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vgfm · 3 years

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Deltarune Theory: More Musings on Everyman and Gaster

Hey all, it’s been about a month since my big Everyman Analysis Post and I just wanted to make a quick follow-up that ended up being quite long.

This follow-up includes some things that I left out of the original post, as well as a couple of new revelations and developments I’ve uncovered since then.

This new post also segues into a theory I’ve been building about Gaster, since I feel like both characters are connected.

I recommend you read the original post (if you haven’t already) otherwise this follow-up may not make much sense.

Sections

Quick Recap

Further Foreshadowing

The Curious Case of Mettaton

“Strange” Times

Revisiting Reaper Bird

Creating Reaper Bird

Ice-E’s Odds and “E”nds

A Deeper Look into Father Alvin

Heroes of the Dark, Villains of the Light

A New Challenger Approaches!

Gaster’s Connection to the Knight

Creating a New Future

Gaster is ???

Gaster the ???

What are Skeletons, Anyway?

Conclusion

Quick Recap

If for whatever reason you haven’t read the previous Everyman post, here’s the cliff notes version:

Everyman was the bullet attack from the Reaper Bird amalgamate in Undertale’s True Lab (the one whose head got eaten by butterflies)

Everyman appears twice in Deltarune Chapter 1, implying a greater role in the full game

In Undertale, Everyman was likely an actual person/monster who became part of an amalgamate like Snowdrake’s mother and Shyren’s sister did

Everyman is likely to be “The Knight,” mentioned in Deltarune (see first post for full argument/evidence)

Jevil and the King of Spades are connected to both the Knight and Everyman, implying they’re the same person (again, see previous post)

The word “strange” is associated with Everyman; his sprite in Undertale is called “strangeman” and Seam refers to the Knight as a “strange knight”

The Knight may or may not have a “strange son”, according to Seam (it’s unclear because the line is worded vaguely)

The Knight/Everyman is probably connected to Gaster

If Everyman is an existing character, then he’s likely either Father Alvin or one of the Ice-E’s employees (long story, see previous post)

[Image transcript: Two text boxes from Rouxls Kaard. In order, he says: “Lost...? Frightened...? Confused...? GOOD!! HA HA HA!!!” end image transcript.]

Need some help? Otherwise, we’re moving on...

Further Foreshadowing

I wanted to touch a bit more on the concept of character foreshadowing in Undertale/Deltarune, since it’s one of my foundational arguments for why I think Everyman will be important in Deltarune.

I still can’t help but find it remarkable that Toby took the time to include multiple Everyman “cameos” in Deltarune Chapter 1. The Jevil fight cameo especially gets me because it’s in a secret fight that most players already won’t experience on their initial playthrough, and on top of that it’s a rare event in said fight. It reminds me of how the “Mysteryman” event in Undertale has a strong chance to not trigger even if you have the correct fun value. This all feels like a lot of trouble for Toby to go through for what is an otherwise extremely obscure character.

Last time I gave examples of how characters like Mettaton and Rouxls Kaard were foreshadowed before they were properly introduced, but I found another example of a foreshadowed character that better illustrates my argument:

Muffet was a fan-made boss included in Undertale as a backer incentive for the game’s Kickstarter. In other words, she was (presumably) not part of the initial plans for the game or its demo (which was released prior to the Kickstarter). In the finished game, Muffet, while not as important as other boss characters, still ties into the spider bake sale seen in the Ruins and she’s (possibly?) one of the mercenaries hired by Mettaton to kill you.

Muffet’s inclusion in the full game retroactively makes the Ruins’ spider bake sale serve as foreshadowing for her character. However, Toby didn’t stop there.

[Image transcript: Two side-by-side screenshots of Undertale. In the left one, the narration says “(It’s a spider web.)” In the right screenshot, the narration continues: “(There’s a flyer for a bake sale on it.)” end image transcript.]

Toby also added a bake sale flyer in Napstablook’s house as an additional reminder and gave Muffet her own introductory bake sale room in Hotland before she’s properly fought.

Note how once again Toby took the time and effort to foreshadow a character multiple times, even though that character wasn’t even part of his original plans. And, as was the case with MTT and RK, the foreshadowing wasn’t just a one-off hint or nod, either.

Muffet is also an example of how foreshadowing doesn’t need to include a character’s name or a direct reference in any dialogue or flavor text. Mettaton and Rouxls Kaard are both mentioned by name (or initials) by other characters, yet Muffet’s name is never spoken before her fight.

A first time player going in blind would have no way of knowing that Muffet exists as a specific character in the narrative, but her presence would still make sense and be foreshadowed from contextual clues. The spider bake sale, while not telling us exactly who Muffet is, clearly builds up to the eventual reveal of her role and motivations. This is what I meant when I said that some foreshadowing only makes sense in hindsight, but that doesn’t change the fact that it is foreshadowing.

The Curious Case of Mettaton

Think back to what I said last time about foreshadowing:

“For all we know there could be other, more-cryptic Everyman references already in Deltarune that we don’t have the full context to understand yet.”

While I didn’t specify it at the time, I meant this as a subtle hint that Deltarune’s mentions of the Knight would double as foreshadowing for Everyman (assuming they’re the same person, as my theory alleges). Obviously I didn’t start my original post with this argument because it would be putting the cart before the horse and I had to first establish why I think Everyman is the Knight.

Speaking of the Knight, another thing that I hinted at but didn’t fully spell out last time is the fact that the three most prominent characters who mention the Knight (Seam, Jevil, and the King of Spades) all coincidentally leave “clues” that point to Everyman as well. Seam uses the word “strange” more than any other character and is the first one to mention the “strange” Knight. Jevil mentions the Knight and has the rare Everyman bullet. The Spade King mentions the Knight several times, including as his final in-battle line, then right after allows his cloak to fly away as a butterfly (an image associated with Everyman, per my last post).

If my theory is correct then it would mean that Everyman is foreshadowed even more heavily in chapter 1 than just his two visual “cameos”. It would also mean that every mention of the Knight would serve as a “namedrop” for Everyman, like how Mettaton and Rouxls Kaard are namedropped before their introductions.

This type of foreshadowing, where namedrops are seemingly “unconnected” to visual cameos, isn’t unprecedented. Mettaton is namedropped several times in Undertale before Hotland, but we also see his rectangular form powering the Snowdin colored tile puzzle.

[Image transcript: An Undertale screenshot of Frisk looking at Mettaton’s deactivated body next to the colored tile puzzle in Snowdin. The narration says “(The machien isn’t working.)” end image transcript.]

I also want to clarify that, yes, that’s actually Mettaton--Papyrus mentions that Alphys designed the tile puzzle and you can see that Mettaton disappears from that room later on before eventually reusing the tile puzzle himself in Hotland.

[Image transcript: An Undertale screenshot of Frisk talking on the phone with Papyrus in the Snowdin colored tile puzzle room. Papyrus is saying “OH HO!!! THE PUZZLE THAT DR. ALPHYS MADE!” end image transcript.]

But here’s something you may not have ever thought about: there’s absolutely nothing prior to Hotland that outright says that the mysterious “MTT” and the machine powering the tile puzzle are one in the same, just like how there’s no line of dialogue in Deltarune Chapter 1 that outright says Everyman is the Knight.

In fact, I’d argue there’s more evidence to suggest that Everyman is the Knight than there is to suggest (to a new player, pre-Hotland) that “MTT” and the tile puzzle machine are the same person (or even a person at all), and yet we know the latter is true. Just something to think about.

“Strange” Times

Something else I wanted to expand upon was the use of the word “strange”. I pointed out last time how Everyman is called “strangeman” in Undertale’s game files and how Deltarune’s dialogue uses the word “strange” very deliberately.

What I didn’t touch on was how the word “strange” is used in Undertale. Long story short: it’s used a lot more often than in Deltarune but its usage also feels a lot less deliberate. On the one hand, “strange” is used to refer to important things like Alphys’ Lab, Sans’ room, Toriel already “knowing” humans after a reset, and the broken machine in Sans’ workshop.

[Image transcript: An Undertale screenshot of Frisk staring at a curtain in Sans’ secret room. The narration says “(There’s a strange machine behind the curtain.) (It seems to be broken.)” end image transcript.]

On the other hand, “strange” is also used to refer to more mundane things like sleeping in Toriel’s house, quiet echo flowers, or Mettaton rattling off the features of the game-shaped bomb.

In truth, I don’t think the word “strange” has much meaning when it comes to dialogue in Undertale. However, Everyman is the only sprite in Undertale with the word “strange” in its title. Almost all of the non-dialogue strings with “strange” in their name also relate to Everyman. There are a couple of other strings referring to a “strangetangle,” but I’m not exactly sure what that is.

My personal theory is that Everyman and the True Lab may have been one of the later additions to Undertale’s programming, and by that point Toby had likely written most of the game’s dialogue and didn’t feel the need to retroactively limit the use of the word “strange”. That’s purely my own speculation, of course.

The point still stands that Deltarune uses “strange” in a way that feels much more planned. Unlike Undertale, Deltarune tries to limit “mundane” uses of “strange” as much as possible. I must also reiterate that the first mention of the Knight and the first usage of “strange” in Deltarune is Seam referring to a “strange knight” in bright red letters.

[Image transcript: A Deltarune screenshot of Seam saying “But, recently, a strange knight appeared... And three of the kings were locked away.” end image transcript.]

On the flip side, Toby has gotten a lot more careful with filenames for sprites in Deltarune. There are no sprites named “everyman” or ”strangeman” in Deltarune’s game files, just as there’s no “Gaster” or “mysteryman” either (save for the vessel name flag that restarts the game). The Everyman bullet that appears in Jevil’s fight is simply “spr_carousel”, and the graffiti is part of “bg_alphysalley”. Toby left far fewer secrets in Deltarune’s files than he did in Undertale’s, likely as a conscious effort to avoid spoiling any future reveals.

Revisiting Reaper Bird

Speaking of covering tracks, when writing my previous post I was a little disappointed to find that Reaper Bird’s battle text was something of a dead end for clues. Almost all of the dialogue and flavor text in Reaper Bird’s fight is repurposed text from the Astigmatism, Final Froggit, and Whimsalot fights.

[Image transcript: An Undertale screenshot of the Reaper Bird battle. Reaper Bird has three text bubbles. In order, they say: “Someone finally gets it,” “Ribbit ribbit,” and “Courage...” end image transcript.]

When you think about it, Everyman is the most noteworthy thing about the Reaper Bird fight. Without him, Reaper Bird would be the most forgettable amalgamate. Reaper Bird doesn’t even show up again during the True Pacifist “victory lap” walk-around. Endogeny, Lemon Bread, and Snowdrake’s mother all show up in the overworld and have additional dialogue (or dog noises) with their family members. Reaper Bird and Memoryhead are the only amalgamates never heard from again.

I do think that Reaper Bird and Memoryhead are meant to serve a purpose beyond being general amalgamates. Memoryhead at least has the distinction of being the first amalgamate fought, having the unique “bad memory” item associated with it, and (arguably) being the most mysterious of all the amalgamates due to having no easily-identifiable “component” monster parts.

Still, there are a couple of Reaper Bird tidbits worth pointing out. First is the name: I find it interesting that Everyman has been associated with two different “reaper”-affiliated enemies (i.e., Reaper Bird and Jevil w/ his scythe). It’s also interesting how the artbook shows an early concept for Whimsalot that carries a scythe as well:

[Image transcript: Two entries from the Undertale Artbook. On the left is a spritesheet for Everyman. Beneath it says “spr_strangeman_losinghead.png by Toby Fox. Name: Everyman Description: Just a good guy who shows up on occasion. To the right of this entry is an image of a Whimsalot holding a scythe while wearing a skull mask. Beneath it says “spr_whimsun_reaper.png by Toby Fox. Different idea for Whimsalot.” end image transcript.]

The sprite is even called “whimsun_reaper”. Funny coincidence how Whimsalot’s design was changed to become more knight-like in the end.

While we’re on this page, there’s something I wanted to take another look at:

Madjick and Knight Knight are grouped with Everyman and Whimsalot despite neither of them being represented within the Reaper Bird’s design or dialogue. This page is immediately after a page that shows concepts for Final Froggit and Reaper Bird:

Wouldn’t it make more sense for Everyman to be on the same page as Reaper Bird, rather than being grouped with with Madjick and Knight Knight? The only things that Madjick, Knight Knight, and Whimsalot have in common are (1) they’re Core enemies and (2) they have the strongest “knights and wizards” theming out of all the Core mercenaries. Final Froggit and Astigmatism’s designs are more ambiguous, and the latter isn’t even included in this section of the artbook at all (despite being a component of Reaper Bird!).

Looking at this page, the earlier design for Reaper Bird’s eye-mouth thing does remind me of something...

It’s a somewhat tenuous connection and could just be a coincidence. Then again, Spade King is connected to the Knight and I already made a big deal out of his butterfly-shaped cloak. Interestingly, Spade King never uses his Chain of Justice attack after his cloak flies away and instead resorts to basic spade bullets to put down the Fun Gang. If the cloak was a gift from the Knight, perhaps it was endowed with sort of power that heightened the King’s abilities?

It is odd how the Chain is the only part of the King’s sprite that’s grey instead of black, white, or blue. Lancer’s sprite doesn’t have any grey on it, nor does he have his own “Chain” appendage. As far as I know this shade of grey is not used on any other character. Grey seems to carry a very specific connotation in this series: New Home is entirely in grey, the overworld sprites for the Amalgamates are grey, and Gaster Followers/Goners are associated with the color as well. We don’t fully know what it means yet, but it seems to be significant. Best make a mental note of it, at least.

Creating Reaper Bird

What especially sticks out to me now is Toby’s line above Reaper Bird’s Artbook entry:

“I created Reaper Bird first but I realized it wasn’t creepy enough so I gave it longer legs in-game.”

Now, when Toby says he created Reaper Bird “first”, he doesn’t specify what that “first” is in relation to. Was Reaper Bird the first amalgamate he designed? Or does Toby mean that he designed Reaper Bird “first” and then designed the Core mercenaries afterwards so that they’d fit as “components” of Reaper Bird’s body?

That latter interpretation may seem like a bit of a stretch, but it’s worth noting that Reaper Bird is the only amalgamate shown in the art book whose concept art does not have a step-by-step “breakdown” of how it was created from the designs of its component monsters. Endogeny and Lemon Bread both have full-page spreads showing earlier concepts alongside the regular monsters that make up their components.

What’s especially interesting is the artbook also includes a scrapped “Royal Guard” amalgamate and a page for Snowdrake’s Mom, whose final design only takes inspiration from Snowdrake.

And yet despite the fact that Reaper Bird has one of the most obvious designs in terms of how its components “fit together”, Toby did not show his early design process and instead only shows three frames of Reaper Bird’s idle animation. Assuming Reaper Bird was designed first and the Mercenaries’ designs were created or modified afterward, this would fit with my theory that the Core Mercenaries were deliberately themed around Everyman and his “knighthood”.

Even the design of Reaper Bird itself evokes some traits of Everyman’s design. Namely, both characters are bipedal, both have long necks, both have a beak/proboscis, and both have a single visible eye mounted on the side of their head. That last part stands out the most to me, as every major character in Undertale and Deltarune has forward-mounted eye sockets, like a human would. Even among random encounter enemies and background NPCs it’s a rarity to find wall-eyed characters.

It could just be my over-eager imagination, but the fully-stretched Reaper Bird looks like it even matches Everyman’s proportions to a degree, almost like it’s a skeleton or outline attempting to regain its “true form” out of the cobbled-together mercenary parts.

I said before that Reaper Bird becomes the most “boring” amalgamate without Everyman. In many respects Everyman is the centerpiece of that amalgamate, and by extension he may also be the centerpiece that informed the designs of the Core mercenaries.

If that’s going too far out on a limb, consider how many places and characters in Undertale are connected to Gaster despite the fact he has no real role in the game’s main plot. Sans, Papyrus, the Core, and the True Lab are all “informed” in some way or another by Gaster’s “existence” even though he never properly appears. Is it so unlikely to imagine that another “unseen” character who may be important in Deltarune also had a large impact on aspects of Undertale’s world?

Ice-E’s Odds and “E”nds

Speaking of impact... I don’t really have a segue lined up, so let’s talk about Ice-E’s instead. In my last post I brought up the idea of Everyman being one of the Ice-E’s employees that we see in Hometown. The bulk of my analysis focused on The Warrior, but I neglected to talk about the other unknown mascot: the “purple guy”.

In truth, there’s not a whole lot to this character. He only has one line of dialogue and he seems to be a deliberate reference to the “purple guy” from Five Nights at Freddy’s. Still, he’s just as mysterious as The Warrior and could very well have a larger role to play in the full game.

Interestingly, the purple guy’s sprite is named “icemascot_fake” in Deltarune’s files, whereas Burgerpants and the Nice Cream Bunny are “icemascot1″ and “icemascot2″, respectively. This fits with Burgerpants’ line where he questions whether the purple guy “even works here”.

[Image transcript: Two Deltarune screenshots side-by-side. Both feature Kris talking to Burgerpants in Hometown. On the left, Burgerpants says “Purple Guy - Man, THAT GUY, you gotta...” and on the right he continues, saying “... actually, does that guy even work here?” end image transcript.]

The purple guy is also the only Ice-E’s mascot whose costume’s body doesn’t match the color of the costume’s head.

His colors do match the Everyman/Ice-E graffiti, though. Judging from his “fake” costume, he’s apparently some sort of Ice-E’s fanatic who made his own Ice-E’s getup and pretended to work there. I’m not sure how that would tie into the Knight’s motivations, if at all, but it certainly fits the bill for being “strange”.

Ice-E’s is apparently strange and creepy enough in-universe to inspire urban legends about it

But Kris was only kidding, right?

Getting back to Ice-E’s as a brand, it’s interesting how the company focuses on the letter “E”, inserting it into the word p”e”zza and other places where it doesn’t belong.

[Image transcript: A Deltarune screenshot of Burgerpants saying “Ice E’s P’E’ZZA, You’re number ‘1′ Spot for a piping hot pe’E’ce of PEZZA.” end image transcript.]

Could the focus on “E” be pointing towards “E”veryman’s involvement? Eh, mayb”E”.

Something that was pointed out to me by gantaloupe on Reddit: In the Core we see two branching paths: the sage’s path and the warrior’s path.

[Image transcript: An Undertale screenshot of Frisk reading a sign in the Core. The sign says “(North, the warrior’s path.) (West, the sage’s path.) (Any path leads to The End.)” end image transcript.]

While this could just be a coincidence, it’s an interesting factoid in light of how Everyman is connected to the Core mercenaries and possibly connected to a character named “The Warrior” in Deltarune.

One last thing that I noticed is how Everyman’s bullet sprite and the Ice-E’s costumes both have nubby arms and legs without any defined fingers or toes. Everyman’s body and Ice-E’s head would fit together like a glove. It would certainly be easier to picture one of the mascots abstracted into Everyman’s bullet design rather than, say, Gaster or Father Alvin. Speaking of which...

A Deeper Look into Father Alvin

Father Alvin kinda got the short end of the stick in my previous post when I said he was “less likely” to be Everyman than one of the Ice-E’s employees. I still hold that opinion, but that doesn’t mean he’s not worth exploring further.

One thing that I glossed over was the topic of Alvin’s potential connection to Gerson. Now, there’s nothing in chapter 1 that outright says Gerson and Alvin are related, but it’s easy to intuit based on the fact that they’re the only two turtle monsters that we see in the series. Both characters are connected to Hometown’s school, and one could infer that Alvin’s drawing in the supply closet could be a drawing of Gerson rather than a self-portrait.

[Image transcript: Two Deltarune screenshots side-by-side. Both feature Kris looking at a drawing on a cabinet in the unused classroom. In the left screenshot, the narration says “(It’s a yellowed, poorly-drawn picture of a green turtle.)” The right screenshot continues: “(It’s signed ‘Alvin’.)” end image transcript.]

Gerson himself seems to have no connection to the Knight’s machinations, and it’d be difficult to imagine otherwise since he’s, y’know, dead. Still, it is eerie how Gerson was the only character in Undertale who provided any information on the deltarune symbol and now he’s “conveniently” absent from Deltarune’s narrative.

[Image transcript: An Undertale screenshot of Gerson saying “That’s the Delta Rune, the emblem of our kingdom.” end image transcript.]

Instead we have a different turtle character who also makes mention of an “angel” like Gerson did.

[Image transcript: A Deltarune screenshot of Kris talking to Father Alvin. Alvin says “Let the Angel’s power light your way.” end image transcript.]

We don’t know much about Alvin yet, but the impression I get from him is that he’s Gerson’s opposite--mild-mannered, patient, and more interested in divine matters than history or research. Alvin also shows reverence for the Angel, capitalizing the name, whereas Gerson uses the term “angel” with quotation marks and treats it as a quaint curiosity.

[Image transcript: Two side-by-side Undertale screenshots of Gerson talking. In the left screenshot, he says “Most people say it’s the ‘angel,’ from the prophecy...” The right screenshot Gerson says: “I jus’ think it looks neat! Wahaha!” end image transcript.]

Getting back to Alvin’s drawing, it was pointed out to me that Alvin’s green turtle drawing and the drawing of three people smiling in Sans’ lab are both described as “poorly drawn” by the narration.

[Image transcript: Two side-by-side Undertale screenshots of Frisk in Sans’ secret room. In the left screenshot, the narration says “(It’s a poorly drawn picture of three smiling people.) (Written on it...)” The right screenshot continues: “don’t forget.” end image transcript.]

