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bylrlvr · 2 years

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unpopular opinion kind of but I want the painting reveal to be after the time jump. I still think midleven would break up pre-timejump, but the painting wouldn´t be neccesearly mentioned. obviously the break up would be initiated by el, mike wouldn´t really have the neurons to bring up the painting, his brain too full of mini identity crisis. plus I think it would be funny how the painting reveal would be the ultimate domino piece to make mike gets his shit together, but yk, no thanks. I need mike to get absolutely confused and stressed for two years, if will had to do it for a decade, then it´s his turn. then, what after those two years? I imagine elmike being besties is in, but mike´s not really bringing up the painting yet bc, even though they´re friends, how do you tell your ex that the painting her brother (who youhave some complex feelings for) gave you two years ago is the reason why you think of yourself as not a completely useless person? kind of an awkward conversation. so, I kind of have a personal headcanon on how this scene should go. first of all, parallels. what parallel am I referring to? not other than robin´s coming out scene. takes place after the time jump, so apocalyptic vibes are in, and what else to do in a apocalyptic moment than let it all out? both el and mike sitting at hopper´s cabin bathroom floor, maybe they´re on a mission or maybe just talking shit. it´s a nice moment, a heart to heart. probably their most genuine conversation, something they never really had while they were a couple. between laughts and sharing memories, mike thinks he should finally share his thoughts on the painting, I mean, it´s a pretty wholesome moment, they´re friends, it shouldn´t be awkward now. can I tell you something? just don´t make fun of me or, think I wanna make it awkward or anything, I mean, since we´re broken up and all- el just tells him it´s fine, we´re friends now, that was a long time ago, and it´s kind of the end of the world, you can get it off your chest. mike´s kind of nervous, but also kind of relieved, so he just says it. yk, two years ago I couldn´t tell you, because yk, the start of the apocalypse and all, and well, it would have been pretty awkard cause we had jus broken up- but, whatever. I guess I just, never really thanked you. el gets silent. yk for, the painting.el laughs. what painting. mike just blinks at her and laughs nervously. well, I guess you forgot, I knew it would be awkard. but, um, yeah, the painting you gave me? well, more like will. but it was technically you. el´s confused, but let´s him finish. I mean, it was a cool painting, but I guess the best thing tha came out of it was what you said avout me. you probably meant it platonicaly, but I really, um, I really liked it, I loved it! I was being a complete douche and you still manage to say those words about me. I was pretty confused though, it didn´t really seem like you but, it meant a lot to me. el thinks she must test the waters, now she´s as confused as mike was. what words excatly meant a lot to you exactly?. mike´s flustered now. well, about me being the heart, important yk? again, I was being a prick and yet, you saying those things about me, that you needed me, it was, probably the nicest thing someone has said about me. it caught me off guard, but it´s also the thing that has made me believe I´m not compeltly useless so. thanks. it´s nice to know you´re needed. el´s still staring at him, confused, but with a smile in her face. that´s really sweet. mike looks up to her. yeah. he let´s it slip as he smiles. I mean- no hard feelings. we´re friends now so- he gets cut off. but I never said that. el adds. what? and that´s when it hits them. both of them. you could say el´s being robin on this situation, she´s hearing mike´s (just like rob with steve) confession, but it´s mike who´s actually coming out with his feelings. there´s a breeze of an unspoken scret in the air, and then-

i- wow. i have nothing to add on to this, just one question: what is your ao3 (for scientific purposes)

#byler #vi’s askbox

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screamingfrenchfries · 2 years

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milkvans are so funny bc they argue so much abt how mike is in love w el but have never once tried to adress the fact that el isn't even in love w mike???

like at this point in the show we actually have no idea wether or not they're even still in a romantic relationship anymore. sure we didn't get a super clear breakup but we never really did with stancy either.

but el's last note to mike literally said "from", something the script even emphasizes with repetition and an underline.

