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an-obligatory-blog · 6 years

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I’ve known this for quite some time, but I’m just going to post this now since even now, it’s still a very confusing part of P5.

Regarding to the ending split...

... it has plot holes, but it isn’t as major as I initially thought it was.

It was a complex plan, no doubt, and certainly, there had to have been a better way to explain it (ATLUUUUUS). After all, for a good amount of time, I thought the thing is riddled with nonsense, but after being explained by a certain someone on discord and some more thought, some questions has been answered. Oh, and reading Futaba’s dialogue before you go to sleep-- I don’t see many videos of that on it’s own so I suppose that’s part of the reason why it’s confusing.

These a few plot holes that I thought (or others) existed, but didn’t:

- How Akechi got out of the Metaverse (do you remember how you leave the Metaverse?) - How Akechi contacted Shido (u thought he was was underground/in the metaverse? apparently he wasn’t necessarily) - The Metaverse app being activated without alerting Goro (you can use the app without audio input via the search history function (see: the second time Akira and Ryuji entered Kamoshida’s Palace)) - Goro not getting into his rebel outfit after entering the Metaverse (When asked, you can sell out your teammates and/or you confidants, but NOT Akechi. At that moment, Sae didn’t know that Akechi intends to shoot Akira until Akechi had already left the Metaverse. During the duration of the attempted hit, there was no reason for Sae to see Akechi as a threat, either a hitman or a thief) - How tf Futaba can get a signal from Akechi’s phone (since it had a GPS) and Akira’s phone (GPS and voice messaging) when both Akechi and Sae were supposedly 8 floors underground (They weren’t necessarily. Sae met Akechi w/ the phone right after leaving an elevator. The voice messaging was pre-programmed into Akira’s phone so that it could work in the Metaverse; Futaba OP, pls nerf)

What wasn’t explained regardless:

- The mess that is Justice Rank 8 (someone told me that it might be a developer’s joke since Morgana commented how it didn’t make sense nor would it make sense for either Morgana or Akira to , which would be shitty cuz that is literally the definition of lazy writing: “Idk what to put here so let him rank up cuz lul”) - How exactly did Sae convince the police that there was a body in the first place? I get forging the death certificate (which should be enough to fool Shido since his ass isn’t getting out of his office chair), but what about everyone else? That doesn’t sound like a feat that could be done by one person. Maybe the grunts anticipated Akira’s death too quickly and assumed that it happened when Sae reported? Eh, even for P5, that relies way too much on incompetence. How Sae managed to 1) drag Akira out without being caught 2) fool the police in regard of a dead body and 3) get away with it all for so long is the worst plot hole you could pull out of this whole plot segment. - SEE EDIT BELOW

Asterisks (*) are used to mark questionable parts that I realized after what Atlus was really trying to do.

I found Futaba’s extra dialogue during NicoB’s Let’s Play of Persona 5. It’s around the last 10 min of the episode linked below. Couldn’t find a better video, but this is where I found out, so it’ll work.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mi6wLyeuqws&list=PL5bkYBlFL9xcNUVU5-EcBxdaVVAZM2zX1&index=62

Look at the moment when Akechi and Sae meet. When Sae showed him the phone, Futaba explained later that she bugged the phone (the one belonging to Akira) similarly like with Akechi’s phone. Through that, she remotely activated the Metaverse app to transport the two into the Metaverse. (remember the search history function that was used for Akira’s and Ryuji’s second visit to Kamoshida’s palace? That’s the function that Futaba remotely activated. She didn’t tamper with the magical app itself.)*

So Sae and Akechi are in and they went in opposite directions. Akechi goes in, kills the cognitive guard and cognitive Akira.** Now, here’s where one of the so-called ‘major plothole’ existed. How did Akechi get out? First, let me ask you this, how do leave the Metaverse in the first place? I thought that you just press the app to leave, but apparently, that’s wrong. You have to physically go back the way you came, and that’s why you always have to return to the Palace’s entrance to leave the Palace. This is what Atlus failed to do-- what leaving the Metaverse actually looks like. We saw Akechi’s pictures of the PT appearing/disappearing out of thin air back at Okumura’s palace, but we didn’t see how it really looks like without the red/black circles washing over the screen every time we do it. Apparently, leaving the Metaverse doesn’t involve pressing the app at all-- just going back the way they came. Remember where Sae showed Akechi the phone? That is where they entered, and hence, where they exit. When Akechi was done with his assassination attempt, he goes down the hall, up the elevator (yeah, the guard couldn’t have seen Sae and Akechi conversing, they were on a different floor), and back to where the app was first activated. Once Akechi crossed that point, that’s when he left the Metaverse.

This is when Akechi calls Shido. You see how he calls Shido right in front of an elevator? Yeah, he probably wasn’t 8 floors underground at that point.

Now, I’m assume you know the general story with Sae, but I’m going to clear this up anyways. Sae received the pre-programmed messages from Akira’s phone, and she followed their instructions to go back to the interrogation room. Once again, she crossed the same point where the app was first activated, thus causing her to exit the Metaverse. She goes down the elevator and towards the room. The GPS installed in Akechi’s phone helped Futaba to time Sae’s entrance because it would be awkward if Sae encountered Akechi mid-assassination. (Futaba would know when Akechi is out of the Metaverse and out of the police station; nothing contradictory of getting a signal by then)

*The problem with this is... even if you use the search history function, the phone still plays it’s voice protocols like normal (”...Beginning navigation” You know the drill.). I don’t recall this ever being mentioned by any of the characters, but you can easily explain this away with “the phone was on silent”. **The cognitions should’ve disappeared similarly like Shadows when they were killed. You can pull any number of BS by using “well maybe Sae’s cognition is different because hurr durr”, but it was never mentioned by the PT to even consider the rate in which cognition disintegrate into nothing nor was there any measures to accommodate for that. This instance is plot convenience at it’s finest.

