#not gonna tag fandoms because meh i tagged those when I linked to all these before | Explore Tumblr Posts and Blogs

do-not-careissa · 3 years

Text

Fic Writer Interview

tagged by @koa-ia thanks for tagging me ❤️ I doubt you expected an essay length response but meh I'm wordy

Name(s): Do_not_careissa (ao3), do-not-careissa (Tumblr)

Fandoms: mostly stick to DC stuff, namely Red Hood, Green Lanterns, Batfam, that area

Where you post: fics go on ao3 with links here on Tumblr, though I do have a few small sections of fics or wips I've put here too

Most popular one shot (by kudos): From Tragedy Comes Happiness, all the other fics with higher kudos are all part of my Sapphire Jason series so I'm iffy on if they could be considered one shots anymore

Overall: Into the Violet Light

From this year: Into the Violet Light

Most popular multi-chap (also by kudos): Guy and the Outlaws

Favourite story you’ve written so far: sheesh that's a hard one because it's more so specific scenes or what went into making the fic that I enjoy more. So I'mma cheat and say a few. Into the Violet Light for kinda obvious reasons, it was the starting off point for my series, it let me start messing around with this idea I'd had for a few weeks/months by then, and it got me to really focus on "how can I show that he deserves receiving this ring when the audience doesn't even know it's gonna happen?" Next one chronologically would be Never Again, specifically the Dick and Joker scene. That was one of those weird cases where I got the idea like at least 2-3 months before I got around to writing it. So the beats of this scene just sat on my white board for weeks on end and I knew I needed to do it and make it good. And I really enjoyed how I got to play around with Dick's perception of the world when the ring took over. Last one I'm gonna add here is From Tragedy Comes Happiness cuz I just can't not add it as a fav because it absolutely is one of my favorites. I literally wrote it in 3 days I was that invested in this story, Google thought I was expecting a child, it was a thing. And it is 100% @kiseiakhun 's fault for mentioning Roy being dead

Fic you were nervous to post: Not Enough My abilities with smut are limited at best, so having a fic that's almost entirely smut, especially with a lesser known ship like GuyHal, is of course gonna leave me nervous if it's even worth posting. I also wrote it in pieces during my half hour metro commute so it's not like I even had an idea what I was doing either.

How do you choose your titles: It changes from story to story. Sometimes when I'm thinking of the direction I want the fic to go a title will come to me, other times while I'm writing or editing I'll think of something either theme or dialogue related. Other times, much like the summary, I just kinda force my way through different ideas and go with the one that works best.

Do you outline: Kind of, sort of? It's not like X is the inciting incident, Y is the climax, Zamaron is our subplot, type of thing, but I do a little bit of planning (usually, sometimes I just start writing and that's that). Usually I start off with figuring out what the end goal is for the fic, then I'll make a note of that, like "Dick becomes a RL, Bruce injured", "Jason has first mission, romantic/sexual tension between him and Kyle by end, Jason oblivious?" Then I'll do what I consider my first draft(some might consider a detailed outline) where I go through, figure out the scenes, rough beats, basically laying out what's gonna happen in each. Sometimes it really loose, sometimes it word for word dialogue and stuff I'll use in the final. So it's like an outline, sort of

Complete: 21

In progress: 1

Coming soon/not yet started: next part of the Sapphire Jason series, of course that GuyHal one set back in like part 3 of the series, need to edit and write some more for the Guy and the Outlaws fic. Other than that, I've also been tempted by the idea of writing a fic centered around that time Guy became a Red Lantern since Hal wanted someone on the inside, play around with the emotional toil there, the pain and heartbreak and of course the GuyHal there cuz I might have an obsession but whatever. I've had some other ideas (Jason got picked up by Amanda Waller instead of Talia and all the angsty stuff to go along with that and the suicide squad believing Bruce tried to murder his son, Jason getting swept up into some horrible thing and gets killed then comes back as the Spectre and absolutely wrecking everyone type of thing, that everyone goes missing and Jason has to step up to lead the few remaining heroes idea, etc) not sure if I'll ever actually write them or if they'll just stay as plot bunnies in my head.