This may sound minor, but these are the only instances where the descriptor “poorly drawn” is used in either game. It’s also significant because the drawing of three smiling people only shows up when Frisk talks to Clamgirl, who mentions “Suzy” and is eventually revealed to be a goner/Gaster follower. This means both drawings are tied to Deltarune’s world.

I’m not entirely sure what the significance of the drawings is, since we still don’t know for certain who the three smiling people are or which green turtle is in Alvin’s drawing. If Alvin is the Knight, I could see him using drawings to attempt to bring specific types of darkners to life with the dark fountains he pulls out of the earth. In the case of the turtle drawing, maybe he was hoping to bring Gerson back as a darkner by recreating his likeness?

In Deltarune we’ve already seen a possible darkner “counterpart” to a lightner in the form of Ralsei, so maybe the idea of “recreating” lightners as darkner doppelgangers will be explored further in the full game? Chapter 1′s dark world was in the school and Gerson was a teacher there before he passed away. Chapter 2 seems poised to take place in a hospital dark world, and we see Rudy in a poor state of health at the hospital just prior to chapter 2. It’s too early to tell, but maybe these “holy” fountains and darkner doppelgangers are the Knight’s idea of bringing about life after death, or an “angel’s heaven,” if you will.

It goes without saying that my ideas of the Knight’s motives are purely speculative, but one last note I’ll leave on is how Gerson is mentioned an awful lot in Deltarune, more so than he was in Undertale. Gerson’s name is also one of the names that triggers a special response in the vessel creation sequence. Seems like an awful lot of attention for a “dead” character with no further role to play in the story, and remember what I said earlier about repeated character foreshadowing. All I’m saying is, don’t be too surprised if we meet a darkner by the name of “Snorge” or “Resong” or “Goners” or--hmm... Goners...

Heroes of the Dark, Villains of the Light

Now’s as good a time as any to bring up something I and a lot of others have noticed: Deltarune’s heroes are dark. Ralsei is a prince from the dark with horns, Susie is a bully described as a “dark knight” in one of her equip screen titles, and Kris is described by some Hometown residents as “creepy,” to say nothing of how Chapter 1 ends. Others in the fandom have pointed out how Deltarune’s battle system places Kris & co on the left side of the screen, in contrast to many classic JRPGs where the heroes are positioned on the right side of the screen.

On the other end of things, Ralsei’s prophecy refers to the “heroes of legend” sealing the “holy” dark fountains in order to “banish the Angel’s heaven”. That doesn’t really sound like a typical “heroic” goal. There’s also the speculation that sealing Card Castle’s fountain may have had negative repercussions for the Castle’s inhabitants. I’m not saying this to argue that the fun gang is somehow “evil”, but merely to point out that they have the trappings of darkness.

Angels, on the other hand, are typically associated with light and goodness, and we know that Alvin serves the angel (whether this is solely in an abstract/religious way or in a more direct way remains to be seen). We know that sealing dark fountains somehow relates to banishing the Angel’s heaven, so it’s not a stretch to assume that the Knight is in league with the Angel due to his desire to create fountains.

I already entertained the idea of the Knight and the Angel working together in my last post, but something else that ties into this is Toby’s refrain of describing Everyman as “just a good guy that shows up on occasion.” He uses this description in the Everyman tweet as well as Everyman’s entry in the Undertale art book. It’s clearly meant to be a significant phrase.

[Image transcript: On the left is a Twitter thread by Toby. On the right is an excerpt from the Undertale Artbook featuring a spritesheet of Everyman. In both images, Toby writes “Everyman. Description: Just a good guy who shows up on occasion.” end image transcript.]

We can infer that the Knight will be a major antagonist going forward, and I’ve already argued that Everyman is the Knight, so this paints the picture of a Knight with good intentions--a “Knight in shining armor,” if you will. This could be another argument in favor of Alvin being Everyman/the Knight, since he at least tries to project the image of piety and fits this theme of "holy” villains to contrast the “dark” heroes.

Now that I think about it, a “villain” like that would be an interesting inversion from the likes of Flowey--instead of an antagonist who’s trying to kill people, we have an antagonist who threatens to smother the entire world with the unchecked new life he’s creating. His actions at Card Castle show that he doesn’t go out of his way to kill, given that the three kings were kept alive as prisoners, but we also see how his actions enabled an evil King to abuse his power in the name of protecting his “holy” fountain.

While Flowey illustrated the lesson of “don’t kill and don’t be killed,” perhaps this Knight would be meant to show the dark side of appeasement and how “good intentions” only get you so far? The Spade King definitely comes off as a subversion of the typical “don’t fight!” approach of Undertale, and if Alvin is the Knight then he might push that “lesson” further going forward.

Still, for every champion of the light there is one who waits in the dark...

A New Challenger Approaches!

That’s right, there’s a third Knight candidate to cover. I’m sure some of you have been eagerly awaiting this one, so give it up for...

spr_normalnpc!

Ok, in all seriousness a couple of people wanted me to talk about this character who shows up in the Hometown Library. Their name isn’t given in-game and they’re simply known as “spr_normalnpc” in the game files. As of right now their only purpose is to block Kris from visiting the upstairs floor of the Library.

[Image transcript: Two side-by-side Deltarune screenshots of Kris talking to Normalnpc in the Library. In the left image, Normalnpc says “I love reading books. Especially the books upstairs. You should really.” before finishing in the right image, saying “Read them!” end image transcript.]

As far as we can tell, this character is the Deltarune counterpart to the elusive Gaster Follower 3 from Undertale.

Not all of the character design details line up, but both characters cut a similar silhouette and that’s good enough for me.

After my initial Everyman theory post, I’ve been asked whether I think normalnpc might be Everyman/the Knight. I never gave it much thought before now, so let me start with the points in this character’s favor:

Normalnpc shares some of Everyman’s basic design traits, namely a beak/proboscis, a single eye visible on the side of their head, and a long neck

“Normalnpc” and “Everyman” are both such generic names that they immediately arouse suspicion

Normalnpc acts “strange,” repeating placeholder-ish dialogue about reading books while simultaneously blocking you from going upstairs

Normalnpc maintains a positive tone, making them a “good guy”...?

Both characters are connected to Gaster, maybe?

Ok, look, I’m not saying that Normalnpc can’t be Everyman, but there’s very little to work with here besides the general design, the name, and vague Gaster connections. And even then, I’d say Normalnpc’s and Everyman’s designs have too many differences for my liking. While some of the basic features are there, their silhouettes, proportions, and stance/posture are all completely different.

Another complication is the fact that Normalnpc’s “goner” counterpart already exists in Undertale, and I said last time that Everyman would have to be a character who isn’t seen elsewhere in Undertale because he was busy being stuck inside Reaper Bird.

On the other hand, we do see goner counterparts for characters that already exist in Undertale, as is the case with Gaster Followers 1 and 2 (for the sake of simplicity I’m assuming that Gaster followers are the same thing as “goners”).

But I’m not sure whether these “goners” are meant to be alternate “versions” of these specific characters or whether they’re just other members of the same “species” as their counterparts.

Monster Kid and Goner Kid, for example, have many differences in their designs, including different shirts, different spine arrangements, and slightly different facial features.

Clamgirl muddies things even further, undergoing a total transformation when she “becomes” Gonerclam. This raises the questions of what causes someone to “become” a goner as well as how and why their bodies change in ways beyond just turning grey.

So far we’ve seen instances of goners coexisting alongside their “originals,” like with the two Monster Kids, but we’ve also seen Clamgirl get “replaced” by her goner by becoming one. Based on our limited and seemingly-contradictory knowledge of how goners work, I can’t even say for certain whether Normalnpc’s presence in Undertale would be accounted for or not with the existence of Gaster Follower 3.

And that’s kind of the problem with Normalnpc as an Everyman suspect: we know far too little. Father Alvin and the Ice-E’s employees each have a smoking gun that makes them likely Everyman candidates: in Alvin’s case it’s the drawing in the closet, and for Ice-E’s it’s the graffiti plus the Warrior’s hospital stay potentially lining up with Chapter 2′s setting. The best things Normalnpc has going for them are a vague resemblance and having a more obvious (yet vague) connection to Gaster, the latter of which is hardly a unique thing in this setting.

Moreover, there’s nothing that specifically ties Normalnpc to being the Knight other than through Everyman, and the “connection” between Normalnpc and Everyman is already tenuous. Alvin is independently connected to the Knight by virtue of leaving his drawing as a “calling card” in an area the Knight has recently been. The Warrior’s roleplaying shtick would make him a natural fit among a “swords and sorcery” setting that the Knight evokes. Of the three candidates, Normalnpc definitely has the weakest claim to Knighthood.

That all being said, Normalnpc is still a character to keep an eye on. The name alone comes off as Toby hiding a secret in plain sight. Even if this character doesn’t wind up being Everyman or the Knight, I’m sure their role will be bigger than that of a mere NPC.

Gaster’s Connection to the Knight

Now for the moment you’ve really been waiting for! Truthfully, a lot of this is Gaster stuff that I wanted to talk about last time but didn’t have room to fit in.

I made clear in my last post that I favored Everyman being the Knight over Gaster being the Knight, though the two could be interchangeable in the event that the Knight has a “strange son” working alongside him (which is a prospect I still can’t fully commit to).

Still, a lot of Deltarune speculators have latched onto the idea of Gaster being the Knight. Near as I can tell, here’s the evidence:

Both characters are associated with darkness

Seam, who’s familiar with the Knight, uses the Entry 17 phrase “darker, yet darker” in reference to the “strange someone” Jevil met (who may be the Knight)

Jevil says “THE HAND OF THE KNIGHT IS DRIFTING FORWARD”, and Gaster is associated with hands

Gaster is believed to be the “man” who gives Kris an egg. The word “EGG”, in all-caps wingdings, is written as three hands pointing in the “L-shaped” movement pattern of a knight piece in chess

I can see how this evidence would be compelling, especially in the absence of any competing theory for the Knight’s identity. I can’t refute all of this, aside from saying that the “darkness” association is overly broad in a game where half the cast are darkners and the “EGG” thing, while neat, could be a coincidence. I do think this evidence could point to Gaster being connected to the Knight, but I have two main reasons for believing he isn’t the Knight himself.

First off, I don’t think Gaster’s goals align with the Knight’s. For this argument I’m going to assume that the mysterious voice from Deltarune’s intro, game over screen, and pre-release Twitter takeover is Gaster. Gaster, at least nominally, seems to be on the same side as the red soul, or is at least willing to work with them. The fun gang’s goal of sealing the dark fountains would almost certainly put them at odds with the Knight, if the Spade King’s reaction was anything to go by.

When you get a game over and continue, “Gaster” says “THE FUTURE IS IN YOUR HANDS”.

While he doesn’t urge you to continue like Asgore does during Undertale’s game over, he certainly doesn’t discourage it either. When you refuse to continue, Gaster says “THEN THE WORLD WAS COVERED IN DARKNESS” and the melancholic song “Darkness Falls” plays.

One could argue that Gaster is trying to maintain objectivity or “neutrality” when the red soul dies, like a scientist would in an experiment.

Nonetheless, I would imagine that if Gaster was the Knight then he would be adamantly opposed to anyone who threatened his creation. Ralsei mentions that the prophecy of legend was foretold by “time and space”, and Gaster is said to have shattered across time and space.

[Image transcript: Two side-by-side Deltarune screenshots of Ralsei talking to Kris and Susie. In the left image Ralsei says “A LEGEND that one day, two HEROIES of LIGHT will arrive.” In the right image he says “And fulfill the ancient prophecy, foretold by time and space.” end image transcript.]

It would be odd for the Knight to deliver a prophecy that predicts the undoing of his own handiwork, and then deliver that prophecy to a prince who would assemble the heroes to do just that.

Creating a New Future

I want to touch a bit more on Gaster’s use of the word “future”. He also made mention of this during the Undertale Twitter account’s takeover just before Deltarune Chapter 1 released:

[Image transcript: A Tweet from the official Undertale Twitter account, dated the day of Deltarune Chapter 1′s release, saying in all-caps “I LOOK FORWARD TO CREATING A NEW FUTURE WITH YOU.” end image transcript.]

For whatever reason and through whatever means, Gaster wants to help the red soul create a new future. Choosing to continue from a Game Over causes Gaster to reiterate this goal, while the “opposite” of that, i.e. giving up, is seen as allowing the world to be covered in darkness. This implies that the “future” Gaster wants to create is one where darkness isn’t running amok. Even if Gaster is trying to remain neutral or merely observe, it still sounds like he prefers for the fun gang to prevail.

All this emphasis on the word “future” reminds me of something from the Reaper Bird fight...

[Image transcript: An Undertale screenshot of Reaper Bird’s check text description, stating “REAPER BIRD - ATK ?? DEF ?? This relentless future finally looks brighter and brighter.” end image transcript.]

Now, this check text is a combination of the three check texts for Astigmatism, Final Froggit, and Whimsalot. To wit:

[Image transcript: Three Undertale enemy check text descriptions arranged from top to bottom. In order they say “ASTIGMATISM - ATK 32 DEF 26 This relentless bully ALWAYS gets its way. FINAL FROGGIT 7 ATK 2 DEF Its future looks brighter and brighter. WHIMSALOT - ATK 34 DEF 12 It finally stopped worrying.” end image transcript.]

But as I said before, Reaper Bird may have been designed first and then “informed” the designs of the Core Mercenaries afterwards, and that could hold true for their check text as well.

I find this use of the phrase “relentless future” interesting. A “relentless” future could mean one that’s inevitable or predetermined, and the phrase “finally looks brighter and brighter” could signify that the future has finally changed for the better. Gaster’s goal seems to be to create a “new” future, which would imply an outcome different from a “predetermined” future where your choices don’t matter, which is a running theme in Deltarune. I don’t think Gaster would describe the future as being “created” by people or “in your hands” if he felt that choice was an illusion.

This isn’t the first time that Gaster has been associated with unpredictability or defiance of “fate”. Most Gaster-related events in Undertale were tied with the fun value, a randomly-generated number that changed with each playthrough. Although this mechanic had little impact on the story, it did give each playthrough a greater sense of identity and made events less set-in-stone.

Now, compare this “optimistic” interpretation of Gaster to the “strange someone” that Jevil met.

[Image transcript: Two side-by-side Deltarune screenshots of Seam talking. The left image says “One day, he met a strange someone... and since then, he began to change.” The right end image continues, saying “ Soon, he began to see the world as a game, and everyone as its participants.” end image transcript.]

Seam says that Jevil began to see the world as a “game” and everyone as its “participants,” which doesn’t imply a lot of agency. This mindset is a big red flag when we remember how Flowey viewed others when he saw them as part of a “game.”

[Image transcript: Two side-by-side Undertale screenshots. The left one shows Flowey tying Frisk’s friends, saying “This is all just a GAME.” The right image shows Flowey talking in New Home, saying “Sets of numbers... Lines of dialogue... I’ve seen them all.” end image transcript.]

Seam’s own view of the world becomes “darker, yet darker” after talking to Jevil, and Seam asks “would I have found a little more purpose in my life...?” if not for the experience of locking up Jevil (and, presumably, the experience of listening to Jevil’s words).

[Image transcript: Four Deltarune screenshots arranged in a grid, all featuring Seam talking. From beginning to end the four images say “Since that time, the strange words he’s said have stuck inside my cotton... And my view of this world has become darker, yet darker. And I wonder, if I hadn’t been asked to lock him up... Would I have found a little more purpose in my life...?” end image transcript.]

In order to understand what “darker, yet darker” truly means, we need to view the line in its original context:

ENTRY NUMBER SEVENTEEN

DARK DARKER YET DARKER

THE DARKNESS KEEPS GROWING

THE SHADOWS CUTTING DEEPER

PHOTON READINGS NEGATIVE

THIS NEXT EXPERIMENT

SEEMS

VERY

INTERESTING

...

WHAT DO YOU TWO THINK?

The phrase “darker, yet darker” originally referred to something that Gaster was observing in Entry Number 17. Although the phrase has come to be associated with Gaster, it doesn’t necessarily refer to something that he’s causing or wants to happen--part of a scientist’s job is to observe and comment on results as they unfold, after all. And the “interesting” experiment Gaster refers to is something that’s happening “next”, which implies that the experiment is happening after or in response to whatever is causing things to become darker, yet darker. It also suggests that he’s not calling the “darker, yet darker” event itself “interesting”.

The impression that I get from all this is that Deltarune is meant to be a struggle against inevitability, with Gaster seemingly in the “choices matter” corner of the conflict. If the Knight is the “strange someone” Jevil met then that would imply that he’s very much on the opposite end of that spectrum. If, for example, somebody like Father Alvin is the Knight then I could see him rationalizing his position as fulfilling “fate” pre-ordained by the Angel. In this dynamic, the Knight would serve as an agent of faith and order to oppose Gaster as an agent of science and invention, further tying into the “dark heroes vs. holy villains” theme I posited earlier.

Okay, phew, that was all the first reason why I don’t think Gaster is the Knight. As for the second reason? Well...

Gaster is (Probably) a Darkner

Boy, that’s sure a loaded title, isn’t it? I made an offhand remark about this in my original post but didn’t want to get into it there. I only bring it up now because I previously argued that the Knight is a lightner and that would rule out darkner characters from filling the role.

So, why do I think Gaster is a darkner? Well, part of the reason is because I think that Sans is a darkner as well. Two Left Thumbs’ "Sans is a Darkner” video is probably the most accessible way to understand the theory, but there are several posts about it on Tumblr already if you look hard enough. Either way it’s not required viewing in order to understand my arguments for Gaster, but long story short there’s a lot of evidence to suggest Sans is a darkner and it’s strongly implied that Sans and Gaster are related (if not by blood then through other means), which makes it likely for Gaster to be a darkner as well.

Aside from the Sans connection, another reason I think Gaster is a darkner is due to the line about him being “shattered across time and space.”

[Image transcript: Two side-by-side Undertale screenshots of Frisk talking to Gaster Follower 2 in Hotland. Follower 2 says “Alphys might work faster, but the old Royal Scientist, Doctor W.D. Gaster? They say he shattered across time and space.” end image transcript.]

We can infer from Deltarune that, for whatever reason, darkners are more difficult to kill than monsters due to Deltarune’s enemies all being unkillable. Whether this is an inherent trait of darkners or some “rule” of the dark world or Deltarune’s universe is unclear, but given that defeating Sans doesn’t contribute towards your kill counter in Undertale, there’s a strong likelihood that darkners are difficult to kill, if not outright impossible.

So how is this relevant? Well, it seems like a darkner would be far more likely to survive being “shattered across time and space” than a monster. When a monster’s body is broken apart it means they’ve either turned to dust or will soon, but the fact that “pieces” of Gaster persist (as seen with Gaster Follower 2) implies that he’s made of something sturdier than dust.

[Image transcript: Two side-by-side Undertale screenshots of Frisk talking to Gaster Follower 2 in Hotland. Follower 2 says “Ha ha... How can I say so without fear? I’m holding a piece of him right here.” end image transcript.]

Not only do I believe that Gaster is a darkner, but I’m pretty confident that I know what “kind” of darkner he is. Most of the darkners we’ve seen in chapter 1 can be linked to real-world objects that exist in the Hometown school’s supply closet. While we don’t know what objects (if any) were used to create Ralsei or (possibly) Sans, at most those two are exceptions to the otherwise-universal rule that darkners come from inanimate objects. In Gaster’s case there’s definitely an object that’s associated with him:

Gaster the Egghead

[Image transcript: A Deltarune screenshot of Kris hidden behind a tree. The narration says “(You received an Egg.)” end image transcript.]

In Scarlet Forest “a man” gives an egg to Kris before vanishing, much like how “Mysteryman” vanishes in Undertale. The song that plays during this scene is called “man” in the game files and sounds a lot like Gaster’s theme. The egg itself exhibits strange dimensional properties, reappearing when used, prompting the narration “what egg?” when you try to get rid of it, and becoming two eggs when put into Asgore’s fridge.

When Kris leaves the dark world at the end of chapter 1, their inventory turns into a “ball of junk”, i.e. the real-world objects that were given new form by the dark fountain.

[Image transcript: A Deltarune screenshot of the inventory menu open in Hometown. The only two items are “Ball of Junk” and “Egg” end image transcript.]

The egg is the only other object that remains after chapter 1, implying that it’s a “real” egg and that the egg itself is not a byproduct of the dark world like the dark candies and other items are.

The fact that the “man” disappears when he hands you the egg implies that his presence or “form” is somehow contingent upon the act of giving you the egg. If Gaster is a darkner, if he’s “the man”, and if his form is based on an egg then it makes perfect sense why he’d disappear in that moment--he’s turning back into an egg and surrendering his “true form” (or a piece of it) to you for safe keeping. Given that Gaster seemingly wants you to seal dark fountains, it would make sense that he’d want to hitch a ride out of the closet’s dark world before its fountain goes caput.

This isn’t the only time we see mentions of eggs in Undertale and Deltarune:

[Image transcript: An Undertale screenshot of Papyrus’ dating HUD. On the left is a small white egg, labeled “EGG.” end image transcript.]

Papyrus (who’s connected to Sans and likely Gaster as well) has a conspicuous “egg” on his dating HUD.

[Image transcript: Two side-by-side Undertale screenshots of Frisk talking to a Temmie in Temmie Village. In the left image, Temmie says “tem... WATCH EGG!!!” In the right image, the narration says “(It’s hard-boiled.)” end image transcript.]

