#might do safe next bc it's not a comic and thus nice to have in between | Explore Tumblr Posts and Blogs

duketectivecomics · 4 years

Note

You might've answered this already and I just didn't find it, but one thing that always perplexed me about Duke was how old he was in comparison to the other Batkids. It's obvious he's younger than Dick and Babs, and I pretty sure he's younger than Jason and Cass, and older than Damian, but I cannot tell if he's meant to be Tim and Steph's ages, younger, or older. Could you help me?

You’re all kinds of good here, anon!!! I answered a similar ask abt the Order of Adoption but didn’t dive into specific ages on that post BECAUSE well they didn’t ask lmaooo but ALSO:

Comic ages are very fluid usually! While Years™️ might pass in the canon proper, or while time seems to slow to a crawl, having a character’s age outright stated is something that occurs very rarely for most characters, if at all!

Because it’s always much easier to have a floating age range to work and play around in! It’s easier to keep a character Perpetually 12 or 16 or 25 or mid-40s or- you get the idea. SO, with that in mind. Let’s do our Best to Break Down What Age Duke Might Be Currently A N D how it might interact with the Other Batkids!

(Warning for a Very Long Post, lots of issue citations, and a LOT of comics terminology regarding specific runs/events/continunity. I’m gonna try to keep it as clear/concise as possible ofc but plz keep these things in mind! If you’re not at least marginally familiar with Bat-Comics, you might find yourself feeling a little lost here!)

So from the Zero Year arc we see a common Trend that plays out pretty consistently with Batfam comics: a Life-Changing Event Occuring while the protag is Young™️.

(Batman (2011) #30)

With how Duke is drawn in these particular issues, and given the trends of the past, I’d place him in the 8-12 range. The historic precedent being ofc that that is the same range that canon usually places both Bruce and Dick at for their Tragedies™; the more benign reason being that he... just very much Looks to be drawn in that Range. He’s very clearly an Older/Prepubescent child here.

Fast Forward to his Next Appearance in the Endgame arc and-

(Batman (2011) #37)

He’s definitely older! He’s wiser! And he’s giving Batman a fistbump lmao. Again, no strict age given here BUT, since they condensed each Robin to a Year or Two tops with Bruce (its n52 and its fucked up is what it is), we can assume it’s been at least 4-5 since Zero Year (which would mean if we go off the age range I proposed for that year, then theoretically he could be anywhere from 12-16 here, and I think that tracks pretty well. Not Perfectly and Certainly Not so well with Pre52 continuity ofc, but I’ll talk about that later!)

In We Are Robin, while its not stated Directly In The Text, it IS given as an Informational Tidbit that Duke is 16 (specifically this can be found at the end of issue #4)! (Sweet sweet canon confirmation FINALLY)

We know that WAR takes place Fairly Soon after Endgame (almost immediately, give or take a month or two given that Duke’s been placed in a few foster homes at this point and has racked up Quite A File) now, again id like to remind y’all that while this is a NICE starting point to have, keep in mind that comics are fluid and this may be retconned slightly/ignored in later stories bc Keeping Duke 16-ish is in DC’s Best Interest at the moment. (Having Relatable Teen Characters afterall is a Good Marketing strategy™️. And the longer they can Keep them Young, the Better)

With that in mind let’s take a moment to Highlight the fact that Duke and Damian have crossed paths at this point AND the storylines that have occurred during this year that were meant to be in conjunction with one another!

Because Prior to Endgame, Damian had Died! And just a year (in real, meat-space time) before We Are Robin, he was resurrected and had begun his “Year of Atonement” in the Robin: Son of Batman maxiseries. Midway through both this series and WAR (and, we can assume, midway thru this “Year” for Damian) the Robin War begins/ends and we see at least one major Moment between these two boys who will soon call one another brothers:

(Robin War #2)

Given that R:SoB is followed up VERY quickly by Teen Titans Rebirth (in which Damian celebrates his 13th birthday), we can conclude that Damian would be 12 during this time (well, 12 and 1/2 to play it safe lmao). That being said, this Confirms about a 4yr gap between Duke and Damian! (One Batkid down at least! but he’s the key to the others so put a pin in him!)