Prompts: I'm down for some prompts or ideas, I just can't guarantee I'll be able to get to them all

Upcoming work you’re most excited about: it's definitely a tie between the two for the Sapphire series just because the one is a bit funny, and the ideas I've gotten so far for the other are much more ansgty, emotional type things and I love both of those things.

tagging @wellthatjusthappend @wajjs @kiseiakhun

#fic writer interview #this turned out way longer than it shouldve #but i have no chill #also #quarantine really came up in here #slapped me #and said congrats bitch youre a writer now

13 notes · View notes

thesaltofcarthage · 5 years

Text

Avengers: Endgame: Did Marvel Pull It Off?

This is a followup to my (surprisingly popular!) post “The Stakes Are Too High.” (at least, it surprised the hell out of me that it got so popular; I wasn’t expecting it to resonate as widely as it did.)

FULL ENDGAME SPOILERS AHEAD. YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED. I’m putting it under a cut just in case.

Also, above the cut in case you’re still dodging spoilers, tagging @kryptaria @iamanartichoke @taurileonis @hjbender @chey-tips22 @wu-the-stoic @englishontheinside @rennemichaels @alwida10 @ladylowkeyed @saltoftheearths @mizkit @thelightofthingshopedfor @essesnceofhappiness @theravenofwynter @pinetreeparadoxx @ironhammermagicshieldedgreenbow @philosopherking1887 @waywardkansasflower @lokeanrampant @maneth985 @ilovethemallsoimconfused @bengalaas @icyxmischief @yuuki-fandoms @snailchick @fictions-stranger @adhdasianaroace @artherra @missmaladicta @queerfictionwriter because you specifically commented/reblogged.

So having seen Endgame, the question becomes: Did Marvel pull it off?

My answer is: yes and no.

Did we get an emotionally satisfying ending? Did Marvel understand that closure doesn’t have to come with corpses?

There were a lot of things I loved about Endgame. There were many, many of the “small character moments” we were begging for. Marvel didn’t forget that we fell in love with people and we need to see people and their choices and how they live with the consequences of those choices... mostly.

I loved how Marvel rewarded the audience for watching 11 years of movies. It was practically wall-to-wall Easter eggs and callbacks. I loved how the time travel allowed us to loop back through some of our favorite scenes and see them from other points of view, and the additional information. (Sitwell and Brumlow taking the scepter immediately after Loki’s capture: oh, so that’s how HYDRA got the Mind Stone!) I loved the cameos upon cameos (despite how silly it is for someone like Natalie Portman to show up for literally 15 seconds and not get any lines). I appreciated that Captain Marvel was used exactly the right amount: she saved Tony and Nebula, she was established as part of the post-Snap team, she came in at the end to lend some firepower, but she did not have any part in solving the problem nor was she the person who ultimately handed Thanos his raisin ass. I LOVED THE FINAL BATTLE, HOLY FUCK. (With the exception of Loki not being present, but I’ll get to that.) There were real laughs, and real tears. I cheered when Steve summoned Mjolnir (and laughed my head off at the Cap-on-Cap fight). I loved Morgan and Cassie, and the echoes of fathers and daughters throughout.

There were things I did not love, even before we got to the final or semi-final fates of some characters. I was genuinely offended with Thor’s treatment. I was not happy with Loki. I was confused about Vision, Gamora, and Black Widow, because they are due to return for future TV shows and movies, so leaving their statuses open or cloudy (or “dead,” which I put in quotes for a reason) was just disconcerting. The time travel opened up a lot of problems.

My original post was about endings, so let’s talk about those. In approximately descending order of Satisfying to WTF:

Stan Lee: Got his last cameo in the end of the arc so he didn’t miss any, driving along, clearly having the time of his life. Excelsior, Stan, and thank you for everything.

Clint: Got his happy ending. He was deeply bitter about losing his family, but got them restored to him. He did lose Nat, but I’ll cover her in her own section.

Steve: He did get his soft epilogue, albeit with Peggy Carter, and I can’t fault that. Marvel was never going to give us the Steve/Bucky romance no matter how obvious it was, and Steve/Peggy also works. (And really, I love Peggy, so for her to get a happy ending too is a bonus.) Steve gave so much of himself over the years. I can’t object to allowing him to be selfish and re-live his life quietly, to finally put down his shield and go home from the war. He got his reward.

It basically works with the existing timeline if you squint and assume that Peggy’s Alzheimer’s was messing with her at the beginning of Civil War, or if there’s another timeline altogether. I’m slightly annoyed that whatever he got to have with Bucky all happened offscreen between the stinger of Black Panther and the beginning of Infinity War, but apparently they did spend time together. And Steve clearly told Bucky was he was planning; that’s what “I’m gonna miss you” was foreshadowing.