Now for the sake of clarification, this doesn’t mean that Atlus is suddenly flawless in regards of how they handled this aspect of the story. Aside from what I’ve already stated above, this stuff could’ve been handled better. The search history function was only mentioned offhandedly in the the very, very beginning of Kamoshida’s Palace (before even Shiho attempted suicide) by Ryuji so there is almost no way anyone would remember without looking back. The anime cutscene where Ryuji was smirking “we got ‘em” when he heard about the supposed suicide of the PT leader made no sense. (How would he know that the plan even succeeded???? I know he was being like, “well I toOOOTALLY knew that we were going to succeed” but goddamn, but that sounds like he was acting tough more than anything. That kind of blind confidence shouldn’t be present, even for a character like Ryuji.)

You know what would really help? Seeing a few frames of the inside of the elevator as it goes up and down. Despite hanging out in the background, I barely even noticed it before someone else pointed it out.

A good part of the fandom was impressed by the plan and yes, I do think it’s a clever trick for Atlus to pull on us. However, the more complicated the plan is, the more effort one should put in explaining said plan because, you know, it would be harder for the player to understand. I don’t mean treating the audience like idiots and I understand the concern of dragging the explanation scene out, but man, Atlus was totally off their game when it came to hinting/foreshadowing. Instead of doing off-hand comments about seemingly arbitrary, but relevant aspects of the plan (ex. Futaba’s bug on Akira’s phone, the search history function, etc.) that you can probably catch by your second or third run of the game, Atlus favored getting hung up on whether or not they wanted the traitor to be obvious or not because they seemed to be pretty damn bipolar regarding to that.

I do give them credit for making some information optional (discoverable by talking to Futaba). It makes the scene less draggy and allows people who don’t give two shits to skip the parts they don’t care. I don’t watch many let’s players on the same game, so I can’t conclude if many people actually went out of their way to talk to Futaba and process her words.

And one last note, I don’t think Persona 5 is a bad games by any standard, but I do believe that the writing is the weakest aspect of the game. Style and gameplay seems more polished than the actual story aspects.

I hope this helped for any of you guys out there. Feel free to let me know if you.see any mistakes/seek clarification. It’s 9:30 PM for me, so I hope I didn’t mess up too badly explaining this.

EDIT: It came to me that if the method of leaving the Metaverse is truly just by going back where they came, it raises issues in Shido’s Palace, where the place they started was on the front deck, which, as you guys know, was sinking into the depths by the end. Basically, there’s no winning with P5 plotholes-- no matter how you look at it, there’s an issue.

#persona 5 #goro akechi #sae niijima #it's a mess #a lot of this is a mess #part of the reason why I'm writing this is to clear up my thoughts so that I don't mess up when writing fanfiction

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cute-trans-people · 7 years

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Mod Frankie here.

In light of the stuff that got posted last I’m going to post an in-depth response, but I’d like to start it off with saying; I do not agree with Ash. I am trying to remove him from the blog as we speak.

This is gonna get long, so I’m posting under a read more.

Hey, @ashthenerdiestnerd here’s a long response. Go fuck yourself and get the fuck of my blog please.

I have deleted the original post as well as the ask Ash answered, but I will keep up the second thing he posted at least temporarily.

I don’t agree with anything that Ash posted. I haven’t spoken to him since March and he has only ever posted 4 things on this blog, I don’t know why the fuck he hasn’t removed himself from it yet.

I don’t think that you need dysphoria to be trans. The only requirement to being trans is identifying as a gender other than the one you were assigned at birth. Being trans is not a disorder. The DSM-5 explicitly states that it is not a disorder.

The myth that non-dysphoric trans people (and especially nonbinary people) are taking away resources and from “actual” trans people is bullshit.

I’m also going to be responding the the asks he deleted here (I get emails for all asks and I will be copying and pasting from there)

@thecreepycrow

"To be tran, you need to have dysphoria" is probably one of the more ignorant things I've hear in the last week. No, no you don't. There are nonbinary people who have little to no dysphoria, those people are still trans. There are people who are born a biological sex and ID as a different gender but have zero issue with their actual body and don't feel the need to medically transition and just look however they'd like. Being trans is not that cut and dry in a lot of cases

I agree completely. If you look back on the other things posted on this blog I have always and will always support all my trans siblings; with and without dysphoria.

Anonymous

Why have you betrayed me like this?

I assure you that I don’t agree with anything Ash said and am getting him removed from this blog as quickly as I can.

Anonymous

good to know your blog is trash! thanks for being open about it, at least. transphobia is transphobia and theres no excuses. i dont have to cut myself up for your fucking benefit.

I’m so sorry for what he said, I would’ve thought it’d be apparent that this blog as a whole does not agree in any way shape or form with truscum beliefs.

Anonymous

Hey, just a reminder that being trans in not a disorder, that a lot of dysphoria is due to society not accommodating trans people and varying trans narratives. Some trans people have dysphoria, some have euphoria, some have neither or both; the defintion of trans is not identifying with the gender you were assigned at birth, and thats the only qualifier. The only person that can comment truely on persons gender is that person

Very well put! Gender euphoria is often overlooked in discussions about being trans, but I think it's very important in combatting the idea that being trans is just suffering.

Anonymous

Wasn’t honestly going to say anything but it’s important. I’m going to be unfollowing. I have been trying to find positivity. That post was negativity and I don’t honestly want to see more of it. Trans people shouldn’t have to hate themselves to be trans. If they say they are a bit then take that and know that they are a boy. Getting surgery won’t make them cry and say “I’m not female enough” just because they didn’t hate themselves before doesn’t mean they’ll hate themselves after lol

I understand unfollowing. I try to keep this blog as positive and discourse free as possible. I’ve deleted that post and am currently trying to do some damage control before going back to the regular schedule of posting.

Anonymous

then why the hell post this here? This is supposed to be about positivity, not telling people who don't want to go through bottom or top surgery that they aren't valid for ANY reason they might want it.