In Undertale, one of the Temmies is watching over a hard-boiled egg. However, in Deltarune we see a Temmie with a very different kind of egg.

[Image transcript: A Deltarune screenshot of Kris examining an egg on Temmie’s desk in their classroom. The narration says “(It’s a black-and-white hardboiled egg.)” end image transcript.]

Specifically, it’s described as a “black and white” egg. Needless to say, that’s an odd way to describe an egg. Not all eggs have white shells, but most people wouldn’t describe a white-shelled egg as “black and white”. Of course, we know someone who’s also “black and white”.

[Image transcript: An Undertale screenshot of Mysteryman in his grey room.” end image transcript.]

And he’s “black and white” in the very literal sense. Unlike the Gaster followers, Mysteryman solely uses pure black and pure white in his color palette, and he’s one of the only characters with an all black-and-white overworld sprite. Note also how Mysterman’s head is vaguely egg-shaped and has lines resembling cracks.

Out of all the objects that I could imagine a darkner being made from, an egg is one that I could picture “shattering” like Gaster did while still leaving some small pieces scattered around. I’m not sure whether this would be a “real” egg or a similarly-fragile facsimile like a Faberge egg--either could work in this scenario.

What are Skeletons, Anyway?

“Now wait,” some of you might be saying, “isn’t Gaster supposed to be a skeleton?” Well, I don’t think Gaster being a skeleton is mutually exclusive from Gaster being based on an egg. Egg shells are made of calcium carbonate, one of the mineral components that make up bones.

We see in Deltarune that darkners’ forms in the dark world don’t have to match their “true” forms completely. Pretty much all of the darkners based on playing cards are abstractions that barely resemble a rectangular card. And while we don’t know what Ralsei’s “true” form is (if he has one), it’s very unlikely that he’s a small goat with a hat and scarf in the light world. If Sans is a darkner then there’s also the possibility that his “true form” isn’t a skeleton either.

The rules of the dark world and its inhabitants aren’t entirely clear, so in spite of my arguments I can’t say with certainty that Gaster is a darkner because I can’t even say with certainty that Sans is a darkner, despite him having much stronger evidence supporting that conclusion.

As compelling as Sans’ case is, it still invites questions like how he’s able to exist in Hometown without the apparent aid of a dark fountain, or why Papyrus turns to dust in Undertale despite being Sans’ “brother”. Similar concerns crop up with Gaster in light of his connections-by-proxy with Papyrus and his implied presence in the mysterious Hometown shed.

I still think the possibility of Gaster and Sans being darkners is one worth discussing and it’s a possibility that many fans are sleeping on. Moreover, it’d be fittingly poetic if Deltarune’s main conflict was engineered by a lightner trying to spread darkness and a darkner trying to seal away the darkness.

Conclusion

So this ended up being a lot longer than I originally planned--almost as long as my original Everyman post!

A lot of what I’ve said here is meant to provide further context and elaboration to my earlier theories, but I admit that some of this was pure speculation, namely in regards to Gaster/the Knight’s motivations and the “dark heroes vs. holy villains” theming.

While a good argument should have evidence to back it up, at the end of the day a work of fiction is still a story and is governed by the conventions of storytelling much more than it is by logic or the laws of physical science. This is one reason why I lean so heavily on Toby’s use of foreshadowing, since it’s a narrative tool he’s leveraged consistently in the past.

My attempts to second-guess the motivations of unseen characters and chart the plot’s trajectory would be downright conspiratorial if I were talking about some real-world event, but Detlarune is a story and stories have to go places. A well-written story doesn’t take the time to set up or foreshadow certain characters or exposition if it doesn’t plan to pay off that setup down the road.

Normally I wouldn’t make theory posts this long and esoteric about a work of fiction, since a large amount of writing consists of revision, retcons, and changing things as you go along. Undertale and Deltarune are partial exceptions to this rule in no small part due to Toby planning Deltarune before he began Undertale and planting many “seeds” referencing Deltarune in Undertale’s narrative as a result.

A lot of my conclusions haven’t significantly changed since my previous post: I still believe Everyman will appear again in the full game, I think he’s the character most likely to be the Knight, and I think the most likely Everyman candidates are the Ice-E’s employees and Father Alvin, in that order.

As far as which of my conclusions have changed, I’m now more apprehensive of the idea of the Knight having a “strange son” and of Gaster being the Knight himself. I still can’t discount either possibility entirely, however. I was always shaky about the “strange son” and I often went back and forth on it, but further probing Gaster’s motivations has made me far less convinced that he could be the Knight or in league with him. I’m sure there’s still a connection between both characters, like a shared origin or some past falling out that they had, but I no longer think that they would be on the same side.

Another thing I’ve (sort of) changed my mind on is that the “purple guy” Ice-E’s employee and Normalnpc have both risen in prominence in my eyes. I don’t know if I’d put either of them down as top candidates to be Everyman or the Knight, but something is definitely up with them and I’m sure Toby has plans for them in the future.

Deltarune is shaping up to be a much longer game than Undertale, likely following the mold of traditional RPGs whose stories span several hours. In the time that it would take to play through Deltarune’s story, we may see narrative payoffs to every loose thread and Everyman candidate I’ve brought up. If the identity of the Knight is meant to be a mystery then some candidates might even be deliberate red herrings set up by Toby. Who can say? We’ll just have to wait and find out.

I closed my previous Everyman post by remarking that I had said all that I can on this topic and hopefully this time I mean it. I can’t really think of much else to say about Everyman until Toby releases more information himself, and that’s not likely to happen until the next Undertale anniversary or Deltarune’s full release.

As I said before, my main goal with all this is to spark conversation within the fandom on what is an otherwise under-discussed topic. I might still make other theory posts in the future, but for now I think I’ve bled this topic dry.

#deltarune #undertale #gaster #everyman #undertale theory

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mythicaldemigoddess-of-deltarune · 3 years

Text

The Theory About Steven, Pink-Steven And Their Mom

I was originally going to sign back on later after talking about well the other stuff I had posted and I wanted to wait to post the talk about the theory about Steven, Pink-Steven and Rose.

I first wanted to sign back in to edit one of the tags in the last post I had posted before I sign out, but then I decided to talk about the theory about Steven.

okay first of all we know the Crossover theory

about Sans and Steven being one and the same.

and Steven Quartz Universe spells out “Sans”

and it is possible that while one version of Steven never became Sans,

such as a version that lived in the Deltarune Timeline, and the Sans we see in that game might very well be a version of Steven that became Sans and is from the Undertale Genocide Timeline, that never had a neutral or pacifist run.

and Sans, his little brother and the rest of the survivors of that non-stop geno timeline had to escape into the Deltarune Timeline.

where there was another him, but the him that was born there was still Steven and never became a Sans.

anyway back to the theory about Steven, Pink-Steven and Rose.

even if it is said that Rose gave up her form to bring Steven into the world,

but what if that is only half true, we know that Pink-Steven

when he was reforming, he first appeared as Pink Diamond, Then Rose Quartz and lastly as Steven.

I believe that Pink-Steven might really be a Fragment from Rose,

when a soul is fragmented, it is likely to become a new being, one that isn’t 100% the same as their soul-parent.

we know that Rose has lied before, and she even kept what she did to Spinel a secret from the rest of the Crystal Gems.

I believe that Pink-Steven saying that she’s Gone, has more meaning than just her being “dead” and he might know what really happen to her.

in theory when Rose was still pregnant with Steven,

she secretly made another Pink Diamond that she put inside herself

and let it bond to Steven, then she fragmented a part of herself and place it in the New Pink Diamond that would be part of Steven.

then once again Rose fakes her death, and went to parts unknown.

maybe she could of escape to the Dark World in the Deltarune Timeline.

I do have another theory about the Dark World, that it might be the very place that Gaster was lost through Time and Space in.

we know that in the Chapter 1, when Susie and Kris got back there was no one at school and it was just them.

and Toriel calls when Kris is about to leave the school.

it is a theory, but it is possible when Kris and Susie entered that world...

their existence was forgotten, like at first they would be remembered,

and those who have been to the Dark World (or Dark Worlds) like them

will be able to be immune to the whole forgetting their existence.

so it is possible while Kris and Susie go back to Dark World,

and a hour passes when they are still there,

the only ones who will be able to remember them and freakout about everyone forgetting them....would be Noelle and Berdly.

since those two had ended up in the Cyber-Dark World.

they might end up becoming immune to the effects the Dark World/Void.

if Berdly asks whats taking Susie and Kris so long,

I would imagine that everyone (but Noelle) would look at him like he was crazy and wondering who are Kris and Susie.

so yeah I believe that the Dark World, might be the Void.

and it has the ability to cause those outside it, to get amnesia of a person who enters that world....

the only way someone from the outside can remember, is if they been to that place before and were able to escape.

back to the talk about Steven, if Steven becomes Sans in one of the possible ways....either being resurrected or reincarnation.

the half that is Pink-Steven would still end up existing,

both halves being cleaved.

if Steven ended up having his age flux dangerously while he was in the middle of dying, then at his last moments he could of ended up becoming a baby.

and Gaster could of found the Baby Sans and ended up becoming his new dad.

or Steven could of been reborn as Gaster’s son, there can be different theories on how Steven becomes Sans.

but no matter the theories,

he would always end up becoming the big brother to Papyrus.

if Steven did become a Baby again, and became Baby Sans.

his memories of his past with his Ex-Dad, Connie and the Crystal Gems.

might not resurface until a few years later, maybe not until after Papyrus was born.

I know not all fans will agree, but it is possible that Pink-Steven isn’t just a reincarnation of Pink/Rose, and might just be a fragment from her that she placed into a new pink diamond she created and had it bond to her human child, that she and Greg would either name Steven or Nora.

Pink-Steven yelling out that “She’s Gone” might have more meaning,

like he knew she didn’t “die” or just retreated into the gem she gave to Steven.

I believe the Pink Diamond that Steven has, is truly his and was possibly made by Rose and Pink-Steven was a creation of hers by taking a fragment of her consciousness light and placing the very small fragment into the newly created Pink Diamond.

if that were true, that would mean that Rose is still alive and hiding.

and she made her friends, Greg and her own Son believe she had truly gave up her physical form and she gave her life to bring Steven into the world.

only Pink-Steven, the other half of Steven would know this very big secret.

it’s okay that not all fans agree about this theory being possibly true.

and it’s alright that no one agrees about the dark world we see in Deltarune,

is really the void that makes others outside it, forget those who enter it.

but it would explain why no one was truly worried about Susie and Kris when they didn’t come back to class for hours.

and the only time they did show worry, was when they came back from the dark world and everyone remembered their existence.

it is possible that Susie, Kris and maybe some of the Darkners/Tulpa

have no idea that the Dark World makes those outside it forget a person’s existence and the only way to undo it is if they return.

I’m gonna stick to my headcanon theory, that has to do with how before the Player/Red Soul ended up using Kris as a vessel.

the Knight had taken over Kris at some point, and would get them into trouble and even did some dangerous pranks, like with the ferris wheel.

the purpose we have in the game, is to free Kris from Knight and have them bond with others and form strong friendships.

but if we choose to go down the Geno Path, we end up becoming partners with Knight.

I had to watch clips from Chapter 2 to find out certain stuff that I missed when finally being able to play it myself.

I believe that the Ralsei we meet in Chapter 2, is not the same one we first meet in Chapter 1, and the real fluffy prince is in imprisoned and the Ralsei we meet in Chapter 2 is trying to fool us into believing they are the one we befriended before.

I know a lot of fans might of wondered if Ralsei is hiding a dark secret.

and it turning out that he is the bad guy, but that might only be half true.

the Ralsei in Chapter 2 might turn out to be secretly a bad guy who is working for the Knight.

but as for the Ralsei in Chapter 1, he could turn out to truly care about Kris and knows that the Player/Red Soul was placed in them, in order to save them from Knight and to take away their control over Kris.

Knight might only get back control during a Geno Route in the Dark World,

and even during the Nighttime when Kris returns home.

it is possible while the Knight has control of Kris, they allow them to eat the Pie.

Kris might possibly have three souls in them, one belonging to them, the other being the Knight who was making their life miserable, and lastly the Player.

the Player can go down the Geno Route, but in doing so would be adding the misery to Kris, and they wouldn’t just have one soul that wasn’t theirs that is making their life a nightmare, but two instead.

we know that Steven was very confused about the thoughts if he was his Mom or not, and it turns out he isn’t her, but he could still have a fragment of her

that ended up becoming Pink-Steven.

no one has to agree about this theory being true, but I believe that Pink-Steven isn’t just a reincarnation of Rose but is really a fragment from her that Rose created, along with a new diamond.

Steven’s relationship with his mother, is already estranged and it can be possible he doesn’t view her as much of a hero to look up to as he did when he was a kid, same goes for how bad things got for him and Greg.

I’m sure that while some who watched that episode on Steven Universe Future,

where Greg showed Steven the House he grew up in, think Greg made the right choice by leaving......well I’m not sure if others feel that way but I’m just guessing.

but I believe Greg was slightly in the wrong, even if his parents tried to do their best, they could of still explained why he wasn’t allowed to have certain things.

I did mention before about the theory that one of Greg’s parents

might of had a sensitive hearing and couldn’t handle loud music,

and Greg kept having the volume up and even though one or both his parents told him to stop it and to keep it down, he ignored them and kept the volume up.

and there could of been a good reason why they gave him meatloaf,

even if too much of it might be possibly bad.

Greg might of had a habit of misbehaving, and that is why his parents had to be even more strict with him.

we know that Pink Diamond, before she became Rose and when she faked her death and poof and reformed, the Rose Quartz disguise was no longer a disguise and that form became her real form the moment she reformed after Pink Diamond was “shattered” and we know before all that happen,

Pink would always misbehave and Blue would have to place her in the tower.

while Pink could of had some unfair moments where she was punished for the wrong reasons, other times the punishments were fair and something she needed.

but it would of been best to just ground her in her room,

and only use the tower if necessary, like to block out her destructive powers.

I believe the tower was made to block out Pink’s destructive powers.

Rose was both a good and bad person, but she could be a bit insensitive

and didn’t know how much Blue, Yellow and White loved her.

or how much Spinel loved her,

or how Pink Pearl aka “Lily” (Fanon) or Volleyball (Canon) loved her

and defended her actions when she ended up hurting them.

even Pearl was hurt by her, and she didn’t want to believe that she would hurt Lily, but then at some point in that episode where they tried to fix Lily,

Pearl had open her eyes to the damage that Rose (when she was Pink Diamond) had done.

after what happen with Steven, and even seeing that his problems had first started in the first series, Rose had caused him some emotional pain.

it doesn’t help that his family, Greg and the Crystal Gems are partly responsible.

even if they love him, they kinda half neglected his human needs.

even if they ended up taking care of most of his human needs....

Greg is at the most fault for not taking Steven to a doctor for his human half,

and Doctor Mahaswaren was in the right to be upset at Greg.

she mentions the unhealthy and healthy stress and the trauma done to Steven’s body, and how he always feels attacked.

I don’t think Sadie, Lars, Connie or others who knew Greg, knew anything about how Steven was being raised might be actually hurting him.

there is something called balance, Steven could still do Gem stuff

but he should make sure to give himself a break and do more human stuff.

some who have been in the same or slightly different feelings that Steven goes through in Steven Universe Future, end up relating to Steven and understand the bad feelings aren’t so easy to get rid of and don’t just go away as fast as we want them to.

if you get a another depression after getting better from the first one,

it might end up becoming worse and might go through some stages

and it will take way longer to get better.

you could try to act like everything is fine, and even if there are people and the stuff that interest you that still makes you feel a bit happy, the bad feeling is still there and it can hurt.

not like the hurt you feel when you get a cut or if you end up with a bruise on your arm and depending how hard your arm got hit, the inside of the arm will feel a bit sore and you will have to use ice and when the bruise starts to change color means it is getting better.

the type of hurt that has nothing to do with those two, has to do with your very soul and emotions I think.

like a build up of too much negative energy that is only hurting you on the inside.

I know there was more than one things that were getting to me that day,

and because of a fight, it was the breaking point.

I didn’t like it when the words I was trying to explain before ended up being misinterpreted and I had to give up on trying to explain.

I learned that it is a bad idea for someone who had a few months of depression, to end up with another depression on another year that might be close to the one that they had the first one and had got better too.

it could end up becoming way worse.

plus it can hurt when you feel like your family don’t listen to you,

and might make you feel they don’t love you as much, even if they do love you, they might make you feel like they don’t when they can’t understand about certain concerns and you might feel heart broken at thoughts that you try to tell them but they wont listen or they try to tell you that isn’t true.

I mean I still love my family, but it feels like they don’t listen to me half the time.

I think it is possible when our family don’t listen when we needed it,

it can end up hurting us emotionally and it might cause us to not trust them with certain things anymore.

we can still trust them, but not like how we use to.

like with my whole Ficto-Aroaceflux and then going through a type of chrysalis stage that has my inner me trying to figure out if I’m more of a Gyno-Agender

or Feminine-Nonbinary.

and I know I can’t tell my family about me believing in a Goddess too.

I still believe in God and even Jesus, but now I believe in Goddess.

at first I started to go by Neo-Christian with the whole Ma-Acolyte

(which the “MA” stands for Mother of All Angels.)

but now I go by Neo-Spiritual.

and I can’t tell my Mom that I am a Asexual Flux type.

there are some Aces who can be Bi or Pan or Hetero.

the Asexuality should not be confused for the Asexual Reproduction.

just because they both use the word “Asexual” doesn’t mean they will be the same.

Steven not talking about his feelings or if he does, it doesn’t go into how bad it has gotten for him.

ended up with him having a really REALLY bad breaking point.

and it caused him to view himself as a Monster and ended up corrupting himself.

there are some things that we can share with family and friends,

but some things we keep to ourselves.

anyway I’m gonna go sign off now, I will sign back later or tomorrow.

I hope some of you agree about the theory about the Dark World really being the Void, and the whole Pink-Steven really being a fragment from Rose and the diamond that Steven has, is really a new diamond that Rose created so she could once again fake her death and go into hiding.

we know that Pink had the ability to create gems from dirt and made a very real looking pink diamond shards.

so it is logical to believe that she created a new pink diamond and place a fragment from herself, into it and made everyone believe she gave up her form when she had Steven.

if Sans and Pink-Steven became separate beings, but still being related...

and Sans still having traces of gem in soul.

Pink-Steven could end up meeting Sans again, and might decide to tell him the truth about their Mother, how she made both of them, and how the Diamond that everyone believed was Rose/Pink’s Gem was really a new pink diamond she created and made everyone believe she had died when giving up her form to bring Steven into the world.

we know that Rose had kept secrets before, this would just be another secret that fans would of had to figure out, I mean if it is true.

but it is still a theory, but it is a theory that I see as headcanon.

not everyone has to agree about it being true, not everyone has to agree on the same headcanon and that’s okay.

I’m going to go watch Steven Universe now,

and later I’m going to play Deltarune.

see ya later and stay safe everyone.

#steven quartz universe #pink steven #rose quartz #pink diamond #fragment #sans the skeleton #steven universe theory #undertale theory #deltarune theory #spoilers #dark world #void #Headcanon

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zirkkun · 3 years

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I can't sleep so I'm gonna ramble for a minute here about. uh. 2020 i guess lol everyone else is so might as well jump on the bandwagon.

Be aware this is really really fucking long so it's a commitment to read it lmao sorry i just cannot sleep and i guess i had more on my mind about this year than i thought. I also did not proofread this at all. I just started writing and didn't look back lol

This year was... Weird for me. It started out with me feeling my best in January, comfortable and positive as I did my nth playthrough of DBH with friends and finally having enough alts of my boy Alfonse in FEH to have a team of Just him to fight with. (Priorities, right?) February hit, and things were still going good. I met Ray Chase and had him sign a print I did of Roy and Alfonse in some casual outfits for a scrapped au I wrote years ago. (And I gave him one 😊). Hell, like, covid was just coming around when me and my friends went to the con that weekend and a breakout of it hit the city just south of where the con was like a week before, but I was genuinely so excited for it that like I was like "Yeah, if i die, i die. Whatever happens happens." God, at this point, the Alfonse gc I was in was still alive and I still didn't talk to anyone in the group outside of that gc. Lowkey miss it tbh. But oh well. Things move on.

But that con was like... Stressful. I usually have fair amounts of stress at cons, being around so many people, I fear theft, unwanted contact, y'know, the standard; but my friend group was so filled with tension that it was absolutely painful. We'd been split most of the weekend, and if the two groups came together, it was hell, because it just caused unwanted arguments. I felt really bad cause I didn't want them to be upset, yknow? But i also wanted to hang out with my friends all at once. So i swapped between the groups a bit over the weekend. And blew WAY more money than I should have and lowkey it kind of fucked me over for the rest of the year cause I haven't had a job all year outside of, like, a local church job that pays at a rare max of $100 a month ;w;

I'd been struggling in school the previous semester already, about halfway through having just stopped going to classes altogether, yet still somehow managed to pass everything with B's and A's. The next semester rolled around, and I thought at first the distraction and inability to do anything was because of the con, and as it persisted after, I thought it was just post-con depression. But, as it turned out, no, it's just been my biggest relapse of depression since the end of high school, and frankly, it's only gotten worse since. I can't sleep rn because I'm between not wanting to do anything because I have a lack of emotions and motivation and not feeling deserving of sleep lol. I checked out of school on February 28th, however, I was convinced I was merely demotivated by my surroundings -- at this point, I was studying Japanese, and one of my friends at the time was a (although probably unintentionally) complete braggart about how much he was studying and how he was improving... not to mention he was textbook example of "This is an Actual Weeaboo, don't Fucking Do this." (One of many reasons i said friend at the time lol) it was just... So draining being around him, and I had to see him in class every day of the week. I barely scraped together assignments last-minute and never studied under the idea of "What does it matter if I'm not putting in my 100%?" So I checked out, with plans of transferring for the following semester.