STEVE IS WORTHY OF MJOLNIR. YESSSSSS!

Bruce: I was okay with the “Professor Hulk” storyline (which I was told by a sharp-eyed nephew is from the comics), although I wouldn’t have minded seeing that internal struggle onscreen, but I understand it’s an IP rights issue and there isn’t going to be another Marvel standalone Hulk film.

Tony: Augh. AUGH! I get it. I know why he died, on a meta level. But still.

This, at least, we can say is mostly “heartbreaking” and not “burn.” Tony got the five-year interval to make some kind of peace with his losses. He and Pepper got married and had Morgan. He got some kind of Happy For Now. He got some kind of reward, which RDJ brilliantly conveyed even in the few minutes we saw.

@hjbender linked @starkysnarks’s excellent post about Tony’s arc. One important part:

That’s why I think that giving a better, more positive message is so important. While other characters have flaws, it’s only Tony who has this consistent, this carefully streamlined storyline of improvement, of redemption, of self-realization and self-betterment. It’s Tony who is most often referred to (by the aforementioned mainstream outlets AND within the fandom) as the most human of the characters, and his story – as the most humane. His happy ending with a new house and young family will not feel like an opt-out, it will not feel complacent, at least not to me. It will feel like hope. It will feel like achieving, at least partially, the goal of that endless internal struggle that we all go through daily. It will feel like it’s possible to be good and be happy and be content, to know that you have done you best and your best is good enough for you to live, and go forward, and be.

He ultimately got some of this, for a while. Tony’s fatal flaw is his fear about Thanos, or the threat that Thanos represents. Prior to Avengers, Tony was happy-go-lucky because he could, eventually, beat whatever the world threw at him. But Thanos was not of this world, and would have wiped everyone out if Tony hadn’t managed to get that nuke through the portal. That trauma, that guilt, that fear, is what drives him for the rest of the Infinity Stones storyline. He is desperate to protect everyone. It’s what makes him want to put “a suit of armor around the world” in Age of Ultron, and of course the way Ultron backfires compounds Tony’s PTSD and guilt, which is what leads to his position in Civil War and the fight he picks with Steve at the beginning of Endgame.

And the worst happens in Infinity War, and the Avengers lose. Everything Tony feared ultimately happened.

Five years later, he’s managed to move forward. He has his happy ending — as happy as he can be, given their losses. He’s accepted his failure, more or less. He wants to rest, which is why he rejects Steve and the others at first.

But his tinkerer’s brain won’t let him put their proposal aside. He needs to know intellectually that there’s no chance, that he can’t fix what he screwed up. Because that’s the other part of what drives him: they lost. He lost. “I lost the kid,” he tells Steve (meaning Peter). That fear of loss, of losing people, of failing people, of disappointing people, is what keeps pushing him. If he knows that there’s no possible way he can undo his mistake, he’ll figure out a way to cope, especially since he still has Pepper and then his daughter. But now there is a way, or there might be, and he can’t let that lie, he can’t rest, until he knows one way or the other. And when the way to fix things becomes possible, there is no other outcome for Tony to choose. He wouldn’t be a hero otherwise.

It is a terrible loss, but in the end I could accept it. Tony got a Happy For Now. He was able to enjoy his life for a little while. He got the genuine closure with his father which he couldn’t in the BARF hologram at the beginning of Civil War thanks to the time travel, and he got to see Peter restored and give him the hug which they weren’t at yet in Homecoming. Tony was triumphant. He defeated his greatest, most terrible adversary. He defeated his fear. Thanos is gone, and his minions with him. The echo of “I. Am. Iron Man.” was exquisite. (even more so knowing that line in the first movie was ad-libbed! it wasn’t in the script! It was RDJ’s idea!) So his death is sad, but it’s earned.

Natasha: Meh. Just meh. The scene where she and Clint fight over who is going to die was blackly hilarious. It made narrative sense for Nat to be the one who died — she has found family, but not children; she spent the interval trying to run the Avengers and SHIELD and trying to fix things, and this allowed her to contribute in a material way; she still has a lot of red in her moral ledger — but on a meta level, we know there’s a Black Widow movie in the works. It doesn’t make sense to have a spinoff series set before Endgame when you know how the character dies. It’s not a bad ending, all things considered, but the actress herself can’t get younger. Is it supposed to be her origin/backstory movie after the character has died? Is it Multiverse Branching Timelines? Was she restored when Steve returned all the Stones to their place in the timeline? Was she restored with Tony’s Snap, or Bruce’s? Not knowing how that’s going to work with the rest of the MCU timeline blunted the emotional effect of her death for me.

