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#stay the same like if they were assigned male they were like im a gay man then were like oops actually im a woman OH im a lesbian
oh-for-fic-sake · 3 years
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The Deal Part Three
Summary: august doesn't know how to lose.
Warnings: Adult Situations +18, Slight Smut, Mentioned Threesomes, M/M, M/F/M, poly relationship, Toys, Seduction, Dom Sub, BDSM, Praise Kink, Swearing.
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August hummed running a finger back and forth on the rim of his glass as he watched the screen,you were on the bed rocking onto your new toy like crazy.
"She really does this everyday?" Clark asked from beside him with a frown, but august could see the kid was turned on, licking and biting his lip as you fucked yourself desperately with your new vibrator.
"Everyday, for a week now..." august hummed twisting his chair to and fro flicking his gaze from the subby on screen to the soon to be sub sat beside him.
"... am i? Am i not enough?" Clark asked tentatively blinking at agaust in a way that made the agent smile smugly.
"Its not that kid, shes gone without playing our game for soo long she forgot how addictive it is, how much she needs it" he explained.
"Needs? Have... i mean shes missed it?" Clark uttered feeling less confident in his ability to satisfy you by the second.
"Probably not, well not untill our little experiment"
"Why?" Clark asked still not understanding
"Being a sub is... more then just sex, subs need to submit its therapeutic for them... when in a scene they just let themselves go, all worry and stress disappear. All they need to do is live in the moment and obey" august began slowly as he stopped swaying his chair and faced clark head on pinning him with a look.
It was there, the curiosity. Good. Its what he hoped for, it was why he'd called clark there to 'catch up'
It was time to make his move, top the man of steel whilst having you making your own little porno in the background to help things along.
"So she cant truly relax without it?" Clark muttered still unaware of the agents motives.
"In a sense yes. She craves being dominated, its as natural to her as being a goody two shoes is for you" august purred placing his drink on the glass computer table fendingnoff a smirk as clark took the bait.
"Hey! Im not a goody two shoes-" the kryptonian grunted offended.
But august was prepared, he'd planned this meeting meticulously and his anwser rolled off his tongue with a laugh.
"Your thirty five years old and have absolutly no run ins with the law, no parking fines no speeding tickets hell you never even had a single detention in your entire shcool life! Or have you handed in an assignment or book report in late"
"But i killed a man- i took a life" clark tried to argue but was waed off with another laugh.
"Zod was no man, he was a fucking alien... no offence, you took a life to save billions... so its not really making you a badass"
"Lazer vision is pretty badass..." clark huffed slumping back in his seat now looking like a classic putig brat.
"Oh? Is my litttle clark sulking?" August cooed gravely voice making clark pause at the sultry tone... he must be hearing things.
"Im not sulking! And im not your anything!" Clark growled snapping at the agent.
"Behave yourself!" August growled leveling him with a look, and couldnt help smirk again as clark shut himself up and flushed.
Your desperate cries called out over the moniter as you rutting onto the toy the wet sounds adding to the scene.
Clark flushed finalky turning away from august making the agent preen. Oh he had him in the palm of his hand already~
"Good boy. You are arent you? A very good boy clark- the best" august purred leaning forward gazing at the younger man with a cheshire grin, that only grew wider as clark flushed brighter and shuddered.
"I.. err well yes" clark panted shiftingnin his seat tryingmto keep his eyes on the screen as you wailed and yelped trying to draw out a climax.
"Oh whats this? Your going all shy on me? Tell me is it because i called you a good boy~ do you like praise clark?" Augusut grinned leaning closer still to the now frozen younger male
"N-no its err... i should go-" clark started shuffljng backwards needing to get out of here, because it was true. He loved praise especially in the bedroom, he loved being told how good he was.
August purringnat him whilst he eyes were fixed on you rollingnaroundnin bed toying yourslef into a sexual frenzie was... making him think of thingsnhe probably shouldnt.
"No. Sit, stay... thats it, theres nothing to be embarrassed about, many powerful men enjoy being praised" August growled latching onto clarks arms holding them to the arms of the seat.
"Being taken care of, told what to do~" august purred standing befor the mighty man of steel leaning close to his face.
Clark gulped but didnt move back, he didnt pull away like he should have.
Instead he eyed augusts lips, clark had the overwhelming urge to.aste them.
It confused him, he'd never ever dabbled in same sex relationships, never experimented. Never shared a woman with another before that fatefull night.
But for some reason august was apealing, drawing clark in. August was apble to overpower him, not physically but he commanded obedience.
August held a dangerous cocksure demeanor that clark rarely saw.
"Is that what you want? Clark~ do you want to be controlled and praised just once? More then once?" August hummed dippjng closer and closer, clark couldnt help tipp his head up.
"Y/n is always such a brat. Just look at her, desperately trying to fuck herself into a coma, despite knowing we hadnt allowed her to touch her pussy" august pulled the pffice chair clark was sat in to closer to him, making the kryptonian drown in his scent, the cologne and sweet arousal that was alreading sworling arohnd him.
Clark swallowed dryly, unsure what was happeningnto him, the sounds of yu moaning a crying ot so sweetly, the praise and authority radiating off august in waves.
It was the same dominant aura and comanding deep voice that had made crks cock twitch in both threesomes they had indulged.
Clark had tried denying it at the time, convincing himslef he was cuaght up in the erotic forbidden act. It was just a thrill of the moment thing. It didnt bmean he wanted the older dominating alpha male and all his bravado.
August grinned shifting forward again filling clarks vision, for a human auguast was large, almost as large as he was.
"Sure she'll listen when she feels like it but... I can't help thinking she needs a role model..." clark hummed absentmidely nodding agreeing falling further into his own haze.
"Someone else to show her how she should behave... someone who will get rewarded for being soo good... maybe a good boy?" August purred finally taking the plunge and weaving jis way around the man. His words coiling around the younger male ensnareing him in his carefully constructed web of teasing words.
Clakr gasped as his chin was captured by the agent forcing him to look him in the eye.
"Would you like that clark? Do you want to be not just a good boy, but my good boy-our good boy?" The words hung in the air, winding the man of steel.
"W-what?" He stuttered tryingnto fathom what the older man meant. But couldnt deny the excitment in his gut.
Did he mean it? Would he really include clark in this kink? Make it official and let these forbidden threesomes continue?
"Oh dont play coy, i know what your thinking~ its natural to be curious, just think we could all be one~" august whispered movjng his thumb over clarks bottom lip.
"We could all play together and all get what we need." He purred smirking as clark gave all the right signs, eyes wide, pupils blown wide shifting in his seat as he cock rose, curtesy of both his praise and the loud wanton moans from you bringing yourslef to the edge of rapture yet again.
"You get the praise and love of a little brat, and a strict dom, y/n gets a role model, a dom and keeps her life partner" august listed shifting on his feet again reeling clark in with low coos full of promise.
The agent curled his hand, cupping clarks cheek coaxing him closer luring his face closer.
"A-And you?" Clark dared to utter, feeling both excited, anxious and overwhelmed, he wanted nothing but to jump at the chance, but was frightened at the same time.
He would admit he'd been a little jealous of all the praise you'd got from august in both encounters.
Closingnhis eyes imagining it was him! That the older influential man had been calljng him a good boy, had been teling him how impressed he was, how proud he was!
Clark was embarrassed and had quickly shook away the desperate thoughts. He wasnt gay, why would he have such thoughts?
He summarised he was just too needy and had gone without. You told him how brilliant and big he was, how sexy and strong and fantastic he is in the bedroom but... with august it was different.
The older male praised down at him! Cooing and fussing at him in a different way. Treated him like a sub and clark liked it. Probably too mucn.
"I get the little brat i've been missing and a very very good boy"
"So what do you say, do you want to let go? Be free and experience things you'd only dreamt of?" August preened keeping clarks attention fixed on him asmhe manipulated him, august had noticed clark had a praise kink.
A weakness. A need who was august to pass up useing the little kink to get the subby he wanted~
"I...I'm..." clark hesitated looking passed august to you on the screen who was digging around beside your bed looking for something.
"All you have to do is say the words clark, just say yes sir and you can have all the pleasure and praise you could ever hope for~ both you and y/n we could make this permanent"
"See look? Just watch, y/n needs her dom, needs to be tamed again we could do it clark... you can show her how to be good again~" august breathed over clarks cheek side steppjng him to reveal the screen.
And clark did look, groaning as he saw that you had rolled over and was straddling a different suction cup dildo stuck to a little hand mirror face up on the bed slapping your own ass as you bounced frantically.
"Just say those words and we can help her together" august hummed into his ear like the devil on his shoulder, tempting him
Clark gasped feeling augusts breath on his neck, his wisters ghosting the delicat skin.
Then in a bold move the older man pressed a soft feather light kiss to the kryptonian's neck.
And it worked
"I... y-yes, can we? Please sir" clark breathed out stuttering and jumbling his words unable to hold back his pleading.
"Good boy clark~ such a good seet boy you are~ i knew it, knew youd be brave enough, you've made me soo proud" august showered him with praise biting off a victorious grin.
Clark mewled closingnhis eyes for a second beaming a smile feeling this strange relaxation take over, suddenly he felt free, and small.
It was a feeling he craved, being the strongest all the time was a heavy burden to bare, now he could feel powerless for once.
August chuckled and pressed another kiss to clark this time on his cheek making the younger male's cheeks glow.
August couldnt get enough, the power trip of having the man of steel under his command was far to intoxicating.
"Now why dont you go get our little brat and we can tie her up and show her that good subby's get rewards" august prompted him stepping around clark completely letti g himstand up.
Clark nodded and shot off out onto the balcony and leapt into the sky eagwr to please his new dom and do as he was told.
August took his seat agin wrappjng his fingers around his glass of scotch and raised the glass to the screen that now had both his subs onscreen, as clark wrangled you into his arms wrapping the bedsheet arohnd you.
"Mission accomplished" he hummed smirking as clark wrapped you in your soiled bedsheet before you both disappeared off screen.
He stood and knocked back the last of his drink and padded across the pent house heading to the play room just as he heard both of hos little subs land and enter his home.
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queenofallwitches · 3 years
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an update and primer:
so the last winter was weird. I had a complete breakdown, went into psychiatric hospital for 40 days in total. two seperate times.
learnt a heap of new things, met a tonne of cool people and had amazing conversations and few fights but overcome my own demons by that.
brain speaking-I have a scarred brain stem and neurological disorder is not a mental diagnosis, but a neurological disorder, proven by MRI scan, ADHD.
also damage to my basal ganglia, and prefrontal cortex.
neurological diagnosis means ADHD is not a "mental" health issue, as some believe, rather a neurodevelopment disorder caused by structural differences in the ADHD brain.
other neurodevelopment disorders include: Tourettes, Autism, Cerebal Palsy, Dyslexia and other Motor and Intellectual Disabilities. (Which recieve, in my view, a lot of insight, media information and stigma reduction by the advocacy networks surrounding these types of disability).
Over the last few years Autism has been over everything, I've seen mainstream media cover Tourettes and yet ADHD is still HUGELY misunderstood, misconceived and misrepresented in media, be in from the angle of documentaries, personal insight of a "typical" case, films, tv, and other media.
one of the first things my dr told me was "in females it rarely presents as hyperactive red-cordial OD child"
which is what my mother BELIEVES, that is because I have an adopted cousin with the ADHD dx who was that growing up, but the representation I'm told is also divergent for women with a higher IQ score than the average IQ. I come in around 142 and tested 123 at age 3 when I was unable to focus, pay attention and had severe trauma. I tested 142 in grade 8.
I'll share my experience as a female who is intellectually gifted, with higher IQ than average, and an adhd brain:
I've been told gifted and talented "genius" children are harder to diagnose because the symptoms present differently, we hide it better (camouflage) and our focusing can be "faked" by mediocre efforts of academic success.. this is true, I would do the assignment the Sunday night hours deadline, last minute, or have my parents half do it for me, plagiarise it (fuck I've killed my whole academic career now) copied but changed my words
from old 1970s encyclopaedias I KNEW they couldn't cross reference (I went through 15 years of school never studying doing homework or assignments and still had top grades).
