is why Sam helps Dean back up and why they're laughing/smiling. Because they know that no matter what happens to them, Jack/the world is going to win. "Why are you smiling?" "Because...you lose." And their sacrifice not only hands victory over to the new generation aka Jack but also instates the new God who replaces Chuck aka The Big Bad of the entire series. EVERYTHING ABOUT THIS SCREAMS HERO.

So it's not only payoff for Jack's story (as well as Chuck's) but also for Sam and Dean's. And both brothers were the heroes. Which is why Sam tells Chuck that he loses and Dean tells him that they won. Why both of them tell Chuck about their plan that they formed together (and Jack doesn't say a word). Which is why Chuck says he's going to die at both of their hands, both Sam and Dean look at each other, and then Dean makes the choice not to kill Chuck. "See, that's not who I am. That's not who we are." Because they both were the heroes and main protagonists of the series. Something that Kripe had set up long before 5x22.

"What kind of an ending is this?" One the heroes had earned. Chuck as the Big Bad wanted violence and death, an ending he would be entertained by. And even for an ending he hadn't imagined for himself (where he loses), he still expected a grisly death at the hands of the heroes. Had either Winchester done that, then Chuck would have gotten what he wanted and it wouldn't be the heroes' end that they had earned.

This was the ending that Sam and Dean earned:

The choice to continue on if they wanted or to get out of hunting for good. To go see Jody, Donna, and the girls, or go get Cas out of The Empty, or go on milk run hunts for a while, or even to go to a freaking baseball game (screw you, John!); the point is it was their choice. That's what they had earned by the end of the series.

The ending that Chuck earned was not only the worst he could imagine but it was punishment for everything he had done. Both brothers say as much:

Sam: "I think it's the ending where you're just like us. And like all the other humans you forgot about."

Dean: "It's the ending where you grow old, you get sick, and you just die."

Sam: "And no one cares. And no one remembers you. You're just forgotten."

This was not the heroes' ending or the ending both characters had earned/deserved:

This was:

For the ones who insist that Dean's sacrifice was the right ending for his story and that he got a new Heaven as a reward are incorrect. Heaven wasn't what Dean wanted, not before he got what he earned.

For the one who insist that Sam's ending was right for his story and that he got to have a family and choose to get out of hunting as a reward are incorrect. Sam wanted Dean to be a part of that life (however it looked) and he had no desire to get out of hunting by the time the series came to an end.

15x20 is not the right ending for either Winchester.

And for those who say that Dean hadn't become one of the heroes in the series or that the finale was right because Sam was the sole main protagonist by the end (or even Kripke's ending in 5x22) clearly weren't paying attention. Not only did Sam not get the heroes' end or the end he wanted and earned, but neither did Dean who had been developed into the other main protagonist of the series, by the series creator himself before he left the show.

Bonus:

15x20 was not their real finale and here's how you know:

Next shot (after cutting to black):

Nothing after it.

SPN:

Next shot (after fading to black):

And then:

(while still in costume, the two leads thanking the fans and then the crew/bridge drone shot complete with show music)

Compare this to how 15x19 ended as well. We get the montage, the drive off shot, and then the scene from 1x01 of Sam shutting the trunk of the Impala as Dean watches. Then cuts to black.

That's their finale.

#dean winchester #i'm not tagging the other guy because...ya know #both deserved the ending they had earned #with both being given the choice of what they wanted to do #that finale was shit #don't let “industry experts” on this site tell you different #it's storytelling 101 #spn #spnposts #anti spn finale #anti 15x20 #that episode was pure garbage #no disrespect to the cast and crew who worked hard #but that was shit writing #it negated 15 years of storytelling #even kripke's own story for both brothers

[drsilverfish]

Dreamscape and Cash Money - The Winchesters...

How do full-time monster-hunters afford the life?

In Supernatural, credit card fraud, pool hustling and (hinted) turning tricks were Dean’s way of keeping his underclass hunter’s life on the road.

