bird primary (in process of building system) + badger secondary
Hi! Itās been a while since I first took the shc quiz, and in retaking it recently Iāve had an unfortunate bit of identity crisis </3 Originally, I was Double Snake but now Iām sincerely doubting my primary. I was given Lion by the quiz, but I donāt think Iām full Lion as I donāt exactly have a ācause,ā Iām just passionate about what I want (and what I want tends to be very self-focused and more selfish than Iād think of when I think Lion).
Well, you very well might be a Glory Hound Lion. :) Itās also possible that youāre sort of between causes - or morally bored - or a Fay Lion with a non-traditional definition ofĀ āgoodā andĀ ābad.ā Letās see what weāve got.Ā
But I donāt want to influence your judgement too much, so Iāll get into just talking about myself :)Ā
Iāve always been a very quiet person, and when I was younger I know it was because I had a fear of authority figures and disappointing them, whether it was my parents, a teacher, a coach, or anyone else. I still remember the one time I got told off in kindergarten for crouching in the door to the hallway to look at a caterpillar. Vividly.Ā
Fear of authority figures can definitely be a human thing, but it does hit external primaries (Badger and Bird) the hardest.Ā
Now, Iām still a quiet person though I think thatās mostly the social anxiety. Iād like to think I can hold a conversation if someone else starts it, but Iām very bad at initiating them unless I have a specific reason to. I canāt just go up to someone and start small talk, Iād die inside.
There might be a little Burning going on with your secondary. This is a very hopeless-sounding way of conceptualizing a pretty normal, neutral statement.Ā āI initiate conversations when I have something I want to talk about.ā Yeah! Thatās how it works.Ā āNice weather weāre havingā is not a start to a conversation, it is a phrase that meansĀ āI recognize you as a member of my social group and we are not enemies.āĀ
Iām at the point in my life where Iāve just started college, so the biggest decision in my life right now is choosing a major. I donāt know what I want to do after, only that I want it to be fulfilling. I donāt know if I could handle something that felt like a drag. However, my idea of āfulfillingā has a lot to it. I want a job where it feels like Iām doing something thatās greater than myselfĀ
Okay, definitely getting some Idealist primary (Bird or Lion) here.Ā
or something that wonāt cause me to remain stagnant. I want to be able to grow in my job in some way and consistently gain new experiencesāif itās boring or too routine, Iāll hate myself for continuing in it.Ā
Iām thinking you might have an improvisational secondary. Maybe Snake - Snake especially loves new people, new experiences.Ā
For example, for a few months last year my only criteria was that I wanted to be able to travel a lot or live in a new place.Ā
Thatās honestly a really great place to start looking. A lot of people absolutely do not want jobs that require a lot of travel.Ā
Iād also like to do something I want to do, but logically I know thatās not sustainable. Since I was seven or eight, Iāve wanted to be an author and that dream hasnāt really faded but realistically, I am not going to do that. The most Iād do would be minor in creative writing so I could have something creatively fulfilling as well as mentally fulfilling to occupy my time.
