#this isnt just about the discourse btw i just feel like this constantly and this is just kinda pushing those feelings over the edge | Explore Tumblr Posts and Blogs

dyketubbo · 3 years

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EDIT (10/7/21, og post made in August)

editing this post since apparently people are still finding it but anyways while im not going to take the post down because i personally just dont like deleting posts and i still agree with some of the things said id prefer that if you find this post that you just. didnt interact with it, at least not if youre not going to be respectful. this post is from august, before the clip of phil saying hes fine w qpr hcs (even if i have complicated feelings on that clip, i dont want to risk getting into discourse about this shit again).

it started a giant discussion and got me people harassing me and talking behind my back, one person even telling me people had groups talking about me, it got me being called arophobic, anti-polyam, claimed i was calling people racist and misogynistic, i got told i didnt have friends, i had people vague me and misinterpret what i said and meant, and through it all i had a total of maybe two or three people at most that disagreed with me and were respectful about it. everyone else that disagreed either resorted to vaguing me (or others that stood by me) or they insulted me to my face (in some cases insulting me then blocking me so i couldnt respond).

many of these people were adults. i had recently turned 16 the month before. i dont mean to pull the whole "oo im a minor and neurodivergent" card but the shit that came from this post, that had at the time barely even reached over 500 notes at the discourse's height, genuinely made me relapse in a way that i just. couldnt handle. i was on meds, i took care of my pets, i distracted myself, i talked to my friends, even talked to my therapist, and it didnt help because every time i came back i found another person giving me shit for it. one of my friends tried to defend me and got people targeting them, insulting them and saying increasingly concerning things about me, and they had to leave the fandom for a bit because of it.

i dont trust a good portion of the fandom because of this mess. i dont trust a lot of big blogs or aeduo fans or techno fans or phil fans because of this. its genuinely concerning to me that a post like this caused harassment, even in places i havent seen, maybe even to people i havent seen. even if this post is still vaguely accurate to how i feel about the situation (mainly, how i feel about it all overshadowing kristin and phils relationship) and i still stand by my idea that qprs count as shipping and that because they arent strictly platonic for many people that i cant be comfortable with qp aeduo, i just. dont want people interacting with this, at least not unless you just want to spread the info in this edit or because you want to say something respectfully. otherwise, i just. want this to be left behind me. even to this day i still get paranoia spikes and nearly panic remembering everything that happened because of this post, and being reminded of it just. sucks. if you want to clear anything up feel free to contact me in some way, but if you see this in the tags while browsing somehow, sorry for the long post, and thank you if you read all of this. have a good day

End of Edit (all text below unedited from when the post was originally made)

btw since kristins been confirmed to be canon multiple times over the past like few months and philza has expressed discomfort with shipping content that isnt him and his literal wife can we as a fandom agree to fucking quit it with treating c!emeraldduo as anything other than friends/family ^^ thatd be great. and yes i mean even the fuckin "platonic" marriage shit, even qpr hcs, just let them be friends.

please god stop acting as if a m/m relationship is inherently better than a m/f relationship especially considering how fuckin shittily the fandom treats kristin already, constantly making her out to be some skinny white girl instead of the fat woc she is. just like. let c!emeraldduo be besties, let c!phil and c!kristin be in a happy marriage, quit going against the cc boundaries because you prefer to ship two average white dudes rather than just accept that ones canonically married to the self-insert of his actor's wife. yall all about minorities until ones actually involved and then suddenly its all about your precious white cishet dudes. my god.