Although he’s not an original Avenger, I had similar issues with Vision. There will be a Scarlet Witch and Vision TV series. Vision is still dead, according to Wanda at Tony’s funeral. So was he restored with either Bruce’s Snap or Tony’s? Was 2018 Gamora?

And the two which completely did not work for me, the ones where I think Marvel really missed:

Thor: Of the original Avengers, he was the one I was most upset about.

I really, really did not like how Thor’s very legitimate grief, depression, PTSD, and alcoholism were played for laughs. Thor is down to a “kingdom” of a few hundred people at best (we don’t know what Asgard’s population was to start with, but Hela killed quite a few, and then Thanos killed half of them on the Statesman, and it’s entirely possible that the Snappening dusted half of whomever remained). He’s living with the murders of Loki, Heimdall, and the Warriors Three (I can’t remember if Sif was supposed to have survived the Snappening, but she doesn’t appear in Endgame). He didn’t “go for the head” in Infinity War, which clearly haunts him despite the fact that Peter Quill is just as much to blame for interrupting Strange, Tony, Peter, and Mantis, or Wanda is just as much to blame for not getting the Stone out of Vision’s head faster, etc. etc. He cut off Thanos’s head after the fact and is clinging to that — “Who else here killed Thanos?” — as some kind of cold comfort. “Look, at least I did that in the end. At least I got revenge.”

Thor is a mess. His family is dead. His dearest friends are dead. He’s in a depressive spiral, self-medicating with food and alcohol, lost in video games because they are a consequence-free way to “win.” He’s holed up with Miek and Korg because they didn’t know him before Ragnarok and they have no real expectations of King Thor, God of Thunder, Avenger, Hero. He feels he has failed at everything which has ever been expected of him.

And the script... plays this... for laughs.

We are meant to laugh at his pot belly and flabby physique. We are meant to laugh at his unkempt matted hair and wild unbraided beard. We are meant to laugh at his drunkenness, at how he passes out, at how he blearily begs and whimpers to be the one to unSnap everyone ( “Please let me do something good, something right,” he pleads), at how he returns to Asgard on the day of Frigga’s murder and tries to frat-boy off to the cellars for some of Odin’s best ale because he cannot face his failure on this day too.

None of this is funny. It’s not funny at. all. It’s horrifying.

I do understand that this is likely more Hemsworth than Marvel. The actor vocally complained that he was bored with formal, upright Thor and would have been done with the character without Taika Waititi’s more comedic take in Ragnarok. He has said in interviews that Thor in Endgame is the closest to Hemsworth himself that the character has ever been, and clearly the actor loves doing comedy. He’s good at it — I enjoyed Kevin in Ghostbusters 2016.

I don’t object to loosening up Thor. I don’t object to showing Thor spiraling into alcoholism and depression and hiding from the world in food and games. I object to using depression and alcoholism for comedy.

Thor faces Frigga, reluctantly, and she counsels her son whom she loves, telling him not to worry about living up to expectations but to be his best true self. This is consistent with both characters; Thor has accepted how hard it is to be king. Then as Thor is quantumming out she adds “And eat a salad.” Really? You had to throw that in there? She sees the wreck her son has become and she nags? She gives him some kind and loving advice, she knows there’s some weirdness going on, but she has to cap it with fat-shaming?

We are meant to mock formerly ripped Thor for being “fat and ugly,” but let’s be clear: Thor’s appearance is an outward manifestation of deep emotional issues. Thor has not been able to cope with his failure. He and Tony faced similar terrible losses. Both characters originally had sunny dispositions. Tony, who still had Pepper at least, has managed to crawl out of his hole and build something with his wife and daughter. Thor lost his brother, his other half, and has mentally, emotionally, and physically collapsed. There really is no Thor without Loki.

