#(because dick's still pretty estranged from bruce!)

[silverwhittlingknife]

How do you feel about Jack Drake?? What are your thoughts on him and Tim’s relationship?

Anon, I hope you were interested in a novel, because look, I am fascinated by Jack Drake.  He’s key to a whole lot of what I find compelling about Tim as a character, and if I were in charge of DC, I’d bring him back to life.  This would make Tim unhappy but would IMO make for good plotlines.

Jack and Tim’s relationship is Complicated (TM)...

Jack and Tim hug in Nightwing 20 / Jack impulsively yanks a TV out of the wall in Robin 45 / Tim grieves in Identity Crisis

“I could tell the truth.  But I don’t.” - Robin 66

...and it involves a whole lot of Tim lying, and feeling guilty about lying, and thinking about telling the truth, and choosing again and again to keep lying.

And I think that’s great.

Below the cut:

Shorter version - key points about Jack

Really long version - my gentler take (vigilantism is choir and Jack loves sports) vs. my harsher take (Jack has some major flaws)

Final thoughts

Shorter version - key points about Jack:

He’s a bad parent.  He’s self-centered, he consistently prioritizes his own comfort and interests over his son’s, and when upset, he does things like order Tim off to boarding school.

But he’s never a bad parent in an actionable way.  He’s not like David Cain or Arthur Brown, who are abusive monsters.  Jack’s not a monster!  He just...kinda sucks.

He genuinely loves Tim. If Jack’s aware that Tim’s disappeared or is in trouble, he’s always worried and upset.  He periodically resolves to be a better dad, and IMO he’s always sincere.

And Tim loves him, a lot.  Tim’s protective of him and worries about him when he’s kidnapped or in danger, and when they’re reunited, Tim’s really relieved and usually hugs him (and Jack hugs back!). 

...But they have very little in common, and that’s a problem. Jack doesn’t value the things that Tim values, or respect the people that Tim admires, or care about the things that Tim’s interested in.  Tim lies to him a lot, but that’s partly because he correctly guesses Jack wouldn’t respond well if he knew the truth of what Tim’s up to.

The Batfamily is a surrogate family that Tim’s drawn to because of the ways his real family doesn’t meet his emotional needs…but also he feels guilty about that and disloyal. (And to the extent that his dad recognizes what’s going on, he's jealous and resentful!)

Very long version:

(LISTEN I HAVE SO MANY THOUGHTS ABOUT THIS)

Okay!  So first: Jack’s a character who IMO is pretty up for interpretation.  You can interpret him very charitably, and make excuses for the bad behavior, and fill in the blanks sympathetically when situations are ambiguous; or you can interpret him uncharitably, and emphasize the bad behavior. I don’t think either approach is invalid - it depends on what kind of story you’re interested in!  I have enjoyed Bad Dad stories and also stories that redeem Jack.

My personal take on canon is that Jack and Tim’s relationship is in a gray area.  Jack's definitely neglectful, and he does prioritize other things over Tim, but he’s never so bad that Tim can easily reject him, and he's never so bad that Bruce could justify taking Tim away.  He's just...not great.  Tim loves him, and feels loyal to him, but it’s a very mixed-up complicated love.

I have a gentler take and a harsher one which I switch between as the spirit moves me. xD

My Gentler Take (tl;dr: vigilantism is choir and Jack loves sports)

Here’s the core conflict: Jack and Tim are very different people with different values.  Tim idolizes Bruce and Dick and vigilantism, and secretly gets involved, knowing his dad will hate it. He gets increasingly wrapped up in his secret world and lies to his dad...because if his dad finds out, he’ll make Tim quit.

This is a great setup for an ongoing comic.  It’s practical, because it provides endless potential for plotlines, and it’s nicely thematic, because it maps closely onto relatable real-life situations with extracurricular activities:

Tim the drama nerd whose dad thinks he’s playing football and not in the school play; 

Tim the closeted-queer kid secretly getting involved in his school’s politically-active Gay-Straight Alliance; 

Tim the choir kid whose dad only values making money and wants him to go into the family business (and Tim keeps promising himself he'll give up choir soon, definitely soon, but maybe he'll stay in just a liiiittle longer, because they need him, you see, the last tenor left town, so...); 

Tim the computer geek with the sports-obsessed dad (this one’s just canon);

etc. etc.  

The extracurricular metaphor works pretty well for Tim’s relationship to vigilantism.  Tim's involved in his "extracurricular" because he genuinely thinks it's important and fulfilling, and he values it and wants to be good at it. He idolizes Bruce and Dick because they're good at it. He's been collecting information about it since he was a little kid, and hiding it from his parents because he knows they wouldn't approve. And mayyyybe there's also an element of low-key rebellion against his dad, and maybe that's secretly part of the appeal. And yet also as Tim gets more and more invested, he starts to daydream: maybe I could tell my dad and he'd be proud of me and supportive. But he doesn't, because actually he knows his dad would be upset and angry and make him quit.

And - again, just like with lonely kids and extracurricular hobbies - one of the things that happens is that Tim starts getting his unfilled emotional needs met ... by people he knows through this secret hobby. And people like Bruce and Dick start turning into a surrogate family. Which Tim feels guilty about. And also as Tim gets more and more wrapped up in their world, he has to lie to his dad even more, which means the distance between Tim and his dad gets bigger and bigger and more and more unfixable.

I love this dilemma. It's simple, it's recognizable, it provides endless sources for conflict, and there's no obvious solution! Tim can't tell Jack: he'll make Tim quit! And Tim doesn't want to quit, because he loves choir / art / theater / whatever.  Yeah, it’s difficult, and there are challenges, and sometimes he has doubts...but at the end of the day, he cares about it a lot.  And everything he values is there, and all the people he admires and cares about are there, and all he wants in the world is to feel like he's one of them and belongs there. So he has to lie, even though he doesn't want to lie, and he feels guilty about it...

...but also he ends up lying more and more.

(Sidenote: I think it's important that Tim chooses to keep lying - Tim's narration often glosses this as "I have to lie to my dad," and that's certainly how it feels to Tim, but this... isn't quite true. He has to lie to his dad, because if he doesn't, his dad will get mad at him and try to stop him, not because he literally has no choice about it.)

Other Reasons Why I Like The "Secret Extracurricular" Interpretation

(tl;dr it complicates not just Tim's relationship with his dad, but also all his other relationships)

Tim's problems have some obvious parallels to Steph and Cass, who both become vigilantes while rejecting their evil supervillain dads. But Jack isn't evil. And that means the Tim-and-Jack relationship is ambiguous and complicated in ways that I like. Steph and Cass can just leave their Bad Dads in prison, and say good riddance, and feel very righteous and triumphant about it! Tim’s more complicated. Tim gets into vigilantism ostensibly out of duty and altruism, but secretly, he's also involved for straight-up selfish self-fulfillment reasons. He's lonely, and bored, and his life feels pointless, but he thinks that Bruce and Dick are cool and amazing and he wants to be a part of the things that they do.  When his dad gets jealous of Tim’s relationship to Bruce, and feels like Tim’s looking for a surrogate family, he’s... not wrong.

And the ways in which Jack is not Actionably Bad complicate things from Bruce's POV.  If Jack was a straight-up villain, it’d be an easy call to keep in touch when Jack finds out and makes Tim quit...but he’s not a villain, not really.  So what do you do?  Do you try to surreptitiously stay in touch with Tim even though you’re ignoring his dad’s express wishes and thus forcing Tim to sneak around?  Do you respect his dad’s wishes and stay away from Tim even though you have a years-long relationship at this point?  

Again: a bit similar to the extracurricular analogy.  Say you’re the choir director and you’ve built this whole relationship with a kid in the choir, and you’re an important mentor to him and you care about him etc. etc. etc.... and then right before a big performance, his dad finds out he’s been secretly involved, and yanks him out.  How would you react?  Well, maybe kind of in some of the ways Bruce reacts.  You replace him. You’re annoyed with him. You miss him. You want him to come back. You’re also worried about him.  You’re upset with his dad.  But also... what should you do, exactly?

Bruce and Alfred and Dick care about Tim as if he were part of their family, but he’s not part of their family, and there’s a lot of interesting tension there.

My Harsher Take

Jack never hits his son.  But his temper is a big deal.

In his worst moments, he takes out his anger on Tim’s stuff - wrecking his room, or ripping his TV out of the wall and confiscating it.  When he’s worried about Tim, he usually expresses that fear by yelling at him / punishing him / sending him away - threatening to send him to boarding school in Metropolis in Robin III, or threatening to send him to military school abroad in Robin 92, or actually forcing him to go to an all-boys' boarding school post-NML.  

This is bad behavior!  It is Not Good!  

And you can easily connect the dots to a bunch of Tim’s terrible coping mechanisms, like the constant lying and or the fact that Tim’s go-to methods for dealing with interpersonal conflict are 1) repress it and pretend it never happened (most of his fights with Bruce), 2) withdraw from the relationship until he can pretend the conflict doesn’t exist (when his friends get mad at him in YJ, he quits the team for a while), or 3) literally run away from home.

Also, Jack is a Manly Man with firm opinions about how men behave vs. how women behave, and he thinks boys shouldn’t be scared and thinks Tim should date hot girls and pushes Tim to work out and wants him to play football and expresses period-typical sexism, etc. etc. etc. ... and though obviously this wasn’t what the writers had in mind at the time, all of that is certainly interesting to read backwards in the light of Tim as a queer character.

More Disorganized Thoughts on Jack Drake

Tim’s our hero, so we’re naturally more sympathetic to him, but it’s also true that relationships are a two-way street, and Tim doesn’t value any of the things his dad values, either.  Jack at various points is shown to care about grades, business, money, boarding schools, archeology, football, a kind of macho bragging-about-dating-hot-women ethos, and a very public and performative kind of caring. Tim tends to respond with discomfort or disinterest or even disgust.  When Jack gets on TV to try to rally the government to save his son from No Man’s Land, Tim isn’t touched—he’s mortified.  When Jack makes some bad investments and loses money, Jack’s deeply upset and his self-image is majorly impacted, and far from being sympathetic, Tim’s annoyed and kind of contemptuous of the idea that this is a problem.  Jack thinks fishing in the early morning and going to tennis matches is a fun father-son activity; Tim finds it exhausting and tedious.  And so on.

This means that Tim often longs to be closer to his dad in theory, but this longing is more tied to fantasy than to reality. He rarely seems to enjoy spending time with His-Dad-The-Actual-Person.  So for example, when Tim’s deadly ill with the Clench, he has an extremely poignant fever dream about telling his dad the truth and getting hugged…even as he insists in real-life to Alfred and Dick that he does not want them to tell his dad what’s going on.

The same is true of Jack, who IMO genuinely wants to be closer to his son and is continually declaring that he’s going to turn over a new leaf and get closer to his son…and just as continually backs out of activities or loses his temper when faced with spending time with his actual son.

Tim and his dad sadly get along best—by far—in Absence Makes the Heart Grow Fonder situations.  When Jack gets kidnapped or is in danger, Tim worries for him (and Tim grieves him deeply when he dies).  When Tim disappears or runs away, Jack’s genuinely worried about him.  So e.g. they have a really moving emotional reunion and hug when the earthquake hits Gotham, and Tim panics about his dad’s safety and comes running home (and meanwhile Jack’s been panicked about Tim’s safety!).  It’s the day-to-day, regular life stuff where they don’t connect.

Jack's written quite differently by different writers. Mostly, Tim's parents are at their least likable in his early appearances and early miniseries (this is where you get, for example, Jack and Janet being nasty at each other while a pained employee looks on, and Tim disappointed to once again get news of where his parents are via postcard - "I guess that sums them up! Never know where they’re going to be–or when–or even how long!” - and Tim alone on school break, and Bruce and Alfred thinking there's something weird going on with Tim's parents, etc. etc.). Jack's more sympathetic but still often unlikable in most of Tim's Robin solo, and he's almost invisible (but positively treated if he does show up) in Tim's team books.

For obvious reasons, Jack's remembered way more sympathetically after his death. Tim's completely devastated by Jack's murder, which he arrives moments too late to prevent, and he basically never gets over it. We see him grieving Jack again and again in Robin, and also in Teen Titans, and also in Resurrection, and again in the Halloween Special, and again in Batman: Blackest Night, and all the way up to the end of Red Robin. Tim also grieves for an extended time over Janet - he hallucinates a happy reunion with her when he's feverish in Contagion, and hallucinates her in the final issue of Robin, and the reveal-your-buried-emotions song in Robin 102 brings up his grief for her too (meanwhile, other characters dance or laugh or otherwise get giddy).  Tim’s grief over his parents’ deaths is intense and long-lasting.

I'm not going to clip comic panels because this is long enough, but if you're curious, here's a nice and fairly lengthy compilation of comic panels with Tim and Jack.

If you're interested in a Jack-centric story with a softer-but-still-recognizably-canon take on Jack, I really like the way Jack’s narration is written in the one-shots Heart Humble (set shortly before Jack dies) and Never a Hero (Ra's resurrects him during Brucequest, and Jack's archeology skills turn out to be unexpectedly useful).

#tim drake #jack drake #ask tag #i wrote this ages ago and now i can't remember what i was going to add to it so oh well draft amnesty? sorry for the long wait anon!! <333 #anyway i kept this carefully on topic and virtuously did not derail into talking about the other blorbo but tags are for disorganization SO #for me this kinda half-in half-out place where tim is with the batfamily is SUCH an interesting part of his relationship with dick #and i never stop turning it over in my head #he's kiiiinda replaced dick in that he's robin - but in a very real way he *hasn't* - he's NOT bruce's new son the way jason was #and early!tim makes a BIG POINT of how bruce is not his dad #and i think this relative distance from bruce is a huge factor in why dick is able to build a close relationship with tim at all #(because dick's still pretty estranged from bruce!) #and there's such interesting tension there when dick starts jokingly calling tim ''little brother'' or when villains call them brothers #because they're NOT. increasingly they would both LIKE to be brothers! but dick has zero official standing in tim's life #if tim got hit by a car in his civilian identity bruce and dick wouldn't even be able to visit him without his dad's permission #which jack would be pretty unlikely to give! jack doesn't like or trust bruce! #or like. this is morbid. but if tim died. dick wouldn't even be invited to the funeral you know? #and there's such interesting tension there for me in the contrast between this vigilante relationship that's very very close #but in their civilian lives no one would assume they're anything in particular to each other #anyway the 1st half of tim's robin solo has this thread of tension between tim's family life vs. his vigilante life (plus his mom's death) #and then the second half + red robin has the thread of struggling with grief in a world that's not fair + feeling lost/alone #and these two threads are a big part of my interest in tim as a character! jack's the backdrop that makes a lot of stories possible

[p1nkshield]

Estranged Uncle Au Part 3!

