how is vore not a kink? /genq
we view it as a nonsexual interest, as well as being a plot device.
(gonna use this post for a general explanation btw bc we. hate having to answer this question (/nm at you, anon!!) hsbdjsbf)
discussion of kink under the cut; we know some people arent comfortable with it.
while we understand that the vast majority of the internet views vore as a kink and a kink only, not everyone views it in that way.
if we saw vore as a kink, we would not be making vore relating to minor characters in any way. The line between the real people and their characters gets blurred a lot in the MCYT community, speaking from personal experience there. (edit, seeing as this has been circulating recently: we no longer post mcyt content for many reasons, but we want to clarify that ALL of our mcyt content was only of the characters, never of the real people. sorry for any confusion!)
outside of the content we make, we also enjoy vore because the idea of just. having a living, breathing person inside of you is a really fascinating concept to us, as well as all the cool plot points you can use it in!
take, for example, ice age; dawn of the dinosaurs. that movie had a TON of vore-esk scenes (buck's flashback, that one plant scene, there's a ton of others), but you wouldn't say those are kinky because, simply put, they arent supposed to be, but they're still technically considered vore.
long story short though, we don't view vore as a kink for the following reasons:
There is an entire community here on tumblr dedicated to SFW, non-sexual vore
We use vore specifically for plot points or fluff; we never have and never plan to use vore in a sexual way in any of our content because, well, we're sex-repulsed.
Vore can exist outside of its usual circle, but its not usually considered vore by onlookers at that point.
Vore is, to be honest with ya, only sexual if the writer (or artist/animator in some cases) intends it to be. People can take it sexually, yeah, but it doesn't have to be.
why would we make kink of characters that often get confused with real people??????
thank you everyone for coming to our TedTalk, and i hope this also answers the question for other people.
sidenote; please dont like. yell at us in our inbox if you disagree. we literally lost an entire friend group over this exact topic.
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Kamen Rider Stronger
finished April 20, 2023
i forgot i finished this on 4/20. LONG POST WARNING!!
Okay, before I start this one, holy shit I’ve done so much since the last time I wrote one of these. Let me get back into the groove here. Stronger is in a weird spot where I feel like I have to recap a lot to talk about what I want to talk about so there’s going to be a lot of that. This one builds. Let me convince you that General Shadow is an interesting character.
AS ALWAYS: I’ll be dropping spoilers willy-nilly for like every series leading up to this + all of Stronger but there's an extra warning before the show ending spoilers. Thank you.
YIPPEE!
I know I've already owned up to it but at this point let's make it official... Showa Rider might be made for me? Every single time I try to think back about what I just watched to write about it I'm hit with the exact same thought: holy shit, that was SO fun. It is, it really is and always is. I had a blast, thanks. This is also the first time I've really felt like the way that I'm watching this (by starting at the very beginning and just blasting through season by season) has actually paid off! The past couple seasons have gotten interestingly experimental but Stronger feels like they were attempting to return to form while still using the knowledge they learned along the way. It's kind of adjacent to how V3 felt like '71 Rider refined; Jo Shigeru came in like "we are SO fucking back."
The comparison between V3 and Stronger extends to the main characters too; I think that Kazami and Shigeru are more alike than not. We've been rotating protags (sans Hayato, sorry babe but you’re special in my eyes) in a pattern I've described as "sensory issues -> batshit -> wet" where for as much as I compared Hongo and Amazon to each other in the "the world is so loud and scary and I can't trust myself to not lash out and that scares me more" department I have to do the same for Kazami and Shigeru in the "hey boss, I'm gonna go fucking, I don't know, dig this bullet out of my shoulder with a knife I cleaned by spitting on it and then electrocute myself for funsies" department. Like okay, take a look at this list I whipped up here:
Both Kazami and Shigeru wanted to become borgs to avenge people who were dear to them and killed by the organizations in their respective series; Kazami for his family and Shigeru for his friend. Though Shigeru went straight to the source while Kazami tried to convince Hongo and Hayato to borg him first to no avail, you can’t tell me that Kazami didn’t jump into that beam and save the two of them and not think that might win him brownie points that he could then later use to convince the two of them that yes, this is the right thing to do and he would be a great addition to the team.