(Bar hustling - Dean in 1x08 Bugs)

In the two previous mooted SPN spin-offs, which didn’t make it:

Bloodlines - looked like a Vampire Diaries style show, but Chicago-based, where monsters were just, ineffably, rich. One of the many reasons SPN fans were bound to hate it.

(Upscale bar scene from SPN 9x20 Bloodlines)

Wayward Sisters - Jodie and Donna had blue-collar law enforcement jobs, as rural sheriffs - which would have worked just fine, in terms of being in keeping with the cultural universe of SPN:

(Work clothes - Donna and Jodie in SPN 10x08 Hibbing 911)

The WInchesters - One of the elements that feels “wrong” for an SPN spin-off, is that Lata, Losy, John and Mary seem like kids who don’t have to worry about money, even though (apparently) none of them are working, not even part-time. Ada is the only one with an obvious source of income, as a bookstore owner. 

Millie Winchester’s garage looks pretty dilapidated, and a single Mom mechanic raising her son, John, in the 1950s/ 60s, that would have been hard. She’s a tough and gravelly woman, and the “realest” most blue-collar character thus far in The Winchesters. 

But is John just... living off his Mom?

Vietnam vets faced a tough home-coming, both politically, due to strong anti-war sentiment, and financially, receiving little assistance:

https://www.history.com/news/vietnam-war-veterans-treatment  

Mary and her friends all have absent parents and yet, apparently, no need to work?

Even middle-class Buffy the Vampire Slayer (25 years ago) as the kid of a single Mom, had some money worries once Joyce died, and struggled working in a burger joint for a while. 

If it turns out that The Winchesters is indeed a dream-scape, in which Holy Ghost narrator Dean is (as the God-author of this story) writing his parents a happier beginning, then the relative lack of financial anxiety/ realness can be made to make sense. Of course Dean would want to protect his young parents from money troubles.

But, I suspect the vibe advertisers on the CW want is “product friendly” and the CW top brass think narrative money-worries are not “product friendly��� enough.

A tragedy for story-telling, and in fact, I suspect, also wrong in terms of audience atttraction (who doesn’t have money worries these days)? 

So yeah, I’d like to see Carlos selling weed, Lata reading tarot for cash, Mary waiting tables in a diner, John actually working on cars with his Mom - all of them trying to fit monster hunting into the everyday scrabble for living..

#Supernatural #The Winchesters #The Winchesters meta #Social class and The Winchesters #Shouldn't it be a helluva lot grittier? #Only the dream-scape AU theory makes sense #spnwin

[heartscfvalor]

Introducing: Penelope Hardy

We are too busy dancing To get knocked off our feet Baby, we're the new romantics The best people in life are free

Penelope Violet Hardy, Penny for short, is the only -- biological -- daughter of Laura and Fenton Hardy, and the youngest child of the brood. Born February 10th, she is the Irish triplet of the Hardy siblings, conceived barely two months after Joe's birth, just as Joe was conceived scarcely three months after Frank's.

Despite being the youngest child, Penny is unusually independent, not liking to be smothered by her brothers or overprotected by them. She can fight her own battles, earning a black belt in her martial arts classes with surprising speed; she can and always will fight for the underdog. She considers herself a deep thinker, often studying others with curiosity, trying to figure out what makes them tic. She deeply loves humanity as a whole for their positive traits, but individual people often disappoint her, and she is uncomfortable with strong negative emotions. Someone crying with receive an awkward pat on the shoulder before Penny is making a hasty retreat, if she can retreat at all.

Some people consider Penny to be quite odd, from her eclectic tastes in fashion and music, to her believing most conspiracy stories. But she is also described as kind, and deeply loyal, a trait that the Hardy family covet in all members, and she is quick to always come to the defense of others, especially in the face of bullies. Like her aunt Trudy, Penny will also join worthy causes of activism, including protests, as she cares deeply for the world around her and she wants to try and make things better than they are. Penny is always chasing the next exciting thing, as moments of quiet are boring and understimulating; like her brothers, Penny is proficient in different languages and musical instruments. Her favorite is the ukulele, and her favored genre of music tends to be indie or alternative folk.