Jazz sat down with Danny while Clark was finishing up dinner.

“Maybe we can just tell him and he can like adult his way out of it? He is a grown man.”

Jazz and Danny looked to Clark as he seasoned the stew he was making, he turned around, kitten sneezed into his elbow and said. “Gosh! Pepper can really get you! Who are you talking about? Is anyone in trouble?”

Jazz and Danny shared a look. This guy couldn’t hurt a fly if he wanted to.

“We have to tell him Danny.”

“Okay, fine! We looked into Bru-” Danny began, but was interrupted by Clark’s phone ringing.

“Hello? … I’m on my way.” There was a noticeable change in Clark’s demeanor. “Can this wait? I uh.. have to cover one of Bruce’s galas!” Clark really does hate lying.

“I haven’t heard word of Bruce throwing another gala today.” Jazz stated in the same tone she would question Danny when he would poorly lie to her.

“It’s uh last minute! Exclusive! All the more reason to to report about it!” Clark said as he rushed out the door. "The stew will be done in about fifteen minutes!"

Before either of them could do anything Clark was already gone.

"He clearly doesn’t know how to uphold his boundaries! Its like Bruce says jump and Clark says how high! What is he making him do? Why does he feel the need to lie to us?" Jazz was suddenly so worried about an uncle she didn’t know she had like a week ago.

"He's not telling us because were just kids. I don’t know if he really has anyone to turn to but he doesn’t want to worry us. We have to help him."

Clark finished thwarting another one of Lex's plans with Bruce.

"Bats can I talk to you for a second?"

"hn?"

"You know the two teens staying at my home for the time being?"

"Jazmine and Daniel Fenton. Your niece and nephew correct?"

"...yeah they didn’t get the best impression of Bruce Wayne."

"How so?"

"I overheard that they think that Bruce Wayne is a creepy billionaire who isn't who he says he is. They also are the children of my sister who is a scientist of questionable ethics from last I heard."

Bruce cannot have a repeat Tim situation.

"Perhaps Bruce could pay them another visit to smooth things over?"

"That is some really good advice! I'll ask him if he can come over tomorrow." Clark asked facetiously

"I think he can make it. Maybe he could bring some of his kids in order to help them feel more at ease with people their age?"

"That sounds like a great idea."

It was not a great idea.

Danny was Bristling like a cat at Bruce and Jazz had a sour look on her face.

Almost every 'i'm harmless' stop was pulled. Bruce tripped on his way in, and called the kids he brought by their cutest of pet names. Bruce decided to bring Dick, Jason and Timothy. Dick pulled dazzling smiles and showed off his acrobatics in an attempt to entertain. This was met with polite but paltry claps. Jason who had been bribed to be on his best behavior talked at length with Jazz about classic authors and their best works. This headway was halted when Bruce called him Jaylad and Jason took it as a queue to do the who "Dad stawwwp!" embarrassed teenager routine. Jazz responded by becoming pale for a moment and being less receptive to whatever Jason was saying.

Tim was a disaster.

At first he was doing great bringing out all of his gala training. He even noticed Danny wasn't feeling the formalities he dropped them. It was working! Then he fell asleep. Into the snacks that were put out.

"Maybe we should go! It’s already pretty late, and we wouldn’t want to overstay our welcome." Bruce said still smiling as he wiped salsa off of the cheek of a blearily blinking Tim.

"Wha? What happened?" Tim said as he was ushered out of the door.

"You fell asleep idiot!"

"I did!?!"

Clark, Danny and Jazz heard them bicker on their way to the car. I would have been endearing if Clark wasn’t worried sick and Jazz and Danny weren’t convinced that they were in the family business of selling weapons to villains.

"So what do you think?"

"The eldest seems sleazy, the Second seemed nice but gave me a bad vibe and the youngest felt like he was doing everything he can to get Danny to like him and then passed out." Jazz listed.

"Not to mention they all seemed like they were doing everything they could to get us on their good side!" Danny added.

This is not good! Why do they hate him so much? What had Bruce done that was so off-putting?

"Uncle Clark, we need you to sit down."

What is this now? Clark let himself be pushed into a chair. Isn’t this what people do when they say something that might make them pass out?

"We have reason to believe that Bruce Wayne is a weapons dealer."

Bruce? A weapons dealer?

"Danny please show him the evidence."

Evidence?

Danny then showed Bruce the bits and pieces of confidential information.

Clark sat there taking it all in.

"We think that you may be in danger." Jazz said gently.

Him, danger?

"We keep trying to hack him but it's not really working."

"YOU HACKED HIM?!"

"We weren’t traced." Jazz soothed.

"We can get you out of this Uncle Clark." Danny said with much more assurance that his appearance can promise.

"I don't think you understand!" Clark began "I'm not in danger I can't be in danger!"

"Uncle Clark, anyone can be in danger."

Clark's head was spinning.

How was he going to convince two headstrong teens that he wasn't under the thumb of an evil billionaire with out telling them he's Superman?

#dc x dp fic #Bruce did that thing where parents expect kids the same age to be besties immediately #Poor batkids were trying their best #Clark hates lying #almost as much as wonder woman #almost #estranged uncle au

[bluegarners]

What drives me crazy with Dick Grayson is that literally he's only " " canonically " " like what? 24? 23? He was an only child at least until he was 18 and within literally the time of a bachelor's and masters degree he went from just starting as nightwing never had any siblings but a team who loved him and now he has no external support and is supposed to be the "glue" for a ginormous family that's developed faster than he could blink. Honestly I think while Dick loves and enjoys all his relationships with his family half the time he still feels like he wishes they were all friends and a little closer in age instead of him suddenly being in charge and cleaning up Bruce's problems not just for Bruce, but now cleaning up Bruce's problems which cause everyone else problems which cause more problems which inevitably he has to fix because no one else will

And 6ish years ago he didn't have ANY siblings! The whiplash is crazy. I think the fact that Dick would resent all this proves how much he loves them all bc he still goes to such lengths for his family despite his frustration and aggravation

hiya anon! i think right now, dick is in his mid-twenties, say 25 or 26... which is CRAZY bc in my head i am always picturing him as 29 or early 30s... but canonically i think he's stuck with the mid-twenties just like tim is stick at 17

also, i get the impression that all my posts about dick being in a kind of limbo of "eldest daughter" and also estranged brother-son figure to bruce has kind of given the perspective that i think he bemoans his position in the family, but i think he honestly greatly enjoys it! there really hasn't been many instances in canon, if any at all unless looked at with a severe magnifying glass, that gives off the impression that dick more or less begrudges the amount of pseudo-siblings and other family members he has come into quick possession of. if anything, i think dick probably takes a lot of comfort in being able to have so many people around him again, as i think what a lot of people miss out on is that dick didn't come from an "only child family" but a village (haly's). we get glimpses of his family life before bruce, and ultimately it forms a picture of one where, yes, dick was the center of attention because he was the baby of the troop, but also he was more or less raised in a huge family that consisted of people entirely unrelated to him- aunts, uncles, people he looked to as sisters or brothers, grandfather figures, cousins, friends; all of these more familial lens people that he grew up with until his parents were murdered, and he was suddenly taken away from

i imagine the shift to being surrounded by many to being surrounded by exactly two would have been very startling. and, like you said anon, it wasn't until he fully integrated with the titans did that sense of a bigger family really come into perspective for him. however, it is interesting that you bring up how fast it all happened, as i agree, dick essentially got- what? four or five new "family members" within the span of five or so years? like, that's a pretty big shift from being a trio (dick, bruce, and alfred) for ten years, adding very few people (excluding the titans) that he could sincerely count on or even recognize as family (barbara, for example), and now all within the span of a bachelor's degree, he's had to hand off his robin legacy to three different people. damian came a bit after everyone else had more or less settled, but he's a wholeeee other topic of conversation considering exactly what had to happen for him and dick to even meet the way they did

but, going back to the quick new additions, again i don't think dick has ever for a moment thought to begrduge or resent the influx of people in his life. i think a really defining part of his character is his love of people, his love of being around them. while bruce loves people, he loves them in a kind of distant way, where he sees gotham itself as akin to a person he can love- a person composed of a million other individuals, but an almost singular entity. the same goes for bruce's love of the world, i think. but dick, dick loves people as individuals, as persons he can speak to, hold, comfort, cry for, touch, embrace, etc. dick likes the physical presence of people, as well as the whole of humanity like bruce, and i think the defining line of separation for the two and how they love people, is how they grew up

circling back to dick's early childhood, he was raised not only surrounded by the performers, but also the crowds, the fans. dick grew up loving being loved, and though that may come off as superficial or a purely egotistical thing, i interpret it as something that is a soulful, very human thing. bruce can love humanity without being loved, and so can dick, but dick is also willing to embrace the love he gets in return. it's why, i think, dick is also known for having so many lady friends (donna, kory, and barbara being the most outstanding examples). dick loves to be loved, and he also loves to love, so to me, dick suddenly feeling trapped because of a couple new additions to a family that has been so small for so long doesn't make complete sense- i'm not arguing with you however anon!! just making my case that, even though i do think it's an interesting thing to meta-textually analyze, with dick being in that eldest position as well as the next "bruce" (oof, that's shudder inducing), it doesn't quite follow his character for him to wish that things might be different in their circumstances

#again not arguing- i agree!! the whiplash is crazy and its like an out of body moment to really look at the timeline for when #all of this happened/is happening esp with various retcons and how the titans have like. almost ceased to be a part of #dick's usual day/comics #anon #asks #dick grayson #nightwing

[frogsandcookies]

Dick taught Damian how to sew. 

Dick learned from his mother who made costumes and clothes for their family while they were touring with the circus and he’s kept up the skill on the side. 

He never got around to teaching Jason because they were still estranged when Jason died and even though Jason’s back, it still never happened.

Tim surprisingly was just bad at it. Genius hacker, young and upcoming CEO of Wayne Enterprises yet he can’t for the life of him manage to keep a straight stitch. (Dick was a little disappointed but didn’t show it)

After Bruce died and Dick took over for him, he and Damian spent a lot of time together. One day, Dick was sewing and Damian saw, asking him about it. Dick explained and offered to teach him. Damian refused at first but after a hard patrol one night, hesitantly asked Dick to teach him.

Turns out that Damian wasn’t just good at drawing, he also could stitch pretty well. Not on the level of Dick but he picked it up quickly. Dick was overjoyed and during the rest of the time before Bruce’s reappearance, they worked on projects.

When Bruce got back, their routine got messed up but one night Damian snuck out to Dick’s apartment and asked him for help. Dick agreed and their sewing sessions started up again. 

Damian’s interests go towards embroidering (”It’s like drawing but with a needle and fabric as paper.”) whereas Dick ends up making more clothes (which are distributed among the bat family and close friends)

#batfam #batfamily #batfam headcanons #dick grayson #Damian wayne #Damian al ghul #Tim drake #Jason todd #batman

[porcelaintoybox23]

My version of Dick Grayson:

CW: mix of fanon/my headcanon thrown in bc comics can be painfully white, cishet, and boring

1/2 romani. Born in Europe but immigrated pretty young. Speaks Romanian, French, and English before meeting Bruce. Best with Romanian and English.

Happy child, a little more sociable.

Father is American, the whole Gray Son of Gotham thing.

Loses parents at 8, adopted by Bruce.

Manages to americanize his accent. Mixes up words, rarely.

Fucking nerd. Talk to the wall. King of the mathletes. Reads.

Surprisingly, he can sing and was goaded into a musical during senior year.

Continued with gymnastics and acrobatics obviously

Sassy but somewhat shy. He's very serious underneath everything and takes things to heart.

Perfectionist but slowly grows out of it as he becomes an adult and goes to therapy. He still has issues but is working on it.

Is estranged from Gotham and the bats as time goes on. His relationships with Tim and Damian stay pretty good.

Babs was his first relationship but they both grow up and prefer to be friends.

Not a flirt. Takes every relationship seriously and is hesitant to jump into bed.

Has a sweet tooth but still eats normal meals when not hyperfocused on a case

Dropped out of college due to mental health but goes back years later to pursue social work.

Slade isn't a raging creep in this, so they're "friendsly." I think of Slade being a sort of weird uncle who appears in your house at random but will also throw you off a building.

Bruce tries, but he also sucks because Spyral and Ric still happen.

Bisexualllll 💙💜🩷

Adhd inattentive, but it's masked well. Adult diagnosis squad.

Doesn't apply the no kill rule to others as much as Bruce. It's a strict principle for him. He has crossed the line a few times. A big part of his development is reckoning with that and learning how to forgive himself and acknowledge that killing can't be avoided in all situations. He still strives to avoid it, but he won't spiral out every time.

Spice fiend

Likes old cartoons

Plays games, not too much.

Kinda old soul. He's out of touch with social media culture. He doesn't keep up with memes. He is on Twitter a normal amount.

I have like a billion more little details, but that would involve delving into an oc ship, and I'm too embarrassed for that 😅

It'd be cool if people shared theirs.

#dick grayson #dc comics #dc #nightwing

[captainlordauditor]

very serious question - have you watched Titans? i feel like. they have massacred my boy. re: Dick. like the characterization of Every Single Character kills me. i’m lowkey hate watching it but i can’t stop

I'm in the middle of it right now - I just started season three, since I have no attention span for binging.

