#he's an antagonist in harley quinn at least

[batmanisagatewaydrug]

obvsly not a rogue but idk when ill get to say it. despite being a jim gordon fucker i wouldnt touch harley quinn show jim with a ten foot pole. also even if we tried i dont think we’d go anywhere before he started crying

I appreciate your honesty

#least fuckable batman villains #sort of? #he's an antagonist in harley quinn at least

[tyrantisterror]

I think one of the things that gets lost in the big, endless internet conversation about whether or not heroes should kill their villains is the fact that killing villains off robs you of a lot of story-telling potential. The Joker died at the end of his debut story in Batman - imagine what Batman would be if he stayed dead. No Joker in Batman 66, no The Killing Joke which means no Barbara Gordon as Oracle and no The Dark Knight, no Mark Hamill Joker episodes of BTAS (so many of them were based on his comic appearances, after all - the laughing fish is a direct adaptation of a comic), which means no Harley Quinn and no Return of the Joker, on and on it goes.

Like, you can argue the morality of heroes sparing their villains till you turn blue - god knows this site does it at least a thousand times a day - but on a purely pragmatic story-telling level, the minute you kill ANY character, you kill all the story potential they had. And yeah, it's fiction, you can bring them back from the dead if you really need them, but that's a pretty hard story beat to pull off without hurting your story. You don't want to fill your tale with "Somehow, Palpatine has returned" moments.

And you can just make new villains, sure, but again you have a problem with that - a new villain has to establish themselves and has to stand out from who came before, which means you can't go directly to the storylines you could have had with a villain who stuck around AFTER their introduction. A recurring villain is capable of doing things that one-off villains can't.

I'm going to illustrate this with a character from a fandom I'm not even a part of - I never played the Ratchet and Clank series and am only vaguely aware of it, but one day I saw a supercut of scenes starring one of its recurring villains, Dr. Nefarious, on twitter, and I was like "Oh shit, that's the guy who plays Quark on Deep Space Nine, isn't? This guys a hoot, let's see if we can find more clips on youtube." Which brought me to this hefty video here from one of the more recent games in the series.

And, like, as a person who "doesn't even go here," it's obvious this goofy little fucker has a history. His opening scenes have him ranting about how much it sucks to lose repeatedly - a lampshade on the "flaw" of a recurring villain, i.e. that their threat diminishes the more they come back because, by the nature of their role in the story, it means they've suffered a lot of losses. So how cool is it that as this supercut chugs along you can clearly see this is a theme of the game - that this is a story about the virtue of losing, a story that is enriched by having an antagonist who fans of the series know has lost a LOT?

The true antagonist is an alternate version of Dr. Nefarious who's won every fight in his life so far, apparently with little effort, and I love how they differ on a design aspect. They're both technically mad scientists, but notably, Emperor Nefarious, the winner, has a more imposing and "heroic" build, but a smaller brain-dome for his robot brains. Because winning may make him look strong, but if a mad scientist's real power is their mind, well, which Nefarious is really the strong one here then?

Dr. Nefarious gets this juicy arc about realizing the virtue in his repeated failures that corresponds with the heroic characters struggling to find a way to win against a seemingly invincible opponent, as well as contrasts the true villain, Dr. Nefarious's explicit counterpart and foil Emperor Nefarious, who has never once lost and is a total piece of shit for it. Again, not my fandom, I don't go here, not an expert on Ratchet and Clank, but even as a relative stranger to it who's just watching a big supercut, I fucking love this. This is an excellent story.

And it's one you can only tell with a recurring villain. Without Dr. Nefarious, this story works significantly less. You need a villain with a history the audience has seen to really sell this.

Anyway, I made this post because, ironically enough, I saw another tweet talking about how some fans think Dr. Nefarious should have been killed off in his first appearance, and, like... that's just fucking baffling to me, as a person outside this fandom looking in. Recurring villains deserve more love, man, they give us so much.

#Youtube

[maniacwatchestheworld]

A quick guide to recent Harvey Dent media for new fans (aka Misha stans)

So you've recently become interested in the character of Harvey Dent. Who can say why. Maybe you're interested in getting into comics and he happens to be the one character that's caught your fancy. Maybe you're here because you've been watching this recent TV show and are curious to know more about this one adult guy in the main cast. He seems like a cool guy! Though let's be honest. You're probably a Misha stan who got into Gotham Knights because your boi is in it. Regardless of why you're here, maybe you're looking at this character and wondering what's come out with him lately and if you should check it out! So here! For your viewing/reading pleasure, a quick run-down on Harvey's most recent appearances and where you can expect to see him!

This post is very long, so strap in kiddos!

Gotham Knights

You're likely here because you've been watching this one, so I'll keep this brief. In this latest TV show, Batman has died and was revealed to be Bruce Wayne. A bunch of kids are the top suspects and are being accused by Gotham District Attorney, Harvey Dent. The kids now need to work together to prove their innocence and find the real killer.

I don't plan on watching this show, but Harvey Dent is being played by Misha Collins of Supernatural fame in this one, and it promises to really dive into Harvey's backstory. As of writing this, only the first episode is out, but what we have so far looks entertaining and has been well received by the Misha stans at least. Reviews more generally do seem pretty lukewarm on it though. I can't speak to its quality, but hopefully it's a promising start to what will hopefully be a good portrayal of the character! Who knows what'll happen!?

The Harley Quinn Show

This show is currently in between seasons, and I don't know when it's coming back. It's a show that focuses on Harley Quinn as she tries to become a top villain in Gotham. The first season is her trying to gain respect from the Legion of Doom after breaking up with the Joker. The second season is based off of the "No Man's Land" event that happened in the Batman and related comics in the 90's or something in which the American government decided to give up on Gotham after a disaster, and so Gotham's top kingpins took over the city. Season 2 focuses on Harley's efforts to kill off each of the 5 villains (The Penguin, The Riddler, Mr. Freeze, Two-Face, and Bane) that have risen to power in Gotham. Season 3 sees Harley not really wanting to pursue villainy anymore as she starts being in a relationship with Poison Ivy.

It's a fun show. Pretty funny, incredibly violent, and very gay! If you want to see a sympathetic Two-Face, this is NOT the place to find it! In this series, Two-Face sticks pretty true to his name and is a lying, backstabbing asshole through and through! But hey! The fact that he isn't dead yet when they've had every opportunity to kill him off could mean that they might have something fun planned for him in the future! Hard to say though. In any case, here's his latest appearance in the show as of the writing of this:

The Joker's wife almost takes a tire iron to his face and I love that for her lol. Two-Face a supreme asshole in this show. But he definitely does have lots of chances to be pretty funny. I think that he still has potential for development and storylines, but thus far he's been pretty one-note. It feels like a DAMN SHAME to not use Two-Face more given the direction that this show is taking, so I have hopes that they'll do something interesting with him soon. (Harley became Bruce's therapist and so the show may take a turn for more interpersonal character drama with psychology thrown in over superhero junk. Feels like a wasted opportunity to not capitalize on Harvey's storied mental health issues for that!) But for now, he's a great antagonist to Harley (and everyone, really), fun to watch for how much of an asshole he is, but isn't much more than that.

Task Force Z

So you've heard of the Suicide Squad before, right? Basically a lot of supervillains join a government taskforce to go on missions that no one else would take. They do the kind of dirty work that superheroes could do, but for whatever reason don't. And the villains that participate in this program get lessened sentences in exchange for their service on these missions. Yeah. So take that... But now it's with zombies. Undead Suicide Squad!

So in this comic, Two-Face recruits Jason Todd (who was formerly one of Batman's Robins but who now has the superhero identity of the Red Hood) to be the field leader of this special undead Suicide Squad taskforce. They have a way of bringing people back from the dead, so instead of getting lessened prison time, the supervillains participating in this program get another chance at life.

I've only read the first issue of this series so far, but I do honestly like what I've read so far. The series is over now, and it's recently been collected into 2 volumes, so it should be pretty easy to find to buy if you so wish! (I've also found both volumes at my local library too!) When it comes to Harvey in this series, honestly, the relationship between him and Jason seems to be a big highlight! Which honestly makes sense. They're both men who have made a lot of mistakes and want to be better. Both have violent pasts, have killed people, and struggle with being on the side of the angels, but are doing what they can to do what's right. If they work together, maybe they can finally be the good guys! Also Jason Todd is probably Harvey's favorite Robin since he's Robin #2, let's be honest. Too bad they're terrible at their jobs! The impression that I get is that their team is constantly dying because Harvey and Jason are both dumbasses and bad at their jobs. Thankfully they can bring their team back to life pretty easily, but they keep sucking at their jobs! The vibe I get from Harvey and Jason's relationship in this series is basically...

Harvey: Are you winning, son!? :D Jason: I fucking hate you, Dent! Harvey: ... I guess that's an improvement over, 'asshole' ... Little steps...

But hey. They're trying their best lol.

Here's the first thing with Harvey in it that I saw in the Task Force Z tag:

[Source]

(You see in the next panel that Harvey got Jason orange juice. Isn't Harvey such a dad!?) And honestly, if that doesn't make you smile just a little, this series probably isn't for you.

Honestly, this series just seems to be having fun with it and a good time. It doesn't seem to take itself very seriously, and that's perfectly good with me! If that's good with you, maybe check it out!

Batman: the Audio Adventures

So this is a podcast. It's currently on a break as of the writing of this. Season 2 came out, and at the end of season 2, it said that it would be returning in part 2 so like... On the one hand, it ended on a cliffhanger. On the other AHHHHHHHHHHH! So I hear that a part 2 is coming out but WHEN!? If you decide to pick this one up, just know that more is supposed to be coming, we just don't know when.

So the story for this... It's Batman but a podcast. What more needs to be said? But it is a very quality podcast! I've listened to a decent number of podcasts in my time, and this may just be the best podcast I've had the pleasure of listening to! It's funny, it's dramatic, it's well-acted, it has spectacular music, it's moody, the characters are well-written... It's just a delight all around! It's on the same level of quality as audio dramas that I've actually had to pay money to listen to, but for free on Spotify or YouTube or other places you get podcasts! And this may contain my favorite iteration of Two-Face and Harvey Dent.

The Audio Adventures somehow manages to make Harvey a character that you're simultaneously afraid of and afraid for! Harvey and his Associate are horrifically violent, and yet you can't help but to feel bad for Harvey. To my knowledge, they really capture the OCD experience well. You can really feel how much their compulsions control Harvey and how much he wishes he didn't have to be like this. His life is fully out of his control and he well and truly can't help himself. And his Associate just isn't helping. This is an iteration of Two-Face in which he has Dissociative Identity Disorder, has him be a villain, and yet somehow manages to not inherently demonize DID. Harvey's Associate is a welcome addition to the cast, and for once isn't someone that they're trying to get rid of! Harvey is simply tragic in this podcast, but is also immensely intelligent, and the way he bounces off of his Associate is just captivating to listen to.

If you like BruHarvey, or just want to see a piece of media that really zooms in on the tragedy of his character, this is a great one to go with! In terms of BruHarvey, there are some moments in season 2 that are choice. Just. Chef's kiss!

Here's a monologue that Harvey and his Associate have together about shoulder angels and devils. It doesn't have much of anything to do with what Harvey's going through in this season, but it does capture their characters well.

They are absolutely unhinged, and I gotta say that I love that about them <3

The Doom that Came to Gotham

This animated film came out like... Within this last month. I haven't gotten the chance to watch it yet and I don't know that I will because it contains a LOT of upsetting things! It's Batman, but with eldritch horror! This is an Elseworld's story. This film is basically an H.P. Lovecraft-style AU for Batman. So it takes place sometime in the 1920's, and Harvey Dent is running for Mayor of Gotham. And then lots of terrible things happen and before you know it, demons from another dimension are going through a flesh portal to Gotham to kill everyone. This is NOT a happy story from what I've heard!

If you want to see Harvey just... Suffering SO much, then this is the film for you! Congrats! Apparently it also has a handful of good BruHarvey moments in it though, so at least have that.

For a preview... Here! Just have Harvey crying! I feel like that's a pretty appropriate preview!

Batman (comic series)

So... In the current Batman comic book arc, Bruce Wayne has apparently gotten himself sent to an alternate universe where Batman was never really a thing (Bruce died young or something). And so now Gotham is controlled by a cabal of villains, led by Red Mask, Catwoman, and others including a drugged up and YOLKED Judge-esque Harvey Dent! Sounds like Gotham has become a pretty crappy police state that uses the Scarecrow's Fear Toxin and a police force drugged up on Bane Venom to keep people in line and send dissenters to the sewer. Bruce meets up with the local resistance and becomes Batman for them... Also Commissioner Gordon is a talking skeleton for some reason... >.>

I don't read the Batman comic series, so I can't personally speak to the quality of this current arc, but I've heard that it's been good! From multiple sources! Just not in regards to Harvey lol! Honestly, this Harvey looks a bit... Boring. Interesting idea, but the execution is looking kinda... Ehhhhh. Speaking of execution, in this, Harvey really isn't Two-Face. He seems to be taking after an idea that Batman: the Animated Series introduced of a Judge vigilante that murders people that he deems as guilty of crimes! :D I like the Judge and want to see them do more interesting things with him! Too bad that this might not be it... >.< But hey! If you want a 'roided up Harvey... For some reason... Here you go!

[Source]

An image of Bruce choking Harvey out because this is what their friendship is all about. u.u (Also Bruce calling Harvey a big boy just tickles me!)

Also Harvey does seem to recognize Bruce in this universe and is quite bothered by how a man has seemingly come back from the dead to kick his ass! So there is some implication here that Harvey and Bruce were still friends of some kind in this universe.

I'm not reading this one, but hey! If this AU idea sounds interesting to you, go ahead and check it out!

Detective Comics

So last but certainly not least, you have the comic series for which the company is named. Now this I actually have been reading! And let me just say, it's quality! Great stuff going on here! Basically they decided to make an Opera-esque Batman story. This current arc is titled, "Gotham Nocturne" and to put the story in as simple of a manner as I can... So the Arkhams (who built Arkham Asylum) descended from the Orgham family which are very powerful foreign dignitaries of some sort. The Orghams have come to Gotham City to gentrify the place to their liking so that they can rule over it unopposed. They are doing this through mind control brain demons, sentient songs, and are just generally trying to burn Gotham City to the ground right now, especially the poorer neighborhoods. Also Bruce is feeling old and has a bat demon from another dimension living in his brain right now. Also Harvey's been GREAT in this story so far!