I literally did not listen, and spent my classes planning the end of the world survival strategies with my GT friend who, basically helped me with my calculus and hard fucking maths, which was the ONLY 50 minutes of the day I put attention into my work.
now I'm going to be heading back to full-time study in the coming months, I get anxious as the pressure of a Bachelor level degree, and the pressure it takes me to perform, is enough to break me down. I've been advised it might be wise to start light (like a basic vet style diploma) and then build up, which is logical, but I keep thinking I'm meant to be doing my thesis by now. which is the kind of pressure one gets as a kid who is told repeatedly, "your intelligence is exceedingly the average and you can do ANYTHING you want"
I wanted to be an astronaut, a storm chaser, and an architect, a town planner and then a journalist. I always held to being a "FBI agent" or spy (I wonder why). so when I found psychology is really a blend of all these things, I kinda found a niche in a psych and social science double degree. but I'm thinking my academic career is LIFELONG, and due to the fact I also want to work in my field alongside my many written thesis coming, I'll be in academics for a long time. I may fail a few things, which I have to come to terms with. I do not fail easily, or readily, but I'm a perfectionist type-a academic who will put my whole life on the line to achieve "merit". I get exams, I get assessments, I read journals super-easy, I talk the talk and walk the walk so well psychologists who are at masters level compliment me on my "knowledge".
when it comes to mental health and trauma, I will always have the personal attachment, called lived experience, which will make failure and burnout, 100 percent realistic. I have to boundary up, bootstraps on, and prepare that yes, my personal "bias" will probably be entwined in this.
which is why I'm looking at the social science for the statistics and thesis writing side of things, and the counselling for the trained therapist side. either way, the degree of counselling requires so much self-insight, and then the social-science will back me away from personifying it. the other choice is criminology, which leads to forensic psychology, which is eternally fascinating. my main concern is the pro-pedophile content Ill be up against, which will look at the anatomy of a shoplifter akin to the devil, and leave the pedophile in the DSM-5 dx "paraphilia" box.
I'm not joining or jumping to anything.
either way I've got 2 year of credit, a heap of pathways and a lot of "academic momentum" from all my life being aimed to be "academic powerhouse". I went through my files and found a lot of awards I'd won in my high school, and top place in the competitions we would be entering in. I remember feeling so sad if I had a "credit" vs a distinction or high distinction, only to see now, a credit in university maths in year 9 is a skillset I don't have anymore so, good on me. or a credit in English, or Science at that age was pretty impressive, considering these tests were random and not studied for.
just a general skills assessment only the top 30 kids in the year were to take on a year by year basis and put out to vet from the top universities and taken by other kids in the same grade around the state.
it puts so much focus on my intelligence, because it's primed to be that way, I know that is true. I know I feel good being academically successful and it gives me a feeling of "achievement" but is it really for me?
I also found 2 letters from my local politicians offering me job placement, work experience and I was 1/4 kids in my 10th grade graduation tom get the letter, and due to my behaviour I pissed ALL the idiots who bullied me off. I was "too pretty to be a nerd" "too smart to be pOpUlAr".
so I made a group of misfits, who are all highly intelligent, creative and my group had the ONLY gay male in the school AND THIS IS BEFORE YOU FUCKING RETARDS MADE IT "COOL". he was bullied badly, so fuck you, you fucks claim "liberalism" but I bet you were the type of idiot who bullied guys like him in high school while you pretended to like my chemical romance and fake cut yourselves. I hate you all, forever.
my grade was full of idiots who were fake emo, who left the scene the moment the scene changed to dub-step and club music. I was there, watching you all, like sonny Moore, went from FFTL to that dubstep skrillex shit he started in 2009.
I dated you, hooked up with you and I went to your gigs. I know who was real and who was fake. I met some of you years later and realised the more emotive ones were the less "alternative appearing".
I can say 1/10000 emo guys from the 00s were genuinely Into the music and scene for the right reasons based on my dating history and this can and will be analysed statistically using SPSS one day to prove a lot. I've had too many relationships from each sub-culture and I have had 4-11 males at a time per public "output" of my energy pursue me over life.
I'm not being cocky when I say I have a long line of "suitors" and its banked back about 50 men. it's been a thing I've avoided as it seems to grow based on my body shape, attitude, appearance, so I am currently out of touch with dating scenes, no interest to try that ANYWAY, given the fact that I have had so many LONG TERM relationships ANYWAY. I can't see another one going well, and at this case, I'm living with an ex but we never went on conventional and now our families label this 3 things: "asexual", "polyamorous" and "open relationship". I'm also "bisexual" but this all to humans outside, looks ridiculous on paper. (wild orgies and lots of swinging or some stupid sex magick probably is what J brother literally thinks we do).
bc humans are intrinsically designed to need to label things they don't understand. we share a lease, not a relationship, and fucking polyamorous, I WISH. there are no girl-girl-guy 3 some, or orgies, or sex magic parties.
this has changed the attitude and perception of this "relation' which Is non-romantic, non-sexual. he can date and likely, will, as can I , and I likely won't date.
I would say 14/15 have had ADHD, or other mental illness and or trauma. which means to me, nothing at all.
I think this "open book" non romantic relationship style of "friends and roommates" not sexual.
attachment is misunderstood by others but works well fro my adhd, meaning I'm not expected to marry, or be a wife in any capacity. he is free to do what he wants, as I am, and open communication is a novel frontier I brought into this in the start, and stayed with for the duration. we fight, but I fight with a lot of people in my life over many petty things. also down to my adhd, I believe, I have rejection sensitive dysphoria, which makes me hypersensitive to rejection, perceived or real.
im not sure if this is trauma or adhd or both. but
I have used sexuality as a weapon in many relationships but it cannot or will not be used here, so I have had to resort to uncovering parts of myself which I never knew, which will stay with me even if he decided to marry and wife up in 5 years, which I'm okay and expecting him to do, and I would much rather that then be trapped in a situation where I cannot be that "wife/mother archetype" as I'm too "femme fatal/other-woman/sex-laced seductress and siren" a "FWB, unicorn, drug buddy, hook-up where im a therapist" or "intellectual and cognitive mind-bender work-study obsessed woman".
both at once and many types of human, including one who is a full-time ceremonial magician of 7 years. I will drink, drug, fuck, fight like males and still be more feminine and high maintenance than 89% of women. I grew up a tomboy and don't mind getting into fun, adventure based situations, like hiking, or anything adrenaline, I would only be reluctant to eat weird shit.
I also have many "neurological" issues including ADHD, and trauma which causes a rupture in the average human and I dating.
I'll tell you how many men have said "you are the unicorn" and then realised what that means, I went as far as canvasing the PUA world back in 2014 after reading the game, a book on PUA, which is essentially, pick up artistry, based on NLP and hypnosis. I did this after reading the copy my ex in 2008 handed me before we dated saying "I gave this up for you". it took me years to open the book, buy when I did I truly believed the only way I would fall in love again, was through PUA. that failed in so many ways but gave me a training foundation for men who were candidates for that, I have trained up J, and the way that sounds is BAD. I know, but I got a lot of value myself, I just don't see it how I wanted to see it.
but that was my original intent, and I achieved this he knows that, knew it was happening and evolved for the best self.
I am thinking we can modulate this into a business model for how I was operating in the BDSM world was mainly psychological, not physical.
I get told all of is incredibly intimidating (I am told) to women and men.
I don't really care anymore, because people have always seen this part of me in the wrong way ANYWAY, but I own who I am NOW. which is what I needed ANYWAY. so it cannot be stolen again, and sexual healing has come from abstinence ironically.
I also don't care what or who is trying to tear up my relations, toxic or not toxic, all people around me will be on a healing journey by default, or cut out of my life, for I am radiating that energy so brightly its impossible NOT to feel that pull.
I will drag your shadows into the light, and make your secrets spin from your lips into my consciousness. its not what I do but its what is design.
I make your weaknesses mountains to climb over. you cannot hide from these in my presence, I won't be this controlling or obsessive female who wants 24-7 attention as I have a life full of meaning without love or sex. I don't want to be wined, dined or expensively gifted, unless specially requested.
I don't want love letters or romantic declarations, this isn't some femnazi bullshit, but it triggers me. I appreciate the efforts and won't make you feel bad about your insecurities, for mine are probably 30 x more pronounced.
I appreciate small things, that most males won't or don't know how to do. like remembering things I've said and being thoughtful. or knowing my silence isn't personal, or a game, but a protective wall. I've had songs sung too me, guitars played, songs written, or things made in ways that are heartfelt. but I've always had them used against me too. so it is the context. I value time, energy, conversations of depth and reciprocal exchange. I also value trauma understanding, my alters and fragments being accepted and valued as me as a whole and a person who is not afraid, or scared of stupid stuff like sensitivity, emotions, feelings as raw as my own. men feel intensely too, lol.
but will only give oral sex 100 times before I don't recieve it, I can communicate now so that wouldn't happen.
but I won't be a bitch about this stuff. I am extremely feminine and care in ways other people, do not, I forget nothing people tell me, so it can be a reward or reverse uno card pull in a fight, but I am not evil or deviant in my relations. I react, depending on how you treat me. I don't need your money, or providing source of income to be okay as I am my own queen, however sharing resources is okay to build something. I don't need to be seduced, but will need to be shown a person is trustworthy.
few cross that.
that will always be time-endurance and testing. there are ground rules I don't play with, or play games. or like being forced or forged into something I'm not. I know abusive and I know safe, and I am a psychology expert, trained psychotherapist and study humans for fun, so I'll always be analysing things.
and I know red flags and I know ego, I know how to placate and please and pleasure, but will only do so, for a bigger and better reason than the mere act of seduction. which is without value and transactional to someone like me, I won't lie.
and I know every tactic in the book, for the book was written by someone like me, many lives ago, and my karma is being burnt for that book.
in terms of walls, I have many, may it be called a maze. or labrnyth.
I will teach you things you never thought you'd know, and change your life in ways you won't ever be able to go back to before. I will blow your mind, sexually, emotionally, intellectually, on all levels, and I'll make your friends and family love me.
I'll bring your walls down and you won't be able to understand this, because you don't understand me, and thats ok.
but I'll always understanding you and make your life better because thats what I do anyway, and people talk to me about things I will never share, as I keep secrets. I am jealous, of everything but, only because I am attached in a disorganised way, and working on that.(I won't even mention how man women or men don't know basic psychology of themselves). I also am a therapist , for my friends and family too.i should not be , but I am. I care, I listen, If you think I'm not listening, I'm still listening. sometimes I interrupt, because I have ADHD and I am horrible at resolute planning, or being "normal". but I don't want to be normal anyway. I need you to recognise and understand my shit, for that is what I do for everyone in my life, and I have helped more than I receive.
I'll probably accidentally give you therapy, but thats fine, because you will uncover your depths and find meaning in this. it's not something that goes bad unless you are fundamentally, evil, even the most abusive relationship I was in, was benefited from this process. yes he's still narcissistic, but he is self-aware. and did I benefit, never, just know the anatomy of self-proclaimed narc and I still can't hate him. will get my civil claim one day.
I will fuck your mind without meaning too. but thats because I fuck my own mind. but the meaning is made in the man- some find this highly offensive or personal (its not). I fuck minds by my own overthinking, or over perception on many levels of reality. so join the ride, or don't come along at all. because once the rollercoaster is in motion, I have no control of what may or may not happen. it's purely experimental.
I am experimental.
and the women who are judging me, are not any better.
look within, and shut the fuck up. self-improve and quit this jealous divide and conquer bitchiness. I HATE gossip, bitches, snitches and fakers.
I look to other women who are intellectually, physically and spiritually "individual". and find value in superior status to my own, which is something my narcissistic ex taught me.
I look for mentors, and teachers and people who will teach me how to improve myself, which I am fearful to reconnect after something is amazing and I can't give anything back of positive value. I am sorry I am working on that.
I won't devalue those below me, but I also need to be mutually benefiting from a relationship.
I dont drag people down, I may disappear if I feel I am doing this by mistake. I am flakey as fuck, and sorry for that. its anxiety and lack of perfectionism, so I am wrong and bad for this. I can change. will change.
if you can find value with my relation, personal professional or romantic, we can move into a symbiotic beneficial agreement based on mutual "terms". but many won't or cannot see this, nor do I impose my bullshit into the lives of randoms at this age.
I don't care if this is cruel, it's real.
I value loyalty, compassion, self-insight/awareness, someone who understands all parts-spirituality, metaphysics while still having intellectual & logical & analytical brain-sight.
I enjoy music, magick and learning new things.
I do not care about appearances I dont think ive dated based on one time. I do value connections and chemistry which is far-few between, I hate fakers. I smell insincerity miles away. but I do respect women who are well-presented, or beautiful, with hair beauty and makeup, I can't do this shit well, so I look up to those who are in professions who do it like art. I find them to be genius level queens who scare me.
