#also… what does her destroying the nobility system even mean | Explore Tumblr Posts and Blogs

randomnameless · 6 months

Text

Supreme Leader and Clout's support in Zahrofl was translated !

Lolcalised Supreme Leader wonders if Clout is serious about killing Dimitri, because she doesn't want to do it sad uwus

Og!Supreme Leader doesn't deny the plan, just thinks Clout could have used other words for his plan, but the substance is the same. Getting rid of Dimitri!

I wonder why the lolcalisation changed it :)

Pat nuked the "her ilk" mention :)

And added the "and we force her to dismantle the Church, we won't do it ourselves uwu" because it sounds better?

or because if what she means by arrest is the same arrest she pulled off in Nopes, Rhea "and her ilk" won't be in any condition to do anything else than, I guess, dance zumba.

We know that's not "good enough" for her at least, from FE16 - Rhea is jailed in her zumba resort for 5 years, effectively not having any military nor political power, and yet, Supreme Leader is still warring her war on the Church and its members (the faithful in Adrestia aren't heard of anymore?).

It's kind of telling when she said this earlier :

Supreme Leader in Pat's version wants to "match" Clout's honesty, but she doesnt' say anything like this in the original version - she is merely surprised how he is being honest with her, and not, apparently, giving her his PR speech.

But she doesn't say she'll give him a real piece of her mind, or, drop her own PR speech.

Back to the "what to do with Rhea" speech, we see how both sort of misjudged what the other would want :

Rather, Claude thought Supreme Leader wants something more "severe" regarding Rhea... and he is not that wrong, remember how in her Big B support, and in SB in general, Supreme Leader's motto is either bend the knee or die? Rhea would never bend the knee (and even if her knees are broken, it's not enough for Supreme Leader, see the zumba resort), so the pretty "losing military and political power" words hide what Tru Piss reveals : Rhea "and her ilk" must be obliterated for Fodlan, I mean, Humanity, to thrive.

Supreme Leader thought Clout wanted to reconcile... but Golden Shower Clout thinks reconciliation can happen with swords and bows, so she thought he would have been his schooled FE16 self.

Again, Supreme Leader is fishing for intel - the same thing she does in FE16 in VW, when she basically asks Claude if he's a bastard or how he became the heir of House Riegan.

Here Supreme Leader reveals her plan : to destroy Fodlan's "absurdity"...

But what is this so-called absurdity? We know Supreme Leader is Supremely Aware, so she might not really know that Almyra or even Brigid has a system of nobility with kings and peons - but giving her the benefit of doubt and at least a modicum of common sense, what is different between Fodlan and the rest of the world?

It cannot be the nobility system, so... does it has something to do with what Pat tried to nuke, non-humans living in Fodlan? What is so "absurd" in Fodlan that doesn't exist, as far as she know, in other places like Almyra or Brigid, bar Nabateans?

Also, note how Clout, who is supposed to be very preoccupied by the Fate of the Alliance/Federation, doesn't react at Supreme Leader's statement that she wants to do something for "Fodlan", and not only the place she is ruling over...

Imo, this support reads as Clout being completely misled by Supreme Leader, sure, he keeps his "ambitions" to himself, and if he might had a correct first guess about Supreme Leader's plans, he ultimately buys her PR bullshit excuse.

Granted, this Clout (rather Barney?) also pulls the race card in Golden Shower to justify going after the evil lizard lady, so I doubt he would have shown any opposition to Supreme Leader's, hm, plans to "destroy" Nabateans.

#3 nopes #lolcalisation woes #Og!Supreme Leader is way more cocky than her lolcalised self #it's refreshing to see at times #both thought of the other as their FE16 selves #but we know Supreme Leader is the same Supreme Leader she crushes opposition #zumbaing for 5 years counts as torture?#Clout is being manipulated but he dgaf because he has uwu real ambitions?#like being the biggest retcon between the games?#and he even fails at that the biggest retcon title goes to Alois!

16 notes · View notes

laulink · 2 years

Text

Following up on my tags regarding Dorothea and Edelgard’s designs in Three Hopes, I wanted to explore in more detail (from a very amateur point of view, I don’t know much about visually designing characters so take this with a grain of salt) the differences between Edelgard’s Three Houses and Three Hopes time-skip outfits and what they might represent because that one is LOADED (I’ll make a different post for the Dorothea/Edelthea analysis).

So, Edelgard :

- In Three Houses, her post time-skip outfit is mainly red with few but noticeable splatches of black and gold and one, BIG splatch of silver as the inside of her cape. The cape itself is big, making Edelgard herself look bigger and more imposing that she really is physically speaking. Her horned crown, the biggest splash of gold in her design, is also very noticeable.

- In contrast, Edelgard’s Three Hopes design makes silver pretty much the dominant colour on her outfit, or almost. Her entire armour is silver, with a couple spots of red at her hips and knees, the only black parts we see are glimpses of her short skirt, hich socks and undershirt’s cuffs and the only reason we can still argue that red is her main colour is her cape, even though this time it’s half the length of her Three Houses one and clearly not as large, not broadening her shoulders and overall silhouette like the previous one did, almost like the cape is only there to remind onlookers that she’s from Adrestia. Her crown has also changed to be much smaller and represent the rays of the sun or a halo, since it’s a half-circle encircling her face.

It’s a BIG change, and few other characters go through such a complete overturn of their Three Houses design (honestly, Dimitri is the only one I can think of and that’s very easily explained by the fact that this time he retained his sanity and spent two years as a sane ruler instead of a wild, half-crazy beast on the run). The one thing that changes for Edelgard between Three Houses and Three Hopes is that she doesn’t have to work with TWSITD anymore, which allows her to make her own reforms, do things they forbade her to do in Three Houses, take her time to prepare her war, rebuilt the Southern Church, etc. This time she is free to do as she sees right, instead of compromising with her abducters/abusers/ancient civilisation trying to take control of Fodlan to shape it the way THEY want to. In Three Houses she was already trying to undermine them, but had to do so more or less “undercover”, to act in a way that wasn’t outright hostile to them, always trying to keep plausible deniability of working against them, which, I think, is where the silver comes in.

I’m not sure what the colour silver is most associated with so I may lack some subtleties, but I think it’s pretty safe to say that a big connotation of it is “purity”, since it’s the only way to “burn the dark magic out of a werewolf” for example. In Three Houses, silver occupied a large portion of the colour of Edelgard’s clothing, but since it was on the INSIDE of her cape, it was mostly hidden and we could only get glimpses of it, the same way she hid her attempts at weakening TWSITD and working against them. In Three Hopes, however, she already ousted them from the Empire, so she’s effectively severed all ties with them and taken away their means of pressure on her, which allows her to openly work against them and try to destroy them, which she does alongside the rest of her war on numerous occasions. That’s why silver has become such a prevalent part of her visual design, outshining the red : Edelgard has vowed to take down the corrupt Central Church and is openly working against TWSITD every chance she gets, which places her in the position of a saviour who will purify the country of its vices, including the antiquated nobility and crest systems. She is taking out the trash, so to speak, and bringing in the light, which is where the change in her crown’s design comes in.

From what I heard, there’s a bit of a pattern with Evil Emperors in previous FE games having horned crowns, so that may be where this comes from, but also Edelgard’s whole image, in Three Houses, with the red colour, the flames and the horns were reminiscent of the devil, to signal that she was the “bad guy” (until you play CF and realise she’s not any more evil than the other lords, but she embraces the image of villain because she doesn’t believe herself to be a hero because of her actions and who she works with). In Three Hopes, however, she clearly places herself in the role of the hero/saviour, not out of ego, but because she has the possibility to and she’s going to use every bit of narrative work and visual design she has at her disposition to try and win the public’s favour and support. Yes, it is propaganda. No, that doesn’t make it “wrong”, literally every government and association uses propaganda to push their own agendas, it’s just that sometimes the end goals are more dubious and/or obvious than others. So, while in Three Houses Edelgard embraces the role of villain because she thinks it necessary to bring about a brighter dawn for Fodlan, in Three Hopes she has no reason to frame herself as the villain, instead pushing the role onto the Church, which makes her the de facto hero and ray of hope for the people of Fodlan, hence why she went with a less ostentatious crown, to symbolise her humility in following the role of agent of justice righting the wrongs of the Church instead of conqueror trying to seize the continent, and one that reminds you of the sun to symbolise the hope she represents and the brighter dawn she wants to bring to the continent.

Now, her cape and, with it, the red in the rest of her outfit. In Three Houses, the cape is longer than Edelgard is tall, dragging on the floor, and the padding at the shoulders makes it larger than Edelgard, serving to make her appear bigger and larger than she is, more physically impressive. It is red with golden accents on the outside and entirely silver on the inside, as said before. In Three Hopes, it changes drastically : the cape is half the length of the original, fully red, no golden or silver accents, much less padded and ornate which makes it look lighter and, with it, less protective, and it doesn’t help broaden Edelgard’s shoulders or make her look larger. That last point is interesting on its own because it shows that, while Edelgard’s goal in Three Houses was to appear strong and impressive, in Three Hopes she doesn’t care about that kind of image at all (she is here to right the wrongs of the Church, not conquer the continent, or at least that’s what she tells her citizens in the beginning even if we know she wants to unite Fodlan). The cape seems to serve a single purpose in Edelgard’s design and it’s to add red to it, to balance the silver of her armour and mark her as Adrestia’s Emperor. It’s actually much more similar to the red half-cape she wore at the Academy to signal her position as House Leader than it is to the cape she wore in Three Houses.

As a whole, the differences between Edelgard’s design in Three Houses and in Three Hopes show us just how her circumstances and the narrative she builds around them change and, therefore, how she changes her image to take advantage of them :

- in Three Houses, Edelgard’s attack on the Church, unannounced, unexplained and so brutal it leads to Garreg Mach being half-destroyed, gives her the image of a villain, so she leans into it with the red, the horns and the ostentatious and over the top of her outfit (big crown, bigger cape, etc) while also choosing a design that makes her appear stronger, more impressive, makes her look like the powerful Emperor that will carve out a bloody path to the conquest of all of Fodlan.

- in Three Hopes, Edelgard reigns over Adrestia for two years, during which she restores the Southern Church and supports it, before declaring war on “the corrupt Central Church” that has been manipulating and enslaving all citizens of Fodlan for centuries. That changes the first impression she gives from a conqueror who throws herself into war a mere few weeks after secretly taking the throne to a benevolent ruler concerned over her people’s well-being and desiring to bring justice to the corrupt institution abusing them. Edelgard leans into that image this time as well, which is why she appears as more of a warrior princess, not fighting for conquest but to right past wrongs and build a better future for her people.

I think that’s really neat to have so much detail and thought put into the characters’ designs, at least for the Three Lords (or, at least for Edelgard and Dimitri, I don’t know enough about Claude’s routes to say anything about him).

#fire emblem three houses #fire emblem three hopes #edelgard von hresvelg #analysis

16 notes · View notes

fireemblems24 · 3 years

Text

Merit Based System

This is a bit all over the place. Sorry about that. I watched a show this weekend that really illustrates why I no longer believe in Edelgard's system after her support with Ferdinand.

Spoilers for Fire Emblem Three Houses CF route and Edelgard & Ferdinand's support and the show Segodon up to episode 8.

Segodon is a taiga drama that retells the life of historical figure Saigo Takamori a. k. a. the last samurai. This man was a brilliant politician and played an instrumental role in Japan's tumultuous 1800s where they overthrew the shogun and instated a modern government. The show itself is absolutely fantastic so far (though, I love anything to do with the Bakumatsu, no, that's a lie, there's some real shitty Bakumatsu anime.).

Like the real life Saigo, the fictional representation has a lot of "merit." As the show writes him, he has a high level of empathy for people who are hurting because of Japan's horrible, outdated systems and is constantly does whatever is in his power to convince the powers that be to back off a bit because their taxes and punishments are so harsh at times, his native Satsuma was at serious risk of starving its entire agricultural force out of work.

Not only is Saigo intelligent, but he's also tenacious. He "dares" to ask his "betters" to see the errors of their way, goes out of his way to try and get audiences with people far above his station, and does everything he possibly can to help everyone around him. Whether he's tackling problems with a larger system or a hurting individual around him, he's trying his best to make things right. And when people listen to him, things improve. People are also naturally drawn to his leadership and overall gentle disposition.

He's also broke.

Saigo comes from a very poor, very large family. So when the powers that be grant him an opportunity to travel to Edo (then capital of Japan), where he could get real experience, where he could start rubbing shoulders with the right people and find ways to gain influence, learn, etc . . . He can't. Because his family can't cough up 30 ryo.