I know and I’m really sorry that got posted. I would’ve deleted it immediately, but I was asleep.

Anonymous

it was rlly hurtful seeing transphobic stuff on this blog, is ash gonna be kicked off?? pls do bc most of what he said isnt even true! being trans is cool! dysphoria sucks yes Ok but u cant be negative and be "being trans is constant suffering and pain and if u dont feel that ur not a real Trans" like thats not even useful or helpful, also; many cis ppl can feel dysphoria (not to b confused w dysmorphia) and they cant be trans just bc they have dysphoria? idk but i dont want him on this blog thx

I’m trying as hard as I can to get him off this blog, but from what I remember he lives somewhere where its like 4am right now so he hasn’t responded to my message.

Anonymous

im actually super glad for that response to that post... as a transguy i literally can not fathom someone not even experiencing SOCIAL DYSPHORIA (which is literally just wanting to be seen as your actual gender and not your assigned gender). I personally experience strong physical and social dysphoria and if someone doesn’t experience even a mild form of either of these.... they arent trans. If you dont want to be seen as your “true gender” (for any reason other than safety) you arent trans.

Hey, kindly fuck off. I don’t want you following this blog. This is a positivity blog and that post was uncalled for. I don’t want truscum or transmedicalists following or interacting with this blog at all.

#mod: frankie #dont reblog

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jamesnovakwinchester · 7 years

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(1) idk what u think about this from a writer's perspective but don't u think there's an oversaturation of bangs that may contribute to authors feeling overwhelmed by their schedule & not being able to do the work they want to do bc they're so worried about how much they have yet to do?? it's something i've noticed in this fandom in particular?? there's so many bangs coming out and they're all back to back that no one gets a chance to rest & breathe & live their lives without a schedule

(2) of bangs looming over their heads and thus fostering a sense of despair as authors feel guilty and immense pressure bc they feel like they have to write even tho their plate may already be too full,,, idk it just seems like there’s constant demand for new content that may be leaving authors wrung out especially since no one pays them for their free content (commissions not included obvs) it’s not a criticism just something i’ve seen in my time in the spn fandom

So I’m gonna answer this in two parts because I think there are a couple things being hinted at in this ask and I have a lot of thoughts about these topics.

So, one, do I think there is an oversaturation of bangs in the fandom and do I think that leads to author despair? Kinda yes but also kinda no.

There are a buttload of bangs in the spn fandom, that’s for sure. And, there have only been more in the past year. I can name at least four that were brand new this year and three of them are starting today. But I think these bangs exist for a very specific reason. I know the mods of the DCJ bang and I know a big motivation behind that bang was to get more art for Dean/Cas/Jimmy (there was literally one art work before the bang) and to get more fics that weren’t all written by the same few people. Seriously, prior to the DCJ BB announcement, there were maybe 100 works for that ship on A03 and most of those that had been written post Pitchers and Catchers and by people who all knew each other on tumblr. The Saileen BB, which I’m co-moding, was created as a retaliation to canon. It was a “fuck you, we’ll keep the love alive”, kind of thing. Other bangs like the Crowley BB and the BMoL BB were created out of love for those characters and fans who just weren’t done with them yet. In many ways, that’s what fandom is all about! And it encourages other writers who might be on the fence about writing their idea or don’t think anyone will care because it’s not one of the Two Big Ships to write and for readers to find authors who write something they’re interested it. It’s really awesome in that respect.

The issue, I think, comes when a person is a multishipper or a shipper in one of the ships that has an assload of challenges. Destiel has, currently, the BB, the reverse bang, the tropefest, the harlequin challenge, another BB (because there were issues with last year’s BB and some people got really pissed) and probably a few mini bangs, too. I know Wincest also has a BB and reverse bang, but I don’t know if they have challenges to the extent that Destiel does. If you’re a Destiel shipper, but particularly a writer, you know the issue with oversaturation that ship has. (But I will save that for the second part of the answer.) As a multishipper, I want to write for all the bangs. I want people who love the same ships as I do to have new content, and I want to read new content, too. I want long fics with character depth instead of just one-shots all the time (not that there’s anything wrong with one-shots or the people who stick to those, I just tend to be a long fic reader). For people like me, who want to read and write it all, the fact that a million and one bangs all at once can be stressful, and it does make me feel a little sad when I can’t participate in all of them. But I think the fact that there are a lot of specific bangs that deal with specific characters or ships is a good thing. Those of us who do ship obscure things and those who prefer genfic have a place to explore characters, make friends, and find new readers. And, not every writer is going to care about every bang. A strict Wincest shipper probably doesn’t care about the Crowley BB, and a genfic writer probably doesn’t care about ship focused bangs either. The people who are going to have the biggest issue with overextending themselves are going to be the people who write for a lot of ships and/or characters. In general, I think it’s a good thing that we have a lot of bangs. It’s a little strange, sure, but SPN’s fandom is wild. We want to see our favorite characters live on after the story is done, and I think that’s cool. I can definitely see how it’s stressful for some people, and I myself have stressed myself out trying to write multiple bangs at once, but it’s a learning curve and it is dependent on each author. Some can manage three or four projects at a time and others just can’t. I know a few authors (myself included) who stress out about bangs and feel there just isn’t enough time in the year to do everything they want. But bang participation is voluntary. I also know several writers who’ve never written in bang and are still stressed about the pressure to produce. Which leads me to part two…

…. it just seems like there’s constant demand for new content that may be leaving authors wrung out especially since no one pays them for their free content…

Yes. Yes, there is a lot of pressure for authors to produce new content but it has little to do with bangs, imo. I personally feel that bangs, in addition to being about celebrating characters that we lost too soon or rarer ships, are an opportunity for writers of The Two Big Ships to get attention. I’m gonna pick on Destiel a bit, but just because I think the prime example of what I’m talking about. The ship is a behemoth. Currently, (at least last I checked) it is the most written ship on Ao3. Hundreds of thousands of words a cranked out yearly for this ship and because of that, smaller authors or new fics are lost. It doesn’t help, of course, that so many of the rec lists look exactly the same with the same few fics and authors populating them. In order to get noticed, the best chance a smaller author has is to participate in a bang or challenge and hopefully be interesting enough that bang readers will give them a shot. It sounds a little cynical, but I do think it plays a part in why there are so many challenges for that ship in particular. Authors are hungry for interaction, so we’re more likely to throw ourselves into challenges if we think we’ll get attention and interaction. It may sound a little vapid, but that’s how we’re paid. I don’t get paid in money to write, but I do get paid in kind words, so the more of that I get the better I feel and the more likely I am to continue to write. It’s kind of sucky thing, honestly.

