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rosehipfield · 4 months

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There're quite some parallels between dynamics of Sara-Keiji and Kanna-Shin.

With the siblings everything is more or less clear: Shin used Kanna for two chapters, eventually growing attached to her as she reminded him of his old self (Midori called them both kind, weak and cowardly, not that last two words are exactly true). Maybe he cared about her from the beginning, maybe only after first main game. Relationship between them was similar to Shin's relationship with Midori as he tried to immitate him, scaring Kanna with his constant manipulation (the laptop case and so on) but still helping to overcome her guilt to some degree. In the end, Shin was ready to die if it meant Kanna's survival, at first offering to vote for her thinking she must be sacrifice (guessing she wouldn't pick him if she wins), and after Gashu incident. Kanna understood that he lied to her (a lot), but still saw the best and was kind of right.

Meanwhile Keiji, in my opinion, could copy some of Megumi's behavior with him when he was a subordinate. I am sure that Keiji sees himself in Sara, reliable, smart, a bit formal and easy to exploit (in terms of giving tasks and responsibility). And as far as I remember, Megumi was flirty with him (though he doesn't exactly flirt, he evades answering difficult questions). So he replicates same type of relationship with Sara, becoming her mentor and showing some clues but leaving majority of the work for her.

At first, Keiji likely knew something because he began pushing for "leader Sara" as soon as met her. But after Joe died and Sara was suffering he grew more and more attached. It was just like him and Mr. Policeman! (plus, Joe could be kid of aforementioned policeman). So he makes attempts to help her. Although still not taking spotlight, even suggesting poor girl to litterally decide fate of all of their lifes. Sara didn't fully trust him, she knew how suspicious Keiji was, but his support was vital for her so she also began caring for him (just in case I don't mean it romantically).

What seems the most like manipulation is him getting trust from Sara while not giving information himself. I understand not giving 50 tokens, he knows about his sins. But transfering keymaster to Sara, pretending he sacrificed his own safety while in reality taking it from somebody else is... cold and calculative (who did he take card from? I understand if it's Shin as he was suspicious and dangerous in Keiji's eyes, but it could be Kanna or someone else innocent).

What bugs me the most is that he didn't do anything to help when Sara got sacrifice card. Ex-policeman had tokens to make exchange, and he actually did make aforementioned exchange... with Q-taro. I read somewhere that he planned to get information from Shin, Keiji wanted to deceive him and so definitely couldn't transfer ill-fated card to him (why would Shin tell the truth if he's going to die anyway?). But nevertheless, Sara still was in danger. A girl with burden on her fragile shoulders who tried to help everyone and who was in position of leader partly because of Keiji.

I think that in third chapter he finally realised how wrong he was about everything and hopefully was ready to truly be mentor figure. I don't remember specifics so I may be mistaken, but Keiji did come to the classroom when Ranmaru deal was happening despite risking showing himself. And we all know how strongly Sara wanted to save Keiji, signing consent form. Their bond reached its culmination, both trusting and wanting to protect each other. Of course, maybe it's a bit early to say so as game is unfinished, but this is something I hope for.

All in all, Keiji kind of used Sara a bit similarly to Shin exploiting Kanna, potentially mimicing some traits of once important person, then saw something familiar in traumatised girl, supported her and formed more genuine bond while still using Sara's leadership to have influence or knowledge until that painful moment of trauma coffin

#your turn to die #keiji shinogi #sara chidouin #shin tsukimi #kanna kizuchi #maybe the way Megumi influenced Keiji is just my assumption #maybe I could go in depth about Shin's manipulations but I feel like it was analysed by others #Plus I have rambled too long as it is #I like Keiji I really do but some of his actions cause me to question his thinking process

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yttdtheories · 2 years

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this scan from volume 2 (game chapter 1-2) it seems that the JoeSara relationship parallel to SouShin is canon. Maybe it's a darker friendship. Shin parallel to Sara, Joe to Midori, well I can say Midori is a dark Joe.

Joe tells Shin from his point of view of his friendship with Sara what he thinks of her.

In the first volume Sara told Shin something about her friendship with Joe, but not in detail, because she doesn't know his past and is a closed person.

Joe describes Sara as a lonely person while he is a friendly person, he can never be alone.

There are two opposites that attract.

What interests me in these scans are Joe's words.

"Sara wasn't big on making friends"

"I, on the other hand, couldn't stand being alone

I filled every moment I could with people and conversation"

"But it was like Sara could see right through me when she looked me. Right away, she was able to notice the loneliness deep inside me. That's why I knew I wanted to talk to her more."

"When I finally got this smile out of her it felt like the first time anyone had ever understood me like that and I understood her too."

hmm they met in high school, Joe starts talking to her, since that day they have become best friends and Joe keeps a picture of Sara's smile. I have to say it's pretty obvious how this parallel to Midori.

we don't know all of Joe's past nor of Midori so I guess in 3-2 we will know everything from Midori's point of view including his past and everything about Joe.

Anyway I'm a little suspicious from his ID card.

Datamine

4EVERDEVOTED if we combine Sara's (Minna Asunaro) ID card

4EVERDEVOTED (Asunaro?)

we have an Asunaro agent, so is the famous traitor? It wouldn't be new. From the start of the game he was suspicious, then this scan.

how did he know her mother passed out?

And who was he really calling?

