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#k*taang salt
firelxdykatara · 3 months
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I actually really don't want to hear anything about how 'overcoming misogyny' is a major theme in Avatar: the Last Airbender when "The Fortuneteller" exists and the ultimate thesis of that episode, in the context of the show as a whole, is that if a girl is in unrequited love, it's cringe and kinda pathetic and she should move on cause the boy will never want her; but if a boy is in unrequited love, he just needs to be patient and wait for the girl he wants to come around cause he's a hero and how could she not?
Its secondary thesis is that you need to make your own destiny and not rely on someone else's words to tell you what your life has in store...if you're a BOY; if you're a girl then what the fake psychic told you will actually determine your ENTIRE life even if you are only fourteen years old.
Meng's existence really would have been the final nail in the coffin for Kataang even if the arc of the ship in Book 3 weren't so abhorrent to me personally (sorry but I have higher standards for romantic relationships than 'the girl is completely oblivious to the boy's advances for the entire show, is actively distressed when those advances become more pronounced, and then her feelings are resolved completely off screen between episodes so that the boy can get his prize in the end')--because her relationship with Aang is deliberately paralleled to Aang's relationship with Katara, and yet Meng, the one-off character, learns a lesson which Aang is quite literally told he must learn in the Book 2 finale... but he never ever does.
Aang has an entire season to internalize that lesson and come to terms with it--that maybe she doesn't have feelings for me and that's ok because I still love and care about her and that's enough--but he never even comes close. His possessive attachment to her gets worse, culminates in the EIP kiss, and Katara just capitulates because we're meant to believe that she went through the entire development of her romantic feelings for the love of her life off-screen between the penultimate episode and the four-part finale.
This was misogynistic even in 2008, and the idea that the show truly had anything meaningful to say about sexism/misogyny when uncritical and unchecked misogyny was baked into its very DNA (assuming we're meant to agree with Brychael that Kataang is 'in the DNA of the show) is just laughable to me. When it comes to 'overcoming misogyny' the show doesn't actually say anything more profound than 'girls can fight too!!!!!'
And that wasn't good enough for me then, it certainly isn't good enough for me today.
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tiny-katara · 2 years
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Hey, sorry you've been getting hate from KAs--been there done that and honestly all I've learned about ATLA fandom in the past couple of years has been that people here really like to stop other people from having opinions. Anyone should be allowed to salt on ships and love ships unapologetically as long as they tag correctly which you've been doing!! And anyone who's truly still trying to deny that there's any merit to ZK in the year 2022 really needs to go outside lol, a ship not being made canon by a bunch of white men in 2008 doesn't mean that all other interpretations of it are incorrect --like who put Bryke in charge of determining what relationships are the best to be put on-screen? Ah I'm rambling but really haters gonna hate and if they're gonna complain about ZK fans constantly talking about how great ZK is? Then just block the zutara tag and let us have it, K@taangs have their supposedly incredible canon so idk why they feel so threatened by ZK anyway. Aha yeah this got away from me but go you, love what you want unapologetically, and block the antis because they will never stop RIP <3 love to you!
i 100% agree! like its really not that personal lol. it's strange how angry they get about what are valid criticisms that they can so easily avoid. i don't think i will ever be able to get past the horrific ember island kiss bc its just so hard to watch and it feel violating.
and absolutely. you recognize the hype for a ship and still not ship it yourself. i can totally understand ships like zukka, but zutara just hits right for me. it's literally ridiculous that they try to argue that there was nothing there at all despite the fact that some of the ship drama was literally created on purpose.
also thank you so much for your support! it means the world to me :)
don't worry the antis tho, they've been blocked, although more are sure to surface, but it's so much easier to deal with with knowing that there are so many kind and wonderful zutara shippers out there <3
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dylanaz · 3 years
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ATLA fandom:
"I hate Aang in this episode because of a, b, c and d..."
"How dare you! He did this because of the reason x, y and z. You have no right to roast him like that!"
"Zutara is kinda cute. And they have many symbolisms."
