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oatmealpeople · 3 years

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Non-Platonic Ships with AroAce Characters: An Entire Goddamn Guide of what not to say.

So,

you’re an allo fan(artist) who shipped an aroace character.

This is now especially relevant in the time of our lord and saviour, Yelena Belova. Many people have been creating ships without taking into account her queer identity. But no worries! Nothing a little bit of taking accountability and listening to the affected community can’t fix!

Just make sure you actually do that and don’t just say;

“Well Aro/acespec people can still be in relationships and have sex”

yes they can... with nuance. Was there a genuine care about the relationship between that person’s aroace identity and relationship to romance/sex? Did you do your research on sex/romance favourability? on gray/demi, etc. aro/ace experiences? Was their Aspec identity integral to how you depicted their character and interactions? There is perspective needed to portray aro/ace experience that is relevant to partnership/relationship narratives.

The majority of the time, this excuse of ace/aro people existing in relationships/partnerships is used as a convenient loophole. Escaping accountability for contributing to the erasure of an aro/ace character’s identity by a creating a romantic/sexual dynamic without considering it.

“Its only canon in the comics, not the MCU”

“Don’t get mad at other fans, get mad at the studio!”

By this logic, any blatant erasure/censorship of a queer character’s sexuality onscreen (e.g. Valkyrie and Ayo) shouldn’t bother you? Fanworks created that ignore a character’s queer identity are fine? Any report of a queer identity being stolen from an onscreen adaption of a character has been met with backlash. Of course there was! There are so many identities and experiences that intersect and represent all parts of a person. Someone’s sexuality isn’t only relevant for who they are attracted to, but all affects facets of who they are. It removes the intimacy in relatability you have to a character, they can become uncomfortable and unrecognisable.

There has been no statement from Marvel or any official source about the future of Yelena’s love-life. The only article issued is from ScreenRant and is an opinion piece about how they could hypothetically, produce a relationship for Bucky and Yelena. Saying they could use Yelena’s proximity and assassin experience in the red room to be Natasha’s replacement in a relationship based from Natasha and Bucky’s relationship in the comics. Hey Siri, play the second stanza of Washing Machine Heart by Mitski.

Basically, what I’m saying is that the studio hasn’t said anything and aro/ace people have the right to give a fuck about erasure and representation and not tolerate bullshit. Erasure and invalidation can come from anyone, people have a right to feel upset and receive empathy when they feel invisible.

“She’s only inferred to be ace in the comics, not aro”

There are two pieces of evidence that are frequently referenced when it comes to Yelena’s ace and aro identities. And yes, its indicative of the existence of both.

First of all the comic panel.

Nikki: Maybe it’s your kink, that’s why. Starkovsky always though you were a lesbian... So I thought I should ask.

Yelena: No I’m not a lesbian, I’m not... Anything.

I guess if you were to interpret talking about kink as inference of sex and sexual attraction, you would see this as only validation in her ace identity. But the way Yelena says that she isn’t “anything”, wouldn’t that stretch over both sexual and romantic facets of attraction? Regardless, it is ace affirming.

The next piece of evidence is an interview with writer Devin Grayson, “...and (Yelena) probably more likely to identify as asexual than to follow Nat’s romantic path...” This seems like a case of miscommunication/misunderstanding. A common misconception to people not familiar with aspec identities, is thinking asexuality is indicative of aromanticism. In case you are one of those people, no, it is not.

Asexual and Aromantic, as labels, are completely independent of each other. Asexuality regarding sexual attraction and Aromantic regarding romantic. It doesn’t make sense to be talking about Natasha’s “romantic paths” and then equate the inverse that is Yelena’s romantic path to asexuality. Ergo, Yelena is aromantic.

In conclusion,

I am tired, it is 3:30am and I ran out of my last fuck to give. Ace/Aro people are queer, Ace/Aro people are queer enough, we deserve representation too. Amen Hallelujah Yahtzee Goodnight.

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angelsndragons · 3 years

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i know that's not where you (or anyone else, at least from what i've seen so far) are coming from, but i think the reason it's easy to get defensive is because of how often, when a character is revealed to be aspec, it leads to posts about how that doesn't have to interfere with shipping (like because they might be grey-ace or grey-ro, in cases where their exact orientation isn't known), and it can feel dismissive even when that's not what's intended. and added to that, there is no (widely-known) term for shipping non-romantically or non-sexually, which makes it harder to distinguish between shipping that respects a character being ace or aro and shipping that ignores or erases it. (not that that means we should attack shippers, i just wanted to offer a different perspective. also apologies if this isn't super coherent, it's 2am for me)

Hello, anon, I hope you’re doing well.

So, there are a couple of things I want to address about your statement. Firstly, you are right. I agree it can get annoying when people keep pointing out that aro and/or ace characters can end up in relationships after a reveal. I understand that sometimes, it can feel like allos are trying to create a ‘well, they’re not that different from us’ narrative and package us into something that more palatable or acceptable to them and the allonormative society we live in. Yes, it can feel dismissive, as though we are not whole people unless we have the potential to enter into a “normal” relationship. I get it. It is also maddening sometimes how little attention characters get outside of potential romantic and/or sexual partnerships.

That said, I also don’t want to dismiss the aros and/or aces who choose to enter into what looks to be an allonormative relationship and who also would like some representation or who would like to write a character like them. But here’s the thing: this is the internet and you cannot tell who the person on the other end is. I also find myself wary of saying ‘only the good allos can write a story with an aroace character in a relationship.’ Not only because, again, aroace relationships and statuses are nuanced. Not only because our side of the equation finally factors into people’s perception of a character for once. Not only because this is a good learning opportunity for allos when it comes to our experiences.

Fans should be allowed to create what they want when they want, period. Yes, even offensive garbage. That is what the tags and blocking are for. I agree with you that we will have to create a few new tags as a fandom to better curate everyone’s experiences. This takes time, patience, and a willingness to assume good faith. It’s a good problem to have.

I do want to say, however, that a person’s relationship status does not change their romantic or sexual orientations. It doesn’t. You might as well say that a single person isn’t het, gay, bi, or many of the myriad of romantic and sexual orientations out there because they’re not in a relationship. An aroace person being in a relationship doesn’t change the fact that they are aroace. Writing an aroace character who has a “romantic” partner or has sex does not erase that character’s aroace identity. Are there better and worse ways to write said relationship? Absolutely. Are people wrong for wanting a way to pick out who is writing that relationship better? No, of course not. That’s why I ask people to boost the content they want and to be patient as the fandom finds better ways of tagging. Amplify and praise the people who write the character and the relationship in a way you find satisfying so that others can find them. So that we can say ‘hey, look, that looks like us, good job.’ Or find people who avoid writing relationships altogether and boost them.

Bottom line, Caduceus is canonically aroace, no one can take that away from us, any more than fans can take away Beau’s canonically a lesbian. I appreciate everyone trying to be civil as we navigate our way into this wonderful new chapter of our fandom.

#my meta #my anon #cr discourse #shipping is not activism #gatekeeping shipping is not activism

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