So when you get a comic book, there will sometimes be a second, shorter story packed in with the main story that you bought the comic for towards the back of the book hence the term "Back-Up Features". Often these stories are unrelated to the main one, but in this case, the stories they've been telling in these back-up features relates to the events of the main one. And so Harvey and Two-Face got their own little story in the back-up features... And that story was excellent! Basically, Harvey has been forced into serving the Orghams against his will and is not very happy about it at all. He has no choice. If he tries to resist the Orghams, the brain demon that they gave him would melt his brain. But Two-Face is not effected by this brain demon and can do whatever he wants... Now if only Harvey would let him have control of the body... This story does a great job of unpacking Harvey and Two-Face's tense history together, and really gets at the heart of their conflict which ultimately culminates in them deciding to try and work together instead of against each other. And honestly, it's simply a wonderful story that addresses their plurality and shows that Harvey and Two-Face are important to each other and in fact need one another! In this story, their plurality isn't an issue that needs to be cured. It's a blessing in disguise and allows them to do things that no one else could! It's a deeply plural story that simply could not be told with a singlet and is everything that I want out of a Two-Face story! You can tell that this story cares deeply for plural people and wants to do them justice! It's a story that rejects the idea that Harvey should strive to live his life as close to a singlet as he can and embraces his plurality, saying that Two-Face isn't someone who deserves to be eradicated, but rather is a person that deserves to be understood and loved as much as any other human being!

[Source]

This story has so much LOVE for plural people and the individuals that they share their system with. And I genuinely hope that they feel it. It's wonderful and a Two-Face story like none other that has been created thus far for him... And that's a damn shame. It's a shame that there aren't more stories like this. And therefore it's a story that you should read! And this is just the back-up story! There's more good stuff in the main story! Two-Face killed a goddamn werewolf in the main story! :D

[Source] (That guy he shoots is a werewolf, trust me.)

And we're still in only the FIRST act of this Batman opera! We have a LONG way to go until the end of this story, and it promises to be incredible if the quality keeps up!

Sadly, Harvey may have departed from the story for now. After Two-Face saved Batman in the images above, and got Bruce fixed up a bit, Two-Face basically threatened Batman, telling him to leave them alone and that if he tries curing Harvey ever again, that he'll torture and kill everyone Bruce loves and then himself, and then he exited stage left. But hopefully he'll turn up again in the story! I hope he does at least! If he doesn't I'll be real sad and upset!

-

And so there you have it! Some of Harvey Dent's most recent appearances and where you can find some of the most recent stories he's in! Even if you don't end up checking any of these out, hey! At least now you know where you can look into the character a little more and know a little of what's going on in the Batman universe right now!

#harvey dent #two-face #misha collins #misha #gotham knights cw #cw gotham knights #two face #twoface #the harley quinn show #harley quinn show #harley quinn series #task force z #batman: the audio adventures #batman the audio adventures #batman audio adventures #btaa #the doom that came to gotham #batman #batman comics #detective comics comics #detective comics #dc comics #the bat-man of gotham #gotham nocturne #a tale of three halves #long post

[paragonrobits]

today's thought experiment; applying some of the principles to creating charismatic over the top classic villains can be applied to creating protagonists by just taking the basic idea and applying it a viewpoint character or someone the author intends to be a hero.

In particular, let's look at the concept of the BACKSTORY.

So, backstories are a surprisingly finnicky thing. A lot of store is presently put by the backstory, to the point that they're considered character defining; as an example of how this can be done well, Magneto was originally not characterized as having a particularly notable backstory, and it certainly didn't inform his character as a standard villain with mutant supremacism at the core of his character; it was not until he was written by Chris Claremont that he was imagined as having survived the Holocaust as a child, which has an obvious wealth of resulting implications on his viewpoint, fears and overall motives, both in terms of defining his antagonistic perspectives ('My people will never suffer again, no matter what I must do to ensure it') AND his heroic depictions ('NO ONE shall suffer as I did').

But at the same time, enough backstory can lock a character down and make them feel more limited, or at least prevent you from characterizing them as freely as you could if they didn't definitely HAVE that back story; if you establish Character A as having been from a wealthy family fallen on hard times and you establish a very specific character history and the precise details of how they fell and the structure of that family, its excellent material but it also prevents you from bringing up any ideas that would contradict it. And if you think later on that Character A works better as having always lived a poor and struggling life, obviously that's not an option without retcons or really wacky plot twists that are functionally ALSO retcons.

So, here is my radical point; unless the backstory DIRECTLY feeds into the character's core motivations and direct impact on a specific plot, a backstory isn't strictly necessary.

Among other things, I've found that what's important for a character is what they do in the HERE AND NOW; in the present events of the story they're in. A backstory doesn't have to really exist for them, and I've found it helps just as much to keep it minimalist to inform their character without having too much to limit potential concepts in the future.

Now, this feeds back into the villain archetype mentioned before; they rarely have any real backstory, and this allows them to enact a kind of unfettered charisma that isn't held back by bagagge. Of note, just about EVERY SINGLE classic Disney villain beloved for being fun antagonists has been given a backstory of some kind to justify their attitudes in remakes, and almost without exception EVERY SINGLE one of them fell flat.

People didn't like these reimaginings. The backstories, meant to recontextualize their actions, made those villains lose the over the top charisma that made them so compelling to begin with.

So, therein lies my proposal; flip the script and apply that same premise to your heroes! Do very little with their backstory and make it vague, or even just a few sentences worth, JUST enough to contextualize their general perspective.

You may also consider going the full mile and having your characters initially start out as villains, but who at some point changed their ways. (An example of how this might work, I would suggest looking at Steven Universe's Peridot, the more heroic depictions of Magneto, and the versions of Harley Quinn present in the Injustice setting; these are characters defined by being protagonists, but initially started out as villains whose characterizations wound up inverting.) On that note, I would also suggest inverting this former villain's characterization to give an impression of having them go full circle; as Peridot started out as a cold and callous person with a very subdued characterization, she wound up becoming a high energy and very empathetic person who is by FAR one of the most hammy and dramatic character in a show where people generally show deep feeling by bursting into song. Magneto also surprisingly is an example, despite his original characterization generally not being considered canonical for the most part; old school Magneto of the Lee/Kirby era was a very hammy and dramatic villain in the style of Doctor Doom; ranting on how his MIGHTY POWER will defeat the puny humans and those foolish X-MEN.

Whereas now, Magneto is still very dramatic, but completely inverted; his drama is cold and filled with gravitas, barely speaking above a level tone, and even this threats are calm, even with a faint hint of joviality; when he tortures a woman who has been having the homeless population abducted and converted into killer cyborgs to kill mutants in premeptive defense of human kind, Magneto indicates his intentions by simply giving a gentle smile and saying "Ah, but I CAN make you talk, with this," and reveals a small floating paperclip.

(This final thought might also lean into people liking villains; instead of bending your favorite villains out of shape to justify their actions and attitudes as secretly being the true heroes all along, why not go the extra mile and write your heroes with the same kind of energy you'd give for villains, but legitimately being good? And of course, writing your heroes as former villains who came full circle!)

#how to write #suggestions #writing #villains

[distort-opia]

Honestly the only thing DC could do that would really shock me and get me invested in reading comics again, is if after "Batman/Joker: Deadly Duo", the writers give Joker a full blown redemption arc and then have him be a solidly good character for at least an entire decade. It worked with Venom in Marvel comics, so why not?

Ngl, I'd also be very shocked if they tried to redeem Joker. Not because it's actually impossible, but because Joker is such an iconic villain for DC, and this kind of thing might detract from that and make him less popular for a specific fandom demographic. And then you have the side of DC fandom (more on Tumblr and Twitter) that absolutely hates Joker; they'd likely revolt if DC gave Joker a genuine redemption story. After all, look at what happened to Kylo Ren :)) But leaving that aside, DC has elevated Joker (if that's the right word) to such an Evil status that they can just slide him in whatever story requires someone to do Something Horrible and Unspeakable To Cause Drama -- and his usefulness in this department might be too valuable to dillute.

And also, I guess they went a bit this route already? With Batman: White Knight (my beloathed) and The Harley Quinn Show. Even though the version of Joker in these stories is not... actually comic-book Joker, he still got redemption arcs in them, and recently. Don't know if DC would want to bring this to the main continuity; but I'll admit, I'm squinting suspiciously at the fact they supposedly revealed Joker's real name, and Joker: The Man Who Stopped Laughing. Maybe they have something interesting in store regarding Joker's character. Showing him conflicted or struggling with depression would be great, it would deepen his current portrayal a lot more. They haven't done that in a while. I guess we'll have to wait and see how they depict Joker in Batman/Joker: Deadly Duo and The Man Who Stopped Laughing especially... that'll give a better indication of the direction they're taking him in.

...To be fully honest though, I personally don't want Joker to be redeemed and made a good guy. He works best as a villain. There's a lot of problems with his current portrayal, but if they managed to fix that and give him more depth, I think he should keep being Batman's main antagonist. Thing is, if Batman can't ever stop being Batman, Joker should not stop being Joker. Sure, showing Joker struggle with who he is and what he wants would be great (much like they do with Bruce), but just like they never let Bruce choose anything else but Batman, Joker should not veer off his own path either. They're fated to be enemies, despite the... at-this-point-kinda-canon soulmate aspect.

#then there's the fact that #Joker is narratively the inversion of Batman #he's Batman's negative. he's where all the horrible things Bruce doesn't ever do go #The Batman Who Laughs is enough indication of what Bruce could become #Joker very much helps in balancing Bruce's potential darkness just by existing and being the villain #if he got redeemed... who'd serve this function for Batman anymore? #idk. the way Batman as a character is constructed requires a character like Joker. a shadow #taking it away would leave the dynamic unbalanced. there's a reason Batman and Joker are seen as a dual protagonist a lot of the time #aaanyway. this is all obviously just my preference and opinion #I do hope these comics are good and you return to comics Anon! #asks #batman #joker #joker meta

[theperfectlong]

Gotham knights news

GOTHAM KNIGHTS NEWS MOVIE

GOTHAM KNIGHTS NEWS SERIES

"Batman's Gotham Knights Was Spotted Filming All Over Toronto & Here's Where". " Gotham Knights: Rahart Adams Joins The CW's DC Pilot". "The CW's Gotham Knights Adds All American Alum". "Misha Collins Eyes CW Return, Joins Gotham Knights Pilot as Harvey Dent". "The CW's Gotham Knights Casts Trio of Lead Roles". " Gotham Knights CW Pilot Casts Fallon Smythe, Tyler DiChiara (Exclusive)".

GOTHAM KNIGHTS NEWS SERIES

" 'Gotham Knights': First Trailer For CW Series Sets Up Batman's Murder". " 'Gotham Knights', 'Walker: Independence' & 'The Winchesters' Picked Up To Series By the CW". " Walker: Independence, The Winchesters & Gotham Knights Land Pilot Orders At The CW". "Gotham Knights is the next Batman game (without Batman)". " Batwoman Team to Develop Gotham Knights Series at CW".

^ a b c Otterson, James (December 13, 2021).

The first trailer was released on May 31, 2022, to a mostly negative response. Filming įilming for the pilot episode began in April 2022 throughout the streets of Toronto. In April, Rahart Adams was cast as Brody. Anna Lore also joined the cast, portraying Stephanie Brown. In March 2022, Oscar Morgan, Fallon Smythe, Tyler DiChiara, Olivia Rose Keegan, and Navia Robinson were cast for the pilot shortly afterward, and Misha Collins revealed that he would portray Harvey Dent. The series is scheduled to premiere in 2023. In May 2022, The CW picked up Gotham Knights to series. In February 2022, The CW ordered a pilot episode to evaluate. The similarly titled video game also takes place in a post-Bruce Wayne Gotham and also features the Court of Owls as antagonists, but the projects are unrelated. The series is currently being written by Natalie Abrams, James Stoteraux, and Chad Fiveash, all of whom also serve as executive producers with Greg Berlanti, Sarah Schechter, and David Madden through Berlanti Productions. In December 2021, it was reported that a television series adaptation was in development at The CW.

Anna Lore as Stephanie Brown, the Cluemaster's daughter.

Olivia Rose Keegan as Duela Dent, the Joker's daughter.

Tyler DiChiara as Cullen Row, the brother of Harper.

Oscar Morgan as Turner Hayes, Bruce Wayne's adopted son.

At least the Harley Quinn show is still going.In the wake of Bruce Wayne's death, his rebellious adopted son Turner Hayes forges an unlikely alliance with the children of Batman's enemies when they are all framed for the murder and attempt to clear their names.

GOTHAM KNIGHTS NEWS MOVIE

Discovery’s recent implosion, including the cancelation of a Batgirl movie with next to no notice to anyone working on it. In other DC news, the comic company’s extended universe has been hit in a few ways during Warner Bros. While the villains trailer showcases a lot of the interesting story elements, its existing in a space between story-driven action game and live-service game has been a point of hesitation for some folks like Fanbyte Intern Charles Harte, who wrote about the issue right here. The game is cooperative, so up to four players can play as Nightwing, Batgirl, Robin, and Red Hood. Gotham Knights takes place in a continuity where Batman is gone and only the kids of the Bat Family are around to protect Gotham.

Batman Voice Actor Thanks Fans For Supporting His DC Pride Story.

The DC Fans Who Flew a Plane Over Warner Bros.

Hopefully, DC Films’ New Ten-Year Plan Will Be Better Than Previous Promises.