Rather than being a main source of author despair, I think bangs and challenges are a response to it. We need to feel like we’re not just screaming into the void, here. Fanfic is an oversaturated market, but I don’t think it would be as much of an issue if readers were just a little more kind with their kudos and comments. I know that it’s different because 10% of readers leaving a “like” is actually pretty good but it still can sting and leave authors to feel that if they just produced more or better work or longer work or whatever they’d get more attention. (Or fewer “more!!” “update soon!” comments.) It’s a strange thing, too, that most people who write for fun do so to make themselves feel better so we do tend to write other projects if one we’re doing is leaving us unsatisfied. (And then we feel more stressed because we’ve got a million things we’re working on and none of them are done and we start circling the drain in our minds.)

The demand for new content is definitely something that leaves authors feeling wrung out and unappreciated, but I think it’s separate from bangs. It may occur in bangs, too, but it happens independently of them as well. I think the stress surrounding having a lot of projects going can and does come from bangs, but I don’t think it’s the only thing that causes the stress. I think, by and large, authors feel the pressure to create lest they are regarded as unimportant. That’s, of course, not true, but that’s how a lot of us feel at times.

That’s my opinion, though. If anyone else wants to weigh in they’re more than welcome.

#big bangs #fanfic #writing fanfic in the spn fandom #really thought provoking question anon #thank you for that #Anonymous

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comicteaparty · 6 years

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September 17th-23rd, 2018 CTP Archive

The archive for the Comic Tea Party week long chat that occurred from September 17th, 2018 to September 23rd, 2018. The chat focused on Soul Hymn by Draco Plato.

Featured Comment:

Chat:

RebelVampire

COMIC TEA PARTY- WEEK LONG BOOK CLUB START!

Hello and welcome everyone to the first week of our trial run for the Week Long Book Club! If you need more information on that, you can check out the link here: https://comicteaparty.com/post/178065237140/new-week-long-book-club Otherwise, let’s get started!

This week we’ll be discussing Soul Hymn by Draco Plato~! (http://khyatix.com/soulhymn.shtml). Use this week to read the comic at your own pace! You are free to come leave comments at any point during the week. You can comment as you read, or you can wait till you get through the entire thing. Whatever suits your schedule best is fine~! As always, remember that while we allow constructive criticism, our focus is to have fun and appreciate the comic. You have until 9/23 to tell us all your wonderful thoughts! Below you will find four questions to get you started on the discussion. However, a new question will be posted and pinned everyday (between 12:01AM and 6AM PDT), so keep checking back for more! With that established, let’s get going on the reading and the chatting!

QUESTION 1. What has been your favorite scene in the comic so far? What specifically did you like about it?

QUESTION 2. At the moment, who is your favorite character? What about that character earns them this favor?

QUESTION 3. Do you think Erik being a faun will be beneficial or harmful to his endeavors to save everyone? Ultimately, do you think Erik will succeed in saving the pillars and stopping Decebal? Please provide your reasoning for both!

QUESTION 4. Erik and Celeste received their powers from three space people, which Hope later reveals as Maha Deva Vijaya. Do you believe Maha Deva Vijaya will provide more help in the future? Why or why not? Why do you believe they’ve taken such a personal interest in what’s going on?

Capitania do Azar

ekekeke

1. my favourite scene was the one about the "oh everything's wrong but at least nobody asked me about my ears" followed immediately by "so what's with the ears?"

2. favourite character would have to be sassy gal Celeste

Tenor | Shinavar

“3. Do you think Erik being a faun will be beneficial or harmful to his endeavors to save everyone?”

We don't know much about them other than people are unaware they're 'real'. Truthfully unless I see some actual world affecting stuff, I don't believe this won't have any affect on his endeavors directly. Indirectly, perhaps. Like how Eric + Celeste already have been doing the magical thing for some time - that there's conspiracy theorists going around

“4. Erik and Celeste received their powers from three space people, which Hope later reveals as Maha Deva Vijaya. Do you believe Maha Deva Vijaya will provide more help in the future? Why or why not? Why do you believe they’ve taken such a personal interest in what’s going on?”

IDK and TBH this is the most frustrating part of the read for me. It's all hearsay footnotes in the comic. If these three space people were so important and play such a huge role, why have they only been foot notes so far? In fact I didn't know it was 3 people initially because the compound name has been confusing and it took a trip to the creator's site and into the character reincarnation to figure out it's actually 3 people. Which sadly has spoiled some things for me ;;;;

Sadly I don't have a favorite scene nor character yet. Mickael was getting close but I'm kinda playing it by ear right now. >_>' But it's a very pretty comic; the eyes in particular have such a pretty depth to them ^u^(edited)

Draco Plato

1. My favorite scene so far was the one where Decebal was behind Mickeal at his home. It felt kinda spooky. I also like Erik talking to Naples in bed, I think it showed how young Erik is, lol. 2. My favorite character is Erik, cause he's adorable n(UvU)n I'd like to see more of Arrow though, I feel like he's been underused so far.(edited)

RebelVampire

QUESTION 5. Unlike Erik and Celeste, Arrow has neither powers nor previous knowledge when he becomes involved. Why do you think Hope invited Arrow along? What do you think Arrow’s ultimate purpose is in all this?

