#lion secondary

[air-in-words]

Anastasia: SortingHatChats

Hey, guys, I back now.

Anastasia time.

So, as a DISCLAIMER: THIS FILM IS A WORK OF FICTION. I highly recommend looking into the actual history behind the film if you're interested!

Here we go!

(I seem to recall there being a sorting already posted of Anastasia, but I remember disagreeing with most of it? Absolutely no offense meant to whoever originally posted it! These are just my two cents!)

ANASTASIA/ANYA

BADGER PRIMARY

Anya's entire storyline revolves around the ideas of "family," "home," and "belonging." Not just her own, personal family (which would be Snake,) not necessarily the home she remembers being born into (as far as she knows, she's an orphan,) and not only her own state of belonging. She deals in the concept of these things as though they were basic necessities: everyone should want them, and she wants them because everyone needs them in order to be whole. This is truth to her, full stop.

Anya: "Do you think you're gonna miss it?"

Dimitri: "Miss what, your talking?

Anya: "No! Russia."

Dimitri: "Nope."

Anya: "But it was your home!"

Dimitri: It was a place I once lived. End of story."

Anya: "Well, then you must plan on making Paris your true home."

Dimitri: "What is it with you and homes?!"

Anya: "Well, for one thing, it's something that every normal person wants!"

This is not a belief system, nor is it a conclusion she's come to. It's something that is such a part of her make up as a human being, that to imagine that another person doesn't care about the concept of a "true home" or "true community" is downright disturbing to her. Her desire for "home, love, family" is not her trying to seek out individuals she already knows, but to find the space she came from, filled with strangers she's never met, but who she believes will accept her through the power of community. It reads very animated Hercules, often dreaming of a far off place where a voice keeps saying, THIS is where I'm meant to be. Badger Primaries love the idea of having a secret family they've never met that will swoop in and carry them away, loving them unconditionally, when the world immediately around them has been so cruel. Lonely Badger Primaries are the perfect characters to fall in love with the idea of being long lost royalty. The main character arc Anya goes through is learning that family is not just the people who gave birth to you: Found family is not only just as powerful, but can become even moreso over time. This is the same moral the animated Hercules learns! Belonging and community is created and watered like a garden: If you keep searching for your perfect, idealized community, you might miss the one forming right before your eyes.

LION SECONDARY

It doesn't take long to pin Anya as a rather loud Lion Secondary. She is unafraid to voice her opinions, and often does so in a blunt and unashamed way. SShe absolutely DESPISES lying, and she is the first to take the easiest, most straight forward way out.

Dimitri: (trying to detach a traincar after breaking multiple tools) "COME ON, there's gotta be something in there better than this!!"

Anya: (wordlessly hands Dimitri a stick of lit dynamite)

Dimitri: "That'll work!"

What this movie actual shows is an interesting, not as often explored aspect of the Badger Lion, which is how the brash and straightforward nature of the Lion Secondary can work against the desires of the Badger Primary. Anya longs for nothing more than home and community, but often inadvertently (and not so inadvertently) alienates those around her with her cutting phrasing. It takes a more grounded, good listener like Vlad to see past Anya's brashness almost immediately, understanding the intentions behind her bravado.

Vlad: "I see an engaging and fiery young woman, who on a number of occasions has shown a regal command equal to any royal in the world!"

DIMITRI

SNAKE PRIMARY (Initially Burnt)

Dimitri's storyline is a bit deeper than many people might initially realize. What we're looking at is a Snake Primary who, at a very young age, tried to save one of their People (the Princess Anastasia, for whom he is implied to have either a childhood friendship with or just a faraway crush,) and failed, horribly. In fact, they failed to the point that they believe they are at least partially to blame for the death of that Person. That's about as deep and dark of a hole as a Snake Primary can fall into, so the Snake Primary will, naturally, Burn and find new, non-Person things to fill that void. Namely, recognition and fortune.

Dimitri: "Imagine the reward her dear old grandmama will pay!"

Of course,this could point to Glory Hound Lion, just as easily. If not for his Snake Primary sneaking in at every possible moment. The line following that one above is:

Dimitri: "Who else could pull it off but you and me?"

The "you" in question being Vlad, the only other Person Dimitri has allowed in (and by "allowed in," I always assumed got so tired of Vlad actively FORCING HIMSELF into Dimitri's life that he acquiesced and decided to just let him stay.) But, Dimitri's obsession with the Princess Anastasia continues, against all odds. His latest con? Directly Princess Anastasia related. Is it enough for the woman they hire to play her be "good enough?" NO. She has to be PERFECT. They hold AUDITIONS, and Dimitri is the perfect person to be on the board, because Dimitri still knows her intimately well, even after all these years. Such as hum recognizing Anastasia's face in Anya's right from the start. Thus, comes Dimitri's initial inner turmoil in regards to Anya: Are his feelings just projection? Is he attracted to her JUST because she looks like Anastasia? Is he ACTUALLY that obsessed? All those questions become moot when Anya is revealed to truly be Anastasia, though Dimitri finds himself where he was as a boy. From this point on in the movie, pretty much every motivation/choice Dimitri makes revolves around the fact that Anya IS Anastasia, and that he is going to give her what she wants and deserves, no matter what it takes. Even if that means keeping himself away from her romantically. His character arc revolves around forgiving himself for what he perceived as a dire mistake against one of his People, which is a ROUGH arc for a Snake to go through.

