#or bi people aren't into women???

[softsapphicvibes]

my issue with bi lesbians/mspec lesbians isn't the idea that it will lead to men being even shittier to lesbians, because shitty men will always be shitty men, they don't need that excuse. it's that these people and their supporters are saying that lesbians can be attracted to men in any capacity. if you can't understand how gross it is to push that narrative all on its own, and you can't understand what a fundamental misunderstanding that is of the lesbian sexuality, then idk what to tell you but you're stupid at best, hold malicious intent towards lesbians at worst, and it's also likely there's a lot of internalised biphobia and/or lesbophobia at work. there are also the biphobic and transmisognyistic aspects to the label that i've mentioned in past posts/reblogs, but my point rn is it is completely reasonable for us to want to avoid you and keep you from interacting, because you do not respect lesbians or bi sapphics at all. yes, even if you are also a lesbian supporting these identifies. idk why people think just because it's not the most important issue in the world that they can avoid criticism for a genuinely harmful idea and opinion. identifying this way and supporting these types of identities implies certain opinions and worldviews.

#m don't look #sapph's post #no im not answering asks arguing about it. suck my massive dick. #you guys know you aren't the first people to put forward the assertion that lesbians can like men right? think about who else does that #also don't get on to me about ''lesbian used to include bi women'' i KNOW we have discussed this at LENGTH that's the BIPHOBIC part #finally posting this because im fed up lol

[lord-radish]

imagine thinking that trans men are inherently bad or evil or predatory on the basis of gendered privilege and societal power structures. cringe

#transmasc discourse #like the idea that trans men gain male privilege and kick down the ladder to beat on the queer community is astonishingly stupid at best #the idea that transphobia or queerphobia as a whole doesn't affect them because they're Assimilating With The Oppressors is like #man fucking what is up with people yknow #gender essentialism is fucked up and it's the same force that's beaten down on bi ace and transfem people #the fact that this has turned into 'trans rights but only for the women' by some dumb-fuck shitstains is awful #no. trans rights for all. #like let me explain what I mean here: trans men aren't seen as men by transphobes #it's not 'oh you're a fella? crack a cold beer and let's bash some gays'. passing as a man has just as much risk to it as passing as a woman #because a man who will attack a trans woman as someone who is not a woman will most likely attack a trans man he does not see as a man #with the same violence he might level against a cis woman #that's just on the masc side. i can't speak for any violence against trans men by cis women but I can see how cis women discredit trans men #by claiming them as Lost Lesbians and Sisters In Arms who've been lost due to the Trans Agenda #like people shit on bi people because they have 'passing privilege'. but we know that bi people face homophobia #and other issues about their orientation. the idea that trans men get their Boys Will Be Boys card is to focus on a tiny selection #that *potentially* has the power to he a shithead - like a queerphobic asexual person or a malicious bi person #and paint an entire group of diverse people as literally the worst interpretation you can imagine about them #like consider that you have your own issues and/or biases in regards to people you like and want to hang out with #and stop calling entire groups of people invaders and oppressors whose entire goal is to upend the community #and turn the power of queer people against them #i understand how it feels to feel powerless and to have somewhere where you feel supported and safe #but if you're going to see pain and hate in every group who shares your experience but gives you an ick for whatever reason #there's a solid chance that the Righteous Crusade against them is - in fact - your own personal dislike wielding a modicum of power #that essentially functions the same way that hetero- and cis-normative standards and people have rejected you. #it is essentially you becoming the bully. and just like bi and ace and transfem people before I won't stand for it #trans men are my people.

[mynameisbillandimaheadcase]

.