Tenor | Shinavar

5. Hope said hes a proxy for one of the big space people so I'm guessing that initially. The only reason he doesnt have powers is because they havent given him any, right? So I think hes going to have a much bigger purpose later. I mean it seems Erik is the big power house but theres probably areas he cant touch that the other two can.

I'm curious though what proxy means specifically in this case

Kabocha

“1. What has been your favorite scene in the comic so far? What specifically did you like about it?”

http://khyatix.com/soulhymn/chapters/chp2/chp2pg19.shtml Probably this interaction? Celeste stopped being bossy for a minute, though....... She still doesn't believe he's really a faun...

“2. At the moment, who is your favorite character? What about that character earns them this favor?”

Arrow, for his intrinsic... Lyall-ness. Don't ask. XD I might have read the world page and may have been spoiled.

“3. Do you think Erik being a faun will be beneficial or harmful to his endeavors to save everyone? Ultimately, do you think Erik will succeed in saving the pillars and stopping Decebal? Please provide your reasoning for both!”

Can't say! Not enough info to judge this. As far as stopping Decebal -- if not in this life, then maybe another...

MDV -- Because making sure the earth doesn't get screwed up by a grumpy fallen angel is kinda important. Also, clearly Erik, Arrow, and Celeste are somehow otherwise linked to those three!

“5. Unlike Erik and Celeste, Arrow has neither powers nor previous knowledge when he becomes involved. Why do you think Hope invited Arrow along? What do you think Arrow’s ultimate purpose is in all this?”

Good question! We don't know too much about him aside from the fact that he's a twin and also is interested in Erik.... So maybe he'll become the story's damsel in distress alongside Rose. >:3

RebelVampire

i will support this canon of arrow being the damsel in distress

Kabocha

Ahahaha. I mean, realistically, I imagine Arrow will support Erik and Celeste, but beyond that? Hard to say. If he's a proxy like the other two, then it's curious that they haven't given him powers, unless his space person is working more through him? ...tbh I can't remember which one corresponds to which without looking at the life chart

mostly 'cause they haven't shown up much yet XD

FeatheryJustice

One of the things I always wonder while reading Soul Hymn is that would Erik like goat cheese? Or what kinds of foods with the characters like or dislike and if they are connected through all the souls do the all have the same likes and dislikes or different depending on each thing.

Kabocha

You know, that's a good question. XD Pre-wedding ring spell, do they all maintain some prefs between lives?

FeatheryJustice

1. Favourite scene so far was when Arrow saw Erik for the first time and completely just shoved his sister across to make room for him. It was just the comedic moment of the dismay in Celeste's face. 2. I think my favourite is Squirrel Familiar? I'm trying to look for the name since it's been awhile since I read the comic, but I love how sassy that squirrel was.

Time to re-read the entire thing, again :3

Kabocha

Napples, I think!

or Naples

Draco Plato

Haha, I like that scene too with him pushing her on the chair Yeah~! Naples is his name. Also, they do generally keep a lot of their likes and dislikes from other lives, but some things change too based on their current environment and upbringing. The ring spell didn't give them any new knowledge or information so it didn't really change anything in their personality. The spell varies from life to life though based on what their souls predetermined for it before being born. Erik would like goat cheese I think XD He's not really a picky eater, although I do think he's vegetarian. Erik really likes to cook too so he has a wide repertoire culinary wise. Arrow would most like foods he can eat while working I think, like sandwiches and fast food. Celeste is kind of apathetic about food overall, although I don't think she'd turn down a pastry, lol.

Kabocha

Celeste has tastes I can appreciate

Draco Plato

a pastry a day keeps the doctor away

also, sorry i'm not responding to everything, I'm trying to avoid anything that'd be really spoiler territory from me, but I love reading all the different PoVs.

anything on the site isn't particularly a spoiler though so it's all right to check out the world page, since I decided it's okay to know the lifetimes of the characters from the beginning as it helps to see their evolution over time.

cause some people seemed concerned about that, but it's also not important to read the world page either.(edited)

Kabocha

Heheh. I get that! There's a lot about the story which I think we have yet to learn, but it'll unfold.

Like, I can't wait to see decebal do some more dickish stuff lol

Draco Plato

Ooooooh yeah, he's still got a lot of stuff to do

RebelVampire

yes, can confirm theres still plenty in soul hymn that hasnt been blathered about on the site itself at least.

RebelVampire

“1. What has been your favorite scene in the comic so far? What specifically did you like about it?”

That scene in the train subway thing where Erik and Celeste fought that demon and had to be bailed out by Hope. I vastly enjoy that Hope came expecting the proxy people to solve all his problems, except nope. No problems solved for him. They aren't ready.

“2. At the moment, who is your favorite character? What about that character earns them this favor?”

For today, at least, gonna pick Celeste. I think Celeste all around has the best facial expressions and I like that shes upfront about the fact she hates being considered 2nd class to Erik.

3-5

[REDACTED SPOILERS]

Draco Plato

looooool

Rebel knows too much

RebelVampire

QUESTION 6. While visiting Desire, Arrow and Celeste learn of a deep connection to Erik that activates some sort of magic that makes them all married. Do you think the three will figure out a way to break the spell? If not, how do you think the relationship between the three will work out or fall apart?

Mharz

“1. What has been your favorite scene in the comic so far? What specifically did you like about it?”

My favorite scenes where the times Arrow goes head over heels over Erik in first sight. It was a fun scene.(edited)

Also that part where Arrow said he and erik just met today but it has hearts on the bubbles.

have to say Naples is freaking adorable here.

“2. At the moment, who is your favorite character? What about that character earns them this favor?”