#Gotham knights news

[bisexualpeacemaker]

i just think that it's so crazy that peacemaker hbo managed to create such a compelling narrative out of such an unlikely character. like, it would have been easy to go for a spin-off with a character like harley quinn or blood sport - actors we all know and love, characters who are compelling and already established as the good guys. if anything i might even have expected them to resurrect rick flag, a fan favorite, and give him his own show or a prequel.

but instead they chose Chris, who is without a doubt the least sympathetic and most annoying character in the Suicide Squad. we don't like him. he kills a character we do like, and makes himself into a pretty malicious figure. there's nothing about him that really seems compelling.

but for the story they wanted to tell, there's no one else they could have picked. chris is a character who is deeply hurt by personal and societal trauma (the trauma of growing up in an abusive, toxic, racist household; the trauma of the violence that he's seen trying to live up to his father's expectations; the trauma of growing up as a queer man in a conservative small town; the trauma inflicted on men by forcing them to live with toxic masculinity), and his background makes his views extremely problematic. but he is fundamentally a good person who wants to do better, and he is given the chance to do that not only in the bigger moments in the show (like his reaction to goff's offer) but also in smaller moments with characters like Leota and Economos, who he hurts through insensitive or malicious comments and then he has to own up to those actions and do better.

the thesis of the show is that we can change when we open ourselves up to people and their diverse experiences, and that using the "greater good" to excuse violence (which we see in the antagonists like Waller and Auggie as well) will always fall flat. Chris learns this through developing relationships that matter to him and realizing that his mission doesn't matter if he can't protect the people he cares about. and idk it's just amazing that we are getting that kind of nuance from this show about john cena and his pet eagle killing aliens

#i made this blog so i could ramble about peacemaker and by god that's what i'm going to do #i love this show so much smh #john cena... what have you done to me #peacemaker #peacemaker hbo #meta

[reddtea]

Comicbook women

I don't know why but women in most mediums don't really feel all that interesting as characters compared to male characters and I feel like this is more so the case in comics.

As the female in stories are just never really as compelling, such as love interests they can be kinda bland or pretty quickly summed up. It's possible that I just haven't really been up to date with following those kinds of characters or they've never really been my favorite. When I look at characters like Harley Quinn as they've been churned out, I feel like whatever depth she had, to begin with, has been stripped down to "hot mess badass clown lady" like if her story is about the joker's abuse it seems like it's a passing footnote of her backstory now, she was just always crazy and kickass. I think these characters come in 3 flavors: - villian that can fuck/flirt with the hero and it's not gay - love interest - There you have a female role model will you stop bugging us about it now? With flavor 1 villian that can fuck/flirt with the hero and it's not gay, I think that if your other characters seem better fleshed out and intriguing, with better chemistry or potential for banter or angst, that's how gay pairings just seem more interesting than whatever lady love interest they throw in there. Like I can see batmanxjoker or batmanxharvey being more intriguing plot relationships than Selina or Talia, just as they are, or even Harley or poison ivy. If we want to pair Bruce with a clown who's more interesting Joker or Harley? I think Joker-like they're both toxic and half the time writers are saying they're just made for each other. Poison Ivy? she's probably her least interesting when she's trying to seduce Bruce.

I feel like this archetype is just made for the "step on me dommy mommy" fetish or "let's stick the dick in crazy" and not much else. I don't know if it's because of stock melodrama that's just dulled the appeal of straight pairings or the completely borderline toxic behavior from it, that those stories just don't stick or feel genuine as a legit interesting romantic option. flavor 2 love interest, it generally seems like this character is usually an accessory. If the male hero is with a lady love, you know there's no way you can call them gay no sir no homo here so don't try to pair him with any of the guys because he's already with someone. This is the case that the female love interest is not really a character other than she's pretty and the main man likes her for some nondistinct reason (she's nice). What's her name or general disposition towards the male main character? I dunno doesn't matter, does he care about her? of course! why like who even is she? uhh... These characters if they serve a plot are usually fridged or baby mamas and then fridged because parents must be executed unless they can serve as an antagonist or be the bad abusive parent. I feel like Talia is done the greatest disservice here, where she just exists to give context to why Damian is a very skilled fighter and not just a normal kid and her character gets further assassinated so Bruce can be the better parent without lifting a finger. As if you can't be the bad parent if mom is a murderer training a little murderer that you use in your fight against crime, just because the little gremlin came pre-trained he'll be alright on his own you don't need to interact with it, the kid's a killer and that ain't on you. flavor 3, There you have a female role model will you stop bugging us about it now? this includes basically a gender-bent what would have been a dude character, but this is more of a character that just "I'm badass too and I don't need no man" character. I personally find them to be really bland like they just hate guys because they're strong and independent and not much else because all we're looking for is an empowering female character, not an interesting one. This character to me feels like the equivalent of slamming two action figures together until one of them breaks, but one of the action figures is traded out for a barbie. Like it's not bad because it's barbie and she's pretty, it's bad because it's still boring.

I'm not more excited for the outcome of the fight because the power level is now over 9000 and I'm not any more impressed because a woman is the one who wields the power of over 9000. These characters because they're so strong and more importantly independent don't feel like they have any bearings with everyone else around them, if they die no one in the universe would really mourn them other than maybe losing a strong team member (which would be unlikely for them to die because they're the only female representation and women would riot or the team comp becomes a full sausage fest with no, assumed completely necessary, sex appeal for the straight male audience to enjoy, maybe it's a loss for lesbians too but I don't know how real the thirst is for you guys) and if someone else dies around them it's a 50/50 chance that they let out a singular tear and then move on. This is applicable to boring too manly to care about anybody male characters, this just makes a boring character.

All in all, I'm not calling for more female characters, or more female writers (You can be female and still suck at writing). This isn't about a sexy lamp test or negative or lack of diverse representation. These characters are just boring. I'm fine with 1 to 3 characters like this male or female, it's just weird that for female characters I need to wrack my brain for characters that aren't just 1 or 2 of these flavors. I think the only extra secret flavor of the female character is the "need to take care of the baby" which is just the damsel trope, which is not even a bad trope so I don't really count it. The only character I can think of that isn't one of the aforementioned flavors is from more recent kid shows because you can't sell sex in those

#woman #dc comics #comics #marvel comics #feminist #women #rant post

[ordinaryschmuck]

Top 20 BEST Animated Series of the 2010s-Honorable Mentions

And now. 

What is hands down.

The Best.

Animated series.

In the 2010s.

Is…

Going to be revealed tomorrow because I'm a piece of s**t (I’ll change the title when enough people fall for it). For now, here are some quick honorable mentions that aren't bad, but just not as good as the shows I picked...in my opinion, at least.

Craig of the Creek (2018-)-From what I've seen from season one, this show is pretty charming. It understands the pure imagination that comes from being a kid and has moments when these characters are more human than cartoons. But it also has the same energy as a Beach City episode in Steven Universe, and as we discussed, not everybody is going to be into that. Plus, I haven't caught up past season one (due to just not having the time), so it wouldn't be fair to claim it's one of the best when I haven't seen how seasons two and three hold. I've heard from other people that it's good, so I'll be willing to take their word for it. And maybe you should too.

Milo Murphy's Law (2016-2019)-I've seen a handful of episodes of this show, but from what I saw, I'd say it's worth watching further. The idea of this kid, who's cursed to literally have the worst life ever, deciding to have an optimistic outlook of the hand he's been dealt is pretty admirable. Plus, Weird Al Yankovic voices the main character. I can't physically hate it. Although the ginormous issue that Milo Murphy's Law has is that it relies too much on Phineas and Ferb's recognizability. I get that both shows were created by the same people, and I'd be more than fine if there were just a few shout outs and references. But the creators decided to force one of the characters in Phineas and Ferb into Milo's Murphy's Law, making it sort of a spin-off series on top of being its own separate thing. Meaning that you don't have to watch Phineas and Ferb beforehand, but you do need to know who these characters are going in. And if you're wondering how that paradoxical concept works...I couldn't tell you. I haven't seen the show in its entirety, and from what I have seen, it's at least good enough for an honorable mention.

The Avengers: Earth Mightiest Heroes (2010-2013)-There's nothing wrong with this series. The designs are great, the representation of these iconic characters is even better, and the level of quality is on par with the Marvel Cinematic Universe...I just always forget that this show exists. No offense to the series, but I just prefer shows that I'll remember instead of shows that I'll forget in another ten years.

Young Justice (2010-)-And before you start making the audacious claim that I'm a DC fanboy, let it be clear that Young Justice is an honorable mention for similar reasons. I love the character designs, and I think the representation is on point. Plus, while it does not have MCU levels of quality, Young Justice matches up with the good DC movies. It's just forgettable...and also because I never got the chance to watch the third season yet. Instead, I wasted my limited time with an HBOmax subscription on watching Doom Patrol, Harley Quinn, and my favorite Doctor Who episodes. Don't judge me!

Harley Quinn (2019-)-And seeing how I mentioned it, Harley Quinn is a fantastic show with perfect satire. And like some of the best satirical writings, this show has a deep understanding of the source material that it's making fun of while still providing an excellent story at the same time. However, most jokes die quick, and the animation is just flat out garbage at times. I recommend it, but keep in mind that there's a reason why it's just an honorable mention.

Rise of the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (2018-2020)-I know I kind of trashed it with my Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (2012) review, but the truth is that I really love this show. Or, at least, I want to love this show. Because there is something amazing and worthwhile that’s hidden under a gigantic pile of poor planning and network meddling. I plan to make a full review for it in the future, so I'll save my thoughts for when that comes. For now, just know that it's something worthwhile if you're the right person.

Amphibia (2019-)-Aaaaaaand it's the same thing here. There's a lot that I like about it, but the stuff I don't makes it hard to enjoy. I'll also do a full review on this one in the future, so you're just going to have to wait...again.

Tangled: The Animated Series (2017-2020)-Another show that I really liked and even considered putting on the list. Even wrote a review and everything. But looking back, the parts that it did wrong highly outweighed what it does right, and honestly, it was a toss-up between this and Star V.S. the Forces of Evil for what took twentieth place. I ultimately went with Star V.S. because at least it had villains that were actually intriguing and terrifying characters. Unlike a specific antagonist with blue hair who was so idiotic and insane that I honestly would have felt nothing if they died in the end...I know that I just made a ton of enemies with that statement, but I don't give a s**t. And if you're nice, I might rewrite my review so I can accurately explain why this series is a tad bit overrated.

The Looney Tunes Show (2011-2014)-... I liked it...other people didn't, but I liked it.

Hilda (2018-)-Because I haven't seen season two yet. That's why. And from what I've seen in season one, this show is incredibly charming, beautifully imaginative, and is absolutely something I would show to my children if I ever have any. Maybe it forces in drama when it doesn't need to, but overall, you can better believe that this would have made the list if I saw season two before I started ranking shows.

And those are my honorable mentions. I’ll see you tomorrow for the actual unveiling of the number one spot. And for the fandoms that I ticked off...be patient.

(Also, let this be a lesson to read the tags before clicking 'Keep Reading.' Unless that's what you did, in which case, BOY, do I have egg on my face.

#top 20 of 2010s #craig of the creek #milo murphy's law #the avengers earths mightiest heroes #young justice #harley quinn #rise of the teenage mutant ninja turtles #amphibia #tangled the animated series #the looney tunes show #hilda #what i thought about #quick thoughts

[aros001]

Going in blind: Watching season 4 for the first time. Random thoughts.

I never said anything about it before but I love Shadow Weaver's DCAU Batman eyes. They're so expressive.

Episode 1: Okay...I wasn't expecting Catra to do that. I mean, it makes sense. If she has leverage over Hordak then she's basically in charge of the Horde and that's what she's wanted (or at least believes she wants) since episode 1. It's an aspect that made her a good antagonist, that she's not blind to the evil of the Horde, she just doesn't care as long as she herself is secure. Which naturally begs the question, when the rebellion and the princesses are crushed, when the Horde is on top, when Adora is dead, when Catra finally has everything she's ever wanted...will she actually finally be happy? Somehow, I have my doubts.

I definitely feel for Glimmer in this. When you go through as big a loss as she did you need to be able to feel and vent if you're ever going to get through it. It doesn't have to be right away but everyone doing everything in their power to avoid the topic entirely can make you feel like you're going crazy. It'a especially bad for her since it unintentionally makes it feel like everyone is acting like it doesn't matter that Angela is gone when it clearly means everything to Glimmer.

Episode 2: I actually had a potted cactus plant once. Accidentally forgot about it and left it outside for an entire winter. Once the snow was gone the cactus looked like it had melted.

I kind of want to see what an interaction between Double Trouble and Clayface from the Harley Quinn animated series would look like. I'm guess Catra was just testing how good Double Trouble was as a doppelganger because it doesn't seem like she did anything while Adora was being distracted, though I suppose that could be a reveal in a later episode.

Not much to say except that I love how buff Huntara is while still clearly being a woman. Like, women can have a variety of different body types, as this series and Steven Universe show, and Huntara's build isn't just, like, Bow's body with lipstick and ponytail and the animators calling it a day. No, she looks like a freakin' jacked adult woman.

Episode 3: I didn't figure out the Flutterina = Double Trouble twist until a minute before it was revealed, so good job there. Before that I was wondering if Flutterina was some fan's original character where they won some contest where their OC got to be in the show for an episode. She was giving off some weird self-insert vibes. That twist made it all work though. It's honestly not a bad plan. Shapeshifters haven't really been a thing in the series before now so there's no reason to suspect it. Even if they did they'd probably be expecting it by way of magic or technology, while Double Trouble's seems to be a natural ability.

I like that even though Bow is definitely the goofier one of the trio he is still consistently shown as competent. That's never in question. He was very heroic and reassuring to the villagers this episode. I get why those kids idolize him so much.

Catra's having guilt over what she did with the portal and to Entrapta and her response is basically to just double-down. She doesn't know any other way to be. Not going to lie, I am kind of hoping we get another moment in the show where Adora just completely overwhelms Catra with the sheer power of She-Ra. I'm not saying like brutalize her or anything but just something where Catra is made to realize just how powerful Adora is and that she could just destroy Catra if she had a mind to do so.

Episode 4: Well, I was saying I wanted Adora to do it but I guess I don't mind Glimmer being the one to get some good shots in on Catra. Like I predicted, Shadow Weaver's moving in to become her teacher like she was with her father. Honestly I like that that was more Adora's problem than Glimmer using her as bait, which she seemed to get over pretty quick. Yeah, it was kind of a heartless thing to do but it was an understandable tactic and she clearly outright told Adora that she did it and why afterwards, which at least means she's still being honest.

It occurs to me that Glimmer and Catra may be the ones running parallel right now. Both are basically leading their respective sides of the war. They both have lost someone very important to them. And both are trusting someone they probably shouldn't. Both even have outfits that've been updated in the intro. The difference is Glimmer's just trying to deal with a bad situation while Catra's is entirely self-inflicted.