#the marriage/qpr stuff was already ehhh bc again. boundaries. but now its just even worse bc kristin is literally canon to the smp #philza #technoblade #emeraldduo #kristin trixtin #mumza #dsmp #discourse #mask mews #tags after this are edited in #negative #long post #ask to tag

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deathgod-ben · 3 years

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guess these anons aren't in the same fandom im in lmao bc i constantly see racism just like,, "casually" existing all the time in stuff like fics especially. esp w the characters of color are never allowed to have their own stories? like diego and ben are only ever there to be supporting characters that take care of klaus, and allison is only ever there to be a supporting character taking care of vanya and its just,,, really gross? and like, whether ppl do it intentionally or not, if your ranking allison diego and ben at the bottom of your list, that's still smth you should be asking yourself about and being critical of. and god don't even talk to me abt lila, patch, and raymond getting ignored constantly. if u don't wanna start discourse feel free to delete this btw but i just wanted to say i totally agree

NO LIKE FR 100% AGREE

I think a lot of people have one image of racism, like the one we often see in movements like Black lives matter, Stop Asian hate and so on. Which is a correct image, but they're so many other different racism too.

How Ben, Diego and Allison are written as supporting characters for their white siblings is a perfect example. THEY ARE SO MUCH MORE. I dont even read so much tua fanfic because of this reason.

I'll forever be made for what this fandom did to Lila. We have this badass southasian woman, but the fans tore her apart. Like, isnt characters like hers that is usually loved by the fandom? Oh no, wait, she isnt white so ofc we gonna hate on her.

Like, not saying the characters of color are perfect and innocent, because they are humans too. They make mistakes, they have flaws. But fans do be making them the worst character to ever exist every time one of them do something bad, especially if it's against one of the white characters.

Yes, this is 100% meant to Vanya and Klaus fans. Like, do people remember Vanya fans eating up Allison for rumoring her at the age of 5???? (idk maybe not five BUT SHE WAS A KID THEN and their dad made her do it) but when Vanya killed Pogo and cut Allison throat, suddenly Vanya is this innocent missunderstood sweet baby. Or how Klaus fans were ignoring how Klaus never let Ben talk to his own siblings and comparing him to their abusive dad, but suddenly when Ben said or did something against Klaus, he was a monster. (yes we talking about fandom racism but I hope people see some parallel to real life how children of color, especially black children are forced into adulthood earlier meanwhile white people always get turned into some misunderstood young person even though they're 30 years old)

Like characters of color can never be a complex character, the same way white characters can, and it's so freaking annoying and racist.

And oh, watch how the fandom forgets Patch and Raymond the second we enter season 3 (it did forget Patch) but forever remember Vanya's country wifey (I honestly forget her name)

#:)))))#hella rant maybe but like bro Im real bad at formulating myself but the point is racism bad racist fans annoying #asks #tua #ben hargreeves #allison hargreeves #Diego hargreeves #I hope the racist yt fans dont find this post #shitpost #idk if I made it clear but I tag all of my post as shitpost #fandom racism

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shoezuki · 3 years

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(long convo ahead. I just had to get this off my chest and officially begin my unbothered life. I love your blog btw)

being in this community for so long now, I've realised that not giving one single fuck for the opinions of others and just enjoying what you love, is truly the way to go. constantly reading threads/posts/tweets about how this cc is cringe, or they used to be problematic, or whatever dumb reason they can come up with, really brought down my mental health and constantly made me feel guilty just for watching a cc's streams/videos. and now I realize, I came into this community for the cc, NOT for the opinions of people who haven't touched grass in over a year and are proving that through their impulsive responses.

tldr; unless a cc did something really fucked up, I'm gonna enjoy who I wanna enjoy, and I'm done living off of the expectations of people who wont give a shit about me and are more concerned over their performative brownie points rather than committing to actions that will benefit real issues in the world without feeling the need to drag others into it to watch.

Anon u are Absolutely So Fucking Right. Like. Yea i argue and bring up shit a lot because i love drama but im in the same boat.

A lot of the shit is performative and has no genuine weight. Theres a HUGE difference between someone saying poor taste tweets years ago, and some dude with genuine racist ideologies or horrific shit they done. But theres thos feeling that you Have to engage with drama like shit shit in order to 'be aware' or understanding which Is Good but..... it doesnt matter so much?

Theres NO requirement to this shit like. You can jus watch the dude n talk bout him and his videos without touching on the tweets or old shit brought up at all. Its become this feeling that in order to watch content from some ccs you need to like. Argue why and Justify your own interests. And its p fucked up

Theres no harm in not engaging or even lookin into this bullshit. Honestly its better NOT to. Watching videos and streams and enjoying content isnt Bad. Its not like youre doing anything wrong or horrible. Literally. We're here cuz we like the content some people put out. Fandom should be secondary to that, including drama and discourse.