I call out bad behaviour and make people uncomfortable if they are repressed. I will change you without even meaning too, I don't even need to date you. its just my presence, over time, amplified by the intensity of the dynamics.
I don't want simplicity, but I also don't need over complexity.
I value passion, independence, creativity, curiosity, problem-solving, deep-disscussions, shared adventures and some occasional risk-taking (lol), sensuality and sexuality for a common cause beyond physical pleasure. I like being taught but not micromanaged. I need my own independence, and need to be trusted with that. I hate being scolded for that like a child, or being pushed to change my ways to conform to societal values. which I will push back and refuse to do. which is not healthy. I don't adult like many others do, but I try to proceed in other ways. and learn to adult like normal people, accept me.
I also value myself, and how I can be celebrated, enhanced and improved vs. the opposite.
I give space, and have boundaries, and understand human psychology, sexuality and relationships in ways few others unless they are trained, can do.
I value MY time. so you can have space to value YOURS. I dont need to be in anyones pocket for a long time. I love being alone, and being around people who are stimulating, but draining people will be drained out of my life quicker than I intend. I am sorry for the people who felt I disappeared, when I was only trying to be 'fair', if I feel I'm a bad influence, I will work on myself until I'm not. I'm still working on it.
I also use this psychology awareness, to enhance communication, connection. you may or may not become an accidental guinea pig. I will be upfront that I am experimental, but that is part of the buy ticket and take the ride. lets work together. not apart.
I am coming from a place of love, and love is what I feel for my animals, which you will be adopting as children.which I want to stop experiments being done on. I love love, in all ways, but hate cruelty of animals and children, violence and suffering. I dont advocate justice, because I find life is fucking cruel, unfair and unjust. by default, so I focus on myself. what can be changed, and what I am able to do in my own locus on control. I will always find myself drawn to the outsiders, the misfits, the vagabonds, the misunderstood. I want to help people who are society, or socially, disadvantaged by trauma and mental illness, but only when I have ability to help myself.
it's a journey.
I will not date anyone who is cruel to animals, outside of specify magical sacrifice, there is not any place for that. nor will I date or fraternise with anything or anyone linked or associated with pedophilia. I won't judge anyone on anything that are outside animal cruelty and pedophilia. I don't and haven't. I keep on good terms with every ex, bar 1 whom I only apologised too this year. it felt good to do that. I change my behaviour.
I am open, but also highly attuned to both logical, factual, empirical , scientific worlds, and spiritual, intuitive, psychic and the "collective unconscious". I walk in both these realms, and I am "conventionally attractive". which puts a lot of pressure on me, to be "stupid". I am always dumbing myself down to fit into normality, but I look ridiculous if I do that so I peacock my intellect.
only to be misconceived.
I give up because I no longer care how anyone but MYSELF can see ME. I won't dumb myself down , but I can enhance you UP. prepare yourself for graded education, evolution and self-growth on mass scales.sorry not sorry.
that sucks for the people who want to be living vicariously through me, for making up to lost trauma years, for family who sold me out for the success I'd bring home, or fake trauma enmeshed friends, or whatever they want or need from me. I value my time and energy, and have given that in abundance, and if you want to be with nut only "one part of me that is alters". I can't provide that now. not sorry.
I have to work on something or not be in a dynamic at all.
I no longer can switch on demand to adapt for you, it will not be effective and that upsets a lot of people. especially now I'm sober. harder to handle this, as I see the world for its ways and why it is, more vividly. I haven't had alcohol for almost 2 months, although, I could drink, I haven't.
I can't do it, anymore. it, being, faking, my selves fronting to impress. I can't. I have no more left to give, and I'm expected by everyone to be a way I can't do it in the way they want.
I will go to another year long outpatient DBT, followed by 10 weeks of A-C-T therapy, and however many ECT OR TMS may or may not help. I'm told it won't (ect) work. but TMS, is something I am open too. but I am telling you, none of this psychotherapy, that will be based on dbt skills, day therapy, intensive skills training, recommencing my studying, and resuming "life worth living" will or can wipe the traumas I've "recovered" memories for.
I will also shut the fuck up, and tell nobody about this if you leave me alone, I told that to my family, and this is open letter to the watchers, stalkers and perps who read this openly as I track the hits on here and have 200+ visits a day every day for the last month. globally. no idea how or who you are but I think its the same people who called the police for the "ayreon song lyrics" seen to be a suicide not last October.
thanks for that wake up call, I have shut the fuck up, since December, more so now. I will burn the journals, or lock them up.
my recovery is not linear, not yet fully integrated and I trust nobody so I don't think my psychotherapy will be deep, I focus on things like ADHD AND my EDNOS. and dbt skills. I won't be talking about sexual traumas.
enjoy the update, and thanks for the "attention".
I have my goals, my work, my meaning and what my life should and could and will look like, but I will not share that with anyone. that means everyone right now.
I've been tested, traumatised and terrorised to the point of not-tolerant of anyone who may bring that back, and banish the fuck out of my sphere every moment I need.
take me as I am, or watch me as I go, which I will go, where I am not wanted I will remove myself, but I will find where I am celebrated because I create that.
I will rise up against all adversity every time but that is survival and that created a resilient and brave woman, in me. who will not be destroyed or decomposed by humans who are fundamentally fucking evil.
I gift you my truth, in progression, and give up the pain of the past.
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assbestos · 5 years
Text
how I figured out I was trans
TW for self harm mention (not graphic)
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I haven’t known I was trans for my whole life.
When I was little, I liked dressing up in dresses and wearing heels, playing princess and house, looking after baby dolls and so many other stereotypical “girly things”.
I found out I was LGBT when I was in seventh grade. Around that time, I had started to become interested in the LGBT community on tumblr, and I knew I wasn’t straight. I liked girls and boys (and aliens). So, I figured I was a pansexual cis girl. But being cis didn’t feel right. I didn’t feel like an actual girl, and I never related to other girls with their experiences. I figured I was just gender fluid, right? I’m a girl because I like to wear makeup and dresses, but I’m also a boy because I can’t relate to girls.
Then I got an app called Paper 53.
I’ve always been a creative person. I draw, paint, song, dance, act; you name it, I do it. So I drew on paper 53. They came out with a social media platform called “Mix” where you could share and “remix” other people’s art by altering it. We were close knit, us og mixers. I started going by the name Jake on mix. It felt right. I felt I wasn’t hiding who I was to my friends! They all thought I was a boy, and it felt okay! That was the first step in my discovery of myself as a trans man.
Another thing that made me realize I wasn’t remotely a girl was fandom, surprisingly. I was a fan of a ton of shows and anime’s, and I blogged about them constantly. I had so many favorite characters, but they all had one thing in common: they were all male. Weird, I thought, you would think that being born a girl would let me sympathize with characters of my same sex, but it didn’t. I liked male characters because they reminded me of myself. I started going by the label demiboy. I told my friends, and they called me jake, and used they/them pronouns when we were outside of school. Then came my last year of middle school.
People were relentless. They asked me why my name was different on Instagram or on Snapchat. Why did I want to be a boy? Everyone seemed weirded out by me being open and out, so I inverted. The only place I had was with my friends and mix. I was weird, creepy, gross. My peers laughed at me and ostracized me and my friends. Turns out, all my friends were basically LGBT, so we were in solidarity to each other. I also hated my body. I only wore leggings and an oversized sweatshirt. I cut my hair short and stopped playing with makeup. But I was still a girl I’m my peers eyes.
I didn’t want to give up the feminine side of me. I LIKED wearing cute dresses, I LIKED putting on makeup and jewelry. I just wasn’t a girl! I didn’t understand, why couldn’t I have just been born a boy!
I wore a dress to my middle school graduation.
Then, we had a graduation party. I didn’t want to get in the pool because I didn’t want to change in front of anyone and have people look at my feminine body. I eventually gave in though, donning an unflattering one peice that compressed my chest. Then the worst thing possible happened. “Come on! Jump in the water, jake!”
Someone had outed me. It was a boy who I was only acquaintances with. Everyone stared at me. I felt like a freak. I just jumped in so they would stop staring. I was furious. My carefully kept secret was exposed to the whole class. I got out and changed back into my clothes, trying not to cry from anger. The one thing that made me feel better was my best friend chewing out that guy.
Freshman year was supposed to be a new start. It wasn’t. I was trans and in hiding. My only joy was theatre, wich was full of the most wonderfully supportive people I’ve ever known. I loved them all. Sorry if this gets rambley, I’m a bit emotional now. I still hid from them though, wich I regretted. I regret that every single day.
Honestly, high school was a blur until senior year. Mix, my safe haven where I could be who I wanted, was shut down. I lost contact with my internet family. I spiraled. Theatre was taken over by the teacher who hated my guts. It became work rather than my passion. I was failing. I was crumbling. My only hope was college, and how was I going to get there now that I was digging myself a hole made of missing assignments and failed tests? Eventually, I cracked. I started self harming. I just wanted the pain that was inside to be outside, I wanted to purge and get rid of it. I was caught one day and I was sent to the hospital for a wellness check. They suggested I go to a thing called a “partial program”. It’s basically group therapy with other teens who are in similar situations. I loved it there. Mid way through my stay I came out as trans, and they all accepted me. I finally was out. So much pressure was off my shoulders and I could be who I wanted to be. They all called me jake. They used he/him pronouns. I was finally happy. I came out to my parents, who supported me! They still don’t quite get it, but they’re trying and I appreciate that so much.
Now I’m much happier, I’m 3+ months clean, I’ve been out at my college and I may possibly start t this year! Im an open, feminine, gay trans man! I’m so excited for the journey ahead of me and just know that all you bbs who are having a hard time, just know it gets better. It will get better and I promise you that! I wear dresses again, i wear makeup for fun, and I do all the things I was afraid to do while closeted!! Again, I promise it will get better. Anyway, I’ve got to go now because I’m crying so hard I can’t see my screen, bye!
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star-anise · 5 years
Note
do you have any sources on the claims you made? im always willing to change my stance if you have legitimate backing for it haha
So first, I’m sorry for blowing up at you the way that I did. I’m not proud that I reacted in such a kneejerk, aggressive fashion. Thank you for being open to hearing what I have to say. I’m sorry for mistaking you for a TERF, and I’m sorry my response has caused other people to direct their own hostility towards you.
So, here’s the thing. “You can’t call bi women femmes” is pretty intrinsically a radfem thing to say, and I am deeply opposed to letting radfems tell me what to do. I’m trying to write this during a weekend packed with childcare and work. I’ll try to hit all the high notes.
The one thing I am having trouble finding is the longass post I talked about in my reply, that was a history of butch/femme relationships in lesbian bars, which had frequent biphobic asides and talked about “the lesbophobic myth of the bi-rejecting lesbian”; the friend who reblogged it without reading it thoroughly has deleted it, and I can’t find it on any of the tags she remembers looking at around that time. If anyone can find it, I’ll put up a link.
As far as possible, I’m linking to really widely accessible sources, because you shouldn’t intrinsically trust a random post on Tumblr as secret privileged knowledge. People have talked about this at length in reputable publications that your local library either has, or can get through interlibrary loan; you can look up any of the people here, read their work, and decide for yourself. This is a narrative of perspectives, and while I obviously have a perspective, many people disagree with me. At the end of the day, the only reason I need for calling bi women femmes is that You Are Not The Boss Of Me. There is no centralized authority on LGBT+ word usage, nor do I think there should be. Hopefully this post will give you a better sense of what the arguments are, and how to evaluate peoples’ claims in the future.
I looked up “butch” and “femme” with my library’s subscription to the Oxford English Dictionary because that’s where you find the most evidence of etymology and early use, and found:
“Femme” is the French word for “woman”.  It’s been a loanword in English for about 200 years, and in the late 19th century in America it was just a slangy word for “women”, as in, “There were lots of femmes there for the boys to dance with”
“Butch” has been used in American English to mean a tough, masculine man since the late 19th century; in the 1930s and 1940s it came to apply to a short masculine haircut, and shortly thereafter, a woman who wore such a haircut. It’s still used as a nickname for masculine cis guys–my godfather’s name is Martin, but his family calls him Butch. By the 1960s in Britain, “butch” was slang for the penetrating partner of a pair of gay men.