As a precaution, Fenton trained all of his children from a young age to strengthen their skills of observation, and he put them in martial arts as self defense. When the kids were in elementary school, they started solving petty mysteries that gradually got more and more intriguing as they got older. By the time Frank and Joe were in high school, the Hardy siblings were solving harder, more adult crimes, so Fenton, after trying and failing to get them to stop, developed American Teens Against Crime, later renamed the Network, in order to train them by the best, and put them on cases where adult agents would stick out like a sore thumb. Penny's codename is Hummingbird, in accordance to her small stature and constant need for movement and stimulation.

When Penny was fourteen years old, Frank, Joe and Fenton came home from a case in New York with her foster sister, Taylor Borelli, and the two girls became fast friends, with Penny almost hero worshipping the older girl due to her tough exterior and feral attitude.

Penny is associated with my other Hardy Boys blog here, and her storyline also includes the SPN verse where, after Fenton's disappearance and Laura and Trudy's death, the Hardy siblings and Taylor fled Bayport and became hunters in training. As Penny as 16, and Joe was 17, they were at risk of being taken by CPS, and neither Frank or Taylor would allow that. Finding out later that the Hardys came from the Campbell family line and thus are viable as Vessels for angels makes Penny extremely wary; she often has nightmares of being possessed, despite getting the anti-possession tattoo as soon as possible.

Faceclaim is K.eana M.arie

#introducing;; penny #visage;; penny #aesthetics;; penny #musings;; penny #regarding;; penny

[castielcommunism]

re: ur latest #libertariannatural post, omg I could talk abt this for hours - to me the most frustrating plothole in spn is how little hunting as a way of life / community is fleshed out - literally makes no sense to me how it’s sposed to be a huge secret since, if u lived in that world where idk, vampires or whatever could kill u anytime you’d want as many ppl to know abt it as possible! to help each other! it’s basic sci-fi / fantasy world building like UGH ! write better !!! (Not u, the show)

It’s super frustrating! I think it’s a result of kripke wanting the winchesters to be these rugged individualist types while also making hunting this established practice that you “do” and “are”. But those two things don’t work very well together! Like sure yeah you can have a “community” of hunters made up almost entirely of suspicious anti social weirdos who can’t be trusted, but if that’s the case then it’s a lot harder to also make hunting a historical practice that dates back decades and centuries. Like hunting in the US is not a formalised order or group like it is with the bmol in s12, which means that hunting is more like an informal practice with loose cultural and social associations. You have meeting places like Ellen’s bar and Bobby’s place where those social interactions can take place, but iirc the reason Ellen’s bar burned down in s2 is BECAUSE kripke didn’t like the idea of hunters having gathering spots to socialise and trade advice/stories/supplies/etc. like he very clearly did not wanting hunters to have any sort of community, formal or otherwise.

anyway hunting as a practice in the show is very nonsensical unless you conceive of it as this like white guy vigilante thing. hunting is not about community protection in any real sense, it’s about vengeance and violence. the actual “community” that hunters rally around is much more broad than their immediate community. the cohesive glue that holds them together is just like, american white masculinity and all the political baggage that carries with it lol

#spn.txt #asks #libertariannatural

[spnfanficpond]

September 2022 Angel Fish Awards

(Angel Fish design by @slytherkins!!)

Welcome to this month's Angel Fish Awards!

Every month all of you fantastic writers work your asses off to post some truly incredible stories. Our Angel Fish Awards are the way for all of us, as a community of writers and readers, to lift each other up and give praise to those who have captured our attention and deserve a few kind words.

The monthly Angel Fish Awards are peer-nominated, meaning ANYONE (you don’t have to be a member) CAN NOMINATE ANY POND MEMBER’S FIC. Everyone in this community deserves to be showered with love and feedback, and we hope that this fun, thoughtful award will do just that.

Be sure to read through this whole post as people who were nominated more than once only had one tag activated for Tumblr tagging purposes!