Dimitri: "Paris holds the key to her past. Yes, Princess, I've found you at last! No more pretend. You'll be gone, that's the end..."

SNAKE SECONDARY

Dimitri is actually quite a good con, all things considered. He manages to trick Anya into thinking they have train tickets when they DEFINITELY do not, and he keeps the reward under wraps for the entirety of their trip. Not just that, but dodging around obstacles instead of facing them head on is his most natural state. As a child, he is seen sneaking out of the kitchens (where be belongs) and automatically offering the servants' quarters as a means of escape, which is extremely clever and resourceful. Dimitri tries to charm and placate Anya at every turn, trying to keep her naturally explosive personality under wraps.

Anya: "The baggage car...? There wouldn't be anything wrong with our papers now, would there, maestro..?"

Dimitri: "Of course not, Your Grace! It's just that I hate to see you forced to mingle with all those commoners..."

But, we spend most of the film seeing Dimitri forced out of his comfort zone by both the situation and Anya's combative Lion Secondary, so he's often seen conspiratorially complaining to Vlad while in his Neutral State or just outright losing his temper and yelling. But, this never comes first, and his plans and plots are always somewhat circumventing. During the train derailment, his plans are to jump off, disconnect the train cars, and just wait until the train coasts to a stop. All pretty passive/out of the box thinking. When he IS shown trying to face someone head on, he is always unsuccessful: Trying to fight for Anastasia during the siege only to be immediately knocked out, trying to take on Rasputin directly and being tossed aside pretty easily. Comparatively, Anya/Anastasia is shown to be successful when she is upfront and combative: Getting away from Rasputin as a child by kicking him in the face, ultimately defeating Rasputin by straight up smashing his reliquary.

VLAD

LION PRIMARY

Vlad is a pretty classic Paragon Lion Primary. He wants to do what is Good and Right and doesn't what is Bad and Wrong. For what reason would he wind up as a con artist as a Paragon Lion, though? Even for Paragon Lions, what is Good and Right to THEM can go against what the collective believes is good and right.

Vlad: "That's what I hate about this government. Everything is in red!"

Yes, the above line is also meant to be a coded message for Dimitri, but Vlad thinks the government has overstepped his moral boundaries and has chosen to step outside the usual bounds to follow his own morals. Part of those morals involve guiding those he believes are lost, thus, his "adoption" of Dimitri, a very lost young man with little direction. He tries to act as Dimitri's "moral compass" until Dimitri finds his own direction again. He does the same for Anya when she comes into their group, trying to lead her towards the possibility of finding her home, while gently guiding her away from focusing on her "past."

Vlad: "There is nothing left for you back there, my dear. Everything is in Paris."

He stands up for what he believes in, and inserts himself constantly when he believes Dimitri is wrong. Letting him know when he's "walking away too soon" or when he "has to talk to her" even if she's a Princess and Dimitri's a Kitchen Boy.

BADGER SECONDARY

Vlad is one of the kindest, most lovingly genuine characters I've encountered in fiction, and I mean with that with all my heart. He is consistently gentle and understanding with the people he comes across, and is always even-tempered and fair. Compare Vlad and Dimitri's reactions to finding Anya skulking around their home:

Dimitri: (shouting, from across the room) "HEY! What are you doing in here?! HEY! STOP!"

Vlad: (coming in at a light jog, holding up his hand politely) "Excuse me, child!"

Vlad always assumes the best from whomever he's interacting with, and is excellent at getting to the root of what's bothering a person. He actively tries to make everyone in his company comfortable, and will often make soft jokes or observations in an attempt to lighten the mood. His Lion Primary makes him unable to entirely give in when he knows what's going on is wrong, but his Badger Secondary gives him the skills to broach those uncomfortable topics with grace and eloquence.

Vlad: (gives Dimitri the most fatherly, loving hug in all of animation) "Ahhh, my boy... you are making a mistake."

TL;DR

Anya/Anastasia: Badger Lion

Dimitri: Double Snake

Vlad: Lion Badger

And, there we go! Anastasia was one of my absolute FAVORITE movies as a child, so I've really enjoyed getting an opportunity to sort them! Let me know your thoughts! :)

#sorting hat chats #sortinghatchats #shc #anastasia movie #anya anastasia #dimitri anastasia #vlad anastasia #dimitri x anya #anya x dimitri #badger primary #lion secondary #snake primary #snake secondary #lion primary #badger secondary #badger lion #double snake #lion badger

[wisteria-lodge]

A question for you: would you sort a living person with whom you are not in communication, and without her express consent, but whose words and deeds are very much on public display? Specifically: J.K. Rowling sure thinks of herself as a heroic Lion Primary; what’s your call?

I have spent a long time thinking about this lady. Possibly too long. But here's what I've got.

She's a Bird. She *likes* Lion primaries, and she likes them in that way a lot of Birds do - Lions feel magical and moral and easy and good. That's why Gryffindor is her good-guy house, and that's why Gryffindors always get a pass when they do shady things. They were always doing it for good reasons, because that's just how Lion primaries are. They know what's good, just by kind of feeling it.

(obviously this isn't at all how it feels to be a Lion primary, but it can SEEM that way, if you're outside looking in.)

And so she likes Lion primaries, and surrounds herself with Lion primaries. And over time, seems to have filtered for the most fiery, if-you're-not-with-me-you're-my-enemy Exploded Lions imaginable. This could also be why she's not interrogating emotional pings when she really should. Like it's heartbreaking to read some of her essays - like, no JKR, that's not a reason, that's a trauma response you ought to be getting help for. But she thinks there's inherent goodness with going with your heart over your head.