Butch/femme as a dichotomy for women arose specifically in the American lesbian bar scene around, enh, about the 1940s, to enh, about the 1960s. Closet-keys has a pretty extensive butch/femme history reader. This scene was predominantly working-class women, and many spaces in it were predominantly for women of colour. This was a time when “lesbian” literally meant anyone who identified as a woman, and who was sexually or romantically interested in other women. A lot of the women in these spaces were closeted in the rest of their lives, and outside of their safe spaces, they had to dress normatively, were financially dependent on husbands, etc. Both modern lesbians, and modern bisexual women, can see themselves represented in this historical period.
These spaces cross-pollinated heavily with ball culture and drag culture, and were largely about working-class POC creating spaces where they could explore different gender expressions, gender as a construct and a performance, and engage in a variety of relationships. Butch/femme was a binary, but it worked as well as most binaries to do with sex and gender do, which is to say, it broke down a lot, despite the best efforts of people to enforce it. It became used by people of many different genders and orientations whose common denominator was the need for safety and discretion. “Butch” and “femme” were words with meanings, not owners.
Lesbianism as distinct from bisexuality comes from the second wave of feminism, which began in, enh, the 1960s, until about, enh, maybe the 1980s, maybe never by the way Tumblr is going. “Radical” feminism means not just that this is a new and more exciting form of feminism compared to the early 20th century suffrage movement; as one self-identified radfem professor of mine liked to tell us every single lecture, it shares an etymology with the word “root”, meaning that sex discrimination is at the root of all oppression.
Radical feminism blossomed among college-educated women, which also meant, predominantly white, middle- or upper-class women whose first sexual encounters with women happened at elite all-girls schools or universities. Most of these women broke open the field of “women’s studies” and the leading lights of radical feminism often achieved careers as prominent scholars and tenured professors.
Radical feminism established itself as counter to “The Patriarchy”, and one of the things many early radfems believed was, all men were the enemy. All men perpetuated patriarchy and were damaging to women. So the logical decision was for women to withdraw from men in all manner and circumstances–financially, legally, politically, socially, and sexually. “Political lesbianism” wasn’t united by its sexual desire for women; many of its members were asexual, or heterosexual women who decided to live celibate lives. This was because associating with men in any form was essentially aiding and abetting the enemy.
Look, I’ll just literally quote Wikipedia quoting an influential early lesbian separatist/radical feminist commune: “The Furies recommended that Lesbian Separatists relate “only (with) women who cut their ties to male privilege” and suggest that “as long as women still benefit from heterosexuality, receive its privileges and security, they will at some point have to betray their sisters, especially Lesbian sisters who do not receive those benefits”“
This cross-pollinated with the average experience of WLW undergraduates, who were attending school at a time when women weren’t expected to have academic careers; college for women was primarily seen as a place to meet eligible men to eventually marry. So there were definitely women who had relationships with other women, but then, partly due to the pressure of economic reality and heteronormativity, married men. This led to the phrase LUG, or “lesbian until graduation”, which is the kind of thing that still got flung at me in the 00s as an openly bisexual undergrad. Calling someone a LUG was basically an invitation to fight.
The assumption was that women who marry men when they’re 22, or women who don’t stay in the feminist academic sphere, end up betraying their ideals and failing to have solidarity with their sisters. Which seriously erases the many contributions of bi, het, and ace women to feminism and queer liberation. For one, I want to point to Brenda Howard, the bisexual woman who worked to turn Pride from the spontaneous riots in 1969 to the nationwide organized protests and parades that began in 1970 and continue to this day. She spent the majority of her life to a male partner, but that didn’t diminish her contribution to the LGBT+ community.
Lesbian separatists, and radical feminists, hated Butch/Femme terminology. They felt it was a replication of unnecessarily heteronormative ideals. Butch/femme existed in an LGBT+ context, where gays, lesbians, bisexuals, and transgender people understood themselves to have more in common with each other than with, say, cis feminists who just hated men more than they loved women. 
The other main stream of feminist thought at the time was Liberal Feminism, which was like, “What if we can change society without totally rejecting men?” and had prominent figures like Gloria Steinem, who ran Ms magazine. Even today, you’ll hear radfems railing against “libfems” and I’m like, my good women, liberal feminism got replaced thirty years ago. Please update your internal schema of “the enemy”
Lesbian separatism was… plagued by infighting. To maintain a “woman-only” space, they had to kick out trans women (thus, TERFs), women who slept with men (thus, biphobia), women who enjoyed kinky sex or pornography or engaged in sex work (thus, SWERFS) and they really struggled to raise their male children in a way that was… um… anti-oppressive. (I’m biased; I know people who were raised in lesbian separatist communes and did not have great childhoods.) At the same time, they had other members they very much wanted to keep, even though their behaviour deviated from the expected program, so you ended up with spectacles like Andrea Dworkin self-identifying as a lesbian despite being deeply in love with and married to a self-identified gay man for twenty years, despite beng famous for the theory that no woman could ever have consensual sex with a man, because all she could ever do was acquiesce to her own rape.
There’s a reason radical feminism stopped being a major part of the public discourse, and also a reason why it survives today: While its proponents became increasingly obsolete, they were respected scholars and tenured university professors. This meant people like Camille Paglia and Mary Daly, despite their transphobia and racism, were considered important people to read and guaranteed jobs educating young people who had probably just moved into a space where they could meet other LGBT people for the very first time. So a lot of modern LGBT people (including me) were educated by radical feminist professors or assigned radical feminist books to read in class.
The person I want to point to as a great exemplar is Alison Bechdel, a white woman who discovered she was a lesbian in college, was educated in the second-wave feminist tradition, but also identified as a butch and made art about the butch/femme dichotomy’s persistence and fluidity. You can see part of that tension in her comic; she knows the official lesbian establishment frowns on butch/femme divisions, but it’s relevant to her lived experience.
What actually replaced radical feminism was not liberal feminism, but intersectional feminism and the “Third Wave”. Black radical feminists, like Audre Lorde, bell hooks, and Kimberlé Williams Crenshaw, pointed out that many white radical feminists were ignoring race as a possible cause of oppression, and failing to notice how their experiences differed from Black womens’. Which led to a proliferation of feminists talking about other oppressions they faced: Disabled feminists, Latina feminists, queer feminists, working-class feminists. It became clear that even if you eliminated the gender binary from society, there was still a lot of bad shit that you had to unlearn–and also, a lot of oppression that still happened in lesbian separatist spaces.
I’ve talked before about how working in women-only second-wave spaces really destroyed my faith in them and reinforced my belief in intersectional feminism
Meanwhile, back in the broader queer community, “queer” stuck as a label because how people identified was really fluid. Part of it is that you learn by experience, and sometimes the only way to know if something works for you is to try it out, and part of it is that, as society changed, a lot more people became able to take on new identities without as much fear. So for example, you have people like Pat Califia, who identified as a lesbian in the 70s and 80s, found far more in common with gay leather daddies than sex-negative lesbians, and these days identifies as a bisexual trans man.
Another reason radical feminists hate the word “queer”, by the way, is queer theory, which wants to go beyond the concept of men oppressing women, or straights oppressing gays, but to question this entire system we’ve built, of sex, and gender, and orientation. It talks about “queering” things to mean “to deviate from heteronormativity” more than “to be homosexual”. A man who is married to a woman, who stays at home and raises their children while she works, is viewed as “queer” inasmuch as he deviates from heteronormativity, and is discriminated against for it.
So, I love queer theory, but I will agree that it can be infuriating to hear somebody say that as a single (cis het) man he is “queer” in the same way being a trans lesbian of colour is “queer”, and get very upset and precious about being told they’re not actually the same thing. I think that actually, “queer as a slur” originated as the kind of thing you want to scream when listening to too much academic bloviating, like, “This is a slur! Don’t reclaim it if it didn’t originally apply to you! It’s like poor white people trying to call themselves the n-word!” so you should make sure you are speaking about a group actually discriminated against before calling them “queer”. On the other hand, queer theory is where the theory of “toxic masculinity” came from and we realized that we don’t have to eliminate all men from the universe to reduce gender violence; if we actually pay attention to the pressures that make men so shitty, we can reduce or reverse-engineer them and encourage them to be better, less sexist, men.
But since radfems and queer theorists are basically mortal enemies in academia, radical feminists quite welcomed the “queer as a slur” phenomenon as a way to silence and exclude people they wanted silenced and excluded, because frankly until that came along they’ve been losing the culture wars.
This is kind of bad news for lesbians who just want to float off to a happy land of only loving women and not getting sexually harrassed by men. As it turns out, you can’t just turn on your lesbianism and opt out of living in society. Society will follow you wherever you go. If you want to end men saying gross things to lesbians, you can’t just defend lesbianism as meaning “don’t hit on me”; you have to end men saying gross things to all women, including bi and other queer women.  And if you do want a lesbian-only space, you either have to accept that you will have to exclude and discriminate against some people, including members of your community whose identities or partners change in the future, or accept that the cost of not being a TERF and a biphobe is putting up with people in your space whose desires don’t always resemble yours.
Good god, this got extensive and I’ve been writing for two hours.
So here’s the other thing.
My girlfriend is a femme bi woman. She’s married to a man.
She’s also married to two women.
And dating a man.
And dating me (a woman).
When you throw monogamy out the window, it becomes EVEN MORE obvious that “being married to a man” does not exclude a woman from participation in the queer community as a queer woman, a woman whose presentation is relevant in WLW contexts. Like, this woman is in more relationships with women at the moment than some lesbians on this site have been in for their entire lives.
You can start out with really clear-cut ideas about “THIS is what my life is gonna be like” but then your best friend’s sexual orientation changes, or your lover starts to transition, and things in real life are so much messier than they look when you’re planning your future. It’s easy to be cruel, exclusionary, or dismissive to people you don’t know; it’s a lot harder when it’s people you have real relationships with.
And my married-to-a-man girlfriend? Uses “butch” and “femme” for reasons very relevant to her queerness and often fairly unique to femme bi women, like, “I was out with my husband and looking pretty femme, so I guess they didn’t clock me as a queer” or “I was the least butch person there, so they didn’t expect me to be the only one who uses power tools.” Being a femme bi woman is a lot about invisibility, which is worth talking about as a queer experience instead of being assumed to exclude us from the queer community.
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telling-our-stories · 5 years
Text
Coming out stories
A heads-up. These are the original stories, however, they are anonymous. This wasn't intentional, I just screwed up and didn't tag. These stories, aren't mine, so if I've posted yours and you want it taken down. Please, just ask me.
Alright.
I am tired of people who are against the LGBTQ+ community. Its alright to have an opinion. It is not alright to put people down for being themselves. The first pride was a riot, a fight for what they believe in. I'm trying to do the same. I'm trying to gather the stories of the fallen, the ones who are still standing, the people who are willing to fight for everything they are. And I am fully willing to take a stand and fight to prove we exist. To prove that we're here, and we aren't backing down.
Hello, my name is Dustyn. I'm here today to collect stories from the LGBTQ+ community. There's a lot of people who are against us, which is exactly why we need to stand our ground. I'm not asking for a fight, I'm asking for your stories. My story is not yet finished, though I'm a bisexual trans male. Our stories are important, because they show who we are and how far we've come. I've struggled a lot in my life, but I've made it. So have others. Here are some of those stories. We'll start with mine. I've gone through many identities, mostly trying to figure myself out. I'm still doing that. My family doesn't accept me for me, but I have many friends who do. There are so many accepting people in life, and I appreciate all of you who are proud to be who you are. Whether closeted or not, you are all valid and amazing.
"Hello my name is Melissa and i am bisexual. My family didn't really have a harsh reaction to it other than the fact that they didn't understand it at first. That was most of my trouble was people saying that bisexual wasnt valid. Im sorry mine is so short but i think the moral is that you are valid. No matter what you identify as on any spectrum in the LGBTQ+ community. Also even if your outside of the LGBTQ+ community and your just an ally. We love you and you are all valid.”
"Salutations everyone. My name is Talan. I am non binary, panromantic and i am currently between asexual and demisexual. I was raised in a very christian household where my mother and father had very strict beliefs. They believed that being anything but straight and to me being anything other than my assigned gender was a sin, and many people still say that to me. When I came out to my dad he flipped, he took me out of school for a year and put me in online school. During this time in my life I had reached a dark time where i thought that it was never going to get better but trust me it does. I am still living with my dad who does not accept me and at this point we don't talk that much, but it does get better. We have gotten to the point where we can have a civil conversation with each other and im back in school. I have an amazing girlfriend and multiple qpps who i love very much. Everybody at school is very loving and supporting. Remember that family is not chosen for you, you make your own family. If you ever feel down than just know that there are so many amazing and kind people in the world who love you for who you are, no matter what that may be. You are loved."
