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zanguntsu · 3 years

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attractiveness and morality - or how people think with their metaphorical dicks instead of their brains

people are fucking horny over the villain characters in bleach, i mean specifically the male ones because as we know the female villains are nonexistent lol. but it’s not hard to see how attractive the male characters are even though i just refuse to acknowledge men unless i have too.

however, there is an issue with how we perceive the characters based on how attractive they actually are, more along the lines of how people will excuse any offensive behavior based on physical attractiveness

the convicts oops i mean examples

there are a few examples i can name like popular male villains that people lose their shit over.

aizen is the big one, where despite the crimes he has committed, such as emotional manipulation, attempting to wipe out a whole town, murders, and hollowfying his colleagues and getting away with it. yet, he is sympathized, especially over Tousen who tends to be more villainized by the fandom or at least held in a less favorable regard.

Gin is in the same boat, with the emotional manipulation and general emotional harm inflicted on multiple people but is sympathizes because uwu he loves rangiku even though he did cause her harm, simply because he betrayed her and hurt her friends and colleagues.

Ulquiorra is another very notable one, since he also has that whole manipulation thing although not as blatant as aizen. he did kidnap a minor and abuse her (isolating her, threatens her and her friends, and it is used to control her/keep her in captivity).

Grimmjow is another example, and its especially notable because he’s just very very violent. And he never apologizes or feels remorse for it, despite generally terrorizing Ichigo and co.

Nn*itra is especially reprehensible, he is overtly sexist, as most of his violent acts are targeted at women and uh. actively saying he hates women. creepy (implied sexual) behavior towards a minor as well.

Szayel as well, he has no regard for his minions, and then theres whatever he did to nemu what the fuck that was so fucked what the fuck.

notably, these men are also wildly popular among the fandom. they will have the most fanart, most discussion, most fics i guess.

why do horny fucks sympathize with them

people empathize with people they see as attractive, and i mean conventional attractiveness. note how none of this empathy extends to people who do not fall in the category as attractive (often pale side eyes) hunk/twink. does zommari get that attention? yammy? why are they not held to the same standard as say szayel/gin or grimmjow. yammy is also angry and prone to violence, much like grimmjow.

what sets them apart is that they are not deemed sexually attractive so therefore, their flaws become easier to ignore and they arent sympathized as much. of course, kubo probably did inadvertently create this problem, seeing as theres a discrepancy in creating a complex character. another example of this is the comparison between byakuya and omaeda. of course, they are obviously different characters, byakuya has more development and screentime. however they are similar in that they are wealthy, in high positions of power, and look down on people they deem inferior for a variety of reasons. byakuya, however, is conventionally attractive and also has screentime. that being said there is an underlying issue of fatphobia as well in reducing omaeda to a comic relief character.

people empathize with attractive people or at least favor them. “People more strongly desire to form or maintain bonds with physically attractive partners relative to unattractive partners—an attractiveness-based affiliation effect (Path B). In turn, through projection, attractive partners are perceived to possess attributes that are compatible with these goals, which largely center on their reciprocation of interest in establishing or maintaining close relationships (Path C).” this is indicated by the halo effect, “the tendency for positive impressions of a person, company, brand or product in one area to positively influence one's opinion or feelings in other areas“ which also applies to beauty and how attractiveness impacts how one recognizes a person. for example, an attractive person will often be associated with positive traits such as compassion, intelligence, and other desirable traits. it could be things like how appearing well groomed heightens others perception of you, how you will appear responsible and capable.

and this does extend to the villains. aizen is viewed as a tragic villain who fights for injustice or something like that. gin is a tragic antihero i think that did everything for his true love tm. ulquiorra is a tragic villain who does not understand love. grimmjow is grimmjow. nn*itra is somehow tragic with an inferiority complex lmao take that fucking L bug boyyy loser. and szayel... exists. see how fanon interprets these characters despite none of them having any remorse for what they have done. the fandom leaps to provide a justification or rational for their actions no matter how abhorrent they are. yammy and zommari are still held as villains, yet they are not sympathized with in the slightest nor are beloved to that extent. compare the sexualization of these men and the amount of sympathy garnered from the fandom.

why this matters

its no secret that in online spaces especially, offenders are romanticized or at least sympathized. take the true crime community for example, in which case male serial killers were romanticized despite the atrocities they have committed. and this is linked to the “bad boy” trope that is prevalent in romance novels, where a troubled or dangerous man seems like a desirable partner despite stalking their love interest among other crimes. of course, this also gets a bad rep from wattpad ya books and just ya books in general.

there are examples of this trope. i have vaguely alluded to edward from twilight. there is also the cause of that white guy from 50 shades of gray, which is most known for romanticizing abuse but the audience cannot help but be allured by his white guyness or something/ there is the netflix film “you” where a man stalks a women but it is seen as romantic and people find themselves attracted to joe despite his violence. literally this type of behavior:

there’s ted bundy film and how people raved about how hot he was despite him being an absolute monster and having real victims whos family have to live with the fact that people find their family member’s killer hot. it is this in its absolute extreme, where people are fully aware of their crimes but still find sympathy or attraction towards a criminal. in this case it is the gradual romanticization of violence that may creep up. i cannot assuredly claim that there is a strong correlation between finding villains attractive and romanticizing violence but there can be some indication of this.

and this view of how attractiveness can bleed into criminal court. of course, there are other factors such as gender, sexuality, age of judges and the inherent corruption within the legal system. here is a list of studies about this topic because christ i am not copy and pasting all of that go read it yourself. but the main takeway is that in mock jurors and other public opinion, the more attractive defendants accused of crimes have less severe sentences or even less sentences (however this is not seen as frequently in judges). it shows that there is a level of sympathy, leniency, or more compassion towards attractive people.

Conclusion

the point being made here is that attractiveness affects how one sees a person. yes, it is possible to find villains attractive, however the bias of physical attractiveness and actual character can potentially be dangerous if left unchecked. this is not exactly a call to action or a psa because a) i am fully aware that this fandom is horny to the point of brainrot and that it is incurable and b) this is just an analysis on behavior in the fandom. and i am aware that the studies are cishet in nature and are not indicative of the fandom as a whole seeing as there are a fair amount of lgbt people in this fandom. that being said, my point still stands.

#hi everyone its me blaze zanguntsu back at it again with a whole essay #ramble tag #dare i tag this in the bleach tag #bleach #i am going to invite so much discourse onto my blog with this wont i

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dahniwitchoflight · 3 years

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Airy Thoughts about Heirs and Gender

That kind of always has been John’s modus operandi when it comes to dealing with problems though hasn’t it?