I actually don't hate large portions of its characterization. It kind of reminds me of a lot of the, like, 2000s-mid 2010s B shows that you'd see on Syfy or similar channels, where the characters are just fleshed out enough to make them feel watchable. They're not full on real people, but they're more like bas relief carvings than cardboard cutouts (It actually pairs nicely with the 2002 Birds of Prey, which was definitely a B show of that vein, and works from the same point of view that Titans does, as an Elseworld). So far the characterization for the most part doesn't feel bad so much as simple.

The characters aren't all that different from comics counterparts at their base, but the plot often demands that they act like idiots - often rude or cruel idiots - to make it work. The episode where all the Titans gang up on Jason, for instance - okay, one, not in the comics, but two, it makes no sense that they would all instantly blame Jason, who has no way of knowing about half their triggers and not, like. One of the empaths.

If anyone feels the most off to me it's Donna, which I think is a result of the Titans take on the Amazons being excessively 2000s B-show-esque. I'm also not personally a fan of Barbara being police commissioner, which ties into my issue with their portrayal of the police overall as a force that Dick doesn't really contend with as an enemy until the middle of season 2, and even then only pretty temporarily. How this relates to the whitewashing of Dick is another matter. The thing about Dick's characterization in Titans is that it's pulling a lot from a lot of very different sources to create a new Dick Grayson, rather than showing one that already exists in a specific continuity. Dick's anger and estrangement from Bruce is from the 70s-80s Bat comics. A lot of his characterization in relation to the other Titans feels very reminiscent of New Teen Titans, where he's the straitlaced serious leader who's too similar to Batman. In Titans these attributes have been adjusted accordingly from the source material they're pulled from to meet the more violent tone of the show. They also included something that's one of my favorite Dick-things in the comics, which is his hallucinations when he's having a Bad Time - instead of hallucinating Jason in prison, Dick hallucinates Bruce, the family who's currently lost to him.

Where Titans really falls down is that it doesn't want its characters to change. It's pretty decent at set up (the scene where Dick talks about burning the Robin suit) but then it doesn't necessarily follow through (he keeps being ultraviolent and killing people just in civilian clothes). This is really apparent in its Jason. In his initial introduction, even post-Crisis, Jason was a sweet, bookish, caring kid once he adjusted to life at the manor. His violence was (and even as an adult to some extent still is) a manifestation of his powerlessness at not being able to protect people, which included both his dad and random people on the street. After his death, flashbacks and retcons turned him into the angry brash kid a lot of people think of him as, which is the route Titans chose to use. And this doesn't work, because if you're writing Dick during one of his "Fuck Batman" moments, and you're also writing Jason in one of his "fuck Batman" moments, and you're trying to show that Jason is the Bad One, then you have to flanderize Jason to have contrast, and then there's nowhere for him to go when he grows into Red Hood. They had an opportunity to do a really heartbreaking tragedy where the sweet 15 year old who quotes Jane Austen turns into a villain, and they didn't do that, because they can't write actual growth.

This ask was about Dick but I do want to touch on a couple of the other Titans real quick - Raven is fine, Titans just pulls from her more modern portrayals, which is not the version of her I prefer. Gar, again, fine, and I really wish they would give the actor more to do. Kon does seem to be younger, but it feels like a deliberate choice, and one I can't bring myself to have issue with given some of the shit that was in his 90s book. The other character I really want to talk about though is Kory.

Titans gets a lot of flack for its portrayal of Kory and as far as I can tell it seems to break into two main categories, which are 1)"I don't like Kory's life not revolving around Dick Grayson" and 2)"I'm racist". I'm paraphrasing, and maybe doing so in bad faith, but it really does seem that I saw a lot of people complaining about Kory having another love interest for five minutes but nobody complaining about Dick having other love interests in the show. And obviously, there was the "this woman who shows less skin than she does in the comics looks like a hooker" from people who didn't like that she was played by a Black actress.

But I'll take this in good faith. You don't like Kory because she's not like she was in the comics. Okay. In that case, I'm simply going to pull out my comics and ask you to consider the baggage a comics-accurate Kory would have on a live action screen played by a dark skinned Black woman:

(From New Teen Titans (1980) #2 - context is the Titans are at the pool, Donna gave Kory a bikini)

I for one am pretty glad that Titans went with "princess used to the finer things in life who's fed up with being royalty" instead of "scantily clad woman who lets her emotions guide her and is extra violent compared to the fully clothed White characters". (more panels under the cut so as not to clog your dash)

If I'd read NTT before Titans came out, I would've been pretty damn skeptical of the casting, because without changing her characterization I think it would've been one of those times where raceblind casting just absolutely does not work. NTT Kory really falls into that intersection of Nubile Savage and Green Skinned Space Babe that you see in stuff like JC's Avatar and Star Trek: TOS, and which has some pretty racist undertones already. As much as I love Kory, I'm incredibly glad that this characterization has largely been left behind for her, even though I'm also not fond of the cartoon's characterization.*

also from New Teen Titans (1980) #2

Both from New Teen Titans (1980) #16

From New Teen Titans (1984) #11. I'm certain there's more instances before this of Dick and Donna referring to her as "savage" but I don't have them handy because I didn't mark them in my notes.

*I think the cartoon leans a little too much into "let's laugh at this woman experiencing culture clash!" for my taste, which is... understandable given it's a show from 2003 for ten year olds, but is very unappealing as an adult. The ideal Koriand'r characterization is actually Red Hood and the Outlaws issues 10-13 and I will not be taking criticism until you've read the story

#titans dc #titans tv #dick grayson #bouncing off the walls #starfire #koriandr #jason todd #team tag for the teen titans #arsonist's lullaby #firebird's child #meta #ntt #anti marv wolfman

[bigskydreaming]

You know what’s a super-interesting thought I just had?

(I mean, unless its not super-interesting thought at all and is actually quite mundane, in which case, lol, can’t believe you suckers fell for that. Wow. How embarrassing.)

But no, I’m just kidding, its actually super-interesting, I might be a genius, waiting on confirmation. So the thing is, there’s one really specific trope that I’ve probably seen used in fic for pretty much every fandom I’ve ever been in.....but that I’ve never seen used in a Dick Grayson fic.

The trope of which I speak is ye olde time travel fix-it trope. Wherein the main character wakes up in their ten or fifteen years younger body or whatever, and like, uses foreknowledge to avert personal tragedies or losses of loved ones.

Now first off, I think there’s something intriguing about the relative lack of this trope in a fandom where things like time travel are literally canon and things the characters are aware of being like ‘so this is a thing that happens, and if my friend/relative woke me up one day and said hey you’re not gonna believe this but I actually have all the memories of me from fifteen years in the future, I would be like no for sure, I totally believe you dude, that happens all the time.’

That right there is already a twist on the usual time-travel fix-it stories, which tend to take place in fandoms where that ISN’T the norm and so the protag is like I must make with the hush-hush and keep the vault of my secret knowledge zipped up tight lest someone book me a nice staycation at the nearest fandom-specific equivalent of Arkham.

But then I ALSO started thinking hmmm, were one TO apply this trope to Dick Grayson in particular, like.....what point in his past would you even PICK as the point in time he returns to, hoping to use his foreknowledge to make play out differently?

Like....would you go all the way back to his parents being killed, and make them check the ropes again? How about before Bruce fired him from being Robin and the estrangement that led to between them? Or before Jason dies? Or maybe before Brother Blood brainwashed Dick that first time, or before Terra betrayed the team, or before Mirage, or before Joey got possessed and the events of Titans Hunt......how about before Blockbuster, or before Donna and Lilith died in Graduation Day or when Bruce was thought dead in Final Crisis, or when Damian was killed by Heretic or before the events of Forever Evil?

THERE’S TOO MANY FIX-IT POINTS HOW DO YOU EVEN PICK?!?!?

But THEN I got to thinking, well.....one of the other things particular to Dick Grayson’s tragedies is how often they’re inextricably tied to later things he doesn’t view as tragic or something he regrets or wants to avert. So its like.....how CAN he go back and avert his parents’ deaths, without giving up the family he later goes on to build with Bruce and all his siblings? If he travels back and repairs his fractured bond with Bruce before being fired as Robin, is it going to be a given that Bruce still meets Jason or feels compelled to take him in? If Jason never dies, does Tim ever join the family? Does Joey ever even join the Titans if Terra never betrays them? Without that time Bruce is thought lost and dead, do Dick and Damian ever form the bond they have in canon? Etc, etc.

So that narrowed it down considerably for me, and I ended up with just a couple key points where I’m like, okay, I could see Dick still ending up back at this time and thinking yeah there are things I want to change and feel safe about changing without undoing other key parts of my life.

1) Blockbuster - This era is I think one of the biggest tragedies of Dick’s life, and because of how....scattered the aftermath and fallout of it was, and the in-story examinations of it, it remains fairly disconnected from the rest of Dick’s life and thus something that he can alter to fairly sizable degree without like.....altering the overall shape of his life after that point in ways he would be averse to. The lives Blockbuster took when blowing up his apartment building, Tarantula, the destruction of Bludhaven as a whole.....all of these are things that Dick, armed with foreknowledge and also strengthened by his growth and development in years long after all this, could tackle and change all on his own. 

And one of the key things about this for me, and the appeal of this flux-point as an area of focus.....is that it would be an opportunity for Dick to change things for the better for HIMSELF. Where the focus would be on yeah, saving all those other lives, but just as much like...saving himself, averting a tragic period of his life for his OWN sake rather than just....because of how it’ll change or improve the lives of friends or loved ones of his. Self-sacrifice is kinda built into so many of his stories and dynamics, that its just like.....very appealing to not deny that this is the case, but rather just hone in on a time and place where he gets to put himself first and be like, I am changing things, I am making things better for ME, because *I* will benefit from this and I deserve to.

I think that’s a neat premise for him, personally. You do you, boo. Get that healing.

2) The Last Laugh - Okay, because I am me and I can’t just like, NOT be obsessed with this story and the implications for Bruce, Dick and Jason, ugh, how OOC would THAT be, like excuse me but I am no Scott Lobdell, I choose to stick with established characterization THANK YOU, next.....

Soooooo, I also got to thinking, what if future Dick were to wake up the morning of Last Laugh’s events and be like, wait why am I here back on THIS day and then also with his knowledge of how things like Jason’s return played out and how much the Joker being alive played into that.....what if he’s like.....y’know what, now that I actually KNOW that whatever else happened if I killed the Joker, at least one person would actually be really fucking beneficially impacted, with potentially large ripples on the rest of the family (like Jason never going full crime lord or attacking Tim in Titans Tower if he were less inclined to avoid his family before all that)....and of course add to that all his awareness of later shit the Joker definitely very much did do and that are not hypotheticals for him (bonus points if this is a Rebirth/pre-Flashpoint continuity mashup and thus Duke’s in the mix here too and Dick’s like, hmmm, one dead Joker means two less Joker-ized Duke parents).....

And so the end result is Dick is like, hmmm yeah, I think actually I’m just gonna kill the Joker again, but like, with intent this time. And Just Say No to Bruce making with the CPR like this is a D.A.R.E. infomercial or something. Yeah, that’s the ticket.

(Because I’ve always maintained that Dick never actually regretted killing the Joker per se, what he regretted was that in losing control and just reacting to the Joker’s taunts and going full pell-mell with the fists of fury, like, he gave the Joker exactly what he wanted and let him ‘win.’ But what kind of quandary is afoot when you have Dick be like....actually, I’m NOT sad about it and I DON’T want Bruce to ‘fix’ this since it doesn’t actually fix what it breaks between them in the first place, and they didn’t ever get past it so much as they just never even talked about it again, so IS it really that much worse if you have Bruce be like GASP, Dick no! You can’t just be OKAY with killing the Joker! and Dick be like GASP, Dick yes! I can, I will, I AM okay with killing the Joker on account of duh, its the JOKER. 

And thus you set the stage for all kinds of DIFFERENT fallout than the first time around, Dick deadset on believing he made the right choice, and Bruce not able to reconcile WHY, and then even if and when Jason DOES return in a much, hmm...’softer’ way than in canon and like, never makes with the attempted fratricide or patricide or any kind of -cide, really, and Dick - who let’s be real, can count as one of his more obnoxious qualities his tendency to be a V. Smug Bitch when he’s feeling particularly ‘I told you so’ about stuff - is like Hah! I told you so! and feels all vindicated and validated about his particular choice of....choices, back then, and Bruce would be like What are you talking about you told me NOTHING, and Dick’s like oh right, I did do that. Vault of secrets thing. Hmm. Well if you’d just TRUST ME that I know what I’m doing which you never do.....

And blah blah blah you get it.

But yeah. That’s my interesting thought. Please feel free to sound off with past-points you’d pick for Dick to return to and try and change things, and perhaps why. 

Or, y’know. Don’t. That’s cool too. The power is yours.

[danny-chase]

Responding to your tags on this post, got way to long so I'm making a separate post, @no-mere-mortals

This also isn't me trying to like be rude or anything I've just read a lot of comics with Dick so I think I can give a good analysis and show his response concisely (or well, this will be long but it's easier than reading a bazillion comics).

So without further ado, Dick's reaction to Jason's death, how he found out, what he felt, and why, with as much canon context as I can fit into a semi-reasonably length post:

Jason died while Dick was on a mission on another planet, right at the end of the Who is Donna Troy (take like 29384, I'm exaggerating but her backstory is ridiculously complicated and this is not the first time they did one of these) event. For context: Dick's been living and working with the Titans for a few years, Robin!Jason occasionally pops up in the comic (notably, he joined the Titans to help save Dick from Brother Blood).