As We Are Robin draws to its conclusion, DC was releasing another arc that would eventually flow into the Rebirth Era, by the end of which, Bruce would approach Duke with an Idea (which involves Bruce becoming Dukes temporary guardian & as he states Many Times “Trying Something New” with Duke).

And thus the Rebirth Era begins, and Duke began his Year of training (most directly encapsulated by the Cursed Wheel arc in the All-Star Batman run:

(All-Star Batman #1 (back-up story))

Bruce introduces Duke to a training regimen that Alfred has named “the Cursed Wheel”. It encompasses all the training Bruce and the other bats have undergone and condenses it down into color-coordinated segments that will take Duke a Year to Complete.

It can be assumed that by the End of this Year Duke will somehow miraculously still be 16, despite, again, an entire ass year passing.

There’s one story that takes place mid-year in All-Star Batman, and the Cursed Wheel is meant to be capped off by Duke’s first Official Day as the Signal (in the titular Batman & the Signal ofc) BUT, near as I can tell after this story, Dukes age is not brought up again. So until they DO bring it up either in Batman & the Outsiders or whatever future run Duke becomes involved in, we can assume DC will be working with the idea that he’s meant to be in that 16-18 range from here on out (ie still a minor).

But, dear anon, you might be saying “okay, that’s cool, but how does that relate to my question abt how he falls in with the other Bats?” You’ll have to be a little patient with me here, but I think I may have cracked the code!

Keep in mind I’m gonna be addressing both the Post-Crisis to Flashpoint Continuity (ie mid-80s to 2010 in comics history) and the N52-slash-Rebirth Era (2010-Today). Its generally agreed by fandom and DC alike that these points of rebooting &/or Major Events constitute the era of “Modern” comics, and that everything from the 80s-on might more or less be canon on some level, even if not All of it is.

(Plus, most of fandom usually likes to borrow elements from both eras and much more rarely from stories before it, SO-)

Lets do a quick rundown of how everyone who’s Closer to Duke’s Age, Relates to each other first, age-wise:

Given that Jason was 15 when he died, in A Lonely Place of Dying its established that Bruce had become increasingly reckless since his death, and by the end of the story, Tim has stepped in to fill Robin’s shoes (he states that he’s 13 during this story btw). Pretty soon after, Stephanie Brown is introduced & established to be about a year older than Tim (wish I could pin-point a specific issue BUT, i unfortunately haven’t read any Tim OR Steph-involved comics that predate No Man’s Land... Besides the aforementioned Lonely Place and Young Justice technically, but im working on remedying that soon!)

NOW, during the No Man’s Land event, Cassandra is introduced, and pretty soon into her Batgirl run, its revealed that she’s around the same age as Jason (or at least how old he Would Have Been, had he not died.) Now, given that Jay has an August bday and Cass has a January one, fandom sometimes likes to play around with the idea of one being older than the other (OR even speculating/placing them in an AU as twins/siblings, given that Lady Shiva (Cass’ mom) was a Possible Candidate to be Jason’s biological mother but that’s a Whole Other Thing i wont get into here.)

The point being, Cass, in this era of comics, IS slightly older than Tim and Steph. At Tim’s start as Robin, their ages could either line up like: Tim-13, Steph-14, Cass-15 (being a few months ‘behind’ Jay), then Jason at 15/16 (depending on how soon Tim filled the role after Jay died in April) OR Jason-15/16, Cass-16/17 (in this case she’d be a few months ‘ahead’ now instead)

So brief detour to talk New 52, however! Because Tim, Steph & Cass all got switched around from where DC originally left them prior to the reboot! Now I haven’t read much of them in this era, other than Batman & Robin: Eternal, so my Understanding of their current ages is Spotty at Best. The general consensus seems to be that while before N52, Stephanie had been attending her first year of College (& doing VERY WELL i might add), with the reboot she was set back a few years alongside Tim to a vague Late-Teen state (so 16-18-ish, instead of a Very Clearly Established 18/19). Cass is probably the worst off for this reboot, given that B&R:E basically constitutes her new origin for the new continuity, and does nothing to confirm her age (all I really know is that she’s a Vague Late-Teen too... Probably? Maybe?), given how much they infantilize her, and subsequently how fandom in turn has taken to infantilizing her too, theres a semi-popular fanon that places her Younger that Tim and Steph. And I, for one, propose that we ignore that bc its Weak Sauce my dudes.