Which is also probably why, for the last two decades, she's been slowly surrounding herself only with people who agree with her - effectively Exploding her own Bird primary. She is notoriously stubborn and difficult to work with, and I have that from first hand accounts... but just think how much better an editor could have made books 4-7. Or the Fantastic Beasts films. Or the Cursed Child (we all sort of collectively forgot about the Cursed Child.)

But I see the Bird! I see the Idealism, I see the mind that likes puzzles, and systems, and mysteries. And then I see her just kinda... be lazy about it. Not think though the implications. Be happy with only a very surface-level understanding. Not edit, or update, or interrogate her system. (We know that her worldbuilding is sloppy. We know she grabs existing problematic tropes and then kind of uses them as-is.)

The more I dig into to her, the more I'll come across bits of her system that just seem very... young. They'll be things like 'Good people have kids, or if they can't, then they take care of kids.' Or 'People with mobility aids are good.' That's one's so weird I just have to bring it up. It's very consistent, and comes with the reverse - 'People who use mobility aids they don't need are evil.' Barty Crouch jr. is the HP example, but that situation comes up like - a weird amount in her mystery novels.

(also, I can't prove it, but I think Lucius Malfoy got a much more sympathetic edit after Jason Isaacs started playing him with a cane. Of course that could also be just because... he has a kid... so he can't be BAD.)

Harry Potter, the character, is also very much a Bird Primary. When he acts on really strong emotions it's because they're - yep, trauma responses. Mostly he's trying to figure out his world, synthesize everything Dumbledore and the Weasleys and Hagrid and Sirius tell him, in order to build his own system.

And he's a really loud Lion secondary, the way I suspect JKR is too. Her response to all of this has just been to double down, do MORE, be LOUDER. If her royalties, or the reputation of her IP take a hit, she honestly does not seem to care.

She's not stupid and she's not evil. Hermione was a complicated, fascinating female lead. JKR has an incredible knack for side characters. The books have good stuff to stay about grief, and depression, and I know it gets memed now, but it was a big deal (for me) when she said Dumbledore was gay. But this is how I think you can get someone who starts out in a reasonable place, and gets more and more out of touch, and harmful and wrong and dangerous - when locked into one way of seeing the world, and no one with the ability to contradict you.

#jk rowling #jkr #anti jkr #sortinghatchats #tangentially #shc #exploded bird primary #lion secondary #bird primary vs lion primary.

[sunnyhatchats]

bird secondary vs. lion secondary (and snake)

"banter cards."

#shc #iasip #sortinghatchats #bird secondary #lion secondary #Youtube

[mooglesorts]

i have not been active on this blog in a While and being very normal about my old hyperfixation lorien legacies, which has an absolute fuckload of characters to sort, has finally gotten me to crawl out of my hole.

[spoilers ahead for both lorien legacies and its sequel series!]

there is a LOT of ground to cover here, and i am mostly going to limit myself to sorting characters and themes from the first series, but my initial notes are:

probably one of the biggest overarching themes of the series is toxic birdsec, and the harm it can do to every aspect of a society or a person's life--on both a systematic level and an individual one--right down to their basic humanity. by extension it also goes into similarly fucked up lion and bird primary used as weapons and tools of abuse, and how they interplay with each other.

a large part of this stems from setrákus ra being The Worst Fucking Lion Bird Ever to Live, lmao. he's an interesting example of birdsec interplaying with cannibal badger, and also of a lion bird who's a cheetah in that he uses systems as tools to manipulate people instead of actually believing them. he hands out toxic systems like candy while peppering them with outright lies, and blithely admits that even the one that he's put centuries into building--mogadorian progress, and the great book--is at its heart just a ruse to run his cult on. the truth he pretends to worship and champion isn't external, objective truth--it's an extension of him. he is the ultimate truth. and the only truth he believes in is his cause, which is that he has the right and ability to own, make use of, and do whatever he sees fit with everything in existence. everyone and everything that could possibly be a shiny or a tool belongs to him.

one of the other overarching themes is toxic badger primary and secondary--cannibal badgering AHOY--as well as toxic lion primary, and it is a great deal less intentional than the bird cautionary tale part lmao

five is a bird snake with deeply toxic lion primary and bird secondary models, one of which he picked up after getting involved with a cult, and one of which he's had since his abusive birdsec guardian started amputating his masks by trying to apply actor bird to them. :') his brand of birdsplode and snakeburn make him horribly, horribly vulnerable to the cult, especially combined with focused, one-on-one gaslighting and manipulation from setrákus himself, and he has to burn his bird right to a crisp to break away from it. i am very biased and i have so much to say about my boy, but i plan to go in depth about this later

there are a LOT of lionsecs among the loric garde kids. the only surviving ones who aren't lionsecs are marina's badger and five's snake (the latter of which is heavily villainized, lol); number one is either a lionsec or a snakesec, maggie is either a birdsec or a badgersec, and we don't really see enough of hannu to be sure, but my guess is badgersec. in context, whatever these books are saying here i am not sure i like it lmao

this stands in contrast to the non-garde allies, minus adam, who end up being Part of the Gang. sam and lexa are birdsecs, and sarah and malcolm are both badgersecs.