then when they reunite they don't kiss, which isn't even that big of a deal but if the plan was to keep mileven together don't you think they would drive the point by making them do so? "it's the little things that count"

before mike's monologue, we get to see them interacting but nothing romantic, in fact the scene in the pizzeria is probably one of my favorite scenes between them because of it's lack of romantic undertones. it's actually adorable imo!

but during mike's monologue we don't actually see her happy that he's finally said ily, nor do we get any romantic scenes after this either.

you could say this shot where theyre standing together looking at max could be coupley, but it shouldn't have to be and i think it could also be to throw off the audience by making us assume so. in reality they are best friends and max is literally in a coma so they needed comfort in the moment. (that and my platonic!mileven (elmike?) obsessed ass thinks it's the best thing ever to see best friends be touchy like this :[) (n for u bylers out there, the way they made will stand so close to mike but lucas has so much space between him & el.. just a little detail i find interesting..)

and honestly, mileven doesn't seem to have either side of the party all in anyway. they're both not fully committed at this point in time, so it's completely possible a breakup could happen in season 5, depending on where the duffer brothers want to take it.

but the fact of the matter is, none of the big mileven scenes this season have come from eleven herself, because if they were to officially break up in s5, the duffers would probably rather it come from mike realizing el isn't in love with him, than el realizing mike isn't in love with her. (because i think she's already figured that out at this point)

#i've never done a full on theory/evidence pile like this #so forgive me if it's sloppy #im just. the brainrot is so real #long post #byler #byler proof #byler evidence #anti mileven #anti milkvan #elmike

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mylittlevsoldier · 11 months

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I love making everything about byler and Taylor Swift's "folklore" (my favorite Taylor Swift album) In folklore, there is a love triangle between Betty, James and Augustine. And Taylor herself said that "Betty and James ended up together but he put her though it." But they willelmike love triangle goes a little bit differently.

How the folklore love triangle goes is, Betty and James were together and had a falling out (but didn't break up) Then, he went away for a summer and cheated on Betty with Augustine. And after that summer, James shows up at Betty's party and apoligizes, Betty ends up kissing him on her doorstep (in front of all her stupid friends) and start dating again. Eventually, they "end up together" But. this is where byler and El come in. How I think, Mike is James, Will is Betty and El is Augustine.

The folklore love triangle is a musical parallel to Mike's relationship with El and Mike. This is why:

Will has been with Mike from the start, just like Betty and James. While, yes, Mike and Will have never dated, they've been best friends since kidergarten (i think) and they've been friends the longest out of anyone else is the party. While they have also had several falling outs but Mike has always been the one, at Will's door, apoligizing to him and begging for forgivness.

Now it's time to talk about El. Don't get me wrong, I am not one of the bylers that hates El, I love her. BUT, she was and is Augustine. She hasn't been there (with Mike) as long as Will has. She's basically a disraction for Mike in a romantic sense. And, hear me out on this, I think Mike is basically using El as a shelid. To cover up his interilalized homophobia and so he dosen't get picked on, so he isn't a target.

Time for lyrics breakdowns! (I have alot of headcannons about these lyrics but I'll try to keep these as close to canon event as possible)

"i knew you" -cardigan

Like I said, Will has been there from the literal start and he knows Mike better than anyone. a n y o n e.

"a friend to all is a friend to none. chase to girls, lose the one." -cardigan

We all know Mike hates being or feeling alone, espically without Will. (See all of Season 1) And I think he knows that he loves Will (that he's in love with Will) but he's too scared to pursue Will because he might lose El or Will or both of them. Also, I do think Mike needs El but not as much as he needs Will.

"but i'd knew you'd linger like a tattoo kiss. i'd knew you'd haunt all of my what-ifs." -cardigan

(i can't help but sneak a hc in here but idk if it is bc i might be canon already) I think that Will has stayed up late at night, just thinking about why he likes Mike and how he's never going to like him back. Why does Mike have to linger in his thoughts?

"i'd knew you'd miss me wants the thrill expiered and you'd be standing in my front porch light." -cardigan

This lyric reminds me of the aftermath of the rain fight in season 3, where Mike (with Lucas) stood in the pouring rain and basically almost kicked down the door, begging Will for forgivness (and later rain though the dark fucking forest, still in the pouring rain, to find Will and make sure he was okay.)