Every single author. Every single one of them. Had a day job of some kind before they were able to make it their full-time job. (Unless they were independently wealthy.) Itās common for even *successful* writers to have another thing they do, because Iāve been there, and putting pressure on your art to be the only thing that sustains you is pretty intense and can lead to burn out.Ā
So when I hearĀ āI want to be an author but thatās not LOGICAL, thatās not REALISTIC,ā number one thing I hear is Bird primary.Ā āI want this, but my system says no, and so thatās what Iām going with.āĀ
And Iāmā¦ lightly suggestingā¦ that itās possible your system may be a little rigid, a little black and white. Maybe it could be cool to be a flight attendant, or pharmaceutical rep, or event coordinator and write a book on the side.Ā
The real reason Iām torn though is because I also put a lot of emphasis on what other people want me to do.Ā
This is a person thing, but it hits External Primaries hardest. Iām starting to like Bird for you.Ā
My mom wants me to go into computer science because she wants me to get a good, well-paying job out of college and has faith that Iāll be good at it. Iāve taken my first computer science class this year, and while sheās right that I am good at it at this level, Iām not sure if I will continue to be. Iāve been enjoying the challenge of a new subject so far, but I donāt know if this is what I want to tie myself to for the rest of my life. I do think I would be willing to, though. Like I said, I did enjoy the challenge.Ā
Youāre sounding a little black-and-white again. You do not have toĀ ātie yourselfā to computer science for your whole life if you major in it in college. You will almost certainly not have the same job your whole life. Iām not sure thatās even possible anymore. There is a high level of probability that at some point you will do a job that does not currently exist, just because thatās the way the world works.Ā
If you like computer science now, great. If you fall out of love with it - maybe it gets predictable and boring - also fine. Youāll have experience, and be able to move sideways to something that suits the person you are in five years a little better.Ā
But I also have put an unreasonable amount of weight on what my English teacher from last year said to me when she told me I was a good writer and wanted to see me go into the arts in some way. And I kind of want that too but again, I also want a job that will make me money. I am not going to spend 4 years at a college just to get an English degree or something like that. So essentially, I still donāt know what I want to do. Iām working on it, but I want it to be my own decision at the end of the day.Ā
This sounds like a Bird primary decision making process to me.Ā āMy mom says x, my English teacher says y, the songĀ āWhat Do You Do With a B.A. in Englishā from Avenue Q says z. I am trying toĀ synthesize all of these into a workable model of the world.ā (And Iām running into a few problems, because I want one option to be Objectively Correct, and another Objectively Incorrect.)
You want a job thatās creatively/emotionally fulfilling, allows for a lot of travel (and upward mobility within an organization?) and makes a lot of money right out of college. Thatās a slightly tall order. But, youāre at college, and one of the functions of college is to sort yourself out, figure out who you are when youāre not part of your school/family/community. So if you are a Bird, and it sounds like youāre at a liberal arts school, youāre at the right place to try out a lot of things. And remember, you can put individual relevant *classes* that youāve taken on your resume as well, not just your major.Ā
What I do know is that the most emotionally and mentally fulfilling thing Iāve ever done was stage manage in high schoolāI was head stage manager my senior year, and I had to somewhat build the position from the ground up since, as a result of COVID, there was no one left whoād stage managed in person. The amount of pride I felt at seeing the fall show was unmatched, and it did help that my director read out a series of acknowledgments that included me at the end of the final show :) That moment on stage after the bows is what comes to mind first when Iām asked to think of my happiest memory, and I think itās only a little bit due to recency bias.
So you like being part of, and ORGANIZING a team. Thatās very relevant information. (Badger secondary? Bird secondary? Your ask has been very primary focused so far.)Ā
I am not, by the way, even considering becoming a theater major. That sounds like a recipe for disaster equal to an English major.
Okay, hypothetically.Ā Thought experiment. (Iām absolutely not saying you do this.) But hypothetically, you major in theater. You participate in/stage manage 6-8 shows during your college career. Put that on your resume. If Iām a hiring manager, what does that tell me? That youāre organized and detail orientated. You work well with other people, are good at managing a team, have a strong work ethic. You probably are decently familiar with fundraising/advertising/permit wrangling. Youāre a good abstract/outside the box thinker. Youāre good at putting on presentations. Probably a good public speaker. Work well under pressure. Those are all pretty good, and honestly very flexible job skills.Ā
A surprising amount of the people I know in politics, business, non-profits, start-ups and general entrepreneur stuff actually have some kind of performing-arts background. My point is not that you should major in theater, or even minor in theater, my point is this is black-and-white thinking again. Once you leave school itās not going to be āplug in A, B comes out.ā In every industry Iāve been in, or been adjacent to, itās much more fluid than that. Thereās also a lot more learning on the job than I expected there would be. Youāre also allowed to have side gigs, and hobbies as an adult.Ā
(itās possible extremely specialized might work slightly differently. But the dentists and optometrists I know also come from like, idk. Dentist/optometrist *families?*)Ā
The most difficult moments in my life, Iāve realized, have been when Iāve felt unfulfilled. I have to be stimulated enough to be challenged or I will quickly grow unmotivated, lethargic, and genuinely depressed. Stimulation for me can come in the forms of relationships, school work, extracurriculars, or creative inspiration. As long as one of those things is interesting to me and taking up enough of my time, I find that my mental state is significantly better. This past semester, for example, I did at a community college so I could transfer to my current one in the spring, and the classes were so painfully easy that I found myself napping in almost all of my free time and doing less than nothing except when I had to. I also withdrew from my friends because at that point, talking to them was too much effort. If that seems like a contradiction, it is.