Youre just. Absolutely fuckin right. This shit weighs nothin to what we could put this energy to instead and its jus a waste of time

#this sound hypocritical of meh odvskssvussvd #but YEA.... YEA I GET U FUCK THEM PPL #anon #discourse

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therewas-a-girl · 7 years

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Ppl thinking oliver queen would have been better - liked/treated/his issues better respected - by fandom, if he had been a woman has me laughing at the… is it called paradox? Blatant nontruth of the statement?

Here are some easy examples of how this is not so:

Laurel lance (lol most heatedly hated character of arrow for a myriad for reasons, at least half of them sexist bullshit the other ¼ shipper bullshit; had some shit writing which is always taken as a character trait and for which SHE is blamed for; had a depression arc, is an addict, after all the times shes been kidnapped abused and beaten probably has some form of lingering effect from all the… u know… trauma + the emotional upheaval that has been her life for the last 10 years. And yet - still loathed and her issues are negated and belittled at every turn. Always misinterpreted, rarely afforded the luxury of viewer empathy; favorite fandom strawoman usually)

Sara lance (ptsd from all the fucked up shit the league put her through amd that she went through before that, which was very visible when she was on arrow. Probably dealt with some for of sexual harassment/threats of violence/violence when she was on the Amazo, which we never explicitly saw thank god. A good portion of Olicity fans dispise her cause ship reasons, same with lauriver fans. Who is the REAL black canary discourse is still going strong btw, which inevitably generates hate on either of the lance sisters side. Saras bisexuality is constantly erased or denied or treated as sth tintillating for the straight male gaze; she is slutshamed at every corner; ppl hardly can be bothered to remember that she was actually suicidal at one point, that she thought she was not worthy of love or capable of love or of being with someone - HUGE CHARACTER MOMENT HERE - when she broke up with oliver usually dismissed/forgotten cause felicity walks in the room so most of the olicity fandom - big portion of arrow fandom - 9 times out of 10 doesnt bother to remember that sara was talking about herself here)

- yes shipper tendencies matter, they shape character perceptions.

Bonus: thea queen (neglected by her mother, abused physically and emotionally by her monster father, has some serious issues with violence, probably ptsd-related avoidance for it, the mask, her old life. Has utterly detatched from a whole side of her personality and history, something that was intrinsic to her for 2 years, and yet nobody sees that as eyebrow-raising worthy for some reason cause that is what a tots normal person would do. The almost oliver-like split of the sides of her life/personality is mentione…. how many times in fandom? The metas are where? Maybe ive just missed them. Okay. Oh i almost forgot - was stabbed and just about died. But she got over that, right? Which has nothing to do with the bloodlust, by the way. Thats from the Pit. Trauma outlasts the bloodlust. And yet whenever she displays behaviour that is consistent with some kind of post-traumautic symptoms/behaviour… she is bitchy or ungrateful or whiny or being a child again. Literally do not know how to go on with this one)

Extra bonus: felicity smoak. How much felicity’s trauma was aknowleged = she has all kinds of traumatic shit happen to her, including but not limited to near-death experinces, and yet the effect this had on her is nearly nonexistent in big fandom spaces. Sunshine felicity yay! Supporting and taking care of oliver. Yay. Always the light to guide his way. Untarnished. Y. A. Y. (Feel my burning enthusiasm for this interpretation. But thats my preference and of no consequence here.) And the moment it was “officially” aknowleged that a ptsd arc would be explored with her (which is, imo, still a euphemism, or a gross misusage of this very serious illness /that they cant be bothered to portray right on a woman/) - the same ppl that say ‘olivers mental illness is disrespected cause he is male’ were all about (paraphrasing here) “olivers LONG LASTING and X YEAR LONG ptsd is as valid as felicitys NEWLY CONCOCTED/FRESHLY CREATED ptsd” …somehow managing to insult the both of them and imply that the years one lives with an illness give u a sort of precedence and ‘elder card’ in the club. ‘Empathy should go first HERE where its mooore…’ more what? I just dont know how to continue this. needed? Valid? I dont know man. I mean, by works of logic the obvious non-truth of the beginning statement of this post is encapsulated by this last example. But lets be thorough.