"Noooo. That's toxic. If you ship them, you will be forever doomed in your future relationships. There is a special place for Zutara shippers in hell. You know Kataang is canon, right?"
"It is wrong to kiss someone without their consent"
"Stop hating on a character to justify your ship."
Greek Mythology fandom:
"I fucking hate Zeus"
"Same. I literally use 'Zeus' as a swear word instead of 'fuck'".
"Ugh, Hera and Zeus are toxic as zeus"
"Agreeeeeeed. If someone cheated on me for eons, I would've gone crazy. But that doesn't justify Hera's actions"
"Absolutely!"
"I ship Hera with Zeus and Athena with Hephaestus"
"Cool. I ship Zeus with Aphrodite from the version where Aphrodite isn't Zeus' daughter"
"Cool. I ship Apollo and Artemis"
"They're literal twins... 👀"
"So? They're gods"
"Yeah... Artemis is a virgin goddess, tho"
"I know"
"Strange taste... but that's ok. Nothing unheard of"
"Achilles and Patroclus..."
"Were roommates 👀😏 or should I say cousins?"
We talk about the characters in any way we want. It doesn't even matter that characters are gods. They get judged. That doesn't stop anyone in the fandom from liking problematic characters. People don't defend the characters as if their lives depend on it.
(At least the part of the fandom I experienced. It includes PJO, eventhough there are some ship wars)
.
Greek Mythology fandom is literally the best fandom, still having the most problematic and disturbing contents in canon.
.
On the other hand, it is kind of wrong to just compare them, since they both have different narratives. Some Greek gods are just really hard to like, because their bad actions are extreme, while ATLA gives us troubles to be on either character's side. (Ozai and Zhao not included)
(Like, it makes us take sides and reason why we don't like certain things, instead of just making us say, "Aang is such a zeus. He has no redeemable value" which is absolutely not true. Most of the characters of ATLA are light shade of gray compared to Greek Mythology characters, who are more like black and white... and when they have those grey values, they are usually extreme in a way, you don't really have to think about it and pick a side.
No one would say Hestia is a bad character. Her actions are often on the white side, just like Zeus' is more on the black side.
Since the narrative makes us see what is right and what is wrong in the extreme way, we don't have to debate about the gray area that much.)
Still, I would like it better if we had that kind of vibe to our fandom. I would've liked if we were just bold and chill about everything and didn't have to fight or pick a side. Would've been better if we just respectively did everything we wanted to eventhough it's problematic.
But I guess there are many paradoxes in it and it just won't work.
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shiroallura · 5 years
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anyways @llurance is bad bc it:
leaves lance and allura in an equally dissatisfying relationship. allura will be annoyed that lance can’t match her work ethic, and lance will eventually feel neglected. that, and resentment if lance has to leave his family after being away from them for so long. they’ll crash and burn, hard.
lance consistently invades her boundaries (s1-s2)
he’s seen her explicitly as a prize and has made no statements that he no longer does (he still saw lotor as a rival that he could win allura from)
lance is possessively jealous on repeated occasions that wouldn’t be okay even if they were together (s2, s4-s5)
he defines success and self worth as being a paladin of voltron, laments blue locking him out, completely unemotionally aware that allura was just rejected twice and he is rubbing both of those things right in allura’s face
he consistently disregards her agency (like... all of s5, aka “coran don’t tell me you’re going to cave in on this!”)
90% of the times he supported her, which again, were only an entire third of the show in, were tainted because we know a decent amount of them were just to try and win points with her
he’s never been able to support her professionally
even in s6, he’s still being performative in hopes of looking good in front of her (monsters and mana)
whenever Lance disagrees with Allura (continual flirting even when she’s not interested, being needed to be convinced the Red Lion is calling for him, annoying her when she’s trying to prepare for a conference in 5x01, being jealous about Lotor, shutting down Oriande, being even more jealous about Lotor in s6, blaming ‘Shiro’ in 6x06 when she doesn’t; I’m sure s7 has more, but as you can see, it’s a lot) it’s never really addressed. He almost never changes his mind or someone else steps in to support her, and that’s about it. It’s also worth telling that a lot of the things he disagrees with her, such as Oriande, don’t actually involve him, or things that are solely her choice (ie. her continual lack of romantic interest in him, pre-s7). 