Minor thing but I like Glimmer's new outfit this season. I'm sure this is the intention but it makes her look older and more mature. A little more muscular in some shots too.

Episode 5: Heart of Etheria project. No idea what that is but assumedly whoever's a part of it doesn't like Light Hope and Mara being friends. Sounds like it's very much interested in She-Ra being just a warrior, and perhaps a tool, for the greater good. It does make me wonder though how much Light Hope remember from when she was rebooting. Even if she deleted the Mara memory she could potentially still have the memory of her and Adora watching the Mara memory, as well as Adora asking to be her friend.

Episode 6: Yep. Scorpia; definitely favorite supporting character. There is something kind of funny about her whole "Scorpions are loyal" line when you remember the story about the Frog and the Scorpion, where it stings the frog despite it meaning death for itself as well simply because that is its nature. But finally we're having someone go save Entrapta, and I can only assume at some point Scorpia's going to access the power of the Black Garnet.

The parallels between Catra and Hordak are definitely at their max here with that speech of hers to him. She's basically trying to convince herself that she doesn't need anyone, the timing of which is appropriate since she just drove away Scorpia and now truly doesn't have anyone. Not that I blame Scorpia, obviously. Like Adora before her, however good you believe someone can be and that you can help them, at some point you just have to cut the toxic people out of your life. You have the right to be happy too.

And man, Bow is just the best. He saw something was wrong between Adora and Glimmer and defused the situation like (snap) that, pushing them to talk like any sane person would.

Episode 7: I'm sure it is just because I've seen way too many TV shows and movies (both animated and live action) that don't do it but it is just such a relief to have a show where the characters just TALK and LISTEN to each other. It doesn't solve all their issues but they're at least not being stupid and freakin' petty. It helps the drama feel a lot less forced and contrived.

Episode 8: A little bit of amusement in Bow thinking at first that Glimmer and Adora didn't even notice he was gone despite them coming to his rescue very shortly afterwards, given Catra is only now realizing Scorpia has left and assumedly she did so a while ago. Bow and Sea Hawk hadn't been gone for that long so it's not unreasonable Glimmer and Adora wouldn't be worried about their absence (Bow was literally talking about "me time" when they last saw him), while Catra is only noticing Scorpia's absence now and it was because she wanted something. Like Scorpia said, she's a bad friend.

Kind of ironic given that a lot of Catra's issues are the direct result of Shadow Weaver giving her very little love growing up but it does seem this tough love is probably what'll get through to Catra the best. She might finally stop making bad decisions and lashing out if she's forced to live with the consequences of them, like Adora told her last season.

Glimmer gets a bit of slack from me since she suffered through a huge loss, that being her mother, and then was immediately thrown into being queen right after. It'd be hard for anyone to be 100% on their game and well-adjusted in a situation like that, and I buy that she was on some level resentful of Adora for coming back instead of her mother, even if unintentionally so. What definitely helps is that Glimmer very clearly and immediately regretted what she said to Adora. Like Catra she's lashing out but unlike Catra Glimmer recognizes some of the damage she's doing and knows, at least in this case, that she went too far.

Episode 9: Now that I can see the design in color I definitely prefer Mara's She-Ra with pants to Adora's She-Ra with shorts. Honestly, while the differences are pretty minor, I do think Mara's She-Ra design is overall a lot better than Adora's. Sharper shoulder guards. Bigger cape (especially the cape, I love capes). I don't know, there's just a lot that clicks with it and I wouldn't mind Adora getting a similar outfit later.

Madam Razz definitely had a Yoda feel this episode. I was very much expecting her to start wacking Mara with a stick over the sugar like Yoda did with R2. Though while that was Yoda acting crazy, for Razz it's because she experiences time out of order, and I don't think I've ever seen that concept taken to this extent, or at least done this way before. There are characters like River Song from Doctor Who, Professor Paradox from Ben 10, or even the Reverse-Flash who interact with other characters in time out of order but those characters are still on a linear path from their own perspective, even when travelling through time. Razz is just bouncing around her own timeline, seemingly not even any real reason or cause to it like Subaru from Re:Zero. Clearly she's not just remembering things oddly because her talk about things of the present are heard by people in the past and have an effect. I wonder if maybe the reason why is because Razz was at ground zero of Mara's actions and this is a side-effect of pulling Etheria away from the rest of the universe.

Bringing more Star Wars into this, it basically sounds like the Heart of Etheria project has turned Etheria into a magic Starkiller Base; storing power that'll be unleashed to destroy whole planets. And jeez, I think this was the first time I really felt creeped out by Light Hope when she was talking to Mara.

I'm looking forward to seeing what it means that the First Ones only made the sword and that Etheria made She-Ra. If that's the case, why is only the sword able to bring out the She-Ra form? Is it like MCU Thor's hammer and the weapon was just meant to help him control the power he already had? Or is what we think is She-Ra not actually She-Ra and that form that Adora and Mara take is just a stand-in for the real thing?

Episode 10: It didn't even occur to me until now but Double Trouble's capture is another blow to Catra's circle of "friends" too. They were at least able to make her laugh. One less person for her to talk to and just...really just distract her from her thoughts.

It's a good dilemma this episode presents about what to do with the Heart of Etheria. The safest and probably best option is to just dismantle it, like Adora and Bow want, since it could easily lead to the destruction of the entire planet if it goes off. Not the mention there's so little they know about it and what it was intended for and the one person who can potentially tell them, Light Hope, they were warned not to trust. But it's not hard to understand where Glimmer is coming from in wanting to use that power to fight the Horde. They're already losing the war and now she knows Hordak Prime and his FAR more powerful forces are on the way. Tapping into the Heart is a huge risk but she's not seeing any other paths for the rebels to win. It's a really good dilemma, with good arguments presented from both sides, and I buy this widening the schism between Adora and Glimmer.

Episode 11: I have mixed feelings on King Micah still being alive. On the one hand there's a lot of good potential interactions we can now have with him, primarily between Glimmer and Shadow Weaver, and he is a fun character. But on the other I can't help but wonder if this kind of lessens the impact of what Angela gave up to overcome the false reality. Part of what made it so emotional was that she had to accept the person she loved was dead and not coming back...except now we see that he wasn't dead and now he is coming back. Yeah, their family lost out on years together and that does still carry some emotional weight but I was already also half-expecting Angela to come back later in the series because she's stuck between dimensions, meaning there's a chance she could still be alive. If both Glimmer's parents come back then that really feels like it takes a lot of weight out of her story. But I guess we'll see what happens.

Also, why did the Horde exile him to Beast Island? Why not just kill him?!

Episode 12: So the Horde exiles Micah to Beast Island instead of killing him. The First Ones protect their secrets by sending their bad tech to Beast Island. Does no one know how to just destroy things in this world?

Ohhh, I am so looking forward to next episode. While it's debatable whether Glimmer should be going through with her plan she is at least being smart with how she's going about it. Double Trouble was being paid by Catra to work for the Horde, not out of any sense of loyalty. Glimmer has the resources of Bright Moon at her disposal so it's reasonable she could pay them more to switch sides. Double Trouble was very good at sabotaging even a group as tight-nit as the heroes, so Hordak and Catra are probably easy pickings with all their issues.

Episode 13: ....WELL THAT AIN'T GOOD!

I'll admit, I had a little bit of an unintended laugh. After all we've heard about Horde Prime, like this shadowy all-powerful monster, I wasn't expecting the fabulous flowing dreadlocks and smoothness. Credit where it's due, man has charisma and charm, which goes a long way in helping your big evil world conqueror not be a very flat character, because it's doubtful he's going to have the same kind of sympathetic motivation as Hordak or complexity as Catra to keep him elevated.

LOVE, LOVE, LOVE Double Trouble kicking at Catra while she's down. Adora and Scorpia were honest but they never wanted to hurt Catra. Not so much with Double Trouble and they just shove reality into her face. Everyone leaves Catra because of Catra. She's the common factor. It's her fault and no one else's. Again, I don't know for certain if Adora and Catra get together at the end (Catra would have a LOT to make amends for regardless) but Double Trouble was definitely implying Catra had feelings for her with the way they put Catra's hand on "Adora's" cheek while talking about how she left her.

I like that we see Glimmer's plan actually working at first. The princesses get a massive power boost and decimate the Horde forces. But the minute it starts going wrong she immediately admits Adora was right and she tries to stop the energy flow. I imagine having her there with Catra was intentional by the writers. Despite some parallels, Glimmer can actually accept her failures and work to try and fix things. Unlike Catra, she didn't blame Adora for things going wrong.

So the sword allows the First Ones to control She-Ra and the energy she'd be absorbing from the planet. Assumedly that means there are at least some parts to She-Ra that have nothing to do with the First Ones and thus maybe Adora can still use some of those powers without the sword.

Season 4 verdict: Yeah, the show keeps getting better, though I will admit last season's finale had me more emotional, but that's a bit of an unfair comparison given everything that happened in that finale vs. this one. This is definitely the series hitting its darkest hour, where it feels like EVERYONE lost. Not just the rebels but the Horde as well. The sword and Light Hope are gone and She-Ra (for now) along with them. Glimmer and Catra are basically prisoners. Hordak's probably going to have his personality stripped away. The Fright Zone is in ruins. The only one who's gained anything is Prime.

Really looking forward to what the final season has in store, especially since there seems to be the implication that Catra just saved Glimmer's life.

Original Reddit post: https://www.reddit.com/r/PrincessesOfPower/comments/o1j5gk/going_in_blind_watching_season_4_for_the_first/

#she ra #she ra spop #random thoughts #reddit repost

[palmett-hoes]

Hi, I really loved your post with the monsters as Birds of Prey! Was wondering if you had any thoughts on the Foxes as Marvel or Mcu characters? I feel like I could see Dan as Carol Danvers and Andrew for sure is Jessica Jones, idk about the rest.

oh wow old post!!

haha unfortunately i’m not really a comics person so i don’t feel like i can really give the best analysis possible, but i have seen most of the mcu movies and bits and pieces of the netflix show so i’ll try my best. also im using dc characters too bc i want to

1. Dan: I think your instinct with Dan as Captain Marvel is spot-on (at least uhhh,, based on the movie lol sorry comics ppl). Her direct, forceful powers and fighting style are definitely reminiscent of dan’s no-nonsense leadership approach. similarly the themes of overcoming sexism and acceling in a male-dominated industry in the captain marvel movie is pretty much the same as dan’s story establishing herself as the first female exy captain (tho sports is way more valid than the military). plus there’s a lot of emphasis on love and friendship between women that dan is ALL about. also lashana lynch would be a god tier dan wilds fc. Dan could also def have that lawful good Okoye from Black Panther energy. Loyal, disciplined, no-nonsense leader. no powers except discipline. no hair. also danai gurira in 2012 with the dreads and the sword and the cape on TWD was definitely part of my middle school sexual awakening

2. Kevin: Aquaman. this is based pretty much exclusively on the fact that jason momoa is my #1 kevin fc and also that Pasifika kevin is phenomenal and mandatory, actually. otherwise i think he has a decent amount of stick-up-the-ass cyclops energy. or dick grayson nightwing energy but i don’t have any evidence for why. kinda looks like him tho

3. Andrew: andrew gets the most characters bc he’s my favorite. i think ur jessica jones instincts are absolutely correct, both in her storyline (i only watched the first season) and her powers. i’ve seen some powers au and the tendency seems to be giving andrew like,, psychic powers or the like, and i don’t really agree. andrew is a very direct character. he’s pragmatic, he confronts problems head on, and he doesn’t muck about in details. to me this really translates best into physical powers like super strength that help u big punch straight thru all ur problems. also i def think andrew would be not just a solo hero but a mercenary (or a detective) because he’s not altruistic enough to be a standard vigilante. he doesn’t care enough about other people to hang out on rooftops all night waiting for Crime to occur. there’s a price for that.  which brings us to the NEXT andrew hero: deadpool. maybe in personality more of a drugged andrew but the superpowered mercenary is really a perfect fit for andrew. also, healing powers have a decidedly tragic poetry to them on andrew. already he’s self-destructive, if he had a healing factor his concern for his own well-being would be so beyond rock bottom it’d be in the earth’s core. even worse when you remember that with a healing factor, as opposed to indestructibility, you still feel all the pain. which brings us to Wolverine and X-23, who have the same thematic points as deadpool but are much more of a personality match and they have knife hands, which i really think andrew would appreciate. ending that sadness train and onto another tho, andrew’s aesthetic and Vibes fit the Winter Soldier just SO well (just that movie tho, not really civil war or anything past that) and a reinterpretation of the captain america story using the twinyards would be incredibly interesting. and finally, one last hero that would work really well for andrew: rogue, only remove the angst around not being able to touch people, andrew would love that. one touch and their comatose? baller. don't fucking touch him.

4. Matt: Shazam. I didn’t see the shazam movie but my dad and brother did and they said it was very funny and all the trailors looked like it had a lot of fun himbo energy and i really think that fits. in terms of matching himbo disaster energy i think i’ve heard good things about comics hawkeye (not mcu). thor?

5. Aaron: Mr. Fantastic. now this might be a stretch but aaron is a character who uses a skin-deep veneer of anger to cover the fact that he’s actually quite pliant and bends to other people’s wills. and he’s a doctor or w/e. he could alse be like,, antman. he’s smart right? hank pym not paul rudd. katelyn can be wasp

6. Seth: Arm Fall Off Boy. no i will not elaborate.             ..... ugh fine, but i'm using my favorite piece of superhero media of all time: x-men evolution, the one where they're all teenagers in public high school. seth can be lance alvers/avalanche who’s a bit of a jerk and has a lot of issues with authority and has a rivalry with cyclops very reminiscent of seth with kevin, but still there’s the recurring theme that he’s lashing out because of low self-esteem and a bad situation and he’s a surprisingly sympathetic character who i’m very fond of. his power is earthquakes but i think the name makes that pretty self-explanatory

7. Allison: Iron Man. cocky, bitchy, and rich rich rich. sounds like allison to me. then to elevate it a level higher: emma frost, rich bitch extraordinaire. also if allison had telepathic powers she would be unstoppable. plus one more bitchy, morally-gray blonde (but chaotic this time): Harley Quinn

8. Nicky: Okay so I do wanna give a quick shout-out to Northstar, the first openly gay comicbook superhero, who’s a speedster which I’d actually say fits Nicky pretty well. However, if i had to choose a superhero to represent nicky in presence and powers it would have to be Jubilee from x-men (... from what i’ve heard lol. i’ve never actually consumed any of her Media hahaha anyway) she’s a joyful, energetic presence and her powers are setting off fireworks which i think is a good balance of nicky being a supportive cousin-parent AND a chaotic train wreck garbage trash man. also gonna throw in johnny storm for a cheap 'flaming' joke

9. Renee: Thunder/Blackbird from Black Lightning bc she’s a fufkin lesbian lol. (i don’t watch the show but i do follow nafessa williams’s tag). now the fr ones i’m gonna do together because to me they have the same Vibes so i chose them for the same reasons. Wonder Woman and Storm who to me have the same  reserved, impartial, regal energy. honestly ethereal and somewhat otherwordly, and quite literally goddesses. also op as hell.  black widow and her “red in my leger” looking for redemption story also fits thematically.