Both of them have another Rider with them (I count Tackle!) who aren’t really… fully borged? Yuki isn’t for sure, he’s just got the arm; I’m not sure exactly whether or not Yuriko is a full borg because I don’t believe they straight up address that in the show but they sure didn’t address her like one and I’ve heard some things (...we’ll get into this later) that would lead me to believe that she was meant to be only partially there originally and get to full borgification by the end of the show. Both of them fought with the respective riders they were paired with. Also, both of their mouths are out in their suits! Very cute!
Speaking of suits, both of them have very silly little suits that I don’t think anyone else in the series could pull off wearing. Imagine if Keisuke transformed into V3 or something. I think I’d cry looking at that. Hayato as Stronger? Man, he doesn’t have the sheer balls for that one. Sorry king…
Which of course leads me to: they’ve both got huge egos. I really don’t need to elaborate on this one, look at the shit the two of them pull… Kazami a little more in the physical department with the stunts he does and Shigeru socially with his cockiness, but you can see the comparison, right?
And before we go on I think I need to clarify something: Shigeru jumping himself with his bike is very very real. That is actually a scene that happens. Anyway! I adore the way that the show started off and Shigeru and Yuriko had already been through their borg procedures and that the first time we meet them they're already fighting. It's a nice break from tradition! It feels fresh and new! I also think that it's one of the only ways that you could possibly sell how they borged Shigeru in a way that would make sense in a children's show. They gave him electric hands? Like, metal hands that he has to wear gloves over lest he fucking electrocute everyone? There had to have been an adjustment period there but by the time we meet him he's fine with things. I think this was probably the right call; while I love myself some good borg angst and it's interesting to see them adapt to their new lives and Ishinomori back me up here I think you would agree that exploring this idea is fun... for the way that Shigeru is borged specifically I think there's a little too much room for things to go south way too fast. Those two concepts can coexist in my mind. Can you imagine what it would have been like if he had tried to go swimming or something?
After the first episode we do get a flashback in the second to exactly how Shigeru got borged which was basically:
Shigeru: [walks into Black Satan] hey I want to be on your side I love facism
Scientists: ok what borgification u want
Shigeru: just fuck me up and make me stronger
Scientist: okay [electric hands]
Shigeru, Stronger: haha fuckin idiot I’m actually here for revenge! you killed my friend and I hate nazis. taste the powers you gave me [explodes them]
And then he escapes, taking Yuriko (Tackle) with him. From the start he’s really cocky! My remark as I was watching the show was that he really feels like he can do anything because he just doesn’t give a shit about the social implications of anything that he does. Take him just walking into a lighthouse, getting stopped by the guard who works there, patting the guy down and being like “alright, well, you’re not a monster I guess,” and leaving. He’s silly and kind of rude to Tachibana (when he shows up) and has a “Who are you?” “What? Don’t you know who I am?” exchange with all the monsters he meets. He has a whole damn speech he does every time he transforms. It’s so good!
^ HE GOES :D
While this might have set Yuriko up to be the Female Straight Man (which she kind of is for him a little) she’ll rib Tachibana or the two of them will team up and slander a monster together. I love the way they interact… I think it helps them remain on pretty equal footing even though Shigeru is absolutely the primary fighter. He still leaves things to her and trusts her to do them. I don’t think she’s fully borged - she’s never referred to as such and instead gets the term… what’s it in English, electrowave human? So she can do special attacks and such. It kind of feels like a Taki type role but stronger? Not exactly; a lot of Taki’s importance in ‘71 Rider comes from the fact that he is fully human and able to keep up with them to contrast Hongo and Hayato, but Shigeru doesn’t have the same need to connect with his humanity as they do (being borged was his choice, after all) and as such I think Yuriko fits with him much better. If we let Tackle and Taki 1v1 I think Tackle would sweep.
You see what I mean about Stronger seemingly learning from and refining the previous series? There’s not a way that I can talk about it without contrasting it – I think this is the point where I would stop and say that if you’re thinking about taking on the Grand Prix for yourself in full or in part and would like Stronger to be one of the series you watch to watch whichever of the series come chronologically before this that you are also interested in partaking before starting Stronger. I personally believe that there can be a lot of value in experiencing things in reverse order [<- guy who played the Layton series backwards and loved it] but also… I think that seeing things build up to Stronger as opposed to experiencing Stronger and then going behind the scenes to take a look at the building blocks is the way to go. Nowhere is that more apparently in my opinion than with:
Hey man, what if the Generals fucked?