“I'm glad you reached out to me, anything to help people understand more about the LGBTQ+ community. I am 19 now and I came out to my family at the age of 14. My parents were the typical ones who said it was just a phase and it would not last but here I am five years later and I made it through. There was a point where I had no one to turn to but then i met my amazing boyfriend. He helped me through the good and the bad and showed me that there were things to stay for. I am now in college and pursuing a career in photography at the University of Arizona. I hope that could help a bit!”
"Okay. Well. My coming out experience was definitely not expected in the slightest. I was in the 5th grade. Realizing that I liked both boys and girls was quite the revelation. I had a lesbian friend who was the first ever gay person I met or knew. I remember being backstage of a show I was in and just crying through the words, "I know I'm supposed to love guys, but I love girls too". After that. I didn't tell anyone else, until 6th grade. I was a track meet and a group of people I sat with was talking to my lesbian friend about kissing. I forget the exact conversation, but I spoke up and said I would kiss her. A Christian girl in my class was nearby and heard. She was disgusted. Therfore by the end of the week, I was completely outed to my entire school. It was ugly, but it got better over time I guess. I'm a junior in high school now. I have yet to come out to my parents, but at least I know that I am finally comfortable in my my sexual orientation and gender identify (demigirl, which I didn't figure out until a few short months ago)."
"Hey, I haven't actually come out to everyone yet but I have told a few people and all of their reactions were positive "oh you're bi? cool" and that was it. No "so do you like me?" or anything which was super great. So I was "straight" and when I heard about the LGBT community I was "straight" for about another five days. I did some thinking and realised I'd actually liked girls before, and shortly after came out as bi to a few of my close friends at the time. They were all supportive, bar one who said "you're just looking for attention lmao".Coincidentally, she had also come out as pan and had received the usual "you're attracted to pans?". I go to a Christian school, so it would be pretty disastrous if the news leaked out, but naturally it did. Not everyone knows, maybe about 10% of my grade. I suspect some teachers found out about how some people were LGBT (not many though, there's about 5 of us), because our dean of year gave the "you're too young to know that" talk. Mostly at school we get sheltered from all LGBT news and details at all, and my parents hadn't told me much about it either, even though they are supportive and would be okay if I came out as bi."
"I'm bisexual. I first came out to my elementary friends over the phone 3 years after we went to different middle schools. They were mostly all so accepting and I was so overwhelmed I hung up on them. I spent a few minutes laying on the ground clutching that phone to my chest, I'd never felt so loved. I cried and cried and cried because these people atleast the ones who accepted me see me different now but are okay with it. Two years later, now, I still haven't come out to my parents. I still need a few years but I'm a little bit more open at school now most of my friends accept me. Others were cut off, I can't do that with my family so they still don't know. Not as if they would take me seriously either way. I want to get past college get a place a stable life then maybe I'll be ready, just maybe. Thank you for listening to my story."
"I was surrounded by my Uncle and his husband for years. I always knew that gay people existed. When I was younger I never thought anything different of myself; I thought I was one of the boys.
 It never really clicked that I was the only one who saw it that way.
When I was 7, my mother and sister suggested I take dance I shot them down saying "that's for girls."
They didn't get it.
I wasn't entirely sure what came over me in that moment either but I know it felt right.
As myself and the people I knew grew up I realised I wasn't happy with the way I looked. I tossed it up as your typical dislike.
~every girl went through that at my age didn't they~
All the girls I knew were so happy that they were becoming women and I just sat in the back wondering why I didn't feel the same way.
I still didn't get it.
Once my depressed state got worse I decided to read into ways to love yourself and your body.
I started taking selfies, dressing up, wearing heels and makeup, forcing myself to sing even though I hated the way I looked and sounded.
It got worse.
I broke down when nobody was looking and acted like it was fine; like I wasn't praying that whatever I was feeling would go away for even a second.
And one day I looked in the mirror and I thought "this isnt right. This isn't me. This isn't what I want. Who in the hell is that person staring back at me?"
And I accepted it. That I would never be who I should be. That I would never be happy. Because nobody would love me. Nobody would want me. And nobody would accept me. Because if I was happy then that meant my family wouldn't have had the little girl theh thought they had gotten.
And up until recently no one knew that I broke down every night, that my thoughts got so bad I wanted to drown in my own tears so that maybe it would all be over. Because to me coming out to them was worse than death.
And here I am years later. My family knows but they don't care. They don't try to comprehend that this repression it kills me all the time. So I gathered my money got myself exactly what they told me they would never let me have and I lie. I go behind their backs and I live like the man I really am online. I bind my chest and I hide from their sight and when they ask I say it's just their eyes.
Because if they knew - if my mother knew - they would rather me suffer day after day than be who I am."
"heyo, i read your post and id like to put something to it.
i am a part of the community, havent came out to my parents yet, because i know for a fact id be sent to a psichologist or thrown out. but i am me online
an old friend of mine is a trans guy and found me a few weeks ago. he said he saw that i support LGBT+ and it was so comforting for him. a friend who i haven't talked with for 9 years!after he told me that he lost half of his family for being himself, his dad ignores him since, but he has a boyfriend and got his life together
and that i could be a little comfort for him is really nice. even the people who are closeted can be helpful in the community."
"Well, my mom took it well. I had gotten stuck in my closet and then she got me unstuck and I told her I was queer.
My brother, we were sitting in the car and he told me he always knew, but I had to keep it a secret from my dad or else bad things would happen.
My friends hugged me and started to use my name and pronounsSo coming out to my dad and stepmom, it wasn't even a coming out but a forced outage.
They took my phone away the night of a Panic attack that I still have nightmares over and searched it. They read all my messages.... everything.
I wanted to scream for it to stop, but I knew it wouldn't. They told me that they loved me, but I had to stop being me and I have to go back to being a girl who was cishet
But once you have a taste of freedom of who you really are, you can never go back ...I couldn't hide again. I just had to wait till I could spread my wings and be free somewhere else."
"Ok so for the thing you tagged me in, I don’t exactly have a coming out story yet, and I’m not sure of my identity entirely. I’ve tried out tons of labels and am sticking with queer at the moment just cuz it takes the stress off of picking an extremely definite word to describe me. I came out as queer last year, but I don’t consider it a coming out story because 1) I only told my friends and not my family, and 2) queer doesn’t completely define me. In real life, I’m doing my best to go back in the closet, but I think my “friends” may have told other people who spread rumors around my school, so it’s been difficult. A bunch of people make random references to me liking boys (I’m amab) and it made me uncomfortable enough that I started telling them I’m straight. I’m planning on staying as far in the closet as possible until people get more accepting and I understand myself fully."
"It's not a coming out story (mostly) but it's a realization of sorts.
Yesterday our Social Studies teached asked us to form groups and discuss a contemporary issue that we would present at the front in a few minutes. Long story short I suggested LGBT+ community and rights, which my group mates accepted. I live in a really conservative country (with at least 81% of the entire population identifying as Christians) and that's an extremely taboo topic. It ended up leading the teacher asking us to raise our hands if we believed the lgbt community should be allowed Civil Union, not considering religion an all. I was so afraid to raise my hand, but it was what I believed in and I couldn't live with it if I didn't show it, so I raised my hand. I didn't really do this as a member of the community, I wasn't thinking of myself. I was thinking of a world where this is accepted in my country, where I can go outside and be open and love whoever I wanted to, and I guess the idea of standing up for what I believed in was what pushed me to do that. A big majority of the class was against, and I was just so afraid even though some small logical part of me knew they would not do anything.Today, our Civics teacher had us grouped again to make a live news report and once again, my group (international news) got assigned lgbt+ community because of our listed problems yesterday. I suggested interviewing a member of the community and basically came out to two people I knew were trustworthy (nearly all three other members in that group but thank God I think the third one did not hear) and we agreed that I could be used if I only had my voice recorded and edited to not sound like me. Just a few hours ago I found out that one of my classmates, who I thought was a nice sweet boy, turned out to be a big homophobe. "Sodom and Gomora and Liberals are teaching unnatural things" kind of guy.I guess that broke something in me, because another thing I was really passionate about for when I grew up was this certain job, though no one supported me. I used to want to do that so much the idea of anything else repelled me, sometimes the idea of the other more "acceptable" jobs brought me to tears. Somehow this one admission that I thought everyone should have the right to at least a civil union and finding out my classmates didn't believe in that crushed something in me hard enough that I lost the passion to do that job I wanted. It makes no sense how this connected with that apart from the fact that neither are things I have been or would be supported on, but I guess seeing that this world isn't really safe made me lose hope.I felt scared to raise my hand, almost like I was actually coming out (which I now realize I'm absolutely never doing to many of those people) and the realization that some place I thought was a safe space for me, because all of those people in that class, I thought I could trust them. I've been with them since before I could spell "friend" correctly, they're family to me, I believed I would be safe and accepted, and then came to find out that wasn't quite the case...But well, basically I was terrified then crushed to find out that I could have outted myself to a group of people who would not take my news lightly
Found out some people I thought were friends thought people like me were broken
Found out some people I used to have the biggest crushes on didn't even believe in letting people have a civil union."
"I’m very excited to see brave people like you ready to start a revolution, so I thought I’d share my, sorta, coming out experience.
So I have divorced parents meaning I’d have to come out to four parents. This happened mainly last year. I was pretty sure I was bi, (tho I now identify panromantic demigirl) I knew my dad and stepmom would be great with it, and they were. But when it came to my mother, well, she wasn’t really homophobic, but she had different ideas about how a gay person should behave. She outed me to her after overhearing a convo with my friends. She then told me I was too young, and gave the “its a phase” talk. She knew I was fairly open about it because I lived by a motto to “be so myself that other people feel brave enough to be themselves too” But she believed a gay person should keep it a secret. Nowadays I don’t believe in the process of “coming out” I am open about my sexuality and gender but I don’t do formal coming outs. I always believed that if straights don’t have to, neither should I just because I “don’t fit a default” My mother wants me to come out to my stepfather even tho he already knows. I thought sharing a coming out story that also showed you should never feel obligated to come out. My mother guilt trips me about it, but I remain rooted in my beliefs that I shouldn’t have to come out, which I think is valid.
Hope my story can help anyone and just wanna say you are so so valid, amazing and powerful and should never feel pressured to be open if you don’t want to. Long live the revolution!!!🏳️‍🌈."
"Hello! I read your post about collecting LGTBQA+ stories and I thought Id share my brief experiences as a bi girl from Germany ^^
Tbh I never made a big deal about coming out, as I personally feel it goes to show that we're revealing a wierd secret, and Id like my sexualtiy to be something normal, not a main identifying characteristic. And everyone of my friends or classmates that I mention it to appear to have no problem with that whatsoever, and as far as I know Im not percieved as predatory either.
My family, however, is a whole different matter. While Im sure that my mums side of the family would be perfectly fine and my parents know already, when youve heard your fathers parents talk about eastern europeans and other immigrants using only slurwords and your uncles parents have expressed their absolute disgust about seeing a gay couple enjoy a nice picnic at the park, you get very cautious about who you tell. Especially since I dont want to put the supportive family in the position of having to consider whom they can talk to about this.
Another thing that Ive noticed after my exchange year in Sweden and seeing my first pride, though not having the time to attend, on my way there in Copenhagen, is how little support my country gives to this community from a social perspective. At my swedish school, all the teachers had a rainbow keyband from a *seminar about LGBTQA+ people*, something Im sure Germany would never do, and all of them kept it. There was no question whether you support us or not, it was an acceped part of social life and no big deal; we even did a private introduction round for pronouns!
And then I came back here. During pride month, there were no rainbow decorations, the most I saw of a parade was two discarded paper flags on the ground afterwards. When I vented about this to my ally friend, she only said that "some people and companies just like to stay neutral". Try all of them in Germany, but sure.
I know our community has come far, but I can also see that it isnt fsr enough, and that is the fight I am still fighting.
Hope this helps ^^."
"Alright. Mine isnt that interesting but I'll do my best :)
I came out as bisexual when i was in the sixth grade. It wasnt a huge deal to my mom. She said okay and we went on with our lives. Around the end of that year, i told her i thought i was trans and she said i wasnt. I came out to her again six months later and she said the same thing. There was a lot of yelling. Mind you, she isnt transphobic at all. The third time... she was so done with me. She yelled and so did i. It took four different times for her to accept me, and even then, i had to do the last time over text because i was scared of her reaction."