So it makes sense, then that Jason is in the Titans files. Enter Danny Chase, a younger teenager about Jason's age. As previously mentioned the Titans are in space, but Danny being younger, Dick orders him to stay home because he doesn't want him to get hurt on an interstellar mission. Danny is bored. He's a pretty cocky kid, he's hyper competent but also hyper annoying. So he does what any bored overpowered teen would do and starts going through the Titans files to make his own team because those losers left him behind. (Following panels are from The New Titans #52)

When he tries Robin, it comes in as reclassified and he's like whoops. Jason is stored under Robin-2, and his status comes up as unknown.

Danny's confused by this, the computer updated through some external system, and no news had come to the tower about Jason, who he saw last week:

There's not actually panels of these two hanging out, I'd argue that it's implying that Jason comes and hangs out with the Titans semi-frequently and Dick and Jason likely hung out with each other the week before Jason died. Also Danny calls Jason the Toddster which is hilarious but besides the point.

Dick doesn't find out that Jason's died until The New Teen Titans #55 when (because Danny is an asshole) this exchange takes place.

From here, things start spiraling (I'm showing things in what I believe is chronological order)

Dick is pretty devastated by Jason's death. A lot of fans assumes that because Dick and Bruce were somewhat estranged, that extended to Dick and Jason - and at the time of Jason's death, just like in current comics that's not true. I would say it's somewhat analogous to having an older sibling in college that you get to go visit a bunch (pre-crisis, with innocent Jason had Dick actually coming home a bunch, it's post-crisis where they start setting up Dick and Bruce as estranged and Jason as the violent one tm). These comics are post crisis yes, but they didn't erase Jason being semi-close/visiting the Titans. When Dick mourned Jason, he mourned the person, not the brother he never had or being like it's sad a child died (I would say that's more akin to Tim mourning Damian).

Now to your point, Dick feeling guilty. He does initially. Visiting Jason's grave with Kory, there's the following exchange (again in The New Titans #55):

Dick: I gave Jason my old Robin costume. I should have been there, Kory.

Kory: It's not your fault.

Dick: Maybe not. But that doesn't make it any easier.

Dick know the guilt he's feeling is irrational, but again that doesn't get rid of the feelings. He's pretty messed up by Jason's death, as Kory remarks to herself later:

Kory: He hasn't been the same since he found out about Jason. Oh, Dick -- I know you were Robin. I know what it means to you that the new Robin died. I know you feel like part of you died, too -- but it wasn't you, honey. Robin died. But you didn't. You're still alive honey.

At the end of this scene, Dick decides to go talk to Bruce, partially about the fact that Bruce didn't even try to contact him and we get this (warning for abuse) scene (also from The New Titans #55).

So before his guilt was mainly, “I gave Jason my suit” which is pretty much his stamp of approval (even in retellings where Bruce gives Jason the name Robins, which is all but one, Dick gives Jason his old costume as sort of an acceptance of Jason in the role). Which he knows is irrational, because Bruce made Jason a vigilante, not him, and Jason would have died whether he was in another suit or not. But now adding this conversation into the mix, it becomes “I left Bruce, so Jason had to replace me.” to which, Dick again knows is illogical, because that was Bruce’s choice not his and he does defend himself because he knows that accusation is wrong. And then it becomes “Taking me in made Bruce weak” and “you never actually even cared about him” (which especially in this continuity) which again are both false. But it’s coming from Bruce, someone Dick loves and respects and that’s hurtful and words like this have a lasting impact. You can see just how defeated and small Dick feels, curling up into a ball at the end. My point being, not all of the guilt came from Dick. Dick reacted like anyone would, “I should have been there”. But Bruce blamed Dick, not all of the guilt comes from Dick himself.

We see Kory commenting again on how Dick’s changed since seeing Bruce (still New Titans #55)

And we see that Jason’s death, has made Dick view having side-kicked aged partners in a worse light, and maybe partially because of feeling responsible for Jason, he realizes he can’t be responsible for Danny anymore. 

And you can see that Bruce’s words hit home because he’s considering that Bruce taking him in may have been a mistake as well. 

Now at this point Kory realizes there’s something wrong with Dick, and she intervenes (mentioned in New Titans #56) and he ends up going to see a therapist. Chronologically, Secret Origins Annual #3 comes after he starts going to therapy (but before we’ve actually seen him in therapy).

The issue starts with Kory and Dick going on a date, and Dick going home because he feels awful (he blames a stomach virus, so we can assume he physically feels terrible as well as mentally).

The context that comes around that hallucination, is that he’s being attacked by Gargoyle and the Anti-thesis, who have personal grudges against him, and draw him into limbo once he falls asleep to mess with him (and eventually kill him). The reason as stated at the end is his weakened mental state. 

It’s also confirmed that things got bad enough for Dick to be using sleeping pills, canonically in response to Jason’s death here, as well as the fact that he’s not super bothered by like hallucinating a person in his mirror painting not the greatest picture of Dick’s mental health. 

Anyways, time for guilt tripping.

It’s notable that though he’s not the ones making the words, the words are having an effect, and it can be assumed he feels as if he failed Jason. An interesting parallel that can be drawn with Jason, is that Dick has had teenagers die while on his team before.

So it’s possible that guilt over Tara could mix in and influence his feelings towards what happened with Jason. And it’s actually being blamed for Jason’s death that allows him to start turning things around, because again, he knows that Jason’s death isn’t his fault.

And he’s right. The Titans did need him. He loves a lot of people, and he can’t be everywhere at once. And what’s further is that he doesn’t blame Bruce for Jason’s death after that conversation in the cave. With the help of his friends, they defeat the nightmare scenario and Dick reaffirms his love for them and they go to the tower to party, and this is where Dick starts turning things around. 

Now back to The New Titans #56 we get to see Dick go to therapy and work through his feelings about the whole situation.

And here we have Dick talking about his guilt again. Standing away from it, he knows it’s not his fault, but in the beginning he felt guilty, which has been compounded by the two external incidents with Bruce and Gargoyle - even he knows both of them were in the wrong to blame him. 

I guess, my point is with all of this, is that most of the fandom assumes that Dick is the type of person to feel guilty for no reason (to some extent he does have a “tendency towards self blame”), and even if fans understand that Dick and Jason had a good relationship, they tend to make him feel guilty without understanding where that guilt was coming from. Dick’s reaction to Jason’s death is sometimes framed as Dick feeling bad because he didn’t do enough - but he did do enough, and there was nothing he could have done. It’s much more a case of Dick blaming himself, and that blame being reinforced by those around him, his friends helping him realize that he needed help, and him getting that help and being able to recover. 

Honestly, I also think these comics handle the blame of Jason’s death the best, because later literally everyone will go onto blame Jason for his own death, but these comics pointed the blame at the adults for letting him become a vigilante in the first place - they show Bruce’s justification for having Jason in the first place (things worked fine with Dick, he was lonely and needed a partner, Jason could be the same right?) and Dick turning away from the idea of having child sidekicks (after this comes Tim’s introduction, and it seems Dick’s position slides to, well, if Bruce is going to take on a kid, I will do everything i can to help train them so they don’t die, which is logical, and isn’t some big betrayal to his morals - he can’t really stop Bruce and he does tell Tim to go home, Tim just won’t - but Dick not wanting to be responsible for child heroes comes up again, in his reluctance to be a mentor for the young justice gang). Because this is from the Titan/Dick’s perspective, the comic was allowed to challenge Bruce and Dick in a way that other comics couldn’t.

As for Dick being clingy after Jason comes back uhhh I’ll analyze Brothers in Blood another day 💀, but currently their relationship is on good terms, Dick’s not overly clingy, nor canonically has he ever been like that (he’s actually probably the best at emotional intelligence out of the batkids and gives family members space if they need it, he shows up when Jason needs him and doesn’t come barging in uninvited). What can I say, they’re brothers.

#undescribed #bad dad bruce #dick grayson #jason todd #child death mention #nightwing #robin #red hood #batfam #momo don't look #character analysis #canon vs fanon #i miss the discowing suit #child abuse mention #long post

[why-this-kolaveri-machi]

it wasn’t power i coveted; it was acceptance.

Titans 3.06

y’know, i was just thinking the other day that 1.06/1.07 and 2.06/2.07 were the best episodes of their respective seasons, so i have great hopes going in to this one. fingers crossed!

as always, typing this up as i see the episode.

SPOILERS AHEAD

1. oh! um... that was a Cold Open, all right. *nudges* get it? cold? because it’s snowing? and two people got murdered in cold blood? eh?

... oh, i’ve just started.

1.5. i wonder if “i want to be sipping pina coladas on a beach with you” is the new “i’m just one day away from retiring.” i was so on edge after that--i kept expecting that car to explode. even so, the way they died wasn’t an anticlimax: brutal, and quick. 

1.75. so i’m assuming that’s the titular lady vic! this show better bring up why this doll was important or why these two cops needed to be killed, and not leave it to the ether like jericho’s little mindscape jaunt in 2.08 (i’m still dying to know what that was about???)

2.

i love how deliberately unappealing wayne manor is. 

(sorry for the pic quality. i don’t have hbo max! ssshhh.)

2.3. i love the many references to “home” and “our house” when they’ve been here for less than a week and saw one of their friends get blown into pieces. i mean, i unironically love it: home is where family is, after all!

2.5. i’d like to say that kom is playing some sort of long game here, especially given the build-up we had last season and some of the more niggling details this season: why did kom choose now to use her bond to lure kory when she’s been on earth for months? why did justin call kory now, just around the time that she started getting kom’s visions? and what about kom’s ability to exactly imitate other people? hmmm.

2.75. the reason i wrote i’d like to say is that i’ve made the mistake of assuming plot complexity where there is none; i was so invested in the jason todd orchestrated his own death theory for instance, when it turns out that oops! ra’s al ghul just happened to leave a little lazarus puddle in gotham, and oh yeah! scarecrow just happens to have a network of henchmen working for him on the outside and a fully functional laboratory and a weapons cache fit for a new supervillain in the basement of the high security psychiatric unit/prison that he’s in! 

(no i’m not bitter, why do you ask)

2.8. iiiii don’t know what to say about the implications of sex slavery being a thing on tamaran, so i’m not going to say anything at all. for now.

3. gotham, six years ago... wasn’t it five years before s2 that jericho died and the titans disbanded? and when was the flashback from 1.06 where dick let zucco die? i think it was after the events of 2.08: jericho? i can’t seem to find any transcripts or reliable information online, so i’m going to have to rewatch 1.06 at some point. 

(i love the old-fashioned batman music in this heist scene)

3.5. “security is a joke... it’s my way of keeping my dad on his toes”. what you’re an ethical thief now, like an ethical hacker? i don’t think that excuse is going to sell, barbara, on the day you do encounter a decent security system and your father is forced to arrest you.

(then again, gotham’s security is piss-poor. did you know that you could just walk into arkham asylum without any official clearance, ply one of its most dangerous inhabitants with contraband, and said inmate could get away with having an entire laboratory and weapons cache--NO I’M NOT GOING TO LET THIS GO)

3.8 so that flashback between dick and barbara was really cute! and also illuminating:

a) dick sounds so light, so... um. look. i have some apologies to tender to mr thwaites, because while i’ve always thought he does a fine job as dick grayson, i’ve never been terribly fond of his cadence as he delivers dialogue. it’s often monotonous, i thought, but then again, he’s usually delivering exposition or dealing with one soul-crushing crisis or the other. so i was pleasantly surprised to hear dick sound so carefree and alive in his conversation with barbara, laughing frequently, his emotions so bare and bubbling to the surface. it’s really a fantastic contrast to the traumatised and world-weary dick grayson that we see now, even more so than the costume department just bunging a backwards-baseball cap on mr thwaites’ head and hoping that will convince us of his relative youth. 

b) and god, when he wakes up from that memory, all alone in his bed, bleeding from bullet holes in his shoulder (bullet holes that are--in a somewhat convoluted way--barbara’s fault)? yikes. it’s great. you have my apologies, mr thwaites!

c) can you imagine dick just... crawling back to wayne manor, trying not to be seen by anybody, shedding his suit and just... collapsing onto his bed without even tending to his wound? the sheer emotional and physical exhaustion of it? 

d) it’s so interesting to see how barbara and dick approach the idea of legacy--a big theme on the show!--in this flashback. barbara is the one bucking the idea that she should follow in her father’s footsteps, while dick seems pretty content with the batman-and-robin setup, and even tries to get barbara to join their team (robin-girl. pfffft). obviously after this several traumatic things happen wherein dick ends up questioning and then resenting his role as robin, his relationship with batman or even returning as a vigilante at all. and barbara... ends up replacing her father as commissioner. it’s tragic, really. 

e) the dynamic between dick and barbara in the flashback reminds me of how it was between dick and donna in 1.08 and even between kory and dick in early s1. it’s like having an older, strong-willed woman by his side means he gives over the steering wheel for a while and lets himself... unspool, a little bit. it’s kinda endearing.

also:

*pinches his cheeks*

3. you know, we talk about dick and Eldest Daughter Syndrome, and that’s definitely valid, but here gar seems to me the embodiment of it, with all the emotional gardening and firefighting that he’s expected to do. he’s kind of the guy expected to keep his shit together and take care of everyone else while they are falling completely to pieces, unable to carve out time to process his own trauma. he’s also picked up dick’s and kory’s tendencies to bottle up their struggles and shun appearing vulnerable, and he’s struggling in the shadow of both dick and kory undergoing acute crises, his best friend (and frequent confidante) on the other side of the world, and seeing hank die, utterly helpless to stop it. 

i’m glad that he got a chance to tell dick even a smidgeon of what he really feels, and i hope this is at least a semblance of a wake up call for dick to actually sit down and work with the people he repeatedly calls family.

3.5. it’s heartening to see that dick immediately makes it his priority to go talk to gar. but don’t blow off kory in the process, man!

4. i’m really loving this dynamic between kom and conner--i get the idea that both of them consider each other as Unknowns, alien two times over. but conner’s only ever known the titans, who embrace being different, and kom’s only ever known... well. 

anyway, kory is Really Stressed, and honestly? #relatable. 

when you’re forced to bring an estranged family member to hang out with your friends...