And speaking of, I’m going to scream for a moment:

SERIOUSLY, MARVEL, WHAT EVEN THE FLAMING FUCK WAS THAT? YOU TEE UP A GODDAMN LINE LIKE “I ASSURE YOU, BROTHER, THE SUN WILL SHINE ON US AGAIN” AND THEN IT DOESN’T PAY OFF? I FUCKING WAVED THAT FLAG FOR A SOLID YEAR BECAUSE I WAS CONVINCED YOU WERE SMARTER THAN THAT AND THIS IS HOW YOU DO ME?

Loki: I am well aware that Loki started as an antagonist, and that my perspective is skewed from the fandoms I choose to participate in. I know that he’s not an Avenger.

But purely from a narrative point of view, Marvel, ya done fucked up. You dropped the ball.

From my previous post:

Loki’s death in Infinity War was so stupid and narratively pointless that a lot of fans, myself included, believe that there’s a plan behind the scenes (since we know Endgame involves time travel) which somehow explains it and gives it meaning. Because if not, then one of the most popular MCU characters — the only antagonist to keep returning, film after film, and primarily because audiences love him — died for nothing.

And there you have it. Explaining it after the fact in Loki’s TV show doesn’t count (and we don’t know that they will). Yes, Loki grabs the Tesseract in 2012 and disappears, so you can argue that “he doesn’t die,” but all that really does is screw up the timeline. It creates another timeline branch which isn’t resolved.

Is everything now a branched universe? If Loki took off with the Tesseract, does that mean The Dark World and Ragnarok never happened? If Loki didn’t go back to Asgard in chains at the end of Avengers, that means TDW couldn’t have happened the way it did. It means that Loki didn’t sacrifice himself, but does that also mean that Malekith would have gotten the Aether/Reality Stone from Jane and killed her? (It was Loki’s plan which saved Jane, let’s recall. And killed Kurse.) Does that mean Odin is still alive and on Asgard? And Hela was never unleashed? And therefore Loki and Thor never ended up on Sakaar and Hulk and Valkyrie Brunnhilde are still there? Or worse, that Odin died and Hela was unleashed but Thor wasn’t able to stop her because he didn’t have Hulk, Valkyrie, and Loki to help him? So she’s now loose and rampaging across the realms murdering at will?

It was appropriate for the larger arc for Carol to be part of the cavalry swooping in during the final battle to pummel Thanos for a while, but I kept waiting for Loki to show up. Loki was tortured by Thanos and Ebony Maw, which is what kicked off the plot of Avengers. If 2014 Thor was willing to break Loki out of prison to get revenge for Frigga’s death, why wouldn’t either 2014 Thor or 2023 Thor be willing to tell 2012 Loki “We have an opportunity for you to get back at Thanos. Wanna help?” Because as strung out and as still cocky as he was, jauntily waving in the elevator at the beast who just beat the shit out of him, I bet Loki would have been delighted to take a few swings at Giant Purple Nutsack Face. Yes, he probably would have escaped at some point during the final battle, because that’s who he was at the time, and still is — he’s “very comfortable with chaos,” as Hiddleston notes. And that would have been consistent. Help others if it also helps him, he’s not really a hero at that point in his arc, check out after Thanos is dead because he doesn’t want to go back to prison. That all would have worked. Even if he had no more to do than Shuri or Okoye, just to show him shooting a few blasts of seidr and showing that he is in fact just as powerful a sorcerer as Doctor “I’ve only been doing this for a year” Strange.

But Loki’s death in Infinity War is for nothing. Even if I wasn’t as invested in the character as I am, from a storytelling standpoint, it was pointless. The entire heavy foreshadowing of that line was utterly whiffed. You can’t even argue that “Loki sacrificed himself for Thor” because Thanos disappeared with the Space Stone, leaving Thor behind, and Thor crawled over to his brother’s dead, broken body and crumpled there to die. Thor gave up and never recovered. The last word he expected he would ever say was “Loki....”

Thor didn’t choose in that moment to use Loki’s sacrifice to stand up and claim revenge. Even Clint did more than that after Natasha’s death. Thor only continued on to forge Stormbreaker because the Guardians happened to pick him up in the vacuum of space after the Statesman exploded. That wasn’t a choice by the character, which is what moves a character arc forward. It was happenstance. Thor’s heart was destroyed with Loki’s death. It’s a shell of a man who eventually beheads Thanos.

Loki got an “Avenge the Fallen” poster, but he wasn’t avenged. The 2012 version of him escaped and branched off a new timeline, according to the Ancient One’s explanation of how time travel works in the MCU.