speaking of adam, he is a lion snake with a cool, calculated double bird performance/model, who has been waiting all his life for a chance to go Absolutely Feral. there are a lot of ways in which he's a real shithead, which track given his life and circumstances up to then but are also real 😬 sometimes, but like, good for him. go ape shitt, kid

nine is an awful, AWFUL double lion who models/performs the worst parts of badger primary; he also uses lionsec stereotypes and methods to misdirect people, so that he can hurt, gaslight, prey on, and abuse them. it's genuinely interesting how he does it, and i could go on for a long time about it, but it's also Infuriating because the authors really want you to love him for being a ~charming jerk with a heart of gold,~ so that is for another post. in the sequel series he also picks up a nasty posthumous birdsec model from sandor to gleefully torture children with so lmfao

there seem to be a lot of birdsecs and badgersecs among the mentor cêpans, which tracks, because, well, mentors. interestingly, it seems to be a pattern so far that the birdsec mentors are either some of the most deeply abusive among them (see: rey, sandor, and ethan even though he's an unofficial cêpan), or the most decent parents of them under the circumstances (see: katarina).

john is a hognose (badgery snake) 'i live here' snake lion, and a VERY loud one. he's set on saving the world mainly a) in order to save his People, or b) because it's what they would want. he also believes STRONGLY in snake values as applied to other people, and absolutely cannot grok that anyone would feel differently--he holds back on killing a major enemy because he's worried about killing a friendly acquaintance's Person--and honestly he can be kind of a huge dick about it lmao. he burns HARD at the end of the first series when sarah dies; in the second, he copes by making an entire community into his circle and no longer gives a shit about the rest of the world outside it, including groups who are in similar if not worse circumstances than his community. Horrific War Crimes Ensue!

rex is an everyone double badger and i love him so much. i love him So Much. he is a wonderful example of how to write a morally dubious character whose dodgy qualities interest me instead of making me grit my teeth and Tolerate Them. his arc could have fixed So Much of the Ending's Bullshit and i will be forever mad that they dumped it in the trash

there is more, oh my god there's so much more, this series has SO many characters in it, but this is a start thank you for coming to my ted talk

#lorien legacies #sortinghatchats #sorting hat chats #LL group tag #lion primary #bird primary #snake primary #bird secondary #lion secondary #badger secondary #snake secondary #bird primary model #bird secondary model #badger primary model #hognose #cheetah #superb bird #manul #toxic primaries #toxic secondaries #there is a lot going on here lmao #LL tag

[sevilemar]

I think I realized I am a Bird with Lion secondary. It was difficult to figure out because not many things about Lion secondary resonated with me - when I read the description, I always had an image of a very straightforward, muscley kind of guy who goes 'No, this ain't right' and blasts off his enemies with guns, who is a truth speaker to a fault and is incapable of subtlety and who can only be more or less intense without shades. All this couldn't be farther away from the truth for me. So I and an idea... What if a secondary isn't about truth vs lies and isn't even about wearing a mask (bear with me, I know it's unusual reading). It's JUST about tailoring yourself to people and just that. A person may be a liar to a fault, and still manipulate people via their general perception of them (correct one) instead of 'tailoring' and a person may be a complete truth teller and tailor everything they say to an audience. Lion secondaries can be detached tricksters and liars but this tricksterness is cold and a bit aggressive. It challenges people instead of genuinely enjoying playing with people like a Snake secondary would. Many eccentrics actually Lion secondaries. Philosopher Diogenes comes to mind. Dude was smart and sarcastic and definitely a trickster but he challenged people and didn't tailor his message to anyone. I call this type 'Sphynx Lion' aka Deadpan Lion who isn't necessarily overly emotional or passionate or straightforward.

Congrats on finding your sorting, nonny! 👍

The image of lion secondary you had made me laugh, because I know a lion, and they are neither male nor muscly, nor do they own a gun as far as I know. They can do subtle, hate conflicts that are left unspoken, they can be intense, they can be playful, and so much more. They are also very kind and one of the most reflected people I know.

I don't think secondary has ever been about lie vs. truth; every secondary can lie. It's the primary who decides if it's OK or not. Masks are only a thing if you're an actor bird using roles/masks.

If I read it right, what you call tailoring yourself to people is essentially being fluid and fitting yourself to match the situation. I speak truth most of the time, yet I tailor everything. It's why I'm snake secondary. If you don't do that, you're probably very much a lion. And yes, lion secondaries can definitely be smart and sarcastic and deadpan and a trickster. So can birds, or badgers, or snakes. There's no trickster sorting, or smart sorting, or sarcastic sorting. There's also no sorting that's especially emotional or unemotional. All of this depends on the person, not on their sorting.

There are stereotypes, because shc was a system for sorting fictional characters first, and fictional characters are always stereotypes of some kind. But when you sort real people, you need to look beyond that as best you can. I'm glad you did, nonny, and found what fits you.

#sortinghatchats #ask answers #lion secondary

[thelongestway]

Sorting Log Horizon: Shiroe (Double Bird, Lion Primary model) and Kanami (Double Lion, Bird Primary model)

Shiroe of Log Horizon is a Double Bird. Kanami is a Double Lion. /endthread.