I don't mean to be negative but I suspect Joe organized the kidnapping.

#yttd theory #kimi ga shine #shin tsukimi #sara chidouin #joe tazuna #yttd midori #yttd manga #yttd joe #datamine #3b spoilers #yttd theories #yttd #yttd 3b spoilers #yttd chapter 3b spoilers

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gonbeeyamada · 2 years

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favorite thing about shinalice/alishin? (despite them both being lame (and perfect for one another))

what really drew me to them was how they parallel each other narratively. (fake names/extensive past with midori compared to other participants/lack of trust amongst peers/entire arcs dedicated to their sisters/dies in chapter 2 or lives to wish he did etc.)

i would consider them ALMOST allies in the game... like there is mutual respect but they are definitely doing their own thing. alice sympathizes with shin greatly and goes so far as to defend him in chapter one, and then respect his dying wish in chapter two. there's one scene in chapter two where sara talks to kanna and asks why she's not with shin to which she responds "alice is taking care of him... seems there is a kind side to him after all." (not exact words but if you guys don't believe me i can find SCREENSHOTS because that scene has me MENTAL and I KNOW I HAVE THEM SAVED SOMEWHERE)

uhm hehe... dots and stripes ^-^ their silly patterns are cute to me. i like the colors together. that one nankidai illustration where shin is trying to give alice a striped shirt and they are both blushing. that one illustration where they are fighting over a striped scarf. that one 3rd year anniversary illustration where it's implied alice called everyone over to save shin from midori. they stand next to each other in the main games <3

oh and like literally i rate my favorite ships by how problematic they would be for everyone around them because i live for the drama of it all. can't think of anything funnier than shin dating the dude that literally murked midori. i cannot think of a single thing that would enrage midori more.

here's an edit for them as a thank you for reading. why does shin have six fingers? i don't know

#you ask for one thing i like about them i give you an essay babygirl. mental illness unleashed <3 #also they are both so incredibly lame and can't talk to girls so what else am i gonna do!!!!!!!

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strawberryjamsara · 1 year

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the ask game thing for fandom anddd yttd or persona!!!

Yttd

Favorite character: Sara

Least favorite character: Midori or Megumi

5 favorite ships: Naoreko, Saranzu, Qmai, Maiple, and Keitaro

Character I find most attractive: Mai is sooo pretty and also covered in blood and wears a cool dress and has that awesome eye design and

Character I would marry: Reko Yabusame has me like that image of Homer Simpson in a wedding dress

Character I would be best friends with: Nao! Sorry I stole your wife.

An unpopular opinion: I don’t think Sara and Midori have many parallels. What’s far more prevalent and interesting to me is Sara’s utility to Midori as another source of entertainment similar to Shin. He wants to bring out her ruthless nature because it intrigues him, and he will hurt people around her for the sake of it, and yet he’s uninterested in treating her like an equal despite talking like she is.

A random thought: The fact Nankidai never finished the sketches for that High School AU bothers me like hell

Canon otp: Ryojoe <3

Non canon otp: Naoreko I guess

Most badass character: Well obviously, it’s Hayasahrurhkgtsjisdjyrgjtzf

Most epic villain: Uh, well my favorite floormaster is Safalin

Pairing I am not a fan of: The twinks with scarfs

Character I feel the writers screwed over: tbh I think the emotion route does Kanna sooooooo dirty. Like first of all she doesn’t even react to Shins death. Like she just tried to stick up for his life and failed. He died. She’s losing another sibling. But apparently she’s better now. In an instant she has gone from wanting to die at the alter to saying that she’s learned sacrifice is something you should never do. Everything is A-Okay. This is the good route. It makes this feel like Nankidai didn’t care about writing her, and that she’s just a pawn to develop Shin and this was a fun bonus. Like that’s the last thing you would want. At least show her change! Or hell, maybe you should show her final parting with Shin!

Favorite friendship: I really care about Sara and Keiji’s relationship. Guy who kills people and the weird lesbian kid who he is not qualified to care for but he does is literally the trope ever.

Character I most identify with: Sara. I have issues.

Character I wish I could be: Nobody. These bitches need therapy.

Persona 5

Favorite character: I am unfortunately, an enjoyer of Goro Akechi

Least favorite character: Kamoshida.

5 favorite ships: Akeshu, Makoann, Ryukita, Akiryu, Shihoann

Character I find most attractive: Tae

Character I would marry: I guess I’d enter a lavender marriage with Sojiro. We can have a nice coffee shop au.

A random thought: Every Ann redesign is better than the original how do they do it.

An unpopular opinion: Yaldabaoth was like a really good concept for the game because saying “getting rid of the asshole in power is not the solution, this here is the foundation of sloth that society feeds upon and you must destroy complacency itself for anything to change.” Is actually like really cool and radical for a game in 2016 to say.

Canon otp: Sojiro and Wakaba

Non canon otp: Akeshu.

Most badass character: They’re all losers

Most epic villain: I liked Maruki as a villain

Pairing I am not a fan of: I see Futaba and Akira as siblings.

Character I feel the writers screwed over: (Holding Makoto’s character arc in my arms and sobbing)

Favorite friendship: Futaba and Yusukes bickering was really endearing!

Character I most identify with: Makoto again. Maybe I need help.

Character I wish I could be: I was gonna default to Sojiro again but then I remembered his attitude at the beginning of the game and I was like “Oh fuck no.” So I got nothing.