4.5. i love that the titans are spending so much time in the kitchen. a real family!

5. jonathan crane is a creep and i absolutely cannot stand him.

5.25. how did he get a whole lab setup (in the basement of a hospital...?) with a bunch of whitecoats to work for him? how did he just waltz into the viewing room of an operation theatre when he’s one of the most wanted men in gotham right now? why is jason wandering around maskless when--presumably--as the adopted son of the most famous person in gotham he’d be a tad more recognisable than your average joe?

why do i expect this show to answer anything anymore?

5.5. that’s not necessarily a criticism, mind; i’ve said since season 1 that titans is very comics-like in this aspect, all about the Aesthetic and the splash-page splendour rather than the niggling unimportant details of how or when the characters got to said location. like. the camera gliding over the operation being set-up, lady vic bursting in and doing her murder dance (imagine the luck of the poor intern who chose this day and this surgery to assist) and jason, shocked and slack-jawed, framed by blood.

5.75. it’s a sobering reminder for jason that, though he chose this path in order to gain control over a world that seemed like it was rapidly spinning out of his grip, he’s only succeeded in handing over even more control to a man with an agenda that is very clearly not aligned with his own. he’s in too far to stop now, though.

5.9. i have a lot more thoughts about jason! saving it up for the end of this recap, though.

6. more kitchen time! i better see dick do some cooking soon...

(”our kitchen”! it still delights me! kitchens are So Important)

6.25. so much of dick’s issues have revolved around his relationship with bruce, so it’s completely understandable that in the wake of a huge crisis where bruce literally asks dick to replace him and be a “better” him, dick would default to all the worst things he learned from the man. and i’m glad kory’s having none of it, but come on, guys. the woman’s literally fetched her fratricidal sister out of a hole in the ground with no idea what said sister is going to do next and experiencing a burgeoning sense of guilt far, far beyond her history with the titans, and dick’s too far into his autocolonoscopy that he can’t see that she needs help.

6.5. “he services your urges”--well, as far as we know, kory is the last person he had sex with...

7. “i hope [gar] isn’t angry with me...” SIR! i thought you’d already spoken to him! smh, as the kids say. kory wouldn’t be needing to reassure you if you just took the effort to build two way emotional relationships with the rest of the team. @superohclair​ was taking about dick’s relatively low emotional intelligence? i agree.

7.5. “i got my own problems [...] you and barbara? fix it.” YOU TELL HIM, KORY

8. man i really like this weird, sad tension between dick and barbara--this sense that both of them are approaching the other based on how they remember them and are ultimately disappointed by the truth. barbara thought she could trust dick to... well, be a better batman, but dick has not only failed at that in her eyes, but repeatedly undermined her while exploiting the authority that she gave him. in dick’s eyes, this is nothing like the barbara that he knew, rebellious and ready to do whatever it takes to find something. 

like. this show sometimes really hits me in the chest about the ways it shows kids grow into adults and into caretakers, and the way it’s stop-start, the ways nothing can happen at all for a long time and then it’s Crisis Central all at once and there’s no space to breathe. the weird sort of sadness that comes with nostalgia. 

8.5. oracle name drop! i agree with barbara, any system that can just randomly tap into gotham phonelines is a monster.

8.7. (i don’t know if it’s my imagination, but is dick holding himself... differently in this episode? like that wound is definitely bothering him, and he’s running on fumes)

9. man, that was a really sweet scene between kom and conner. “feeling alien in your own world”... “not quite here nor there”

honestly this team runs on conner and gar’s faith in their value as a family, and it’s a sign of conner’s generous heart that he extends that opportunity to blackfire. this arc of maturation for him, where he’s now able to consciously choose which parts of himself he can use to do the thing he wants to so--save people--has been so fulfilling to recognise. this baby’s grown with the titans! and what he’s learnt is that people can get fucked up, but the titans is a place where they can be fucked up, and grow.

MY MAN CONNER

10. oh man i’m drinking in the gar-dick interaction in this episode like i’m three days into the desert and it’s the only source of water for miles around!

a) gar is absolutely not dealing with dick’s bullshit this episode and I LOVE IT. it’s such a far cry from the man who was idolising dick/robin back in s1 and expecting him to solve all their problems. dick is fallible, dick is fucked up, but he Tries His Best and that’s ok.

b) dick, huffing and puffing through that vent, unable to put any pressure on his left shoulder, trying to have a heart to heart with gar... fuck i love this asshole. 

c) bruce took in a kid who was suffering... “and made him into a weapon”. well. i absolutely agree with dick that it was bruce who put these kids into these horrible situations with him and they came away with a bucketload of trauma to add to the one that they already had. but we know that bruce was really trying with jason, and at the end of s2, dick was coming to acknowledge that bruce had offered him something that wasn’t just darkness. jason’s death and bruce’s reaction to that shattered that fragile progress.

d) “gotham got to me too.” i feel more sympathetic towards dick running off on his own than most, and it’s not just because i’m an unapologetic stan.  we’ve seen before that dick... devolves when overwhelmed, and he lashes out and makes ill thought out decisions and just Does Not Deal. it happened after hearing the news that deathstroke had returned in s2, and it didn’t help that everyone around him was reeling at the news, either. this time, however, he has his salvation in his family, and despite some stupid decisions like running off and kidnapping supervillains without telling his team, he’s been really on the ball this season. thinking clearly and logically, holding it together and working on a plan, thinking two steps ahead of the villains... yes.

e) gar needing to believe that jason isn’t beyond redemption... there’s a lot of blood on his hands, too, from when he was manipulated by cadmus last season. it makes sense why he’d relate to jason’s predicament, and i hope dick picked up on that.

f) my head just added a plaintive ow after dick jumped feet first into the storage room

i need, crave gifs of this scene!

11. *sits on hands* i’m going to talk more about red hood, i promise!

12. more gar and dick! is it my birthday??!!

(actually, according to the tamil calendar, it is my birthday! my “star” birthday)

12.5. excellent. dick using some implausible training that bruce taught him to solve a mystery? passing some of that knowledge onto gar? that proud smile when he sees gar perfectly execute moves that he taught him? MY HEART IS EXPLODING

13. aw, i love flashback!dick and barbara, they’re so cute <3

13.25. why does it not surprise me that the way he proposes a relationship to barbara is by saying “we make sense”? this guy can deduce exactly who was present where and what weapon they were holding from a garbled audio recording but other times he’s utterly clueless, and that’s a consistent character beat right from s1

13.5. so.... that’s why lady vic has it out for... barbara....? i don’t get it. it’s flimsy. but hey! the fun thing about titans is that i don’t have to get it. the payoff has nothing to do with the plot.

14. i can’t believe that barbara fell for that, but at least that wheelchair fight looked awesome, so.

15. oh yeah, i forgot that red hood bullied the mob into helping him and scarecrow... at least that explains the whitecoats and the elaborate set-up.

15.5. honestly i love how this dynamic between kory and kom is developing, though i wish more of the team would pay attention to it. time to call justin, i think!

16. i wonder what happened after that second flashback where barbara got hurt during that heist. did she give up on doing any more (maybe jim caught her)? was it because dick was called away by bruce and then the titans and got caught up in his own issues? maybe barbara froze him out because she wasn’t looking for the relationship that he was looking for? maybe the idea of doing that with someone turning into batman-lite was just... unappealing? scary?

whatever it is, it doesn’t look like dick ever processed the end of that relationship. it’s very intriguing to see where their dynamic goes next.

17. so.... what, did vic deliver some fear toxin to barbara? i... what?

17.5. and i TOLD YOU that they would never explain that doll or why vic attacked those two cops at the beginning! oh, titans. never change. 

18. did jason just randomly have tim’s restaurant burgled? god, i’m feeling a bit nauseous... are they going to kill tim’s father?

18.25. i feel like the rest of the season is going to wrestle with jason’s culpability in the horrible stuff he’s doing and i’m already seeing that prospect divide fans. on one hand, his story is taking a lot of oxygen away from other equally interesting story arcs, and he’s done some truly awful things, like indiscriminate murder, threatening to kill children, blowing up hank, and potentially killing tim’s parents. 

there’s something to be said for the kind of hold that crane has over him, and the so-called ‘anti-fear’ drug that he keeps plying jason with--he’s alone, drugged almost constantly (to the level of dependence), fresh from the trauma of being bludgeoned to death. he hasn’t conquered fear; he’s ruled by it. on the other hand, given that he’s the one character on the show given an obvious and identifiable ‘mental illness’ arc (maaaaybe dick too), one can argue that it’s irresponsible to show this progress into such violence: jason was vulnerable because he was struggling, and that left him vulnerable, but it took only a push before he became a fucking serial killer.

but that could mean we underestimate the degree of that vulnerability, and the mechanics of this universe where he fell into the clutches of the one supervillain perfectly designed to exploit that vulnerability. that helpless spiral into further and further self-destruction is all too real. it’s valuable to know that someone who has sunk that low can still seek help--actual help--and get it. 

18.5. i don’t know. it’s not a question i’m going to resolve at the end of an overlong recap at 1 in the morning. i don’t believe it’s even a question that titans can resolve. but i am interested in where they’re going next with jason.

19. this episode was genuinely great! i’m pumped for the rest of the season!

#titans #titans spoilers #meta #dick grayson #koriand'r #barbara gordon #garfield logan #conner kent #komand'r #jason todd #jonathan crane #a byronic cupcake #badass strawberry truffle #manic pixie pop tart #a tragic jalebi #this is a 3k+ MONSTER yikes

[stxleslyds]

NIGHTWING VS HUSH

I did read it and I loved it! In fact, I loved it so much that when the trade came to my country, I bought it even though its cover has Joker and Harley in it (and I do not like any of them). Travis Moore’s art might be one of the biggest factors of my love for that issue but many things from it were just right!

First of all, it was really nice to see both Dick and Clark being presented as the closest friends to Bruce, because they were the ones coming up with his bachelor party. I am always here for Clark and Dick content! It even got better when we were told that Dick came up with the idea for the “party”, Bruce seemed really happy and content with that pocket dimension where basically the only thing that he could do was do some fishing. It just seemed adorable to me.

Hush as a villain can sometimes come off as boring but I think they did something really good and interesting when Hush and Dick found themselves stranded in a creepy dimension.

While I will always see Dick and Bruce as a son/father duo I also really like the idea of Dick and Bruce being friends as Dick grew up. And because of that I really enjoyed Hush feeling especially mad at Dick for having “taken” his place in Bruce’s life.

Dick is written beautifully, he is serious and doesn’t let Hush play games with him. I love it. I would have loved to see more of this Dick Grayson, you know? The perfect mix between adorable, kind, sweet, badass, serious and smart.

This issue, brings to light in very subtle ways how much of a good man Dick is. He is just the best and in this issue he proves it more than once, when he knows exactly what Bruce would like for his “party”, when he carries Hush’s body to safety even though it was very far away and Hush continuously threatened to kill him...

When that guy decides to help them by saying that they needed to go “somewhere that reflects where your identity is strong and distinct” and Dick chooses Wayne Manor I feel like that was a clever decision. (It wouldn't be the first place that comes to mind for Dick specifically but he needed a place for both of them to be strong).

As Dick explains to Hush why he brought them there, Hush begins to question why Nightwing knows so much about him and why would Wayne Manor could be of help to Nightwing himself. Dick really makes Hush loose his cool completely and I like to think that he had thought that would happen.

When Hush unmasks Nightwing, Dick isn’t troubled at all, he is all cool and ready because he knows exactly what to say. And he destroys Hush by telling him exactly what he doesn’t want to hear.  He tells Hush the truth, that even when Hush was just Tommy, he was never truly there for Bruce, he tried so hard to be like him that he forgot to be there for his friend, and that’s why as time passed Tommy and Bruce became more and more estranged.

If I weren’t already in love with the writing in this book, the twist that Dan Abnett gives us next would have made me go insane out of love for this story.

This might be me, but Hush revealing that he transformed his face to be an exact copy of Dick’s only proves that Dick is the MVP in the Bat-Clan (Dick-Family rise up!). Hush literally says that what he wanted “to go back to being his (Bruce’s) best friend again. So, I did it. Mr. Grayson. I practiced my art... I’ve become you, Dick Grayson”

Hush wanted to be important to Bruce again so he “became” Dick Grayson, that validates every theory/idea that we have had that Dick is Bruce’s (as well as others) support system and safety net. “His true confidant. Always there. His best friend.”

Dick Grayson’s power!!! Listen, I don’t care about Bruce and Dick’s relationship all that much, I still think that Bruce is a horrible father but my love for this book has nothing to do with Bruce, it has everything to do with how important Dick is written out to be for Bruce. How much value Dick’s love and they way that he cares for people has. In very few pages this story gives me (and maybe other readers) back that feeling of Dick being represented as the absolute best thing that happened to Batman and DC comics.

I know, it sounds like I am hyping up the story way too much but that how I felt when I first read it and I, right now, can only agree with my past self.

Anyway, let me go back to the issue, after Hush reveals his new face those scary faceless things get in Wayne Manor but Bruce also manages to open the dimension rift back up.

And here Dick shows us once more how much of a good man he is, he not only tries to reach for Hush as he is being attacked by those weird people but after he crosses the rift he asks if Hush was able to make it back with him! I mean, this man is just too precious!

Now comes the kinda sad but also adorable part, when Dick wakes up after having passed out in Bruce’s arms (when he went through the rift) he hears Bruce and Clark talking and that’s when he finds out that Clark will be Bruce’s best man at his wedding.

Travis Moore, I love you. His Dick Grayson is pretty, yes, but it is also full of emotion, his eyes are full of hurt but he still manages to look soft as if to hide how hurt it makes him that Bruce didn’t choose him. I love it, have I said that before?

And when Dick notices that he made Bruce feel uncomfortable he does his best to make him comfortable again! His eyes and his body language change... Travis Moore is a master at drawing emotions in characters and how those emotions change, it is honestly impressive, if someone doesn’t like the plot of this issue, the art, I am sure, makes up for it!