I have to say Celeste. She's sassy sure but not in an annoying way and I like that. Also Naples... such an adorable puffball.(edited)

I feel like it's too early for me to gauge it so I can't really give a clear answer. I believe Erik will succeed tho as long as he gets his psyche intact and not get affected by the pillars like what happened when Desire grabbed his hand.

I dunno... I feel like they will just watch and let the trio deal with this themselves. Otherwise they would've interfere already.

I do know stuffs from outside the comic that is particularly spoilery <.< So I kinda know the real reason but I do hope Arrow will transform in anyway? That would be fun to see.

Kabocha

Magical boy Arrow! XD

I actually wanna see that, too, even if it's a joke or if he gets some sort of halloween costume

Mharz

6. While visiting Desire, Arrow and Celeste learn of a deep connection to Erik that activates some sort of magic that makes them all married. Do you think the three will figure out a way to break the spell? If not, how do you think the relationship between the three will work out or fall apart?

Eh. I'm sure it'll be fine. <w<(edited)

"Sorry Arrow, since you can't transform me and Erik just bought you this."

gets a totally random halloween costume

RebelVampire

and hten arrow died

and everyone mourned him

erik went crazy and ate cans for the rest of his days

and celeste took over the planet and became a vicious dictator

Kabocha

aaaaaa

I don't.... Well. that is a way it could go, I'm sure

Mharz

that is a scenario I can imagine as a high possibility

Kabocha

I'm sure the problem with the marriage spell is probably going to come from Arrow and Celeste at first, bc like.... I can imagine one of them logicking it all out like this: -We're all married -I'm married to my sibling?!!!!! -I'm going to kill my sibling and keep Erik to myself without realizing that it's just that they're BOTH married to the same guy. ....I mean, this could all just get awkward. Or murderous, if they're so inclined to take the murder-the-hypotenuse route -- but I mean, that would require someone stepping in and bein' like "Yo, Celeste.. Arrow........ wanna make Erik suffer for cheating on you with your sibling?" Meanwhile Erik's all over in the corner, like "What"

Mharz

I think Hope explained that they're married only to Erik and not to each other. In which Arrow cried polygamy.

Kabocha

........oh crap, I forgot about that

still

Mharz

literally just read it. <.<

Kabocha

Mharz

like the past hour.

Kabocha

well, that makes your memory much sharper than mine!

But still.................... Now I'm imagining Decebal getting Arrow to align with him, all for the purpose of forcing Erik and Celeste to give up

Mharz

or just get Erik to himself. XD

I mean Arrow agreed so he can have Erik to himself.

RebelVampire

tbf even if hope said it doesnt mean they accept it in their hearts. hope also explained a lot of things and i think from many of their dumbfounded wtf faces, not all of it absorbed into their brains

Kabocha

.............Hey, I remember the first time I read it, I was kind of with them XD

I wasn't familiar with much of Draco's other stuff!

RebelVampire

i think draco actually trimmed hope's explanation a tad cause im pretty sure originally it was supposed to be longer

Mharz

I like how Draco made all of these interconnected with all of the rest of the comics

RebelVampire

yes. its nice when things are governed by the same rules.

Kabocha

it'll be really cool when more stuff is complete, too -- we'll get a good feel for how it all works together

Mharz

Yas. I'm excited to see how this goes.

Kabocha

...Is this point where we start coming up with crack theories

RebelVampire

yes

granted as long as its related to soul hymn since dont want to alienate ppl too much with draco's billions of other comics

Kabocha

Ahahaha! SO crack theory: Decebal is going to use Mickael to release a mind-control hit single. He's going to spread his message through the world that way, and...... The first step to suffering will be removing all pizzas from the planet.

NO PIZZA EVER

RebelVampire

well i mean

that would be suffering

unless they already dont have pizza

Mharz

Not the pizza

Mharz

I have a weird question... Does Erik produce milk? <.< hides

Kabocha

I don't think male goats do

Tenor | Shinavar

Some do - usually dairy bucks who are in dairy-heavy lines can develop milk during rutting apparently. /Sorry had to look it up

Draco Plato

No, he definitely doesn't produce milk XD although for awhile the comic was titled Goat Milk for other reasons

Tenor | Shinavar

oh god

Kabocha

..............

I... You know. I just DRACO

Fuckin' hell, I feel like a pervert now XD

Draco Plato

Just realized how porny that title can sound, lol

Tenor | Shinavar

That's why I'm dying about it lmao

Kabocha

Now I'm thinking there needs to be a "name your comic like it's porn" joke, but......... that's neither here nor there. What would the difference have been if it was called Goat Milk though? Was there story significance?

Tenor | Shinavar

But I am curious Draco - how much would you say you need to read your other titles to be in the know with Soul Hymn? Cause seeing others' opinions I"m curious how out of the loop I am ;

Kabocha

See, I know some spoilers so I don't count for what I know

Tenor | Shinavar

Fair but IDK how many people know spoilers either

So I'm just curious :D

Draco Plato

I mean soul hymn should be pretty okay by itself, but maha deva vijaya have appeared in Zenchav out of order so it explains them a touch more atm, and soul hymn will directly feed into Zenchav by the end, but it hasn't yet. Witch Carnival also mentions the ring spell more, but again I don't think any of them are actually necessary to read for the story, more just additional information for people into the overarching story

RedEmyr ties into Soul Hymn the least so it d be super irrelevant to read for SH info

It ties into Zenchav and OoO tho a lot

Tenor | Shinavar

-Nodnod- Aaaah okay~ I haven't had the chance to get to OoO nor RedEmyr yet.

Draco Plato

Thats totally okay XD

Oh and it was called goat milk before because it focused on pregnancy and Mickeal and Sam's story more, but I took all that out so it no longer was relevant.