We don’t know if either Tony’s or Bruce’s Snap restored 2018 Loki. Endgame is the end of this arc. Marvel can’t patch stuff up later and claim a do-over.

AND FOR FUCK’S SAKE MARVEL WE NEVER GOT THOR AND LOKI’S HUG.

So: did Marvel hurt us?

Not as badly as I feared. There was a ton of fanservice and moments which were so go-for-broke that I felt like we were watching wish-fulfillment fanfic. (So many jokes about Steve’s ass. Steve joking about Steve’s ass.) The script didn’t stop to explain who people were or give context; it assumed the audience knew everything and was keeping up. And that last battle, have mercy, Helm’s Deep and Pelennor Fields look like playground skirmishes in comparison.

BUT: The loose ends are deeply frustrating, and I think the Loki fandom is going to blow a collective gasket. Grotty Drunk Thor having constant My Dick Is Bigger fights with Peter Quill is not going to make me want to watch Guardians 3. (Although if Loki comes back and sneers at Quill, and Thor follows his brother off into the wild yonder with stars in his eyes, okay, call me.)

I will watch the Marvel TV shows because I’m a masochist, but I don’t know how much I’m going to allow myself to get emotionally involved. My expectations are far lower than before IW/EG. I don’t know how the shows and movies involving “dead” characters are going to explain things. Wibbly-wobbly timey-wimey handwaving is kind of a cheat, and it doesn’t excuse the shit storytelling which was allowed to happen in the first place.

Do I regret the journey? I don’t. It’s been a hell of a ride, and I’m so glad to have met these characters. I could wish for some things to be better, and hoo boy is there going to be a lot of corrective fanfic, but I’m not sorry I came along.

(and P.S.: Loki lives. :P)

#endgame spoilers #the stakes are too high #avengers: endgame #meta discussion #mcu #long post

120 notes · View notes

peachymess · 5 years

Note

1/2 Peachy I would love your opinion on a post I came across. Spoiler warning.... The post goes over Armin's crying scene, they say that Armin was actually moved my Yelena's words and how Armin has changed for the worst over the years. How he just wants to sit and talk etc...ah I wish I could link u the post on this. It's in the Armin tag and it's a recent post. I would love your feed back on that. I'm just kinda paranoid and worried for Armin, I could see him actually being moved by those words

2/2 to find the post the title is “Armin was pretending to fool yellena”?“ I kinda worry for him, I seen a lot of theories that he’s faking it or that his emotions were real but what came out of his mouth was a lie. I also saw your post that another Anon asked over Armin’s crying and that could also be it. Reading your post I kinda got reminded of how Armin has lied to Bert on Annie and also lied to the female Titan of crushing his best friend to distract her.

Hi, anon. I’m sorry; I really wanted to write a thorough meta for this, but I simply don’t have the time. I got this on my way to work yesterday evening, and today will consist of packing until I’m picked up to head to the family cabin (no net there; only on phone). I’ll be staying there till the 22nd of April, and I’ll be busy until the 25th. I would have saved the asks and replied once I’m back, had the topic not had a, probably, short expiration date. Meaning, I assume you’ve probably either landed on something, or there’s just a few days until a new chapter might give further answers, by the time I can actually get to it. However, if, at the end of April, you still wonder, feel free to ask me again about this topic. You’re right, I already gave a general reply, and I’ll give another. If I write another, deeper diving meta about this, it will only be to build up under the thoughts and arguments I have already given. Because, short answer to all of this is: I believe Armin is faking it, in hopes of getting an upper hand out of it. Armin has faked stuff and played on emotions like this before. He lied about Annie to reach Bert (and Reiner’s) emotions twice, he played on Eren’s trust in him during the Return arc - so that Eren wouldn’t catch on to his plan of self-sacrifice (if you don’t remember, Armin knew Eren wouldn’t go along with the plan if he told him the planned endgame, so the moment Eren started to ask himself what Armin was getting at, Armin pulls the “I’ll back out before I get too hurt, I promise; would I ever lie to you?”), he withheld the planned endgame from Jean and Mikasa for the same reason (aka, he knew their emotions could get in the way of them allowing him to sacrifice himself), he woke Eren twice from titan from by appealing to their dream (emotions) - the second time even when he thought he wouldn’t see it (read: he thought to himself “if this plan works, I’ll probably never see the ocean”, and then stabs Eren in the neck and says “Eren, wake up, we’re going to see the ocean”; lied). He also sweet-talked Annie into helping him, by talking about good vs bad people, and how she’d be a bad person to him if she didn’t help him - because we’re all human, and we have an instinctual need to be liked by others (especially if we like or respect the person in question, which Annie did). Armin also lied about his best friend been crushed under her foot, to (among other things) save Jean’s life; by faking his emotional distress over seeing his friend dead - as in, using emotional manipulation.