But really, let's get into some more details. Shiroe is the point of view character for most of Log Horizon. He's the rare main character who is essentially a support. The class he chose, Enchanter, is magically weak, and shines when others take advantage of its abilities... Sounds like a Badger? Nope. The reason Shiroe chose that class was that he identified that he had a problem with trusting others and decided to learn how to do that by putting himself in a position where he'd have to rely on others to succeed, and also in a position where he'd have to squeeze out every last advantage to win. And succeed he does--but not only through direct contribution, but through strategy. Shiroe is quick to observe patterns and is able to hold an insane amount of variables in his head, keeping up with the status effects of a 24-man raid on the fly at the same time as calculating boss mechanics. By being in a support position, he is ideally placed to have a Bird's eye view of the battlefield. At the same time, Shiroe has a hard time identifying his own goals. He's much better at executing than at goal-setting, at least until he's seen the situation. When left with no input, he flounders - until he can get that input. He also has a few, mostly Badger-related, hangups about the methods available to him. Before the show's official beginning, Shiroe's a loner who has few real friends and is generally wary of organized groups. When he started out, he joined an informal group, which avoided ranks and distinctions - and which also had the Double Lion Kanami as its leader. In the show, Kanami is initially mostly defined by her absence - but even that absence itself is defined by the way in which she determines goals and Charges, easily leading people in a distinctly Lion way. Kanami wants to clear the hardest raid? She's not joining established groups; she's getting people together and going. Kanami wants to move to Europe and have a kid? She switches tracks and does that, completely turning her life around. And when Kanami does finally show up again, she resolves the current struggle Shiroe has by simply saying "THIS is what I want", and giving him enough input to crystallize his strategy. Her internal moral compass is something that Shiroe lacks, and that he also consciously works on emulating. At the same time, Kanami also thinks back to Shiroe and his brilliance in execution when she needs to. She knows what she wants; she does not necessarily know how to get it - and she learns from him. Shiroe, in turn, learns from Kanami - and when the show starts, he is perfectly capable of staking out a place of his own, because he wants to, and is capable of holding a group together, even though he definitely finds it much, much easier to be in Strategist mode than in Leader mode. I'd say that these two model Lion and Bird Primaries respectively - and they model them off each other.

#shc #sorting log horizon #sortinghatchats #character sorting #shiroe #bird primary #bird secondary #kanami #lion primary #lion secondary

[misku-nimfa]

How would a Lion primary/burned lion secondary manifest? I read descriptions and I think this fits best for me, it wasn’t sure what the combination would look like rather than just the individual attributes. Hope you’re having an awesome day! (@badbadbucky)

@badbadbucky

I'm sorry, but there really isn't a good description that I can give you.

Externally, just about everyone is going to see the Burned Secondary and nothing else. Depending on how Burned your Secondary is they might get glimpses of what's underneath the char, but without the ability to reliably act your Primary will be indecipherable from the outside.

My personal internal experience, it felt like hitting an invisible wall over and over. Knowing what I need to do, how I need to do it, why I need to do it, and then getting nothing done. How much of that can be generalized and how much is specific to my own experience is up in the air.

#sortinghatchats #lion primary #lion secondary #burnt secondary #anon reply #text #gifs #nimfa speaks

[mysticalenthusiastvoid]

Lion Secondary with Bird Model or Snake Secondary?

If anyone see this, I’ve read about SHC for a long time, but never posted until now. I already know I’m a Lion Primary, but I’m still not sure what my secondary is, other than I have an improvisational secondary with a bird secondary model and a badger secondary model/performance.  If I am a Snake, I don’t do multi-player well, but I do wonder if I just exist in neutral most of the time or it’s just battering-ram Lion or some kind of rapid-fire Bird.. Examples of single-player problem-solving: While cooking, I don’t always follow the recipe or I’ll substitute with what I have. One time I was making stuffed peppers and accidentally put too much tomato sauce into the rice. I ended up throwing out that batch and substituting salsa instead for the tomato part. It’s also not unusual for me to throw together random things for soups, stews, etc. If I don’t feel like cooking, I’ll just keep things on hand for wraps and sandwiches or premade things like carrots and dip as a side. The skin on my hands were dry and I had run out of lotion. I ended up using facial moisturizer as it was the middle of the night. In high school biology, we were supposed to create a model of the inside of a cell. The night before the assignment was due, I got the idea to buy a cookie cake, some frosting, and spent a couple of hours creating a cell. I hope these are good enough examples, but I can clarify or answer more questions if anyone has a question or even sees this, lol.

#sorting hat chats #improvisational secondaries #lion secondary #snake secondary #bird secondary #single player snake #rapid fire bird #battering ram lion

[angrycommiedyke]

#gryffindor #gryffindor pride #gryffindor primary #lion primary #lion secondary #gryffindor secondary #sorting hat #harry potter #playlist #harry potter playlist #gryffindor playlist

[familyofpaladins]

I Choose ones that are actually sequels, not prequels or inbetweeners (sorry lion king 1/2 and Bambi 2). Also had to be direct to video, not theater release (I'm very sad I couldnt include Return to Neverland but it had a theatrical release).

Theres still others that fit this bill, but I selected ones that I've actually seen/own or ones I thought were "bigger"/better known

#Very curious to see the results #It's so funny how most of these have a secondary title #But mulan and brother bear are just ... 2 #Polls #Disney movies #Disney #Disney direct to video sequels #Aladdin 3 #Aladdin and the king of thieves #Lion king 2 #Lion king Simba's pride #Lady and the tramp 2 #Lady and the tramp 2 scamps adventure #Cinderella 3 #Cinderella 3 a twist in time #The little mermaid 2 #Little mermaid 2 return to the sea #Mulan 2 #Pocahontas 2 #Pocahontas 2 journey to a new world #Brother bear 2 #Disney sequels

[arizonaraine]

Sorting Hat Chats: Zootopia

(Have I talked about how much I love this movie? Because I love this movie.)