Eveen waaaaay back in the beginning when John totally pushed it out of his mind that his dad was actually just a normal business man and not obsessed with clowns, that it was actually John who was obsessed with clowns, and jokes and pranking, thats always been how he deals with stuff he doesn’t like

Ignore it, make it not real, don’t acknowledge it, compartmentalize it, heck, joke about it, do pranks, make it silly, make it lighter, try to lessen the seriousness of it all

John has ZERO skill when it comes to actually dealing with perceived negativity in any sense, always been very reliant on basically his Aspect’s traits to solve problems for him

and now its becomes so bad, thats hes on the edge of having a full blown dissociation disorder about it

(I wonder actually if being too reliant on what’s been given to you on your plate already is a trait overall for Heirs or Those Who Inherit? It fits well with my previous idea of Heirs notable for being stuck in ruts, but it seems the true train of thought here, is that Heirs basically are caught in a pre-determined state, the lines have been drawn around them, their plates have been served, and they have to deal with what’s given to them, and as a result, have ZERO ability to handle situations that their pre-equipped toolset cannot deal with)

definitely an area where Heirs are prone to overembracing, when they become so, reliant on their pre-existing toolset, that they become unable to change things ups, see things differently, handle different problems

There’s an element of priveledged behavior here that clearer to me now, people who Inherit their wealth have no idea what it’s like to work for it or earn it themselves

and now isn’t THAT a connection to Maid and Heir?

this is where you could spin Heir as someone who starts out having no idea how to create something new and having to forcibly learn that

I could see someone creating a Maid/Heir argument for this

but then the problems arise of “how is that different from the Maid’s arc of also having to learn to take what was given them and start making anew what they want”

and the biggest hurdle to Creation Heir: Heir is not a feminine associated class

and the reason this matters, is if creation doesn’t have to be feminine associated, then masculinity gets the lion’s share of creation and destruction in Homestuck overall, and that feels like favoring masculinity too much, especially with how much Creation and Destruction as concepts are overvalued over the other aspects by far, it’s tilting it too far in one direction, when these Red and Green concept should spiral Equal (theoretically)

its out of step with how Creation and Destruction have been shown to be thus far

BUT

All of this was how things went down for me, back before June Egbert became a thing

So, in reading this, and with having the knowledge June might actually be a girl (maybe, Hussie said so, but thus far have yet to see anything from John in canon)

is that enough to make “Heir” feminine associated overall? moreso than other feminine associated classes like Maid/Sylph/Witch? Enough to be a strong enough pair to the Maid over Sylph? Two words that can literally mean “Girl”

Equius and Mituna still exist, what does that say about them? Is the background joke of Equius in a Maid outfit starting to actually become relevant?

who knows, but, It’s bringing up interesting questions I think, for me at least

John is the Main of Main Characters, versus Equius being background and Void aspected and Mituna being essentially non-existant, is that enough to balance out importance wise of who really gets to define what being an Heir means?

is it distateful to call being Spoiled an essentially feminine associated trait, if it’s balanced out by Maids being hardworking (or Servile..?) as opposed to a royally spoiled Prince and silly clown Bard?

better question, are these questions about gender things that Hussie never actually thought that deep enough about, so theres threads of things that could work, but end up falling apart in practice, revealing biases unfortunately baked into the system itself

cuz its like this: if Sylph/Maid is the females creation classes, its making sure girls vs boys in the grand scheme of things is equal, but that’s kind of going with the quid pro quo of masculine destruction/female creation thats baked into homestuck from the start, which is likely just the result in the authors inherent bias. Is that a net good? or a net bad? kind of unsure

if creation doesn’t have to be female, the idea that we should just be able to do away with the idea of gendered classes entirely is a thing, which is good in its own context, unfortunately leaves things with a different unfortunate gendered bias, where masculinity gets all the good shit and importance and feminine associations get sidelined and its unequal again, is this a better or worse way of seeing things? if male just happens to get the lions share of cool stuff, does it mean we can ignore gendered classes altogether, or is that exacerbating the problem with gendered classes to begin with

if a class that so far, hasnt had any traits associated with either masculinity or femininity (kind of a lie with Heirs being unusually good at the “mangrit” stat) gets strongly associated with femininity via one main character, is that enough to tip the scales and make things balanced again?

(is the above perhaps just a beautiful metaphor for the question of said characters eventual transition?)

(yknow, if that actually happens in canon, and gets explored by John/June at some point, and doesnt just die as an author word of god background fun fact..)

basically, Ive been wondering exactly how much the who gendered association of classes in homestuck should matter, but more importantly, how much it’s already affecting

would it be a good step to make Heir/Maid a creation pair? or is that just making a small problem bigger

tl;dr basically if Hussie makes it clear in canon that June Egbert has been a girl/dealing with a gender struggle all along in the way that they always have done by trying to downplay/ignore/compartmentalize it then yeah, Heir Maid gets a lot stronger legs to me, purely for the character symbolism of it all and the great message that would say about the gender construct of homestuck overall

but

if John Egbert remains the status quo, if Hussie never actually intended John to transition, if it never gets brought up in any way other than the authors saying out of the workd “I said so” Heir Maid as creation just doesn’t work without that Transition metaphor, so it fallbacks to the traditionally neutral Sylph/Maid as creation oriented

though, there’s also the fun question of what if through change of the characters themselves, their classes change with them? So through the power of Main Character June changes the associated traits Heir has overall OR stops being an Heir and gets a different class, both would be equally cool transition metaphors (which ironically would just reinforce Heir as a class of Change/Transmutation overall but lol)

#John Egbert #June Egbert #Heir Class #homestuck #Sometimes I wonder if Im giving too much or not enough credit to Hussie when it comes to gender stuff

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rametarin · 3 years

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We deal with this, “fiction is reality” shit EVERY. GENERATION.

And I mean it comes back among authoritarians playing to sheep EVERY fucking generation on different pretenses.

It always boils down to a bunch of people that are insecure about the effects of culture and media on other people, and as a flimsy pretense/pretext to restrict access to things to other people “in society” for their own safety and sense of security.

And when it comes to, “obscene literature” or illustrations, the source is always jealousy, insecurity and an attempt to reduce other people down to a demographic statistic. Whether it’s reducing black people to a caricature and acting like hip-hop just turns the kids into violent, drug abusing, psychotic felons, or imagining pornography is what turns people into horny fucking do-nothings, it’s always about control.

And we’ve put it off for so long. We’ve put off the conversation about just what demographic these people play to in order to get traction and followers and staying power and warm bodies for their movements. They’re the demographic that makes antis- work, the demographic that screams for censorship because illustrations “hurt them personally,” or “cause men to hurt them.”

I’m talking about women. Particularly, cis women, as trans women are not in numbers enough to affect anything, and it is EXPLICITLY IMPORTANT that the source of the offense and complaint come from the population that are the gateway through which the next generation is born and brought up.

Individual men may be so clueless as to assume the way degeneration works is a person is left improperly or negligently nurtured, and so just make bad decisions because, “they were never taught better.” They embrace the idea that people only do bad shit because, “the society,” isn’t paying attention, or that individual people are just blank slates beholden to the righteousness and morality of the cultural hivemind of said society. That Society is an objective effect, and if bad people exist, it’s proof to them that there’s something wrong with said society.