It sounds like you might actually have just been depressed. It also sounds very possible that youāre some flavor of neurodivergent, and under-stimulation can absolutely be the kiss of death if thatās the case. As Sherlock Holmes puts it,Ā āI have a curious constitution. I never remember feeling tired by work, though idleness exhausts me completely.ā
Talking to [my friends] would likely have helped, but I couldnāt be bothered.Ā Being very alone, very bored, and incredibly under stimulated have led to some of my worst mental health periodsāand I use this as an example because it feels very telling and also because I donāt want to go too terribly dark, not because itās necessarily the worst Iāve ever felt, if that makes sense.Ā Losing close friends also affects me poorly.Ā
I donāt have much data about how you actually solve problems, so Iām not sure about your secondary. There are a lot of mentions of friends, being part of a group, and not liking when that isnāt the case? But you could just be a social version of any of the primaries.
I donāt make friends easily, so I only have two very memorable losses. The first explained the situation to me afterwards and apologized, and it very much wasnāt her fault. But for whatever reason, I still canāt get all the way over it. It was a very online thing, so I remember what I saw her and the people she left me for say. We used to be about as close to best friends as you could get in two years or so, but we donāt really talk now at all. Weāre cordial, but the last time we spoke was also in November, which as of writing this was around three months ago.Ā
Interesting. You had a falling out with a friend, and she apologized for the situation and explained why she behaved badly? Now, itās interesting that you want the fact that thereās a sensible explanation to wipe out all the emotion associated with the friend break up (or think that it shouldĀ wipe out the emotion associated with the friend break upā¦) That way of seeing the world - emotions are unreliable, I want to be able to logic myself into feeling however I want to feelā¦ thatās extremely Bird primary.Ā
The second one also really messed me up, and Iām still bitter and conflicted about it. I know there should be no timeline on moving on, but six months to still be periodically obsessing over it seems excessive to me personally.Ā
That one was a bit more my fault, but it certainly wasnāt entirely and every so often I get irrationally angry that this friend didnāt give me the time to think and resolve everything properly. I donāt know exactly where we stand since it was kind of a mutual breaking off of the friendship, but it wasnāt really as clean as that and Iād thought weād eventually talk about it again, but we havenāt.Ā Iām not the one who made the final call, so Iām not going to reach out again first either.Ā
This is also very Bird primary to me. Itās not so much that the friendship ended that bothered you, itās that you havenāt been able to make sense ofĀ why it ended, and you low-key resent this friend not giving you a logical, cohesive explanation.Ā
I also ended up asking the first friend after a few weeks whether or not it had been at all my fault when theyād broken off the friendship just to reassure myself that the feelings brought up by the second friend (i.e. I was a toxic and terrible friend) werenāt true. I knew it hadnāt been, and she told me again that it hadnāt been. But it had felt like a pattern, so I had to check.Ā
Checking in with an outside source to confirm your idea of yourself actually seems like a very Badger secondary move.Ā
Anyway.Ā
I think most of all I want to be loved and appreciated for who I am. But not for what I do.Ā
Yeah, thatās the dream. To be loved because youāre a person, and not because youāre a tool/trophy/symbol.
I want to be loved by those I love and admired by my peers, but not for being able to appear more competent than I am, if that makes sense. I do, however, want to be the best in whatever I do, but being listed or seen as among the best will work in a pinch.Ā
I see a little of what made the quiz give you Lion. I donāt think you are, but this fantasy sounds very young Lion. I want to be seen as the best, but the best at whatā¦ is less important. Thereās also a recurring theme of an intense need for external validation - from your mom, your teachers, your director, even in your fantasy here, itās important that youāre listed asĀ ābestā as some kind of external list. I suspect this might be a young Bird thing, but itās a thing to keep an eye on, because thatās a dangerous sort of drug.Ā
That seems contradictory to my desire not to be put on a pedestal, but thatās different in my mind. I donāt want to be seen as unreachable. And those I love seeing me for what I do before who I am hurts just a bit.