^ he's calling the cops on me for that one
Maybe this was the part of the series I was most excited to talk about. Don’t worry about it. So far I’ve pitched Stronger like a continuation of ‘71 Rider to V3 which I’d say the main cast falls into; there’s not really a lot of the others in Shigeru… but if we’re talking villain generals? We’re talking X, baby. I think that meeting Apollo Geist first is absolutely essential if X is something you’re planning on watching (don’t watch X but like, watch X) so that you can see the fields from which Titan was grown. I have it on anecdotal evidence that doing things non-chrono and going back to watch X and therefore meeting Apollo Geist post Stronger feels a little underwhelming, but meeting Apollo Geist fresh off the heels of V3 feels correct and the ramp up in Stronger comes naturally. All of that to say: we’re back with the sexual tension, but it’s even more nuts this time.
There’s one scene in X where civvie Apollo Geist shows up at Tachibana’s coffee shop and sits down at the counter to order. He asks where Keisuke is; Tachibana tells him that he’s out, and inquires as to how this man (who has not introduced himself) knows Keisuke. An old friend, perhaps? Apollo Geist shrugs – something like that. It feels like Titan took that scene and decided to build his entire goddamn character around it.
^ man what the hell was this pick up line
Remember earlier when I mentioned that none of the monsters seem to know who Stronger is? That’s very much true, but Titan absolutely knows. He follows him around and smokes his stupid little cigarettes from his stupid little cigarette holder and just watches him. Titan’s obsessed with this man but whereas with Apollo Geist all the monsters were like “oh fuck yeah, let’s tie up X and drag him back, I’m sure that would make Apollo Geist happy,” it almost seems like Titan wants to keep Stronger for himself and just… doesn’t tell anyone about him. He’s possessive. He’s really intense about it. He is also using X-era techniques which didn’t even end up working against Keisuke to try and get Shigeru, of all people. It’s a fascinating strategy. The two of them follow each other to a concert and just stare at each other across the hall. Titan doesn’t really get his ass kicked, but he knows he’s not strong enough yet for Stronger. He upgrades himself. He fucking goes for it. And Titan… dies.
Well, let’s put a pin in that for a second. In any case, we need a new general, because that’s how these things go. Despite looking like a cross between an anatomical model, an astronaut, and the fucking Joker, Shadow is oddly compelling as a character to me in a way I have absolutely no idea how to describe or talk about? He’s not actually a part of Black Satan – he just kind of heard that Black Satan was fighting Stronger and was like “well shit, I want a piece of that, let me in,” and is just kind of here now. He proclaims so to Shigeru upon meeting him. Shadow really likes to play whatever game he thinks is going on by his own rules and he seems to have a blast doing so. He’s enigmatic, he’s fresh, he’s unlike any general that we’ve had before. His weird secretive nature almost makes him seem more like the leader type than the general type. Shigeru seems to understand that Shadow’s much more of a sinister threat than Titan, but doesn’t really seem to know what to do about it.
Let me quickly detour you another time just to finish setting up this stage here: throughout my time watching Stronger I was also working on over easy, you know, that Donbros comic I made! Still really like that thing. I know I and others have joked about Tarou being Showa-coded and honestly if you were to pick him up and place him down in a 70’s Rider series I think he’d be right at home; I mentioned up top that Shigeru doesn’t seem to give a shit about societal expectations and while I think that Tarou gives a little more of a shit about the consequences (seems to have less of a grasp on how the implications actually work though) I’m fine putting them in a similar category. Did you know Inoue’s dad worked on Stronger? That’s a fun little fact for you.
Okay, time to get back to the show.
Titan gets one funeral (which Shigeru gets invited to in the funniest way, by just Being in a field while this was announced to him somehow) but it was kind of a flop and nobody showed up and they didn’t even manage to use it to capture Stronger, so they decide that he needs another one. It’s at this second funeral that Shigeru finds Titan laying in a casket on a bed of roses (yes, just like Shigeru has all over his outfit) and manages to prick his electric hand on one of them, bleeding like a human, directly onto Titan’s lips, who then revives, licks it, and becomes Hundred-Eyes Titan. Buildup’s over, this is where the mad yaoi really starts.
You might now be understanding why I brought up Donbrothers earlier; yes, this scene shares really striking similarities with the time that Tarou got the juice sucked out of him at Sonoi’s funeral but even more homoerotic, because it’s actual blood?