10. Neil: okay lazy answer first: the flash or quicksilver. get it? because they run fast? and neil run too? yea i like to think i've proven myself to be better than such a surface level interpretation but worth the mention ig. so for srs now, mystique and her shape changing powers would be an interesting interpretation of neil's identity issues, but i wanna push it a step further. nightcrawler would actually be possibly the MOST interesting hero to apply to neil 1. because powers still very movement go fast place to place 2. because of the thematic focus on neil's unusual looks and the lengths he goes to hide them, very much in line with the way nightcrawler will use a hologram-projector in order to look human, yet in both cases it's only a surface-level illusion, and 3. his parentage. here, mary would be mystique, which i also think works very well considering mary seemed to be the far more effective chameleon on the run than neil, and also fits with her place as a morally grey character, as mystique herself is often a villain or an antagonist, with her own agenda and shadowy motives. then nathan matches well with nightcrawler's father: azazel, a literal demon, and also where kurt gets his appearance. it's a shockingly coherent narrative between the three of them. then, to also give neil some powers that aren't contingent on his fucked up geneology and rather on his own merit and abilities, Black Canary and her sonic voice parallel the way that neil began to anchor his identity and take ownership over himself through his voice and his sick roasts

and 1 extra, wymack: batman, on account of his altruism, his dedication to second chances, and his many, many adopted children

---

anon, ik it's been a sec since you sent this, so i hope it gets back to you. i had a fun time with it and it prompted like,,, 7 different au s that i'll never write

#Anonymous #txt #the foxes #im talkin #my posts

[wonderfulworldofmichaelford]

Psycho Analysis: Roman Sionis

(WARNING! This analysis contains SPOILERS!)

Birds of Prey is a fun, silly movie. So you’d expect a fun, silly villain for such a film, right? Well, we sort of get that… but this is an R-rated fun, silly movie, so the villain is going to cuss a lot and peel people’s faces off and be a raging psychopathic manchild. Roman Sionis, everybody!

Good old Roman Sionis, known to comic fans as Black Mask (he isn’t ever called that by anyone except Harley during his introduction, and he doesn’t even wear his mask until the end), is just an absolute raging lunatic. He gets mad at the drop of a hat, is creepily posessive of Dinah Lance, has a very close relationship with his murderous second-in-command Zsasz, and is just generally unpleasant to every single person who crosses his path.

But that’s par for the course for Roman Sionis, who is never really EVER portrayed as a charming, likable guy. The real question here is, is he an entertaining villain? Well he’s played by Ewan McGregor, what do YOU think?

Motivation/Goals: Roman is a relatively simple villain, but I think this works in his favor. You see, a big issue with Harley’s previous outing, Suicide Squad, is that the mission was way too high stakes despite the cast featuring a group of people who didn’t really have any powers beyond “fighting really good.” or “has weapon skills.” You’re telling me you’re gonna put Harley Quinn, Deadshot, and Captain Boomerang up against Enchantress and her army of ancient Aztec super-zombies? WHAT? Here, we have a street-level threat much more suited to Harley’s capabilities: Roman is just a very powerful gangster, and his goal in this movie is the simple “get this diamond that was stolen back to me so I can make fat stacks of cash.” That’s really all their needs to be here, a simple MacGuffin to drive along the plot to its various setpieces.

Performance: I love Ewan McGregor, so, really, he didn’t have to do much with the role of Roman Sionis to make him great. Still, this man went above and beyond despite having comparatively little screentime to Harley. Roman seems incapable of going a single sentence without cursing up a storm and is the epitome of a psychopathic manchild, tormenting people for the slightest of reasons. He forces a woman to strip and dance on one of his tables because she was laughing too loud when he was upset, and decides not to spare a girl’s life because she had a gross snot bubble on her face from sobbing while he had his crony Zsasz peel off her parents’ faces. As funny and hammy as he gets, the dude is a stone-cold ruthless bastard who has no line he won’t cross to get what he wants.

Final Fate: Cass hides a grenade on him and steals the ring, and then Harley kicks him off the pier while he panics. Before he even hits the water, BOOM! Never would I have expected to laugh out loud at the sight of Ewan McGregor being blown into bits, but this movie was just full of surprises.

Best Scene: I think that the honor has to go to his establishing character moment with Zsasz, as they cut off the faces of a family who crossed Roman, and then when Roman decides to spare the daughter, he notices snot on her face, says “Ew” like a petulant child, and has Zsasz cut her face off anyway. It’s a great way to establish that Roman is an awful human being no matter how you slice it, and firmly establishes that while, yes, he is a misogynist villain in a female-led blockbuster, his misogyny is just a tiny facet of how unabashedly terrible Roman is.

Final Thoughts & Score: So, this is gonna sound weird, but… Roman kinda reminded me of Justin Hammer. Hammer is a villain who I have greatly warmed to over time (mostly thanks to Nando V Movies on YouTube), to the point where I think he’s actually pretty funny but is held back from true greatness by the sloppy nature of Iron Man 2. The film was big, bloated, and didn’t know what to do with itself. And this film is KIND OF like that… but it knows what to do with Roman.

The movie has an undercurrent of female empowerment, so why not make the villain emblematic of things women have to overcome? Roman is creepy, misogynistic, and even a bit racist especially with his condescending actions towards Dinah. And he even throws a fit when she “betrays” him and decides to murder her. But the movie is smart so as to not make this hamfisted; the movie makes it entirely clear that even if you take away his misogynistic elements, Roman Sionis is just an utterly disgusting human being. Everything about him is just so hilariously vulgar and repulsive, but the way he’s performed helps lighten it and help keep him within the tone of the movie. He’s just dark enough and just hammy enough to work.

My big issues with Roman are mostly due to his utilization and the wasted potential, which is a problem that really hits a lot of stuff in Birds of Prey. He is great every time he’s onscreen, but his screentime is fairly limited, and then he dies at the end which robs him of any chance of coming back in the future as an antagonist. He actually functions great as a more grounded threat rather than some larger-than-life end of the world threat, but the fact he dies horribly – before even having his mask burned onto his face, even! - just kind of feels like a waste of a character. To be fair, Black Mask is not the best or most interesting Batman villain crime lord; we have the Penguin for that. But when you cast  someone like Ewan McGregor and he’s clearly having a blast, it’s hard not to feel at least slightly bitter when he gets hilariously gibbed at the end.

Still, I can’t let Justin Hammer’s sacrifice go in vain; he walked so Roman could run, and Roman ran so that perhaps someday Hammer could sprint. Roman gets a nice, fat 8/10, which he definitely earns with the heaping helpings of ham he brings to the table, though he is held back at least a little by the wasted potential of his character.

But hey, if you want to talk about wasted potential…

Psycho Analysis: Victor Zsasz

I really like Victor Zsasz in this film. I really do. The angle they went with, the implied homosexuality, the actor… it’s all good stuff that helps make a disturbing character like Zsasz easier to swallow. But he gets hit with wasted potential harder than even Roman does.

Motivation/Goals: He’s Roman’s right-hand man, so basically his motivation is to do whatever Roman wants him to do. However, there is a bit of an implied thing between his boss and him; Zsasz seems undeniably irritated with the attention he lavishes on Dinah, and is very hands-on and affectionate with his boss. A lot of his later actions in the film and his cruelty towards Dinah does seem to stem from some place of anger towards her for taking Roman’s attention away from him.

Performance: I have to say, Chris Messina does a stellar job at portraying Zsasz as creepy and obsessive, and certainly showcases the fanatical loyalty he has towards Roman, making him something of a dark mirror to Harley’s former relationship with the Joker. I also appreciate that, despite not going with Zsasz’s original psychotic serial killer angle, they still made him a bloodthirsty psycho with a sort of nihilistic edge to him. Frankly, this might be the best possible take on a live-action Zsasz without things getting intensely uncomfortable.

Final Fate: This is probably the worst element of Zsasz: his death. Right before the climax he gets shot out of the blue by Huntress and then Harley just repeatedly stabs him with the arrow. And I have to make it clear here – Zsasz barely got to do anything. He never really poses any sort of physical threats to the heroines, never gets into a fight, and is never mentioned again after his death despite being very close to Roman (to the point where the two may have been lovers).

Final Thoughts & Score: As far as henchmen go, Zsasz is pretty solid conceptually. He’s established early on as a psychopathic enforcer of Roman’s gang, he has an eerie air to him, and he has a lot of elements from the comics you rarely see on Zsasz in other media, such as being blonde. Messina does a fantastic job at making the character seem like a competent killer in the employ of Roman.

But the key word is “seem,” because Zsasz frankly never lives up to his hype. Despite being introduced peeling the faces off of a family, he is just never utilized to his fullest extent. He’s kind of just there in a lot of scenes, and while he isn’t unmemorable or anything he never really does anything that makes him into a worthwhile addition to the franchise. He’s honestly just a glorified mook with a few interesting gimmicks to help set him apart.

I’ve gotta give him a 6/10. While he’s definitely a step above average, he’s really not anything amazing, mostly because the movie refuses to allow him to reach his full potential. He doesn’t have any great quotes, his most memorable scene really serves more to establish Roman than anything, and he is dumped and quickly forgotten right before the climax. He would easily be a 7 or 8 if the story treated him with a little more weight or respect, but he just ends up underwhelming despite having so much going for him, and it’s frankly a bit depressing. It’s just a very sad state of affairs for the character, especially when he managed to be more intimidating in the Arkham games despite the fact that he posed even less of a physical threat than he does here.

Well, while we’re here, let’s go over THAT Zsasz briefly.

Portrayed in the games by Danny Jacobs (who you may know as Sacha Baron Cohen's stand in on The Penguins of Madagascar. Yes, Zsasz and King Julien had the same voice actor.), Zsasz is never really a major antagonist and is, in all honesty, a pretty weak fighter; you can always take him down in one punch. The thing with Zsasz in the games, though, is that it’s always tricky to get to him, because he usually has hostages of some kind. In Arkham Asylum, he appears twice, and you need to use stealth to take him out before he kills his hostages. In City, he gets a much longer sidequest where he requires you to pick up ringing telephones and then glide to another one across the city within a time limit. Once you’ve listened to all of his messages, Batman finds out where his lair is, sneaks through it, and whoops his ass.

I certainly can’t say he’s the best villain in either game he appears in, but he’s definitely scary. His messages and game over screens are really freaky and unnerving, and the Riddler even requires you to find some of Zsasz’s work as parts of riddles… and by “work” I am of course referring to corpses posed in life-like positions. There’s also the horrifying little tidbit that in City, Zsasz actually does kill one of his hostages and there’s nothing that can be done about it; if you switch to detective mode in his lair, you can see a corpse at the bottom of the water in the room.

I think how creepy and intense he is really helps make him stand out among the more colorful characters in those games like Joker, Clayface, and Riddler, so I think giving him a nice 8/10 for his appearances is well-earned. I feel like Birds of Prey could have learned a few lessons from this portrayal; if they wanted to make him more creepy than physically intimidating, that could have worked well and it would have made his anti-climactic defeat a bit more plausible. Instead, they kind of tried this middle ground where he’s creepy enough and intimidating enough physically that it just feels like a letdown when he’s offed.

Oh yeah, did you know he appeared in Batman Begins? He had a brief cameo and didn’t do anything significant and looked like this:

Pretty sure he’d get a low score if he wasn’t just a quick little reference.

#Psycho Analysis #Roman Sionis #Birds of Prey #birds of prey (and the fantabulous emancipation of one harley quinn) #Ewan McGregor #victor zsasz #Chris Messina #Danny Jacobs #Arkham series #Batman

[breath-of-void]

Birds of Prey Rewrite

Alright, I know I’ve already posted more in an hour than I have in all of 2019 and it’s about this one fuckin’ movie, but it had such potential and I hate to see it wasted.

I’m going to write out my approximation of the perfect Birds of Prey/ Harley Quinn movie just for the catharsis. Heavy text post ahead.

So, the movie starts as it normally does, with the animated scene of Harley’s backstory complete with her stealing the diamond and Joker taking credit. We then continue the same way right up to the point where she blows up Ace Chemicals and maybe a little beyond that for the purposes of Montoya and Canary. I’d leave out Huntress herself, but make a point of Montoya finding high profile killers with crossbow bolts in them. We might interlace Canary’s introduction scene with Cassandra having her comfort the kid, give her $20 and head TO work at Sionis’ club.

Then I would have Harley get it into her kooky little head that if Joker wasn’t going to be her boyfriend anymore then she wanted her stuff back. Stuff, in this case, being the diamond she stole in the opening sequence. 

We can write Joker out of it somehow. Maybe he’s in DC trying to assassinate the president or maybe he’s been recently caught by Batman and is enjoying a brief stint in Arkham, either way, Harley storms his safehouse the same way she did the police station in the movie, only, this time she brings Bruce along because why not. She succeeds and gets her diamond back with minimal effort, but, as she’s leaving, Cassandra wafts by and steals the diamond.

Harley notices and gives chase. Cassandra books shit, but gets trapped in an alley. Not thinking clearly, she swallows the diamond before Harley and Bruce catch up with her. Harley demands it, she reveals that its making super slow progress through her digestive tract and Harley sighs in exasperation. Next scene has them in the supermarket picking up laxatives and stuff. That scene in the movie was great and doesn’t require any changing, maybe have Bruce bounding along behind them for the sake of continuity. Someone can ask if that’s a hyena and Harley will respond that it’s her pet cat, or rabbit, or something ridiculous. 