#ask #kimi ga shine #p5

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amaryllisblackthorn · 2 years

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so like, contrary to what seems to be the common/popular belief, I don’t think Meister and Mr. Chidouin are actually the literal same person?

i think one is a doll of the other, with Mr. Chidouin *probably* being the doll,

for one i just don’t believe everything we see about and hear from him in the Kai flashback & emails were lies? they portray him as someone who is aware of the Death Game and trying to keep Sara *out* of it, even putting his own life on the line –

...If it comes to it, I’m trusting you with Sara.

That girl’s destiny has so much potential for change that I’ve put my own life on the line…

Hello hellooooo! (^^)/ Feelin kinda in danger lately.... Well ok, its Sara they're after. She's been targeted. I'm attached to this house, but I guess I gotta discard it and run. ...Will you come with, Kai?

i mean, yeah, he doesn’t specifically name the Death Game iirc. and it’s also possible that Mr. Chidouin’s just completely lying to Kai, but like. I guess I don’t see any real reason to doubt it other than his apparent connection to Meister

also like why would Mr. Chidouin be wearing a different suit&hat/outfit (the flashforward at the end of 2-2) than Meister? i guess anything’s possible but like, i don’t see why he’d be wearing a completely different outfit idk

generally what i think is going on is:

Meister is the man from the Memorandum, the survivor of the Death Game from the ‘Hades Incident’

all of the candidates in the current Death Game are his biological children, and the purpose of this Death Game is to determine a successor

this means all the candidates are related

this also includes Sou ‘Midori’ Hiyori

Shin and Kanna probably have the same biological mother, too;

Shin is prob also adopted, which makes more sense with him not knowing if his sibling was older or younger than the alternative tbh

Alice and Reko’s situation is admittedly ??, but it’s still possible

I wonder if AI Reko’s comments about her dad are relevant at all ? maybe not but hm

i also wonder if the ‘something’ Megumi was looking for, when Keiji seems to ask about her reason for joining the police, was her father, which led to Asu-Naro? maybe? i’m not like committed to this thought, but I do think she was aware of the relation with her and Keiji but idk

the cult-like aspects of Asu-Naru are interesting and curious, too; it goes beyond just like, a yakuza organization/organized crime syndicate, so i wonder what that’s all about

the reason why Kai was sent to the Chidouins was at least in part bc the organization began to suspect Mr Chidouin’s loyalty [maybe]

Mr Chidouin talked about and acknowledged Kai’s guard work even though Kai was hired to help around the house and with Mr Chidouin’s work, with Kai’s guarding of Sara being originally on the behalf of Asu-Naro

Mr Chidouin says the the apron he gave Kai belonged to his own mother, so there is the question of would a (self aware) doll consider her his/their own mother, which is possible but admittedly something to thing about. the alternative situation, with Mr Chidouin being the human from the Hades Incident and Meister being his doll carries the question of if (male) dolls can reproduce -- which I guess is possible but also pretty weird but I am acknowledging the possibility to cover my bases

there is the question as to why Meister’s doll counterpart would be raising Sara out of all the participants -- there’s no real way they could have known her parallels to the girl from the Memorandum when she was just a baby. I imagine Sara’s mother is her biological one since they share similar hair color based on what we’ve seen. I wonder if maybe she has any connection to the original Memorandum girl? I also wonder if she knows anything at all -- we know she considers Kai family but not if she knows everything.

I have a lot more thoughts that I’ll probably use another post for instead of going on here. but basically I just wanted to express that I do not think Mr Chidouin and Meister are the same person -- or rather that I do think Mr Chidouin and Meister are separate people, with one being the doll of the other. also that all the candidates are related through Meister and the Death Game’s purpose is one of succession -- which is super messed up ?? but i’ll guess we’ll see how everything plays out

i could be wrong of course but i just wanted to put my thoughts out there

also obligatory 🟦🟨 Слава Україні / Slava Ukraini ! 💙💛

#yttd #Your Turn To Die #ab analyzes #mr. chidouin #mr chidouin #yttd meister #yttd spoilers #your turn to die spoilers #;spoilers for every current chapter of yttd (up to 3-1)#;i think some of this got deleted/erased but i cant remember everything so some of my original thoughts may be missing but oh well #;obligatory support ukraine !//.

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shadowduel · 2 months

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eye of the beholder

#yttd #your turn to die #sara chidouin #shin tsukimi #sou hiyori #midori yttd #kimi ga shine #kmgsn #shadowart #EXTRA NOTES IN THE TAGS TIME AS USUAL #as far as im aware these are the only two lines that specifically mention sara's eyes ?#and they're both worded in such incredibly similar ways #both are almost very abrupt too #as if they both got distracted and felt compelled to say something about her eyes #there are in general a lot of midori parallels with sara #and i think shin's remark on her eyes being scary... well... shin would know a lot about scary eyes wouldn't he #after all he was uncomfortable with midori's stare too #which further leads into of course midori complimenting her eyes #he sees himself in her. or more specifically. the ruthless sara of the simulations #eyes to some are like a window to the soul #midori's offhanded compliment directly paralleling shin's much earlier remark on her eyes... well it makes sense these two would both make #a comment like that #that being said. i'd love to make make a partner piece to this about gin and ranmaru commenting on sara's smile #as i think those are also the only two instances where someone sees her make a dark expression and calls it out #that's all!#WAIT ONE MORE NOTE #shin going ahaha in this dialogue because it's a quirk he stole from midori really adds to the whole thing #like even while actively pretending to be sou. he is still frightened by the man he is masquerading as #and he sees that man in sara's eyes. terrifying!