But individual men know that the bad actions of other men are not caused solely by “male culture,” or the absence of it, or shitty “role models.” They see the shitty natural inborn attitudes of other men, and despite being raised in shitty conditions, naturally develop a good head on their shoulders, and despise actions like that. As men you can’t HELP but grow up watching boys around you make shitty decisions based on shitty impulse control and, no matter how often they’re punished, how much they’re loved, how much they’re compassionately talked to, STILL act the fool and wind up as terrible, stealing, violent adults. As men you can’t do anything BUT reconcile that some people are just fucking shitheads, and the idea as a man YOU should be punished or treated like the “association” of men itself is at fault, smacks of sexism. The same sort of sexism women’s lib supposedly is against- at least, when it happens to women.

Women, however, are not men, are not privy to the thoughts and feelings of men. Men are abstracts to these women, many of whom are so solipsistic or gynocentrist that they just see men as a class of monsters in a videogame. Just a pattern of individuals that surely must all get their code and culture from “society.” Clearly, when there’s bad men about, it’s proof this “society” isn’t doing everything it can to mollify and gentrify those horrible beastly men to make them safe and not dangerous and productive.

These women that see men like living aggregates for society, imagine that in order to “keep men working properly,” they need to not have “bad moral influences,” treating pornography and access to drugs and literature like a cleaning lady treats dirt on linen. They imagine that the only reason rape or murder or theft by men occurs is because “there’s a problem with men, thinking that is okay.” Like the only reason your average man isn’t running around violently raping people or killing them is because they sang enough hymns at church- by force. Or because they were prevented from, “getting deranged by wrongthink.”

So with this in mind, how do they imagine porn affects men, male minds, and this big abstract-turned-monolithic-concept called, “society?”

Well, they imagine fiction is reality. That if “people of lesser intellect” read a thing, then they’ll inherently believe it, because, “it presents itself as factual and reality.” When.. no. That’s not how it works. They believe, absolutely, that without some mechanism there to go, “BUT WE’RE JUST PRETENDING THO, IT’S NOT REAL!” that will inherently make people, whom all have tenuous and toddler-like grasps of reality and object permanence, think a thing in fiction is real and applies to reality.

And naturally, they see men as people of lesser intellect. So they reason, those dangerous statistical anomalies are just men that haven’t been browbeaten, and whom are subject to any given negative influence or writing or opinion or culture that preaches values and ideas incongruent with their preferences, as women. Therefore, they conclude, fiction that does not preach their “good values” is in fact advocating bad ones, bad habits, bad moral character, bad mental health- call it whatever you want based on your generation. It’s ALL THE SAME SHIT. All the same knee-jerk moralism based on justifying societal and institutional use of force to restrict and arbitrate and judiciously enforce and justify dictating censorship and good-think. It’s just a question of where that basis comes from.

And theres’ ultimately no reasoning with that culture of women when they grasp hold of a thing that appeals to them, flatters and justifies their prejudices and biases. You can sit there colorfully or dryly explaining the ways in which this shitty point of view is wrong, much as you can try to walk back a persons beliefs in their homophobia that they base on religious purism or use the purism to validate their homophobia, but you cannot just get them individually to give up those nice, comfortable beliefs.

And when grouped together for mutual support and validation, it becomes this negative-thought, field of fucking SHEEP braying “Nuuuh-uuuh!” and arguing for restriction of content and sanitation and disbarrment from certain subject matter to be in consumable porn or literature or even just art. The only thing keeping them in check being the consequences for vandalism, and the ability for a community or institution to police out the bias usurpers that would seek to enter their foundations and run them on behalf of the values of these easily upset, insecure sheep.

every FUCKING generation, it manifests in some manner. Be they from church ladies, to radical feminists, to intersectional feminists. If you capture the imaginations, insecurities, jealousies, foster and sanction them, interpret them, get young women believing them, participating in the romance that tells them the way to change the bad things or take the edge off the bad men is to foster and enable authoritarianism (be it regional social, regional institutional, or federal institutional) then you have this neverending avalanche of unending support for it. Be it from dictators, or just from pure ideology from a doctrine. They’ll do it. And stubbornly and obstinately believe in whatever compliments their biases, to the contradiction of everything.

And while you can remove a man and his influences on the next gen from the home, from the social radius of the next generation to be a significant source of culture and how they relate to young people, removing women from the equation, from whom the next generation comes from, is virtually impossible. So a male zealot, already susceptible to scrutiny and punishment for being so wild and zealous with their beliefs, can be retaliated against, muted, beaten and removed from relevance until they censor themselves or change their tune.

But you cannot do that to a female human, or women/mothers as a sex, without both women AND men taking it as an attack on humanity at their most prime and kernel. It has to be done with disproportionate authoritarian state power that does not fear mass dissent and violent retaliation, or it isn’t done at all.

So these zealous Karens that embrace wholly these ideas enabling authoritarianism under a banner they approve of, are allowed to propagate unchallenged, and even if challenged, cannot be subdued or subverted. Their own little cliques and echo chambers and lack of desire to even consider their positions are wrong. Any attempt to point the fingers at this very real, disproportionate and characteristic, objective power female humans have just on the basis of their sex and how that relates among them socially, can and will be trash binned arbitrarily as, “sexism.” Despite the fact, it’s absolutely true.

So long as women that believe “society” is an objective, monolithic thing from which, “that other sex” and other women get their marching orders on how to BE what they are, and don’t see them as billions of individuals with their own ambitions, instincts, inborn personality and character flaws, independent of “society’s failures,” believing those people can be saved or corrected IF ONLY WE CENSOR EVERYTHING or make all media “good thing,” we’re just going to have people with illiberal beliefs asserting their dominance and insisting it’s for the soul of the species, society and the planet.

I mean yeah there are male antis and shit, but honestly. Tell me honestly. How many fucking deranged fandom people that are doing shit like mailing cookies with sewing needles backed into them are male gendered or male sexed, either? As uncomfortable as it may be to acknowledge or consider this might have a sexual grounding, I’m sorry. Not acknowledging it is simply rejecting reality.

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maid-of-the-golden-deer · 5 years

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A rundown on my thoughts on Vesperia (I’m at the beginning of the second part, am a chunk of the ways into the Nordopolica Coliseum stuff). Under the cut, broken into “what I liked”, “what I didn’t”, and “what I feel nuetrally on”.