"So, my name is Ell. I identify as queer and demigender. I don't know what to say here really early than it's important to find others like you when you're not as close to your family as you used to be. Because of your identity. My family is more accepting than most, but still. The community online is so so important to me, and this project makes me really happy. So thank you. "
"I was at sea world and my mom was in the car I was talking about how my dad was super homophobic. My mom says that my dad acts like it’s a disease I said will if it is then I have got it, My mom is understanding and says that she will love me no matter what."
"So, I’m non-binary and bisexual. That’s a big no-no in a latino family like mine, it’s always grow up, get married with the opposite sex, and have kids. I don’t know why I felt that I could just say anything to my mom one day and she immediately objected. “Are you sure you’re not a lesbian or just confused? You can’t like more than one gender. Also, what’s this about a non gender? You’re either a boy or a girl, that’s it.”
Thankfully after a lecture and me apologizing (though I did nothing but tell her more about me) she let the subject go. I’ve never told my dad because I know mom just will get in the way and say I’m lying again, but at least my friends are understanding and almost completely LGBTQ+."
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I wanna talk about the emptiness inside me that I tired to swallow, the black hole that started my downfall into the pits of eating and mood disorders.
1- My dad isn’t my father.
2-I don’t know if god exists.
These are the two things that are the bane of all the shit in my life.
My parents divorced when I was 3 and my mom and I and my sister lived with my grandparents and my messed up uncle. We were dirt poor (now we’re just poor thank god lol) so my childhood was sad mostly with an absent father who would show up once every many months to abuse me emotionally and give me abandonment issues. I’m sad to say I will never know what it’s like to have a father. He is trying to make it up to me now but only mildly. But I’m 22. His presence and support were needed when I was little and my teachers were telling him that I was very bright and that I should go to a better school, or when people told him I am a great artist and that he should buy me art supplies to hone my skills. He never even got me A4 papers. Now I’m burned out and bitter. I know I had insane potential but he only ever gave me issues and made my life more difficult that surviving was more important that any imaginary “potential”. And now I see people who were not as half as good as I was and they got the support and attention of their parents and have got far in life. My mother was a good parent growing up but the poor woman could not be blamed for not signing me up in fancy schools or drawing classes or whatnot because she was too busy being a single parent of two children working all sorts of jobs because the alimony is worth 250 dollars. What a joke. I’m broke now and I got through 250 in a week if I’m careful. What man would let his children go through poverty when he’s very wealthy. I love him and I understand that he has his issues to but I will never forgive him for what I had to go through. At 15 no one wanted me thats when my ED started. My mom was working in another city and she didn’t want me to live with her anymore. She send me back to my grandparents house where my uncle pulled a butchers knife on me. Who pulls a butchers knife on a 15 year old child ? My aunt instead of defending me gave me a talking to and told me to not tell my mom. I couldn’t believe my ears but I still didn’t tell my mom. Then I moved in with that aunt because I couldn’t stay in that house. But because my mother had body shamed me so much ( I was going through puberty and started to grow the tiniest little boobs and the tiniest little hips) and my other aunt who was pregnant the year before and had to also live with my grandmother as well as her husband and children would shame for whatever I ate. Soon her children followed suit. I was the tiniest boniest little thing but she shamed me nonetheless because food costs money I guess. At that time the only thing I snacked on were apples because I loved them so much and we again we were poor so we didn’t have delicious snacks lying around so apples were the only sweet thing there. How much were 1-3 apples a day gonna cost you ? Cheap yellow apples.. I could never do that to a 13 year old or anyone for that matter .
Does god exist ?
Are you there ?
Do you see me ?
Why am I here ?
Am I doing good ?
Am I not doing good ?
What’s the point of it all ?
If you’re god and you control everything did I do something to you to offend you ? Cause my life feels like a maze and I’m a rat and the maze is also a wheel and I’m just running but I’m still in my place. Im not even moving in the maze. If you wrote my life why isn’t it making any lyrical sense ?
Can you talk to me ?
Can you lend me a hand ?
Because I haven’t felt like the main character in my life for four years now… that’s a lot for someone to not fell like the MC in their OWN life.
So I was raised Muslim and questioning the existence of god in the Muslim community is a big no no. When I was a kid at least I knew for was there and if someone bullied me or did me wrong they were gonna get what’s coming for them sooner or later. But people who have wronged me so badly are thriving so what if this is it ? Also all the injustice in the world the racism sexism sex trafficking slavery that still exists countries that bully other counties and leaders that sell their own people. Sadly third world countries are enough to make you doubt gods existence. I just don’t want to be duped. Also what is up with the homophobia ? Religion to me seems like a big pretext for sick people to beat kill rape others. And this whole holier than thou attitude religious people have is such a peeve. So god, are you there ? Do you love me ? Or are you mad that my faith is weak and this depression and eating disorders are your way of getting back at me ? Because which are you ? Are you living and merciful ? Or are you scary and dishonoring sub-doing ? Because if someone told me they love me and were kind to me but at the same time messed my life behind the scenes and when I confronted them they said oh I’m punishing you because I live you and I want you to get closer to me I would just call them toxic and be like why the f ??? I’m not gonna lie the idea of being an atheist is so tempting but my brain can’t Handle the possibility of a god not existing because whenever I’m in trouble I go inwards and I talk to him god allah the universe u know I just know someone is listening and you wanna tell me it’s just me talking to myself ? Ouch And what is up with everyone assigning god the male gender ? That’s some sexist stuff right there. Also aren’t divinities supposed to transcend the concept of gender and genitalia ?? The religious inside me is freaking out right now over everything I wrote and I’m scared god would strike me or something over what I’m saying but I’m also tempted by the possibility of god just up there like good girl don’t trust what those misogynistic men have twisted religion into. Good on you for using the brain I GAVE you ! And he’s be like of course I love you I love the women I live the in between I love the gays I made you ! Of course I love you even the most broken ones are so beautiful to me. So If you were real how do I not make you mad at me cause I don’t want to piss off the all encompassing all knowing obviously do you see gif how so much of religion is fear. I don’t get it. So how do I do it without going crazy ? Also I’d you didn’t know us Muslims aren’t a allowed to leave the religion then go back etc like I see a lot of white people try everything out there and it’s just like isn’t that what we should do not be raised in a certain religious but like sample everything then decide based on how we are like some exchange program or as simple as a buzzfeed quiz. Because I didn’t choose this so It’s not an informed decision. Wondering if god exists probably stems from my fear of dying. Like everyone on this planet I don’t know when or where that’ll be so I have some unexplained anxieties. So I wonder what’s gonna happen after I bite the dust. It’s like sitting in the waiting room of a dentist you’re scared shitless you see people go in and you try to distract yourself you read some magazines or mess around in your phone etc. You know you avoided the call to the dentists office as much as you could but it was inevitable. Idk what I’m saying. Anyways so I’m sad because I’m unfocused in life school career like the driven overachieved millionaires Elon musks Angelina Jolies and Oprah’s out there so I’m not successful but when I try to focus I can’t because I’m reminded it’s only a few years and blinks until it’s my turn to go into the dentist office so what’s the point and a big majority of my life had been shot so far so..
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thesquidwizard · 3 years
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I was told reading  Philosophical problems with blah blah blah would answer why making 500 genders would solve gender stereotypes I am petty and affable so I read it
If you want my opinions and my mind slowly melting i am kindly putting this under a read more cuz its fucking long as shit
the TLDR is : this drivel doesnt mention the problems of gender stereotypes or neogenders at all its just some guy wanking on why women need to give up their spaces because he thinks their wrong and annoying ( Kathleen Stock especially)
I’d love to @ you lake-lady, but you blocked me for thought crimes and im to lazy to try to get around that ( if you actually read this before recommending it to me, you are very very strong and very very brainwashed)
the first 14 paragraphs are circle talk "GC feminists are wrong, i will prove their wrong, they think "this" it is wrong ill prove its wrong etc etc etc" if you survive that that, They focus on Kathleen Stock in their words "Stock presents an articulate, relatively comprehensive, and moderate form of gender-critical feminism" first: If Margie’s self-diagnosis (“I’m a boy”) is questioned by the therapist, the therapist can be construed as . . . “converting” . . . a trans child to a “cis” one. If, on the other hand, Margie’s self-diagnosis is affirmed unquestioningly, the therapist is effectively failing to affirm Margie in a sexual orientation of lesbianism; something which also looks like conversion by omission. (Stock, 2018e) -They spend 5 paragraphs explaining why Stocks hypothetical girl^ isnt converted to male heterosexualness by transitioning, and not affirming Marges Gender identity is Dangerous They do not address Stocks ACTUAL concern that Gender Affirming Therapy without any kind of therapy and research on GNC and SSA children is conversion by omission because it doesnt take into account if these feelings stem from gender stereotypes and homophobia. Stocks is not concerned that you are converting this girl straight( sex is real she would be SSA either way) she is concerned your transitioning her without affirming her sexuality and giving her support in the knowledge that being a lesbian is okay and perfectly normal.-
Next: concern about female-only spaces is about legal self-identification without any period of “living as a woman,” prior male socialisation in a way which exacerbates the tendency to violence against female bodies, and the fact that many self-identifying trans women . . . retain both male genitalia and a sexual orientation towards females. (stock) If the evidence shows (as, in fact, it is already showing) that some males—whether genuinely “truly” trans or just pretending—turn out to pose a threat to females, and it’s really hard to tell in advance which ones will, can’t we then make a social norm and/or law to exclude all [natal] males from female-only spaces . . . ? (also stock)
-Quotes are separated by garbage but this whole section is what we have all seen before " why must trans woman suffer, just because cis men hurt woman" except its really long it acknowledges male violence rates but refuses to acknowledge we have already seen men (and identified transwoman) taking advantage to hurt woman. This whole chunk is just SOME woman must be sacrificed for Trans feelings-
They do put: Finally, we know that some men who come into contact with children in their work will offend against them. Yet we do not exclude all men from working with children, even if using gender as a watershed would prevent those offenses. Why does the good of minimizing child sexual abuse not lead us inexorably to the conclusion that we must outlaw all male teachers and coaches? Because our practical reason recognizes complexity: We readily see that even the most highly desirable states of affairs (minimizing abuse of children) do not have simple, quasi-mechanistic implications for policy or decision-making, and that they do not justify the indiscriminate suppression of other goods (even less important ones, such as professional vocations).
-And id like to add with the rise in pedo crimes I am 100% down with separating men from children because i do not think any child should be endangered just to keep men in jobs.-
They also put this quote in:
there is clearly a difference between the experience of a child who is treated by others in way that are characteristic of boys and also feels like a boy, and a child who is treated by others in ways that are characteristic of boys whilst feeling that they are really a girl. (Finlayson et al., 2018)
-And are you sure? are you really sure? I feel like there might be differences between social conditioning, experience and feelings. A boy treated like a boy and a boy(who feels like a girl) treated like a boy are still experiencing being treated and raised like a boy?? one just has emotional differences  (is it internalized homophobia, Gender non conformity, a developed fetish?? who knows but they still experienced boyhood)-
-Next section says we cant make single stall or any other kind of netrual or trans bathrooms because its to hard? and it hurts trans feels reminding them that they have birth sexes because thats hate speech???-
also this: Our social world is arranged in a way that makes exclusion from the sex/gender they claim—on the basis of a lack of “authentic” belonging (Serano, 2007)—central to trans subordination. As with other forms of social subordination, trans exclusion has not only material dimensions (Blair & Hoskin, 2018; Hargie et al., 2017; Moolchaem et al., 2015; Movement Advancement Project and GLSEN, 2017; Rondón Garcia & Martin Romero, 2016; Serano, 2013; Stonewall, n.d.; Yona, 2015), but also discursive ones that work in accordance with the logic of so-called performatives. Performatives are utterances that do things with words: specifically, they accomplish something in the act of saying it (Austin, 1975). The classical example is marriage—in the act of declaring a couple married, a celebrant brings about a change in their normative status, provided the celebrant is the right person in the right circumstances. This presupposes a normative background (that is a set of laws, conventions, or other rules) governing all those matters: who qualifies as a legitimate celebrant, what the right circumstances are for the performative to do its work, what marriage status means in terms of spouses’ rights and obligations, etc.