Judy Hopps might be the Lion-i-est Lion primary to ever Lion. Seriously. From the time she's a little girl, she has this internal conviction that she needs to "make the world a better place." She loves her family in Bunnyburrow, but is perfectly fine with heading out on her own, moving to the big city to fulfill her dreams. Her passion, her drive, is internal and idealistic. She believes so much in the idea of Zootopia. It guides her decisions, the advice she gives, and the way she treats other people. When she acts out of line with her values-- her careless comments about predators are used as justification for mistreating them by the media and by Bellweather-- it eats her up inside. She resigns from the police department and moves home, but is despondent. She's on the verge of burning until her conversation with her parents and Gideon Gray, which proves to her that 1. her idealism made a change in their lives and 2. the fight isn't over! Her Lion spark is reignited, and she speeds off to Zootopia to make things right. She ends the story a more mature Lion: recognizing that "life is more complicated than a slogan on a bumper sticker," but still working to make that dream of Zootopia true.

I think she's a Badger Secondary. Yes, she can be a shouty and charge-y like a Lion, but I think that her real strength is connecting with the people around her. Like Captain America, she creates assets. She uses Nick's street smarts and leverages her connection with Bellweather to access the Jam Cams at City Hall. She and Nick are saved from being iced by the mobster because of the warmth and kindness with which she treats his daughter. She also showcases the Bookkeeper aspect of this secondary through her nose-to-the-grindstone, "I'm not going to write 100 tickets, I'm going to write 200 tickets before noon!" approach to becoming a cop.

Nick Wilde starts the story a burned Badger primary. The childhood trauma that forged him was being rejected by a group. All he wanted was to join the Junior Ranger Scouts: he was excited to put on a uniform and be part of their community. When he's bullied for being a predator, he burns. He looks sort of like a Snake when Judy first meets him-- kinda hedonistic, only looking out for himself-- but as the story progresses, his true Badger self starts to shine through. He knows everyone: Otterton the florist, the mob boss, Flash the sloth... He stands up for Judy to Boggo. He's a mix of trepidatious and excited when Judy suggests that he join the police force. He refuses to abandon her when she's injured, insisting that they come up with another plan. And in the end, he joins the force! He's finally part of a community.

I'm going use Occam's Razor here and say that he's a Snake secondary. One could argue that he's just modeling Snake because that's what's expected of foxes, but I don't see enough evidence of another secondary, so I'm going for the simplest explanation for now. Nick is good at improvising. He's great at taking information and using the environment around him to shape the outcome he wants. When he first meets Judy, he plays her like a violin. "It's called a hustle, sweetheart." He sells skunk-butt rugs to the mobster. His whole popsicle scam?? Snake, snake, snake. He can talk his way out of pretty much any corner. He can go neutral-state blunt on people, but most of the time, he's charming as hell. Judy teasingly calls him "slick Nick."

TL;DR

Judy Is a shining Lion who grows into a more mature version of her primary by the end, with a Badger secondary that uses hard work and the people around her to accomplish her mission.

Nick starts out a burned Badger primary who eventually finds a home with Judy and the police department. His Snake secondary might just be him playing to what people already think foxes are-- I'd love to hear arguments for another secondary!-- but he seems to use these tools naturally.

#sorting hat chats #shc #lion primary #badger secondary #burned badger primary #snake secondary #zootopia #judy hopps #nick wilde

[wisteria-lodge]

most lion secondaries are tough, but what about sensitive lions? i'm someone who feels things very deeply, who cries easily, and can have a hard time standing up for myself. i also prefer calmer and quieter activities most of the time when a lot of people see lions as very exciting and energetic people. do lions like that exist too?

Of course. Even in fiction you'll get your more quiet, bookish lion secondaries like Belle, Hamlet, and Sam Winchester. And boy can those guys cry, and feel all of the things.

'Standing up for yourself,' is also one of the things you learn, and then get better at, and that's the case with all the secondaries.

#shc #sortinghatchats #lion secondary

[sunnyhatchats]

snake primary/lion secondary

#shc #sortinghatchats #it's always sunny in philadelphia #snake primary #lion secondary #Youtube

[reading-sometimes]

Wreck-it-Ralph Sorting

A basic overview of the SHC system by @wisteria-lodge is here.

Ralph - Badger Lion

The first thing that we see Ralph do in the movie is going to a Bad-Anon meeting. His driving motivation for getting the medal is not because of the medal itself, but for everything that the medal will get him - acceptance from all of the other characters in his game. I did consider Snake primary for Ralph, since his friendship with Venellope and the characters in his game seems to be enough for him, but he's so focused on groups that I settled on Badger.

As for Ralph's secondary, he gets stuff done. He needs a medal? He deliberates about the specifics with Tapper for a bit, and then he climbs a building and goes Turbo to get it, risking his own death. He does have a Snake secondary model that he uses for other things, like taking Markowski's clothes to sneak into Hero's Duty and lying to Venellope about the tree-trimming service when they first meet. He also lies to Felix about how he didn't know that there was a party, and it's worth mentioning that Venellope calls him a liar, but it's not his primary way of doing stuff.