No matter how much merit Saigo has, his upbringing keeps him from reaching his full potential. The top leadership of the area invites him to the opportunity of a life time, but even with an open invitation, he can't so easily accept it.

His mother, father, and grandfather had all just died (and this is a historical fact, at least) and left him in charge. The family went into even more debt buying medicine during various illnesses. There's younger and elder family he needs to look out for, a sister who he now needs to find a husband for, and a new wife on top of everything else. They don't have 30 ryo to spare.

No matter how much merit Saigo has, no matter how much he wants to make a difference, he can't. Because he was born into poverty, because he can't afford to step away from the family land or else risk running out of food in the winter. His merit isn't enough. You need privilege. And he's already got privilege in that he wasn't born a farmer, that he has the personal attention of those in charge through connections and channels his family name permitted him, he's already jumped over hurdles others can't - and he still can't take advantage of his merit.

A merit based system benefits those who have and punishes the have nots. All the rich kids with rich parents who don't have to think twice about spending 30 ryo and have servants to take care of the elderly and young in their families. They can take every opportunity so the gap widens even further. Even worse, a merit based system tells the people born poor, born sick, born neurologically divergent, born into an abusive family, born into a historically disadvantaged race/gender/sexuality/etc, etc . . . that it's their fault they're not at the top. That if they just "tried harder" and had "more merit" they could make it. You too could be a billionaire if you just pulled on your bootstraps hard enough, and failure means you didn't try hard enough. And, yes, this is very much happening in our culture today.

That Edelgard didn't even consider something as huge as inequality before starting a war that would kill thousands really shocked me. Her support with Ferdinand exposed just how naive she is and how narrow-minded her world-view and experiences are. If she's going to sacrifice thousands of people for her supposedly better system, I wish she'd put at least some thought into it.

I do not expect a Fire Emblem game to get hyper-political or into nitty-gritty details. Honestly, I wish this support didn't exist. If their A-Support focused just on educational reform or even Ferdinand cementing himself as a actual check/rival to Edelgard, then I'd be more willing to believe she could make a good leader. But, for some reason, they decided to use this support to show how little Edelgard actually thought about her actions despite the dire consequences of them. These details aren't needed. These lines could be completely omitted and let the reader imagine Edegard has the political know-how to actually pull what she wants off. But instead the game went out of it's way to show she doesn't really have a single clue what she's talking about, and I cannot fathom why. This isn't even touching on her admitting it didn't even occur to her that her actions would leave a power vacuum and would need to fill it (like - what -), but that's for another day.

THIS is why I can't get behind Edelgard. Because her merit based system isn't worth all the lives she destroyed in her war. She thinks her ideas are worth everyone that dies, but her ideas aren't well thought out. This episode 8 of Segodon illustrated perfectly why Edelgard's system is a house of cards that will do nothing but pat the nobility and otherwise rich and privileged on the back while blaming farmers and otherwise disadvantaged for their continued poverty because "lack of merit."

I honestly can't express how badly I wish these lines in this support didn't exist. It serves no purpose except to expose Edelgard's lack of forethought and lack of understanding about the lives of the people she's claiming she's making better.

But, yeah, watching this episode just made me think about Edelgard's system and reminded me again of the exact moment I gave up on supporting her war.

(spoiler alert about Segodon: all those people he kept helping scrounge together 30 ryo so he can go to Edo and leaves the lands in charge of his younger brother, and yes, he's going to go down in history, but also . . . prepare for a downer ending if you actually watch this (I mean . . . it's the Bakumatsu). I already know I'm going to cry my fucking eyes out and I haven't even meant this version of Sakamoto Ryoma yet)

#fire emblem three houses #fe3h #fe16 #I just really love segodon so far #man almost all of this is just gushing over saigo lol #and I thought it was SAKAMOTO who was my historical crush #this show is tempting me #but at least i'm not flipping sides #no Hijikata #your gorgeous face will not sway me #besides #we have Katsura on our side #very underrated face

86 notes · View notes

fuwametal-writes · 3 years

Text

Edelgard Working Together with TWSITD Makes Zero Sense

I wouldn't qualify people suffering because of their Crests under the Crest system of nobility as the same thing as suffering under the rule of the Church of Seiros. This is the very reason why I honestly believe that none of Edelgard's actions in terms of conspiring together with TWSITD make sense.

She suffered under the Crest system of nobility and was experimented upon by Those Who Slither in the Dark because the Crest system of nobility allowed cracks and gaps to manifest within Fodlan society where TWSITD were able to thrive, but she never came into contact with the Central Church which Rhea leads until she entered into the Officer's Academy.

For a majority of her life, Rhea and the Church of Seiros were non-entities that were not responsible for any of the tragedies that befell her, and while, through logical thought, one might be able to identify the Church's maintenance of its doctrines as the force responsible for keeping the Crest system alive as the status quo, which in turn created the cracks in society where TWSITD were able to thrive and gain influence from, that still does not mean that they were the parties directly responsible for the suffering that Edelgard has experienced. It thus seems strange for the Adrestian Princess to pin the Church as the party ultimately responsible for her suffering and come to the conclusion that she must first defeat the Church working together with TWSITD, or in other words, her oppressors before dispatching of her oppressors... somehow... later on.

Even if the actions of the Church were responsible for creating the butterfly effect that would eventually lead to her torture, her siblings' deaths, and the downfall of her father's dynasty, it's just strange that even when those who are directly responsible for these atrocities are staring her straight in the face, she still seems to believe that all of these are the ultimate responsibility of the Church, and not as the further result of an even longer-standing conflict caused by none other than those who seem to have no trouble hiding their millennia-old vendetta against the Church.

It is so incongruous for Edelgard to not see how it would be much easier and much more sensible to purge those who slither from the cracks of Fodlan society with the help of the Church and then fill in those cracks with reform so that they can no longer resurface when we know how meticulous and brilliant she is, and especially when we know that she is a mere few steps away from unlocking the truth that Thales and his dead-eyed cronies are pulling a fast one on her. We'll discuss more of that later.

We see over and over again over the course of the story without it ever being shown to us or told explicitly that TWSITD were pulling the strings behind all of the conspiratorial happenings in Fodlan through the underbelly of corruption that has festered over the course of centuries of the Crest system of nobility being in place. This system was created through the influence of the Church in order to establish order following the War of Heroes, but by and large, a lot of the suffering caused by the Crest system is not caused or meted out by the Church, but by those who hold positions of power within the system - people like the nobles of the Insurrection of the Seven who were seduced by the wiles of TWSITD who promised them greater power within the system through their strange means. When we consider this angle, we see that really, Edelgard's anger at the Crest system of nobility is justified, but that her anger at the Church is (and this is important) not wrong, but misguided. I'll explain why.

Rhea formally instituted the Crest system as a way to fill the power vacuum in Fodlan and prevent the continent from falling into chaos again following her victory against Nemesis and the Ten Elites, but remember that the system of ruling over the masses with the power of Crests was not created by Rhea, but by the Agarthans who used Nemesis as a tool to enact genocide upon the Nabateans.

Remember that it was the Agarthans who guided Nemesis and his band of bandits to pillage Sothis's body for the purpose of obtaining the Crest of Flames and the Sword of the Creator, which they then used to wipe out the Nabateans, drink their blood and take their bones, from which they obtained more Crests and Relics with which they could rule tyrannically over the people of Fodlan. With the end of the War of Heroes, Seiros had the opportunity to reveal the truth and abolish the Crest system of power that existed within Fodlan entirely, but she was not in a state of mind to do so, grief-stricken by the death of her mother and the genocide of her kin.

In a cruel, twisted kind of way, the blood running through the veins of her kin's killers and the weapons they fashioned out of the bones of the people that she loved were the only reminders of her family that existed. Therefore, I believe that her decision to instate the Crest system of nobility as the official system of governance in Adrestia through her influence as the head of the Church was motivated by her desire to preserve the vestiges of her kin's memory. To ensure that they don't simply fade into obscurity, and to be able to keep them close to her in a way - even if it is twisted.

I don't know what kind of manipulation Edelgard had to have gone through for her to come to the conclusion that the most effective way to topple TWSITD and their influence over Fodlan was to first eliminate the Church rather than work with them to topple TWSITD and then work with them to enact systemic changes to the way that Church and State interact within the continent to ensure that no one suffers under the dated Crest system (and also possibly go through dialogue to slowly bring to light Fodlan's true history - because obviously, none of that surfaces in the ending of Crimson Flower either).

Edelgard had part of the real history, but clearly, TWSITD cherry-picked the most convenient parts of that history to show Edelgard while obscuring the most inconvenient parts to her such that she would cultivate a vendetta against the Church as the perpetrator behind all suffering in Fodlan when TWSITD are the ones who are truly causing suffering by manipulating local nobles and satellite Church leaders to cause unrest and instability.

Does that justify Rhea's swift execution of heretics? No, of course not, but if Edelgard weren't already so set on her ways in the beginning of the game, she might have been able to gauge by Rhea's reaction to the appearance of the strange mages that she conspired with as the Flame Emperor in the Monastery that the Church was diametrically opposed to the very people that she was conspiring with in the first place for reasons incongruous with what Thales has led her to believe, and that maybe, her anger was misguided... and that she was taking a very, very roundabout way to achieving her goals that would not bear her the full truth of the matter... and maybe even that the Church would gladly help in the purge of TWSITD.

Not that that matters because she wrongly believes that she already has all the answers in her hands, which we know is untrue when we learn the whole truth from Rhea's own mouth in Verdant Wind. TWSITD played Edelgard like a fiddle. They had two main goals, 1) to destroy the Church to exact revenge on Seiros, and 2) to rule the world, and they were able to exploit Edelgard's anger and her ideals as a means to the first one.

This all makes even less sense when you consider that in order for all of this to have come to pass, Edelgard would have had to trust the words of her abusers fully and take their word for what the true history of Fodlan really is... What reason would she have to believe everything that TWSITD had to say about Fodlan's history is true when 1) they were the ones who experimented on her and implanted the Fire Emblem into her, 2) are not working with her in good faith, and 3) it is clear that they are also in the business of hiding even more information from her?

In fact, what reason would she even have to believe everything she said in her speech, particularly these two lines: "The leaders of the church have misused its creed to fulfill their true desire - to rule the world," and "They gathered gold and lived in extravagance," when it would have been plain to her from her months in the Monastery that 1) the Church is largely uninterested in interfering with Empire, Kingdom or Alliance politics except when heresy against the Church is directly involved or in preserving peace from petty bandits where nobles request their aid, 2) she would have seen how far removed from extravagance lifestyle at the Monastery was, and most importantly, 3) she came into contact and interacted with so many students and just... people in general who would have challenged and even shaken those beliefs?

Let's not even stray from point 1 in the previous question that I posed. As I've already said before, her suffering was never directly at the hands of the Central Church because as we see in the game, the Central Church has little influence over the Empire where the Western Church has more influence and because the Empire, unlike the Kingdom and the Alliance, has its very own Ministry of Religion. Even the game's narrative betrays any reason that Edelgard might have had to bear a grudge against the Church in particular and work with the very clearly evil group of shadowy figures because the game goes out of its way to remind us over and over again that the Church has had very little influence over the Empire's religious affairs in recent years - which has led to the rise of heresy within the Western Church, which, since Edelgard was working as the Flame Emperor, she should have known was also the handiwork of TWSITD.

She should have known from spending time in the Monastery that Rhea was less concerned about the loss of influence in the Empire preventing her from levying Church taxes on the Empire and more concerned about the actual heresy against their doctrines that they were committing. More damningly, she should have known that this concern of Rhea to protect the doctrine of the Church was not about maintaining the status quo of the Crest system because what the Western Church was preaching did not undermine the doctrine that Crests and Relics were Sothis's blessings and thus did not jeopardize the Crest system that revered Sothis as Goddess, but rather about maintaining her legitimacy as Archbishop of the Church such that Fodlan could have a unified faith among other reasons that she may have but is not forthright about, as she may have learned if she had taken the time to earn Rhea's trust and learn layers deeper into the truth.

As players, we do know that beyond maintaining her legitimacy as Archbishop, Rhea wanted the people to have a common faith in Sothis because she is still grieving the death of her mother, and that over the centuries, she has almost somehow deluded herself into believing the faith of her own making.

So then, was she fighting for religious freedom? No, because she didn't give a damn about the Western Church either, and because what the Western Church was teaching wasn't reflective of the true history that she apparently wants to bring to light... but never does in the end.

And now, the final nail in the coffin.