-Celebrating a Marriage is celebrating a couples chosen form of representing their relationship publicly and adding each other to their legal family, how is that the same as letting men into woman's bathrooms because they have feelings??-
-Theres more babblery about subjugating trans people by not pretending biology is fake, and that saying they cant just taking womans rights and spaces is denying their reality and existence we find out the author is a gay(cis) man so why does he have opinions on womans spaces and issues who fucking knows ( he really likes the word unintelligible)-
-Im tired, Ive taken several breaks just to stay clear headed( mildly sane) and now we are onto why Trans inclusive practices dont threaten the concept of female, male, lesbian and gay. Okay buddy ole pal bring it on-
Stock (2018b) has also argued that trans inclusion on the ground of self-identification/declaration threatens “a secure understanding” of concepts intimately related to “woman”—namely, “female” and “lesbian.” It is hard to see this threat as a real one. After all, conceptually, “trans maleness” and “trans femaleness” presuppose “cis maleness” and “cis femaleness” as their other—namely, the case of female and male for which no transition, no reaching across, is required: the case of femaleness and maleness already on this side of (= “cis”) their sex.
-At some point i expect to find out Stock implied his dick is tiny or something " gender crit feminists are wrong im gonna argue with just this one" In this section he manages to be long winded and say nothing have a taste:
Stock (2019b) argues, correctly, that “sex [i.e., maleness and femaleness] is not determined by any single, unitary set of essential criteria,” and that “there is no single set of features a person must have in order to count as male or female.” She goes on to state that: (a) “you do still need to possess some” female (biological) sex characteristics to count as female; (b) that this is “a real, material condition upon sex-category-membership”; and (c) that “medical professionals [assigning sex]. . . rely upon an established methodology, aimed at capturing pre-existing biological facts” (Stock 2019b). Stock presents (a), (b), and (c) as if they were true without qualification. In fact, they only describe how, for very legitimate reasons, sex is understood and assigned within the discourses of biology and medicine; but our everyday usages of “male” and “female” may well be more capacious. It does not follow, of course, that there is no connection at all between these discursive domains—biology and the everyday. Rather, something like the biological meaning of “male” and “female” refer to the central cases of “male” and “female” as those terms feature in everyday usages. But those usages, if trans-inclusive (as they should be), will also cover, legitimately and usefully, noncentral cases of those selfsame terms.
-Yes you need to be female to be female, it doesnt matter what you look like how much you weigh your hobbies or tastes you just need to be female. Observed Biology is observed not assigned we dont pop out blank slates until someone says "ya this ones a girl"-
There really is no good reason to fear that such trans-inclusive practices will imperil “maleness” and “femaleness” as concepts. It is the very fact that those concepts have and will retain central cases that puts to rest any such fear. What makes something like the biological meanings of “male” and “female” the central cases of everyday usages of those words is “[o]rdinary-life truth seeking, a certain level of which is essential for survival”; this “involves a swift instinctive testing of innumerable kinds of coherence against innumerable kinds of extra-linguistic data” (Murdoch, 1992). Reproduction is a key aspect of human experience: The existence of each of us and the perpetuation of the human species presuppose it. The extra-linguistic reality of the dioecious configuration of human bodies, which is functional to human reproduction, means both that the concept of “female” and “male” are here to stay, and that their central cases will remain well-understood, even after we give up on trans-exclusionary attitudes, practices, and policies. To put it another way: trans-inclusive linguistic usages, policies, and so on, cannot threaten the distinction between the concepts of “male” and “female,” which hinges on the nondisposability of the central cases of those concepts.
For similar reasons, it is difficult to agree with Stock that characterizing as “gay” trans men attracted to men, and as “lesbian” trans women attracted to women, “leaves us with no linguistic resources to talk about that form of sexual orientation that continues to arouse the distinctive kind of bigotry known as homophobia” (Stock, 2019d). After all, our linguistic conventions make cissexual womanhood and manhood the central or paradigmatic cases of “womanhood” and “manhood”; cissexual (though not necessarily gender-conforming) lesbianism and male homosexuality the central or paradigmatic cases of “lesbianism” and “male homosexuality,” and so on. This will not change. First because of the prevalence of cissexual women/men and cissexual lesbians/gay men, in terms of sheer numbers, relative to trans women/men and trans lesbians/gay men. Second, because of the ways in which the concepts of “man,” “woman,” “gay,” “lesbian,” “cis,” and “trans” sit together with the concepts of “male” and “female,” which reference an extra-linguistic reality, of which, as we have already seen, we cannot but take notice. Given these linguistic and empirical facts, a trans-inclusive use of the terms “lesbian” and “gay” does not carry the dangers Stock (2019d) worries about.
-I keep going back and checking the date this was published  in 2020 clearly this man has neither been online except to stalk Stock, nor talked to a human who actually believes what he is arguing against. No one is mad at transwoman for liking woman or vise versa its the kind of woman and men they go after and EXPECT romance and validation from ( ie lesbians and gay men, ie threatening what lesbian and gay mean in "inclusive" climates) fucking knob.-
I dunno if this is translated or the writer isnt english but he keeps using subordination where "opression" would be used and umm. anyway onto "Overemphasizing Sex-Based Subordination"
first he explains the difference between paranoid and paranoid structuralism there is so much fucking bullshit then we get to some quotes! that are bullshit-
Even assuming that the socialization of trans girls mirrors that of cis boys, the fact that trans girls do not identify with maleness can be expected to make a difference to the outcomes of such socialization (Finlayson et al., 2018).
-this guys back, love this guy doesnt know you dont fucking socialize yourself-
It is a mistake to treat “violence and discrimination against trans women . . . as if it were unconnected to that faced by cis women” (Finlayson et al., 2018).
 -Finlayson marry me your so smart, that big brain of yours is sooo sexy. Anyway transwoman and "cis" woman face violence from the same people.. Men. but it is not for the same reasons and most transwoman who face violence are brown and black sex workers( if your gonna care go wholesys not halfseys). As opposed to woman who face violence no matter their class, race, nationality, age.. etc etc etc-
Saying “Not giving people everything they desire is not a denial of their humanity” (Allen et al., 2019) amounts to an insensitive dismissal of the serious argument that trans exclusion is ipso facto harmful.
-I want an affordable home and access to food and water whenever i am hungry, you want me to pretend reality doesnt exist so your feefees dont get hurt-
The claim that women “are a culturally subordinated group . . . [while] at best, trans women are a distinct subordinated group; at worst . . . members of the dominant group” entirely discounts the ways in which sex, gender, and cis/trans status intersect. These intersections produce more complex, shifting, and context-dependent power relationships than are captured by the M > F formula.
-Sex based oppression is actually like jello, sometimes woman are less oppressed or oppressed slightly more to the left, I too can just kinda say words-
A dubious assumption underlies this statement: “[T]he fact that our concept-application [of, e.g., ‘woman’] might indirectly convey disadvantage towards some social groups [e.g., trans women] is not itself a reason to criticise the concept use, because the concept use has a further valuable point” (such as “to pick out a distinctive group, relative to recognisably important interests”) (Stock, 2019e). The dubious assumption here is that the “valuable point” of a restrictive use of the concept will be lost if the concept is broadened. The assumption is dubious because even in its broad, inclusive use, the concept retains a readily identifiable central case.
-Yes you dunder head if we start calling lizards mammals we lose the point of what makes a mammal a mammal, which complicates and endangers our way of researching and understanding mammals by making woman "whoever the fucks wants to be one" we loss the ability to easily talk about things that are exclusive to woman the more female language is edified the harder it is for females to unite to talk about womans issues, womans health, girls puberty, womans oppression etc etc.-
-my fuck i dont even care to learn this mans name and i have a personal hatred just for him, i hope ya'll have noticed he uses several different "sources" for his arguments and yet pins GC feminism on Stock alone. Anyway here we go into Doing Philosophy and Debating Policy in the Age of Social Media and Digital Platforms ( i think this man nuts every time he types out philosophy)-
my god we have brough Plato into this, Stocks must stand alone but we are at fucking plato, anyway this section actually has some brains in it there drivel but also truth:
Needless to say, in real-world face-to-face exchanges, unalloyed communicative action is known only by approximation. But there are very good reasons to think that the distance between the ideal (namely, communicative action) and the real is especially wide in the context of the quasi-spoken digital media used to construct (and respond to) the gender-critical case against trans inclusion. Stock (2019f) herself, discussing the reception of her arguments, has complained about countless “half-arsed takedown attempts” by “online philosophers,” crediting, conversely, philosophers she meets offline with “interesting, constructive, and charitable” objections. She also notes that social media siphons “users into paranoid, angry silos” (Stock, 2019d), and that “when reading disembodied words on a screen” it is “easy enough” to engage in “projection” (Stock, 2019a). Why and how do social media and allied platforms have this potential for distorting genuine communicative action?
First, they enable new manipulative communication practices, such as flaming and trolling. The popular support base of gender-critical academics makes ample use of these, though gender-critical scholars are also at the receiving end. Rather than using the quasi-spoken features of social media and allied platforms with a view to genuinely advancing understanding, online activists may exploit these features for strategic aims. Common techniques include drowning a post or blog with irrelevant comments; exposing the blogger to ridicule; deflecting attention from the point she made; forcing her to address spurious objections; pretextually professing a failure to understand, demanding endless further explanations; and so on. Some of these techniques are available in spoken exchanges, but social media and allied platforms magnify their power by enabling “widely-distributed individuals to organize and galvanize around issues of common interest [or] political advocacy” (Stewart, 2016); and by facilitating the use of nonverbal or nonargument-based, but effective, communicative devices, such as memes, gifs, and emoticons.
Another way in which these digital media distort genuine communicative action is by affecting the motivations of the blogger, or micro-blogger, herself. Specifically, they facilitate the interference with genuinely communicative goals (reaching understanding) by noncommunicative, strategic aims. I will discuss three: acquiring influence, career progression, and venting.
In traditional academic communicative practice, one’s recognition as an expert is supposed to follow from the credit that accrues to one as a result of the soundness of one’s research methods and arguments, judged through peer-review processes. But “in the era of social media there are now many different ways that a scientist can build their public profile; the publication of high-quality scientific papers being just one” (Hall, 2014). Veletsianos and Kimmons (2016) have found, by examining a large data set of education scholars’ participation on Twitter, that
being widely followed on social media is impacted by many factors that may have little to do with the quality of scholarly work . . . and . . . that participation and popularity may be impacted by a number of additional factors unrelated to scholarly merit (e.g., wit, controversy, longevity; p. 6).
-This section like every section goes on forever but we finally finally reach our conclusion-
Cooper (2019) has invoked a legal pluralist perspective to argue that it is possible, and may be desirable, for gender as conceived by gender-critical feminists (as “sex-based domination”) and gender as conceived in trans-affirming terms (as “identity diversity”) to coexist side-by-side in the law. Access to women’s spaces is just the kind of policy matter that need not choose between one conception of gender and the other: it can and should be granted on the basis of both. While a compelling feminist case has been made for inclusion (Finlayson et al., 2018), the best feminist case against inclusion suffers from a number of argumentative fallacies (Aristotle, n.d.), and is at odds with well-established and sound uses of practical reason. Many problems in gender-critical thought are consistent with the explanation that paranoid structuralism is too often presupposed in gender-critical work, rather than being treated, productively, as a hypothesis. The nature of the publication outlets favored by gender-critical feminists (social media, blogs, etc.) is also likely to be implicated in generating some of these problems.
I think one of the things i would like anyone who managed to read this entire thing to take away from this is that not ONCE were male bathrooms or male spaces mentioned, not once did this apparently "cis" gay man say that he welcomes and wants transmen in HIS spaces or that he has even thought about it
(((( also he didnt even mention neo genders so my original question 100% unanswered, even fuckface magee doesnt think demiboys are real. He doesnt want to or even mention solving sex based oppression he just wants woman to stop fighting to keep men out))))
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YASS QWEEN IT'S THE GAYS.
YASS QWEEN IT’S THE GAYS.
So you’ll be happy to know no trauma train *no choo choo :(*
This is going to be one of my more positive blog about how I figured out I a pansexual bean.
So I always knew from a young age I was a little bit different I think I’ve always been this way but only started showing it in school unsure what year exactly. But I had a girlfriend at the time. At this time I was also questioning my gender I thought hey I might be transgender I started to make changes. 