Venellope - Double Lion

Venellope was by far the easiest character to sort for me. I mean, "I know I'm a racer. I can feel it in my code." might be the most Lion primary sentences ever written. Even though everyone else tells her that she's just a glitch, she knows she's a racer. I mean, the first thing that she does when she first meets Ralph is race him for the medal. 

And Venellope's secondary? She's a loud Lion secondary. She knows what she wants, and she's not going to back down from it no matter what. She wants to win the race, even if it's on her own. 

Felix - Double Badger

Like Ralph, Felix is fixated on groups. He wants to include Ralph at the party, even if it's uncomfortable for both him and the other characters in his game, and he tries very hard to keep the peace. 

As for his Secondary, Felix primarily seeks out other people. He finds Calhoun when Ralph's gone Turbo, and coerces her to help him. When he gets to Sugar Rush, the first thing that he does is seek out Sour Bill. I considered an 'I-know-a-guy' Bird, but Felix doesn't collect anything else like how most Bird secondaries do. When he's locked in a dungeon, the first thing that he does is call for help. I think that a Bird Secondary would at least try to look around first. 

Calhoun - Badger Lion

She was hard to sort for me, because she's very stereotypical? I mean, she likes groups and bossing people around, so I could say that she's an Authoritarian Badger? Maybe a Snake, since she cares about Felix and her troops? She definitely doesn't like selfish people, judging by her saying that the selfish man is like a mangy dog. I'm going to cautiously say Badger, because when a Cy-bug escapes her game, she goes after it so that the other games don't have to deal with it. Snakes can do that too, obviously, but it wasn't even a question for her.

When Felix enters the game, she first thing that she does is try to shoot at him. I don't think that someone can really get more Lion secondary than that. She's very direct, and gets things done.

#wreck it ralph #shc #sorting hat chat #sorting hat chats #double badger #badger lion #snake secondary #double lion #ralph #Venellope #Calhoun #Felix #disney

[sevilemar]

I put your two asks into one post, nonny, because it's easier for me this way.

I have to say Idealist Media confuses the heck out of me, like V is for Vendetta for example. I've seen other Idealist vibe with that movie, and I feel like I'm sitting in a corner, not getting it and having only silence radiating from me. There's no connection there.

That's not a bad thing. Some things just don't work for us, and that's OK. We are allowed to have different opinions on things.

I don't remember much about V for Vendetta, except that I did find something in it that worked for me, or that I found interesting. There is a million things it could be though, and most of them have nothing to do with shc. And since I have no possibility to re-watch it atm, I couldn't tell you what it was.

Loyalist media is my jam. I could rewatch the Witcher 1st season over and over, I love the characters (except for the idealist one, but she'smore annoying than not) when snake Jaskier asks Gerald is he maybe short of a marble for going to rescue a crazy witch, that's my jam.

Season one of Witcher is pretty awesome, I agree. I love how the fight in Blaviken was filmed, and Geralt, Jaskier and Yennefer and their dynamic are to die for. Also, yay for fantasy that's based on a different cultural background, something I feel more at home in.

I hate being called an idealist, I think all the ideals I'm ready to argue over even with my family and friends are based not around ideals but around people and some group I find a slight personal connection with being hurt. Personal, people based, but in idealist language.

OK, let's get something straight: the shc terminology is not the best when we're looking at the idealist/loyalist divide. Framing it like that suggests that 'loyalists' have no ideals, and that 'idealists' are not concerned about people, or even that ideals cannot concern the people in front of you. Which is all bullshit, of course. Being loyal to the people in front of you is very much an ideal, for example.

That's why I think shc needs new words for it, to be honest. In my experience, 'idealists' look for the bigger picture (as many people as possible, the system we live in, etc.) because they believe that affecting as many people as they can is the best way to achieve whatever their goals are.

They get strength from believing that whatever they are doing, they are hopefully affecting a lot of people. That's why I like to call them big picture thinkers.

'Loyalists' look for the people closest to them, because they believe that affecting them as directly as they can is the best way to achieve their goals. And because not every goal has a direct and noticeable impact, their goals are usually much smaller in scope.

They get their strength from having as much immediate and concrete impact on whoever is around them, and being there to see it. That's why I like to call them concrete thinkers.

I am not perfectly happy with this definition either, but maybe it can help you see the whole idealist/loyalist thing from a different angle, nonny, and take away some of the negativity around the words that I can read in your asks.

But I can't be a loyalist, I have no people of my own, I have no group loyalties,

Just because you do not have people or groups does not mean you cannot build your morality around them, nonny. I am a snake primary, whether I have people or not.

and I will argue with my conservative mom or brothers and friends over lgbtq rights (personal - I'm ace and probably bi, woyh gender stuff on top), over stray cats (my own sweetie was one) or the importance to wear a mask (it makes sence, just like ecology does - our actions, our plastic filled lifestyle naturally has to have consequences), I will argue even more strongly with anyone over my boundaries and holding principles, like children should not be allowed to pet stranger's dogs they see in the streets just because they're children and they don't know a word no (I hate to be used and people like to dump their stuff without my consent and family and friendship interactions become boring and more like work).

Arguing and standing up for what you believe in does not automatically mean you're a lion primary, or even any kind of big picture thinker, nonny. Lion secondaries often like to argue as well, no matter their primary, and/or people who have learned to do it from their surroundings, or who had to learn for their survival.

Though the things you list are pretty big picture things in my experience. And especially when you defend them against your loved ones like you're describing.