the conversation of 5x03 with “speaking with you has actually made me feel better,” tells us that this is largely the first time she’s confided in Lance about something. five seasons in.
it goes back to that weakness of Allur@nce, that they don’t have a unique relationship to each other, especially on Allura’s side, because look at these questions, hard and honest: what defining decisions has Allura made to support him? What has she sacrificed for him? When has she chosen him over everyone, or everything, else?
Lance is a teenager who thinks he knows what he wants, and as he grows up, he needs to realize how to be content with what he has. But if he’s with Allura, that message and lesson are ultimately discarded, and it diminishes her character to an unhappy partnership with a boy who someone else could easily fall in love with, but not her.
it’s called not a single relationship in canon is well developed or perfect and vld is a shitty racist ableist show and if you defend it bc u like allur@nce ur dumb and just bc it’s canon doesn’t mean it’s well developed OR healthy, and you can’t change my mind
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zelzenik · 3 years
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a huge informal essay on being biracial and shipping zutara
ok genuinely i’m so tired of this. so, so tired of this. obviously not all biracial people are the same, and we have our own experiences/histories based on our own racial identities, but a lot of the biracial ZK friends that i’ve made via tumblr/ao3 have the same or similar opinions that i do, and we are TIRED. that being said, i’m not speaking for all biracial people, but i’m speaking from a place of personal experience.
those who headcanon Fire Lady Katara are not inherently in the wrong. those who do not headcanon Fire Lady Katara are ALSO not inherently in the wrong either. there are racist/sexist ways to execute this headcanon, the same way there are with literally every other headcanon. those who attack this trope, though, need to evaluate themselves because the reasons they give are often sexist and racist (ironically lol).
i’m literally half Asian (from a country that was heavily colonized by other Asian countries). did my Asian parent have to give up their Asian culture in order to be with my non-Asian parent? NO. did my Asian parent have to give up their Asian identity in order to be with my non-Asian parent? NO. did the presence of my non-Asian parent completely erase all the harmful racism my Asian parent experienced growing up? OF COURSE NOT.
i’ve read a LOT of ZK fic over the past few months, and i can say that i’ve read most, if not all, of the major Fire Lady Katara fics that exist within the fandom, and i cannot name a single one where Katara is forced to give up her culture in favor of Zuko’s. even in various ZK art pieces that feature Fire Lord Zuko and Fire Lady Katara, Katara often has Water Tribe furs and symbols incorporated with her regalia, and sometimes ZUKO does too. my non-Asian parent wears the traditional dress of my Asian parent’s culture when the situation calls for it, and my Asian parent does the same. (and that’s just an example with clothing - there are tons more applicable situations). interracial relationships are (under most circumstances) a blending of all the cultures present, and often, incorporating the other’s culture into daily life is an act of love. my non-Asian parent LOVES my Asian parent’s culture and does everything in their power to respect it, cherish it, and help my Asian parent to pass it down to their children (like me, lol). i can’t imagine Zuko not doing the same for Katara. 
similarly with the above point, i can’t recall any Fire Lady Katara fic where Katara’s racial identity gets erased in favor of Zuko’s. just because those fics tend to occur in the Fire Nation doesn’t mean that she’s... not Water Tribe anymore. just because my Asian parent does not live in an Asian country doesn’t make them any less Asian. i’m not spending much time on this point because it literally doesn’t make sense.
i do think that it’s important to mention, though, that Zuko’s presence in Katara’s life does not erase the way the Fire Nation hurt her. that hurt will likely always exist because those types of wounds go deep. but at the end of the day, they’re both two PEOPLE. they’re Katara and Zuko. the same way that Indians marry British people or Koreans marry Japanese people, people from the Water Tribe can marry those in the Fire Nation. to imply that a marriage couldn’t occur between someone from the Fire Nation and someone else from the Water Tribe is stupid because it happens all the time in the real world.