Dick looks so soft and relaxed, he even apologizes for things that aren’t his fault, he goes out of his way to make sure Bruce doesn’t feel bad for not choosing him as his best man and then procedes to tell Bruce that he would like to like to hang out with him as soon as he can because he felt guilty about them having distanced from one another.

I know, him blaming himself for things that aren’t his fault and him trying to comfort others when he didn’t do anything wrong to begin with, isn’t something that should be praised (and I am not doing that) but it’s in character for him. It is, because he is selfless and wants his family to be happy and comfortable.

(Just to be clear, I don’t believe for a second that Dick was the one that put “distance” between them, in canon it has always been Bruce, either Bruce couldn’t handle that Dick spent more time with the Titans or he pushed Dick away with his horrible attitude, but Dick is the one doing the talking and sadly Dick can sometimes come off as an unreliable narrator because he tends to take the blame for things that aren’t his fault or, at least, not completely his fault).

So yeah, those were my thoughts on Nightwing vs. Hush! Thank you for the question @chainusser​ ! I hope you have a wonderful weekend!

#nightwing #dick grayson #nightwing vs hush #bruce wayne #DC comics

[maychorian]

hi! I don't know if you can help, but I'm really trying to figure out about Dick Grayson and his growth and change from Robin to Nightwing. I thought there was some argument between Dick and Bruce that led to Dick going on his own, and tension about Bruce taking on a second Robin, but nothing I've really found talks about that transitional period for Dick

I am a bit limited right now because I can't really get into the comics and copy paste the screenshots for you I hope someone who follows me will be able to do that for you to give you more information right now because of the limitations with my eyes I just can't do that.

Also I'm using the speech to text on my phone I will go back and edit it a little bit to try to be more clear but it keeps auto censoring d*** and I think it's kind of funny.

But long story short yes d*** and Bruce had an argument it's been retro O gosh what's the word It's been retconned at least once in the nightwing solo series.

In the original version d*** got shot while on the job as Robin and Bruce got incredibly paranoid about that and decided to bench him and d*** took it very hard basically thought that he was being kicked out of the house and Bruce was not clear that d*** was still you know his kid and d*** ended up basically going to live with the Teen Titans and remade his entire costume to be nightwing instead of Robin because Bruce had taken Robin away from him. And then Bruce met Jason and made him Robin basically immediately and it was very disrespectful and cruel almost and I talk a lot about how Bruce in the older comics is better than Bruce in the modern comics and that's true but that entire thing with d*** was just really mean and bad and I don't like it and I ignore it most of the time.

The nightwing solo series version was also pretty stupid though. D*** was too busy with the Teen Titans and he was late to Gotham to help Bruce with some pretty insignificant case like I think they were fighting killer croc. It wasn't even that big of a deal but Bruce basically gave d*** an ultimatum that he had to choose between Teen Titans and being Robin and and once again d*** felt very disrespected and felt he was being kicked out and ended up talking to Clark and learning the kryptonian legend where he got the name nightwing and then he made his new costume. That version also had a really awful way of Bruce like taking Jason in and making him Robin he essentially kidnapped Jason and tied him up in the cave and d*** sees this and is just really really stupid and bad. But at least in that version we got d*** calling Jason little wing which is cool and I loved that part but otherwise very bad do not like.

In both versions yes d*** was pretty upset about Bruce taking another Robin. And they both make sense because Bruce basically took it away from him for very little reason and then gave it to a kid who was much younger and it just didn't make sense. Like in the 1st version his excuse was that it was too dangerous the streets had become too dangerous he couldn't have a teenage partner anymore, but then he makes Jason into Robin who's even younger than deck and it was just really bad decision making all around. He even ends up admitting to d*** that he made Jason Robin because he missed having a you know a little side kick but that just means that he decided his loneliness was more important than keeping a kid safe and that's gross.

And in the 2nd version it really came off seeming like he wanted a Robin who would be more under his control and more subject to him instead of independent the way d*** was becoming too involved with the titans. And that is also very gross. So yeah just really really really nasty stuff in the comics both the the older version and the retconned version and I do not like either versions and I ignore both.

It is very clear in the comics though that Bruce did come to see Jason as a son and not just sidekick. I wish that had been made a little bit more clear but he really loved Jason a lot and he really wanted what was best for him and it's a shame that the comics fan community never really came to appreciate Jason and so when they were given a choice they ended up killing him off.

Either way d***'s anger at Bruce was quite justified and it only makes sense that they were estranged for a while and d*** definitely had difficulty accepting Jason. But d*** is such a warm and outgoing person that he did end up loving Jason as a little brother and spending time with him and it's a shame that they didn't get more.

#askbox #batfam #dick grayson #bruce wayne #jason todd #speech to text

[biblio-bitch]

Titans (2018): Post S1 Thoughts pre-analysis

To add some variety my pre-written Detroit Evolution posts, have a slightly pre-written Titans post. This isn’t a liveblog simply because I already watched a whole season and I only wrote things down in a groupchat so once I rewatch I’ll write something out.

As usual, spoilers under the page break!

I need y’all to understand my love of the characterization. Seriously. Finally we have a show that understands the underlying rage in Dick Grayson and the general no-fucks-given attitude that surrounds Jason Todd.

Dick! Is! The! Angry! Robin!

Dick is the OG angry Robin y’all coming at Jason but he learned it from Dick “Moved cities and became a cop to avoid Bruce because he was pissed at him” Grayson

Dick “Started a fight with Hank Granger in front of the kid he just impulse kidnapped/adopted because they both have anger issues and won’t address them” Grayson

Jason “Likes classic literature and was only mad because he got killed and Bruce couldn’t be bothered to avenge him and was also affected by the Lazarus Pit” Todd isn’t angry he’s just grieving. (In case you haven’t seen the show and just give zero shits about spoilers, Titans Jason and Comics Jason have two different timelines as of S1, C!Jason died at about 15 and then the whole Red Hood thing happens, T!Jason is 19 and thriving so any mention of Jason’s death is entirely about the comics.)

Jason “I’m Robin and Robin gives me magic” Todd came from the streets and fought for his happiness and then was murdered he’s just the OG dead Robin

Dick “I’m a cop because I don’t want to be Robin and I’m estranged from Bruce except I’m still going into the streets because I’m angry” Grayson and Jason “I love being Robin and I idolize the original boy wonder except he doesn’t really like me and also I really hate cops for a really valid reason” Todd

Ok now that I’ve rambled about Jason and Dick, let’s talk about Rachel for a hot friggin second. I haven’t watched the original Teen Titans so don’t come for my ass about this. It’s on the watchlist I swear.

Rachel in this is a kid. Straight up a child. Raven in the original TT as far as I know is kinda an ancient demonic being who knows. everything. I really like the Rachel & Dick dynamic though. More of a mentor dynamic than the Teen Titans thing. I hope Dick is the Teen Titans Robin. There’s so many of them I just can’t tell. 

In any case, I like that we get to watch Rachel learn to use and be confident in her powers a little bit. It’s a nice character arc that I like seeing.

Starfire? What a queen. Koriand’r is such a cool character and I love seeing her played by a darker skinned black woman. Also her hair? Beautiful. I love that we see her go from this angry, mostly indifferent, slightly out of control woman who literally only wants to know who she is to a slightly less angry woman who wants to protect the kids she and Dick surprise adopted and began to build an identity away from who she was without completely giving up on finding out who that is. 

The Dick/Kori thing? Beautiful. I love that there’s a moment where they address that it’s not a great time for them to be in a relationship because Kori still wants to figure herself out and Dick has so many issues a therapist would cry. Not to mention that he was still clinging to the last bits of Robin. It’s a nice message I wish I had known because goddamn that would’ve been helpful. 

Garfield Logan is a wonderful being. He just wants to help, y’all. Seriously someone give him a hug he looks like a lost puppy. 10/10 would literally die for him. I will never forgive the show for 2x07 (which I skipped ahead to watch for fanfic purposes) where he has like two lines and they don’t show him caring about Jason at all even though the Gar I know would be by his side the whole time. He’d notice Jason’s absence before Mr. Dick “I’m hallucinating but won’t tell anyone because I blame myself for everything” Grayson, don’t try to bullshit me DC.

Donna Troy? I love her. I have no background comic knowledge of her but I am in love with her. She could break my spine and I wouldn’t care. Also? She calls Dick out on his bs. Good. He needs it.

Dawn and Hank. I have literally nothing about them. I think Hank is angry for good reason but I haven’t seen a lot of them interacting with the team so I’ll refrain from judgement until I have. But Dawn is played by Minka Kelly, aka North from DBH and she’s very pretty. That’s all I got for now, will revisit in S2′s analysis.

Also, honorable mention to the fact that out of the three adult women in the show, Dick has slept with at least two of them. Honestly I think that’s awesome but I wouldn’t ask for relationship advice from him because A) I’m ace and B) His relationships don’t seem to last very long beyond that. Maybe he should get therapy and come back when he’s mentally stable. 

Overall I give S1 a 9/10, I will never give anything DC makes a full ten simply because DC’s canon is so screwy. Seriously. I adore the show but this is a whole other DC canon I’m trying to keep straight. I haven’t even finished Red Hood and the Outlaws yet ok it’s not easy. 

#dc comics #theo watches titans (2018) #jason todd #dick grayson #titans #dc titans #donna troy #garfield logan #rachel roth #dawn granger #idk her last name and I assume they're married at some point #hank granger #koriand'r #kory anders #robin #nightwing #wonder girl #beast boy #raven #hawk and dove #starfire #dc's screwy canon #titans spoilers #robin the second

[alecmagnuslwb]

Inked

Writer’s Month 2020 Day One

Read on AO3

The door swings open right on cue just like it has at three o’clock on the second Tuesday of every month this year.

Jason looks up from where he’d been sketching at the front desk when the little bell above the door chimes and he hates to admit he freezes for a moment. Roy Harper looks good, really good. He’s cut his hair since the last time he saw him for his monthly tattoo in July and it gives Jason a whole new view to admire.

The shoulder length red tresses are gone his hair now shaved down on the sides and a little longer at the top. Jason likes it, it gives him a view of Roy’s strong neck that had previously been covered. Roy lifts an arm running his hand through the top of his hair as he gives Jason one of those big beaming smiles he always seems to sport. The movement highlights his biceps which are blissfully exposed due to the oppressive August heat of the city.

He slips the beat-up grey trucker hat in his hand on his head backwards once he reaches the desk leaning on it with his strong exposed forearms.

“Hey, ya Jaybird. Ready for me?” he asks that grin still on his lips.

“Always,” Jason says closing up his sketchbook.

Jason moves back a bit so that he and Roy aren’t practically nose to nose. Not that he doesn’t want them to be nose to nose it’s just that they aren’t there yet. They might never be, he’s not really sure what’s going on between them if he’s being honest.

Jason and Roy have technically known each other since they were teens, back when they were Robin and Speedy the children of two of the most known superheroes in the world, but Jason made a choice to hang up the pixie boots before he graduated high school for his own mental  and physical health and Roy chose the same after his first round in rehab had nearly killed him.

After that their paths had diverted. Jason had gone to art school and promptly dropped out a year later to pursue art on his own terms. Roy had attempted an engineering degree, but his mind was lightyears ahead of anything any college could teach so he’d flunked out for not doing his assignments properly ever.

Then came a dark year for both of them, a year that no amount of therapy will every completely wash away. Jason had hit rock bottom with is career and his estrangement from Bruce for choosing a world outside of vigilantism came to a violent head while Roy hit his own rock bottom at the end of a needle.

It took years of failed relationships, bad decisions and hard work for them both to pull themselves back up out of it all, only ever really hearing about each other’s struggles through the gossip grapevine that is Dick Grayson.

Eventually Roy made his way back to Star City. Upon finding out he had a daughter he had gotten truly sober and stable for the first time in his life with the support of his dysfunctional super family. He made amends with Oliver, primarily through Dinah’s stubborn insistence they work it out, took to single fatherhood in a way he’d never taken to anything so quickly and got a job at a florist’s shop giving himself a peaceful place to spends his days that allows him to tinker with every new invention he can in his spare time without the stress of making exploding arrows to fight crime at night.

Jason had had a similar path. He and Bruce still rest on shaky ground and he’s fairly certain they always will, but he’s good with his brood of siblings again and putting his art expression into something as permanent as tattoos has been therapeutic.

Moving to Star City for Jason had been a whim. He needed out of Gotham, he’d saved up enough to start his own shop to truly make a name for himself, but he couldn’t do it in a city that was swimming in Bats. Dick had been the one to suggest Star, at the time Jason hadn’t thought anything of it. Had just assumed he was sending him to a town that still had the comfort of rampant vigilantism, but with the advantage of being on the other side of the country from anything with the name Wayne slapped on it.

Ever since Roy came walking into his shop, Bat Tats a name he 100% chose to piss of his adoptive father, eight months ago on Dick’s suggestion Jason thinks maybe his overbearing brother had ulterior motives. That maybe there’s a reason Dick is one of the few people who understands why Jason and Roy have become so close.

So here they are now two former sidekicks with their fair share of daddy issues and trauma doing a little bit better in every aspect of their lives every day and finding a friendship in one another Jason’s come to treasure.

“No Lian today?” Jason asks as Roy moves on autopilot to his usual station to take a seat.

Roy shakes his head taking off his hat and throwing it on the wall ledge behind him.

“I love that little girl more than anything, but keeping her sitting still and entertained for an extended period of time can be a struggle, especially when she knows she could be playing outside,” he says chuckling. Jason smiles remembering some of the previous months when she had tagged along and the way Lian had twirled around on a swivel chair asking Jason a million questions and briefly running into one of the brick walls when she spun a little too hard. “Don’t need her distracting you so much you end up accidentally inking me with something that looks like a dick.”