Well, then March hit. Y'all know how March went down lmao.

I pretty much locked myself in my room at all times during March, going between Animal Crossing and BOTW (which actually racked up like 200ish hours i think according to the nintendo year in review i had lmao). I started making a bit closer online friends at this point, notably @levitumbling who decided to take me in as his channel designer for YouTube and I've been ever since! But. Of course. My first task? A Sans meme. My payment? One Switch copy of Undertale because he considered it a disgrace that I'd never played the game before.

Now, let me tell you. I was fuckin scared to play this game. I held onto it for weeks between the fear of "My friend bought me this and i should play this" and "I told myself I'd never touch this game with a 20 mile pole because of how much it's been shoved down my throat over the years." So, one day, I don't remember when, early April, I said, fuck it, I'll play it for a little bit, just enough to say "hey i played it for a bit!" and then never go back.

The only thing that stopped me from beating the whole thing in one sitting was it was the crack of dawn when I passed out, extremely tired and extremely frustrated by the fact I couldn't beat Muffet. Yes, I got that far in one sitting I intended to play for 15 minutes tops.

Now. Let me fuckin tell you. About my first playthrough of Undertale. I haven't gone into a game knowing ABSOLUTELY NOTHING about it like... I think ever. Usually I know what style of game it is, the genre, the main plot premise. I knew nothing other than the existence of Sans (and, as it turned out, I'd heard some of the soundtrack pieces before, notably Bonetrousle I heard this cover of it in a radio livestream a while back and never really looked it up, but was always excited when the radio looped back around to it being on; and I'd heard Dating Start! because that's Alpharad's go-to sponsorship ost lmao.) But anyway. I was completely in the dark. Do yall mind if i just go through some highlights of my favorite memories? This is supposed to be a summary of the year but I mean, I think this made a big enough impact on me to really like. Discuss it a bit.

I watched the whole opening cutscene, started a new game under my old screenname, "Yoru," since in naming the "Fallen Child," I assumed they were dead. Well, I was a little surprised to just be that child, alive, two seconds later, but whatever, I rolled with it.

I genuinely trusted Flowey right away. Like no shit. He told me run into the "friendliness pellets" and I didn't even fucking question it. And when Toriel came in? And she said to follow her? I straight up was like "Why the hell should I trust you?? That guy just tried to kill me what says you wont?" I followed only because the game made me but i was Wary the whole time. It took me a LONG time to warm up to Toriel.

Now. Let me tell you how stupid I am as well. The game says over and over right, "Don't fight. Spare. Have Mercy when names are Yellow." Well, I took this literally. I didn't understand the Act mechanic most of the time, and when something didn't work I just said, fuck it, and fought them. If their name didn't turn yellow, I just fought them. "They don't want Mercy if their name isn't yellow, right?" After a while, I'd started getting bored of fighting and would just run away, but like, I came to a point where I was like "I have a really low level, I'm really going to regret this later on if I don't grind for a while."

I don't know when I stopped but. I think I was only one or two kills away from a genocide run accidentally my first playthrough, based on how I think I was LV 3 and looking at genocide playthroughs, you're LV 3 or 4 when you fight Toriel. Like. Holy fuck. I can't imagine what I would have thought of this game if that happened lmao.

Speaking of Toriel, still didn't trust her, at all. When we got to Home, and after I did Every Single different phrase she says when you go downstairs before you talk to her reading about snails; I did not Hesitate to ask "cool uh when the fuck can I leave?" When we got to the Ruins exit I was like, ah, here it is. The betrayal from her I was expecting, where she tries to kill me. Well, nothing on the Act menu worked, right? So... I fought and killed her. I didn't really care, actually. I just kept going.

Then meeting Sans and Papyrus happened. I lost my fucking shit at this part, mostly when they were talking, because every time Sans made a pun it would zoom in on him and do a rimshot. The puns were not funny and I was definitely on Pap's side of "oh my GOD shut up." But that fucking zoom in and rimshot was just so fourth wall breaking and unexpected. Fuck, it still gets me. Anyway. Game continues. I again lose my shit at (insane spinning in random directions) "OH MY GOD! IS THAT A HUMAN?" "uh, i think that's a rock." "OH. WAIT! WHAT'S THAT IN FRONT OF THE ROCK?? (IS IT A HUMAN??)" "(yes.)" "OH MY GOD!!!" and still think these two moments in the game are Peak comedy. Oh, and let me tell you, I did not like either of these two at this point. Sans I was like, okay, hes kind of a dumbass in a funny way, but Papyrus is a dumbass in a way that just annoys me. Genuinely the archetype that misses social cues and therefore has miscommunication usually just annoys me to no end. (Mostly for the miscommunication. It's my least favorite trope and makes me unreasonably angry.) But yeah. Wasn't really a fan. But out of everyone so far? Definitely found Sans to be the most tolerable. But that's about all I thought of him lmao.

Getting to Snowdin, with the Papyrus battle, remember how I said I didn't like Papyrus? And yes, this was something I genuinely thought at one point, I genuinely hated Papyrus, imagine that. What a wild world that is. But anyway. You know how his Act menu has the "Flirt" option? I, for no reason, gunned it for the Flirt option, even though I did not want to. Then when he was like "WE'LL GO ON A DATE! LATER!!" i was like yea sure okay lmao. Again, couldn't figure out the Act menu to turn his name yellow, so I fought him, and he was one or two attacks from dying (miraculously) when he ended the battle. I spared him here cause, well, he spared me, it was only fair. Then this guy again is like "ILL BE AT MY HOUSE WHEN YOU WANT TO GO ON THAT DATE!" and i was like haha funny but still turned around to go on the date. Like why? I have no idea. I think I was more like "haha hes probably not gonna be there and its just cause i picked that option and lo and behold there was an actual fucking date. Oh my god. I have never in my life been on a video game date where one party was convinced I was infatuated with them and im here on the other side of the screen like "oh my god make this end i can't stand being around you.???" But still. The date was. Really fucking funny. I wish I could experience it for the first time again like holy shit. There are few playthroughs I did after this where I didn't go on the Pap date, even if I just spedrun through it.

So then you get to Waterfall and Sans is there like "hey wanna go to grillbys" and i was like sure why not so we go there and my choices were fries & ketchup (so i did not get the legendary scene where he chugged a bottle of ketchup, but i sure did my second playthrough, and let me tell you, i was disgusted). But like. This whole experience at grillby's like, the whoopee cushion, him using a comb on his bald ass skull, him just fuckin unapologetically scratching his ass for no reason?? Bro i was like "why the fuck is this guy part of the Tumblr Sexymen™ group ??? He's so ????? Gross???????" and like i still have this question tbh lmao. But like. Okay so he asks you "what do you think of my bro?" And my genuine answer was "uncool" and he was like "hey man sarcasm isnt funny" and can i just mention how like inheritly manipulative sans actually is like fuck he does things like this where he throws your answer the other way a few times and Every time it actually swayed me the other way. Because right here I went. "Oh. Maybe Papyrus is better than I thought." Like holy fuck maybe i should be more aware if something like that can sway my opinion so easily LMAO.

Anyway waterfall i genuinely was very bored of the whole time. I spent like a genuine 20 minutes figuring out the puzzle where you have to talk to a wall and I actually didn't realize you could move the telescope around. What helped me solve it is my friend's advice before I played it. "Inspect everything. Even talk to walls. Trust me." And literally thats how I solved it. But pretty much everything in Waterfall otherwise bored me. I did think it was pretty though, and did enjoy reading the lore, but when it started talking about monster biology my one fear had been realized: oh god, oh fuck. My original species for my own series also has physical Souls and die by turning to dust because they're made entirely of magic. God fuck. My luck, it has to be something popular, so now everyone's gonna think I'm a ripoff. But, at the same time, I do think it helped me understand monster biology (and it helped me come up with the ULR biology) better, because I've put in a lot of thought to existence of a species that exists only by magic and a Soul (which, mine only actually have half a Soul, as a full Soul makes a being immortal, which was also similar to the boss monsters in a way). It definitely made a lot more sense for like, the skeletons n stuff for me, because like my characters are wholly shapeshifters but usually take human form, and while they have "organs" in the places humans would have them, they don't operate. They're just placeholders, because they just live with their Soul. So I've always thought the same with UT monsters, since the skelebros can live without organs, that means so do the rest of the monsters, even if they have animal-like appearances.

Off topic lmao. Back to UT. So, the Undyne fight was kind of the turning point for me. She was pissing me off so much during this whole game and like I was like "if theres another fucking part where I have to run away from her im going to scream." Well, once again, her name wasn't yellow, so I wasn't going to spare her... and, actively, I made the decision to kill her, because I didn't want to deal with her still chasing me later on in the game. It took me a long time to beat her, and when I did, I texted my friend (@cheshiregrinnbuttoneyes ) in excitment like "YES I FINALLY KILLED UNDYNE" and she texted back like "YOU DID WHAT?????" and i was like "i.... Killed Undyne????" she replies, "YOU DONT HAVE TO OMFG WHY" and im like "I DIDN'T HAVE TO?? THERE'S OTHER OPTIONS?????" and shes like "YES OMFG THAT'S LITERALLY THE PREMISE OF THE GAME" and im "WHAT."

So then. I get that call from Papyrus like. "HEY! YOU ME AND UNDYNE SHOULD HANG OUT SOMETIME!"

oh my god the guilt i felt.

alphys on undernet being like "omfg i forgot to watch undyne fight the human. ah ill ask her about it later she never loses <3"

bro. i nearly fuckin cried. i was like. Not to mention I'd gotten the crush question right for Mettaton's quiz in answering Undyne (bc i was like "plz be gay plz be gay") so it fucking cut like a knife what I'd done.

I don't remember when I let myself get passed it. But I do know that the whole story arc between Alphys and Mettaton went way over my head. Like, i know im probs the minority on this, but I adore Alphys, I have since I first met her in game, and like, when Mettaton was like "ALPHYS HAS BEEN LYING TO YOU!" i just went "...nah."

Also, I didnt like mettaton at this point, cause I thought he was being really obnoxious, and then the turn around to betray Alphys really kinda pissed me off.

But like.

Oh my god.

Remember how I said I swapped my opinion on Pap earlier bc of Sans's comment? Yeah that was a pretty fast turnaround, but it still took me a few times.

But the second i saw mettaton ex

I was like

"HIM. HE. HE'S THE ONE I LOVE."

Like, full turnaround from Undyne, I actively refused to kill him. All times I thought he was an asshole? Forgotten. Me thinking he's a selfish prick? Gone. Nada. Nothing. Pure adoration. Suddenly every flaw he had was pushed aside purely from how hot I thought he was. Also, fuckin, im really glad i played this when no one in my house was awake, because I still didn't understand the Act mechanic here, and every time you attack mettaton he has this like moan he does and im like oh my god. stop. omfg.

At the end, too, when there was the calls and everything, when he had his big turnaround, I was just so happy for him I genuinely cried. Also, I had to do his battle probably the most out of everyone's in the game (not including genocide), so when it came around to his battle during the (glitchless) speedruns i did, i was more invested in how fast I could rack up points, cause you need 10k rating points to pass, and I actually did get that before he lost his legs, but apparently he needed to lose those too before you passed lol. Unfortunate.

Anyway after Alphys talked to you and everything, i genuinely went to see if Mettaton was still there, but he wasn't :( so i just went to New Home. I was very ill prepared for the fight against Asgore and the only reason I struggled with it so much was because my only healing items were like. Something that healed like 10 or 12 hp and the snowman piece. I was LV 9 when i finished the game, so like, my HP was pretty high, but i didnt have the G to buy items, so i was pretty much fucked. Yes. I had to eat the snowman to win.

Oh speaking of terrifying shit though. Photoshop flowey? My god. I haven't been afraid of a video game boss so much since I was a little kid. It was like 3 am and i was not prepared for him to just delete my save file and then kill me on repeat, glitching and breaking everything as he pleased. Bruh i was genuinely scared. Like, not even just, "oh yikes :(" or something. Like, crying scared. Lmao im an emotional bitch by nature.

I of course had to restart from the beginning again to get the True Pacifist ending. I was very careful to never touch the Fight button literally ever. And, it actually took me a while to reset, because I hate erasing my original save files, yknow? But, well, as it turned out? While technically New Game+ by naming, resetting doesn't erase everything you did. It wasn't a new file. I was a little confused at first to be honest. Toriel saying things were familiar, remembering things I said, Papyrus and Undyne both recognizing me, like. It was unnerving.

When I got to the end, i had to look up how to get Alphys's date (since my friend told me the way to unlock TP was to go on all the dates, but Alphys's was definitely designed in mind of you turning around from New Home and going back to talk to people rather than a new reset. So after unlocking it, getting through Alphys's date (i still remember being like, verbally, "omg alphys you look so nice??" When she came out with the dress on and then had a thought to myself like... since when do i care about what people look like? since when do i compliment people? At that point, while I didn't consider myself to be a rude person, I definitely wasn't exactly all that concerned about others for anything. Sure, I cared about others' lives, but I tended to be a bit more judgemental internally, and just. Didn't really give a fuck about what people did in the most negative sense possible, unless it involved me. Yet, it rolled off my tongue like it was something id say normally to anyone. I really wonder if this is the true turning point for me this year.)

Getting to the end, with everyone cheering me on. Hoo boy. This was the start of many tears to come. Papyrus's "DO WHAT I WOULD DO! BELIEVE IN YOU!!" sticks with me the most. I wasn't surprised by Flowey's actions, but what fucking threw me for a loop was like. When Flowey was revealed as Asriel, I was genuinely jaw-drop shocked. I was like. Holy fuck. I thought he was dead. What the hell. To this day, though, i still think Hopes and Dreams hits me the hardest out of all the boss battle themes. It doesn't super bother me, bc like, difference in opinion is whatever, but like. Whenever I see Megalovania at the top of someone's ost list for Undertale I'm just... Why? Maybe it's because I'd overheard it meme'd to much before I played the game, but like, i dunno, it's not a bad song, but it's not the most emotional provoking piece for me, so it's pretty far down my list. Hopes and Dreams will still remain my #1.

I really did feel determined during this battle. I really felt a lot of emotion. I felt excited. I felt frightened. I felt ambitious. Asriel's battle is probably still the hardest for me, and yes, I'm counting genocide this time. I can't grasp his magic patterns at all, and I more so played it as a "okay, how much damage can i take? Whats his next move?" As i healed every other turn. It took me a very long time to beat him (though no 11 hours like Sans, this was more like, 2 or 3 max) and when I got to the part with the Lost Souls, most of the characters just said their "we hate you" piece and i was like "nope you're controlled" right.

But then there's Sans's "just give up. i did."

I genuinely had to stop. I set down my controller and just sat for a minute. I'd mentioned before how much I've been struggling with depression for years now, and it's at the worst it's been since high school. Maybe you'd think when I saw that, I was like "sure, maybe I should give up." But... It's really the "i did." that hit me like a rock to the stomach. While I do know a couple other people with depression, the most discussion we have with it is "haha i wanna die" kinda jokes yknow? Nothing really serious. And, well, I've always been the type to lean to fictional characters for support more than real people, since I've just been so disconnected from a lot of friends growing up and was too scared to talk about anything with my family.

So seeing someone else say "just give up. i did." hit me so fucking hard that I just started crying. I had already been in a real sappy mood cause the whole scene was so emotional as it was, even if merely the cliche of friendship will save all, y'know what? Its a good ass fuckin trope and makes me emotional lmao.

So, naturally, I was more hyperaware of Sans's implied depression from here onward. The conversations with everyone post-battle left me crying. God, so did the hug with Asriel. I was just fucking bawling.

Oh god. I didn't even mention. "Despite everything, it's still you." Another line that just hit me and I had to pause.

So admist my crying mess, I was telling my friend I'd beat Undertale again. He asks me "so... you gonna play the genocide route?" And I already had from the beginning. I always want to play every available route in a game. I see no point in paying for something and then not playing it all. I'd consider myself a completionist who doesn't ever actually finish anything lmao.

I definitely put my emotions aside for genocide. The absolute hardest kill for me was Papyrus, though. And i was absolutely fucking heartbroken when he said he still believed me as his last words. But I forced it aside. I didn't want to reset. I wanted to beat it to have it under my belt that I had. I was pretty sure the Sans battle would be here, since I hadn't heard Megalovania in the game yet, and I was aware of how hard the battle was, despite never seeing it.

Undyne's battle I'm more emotional about in retrospect than I was at the time. At the time, I didn't care, didn't like the theme much, and the dings gave me a headache. Undyne isn't exactly my favorite character (though definitely not my least favorite, that role is given to Frisk with Toriel not close behind ahdhsb im sorry), so I really wasn't concerned about it. Not to mention, I don't know why, but all of the battles I struggled with EXCEPT Undyne's I ended up liking the character more as a result. Maybe it was the dinging lmao.

Bro you shoulda seen how prepared I was for Mettaton NEO's battle to be hard as fuck. I was like sitting upright, took deep breaths before hitting fight, then when he died in one shot i just kind of "wh...what." Still very disappointed lol but I guess that's kind of the point of the genocide route.

Then came the Sans fight. As I said, I spent 11 hours on this. I genuinely didn't pay attention to what he said after a while, but I do remember the first time I read it, I was fucking terrified. Usually, sarcasm, hatred, and sass is very hard to convey through pure text, especially when it's said in the same tone as his usual talking. But the absolute harshness, the coldness, and the lack of any fucks given Sans had at that point was so plainly transparent through everything he said that it fucking scared me. Toby Fox's writing here was fantastic. I can only dream of being able to write like that. Frankly, I love his writing in general. Actually, fuck it, I love all of the artistic takes of this game. This is gonna sound weird but... The "childishness" of it just is so good. Like, there's no rules. Every socially accepted rule of art, writing, character design, speech patterns, and even basic grammar are thrown aside. He didn't just think outside of the box, there literally was no box. I call it childish only because like, children also create with no rules. They have no rules to restrict their creativity. And seeing that embraced in Undertale in every form possible just blows me away.

Anyway. The battle. It. Was hard. Thats a given. I spent about two weeks playing it on and off, and it's probably the most healthily I've treated myself in recent memory, because when it became too much for me to handle, I set it down and took a break. I would retain what I memorized and use it for the next time I picked it up. Frankly, it came to a point where every time I opened up Undertale to play, it was more just cause I wanted to see him lmao. The guy hated my existence at this point and it's not like i disacknowledged that. But it just felt like every time i opened the game... Idk. I don't know what I felt. I can tell you for sure this isn't the time when Sans started slipping into my favorite character spot over Mettaton, that didn't come until the development of Act to Flirt's first demo, which was a month or so later lmao.

I was very excited when I beat Sans.

But then, after it was over, I felt very empty.

I didn't feel good about beating genocide. I still don't. I want to play the boss battles again, cause they were really fun, despite how hard they were, but I can't bring myself to.

When I got to Chara, and everything went to black, I just wiped my save and started fresh. I think this was the first time I used the name "Willo" for anything. I just picked a random name to use, and Willo was the first thing that came to mind.

I beat neutral again many times, trying to unlock as many secrets as I could. I accidentally spent like, way too long trying to get Sans's room, because I couldn't figure out how to do it... which is when I started speedrunning the game, because I was just so used to going through it all. I timed myself once, and I got somewhere around 1:20:00 ish, which puts me at the very bottom of the NG+ Glitchless runs by like 30 minutes, but hey, it's still not too bad all things considered.

I'd started working on Act to Flirt sometime in between the speedruns. I was playing Papyrus's date again, and I had this thought of. What if Undertale... but all boss fights are instead like Papyrus's date?? I pitched the idea to my friend who was like "thats definitely been done before lol" and immediately I almost shut down the idea. But then I still had that glimmer of hope that, maybe, since I haven't made it yet, people would like my game because it was by me. Besides, quarantine was getting to me. I needed some way to spend my time. So on May 6th to May 7th, I spent the whole 24 hour period making the first proof of concept for the game, which was UI setup and Flowey's tutorial date. I hadn't made any of the art yet, so it was a black background with Flowey's undertale sprite. I originally was going to make everything more visual novel like in the sense that, so like on Papyrus's date, you could make choices like "unwrap the present" "dont unwrap the present" or "you look great" "you look terrible" and getting the ending would involve pretty much just saying the right things at the right times. But this alone was... Yknow, already done before, and part of what makes Undertale so great is that it's, despite its many outside influences, very unique in its gameplay. So I decided to make the dates more like puzzle-solving RPG's, and frankly, since doing that, I dont know if I want to go back to making other visual novels lmao.