My point is, Armin understands people’s emotions very well, he analyses situations well. He knows how to use that to his advantage. If he is faking it with Yelena, it would not only be “in character”, it would be textbook Armin. Even more textbook Armin, than him being generally moved to tears by words. I haven’t looked into what exactly it is Yelena says yet, but by word of mouth, she talks about their work being remembered past their own deaths (among other things). Armin doesn’t want/need to be remembered. You have to think about what his goals and desires are. He doesn’t want bloodshed. He would want every single person to live, if there was a way for it. Even if what they do gets remembered for centuries, do you think he’d be happy if what they did, was to commit genocide?

Again, I don’t know Yelena’s stance in detail, nor her words to Armin, but I know their positions pre-116: opposite sides. Words will not sway Armin from one to the other. He has an analytical mind, and he has thought about both sides already, from many angles, I am sure. He has picked the side he morally believes in. And because he has thought about it thoroughly, I doubt that simply phrasing the (in his mind) “wrong side” in a certain way, will suddenly convince him to agree with it. If people, words or emotional appeal would convince him, don’t you think his best friend would have been able to get him on board these past 4 years? Armin and Eren are torn because their morals have garnered considerable distance to one another (or so it seems), and Armin will rather uphold his morals than break bread with someone over a treasured friendship (and before anyone goes after Armin for that, remember it takes two to tango; the exact same could be said about Eren).

What more, think about the story aspect of this. Firstly, what was the point of the scene? What was the point of showing Armin getting on Yelena’s good side? Either it’s to show Armin’s development into being a Zeke-follower - but if that isn’t it (which I don’t believe), then the point was that Armin having Yelena around his little finger, will become an asset to him later. He can use it to influence her choices/actions, to free his friends, etc. Where would the story take him, if Isayama makes Armin suddenly side with Yelena? It looks like a dead end to me, especially this late in the game. What will happen next, if Armin goes over to Yelena/Zeke’s side? Eren is gonna throw Zeke a curveball, which means the parties will split into three (if not more). This would leave Armin (still) opposite to Eren, but also opposite to Mikasa. Which would make it finally easy(er) for Mikasa to go against Armin over Eren. And after Mikasa reluctantly sides with Eren to take down Armin, who becomes a side of his own, then what…? We return to Eren vs SC, just like before? A dead-end loop. Of course, there’s a lot of room here, and I honestly won’t pretend to know what the future of this story holds. I will, however, trust my knowledge of Armin enough to say I highly doubt that Armin is being moved to tears over some fanatic’s words. It’s all about motivation here. I already mentioned it, but that’s because it’s such an important thing to look at. You cry when something resonates with you. What about Yelena’s words, would resonate with Armin’s ultimate goals?

… Because his goals are the same today, as they’ve always been: as much peace as possible, for the smallest price possible. I’m still eager to hear him talk about his dream (ocean, northern lights, etc.) again, just to see where his stance is on that now (it’s the only part of him I won’t confidently guess at), but that’s somewhat irrelevant right now. The point I’m trying to get to is this: Armin hasn’t changed for the worse. He hasn’t changed at all. What has changed, is Eren’s opinion on Armin and his ideals. Before, Eren admired him, now he’s impatient with him. I don’t think I heard anyone talking about Armin’s morals changed, before Eren brought it up at the round table. Because Armin hasn’t changed; what Eren said, he said (either) because he’s convinced himself of it, and (or) because he wanted Armin to start doubting his own mind/motivations. Armin’s strength is his mind, and as long as he thinks he can trust his own judgement, he will be solidly in place (as he has been for 4 years). Topple that confidence, and he might finally, possibly be susceptible to manipulation. That would be to Eren’s great benefit. I think that’s part of why he said it. But he’s wrong either way. And I think that went over parts of the fandom’s heads.