“Lian is no distraction, trust me, she’s a delight,” Jason responds with a smile as he sets up his station. He means it Lian is a ball of energy with a smile like her father and wit far greater than most adults Jason has met. Roy is far more of a distraction, his tattoo in April which had been on his bare chest had nearly killed Jason. “And if I was going to tattoo a dick on you there would be nothing accidental about it.”

Roy full out belly laughs and Jason loves the sound.

“Speaking of dick’s,” he says as he rolls up his chair to Roy’s side snapping on his gloves. “You sure you don’t want that Nightwing tattoo? It’s a best seller.”

Jason tilts his head up to the wall where proudly, because Dick framed it the ass that he is, is the Nightwing symbol with a gold plate below it reading #1 bestseller. If Jason didn’t like paying his bills he’d probably stop offering it, but the last three months has seen a surge in his popularity since he and Babs essentially stopped an apocalypse on their own and Jason has found himself with at least a dozen requests for the symbol every week.

“Not a chance, I will not take part in fluffing Grayson’s ego, I refuse,” Roy says before gesturing down at his body. “This body is temple now.”

Damn right it is, Jason thinks eyes lingering a little too long at the body in question. Long enough that he’s pretty sure he’s been caught so he clears his throat not meeting Roy’s eye as he loads up the tattoo gun.

He doesn’t see Roy smirk as he stretches out his arm for Jason and he definitely doesn’t notice how Roy watches the white streaks at the front of his hair fall over his eyes intently as he bends his head to get to work.

Today’s tattoo is a simple one. A small date that’s just a few days away to be added onto his ‘Lian forearm’ as they call it, alongside her name, the word for daughter in Navajo and a handful of little drawings Lian herself has proudly designed. The date marks his fifth year of sobriety, the day he decided to be there for his little girl for the rest of his days.

They chat while Jason works, Jason trying to ignore the way Roy’s scars feel warm under his fingers at every pass. Roy gives an update on Lian as back to school nears and Jason updates him on the weirdest tattoo requests he’s had the past few weeks. His personal favorite being the 82-year-old grandma who’d come in requesting a tattoo of a lion’s head that her grandson designed.

Roy chuckles as Jason finishes up getting the materials to wrap up the new ink.

“Well she sounds cool as hell, any chance she’s willing to take on new grandchildren?” he asks.

“I asked, she said she could direct me to some equally as cool friends since she’s already got 13 of her own,” Jason chuckles as he finishes wrapping up. “All done.”

He pulls away with a smile snapping the gloves off and throwing them in a nearby trash can. They walk back up to the front together, Roy paying and tipping him way too much like he always does.

“You’re absolutely worth it,” Roy says when Jason tries to wave off the excessive tip. Jason’s breath catches, the context isn’t remotely what Jason’s dumb gay brain is thinking, but it feels loaded anyways.

Jason brushes it off best he can. “If you say so,” he shrugs.  

“I do,” Roy says back instantly not missing a beat. Jason’s about to ask him if his tattoo streak is going to continue next month, but Roy beats him to it.

“I know we usually have a monthly date here and I do plan to keep that up, Lian has a killer new idea with a lizard wearing a top hat,” Roy says a little nervousness in his words. He reaches up adjusting his hat, a nervous tick Jason has picked up on over the months, it’s a little thing most people would overlook, but no matter how much time passes his training from Bruce is always there telling him to watch every little move and tick of every person he encounters. “But I was thinking we could have another date before that, you know not here and not you giving me a tattoo. Maybe over dinner?”

Jason’s eyes drop down to Roy’s at that quickly looking away from where he’d been watching him play with his hat.

Evidently Jason is quiet for far too long because Roy starts to fumble the hat around even more.

“Obviously if I’ve read everything wrong all these months then we can just act like this never happened and call it nothing more than a friend hang,” Roy rambles. “Or you know just let me die of embarrassment for a few more minutes and we’ll only ever see each other inside these four walls.”

“No,” Jason says finally snapping out of his shock that Roy just asked him out. “I mean yes, yes I’d love to go to dinner with you on a date.”

Roy puts his hat back on properly and smiles that big smile of his again.

“Great, how about Friday? Lian’s having a sleepover at Dinah and Ollie’s, so I’d be all yours for the evening,” Roy says, there is a little bit of implication in his words, months of built up charm and light flirting via friendship slipping in.

“Friday works for me,” Jason replies easy with his own smile no doubt as big as Roy’s.

#my fic #writersmonth2020 #jayroy #jason todd #roy harper #fun fact idk if i like writing jayroy but i've commited to three fics for them this month so i'm putting them out there #30 more days to go

[m00nslippers]

Everyone Crushing On Jason 1

Well um...I said I had something nice for you guys and this is it, the prologue to the 'Everyone Crushing on Jason AU' that no one asked for. Unlike the AU you all know and love, this isn't actually funny, it's more serious. I want to write more of these, maybe turn some of the longer scenes into chapters. But for now I hope you guys enjoy.

- - -

It was a mistake.

Bruce should have realized that fact as soon as the matter was proposed in the monthly JLA meeting, but the truth was that he hadn't wanted to. Jason was doing so well. He'd been a solid member of the Gotham vigilante community for going on two years. He'd stayed out of trouble as well as any former Robin could, that was to say not at all, but at least the Red Hood was respected as a hero and no longer condemned as a villain.

And possibly even better than Jason's progress from villain to hero, was Jason's progress from estrangement to established family member. Bruce was finally at a point in his relationship with his second son that he didn't wake up in a cold sweat with nightmares of it all falling to ruin. Jason was comfortable, he was committed, he was reliable in a way Bruce had dreamed as being possible but rarely dared hope for. Even with all of the reasons Jason had to be angry at and resentful of Batman, of the world in general, he'd chosen of his own accord to let that go for something better and Bruce was so proud of him for that. It wasn't instant and it wasn't easy, but after all this time, Jason's effort and sacrifice should be recognized and rewarded.

He thought this could act as something to that effect. And if it didn't appeal, Jason always had the option to say no. Many had in the past, including Jason's close friend Roy Harper.

So one evening after patrol, Bruce dismissed everyone from the cave except for Red Hood. His other children trundled up to the manor with varying levels of drowsiness as Jason waited, cooling his heels by idly spinning in one of the desk chairs at the bat-computer. He was an intimidating young man at the best of times and even the absence of his weapons and leather jacket, thrown over the back of the chair, the arms fluttering as he spun, didn't exactly help. Red Hood was all black body-armor and tactical gear over a body every bit as honed and skilled as Batman's. Perhaps he should have given Jason a chance to change out of his uniform, if only for Bruce's nerves, but he didn't anticipate a fight so it didn't exactly matter.

“So what's this about, old man?” Jason asked, a curious quirk of his head, disturbing the lock of white in his hair. Jason's tone was casual, but Bruce was familiar enough with his son to recognize an edge of anxiety at being singled out. Bruce figured he deserved that. When he took the time to speak as Batman with one of his children, he rarely had good news.

“As you know,” Bruce began, “last night I attended a JLA meeting. A number of matters were decided.”

“Okay,” Jason acknowledged, and by his carefully controlled expression he was suspicious. Despite their growing closeness, Jason was always certain he was one mistake away from ejection from Gotham and exile from the family. That was Bruce's failing, as a leader, as a father. He hoped what he had to present to Jason would go some way toward relieving those feelings.

“One of those matters was candidates for membership,” Bruce explained. “Jason, the JLA would like to formally invite the Red Hood to join the ranks of the Justice League Alliance.”

For a moment Jason stared at him, large hands gripping tight to the arms of the chair, the flickering of a muscle in his temple above his sea glass-green eyes revealing the rapidity with which his mind was analyzing Bruce's words.

“I...what?”  he finally asked, mouth drawn into a frown. “Is this...is this a joke?” Jason's words held a hint of anger, as if sensing this were a trick to hurt him, even if he couldn't see how.

Bruce shook his head. “Not at all. Diana nominated you, Green Arrow and Black Canary supported the nomination.”

Jason raised a brow, surprised. “Ollie did? I didn't think he liked me very much.”

“He doesn't exactly like Batman, either,” Bruce reminded him with a slight smile.

Bruce's reward for opening up was a wide smirk of amusement that took over Jason's face and reminded him of his son's Robin days.

Jason chuckled, “Well you're not exactly a ray of sunshine, B.”

“Hn,” he hummed.

Jason stood up from the computer chair and took a few steps as if to find room to breathe, a hand rising to rub at the back of his neck, his lips tight with difficult thoughts.

After some consideration, Jason looked up at Bruce, his casual facade brittle and showing it's cracks as he asked, “Why didn't you nominate me? Is it because...you don't think I'm good enough? Do you not want this?”

Despite the straight way in which Jason asked the question, Bruce knew this was important to him, knew the answer had the potential to break him wide open.

Bruce took a step closer and put a hand on Jason's shoulder, giving it a light squeeze. Pouring as much sincerity into his voice as he could, he assured his son, “Jay, you are absolutely good enough. You've proven it time and again. I didn't nominate you only because I didn't want to show favoritism towards my child, and because it simply wasn't necessary. I can't deny you've been unpredictable in the past, but the work you've been putting in the last year shows. You've been on the short list for a while now.”

Jason's voice cracked slightly as he said, “O-oh...” and ran a hand throw his hair in a gesture of anxiety. “I...it's not like I ever wanted this, ya know?”

Bruce nodded. “I know.”

Jason swallowed and weakly shrugged off Bruce's hand, gaze moving to look somewhere over his shoulder at the cave wall, maybe trying to convince himself of the fact as he stumbled over the words, “It's not like I care if you...if they...”

But Jason didn't need to convince Bruce of his self-sufficiency. He knew Jason was a strong person who did what he thought was right no matter the potential for risk or reward to either himself or his reputation. Jason would give up anything, anyone, even his family, even himself, if he thought it would save innocent lives. Bruce knew that—admired him for that. Jason didn't have anything to prove to Bruce on that score. Accepting or rejecting the offer wouldn't change that.

“You have every ability to turn down this invitation, Jason,” Bruce said, trying to explain, trying to reassure his son of his own strength. “I know you've never expressed an interest in joining the League, but I believe—the League believes—that you would be a valuable asset. Whether or not you want this, doesn't change that you deserve it. You don't have to decide now, and I'm here if you have any questions. I'm sure Dick, Barbara and Cassandra would love to talk about their experiences in the League as well, if you wanted to.”

Jason nodded vaguely. “I think I pretty much know everything. I've seen it from the outside for years.”

“True.” Of that Bruce had no doubts, he just wanted Jason to know he had resources to help him make a decision.

Jason sighed and looked up at the darkness of the cave ceiling as Bruce hovered, in case he was needed for something, anything. He didn't know what Jason could need from him, but he wanted to be there to give it.

“I want to do it, I think,” Jason said, appearing surprised at his own words, as if he hadn't realized that desire was in him until he'd voiced it. “Gotham's got a lot of vigilantes these days. The Outlaws are kind of defunct, to be honest. So...why not, ya know?”

Jason looked back at Bruce, his gaze intense as it always was, filled with passion and intelligence as he searched Bruce's face, trying to guess at his opinion.

Bruce simply nodded. “If that's what you want. I trust your decisions, Jay.”

At his words, Jason's expression slid into shock, eyes wide and vulnerable as he repeated, “You tru-trust...”

Halfway through the word Jason's voice cracked and his composure broke. His shoulders wilted inward and a hand hastily moved to conceal his eyes as they started to glisten with moisture. Jason's jaw became tight with tension, his lower lip quivering with the effort to remain silent as the tears began to fall down his cheak. Bruce felt a clenching in his heart and stepped forward, his own hands rising uselessly as he hesitated, trying to decide if this was a moment when Jason would want to be touched.

Luckily Jason took the decision away from him when he surprised Bruce by falling against his chest and wrapping him in a tight hug. Giving in to his own feelings, Bruce returned the embrace, squeezing closely the body that was now of a size with his own but which he could still remember being so small. They didn't do this very often. Bruce couldn't even remember the last time he'd held his second son, but he was suddenly aware that he wanted to do it more, and perhaps optimistically, he thought that opportunity was one Jason might be open to.

But for the time being, he just hugged Jason and combed his fingers through his son's hair and let him break down so he could build himself back up better. For so long Jason had seen himself as broken. For nearly as long Bruce had seen him as broken. But Jason hadn't been broken, he was just deeply hurt, and though the scars would always remain his son had healed. He'd thought of Jason that way for a while now. Maybe with this, Jason would start to see it too.

In the moment, none of this felt like a mistake, it felt like a wonderful gift. Perhaps 'mistake' was too harsh a word, because Bruce didn't actually regret any of what took place this night. And truth to tell, he regretted little of what happened after as well. What he did know was with this decision, Bruce's life had become condemned to a new level of misery.

Because by this time tomorrow, half of the Justice League would be in love or lust with Jason Todd.

#I might start posting to AO3 under the title 'Jay-Crazy' #Jason Todd #red Hood #Bruce Wayne #Batman #prologue #fanfic #Everyone Crushing on Jason AU #angst? #hurt/comfort? #something like that

[simply-ellas-stuff]

My Thoughts on Episode Two of Batwoman *Spoilers*

Opening Sequence, Kate finding out she's relatively bullet proof was kinda adorable. The Crows shooting that man was dumb, but understandable. Entering the batcave was a cool sequence, a little choppy but cool.

Batman fever sounds a little dumb, but I like the build up of everyone hoping it's Batman.

Breakfast scene, Kate you blunt wierdo. That breakfast was awkward. The acting was a bit... stuttered - the pausing after Kate mentions Beth was like they were being told to make it dramatic but the actual set was too dry for it be as dramatic as the actors made it seem. Kate's abrupt way of telling Daddy-Kane that his long lost daughter is actually alive. Laurel was a bit smoother in telling Quinten that Sara's alive - Kate should take lessons from... well either of the Lance sisters.

How is it "not labeling" when you immediately drop like seven labels, Mary? Just curious. That "lets not" line seemed to come from Ruby a little more than Kate, just sayin'.

Alice is insane, but I'll talk more on that in a bit. Along with the flashbacks.