Nevermind the actual Showa-era “how human are cyborgs, really” conversation that’s to be had both in the borg angst sense but also about the fact that he can bleed from his what-I’ve-been-presuming-to-be-metal hands. Again, calling back to X, it’s almost like that point after Apollo Geist got resurrected and was going to die unless he took one of X’s parts and put it in his heart, but this actually happened and wasn’t just theoretical. We’re going past where Apollo Geist got to. If first base is fighting the Rider and home base is actually killing them, I think Titan’s made it to second. Uh, but he’s got a problem getting to third. They’ve already brought in his replacement. There’s only one way to fix this one.
Titan and Shadow Get Divorced
Titan was kind of a flop in his first life. He’s been powered up a little more with Shigeru’s blood, but Shadow’s also been given Titan’s position pretty recently, and it would be a dick move to fire him. Look, usually the generals don’t come back unless the people they’re working for are the ones bringing them back, and they sure as shit weren’t doing that for Titan. Might as well just make them work it out together? For some reason the Black Satan leader seems to think this will work; really all it does is just instantly sets the two of them at each other's throats, and they begin to fight over Stronger.
They get exceptionally petty about it. Titan shows up, with a rose again, leading Stronger into a minefield, also strewn with roses, just to really rub in the whole “haha, your blood revived me” thing. Shadow at a couple points ends up straight up giving information to Shigeru so that he can get the upper hand on Titan. Shadow (who has a playing card theme, by the way, that’s his whole deal) shows Titan one of the cards that he just did a fortune reading with, and who else appears but Jo Shigeru, dripping wet, in the outline of the spade (cropped with the tail not showing) like he’s being framed in a heart.
^ the way he looks at that card just takes me the fuck out every time
I feel like I’m losing my mind every time I think about the two of them. Titan staggers up a dune into the good ol’ Toku Desert, dragging himself to Shadow before Shadow kills Stronger so that he can have the pleasure of at least torturing him a little bit before he goes. Shadow pokes fun at Titan for being like “I’ll be the one to kill Stronger!” with a “are you sure you actually can?” and Titan, hand to my heart, blushes.
Titan staggers up a dune into the good ol’ Toku Desert, dragging himself to Shadow before Shadow kills Stronger so that he can have the pleasure of at least torturing him a little bit before he goes. What the fuck?!
^ DIVORCED BITCHES REALLLLLL
Titan has his own hell! Titan has made his own hell and takes Shadow there to show off his accomplishments in a scene that I can only call “two socialites who desperately need a divorce” in which Titan plays the tired husband who’s got eyes for his secretary (Shigeru) but has to bring his bitch of a wife Shadow with him to work to show off just how much he does for this family while his bitch wife Shadow looks on, unimpressed, and thinks about also fucking his husband’s secretary (still Shigeru) or maybe killing his husband and taking the life insurance money, because there’s no way this plan of his will do anything but collapse down around him, which it does, and Titan once again dies as Stronger throws him back down the crevasse to this pit he’s quite literally dug himself.
Watching the two of them interact is absolutely fascinating. Titan’s passion for Shigeru seems renewed and completely focused now that he has a rival, Shadow’s ignited something in him, and Shadow seems like he’s having fun playing around messing with Titan while enacting his own plans. Shadow turns out to be superstitious, and bases most of his decisions off readings that he does with his deck of cards, which adds an even more fun element to his character. This is the part of the show where he seems the most… I don’t want to say happy, but how about “in his element.” These are all some really good episodes of television and they’re a blast to watch.
Black Satan leader susses out that Shadow’s up to some shit (don’t know how that could have happened, it’s not like he’s been telling everyone he meets or anything) and decides to try and bring in another General instead of letting Shadow lead. Shigeru gets captured, defeats the leader, and Shigeru and Yuriko are the FIRST RIDERS IN HISTORY TO CRACK OPEN A COLD ONE WITH TACHIBANA!!
LIFE IS BEAUTIFUL! THE END!
LET’S GO TO DEMON WORLD! [SHOW END SPOILERS START HERE]
No, things aren’t actually over. This is where you can tell that things got rushed in production as (from what I’ve heard) ratings kind of tanked. Shadow brings in his friends from Demon World (where he lived before?) and decides to start a new army with them called the Delza Army, which he kind of leads. This is what he’s spent his time fighting with Titan and Shigeru and Black Satan secretly working towards - taking over the facilities that Black Satan already had and using them for his own new purpose. And sure, to do this, they need to kill Stronger, yeah.