WITHOUT FURTHER ADO, HERE ARE THIS MONTH’S ANGEL FISH AWARDS!

Nominated by @mrswhozeewhatsis

The Pact (series) by @coffee-obsessed-writer

I had lost track of this series a while back, but I recently found it again, and I’M SO HAPPY! For those who steer away from smut, the smut is minimal in this series, but the plot is maxxed out!  There’s everything you could want: mystery, intrigue, magic, enemies to lovers, daddy issues, found family, and true love. (The masterlist doesn’t have the two most recent chapters on it, but they are easily found on Jen’s blog.) Only start reading this if you’ve got some time to spare because you won’t want to take a break!

Proud by @waywardnerd67 

Tumblr was being a pain and decided that I didn’t need to see any of Nerdy’s tags for me for... *checks calendar* ...FIVE YEARS. I missed a couple of YEARS worth of these little drabbles and ficlets! Well, 2017′s loss is 2022′s gain because I’m getting them all in dribs and drabs, now. This is just one of the dozens of these little stories that are like little, yummy snacks of fics. They’re bite-sized morsels of mostly fluff (there are some that are angst or smut, too) that are perfect for when you’re on the go! Be sure to check them all out!

The New Mrs. Winchester (series) by @percywinchester27

I thought I had already nominated this series, which is my only reason for not having nominated it before!! This is a Sam x Reader AU with so many mysteries that I’m on the edge of my seat waiting to find out what happens next. We have heard just enough of what has happened in the reader’s past to know it wasn’t pretty, but Sam’s past, and why Dean is nowhere to be found, is still completely unknown. The back half of your chair won’t get much use while you’re reading this because you’ll be on the edge of your seat!

~*~*~

Nominated by @percywinchester27

Reluctant Renegade (series) by @deangirl93

I really like how the SPN scenario is completely reversed in this one. I've only just started with it, and the story has already gripped me. I'm curious to see how much more of an anti-hero Dean can be and the reader is very interesting! Looking forward to reading more!

~*~*~

Nominated by @mariekoukie6661 

Family Matters by @glygriffe 

I thought it was a really great story and I loved that it was different! I really liked the « what if this happened instead » ! I really enjoyed it!

~*~*~

Nominated by @princessmisery666 

Hunter/Hunted (series) by @talesmaniac89 

I need to catch up but the 15 parts I've read are amazing. So few words in each part but each one gave me just enough to want more and enjoy the ride. Excellent work.

Without A Stitch by @raidens-realm 

I loved the idea of the bunker being a living entity and wanting to take care of the boys. Bonus for Sam being naked most of the time 😂

Butter Knife by @fictional-affairs 

Can't beat a bit of miscommunication and love confessions. 💓

A Little Trip by @mariekoukie6661

I could totally picture the guys walking around in absolute amazement and getting lost like we all do in Ikea.

The Best and Worse Plans by @girl-next-door-writes 

I am a total fangirl for @girl-next-door-writes and I can never resist putting in a request when they open them up. This one was perfect for that gif.

Big Brother by @girl-next-door-writes 

Emma indulged me again and this broke my heart but is soooooo in character 😭Dean will always sacrifice his happiness for his brother.

THANK YOU ALL FOR THE AWESOME WORK AND GREAT FEEDBACK!

These are not actual awards, as in, there is no competition! This system is set up so everyone has a chance to share the love and promote a fic/author in the Pond that has grabbed your attention. The more people that participate, the better this will be :D

THANK YOU ALL AGAIN, KEEP UP THE AMAZING WORK, AND AS ALWAYS, HAPPY WRITING!