"cause you were never mine." - august

El has to know about Mike and Will at this point. She isn't dumb. This is highlighted in the "You never say it" scene. She knows that Mike isn't loving her the way she wants/needs to be loved, but she knows that Mike loves Will the way he needs to be loved.

"i remember thinking i had you." -august

While I think El knows, I think this is a new(er) realization. I think this was as nesw as that "you don't say it" and airport scenes. And just a friendly reminder that Mike only said "I love you" to El with Will's encouragment.

"and say, meet me behind the mall. so much for summer love and saying us. 'cause you weren't mine to lose." -august

This entire lyric reminds me of season 3 elmike and the whole "I dump your ass" scene.

"betty, one time i was riding on my skatebaord when i passed your house, it's like i couldn't beathe." -betty

(another hc im sorry) i 1000 percent think that Mike would go back to the Byers' old house after they moved. And everytime he felt like he was gonna cry so hard he would throw up.

"the worst thing that i ever did, was what i did to you." -betty

We all know Mike regretted the whole "it's not my fault you dont like girls" thing. (y'know banging on his door, running though the woods. all the stuff i already brought up.) But he proably also lies awake at night after Will moved away, staring at the celing, thinking about what he said, replaying it in his head, wondering why he was such a bad fucking friend.

"slept next to her but, i dreamt of all sumer long." -betty

I definitly think that Mike realized his liked Will in season 3 but got back together with El and that's when he started using her as a sheild.

I love the folklore love triangle and willelmike. i even write a whole one shot about byler and the song betty. (ill proably post a poll abt that to see if yall wanna read it.) ive been wanting to write this for a while so thank you for reading! and let me know if i missed anything so i can add onto this. i love you! bye!

#sagey writes #sagey is a swiftie #sagey is a byler truther #byler #<< target audience #swifties #<— target audience #mike wheeler #will byers #el hopper #mike is james #will is betty #el is augustine #byler endgame #stanger things #byler is real #stanger things season 5 #folklore long pond studio sessions #folklore love triangle

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maddy-ferguson · 1 year

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Ik you don't like ambigulous sexuality Mike so I would like to know, do you think canonically Mike will be explicitly gay? I don't even mean like saying the word gay I mean even just explaining that he didn't like El romantically. Bc I'm confident in endgame Byler but I find a lot of gay Mike theories far fetched in the sense that it makes sense but I don't really believe they'd do that in canon and I don't think it's what the Duffers intended (like the Phoebe Cates scene). I think that if they wanted to do explicitly gay Mike then they dragged on the Melvin storyline for way too long for it to make sense to anyone who isn't spending time analyzing Mike's behavior because so much gay mike proof is so subtle unlike general Byler proof which a lot of the GA has picked up on.

I know the show certainly shouldn't cater to the GA, but it should still be understandable to the audience even if they haven't spent hours analyzing, and I think by now they've passed the point where they could convincingly show that Mike never liked El romantically in the first place.

I know I sound like I'm repeating a lot of Byler anti talking points so sorry if I sound like a Byler anti, I promise I'm not. I just really don't understand how they would do gay Mike and would like to hear what you think.

this is from a week ago and i've talked about it again since but i was so flattered that you a) knew i don't like ambiguous sexuality mike and b) wanted to ask this to me. <3 and don't preemptively apologize omg i love you

i honestly feel like the main thing is an unhappy mlvn breakup. think this. in spirit. i am sorry to every platonic elmike enjoyer i think they could've had a relatively fun onscreen dynamic post-breakup had the s3 breakup been final i really do but this is a post-season 4 world. failed monologue and all that. only one season left. i need it to be clear somehow someway that this relationship hurt el and that their relationship was bad from the get-go. no idea how realistic this is btw but i feel like they can't afford to have them break up off-screen or to have it be vague à la season 2 stncy because it's their quote unquote main couple lol.