Some fans chose to ignore N52 continuity due to this vagueness, and will stick to the ages established before the N52/Rebirth reboots. But its something to keep in mind regardless bc we’re all obviously going to pull from what’s most familiar to us!

But WHERE could we place Duke with regards to them, then? Because them being “Late Teens” is certainly much too vague to work with!

This is Where Damian is the key!

Because Damian is one of those rare exceptions to the Reboot Rule. His story flowed almost seamlessly over from before to after. While he was made a Robin at the age of 10, he continued to grow and learn even after the universe was being rewritten to suit the whims of DC editorial.

If we choose to ignore how everyone else’s ages and origins were swapped around, and stick with the growth that was presented before the reboot, then we can draw some interesting conclusions!

Firstly, though Stephanie also had Died and subsequently Returned, she hadn’t lost much, if any time, from the Ordeal. At the start of her Batgirl run, she is enrolled at a Gotham university and making headway with a more firm foot in the Batfamily (even to the point that she and Damian spend a few issues bonding. At this point in time, Damian is definitely 11, and again, Steph can be assumed to be 18/19 during the course of her run. We’ll assume 18 for clarity’s sake.)

So, then when Damian is 11, now our line up is as Follows:

Dami - 11, Steph - 18, Tim - 17, Cass 19-21 (the range depending again, if you subscribe to Cass being either older/younger than Jason).

WHICH MEANS, If during Robin War Damian is 12 (and a half) THEN We’ve got an age line-up that Potentially looks Like This:

Dami -12(and 1/2), Duke - 16, Tim - 18, Steph - 19, Cass - 20-22 (And Obvsly Jason, Babs & Dick at their varying Older Ages than everyone here)

and im just now realizing i Didnt include Harper in this line-up, but thats bc she’d also throw a big wrench in all this. I’d personally throw her in with being Steph’s age, but I’m pretty sure she was supposed to be either that, or between Steph and Cass (again, since its N52, i believe Cass was/is assumed to be Younger than Steph, but that contradicts the assumed following of pre52 canon that we have for the above line-up, obvsly, and so we ignore that lmao)

All this to say, however, that canon and fandom is what you make of it, and if you want to wiggle these ages around a little, you’re more than allowed! God Knows i usually like to skew the Tim-Steph-Cass age group to be a tad older than this in my own fic writing, and I like to have Duke start as a Robin at 14/15 instead of 16, but that’s just bc I like the dynamic potential it could bring with them being Definitively Older that him, and thus in a more secure place to be Mentoring him right alongside Bruce & the others.

But you might see these age ranges and want to do something Different (say, making Tim, Steph, Cass, & Duke all the Same Age at 17 instead! And that very well tracks with how current comics kinda looks right now!) and you’re absolutely valid to do so! Because again, comic character’s ages are meant to be fluid, not fixed!

And at the end of the day, its all about wanting to see these teen heroes kick serious ass haha

#duke thomas #guest starring:#batfamily #damian wayne #tim drake #stephanie brown #cassandra cain #randywrites #randys meta #meta #asked and answered #anonymous asks #this was A LOT and i tried to throw some humor where i could #but uhhhh yeah!!! i hope this helps anon!!!#also just realizing its TWO AM WHERE DID THE TIME GO #ah well. Worth It

108 notes · View notes

hateful1979 · 3 years

Note

loki finale ask (finally)

tbf i didn’t really go in blind because i am an internet addict. parts that were already spoiled for me include:

mobius doesnt know who loki is 😭

sylvie and loki kiss (why!) & she immediately transports him back to the tva. so presumably wasn't actually that romantic, just manipulative (still bad)

the multiverse gets created

kang is the one who remains

actually watching the episode taught me that:

kang created the tva is because he’s a genius egomaniac who wanted to keep himself safe from all the other genius egomaniac versions of himself (this totally works given his comic origins, he's dealt with many versions of himself, eg. immortus, but i have a lot more questions below)

sylki kiss was definitely not romantic. she tricked him so she could kill kang. (still not a good enough excuse smh)

my interpretation of their fight: neither loki nor sylvie, if they 100% knew that kang was telling the truth about the tva, would kill kang. sylvie told loki she was doing this because she thought he was lying. (not totally true to loki's characterization imo, i'd think that both loki and sylvie would rather deal with infinite kangs than give up on free will)