Postives:

The characters are so lovely, I am so attached to all of them, especially Yuri, Flynn, and Estelle. I love the sliding scale of idealism to cynicism they have going (though none of them are 100% either), it’s so fascinating and endearing

Yuri. I’ve been told that he’s almost far and away one of the most popular characters in the whole series and man, I completely get it. The fact that he turns to morally grey actions because he cares so much about the well being of others, even people he knows he’ll never see again, is just so unique for a protagonist that it makes him so hard not to love. You can tell that he wants to be able to be cold, to be unfeeling, but he just can’t, he loves and feels and desires to help others so strongly that he can almost never say no to anything that’s asked of him, even if he’ll offer token complaint along the way. He’s just. A treasure. And he’s a goddamn adult for once, like young protags are fine but seeing a character who has a bit more life experience under their belt is so refreshing

Found family bitches!!! I legitimately teared up when Yuri pat Karol’s head to comfort him. He’s such a big brother to Estelle and Karol it’s so precious!!!! You can really feel that Yuri enjoys having people who rely on him, and whom he can rely on in return. He’s always so supportive!!

Estelle is an angel descended upon this world, I love how shes in many ways sort of a more typical protag than Yuri but instead the game examines the pros and cons of being Like That. That to have that inherent goodness and selflessness is a great thing, but it can also be very selfish. And watching her discover what she really wants in life is a fascinating journey I can’t wait to finish with her

Karol isn’t my favorite child in media but like I want to give the poor boy a hug, like everyone chatises (outside of Brave Vesperia) him for being a coward but like he’s only 12 years old????? I find it perfectly reasonable for him to run??????? He’s a fucking 7th grader. And his reaction to finally getting the acceptance he’s always craved? Mwah

Where I’m at in the story Flynn’s only been in and out and only playable once so I don’t know him as well but he’s an archetype I love so I have immediate bias for him lmao. I do like how they continually go out of their way to show you that him and Yuri have the same same goal, the same morals, the same hopes, but they simply cannot reconcile each other’s methods no matter what. That is exactly how you make amazing rival characters. Even when they opposed each other you could always feel the overwhelming care they have for each other, it’s so good....

Judith is a Queen, I don’t know much about her yet since she’s a relatively recent addition to my party but I love that like the designated fanservice girl has like an actual Reason to be so and like, isn’t just titties out for no reason and actively enjoys it. Her slightly moral ambiguity is also really well done, like you can super tell that she’s a good person but she’s done some shit that was at least callous to the consequences of her good deeds. Also, flirty friendships are my jam Yuri/Judith BrOTP 4 lyfe

Rita is a baby gay and I wish her the best of luck on her journey to come to terms with her lesbianhood. For the most part imo she’s a fairly standard tsundere but like, sometimes having an Archetype...but Gay(tm) is all you need to be a good character

I have no strong feelings on Raven since he’s also been in and out and I don’t really like how he’s voice acted. He’s like, chill, he’s the funky uncle

I tend not to retain much about the story of an RPG the first time I play it since theres so much dialogue and flavor text to plow through but I do kind of like the loose structure of it, it feels very natural, like I’m just along for a random ass adventure these people are having. It’s really linear but it never feels like it’s on rails or anything

Negatives:

I’m not super into the gameplay, I can’t tell if its not good, I’m just bad at it, or a mix of both

Okay the fact that you can’t see enemy health bars in combat unless you hold down a button which also pauses the action is Bad imo, it makes every fight feel way longer bc I’m getting no immediate feedback on my progess

It’s. So. Fucking. Obtuse on what it wants you to do sometimes!!! Like a lot of the time its obvious but then sometimes the only reason I didn’t need a guide is I was blindly spamming A or Y (for shit with the Sorcerer’s Ring) and running into the walls praying something was interactable. I know people complain about games these days holding your hand too much or something but geeze.

Related to the above, minimaps for the dungeons and towns please, like its nice to have on the overworld but honestly I get more turned around and lost in indoor locations, since a lot of the backgrounds aren’t super unique looking. It could be progessively filled out as you go like the overworld map. Please.

I LOVE the story and characters and as I said above but like. The cutscenes break up the action every fucking five seconds, these people can walk and talk!!!! Like not to somehow bring a Bioware comparison into this but like, some of the skits could be had while you’re traversingt he world map instead of stopping you dead. It makes the pacing very “stop and start” and jarring

The puzzles. Wait, that’s not accurate, the long ass sections where you just spam the Y button to hit shit with your socerer’s ring an back track. They suck. The game’s already plenty long, didn’t need padding

No strong opinions on:

The aesthetic. Standard fantasy setting, some of the monster designs are cute and fun, some feel lazy, I likely won’t remember any of them in the long run.

Same for the music. The Dahngrest theme is the only one that ever stood out to me as “oh, I like this”.

Worldbuilding too. The names are a bit Much so I can barely recall a lot of them, and the ones I do I def can’t spell lmao. And I find it hard to retain a lot of the background stuff that you find out when it’s mostly infodumped at you by Estelle like she’s Ye Olde Google

All in all I’m enjoying my time with it, though honestly more for the interactive experience elements than as a game.

#dont worry im not particularly scathing on the shit i dont like #like u might disagree but i promise there wont be a reason to hate him #wow suu talks about a 10+ yr old game #tbf its the fancy new version with all the shit and more #tales of vesperia #yuri lowell #since a good chunk of the pros section is me gushing about him lmao

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calangkoh · 5 years

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Why do you consistently feel the need to affirm that 03 is better than 09? Is there still brotherhood superiority going on? I mean, come on, it's 2019, people like what they like.

thank you for your ask! it’s actually something i’d like to address.

im not affirming one is better than the other. i think they’re equal and i like to point out that 03 is just as amazing, because yes, there is still a fmab superiority. unfortunately the things i love about 03, fmab tends to lack which means ill compare how they approach the things i care about. in my last few posts i dont believe i affirmed anywhere that one is better, in fact i specifically said that just because one does one thing one way, doesnt mean its better. it’s just different, and people will have preferences.

this blog’s purpose is 2003 appreciation with some general fma stuff thrown in, so yeah im gonna be affirming that 03 is a good show a lot. i think fmab gets all the (well-deserved) appreciation elsewhere so i dont need to spend time praising it.

i just state my opinions, as well, which might be negative and those are just my opinions im voicing. like ive said many times, i just dont like most of the characterizations in fmab, but everything else i love. i just dont devote attention to the fmab things i love because it gets praised all the time. so there’s definitely a skew.

im a biased human what can i say? i LOVE fma 2003, which often gets forgotten or unecessarily shit on, and i thought fmab was just pretty great but not a lot that *(edited from saying “nothing” because yes there were quite a few aspects that stuck with me to this day) personally spoke to me. theres a lot of subjectivity going on there. and i don’t always filter myself properly when presenting these opinions and that’s just my fault.

you’re absolutely right and people need to let people like what they like. which is why im not seeking out fmab fans and starting fights. im not making posts on why it sucks. i made my space to rant about how much i love fma 03, which inherently includes comparison to its counterpart since they’re both fullmetal alchemist, and so their differences are interesting to analyze, and since i obviously favor one over the other, there will be bias. just like in those videos i linked: there is a clear bias from the youtuber who spends significantly more time discussing 03′s strengths than fmab’s (but he also points out weaknesses of 03 that i agree with but choose not to dwell on.)