The scene leading to Harley’s house is the same. Meeting her landlord and her and Cassandra just chilling at home are all perfect. 

At this point we can show Sionis and Zsasz for the first time in a primary scene (before we can have them interspersed in the background; little nods to them being the antagonists, but not really hogging the light). Sionis finds out that the Bertinelli Diamond is not only in Gotham, but right down the street in Joker’s safehouse (I don’t think we really need to explain what it is at this point, but make it seem important). Sionis sends Zsasz and an army of thugs to get it back by any means necessary, even if it means pissing off the Joker. 

They get there to find the safehouse already broken into and everyone either dead or unconscious. The diamond is, of course, gone. They question one of the guards and are told that Harley stole the diamond. Zsasz goes back to Sionis and, now that they are actively looking for her, it takes them the rest of the night to find out where she lives (or, at least, the restaurant she likes to visit). They show up, interrogate the Thai guy and, when he refuses to talk, they kill him (that can be done offscreen. Maybe have him say something like “I’ll never talk” and Sionis, in his black mask, says “they always do, eventually”).

Back to Harley and Cassandra, they’re out for the day training Bruce to attack on command. Harley is warming up to Cassandra, but won’t admit it. Maybe they cross paths with Huntress, but don’t know it. They get back home to find that the Thai guy isn’t there and Harley’s room is more ransacked than usual. Harley needs sugar to calm down so she goes to get some ice cream, but, oh shit, the Thai guy’s head is in the freezer. In his mouth is some dramatic note like ‘Turn Around’ or ‘You’d better duck’. As she reads it, it’s revealed that Sionis left Zsasz behind for when Harley came back and he’s about to strike, but Cassandra says the command word (I’m thinking “puddin’”) and Bruce attacks Zsasz. In the confusion, the three escape. 

Harley is now under the impression that Sionis and Zsasz are after her as Joker isn’t protecting her anymore. “What did you do to them?” What didn’t I do?” cue rapid flashbacks of her wrecking Sionis’ club in various ways. Harley opts to leave Gotham and insists on bringing Cassandra because she still has her property. Cassandra doesn’t really want to go, so Harley handcuffs them together. Road trip!

Now, back to the Birds, Montoya gets suspended and she uses her new freedom to go after low profile assassins that she has files on. This can be our introduction to her fighting skill. She makes it to the “boss” at the same time as Huntress (first proper appearance) and the two duke it out as Montoya is still anti-murder, being a cop and all. Huntress gets the upper hand and kills the guy. She then lets it be known that she only has one target left and she’ll leave Gotham: Victor Zsasz. Montoya, I’d give some trauma relating to Zsasz. Maybe her ex was murdered by him or her parents or her partner and, in a moment of darkness, she agrees to lead Huntress to him. 

She has a contact with Canary who dislikes all cops due to the mom dying thing, but understands that some evils just can’t be stopped. She helps with information from time to time but never properly gets involved. Huntress and Montoya show up at her place asking for information on Zsasz only to be told that Sionis sent Zsasz after Harley (keep in mind, at this point, no one knows that Cassandra actually has the diamond). Huntress asks who Harley was and we get Montoya’s voice over describing Harley in the most negative-positive ways (something like “She’s an evil genius trapped within a psycho brain” or something to that effect) as we show Harley and Cassandra barrelling down a highway in a stolen semi.

Still with the Birds, Huntress recognizes Harley from that time they bumped into each other (Harley is pretty memorable) and notes that she had a scruffy-looking kid with her. Based on description, Canary goes to check with Cassandra’s parents and have her fears confirmed when the dad is glad that she hasn’t been home in at least a day. Pissed off, she lets the others know that Zsasz 100% will kill Harley and Cassandra to get back the diamond. This is where Montoya explains what the Bertinelli Diamond is (or... or... OR, Huntress does as she’s a Bertinelli herself). They all agree, more or less, that Zsasz needs to be stopped. We can have a heartfelt scene where Canary doesn’t want to go because of what happened to her mother, but Montoya convinces her that her mother would have gone to help no matter what.

On to the Harlandra Quain hijinx, they get into scraps on their journey. I’d imagine Harley would stop at every available restroom to let Cassandra try to pass the diamond, but to no avail. There should a scene where Harley and Cassandra have a fight and Cassandra reveals thats he could have gotten out of the handcuffs at anytime, locking Harley’s hands together, but neglecting to run explaining to Harley that she’s an orphan and that no one really cared about her. Harley probably psychoanalyzes her, getting to the root of her kleptomania. Cassandra also tells Harley that she’s the first real mom she’s ever had (or, at least, big sister). I also imagine a biker bar scene in which they get into trouble and Harley has to kick ass to get them out. They run back to their vehicle and take off, but the bikers don’t follow them. When Harley questions this, Cassandra reveals that she stole their spark plugs. 

Zsasz closes in on the trail.

The Birds also bond as they travel together, picking up the pieces that Harley and Cassandra leave behind. Maybe Montoya is more insistent of helping despite losing the trail and the others are annoyed, but come around because they are fundamentally good people.

Harley and Cassandra’s story reach a head when Cassandra finds a family willing to adopt her. Their vehicle breaks down and they meet a nice rural family who is totally down with taking in this orphan kid. Harley feels betrayed as she had hecking grown to love Cassandra and didn’t want to give her up. She leaves in anger, forgetting about her diamond in the process.

Zsasz catches up with Cassandra and, from reports of Harley travelling with a child, puts two and two together that she has the diamond. He kills her new family and contacts Sionis. I imagine he then performs amateur surgery on her to get the diamond out.

Harley, in the mean time, gets into a car crash as she’s super reckless and her getting hit has her remember some of her time with Joker. She remembers why she and him heisted the diamond in the first place (it was the Bertinelli diamond) and she remembers that, when Victor attacked her in her apartment, he demanded something. This clicks that they aren’t after her, but are after the diamond which Cassandra has. She turns around and goes back for her.

Her and the Birds meet up and have a fight with Canary using her scream more than once for goodness sake. Bruce is there too, of course. The fight ends in a stalemate as it comes out that Harley does not have Cassandra or the diamond and that both are in danger. At that moment, Sionis drives past unaware of them and they plan to team up to save Cassandra.

Zsasz has finished cutting Cassandra open and sewing her crudely back together. He has the diamond along with at least two other things Cassandra has swallowed, showing that she regularly did that to hide things and that was probably why she hadn’t been able to pass the diamond. 

Sionis gets there and he and Zsasz rejoice over having the diamond back and plot their takeover of Gotham. The Birds+Harley arrive during this but keep out of the way. Sionis and Zsasz decide to kill Cassandra because any loose end is a problem. At this, the Birds+Harley attack and there’s the climactic fight.

Zsasz first fights with Canary, but quickly switches to fight Huntress as the climax of her story. Fight scene, fight scene, fight scene and it ends with a crossbow bolt in Zsasz’s neck and a bullet in the back of Sionis’ (maybe Bruce eats him). The Birds+Harley+Cassandra head back to a diner to recuperate. 

Cassandra heads to the bathroom to enjoy her new freed bowels as the other discuss their future crime fighting career. They settle on the name Birds of Prey because, I dunno. Perhaps, during the scenes of them bonding, Canary reminisces that she once thought that canaries were birds of prey because her mother was such a badass. The others assured her that, with her, it damn well was. Cassandra calls for Harley to help her and Harley goes. 

After a while, the Birds wonder what’s taking them so long and look out the window to see them driving off. As they rush to their vehicles to give chase, they realize that they can’t start them. In their car, Harley and Cassandra grin and knock together the spark plugs they stole. The rest of the movie proceeds as it did originally.

  And that is all.

#harleen quinzel #birds of prey #rewrite #cassandra cain #renee montoya #huntress #black canary #dc #margot robbie

[ithinkthingsaboutstuff]

What is with Birds of Prey criticism?

i have seen BOP 

and i have read comments and review’s from different people (male and female) and i have decided to throughout my observations into the void. 

now personal taste is personal taste and everyone is allowed to like or not like whatever they want. 

but i will be looking at this from a ‘structured’ pov so i will be breaking the movie down into what others have got to say about it.

and with that in mind i will be taking things out of context but i will be summarising and linking to the sources when possible.  

i will be looking at how people have persevere them (again male and female) and why this might be so (but i will say now that it is only my best guess, and i will try to be as fair as possible)

and i will also add i have only seen the movie once at this point so i may miss some things or misremember others 

so from here on out we this will be nothing but 

------------------------------------------SPOILERS-----------------------------------------

ok so with that out of the way. 

PLOT 

the plot is basically 

Harley and the joker have broken up (joker, dumped her) 

this makes Harley lose her immunity in Gotham as she was protected by the fact she was the jokers girlfriend.

black mask is one of these people and is one of the most powerful in Gotham.

but he needs a diamond (that belongs to Helena) to be the most powerful in the city,

but when Zsasz and Black canary, get it take off them by a street girl (Cass) 

Harley says she will get it back to square herself with mask and he will protected her afterwards 

(there is also a b plot with Helena going around kill everyone who was involved with the death of her family)  

things happen 

and they all end up fight Black Mask men in a amusement park 

and Harley kills him on a dock.

then they all part ways.

now this is an oversimplification. 

but that does allow the movie to explore the characters and their relationship's with the world and the story.

but over all an average plot but no so more them say 

-the avengers (2012)

-thor (2011)

-age of ultron (2015)

-spider-man homecoming (2017)

and so on.

Criticisms

this is what one critic had to say about the movie

review from  Mick LaSalle

“but no, even that makes things sound better than they are. There’s no character there at all. There’s a look. There’s an attitude, and there’s an assemblage of mannerisms, but these are all veneers surrounding a vacuum.”  

“None of them suggest a personality, beyond some generalized zaniness.”

now i am no expert but is having a look, an attitude and mannerisms all things that make up someone’s personality? 

i can see if he was trying to say she has not much to add to the overall story or if it over shadowed everything in the movie, for sake of being “zany”   

but it was integrated into the movies narrative as a the main story telling tool,

e.g. Harley’s narration and the cartoons/ animation that came with. those where there to add character to the movie through Harley’s, so basically Harley’s personality is the films personality. 

and this is what he had to say about the plot

“If she wanted the Joker back, that would be something. That could be a movie. If she wanted revenge, that would be a weak motive, but it would still be something.”

now this has some interesting connotations,

what he was trying to say with this sentiment is only something i can guess, but i will want to give him the benefit of the doubt, maybe he was asking for a story similar to ‘mad love’  from the s4 of the Batman new adventures.

looking more at the sickness of that relationship (that some people admired and fawned over in suicide squad) so if that is the case then its not a bad thought,

however the way it is phrased makes it sound like more like Harley needs the Joker to be major part of the story for it to be any good. 

but Harley has had comic’s for year’s that prove the opposite.

now to compare this what he had to say about the Joker (2019)

“What’s terrifying and brilliant about Phoenix’s Joker is that he seems to be operating from an intricate yet alien form of logic. There is very little common ground between the character and the viewer, no shared understanding of right and wrong, real or unreal. He erupts into laughter without warning — a terrifying, piercing laugh that he can’t control. He sits in the audience at a comedy club, joyously and maniacally laughing at setups, not punch lines.”

now i am not saying Joker is a bad movie, I am just saying that he complained about the lack of story and character in one film and praised it in another.  

now i also understand that these films are different, and they have different tones and messages. and ever genre (one is action, the other is drama)

but basically

he is saying Joker’s lack of clear “personality” made the movie good and Harley’s made it bad (again this is apples and oranges, and way to simple)  

but the main point is that he has failed to look for WHY Harley is that way, or how that adds to the movie like he did for Joker.

now moving on to

Anthony Lane

“ No one could call Harley Quinn a recluse. She loves to go out, get wasted, meet people, and fight them. In onscreen graphics, she proudly reports what it is about her that vexes her opponents. (“Voted for Bernie.” “Have a vagina.”) Yet Harley is often alone in the frame—marching toward the camera in her T-shirt and shorts, smiling madly through lips of fire-engine red, and peppering us with unceasing chatter, as if words were buckshot. She lives on her own, too, with a stuffed beaver in a tutu and a pet hyena named Bruce. (As with the title, note the surfeit of nuttiness. Rarely have I seen a movie strain so hard to seem out-there.) Our heroine needs some kindred spirits, and quick.”

ok benefit of the doubt this is just a colourful way to describe the movie and Harley’s set up,

however with the next paragraph that follows i don’t think so

“No surprise, then, that Yan’s movie, peopled as it is by women who talk among themselves, with only fitful reference to men, doesn’t so much pass the Bechdel Test as ace it, while also ticking the profanity box, the ear-splitting box, and the bone-snapping box—every box, in fact, except for the tricky one that requires a motion picture to be good”

the strange thing is that he was so close to an epiphany

yes Harley is social but she is lonely that is the point of her being with the BOP, taking in Cassie.

and saying someone who is social is not able to be lonely is the dumbest thing i have ever heard.

and i can name dozens of movies off the top of my head that is a group of guys ‘talking among themselves, with only fitful reference to women’

like 

-  the hang over (1,2 and 3)

- die hard

- pulp fiction 

- fast and furious (all 9 of them)

- the other guys

- Sherlock (RDJ movies)

- the dark night 

- scarface

-  any Adam Sandler movie for the last 20 years

-memento

- rush hour (all 3)

- fight club 

like damn dude your getting all bent out of shape for women having the nerve to want to tell story’s about other women.

(and i would also like to point out that very on in the movie was a ‘bad guy’ or did bad things all throughout the film and the men are just what they are up against you know like some kind of antagonist??? fucking wild idea right, and as we all know every female villain in movies are always written with respect and dignity, can you feel my sarcasm)

and this is what this man also said about ‘ford vs ferrari’   

“Ford v Ferrari” is directed by James Mangold, and it may be his strongest film.

like dude you are showing your hand here.

but i am not wasting any more time on this dude.

 let us move on to the lady’s

MOLLY FREEMAN

“the movie ultimately embodies different kinds of liberation - not only of women breaking free from their abusive boyfriends, psychotic employers and the restrictive boy's club, but also the freedom and power that comes with finding a group where they feel accepted and supported.”\

“Cathy Yan's directing and vision for the film, which is realized in the action, costumes and music. The fighting sequences are absolutely brutal and choreographed in a way to showcase the characters' respective abilities. Harley's gymnast moves make a return, and when she gets her hands on a bat, the Cupid of Crime really lets loose - and it'll leave audiences breathless with exhilaration. Birds of Prey stands out because it's uniquely female, from the characters' fighting styles down to the details of Harley pausing mid-fight to give her friend a hair tie. This further extends to the costumes, designed by Erin Benach (A Star Is Born), which are exquisite and perfectly showcase each character's personality.”