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sou-ver-2-0 · 3 years

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“Midori is Meister’s son,” and other Sou theories

I’ve had a theory for a while that Original Sou is the son of Meister, the likely Mastermind behind the Death Game. I’ve alluded to this theory before, but I haven’t made a proper post for it until now.

I came up with the theory because it’s the easiest way to put Original Sou under Meister’s power and influence. It’s the simplest explanation I can think of for why Original Sou was both an Asu-Naro member and a planned Death Game participant. That’s a strange combination of things to be, but it’s not that strange if that’s what your father raised you to be…

However, there’s more to this theory than a mere hunch. In the first two chapters of YTTD, we learn the story of the Satous: Gashu the father, Kai the human son, and Rio Ranger the doll son. I believe that the story of the Satous is foreshadowing for the story of Sou’s own family.

Gashu is a villain dedicated to the cause of Asu-Naro. He raised Kai to be an Asu-Naro agent. Part of Kai’s job was to watch over Sara, a planned Death Game candidate; he grew to care for her. Kai becomes a participant himself and is one of the Game’s first victims. After Kai dies, we are introduced to Rio Ranger, a sadistic Floor Master. He is a broken doll who wears smiling masks. Rio Ranger is similarly fated to die, and Gashu is then revealed as the father.

Let’s try changing the names in that story. Meister is the main villain behind Asu-Naro. He raised Sou Hiyori to be a top agent. While on the job, Sou developed a close relationship with Shin, a planned Death Game candidate. Sou himself is the first candidate to die, before the Game even begins. However, we meet him again in the “Graveyard of Broken Dolls” as Midori, a sadistic Floor Master who masks his cruelty behind a smile. Midori instructs the participants to kill him… Perhaps leading to a scenario where Meister will finally reveal himself.

I’ll dig into these parallels deeper beneath the cut. But before I go any further, I want to give credit to @joukester who came up with the “Shin was a replacement candidate for Sou” theory, which has influenced my thinking a lot. I also want to credit @novatoast, who pointed out the important Kai parallels and many other ideas to me! I’m very grateful. While Shin is my favorite character, Sou is the character I enjoy speculating about the most. I’m excited to finally share my thoughts on the ramifications of this theory.

Some words on Meister, and the role of the Man from the Memorandum

I should be clear upfront that I think Meister is the Man from the Memorandum, the winner of the Previous Death Game, who loved and lost a “17-year-old School Girl.” I subscribe to the theory that Meister is recreating the Death Game to mold Sara into his beloved High School Girl by putting her through the same trials, and he is hoping she will win this time.

In order to make the perfect recreation, I think the other Death Game participants are also meant to fill in the previous participants’ roles. I believe that Shin fulfills the role of the “Man” himself, which was likely an antagonistic role. However, I believe that Sou was originally meant to play this antagonist role. I think that Shin’s First Trial is so unusual because it was designed to twist Shin into adopting Sou’s personality. That way, he could better play the part.

The first thing we learn about the Man is his confession, “In the first trial, I killed a person.” If Sou had survived to the Death Game, it’s possible that his First Trial would have been to literally kill Shin. Instead, Shin’s First Trial is only that “Sou” metaphorically kills “Shin.”

I want to bring up another possibility for the Man’s role; it may be a doomed role. It’s possible that even if Sou had survived to the Death Game, he might also have had a zero percent chance of survival. The worst outcome for the Mastermind may be seeing a “repeat win” for his own role. While I love the theory that Shin’s zero percent survival rate is due to his own agency (having a self-sacrificial nature), there’s a poignancy to the idea that both Sous turn to villainy out of desperation in the face of certain death. Knowing that the Game is rigged against them in favor of a teenage girl.

Perhaps, even knowing that your own father favors a strange girl over yourself.

Even if the role isn’t necessarily doomed, I think Sou Hiyori still knew more about Meister and the Death Game than any other planned participant. If Meister was Sou’s father, and Sou was serving him faithfully, wouldn’t it make sense for him to be upset that he isn’t the favored “Chosen One”? Knowing that he will someday participate in a Death Game, with a high chance of death, but his father isn’t even rooting for him?

What would that horrible knowledge do to a person?

Kai Satou and Sou Hiyori: Two Different Kinds of Stalkers

Let’s talk about the Human Sons, Kai and Sou. Kai was raised to work for Asu-Naro and he was trained to become an assassin. However, he could never kill a person, and so his ranking in the organization was low. I’m suggesting that Sou was also raised to work for Asu-Naro, but since he took on so many important jobs of manipulating participants’ lives, he was likely in good standing.

The most interesting parallel between these two agents is that they each developed an attachment to another candidate. Kai was instructed to watch over Sara, the strongest candidate, and he grew fond of her from afar. Sara never even knew his name. Although Kai had noble intentions, Sara feared him, and lived with the anxiety of having a stalker.

In contrast, Sou developed an intense, abusive relationship with Shin, the weakest candidate. Instead of keeping his distance while spying on the boy, Sou seems to have become Shin’s closest friend.