new mobius doesn't know who loki is not because the tva wiped his memories, but because this is a totally different version of mobius (unmined angst potential imo)

ravonna fights mobius, lets him live, and goes out in search of "free will", and may align with kang in the future, since ravonna in the comics is kang's wife. (curious to see what they do with her. i have Thoughts on her place in the whole religious allegory of the show i will explore in my wowki fanfic)

me overthinking things

if kang knows all why would he go through all this trouble to lead loki and sylvie here? he couldn't have done this in an easier, less heartbreaking way? his plan was so contrived :/

one question i've kinda pushed aside for the show is: what kind of time travel disruption would qualify for a nexus event? because technically any variation, no matter how small, should create a branch in the timeline, because 2 contradictory things can't happen in the same timeline at the same time. but now we might have a kind of answer: if kang founded the tva to avoid other versions of kang, he doesn't need to make sure there's 1 sacred timeline, he'd just need to make sure all the variations are so small that the infinite timelines are basically the same, so there's basically infinity copies of the same timeline in existence, thus averting multiversal war between egotistical kangs.

why was there that arbitrary barrier past which kang couldn't see? yeah, ✨suspense✨ and ✨plot✨, but it's arbitrary, and it really would've made no difference if he knew what happened to him. in fact i quite like the idea of kang walking into his own death.

thoughts that don't really fit on this list

the finale was awful. not just the sylki kiss & bad narrative choices or whatever. there was so much padding and exposition, jonathan majors's performance totally took me out of it (i doubt he's a bad actor, this episode didn't give him a good opportunity to shine), the writing was super slow and bad, this ep could have been slimmed down to like 15 minutes because not a lot actually happened.

natalie holt's music — both the titles (lokius!) and the actual tracks — slap so hard. probably the best soundtrack in the mcu other than black panther. she really gets the show

production & costume design of everything related to kang was amazing, felt very vast, old, and regal

sylvie is acutally a surprisingly well-realized woman character and i'm quite proud of the show for that. (unfortunately neither her nor b-15 are fully realized until they kiss each other which has not happened as of yet)

please watch this it has brought me great comfort

HIIII so happy u saw it <3

1. YEAH :’) that broke me .

2. IKR i am Not a Fan and yeah! it was a manipulative kiss so sylvie could get what she wants but there are so many other things they could’ve went with !!!!!

3 + 4. damn it sucks that u got spoiled for those but yeah that’s what new in the em c you !!

——

1. yep! i don’t know much about his comic origins but from what i know it seems pretty in character

2. exactly!!!!!! and yeah it’s not a good enough excuse they could’ve gone with anything else !!!!

3. yeah !! i think both options (killing kang and fighting other versions of him / ruling the timeline) seemed pretty loki HJSKD but i feel like he’s gone through lots of character development through the show and i thought they would both go with killing kang but i guess not dhdjjfjd

4. yep and it hurts . so much .

5. yeah that makes sense !! and yeah i’m curious to see what they do with her, she felt kind of vague and didn’t have enough good motives to be a villain, so yeah i’m curious to see where her character goes !!!

——

1. yeah his plan kinda backfired HJSJDJD but i guess it works for plot HJSKDKD

that’s a lot of thinking to do but i think ur right !!

3. yeah ! i think that ✨suspense✨ was nice for a minute but him walking in to his own death seems way more fun

——

1. yeah it was really,,,,,,, boring ? idk i wasn’t really interested yknow? there was a lot of talky talky (ha mobius reference am i cool) so yeah this ep could’ve been a Lot better but it is what it is i guess

2. YES !!! everyday i was up and think about the opening of ep 5 (was it ep 5? i think it was yeah) but anyway i could listen to the soundtrack for HOURS

3. YEAHH they made him really interesting so i’m excited to see him again !!!

4. YES i think that’s why so many people love her bc she was really well written and she didn’t turn out to be the whole “woman helps man to get what he wants” trope !!!! she actually got what she was going for in the end so yeah !!!! also so true manifesting sylvie and hunter b 15 kiss next season

5. HAAHHAHAHH i love that tysm my day is blessed

#ILYYY #u are so right in all of these #feel free to not read all that LMAOO i just said yes and rambled a lot #ANYWAY tyyy ilyy sorry this look so long #asks #tiger <3 #loki spoilers