Susana Polo

“Each character’s storyline is given a slightly different genre and tone, as well, one of a number of tactics the production employs to mimic Harley’s manic internal life. Huntress stalks around Birds of Prey like it’s a Kill Bill-esque revenge epic, while Renee Montoya is in a hard-boiled cop flick. The main heroine ensemble actors all breathe a wonderful amount of life into little-known characters overdue for mainstream attention.”

“Winstead delivers a comedic twist on the Huntress’s classic personality that I hope makes its way to comics as soon as possible, and the 13-year-old Basco deserves particular credit for holding her own alongside Robbie in their many scenes together. Robbie’s Harley Quinn is just as scene-stealing as she was in Suicide Squad, appearing to operate on at least 20 percent cartoon logic at all times — a useful skill for an occasionally fourth-wall-breaking narrator. Cartoon-channeling is also a useful skill for the star of a movie with such splendid fight scenes.”

 now i am not saying every man hates the movie, and every woman loved it that is insane and dumb.

but what does seem to be a common theme is that positive or negative, men and women are looking at different aspects of the movie 

women look at the movie on its own terms and men seem to look by comparing it to other “guy movies” 

now this a generalisation but this is a common idea that seems to run through it.

and here is some general thoughts from some people who have made comments, online.

female 

“I am sick and tired of being told what movies I need to like as a woman, this is a bad movie. It isn't a zero nor is it a ten and anyone rating it that way isn't being honest either with you or themselves. The storytelling is odd and the flashbacks are weirdly placed to the point where they take you out of the movie. This movie has too much exposition and then not enough which I congrats I guess. I don't think men are rating this film low because they are "man babies" I think they are rating it low because there are far better superhero and anti-hero movies out there to choose from.”

this is based on personal taste and why it didn’t sit right with them (and that’s fine)

male

“A rush movie without any type of storyline and God knows where they are heading with DCEU and it's characters..It's only Harley and Harley who has never been in BOP in comics...Mis usage of characters and movie..Just make a decision where do you wanna go with your movies”

now this interesting, when this people has the same feels as the person above 

they don’t look to the movie itself they look to find out evidence to discredit instead of anything in the film itself.

again i am not saying this person is wrong to feel this way i simply think the method of expressing it, is interesting.      

(and for the record this is actually an incorrect statement Harley and Poison Ivy have been apart of the team at different points) 

male

“The girls looked terrible like they were going Break-Dancing or something and Harley Quinn was dressed up like a Bird with makeup?? The ending was ridiculously stupid and predictable and the misogynist male pig attitudes towards the females in the film were jaw dropping cringe moments, like who acts like that??”

now this is about appearance, and the male characters, now this is showing that men see a violent, man who literally gets someone to cut a MAN’s face off  

and the only thing they focus on is that ‘oh he is mean to women damn SJW’s’

that is the weird’s thing? like you the bad guy is bad to the hero’s? shocking.

now i am not saying that the character is perfect and well crafted like loki or kilmonger but he serviced the purpose he was meant to, he was powerful intimidating and unpredictable.

(and black mask has always been a nut case)  

but i also think its interesting that these men who cry about SJW’s and how they mock men (and that does sometimes happen, it would be dumb to say they didn’t) 

never seem to mind that that women get called bitch’s and whores in every other movie.or that women are used shallow props to move the movie along. 

almost like it is distressing when you see someone you can identify with is treated like the peace of garbage. 

female

“The Film was decent enough for a lowkey Friday night out with the girls. Nothing you'd rant & rave about or even remember seeing in a few months but it was entertaining in places. The script felt a little bit underbaked & the story itself felt a bit disjointed. The direction of the film was lacking for me. In a world where Todd Phillips pulled off Joker (2019) this seems like a more rushed project that would've been better at Netflix or even Amazon Prime for release. I think the deserve another crack at this movie & another attempt at something with a bit more substance”

honest to the point and is looking at the movie on its own term's

notice how she does not need to devalue other women to get this across, not the character’s, not the write or director but was looking at it from a personal taste and rewatchablity,

the anger about this movie is so strange 

like how many hero movies have been worse then this and was not taking very chance they get to bash the creators and that they should not do their job’s because the movie had women as most of the cast and was mainly about them.

anyway i hand it over to all of you.    

#Birds of Prey #birds of prey movie #Harley Quinn #bop #long post

[smokeybrand]

Venomous Visibility

As a creator, I always find the subject of representation kind of dubious. With the f*cked up Last of Us II leaks, the continuous misandrist poison leaking into the Star Wars canon from that Kennedy-led Lucasfilm, and the incredibly amazing portrayal of Jill Valentine in the Remake, this sh*t has been on my mind lately. Like, how do you write strong, female, protagonist without falling into that Mary Sue trap? How do you code black without being offensive? How do you write gay without resorting to stereotypes? I don't know how to distinguish a trans or deaf or autistic or native person through text without outright stating these things. Where's the nuance in portraying someone queer without it coming across as pandering? I don’t know if it’s because of my limited experience as a straight black dude who kind of thinks the current trend of eighty-eight genders and personal identifications is kind of ridiculous but i find the attempts studios make to cater to these groups to be adequate as f*ck. Like, Sarah Connor and Ellen Ripley kind of defined feminine bad-ass and they both did it way back in the 80s. Why is there this irreverent need to portray this misandrist energy in modern cinema? Birds of Prey was a fun time but it was way heavy-handed on that “Girl boss” energy and it didn’t have to e. Harley Quinn is already a boss and the Birds kick ass in their own right. Why does that have to be the focus of your narrative instead of actual character development and plot? Especially when you have that Ellen Ripley template? It’s weird to say but it feels like certain groups want those aspects to define the entirety of a character instead of it just being a part of them. I think that mindset is both toxic and does a disservice to the given narrative, unless the narrative, itself, is defined by those aspects.

I'm of the mind that, if you wrote dope characters, that should he enough. Take, for examples, Disney’s newest attempt to represent a queer character in Onward. I’ve never seen the movie, i have severe daddy issues so this hilariously outside of my wheelhouse, but i hear that one of the characters makes a passing reference to their same sex spouse. How is that not good enough? Isn’t that how it is in real life? I don’t see gays running around, shouting about their homo love from the balconies and rooftops. Unless it’s Pride. To add that little tidbit in the middle of a Pixar film, aimed at the notoriously conservative middle America, and not have them trying to burn down city hall is kind of amazing and, in my opinion, very tastefully done. At least it’s better executed than the way Beauty and the Beast did with the LeFou reveal. Like, holy sh*t. Talk about blue-balls. This fervent obsession with representation for representation sake or to push an agenda is absolutely repugnant. You think the character of Rey Skywalker would be enough of a lesson on that poisonous nonsense for everyone, not just Disney. Be it female lead, bisexual heroine, gay protagonist, whatever; If you're character is strong enough to be more than whatever social label cats want to code them with, then the representation is inconsequential. Don’t force something that doesn’t need to be forced.

I’ve seen representation executed beautifully. Euphoria is one of the best shows i’ve seen on television and it deals with a ton of sh*t that most SJWs want to fight about. Zendaya is excellent in this show and so is her trans partner, Hunter Schafer. The way that show is written, you can tell that there is an understanding about that culture, a personal connection to their world. That level of representation is outstanding and i commend the creators for giving us such a rich vision for those characters. That said, the strength of Euphoria is in the characters. Rue makes that show. It’s about her journey and everything after that, is a part of who she is as a character, not the defining aspect of it. That subtlety is how you represent an uniquely ignored demographic. That’s how you handle representation in media for adults. For kids, i think this is a little much. Not many nine-year-olds out there are recovering drug addicts.

I think the best piece of media i’ve ever seen in terms of representation actually came out of Disney years ago and gets criminally slept on to this day. Atlantis: The Lost Empire i easily the most diverse, accessible, and palatable piece of “woke” media, Disney has ever made, and it was never created to be so. Atlantis is a story with a female co-lead of color, who has her own agency, doesn’t really fall into the trap of being “damseled” and ends up being a Queen by the rend of this story. The male co-lead is an anxious, neurotic, nerd with a distinct lack of brawn, who beguiles the antagonists with his intellect. The supporting cast is a mixture of people of color, both of which are dope as sh*t, and various nationalities. I’ve spoken at length about my love for Kidagakash Nedakh, she’d be my favorite Disney Princess if she wasn’t a motherf*cking Queen, but i’d be lying if i didn’t admit Audrey had a near equal place in my heart for her sheer dopenesss. Doc is cool, too. Seriously, how is there no Atlantis world in Kingdom Hearts yet? F*cking Disney, man... For the record, my actual favorite Princess is Rapunzel with Jasmine coming in a close second.

Personally, when I create a character, I describe the way I imagine how they physically appear and let the reader assign whatever else afterwords. If I say a character is female with caramel color skin and lavender hair, it's up to the reader to define the minute details in their mind's eye. Is the Lavender a natural hair color? Is she black? Maybe Hispanic? Could she be native or Indian or something completely different? A lot of people have caramel color skin. Hell, she might just have a tan, I don't know because the way I see the character, is different than whoever reads it. I think that's one of the joys unique to literature, that ability to essentially "customize" a narrative to taste, which only amplifies my inability to reconcile this trend of "representation." A lot of people in the fandom attribute Ahsoka Tano as an LGBTQ character and i think that’s fine. It’s never implicitly stated but i don’t think it really has to be. Ahsoka is a bad ass and she displays all of that effortlessly. If you ant to ascribe a queer connotation to her, fine, but that’s not the part of the character that matters to the overall narrative. It shouldn’t be the one aspect which is harped upon officially. I actually really, really, love Ahsoka so i have a dog in this fight. Not so much about the gay coding, that’s a thing that doesn’t really matter to me, more the fact that she needs deserves more shine in the franchise. Thank you Mando II. Also, Dr. Aphra. I hope they actually give her a show. She’s f*cking awesome and, i think, a legit LGBTQ character. I could be wrong about that though.

If a character can be whatever you want them to be, why does it have to be implicitly stated? How is all of this forced representation and social agenda pushing not disingenuous at that point? How is it not more a hindrance than a strength? Why is it acceptable to have your token marginalized appearance, if it’s forced and detracts from the overall story trying to be told? Is it really okay to just accept such pedestrian pandering for the sake of pandering? Like, i’m not gay. How am i supposed to write a gay character without being an ass about it? The only way i know how is to be direct with it. Direct but subtle about everything. “Strong Female Character” should not be the one aspect of your character driving their development. You don’t need to create a Mary Sue in order to have a compelling female lead. Tifa Lockhart and Norah Price prove that. Your protagonist doesn’t need to be “the big gay” in order to be a bad ass. Ian Ghallagher and Willow Rosenberg prove that. Also, they’re both gingers so, you know, double the suffrage points i guess? You don’t have to write a potato who can do physics in their head, to represent an autistic person. Sherlock Holmes and  Amelie Poulain prove that. I would definitely do what Disney did with Onward in order to represent a character of that type of minority because, to me, as a minority, i don’t believe any singular aspect determine the whole of a character. Race, gender, orientation, religion, and other social identifiers; All of those are just qualifiers to the core of the character you’re creating. They are parts, never a whole. These things are just additions to embellish and enrich, not the definition of who they are, as much as everyone wants it to be. I mean, at the end of the day, how lame is your character if all they are is gay or stronk female? How much of a boner is our story going to be with a protagonist as deep as a puddle because you feel some kind of way about visibility?

[monkeyandelf]

The true story of Harley Quinn

Being a partner, the second number for a superhero, is an ungrateful job. It is necessary to distract attention, take strikes - and, of course, retreat when the hero comes time to shine, delivering a final blow or uttering a cool phrase. But it’s much worse to be the companion of a villain, not just a simple one, but one of the most unpredictable and merciless ones that the history of comics knew. The villain is so iconic and bright that it is practically impossible to look near him. The chances of getting out of the shadow of such a character are vanishingly small. But our today's heroine not only got rid of the catch-up role, but also found her own wings, shaking the world of comics. This stunning girl successfully got out of an abusive relationship and became the first number to promote her own films and comics. Harley Quinn appeared in the pantheon of opponents of the Dark Knight, in general, by chance - there was no plan to introduce a new antagonist. Paul Dini, screenwriter of the legendary animated series of the nineties "Batman", conceived a scene in which at a reception in honor of Commissioner Gordon, the Joker had to jump out of the cake and paralyze those present with gas. This trick was considered too eccentric even for the Joker, so he was allocated an assistant acrobat in a Harlequin costume (it’s interesting that in the end the Joker was inside the cake, and Harley rolled the cake into the hall in the guise of a policeman). Dini modeled Harley based on her friend, actress Arlene Sorkin. In one of the episodes, Arlene appeared in Harlequin's costume; Paul remembered it, and he invited the actress to voice Harley.

Arlene Sorkin voiced Harley in many cartoons and games and is as firmly associated with her heroine as Mark Hamill with the Joker, and Kevin Conroy with Batman. The eccentric, lively, sharp-tongued blonde with a Brooklyn accent and specific appeals ("Pie", "Betsy", "Ginger") could not help but be remembered by the viewer. Indeed, how often does someone annoy the Joker with jokes that are funnier than him? The character gained popularity and firmly established in the animated series. Benefit was not long in coming - it was the comic “Crazy Love” (by the way, the Eisner Prize winner!), which first tells the story of the appearance of Harley Quinn, almost unchanged by subsequent retcons. After completing an internship at Arkham Hospital, the young psychiatrist Harlin Quinzel tried to solve a riddle that tormented many: what is the problem with the Joker? Left alone with the girl, the psychopath seemed to finally open up: a difficult childhood and violence by his alcoholic father pushed the young man onto a slippery path. Batman, as the personification of Gotham, did not forgive the mistakes of youth and over and over again knocked the poor man out of the way of correction with his heavy fists. Dr. Quinzel identified the main source of frustration and anger of her patient and concluded that if this source is eliminated, it will help the recovery and socialization of her pale ward.