i can make a post discussing everything wrong with 03, and everything perfect about fmab, but that’s not what i want to do because it’s been said over and over before, and why would i do that when i can’t deny i strongly prefer 03?

tldr: they are equal and opposite shows and i don’t think either is better, just that they are different, but i have a clear preference for one over the other and i like to talk about why simply because i enjoy ranting about media i like and analyzing why i feel a certain way, and i made a space for me to do that. i don’t mean any harm and i understand if someone wants to block me, but i promise im not trying to cause stress to anyone. i totally understand how frustrating it is to see criticism of something you like, regardless of the criticisms’ validity (im a steven universe fan and i cant stand the su critical subculture, for example. im well aware of the flaws of the show, but really? a whole subculture for shitting on something people love?)

and people have pointed out when i step out of line and am overly harsh or just plain wrong due to my bias, and i appreciate that.

17 notes · View notes

comicteaparty · 5 years

Text

March 21st, 2019 CTP Archive

The archive for the Comic Tea Party chat that occurred on March 21st, 2019, from 5PM - 7PM PDT. The chat focused on Asteroid 8082 by Will Quinn.

Featured Comment:

Chat:

RebelVampire

COMIC TEA PARTY- THURSDAY BOOK CLUB START!

Good evening, everyone~! This week’s Thursday Book Club is officially beginning! Today we are discussing Asteroid 8082 by Will Quinn~! (https://asteroid8082.com/)

Remember that Thursday discussions are completely freeform! However, every 30 minutes I will drop in OPTIONAL discussion questions in case you’d like a bit of a prompt. If you miss out on one of these prompts, you can find them pinned for the chat’s duration. Additionally, remember that while constructive criticism is allowed, our focus is fun and respectfully appreciating the comic. All that said, let’s begin!

QUESTION 1. What is your favorite scene in the comic so far and why?

my favorite scene is probably at the beginning when corrina is getting a tour of the colony. i really love the design for the colony and how theres just like this conveyor belt that goes through the whole place. for the life of me i never wouldve thought of a design like that but it works so well in making it feel familiar, foreign, and futuristic

but i also like the door designs you see as they pass by because it still has that mark of needing to be kind of a sterile and effecient environment

but all around i really enjoyed how quickly and simply it built up the world in the background and really kind of drove home how corrina is in an entirely new situation

Knytt

Hmm, that's good to hear. I was worried about the sterility being too much

i mean, I'm used to drawing outdoor environments, so it was a challenge

Oh! I'm Will Quinn, by the way!

...

sorry, I forgot that wasn't clear on Discord.

RebelVampire

thank you for coming~! its nice to see a creator come by.

Knytt

well, I usually lurk around here

...but rarely comment

thank you for having me!

RebelVampire

another scene that i really enjoyed was the one where theyre kind of bantering over the hoverbike and corrina accepts the challenge and is like "nah i can drive." that was the moment where i truly felt that corrina was indeed a kid since she was trying so hard to look cool. but it was also a nice moment of vulnerability too in that way. like showing that you can be as mature as you want, but that doesnt mean peer pressure isnt there

Knytt

Yeah. Corrina really does try to act cool

And before that scene I guess she succeeded

RebelVampire

idk if she succeeded so much as a lot of scenes her uncoolness felt like it came from a different place of insecurity. like not so much peer pressure, but more from being alien to a new place and being insecure in her own adjustment

Knytt

Hmm, that actually reminds me of something.

When my spouse was reading the comic, she saw Corrina as the main character.

But my original idea was that Iris was (my spouse is an immigrant)

So I've always been curious about how people saw that

RebelVampire

i personally saw corrina more as the protagonist myself. not that iris wasnt a main character. but corrina felt more like the main of the main characters. but this is inherent bias that between the two, corrina was introduced first.

Knytt

I see!

Thank you

I should mention that chapter 3 was originally supposed to be the first chapter

RebelVampire

hmm, interesting. that def would have changed things then cause itd have been a lot more even.

but it is pretty even between the two as is. i just connected a bit more with corrina. i think it also has a lot to do that corrina feels like the more grounded character between the two. Iris as been on the asteroid for years upon years so none of the culture stuff feels weird to her or anything. Whereas Corrina is like "yup this is weird." and as an earthling who doesnt live on an asteroid, that is basically how you feel seeing everything. so corrina provides a really needed grounding influence for that reason. its a lot easier to understand how she feels in regards to the world and shes easier to sympathize with from the immediate start cause its kind of a fish out of water intro.

mathtans

Made it here. I rather liked the "no use of ozzes", just as one-off comedy.

Also the conversation near the start of "you live in one building?" "oh no, no... three".

Checking the backlog now. Yeah, the conveyer belt was a neat idea too. There's a lot of interesting science happening behind the scenes that comes out every so often, which is pretty neat.

RebelVampire

QUESTION 2. The comic’s setting is quite futuristic and different from Earth, causing a number of culture clashes for the characters. What ways of life on the asteroid interested you the most? What sorts of details did you notice in general in how the colony was culturally and physically structured? Of the culture clashes that occurred between the characters, which one did you find the most compelling and why? Which culture similarities did you notice remained between Earth and the asteroid colony? Why do you think those cultural elements and traditions stood the test of time? Last but not least, how similar or different do you feel other colonies would be?

hey math~!

i did enjoy that joke as well about the nah we live in three buildings

like that was supposed to be marketably better XD

mathtans

I think I see Corrina as the main, in large part because we see her arrive as the outsider. Outsiders are generally mains in stories, because stuff needs to get explained to them the way it needs to get explained to readers.

Also, she's from Earth, and so are we.

Hi Rebel & creator!

Knytt

Hi!

mathtans

One of the things that I found kind of interesting was the whole planet/asteroid loophole issue. Hadn't thought about how governing would work in that sense.

But there were also subtle details, like the colour of the sky on Earth.

RebelVampire

yeah i was really interested in the politics. especially cause they briefly mentioned a war and like...man. space wars already. thats a pretty heavy thing to admit in passing.

but it was interesting to see that there is some complicated governance stuff going on cause i feel thats reflective of how itd probably be in life

mathtans

I'm not sure I even picked up on the war aspect. It was more the trying to get rights and using ships as bargaining points.

It makes sense but I doubt I'd have thought of something like that.

Knytt

I'm glad someone liked these science/future bits, because I definitely spent a lot of time planning them! (compared to how often they come up, of course.)

And Math, there was a war mentioned briefly

mathtans

Yeah, that's always the lament of worldbuilding, you do all this stuff and then it never really comes up. The short strip about the gravity thing in between parts was a good way to do it though.

Oh, I don't doubt it, just mean it kinda sailed over my head.