In much the same way that Titan and Shadow fought with each other, giving Stronger an edge, the Delza Army part of the show is mostly about these characters showing off their weaknesses through their bickering with each other, but there’s a whole fucking throng of them this time around. They each brought their own themed goons with them, and on multiple occasions the goons even begin fighting with each other while Stronger just kind of looks on in confusion and gets a clean path to the monster he’s actually looking to fight. This being backed by scenes of Shadow (somehow) drinking wine listening to one of his compatriots drone on and on makes it seem like he really misses being on the front lines?
^ look all i'm saying is that it looks like it's 2:55 and he's got another meeting with the guy this dude is bitching about at 3 to hear the other side of this story and he hasn't had lunch yet
The thing about the Delza Army is that it’s absolutely a “too many cooks in the kitchen” situation. Shadow’s brought in a bunch of people with conflicting views and outrageous personalities and different fighting styles who spend half the time using him as HR to work out their interpersonal issues and he just seems… tired. He doesn’t seem like a guy who was cut out for management! This is not a new character type by any means, I could name so many characters who get into a position in their job and realize like “nah, actually, I was way happier where I was,” fucking Jim from The Office does it, but it’s a completely new role for any General and like also, this was what he was working for from the beginning. To finally get here and realize that actually, he doesn’t want this, is kind of weirdly fucked and not at all what I was expecting from this show. All of the characters around him have so much personality and character that they’re completely forgettable because of the oversaturation . They went an oddly adult angle with his character and I can’t tell if it’s at all intentional or if it just happened to turn out this way. I don’t personally think that this part of the show is as good as the part with Titan and Shadow fighting, but I feel like that decrease even more helps support the change in Shadow’s character, so it ends up wrapping around to working.
This is also the part where Yuriko dies.
There’s not really much that I can say about that one other than the fact that I’ve heard she was supposed to be brought back later as a full rider this time but, because the show had to be cut, isn’t. I have a story in my mind where the rest of the guys – because they all come back at the end, they have to put on one last big show, and they’ve got a lot of science guys there – manage to jump her back to life in much the same way Shigeru did himself and transform her into a full cyborg, like I said earlier, and that she’d fully join the ranks. I know that there was talk of possibly making Taki V3 or even Riderman, which is another reason I compared the two up top. They could have done that without all of the additional angst that it would have caused the '71 cast to borg Taki since Yuriko's already been modified. It would have been so good... I’ll mention this again I’m sure come Skyrider post, but I really liked his little spotted scarf, mostly because it reminds me of Tackle’s suit. It’s like she did get to be with us in a way!
From there on you get your usual show beats: as mentioned previously, all the previous riders show up which is very fun, they defeat Shadow (who kind of seems relieved to be going out, to be honest) and the rest of the Delza army, and then it’s time to fight the Leader.
^ Tachibana's really silly in this one and but it's the sweetest thing seeing his boys come back to him
The leader this time around is like, I think the quarry come to life? No, but for real: some kind of rock monster that has been pulling the strings of all the different groups that all the different riders have fought. It’s all the same guy behind the scenes. I’ll say it, I kind of appreciated that one as a “no matter what name you put to it, facism is facism” type thing? I don’t think it’s that much of a stretch to interpret it that way. It feels kind of appropriate. The specifics of what they’re fighting change but the root cause and their aim is always the same; though there might be infighting between the groups, Kamen Rider is a show about punching Nazis at its core.
^ and they all love Tachibana so much!
This is the last time (besides the little special) that we get to have Tachibana on the show. There’s a break between this one and Skyrider and you can absolutely feel it looming in the horizon as everyone rides off again. Despite that, Stronger’s a blast of a show! I think this is one where there are absolutely different ways you could watch it and I just managed to take the path where I ended up probably the most satisfied I could have been during the Delza part since I was just watching the degradation of a man in bureaucracy. Which is always, always fun.
TO RECAP:
YES fuck yes I recommend Stronger, with the caveat I gave at the beginning that you should probably watch whichever shows chronologically come before this one that you’re interested in watching before you Tackle Stronger.
Bu dum tss…
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