i honestly think it’s really stupid that some SJWs act as though they’re doing non-white or biracial or multiracial people a favor by attacking a headcanon that was created and has been largely supported by those who are oppressed in the real world bc of their race. obviously the Fire Lady Katara trope isn’t for everyone, but to imply that it’s racist and sexist while tearing down the POCs who headcanon it? really? don’t get me wrong, i LOVE Katara (i would do anything for her, no lie), but how is attacking real POCs better than defending imaginary ones? sorry not sorry, but that’s stupid.
the Fire Lady Katara trope has the potential to grant Katara with tons of agency, not only within her relationship with her significant other, but also with the country that HURT her (so she can prove any of the prejudiced Fire Nation people the hell wrong and provide protection for the Water Tribe in a post-war world). 
and going a step further, personally, i identify heavily with Zutara Steambabies (as i know a bunch of my other biracial ZK friends do) because of the intricacy behind their racial identities. a Fire Nation and Water Tribe union WOULD be complicated due to the countries’ histories together, but that doesn’t make it impossible. love CAN be born despite broken histories and deep-set prejudices. that’s part of what makes Zutara so beautiful, in my opinion. 
finally, i don’t know what people are on when they attack mostly only Zutara for these sort of headcanons. don’t y’all realize that 85% of all the canon/fanon ships within the ATLA-verse are interracial?? K*taang is interracial. Sukka is interracial. Taang is interracial. Z*kka is interracial. Jetko is interracial. Azutara is interracial. Jue is interracial. Tokka is interracial. Jetara is interracial. Ty Lokka is interracial. Jinko is interracial. (I COULD GO ON). y’all are straight CLOWNING if you only come for Zutara shippers on the grounds that we’re being racist and sexist for having a headcanon like Fire Lady Katara. don’t be a hypocrite.
additionally, just because you’re poc or biracial or multiracial does not mean that you can’t be racist. so many of the people who attack this headcanon pull the “i’m biracial!” or “i’m a poc!” card. I’M NOT HAVING IT. it’s okay if the trope isn’t for you! you’re free to headcanon whatever you want. to be blatantly racist to other poc or biracial or multiracial ppl who headcanon, though, it is wrong. we already catch enough flack irl for being what we are without people attacking us in our fandom spaces too.
that being said, i love Zutara deeply. for me, as a biracial person, it’s a comfort ship. a bunch of kids posting and mistagging salt regarding our headcanons isn’t gonna change that, lol.
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tea-and-la · 3 years
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For the salt game! 2 and 20!
(Authorjoydragon)
2. Are there any popular fandom OTPs you only BroTP?*
Hmm... quite a few actually: K*t@ang, Zvkka, M@iko, and Tokk@ (idk the last one is really popular on tiktok lol.)
with zvkka, i just think it’s really meaningful how they’re each other’s first guy best friend around their age. and the dynamic of zuko being sokka’s ultimate wingman while letting him get reacquainted with suki is so cute.
with m@iko, i think it’s underrated how powerful their platonic bond would’ve been. idk how to explain it, but it feels more meaningful to have the only person who still cares about him in the Fire Nation be his best friend, rather than just because of romantic feelings for him? 
20. What is the purest ship in the fandom?
TAANG WITHOUT QUESTION!! The symbolism of fate and literally nature (when the Earth was ‘calling’ to Aang to land in the swamp) bringing them together. Them being destined to meet each other. The vision of her and how he recognized her in the Blind Bandit just based on her laugh. How amazed he was by her at first sight, because of her skills. How he immediately respected her because of her bending ability (called her sifu toph.)  
They are childhood friends to lovers excellence! I love how Aang is so determined to have her as his teacher (and the cute little scene where he is being super cheeky trying to impress her parents so she can teach him.) I love how Toph was extremely vulnerable with him in the balcony scene; how he’s the first person she told about her feelings around living a “double life.” How he immediately offered validation and suggested that she come with them. I love how free Toph looked when she ran away from home to join them. AHHHH I’m going into Taang brainrot now lol. 
