What's relationship between your Harley and Joker? For now it seems they're pretty alright.
Yay I’m glad someone asked!
Punch!verse Harley and joker are a couple. Their dynamic is more mutual than one sided. If you ever played Lego DC super villains I heavily borrowed from that depiction. I think that Harley sees him as her escape from monotony. Almost like he helped her realize she had more potential in life than a desk job. In Harley, joker sees a possibility for a chance at something slightly normal. She grounds him.
They really do love each other and I’m aware that in their conception and in past depictions their dynamic has been unhealthy. However, this is my adaptation of the characters. I’m not a fan of most modern Harley depictions either. I like her classic vibe more but she still deserves to be able to stand independent from Joker. I like them more as partners in crime than boss and henchgirl.
That being said, I do love Harlivy and Batjokes but I don’t feel as if they fit in my universe. I might still draw these pairings one day though cause they are cute
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Suicide Squad // Gotham // Joker 2 Folie a Deux
Joker and Harley Quinn
Jeremiah and Ecco
Arthur Fleck and Harleen Quinzel
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Todd Phillips confirming what we already know.
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The Joker: The Man Who Stopped Laughing by Haining
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The Joker’s “Coming Out” story.
For 2024 Rainbow Month Instead of DC throwing bisexuals at us.
I want DC to finally acknowledge their original Queer character,
The Joker but, you can’t have just anyone tell the Joker’s coming out story. I want Paul Dini to come back and fix the mess he started!!!
Prior to the introduction of Harley Quinn writer Neal Adams portrayed the Joker as a gay character but, when Batman the animated series came out writers didn’t want to get cancelled so Paul Dini invented Harley Quinn to make the Joker seem less gay.
It didn’t really work but,
Harley did become a popular break out character. Now we all know the whole story of Harley and Joker. Their relationship was doomed from the start. Instead of focusing on the whole “Mad Love” plot. I want Dini to take modern Harley back to her roots as the Joker’s therapist.
You see Harley never really got around to actually being a therapist to the Joker. She was appointed as his therapist but,
Harley had different things on her mind.
I want Dini to do justice to Harley. You see even though Harley is no longer with the Joker he’s still her whole life. She spent the first half of her comic career obsessively in love with the Joker and, constantly defending him for his actions. Now in the second half of her comic career Harley obsessively hates the Joker and, blames him for her actions. (Yes to all you rabid Harley fans the Joker was abusive to Harley but, now after she bit off his lip, shot out his eye, stole his cut off face, repeatedly tried to kill him more times than he actually tried to kill her, and the infinite number of times she’s punch, kicked and, hit him in the crotch. I think they’re good and, if this makes the Quinn fans go feral look even if some hack online said that a couple couldn’t be mutually abusive, I’ve seen it enough times in real life with, my own parents, family, friends and strangers to know that they can.)
I think Dini should write Harley sitting down with the Joker and, for once actually being his therapist. Now Joker is way too far gone to ever be cured and, there’s no way anyone could help Joker rationalize his feelings about Batman but, Harley could help the Joker come to the conclusion that he’s actually gay and, that much of his obsession comes from his sexual attraction to Batman. Will Joker and Harley be friends after this? No. No they will not but, like in the Harley Quinn Show it will help Harley and, Joker come to terms and, move on, only this time Joker won’t be a victim of straight washing like he was in Batman the Animated Series and The Harley Quinn Show. As for all the haters who will reply with “We don’t want the Joker in the Gay Community!” Well that’s too damn bad! It’s how he was originally written by Neal Adams which happened before the Killing Joke or the introduction of Harley.
There’s a lot of people I don’t want in the community too but, they’re here and they’re queer and, I got used to it. (For all Jarley shippers who protest, You’ve already had your turn!)
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I miss some good old-fashion Joker X Harley.
Finding some good fic/fanart/thoughts or rants is like finding a needle in the haystack.
I'm tired just give me my puddin' and Harls back.
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When people unironically ship Harley Quinn and the Joker, it’s a pretty dead giveaway they haven’t engaged with much DC media other than the 2016 Suicide Squad movie and probably only have surface level understanding of the characters. B:TAS (where Harley originated) and the rest of the DCAU explicitly acknowledged the Harley/Joker relationship as toxic and basically said “Harley deserves better.” Various pre52 comics addressed this as well. The past decade of comics has featured Harley and Poison Ivy as a couple, also recognizing Harley as an abuse survivor. This attitude is also present in the Harley Quinn cartoon, and in The Suicide Squad and Birds of Prey, and in basically every interview on the topic Margot Robbie has ever done.
Joker/Harley is more popular than it should be, considering its actual canon treatment. I don’t get it.
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I know you ship batjokes, but what do you think about jarley?
Well, I can't say I ship it, but I do find it interesting-- much like I find Bruce's other relationships interesting. It'd be tough not to, since in Punchline's own words:
-- Batman (2016) #93
Harley is the person to get closest to Joker emotionally other than Batman. And with the big disclaimer that this is all my personal opinion which I got specifically asked about, I'll put a slightly longer discussion of the subject under the cut.
To be honest, I dislike how Jarley has been reduced solely to the label of "abusive relationship", with Harley's own darker traits being swept under the rug or fully attributed to Joker's influence. Doctor Harleen Quinzell had her own demons and psychopathic tendencies, before ever meeting Joker; and it was a sense of deep loneliness that drove her to him, and which he exploited. At the end of the day, that does seem like what it amounted to, especially in the beginning... Harley feeling horribly alone, and latching onto Joker to fill that void, with Joker manipulating it and taking control. However, Joker would not have been able to take advantage of any kind of attachment if Harleen's own darkness didn't relate to Joker's own somehow.
And well, thing is... Joker, in his own way, cared about Harley. Put bluntly, he wouldn't have bothered to keep her around otherwise. It's a Black Label comic, but my mind always goes to this phrasing when thinking of Jarley:
-- Birds of Prey (2020)
"Crawled in each other's void." And Joker's void was Batman-shaped, just like she says. At this point it's been canonized again and again that Joker is in love with Batman, with Harley herself being the one to confirm it more than once... and it is fascinating how Batjokes and Jarley interact, most tragically when it comes to Harley. Because she was jealous of Batman and the hold he had over Joker's attention. Part of what kept her next to Joker, trying harder and harder to please him (like in Mad Love) was the hope that eventually, she could become as special to him as he was to her. She saw how human Joker could be about Batman, and wanted to nurture and help him turn it into something more, but in the end it probably became the most hurtful thing-- Joker being incapable of caring about anyone else but Batman, no matter how hard she tried or the things she endured.
...Anyway, Anon, to summarize, I do think Jarley is interesting :)) That being said, it's also annoying how it's being used to turn Joker into a one-dimensional cartoonishly evil abuser, ever since Harley's redemption arc began. Better writers could find ways to turn Harley into an anti-hero without bulldozing over previous characterization for her or Joker, but alas.
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It has occurred to me that Harley Quinn could sue the fuck out of Arkham Asylum for placing her in an unsafe working environment and causing irreparable damage to her mental health, and I'm mad as fuck. And like why would you not require the employees there to undergo psych evaluation?! They're working with murderers, rapists, etc -- you think that's not gonna get to them a little bit?! And why would you not do background checks on your employees given the crime rates in Gotham?!
"Oh, you were a bouncer at the Iceberg Lounge owned and operated by Oswald Cobblepot before serving five years at Blackgate Penitentiary? Welcome to the Arkham team!"🥰
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Harley Quinn is canonically bisexual-biromantic, stop trying to erase that.
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