Sara and Shin share a similar trauma of feeling stalked. Watching eyes and grabbing hands haunt them.

Another clear parallel between the two stalkers is that they both left written accounts of their observations. We see Kai’s notes about Sara on his laptop, and we see Sou’s notes about Shin in his “Shin Tsukimi AI Test Data” book, to Sara and Shin’s chagrin.

Kai grew an emotional attachment to Sara in spite of his job to watch her. Now the question is, how much of Sou’s relationship with Shin was “strictly business”?

Was Sou’s interest in Shin really all for Asu-Naro? Was he instructed to form such a close relationship with the boy? Or did he also grow close to his chosen candidate in spite of his job? We can’t say for sure yet. However, the closer parallel to Kai would be that Sou’s feelings for Shin became more “personal” than “professional.” Personally, I find it likely that Sou wanted to exercise control over a vulnerable person because he didn’t feel like he had much control over his own life.

I speculate that a major difference between Kai and Sou is knowledge of their fate. I think that Sou grew up knowing that he would one day be a Death Game candidate, while Kai did not know this until the last minute. In a similar way that Shin only becomes a villain if you tell him his survival rate, I think that Kai’s innocence of his fate informed his nobler personality. Meanwhile, Sou’s knowledge of his fate could have harshened him.

How do these two men behave in the face of death?

Death: An act of resistance?

“This is... resistance. Our lives toyed with to our enemy's whims, we are unable to save even a single person... As we die off, this is... my feeble... resistance. But it is one large step... toward counterattack...! It is a step I was able to take... because you bought me time. It is surely... not futile. I entrust them to you...! Our regrets...!! Our hopes...!! I... am satisfied.”

Kai’s suicide in the First Main Game is framed as one of the most courageous acts in the story. Kai takes his life into his own hands, rather than let himself be abused by Asu-Naro a minute longer. He also uses his final words to give an inspirational speech to Sara and entrust his hopes to her. It is a heavy burden for Sara to carry, but she doesn’t have a choice. Nobody has any “easy” choices in this Game.

How does Kai’s death compare to Sou’s death? While Kai took his own life in resistance of Asu-Naro, Sou was murdered by Alice, presumably in service to Asu-Naro.

That’s certainly how it looks…

But what if? What if Sou’s early death was his own form of resistance? What if he deliberately provoked Alice to kill him, knowing that this would mess up the script? Knowing that this would make things more complicated for Meister? Is that so unthinkable?

Why would he do that?

It’s not like Sou’s life was particularly meaningful. He lived in service of an evil organization, possibly with a father who didn’t love him. His only close friendship we know of was with a helpless teenage boy, and Sou treated him terribly.

But…I’d like to share my most outrageous Sou theory, because I might as well go big or go home.

In the same way that Kai entrusted his regrets and hopes to Sara, it’s possible that Sou was entrusting his own regrets and hopes to Shin.

What I’m saying is that: it’s possible that Sou died thinking that his death would give Shin a fighting chance.

“I gave Sou to Shin. He’s already Sou by now, you see.”

This quote has always stood out to me. From our point of view, it was Shin’s own choice to take Sou’s name! Sou didn’t “give” it to him!

Unless…Sou knew that his own death would force Shin into the Antagonist Role? He might have known that his own First Trial would be to murder Shin, and he wanted to avoid that? He might have wanted Shin’s First Trial to make the young man “stronger”? He may have even liked the idea of Shin carrying on his own name and legacy?

Following this interpretation, it’s possible that Sou rationalized his abuse of Shin was “good” because it would have “prepared” the boy for the upcoming Death Game. Shin ought to learn how cruel people are. From a “friend.” If the story were to actually frame Sou’s abuse of Shin as “teaching Shin,” this would also tie into Shin AI’s line, “Though I learned a lot of things at his house.”

There’s an obvious argument against what I’ve just suggested. It comes from one of Midori’s most memorable lines.

“Since he was going to die anyway, I wanted to kill him with my own hands…”

Midori the doll says cheerfully that he wanted to kill Shin himself. That clearly shows his intentions towards Shin are purely negative. That line is not befitting someone who might have died to “help” a vulnerable person.

However, I have a counterargument for that. It’s that Sou and Midori aren’t the same person. YTTD’s narrative makes it very clear that the dolls and humans can have separate personalities, shown most clearly with Reko and Fake Reko.

And Midori doesn’t parallel Kai. He parallels Rio Ranger.

Rio Ranger and Midori: the sadistic broken dolls

Rio Ranger is an incomplete doll. His father Gashu strongly imbued him with “a strong sense of inferiority, which gave birth to jealousy and hatred.” Gashu also “discarded what [Rio Ranger] originally possessed.” “Kindness… compassion… happiness… / Nearly all of [his] positive emotions.”

I think it is possible that something similar happened to Midori. Sou’s feelings for Shin may have been more complex than simple sadistic pleasure at Shin’s pain. If Sou truly paralleled Kai, he may have had hidden “positive” emotions for Shin as well. Inconvenient, rebellious emotions that Meister would want to “discard.” Leaving Midori as the purely sadistic doll we know now.

I realize that this would be a shockingly positive development for Sou’s character if any of this is true. Original Sou is currently treated as a hate-able joke in the fandom because he is so cartoonishly evil. I feel obligated to say that nothing I’ve written would make Sou’s treatment of Shin “okay.”