They’re just a super cute OTP of smol cinnamon rolls and i love them so much.
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Hiya! So, I know you say that you don't really pay attention to the thoughts of voice actors, but tbh, when I hear that Dante Basco and Mae Whitman both genuinely thought Katara and Zuko were "secretly and desperately in love from almost the beginning," I'm not sure what to say because it makes me feel like I'm missing some subtext somewhere. It also makes me wonder why Mae especially would hate Kataang so much as to say that she was in love with an abusive ass all along.
1. Dante Basco hadn't watched the full show until this year lmao, dw about anything he says anon the man ain't a reliable source 😂
2. where did Mae Whitman say that?? as far as i know she's fine with k@taang?? idk where you heard that anon but definitely take it with a grain of salt. from what i understand (again, idc about VAs so i don't know much), whitman has stayed largely uninvolved with atla's ridiculous ship wars. i don't know why that would change now
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29. “Come over here and make me.” please! Thank you so much!
I’m gonna be honest. This one has absolutely no point except for shameless fluff. Plus, I really just wanted to write Zuko and Katara interacting in a more lighthearted and carefree way.
Set in post season 3 at the Ember Island beachhouse. Let’s just say the Gaang took a much needed vacation after the war (and the k@taang kiss/m@iko reunion never happened lol).
——imstillonmobilesopretendthisisalinebreakagainthx——
It’s an obnoxiously hot day.
The whole group has dispersed across the beach property in an attempt to distract themselves from the beating sun. Katara can hear Toph and Sokka arguing about who gets the last moonpeach somewhere inside the house, and the last time she checked, Aang was sprawled out on the porch with one arm sluggishly bending the air around him to manufacture a breeze.
As for Katara, she’s forgone most of her outer layers of clothing and decides that a swim at the beach is just what she needs.
She crosses paths with Suki on her way down to the shore. The older girl has also stripped to just her bindings, and her fair skin is tinted pink from the sun. Her metal fans, tied together at their handles, are slung over one shoulder.
“Hey, do you know where Sokka is?”
Katara nods and points to the house, too overheated to do anything else. Suki hums in thanks and continues up the hill.
When Katara reaches the beachfront, she can’t help but blink. Zuko’s prone, shirtless body glistens with sweat, his dao swords sprawled on the sand beside him.
“I thought you were taking a nap.”
One golden eye slides open to regard her before shutting again. “I asked Suki to spar. Wanted to see if swords or fans would come out on top.”
Katara grunts as she flops down next to him. She digs her toes into the sand and shields her eyes from the glare of the sun off the ocean waves.
“So?”
“Hm?”
“Which one came out on top?”
“Oh. Neither. It was pretty much a draw.” He exhales and a flickering flame escapes his lips. “Plus, it was too hot to keep it up.”
They sit like that for awhile, the sound of the waves and the parakeet-gulls only serving to emphasize the lazy mood.
But all too soon, Katara begins to feel antsy. Her hair keeps sticking to her sweat-slicked skin, and a thin coat of sand covers most of her body. She looks to her side where Zuko remains spread-eagled on the floor, his sharp features the perfect picture of relaxation.
A strong urge to ruin his peaceful countenance overcomes her.
With a flick of her wrist, a small jet of ocean water hits him on the cheek. She watches him scrunch up his aristocratic nose before he merely turns his face away from her. Another wave of her hand and he can’t help but splutter as a larger jet splashes him again.
He wipes a hand over his face and shoots her a glare.
“Quit it.”
Something playful glints in her eyes and she just splashes him again, this time on his bare chest.
“I’m serious, Katara.” His voice is a low growl, but it lacks his usual bite.
She stands up, a grin beginning to curl her chapped lips.
“Oh, you’re serious. I’m really scared now.”
She starts walking backwards towards the shoreline, flipping her thick hair over her shoulder. He rolls his eyes and lets his head thump back down onto the sand. But Katara can see the tension coiling in his muscles, like they’re preparing to spring, and she knows that she’s got him.