The people that Edelgard came into contact with in the Monastery. Let us talk about Marianne and Lysithea, yes?

Marianne bears the Crest of the Beast, and because of that, is visibly disturbed by any discussion of Crests. She has suffered much because of the Crest system and the prying eyes that look on at her and cast suspicion on her. While Edelgard and Marianne do not have supports, surely, she would have seen how Marianne would have reacted to the mere mention of a Crest, and yet all the same, she would have seen how she chooses to believe in the Goddess anyway, and how she did not begrudge the Church, even when it would be very easy to do so as the Church is, after all, responsible for teaching the doctrines that uphold the Crest system. Would this not have cast doubts on the beliefs that she held about the supposed injustice of the Church?

But I concede that Edelgard may not have been paying much attention to Marianne. They barely know each other, after all. It's a shame we don't have someone who experienced basically the exact same thing as her yet didn't begrudge the Church as the reason for her suff-

Wait a minute.

Lysithea von Ordelia. Here is a student that she knows was also experimented upon in the same manner as she was, and yet, she does not begrudge the Church in the same way that she does. Their support conversations are quite heavy, Edelgard trying to reach out to Lysithea as kindred spirits who know exactly how the other feels, and we learn that Lysithea does believe the Crest system and the obsession with the power of the Crests to have been responsible for her and her parents' suffering, but she doesn't speak a lick about the Church. Not to Edelgard, not to Claude, not to Byleth. Why? Because Lysithea has elected that the Church itself was not responsible for her suffering. Plain and simple. It would have been just as easy for Lysithea to also believe that because the Church was the entity responsible for putting the Crest system into place, that they are also ultimately the ones responsible for her suffering just as Edelgard believes... but she doesn't. Would this not have at least made Edelgard question her beliefs even just a bit? Seriously.

And to speak of commonfolk around the Monastery, what does she make of the orphans that the Church takes in? And all of the devotees that the Church extends its mercy and aid to? What did she make of the fact that following Remire, the Monastery took in its orphans and its survivors? Seriously.

What of the Almyran boy that Rhea treats equitably just like any Fodlani person that she holds audience for? What of Cyril? Does she see Rhea's kindness to the boy and how this boy is grateful for saving her from a life of indentured servitude and think that it is insincere?

Would any of these encounters with the people in the Monastery not have allowed her even a little leeway to question her alliance with TWSITD?

Don't you think that it would make more sense for Edelgard to also be mistrustful of TWSITD enough to want to learn more about the Church and the history that underlies them to verify the veracity of her cause before deciding who to confide her motivations in fully, acting as a double agent with the side that wins her over with the truth to win peace and carve out her destiny in her own terms, free from the shackles of those who would keep her in line for their own ends?

It just seems so asinine to me to see Edelgard playing right into TWSITD's hands and it frustrates me to no end seeing how IntSys made such a chump of Edelgard when she's such a good character. I will never let IntSys live this down. Edelgard working with TWSITD makes zero sense. Try as you might to change my mind as to why Edelgard siding with TWSITD and declaring war on the Church was necessary, but know that if you do, I have barely even scratched the surface and I will have an answer ready for you. It's sloppy writing on IntSys's part and Edelgard deserves better.

#fe3h #fe16 #fe3h edelgard #edelgard deserves better #fe3h rhea #rhea also deserves better #why do the lords of fe3h have so many trust issues #this could have all been avoided if they had just sat down to talk #edelgard critical #edelgard discourse

51 notes · View notes

gascon-en-exil · 4 years

Note

Crimson Flower lets Edelgard institute all her progressive reforms, and puts a definitive kibosh on both the Agartheans and the dragons. Various other character endings describe the slitherers resurfacing and being foiled again. Dmitri the emperor, and he's a well-meaning lad who probably makes reasonable strides against racism and systemic crest bias, but he largely keeps things going as they were. He makes it very clear that he hasn't thought very hard about his position in the world.

Edelgard, on the other hand, is justified in everything she does by virtue of her circumstances. At no point does she have any options other than declaring war on the continent or dying, because she has been in the clutches of the Agartheans her entire life. They want to use her as a figurehead, but make it very clear that they will bump her off if she steps out of line. She cannot prevent the war, so she instead makes it her own, and rallies her forces until she's can make a move against them.

Dimitri is a hereditary autocrat who secures his family's grip on the entirety of a continent, 2/3 of which he obtains through conquest. Really struggling to see the 'not an autocrat' angle here even if he does some positive reforms later in life. Like we get a fairly decent look at how non-traumatized Dimitri acts in CF and it all sets up that he entered into a political marriage and had a quick child to secure the inheritance. Hereditary monarchy is a scourge even if you have a 'good' monarch

FIrst, let’s get the most obvious thing out the way: there is no evidence that Dimitri has a political marriage and an heir in CF.

The line about the Blaiddyd line continuing almost certainly refers to his uncle Rufus, who is killed in Cornelia’s coup in the non-CF routes but is presumably still alive in CF because she never gets the chance to carry it out. In the Dimidue death scene Dimitri expresses regret for not being able to get revenge for his family among others, so he’s still thinking of family in terms of his slain father and stepmother. I’ve also pointed out several times that Dimitri’s fondness for orphans is noted in story text and in AM’s ending tapestry, such that it’s entirely reasonable to conclude that he adopts regardless of circumstances as a way of diminishing the role of Crest-based inheritance. In CF his circumstances seem to be nearly identical to the Dimidue paired ending where there is no queen in sight and Dedue is a royal consort in all but name. I highly doubt they chose to adopt while fighting a war that’s by now been dragging on for over five years, so the conclusion about Rufus stands (even more so because he’s noted elsewhere to be a shameless womanizer so it’s likely he’s got one or more bastards somewhere). If you’re looking for a hereditary monarch who founds or perpetuates a dynasty, that would be Claude, or Byleth in various VW/SS endings. Quibbling over monarch vs. emperor has little meaning in this context, especially when Edelgard stepping down after an indeterminate amount of time and naming a successor is fully in line with real world dictatorships. Non-democratic systems of government are the standard for all of FE, although the beginnings of a representative government mentioned in Dimitri’s solo ending might be the single closest instance of a significant movement away from that even if it’s only a constitutional monarchy with the heir to the throne a Crestless adoptee. This follows naturally from the years of the timeskip where Dimitri was homeless and in and out of the slums of the Kingdom, where he saw the suffering of the common people firsthand and, as seen in the AM parley, came to understand their needs better than Edelgard ever attempts. In conjunction with Claude’s ignorance of the lives of the Almyran people as seen in his Cyril supports, it’s actually reasonable to conclude that Dimitri has thought about his position relative to his subjects more than either of the other leaders.

And speaking of Claude, Dimitri does not conquer the Alliance in AM; rather, Claude hands it over to him unexpectedly after the Kingdom army comes to his aid and fights off the Imperial army invading Derdriu. If Hilda is recruited in AM her monastery dialogue the next month reveals that the Alliance council peacefully agreed to go along with Claude’s decision to cede their territory to the Kingdom. This is incidentally a much better deal than the Alliance gets in either VW or SS, where Claude disappears either at the end of the game or after Gronder and it’s given to Byleth with no further discussion (and the same thing also happens to the Kingdom in both routes). The Empire at the end of the game is in much the same situation as every other antagonist nation in FE, with no one to rule it following the counter-invasion from the protagonist nation(s) because they’re all dead. Similar to Genealogy the picture does open up a bit depending on who’s alive, with Ferdinand, Lorenz, Marianne, etc. governing their respective territories if they’re recruited. Ditto unseen noble heirs like Holst and Caspar’s older brother who are still around to inherit their titles even with Byleth or Dimitri ruling the continent. As far as the Empire is concerned the two of them are as much imperialists as Marth, Seliph, the Renais twins, etc., a far cry from Edelgard in CF invading and conquering two sovereign nations without provocation, predicated in part on the basis that centuries prior they were part of the Empire so it’s acceptable for her to conquer them.

Now, onto Edelgard. You must be aware that Edelgard chose to ally with the Agarthans at Hubert’s suggestion, and she continues to make that choice for nearly a decade without any attempt at checking them despite knowing all the terrible things that they’re getting up to behind the scenes at the monastery and that they enacted earlier without her direct involvement to destabilize the continent and make her conquest easier, like the Tragedy of Duscur and the death of Claude’s uncle. As myself and others have noted attempting to spin her as a helpless victim of their machinations only makes her look incompetent and terrible in her choice of allies - not just the Agarthans themselves but also known murderers Hubert and Jeritza whom she cannot fully control with one frequently going behind her back and the other openly disobeying her multiple times on the battlefield. This in combination with Hubert’s status as the Manfroy to Edelgard’s Arvis leaves me very much in doubt of the Agarthans being truly eradicated in the postgame. Not only is this unsatisfying for the player, but given Hubert’s use of dark magic and dabbling in the Agarthans’ experiments (plus that he was the one who suggested the alliance in the first place, for all that he grumbles about Thales ordering him around) it’s more likely that he eradicates their leadership and then installs himself at the head of the remaining cult, folding them into his established network of spies and assassins. Hubert is one of my favorite characters in this cast, but he’s anything but trustworthy especially if his primary motivation really is wanting Edelgard to sleep with him when it turns out she never will, not even in their paired ending. In keeping with his status as the pathetic hopeless suitor pining for this game’s headlining waifu despite her overt attraction to the self-insert, sexual frustration is built into his character even if he gets a wife or if he and Ferdinand become the most notorious lovers in Enbarr.

Plus, if you look Edelgard actually does rather than what she says she aligns more with what the Agarthans want than the stated goals of her own propaganda. She completes their genocide of the Nabateans and unifies the continent with Agarthans in positions of great power. On the other hand she doesn’t eradicate the nobility as a whole but only replaces those who would oppose her seizing absolute power, which goes to support that it was the Insurrection of the Seven and not the Agarthan experimentation that truly shaped her worldview and motivations. The stated reasons she wants to destroy the church are provably incorrect - she knows they didn’t create Relics or Crests thanks to secret Imperial knowledge passed down from Wilhelm, and she must know that they aren’t all-powerful as the Empire disbanded the Southern Church completely a century before the events of the game with apparently no pushback from Rhea or anyone else - and one must therefore conclude that she instead targets them because they, like the Imperial nobles she replaces and like Claud e and Dimitri defending their nations, would oppose her solitary rule of the continent. It’s just awfully convenient that this goal also accomplishes the Agarthans’ main goal of killing or driving into hiding all of the remaining dragons. Saying that the war was inevitable because the Agarthans were slinking around setting it up to happen doesn’t absolve Edelgard of the responsibility of choosing to ally with them and playing right into their hands, especially when her conquest only noticeably improves her own situation, and possibly Hubert and Jeritza’s now that they have a license to kill, torture, etc. for an entire continent. All of the other Eagles go on to inherit what they would have inherited anyway, and all the reforms mentioned in the CF endings are the same or better in endings for the other routes only your side didn’t start a war and complete a genocide to bring those about.

#Fire Emblem #FE16 #Fire Emblem Three Houses #Dimitri Alexandre Blaiddyd #Edelgard von Hresvelg

85 notes · View notes

ghostmartyr · 4 years

Text

SnK 129 Thoughts

This month: More people screaming and dying.

Next month: Probably more people screaming and dying.

Eventually: Just a whole heck of a lot of screaming.

(Not dying because there will be no more people.

They will be dead.)

Sooooooooooooooo.

Uh.

This chapter has people screaming and dying in it.

As well as the continuing strangeness of actively rooting for Reiner and Annie.

Ayep.

Ding-dong, Magath is dead?

Yet again, we land on the problem of a chapter that is largely self-explanatory, and the perhaps deeper problem of people committing themselves to doing a thing once a month, even if they’re not sure they’re able to do said thing. There’s good stuff here, I’m just hesitant to start talking about it lest it comes out like a random spew of instantly forgettable bullet points.

Since I don’t care, I guess we’ll start with Magath dying.

I don’t care. Moving on!

Theo Magath is a man who has always cared for the children under his command. Even though they’re Eldian, he has routinely gone above the expected amount of effort in securing their safety. He is the one who worries and waits for Reiner, Annie, Bertolt, and Marcel to come home. He is the one who destroys the worst of the military he’s a part of so they can stop depending on titans. He cares.

What a fucking bastard.

Keith Shadis dies with him. After a life of trying to make himself special, putting lives at risk every step of the way, he finds an appropriate time to make his exit. He’s the one who raises every fighter out in the port. He’s the one who has watched as the other instructors kill them so that they can find the ones strong enough to make the cut.

He’s the one who picks Eren up and brings him back to his bed after he inherits his father’s burden.