You know, I might be even a bit frightened by V is for Vendetta. Maybe I'm bird and this lion movie really hits the wrong idealist spot for me? What do you think with your experience?

Might be? From what I remember it's pretty intensely lion primary, and intensity can be scary.

I think a good question to ask yourself would be what exactly it is about the movie that makes you feel that way? Because you cannot deny that it sparked something in you, something I think would be worthwile following up on for a bit.

Part 2: A follow up to loyalist vs Idealist wall of text. I can't be a bird, my emotional responses come first and foremost, and the questioning and the need to question if ever comes second.

Alright, sounds good to me.

I think I hate being idealist, especially lion, bcs I can see that even if this is the quickest and most accessible way to see, understand and interact with the world, it's not the most effective, or accurate way. I don't wish I could trust my instincts more, I wish there would be a better and more correct way, that would work as quick as your gut instincts, but would also take into account your surroundings and would give you good and correct info, and also would make you feel good and okay too.

Maybe my lion, if I'm one, is burned and so tired of being seen wrong that it just doesn't want to be one, it just wants to have something better and more effective, more pragmatic. I guess snakes are pragmatic, while badgers have a touch of niceness on top of it all.

I'm still made about that V movie, why would you torture someone to get them to see your ideals? He had to leave them alone and go figure how to do it all by himself. And they're not angry at him after all if it, after all that crap he pulled out? Nonsense.

I don't think your lion primary is burned, nonny, not yet. I think it still knows very well what right and wrong is for you. It might be a bit of a wild guess, but I think it's your lion secondary that is burned, not your lion primary. And that means your lion primary has lost its voice, has lost its ability to make others understand in a manner that works well and also feels right.

And roaring truths into a void like that would make anyone tired. What do you think, nonny?

#i really hope i'm not projecting too much #but i do feel like i have seen something like this in a friend #sortinghatchats #ask answers #lion primary #lion secondary #maybe

[thelongestway]

Sorting The Slayers: Lina Inverse (Bird Primary/Lion Secondary)

While on the surface The Slayers is a comedy, it's not one of my favorite shows of all time because of the fun. It's one of my favorite shows because, despite all the slapstick, it's very Bird fun. And this is because the main character, Lina Inverse, known as the Enemy of All Who Live and the one Dragons Step Past Out of Clear Revulsion, is a Bird Primary. Admittedly, that Bird has basically built a Lion-flavored system ("No rights for the wicked!") and has a LOUD Lion Secondary. But in her heart of hearts, Lina Inverse is a Bird, and the Slayers, centered on her as it is, is a Bird/Lion show (and also why the later seasons are sad: they completely lose the Bird). To get at Lina's Primary, you have to pay attention to how she fights. While she talks up a big game about "yup, one spell and you're DEAD", in reality she chooses her fights. She takes the higher ground, she chooses the right spell for the right situation (and has an absolutely dizzying array - it's not just the Dragon Slave), and she is incredibly inventive. When she has no magic and has to face up against an augmented mage that is her equal in spell level, she holds him off for a good few minutes with nothing but a Light cantrip, using it as a distraction and as a dispel for a shadow-based spell. She has a tactical teleport (which she only used once, as it's situational), all sorts of elemental spells, and a bunch of her own creations, which she uses to good effect. Even her Charging is incredibly Bird-flavored. When she gets locked into chains that electrocute her whenever she casts, and her partner says "Well, you can't use magic and they took my sword, what can we do?" Lina goes: "No, it's not that I can't cast. It's that it hurts to cast. That's different". And then she casts through the pain. This is her common pattern: Lina assays the situation and then turns on Lion mode to Deal With It (or, when the situation calls for less destruction and more thought, she also has a fun Actor Bird Mode she uses. "I am a merchant's daughter, after all"; "Oh wait, the heroine is supposed to be all shrieky here!") Lina also has a robust set of rules she follows. "No casting spells that give me nightmares" - and after using an incredibly effective spell that rips trolls to threads, she never uses it again. When Amelia, who at the very least models a loud Lion primary (need to rewatch to see what's under that, because she and Phil have a lot of trauma going on), asks her to teach the most powerful widely-known spell in all Black magic, Lina instantly imagines Amelia blasting someone who found a coin with it and basically starts stalling for time (instead of just going "nope"). When pressed, she snaps: "The most powerful spell in the world is useless if you don't know when and where to use it!" And yes - when deciding to risk destroying the world to save a person she loves, she DECIDES to take that risk. It's a question she grapples with and makes her decision. Lina's Secondary is basically how she's coded as a character (redhead with red eyes, come on, you can't get more aggressive visually). Lina obviously enjoys just blowing things to oblivion, going in to deal with things, and generally enjoying the limelight. Her secondary is in her iconic speech: "Where monsters rampage, I'm there to take them down! Where treasure glitters, I'm there to claim it. Where an enemy rises to face me, victory WILL BE MINE!" And she means it. When the men on her team go "we're going to die but we must fight," Lina goes "nope. I'm fighting to win." Not because that's a gut feeling (although she values her gut highly - her Bird has basically built her a Lion system), but because "if you take that attitude, your chances will be zero." All in all, Lina's a surprisingly healthy character when it comes to both Primary and Secondary. Her Bird is well-developed and serves her well, and her Lion, very powerful and fun, is not at all out of control - instead, it's carefully guided by her Bird.

#the slayers #lina inverse #sortinghatchats #bird primary #lion secondary #character sorting #sortingtheslayers #slayers