#it's so funny that trans men aren't safe where gay men are #the most popular hooking up place/ nude beach for gay men ? #not safe for trans guys #one of the most historical queer saunas ? nit safe either #and those aren't even rumors #people and travel guides warn that those places aren't safe for trans men #some lesbian places are more accepting but then i feel like I'm trespassing #the majority of people that are coming out are gay men #probably bc it's the acceptable socially #and they are actively creating hostility against their own community #it's making me feel like I'm trespassing when i go to gay bars #but I AM a gay man myself #a gay man is still a man that only accepts what's appealing to him #trans fems ? mostly okay bc gay men see them as MEN so appealing to them #bi women? too confusing either seen as straight or lesbian bc they refuse to understand the duality that exists #so not accepted #trans men ? not sexualy wanted so at the same time not accepting #of them #i am ranting on bad English while in the bus home bc i just had that realization #gay men still operate the same way straight men do #they only accept what they find sexually appealing or benefiting to them

[mrdyketator]

yo “straight or bi” doesn’t mean straight girls lmao! if you equate bi women with straight women then pls examine your biphobia

i was specifically talking abt women who identify as lesbian despite being aware of their attraction to men, and then later come out as straight or bi. like I mean the lesbian until graduation phenomenon. not bisexual women who just initially thought they were lesbian. the other instances I listed on that post are only applicable to straight women, which is why I only mentioned bi women in the last line.

#also I was speaking from personal experience irl regarding the thing abt women displaying evident attraction to men iding as lesbian #it's happened like thrice to women I'm acquaintances with irl; people who talk abt how 'gay' they are and how much they hate men #only to just suddenly have a bf or male crush and the crazy part is they accuse me of being straight bc I have male friends #ask #anon #anyways we love bi women who aren't lesbophobic and lesbians who aren't biphobic in this house

[bisolationist]

What are you trying to say with that screenshot? Are you anti-febfem now?

I'm all for bi women being female exclusive.

I'm against how the febfem label seems increasingly like a panic response to not be called a "bihet" because they have absorbed the idea that bi women are not meaningfully different from straight women and deserve to have their experiences ridiculed and mocked.

#sorry I'm not trying to stick my nose in things but I'm not blind either #like I think it's very illuminating that there's people saying bihet means all SORTS of things #including 'bi women that aren't really oppressed' #like........ that should be concerning sorry

[sapphicdessi]

lol so many bi radfems argue like reactionary manipulative queerio tras and liberals when they're called out for homophobia or told of their privilege ://

#the bihet victim complex #lmao saying someone is calling bisexuals evil for calling out your denial and downplaying of your privilege/homophobia come on #bi women are obsessed with saying liking men is oppression #treating it like it's homosexuality itself #and that gays are oppressing them for it #tra mental gymnastics in all bi communities aside from febfems which many also dislike #it's amazing the community obsessed with converting gay people or showing/telling men lesbians aren't real and can be fixed #has such a victim complex #such narcissism #bisexuals force gay people to always centre and talk about their osa and treat it like oppression #they act like it's an EXTRA struggle over gay people #what other community gets away w this shit #osa don't see lesbian as people #bi women are especially horrible to lesbians despite being ssa so like stop acting like we need to bond w homophobes #“lesbians are oppressing me by assuming I won't be serious about women” #it's a pattern and not our fault your community sucks. that you're so male centric male obsessed homophobic/misogynist and prefer privilege #you admit most bi women prefer men and rarely prefer women #and no “settling” for women bc men are shit and annoy you isn't preferring women #it's exhausting hearing the most homophobic women complain about homophobia like LOOK IN THE MIRROR you hate homosexuals yourself

[watchmakermori]

cannot emphasise enough that some of u need to put the term ‘queerbaiting’ back on the shelf until you know what it means. i saw someone in a youtube comment yesterday accusing genshin streamer zy0x of queerbaiting because he *checks notes* jokes and talks about finding men attractive. this comment had a lot of upvotes. like please do explain to me how a Real Human Being joking about wanting an anime husband is bad or harmful to the queer community in any way. some of you think queerbaiting means ‘this person acts queer sometimes but i can’t tell if they mean it or not and that annoys me’ and it really shows