One thing I do think is important to note, whenever I’m inspired to say, ‘Fuck Marley,’ is that Paradis is not great.

Paradis has child soldiers too. They’re just slightly older.

Paradis fully expects their soldiers to go out and die too. Their consent just skates through needing air quotes.

Paradis has a corrupt government run by self-interest -- until they have a coup.

Magath’s job, his entire career, has been to make the most of the enslaved Eldian lives he’s been handed on a platter. It is his job to train children up to murder people. If they are not good enough at murder, they will be fed to other children.

Shadis feels more comfortable. He’s been a reasonable authority figure for most of the manga, with his worst crimes being in his past, and even that reveal coming with a greater show of humanity than any other displayed that night. He tries to run Eren out of the military before he destroys himself. He worries for the boy, and gives a voice to the struggle of trying to be special when you’re most gifted at fucking up.

Paradis’ military, at the start of the main plot, gets its recruits via shaming teenagers into being willing to die, or starving teenagers into being willing to die.

The primary difference between it and Marley’s system is that in that section of the totem pole, the oppression level is relatively neutral. The wall systems are kind of fucked, the nobility is kind of awful -- but like. Their last genocide was what, two years ago? And it was killing poor people, not people people.

Everyone in Paradis’ military has to deal with the fact that they’re in a shrinking safe space and they’re either going to starve, or monsters are going to eat them. That is the great equalizing force. If their commanding officer fucks up, he is going to get eaten. If the person next to them fucks up, they are going to get eaten.

They are not crouching down, approaching tiny children, and explaining that it is for the good of humanity that they are the ones eaten because their blood is dirty. Anymore.

Fuck Marley. Fuck its internment camps, fuck its slavery, fuck its brainwashing, fuck how it turned Good Eldians and Bad Eldians into war rhetoric. Fuck just about everything it has to offer.

Paradis is fucked up in the spirit of everyone there being equally fucked (unless you’re rich) (or nobility). Marley is fucked up because it’s made being fascist, warmongering assholes a national policy.

So you have two men on a boat waiting to die. They’ve both sent children to their deaths. They’ve both pushed over the lines trying to let their uniqueness carry change instead of doing the difficult legwork it actually takes.

One of them is not an active agent of genocide.

One of them is.

They both have sad feelings.

It is sad.

The important part is however badly they fucked up, the traumatized children they’re leaving behind are about to be more traumatized, and they’ve realized what a bad thing this is.

Only not really because Keith did his job, did his first job badly enough to find a new job, did that new job, and has continued doing that new job up to the point where he’s blowing himself up, and has no particular qualms about any of that since he’s pretty much been acting his conscience the whole time.

I’m lingering on this because you have both people who trained up our primary cast making a choice for the good of humanity, and dying the same way. It is a clear and obvious parallel, and it is being milked.

But it’s one of those parallels that makes me twitchy the longer I look at it. Probably because of that conscience part. These men play the same role, but besides their stages having massive differences, their choices do as well.

Magath’s conscience doesn’t stop him from shouting racist rhetoric at a preteen on a battlefield. In his introductory scene.

Shadis’ conscience, however warped some of the intent is, leads to him quitting and passing his job up to someone more qualified.

...Essentially, Shadis is kind of a bastard for a lot of things, but Magath is a fascist bastard, and continues to be a fascist bastard even when he takes steps to overthrow a fascist regime, and I know and appreciate that Magath realizes this and feels bad about it, but it’s hard not to resent the manga comparing Shadis and Magath so strongly.

Magath’s fucked up a lot. It’s good he admits it.

Shadis feels like one more person who sees death as all he has to offer the world.

In a series that actively opposes that line of thought whenever it comes up, it’s really difficult not to find the whole dynamic frustrating. Yes, the manga doesn’t say these two people are the same. They’re just in the exact same boat making the exact same decision.

Like that other group over in their boat.

Shadis is looking to die. Magath is looking to make a last stand.

I don’t think I’m doing a great job of putting into words why it’s so aggravating for me, except, you know. Fuck Marley. Also Magath helped cause all of this. Keith’s sort of sat around feeling various forms of guilt for years over things he screwed up because he was trying so hard.

Shadis forfeits his life.

Every other time someone with that mindset is ready to die, it’s met with no, you’re not done yet.

Shadis doesn’t get that. He’s done. Magath is the only one there to tell him otherwise, and Magath has his own problems.

There’s a vibe here that these two old teachers have outlived their purpose. Their kids are grown, for better and worse, and they’re the ones who will control the turn of the future. I don’t oppose them making that decision, but in Shadis’ case, it really comes off as him being cool with whatever, now that he’s made his stand.

Ugh. I don’t like it, but articulating why is probably best represented by me sulking and crossing my arms. Artistically, I get it. They’re the same piece on opposite ends of a chessboard.

But they’re different people and aaaargh.

Anyway, we continue the proud tradition of making Gabi cry.

Sorry about your life, Gabi.

In other news, we continue to not have any way to stop Eren.

Like.

At all.

We have an estimate of four days before Eren succeeds in wiping out a continent.

Their only chance of stopping that is powering up an airship, using some of that good ol’ talk-no-jutsu, or killing Eren.

If they take the route of killing Eren, all of the Colossals he’s been ordering on their walk will stop being under his command. Because he will be dead. Meaning that the continent, as well as our heroes, will now have to contend with a wild hoard of Colossal Titans out for a stroll.

Which is bad.

It’s basically where Paradis started out, but worse in every possible way.

Even if they manage to have someone on their team eat Eren, there’s a good chance that OG Ymir might not react well to her savior being axed. There’s a similarly good chance that the ability to use the Founder’s power just won’t be functional.

So if they kill Eren, they will stop having intentional destruction.

Instead, we will have unintentional destruction, of which there will be a lot.

Leaving us with talk-no-jutsu.

When the last attempt at talk-no-jutsu led to Armin punching Eren and being bad at it. And Eren punching Armin and being less bad at it.

Basically, everyone’s really hoping that by communicating with Eren, they can somehow make this all go away. There is no evidence that this will work, and no evidence that any of the added backup plans will do anything but cause different problems, but by golly, they’ve completed step .5 of their 3-step plan to maybe changing their circumstances.

(Step 1: Get Air Boat Step 2: Fly Air Boat To Eren Step 3: Talk Eren Out Of Genocide)

BOY I SURE AM HAPPY FOR YOU GUYS PUTTERING ALONG WITH THAT FORWARD PROGRESS. WHAT CHAMPS. GOOD FOR YOU.

YOU’RE STILL FUCKED.

I AM SO HAPPY THAT WE ARE SPENDING ALL THIS TIME ON A PLAN THAT DOES NOT SOLVE THE FUNDAMENTAL PROBLEM OF HOW COMPLETELY FUCKED YOU ALL ARE.

IT IS NICE THAT YOU ALL FEEL LIKE YOU ARE CONTRIBUTING USEFUL THINGS TO YOUR SOCIETY. YOU DO YOU.

YOU ARE NOT ACTUALLY HELPING.

BUT MORE OF YOUR FRIENDS ARE DEAD FOR A GOOD CAUSE.

I’m not upset, I would just really like all of this to feel meaningful. Right now there’s a ridiculous amount of stress and dead bodies going into a goal that could easily end up pointless.

There’s merit to that as a story, but none of that stress lands properly, because the tension of “will they save the day or won’t they” isn’t dependent on what they’re doing here. The ticking clock might be making the characters stressed, but it’s not where the consequences lie.

I will continue to complain about this every month because I can.

In more positive news, Connie is best boi and no one appreciates him they way that they should.

Once upon a time, Reiner bullied Annie into taking a more active role in murdering Marco.

One of the arguments he used to provoke her was that she saved Connie’s life.

Not long after that, Reiner and some other recruits find themselves stranded in Utgard Castle, where a titan gets in and goes after Connie. Reiner charges in, gets his arm chomped on, and through everyone’s combined efforts, the titan gets shoved out a window.

Annie and Reiner both make the choice to save Connie’s life, even though it does nothing to benefit them.

In this chapter, beheaded and missing their arms, Connie swoops in and saves both of them.

The first taste of this technically goes to Mikasa, because she can’t help being a hero. She doesn’t like Annie. Annie is about the only human being whose existence can make her lose her temper. When a soldier gets behind Annie, Mikasa is there to back her up. It’s done casually and smoothly, because Mikasa’s just that good.

We’re still left with multiple shots of Annie staring at Mikasa.

Later followed with her staring at Reiner.

Annie and Reiner are used to being the traitors. They’re the ones their friends have every reason to hate. They’re the ones who spend years living with the victims of a war they brought to their shores. They’ve never expected forgiveness. They’re condemned, and almost welcome it.

Their trio interplay is never great. Reiner is trying too hard, and shielding Bertolt. Annie gets stuck with the grunt work, and knows they’re the bad guys. They don’t get along. They’re comrades, and allies, but their friendship is never portrayed as anything but their last lifeline.

Reiner and Bertolt are friends.

Annie’s the only one who has her fight with the Survey Corps alone.

This time, Reiner’s there, and he’s protecting her.

If you dig into any combination of these relationships, there’s not exactly a shortage of rot. They’ve all hurt each other, and they all know it.

But at the end of the day, they’re all just a bunch of damaged kids looking to be found.

None of the surviving cast is without a shoulder to lean on. They’ve made the decision to be there for each other, and as bleak as circumstances are, Annie’s face spends so much time this chapter shouting that she’s never been able to have that.

Even Magath, who goes off with the intent of dying alone, doesn’t.

There’s still some human warmth left in the world, and that’s what they’re trying to protect.

Please just do it with an actual plan, I’m begging you guys.

Also, Floch gets shot! So that’s nice.

I do not see a corpse.

That is less nice.

Isayama also gave Falco a fucking birdsona titan.

We’re not without things to cheer.

Tune in next month for more screaming and dead bodies.

#Shingeki no Kyojin #SnK 129 #Theo Magath #Keith Shadis #the inherent fuckery of child soldiers #shingeki no spoilers #SnK spoilers #spoilers #tl;dr #chapter post

91 notes · View notes

moonlightreal · 3 years

Text

Deep Dive: Diaspro! Part two

In the very first episode of season two Bloom and Sky meet up again after a summer apart. Since Sky is a prince he’s famous enough to be social news and Bloom read an article that said he was “canoodling with Diaspro over the summer.” Sky replies that their parents vacation on the same island and “there was one canoe trip but no canoodling.” They didn’t hang out.

Good news for Bloom, but for us it makes me wonder if vacationing on the same island is a regular thing for the two families.

This is in 4kids. In Rai they have a completely different conversation!

Jump ahead to episode ten, 4kids version. Bloom is happily planning their next date but Sky wants to have a serious talk first. In person, and he tells Bloom this over the phone. Bloom immediately guesses there’s a Diaspro issue and immediately gets all pissed off and yells that sky promised not to see her anymore. Sky says it’s not a Diaspro issue. Bloom yells, ‘She was only your fiance!’ Sky says again that it’s not a Diaspro issue.

And it isn’t. Sky just wants to have the 3-month talk where he asks her to be his official girlfriend. Sky and Brandon have a cute scene where Sky’s worrying and Brandon says, “Just tell her how you feel and give her your Red Fountain hero jacket.”

Then an evil spell zaps him and attacks Red Fountain. Everybody’s distracted with “protect the codex!” stuff then Bloom raises Sky from the dead and he asks her to be his official girlfriend. So Diaspro may not be around, and Sky really does seem to be over her, but Bloom still worries.

We don’t actually see Diaspro until episode 14 when she gets kidnapped by the Wrong Righters. This is a weird episode, it’s one big homage to the Patchaman anime so I’m not even sure it should be thought of as canon. But we might as well look at it since we’re here.

In 4kids the Wrong Righters say they’ve kidnapped Disa because “You’re destroying Planet Isis! People are going hungry because you’re making them spend all their money on outfits! you’re sending people into exile for wearing more than one type of denim! We are going to turn you into a good person!”

Suddenly I see why Fate decided to merge Stella and Diaspro into one unholy union. But taken at face value, Diaspro is oppressing her people in the name of making them look good. Also Isis must have some weird system of laws if the ruler can declare what people must buy.

In the real world there have been laws about clothes, called sumptuary laws, but they worked in the opposite direction-- limiting what people could wear so the peasants weren’t legally allowed to dress like the nobility even if a peasant was rich enough to do so. They were meant to stop people from bankrupting themselves trying to live large on Ye Olde version of Instagram, and there were also religious angles about humility as a virtue. Of course the nobles who made the laws were probably more concerned about keeping their spot on top of the heap! Rules for thee but not for me, said rich people throughout history.