I think Iām liking Badger secondary for you, if only because a big part of this fantasy is the desire to be *relatable*Ā
Finally, because I fear this is getting too long, family dynamics. I grew up Christian and am not anymore, which probably says a lot already.Ā
ā¦ I mean, Iād love if you went into why. Intense relationship with religion is often a marker of Bird primary, but there are lots of reason to step away from religion, and they all say a lot about you.Ā
My mom and dad both have high expectations of meāwhich you might have already been able to gatherābut they absolutely love me. I suspect my dad wants me to do what will make me happy first and foremost, but I think my mom, though she wants the same, believes that success will bring me happiness. Sheās not entirely wrong, in fairness.Ā
I also have a younger sister!! If I am a Snake primary, she is the one person right now who Iād call my inner circle. Sheās not always the best person and Iāve sided against her when itās come to some of her choices, but I know sheās trying and I truly donāt think thereās anything she could do to make me stop loving her. Thatās not exactly a rousing endorsement I know, but deep down she really is the sweetest and loveliest person I know (I suspect Badger primary for her btw). I really am so lucky to have her as my sister and I know she feels the same, and for that reason Iām always slightly worried sheāll be bitter if sheās ever compared to me, and I donāt want that for her at all.
If thereās a need for glory, itās coming from your primary and not your secondary. I donāt know 100% about your secondary, but with the evidence I have Iām going to say that Badger is most likely. You want approval, but you donāt want the spotlight.Ā
Anyway! Thank you so much for reading through all of this if/when you do, I hope it wasnāt too much to work with but was enough to glean an understanding of Me. I look forward to seeing what you have to say about it :)
I really, really enjoyed reading and going through this.Ā
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"Don't confuse how I communicate with what I am saying, nonny."
Really good point from @sevilemar. A Snake secondary's message doesn't change (because the message comes from the primary). Only the method of delivery does. And if you've decided that a very direct, straightforward expression is the correct vibe for *this specific person,* then great. But that's different from being a Lion who wants to only be direct and straightforward, and if they end up alienating/confusing someone, them's the breaks.
Hello, I've been reading through your sortings and thinking, y'know... snake secondaries sound really impractical? I mean, if they change so rapidly. Wouldn't the practical thing to do be to at least *look* consistent and straightforward and honest, since those traits are at least nominally prioritized and praised/valued (and then watch people squirm because they don't *want* you to be like that because they can't manipulate you but they can't say that because everyone is supposed to strife towards being honest and direct and value that in other people). I guess what I mean is, Snake secondaries are supposed to be pragmatic and practical so why do they do something that is likely to get them mistrust?
Snake secondaries aren't more pragmatic or practical than any other secondary. Unless you're very Burnt, everyone thinks their own secondary is a very pragmatic and practical way of doing things, and very likely thinks that one (if not all...) of the other secondaries is very silly for doing it how they do it.
(it's possible you're thinking of Snake primaries, who absolutely do have a reputation for being grounded. Their focus is very narrow compared to the others, so their sense of self-preservation is generally pretty high. It's weighted more.)
But to answer your other question, which is basically how do snake secondaries *work* if they don't look straightforward and honest... well... they generally don't *want* to come off that way. A Snake secondary wants to look clever, sparkling, lucky, like they hold all the cards, never miss a trick, and can pull solutions out of the air. Snake secondaries are people like Captain Kirk, Jack Sparrow, Ferris Bueller, Lyra Belacqua, Lucy Grey Baird, Percy Jackson. They would feel constrained by being always one way - always consistent, always straightforward, always honest.
It's also worth noting that Snake secondaries will often have have specific faces they wear for specific people, so while I guess it might be jarring to see a Snake secondary act very differently around someone else... it's not like they're a different person every time you meet them. It's also true that when Snakes trust you they often stop playing, just exist around you in Neutral, and there's an honesty and consistency in that - a very earned one. I generally feel very flattered and very safe, whenever they trust me like that.
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