After making the first demo and releasing it, I hit a creative funk. I wanted to make the next demo right away, but I forced myself to stop (since i was working 16+ hour days to finish it in exactly a week. I didn't eat much and i slept very little during this time too. Dont do this lmao). I didn't know if the game would be received, and frankly, I'd had many failed projects in the past due to lack of support. I lost a lot of support in the past due to the dropped projects I kept starting and quitting because I had such a small audience, and that made me lose a lot of interest and motivation to work on them. So I posted the first demo and waited. I was very shocked to have a YouTuber with over a million subs play it that weekend. Dantekris I think was her channel name. She speaks Russian, and I never understood a word she said, but I've still watched her let's plays because I enjoy seeing her reactions. I hate that YouTube keeps deleting my responses on her videos, probably because they're long and in English so it's marked as spam on a comments section full of purely Russian comments yknow. But it makes me feel like such an ass ;w;

Mairusu is the next large YouTuber who played it and my god I love seeing when he uploads a new update for my game because I genuinely have no idea what to expect from him. I don't know what it is but he's just so absolutely funny to me. He also seems to be the most common breaker of my game though. Stop making your own bugs!! I try to testplay to find the bugs he gets and it's like.... what did you do.... how did you skip that whole date im so confused thats not supposed to happen..... He accidentally skipped all of Muffet's date because of this too and hers is supposed to be the hardest in the game right now so I'm very upset by it;; i dont know how it happened, it never happens for me.

But like. I was definitely struggling a bit with the direction I wanted to take AtF. I wanted there to be a core message, like with Undertale and many other of my favorite things. When there's a core theme to write about, it makes things a lot easier to compose than if you have a plot with no meaning to it. It ties it all together for a common purpose. But, as I started diving more into the fandom around this time, finding not only it being still alive but still enormous and filled with passion.

Passion. Hm. That's familiar. That's the trait I gave the player character, rather than determination. While it was intended for giggles "haha dating game u have passion wink wonk," it started becoming more than that. It started becoming a manifestation of what I really felt upon finally soaking myself into the deep end of this pool I'd once been too afraid to step into. Passion. Everyone here is so driven by their passion for this game, the characters, its story. Everyone is so inspired and creative. That's it. That's what I wanted Act to Flirt to be.

A game made for those who have already dived deep into Undertale. A game made for those who have the same level if passion I've wittnessed. A game that someone might stumble upon, merely wanting any Undertale content they can find, and a dating sim leaves them grasping at straws, only to find it's a game instead deeply rooted in how much they care about this world and its people. You have a Soul of Passion, because your passion for Undertale brought you to this game. That's what the core message is. Every ending is supposed to depict different kinds of empathy, and True Passion shows you truly cared the most you could for all of these characters. Sans is so blocked from it because, well, how can he really believe it? "if we're really friends, you won't come back," right? But here you are. Again and again.

And Heartbreak. Whose heart is really the one breaking here? Taking the Hopes and Dreams of every single character you've grown to care for and crushing it beneath your feet... who is the one suffering in the end?

I just... I'm very excited. I've written that game with the player as the main character. Not Willo. Not Frisk. Not anybody else. You, the player, are the main character. I've honestly done a lot of looking around in the DDLC code to make this game as 4th wall breaking as I can (without like. Disrupting it as a game experience like ddlc is, with monika deleting things and stuff). Just enough to leave the player unsettled and confused. Like. "Me? Are you talking to me?" Yes. You. Directly to you.

I started sketching out designs and ideas for ULR around July. I genuinely loved Underlust after finding out about it, even though it was posed to me as an insult about the contents of Act to Flirt. I was both like "uh... Act to Flirt is nothing like this. Maybe in reversed roles at best but..." and also "okay but this? This shit is good. Thank you." But finding out it was discontinued and wanting more, well, that's when I decided to make ULR. I presented the idea to my friends, who were like "please stop making aus," and then continued onward. I told myself I wasn't going to work on it though until after I finished Act to Flirt... Then after the next demo came out... Then it turned out I was working on it too much and it resulted in me rushing my release of the 3rd demo of AtF because I'd been so distracted I was going to miss my release deadline of the end of August, before school. I... Still kinda regret that a lot. It's still very buggy. Though I hope I got them all for the next demo...

But speaking of school .... ha... Remember when i said i was going to transfer to another school? Well, I did, and for the first few weeks it was fine! Then I started skipping assignments I didn't want to do. Then I started panicking about my low grades. Then I started getting behind on assignments. Then I stopped going to classes. Then I lost all motivation to work on anything at all. I just locked myself in my room and did next to nothing with the occasional drawing here and there, for weeks. It came to the point where I was like "I just have to get through this semester, then I'll drop out." But if I ever wanted to go back to school, having all F's on my last report card would not bode well for my acceptance. Which lead to more stress. I didn't want to fail, but I also didn't have any motivation to work. I would do one assignment here or there, feel good about myself, then realize I was still months behind on work and suddenly oh god oh fuck finals are next week. And my solution? I just. Fuckin dropped out. Oh my god. It was such a relief to just get that weight off my shoulders that I'd been carrying for months on end, preventing me to do anything I wanted to work on.

Well. Then my car tires died. So that's a thing. But good news! Between commissions and gifts, I have enough money to get them replaced! I don't think I've ever like... Been so excited about that before.

And, well. Now I'm here, pretty much. God, I just went through my entire year summary, and it feels like it was both forever long but also not long at all. I don't get it. 2021 still feels like a far off future, despite the fact I'm now 5 hours into it. Yes, I spent 4 hours writing this. Whoops. Oh well. I couldn't sleep anyway, so it's not that big of a deal.

All in all though... Despite being locked inside, away from my friends, unable to talk to anyone about the things i was enjoying, and living in fear of getting sick at all ever with anything, 2020 definitely fuckin changed me for the better. It was a hellhole of a year and I'd never do it again or wish it upon my worst enemy, but I came out a better person... I think. I hope.

It seems cliche to bring back but fuck it. Undertale? My friend insists its core message was that anyone can be a good person if they just try, which I mean, it definitely probably was intended that way. But that never was the message I felt while playing it.

What lesson I took from it was "things aren't always as they seem."

Flowey betrays you immediately, but then you find out he's just the remnants of a boy who died years ago and is still grieving over the loss of his best friend, whomst, despite how much he cares for them, recognizes they weren't good to him and he'd been manipulated and used by them.

Toriel is a kind and caring woman, a still grieving mother over the loss of her children, who seems to have kindness to no end, but is actually filled with such hatred and depression that she regularly gets drunk, swears, and still, without resilience, hates her ex husband.

Sans is a playful character who is full of puns, a gross atmosphere, and decided to break physics just because he can. He's the embodiment of a comic relief character. But at the same time, he's suffering, struggling, in constant pain and worry. He's lazy, but quick on his feet. He's harmless but will kill without hesitation if need be. He's both caring and the least caring of them all.

Papyrus is like... a self-centered asshole in a way, when you first meet him. He prides himself and everything he does. Yet still, he's actually quite open and accepting and loves everyone. He loves talking with and being with other people, even if maybe sometimes he has a different interpretation of social interaction from the "norm."

Undyne comes off as cruel and deadly, such even being emphasized in many points. But, deep down, she's extremely caring for those who are close to her, and her only cruelty is dealt to those who have wronged her in some way.

Alphys is a sweet and nervous wreck who comes off as helpful and lacking a filter due to her tendency to ramble. She seems to be merely anxious due to likely social anxiety... But you eventually find out that she's a liar who merely wants to create a world to be a better place, and by doing so, she pretends all the bads do not exist.

Mettaton comes off as an absolute self-centered asshole. Like. There's no way around that. He seemingly has no regard for other people with only full intentions of helping himself. But, deep down, he actually cares a lot for other people, especially his family and friends, and just tends to get caught up in things while he's in the moment.

Muffet seems to be greedy with how much money she begs people to give her for the spiders, but, as it turns out, she's flat broke and drops no G when you beat or kill her. She merely needs the money to help the spiders.

Asgore, too, is built up to be this ruthless killer throughout the whole game, and when you finally meet him, he's an incredibly sweet guy who's only filled with regret, and because of his past decisions, has decided to put aside his hopes for the sake of his people.

I...

Didn't see any of these characters for who they really were right away. Why would I? Few of these archetypes are explored much in a lot of fiction lately, or at least what I've been consuming; and is more focused around how someone can change their flaws into something positive... Not how to accept someone for who they are, despite the wrongs they may have committed or the lives they lead. Everyone's different. Everyone's grown up differently. Everyone has a reason for what they do.

And it took me playing this game to realize such a simple concept that I probably should have learned years ago.

That's why I really think 2020 changed me for the better. I made a realization that I should have had many years ago, and it's made me a lot more confident in expressing myself, accepting people for what they do, and seeing the brighter side to everything. I say that, sitting here filled with nothing and void of all emotion whatsoever... But it's a conscious thought i have. My emotions are so weird... They're either on full blast or I feel nothing at all. But yet I have... Thoughts of what i should feel? It's weird. Idk. This is why I'm getting therapy LMAO

But yea. 2020? Fuck you. But also thank you. But mostly fuck you and good riddance lmao

#zircon rambles #a lot #lol #its very long im sorry #i spent way too long writing this too #also please don't reblog this

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randomizertale · 3 years

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Basic Undertale AU Info- RandomizerTale

The Story

With each reset everyone (other than frisk/chara, gaster, and maybe flowey) are randomized as different character roles. The characters still look the same and have the same names, but they act and talk as the characters they are playing as. They still have their same basic powers (except for sans who can't maintain his knowledge of resets outside his role), they just act different.

Think of it as a randomizer mod. The same art and battle assets, just different dialogue.

Sans gets nerfed for whoever he's playing as though.

The only one who realizes is the character playing as sans. Since the sans has an unnatural ability to remember every resets, this ability is transferred to who is sans and gets multiplied as they'll remember not only the pov of every sans before, but of their own povs as other characters as well. This multiplication increases exponentially to the point that sans is basically an amalgamation of everyone's povs in the underground.

The Sanses are also proficient in all types of magic now (as the body allows of course [if in Sans bod he still tired with 1hp bro and Undyne sans is an absolute BEAST] and depending on who else has been sans before). This means that genocide fights get progressively harder and harder each time a reset happens and dialogue changes too depending on who is playing sans (pap genocides usually end pretty fast though [despite everything he thinks the human can do better]).

Eventually the randomization just so happens to land on the original configuration of monsters. Seeing his chance for it to go back to normal, Sans, with everyone's pov of the resets, teleports to frisk at the beginning of the route and confronts/begs frisk to stop the madness: pleading them to be better person (paps), to stop hurting the ones they love, to let them to finally live on the surface instead of just looking at it, to just stop the resets altogether and to let this be their final reset.

After the final reset, Sans is still sans but he has EVERY monsters pov of past resets (boss and minor monster alike). Once the resets end, he isn't everyone shoved into one body, but sans with a recollection of everyone's pov of past resets. IT IS NOT D.I.D!!!! Of course he knows that he himself is sans, but he might have random episodes where he does/says things that other characters would say/like/do (ex: pose like mettaton, make a puzzle, gush like alphys over his interests, drink tea...you get the idea) due to him being forced to play as other characters in other resets. (Other chars in the au don't have this happen to them cause they don't remember previous resets)

When he is talking about past experiences during the resets, he flips between pronouns and from first/third person (I, we, she, he, they) in order to get some of feelings across (I as Sans, we as everyone's pov of resets, and others as specific people's povs).

“Episodes”:

His episodes can be broken by a) someone telling him that's not how he is, b) physical interference (ex: slap, tripping, sleep), c) him having a dissociating moment where he's like “wait a minute...”, and d) he finishes the action the episodes requires of him.

Some episodes are harder to recognize (specially ones with no final action/goal in mind. For example: getting anxious over social interaction like alphys vs making a butterscotch pie.) Episodes don't overlap each other, so he could be his sans personality while making a pie, making different jokes based on an interest change, or just extruding mettaton confidence/self-absorption).

There are certain episodes that he doesn't mind very often and will actually complete it even after he breaks out of it, specifically the task episodes like making pie/spaghetti/tea. He's learned to really like that stuff.

Some episodes that he particularly hates are when he acts/speaks like mettaton or temmie, nervously word vomits like alphys (cause there's no filter and he can say stuff he doesn't want to be said out loud [he a secretive guy]), and when he acts like Jerry because eewwwwww.

To apologize or explain his behavior after an episode he calls it the (insert character) in me or my inner (insert character). "welp my inner toriel came out again..." "sorry, kiddo, that was just the undyne in me..."

Ones he hates or are improperly timed, he sometimes just insults the characters though. "f-ing mettaton..." "alphys I like you but whyyyyyy" "*gags* ...Jerry"

Types of episodes: social (acting or talking like someone), thoughts (interests or ideals) (he HATES this one the most as it makes him feel less like him), physical (task or long-lasting [long-lasting like dancing/ posing/working out]). (Keep in mind that social and physical episodes keep sans ideas/thoughts/interests intact, he just communicates them in a way another character would say them.) Specific social or physical episodes can be triggered with high emotions (though most of the time it's just random). Extreme anger can bring out the undyne in him, fear/nervousness alphys, adoration paps, depression nabstablook, worried for someone else toriel, and so on.

Some Fun Facts:

Fun facts: Sans gets headaches after an episode where he acts/thinks like someone else. The severity usually depends on how long the episode is and how out of character is for him.

Fun facts 2: Following the logic of post reset sans, other characters playing as sans will think and act like the original char they are supposed to be but with sans personality. Unless episodes happen... (EX: Toriel goat jokes, undyne fish jokes.) So it leads to different character interactions where an undyne sans is more pissed off at frisk and more prone to violence. Paps sans more encouraging to be a better person. Other chars as sans also get episodes and headaches if they act like other chars other than themselves (disregarding sans cause they are supposed to be sans.). Bruh does this get complicated...

Fun facts 3: The other char’s povs only start once frisk falls underground so sans doesn't know how toriel felt leaving ashore or pap waiting outside undyne’s house to join the royal guard. That means his episodes and knowledge of others chars reset feelings/actions during povs are strictly based upon the duration the timeframe that frisk is underground.

Fun facts.4: The sanses in all the reset always has a soft spot for paps. They know that he ain't their bro but the code just has that as a priority for the sans. (Paps as sans is like my bro loves me ;n;.) They enjoy it when paps is playing alphys in genocide routes cause at least they know he won't die that route.

Fun facts 5: In an alternate version of this au when frisk ignores sans's plea for it to be their final route, sans would most likely snap and go crazy and just straight up try to murder the kid over and over again regardless if they were going to do a pacifist or geno route until they agree to his terms or until he dies (and he'll do it for all future resets [except for maybe pap sans???]) Who knows a Dusttale (see @ask-dusttale ) might even happen but the version of sans would feel less guilty bout it cause most other char povs would only confirm that other characters would just want frisk to suffer.

Fun fact 6: In another happier alternate version of this au, a version of sans confronts frisk earlier on, making them feel bad early and just wants everyone to go back to normal. So they constantly reset until they find the normal config for the final reset. The Sanses in this route are pretty chummy with frisk. They are very tired of the resets regardless though (as it takes forever to land on the normal configuration) and sometimes halfheartedly bets with frisk who the next sans is going to be. The resets where everything is normal except for one monster are especially soul crushing for both the Sanses and frisk. They were so close!!!!!

Designs:

For the design of another chars as sans they might go out of their way in the assets and wear sans classic jacket to showcase that they are a sans and are aware of what's going on. So their normal outfits but with sans jacket on top.

Interesting info of probability of a normal config happening in the randomizer:

~58 enemy types so 3364 (0.000297265% of normal config)

~322 monsters total so 103684 configurations (0.0000096446896% of normal config)

(let me know if I did the math incorrectly :) )

#undertale #undertaleau #undertale au #randomizertale #sans #sans au #sansau

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kittyluvr42 · 4 years

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The Origins of Evil Chara: A Metatheory

This is a theory about why evil chara theory became so ingrained in much of the UT community that I’ve had going in my mind for a while, but I was inspired to post it by a discord convo. It’s a bit long, so I’m gonna hide it under read more.

So I’m always a little hesitant to make theories about the thought processes of other people, and this is still rough, so feel free to send asks with suggestions about it, but I’ve found it a useful lens for interpretting where the whole evil chara theory came from and how to address it. This is specifically looking at the whole “Chara is evil and possessed Frisk to do the whole no mercy route” thing.

Uh, there are already a ton of posts about why that theory is nonsense, so I’m not going to make one. To summarize, there’s practically no evidence of that in the game, and the characterization they’d need to do that is completely different from their characterization under narrachara, which IS so strongly supported by canonical evidence it basically is canon itself.

This is more about where that theory comes from, because, as I said, there’s practically no evidence in the game to support it, so why do people actually believe it?

In general, a lot, if not the majority, of media is about, or at least contains violence. This leads to a contradiction: violence is bad and hurts people, but violence is a form of power and power is cool. To resolve this contradiction, the piece of media will generally provide some narrative justification for the violence contained within it. Violence is necessary because the hero is fighting bad people, because it’s necessary to save the world, etc.

This on it’s own is fine. I’m not here to rail against violence in media, I’m just presenting this as a trend. (It’s also worth noting that violence is not necessarily murder or gore or whatever, it’s just people fighting.) I’m not even saying these justifications are wrong. There are often justified reasons for violence, punching a nazi being the one that immediately comes to mind. Again, this is a trend that is common and on it’s own is fine.

Videogames especially tend to follow this trend, because violence is an easy way to present gameplay. Again, this is not inherently bad, I enjoy a lot of violent games, Hollow Knight immediately coming to mind as an example. My point is that this is enough of a trend that, as a player who is exercising violence, you generally expect to receive some form of narrative justification for the violence you enact.

This expectation is exactly what the no mercy route of Undertale is examining. (Ok, not in entirety, it’s also about completionism and feeling it necessary to milk every piece of content out of a game, it’s also about living with consequences, but it is at least one of the ideas being explored.) Undertale is aware of this expectation, and not only refuses to give you a narrative justification, but shames you for even expecting it. “Do you think you are above consequences?” (This happens in several of the neutral routes too, to a lesser extent. See the Queen Alphys and Leaderless endings.) In short, Undertale wants you to question why you were expecting a narrative justification for mass murder.

But what if you refuse to do that?

What if, instead of questioning why the game doesn’t do what you expect, you just... pretend it does?

The game never gave you the justification you need to continue to consider yourself a good person. (Or, at least, someone who only plays good people in videogames.) The fact is that you, as the player, chose the no mercy route. You did that, but if you refuse to accept that it was unjustfied, you may just make a justification for yourself.

And there’s only one character who makes a convenient scapegoat.

There’s only one character who waits for you to piss them off before they tell you their name. There’s one character who shows up right at the end of no mercy. There’s one character who shames you most directly for what you’ve done, and for expecting someone to retroactively justify it for you. And also, by doing so, there’s one character who makes it hardest to shift blame onto someone else, since they directly call you out.

What if you could just ignore what they said? What if nothing they said mattered, because it was actually their fault? What if you weren’t the one who did bad things, but they were?

It’s so easy, isn’t it? I can almost understand why someone else would want to blame Chara as a defense mechanism.

This next paragraph is more speculative. Maybe I’m just salty. However, I don’t think it’s a coincidence that so many of the people who follow this theory are the same people who treat sans as THE main character. (At the expense of Frisk, Chara, Asriel, the actual main characters, at the expense of Undyne and Alphys, who are the actual heroes and genius scientist people pretend sans is, at the expense of Toriel and Papyrus, whose characterizations are often neutered to put sans on a pedastal.) Sans is the closest to the “default” main character (present for most of the game, male, not strongly queercoded, his neurodivergent coding is easily ignorable, etc.) that’s expects from media. If you’re not likely to question one of your assumptions about media, as necessitated to fit into the earlier description, you aren’t going to question others right?

Is it any surprise that the same people refused to pay attention Kris rejecting their control, instead portraying them as an evil person for standing up for themselves, because the person they were standing up against was YOU.

I honestly don’t even think it’s malicious. It’s a defense mechanism. It’s so easy to just not think about the implications of the things you believe. But, it is still harmful. Because Chara and Kris are so neurodivergent coded, and portraying them as mindlessly evil perpetuates those harmful stereotypes. Because putting sans front and center at the expense of the lgbt, neurodivergent, and female characters is just a continuation of the destruction of representation that make those characters stand out.

Because Undertale is some of the best neurodivergent, gay, and nonbinary representation we HAVE, and so the very people who are likely to like it are the most affected by the harmful stereotypes this behavior perpetuates.

Finally, I don’t like to gatekeep, but if you are going to actively ignore the things the game is actually saying. Why are you even here?

#mine #undertale #chara #undertale theory #sans #If I put this in the main tags how many people will get mad at me?#Let's find out :)#Anyway yes I'm kinda salty but is it so hard to not ignore what's actually in the game #There's not even anything wrong with sans I'm just tired of people putting him front and center

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llama-lord · 4 years

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My Full Personal Interpretation of Chara

It’s my view that Chara was severely abused during their time on the surface, and began to view crying as weakness because of it. I'm not sure if Chara was actually trying to commit suicide, but I think they had suicidal tendencies, showing little concern for their own life. Undertale's intro shows Chara tripping instead of jumping, but it also shows them clearly seeing the hole and approaching it beforehand. Given that the injuries Chara sustained from the fall were far from fatal, as they were able to walk with Asriel's assistance, their cry for help could've been out of pain and/or survival instinct, rather than a genuine desire to live.