Knytt

Actually, Iris's father was closely involved in the war, btw

RebelVampire

thats fair cause when i said it was mentioned in passing, i really mean it was mentioned in passing. but it was bad enough to cause some long lasting political effects for even their asteroid. and considering their asteroid is kind of out there, you can only imagine the effects it had on bigger colonies.

that is an interesting factoid

mathtans

Iris' father does seem the type

Knytt

I made an upcoming short comic where Corrina talks more about it

The war, I mean...

But it'll be in a printed anthology

mathtans

I wonder if the spacers know about trees and plants and stuff.

Though that reminds me of another interesting aspect, that whole idea of "wearing the clothes of another culture". And Iris is like, wear whatever.

RebelVampire

yeah i really liked how thinking of things like "oh that person is japanese" is considered archaic by iris

cause it opens up the question of at what point in someones heritage do they stop being one nationality and become another

and i liked seeing how that question had evolved in regards to space travel in the comic

cause space travel comes with a lot of huge punches in that arena

mathtans

Yeah, it's sort of a planet culture rather than a country culture.

But an asteroid isn't even big enough for a planet culture, so it's more of a mixed bag.

RebelVampire

yeah, but still i think the point stands. in that the comic really makes you think about what constitutes a culture and how a countries culture may no longer matter in the future. it may come to be entirely about each particular communities culture.

speaking of culture, i really liked the bit with corrina and iris arguing about child labor laws. i thought that was such an interesting piece of culture. but also sensible because generally a colony would need everyone pitching in to survive so it makes sense iris would help. not to mention i cant imagine theres much for a kid to do on an asteroid. yet, i also understand corrina's point. so it was just an interesting argument where both sides had some fantastic points even though nothing was solved.

mathtans

Community, that's a good way of putting it. And yeah, nice to have those grey debates where neither side is necessarily right.

Also, the way Iris summed it up later as "she concluded she was smarter than me" (or whatever it was) felt true to the age (whether it really is I dunno, but it felt that way).

Knytt

When I was writing a lot of these scenes, I was worried people would take it the wrong way, politically. I was trying to have sort of "grey" debates like you said, and I'm glad that came through

RebelVampire

yeah i think the comic did a great job of being more thought provoking than anything when it came to these sorts of areas. cause theres a lot to dissect.

like another moment i really enjoyed was how even though the asteroid is seemingly very disconnected from a lot of earth culture, everyone was still super stoked to watch some sports. so it was interesting to see how even when separated, older cultural phenomenons still kind of continue to be present. not to mention theres lots of one culture affecting another, even though its earth culture affecting colony culture in this case.

mathtans

That reminds me, the asteroid was always seemingly having internet troubles, yet the door to the food station room said "free wifi". I found that funny.

Knytt

Oh, that's right!

mathtans

It was also a bit amusing that when they finally got to watching the sports game, there was almost more interest in the field and the spectators.

RebelVampire

tbf wifi and internet are separate entities. you can have wifi without the internet. so not false advertising, just a useless service.

mathtans

Indeed!

I figure they bought the door surplus. One of those items they were paid money to take off someone's hands.

RebelVampire

QUESTION 3. Though filled with lots to say about culture, the story also has a strong focus on character. For what reasons do you feel Corrina and Iris struggled with their relationship initially? Between the two, which one did you identify with more in regards to their feelings? By the end, did you feel the two characters truly overcame their issues with one another? Or, did you feel that there would still be many moments of strife between the two? Equally so, between all three children characters, how do you think their perceptions of each other changed over the course of the story? Finally, which character did you enjoy the most overall and why?

mathtans

I will say that as soon as Corrina confused Iris for a boy, I was shipping them. Or a future them in a few years, at any rate. Gotta get my ships in there.

Though I think wondering if Iris was a "fanboy" was almost the greater faux pas. With the implication of Corrina's popularity in there.

As to which character I enjoyed more... that's tough. It really kind of depends. I think maybe overall I prefer Iris, but she does go a bit too far sometimes - or in the case of giving up on fruitcake, maybe not far enough - and in those cases I'm more for Corrina.

Knytt

Heh, if I ship them too, is that canon?? I definitely identify with Iris more, but I like Corrina better I think

RebelVampire

i think i overall identified more with corrina more just because i felt corrina was trying hard at least to make friends while looking cool. whereas iris was just a grumpy bear of insecurity. so between the two corrina felt more sympathetic. not to say corrina was perfect cause that whole "fanboy" thing made me think "girl turn it down a notch we get it youre very cool"

Knytt

Yea, both of them need to take it down a notch...

RebelVampire

but tbf, i think the reason that they struggled with their relationship is that theyre super similar. cause they both seem to be insecure and have a desperate need to appear cool to each other. but because theyre trying to achieve the same thing, they both come off kind of pompous and butt heads. cause even though they have the same goal, they each handle it super differently. cause corrina is focused on kind of raising herself up to appear cool whereas iris feels like she wants to just not be looked down on.

Knytt

I worked as a teacher before doing this, so I tried to make them seem like the kids I taught

in terms of their insecurities

mathtans

Heh, canon ship is now in. Yeah, Corrina's more sympathetic, but I kind of like how Iris is outspoken at times, like even speaking up about politics and things.

I teach high school, so I kind of know the feeling.

Meanwhile the guy is just basically clueless to all that.

Superjustinbros

Hello!

I hope I'm not too kate~

RebelVampire

hey super~!

yeah i agree, between the two i felt iris was perhaps more worldly and that while she might know all the tech stuff corrina does, shes way more versed in like social and political situations than corrina

Superjustinbros

...Wow I'm amazed at how much progress this comic made in only about almost a year of production.

And it finds a way to work in monochrome as well

mathtans

I'm with the commenter on that one strip by the way, where Joe was saying to Iris "Corinna's the only cute girl out here", I'd have kicked him.

RebelVampire

i really do think the black and white suits the world too. makes it feel more space like.

i was super surprised joe got away with that XD

mathtans

Yeah, that's a good point, what with space being black.

RebelVampire

not that i dont understand where joe is coming from. not that iris isnt cute, but iris is also his bestie so automatically not available or even on the consideration block.

Superjustinbros

“i really do think the black and white suits the world too. makes it feel more space like.”

I second that- makes me wonder what will happen if the main cast ever lands on a regular planet- will the story suddenly shift to color?

mathtans

Oh yeah, I get it, guy be clueless because he grew up around her. I suppose I shouldn't complain, he'd spoil the Iris/Corinna ship.

Knytt

I'm not sure I'd be good at drawing Luna or Mars...

There's a short comic about Corrina on Earth though

(also black and white)

Superjustinbros

oh lol I didn't realize the creators were here, heh.

Knytt

Hiya!

Superjustinbros

Well I think the black and white works regardless

Hiya!

There's a good usage of clever shading to show depth

mathtans

I kinda wonder what it is they study out there. Aside from each other.