Also, here’s the fact that Diaspro is the ruler of the planet Isis.

In the Rai that whole bit is the Wrong Righters introducing themselves, they don’t say anything about Diaspro’s bad behavior or mention her being ruler of Isis. This is why I love all the dubs—pick the canon that fits your headcanon and you’re already right!

Some of the girls travel to Eraklyon, Bloom’s coming to meet Sky’s parents. Zing the pixie tags along, in 4kids she just wants to see the place but in Rai she says, “Eraklyon! The kingdom plagued by evil ninjas!” So… Eraklyon has a longterm ninja problem?! The gang arrives and finds out Diaspro’s been kidnapped. They sent a brooch that in 4kids Sky gave her and in Rai it’s just her brooch, along with a ransom note.

We see a blurry shot of Disa’s parents crying, her mom has blue hair!

Sky and Brandon are ready to race to the rescue. Oddly in 4kids Erendor tries to stop them saying Sky doesn’t need to go after someone who isn’t his fiance anymore while in Rai Samara points out that Diaspro is still Sky’s best prospect. These dub disagreements make it hard to work out where we are! It seems clear that Sky has officially ended the engagement but his parents aren’t totally thrilled. They don’t want him going after Diaspro and Samara yells at Bloom for speaking out of turn when she offers to help. The two of them go racing to the rescue anyway! Both dubs have Sky’s parents hoping that the rescue may help Sky fall for Diaspro again. They don’t like Bloom. Remember this is before Domino is restored so Bloom is princess of nothing at the moment.

Rai Diaspro says, ‘I’m not afraid of your justice, I’m rich.’ Heh.

All this time poor Diaspro has been tied to a stalagmite in the Wrong Righters’ cave. Our heroes have a teleporting flower but they have to swap someone and Bloom volunteers. The Wrong Righters are about to… ‘torture’ is too strong a word, ‘give her some grief’ is a better phrase. They’re about to stick a weird helmet on her head, maybe to reprogram her brain to be a good person or something. But Diaspro poofs out and Bloom poofs in and flames out the lair and everybody has a fight.

Diaspro ends up in a tent with Flora and the pixies out of the way of the action.

Rai Disa: “It’s so not fair, Bloom’s the one who rescued me but I hate her! Why does Sky have to like her? I spent my whole life studying posture, etiquette, court protocol, everything! After all that work I’m supposed to marry a prince, that’s the whole point!”

4kids Disa; “You’re right Flora, nobody should be without freedom, I don’t want anybody to be without enough to eat! I have to change! And I will change, I promise! I will become a great leader! ...though I still believe that hair accessories should be considered a basic necessity.”

And my plan of “deep dive into figuring out what’s up with Diaspro” breaks down, because we have two different Diaspros. 4Kids Disa is a tyrant ruler of a planet who seems to have been talked around by Flora and is now determined to be a better person. Rai Disa is I think more authentic to the character we see throughout the series. I’m supposed to marry a prince, that’s the whole point. That kind of covers it, right there.

The 4kids version gives us a whole lot to work with, with Disa being a fashion-obsessed tyrannical ruler of a planet who had a sudden enlightenment, while the Rai version leaves her a much more sympathetic character. If Disa’s family and Sky’s vacation on the same island every year that could mean that Diaspro and Sky grew up seeing each other regularly, maybe with other royal families around. They’re used to being in the same social sphere. It’s also clear that Sky’s parents still think Diaspro would be a good bride for Sky. At the end of episode 14 they praise Bloom for her bravery in helping with the rescue, but up until then they support Diaspro. These things could give Diaspro hope that Sky will come back to her and make it feel more reasonable to continue pursuing him.

And that’s it for season two. Diaspro only appears in the one episode and doesn’t do anything but get kidnapped and have one of two different conversations with Flora. But whether you like gonzo 4kids Diaspro or understandable Rai Diaspro, season 3 is when things with Diaspro really heat up! we’ll look at the next chapter in her life… eventually.

#winx club #winx club season 2 #diaspro

9 notes · View notes

noblexcelestemorningstar · 3 years

Note

Is your character a good judge of character? If so, have they ever 'dodged a bullet' thanks to their intuition? If not, have they ever trusted someone they shouldn't have?

Oh BOY.

I'm going to rate how good each Blade In Ash oc is at judging character is on a -10 to 10 scale, -10 being reverse competence, 0 being complete innocence or random chance, and 10 being a perfect judge of character.

As Usual, Rating is Mid-Expedition, spoilers will be avoided, and things will be kept sfw.

Morna: 7/10? Morna is complicated in that her initial impression of someone is usually mostly correct, and under normal circumstances she's able to judge someone's character relatively well, but she also trusts people's promises to do better and lies they believe about themselves. She has dodged a few bullets though, both as a merchant and as wizard.

Ayemsa: 2/10. Even with the training both official and unofficial that growing up in the nobility provides, Ayemsa's VERY innocent. Has a nasty tendency to assume good intentions and the best of people. While the big example of them trusting someone they shouldn't is spoilers, their naivety has gotten them into trouble too. Usually it's small things such as not catching merchants ripping them off. When they were much younger (equiv. 14) they trusted an "acquaintance" to keep the details of something quiet and they didn't. Broke their heart.

Falandil: 8.5/10. Out of all the people in the BIA canon, Falandil is probably the best at sensing how trustworthy someone is. A combination of a rough childhood, work as a sellsword, and the experience innate to a half-millennium of being alive have sharpened his skills in the art of Fuckery Detection to a terrifyingly sharp point. If he catches you entering a room with him, he'll know what you want and how he wants to deal with you before you reach him, even more so if you're hostile. This skill has served him well as a wanderer, a historian, and as a mage. However, this ability is tempered by his own hubris. A good read means nothing when you assume the other person isn't a real threat.

Irene: 6/10. Irene's ability to read people is quite average all things considered, though she is better with it than some people. She can usually spot people in a crowd who are less than savory and can quickly read if someone's intentions are good or bad. While she hasn't avoided everything, she generally utilized this to remain outside the territory of other necromancers mages, which is a skill that is very useful for someone in her profession

Selma: 7/10. Selma has the dubious honor of being the person who's earned her knack for judging other people. As an innocent young Nord, she was not exactly the most skilled at seeing who and what around her was dangerous, and I mean she *did* run away to marry a stronghold Orc. However her time in the stronghold remedied her relative innocence and she learned the hard way what ill intent looks like. Thankfully she attempts to use it to protect those around her less intuitive, and not in order to manipulate others.

Astante: 9/10. Astante, as always, has a knack for hiding things about them/herself, and her ability to read people is one of them. While she is less adept at sensing moment-to-moment ill intent and instant first impressions than Falandil is, with a bit of interaction, she will be able to know WAAAY more about you than is comfortable. She'll see what makes you tick, and then she'll see what can break you. She zeroes in on the flaws of others more than anything and figures out how to encourage them. You probably won't realize she knows this about you unless she decides to destroy you for fun and profit. On the less creepy side, she can give really good advice.

Lorana: 5/10. Lorana can read people, but she's usually waaaay too focused on something else to do so. When she is focusing, it's clear to her what's going on with people, and she attempted to nurture her intuition in order to get ahead of people. She does have a nasty tendency to miss the mark and assume others are planning things even when they aren't. As a daedra worshipper, this is not always a bad thing for her, and it has helped her keep on her toes. However a liar skilled enough and motivated enough could throw her quite off. This is something she's aware of, but hasn't really planned on a way to deal with it.

BONUS!

Starship 31:

Melody/Melds: 7/10. For a sentient slime mold with no central nervous system, she's pretty good at picking up on tiny movements and stuff people miss. She's not perfect and she has her misses, but she's correct enough that the rest of crew will ask her opinion of people. I think the best example of a "got out of trouble because of her intution" story is her immediately spotting the imposters in a diplomat's posse, pulling an alarm, and then high-tailing it out of the space station before the bomb went off.

#Blade in Ash #Oc talk

1 note · View note

isazulabaeorwhat · 4 years

Note

Different anon here but bruh c'mon... abuse is the behaviours and actions of a person not the intention of their actions. It doesnt matter if Azula was tryna be nice and friendly to Mai and Ty Lee, what matters is that she used fear and control to coerce Mai and Ty Lee to do her bidding (like you said) and that is abuse. Doesnt matter why. The army doesnt do this, theres consent and agreement. Pls dont be an abuse apologist... I like your blog :(. I want azula redemption but not like thisss :(.

The definition of abuse (noun):

1. the improper use of something.

2. cruel and violent treatment of a person or animal.

3. (More in-depth) interactions in which one person behaves in a cruel, violent, demeaning, or invasive manner toward another person or an animal. The term most commonly implies physical mistreatment but also encompasses sexual and psychological (emotional) mistreatment.

And then the psychological definition for abusive behavior:

1. Emotional abuse is a way to control another person by using emotions to criticize, embarrass, shame, blame, or otherwise manipulate another person. In general, a relationship is emotionally abusive when there is a consistent pattern of abusive words and bullying behaviors that wear down a person's self-esteem and undermine their mental health.

And this is from ReachOut.com:

“If you feel scared or confused around your partner, or doubt yourself when you’re talking with them, you may be experiencing emotional abuse. An emotional abuser’s goal is to undermine another person’s feelings of self-worth and independence. In an emotionally abusive relationship, you may feel that there is no way out or that without your partner you’ll have nothing. Emotional abuse is a form of domestic and family violence.”

The intention of the abuser and how it affects the victim is relevant. The actions that the previous anon you’re referring to can all be displayed by any person at any time whenever they’re angry or just petty, but the triggers of it widely differs from abusers. People say mean things or blame you when they explode under a lot of stress. An abuser doesn’t need to be under even any stress do this to you. They’ll just destroy your self-esteem whenever you show even a hint of independence. They want control over you. If you think that anyone who has ever been mean to you is abusive, then that means literally everyone in the world is abusive. People aren’t saints. We are all mostly driven by our emotions. The difference between us and abusers is, they aren’t. They’re driven by narcissism and logic instead of their emotions. Whatever works best solely only for their own happiness, they’ll do it because they don’t care about ethics. They basically live only in a ‘ME’ world. And just because abusers are often victims themselves, doesn’t mean they’ve never felt or known what a healthy relationship. They know what a healthy relationship is. They just don’t care.

Now, the abuse in the army. Abuse doesn’t care about consent. Not everything is about consent. You can give your consent to be treated like shit and that’ll still mean that you’re treated like shit and the person who treated you like shit should still be held accountable. The most common abuse in the army is verbal abuse. Definition of verbal abuse: the act of forcefully criticizing, insulting, or denouncing another person.

Examples of sergeants in the army verbally abusing their soldiers is when they call them maggots, scream at them and throw degaratory insults. Technically that is abusive on paper. But in real life with context, that is acceptable behavior and is called Discipline instead because first and foremost, the intention is different. Sergeants verbally abuse their soldiers to train their mental fortitude and to be able to cope under stressful situations. If you mess up during battle, you’re gonna get yourself killed and you’re gonna get your comrades killed. No one will take your bullshit if their life is on the line. If they can’t handle being screamed at while performing a simple task, then how do you expect them to follow even the most basic command while being SHOT at? How do you expect them to not reveal any intel to the enemy when tortured? All soldiers are trained to obey, and this is a fundamental part of being a soldier. Second, drill sergeants do not select who to treat this way. This is how sergeants treat everyone. It becomes abusive when that sergeant does it exclusively to only some people instead of the entire batch for absolutely no reason. If you compare a 21st century war to the Vietnam War or the World Wars or any other war before the 21st, you’ll see that it was actually more ‘abusive’ back then because of forced conscription which made recruits unwilling to fight, hence their superiors being more brutal. Nonetheless, conscription was necessary because of the advantage that manpower gives.

If we only see fear and control as the main indicators of abuse, then that becomes extremely flawed because then everything that pertains to discipline would mean that the whole system is abusive. The army would be abusive, the asian culture of discipline would be abusive, lol you can even call the criminal justice system to be abusive at this point. Context is necessary to put a label on something. Otherwise you’ll be calling someone worse than they actually are.

Azula treated Mai and Ty Lee the same way she treated her soldiers, using fear and control. When she was making a speech in the first episode, that was all fear and control— When she threatened her captain to continue on their journey, that was fear and control, same as how she threatened Ty Lee when she declined her request to assist her. In both of these times, she abused her power as Princess of the Fire Nation because she was doing those things in service of her nation. When she was OFF DUTY, we did not even see a single moment of abusive or disciplinarian behavior from her because in Book 3, none of them were soldiers and their mission was over. They were simply children of the nobility/royalty following their family’s wishes which was to have proper conduct and not dishonor the family.