Cali helped me to think of the soul hymn title which I like a lot

Kabocha

cough

Mickeal, plz But I mean, that makes sense. XD

Draco Plato

Yeeeah, there's a lot of versions of this story at least 10

Draco Plato

Oh, cause it was mentioned earlier Maha Deva Vijaya is always said as one name because the three souls are so close they are treated as one entity

Tenor | Shinavar

That would be me, I think. THat's good to know - I think the confusion comes from addressing them as 3 people so I legit thought it was someone else entirely and it made me have to double over everything fFFFf

Not addressing, describing hem*

Draco Plato

Yeah, that's fair XD

RebelVampire

since someone mentioned it earlier, i will mention random fact: despite knowing all the many spoilers, i actually do have to look up which one is maha and which one is deva because i forget a lot and mix them up

Draco Plato

Ffft, they would be pleased

Kabocha

GASP

Pleased?!

Draco Plato

All according to keikaku

Kabocha

But... But... Well, I guess at that point they don't have a lot of the arguments that the would have in previous lives XD

Draco Plato

Nah they don't, they're just vijayas pillars of support so all their focus is in him

Kabocha

Maha is actually going to be very easy for me to remember because Maha sounds like how you say Macha as in the cat character from .hack and Macha was a girl, so Maha is.... well.

anyway XD

....that train of thought just occured to me

don't mind me! :'3

Draco Plato

Lolol! XD

Their name roughly translates to Mighty Deity Victory in Sanskrit.

So the names Maha and Deva are even just accents to Vijaya

Kabocha

RIP Celeste and Arrow

Draco Plato

Nah it's a good thing OvO

Or maybe just symbolic, lol

Mharz

Omg goat milk

imagines if that became the title

CalimonGraal

the 18+ version of soul hymn

looooool

Mharz

Where all the dark secrets happen

The solution for saving the world is goat's milk

Draco Plato

Erik plz you must give up your milk to save the world

Mharz

baaaaaaaah

Draco Plato

ooooomg

if i'd used that title I could've just used emojis for it

missed opportunity

Mharz

This has took a strange turn whoops(edited)

Draco Plato

hello darkness my old friend

Kabocha

So would the logo then include an eggplant? Oh gosh ahaha

Tenor | Shinavar

Omg. All of u need jesus

Kabocha

HEY, HEY, we have Vijaya, why do we need Jesus? I mean, what jokes were we supposed to make about a Mickael/Samantha relationship story called Goat Milk? It ends up with her pregnant, right?

BUT, that's neither here nor there. XD Speaking of those two, we're gonna learn more about their relationship with each other, right? :3 Like, just, generally, I mean. How did they meet... How did they fall apart... Why do they get along now instead of hating each others guts XD

How often has Rose been spotted with her horns in school XD

Draco Plato

There's a version of Goat Milk where everyone ended up pregnant, it was not my finest writing moment

And I am super happy that it was scrapped, it went in really weird places

and if I'm saying it went too weird, that's pretty off the deep end weird

Kabocha

I heard some comic sites pay $70/page for that sort of thi--- /shot

Draco Plato

LOL!

there's that olympic dames comic

I didn't want to be in the same genre as that

We proooobably won't get to see Mickeal and Sam's backstory unless I make it a side comic

but the whole focus of it would be teen pregnancy and I've been trying to back off on that kind of stuff

so It's kind of been sidelined indefinitely

I became worried about portraying it insensitively unintentionally

Kabocha

Ah, fair!

Maybe it's one of those things that they just mention they were teenagers and well, at least Rose is happy now

Draco Plato

yeah, I think I'll be able to squeeze in most of the details at some point within Soul Hymn anyway, especially since interest has been expressed about it

Kabocha

Also, I apologize in advance for craziness with my train of thought, I have had to take the nyquil tonight!

But yeah! I'm interested to know more about them in comic, even if it's a passing mention

Draco Plato

I can do that

I think Rebel was afraid I'd make Erik Rose's father for awhile

all comic decisions are a roll of the dice so you never know where it'll land

Kabocha

It's not canon until it's firmly in print, right? And even then, it can be revised in future editions

Draco Plato

baaaaaasically, altho I do try to not change things that have already happened at least. But I have had to go back and fix dialogue in some of the comics when it didn't quite add up right to things later on, oops

Mharz

RebelVampire

I think Rebel was afraid I'd make Erik Rose's father for awhile :joy:

all comic decisions are a roll of the dice so you never know where it'll land

that may have something to do with the fact youve point blank said youve played around with the idea

Draco Plato

muahahaha

It's super unlikely though, very improbable

RebelVampire

QUESTION 7. Desire mentions Hope is the sixth pillar, implying there are four others we have yet to meet. What do you think the other pillars are like? Do you think all the pillars are on Hope and Desire’s side, or do you think some might side with Decebal? What do you think will happen when Erik runs into the other pillars?

Kabocha

So, what are they pillars of? I've actually been confused and hadn't asked about that before. What do the pillars represent and how are they important to the world? I may be just not remembering. xD

Or well, I guess they're important to Decebal's plan.... (looking at it again now lol)

What...... were they before they were pillars

.........Virtues. XD OKAY SO WHY ARE THE VIRTUES IMPORTANT ........I'm going to have to reread this comic hrrrghleble

You forget details when you read in chunks! So, time for a fresh readthrough which I'll do tonight.

Capitania do Azar

hauehuhah

Draco Plato

Legit straight up forgot I mentioned there being 6 already and had to remember who the others were, totally on the page of forgetting details after not reading in awhile

Draco Plato

Basically the virtues are angels who perform small miracles within mankind and represent a virtuous quality. Decebal turned them into their negative opposite and that negative quality is then constantly feeding into them from their surroundings (via people's negative thoughts and energy). They're called the pillars in this negative state because to Decebal they represent a pillar of negative energy he's building for a "purpose".