Pre-death Chara hated Humanity, but there was always a look of hope in their eyes (in the neutral ending where Asgore commits suicide, he tells Frisk “I'm reminded of the human that fell here long ago... You have the same feeling of hope in your eyes”), they loved Monsterkind, they loved Toriel and Asgore (while it’s possible that Toriel knitted the Mr. Dad Guy Sweater for Asgore, I think it’s more likely that it was Chara. “Mr. Dad Guy” is an awkward name, one that sounds like a middle ground between “Mr. Dreemurr” and “Dad”), and they loved Asriel more than anything. However, while Chara was capable of and showed genuine love and kindness to the Dreemurrs, sharing countless tender moments with them, they could be a bully sometimes. Although Chara never physically hurt Asriel, they frequently shamed and sometimes mocked Asriel for crying (mirroring their own treatment on the surface), and liked to playfully toy with his emotions from time to time. With no other friends and due to his own insecurities, Asriel looked up to Chara and came to idolize them. That said, while Chara's and Asriel's relationship was unhealthy, I doubt it was ever intentionally abusive until the plan came forth. Had Chara been made fully aware of how much damage they were doing to Asriel, I think they would've been horrified.

EDIT: I view the mindset that "big kids don't cry" as being picked up by Chara on the surface due to mistreatment. They shamed Asriel for crying under the distorted belief that they were toughening him up.

While I think Toriel and Asgore were decent parents, they never noticed Chara's darker tendencies, nor did they ever ask them questions about their life on the surface. When Asgore told Chara that they were "the future of Humans and Monsters" (I highly doubt Chara’s deathbed was the only time Asgore said this, given the weight of the title, and his bad habit of placing enormous responsibilities onto the shoulders of young children, seeing how he gave Frisk, a child no older than 12, the duty to "seek the truth" of the Prophecy so they can free everyone in the alternate Neutral Route where he commits suicide), his intent was to refer to Chara as living proof that the two species could coexist. However, Chara took it the wrong way, believing it now meant that they were responsible for everyone, giving them a complex, putting pressure on them as one of the Royal Children.

EDIT: I placed too much blame on Asgore in my initial write-up. It’s far more likely that Chara developed a complex from living with Monsters, and that being called "The Future of Humans and Monsters" was simply the icing on the cake.

EDIT: I think Toriel and Asgore may have recognized signs of abuse in Char, or just felt that something was off about them, but I doubt either of them realized how bad their issues were.

Poisoning Asgore was a genuine accident. I don’t believe Chara "laughed the pain away" nor laughed sadistically. There is a recurring theme of characters laughing and joking in stressful moments (Snowdrake's Father when he talks about his son ran away after his mother disappeared, Snowdrake's Mother during her fight in the True Lab, Mettaton NEO, Undyne when Frisk is beating her to death in the Neutral Route, Toriel when you oneshot her in the Genocide Route or betrayal kill her, Asriel when you hug him, Asgore when he kills himself in the alternate neutral ending, and Migospel, especially Migospel, as his entire theme is him putting up a happy facade to hide his pain). The only times we ever see sadistic laughter in Undertale are from Asriel, who is soulless, and Chara in the Genocide Route, which I don’t believe is an accurate reflection of the person they were in life. So, while I doubt that Chara felt particularly terrible over accidentally poisoning Asgore, I believe their laughter was relatively dry, hollow, and empty.

EDIT: I think Chara freaked out when Asgore got sick, but calmed down after realizing that he wouldn't die. There was still some guilt, but most of it left at that point.

Due to a combination of Chara shaming him for his tears in the past, and his own idolization of them, Asriel now looked down on crying, and saw Chara's (relatively) calm reaction as preferable to his, saying "I should have laughed it off, like you did".

Then came the plan. I think Chara was motivated by both revenge and a wish to free Monsterkind. Chara chose to commit suicide rather than kill the Dreemurrs for their Boss Monster SOULs. I've seen people theorize that Chara picking death of buttercups was self-punishment for what they did to Asgore. I'm neutral on this theory, but I'll acknowledge that there are far less painful ways to die that would've still appeared accidental. And in this moment, yes, Chara was intentionally manipulative (which is abusive). They belittled Asriel's emotions and played up his desire to be a hero by telling him that he could free everyone. When Chara discovered their shared control with Asriel after their SOUL was absorbed, they resolved to walk to the village themselves. When the villagers attacked, Chara tried to kill them all, and that's when he resisted. Asriel had just enough control to walk back to the Throne Room, where he died.

EDIT: I doubt Chara was lying to Asriel when they told him that they only wanted 6 SOULs. Chara had no way of knowing of whether they’d even be conscious, let alone share control with Asriel, after they died. That, and going back to their village would’ve re-opened old wounds, which leads me to believe that their attempt to destroy it was an impulsive act fueled by a power trip, not a pre-planned one.

I doubt post-death Chara is entirely soulless, because they would need a way to manifest themselves. However, Chara’s dialogue at the end of the Genocide Route implies that something happened to their SOUL, saying that “My 'human soul’...My ‘determination’...They were not mine, but YOURS.” While Asriel’s SOUL was completely destroyed, Chara’s SOUL shattered into fragments. At least one of these fragments latched onto Frisk's SOUL after they fell, due to the amount of determination that Frisk had, and their shared SOUL trait.

Fast forward to Frisk's fall. I'll state my main points here. I fully believe the narrator theory, but disagree with the possession theory almost entirely (more on that soon).

If you do not believe the narrator theory, you can skip the bolded passage below.

While Chara does not make a physical appearance in True Pacifist Route, I think they become a better person from it. Chara realizes that they were wrong, that Asriel was right, and that not all Humans are bad. And while Chara doesn't save Asriel or your friends, they give you a push in the end, saying "you can SAVE something else".

Asriel's admission that "Chara wasn't really the greatest person" rings true. Chara was far from perfect. However, I see this statement less as him actually condemning Chara, and more as him taking them off the pedestal he’d placed them on, and realizing that they weren’t a good role model. When Asriel addresses “Chara” after the True Pacifist Route, he has low expectations for them, saying "You’ve probably heard this a hundred times already, haven’t you…?", when he asks them not to reset. However, the fact that he was willing to even make an appeal to begin with, saying "Take a deep breath. There's nothing left to worry about", shows that, despite everything, he still has hope, even though it’s not much, that Chara will do the right thing.

(On another note, the fact that you returned in the first place, after Asriel asked you not to, after he said that he couldn’t come back, after you were EXPLICITLY told that the game would end after you left the Underground, doesn’t speak well of your intentions. Flowey’s expectations for Chara weren’t very high to begin with, but I believe that your return further lowered them. It serves as proof to him that maybe Chara hasn’t learned anything from this.)

Then there's the Genocide Route. Yes, the player not only starts, but is responsible for the overwhelming majority of the Genocide Route. No, I don't believe Frisk is possessed, at all, not until we are very close to the end. Until that point, Chara simply provides a Monster counts for us, and Frisk's more aggressive personality is simply a reflection of our actions. With Chara's SOUL fragmented, severely restricting their ability to feel love and compassion (they might benefit from Frisk's SOUL), there's hardly anything left to restrain their worst traits. Once we kill all 20 Monsters in the Ruins, feeding a desire for power, Chara is on board with us. Their dialogue changes from less joking and increasingly apathetic (“Not worth talking to”, “Forgettable”), with a trace of violent overtones (“Where are the knives”), to outright sadistic as we progress (laughing at the RG 01/02).

EDIT: Judging from the dialogue for the stove after killing Toriel and the dialogue for killing dogs in a Neutral Run, I think Chara may (at least initially) have shame for what they are witnessing in the Genocide Route. However the thrill of gaining power ultimately overrides it. It’s essentially a guilty pleasure.

EDIT: Looking back, while Chara doesn’t actually kill anyone before Sans, it’s plausible that they helped us deal more damage in certain fights. A possible reason why we deal so much damage to Toriel in the Genocide Route is that Chara lashed out. Flowey has feelings of abandonment associated with Toriel (”She'll find another kid, and instantly forget about you. You'll NEVER see her again.”). Given that Toriel refers to Frisk as “my child”, and Chara’s final pre-death memory was of their betrayal, Chara could’ve felt betrayed by her, even though she was a decent parent.

I doubt Asriel’s “recognition” of Chara in the Genocide Route is an accurate reflection of what they were like in life. There is ample evidence to conclude that, not only did Asriel genuinely think that Frisk was Chara in EVERY route, but also that he held onto this delusion the ENTIRE time. Furthermore, there are multiple inconsistencies with the interpretation that Asriel will only quickly conclude that Frisk is Chara in the Genocide Route, and takes much more time to do so in the True Pacifist Route:

1. Omega Flowey toys with Frisk in the Neutral Route, despite seemingly wanting their SOUL.

2. Flowey’s dialogue for sparing Asgore in an aborted Genocide Run directly contradicts the notion that he thinks Chara would only be cruel.

3. Omega Flowey saw the name of Frisk’s SAVE file right before the fight, which alone should’ve been enough evidence to make him think that they are Chara.

4. Flowey’s spare dialogue doesn’t change in an aborted Genocide Run, directly contradicting the notion that he doesn’t think Chara would care about anyone else, as he still threatens to kill “everyone they love”.

Here’s something to consider:

Given how long it took for Flowey to go insane, he is likely aware that Chara will not necessarily be as violent as he is. By giving him evidence for him to conclude that they actually are (killing everyone in the Ruins), Flowey gains enough confidence to drop his charade.

Perhaps the strongest piece of evidence that Flowey thinks that Frisk is Chara in every route is his reaction to being spared in a Neutral Run. He should not be confused by the concept of mercy, as he has undoubtedly been shown mercy himself many times during his own resets.

In other words, it’s not that Flowey can’t understand the concept of mercy itself, it’s that he can’t understand why this person specifically would show him mercy. Although Flowey is aware that Chara may not necessarily be as violent as he is, this scenario is different. If there was ANY time to have a kill-or-be-killed mindset, this was it. Flowey gave us every possible reason he could for us to kill him, and sparing him is the strongest challenge to his delusion that Frisk is Chara. He simply cannot understand why “Chara”, who tried to kill the villagers when he refused, would show him mercy after what he said and did.

Asriel makes three colossal mistakes in the Genocide Route. First, he talks as if he's equal to Chara in strength, that he could kill them if he wanted to, saying "Creatures like us wouldn't hesitate to kill each other if we got in each other's way", making them turn on him (I see this line as serving as proof to Chara that Asriel hadn’t learned anything from the village incident). Asriel flees to the Throne Room. We fight Sans, with Chara making the final attack for us. We confront Asgore, who Chara attacks for us. This is where Asriel makes his 2nd mistake, destroying Asgore's SOUL, trapping us in the Underground. His final and fatal mistake is when he begs for his life instead of hiding in the ground. The Chara who Asriel begs for mercy from is, for the most part, soulless; they cannot and do not feel any love or compassion for him anymore. Asriel neglected his own belief that Chara was soulless, when he told them "No... you're empty inside, just like me". Asriel has given Chara plenty of reasons to be angry, and with nothing left to hold that anger back, Chara proceeds to hack him to pieces. This is when Chara finally makes a physical appearance. While there are plenty of other Monsters left in the Underground, murdering the person they loved the most in life is the point of no return for them. This is important because I don't believe that Chara would've intentionally killed Asriel prior to their death, even at their absolute worst, even if he betrayed them. But here? Chara sees killing Asriel as the elimination of the one person who always held them back, and the final step to abandoning their humanity and ridding themselves of the emotions that they now believe only ever hurt them. They've found a better partner, us, one who will always give them what they want. With their goal to achieve power in this world accomplished, Chara believes that its existence no longer serves a purpose, and asks us to erase it. And if we refuse, they think it's hilarious, that we believe we have a choice here. When Chara says "SINCE WHEN WERE YOU THE ONE IN CONTROL?", it doesn't mean they were possessing Frisk, nor does it mean that we never had in control. We controlled Frisk, we had countless chances to abandon this path, but we pushed all the way to the end. Chara has been betrayed before, and was caught completely off-guard. But this time, they came prepared. If their partner tries to turn their back on them like Asriel did, they'll override their decision, because they have final say, and they WILL get what they want.

EDIT: I’m on the fence on whether Chara actually hesitated to kill Flowey. I will say that, unlike with Asgore, they were willing to hear him out at the very least.

As far as the Soulless Pacifist Route goes, I fully believe that Chara kills your friends. However, this is not done out of malice. If Chara genuinely wanted your friends dead for good, they would’ve kept the world erased. This is simply a demonstration of power by Chara, to show that they are the one in control.

Other thoughts:

Despite Asriel’s betrayal, Chara doesn’t seem to hold any strong feelings of hatred or bitterness for him outside of the Genocide Route, and until the “Creatures like us...” line, given how there's no push to kill him in an aborted Genocide Run.

Everything after this point are mostly unsubstantiated headcanons and beliefs of mine. Feel free to continue reading if you are interested.

In my opinion, Asriel’s trauma is often underestimated in fan portrayals. While he has healed to some extent from the True Pacifist Route, taking Chara off the pedestal he once placed them on, his sense of self-worth is still in dire need of repair. How intentional the trauma inflicted on him was is simply a reflection on the perpetrator. It is irrelevant in measuring the damage.

I don’t think Chara is completely fixed by the True Pacifist Route? While Chara has certainly learned something from observing our actions, they still have plenty of work to do on themselves. However, while they can’t change what they did, with Frisk’s help, I think they can try to make up for it by becoming a better person.

While Chara is inherently in a better position than Asriel after the True Pacifist Route (Chara benefits from Frisk’s SOUL and fragments of their own SOUL, while Asriel is completely soulless) I think Asriel will be much easier to help. While Asriel could easily get his form restored by SOUL donations from 7 generous dying Humans, I doubt Chara will ever be able their own body again. The absolute best case scenario I see for Post-Pacifist Chara is them peacefully body-sharing with a consenting Frisk.

Asriel is not obligated to forgive Chara, or (while I doubt he’d be this bitter) even talk to them ever again. That said, Asgore and Toriel owe Chara a lengthy talk. Chara is responsible for their own actions, and their circumstances do not excuse them, but, while they failed themselves, Asgore and Toriel failed them too. This talk can be one for understanding, and, hopefully, reconciliation.

I strongly dislike the concept of killing off Chara under the guise of “setting them free”. It does not heal Asriel’s trauma, nor does it accomplish anything else.

#undertale #chara #asriel #flowey #asgore #toriel #frisk

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chorusnihili · 3 years

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I'd love to hear more about the development of your Gaster! :D

BACKSTORY ASK MEME 1. How did you first come up with your muse’s backstory, if you did at all? Continued from here Also asked by @alagaster

So I left off with the question of just how Gaster's soul ended up in pieces.

I’m actually going to detour at the moment and say that it was around that point that I had decided to make the blog. I had a vague beginning and an ending, and usually that’s not enough for me to want to start, but I was excited, I had a lot of fun, so I went for it.

Honestly, one of the first things I need to have before I even think of making a blog is a good url. Urls are super important to me, and generally, whether or not I think of a good one is a key factor in whether or not I actually make the blog.

But in this case, I was too eager to start and I actually just threw together chorusnihil so I could get started on the pages. The thought process remained the same--the chorus is from Greek plays, the group of characters that narrate the actions occurring in the play. nihil is Latin for nothing--and I later changed it to nihili, which is Genitive, to roughly make the “chorus of nothing” or “nothing’s chorus,” a reference to the fact that the guy wiped himself out of history, and so there’s no protagonist to narrate. This was supposed to be a temporary URL, but I got attached to it, for reasons I’ll get to later.

(And really, isn’t a roleplay blog a modern chorus in it’s own way?)

Also there’s the phonetic pun-- CORE-us, anyone?

So I threw together a lot of the basic bios. Most of the stat pages are really bland, most of the guts of the story comes from the hidden details, most of which were added on later.

Something that came up around this point was Gaster’s relationship to Asgore. A lot of fanon pictures them as really close. A lot of fanon also portrays Gaster as Gaster as desperately wanting to retake the surface, which...as mentioned previously, my Gaster just, wasn’t into.

So it sort of put Gaster in between Asgore and Toriel--he wasn’t happy about the decision to go to war with humanity, but he wasn’t going to abandon everyone, even if he did become really reclusive.

I thought about the idea of the human souls, and I knew that Gaster would immediately hate the idea of working with them. And that was convenient, too, since it allowed me to further separate Gaster and Alphys’s work. At first, it was just a heavy disagreement. The idea that Gaster killed Asgore accidentally came a great deal later, but it honestly served to be a rather critical piece of the story.

The design of the DT Extractor and Sans and Papyrus were also very vague concepts at this point.

Revisiting the idea of his fall. We know from the canon dialogue that he fell into his own invention and that he was scatted across space and time.

The CORE is the common culprit and it was what I had chosen, too. But how? How could an energy source... do that?

So the idea occurred to me that maybe--maybe that was exactly as it was designed to do. After all, even in the real world, we have power plants that operate by ripping apart molecules. So... magic. Why not magic? A machine that derives power out of ripping apart magical energy.

And monsters are made out of magical energy.

Falling into that sounds like a very grisly fate, indeed.

The idea of how he got erased from reality isn’t one I really have solidified. G has a couple of theories, and I’m willing to roll with either of them, but, really? I’m not super interested in making a hard reason for it. Namely to adapt to other versions of fanon other muns might have.

Essentially, the theories say that the CORE destroying him released so much energy that it tore a hole in the Determination that pushes the timeline forward, thus allowing the Void to enter and merge with his soul.

From there, either,

A., his Determination very briefly was larger than that of the Timeline, and he himself invoked a Reset, but given that he was outside of the timeline at the moment, it was corrupted and only erased certain parts rather than fully resetting. I think that this was the original theory that I used in the original RP.

B., the Void acted as a corrective force trying to correct the hole in the timeline. In doing so, it erased Gaster from the reality, thus replacing the existing timeline with a new one in which certain things never happened.

C., something involving the power of Rewrite that Gaster has from the duality of Determination and Void.

D., something else entirely.

And so we had the scattered Unbound Gaster.

Which, funfact, the name Unbound Gaster for the form was supposed to be temporary, as well. It’s a reference to Unbound Hoopa for Pokemon. (Which is why Provoked Form Gaster isn’t called Unbound Form!)

Within the original RP that I developed most of this lore, Refused Gaster didn’t exist. In fact, that roleplay ended with Gaster’s permanent death--and being permanently forgotten to the world. A choice he intentionally made because the damage he did to the timeline by falling into the CORE was still present and only getting worse, and the only way to fix it was to allow his Soul to come together and pass on properly, thus allowing the damage to mend.

It was sad. I cried. I got emotional.

I got attached to a traumatic asshole character I literally had for four days.

Somewhere in here, I began to think about the origins of Gaster. Like, way way way in the past. Some people have Gaster being actively involved in the war, but it didn’t work for my portrayal, of having him be so afraid of humans and the surface. So for it to work out, I had him really young for the war, really young when everyone got driven underground.

I killed off his parents because ......

Frankly I didn’t want to design them :|

There’s a lot of varying opinions and interpretations about skeleton monsters, and it’s a section of the fandom I’ve decided to stray away from for now.

But I didn’t want the loss to be traumatic. Gaster’s been through a lot already, and I have personal vendettas against characters who solely consist of trauma after trauma.

So I decided to make the loss very distant--he’s aware he probably had parents, or maybe he came to be some other way--but he doesn’t remember them, there’s no tragic “my parents were killed in front of me,” it’s simply something he didn’t have, and something he never needed given the nature of monsters to be kind and caring.

...

But it felt like it was missing something.

So I started to toy around with this idea of a mentor, one who played the role of a father-figure, one who would plant the seeds to give Gaster the appreciation of science and knowledge. Someone who could take this lost and terrified boy and start to turn him into the intelligent and steady doctor we end up with.

Then came the problem of how he and this mentor would actually meet; Gaster’s scar proved to be a convenient excuse, plus it gave me a backstory for that, as well. A few humans attacked him and delivered the injury, and Gaster’s mentor found the wounded boy and took care of him.

The mentor is meant to be a vague entity, and you can view this in action in this memory. (Only partially because I didn’t want to name them.) Unfortunately, as per the nature of characters created post hoc, their fate was already sealed. I made the choice to cut their influence on Gaster’s life short.

(If they were around longer, who knows? Maybe they could have prevented some of the stupider things Gaster has done. Maybe they could have changed fate. But... as we’ll get to, everything happened exactly as it had to.)

Again, I made it a very distant loss. It’s a rather simple conclusion that not every monster would be happy vacating the surface--Gaster’s mentor had lived there their entire life. It was their home, they were not leaving, even upon threat of death. And so it was a bittersweet parting, but one with closure, and Gaster said his farewells and departed to the Underground.

Honestly, what I find really shocking about this character is just how intensely he wants to do good. I mean, I’m no stranger to good characters, but few of my characters push it as far as Gaster does, and how quickly that feeling came to me, considering he started in the original roleplay as a ruthless asshole bastard more than willing to fuck over and torture a bunch of children just for a chance at being whole again.

Most of Gaster’s early life in the Underground found in this post was written on the spot as I wrote that post, so it came really late.

I still find it hilarious that he used to work in therapy. You’re well aware you need therapy you fucking bastard. Quit denying it.

So, revisiting the idea of Gaster and Asgore. I do like the idea of them being close, and Gaster even calls Asgore his best friend. The declaration of war put a huge strain on the relationship.

I originally thought about the idea of him accidentally killing Asgore for shits n giggles. At my heart I am indeed an angst gremlin, so I was just thinking about what an alternate timeline where that happened might be like. After all, Gaster’s angry, Asgore’s full of guilt, with the way monster magic works, it wouldn’t be too far of a stretch to think that it could happen.