i feel like making it apparent that the relationship was bad for both of them would be ideal. and specifically el not being all mature all oh it's okay because i don't love you either would be good i think. we would've had that had the monologue not happened but we're past that now. i don't think they'll be on bad terms by the end of the show they're not gonna hate each other or anything but i don't see them being instant best friends after breaking up AT ALL

and yeah i agree that a lot of gay mike proof is only proof in the sense that it's in there and some of it is inconsequential. but that could also be said of some byler proof lol, like no one in the ga is thinking oh look blue met yellow in the west they're color-coded!!

i don't think they dragged mlvn on for too long and i can't for the life of me word it in a way that makes sense so i'm gonna link this post (inluding the tags from my mutual who reblogged it) :) i hate mlvn, hate with a capital h but i think them staying together this long (it's only been like a year and three months in the show which is kind of crazy) makes sense for them for multiple in-universe reasons (mike being the one who introduced the concept of romance to el, el only getting back together with mike after hopper died, i can think of about a thousand reasons for mike), but for us as viewers, yeah idk, obviously ending the season 4 with them being broken up for good would've made it easier for the ga to accept the possibility of byler being endgame and of mike being gay but it would've also been very obvious so i can see why they didn't do it. they still need people to tune in and also we needed to feel like we lost at the end of season 4 and that includes me and the other...27k tumblr bylers at the time

when you look at the facts i don't think gay mike would seem far-fetched to the average non-homophobic viewer: mike takes in a girl. kisses her after being told by everyone that he must like her, after telling her that his sister would be her sister and that and after 8 episodes of her being repeatedly mistaken for a boy and for will specifically. doesn't see her for a year, spends a season glued to will's side, kisses her again at the snow ball. pushes will away in season 3, inadvertently calls him out for being gay and for not growing up. starts having problems with his gf as soon as said gf starts to look like a girl and learns that she can have preferences of her own. lies to gf and gets broken up with, is very obnoxious about it all season. indirectly tells will he actually doesn't want to grow up and wants to keep playing with him at the end of the season. goes back to playing dnd as soon as s4 begins, which goes to show that he actually didn't mean what he said about wanting to grow up last season (either that or he's a hypocrite and hates will specifically. lol). acts weird with will again. focuses on his gf WHO LITERALLY LOOKS LIKE WILL IN A DRESS for the day. gets lied to by his gf and is then left behind by her, isn't as obnoxious about it but also keeps talking about his relationship without ever mentioning why they fought so he never has to explain why exactly he couldn't say That thing. to his boy best friend who he keeps having emotional talks with. doesn't say the thing until he gets told that he's the heart and all that by said boy best friend and still struggles to tell gf that he loves her. end of the world

i really think most of them are just not thinking about it. i remember asking my friend how likely byler being endgame was to her in august and she was like i...had never considered the possibility of el and mike not ending up together. then i talked her ear off for 60 minutes and she was like okayy i can see it maybe And she was sad for mike. so!

i think no matter how it goes we're gonna get an interview confirming it because they had to do it FOR WILL because people couldn't possibly imagine that the character who'd been called gay for the first time in the first twenty minutes of the show could actually be written to be gay

but maybe he'll tell us he's gay himself lol who knows

#added the instant before best friends to be nice<3 #and i've said before that i don't think el was ever in love with him either and i still don't but i still think she's been hurt by their #train wreck of a relationship lol. mike too but he's the one who just said he loved her on her good days and on her bad days so i don't #feel like he's in a position where he gets to...voice the hurt? and he's the one who could hold a normal conversation in s1 so hm...idk :/#the hurt caused by their relationship specifically. like i can't picture him saying i don't think you're loving me very well either you #dismissed me when i tried to relate to you being bullied even though you saw me get bullied to the point of jumping off a cliff. yk? lol #i didn't write Hate because i wanted to be funny. it worked for me #el literally looking like will in a dress at rink o mania is actually crazy #literally the socially acceptable version of will el bff i'm so sorry this is happening to you #my friend had actually asked for the stranger things oral dissertation. for the mike dissertation specifically #i thought about this for like a week and after my first paragraph (well second) i was like wait...was else was there again? and i don't #know actually. was there anything else?#ask