Sexuality and gender is a very hard thing to figure out I don’t think I have found myself my sexuality is definitely Pansexual (not limited in sexual choice with regard to biological sex, gender, or gender identity. Just in case as I know it’s not that common a lot of people may not know what it is so there) and my gender up until a few days ago was Non-binary (Non-binary, or genderqueer, is a spectrum of gender identities that are not exclusively masculine or feminine‍) But I have started questioning whether I am demiboy (A demiguy, also called a demiboy, demiman or demimale person, is a gender identity describing someone who partially, but not wholly, identifies as a man, boy or otherwise masculine, regardless of their assigned gender at birth.) But oh well I’ll figure it out I have my whole life to .
In all of my relationships I have loved the person for who they are and their personality as I said I got distracted again but I started off thinking hey I’m gay I think I like the same gender only then I got into a relationship with a person the opposite gender  and realised hey I like this as well aaaaaaa. Then I realised after a while of meeting some lgbtq+ people that I am pansexual (no I don’t have sex with pans…usually) but yeah since the age of 14 I have identified with being pansexual and guess what I’m proud fuck anyone else who disagrees I am me. 
I’m very glad that in today’s society that it’s okay to be gay and pan and anything else it makes me feel happy I only started really accepting myself as this at the age of 18 I am pansexual and proud.Until this point I was painfully closed about who I was and it caused my mental health to decline with everything else going on.
You out there you lgbtq person without hope and no love because your family doesn’t love you for being gay it’s okay the whole lgbtq community loves and accepts you let us be your family it’s okay to love whoever you want. Being gay is okay and if you’re struggling with your sexuality as normal Dino got you with links below
Gender is another struggle I’m having a crisis with my gender at the moment I’ve been out as non-binary for about a year and now I’m like hey I might be more I think I’ve said this but I think I’m demiboy. Gender is a spectrum it isn’t that easy for some I mean some people it can be easy but others are left  confused and alone with their gender but you’re not alone so many people struggle with their identity.Gender has always been a issue foe me I was always a tomboy grew up around guys so  I was always around guys I just had them I grew up playing wrestling and take down bulldogs it was fun.But it wasn’t here ive had a right fight with my gender.Firstly in 2016 I thought I was transgender and my gf at the point was supportive then I relaised after being out as trans to her I wasn’t I was non binary and since the age of 17 ive been non binary I only told people I tustesd I evan got a flag when I came here but in the past year or so ive been like im non binary but inside I just am thinking are you gere have that feelng masculine.So here I am tonight at 12.17 and ive just decided I identify as demiboy  so my gender associates with non binary and male I only switch between male and nin binary.So this blog is more positive im nit going into the negatives of my jernoy to fins myself and my ex who outted me that’s another story foe another day yay enjouy.Anwyaw just for any lgbtq beans out there to feel less alone below is what one of my friends says about their sexuality..
Something from a queer friend of mine:
“I realised I wasn’t straight in year 8 (around age 12) when I realised I had a crush on my best friend at the time (we were both guys) At first I thought I was bi, and then as my mental health took a plunge I became numb and just decided to say I was asexual as a way of cutting people off. When I finally started to recover I realised I was getting turned on in the kitchen a lot (that’s a joke. I realised I was pan.) I was pretty comfortable with my pansexuality when I started experiencing dysphoria and questioning my gender, eventually coming across the character of Alex Fierro in the Magnus Chase books by Rick Riordan (if you want gay icons by the way, go check his books out! He is NOT just about Greek myths anymore. He’s about the gays too!). So, anyway, Alex Fierro is genderfluid, and honestly I can’t actually even remember what their biological sex is anymore. The character really resonated with me. I didn’t think I was trans because I didn’t get dysphoria all the time, and I didn’t think I was a guy either because I did get it sometimes. I went to an all-boy school and it was a very toxic, sexist, homophobic atmosphere, so I didn’t feel safe telling people about this stuff or trying to work it out. When I came across Alex Fierro I finally understood I was genderfluid and I felt like I belonged somewhere at last. I guess my point is… you be yourself. If you don’t like labels, then I’m happy you can feel safe in yourself without them. If you do like labels but don’t know which ones you belong to yet, that’s ok. Just because you’ve never heard of the label doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist, and when you do find it, it’ll be like finding out you’re not the only person left in the world.”
 So basically lgbtq straight we don’t care as long as your happy with who you are and comfatible with who you are there is a lot of hate in the world but the world is slowily learning to love and accept evyone within the wold we are all different and we are AMAZING the way we are who cares if your gay pan bi trans attack helicopter lets  just love each other and no more hate no one desuves it. Never bully someone because of their gender sexuality race they are unique and human just like you !
 Stay strong and stay you beans!
 Helplines if you need it love you beans.
 Switch bored-https://switchboard.lgbt/
 The Trevor project- https://www.thetrevorproject.org/
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My Soulmate is Gay, Now What?
I met him during freshman year in college. He is one of the few male students in my class since Nursing Course is dominated by female students. He looked so foreign, has bushy eyebrows, great sense of humor, smart and artistic. The only problem is the acne breakout.  But I saw him beyond his imperfections.
He had a huge crush on one of our classmate. She's a flight attendant now, so you could just imagine how beautiful she was and is. I never saw him with a girlfriend. He's too focused on his studies and his passions though I didn't really know what his passions are back then. It seemed that he's not interested in having a relationship before. We became close friends and even discovered that we both like the same things.
After we graduated college, we haven't seen each other for months. No contacts with each other at all. After one time we saw each other again during one of my trainings. We sometimes skipped the class and watch movies together. We even hang out at an organic restaurant and drink stuffs that we both like and talk about life and our future. We planned our future together - as friends.
That moment, I started falling for him. How could someone plan his future with me in it? Maybe, just maybe, he really wanted me in his future and has no plans of breaking this friendship. We might actually end up being together.
I left him again and decided to become a missionary. I had to stay in another island to train. But I didn't get to finish the training. Halfway through I realized that being a missionary isn't my calling. I'm called for something else.
So I went back to my hometown and searched for my own destiny.
I messaged my best friend if we could meet for a movie, just like the old times. He agreed. We met the following day and talked about everything. I updated him about my life and even shared to him how holy I was feeling at that moment. I shared my love for God with him and he shared his to me. We have different religions but that didn't stop us in becoming best of friends. We respect each others' beliefs and that just strengthened our relationship.
I told him I was going back to the neighboring island to get my things and I asked him if he could accompany me. He said yes right away and said that he can't wait to travel with me. It's our first travel together. He was excited, he joined me as I attended the worship service in one of my co-trainee's church. He's so friendly and even talked to my friends about anything under the sun. We even went to my training place and gathered my things and enjoyed the rest of the day and night at the city. We went to a club and danced and drink the night away. Well that's me - a missionary trainee who's also a party girl and an alcoholic. That explains why I never belonged to that place. We enjoyed that night and vowed to go back there, drunker and wilder.
We're both licensed nurses and we decided to pursue our careers. We took the entrance exam for one of the government hospitals in the city and both learned that we passed.
We started working on the same day, on the same hospital but different areas. I was assigned to the Emergency Room and he was assigned to the Medical Ward. Everytime our shifts would coincide, he would visit me in the ER during his break. We also meet up after work for hot chocolates, beers and burgers.
Months passed and we decided to further our dream getaways. Since we don't earn that much before, we save up our allowances and finally got enough for a trip to a neighboring island. Again.
I'm a t-shirt and pants kinda girl but this time, I decided to girl up. We took the first trip of the ferry and explored the island the whole day. I had so much fun spending the day with him. Until night-time came. We had a power nap and when it was 9pm, he told me that he would just step out for a bit to meet a friend. Well I didn't know that! I didnt know that he had a friend here. I waved it away thinking it's just someone not important. 11pm came and I decided to prepare for our night out. We haven't had our dinner yet and I was starving. I put on this dress and heels and thought 'I looked okay'. It's my first time to wear a dress on a night out and im kinda nervous. Oh, and did i mention it was his birthday? Yeah, an hour away from his 24th birthday. I waited, took pictures of myself and admired myself. I never dressed up for a guy before. I waited for an hour more. He arrived 10 minutes after 12. I wasn't feeling it anymore but I don't want to ruin the night for him. So I pretended that im still excited. He asked for an apology for coming back later than what he told me. I waved it off and told him that it doesn't matter. We took a taxi, had our expensive dinner in a semi fine diner and went to the same club that we went to the first time we were here. I wanted to get drunk, but I cant focus too well because im not comfortable with my dress.
We had some beer, since we are in our beer-lovin' days. We had a couple of bottles but that doesn't knocked us up. Remember, the goal for this day is to be drunker and wilder.
He loves tequila, so I told him ill pay for his tequila shots. It's way too expensive but I saved up for this. He had like 4 shots of tequila and i had 2 and we ordered some more beer. He's totally drunk now. And im a little bit tipsy at the moment. Someone has got to be sober enough if we wanted to survive the night.
We abandoned our seats and invaded the dance floor. We danced and jumped and screamed and laughed! We are enjoying the night! Until 2 guys decided to position themselves behind me and started grinding me. So I told my best friend if we could switch places. He grabbed me by my waist and that's the most intimate thing that he did to me. I was over the moon. Until...
The guy started to grind on him. And he seemed to enjoy it. And I was shocked. The other guy talked to me and offered me a drink while the other is busy grinding on my best friend. I understood that he was drunk but damn, man! I was planning to marry this guy someday and he ended up being gay! They didn't do anything 'wrong' but they exchanged numbers. My entire dream ended right then and there.
I convinced him to go home. And instead of taking a taxi back to the hotel, we opted to walk to sober up. He's obviously drunk. He keeps on telling me that he really enjoyed what happened tonight. We passed by a big bridge which he decided to climb the railings and walk there drunk! One slip and he'll fall to his death. I gripped so hard on his ankles and I sobered up 100%. Because i thought he's going to die. I managed to convince him to come down and walk on the pavement. He's walking in a criss-cross line. He's happy, so that made me happy too in a sense. We passed by Jollibee and ordered some meal coz the drinking, the dancing, the grinding made us famished. We walk for over 30 minutes and finally we manage to arrive at our hotel safe and sound. When we arrived at the hotel, he dropped right away to the bed and slept. I removed his shoes and fixed him on the bed. He checked his phone and told me that the guy who was grinding both od us earlier is asking him if he could join us in our hotel. That fcking bastard! I told him to put down his phone and delete his number. I don't know of he did that though.
Before we went home the next day, we had some hot drinks to deal with our hangover. He's like a broken record saying that he enjoyed last night and that he's hoping we could do it again.
Well that happened again and again but no more grinding happened. Instead, I met his so called-friend and he's a guy. He told me that he's like his best friend but only online. He confided in him, told him his secrets and that kinda made me jealous.
He used to meet up with me before my night shift. He would ask me for dinner, for a bottle of beer or a cup of coffee or chocolate just before my shift starts. I was secretly hoping that he would fall for me. He would tell me stuffs like "You are worth spending for.", "I'm at my happiest when im with you", and "I'd like to travel the world with you."
A year after that, he still never fell for me and I decided to work abroad. Away from him. We messaged each often the first few months im here and it just stopped. We'd ask each other how were we after a few weeks and the conversation just end abruptly. They say, if you love each other, you'll never ran out of things to say to each other. But we did. We just ran out of words to say to each other. The thought of him thinking of me is enough. It's just that maybe, everytime we contact each other, I will always remember what happened on his 24th birthday. And I remind myself that he'll never fall in love with me because he's in love with the same gender orientation as him.
I'm not judging him for that. But everytime I remember that, I had to nurse my broken heart all over again. I was never so sure in my life. I know from the moment I met him that I wanted to spend the rest of my life with him. I saw forever the moment I met him. That's the feeling when you found your soulmate. But what if your soulmate is not who you think he is? What if that's all you get? Loving him from a distance? Supporting him while he loves someone else? Pretending to smile and happy for him when in fact your heart's been broken to pieces? I was able to do that. I never could've believed that I was able to do that. Listen to him while he told me stories how happy and contented he was (without me). I had to cry after a shared smile, laugh and nostalgia with him. At night, I reminisce all the moments that I thought were special for the both of us. I reminisce the moments when I thought he was falling for me. The drunk nights, the long walks along the city lights, the dinners under a starry sky, movies, music - all of that is purely friendship.
On Feb 2018, I decided to completely move on from him. To stop hoping that things will change between us. Because it's hopeless. Every now and then he would send me a message telling me that he wished I was there with him, enjoying UK together. But that's all there is. He missed the company but not me. I had to stop hoping if I wanted my heart to be whole again.
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