But the more I thought about it, the more it fit eerily well. The guilt gave Gaster a reason to create Sans (and later Papyrus) as part of his belief in Karma (creating a life to replace the life he took) and to look into Alphys’s research into Determination enough to create the blueprints for the DT Extractor; both of these things were things that I couldn’t otherwise really fit into his storyline.

And finally...

His declining mental state and despair over the concept of the DT Extractor was what led to him being distracted enough to make such a critical mistake and fall into the CORE.

And given that the timeline changes when he falls, I realized that... I could have this happen, and the current timeline be unaffected.

Now, given that I said that I wanted to avoid more trauma in Gaster’s life, this decision might seem contradictory. But, it also served a very important point--Asgore returning to life, that mistake being fixed upon his fall gave Gaster something to hold onto. Something that made his fate not as awful as it otherwise would have been. A small piece of solace in hell.

Plus, Gaster’s guilt at the incident caused him to resign as Royal Scientist, further allowing him and Alphys to have their separate stories.

And pretty much everything snapped together at that point. Really, strangely well. I joked before on this blog if I’m really the one writing it.

If Gaster had not killed Asgore, he would have never created Sans and Papyrus, he would have never created the DT Extractor blueprints; if he did not create the blueprints, he would have never been distracted enough to fall into the CORE, if he never fell into the CORE, the blueprints would have never ended up with Alphys, she could have never created Flowey, and if Flowey was never created, he could have never used the souls to break the barrier and the True Pacifist ending would have never come to pass.

It all happened exactly as it had to.

It feels oddly poetic, given the way Undertale works.

In some ways, it’s cruel. Gaster regularly struggles with the idea that for his people to be happy, he had to literally be wiped out of existence. But in other ways, it’s a comfort--for at least he knows that his suffering wasn’t for nothing. That there was a purpose--that even if he had to be erased, he played a vital role in ensuring his people found victory.

Oh. One final note... In finalizing this story, you may notice that Gaster follows a classic pattern. We have a hero, who’s mostly good, but through his own flaws makes a tragic mistake and seals his own grim fate.

It’s called a tragedy and they’re common in Greek plays.

What was that about a chorus again?

I think that’s just about every important point I could cover. That being said, if you couldn’t tell, this is a very fascinating topic to me, so if you have any further questions or need any clarifications, feel free to send them in.

#let type = out of character #let type = answer

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missholoska · 5 years

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At long last, it’s the goats’ time to shine ✨🐐

(For anyone unfamiliar with my Swap content, see the character sheets for Papyrus & Sans, Undyne & Alphys, and more about Underswap MH here!)

Before the usual further rambles under the cut I want to properly explain one little detail in Asgore’s info box: Asriel being his nephew. I didn’t change this just for the sake of it! It has to do with everyone's roles and actions making sense to me and keeping certain details intact, and I'll talk about it more in Asriel's character sheet but here's the shortest way I can explain it:

Basically Asriel being alive in Underswap and still being Toriel and Asgore's son without any of them aging doesn't really make sense to me, and physical distance doesn't seem enough reason for none of them to have aged a day in 100 years, as Boss Monsters should. I've also seen (and liked) some Swap takes where Asriel instead has only a distant relation to the Dreemurrs or even none at all, but speaking purely for my Underswap it just feels kinda sad for him to have nothing to do with them.

So my middle ground for both of these points is Swap MH Asriel is their nephew instead, allowing him to have a close family bond with both Dandelion and Orchid without any of them aging, and lets him be separate enough to live his own life in Snowdin in UT Monster Kid's role. His parents are dead and about as relevant as MK’s biological parents, which is uh. not at all, but that’s just how it's gotta be.

As I've often said with Underswap MH, I don't mind if this doesn't appeal to everyone! I know it might be odd even with thought-out reasons for it, but in the end I'm still just doing what I want with my version.

anyway on with the enormous amount of extra info for these two:

Because they have no biological children (and to be clear, it's not that they can't have kids, they just didn't), Dandelion and Orchid are physically younger than their UT counterparts. Personally I don't think they were that old when they gained their Boss Monster immortality and I headcanon UT Asriel as 10 when he died, so I see UT Toriel and Asgore as being physically around their late 30s and early 40s respectively.

It took a while to figure out why Orchid would ever kill the six humans because it always felt out of character for a Swap Toriel who retains some of UT Toriel's personality. I can't see her killing anyone voluntarily at first, but UT Toriel is able to kill UT Frisk accidentally, so likewise killing the first human to fall after Swap Frisk was not intentional. She still tried to reason with every human who faced her, but being unable to convince them to stay in the Underground in peace and already having blood on her hands, was resigned to her duty.

On Dandelion's side of events, he still has UT Asgore's traits of being prone to anger in grief and somewhat cowardly about his duty, hence him still calling the declaration of war on humanity but then backing out on it. Feeling like he'd betrayed the memory of their children and knowing he'd hurt Orchid emotionally, he exiled himself to Ruins, assuming that in his absence she would call the war off again.

Orchid's reason for not using a human soul to cross the barrier (i.e. exactly what UT Toriel calls Asgore out on) is that taking the first child's life traumatised her on top of her grief in not wanting to follow the doomed footsteps of her adoptive children. As she's still Toriel she still considered doing exactly that, but wasn't emotionally capable of it and is very aware of her hypocrisy.

...basically if you think the eternal fandom slapfights over whether Toriel is just as bad as Asgore or either of them did nothing wrong are a mess, it's definitely even more complicated in Underswap MH. They both made wrong decisions in grief, but in the end both deserve mercy too.

Orchid's throne room, rather than being covered by a bed of golden flowers, features the same black tree seen in front of UT Toriel's home, with red leaves covering the floor (meanwhile the Ruins has no red leaves). Her throne sits directly in front of the tree and the room is darker, and the original game's room of coffins in New Home is nonexistent as Orchid buried the fallen humans in the throne room to show them what respect she could.

Instead of trying to destroy the Ruins' exit like UT Toriel, Dandelion leads Chara there when they ask to leave and tells them the monsters on the other side will try to kill them. He apologises and says it is his fault for that, and the least he can do is give them the choice to stay with him in safety or prove that they can survive out there, and as mentioned above they can always change their mind and come back.

Dandelion could hypothetically still do the orange/blue eye-flashing attack UT Asgore does, but doesn't because he's the tutorial boss. In Orchid's battle, the orb of her sceptre flashes orange or blue before she attacks with flames of the same colours (she'd also destroy the mercy button with a column of fire).

I spent too much time thinking about whether Orchid should still speak without contractions like UT Toriel, because speech styles are mostly swapped but it's such a Toriel thing, so... I decided her natural thoughts/spoken words still lack contractions, but she forces herself to use them fairly often to try and keep up with modern speech. Meanwhile Dandelion mostly speaks without contractions, but occasionally some slip out.

Given that I'm a Bigtime Soriel Shipper™ it's probably worth mentioning that the role equivalent of UT Sans and Toriel's friendship between Noodle and Dandelion remains platonic, primarily due to Noodle being aromantic. But Dandelion is panromantic and Noodle would definitely be his wingman if anyone took his fancy, and their bond is incredibly important to them both! They basically have one of those friendships where sometimes you just make small talk and chat about mutual interests, and sometimes you both unload your entire life's emotional baggage and support each other's mental health.

and yes because I have to give a mention to my beloved Swap Soriel: Neptune initially has no intention of telling Orchid about his feelings for her because he doesn't want to make their friendship awkward, but he ends up blurting out how much she means to him when she's feeling especially bad some time in post-pacifist. As mentioned above she doesn't feel the same at first and their friendship continues (no man has ever been as genuinely happy to be friendzoned as Neptune), but she begins to return his feelings before too long. There's actually so much more depth to their friendship I'd love to share immediately, but trust me it'll be much better in comic form ;v;

I've forgotten the flower meanings of dandelions I read while I was looking up yellow/gold flowers to name Asgore after, but most of the reason I chose that for him is because I see Asgore as part lion and he is very fine and dandy. As for Toriel, apparently purple orchids represent things like royalty, respect and dignity which sounded fitting!

I swear I absolutely will not let my current pattern of procrastinating on the next character sheets for a whole entire year continue, I want to get the last three done much quicker!! Chara and Asriel will be next :D

#Undertale #Underswap #Underswap MH #Toriel #Asgore #underswap toriel #underswap asgore #undertale art #holoskart #long post //#if read mores still don't work on mobile I am so /so/ sorry :D;;;;#half the reason I delayed this for so long is I just kept getting more and more ideas I wanted to develop properly #anyway in saying that it's fine people don't like my ideas for these two I'm still nervous about uh. pretty much everything in this post #but that's just the typical anxiety of sharing concepts I've been working on for months I suppose ahah;;#also no extra doodles this time bc halloween is approaching and the deadline for my overly ambitious art plan is scaring me #orchid (swap mh toriel)#dandelion (swap mh asgore)

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squidy-scribbler · 5 years

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Since it is November 1st (or at least November 1st in central america which right now it’s like 8am. (WHICH MEANS I CAN FINALLY POST THIS, I GOT UP EARLY AS FUCK JUST FOR THIS. I left my laptop in sleep mode just so that I could easily post this and not ruin Toby’s request ouo) believe it’s time to talk about this theory I have.

I believe Delta Rune takes place in the timeline where “Chara” and Asriel succeed in getting the monsters above ground or in a timeline where Asgore succeeded in getting 7 human souls much earlier then in Undertale. Which can be validated by the fact that him and Toriel seem to be divorced by this point and that he keeps colored flower’s under glass in his room which could be memorials to the fallen children that he took. I however am going to go with the first part of this..mainly because of the title of the game it’s self Delta Rune as in the same Delta Rune that held the prophecy about going up to the surface which I think that Asriel and Chara both fulfilled. And that the red locked door by it’s lonesome is the exit from the underground to the surface.

So let me explain my findings~

First we are introduced to Kris who is Toriel and Asgore’s “child” along with Asriel who is at college right now. Kris is definitely in Chara’s outfit and is taller then both Chara and Frisk so they’re older. and from the ending…..it’s safe to assume that Chara and Kris are the same person. Chara has never been explicitly called Chara in the game undertale..their name has always been the player’s name and the fandom labeled them as Chara due to data mined sprites labeling them as such. I can hear it now though..“but then why is it when you type in “Chara” for your name it calls the game calls it “the true name”? cuz it’s literally short for character..the true name of any person in a game is that they are a character in that game..and without our influence as a player I think that “Chara” could have easily been given the name Kris.

There’s also the fact that Bratty/Catty are enemies and Alphys/Undyne do not know each other. The second of those two options being much more interesting since it implies that Alphys was never the royal scientist and never spent much time in the dump to help those two develop that friendship and also therefore never met Undyne in waterfall or royal guard. Supporting this fact is that by knocking on Napstablook’s house can get the voice of someone calling you darling and Beautiful along with saying that they are a nobody. Assuming this is Mettaton they definitely would be a nobody had Alphys not made them a robotic body.There are also two graves found in the graveyard by the church that are for the ice bird’s mom and for the dog’s pack leader which both had died but had been brought back as amalgamates via Alphys’s experimenting so that never occurred.

So when did they leave the underground exactly? Well as much as I would like to find a more exact time based off of these character deaths the problem of how monster’s decompose is an issue. They turn to dust..so who’s to say that the monster families didn’t just keep the dust in a jar and bury it in those spots at a later date? Another issue with this logic would be that they could have died on the surface. So until further details I can’t base the timeline on that.

However I can base it on how Toriel and Asgore act along with Alphys non royal scientistness that I discussed earlier. Asgore and Toriel are divorced in DeltaRune from what I can tell since it seems like Asgore lives in his flower shop which means that by this point he has probably killed a couple kids one way or another. This along with the fact that Alphys is not the royal scientist can mean only one thing. They had to have left the underground when WD Gaster was presumed to be the royal scientist…and judging by the fact that we have yet to see him it’s safe to assume everyone left the underground shortly after he disappeared.

Another thing to note is that Sans can be talked with as Kris is returning home and he says that he’s new in town. How is it that they were much later then everyone else in getting to the surface? One of the main fan theories is that Sans and Papyrus are fairly new to the underground and were made much later in Undertale’s timeline so by this logic they would have been born or made shortly before or after Alphys was named royal scientist which means this would hold true in the DeltaRune timeline. Meaning that right now the DeltaRune timeline is taking place right around when the skeleton brothers first came to Snowdin in the Undertale timeline. Side note this is nice to know since it could also tell us how old Asriel and Chara/Kris would be if they were alive when Frisk would have gone to the underground in Undertale, of course adding a few years to let the skeleton brothers settle in. Though there is one thing that could throw a wrench into this line of thinking and that is Gerson’s grave.

Gerson is definitely alive and well in Undertale well past when Sans and Papyrus first moved into Snowdin so why does that no longer hold true in the DeltaRune timeline? It may just be an assumption but i’m going to say that the reason for them leaving the underground so soon may have resulted in Gerson’s death. Otherwise this new timeline would have a lot of explaining to do about Sans and Papyrus. Which frankly we need a lot more of already but for now we’re trying to stick to the order of events as Undertale portrays them to be and would most likely happen across all other timelines as well.

With all this in mind what could cause such a need to get out of the underground so quickly? Why would Chara and Asriel succeed this time and not the time they tried in Undertale? and why is Gerson dead? My answer…of course involves our mysterious friend Gaster. Now we have yet to see any inkling that Gaster is alive or dead in this timeline and given that he’s definitely connected to the skeleton brothers i’m going to assume if he had survived that he would be with them. Since he’s not mentioned by Sans (or frankly anyone) as of yet i’m going to say that the event that made Gaster into what he is was in Undertale happened in a different way this time around and somehow Gerson was involved. I’m supporting this with the fact that two of his followers are now normal in this timeline and the fact that Undyne still has her eye. It has been said in Undertale that her and Gerson were close so his involvement allowed for the followers to keep their non Gaster filled lives along with making sure that Undyne never got injured in the eye.

Since Gerson was once a warrior and knows a lot about monster history I would think that having his involvement would mean that the event that made Gaster in Undertale probably was much more of an emergency in the DeltaRune timeline and required the aid of an experienced human monster war veteran. There are also a lot of strong theories that Gaster turning into what he is involved the core so i’m going to guess that since the monsters got out early, this time the event that made or caused Gaster to change resulted in a core meltdown. This would make it easier for Asriel to attack the humans of the surface rather then take their blows since otherwise all monsters would be doomed to die if the core was going to erupt, die, meltdown, etc. This could also explain Kris since Chara’s spirit could latch onto Frisk..so who’s to say Chara didn’t attach to Kris after they separated from Asriel? Or Kris is one of the human’s Asgore killed and Asriel infused Chara into Kris’s dead body before they left the underground? Hell Chara might not have even died this time and their real name could've been Kris all along in both timelines and Chara’s just kinda a place holder name (like Character) as they may have forgotten their real name after dying. But that's all just wild speculation with no evidence. We’ll hopefully find out more later. (Going off from the beginning say Asgore did get 7 human souls early.This could also explain why he did it so soon. He took Toriel’s advice of just using a human soul to pass through the barrier and then come back with 6 more since everyone would die otherwise. Which would explain the divorce but again I still like to think that the Delta Rune prophecy still came true some how).

In conclusion I looked way too much into this and I would love to hear everyone’s thoughts and opinions going forward. This is just how I interpreted all of these elements of DeltaRune and hopefully we’ll know the full story soon enough :D for now I await this chapter 2 and hopefully it’ll bring more answers.

#deltarune #delta rune #gerson #delta rune theory #deltarune theory #undertale theory #ut theory #dr theory #asgore #toriel #chara #asriel #undertale #undyne #gaster #wd gaster #w.d. gaster #og #theory

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topazshadowwolf · 5 years

Text

The Door (Chapter 14)

An Undertale Fanfiction by: Topaz Shadowwolf Undertale is owned by: Toby Fox Setting: Post neutral run when Papyrus dies with chapter intros being before the child fell. Relationships: Sans and Toriel is the main focus, with a little bit of Undyne and Alphys Rating: I’m thinking Teen? Heads up: There are some depressed thoughts, feelings of worthlessness/wanting to die, mention of major character death, and the occasional bad word. Oh, and flowey being flowey, so you know, psychological/physical trauma. I really don’t want to say much more since I really don’t want to spoil anything further down the road…

You can read it on AO3! Here is Ch 13 Ch 12 Ch 11 Ch 10 Ch 9 Ch 8 Ch 7 Ch 6 Ch 5 Ch 4 Ch 3, Ch 2, and Ch 1on Tumblr.

Random thoughts from the writer about this chapter: I’m not dead and I did not abandon this fic. I was just lazy and lacked motivation. I love this fic though, so don’t think I won’t finish it. I might take 20 years, but it will be written.

It had been another dull day in the Ruins. The most exciting thing that happened was her finds while bug hunting. She caught a fairly large snail and a few unique bugs that she eventually released after looking them up. One was one of the smallest beetles she had seen, but it had the shiniest golden shell of all she had ever caught. It was mesmerizing, really, and she couldn’t help but hang onto it for a while to marvel at it as it crawled over her paw pads.

Because the day had been dull, she tried thinking up new and good funny puns and jokes to share with her friend since she wouldn’t have anything new to discuss. And while her friend did seem to enjoy hearing about her days in the Ruins, it didn’t seem fair to bore him with such meaningless drabble as what bugs she caught day after day. As kind as he was, even he must have limits on how much of this nonsense he could take.

When the time came she walked down the hall, hoping to hear her dear friend really let loose with his laughter. It had been a while since she had heard a good laugh from him. It wasn’t like when they first met anymore. She feared he was getting tired of this but was too kind to tell her so. The last few days his laughs had started sounding a bit…. forced.. It can’t be fun or pleasant for him, sitting out there in that cold snow every day just to entertain some silly old woman, such as herself. And yet he made the trips, sat out there, made her laugh, listened to her stories, and stayed for hours for her benefit.

Back when he laughed hardily, she knew he was enjoying himself, but ever since his laughs started weakening… well, it just seemed like he no longer found a reason to come out here. And she couldn’t blame him. He always sounded so tired, too. She knew he had several jobs and yet, she doesn’t insist on him taking a break. Instead, she eagerly awaited him and encouraged him to ignore his own needs. All of this must be putting too much stress on him, especially since she made this an everyday thing. Maybe she should ask him to come out every other day instead? That would give him a day to rest and a day without having to listen to her prattle on about nothing. When she gave him the option before, he had insisted that meeting every day was fine. But she really doubted that now, and was sure she would have to set the schedule. Her dear friend was just too kind to say ‘no’ to her.

Well, as she thought about it, even every other day sounded like too much. She can’t just base her happiness on him. She needs to pull herself together and let him make the schedule. He will know what is best for himself, even if it means they part ways. She will just need to be insistent that he needs to step up in scheduling their meetings in a way that doesn’t make things hard on himself. And, if he were to say he was done, well, at least, for this short time knowing him, she had some laughs and fun times.

That decided, she knocked on the door twice to see if he was there, “Knock, knock!”

“who’s there?”

His voice tore at her soul. It was so heavy with tiredness and sadness that he didn’t sound like the monster she first met. Was this because of her? It seemed hard to believe that she had caused him sadness as well, but perhaps this was getting in the way of other plans? Rationale told her it was something else. This had been a growing problem with him. He hadn’t said that anything was upsetting him in his life but she could hear it in his voice. There was no mention of anything other than work wearing him out. He might not be the most open and talkative about himself, but he did share some things that clearly mattered to him. But this, whatever was causing this, he didn’t share.

Paranoia made her worry that it was her. She wondered if that was why he kept it all a secret. Because she was the source of this sorrow. But, why? Had she done or said something that would hurt him so much?

“Friend,” she started, and he began to reply thinking it was part of the traditional joke, but it wasn’t. Instead, she continued, “What is wrong? Have I done something to offend you? Is this taking too much time out of your day? Truly, you have done so much for me already, you do not need to keep this up if it is a burden for you.”

“lady?” he sounded confused then she heard him shift, his voice getting closer to the doors, “no, lady, it’s… it’s not like that.”

“Then what is it?” She felt tears forming in her eyes as she placed a hand where she hoped his hand might be. Her nails scratched the door as it tried in vain to grab his hand.

Just open the door, you coward…

She couldn’t… for the safety of any other human that fell… and for her people, she couldn’t open this door unless it was an emergency.

“Day by day you are becoming less and less like the monster who first made me laugh so hard. While you are bringing me joy, I fear you are only receiving misery.”

He was silent and she closed her eyes, resting her head against the door, waiting. If he needed a moment to answer then she will give him the time he needed to think over what he wanted to say. After all, he had been too kind of a monster to her. It would not be easy for him to say she was boring and that he didn’t want to visit her anymore. So, she will let him better formulate an answer for her to tell her what she already knew.

But as time ticked by, and the silence grew, she decided to add softly, “We may not know what each other looks like, or actual names… but I still consider you my friend.”

“you’re my friend, too, lady… meeting you here is one of the main reasons i’m able to get out of bed in the morning. sorry, i don’t mean to worry you, but… no matter how i sound, i want to make sure you know doing this, being here… it makes me really happy,” he replied, and she heard a “thunk” as he likely placed his head against the door. “lately... a lot has been happening that is hard to explain and it’s, well, making things difficult. and... it was really… really hard... today. so, uh… heh,” he sounded on the verge of tears.