Because whether Armin has Bertolt’s memories or not, he is still himself. If all the shifters were just an empty shell of the shifter that came before them, then Bertolt wasn’t himself either; he would in turn have been the shell of the previous one, who was a shell of the one before him, etc. Even with shifter influence, that function only works, if it’s at most partial (except for, possibly, exceptions under special circumstances that Armin don’t meet). Look at all the shifters; there is enough evidence to say with certainty, that they are to some degree their own person, with wishes and feelings connected specifically to them. Things from previous people might be added, but not everything from the pre-shifter holder is taken away. Just look at the BRA chemistry: Reiner and Bertolt are friends, and Annie is going “meh” on the sideline. Fat chance the original colossal, armored and female had the exact same dynamic as the BRA trio had pre-shifters, yet they are the same trio before and after becoming shifters.

Armin has tried to talk things out with the enemy before. He tried to talk to Bertolt in the return arc, he tried to talk to Bert and Reiner when they were running away. He generally wants to understand the enemy, and for them to in turn understand him. He believes that if they can find common understanding, they can find common ground. Him wanting to build bridges with the other countries has nothing to do with Bertolt’s memories, and it is not something he “wouldn’t have wanted before”. Remember how upset he was when he shot the MP lady? She was an enemy, but he was still so distraught he puked and cried his heart out. Remember in the return arc when they blew Reiner to bits (one of several times, lol)? Armin looks at him, tears in eyes, and expresses that he is heartbroken that it had to come to that because there was no room for talking. He explicitly mentions how he regrets that they weren’t able to talk it out. Armin Arlert has always wanted to pursue the most peaceful solutions! This is not new! And I was going to dedicate a large chunk on my meta just for this, but sadly, I don’t have the time. I have talked about this many, many times; talked about how he’s not a pacifist, as some claim he is, because he is not - but that he, instead, feels like they have a duty to make sure the violent option they choose, is still the least violent option. He would let a thousand men die if it meant saving the rest of the world. But not before he is confident that there isn’t a way to sacrifice only a hundred for the same outcome!

1. Zeke and Yelena’s plan is to kill probably several thousands, to save the rest of the world. Armin thinks they can save the world by sacrificing considerably less than several thousands. That is why, no matter how pretty Yelena makes it sound, her plan will never move Armin to tears.

2. Armin’s morals have not changed; he’s always wanted to save as many people as possible and to get as far as he can with communication. His first line in this damn story is about how if you abandon arguments and resort to violence instead, it means you’re in the wrong.

3. … Yet he’s not a pacifist. When there is no other solution, he will restore to violence. Eren forced his hand with Marley, and what did Armin do? He didn’t stand passively by; he did the only thing that was left to do to proceed: blow up the harbor. When Jean was about to get shot, what did he do? He shot that MP in the face. He doesn’t like violence, and he wants to avoid it as much as possible, but he recognizes that if communication doesn’t get you all the way, violence will cover the rest. However, he feels that they all have a duty to exhaust all possibilities before turning to violence (”the end justifies the means - if you were mindful of the means”). That is why he and Eren now differs: Armin feels that Eren is no longer attempting to look for less horrific means, and instead going for the first thing plan that comes to mind. And it’s making Armin question his morals; if Eren truly cared about everyone, would he not also - just like Armin - desire to spend at least some time to think and analyze, and test the waters of less horrific plans? Eren, on the other hand, seems to feel pressed for time, and has no patience for Armin’s “lingering”, and thus grows angry and refuses to put himself in Armin’s shoes to try and understand why he “lingers” against the enemy. Pick what side you want, but Eren is wrong in the way he sees Armin. And the fandom should realize this and not so readily take his reprimand of Armin as facts. Armin has not changed. … but I know I’m seen as biased in Armin’s favor, just like that post you read sounds to be biased against him. And since I have no time, I’d encourage you to seek out @momtaku; she’s given good, believable, objective analysis of Armin before and I trust her to treat him fairly. She writes metas a lot more than I do these days, so - though with fear of sending too much work her way - I’d suggest you ask her what she makes of the scene. Either way, that’s enough of my rambling. I hope that no matter what, anon, you are able to de-stress somehow. SNK makes me worry a whole lot too, but Armin stepping away from his greatest strength (good judgement) at the last hour, is not one of those worries.

(PS: I didn’t read that post you talked about, I don’t have the time, but if there is a fair point in it that I don’t cover, feel free to ask me about that part specifically. Also, had I read it, I would have sourced it and tagged the author so that there is no shade).

#ask #anon #snk 116 #armin arlert #snk

19 notes · View notes