Look there are layers. Olivers character deals with shit writing sometimes and horrifying demonisation of his mental illness FROM THE WRITERS OF HIS OWN SHOW. And there is a shitton of ableism in fandom about him.

But if he’d been a woman… my dude… my guy… my pal…. experience shows fandom generally, not as separate ppl but as a block unit, (fandom currents? Fandom tendencies?) have *lower* empathy for women and their narratives (e.i. a lot **less** 29596k word metas about why he does the things he does, trying to explain away the writing holes would be floating around). Lower patience for their fuckups. Lower imagination for their inner lives and even lower willingness to search them out. The show itself would have a lower interest in exploring these issues, as they have shown it to be the tendency with female characters.

Oliver queen is human, he fucks up, he has a deep inner life and his trauma has far reaching shockwaves. All those are characteristics we assume him to have, as default, cause hes a WHITE MALE presented as straight. Who has to contend with bullshit ableism, sure, and fandome expectations colored by toxic masculinity, which canon doesnt even support. But he would have faaaar more prejudices to contend with if he were female. All those assumptions - of hidden logical reasons, depths, triggers etc - up there wouldnt even go halfway if hed been a woman, or not white or, god forbit, a woman of color.

(Dude can u imagine the shitstorm of slutshaming that would hit a female!oliver for sleeping with a *fraction* of the number of ppl oliver has slept with??? In canon he has always had emotional ties or reasons for sleeping with every single one of his partners whether fandom likes it or not, and STILL he is called a manwhore, as if he only thinks with his dick. Even oliver isnt afforded brains and emotions when it comes to sexual agency. It baffles me.

But im willing to bet that it would be worse if he were a woman because the reason for dumbing him down would go from ‘i want to belittle all these other relationships he has so that THIS ONE SHIP shines thru’, to straight up sexism and womens agency over their bodies and emotions. Case in point ppl were calling felicity a plethora of disgusting epithets for sleeping with ray (ONE MAN) when she was a FREE BEING WITH AN INDEPENDENT WILL tied to !!!nobody but herself!!!, just cause she didnt plant olivers name on her ladyparts from the moment she first saw him. (Lets also admit that shipper reasons are present here too but the difference is that in olivers case, his sexing up other ppl lowers olicity’s value cause hes not devoted enough and whatnot. In felicitys case, her sexing up other ppl lowers *felicity’s* ‘value’ because… do i rly need to explain why here? Hint - It ties back to the ‘pure felicity oliver’s light’ argument and the dehumanization of her character by making her the literal object of olivers salvation and therefore nullifying/ridiculing her choices if they make her path deviate from olivers.) Ppl are saying Laurel would be betraying tommys memory by loving oliver still - TOMMYS MEMORY. a man whos been dead for *four years* matters more than a live womans feelings. Just… christ…)

#personal #negativity #pure vitriol yes #ps: my personal stance is and will always be that all issues of everyone involved in an interaction are always valid #and they will always explain to u the reasosn for these actions #but these reasons - mental illness. abandonment. neglect all of them - will never justify the wreckage #a characyer or ppl cause #mentaly ill ppl are as responsable for the hurt they deal out as evetybody else and there are differnet ways to adapt to #each other when both or three pll or a family is made up of fucked up individuals #but in the end as long as the discussion progresses in a way that shows that wveryone matters #its gonna be okay #this is to say that i will never fu king stan for amy character ever because i have see it time and again that it blinds ppl #to the humnity of other characters and just overall doesnt make for a good writing or researching tecnique #it throws everyoing far out of balance #but i will alwas write for ppl whose stories are never told. because what is the point of not doing so #and seriously this post is pure wank #im not bitter. i say bitterly. with a bitter expression.

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