“Oh, Dishes, I’m sorry,” she replied. Her claws continued to scratch the door as her hand started to ball up with frustration. Again, she wanted to open these doors and comfort him, but…

“don’t worry about it… i’m sure it will work itself out eventually,” he said, but he didn’t sound any more convinced than she was.

“You are truly my friend, Dishes, and I want you to do what is best for you. So, if you need the day to yourself,” Toriel started but her friend cut her off there.

“that’s not really going to help, old lady… being by myself lets my mind cause some… skulduggery,” he said with a soft, chuckle.

The pun earned a soft giggle from her but she still couldn’t help but feel sad by that information. Her poor friend…, “In that case, I will keep you company then.” She tried to push away her saddened thoughts to feel happier for him. “Shall we tell some jokes,” She asked, hoping to cheer him up.

“alright, after that, how about telling me about your day? had to be better than mine,” he inquired.

“Oh, well… I really just went bug hunting and nothing much else,” she apologized.

“that sounds interesting,” he truly did sound interested in hearing about that. Whether he actually was or wasn’t, she didn’t know. But at that moment, he made it sound like it was the best thing he heard all day...

It was nice to just be back in their room at the castle, but not quite like how it felt being in her home in the Ruins again. Toriel was sure Sans also just wanted to return to the Ruins and let it just be them again. She would be lying if she said the thought didn’t cross her mind, and still lingered there. But, as it was, and with everything known, a sense of duty kept her here. There was still a bitterness in her that made her want to neglect this duty. It was the monsters that called for the death of all humans then forced her off the throne after she came back.

Did she really owe them anything? Did she really need to sacrifice her happiness for these monsters who turned on her so easily? She wasn’t their queen, she wasn’t in the guard, nor was she in any position that made her obligated to care about their welfare. And yet, here she was caring about them. She couldn’t just abandon them to a potentially dark fate. At least, not again. This was different than them seeking the blood of innocent children. This was them needing help from a potential threat that even she knew nothing about. A being that could remove her happiness even if she did try to hide. While Sans seemed more willing to accept his fate, she was not. Just as she rebelled against Asgore to try to rescue the humans, she will push her love to protect the peace they had instead of just letting what may happen, happen. So, as much as she wished to return to the Ruins, she couldn’t turn her back on them now.

Besides, it’s not like their time together was limited. That thought was silly. There was supposed to be no more of these “resets” that had plagued Sans and, unknowingly, her and everyone else in the underground. And that also meant they had plenty of time to share.

Well… not completely.

While she was a boss monster, sentenced to continue to live on and never age, Sans wasn’t. Over time he will grow old and die… That thought caused a shiver to travel up her spine. She didn’t like the idea of watching her dear friend and loved one slowly fade in front of her, but she loved him too much to not want him around. That is the sad trial that now was her life, one she will have to accept. She will watch the ones she knows and love wither and die while she will live on, ageless.

Chara’s body seemed to wilt to the illness they had had that resulted in such a horrible and painful death. Asriel, bloodied and broken, stumbling into the throne room and collapsing on the floor only to then dust in her and Asgore’s hands. Then there was Asgore himself, he changed before her own eyes from the monster she loved to… a creature filled with hate and anger. By what she was told by Sans he didn’t stay that way, reverting to his more meeker nature, if not more so.

Looking over at her dear one, she saw he was clearly exhausted and she scooped him up without a complaint. There was that tired, husky chuckle of his that only encouraged her to cuddle him close. She nuzzled his cheekbone and he started to laugh in reply while leaning into her touch. His boney hand reached up, petting the soft fur just behind her ear, and she hummed contently. Her dear, sweet skeleton, all dressed up as a cat, half curled in her arms in an adorable manner, was too much for her to let go. Placing him in bed and going about her own business will not do. So, she moved over to a chair to sit down. She felt well overdressed in this beautiful gown at the moment, but that didn’t matter. It was nice being the white queen with her Cheshire Cat for the moment. She hoped he felt the same as he cuddled close to her.

Soft snores signaled to her that he had fallen asleep and she was happy. Closing her eyes, she held him and thought about all she had learned, all they had been through, and all they will need to go through. If only things could be easy for them for the remainder of their days. But there were still matters left unsolved, things that still needed to be dealt with. There were obstacles that would interfere with their peace. Also, the mental and emotional wounds that were best solved out here before retiring away in peace. Once these matters have been resolved, and once they had true peace, she really saw no reason as to why they couldn’t just retire away to the Ruins once again.

Maybe she had grown used to her self imposed isolation; that being out here, among other monsters, was far more tiring than she remembered. She once was queen and did many things with her people. She didn’t really enjoy crowds then, but she still thrived in them and never avoided them. But now, she would far rather be alone with a good book and those she loves than be among a crowd. She had forgotten what it was like dealing with her people, and now… they weren’t even her people.

Their ruler is Undyne. Yet, even if she was not currently in charge of their well being, there was still a sense of responsibility because she once was. Even if they weren’t her people, they still felt like they were. Although she had turned her back on them, feeling betrayed that they chose to kill humans along with Asgore, humans much like her own Chara, she still didn’t hate them. And while they despised her declaration that monsters should no longer be at war with humans but instead ally with them once more and then sought to overthrow her… she still wanted what was best for them. She was angry with them, as angry as she was with Asgore, but she did not wish harm upon them, just as she wished harm hadn’t befallen her ex-husband.

And perhaps Sans helped with that. She had closed herself off from everyone, even emotionally from the innocent monsters in the Ruins. They knew little of the world beyond the doors; yet, she treated them as if they were as guilty as the ones she heard calling for the death of all humans. But Sans… knocked on the door she used as a physical reminder to close herself off. He invited her to open herself up again, which she accepted. He then made and kept a promise she thought she would never be able to get another monster to accept. He showed her that there was still something to be hopeful for, even though he clearly had little hope himself.

Her dear, dear sweet Sans. She highly doubted he knew how much of an influence on her he had been, and for once she wondered if the same could be said the other way around. Was it possible that she has been an influence on his life and she simply didn’t see it? He had said that before, that she had already repaid him for anything he possibly could have done for her. Sans even expressed that he owed her. Perhaps they were both right, they both have been a great force of good in each other's life.

Yes, it did seem that way, and she was finally now just seeing that. They had helped each other, made each other stronger and better monsters. Neither are in debt, neither owe each other, but both want nothing more than to pay the other back for what they did.

At this realization, she giggled softly before nuzzling her beloved skeleton on the top of his skull. They really were a silly pair of monsters.

…

Oh…

Oh dear…

In her haste to sit down with him, she forgot to grab a book or anything to occupy herself as he slept. With a sigh, she sat there in thought. She could get back up. If there was one thing she knew about her skeleton, he didn’t wake up easily. Though she was comfortable, and getting up just wasn’t something she wanted to do. She was just so content the way she was, even if it meant she was sitting there with nothing to do other than hug her dear skeleton. He was cuddled close, his slow breathing calming her troubled heart and thoughts.

How badly she needed this before. All those nights in the ruins when she couldn’t sleep would have been easily rectified had they only reached this point in their relationship sooner. Toriel closed her eyes, resting her cheek on his skull with a content sigh. How dearly she loved him. She hoped he felt that from her soul. A small green bullet of magic, in the shape of a soul, floated from her to him and she felt her face flush with embarrassment. Normally she was far better at controlling her magic, but at the moment she might as well be a lovesick child again.

To think she would again be like this. Some would think she should feel shame for it, but she really just giggled. It was a pleasant feeling, one she missed. As their relationship matures, they will advance past this, but she will enjoy this for now. She felt everything around her start to fade away as her own tiredness started to catch up with her. Tomorrow morning they were to meet up with Alphys to have a pleasant picnic. For now, though, they can rest. As she drifted to sleep, that is exactly what they did. It just felt like such a beautiful moment, that Toriel clung as long as she could to the edges of wakefulness, to savor this. Their breathing matched, his weight pressed against her, and her arms enveloped him. Soon, she couldn’t fight it any longer, as his soft snores guided her to sleep.

She wasn't sure how long she had slept before a loud knock woke her up. Toriel felt herself jump and Sans shifted on her lap, muttering something that, if she thought about it, sounded like a plea for a few more minutes. This made her laugh softly and she nuzzled her poor dear, enamored about this adorable behavior. Still, the knocking repeated itself and Toriel knew she was going to need to answer. It was obvious that the sleeping skeleton on her lap was not about to get the door. She lifted Sans from her lap and set him in the chair, though she could feel him move again in her arms, hinting that he was really awake. He just fought against wakefulness which took over in the hopes of going back to sleep.

Toriel walked over to the door and opened it to find... well, a monster she had never seen before. "Hello?" She asked before the odd rectangular monster wheeled past her.

"Hello, darling! I hope you don't mind me interrupting your evening but I just heard you were in New Home. I must have you come by my station for an interview. I'm sorry we didn't meet during your time as Queen," He said in a strange, static tinged voice.

"Oh, well, I suppose we could arrange that," Toriel replied, though she was unsure what to think of this monster or what he was saying. She then smiled apologetically. "I'm sorry, but who you are?"

"I'm Mettaton," he said as if that was supposed to mean something to Toriel. When that didn't get a reaction he then added, "The biggest star in the Underground?" Toriel's continued confusion didn't seem to make him happy. Though how she knew that with his faceless features, she didn't know.

"heya, ti-83, what brings you here?" Sans asked from the chair, pulling attention off her and on to him. Toriel was thankful for that, to say the least. She seemed to remember Sans saying something about a robot who was famous in the Underground, but she wasn't expecting this to be him. There must be something about him that the other monsters saw that she didn’t.

"Hello, Sans," the robot said and his tone sounded not that happy about this interaction. "I was hoping you would have come by the resort now that you’re back on this side of The Ruin's doors."

"yeah, well, talk to undyne about that. i was a little locked up in her business," Sans replied. "anyway, i'm free now, what's up?"

"Well, you know your 'show' was popular, for reasons I'll never understand. I want to see what times you would like to book." Mettaton pulled a booklet from some compartment and from the look of it, it was a schedule book.

"huh, i thought you said my show was a waste of time," Sans chuckled then shrugged. "sorry, but i'll pass."

"Look, I know we have our differences, but this is for the people. They miss your stand up and your odd science talks," Mettaton plead but Sans looked away, leaning on the arm of the chair.

"um... yeah, still not feeling like doing it."

"You did stand up?" Toriel asked, surprised by this. "I'm sure you were very good."

"Yes... I suppose you could say that it was good," Mettaton replied. "It was more of a variety show he did. Not even I knew what he was going to do each time... One time he just slept standing up the whole hour."

"heh, good times," Sans chuckled.

"I'll pay you double if you come back," Mettaton bargained. This seemed to catch Sans's attention and the skeleton looked at the robot.

"double, huh? sure, for that much i'll do a show."

Toriel stood back and watched as the two then discussed the when for Sans's show that he will put on. Mettaton tried getting Sans to say what he would be doing, leaning toward a comedy act, but Sans just gave a non-committed shrug. It was clear he didn't know what he wanted to do, and Toriel wasn't sure he really wanted to do this show. Knowing he decided to do it based on the increased pay made her wonder what he wanted the money for as well. They were doing well financially, Toriel had more than enough money for the two of them. And yet, she didn't feel the need to bring that up at the moment. In truth, she felt it would help Sans to do something more than just hide here. Once the two had their business sorted out, Mettaton turned back to her.

"Shall we schedule our interview now?" Mettaton asked. He started jotting down something in his booklet. To her surprise, Sans spoke up before she could.

"i think we'll take a raincheck on scheduling that. i'm sure tori wants to focus more on assisting empress undyne," Sans said, again, leaning on the chair's arm, with his head on his hand, looking disinterested with all of this.

Something about what Sans said, though, interested the robot and he wrote some more. "Oh, you are assisting Undyne, darling?" Mettaton asked while turning back to Toriel. Why had Sans said that? He was also here to help, but the way he said that hinted that it was her responsibility alone.

"Well, yes, we-" She started but Sans got up and walked over.

"we are staying at that castle under undyne's direction so tori can help out with some matters is all. and she needs to focus on that," Sans said, putting an arm around the robot as if they were buddies. He directed the other monster out the door with a kind goodbye though she knew he didn't fully mean it.

There was silence for a moment, Toriel had to admit she was annoyed that Sans had interrupted her and she put her paws on her hips and glared at him. "What was that about?" She asked.

"sorry tori," Sans apologized and shuffled back to the chair. "mettaton was more of a fan of asgore's plan, even if he wanted to be a star among monsters and humans. i guess he just saw asgore being more likely to get him to the surface. do what you want, but i don't suggest going on any show of his for an interview, he'll just make sure the narrative he wants is the one heard."

That troubled Toriel, knowing that some monsters still feel that way about her. It was more than just Undyne who did not like her, and while Toriel never asked to be a loved queen, it still hurt to be so hated. She walked over and scooped up the skeleton to place him back on her lap. He leaned against her, and she could feel contentment from him. "What about telling him I was here to help Undyne?"

"it gives you an excuse to be too busy for him, and it is true... and it was a dig at undyne. one that, even if he supports her, he won't be able to help but spread." Sans chuckled softly before adding, "i made it seem like she needs someone else to help her with the ruling, and, well, who better than you?"

"Sans, that was rather mean to do to Undyne. She," Toriel then sighed and nodded a bit. "I'll admit she deserved it, after all she put us through, but that was still rude to do."

Sans just chuckled and shrugged, "yeah, maybe, but as you said, she deserved it. anyway, she's pretty good at running damage control. and if you decided to show pity on her you can set the story straight yourself. until then, though, let her deal with it."

"I will make sure the true story is heard. I'm not that vindictive. Though, I suppose that can wait until after the picnic tomorrow," Toriel said tapping her chin. It was better than just leaking the truth of what Sans had been through, even if it should be known. It would cause others to have trouble trusting the Empress. This, while rude, won’t be as shocking and it won't be as likely to destroy the faith of monsters in their ruler.

Morning activities were never something he enjoyed, they denied him the ability to sleep in and made him feel tired the rest of the day. Sans wasn’t sure how he got roped into this, but he tagged along with Toriel and Alphys as they found a spot to “stargaze.” This brought back some old memories that felt much older than they truly were, he remembered all the times he took his younger brother out here to look at the crystals and pretend it was the night sky. It was one of the things Papyrus insisted on doing because Sans was interested in stars. Though they did it in the evening and “camped” in Waterfall for the night. Alphys and Toriel somehow came to the decision that morning would work best for them.

Now that he was here, though, Sans remembered the nights he and Papyrus would spend in the field the three currently stood. Though, at that time he was just a child. Sans and his brother would lay in the grass for hours, imagining they were looking at an actual night sky, and the glowing stones above them were real stars. They even made their own constellations and Sans, for the fun of it, charted them. There were many cool and unique ones, along with a few that, as they grew to teenagers and young adults, clearly lacked maturity when named. The earlier ones they made as children had eventually be traded out for far better constellations, far more suited for The Great Papyrus and his brother, astronomer Sans.

Well… the “Butt” constellation with “Fart Gas Cloud,” or F.G.C. for short, were still up there, and still right next to each other. Papyrus had tried making them into something else, but even he admitted, it was a butt. Either that was the extent of their creativity, or that was undoubtedly what it was.

Tori, Alphys, and Sans rested in the grass, looking up at the crystals above. And, upon Tori’s request, Sans began pointing out all those constellations, saving the best for last of course. He heard Tori snort while Alphys rolled her eyes and sighed.

“S-seriously, Sans?” Alphys sighed, “I bet you n-named both of them, didn’t you.”

“actually, i named f.g.c. but paps named butt,” he said with a wink. Relaxing back, Sans sighed, looking back up at those two. He then said, “he named it when he was young… and we couldn’t rename it.”

“Well, it does look like one,” Tori said with a laugh. It was nice to know her humor matched his so nicely. It might seem silly to laugh at a group of glowing crystals that happen to make the shape of someone’s backside, but at least they could laugh together.

“we did argue over the ownership of them. i figured since pap spotted and named it, it should be his. but he didn’t like my fart by his butt,” at the drop of that punchline Toriel burst into a fit of laughter.

Alphys groaned and glared at Sans and Toriel. “I’m h-happy you found someone t-to share your humor with.”

Before Sans could reply, Tori wrapped him up in her arms. Her hug was tight but comfortable, and she nuzzled the side of his skull. Sans cuddled close, enjoying the warmth and softens of the monster he loved beside him. “I am as well,” Tori then said. She looked over at Alphys, who was clearly enjoying every second of this scene. “For the longest time, I thought I would never laugh again. Then… I met Sans. It doesn’t matter to me if our humor is childish to some… we laugh and that’s all that matters”

"heh, and when i heard that first laugh of hers..." Sans sighed wistfully as he thought back on that odd braying sound the had heard through the door that day. That beautiful noise that brought such light to his tired and dark soul. "well, i promised to myself that i would make her laugh again."

Toriel smiled at him and he smiled back at her. It really was a scene that would be thought as overly mushy if viewed by a non-romantic. Sans never thought he was much of a fan of romance until he found Toriel. She had brought forth this want to spend time with her, cuddle with her, court her. And with that came the romantic desires that he never once knew he had inside of him.

He then settled beside her as he listened to Alphys and Toriel as they point out more possible constellations in the crystal ceiling above them. It was fun seeing what their imagination would find among all those tiny lights above them. A few made him chuckle but, for the most part, they were either sweet or anime related. Toriel pointed out the brightest crystal and suggested it be named after Papyrus. Sans did say it should be fully called "The Great Papyrus" to which both Toriel and Alphys agreed with him. Sans then smiled and looked up at the crystal named after his brother. It was now his favorite one up there, and he hoped his brother was happy with the honor of having that crystal named after him.

As he watched the crystal he felt himself slowly drift off to sleep. Well, Tori and Al were doing well enough so he saw no reason why he should force himself to stay awake so he let himself rest. It was pleasant here, in the dark of Waterfall, cuddled close to the monster he loved so dearly, and under the light of The Great Papyrus. If Sans could fall asleep like this every night, or morning, he would be more than happy. He only fought to stay awake a while longer so he could soak in this moment as long as possible before falling asleep.

He should have stayed awake a bit longer, as he woke up with a start when he was assaulted by Tori and Al tickling him awake. Sans rolled around trying to get away only for nothing to work. No matter how hard he tried protesting the fairness of this attack it didn't work. It wasn't until he was out of breath, which was an odd feeling for someone who didn't need to breathe, did Tori pull him up onto her lap and hug him tightly. "Oh, my dear, I couldn't help myself," she giggled and nuzzled him.

"Y-you were snoring over our t-talking," Alphys said, arms folded as if annoyed, but she grinned away.

"eh, sounds like a reasonable reaction, then," Sans chuckled and nestled the back of his head under Tori's chin.

"By the way, S-sans, I'm surprised to see you are w-wearing that hoodie again. Did you like it?" Alphys asked, looking over Sans in the Cheshire cat hoodie she had made just for him to wear.

"More like his needed to be washed and I liked it," Tori said for him and he chuckled and shrugged his agreement.

Alphys giggled at what Tori said and Sans knew at some point he was going to have to get even with his science buddy. She had seen and been able to laugh and tease at a few too many things at his expense to just let it go. Or, he could just let it go... That would be the easier thing to do, really. Besides, in the long run, they are friends, and even though they had prank wars in the past, he just wasn’t feeling that up to it anymore.

“as tori said, mine just needed to be washed, but i’ll admit, al, you do make a cozy hoodie,” Sans replied with a shrug.

Tori and Al started to set up for lunch now that it was close enough to “brunch time” to qualify for a picnic lunch. Sans sat back and watched, intent on having a slice of pie over any of the other foods they set out. A sound caught his attention though, and he turned his head to look and spotted Undyne heading their way. He still had no desire for Undyne to see him dressed as a cat. With that, Sans saw it was time to see himself out. He knew a few good spots around here he could watch them and remain hidden. Perhaps it was silly to care about Undyne seeing him dressed as a cat, but after how she treated him, he just didn’t feel the need to show her any more weaknesses.

He grabbed a slice of pie then stood and saluted Tori and Al with his free hand. “welp, i’ll be around. i’ll see you but you won't see me. have fun.” And with that, he took a step while he used a shortcut to move to a ledge where he could watch everything going on and stay unnoticed.

Tori looked perturbed, but he did warn her earlier. He took a bite of the pie as he watched Undyne walk up to Tori and Al. She started talking with them and looked around as if looking for him. He wasn’t surprised since Sans was not about to leave far from Tori and he was sure Undyne knew that. Alphys gestured to the area around her then Undyne laughed. He figured that was about him, but still, he'd rather be considered a coward than let her see him like this. Besides, he already knew she thought of him as a coward so it was no big deal. Keeping the reputation of a coward is better than adding cute.

“Golly,” A voice said from just behind him. He didn’t need to turn and look to know who it was. After nightmares as severe as the ones he has had, the voice had been ingrained in his skull. “You sure did skedaddle out of there fast,” It said, mockingly.

“heya, haven’t heard from you for quite a while,” He turned and looked at the flower, looking down at the anomaly formed by misguided DT experimentation.

End notes: thanks again to @obsessedkatie for beta reading. Hope you all enjoyed!

#undertale #fanfiction #the door #soriel #sans #toriel #myfic #alphys #mettaton #Well #um #normally this is where I ramble on about stuff #but got nothing #so...#enjoy

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