Luke talking to Kate about being the city's next great hope and then schooling her about how much she doesn't know only for her to compare him to his father (which, I'm sure they're is an estrangement based on his reaction) seemed like a low blow that didn't really need to be said. That could have been a moment of Kate going "Yeah, maybe I'm not Batman and don't know all his tricks but I need to do this and I need help"

Kate going to Sophie for help seemed a bit weird, like they were trying to not flirt. Sophie already knows Kate is Batwoman, I know it.

Wonder Woman is in the Arrowverse? I mean I know on Earth-Two Barry and Iris have Bruce, Hal and Diana's numbers on their phones...

Beth and Kate are twins?! When exactly was that mentioned in the first ep? I though Beth was the big sister, not a twin.

Fraternal twins don't have exact DNA Kate, that's identical twins. So, You'd need something else to compare the DNA to.

Kate, You were going to stop a wedding? Really??

Sophie pulling Kate out of the way was a little too obviously not real.

Not gonna lie, The fight sequence of the White Rabbits getting the Knife back was a bit... pause-y and awkward almost like they'd been taught the choreography to the fights but didn't quite get taught the rhythm, if you get my meaning. but I'll attribute that to Ruby's back surgery she had just before filming the rest of the season.

Why is Daddy-Kane so fucking adamant that his daughter isn't alive?!

Everything fucking happens in fifteen years in the Arrowverse.

"Fifteen years ago my mother was murdered" - Flash

"It's been fifteen years [since Beth 'died']" - Batwoman

So, the clinic is on Bennett Ave? Mary is protective of her little clinic, Good. Mary is such a fangirl.

"Waffles" is cute, and nice story building.

They HAVE to be Fraternal Twins for Kate to even slightly consider the idea that Alice is Beth.

Why can't Mary know Waffles? That doesn't make sense? The exgirlfriend can know but the stepsister can't?

When Ruby said the line "Its better if you don't know" to Mary, her real accent came out a little.

Daddy Kane assumes that Alice is mimicking Beth's important things (The Birthstone, The House, etc) but he he won't give hope a chance?

The Wafflestand is a great storytelling tool, it gives a deeper background makes the story a little more grounded and heartfelt.

I have a feeling Beth didn't kill those old people in the house, I think it was the other guy. Alice seems a bit more, strategical than that... but maybe I'm just reaching.

The goddamn swing is very Alice in Wonderland.

The swingset/wafflestand scenes confuses me, although Alice offering up her blood as a DNA test makes me think it's really is Beth.

If Beth is Alice, some of those details would be pretty dead on for drowning in a car - although she never explained how she got out of the car. Alice seems very unhinged. My only idea if it true is, Beth clung to the story of Alice in Wonderland (maybe a story her and Kate used to love) to keep herself sane while in isolation but it slowly drove her insane instead until she took on the persona of Alice (Dyeing her hair, finding those dresses, and building a cult of White Rabbits) while keeping the memories of Pre-Alice-dom.

That moment "If I was your twin, wouldn't you feel something" (or whatever she actually says) I think that feeling is why Kate thinks Beth is still alive - Twin intuition.

Kate putting herself between Daddy Kane and Alice was a great scene. Also, Why does it sound like Kate/Ruby is losing her voice - is that because she was probably still recovering from her back injury?

Kate's "Here I thought you could keep a secret" line was sassy but said a little awkwardly.

"Three little sisters" line from Alice made me think of myself and my two older sisters.

Alice/Beth doesn't want to share Kate with someone else how... obsessively psychotic.

Alice going after Mary was... a mess. Not wanting to share Kate is believable though. If the thought of being able to see Kate again is what kept her hold on her memories it would make sense that she wouldn't want to possibly lose the only shot at keeping her sister - killing Mary. It's understandable but it's also textbook insanity and obsession.

Mary's fangirl about Batman/batwoman just saved her ass, nicely done.

The Van exploding was unexpected but I did expect something to happen on the way to Arkham.

The poeticness of Kate/Batwoman saving Beth/Alice then then literally being slammed apart by a bigger force cops/Crows is either foreshadowing or something similar. Also, WHY THE FUCK WERE THE COPS SHOOTING INTO THE WATER?! That is not how you get people out of the water, what the fuck. Also, the framing of the scene reminded me of the opening sequence of Underworld Awakening between Selene and Michael.

Also, If they used the defibrillator in the suit, Kate's reaction should have been different. A groan before she opened her eyes. a light jump from the jolt. Literally anything besides her just opening her eyes, humming, and jumping up to leave. Also, if her heart was still beating while he used the dfib, she could have had a heart attack or he could have just straight up stopped her heart. Just pointing that out.

[[I got an ad for Tomorrow People on CWWebsite;; Firestorm, Golden Glider and Lincoln from Agents of Sheild all in one show looks pretty cool - I've never seen the show]]

Gotham Skyline in from the Ocean/River is gorgeous.

"Robin's high school graduation" Oh my fucking god! Is Robin alive in the Arrowverse then? Is he with Bruce where ever the fuck he is??

Mary and Kate having a heart to heart in the medical place post-Alice attack was kind of heartbreaking. As someone whose felt like barely a sister I see where Mary is coming from and the line about "if she [Alice] is [worth it], tell her I'm not a threat" speaks to me more than it probably should because the context is pretty much in the ballpark of "If you think she's the better, tell her I know my place please. Because I know I mean less and she needs to know that" which I understand completely.

Kate and Daddy Kane arguing was kinda pathetic, he's a dick. Just straight up, He's a dick. Even though I did feel bad for him when he cried in the flashback, the person he became is a dick - and yeah grief effects everyone differently but you would think he'd try and keep Kate as close as humanly possible instead of pushing her a way and threatening to arrest her.

Sophie and Kate talking, "are you happy?" "yes" "yes or ish?" then Kate being shut down was heartbreaking (and all to a Billie Ellish song).

Also, Why does Sophie keep helping Kate if she had no romantic feelings towards her?

I'm honestly hoping that Kate finds a different girlfriend because this whole Sophie thing kinda gives me a bad feeling.

Luke and Kate should be besties, it would be perfect.

Kate torturing Alice's boyfriend is funny, in a weird way. Kate should have a voice changer on her Batsuit.

Alice writing to Kate is... poetic. The bat was gross.

StepMom Kane wants the knife gone why? What does she gain from that? Power?

Alice knows Kate is Batwoman, that was quick.

The Note "You have our fathers eyes" was beautifully written.

The CGI on the bat could've been better.

Anybody else think that Daddy-Kane faked Beth's death certicate/the DNA evidence to keep Kate from searching for Beth as hard as she was(staying up, not really eating, blaming herself, etc)? And that's why he's so fucking adamant at denying the idea of Alice being Beth??

Kate was so hellbent on finding her sister (staying up late, not really eating, thinking about it all the time, building a map of all the places they looked) that it makes me think Daddy Kane/Catherine Hamilton faked the Skull fragments and DNA confirmation so that Kate could move on with her life. But that doesn't explain why Step-Mom Hamilton Kane blew up the van and stole the knife so it could be melted down.

#Arrowverse #Batwoman #Kate Kane #mary hamilton #catherine hamilton kane #jacob kane #beth kane #the flash #batwoman season 1 episode 2 #batwoman season 1 #batwoman episode 2

[gothamdetected-a]

an idiot’s guide to ra’s al ghul. 

ok so at this point im really gna say fuck dc canon, and go completely off piste and write my own.

dc really don't know how to write this man a backstory and he literally has one of the least developed and simultaneously confusing origins of any batman rogue. so here, lemme fix that.

ra's al ghul is a moniker, a title that is passed down. anyone who leads the league of assassins/shadows, becomes ra's al ghul (roughly translated to the demon's head). this explains how a White Man, henri ducard was able to become ra's al ghul in batman begins. at the passing of the head of the league, the next in line, by order of physical and mental prowess, becomes the next ra's. bruce himself is, at one point, supposed to pick up the mantle - the current ra's considers him his only worthy successor (a la arkham city & some of the comics from the 80s/90s), the man who will replace him and exceed him. however bruce, due to his unwavering morals and refusal to kill in order to bring "justice" ends up spurning the league, and is disowned by ra's in a very effective way - he tries to kill bruce. ra's still holds some sort of belief that bruce will return to him, despite all of this. he uses talia and then damian as a pawn in this game, to draw bruce back to the league and have him become the next demon's head.

so who is "ra's", or at least the goateed, green pant suited, scimitar wielding ninja who is most commonly seen as THE "ra's"? well, dc couldn't really make up their minds, so i'll do my best to patch it together from the 8 different versions, and compile something that agrees with most of it.

ra's was born approximately 600 years ago, to a man known as the Sensei (an asian martial artist) and an unknown mother of arabic descent, somewhere in the middle east. little is known about his early years, other than he was obsessed with the sciences, and became a physician with a wife named Sora. he made many discoveries ahead of time - understanding microscopic pathogens, how to cure diseases such as cholera and typhoid, although his greatest discovery was the Lazarus Pits - a natural phenomenon containing a mysterious green liquid with immense restorative properties. ( this is not to be confused with the fountain of youth at shangri-la, which his father, the Sensei, used). ra's uses the pit on the son of a local sultan who is dying, but when the boy returns, he is not all there. the empathy is gone, and he gets pretty funky about killing people, including ra's wife, sora. it is important to note, at this point, ra's is not called ra's, but dc have never given him a name so idek what to call him. so we don't know his real name, age, or what his chilhood was like. lets keep it that way, we stan an air of mystery.

the death of his wife and the overpowering grief leads to a fixation with revenge - ra's trains furiously to master martial arts and eventually kills the sultan, his son and razes their city to the ground. at this point he becomes "the demon's head" and founds the league, with the aim of eradicating evil from the world, mostly through assassination and genocide. which, you know. isn't great. this is also the period in which ra's begins to use the lazarus pit on himself, in order to prolong his life. he seeks more pits throughout the world, travelling extensively, and finds three more: one in switzerland, one in what will later become gotham, and one on infinity island, making a grand total of four. dc can go fuck themselves there is literally only four, you can't just keep making more when it's convenient. ra's intends to only use the pits until a worthy successor can be found for the league, but two problems occur; one) he starts going a bit nuts from over using the pits, and it does become like an addiction and two) he never finds someone he considers worthy.

so, skip through a bunch of wars he fought in, the league becoming globally established, and the industrial revolution. ra's doesn't like that. bad machines, destroying the earth, coating the skies with pollution and leading to greater inequality. so ra's decides it's time to purge humanity, and leave only the people he deems worthy behind, in a fresh clean world (in a real james bond villain move.). he builds wonder city, beneath gotham and around the gotham lazarus pit, but the city is never used because ra's does something mad stupid and falls in love. so much for eco terrorism, he's now off having babies with a woman named melisande. or one particular baby - talia. due to ra's having been using the pits for centuries before boning this poor woman, talia comes out with slowed aging abilities. ra's eventually murders melisande when she gets antsy about him training their kid to be a master assassin. he does a very similar thing with a russian lady to produce talia's half sister, nyssa. so by now the 20th century is in full swing, ra's has a cute lil murder family and the league has become a smaller part of a huge underground organisation called The Demon, at which ra's sits at the head. he still hasn't found a successor though, and he's getting Old. the lazarus pits are no longer bringing him back 100% - he loses more and more of his sanity with each ressurection. and then. wow. bruce wayne appears. and ra's sees a huge amount of himself in this kid, the loss, the anger. boom, we got ourself a successor.

we all know how that wound up.

so ra's is now Personally Mad at batman, and we get the Contagion storyline. back to his old, eco-terrorism ways, ra's unleashes the clench, a really nasty virus that's definitely worse than your average cold. batman eventually finds and disperses a cure, but gotham is Mad Fucked. damian wayne is born, trained by his mama and gramps, and then abandoned at 10 on bruce's doorstep. there's a brief interlude where bane also goes to train under ra's in the hopes of being the worthy successor and marrying talia instead, but then everyone realises he's one sandwich short of a picnic and ra's kicks him out in his ass once batman beats him in another fight. there's also some funky moments where ra's

• tries to resurrect thomas and martha wayne. it goes about as well as you'd expect.

• pisses off both of his daughters who start to work against him. talia half teams up with supes. wild.

• lets his guard down and most of the lazarus pits are destroyed, leaving only the one beneath gotham.

• tries to body swap with his grandson (i literally hate dc)

• watches batman accidentally kill his old dad the Sensei, by dragging him into a lazarus pit which destroys the nasty man's corrupted soul and heals bruce tf up which is how dc get away with him looking permenantly 30

• has another, estranged child, who becomes the White Ghost

• helps tim find bruce after he "died" but then becomes a lil bitch over it and tries to do a ninja take over of gotham and destroy anything about wayne. he fist fights tim, and dick, and then lo and behold it was all a test or some shit, which is the dc version of "he woke up and it was all a dream".

• makes superhumans in whale wombs which honestly, when i read the issues, i wanted to Die. literally straight up end me.

there's a bunch more stuff but im not a masochist enough to keep going. the point is, he's an old naughty man, kind of bruce's father in law, definitely insane, and dc will probably drag this mans back at some point. but i like to go with the arkham knight ending, where bruce chooses to cut a half-resurrected ra's off from the last of the lazarus pit, and drops his dying body off at the gcpd to an indeterminate fate, while nyssa becomes the new demon's head. its a good ending. makes sense. works well with everything. gives him a solid out. but honestly they won't leave him alone and he'll be back soon i'm sure, being pesky and owning really freaking cool swords.

so yeah, that's a rough and ready guide to ra's al ghul, because dc really can't manage this themselves and i'm made to pick up the slack.

#nyall should let me know if theres anyone else you want me to do this for #just kind of compile and simplify some of the most confusing characters because honestly #i have so much fun doing stuff like this #and just geeking tf out and using the full breadth of my dc knowledge #which is still nothing compared to the entirety of canon but still #uwu love me please #\system\directory\hidden.txt ›› META #long post /