And it could be that nothing I just wrote is true! I’m simply drawing parallels with Kai’s death of “resistance” and Rio Ranger’s loss of “positive emotions,” and trying to show the implications of what that could mean for Original Sou and Midori. But it could also be that Nankidai will write Original Sou’s death in an opposite way from Kai, and that Midori is more of a “broken person” instead of a “broken doll.” In fact, my favorite difference between Midori and Rio Ranger is that Ranger only knows what it’s like to be a doll, while Midori has the complex memories of human existence. Honestly, there are many ways Nankidai could approach this. I just don’t know yet.

For example, Original Sou could have even been instructed to allow Alice to kill him. I can’t discount that possibility.

Nankidai could also approach a death of “resistance” in a nuanced way. Perhaps Sou stumbled into conflict with Alice without meaning to take things so far. Like Kai, he didn’t want to die. Perhaps he escalated the tension because he was feeling more emotional than logical. Perhaps he found himself in a fight with a larger man, a fight he couldn’t win, and then he finally started rationalizing to himself that his death could still have meaning. And that meaning could have been a combination of feelings of spite for his job and obsession for his friend.

We do have evidence from Midori’s behavior that he seeks mutually assured destruction, and he even seems masochistic. This could lead to a death of “resistance” which is still very different in tone from Kai’s death.

“But I’ll try my best to make it one shot, one kill… I wanna take at least four people with me…”

“How nice hatred is… It lets me satisfy a person 100%...”

I do think that the only interesting thing to do with Midori’s character is to humanize him. He could get sympathetic traits to make him feel more realistic. I think this could even make him scarier! What’s most frightening about the character isn’t his campy villainous vibe; it’s the fact that he’s an abuser. And abusers use sympathy to get what they want.

Rio Ranger is mostly demonic in the story until we finally learn about his father, Gashu, who “puts Ranger in his place” by killing him. Something similar may happen with Midori.

Conclusions

This is getting long and I’ve already written about the most interesting potential parallels between Sou and the Satou brothers, so I’ll wrap things up.

The reason I find Sou/Midori so fascinating is because he is a man of many contradictions. He is a participant and floor master, alive and dead, aggressor and victim. He could be a victim within the cycle of abuse himself, if they develop his relationship with Meister as much as I’m speculating.

Even if my theories and conclusions are wrong, the parallels between Sou Hiyori and the Satou brothers still exist. We have two Asu-Naro agents who developed an attachment to a candidate before becoming early victims. We have two “broken” sadistic doll floor masters. I feel instinctively that these parallels must mean something. I want to think that the parallels mean that Sou could have a father figure, similar to Gashu, and the most likely candidate is Meister. We can also use these parallels to infer how Sou/Midori could be written to be a more complex character.

Thank you for reading!! @ Nankidai good luck writing this bastard.

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beanieman · 1 year

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do you see any shin and sara parallels? similarities? also any headcanons about their relationship? (platonic not romantic- i think they have cousins vibes lmao)

Shin and Sara have a ton of parallels! They're the two people most and least likely to win the dearth game. (Sara with 15 percent and Shin with 0 percent.) They both had a strong connection to someone who worked for ASU-NARO before the death game. (Midori and Sara's Father.) They both are involved with the death game. (Shin accidentally helped Midori makes files for it, and it's been implied that the death game is for Sara.) and they both have other sides to them that they hide to make it through the death game. (Shin hides his kindness to seem strong, and Sara hides how vulnerable she is to seem like a good leader.)

Even the colors in their pallet is similar! The blue of Sara's blazer matches Shin's eyes. The green of her tie matches Shin's beanie. Sara's eyes match Shin's jacket, and the pink on the flowers on her skirt and the pink on the dots on Shin's scarf are the same.

Long Post So More Undercut

As for headcanon's:

A: If they ever escaped the death game it would take them a long time to be friends, and not just because of Kanna. They'd still be weary of each other and half expect the other to show up with a knife and take them out at every moment.

B: When Sara pointed out that her tie was the same shade of green as Shin's beanie, he nearly threw out the hat then and there.

C: Their friendship is the equivalent of the "He asked for no pickles." meme.

D: Both Shin and Sara could really use each other in their life. It would be good for them to talk about the effects of Mr.Chidouin and Midori had on them.

E: Sara called Shin her younger brother once just to mess with him, and it got under his skin for the rest of the day.

F: Shin would win in a verbal argument, but Sara could throw him threw a wall in a physical altercation.

G: In an everything's fine AU Sara and Shin aren't allowed to sit behind each other on road trips. They kept using their foot to yank the other persons seat belt.

H: They both have really similar taste in media. They both like cute things that have dark moments. (EX: The Owl House or Amphibia.)

I: Sara really wants Shin to survive because if he doesn't then her vote for Kanna was for nothing.

J: They were both the kid's to tell the teacher they forgot the homework.

K: Shin almost respects Sara in a weird way. Sure he's terrified of her, and thinks there's a good chance she's pure evil, but if he could be even half as strong as her his life would be so much easier.