#miscellaneous #it's baffling to me #he's just a dude vibing??? it's not like he's known as some Big Queer Content Creator or whatever the fuck. he's just a guy #it's fucked up thinking because like. a lot of people who aren't out or who aren't SURE about their sexuality will joke like this #making people confirm or prove their sexuality so they're allowed to behave in certain ways is fucked up #especially when a lot of queer ppl start out thinking they're straight #reeks of biphobia too #on an unrelated note i doubt zyox is completely straight anyway lmao #the dude talks about 'bi meta' and literally never shuts up about attractive men and women in genshin #his sexuality is his business. but the fact ppl think he's queerbaiting rather than just like...expressing himself and having fun #wild shit

[cruelsister-moved2]

Frustrated rn at all of the denizens of this site who are starting to critique the endless posts urging lesbians to "stop being so close-minded and just fuck men already!" because it's clear that they only care about people avoiding calling themselves bisexual (though I agree that's part of it) but don't give a shit about the entire ideological basis those posts have in condescension and cruelty directed towards lesbians because they fundamentally agree but just use different language and ideas to convey it

yeah I honestly agree with you and the same with the bi lesbian thing I feel like it's this balancing game to never suggest one thing affects one of us over the other. now I think it's worthwhile to point out that these things are also not in the best interests of bi women in order to prevent it turning into a "lesbians vs bi women" thing & point out that our needs are almost always aligned BUT it's really frustrating when people only care because it's like someone's saying they're too good for bisexuality like it's corrective rape rhetoric towards us at it's core and they are also bisexual people doing it. bisexual people with internalised biphobia, sure, but people acting like they're a secret third thing when ultimately its people who aren't lesbians that don't want lesbians to exist like can we talk about that 😭it's very much not the idea of attraction to multiple genders that they have a problem with in this case

#ask #anon #it's weird bc it's like people have this feeling that you can never say a certain issue largely affects lesbians #as if that will invalidate bi women. but you can say if something affects bi women more I guess because lesbians aren't at risk of being #invalidated? and honestly the constant treating of bi women with kid gloves is just insulting to all women #as seen in jakeygate with people foaming at the mouth to defend a neonazi #at the very idea of a hypothetical bi woman being attached to him!!? #which is most concerning in that if ur bi friend was actually dating a racist man the solution is absolutely not to be like omg hes so cute

[hydenine]

Boy golly nothing like seeing bisexuality discourse in year 2024

The ol' 'if you mention you might be bi and we only see you dating one person are you really bi?' with an added twist of 'where is the 'payoff' to the character mentioning they're bi if they only date someone of the same gender?'

#I'm not tagging what this is about but I'm annoyed I had to read it lol #there really is nothing like having someone go 'why would they mention they're bi if they aren't gonna be in a straight relationship too' #I'm so tired #how do you think bi people work #this is like if someone went 'I'm a straight guy and I'm attracted to all women!' #and said straight guy wound up in a commited relationship with one woman #and you went 'okay prove it! let's see you date EVERY woman then!' #I'm pretty sure straight people are equally capable of being attracted to multiple people while still winding up in a commited relationship #anyway #so dumb andnnfmf #hydenine rambles

[musical-chick-13]

ANYWAY. What if I sang and recorded Good Luck, Babe! by Chappell Roan.

#would it 'count' as a wlw anthem then? #probably not. if people aren't gonna acknowledge HER as a legitimate queer artist they certainly won't do it for me #STILL thinking about that one absolutely DERANGED (derogatory) anon I got that one time telling me bi women bring biphobia on themselves #(granted. as far as I'm aware this artist doesn't identify as bi. so not directly related per se.) #(but still relevant re: de-legitimizing sapphic art) #making this post partly to clarify a previous post because if that gets widely misinterpreted...I would honestly rather die. like actually.

[rotationalsymmetry]

[ID: digital art of interlocking venus symbols on a bi flag background that's been heavily blurred, so that there's blue swirling into the pink and vice versa. End ID.]