Superjustinbros

(also I'm in love with the simple character designs and the bead eyes, they fit the style of the comic)

RebelVampire

yeah i was wondering that too. especially in regards to what corrina did to get labeled a genius and made an intern despite her age.

Knytt

Corrina's main area of study is physics

specifically "gravity manipulation", a relatively new field that Iris's father helped develop

Superjustinbros

Sorry if I'm not focusing on the questions atm, I'm kind of stuck in conversations in other chats.

mathtans

So she understands the gravity of the situation.

Superjustinbros

"gravity", heh.

Knytt

slow claps

RebelVampire

yes, so im sure shell stay grounded in her studies

mathtans

I suppose gravity's lighter on an asteroid, must make things easier to monitor for fluctuations.

RebelVampire

this reminds me that one moment i found really funny was when they were fixing the tower and then the thing they used to fix it was a fraction of the size of the original

Knytt

Yep. That's how technology!

RebelVampire

QUESTION 4. As a slice-of-life, sci-fi, there is a lot to be said about the comic’s approach to life. In what ways did you see our present day lives represented in the comic? Additionally, how did the comic affect how you think about the way we live life right at this moment? Given this comic is also set in the future, what scenarios from the story do you think are the most plausible that we’ll see in real life once we reach that level of space travel? Alternatively, what scenarios do you feel might change due to the length of time it’s going to take for us to get to that future? Overall, what is your ultimate take away from the comic’s message about life, people, or anything related?

yeah. that was a moment i indetified with iris tho. cause it made sense cause that is how technology do, but i was equally confused how it was meant to be replaced at first when they didnt have a giant thing with them

mathtans

That remark reminds me of the fear of heights. It's nice to have little things like that which characters have to overcome, or otherwise delegate.

Superjustinbros

If the future happens I don't want it to be on nothing but meteorites and other extraterrestrial masses of land.

Feels... lonely too in a way

mathtans

I like how they still do stuff we do, like try to watch sports, or bake fruitcakes. Even if they don't necessarily do it often.

(Resulting in ghosts speaking to you, eerie.)

RebelVampire

i enjoyed that fruitcake was still considered mostly awful

except by joe who has nostalgia glasses for it

mathtans

Heh, yeah. Also, Christmas, still a thing.

(Who won the 'war on Christmas' then?)

Knytt

I thought "of course they'll still have Christmas"! We don't sacrifice a goat anymore, do we??

Superjustinbros

lol

Space Christmas: The holiday of the Future

mathtans

Well, in Sweden they kind of do. (Google 'straw goat'.)

Knytt

I've seen those! they're cool

RebelVampire

speaking of xmas i found it kind of humorous that iris kind of assumed joe was just in some sort of cult

Knytt

Oh yeah, the Pilgrims

I imagine any religion would seem a bit cultish to Iris.

RebelVampire

tbf tho there is kind of a fine line between a cult and religion in some respects. so it makes sense for any child to not really necessarily understand the difference.

Knytt

yea

mathtans

As to character bonding, the ship is maybe starting at the end there with the having something to drink together while watching the fruitcake.

RebelVampire

of the scenarios we see, i actually think the lack of attachment to nationality is the most plausible for a real life future for us. cause its hard to be attached to that when the world is spread out.

you mean your corrina iris ship?

mathtans

yis. must have yuri ships.

Superjustinbros

I second that, Rebel.

RebelVampire

https://asteroid8082.com/comic/chapter-2-page-11/

cause personally i thought that ship started there

cause knowing iris' personality she tots thinks that looks cute but wont say so

mathtans

Heh. I'd forgotten about that moment. It was nice too.

Iris probably kept the clothes in case Corrina changed her mind.

RebelVampire

tbf where would the clothes go otherwise?

its a 3 building colony that doesnt sell anything according to iris XD

mathtans

Maybe someone will offload some dept store dummies.

Superjustinbros

oh boy we got ships in this comic? owo

mathtans

We can ship Joe with one of the dummies.

Knytt

Iris think she's cute. pay attention to the phrasing: https://asteroid8082.com/comic/chapter-3-page-7/

mathtans

Finally a cute girl.

Good point there.

Incidentally, I wonder if 8082 has any particular significance.

RebelVampire

look at that ship sail

Knytt

the number 8082? hmm, not a lot

Superjustinbros

space ships

ba da ching

Knytt

I wanted it to be like "there are a lot of other asteroids; it's not important enough to have a name"

RebelVampire

that is the impression i got. that it was just a no name number cause heck there be a lot of colonies and asteroids and stuff

mathtans

I wondered if there was some kind of filing system, like it was system 80 and they were on the 82nd rock or something.

Knytt

There is a system! Asteroid 8082 isn't the 8082nd asteroid.

RebelVampire

the 82nd rock from the sun

Knytt

the 8 at the beginning is the number designation for that charter

so that's right!

There are 8 charters. think I mentioned that... so there are no asteroids in the 9000's

RebelVampire

interesting

https://asteroid8082.com/comic/chapter-4-bonus-2/ off topic but before i forget, i really liked this bonus comic. it was nice to see that there was kind of no reasonable expectation for the kids to fix it. and it more seems like adults being adults and just wanting the kids out of their hair so they can work.

Superjustinbros

Yeah.

mathtans

Ahh, that makes sense.

Yeah, that extra comic was fun, but I think in part because they were keen on the outcome too. Happy ending all around.

(Until they learn of the crash.)

RebelVampire

yeah i was kind of sad we didnt get to see them react to that

the adults

cause i bet that was a scolding about hovercraft safety

Knytt

I thought of making a bonus comic where Joe gets his hat back...

mathtans

Other ship: Joe and his hat.

It was nice that Iris cared about getting it back, when he couldn't seem to vocalize it.

Before the end, also want to mention that some of the science behind the scenes is cool. Like what happened when that hatch opened, I hadn't thought about that stuff.

RebelVampire

yeah i was a little surprised corrina was so cold hearted seeming about it. not that i didnt understand her point, just was surprised. especially considering corrina was the one who was like "lets make fruit cake for joe"

mathtans

Also the initial visual of walking away from the ship itself is interesting, what with wondering about being able to breathe.

I don't think Corrina was cold hearted, it was more, I'm busy trying to fly this thing, let's deal with that another time.

Superjustinbros

Anyways since the CTP is ending soon, I'd like to wish the authors luck on the rest of the comic- it's coming along great so far and the artstyle is amazing and well-drawn.

mathtans

Woohoo for bonus content.

Knytt

Thanks everyone for coming and talking!

mathtans

Thanks for creating!

Knytt

Oh, and if anyone's interested in that prequel story on Earth, it'll be in this kickstarter anthology (we just went live today!) https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/386994989/planetside-anthology?ref=cbco55

RebelVampire

COMIC TEA PARTY- THURSDAY BOOK CLUB END!