#asks #sara chidouin #Shin Tsukimi #Your Turn To Die #YTTD

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where-all-the-time-went · 3 years

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okay okay but what if asu naro is meant to be like,,, the internet

I don’t think Nankidai intended this, and you’re really gonna have to hear me out otherwise this will sound absolutely absurd, but some of the plot points in YTTD remind me of common conversation points about data collection and privacy on the internet. SPOILERS

This part is a bit of a stretch but Asu-Naro stalks the players in order to collect enough information to create AIs. These AIs are exactly like data doubles on the internet, in that both can be put through simulations in order to determine how an individual will act. Generally, this creates a picture of a company that surveils people without their permission in order to meet their own goals, most of which are unknown to the surveiled.

This part was just a weird parallel to me: you know when you get onto a website and it says��“this website uses cookies?”

Generally, when I see messages like those, two things run through my mind: 1. I don’t really know 100% for certain where my data is going when they take it, I wish I didn’t have to accept the cookies but 2. I really need to use this website.

Basically, you’re giving uninformed consent by signing a contract because you don’t have much of a choice--that was very death game to me, for reasons you may have picked up on by now. As far as we know right now (and istg if you correct me on this don’t datamine spoil), when Sara decides whether to sign midori’s contract, she doesn’t know what it’s about, but she doesn’t have a choice if she wants to save Keiji.

That decision in conjunction with the technological and privacy-breaching nature of Asu-Naro makes me wonder if there is a broader theme about data collection, and about how we really do not know how our data is being used against us. Now, I doubt any of us would be pitted into a death game any time soon, but no one expected the Cambridge Analytica incident--but here we are.

so like this theory is a lot less comprehensive than my theories in the past, but i was just watching a philosophy tube video about the subject (this one) and halfway through i was trying to figure out why exactly it was giving me such yttd vibes and this was the result of that. also when i say “the internet” i mean companies that do internet things: google, facebook, literally anything.

in conclusion: big company steal data aaaaaaaa do you know what a majority vote is

#yttd #your turn to die #yttd theory #your turn to die theory #yttd spoilers #your turn to die spoilers #kimi ga shine #wrote this at 1 am and will probably end up completely rewriting it tomorrow but whatever

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hajimeme-hinata · 3 years

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yttd heathers au. think about it.

Oh bestie I am definitely thinking about it now

Ofc midori is JD. obvious answer considering he messes with and kills people for fun and is weirdly charismatic, despite some people finding him kind of unnerving. also I think midori climbing into someone’s bedroom window whenever he wants is really on point for him

It’s gotta be sara as veronica since she’s got her whole manipulation/murder streak in the simulations right? even if she’s not trying to kill people in heathers she does show the capacity for it (and does kill intentionally to save her own ass, even if she was pushed into the scenario) which is why JD/midori continues to find her interesting. which seems like an almost perfect parallel to how midori views sara in the game so... also haunted by hallucinations of the people she’s killed?

It’s a stretch but heather chandler would be.. sou? ignore the logistics behind the hiyori act and his abnormal charisma we need an asshole character for sara to have a lovehate friendship with. maybe the whole shin tsukimi thing could actually be part of the fake suicide note they write that makes everyone pity and worship him in death?

The other heathers would be ranmaru as duke (the one that seems the most pushover and nice at the beginning but by the end takes the main heather spot and bullies heather mcnamara into attempted suicide) bc under the right circumstances he has the ability for evil like that. he’s normally a pushover that doesn’t stand up for himself but he gets the drive and inspiration after sous death bc for the first time he actually has a chance to be more than just a heathers underling. he could be worth something. the other heather mcnamara (probably the nicest one tbh) would be... alice? like I said even though he’s mean during the times where the heathers are all together, he’s the nicest underneath, and when the heathers break after sous death he starts expressing interests in things he didn’t/couldn’t before like reading. he also opens his heart as a radio show call in, which is something i can see alice doing... also ranmaru causing alice to (try to) die (after bullying him about the radio show call in)? yeah canon parallels again...

Sara’s old friend would be joe, someone she kind of wishes she never left for popularity. is it implied she goes back to him at the end of the movie? I don’t remember, pretend she does

Didn’t know I needed midori influencing sara to help kill people to try and convince her into his view of violence. also just bc he thinks it’s fun to manipulate her like that. imagine them: the scene where the day after they break up because she realizes he’s crazy sara says [about what to do later] “how about slitting heathers dukes wrists” and midori responds “that’s it! see I knew you’d be back to normal soon enough :)” implying he sees the dark part of her and actually thinks that they’re both on the same side of everything and that his encouragement is genuinely bringing out the part of her that he’s most similar to. like during the murders he actually thinks they’re convincing her to become violent like him (like how he thinks revealing her simulation self to her during the game will bring out the part of her he likes). also when he climbs into her window before the pep rally to kill her himself and discovers her “dead” and he’s just mildly annoyed he couldn’t end his pet project himself. yeah all sounds on point

#girl i love heathers you opened a black hole #idc who kurt and ram are tbh they kinda suck as people Im not gonna assign anyone that #i wasnt sure if this would work for every character at first but turns out it kinda does. huh #I rewatched part of heathers for this. can you tell #also the parts i did rewatch like i could SEE sara and midori it worked so well #thank you anon :) you understand me #yttd #ask #anonymous #okay this is really long so I’m putting this is main tag fuck you #your turn to die

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dayables · 3 years

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So I haven’t stopped thinking about YTTD and Honey I’m Home.