Mharz

Was thinking along the lines of 7 virtues turned into 7 deadly sins of some sort. XD(edited)

I have the feeling some already sided with Decebal. :u

Draco Plato

It does seem similar to the seven deadly sins weeps

ah good they aren't all the same as the seven deadly sins, lol! I couldn't remember what the 7 were for that

Mharz

RebelVampire

QUESTION 8. In recent happenings, Decebal kidnaps Rose. Why do you think Decebal would do such a thing? How do you think Decebal intends to use Mickeal exactly? On a different note, what do you think will ultimately happen between Sam and Mickeal?

CalimonGraal

feels like decebal is going to use mickeal or something for whatever he's planning

RebelVampire

hes gonna use mickeal to trim his lawn

and then start a goat lawn mowing service

CalimonGraal

omg

Mharz

he needs goat fur for coats

RebelVampire

decebal is gonna start a whole goat based industry

Mharz

goats are great for business

Mharz

I feel like Decebal will use Mickeal's influence being a famous singer and all to brainwash people into feeding his pillars negative energy

RebelVampire

http://khyatix.com/soulhymn/chapters/chp1/chp1pg18.shtml

well mickeal does have a head start with lyrics like htat

CalimonGraal

he could collab with daed inside

Mharz

deep inside he agrees with decebal. <.<

RebelVampire

and here i always thought mickeal was the good one

Mharz

if there's anything I learned, is that the most innocent looking people are the evil ones... sometimes.

Draco Plato

Does Mickeal look that innocent tho? XD

I like how disinterested he looks while singing, as boring as doing laundry to him

Tenor | Shinavar

I like Mharz theory with the brainwashing

But I'm willing to bet hes about to take him in for some plastic surgery missing some extra parts he'd like

Draco Plato

lol! Oh no

RebelVampire

now thats just gruesome

RebelVampire

QUESTION 9. At the beginning, Hope warns Decebal that he will fall for his actions. Do you think Hope is right and that there is indeed no saving Decebal? Why or why not? Additionally, Hope and Decebal argue about whether the outcome is decided or not. Do you think Hope is right that the outcome is decided, or do you think Decebal is right?(edited)

Tenor | Shinavar

IDK I mean - someone who gets pissed and turns you into a beacon of negative energy doesn't sound like someone you can reason with /shot

Mharz

I feel like it can go either way? Like Decebal probably believes you can change your fate of some sorts. Tbh I think he has good intentions tho his execution is really really bad. :v

Kabocha

Decebal, if I recall, thinks humanity needs to git gud and start doing what they need to do ........ ........................ So he's going to make them fall in to despair so they can appreciate what they had or something.

I wonder where on the timeline this all happens compared to like, OoO

Draco Plato

it's both before and after

don't cry, it'll all make sense some day

Kabocha

Hahaha, yeah. Is it time shenanigans or just that it's over a long span of time?

Draco Plato

it's because of there being multiple lifetimes of the characters in the story

some are before and some are after

Mharz

draco no

@_@

Kabocha

So... Erik might fail this time, but...

or is it just because of the lifetimes and the space people XD

Draco Plato

The before and after is just because of the chronological happenings of the individual lives.

Like decebal's life takes place before Mickeal's

He even mentioned that mickeal is his future on one of the recent pages

http://khyatix.com/soulhymn/chapters/chp3/chp3pg39.shtml

Decebal's life is before Rex's since Rex is a fallen angel, Erik's life is after Damon's though

The space people are irrelevant time wise I think since they exist in their own sort of timeline with a different trajectory

But they do interact in some manner with most of the lives.

Technically they're supposed to play an inactive role within the lives of mortals and use other means

Karmic laws and all that

Mharz

Decebal is one of the powers right???

Is Rex a high ranking angel as well?

Draco Plato

Rex is a Jinn now so not really an angel anymore but he was Decebal, sooooo I mean he was a Power XD

Kabocha

Ahahah, well, I meant timeline as far as like, linearly-speaking now

Mharz

oh I see

Kabocha

so, like, OOO takes place in year X, Soul Hymn takes place in some other year... or is it all overlapping owo

Mharz

lol I got it confused a bit. I was thinking Decebal came after Rex woops

Draco Plato

events at the end of Soul Hymn will lead into Zenchav, but for Erik, Celeste, and Arrow it takes place after OoO but before WC(edited)

Mharz

rolls around

Draco Plato

S-sorry, I guess it gets a bit confusing

Mharz

it's fine draco

Draco Plato

This is why I didn't hide the lives cause I thought nobody could ever guess them

And it d just be even more difficult to tie it all together for people(edited)

Mharz

but it's fascinating tho

Kabocha

Hehehe

I had figured the progression of lives didn't take place in a linear fashion compared to the timeline overall

Draco Plato

Nah, originally I'd planned to keep everything linear bit that didn't work out

There's technically other dimensions too with different outcomes but I'm avoiding going into those since it's already confusing for readers

Kabocha

hehehe

Draco Plato

I've also cut down what I had planned for the astral plane stuff too cause of that

RebelVampire

QUESTION 10. What are you most looking forward to in the comic? Also, do you have any final thoughts to share overall?

Mharz

Looking forward to Erik and Decebal face-off and seeing all the pillars and how everything links together.

Draco Plato

There's a lot of scenes coming up I'm looking forward to, particularly with the main three's relationship and the changes I've made to the story recently.

FeatheryJustice

I can't wait to see when they all duke it off and then see how the reincarnation works.

RebelVampire

COMIC TEA PARTY- WEEK LONG BOOK CLUB END!

Thank you everyone so much for chatting about Soul Hymn this week! Please also give a special thank you to Draco Plato for volunteering the comic for this trial run! We really appreciate it! :D If you liked Soul Hymn, make sure to continue to support it!

Read Soul Hymn: http://khyatix.com/soulhymn.shtml

Draco Plato’s KoFi: https://ko-fi.com/khyatix

Draco Plato’s Discord: https://discord.gg/NTYuQTU

Draco Plato’s Twitter: https://twitter.com/KhyatiX

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