1 note · View note

gokinjeespot · 6 years

Text

off the rack #1129

Monday, September 24, 2018

Hello all you off the rackers. How's it going eh? I've been away the last couple of weeks on a trip out west. We landed in Victoria, BC on September 6 and did a road trip visiting Duncan, Comox and Tofino. Had a wonderful reunion with my childhood friend from the Glebe in Comox who I haven't seen in nearly 25 years. Time in Tofino was spent walking the beaches and enjoying all sorts of culinary delights. If you've never been to Vancouver Island you should go just for the drive through the mountains. We could see a glacier from the air B&B in Tofino that we stayed in. Penny and I spent an extra couple of days in Vancouver before returning to Ottawa where we had a lovely dinner with some Comicshop alumni from the 1980s. Thanks to Brent, Colleen, Keith, Louise and Scooter for showing up and catching up.

A tornado touched down in our area on Friday, September 21. The power at the house went out at 7 PM and we didn't get it back until 11 AM on Saturday. No damage in our neighbourhood but others were heavily damaged. Our new fence held up excellently, thanks to Keith Astley. We were very lucky to only be inconvenienced a little. I feel for the folks who lost their houses and businesses. I had to drive around on the weekend and was glad to see most people being patient and courteous at the intersections where the traffic lights were not working. I did see a few anal pores who thought that the rules didn't apply to them and made other drivers hesitate and thus slow the whole process down even more.

This may very well be the last off the rack that I write. Comet Comics is closing down it's current location and moving its subscription service to a used book store up the street. I will be out of a job and will not be able to borrow comic books to read anymore. Thanks to Brent at The Comicshop in Vancouver, I found out that I started to write for the newsletter back in 1986 with an editorial and then writing the Newswatch section. My first off the rack was in 1994 and I have been doing it weekly since then with only a few breaks. I love sharing my thoughts about the comics that I read but it sometimes feels like I'm doing an unpaid job too. Thanks to Ron Van Leeuwen at The Silver Snail and Heather MacDonald at Comet Comics for allowing me to enjoy my comic book hobby gratis. I wish you all the best. Thanks to the folks that read my musings and the comments you've shared with me. You guys take care, okay?

Cover #1 - Brian Michael Bendis (writer) David Mack (art) Zu Orzu (colours) Carlos M. Mangual (letters). Things start off at a comic con where we meet Max Field, comic book artist. It looked to me that this was going to be about comic book covers like the reprints in the back of the book of the ones David Mack has done, but then we meet a super fan of Max's with very deep pockets. Her name is Julia. The story gets a lot more interesting when Julia shows up at a con in London, England and tells Max what her job is. David Mack's art is very distinctive but I didn't guess that this was drawn by him until I got to some painted panels later. This is an intriguing new book and I would put it on my "must read" list.

The Immortal Hulk #6/LGY #723 - Al Ewing (writer) Lee Garbett (art) Paul Mounts (colours) VC's Cory Petit (letters). I am very impressed with the writing. It's sophisticated and thought provoking. The new military organisation set up to handle the Hulk is creepy and eerie. This issue sets up a big fight between the Hulk and the Avengers so it looks like next issue will be a smashing good time.

The Dreaming #1 - Simon Spurrier (writer) Bilquis Evely (art) Mat Lopes (colours) Simon Bowland (letters). The Sandman is AWOL, the Dreaming is crumbling and its denizens don't know what to do. Lucien the librarian is in charge but he seems overwhelmed by the chaos around him. Meanwhile, new character Dora is hopping about between dreams and we get a glimpse of her true self. There is so much that is intriguing about this new Vertigo series based on Neil Gaiman's creations that I think Sandman fans will be pleased.

Return of Wolverine #1 - Charles Soule (writer) Steve McNiven (pencils) Jay Leisten (inks) Laura Martin (colours) VC's Joe Sabino (letters). I consider myself to be a pretty good artist spotter. I can flip open a comic book and tell you who drew it but this time I was fooled and thought that Barry Windsor-Smith did the art for this issue. I still enjoyed the visual feast featuring Logan's return to the racks. Some fans might not be satisfied with no real explanation of how Logan came back to life and starts fighting the bad guys but I just accepted that he's here and has a mission to save the world. His foes are formidable and he starts off wearing the old familiar yellow and blue costume but changes by the last page to a more contemporary one. As much as I liked this getting a running start I do hope they tell us how Wolverine gets resurrected down the line.