So ever since an anon asked me what songs I relate to YTTD and I responded with ‘Honey I’m Home’. Likely because I had the song on loop at the time. You can find the ask here. And in my desperate pursuit of why just to give myself some clarity I present too you one way you can interpret this song!

It’s all under the cut however, the actual meaning behind the song heavily implies ab*se, mentions substance abuse and Religious imagery. If any of that could be triggering to you please don’t read more :)

Father said that this world isn't for me I tried to pray for a new reality

The father could be seen as a symbolism of ASU-NARO. The winner of the death game will ultimately have a world they didn’t ask for but they are believed to be destined for. This could be seen as a new reality, a better reality. Especially considering all of the adults in YTTD (barr Mishima with our limited knowledge on him) are not in the position they imagined themselves in despite all being so close.

"So, come to me we can change night into day." A tied up moth seemed to know a different way

The moth in the original meaning refers to Norman escaping from his reality, and foreshadows what happens in his real world. In the same way the cast of YTTD are literally trying to escape ASU-NARO in ways they don’t offer to them DON'T REMEMBER IT DON'T RETURN TO IT

This could refer to Joe, from Sara’s POV or refer to Sara from Asunaro’s POV. Either ways there are several things you’d want to forget surrounding this whole death game Oh, Father tore out the umbilical cord

yeah. I’m just as lost as you are. There's nothing left in the bottle keeping me scored We'll abandon the scenery in the (DON'T REMEMBER IT DON'T RETURN TO IT) Rear-view mirror

ESCAPISM WOO!. Something I personally found the cast to do is play a nice little happy family in chapter two to try and forget the events of the main game. I think this whole section refers to trying to forget it. The first line could be seen as a reference to several of the adults likely having unhealthy coping mechanisms (Mishima smokes and Keiji’s an alcoholic. Reko likely has issues regarding her anger and need I get started on all the possibilities for Shin?) that they can’t use in a death game A petty line of white noise Pack up your bags and throw out the toys

Continuing on from tne concept of a happy family, when the main game comes round they all throw that out of the window and throw infomation out of the window. The whole ordeal from before being ‘a petty line of white noise’. Three strikes, and "Honey, I'm home!" Three voices come from the gramophone

Floormasters. There’s 3 of them we see in the main game and they’re threatening. The three strikes and ‘Honey I’m Home’ is a threat for Norman in the original song, in the same way they are too the participants. A vivisection of me yielded the start of a mystery

The analysis of them and the raising of the participants is what causes the death game to be so baffling to both the participants and the player. With the current infomation, nothing adds up. Say "Hello! Honey, I'm home!" Three voices come from the gramophone

In the original, Honey I’m home is not a good saying despite the fact it commonly is. In my mind, this is some time after the second main game, when they all return back to the halls as if nothings really happened because they have to move on.

God returned with the moth chained to his hand "There's so many things that you'll never understand…

God is the hardest person for me to try and come up with at this point. In my mind, I think of God as Keiji and see the singer as Sara seeing as he is her main ally at the current point I picture this to be. He consistently hides stuff to give himself the upper hand. In the same way God could easily be read as Midori because he is the one who holds all the information they need and ultimately has all the participants playing his game. Both as a floormaster but also as a man from all of their pasts. Both interpretations work.

So come to me, we can change night into day. You'll hold my hand so you'll never go astray."

This line is what sealed the concept of God being Keiji for me and the Singer (Norman) being Sara. Keiji offers Sara guidance and offers to work together yet somehow it always seemed to me like Keiji was making use of Sara’s trust. Or you know what, maybe my distaste for Keiji is showing through God devoured that of father

Whoever you see God as, they are now a bigger threat than Asunaro and I think that’s true. Is it your allies who are greatest enimies now that trust is nothing next to their own lives? Or is it the guy who literally has your life in his hands. At the current moment they are both huge threats to Sara A spider preaching with poison on its lips "To get out of here is to promise me a kiss"

I see the spider (Charon) as Shin and you can tear this interpretation away from my cold dead hands. Everything he says is for his own gain or too take Sara down. It is impossible at any point for Sara to work with Shin without helping him and giving him what he wants. (Obviously if we want to draw parrallels between Shin and Charon we find absolutely none out of this but shhhh) The abandonment of scenery in the Mind of Mother

If Asunaro is the father than normalcy is the mother, yet in chapter three no one, not even Gin or the dolls, feigns normalcy or hope like they did in chapter two or one. At this point, it’s all about survival. DON'T REMEMBER IT DON'T RETURN TO IT

Returning to normalcy will hurt more at this point than accepting the death game because of the no chance of escape and everything they’ve lost. So, with advice of the dead and a halo over my head

So this is where I stop drawing parallels to canon but more along the lines of what is likely to happen from Sara’s POV which is her own survival. With Asunaro likely viewing her as an angel along with the the dead participants she moves on. It also ties quite neatly with Keiji’s line about the angel of death sort of thing. Especially seeing as she did lead them all to their doom in one possible outcome At last "Honey I'm home!" Three voices come all alone In the same way the following ‘Honey I’m Home lines’ they’re calling out to someone. Except this time they aren’t there. Sara, and whoever these two others are (Likely Miley and Safalin) are the only ones left. A vivisection of me done by God for all to see

The analysis of Sara, done in death game for all of Asunaro and the participants and everyone to see.

#im back on my bullshit #song analysis #your turn to die #the crossover i didn't know i needed #gets heavy on speculation

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