Sadly, this wraps up this week’s Thursday Book Club chat for now. Thank you so much to everyone for reading and joining us! We want to give a special thank you to Will Quinn, as well, for making Asteroid 8082. If you liked the comic, make sure to support Will Quinn’s efforts however you’re able to~!

Read and Comment: https://asteroid8082.com/

Will Quinn’s Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/willquinnart

Will Quinn’s Twitter: https://twitter.com/willquinnart

#ctparchive #comics #webcomics #indie comics #comic chat #comic discussion #book club #bookclub #webcomic bookclub #webcomic book club #comic tea party #ctp #asteroid 8082 #will quinn

0 notes

nobody-but-mebody · 7 years

Note

Understand that no one is claiming that you can't feel the way you want, because chances are, that no one that old wants you anyway. The fact that you think people are claiming that you should look at people that way, and that if you don't feel comfortable then you shouldn just shrug and be okay with it just goes to show how naive and immature you actually are, when no one is saying that, and no one is shipping sheith with you or anyone else in mind

The grammar is actually so weird in this that i have basically no idea what you’re trying to say but i’ll do my best.

A good amount of this will be uncomfortable or unpleasant to read if you ship sheith, please read it anyway. In the end I hope you’ll understand that I’m not demonizing you as a person, and I just want you to understand the impact that producing sheith content can have on the real world without precautions.

I can feel the way I want..because no one over the age of 20 wants to date an 18 year old?

First of all, i see no correlation between these two statements. Second, either you’re assuming i’m WAY younger than I am, (again, 18) or you’re completely forgetting theres an entire porn industry (in both straight and gay) devoted to (usually older) men fucking eighteen year olds. In fact, it comes in different flavors, here’s for example what comes up when you google something like “just turned 18″ and click the first link

I’ll add emphasis.

This one porn site has 994 videos JUST about sex with an 18 year old who’s only been 18 for, at most, a month or so. AKA the youngest person you legally can fuck or view being fucked. Not to mention btw, this is just in the heterosexual porn section. To drive the point home, here’s another search result number from another porn site.

211,962 results. 211,962 videos specifically catering to the desire to have sex with the youngest teenagers you can legally get at. “No one that old wants [me]” huh??? There are people out there who are predatory towards people my age. There are people who will use praise like “your so mature for your age” and the like to coax young people into relationships where they’ll be controlled. There’s a power imbalance. We live in a society, partially due to culture and partially due to nature, where teenagers are constantly told they’re not adults, they dont know as much as adults, they’re not as smart as adults, they’re not as powerful as adults, so when an adult praises them as an equal the teenager will respond more than if an adult praised another adult. Because of this, while the adult may treat the teenager as an equal, the teenager is usually incapable of treating the adult as an equal. Hence, these relationships are inherently imbalanced, and an imbalanced romantic/sexual relationship is an unhealthy one. There are adults who use this imbalance to control teenagers. Its a predatory form of abuse.

Keith clearly admires and, dare i say, even idolizes Shiro. Even if we presume that Shiro favors Keith among the paladins and views him as an adult and his equal, Keith is incapable of doing the same. He reveres Shiro, but Shiro doesn’t revere Keith. Because of this Shiro wields immensely more power than Keith in their relationship. Shiro could suggest something, and Keith could feel uncomfortable with it but agree anyway because of that sort of idolization. It isn’t healthy, and even though Shiro is a good person, he would end up hurting Keith eventually due to this imbalance. To Shiro, Keith is a favorite. To Keith, Shiro is everything, the only family he has left. If that doesn’t communicate the power imbalance here I dont know how else to say it. I am uncomfortable with adults shipping Sheith, because even if you whole heartedly believe fiction exists in a vacuum, if a predator sees support of a relationship where one party is around 25 and the other is in his late teens, and confirmed not to be an adult by the shows creators regardless of what promotional materials (designed to be catchy and flow well, “five teenagers” sounds better than “four teenagers and an adult”) that predator has had their behavior in a small extent normalized. If a victim of this abuse and predation sees a similar situation portrayed as romantic and healthy, it might reinforce their incorrect world belief that their relationship is romantic and healthy too.

I am uncomfortable with adults shipping Sheith because adults should know better.

I am uncomfortable with adults shipping Sheith because whether that adult knows it or not, they are giving passive approval of these relationships in the real world.The only time fiction exists in a vacuum and does not affect the real world is when it is clearly stated with every instance of that fiction not to apply to the real world. If you produce Sheith content and apply a warning to it saying something such as…

“This is a work of fiction. As a work of fiction it is not meant to reflect the real world, and is an idealized and impossible version of a relationship. Relationships like this are, in real life, always unhealthy. It is intended for consumption, again, in a purely fictional setting.”

I will not have a problem with your content, as it has been fully removed and severed from reality. It may seem obvious that the work is fictitious and people should not take it as a real world example of something good, but the truth is that the human mind is shaped by media as much as by upbringing and other sources. Perhaps even more so.

For a real world example, when i was a young child who watched a lot of TV, I wondered why my mother didn’t cook and clean. The answer is that my mom always has hated cooking, and she suffers from migraines that make her doing housework difficult, not to mention how for as long as i can remember she’s always been working. However, my perception of reality was shaped by the cartoons i watched and media I consumed. The message repeated over and over again was that Mothers cook and clean.

That might seem an irrelevant example, as I was a small child at the time and thus impressionable, but the thing is that teenagers are still incredibly impressionable. There’s a reason most terrorists and suicide bombers are young men between the ages of 18 and 20. Theres a reason why young people are some of the most passionate and quickest to take up new world views. There’s a reason that so many kids on tumblr so ferociously buy into “problematic” and “call out” culture. People my age, older than me by a few years, and younger than me by a few years, are incredibly easy to coax into a belief or world view and once that world view is established it can be strengthened and set with media.

Not to mention that once these beliefs are set, they’re difficult to dispel. Confirmation bias is a phenomenon where people will discard conflicting facts and accept only that which enforces their own beliefs. If relationships like sheith, however innocent the original intent, continue to exist without obvious warnings that this is UNHEALTHY in the real world, it has the power to damage real people and real lives by playing into confirmation bias.

If I were in love with an older person, and there were sources that said that it was unhealthy, and sources that merely implied it was fine, i’d definitely seek out more of the later because it feels good to have your beliefs reinforced. So even if its unpleasant, or clunky, or downright annoying, people who produce content unhealthy in the real world but fine in fictional settings (such as dub-con, unsafe sex, or the relationships we’ve been discussing) have a duty to point out that these aren’t cool in a real world setting to prevent real world damage.

Even if you’re not shipping sheith with anyone in mind, and you’re producing content or spreading content of it with no one in mind, there are people consuming that content with themselves in mind.

Dont let your content normalize and romanticize abuse. Sever it from reality.

#anti sheith #anti shaladin #TBH #antisheith

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