HOWEVER, despite fear and control being required in war for everything to go as planned and efficiently, that does not mean that it makes it okay, hence why it should still be labelled as toxic. When someone is being treated like a property for their own personal gain, that is abuse. When someone is being treated like shit for that someone’s own good, that is toxic. The military culture can be seen as abusive if you compare it to society norms, but the thing is that soldiers are trained to incapacitate the enemy in the first place, and prepared to kill if needs be. And there is nothing normal about that. At best the military culture is toxic, but really that’s irrelevant at this stage because of the shootings.

What makes Azula toxic is how she prioritized the mission’s success over her friends welfare despite them having not been enlisted in the military (so they had the right to decline), thinking she knows what’s better for Ty Lee because she believed she was wasting her time in the circus, and then abusing her power to make them obey her. On paper her actions sound abusive, but when given war context, it really isn’t. That was how wars were won. By using fear and control to cultivate motivation. This is generally part of almost every Asian culture, hence the discipline. It’s also noteworthy to consider that the Fire Nation is based on Imperial Japan (and they were terrifyingly loyal and strict). Being abusive implies not caring about the person’s needs and happiness. There is no culture or family or group that can function under abuse because of this. None, but what Azula did is what most have done in the Fire Nation, and she behaved like an ordinary friend when she was off duty. The truth is that being a leader of a military and being a Princess during war is an occupational hazard. The control and fear that she used against her soldiers was also carried onto her friends when she was recruiting them.

And again, it’s canon that Azula did feel remorse and guilt for using fear to control her friends. Her hallucination of Ursa was the manifestation of her guilt, hence why ‘Ursa’ confronted her about her use of fear and control towards everyone. An abusive person doesn’t feel remorse for their actions which is why they’ll just do it again, unlike Azula who actually did feel remorse. That’s also why she acknowledged that she was a monster in The Beach, because she knows that using fear and control makes her horrible, but she still does it anyway because that’s the only security she believes she has. She didn’t use fear to control just her friends, but literally everyone. Abusers will constantly deny and deny confrontations about their abuse and gaslight their victims. Azula literally did the opposite of an abuser.

You cannot and should not separate abusive behavior from an abuser. If that person is abusive, that means they’re an abuser. Abuse is not normal, and you should not normalize it. That’s why being able to differentiate toxicity from abuse is important. In general, you shouldn’t have to put up with all that negative energy so it’s better if you just break off contact with both of these people, but abusers are more dangerous than toxic people. At the very least, toxic people at least will have the willingness to change (this requires you to be really thick skinned and patient if you want to be that toxic person’s therapist yourself), unlike abusers. Toxic people are just stubborn and petty, but they’re not deluded with themselves like abusers. Abusers don’t and rarely rarely ever change. The chances of an abuser ever changing is honestly extremely low because they rarely ever go to therapy themselves since they think they’re the ones in the right.

Things you go for therapy for are things that can be changed because either they realized that their behavior is potentially life threatening to their own, or it hinders them from doing everyday task, or it’s threatening to those around them. But again, like I said, abusers don’t just ‘realize’ that they’re abusive. If they’re confronted about their behavior, they will justify it in ways that will make you doubt yourself and think badly of yourself for making them ‘look’ bad. An abuser HAS a choice, just like murderers and rapists do. And yes, I do hold abusers to the similar lowest caliber of a human being as those criminals because they violate a person’s mental health. Abuse can lead to trauma and sometimes even PTSD, and that often is the case because that is how dangerous an abuser is.

An abuser, abusive person, whatever you want to call them is killing you mentally and emotionally, and you won’t even be aware of it till you’re so far in because you’ve been thinking that was normal behavior. And even if you have identified that your partner is abusive, at this point, you will return to their side several times because you believe that they just need to apologize and it’s all good or just go to therapy which is VERY UNLIKELY to happen or succeed. Very few abusers ever go to therapy and it can take months to years for them to even be remotely trustworthy to never be abusive again.

I’m not condoning abuse, nor am I an abuse apologist. I think it’s been pretty obvious that I loathe abusers. Right now, YOU are actually being the abuse apologist by supporting Azula DESPITE claiming her to be abusive. I want Azula to have a redemption arc too, but NOT if she’s abusive. Abusers don’t deserve a second chance just like Ozai doesn’t. If you still believe that Azula is abusive yet still deserves a redemption, then I don’t see why the same thing can’t be done for Ozai who is a model citizen of abusiveness 101 because since he just had a terrible childhood like his children, he shouldn’t be left out .-.

If you say that Azula is abusive, you are saying that Azula has been relentlessly destroying literally everyones’s self esteem, undermining them, gaslighting, denies that she’s a horrible person, blames everyone for every bad thing that happened to her, feels no remorse for her treatment of her friends, and literally does not care about anyone but herself. In which case, if you support an abusive character, be it fictional or real person, would be extremely harmful and it gives a terrible message to victims of abuse and encourage the behavior of abusers.

The victim of abuse or a third party shouldn’t decide whether the abuser deserves redemption. And it’s definitely not the victim’s responsibility to ‘help’ their abuser get better. That is entirely up to the abuser themselves IF they ever want to change and seek professional help which as you’ve seen in the present ATLAverse, does not exist because those with mental disorders are just sent to mental asylums and locked up in straitjackets with no actual chance of recovery.

Conclusion: If you say that Azula is actually abusive and still think there’s a chance for her, that will never happen because ATLA is not advanced enough yet to understand psychology, much less mental disorders. If you say that Azula is actually abusive and Ty Lee is the one who can help her because she can provide the love and security that Azula has never received, again, wrong and DEFINITELY a terrible message to send.

If you say that Azula is actually abusive, please please please stop liking her because that is disturbing and just so wrong on so many levels. It is WRONG to like an abusive character. It is WRONG to think there’s anything good, admirable or redeemable about an abusive person.

Just.

No.

Not everyone deserves redemption or forgiveness.

#avatar the last airbender #azula #abuse #this will be my last response to this issue #cuz we’re just going around in circles now #i just pray that none of you condone abusers #or at least will stop

23 notes · View notes

themightyaliendwarf · 3 years

Text

TPN s02e10

Guys, I’m really conflicted. On one hand this episode has done some things better than the manga, but at the same time it has so many plot holes... And I mean major plot holes! But let’s start from the beginning

1. Well, the episode start with a scene that I can nitpick. How do they know what happened with Grace Field after the fire? Is it once again from that data that has 15 years? As I said, it’s a nitpick, but I think ultimately little things like that can ruin a series.

2. So, I was right about that Vincent isn’t a traitor. I mean, I wouldn’t say that it was very difficult to guess. Even if you are anime only and don’t know how loyal Vincent was to Norman. But I have a question: wouldn’t Barbra be a better red herring? Anime showed how much she hates demons, so it would make more sense for the audience for her to be the “traitor” (since I guess we need one). Besides, she wasn’t one of the smart lambda kids, so she would be less suspicious. But I guess Peter is dumb, so I guess it doesn’t really make a difference.

3. I don’t like providing false information, so I did a little bit of research. According to my source (here is the link -> http://aerostation.free.fr/mfr/en/mfr_7.shtml), it should take from 150 up to 300 work hours to build 1 hot air balloon. That’s at least 6.25 days. Do you know how many hot air balloons those children build in less than a week? 10 at least! Look, the works of fiction can be unrealistic, but we should set up some boundaries. Is it too much to ask for an anime (that should be about young geniuses being geniuses) to show us characters being smart, making good and creative choices and overcoming obstacles in a way that makes sense? Besides, I’m salty that they didn’t give us more Ray content here. I mean, he was supposed to be an incredible engineer. How could you miss this opportunity? How?

4. Hey, why does demons are throwing spears at those balloons? Don’t they have, I dunno, guns? Why this anime doesn’t want to use guns so badly?

5. But I have to say one thing: the fact that first thing those kids do after coming back to the farms, is starting a fire, is absolutely hilarious.

6. Also, I love the addition of Thoma and Lannion finding canned food in the old well. This scene comes from extra page added to the volume #20 of the manga, and it’s delightful.

7. As I mentioned above, Peter is stupid. Let’s think for a second. They set up a plan of luring children in, then they find out that they will come back to the farms thanks to the ‘traitor’... and they don’t suspect a thing. I mean, really? Really? In the manga, he also forces them to come back, but there the plan looks drastically different. Peter is not fooled by a “traitor”, he just didn’t expect that the children will try to take over the farms.

Besides, let’s not forget that in the manga, both sides are playing cat and a mouse. The whole things lasts, I think, about 10 chapters, so it makes sense that it’s better fleshed out, and both sides can take as many wins and fails. Here it kinda goes like this:

- I win! - No, because I outsmarted you! - Haha, no, I’m outsmarting your outsmarting! - But did you expect that outsmarting your outsmarting of my outsmarting?! It’s fast to the point of the viewer not being able to get invested in the story. You don’t feel tension because there is no time for that - the problem disappears before the solution will be useful, because another problem appears.

8. But let’s talk about the good side because there is one. I like the whole idea of this plan more than the one in the manga. Let’s look at the steps of the plan from the anime.

1. Provide Peter with the incorrect info 2. Makes farms believe that the incorrect info is true by tricking them 3. Get inside while they are busy with your distraction 4. Connect to the system 5. Get in touch by children from the farms by blending in 6. Take over the system 7. Help children escape from the adults 8. Buy some more time 9. Reach the assembly point and escape It sounds really good on paper, but you need at least 3 or 4 episodes to make it work. Actually, let’s not forget that it took 12 episodes to escape from the farms. Now, I don’t think that we would need this much time (it would be cool, though), but 1 episode is just not enough. Especially by the amount of ‘no, you’ moments in this episode.

9. Another nitpick: do you think a 13 year old would be able to destroy a, I think, camera with a bow and an arrow? The answer is: no, of course not. I don’t think you would even be physically able to do it. I mean, you can’t even break an armour with a bow! (well, alright, there were some gigantic war bows in the history, but they usually take a looot of strength - and sometimes more than a one person - to pull)

10. The moment when Emma just dropped her weapon on the floor, I was like “Yep, that’s because she didn’t go through Godly Pond”. Why would you drop a weapon on the enemy territory? Why? Sure, she also does it in the manga, but at that point, the danger is gone (well, not really, but she couldn’t expect that).

11. Here is a couple of panels from the manga I’m REALLY salty weren’t included:

So, basically, Vincent being a wonderful ally, symbolism, Oliver being a badass (and GP crew existing) and one scene I think is really funny.

12. Let’s talk about civilian demon rising. Yes, it makes sense and I overall like it... but what about the nobility? We know that it exists and that the farm system is simply a method they use. Yeah, it makes sense to start from attacking them (as a symbol), but it was poorly executed. Again, too much, too soon.

13. You know what really sucks? The anime didn’t explain a thing about the promise. All we know that it was made 1000 years ago. You would think that it would be good to explain the thing that is in the title, but I guess there is no use, right? Fortunately, it was explained in the manga, and I would recommend checking it out if you are an anime only. But if you are, you probably shouldn’t read my posts, because I spoil the manga :^)

So, to sum up... I’m conflicted. I can see that there was potential, but the episode suffers because of the lack of time. Which is ironic since anime was supposed to go anime-original because they wanted to ‘fix the ending’. What’s funny, they are making the ending less nerve-wracking because Emma didn’t make a new promise, so we don’t have to worry about the reward. You know, the thing that bother manga readers for months because we had no idea what it will be. So, I guess we will just get a plain happy ending because there are absolutely no stakes.

I’ve also just realised that Isabella might survive this time, since season 2 killed, I believe, a whole 0 named characters. Sure, in the manga, there are not that many deaths, but when they happen, they are painful - bunker dads forever in our hearts.

So, yeah, one more episode left. Let’s see what will happen next week.

#tpn #the promised neverland #tpn s02e10 #tpn anime spoilers #tpn manga spoilers

2 notes · View notes

narutsuart · 5 years

Text

Edelgard’s backstory and why she blames Crests/Church(Spoilers Obviously):

So I’ve noticed that some people were a bit confused about El’s backstory and why she’d ultimately blame the church for her tragedy and the state of the world. Understandably so, because as much as I love this game they don’t do a great job in explaining it outright. That being said there is enough lore and suplimentary lore, to read in between the lines.

Note: this is NOT a write up on whether she’s right or wrong, it’s purpose is simply to clear up some muddy details in the lore and help explain Edelgard’s motivation and perspective.