#if you have to explain art by definition it's failed #but what I was aiming for was something like: here's a lesbian symbol; a wlw symbol; a sapphic symbol #on a bi flag #and also gender is made up and orientation is made up and there are no firm lines anywhere #and sometimes women are also men and sometimes wlw aren't women #but there is connection and love and finding a community where you belong #and people you can hold onto #while the world swirls and spins #btw I realize that's not how the venus symbols are normally positioned but I was picturing a key ring where they're not in fixed position #relative to each other anyways? so that's why it's like that #but the one going into the pink part of the flag being at the same angle that the mars symbol traditionally goes at #is a happy coincidence #I messed up at first and drew one as being over the other rather than interlocking so I had to go back and fix it #it's making me happy

[ot3]

This is new sexier anon then the others and this is coming from a place of good faith, or at least what I consider good faith, but it feels like there is a dissonance between your hating people who call lesbians sapphic and being ok with lesbians being called bi or vice versa. Most of the reasoning I see behind don’t call lesbian character bi is that it’s seen as people thinking lesbian is a bad word, and again vice versa. (Sorry if this sent twice??)

well for starters i'm definitely speaking with a significant degree of hyperbole here and while someone calling a lesbian character 'sapphic' is something i personally hate sooo bad i wouldn't ever actually like. make any kind of stink out of it. i'm bitching on my blog because that's what i do here but at the end of the day everyones preferences for language are gonna be different and i do not actually wish ill will on anyone who has a differing opinion from me on the subject.

but for me it's kind of like i don't see these as equivalent things at all. when a lesbian or bi woman says they view a character as lesbian or bi. it speaks to me as interest in the specific experiences this character has with their sexuality, even if it's not what's 'canon'. bi and lesbians experiences are wayyy too similar and historically intertwined for us to pretend that they are fully discrete when appearing in fiction.

whereas calling something sapphic when the characters have explicitly stated orientations already feels to me like stepping away from anything specific so it can be dropped into the greater amorphous pool we call 'representation'. it feels almost like a rebranding of discussing sexuality in media using terminology that has as many corners filed off as possible. if the whole point of sapphic is to use as an umbrella term when using a specific identity label wouldn't be accurate or appropriate, then using it when something else would be accurate or appropriate feels like a copout to me.

#people who aren't gay women love to bend over backwards to explain why lesbian characters are actually interested in men but #thats a whole different conversation. im mostly talking about the way bi women and lesbians will turn on Each Other for this sort of thing #when our experiences are more shared than not #i dont think bi women who have bi readings of some fictional characters are avoiding Lesbianism #but i do think people who will ALWAYS use the word sapphic over calling anyone a lesbian maybe have to re-assess a bit #also once again i must stress #while i find the use of the term sapphic a bit eyerolly when it comes to discussing fiction #my main issue is i dont think its good for real people

[bubtans]

i literally feel so much more at peace here holy shit twitter is awful

#and i hate saying that bc it's how i communicate with so many people that i adore so much #but it's so much easier to avoid absolute cesspools here #like obviously it was hell many years ago but nowadays #i can't imagine someone unironically telling me what people tell me on twitter #and i think it's because social spaces there have become so mired in this perpetual weaponized victimhood #it's normal to operate like you are constantly under attack by people who disagree with you and that you must respond with indignance #the fulcrum of queerness lies in the eternal self-pitying misery over how mean other queer people are to you #because online queer spaces aren't about reflection or healing they're about unconditional acceptance without any accountability #if i as a lesbian hold my community accountable for how much radfem ideology has gripped it for decades it's an act of betrayal #if i hold bi women accountable for wanting their cishet boyfriends to be allowed into queer spaces without putting in the work for us #i'm getting into bi women's business and 'bi women get abused by their boyfriends so ur being selfish' #it's so fucking juvenile everything is so juvenile

[marklikely]

actually no i think the MOST insulting thing is when people are like 'ok fine bi women can be butch or femme but not if they have boyfriends!!' as if a woman is unable to have her own identity once she's dating a man