So, she lets a tall wall of water crash over his body.
Finally, he sits up, dark hair plastered to his face and spitting out salt water. By now, she’s already calf-deep in the ocean, her knees bent in anticipation.
Zuko shoots her a dark look. “I said, cut it out.”
“Come over here and make me.”
She won’t lie and say that the way he sizes her up in that moment doesn’t make her stomach flip.
And suddenly, he’s on his feet and charging at her, fists encased in flickering flames.
She’s a little surprised that he immediately goes for a close-combat spar, but mentally shrugs. Less effort this way.
They block and strike and try their damn best to get one over on the other, but the fight remains at a stalemate. Zuko punches out with one fist, but Katara quickly catches it in a block of ice. He swings with his other arm before that too is frozen.
Katara smirks and prepares to deliver the final blow, but Zuko inhales and ducks underwater before she gets the chance.
Her eyes narrow, searching the water for his shadow, but the reflection of the sun off the waves keeps her from locating him. And right as she resolves to go in after him, a strong arm wraps around her stomach and tugs her under.
She yelps and gets a mouthful of seawater before she pushes against the ocean floor and half-kicks, half-bends them both back to the surface.
They burst to the top, Zuko’s arm still caging her back to his front. She coughs and lamely tries to shove her elbow into his head, but she’s laughing too hard and her limbs have all but turned to jello from the exercise.
She hears his chuckle by her ear and twists to catch a glimpse of his rare smile before it disappears.
His bad eye is closed against the water droplets slipping down his forehead, but the other is alight with mirth, and his cheeks are flushed from the exerted effort of their spar.
She laughs again, the tip of her pink tongue pinched between her teeth, and raises her free hand to poke him on the nose.
“Okay, okay, I forfeit.” She almost regrets it when he releases her to float a few feet away. “But you gotta admit that it feels nice to get in the water.”
He scoffs and a little spew of fire carries on his breath until it fizzles out an inch or two away from her face. She sticks her tongue out at him.
“Yeah, whatever. I was already tired from sparring with Suki, and now I’m exhausted.” He relaxes in the water, turning to float on his back.
“Aw, is poor baby Zuko all tuckered out?”
“Yes. Yes, he is. In fact, I think I’m too tired to keep swimming. I’ll just go ahead and blurbaghab—“
A startled laugh escapes her when he lets himself sink underneath the waves, garbling the last of his words. She rolls her eyes and freezes a thick sheet of ice underneath him, effectively lifting his body back up to the surface.
He spreads out on his makeshift raft and rolls his head to the side to look at her, his cheeks puffed out. Zuko purses his lips and water streams out from his mouth, hitting her square on her nose. She ducks under the spray and hoists herself onto the block next to him.
“Gross, you Drama Queen.”
He snorts, and watches her wiggle across the ice into a comfortable position. He has a smug grin on his pale pink lips, a hint of teeth flashing at her. And with his shaggy hair poking out at all angles from the sticky saltwater, and the sun illuminating all the different shades of gold and brown in his irises, it suddenly hits her how boyishly handsome he really is.
Her stomach clenches from more than just the cold ice against her skin. She quickly hides her face in the crook of her elbow, and misses the soft look that he gives her.
Zuko closes his eyes, face turning back towards the still oppressively-hot sun, and let’s himself unwind.
They wake up two hours later when Aang and Sokka sneak under their ice-raft and flip them back into the water.
Needless to say, their evening does not remain peaceful for long.
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While I do think people can and should curate their own experiences, crosstagging is a thing. If I don't want to see Z/utara, I shouldn't get my ass handed to me if I go into the Kata/ang tag for goodies and see some anti-Kat/aang salt or some Z/utara shit. In a perfect world yes the streams would not cross but we don't live in a perfect world.
oh i completely agree! i do think most people tag appropriately, but sadly some people don't (i try to politely ask them to take their posts out the k@taang tag in those cases; on the bright side, at least, they usually do so!)
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