#angel fish awards #angel fish awards masterlist #spnfanficpond #fan fiction #fanfiction #fan fic #fanfic #spn fan fiction #spn fanfiction #spn fan fic #spn fanfic #supernatural fan fiction #supernatural fan fic #supernatural fanfiction #supernatural fanfic #fic rec #spn fic rec #supernatural fic rec

[fandom-hoarder]

copy/pasting my live react i sent to @cordellwinchesterwalker

Watching TWin now. The opening has nice vibes but now I'm on the johnmary meetcute and it's...awk af

Goddd this girl's face is just claire i cannot 

John and mom are ok so far. Nothin to write home about 

This scene transition into the demon fight was sooo anticlimactic wtf

Ok i am SERIOUSLY side eyeing Mary's ability with demons. I feel like i need to watch the spn flashbacks again

Whyyyy is mary giving up all this fucking expositionnnnn 

Why would you have an anti possession medallion that you have to HOLD instead of having it on your person on a necklace or something? Ffs🤦‍♀️

WHY are they introducing a scar we have never heard of before? We have SEEN John's arms

Goddd did the writers base mary on reincarnated mary and not watch the fucking flashbacks?

Why is the pacing boring af

John is not reading like a former marine that signed up illegally at all. A draftee that never wanted to go, maybe

Ohhh god it's the demon part from the trailer lmfao whyyyyy

I was sincerely hoping that was a thing that got cut for tone omg

At least they took out that ridiculous scooby reaction shot

But WHY THE FUCK would carlos have a newbie read the fucking exorcism?? It's not a normal thing to know how to fucking pronounce

I kinda like carlos just as a character and I'm on board for john/carlos already...

Sighhhhh not just the slutty bi stereotype but the flippant kind that can't be bothered to care about the other people they're slutting with? This is Not On. Make the slutty bi poly and compassionate i am fucking BEGGING people

Got a text from Jpop to stop yelling :/

This expositionnnnn is soooo ridiculously funny to me lmao 

Is this accent for Latika the actress' real accent 🤔

Ok Carlos has had the best lines so far

"The only thing worse than how it starts for a hunter is how it ends"

Unfortunately i like Carlos' van a lot

Lol john/latika fakeout PUH-lease. AU where no one gets together how they're supposed to 

So are they insinuating samuel knew about the fucking mol and never said anything or even looked for their compound while working with crowley? 🙄

Indiana jones vibes

Lmfao a commercial started as soon as the monster showed up but was that the afanc from bbc merlin lmao 

Lmao already with the self sacrificing... first marine behavior 

Convenient silver in his arm lmao

Plot twist: john becomes a loup-garou cuz he gets blood in his mouth

(Can't remember the lore rn)

(NOT THAT IT MATTERS HERE LOLOLOL)

So John's MOM knew too???? Wtf IS this?? I NEED more than the promise that everything will make sense by the end. I NEED THEM TO SAY SIKE THIS IS AU

I AM REBELLING AGAINST SWEETENED COFFEE JOHN. IF THAT'S WHAT HE DRANK SO WOULD DEAN AND SAM WOULD'NT EVEN IF HE HATED BLACK

IS JOHN SWITCHING TO BLACK COFFEE PART OF HIS CHARACTER'S JOURNEY😏😏😏

Goddddd PLEASE why does the styling look like 90s "retro 70s" fashion

Hahhhh ok, dean voice actually sounded like dean voice this time and thank fuck they didn't have that awful windy hair shot where he's unrecognizable. His gaze at the samulet-- i was expecting but OHH??? SO SAD LOOKING

I am making a HUGE LEAP here but what if sammy is missing and that's the only reason dean is trying to find out what happened lolol the akrida have him

#spn prequel #i...dk what other tags i want to use..this isn't exactly anti... #TWin crit #TWin spoilers #TWin (the cw)

[fellshish]

correct me if I'm wrong, but I feel like spn should have done a season where the government was aware of supernatural creatures and t was all about the winchesters working with the government to defeat such creatures but there were some issues (can't think of any on the top of my head), but eventually it's the reason why they don't work with the government. I mean I know Dick Roman was president for a bit or Lucifer was president, i don't remember, but imagine if it were a president that was like yeah we're working with the best hunters in the country etc to defeat monsters.

okay this has me feeling nostalgic because in s1 it was just the two of them but by the later seasons they have this kind of network (well not fully functioning but in fanon they've created a network so yeah)

Honestly, i’m glad they didn’t. Sam and dean have (and even more so in the early seasons) a bit of… outcast vibes about them, not anti government per se but very close to it. I know they make cop friends in later seasons but the general vibe is still anti government, anti institution, on the road adjacent freedom.