#like . so you can be a butch bi woman but as soon as you get a boyfriend your entire identity belongs to him? #wow thats such a feminist pro woman take. its SO true women cease to be individuals once they have a man to serve. (/s) #its very weird to me that i never seem to see complaints about bi men using 'gay' terms. even if they're dating women. #but for bi women they have to be subjected to endless discourse about their identities if they so much as look at a man. #i wonder if maybe misogyny is a factor in that or- no? just me? ok #avpost #anyway im just internet complaining but this is such a dumb thing to get overly invested in #like. trying to police what words strangers are and aren't allowed to use for themselves. #its just kind of. a huge waste of everyone's time and usually betrays some really backwards and close minded logic #(not always but. i'd say at least 90% of the time or more. like anything outside of 'hey dont appropriate this closed cultural term' yknow) #you dont know other people or their lived experiences you dont get to tell them what they can and can't call themself. yeah

[blue-sketches]

reading the responses to the post about biphobia is exactly the thing i was talking about in my tags. i didn't want to derail the post, but the fact that some bisexuals think that bi and pan ppl can't coexist is crazy omg.

like it's not biphobic to prefer one label over the other.

it's not biphobic to define the labels differently and recongize that difference as the resoning for your decision of label.

it is NOT biphobic to validate and coexist with pan people.

and all of these are true, ESPECIALLY IF YOU'RE BI YOURSELF/THE PERSON YOU'RE CALLING BIPHOBIC IS BI.

anyway, the existence and support of pan people is not biphobic.

bi pan solidarity and all that <3

#i feel so strongly about this bros #like the rage i feel for panphobia by bisexual people #and i get that there's a misconception of bisexuality (the idea that attraction is limited to men and women) #but that is the reality for some bi ppl #if you're mad b/c you have to continuously explain your sexuality that's not the fault of pansexuals #they have to do the same thing #ppl saying 'isn't that just *insert sexuality*' happens to both bi and pan ppl (a lot of times from the other side) #so we should be understanding of each other and relating to each other cuz we all know the feeling of invalidation #we shouldn't keep that chain of invalidation going #pan ppl aren't the enemy of bi ppl and vice versa #wonky that some ppl don't get that #sketchyrants #long tags #long post #this has been a psa <3 #bisexual #pansexual

[biromanticbookbabe]

So I'm signed up for this online 30's speed dating event for WLW and sapphics right?

Here's the thing: It looks like they aren't even bothering to regulate it at all because I see tons of people who aren't in their 30s and even some men are listed in the people who are signed up for the event.

What's even the point of a specific event for 30 something WLW if just anyone can join it? :/

#As a 30 year old I'm not interested in 18/19 year olds and yet a bunch of them are signed up for a event for women in their 30s??? #any one who is in their 30s and wants to date teenagers is a total creep #I hope they realize that because I don't think they do #18 and 19 year olds look like children to me now #if you promise an event for women in their 30s please actually deliver it :( #If I'm using a site that's for women loving women- men shouldn't be allowed? I'm not looking for a man! #now I see why the lesbians and other sapphics get angry #I'm debating whether or not this is even worth my time because I'm not confident that it will be run well at all #so many people failed to understand the prompt or purposely don't care #they are either too young or the wrong gender- if you're not a woman in her 30s it's not for you? #If a woman is in her late 20s that's different but it was a bunch of people under 25 #dating is inherently exclusive- most people aren't attracted to everyone else??? #A lot of people fail to realize you CAN be pro equality and still not want to date most other people- it IS possible #Now selfish people are going to ruin something that isn't even for them :/ #I am the target audience for this event and they are making me not want to participate #I'm 30 and sapphic- questioning whether bi or lesbian but I belong there #Should I be surprised? I really don't know what to think honestly #I'm a little angry that they don't seem to care who attends because I paid for a ticket- not too much but still? #mychatter