Harley's dreams were quite classic and could not be combined with the plans of the Joker Mr. Jay's charisma and ostentatious readiness to pour out his soul enchanted Harlin. She fell hopelessly in love and helped the Joker escape from the clinic, hoping to win his love with her devotion and match his madness. This is a key moment in history that has changed the public's view of the Joker: it turned out that you can fall in love with him! Before Harley appeared, he was, as a rule, portrayed as an absolute evil, whose motives did not require clarification, and the lack of background was only more scary. Paul Dini made a small revolution in the plot - perhaps for the first time since The Murderous Joke, where Alan Moore spoke in detail about the fall of a comedian-loser into a vat with chemicals. Of course, the animated series “Batman” was not burdened with the whole load of Joker sins - for example, the murder of Robin and violence against Batgirl. Alas, Dr. Quinzel fell into a trap prepared by the manipulation master. The young psychiatrist expected that she would not only be able to understand the Joker, but also be cured by turning him into a family man. For this, Batman had to be eliminated, and Harley decided to conduct her first solo operation. She single-handedly realized one of the abandoned plans of the clown maniac: put to sleep Batman, tied him up and hung him above the tank with piranhas. That would have ended the path of the Dark Knight if he had not convinced Harley to invite the Joker to watch his death. The Joker, angry that his girlfriend defeated Batman before him, beat her and freed the shackled hero with almost an apology, which he counted on.

Harley managed the incredible - she made Batman laugh! The laughter turned out to be creepy and unpleasant, but nonetheless ... Although Harley’s plan ultimately failed, she crawled closer to the Joker’s main goal than himself. Such a criminal talent could not arise out of nowhere. As Batman himself noted, Harley Quinn was not an angel from the start. Advances in gymnastics provided her with a place at Gotham University, where she intended to receive a prestigious degree in psychiatry - no matter thanks to diligent study or affair with teachers. Not every doctor can withstand work in Arkham, but Harley bravely went straight to the mouth of a lion, and the Joker not only stupefied the girl, but revealed her hidden talents. Despite the huge popularity of the character, seven years passed between the appearance of Harley Quinn in the animated series and in the main comic book series. The comic Harley began to grim less and with the help of Poison Ivy gained some superpowers: increased dexterity, stamina and immunity to poisons.

Harley and Ivy immediately became friends. Once they hypnotized Bruce Wayne himself and went shopping. At his expense, of course Another convention of the animated series, which could not remain constant for a long time in comic reality, is the relationship of Harley and Mr. Jay. Work with someone in a pair not in the style of the Joker, be it an accomplice or a lover. Whatever Dr Quinzel thought to herself, the Joker was indeed a psychopath, incapable of empathy and caring for anyone other than himself. Harley did not affect the clown’s bad habit of getting rid of her accomplices, but the girl still had to get out of an unhealthy relationship.

New Harley puts on her old outfit only if a retro-style party is scheduled In terms of obsession, Harley Quinn is a reflection of the Joker. As the Joker is obsessed with Batman, so Harley was so passionate about the Joker that she was ready to sacrifice her life for the maniac. And although she retained this trait later, in some ways Harley was able to become higher than the ex-boyfriend. In her own comic series, Harley Quinn, with the help of Poison Ivy, finally abandoned the Joker and tried to organize her own gang, survived death and resurrection. We were also told about Harley's early bad relationship with student Guy Kopsky, whose suicide severely injured her. Harley honestly tried to get rid of the criminal past, undergoing treatment in Arkham. Later, she joined the Secret Six team, whose task is to complete dangerous missions that are morally ambiguous. Among Harley's colleagues were other Batman's enemies - Bane, Deadshot and Catman. However, for a long time she did not spend among her colleagues: endless showdowns within the team and uncertain prospects did not give the heroine any hope of restoring her reputation.

The Joker's severed face on the Deadshot is one of the most shocking scenes in The Suicide Squad. At least for deadshot The Gotham Sirens series tells of the adventures of Harley Quinn, Poison Ivy and Catwoman, who settled in the same apartment and made a promise to help each other. All three “sirens” have a flexible attitude to the law, but each has her own fad, and this has more than once led to clashes - for example, when the eco-activist Catwoman tried to convince Harley to hand over tame hyenas to the zoo. Or when Harley decided to avenge the Joker for everything he did to her and tried to kill him in Arkham, but then changed her mind and helped him out, and only the intervention of Batman and Catwoman saved the hospital from new repairs and the need to update the staff. The next restart of the DC universe made adjustments to the history of Harley's origin: for example, her white skin is no longer the result of makeup, but the consequences of a fall into the chemicals where the Joker pushed her. Harlequin's suit was replaced by a topic, leather shorts and fishnet tights.

Gotham Sirens were also supposed to be a movie, but the uncertainty with Squad suicides ”forced DC to postpone filming at least until the release of“ Birds of Prey ” Harley Quinn is an incomparably better team player than the Joker, and Amanda Waller, a government agent and creator of the Suicide Squad, has noticed it. The detachment got its name for a reason - it was based on death row inmates, whom Waller almost stole from an electric chair to use their skills to complete dangerous missions. In addition to Harley, the Squad included Rick Flag, Katana, Captain Boomerang, Black Manta and already known to our heroine from the Secret Six Deadshot, with whom Quinn had an affair. Each member of the detachment was implanted with a micro-bomb, which was supposed to explode in case of disobedience. After one of the missions, the guard of the prison where the Detachment was kept accidentally disconnected the bomb inside Harley, and she escaped. Waller could not allow the loss of control even of one of her people and sent the entire Squad to return Harley - alive or dead Participation in the Suicide Squad can be called a turning point for Harley Quinn. In the past ten years, she has been portrayed as an antiheroine rather than a villain. And although her mental health still leaves much to be desired, the desire to constantly improve is an integral part of the new Harley, which is trying to return to work as a doctor, appreciates human life and cares for the environment. Harley was able to get rid of the label "girlfriend of the Joker" - and from the clown himself, too, and this is perhaps her main victory. Her life path is the path of an ambitious woman who quit her career for the sake of a relationship that brought her nothing but pain, and then struggled for a long time to regain her own voice and opinion. It was also difficult because the Joker, although not able to experience human affection, was jealous of Harley, considering her his property.

Mr. Jay is also Bluebeard now? As if he had few bodies on his account! Quinn needed to be free, but her heart could not remain idle for a long time. Therefore, for geeks, the transition from Harley Quinn and Poison Ivy from friendly to romantic did not come as a surprise. Harley and Ivy are an even more successful criminal duet than Harley and Joker, if only because Ivy does not try to periodically kill a partner. Pamela Aili (Ivy's real name) helped Harley survive the eternal mood swings of the Joker, each time noting how terribly he treats her, and encouraged her to get out of a humiliating relationship

The animated series "Batman" The close friendship of Harley and Ivy has always made readers wonder if it has boundaries. Paul Dini himself in a special edition of “The Adventures of Batgirl” back in 1998 hinted at a connection between the heroines, but their romance was officially confirmed only in 2015, when DC considered that the public was ready for this. Harley Quinn is a child of a new era, if you like, a millennial. It was no accident that she first appeared not in comics, but on television. She was a complex and interesting character from the very beginning, and without a story about Harley's tricks in a variety of games, cartoons, films and non-canonical comics, her portrait will be incomplete. The gallery of her reflections shows the widest range of this anti-heroine artist, who easily juggles with various personalities. For fans, the first and most important Harley is, of course, the charm drawn by Bruce Timm and voiced by Arlene Sorkin in the animated series Batman. Paul Dini wrote her line so believably and witty that this image is still loved by fans. “Batman of the Future” is a kind of cyberpunk continuation of the animated series “Batman” with the previous team of creators.

The Return of the Joker In the feature film The Return of the Joker, released within its framework, Harley Quinn appeared briefly, but left a lasting impression. There she is a grumpy grandmother who picks up her troubled granddaughters from prison and grumbles at the youth! In this universe, Harley renounces the Joker and devotes himself to raising their common daughter. True, before this, she participates in the abduction of Robin (Tim Drake), his torture and transformation into the Joker Jr. Apparently, then a conscience woke up in Harley. On the alternative Earth-3, the Joker is a successful comedian, and not least thanks to his manager Harlin Quinsel. Unfortunately, Oulman (the evil version of Batman) kills her violently, and the comedian becomes the superhero Jokster. In non-cartoon comics, Harley first appeared in 1997 in the Thrillkiller series, which told what would happen if Batman and Robin were heroic in the early 1960s. Unlike the comedy show with Adam West, these stories were grim and realistic. Harley's name is Haley Fitzpatrick, and she dresses with Harlequin to help the female version of the Joker named Bianca Steeplechase. By the way, Bianca treats her better than any of the male versions of the Joker! True, in the end Biancu is killed by Batgirl, and Haley promises to avenge her beloved.

Thrillkiller In the 2004 Batman Punch comic strip, Harley had her own talk show where she gave out terrible psychology advice to callers who called. When the show was taken off the air, she teamed up with the Joker and became a supervillain. In the games of the Arkham series, Harley is the faithful assistant to the Joker. After the death of her lover, she mourns and even captures Batman, which is dedicated to the addition to Arhkam City - "Harley Quinn's Revenge". In the Injustice fighting game, Quinn reacts differently to the Joker’s death: it unites with the Green Arrow and enters into resistance to Superman’s totalitarian regime. The comic, which reveals the plot of the game, tells about Harley’s friendship with Black Canary, as well as about Quinn's pregnancy and about the problems that a baby from a supervillain could entail. And if you go through the staircase mode for Harley, then in the end she herself will kill the Joker - right at the wedding! You shouldn’t dunk her face in a cake on such a day ...

Batman Kick In the brutal Joker comic book, Brian Azzarello Harley is the silent and most trusted assistant to the Joker, who has just left Arkham and is trying to get his money and territory back. She dances a striptease and backstage flaunts the careless accomplices of the Joker, who in this comic book not only does not yell at Harley, but also sobs, hugging her. In the sequel to The Joker, the comic strip Batman: The Damned, it turns out that Batman has cracked down on the Joker and is now suffering from having committed the murder. Here, Harley gains a voice, decides on an operation to become like the Joker, and paralyzes Batman, trying to rape him. In the comic strip The White Knight, it turns out that Harley was two characters. The first of them, Harlin Quinzel, left the Joker when he killed Robin. The second, Marian Druze, replaced her, which the Joker did not even notice. When the offender is cured of madness and just becomes Jack Napier again, Marian hits him and scoffs at him for being “normal.” Then Harlin appears, stuns Marian and reveals the truth to Jack: she loved Mr. Jay in spite of his shortcomings, and Marian - only for them.

Comic "The White Knight" In the neonaric comic strip Joker / Harley: Sanity, Harley is the main character, a high-profile psychiatrist who compiles psychological portraits of serial killers in Gotham, in which Batman does not smell. A few years ago her friend was killed; the maniac was never found. Now, crimes with a similar handwriting have resumed, and for Harley, this investigation becomes a private matter. The Harlin comic focuses on Harley's crush. The reader will go all the way with the girl — from the affair with the professor, whom the whole college learned about, to the first murder, after which there was no turning back. The Harlin feature is that in this comic strip, the Joker is portrayed as incredibly attractive, almost like Jared Leto.

Joker / Harley: Sanity Few people remember, but "Birds of Prey" were already on television! Such a series was shown in the early 2000s, and Harley Quinn performed by Mia Sarah who was the main antagonist desiring domination over the whole city of New Gotham. Harley doesn't wear a costume, but her final dress is a bit like Harlequin’s familiar outfit. The series lasted only one season.

According to the plot of the recent animated series, which is simply called "Harley Quinn", Harley finally gets tired of the fact that the Joker is pushing her and wants to become his full partner in the criminal business. When the “pie” is expectedly refused, Harley throws it and collects her own team of bad-luck villains, who have something to prove to seasoned colleagues. Her faithful friend Poison Ivy does not forget to remind Quinn that she is strong and will surely cope on her own (the topic of their lesbian relations in the animated series is not affected). By the way, Harley was voiced in this show by Kaylee Kuoko - Penny from The Big Bang Theory. And Kaylee's TBV colleague, Melissa Rausch (Bernadette), has already managed to voice Harley in the 2017 Batman and Harley Quinn cartoon.

The series "Gotham" also had her own Harley Quinn - her role was played by Francesca Ruth-Dodson. This Harley combined the features of several DC characters, but something was recognizable: a black and red suit, the brand name “pie” and complete devotion to proto-Joker Jeremiah Waleske.

Of course, for the mass audience, the main Harley is Margot Robbie from The Suicide Squad and the upcoming Birds of Prey. Robbie, a star of the first magnitude, according to the recognition of the "father" of the character Paul Dini, just fell into the image, making the already recognizable anti-heroine, superpopular.

The Suicide Squad is phenomenal in its own way. The film gathered a huge box office with low critics, was recognized as a victim of editing and will soon undergo a soft restart by James Gann. At the same time, Harley stepped dry from the chemical tub - the image created by Margot Robbie was too memorable to disappear in vain. But her interaction with the Joker pimp played by Jared Leto will definitely be reworked. Harley in “Suicide Squad” is a sheep led by a glamorous psychopath, ready for anything for her “daddy”. Surprisingly, the Joker in the film does not seem to be heartless and even cares about Harley, but we hardly see the continuation of their romance. In the Bird of Prey trailer, Harley cheerfully states that she broke up with Mr. Jay and will now go her own way - along with fighting friends Huntress, Black Canary, detective Rene Montoya and young Cassandra Kane. This team will confront the narcissistic gangster Black Mask. Thus, the film will catch up with the comic and television trend towards the emancipation of Harley, which has gone from under the joker's tyrannical hand.

Harley Quinn is a truly deep character who managed to survive an intense evolution despite her youth. Take a look at Batman with the Joker - their relationship has not changed for decades! But the own way of the cheerful Cheerleader distinguishes her from a handful of ossified veterans. Being a fearless hero or an insidious villain is nothing. To be a bad guy, to improve, become the first number and increase interest in yourself is doubly difficult. Now is a great time for strong heroines, and Harley Quinn is one of the most interesting and lively ones. Read the full article

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