Ok so here’s where actual spoilers roll in...

Insurrection of the Seven and the Tragedy of Enbarr:

Those who have played Black Eagles route will know that Edelgard’s tragic past involved the experimentation of her and her 10 siblings. In her C+ support with Byleth she says that the one responsible was the prime minister Duke Aegir, (Ferdinand’s father). Now anyone that was paying attention will know that Thales and those who slither in the dark were the ones that performed the experimentation on Edelgard. When we see the Flame Emperor(later revealed as Edelgard), and Thales speaking, he calls the Flame Emperor “their greatest weapon” and mentions imbuing the Flame Emperor with the blood of the “defiled beast” aka the goddess. Then we get confirmation in the part two: Crimson Flower from Hubert they are indeed responsible for the expiramentation. So did she lie about the prime minister?

Well no, not quite, you see in part one of Black Eagles Edelgard hints her true intentions several times in the story because more than anything she wants her allies and professor to walk her path with her. Of course she has to worry about blowing her cover so she did have to resort to half truths throughout part one. While it’s true that she and her family were experimented on by Thales(the leader of those who slither in the dark), in order to endow them with the Crest of Flames and in-turn become a powerful weapon. It’s exactly as Edelgard says it was ultimately the “prime minister and his gaggle of nobles” that allowed for her to do so. When Thales conducted the expiraments on Edelgard it was when he was under the guise of Volkhard von Arundel, brother of Edelgard’s mother Patricia von Arundel. Due to Patricia being wed to Emperor Ionius IX( Edelgard’s father) Volkhard was granted power as well as the title of lord. He comes to simply be known as “Lord Arundel”. With Volkhard’s new station and power he was able to play a big role in instigating an event known as the “lnsurrection of the Seven”. A soft coup that occurred within the Adrestian Empire in Imperial Year 1171. Duke Aegir, backed by a cadre of other corrupt imperial nobles. The nobles being: Count Bergliez, Duke Girth, Count Hevring, Count Varley, Marquise Vestra, and of course Volkhard von Arundel. They in-turned stripped Emperor Ionius IX of much of his power, relegating him to a mere figurehead while Duke Aegir became the true authority behind the throne. Remember that Thales under the guise of Volkhard von Arundel and used his position to manipulate the prime minister and the other nobles into the experimentation on the Hresevelg royal family as well as various other unsuspecting victims( Lysithea and her family) in order create “a powerful heir for the Empire” (while Thales real objective is to make a champion to destroy the church and children of the goddess.) All of the expiramentation was conducted in secret, implied to be imprisoned underneath the castle grounds of the Adrestian Empire.

Important Note: I want to clarify the expiramentation does not take place in Shambhala it’s heavily implied Edelgard has never been to Shambhala and seen those who slither in the dark at large. We know this because in Hubert’s posthumous note sharing the directions to Shambhala, says he was only able to detect it’s location due the Javelins of Light. The reason why those who slither in the dark use them sparingly is because they can be traced back to their domain.

The reasons why this all comes back to Rhea/Seiros and the church is because had she not lied about the true nature of the Crests, Saints and Elites and created an elitist nobility system where those without crests are screwed, and those with them rise to power, then Fodlan wouldn’t be led by a bunch of corrupt power hungry nobles who seek to further their power by any means necessary. You see regardless of intentions Seiros essentially creates a rift in society, by saying the Crests are a gift of the goddess passed down through nobility she allows the nobility of Fódlan to develop an abnormal sense entitlement as they believe their Crests are blessings from goddess herself. This system is what allowed corrupt nobles like Duke Aegir to rise to power, and ultimately diminish Ionius’s power making him helpless to stop the experimentation and consequential murder of his children. It also allowed Volkhard aka Thales to slip into the Imperial nobility and keep the empire under his thumb and gain influence over a decent portion of the Adrestian Empire. Thales would’ve never been able to accomplish all he did if the nobility system wasn’t so corrupt. The issue of corrupt nobility becomes even worse in the current era as it’s noted that Crests are starting to diminish and noble houses are desperately trying to keep their power. Even still despite the current system failing its still perpetuated by Rhea and the church’s teachings and due to the vast influence the church has it keeps things the way they are, as nobles can justify their rise to power as simply fullfilling the goddess will.

Fódlan’s History:

Now one of the biggest criticism towards Edelgard is her lack of understanding of Fódlan’s true history, but to be fair though it’s not like it’s her fault. Throughout her life she’s had a far more accurate understanding of Fódlan’s history than most characters in the game. I think it’s important to see this from her perspective. Ever since she was young she had been privy to important knowledge that had been intentionally hidden for thousands of years by Seiros and the church. Some things that were hidden like how the Ten Elites created the Heroes Relics, that the story about Nemesis Seiros was heavily altered, and more importantly that Fódlan had been secretly been led by The Immaculate One and her fellow children of the goddess. All that she knows is this monstrous creature in human skin had secretly been leading the world, altering history and stagnating humanity for over a thousand years with the Crest and nobility system and using the church as a front to do so. While Edelgard’s suspicions of why Rhea uses the church are wrong she is ultimately correct that Rhea was using the church as a front(she admits to such in her S support). Even as her time as Seiros she was trying to facilitate the rebirth of the Sothis which led her to conduct her “questionable” experiments to do so. I digress, a misconception is that Edelgard’s understanding of the history of Fodlan came from those who slither in the dark or that she was flat out lying to Byleth. It’s not either of those, Edelgard isn’t dumb enough to simply believe those who slither in the dark after all once she no longer needs their power she seeks to crush them, and after choosing Edelgard she’s always sincere about everything to Byleth. The real reason she is missing details is because her ancestor Wilhelm I (Wilhelm Paul Hresvelg) who had been allied with Seiros in the War of Heroes, passed down the true history of Fodlan to his successor and it went from emperor to emperor, so all sorts of details became lost due to practically being a huge game of telephone. Due to it being passed emperor to emperor it can be assumed that she received her information from her father. Considering her love for her father it’s no surprise she’d believe him and have no reason not to. Edelgard thinks she knows the true story of Fódlan already so it at least makes sense that she wouldn’t risk asking Rhea for the truth, considering she’s been hiding the truth for over a thousand years. Regardless of whether Edelgard is getting an A+ in history class, the thing she seeks to change is the Crest and nobility system as well as take down the corrupt Church of Seiros. By the end of every route these are all things that either get completely abolished, or revised in some way or form.

(I don’t imagine a hypothetical scenario where Edelgard confronts Rhea about the truth going well, Rhea always waited to the last possible moment to give the lore dump and in Golden Deer she’s rather hesitant to tell the truth despite the danger knocking on Fódlan’s door. I would not be suprised if she branded Edelgard a heretic)

Hopes for the world and Views on the Faith of the Goddess:

Edelgard wants to create a world of opportunity. One where people can rise to their position because they are best person for the job. One where all aspects of a person is taken into account instead of simply their status or whether they have a crest. As she says a world where people can rise, and fall by their own merits. A lot of character’s problems in the game has to do with their status as nobility, their crest and the misfortune it brings or the struggles they endure due to a lack of a crest. In Edelgard’s Fódlan people are free to pick their lot in life, if settle mediocrity so be it, and if they aim high they must be prepared to work tirelessly to achieve it. Edelgard simply believes in power of humanity. A lot of the characters in the game have this misconception that Edelgard seeks to create a world where only the strong survive, and a world without faith in the goddess. They have this believe that just because Edelgard seeks to crush the Church of Seiros, that she also seeks to get rid of the faith the goddess as well. That some people need their faith in of the goddess in order to get by and she’s essentially trampling over all those people. While it’s not exactly clear how she’d handle the faith in other routes as she ultimately is unsuccessful, in Edelgard’s route she makes it abundantly clear that she’s simply an enemy of the current church and not the faith. She even says this practically word for word against Rhea in Chapter 11 of Black Eagles.

Edelgard is what we call a Nay-theist. A fictional character in a fictional setting that has real gods and simply doesn’t believe that they need them. Edelgard is well aware that the goddess and children of the goddess existed and that she essentially established Fódlan, but she also believes that people shouldn’t put blind faith in that the goddess will take care of them. She thinks that people should take charge of their own lives. That being said she doesn’t seek to enforce this on people as recruited characters of devout faith like Mercedes and Marianne will comment on how Edelgard doesn’t discourage the prayer to the goddess. Her support with Manuela also shows that she is not above understanding the perspective of those who believe in the goddess.

Alliance with Thales:

(Check my reblog pls!!)

#fire emblem #fire emblem three houses #edelgard

369 notes · View notes

truetgirl · 4 years

Text

People love to hate Edelgard, but in doing so they drop a lot of context for what she was up against.

"She started a war!" Yes, but did we miss the part where her only stated objective was to destroy the church for it's many crimes, several of which you see firsthand? How she only makes plans to fight the other powers because she knows they will defend the church?

"She completely destroys the order of the world she lives in!" Also yes, but let's refer back to that world order's feature list. The church was exerting near dictatorial powers, including no-trial executions and the right to effectively wage war as they pleased, across multiple major powers in the name of so called peace, indoctrinating generation upon generation of young leaders and scholars, actively suppressing any technological advancement that had any potential to undermine their authority, and perpetuating a system of nobility that was actively harmful to all but the most fortunate members of the noble class. Sometimes the status quo needs to change and it usually resists violently.

"She worked with evil people to further her goals!" And she hated every minute. She did not work with them willingly. They sank their claws into her and the empire when she was just a child, if you remember. It is blatantly and constantly brought up how, as soon as she can, she plans to take them down.

Finally, "well why not just go Claude's way and try to peacefully open Fodlan to the rest of the world?" This is a great idea in theory. But the church, we find out in the DLC, is horrified of their total authority being eroded in any way. For example, they stomp on innovations in medicine for fear that their own healers will be rendered obsolete and thus the idea of the goddess being all-powerful could be weakened. That is one example from a book containing like 12. Bearing that kind of authoritarian behavior, you cannot possibly convince me that the church would have allowed Claude to do what he was trying to do. By definition of the effort they'd have known when he started trying to put it into action and come down on him with massive force.

Look, I'm not saying Edelgard is unambiguously correct in all she does. She isn't, nobody is in this game. That's kinda the point. I'm just trying to make the point that taken in context and with any critical thinking applied, her actions make a decent deal of sense. These things are meant to be moral questions. They're meant to challenge you to consider what you would tolerate in the name of what you believe is right and to even consider what that is. That's how stories like this work, especially in choice-driven games. At the end of the day, we all have to keep that in mind along with the fact that this is, in fact, a game. A story. A fiction. It isn't real. By all means engage with it, analyze it, discuss it, argue over it if you must. But remember that, with the occasional exception such as literal nazis, we're all just people engaging with something we love and we all deserve respect.

#this post went #all kinds of places #but i stand by everything i said here #fire emblem #fire emblem three houses #feth #edelgard #edelgard von hresvelg #kelly things

12 notes · View notes

fireemblems24 · 3 years

Note

I am so glad you pointed out the imperialist vibes Edelgard has sometimes. As someone who lives in a country who was basically occupied ahem conquered because they said "we have better ideas that will improve your lives" and had our culture absolutely shattered, one of the main reasons why I disagree with Edelgard so much is because of that. She thinks her point of view is superior and the most morally right and I really don't like it whenever she sounds so confused about people defending their homeland. Especially that one line she has with Dimitri in Chapter 17 ffffff—

Like, girl, they have the fucking right to disagree with you please stop sounding so confused as to why they can't see eye to eye with you gahhhhh

I would be more tolerant with the war if she had say, did diplomacy before it? But she tried to had Dimitri and Claude killed in Part I (the prologue). I would also understand her better if the war was a last resort and the other leaders were corrupt and all that. But they're not. Many of the students (who have power because many are noble heirs) outside her house are heavily affected by the nobility and Crests (Sylvain, Ingrid, Mercedes, Lysithea, etc.) or at least understanding of the problems caused by them (Dimitri). It's so frustrating how so much of this can be prevented if she just talked about it.

Also, to those who said she wants the change to be quick, even with war it won't be. The fucking war basically caused continent-wide damage. It's going to be so hard to actually fix this. Hell, there's definitely going to be an eventual rebellion by former Kingdom / Alliance people or sympathisers. It's not going to be as clean cut as the game or some pro-Edelgard people make it to be. Not everyone is going to agree with her, whether she takes over or not. She just destroyed the stability of the continent and while yes, she can rebuild it again, it will still take time and who's to say future leaders won't be corrupt? Also, a hierarchy will always exist, whether she likes it or not. Especially if she plans to set up a meritocracy. Meritocracy is going to usually end up giving power and privilege to those with already pre-existing privilege as they the opportunity to show off their merits or develop those skills. Poor and disabled people are going to have difficulty as they don't have equal opportunity to develop skills and accomplish stuff. I'm generalising, but it just ends up as a hierarchy, again. Not only that, it also has ways to enforce discrimination.