That being said umm if you’re interested maybe in reading a crack fic where the government finds out about monsters and works with the supernatural ACTORS… well look no further

[lettuce-seize-the-day]

for anti-honesty hour: who is your favorite spn character

John Winchester 🥰 just think he was a phenomenal father figure and really emulated what it means to be a good man and set the boys up for success both in life and as hunters. Great question! Thank you for asking 🥰💕

#shut up hanna #ITS ANTI HONESTY HOUR DONT UNFOLLOW

[dotthings]

In fact saying that The Winchesters respects the fans of the original is a completely valid reasonable opinion people have a right to say, as being fans of the original series, they are fans, and have a right to say that if they are pleased with The Winchesters.

Actually, Janet, people are allowed to say they like it and that it's very very good and they're moved by it and grateful for it and appreciate the thought and care and love being put into it and the producers and the wonderful cast and the writers and directors and how this has opened the door so much wider to different voices crafting episodes of an spn universe show and telling that story and centering marginalized characters who don't often get to be the main heroes.

In fact, Susan, it's a very sane clear-headed thing to do. To notice, to care, and appreciate.

Stans who have had their favorite's show fluffed in blatantly obvious and biased ways so loud the marketing gears are visible from space are not in a position to cry about bias just because someone is expressing their enjoyment of the universe expansion on an established IP.

The idea that spn fans are not allowed to have an opinion on TW unless they're ripping it to shreds is wank manufacturing absurdist theater. I'm not mad. You know what I am? I'm reading their pointless drama it for the giggles and now I'm going to speak my opinion.

Because I can.

"Criticism" is not a year and a half of non-stop hatred and trolling and angry screaming at a tv show merely existing to usher in a universe expansion that is doing all it can to fully live up to the idea that Supernatural Is For Everyone. "Criticism," Karen, is "the pacing was a bit slow this week and I wish we'd seen more of this thing I want, I loved the scenes with these other characters though and how about that gorgeous set design." "Criticism" is not a year and a half of non-stop hatred. "Criticism" is not attacking people just for writing an article that said something good about a thing they're enjoying.

People who actually love and respect a fictional universe they claim to love do not behave this way when presented with a universe expansion. If they don't care for the universe expansion, they might say why, but they don't do whatever this hot mess that's still ceaselessly raging is, and if the problems are not alleviated, if they have any self awareness whatsoever, they pack up and move on to something that is more welcoming to them.

No, in fact, this behavior is not "what fans do" it's what antis do, it's what people do when an entire fictional universe breaks for them and they no longer derive joy from it. This is what happens when an entitled subset of stans online who were under the actual, selfish delusion that an entire universe was only for them, should be only for them gets smacked in the face with reality. The og series was not only for them, they were only under the illusion it was, and they spent 15 seasons being angry because other fans besides their little subset dared to exist, now the universe expansion is not for them, and the light's finally dawning onto their narrow little minds.

Supernatural is for Everyone. And they're mad about it.

We've seen this song before in other fandoms. It's tired.

Yes, actually, this show about John and Mary and their found family circle of hunter friends fighting space insects has made me feel better.

Does that make you mad? That is not my problem.

#The Winchesters #spnwin

[mooshroomister]

dni- basic critera (homophobe, racist, xenophobic, p3do, mysogynistic), anti-MOGAI ppl, NSFW blogs, ED and SH blogs, and coquette blogs due to personal reasons. incest shippers of any kind dni. also, trans-race and paraphilia blogs. otherwise just don't be disrespectful!

my kins include...

high kins: sam winchester, toothless (httyd), australian shepherd

med/low kins: gabriel (spn), hunter (toh), peter quill (gotg), izuku midoriya (mha)

I also reblog agere stuff (strictly sfw) so yea

#introductory post