The Immortal Hulk #5/LGY #722 - Al Ewing (writer) Joe Bennett (pencils) Ruy Jose (inks) Paul Mounts (colours) VC's Cory Petit (letters). I had a feeling I was missing something when I was reading #6 yesterday. This book is hitting the racks every two weeks and I didn't get a chance to read this issue before leaving on my trip to Vancouver Island two weeks ago. I'm glad I did because it explains the mysterious reflection that Bruce sees in the mirror in #6. I thought it was Major Talbot or the Leader with a normal sized head but it's not. Here we have the Hulk fighting Sasquatch and saving Walter Langkowski from himself. This issue also emphasises the fact that this new Hulk isn't just a mindless monster. I really like that this Hulk can have a regular conversation.

Adventures of the Super Sons #2 - Peter J. Tomasi (writer) Carlo Barberi (pencils) Art Thibert (inks) Protobunker (colours) Rob Leigh (letters). How are a green Kryptonite weakened Superboy and a bound Robin going to defeat the Gang of young super villains? They get help, that's how. The last page made me smile because it uses a classic twist from the days of "The Death of Superman". This is a fun book.

Avengers #7/LGY #697 - Jason Aaron (writer) Sara Pichelli (pencils) Sara Pichelli & Elisabetta D'Amico (inks) Justin Ponsor (colours) VC's Cory Petit (letters). It's the origin story of the very first Ghost Rider plus a super villain that Wolverine fans will recognise. This issue is a nice segue to…

Avengers #8/LGY #698 - Jason Aaron (writer) David Marquez (art) Justin Ponsor (colours) VC's Cory Petit (letters). The current Ghost Rider, Roberto Reyes, arrives at the new Avengers headquarters and is officially made a member. The new HQ at the North Pole is very cool and pure comic book plausible. After a quick tour the team gets a global alert that Roxxon is up to no good and the battle cry is uttered. It's off to the southern seas and a confrontation with an old ally. Imperius Rex!

Batman #54 - Tom King (writer) Matt Wagner (art) Tomeu Morey (colours) Clayton Cowles (letters). Dick Grayson sticks around after Batman and Catwoman's break up to help Bruce get through it. It's a good excuse to remind us of their partnership. I loved how Dick's humour contrasted with Bruce's dour demeanour. Matt's art was a bonus for me.

Batman #55 - Tom King (writer) Tony S. Daniel (pencils) Tony S. Daniel & Danny Miki (inks) Tomeu Morey (colours) Clayton Cowles (letters). The Dynamic Duo continues to keep Gotham City safe while a one-armed stranger arrives to go about an unknown mission. That mission is revealed in the shocking last page. This incident may just top the Killing Joke.

Pearl #2 - Brian Michael Bendis (writer) Michael Gaydos (art & colours) Josh Reed (letters). When the first caption of the first page reads "years ago" you know it's origin story time. This story about a Yakuza tattoo artist/assassin is very different from Brian Michael Bendis's super hero stuff for DC. His work on Superman doesn't engage me like this book, Cover, and Scarlet do. I think it's because he's got to write the Man of Steel to appeal to younger readers too. Maybe I've outgrown Superman.

West Coast Avengers #2/LGY #104 - Kelly Thompson (writer) Stefano Caselli (art) Triona Farrell (colours) VC's Joe Caramagna (letters). This is a little more sophisticated than the Adventures of the Super Sons but it's still a lot of fun. I especially like Stefano Caselli's facial expressions. The B.R.O.D.O.K. AKA Bio-Robotic Organism Designed Overwhelmingly for Kissing is an upgrade from the super villain M.O.D.O.K. AKA Mental Organism Designed Only for Killing, but he's still not nice.

Thor #5/LGY #711 - Jason Aaron (writer) Christian Ward (art & colours) VC's Joe Sabino (letters). We take a break from the present and travel to the far flung future to see if Old Thor can save the universe from dying. He meets an old friend who turns out to be not so friendly. The amalgam of Wolverine and the Phoenix Force is cool but wait until you see the huge mash up on the last page as the villain is revealed. This guy makes Thanos look like Forbush Man.

2 notes · View notes