Basically, what I'm trying to say is, she needs to long term plan out her systems. I apologise since I have bad memory but as far as I remember, the game doesn't give us too many details on how she wants to establish her system. All I remember is she does the war > Church / Rhea out of power > Establish her government > ???. Someone please clear this up for me because I'm confused.

...and again really, diplomatic reforms are an option. Yes, they're much more tedious. Yes, they take so much more longer. Yes, sometimes it feels impossible to accomplish. But did she not even consider it as an option?

All in all, I do like Edelgard. But I really wish the game let us go against her while we're with her? I wish it wasn't just general "agree with Edelgard" for CF. I remember someone pointing it out to me before that it would've been really great if she had someone in her house who does the same role Felix does in AM... which is basically disagree and call out the lord's shit. And they pointed out Ferdinand could've probably been that character for CF. And I kinda agree? I really think CF would immensely improve if Edelgard had a challenger / foil to her beliefs similar to how Felix does that for Dimitri.

Anyway, sorry for the very long ask lol. I like Edelgard and I agree with some of her morals and ideals such as the crest system being bad but....she's done so dirty asdfghjkl. I do think she's written well enough to incite these emotions in me, and she makes for a good antagonist. As a protagonist lord however.... yeah.

First off, sorry it took so long to respond, but I wanted to give an equally throughout response.

While I haven’t gotten to chapter 17 yet, I can attest to the notion that Edelgard’s rhetoric is eerily similar to Imperialist propaganda. I do understand this is fiction, and that it’s okay to hand-wave/enjoy things in fiction that you shouldn’t or wouldn’t in real life. Crimson Flower has its charms and parts I enjoy. Edelgard is an interesting character more hampered by things that plague Three Houses as a whole than anything else, but it’s still worth examining how dangerous her rhetoric is. Because, unlike you, my country sits at the opposite end - the Imperialist nation selling that rhetoric to its citizens, and, unfortunately, at the time I bought it - which makes me really sensitive to this.

I’m from the US and I’m specifically speaking about the US’s invasion of the Middle East. I was in middle or high school, just barely a teenager, and naive and ignorant enough to believe what my leaders said. Because guess what? I bought into it out of misplaced and ignorant (and racist) compassion. I was horrified at the idea these people were suffering unfairly just because of where they were born whereas I got all these promised privileges just because of where I was born. I really thought the US would go in there and give them democracy and everything would be great. Looking back, I realize they were lying, that we’ve only made things worse, that it’s horribly racist to assume the US was just inherently better, and I’ve sense then gained access to fast-speed internet, traveled, matured, etc . . . and thankfully this all happened before I had any actual power to do anything like vote. But to this day I’m beyond pissed off they used my own compassion against me to line their own pockets. It was ignorant and racist, but it was all based in concern that others didn’t have the same quality of life I had and a growing realization of my own privilege. And that’s what I hate so much. It didn’t sound evil. It sounded good. It used people’s good will and compassion against them and twisted it into evil for their own causes.

I don’t think Edelgard is after Faerghus and the Alliance because she wants oil. I think she honestly thinks she’s doing good. And, if this were real life, I think that makes her rhetoric even more dangerous than a corrupt politicians’. Because everything else is still the same. She’s being ignorant, nationalist instead of racist in this case, and honestly thinks her moral superiority will improve everyone’s lives even if it means ravaging the entire content in war. She is dangerously naive and ignorant.

Maybe I’d support her more morally if I believed for an instant the general populace welcomed the changes she wants to bring, if the leaders she fought against weren’t open and wanting change themselves, ect . . . But the dialogue indicated her presence inspires people running and screaming in terror, not welcoming her presence (see the chapter where you kill Claude). The Kingdom is still fighting tooth and nail against her. She’s not supported. Her changes aren’t wanted. And she hasn’t bothered to learn a single thing about the cultures she’s determined to squash under her heal nor the leaders heading them.

I also think I’d support her better if we had a clearer idea of what her plans were. But CF has shifted from Edelgard speaking about interesting ideas and classism to evil dragon overlords and chastising Byleth for making her blush. The decision to side with her or Rhea is not choosing between two ideals, but an emotional, spur of the moment thing. Edelgard’s early supports with Byleth attempt to convince the player to side with her not based on political ideals, but on feeling sorry for her.

CF gives you no choice but to agree with everything Edelgard says (as you said, there’s no “Felix” or a “Lorenz”). It wants you to support her war without question, and therefore you don’t get any answers to questions like - if this is really just about Rhea, why are we invading the Alliance? Because they won’t hand power over to you? Why didn’t you just stick to the Empire to enact your changes? In the end, you’re left with what sounds more and more like an entitled Imperialistic princess with absolutely no idea how ignorant she is hell bent on conquering what she thinks belongs to her based on a conspiracy theory.

All that said, I do think Edelgard has interesting ideas and isn’t wholly wrong, just how she goes about it is horribly wrong. And I fully believe the core issue is how CF has dropped the ball big time writing wise, because diving deeper into her ideas and not her crush on you would go a long way. So would shifting the narrative away from evil boogey dragon lady must die and everyone else is wrong and I am superior and right and more towards a clashing of ideals, this route could’ve been a lot more and seemed a lot less ignorant, naive, entitled, and Imperialistic.

#fire emblem #Fire Emblem Three Houses #fire emblem 3 houses #fe16 #fe3h #edelgard discourse #just incase any of her fans don't want to see this #and have that tag blocked #because this doesn't paint a pretty picture of her

78 notes · View notes

lady-byleth · 5 years

Note

Do you have any points of Edelgard not being a fascist or racist? I don't like how people call her those things but I am not good at making arguments.

I do, sure!

Edelgard's goal is to free Fódlan from the influence of the Church of Seiros, an organization that is proven over and over again to manipulate information, reinforce class separation and rewrite history to benefit itself

The Church has more influence than the three governments, executes people without due process and Rhea has held this position for ages now, archbishop of a church dedicated to the worship of herself

Sure, Edelgard's methods are questionable but her ultimate goal is to remove the totalitarian regime of the church, destroy the oppressive class system that keeps the nobility that Rhea put in power herself right where it is while also limiting the chances of non nobles and Crest bearers and give freedom to choose their paths back to the people

In her solo ending we get this: "With tireless work and great sacrifice, she reformed the class system to ensure a free and independent society for all"

That alone already shows she's not fascist or racist as a fascist regime would put one class of people above the others and a racist ruler would put one or more races below the others

In Verdant Wind we also get Claude - the most opposed to violence and the one who openly says he wants to work against discrimination - who says that their goals are very similar but her methods are too bloody for him

Dimitri calls her for a meeting to see if they can't resolve the conflict peacefully, which she accepts, in which she says the cycle of the strong trampling the weak has to end, something Dimitri agrees with, and that's exactly what she does in her route

Yes, her methods are extreme but they're the methods of someone desperate, of someone who wants to change the world as quickly as possible

Under a united Adrestian rule she can change the system the fastest and even in other routes her destabilizing the power structure of Fódlan helps reform the system

Her methods work, they're not what the people want but they work and end up bettering the lives of everyone

Edelgard is neither fascist nor racist, she want to force change the only way she can think of for the benefit of all, even if it means making herself the villain

#fire emblem three houses #edelgard von hresvelg #three houses spoilers

165 notes · View notes

gascon-en-exil · 4 years

Note

How would you describe the three lords as leaders? Good? Bad? Etc.

That’s not an easy question to answer when there are so many ways to evaluate leaders. Even so:

Edelgard: She’s got charisma and a strong commanding presence, but...yeah, that’s about it. Being an “ends justify the means” type of leader doesn’t work so well when your means (allying with the people who tortured you and nobles you keep in power to destroy the church and conquer the continent) don’t align with your alleged ends (end Crest-based oppression and the system of nobility and also get back at the people who tortured you), all the more so when she’s known to lie to her allies to try to make this work. She commits war crimes and abets the war crimes of others killing an untold number of civilians in the process (many of them her own, like all those human shields in Enbarr), and on the flip side she has a perplexing irresponsible streak where she’ll put the war she started on hold for five years to go looking for her crush and spend the month before the beginning of the Kingdom invasion holed up in her room drawing pictures of said crush. Her planned meritocratic system still favors the nobility she claims to want to tear down, and if she has a replacement for the largest institution on the continent that she’s set out to wreck it’s a dystopian state-run affair.

Laid out that way it’s not too difficult to see why it might be easier to headcanon Edelgard as the charismatic figurehead being manipulated in different ways by Hubert and the Agarthans to achieve their ends. Similar to her preferred style of Leeroy Jenkins-ing in with a giant axe and murdering every dragon and sweet interracial gay couple she can find, she appears to lack the head for anything requiring a more delicate touch - not to mention she has horrible taste in allies. I assume she pushes the Agarthan problem onto Hubert in the postgame because she’s too busy looking forward to frolicking with her teacher to notice all the red flags he’s been putting up about just how evil he is for more than a decade.

Dimitri: He has an actual character arc - revolutionary concept, I know - so the answer depends on what point of his development he’s reached. In VW, SS, and the first half of AM Dimitri is not much of a leader at all; the AM army is fragmented into squabbling factions unsure of what their next move should be, and in VW it’s possessed instead of such a manic energy to invade the Empire that it’s crushed into nonexistence at Gronder along with its prince. In CF and later AM however Dimitri is easily the house leader most in touch with the needs of his people, from his sensitivity to the victims of war and the Crest system alike to his firsthand understanding of the lives of the poor through his time spent living in the slums. The Lions at their best are a powerful support network for Dimitri and for each other, and you see this in the way that they criticize their prince at his low points and how he actually listens to their advice and resolves to better himself - and that’s not even getting into the support lines. AM ending cards enact a variety of meaningful reforms including the restoration of Duscur, the de-emphasis of Crest-based inheritance in Faerghus culture, and the institution of a representative government. It’s also the only route that keeps the church and keeps it separate from the secular government (even in the Dimileth ending, theoretically), easily the most diplomatic resolution to that particular question as opposed to giving Byleth everything ever or else setting up a new church overseen by someone like Hubert of all people.

Also, Dimitri already became a folk hero during the timeskip, so it’s logical to conclude that he’d be a very popular ruler among the common people even before you factor in the dozen or so orphans that he adopts with his devoted husband and also the dozen or so other men who occupy the royal bedchamber from night to night. Future historians will do their damnedest to no homo the whole lot, but they’ll more than likely preserve the Savior King’s reputation for popular support.

Claude: The hardest to evaluate as a leader, because although his goals are far more consistent and ethically sound he’s arguably even more hands-off than Edelgard is. No one really knows Claude, not even Byleth at the end of the game; he never tells anyone in the game text that he’s from Almyra much less its prince, and he only drops his plan to smash the bottle on the Deer a few chapters from the end of the game at a time when there’s no apparent connection between that long-term goal and their immediate one of defeating the Empire. Of course the problem is that there really isn’t a connection apart from the knowledge that Edelgard would definitely not approve of opening the borders or sharing power with anyone, even the teacher who was never really “her” teacher in VW continuity. That’s a larger problem of Claude’s route being mostly a C+P of SS, but it’s still something that has to be reckoned with.

It’s undeniable though that he plays his cards very well, setting up Byleth to rule all of Fòdlan as a means of replacing the squabbling Alliance council that Claude considers so ineffective for governance. The Claudeleth ending seals the deal even better, as the two of them unite Almyra and Fòdlan under one dynasty which is more than anyone in all of FE16 (Rhea and Wilhelm included) could have ever claimed to do. That disconnect from his followers does come into play again though; Claude up and leaves the continent he’d just help save at the end of the game, leaving it to his allies to sort out, and we know from his Cyril supports that he’s probably not any more in tune with the needs and wants of the Almyran people even as he goes on to take their throne. We know from AM and even from his own route that the Alliance is no more than a stepping stone to Claude’s ambitions, and it’s not unreasonable to conclude the same of Almyra if the VW ending narration is anything to go by. He’s looking beyond the landmass to those across the sea, playing out his famous schemes with all the people he and his allies are ruling. It’s a similar problem as Edelgard’s leadership style, minus the heavy villainous draping.

#Fire Emblem #FE16 #Fire Emblem Three Houses

27 notes · View notes