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demadogs · 2 years

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hi!! hope you’re having a good day :) what are some things you’d like to see or expect to see in season 5? 🥰

hellooo! something i really really want to see is mike be more emotional. i think given the fact that hes been so repressed and kind of an asshole for two seasons and we still havent seen him come to terms with his feelings, hes gonna completely breakdown. will has had a moment in every season where he cries but mike hasnt, hes just been suppressing it this whole time so i think hes really going to sob when he confesses or comes out to someone. maybe not even to will. id kinda love if this scene was with el and their breakup was a really emotional moment where mike is coming out to her. it would be really comforting and nice for both of them because i think el needs to understand that the reason he doesnt love her is bc he doesnt love girls at all, not bc she’s unloveable or anything like that. and i think mike coming out to someone like el would help him so much too bc she has no bias and didnt grow up in a world knowing what homophobia is. i think mike seeing someone completely genuinely baffled at the idea of someone thinking he is wrong for his feelings would make him feel so much relief.

now i really really want this omg i want their breakup to be emotional in the healthiest way possible. cuz like obviously mlvn is bones but i dont like when people make it seem like mike doesnt care about her. he love her like family and he wants whats best for her so i dont like peoples hopes of them just breaking up in the first episode and then go right to byler. i think/hope their break up will also be mike coming out to her and el will be rooting for him and trying to tell him that will loves him back. and then mike and will get stuck in the upside down together and mike kisses him. in a perfect world this is exactly how itll go down. i think theyll break up around like episode 4 or 5 and then mike and will get together the second to last episode. but yeah i love elmike and i hope/believe theyll make their breakup really emotional and sweet. i dont want either of them to leave each other sad because of the break up.

another hope is mike and will being in the upside down together. i just fucking love the forced proximity trope and honestly i think it would be the best place for mike to confess or kiss him because they would literally be in their own world with no one else to say theyre wrong or anything like that. and i want their first kiss to be SOFT!!!! AND HESITANT AND SWEET!!!!!!!! NO ANGST MID FIGHT KISSES I DONT WANT THAT AT ALL!!!!!!! i want it to be just a quiet moment with no tension just love!!! with the track “being different” playing over it!!!!!!!!!!!!

unrelated to byler, something else i kinda would love to see is max being blind which is crazy cuz thats so sad and shes my favorite character but man the potential that has for writing is so fucking cool. they could all be thinking of plans to kill vecna and max might notice things no one else does bc theyre all thinking about the bigger picture of everything they saw but max would notice things like feelings and scents and sounds. i also need some happy lumax moments again cuz god i love them.

#thanks for the ask i havent had one in a while #byler #eden answers

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refusetoseetheghosts · 2 years

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Hi! I'm the Byler Budget Anon Ash, I'm here to give you a tight budget of 500 Byler Coins (BC), how do you wish to use them?

S5 Byler Scenes Store:

1. Byler gets Murray'd or Argyle'd: 50 BC

2. Will and Robin bonding time: 50 BC

3. Elmike being platonic BFF on screen: 50 BC

4. Will gets a gun: 50 BC

5. Will in Mike's Hellfire shirt: 50 BC

6. Painting explanation: 50 BC

7. "Crazy Together" parallel: 50 BC

8. Jealous!Mike: 50 BC

9. Mike and Will's sleepover and cute bonding time: 100 BC

10. Ep. 5 is called "The Paladin and The Cleric": 100 BC

11. Apocalypse Mike and Will (they go in the UD): 100 BC

12. Mike Unsent Letters signed "Love, Mike": 150 BC

13. LuMax and Byler double date: 150 BC

14. Mike (or Will) gets Vecna'd: 150 BC

15. Byler Snow Ball Dance: 150 BC

16. Byler Rain Kiss: 150 BC

Hiya Ash!! TY for inviting me the store 💕 now there are definitely some purchases I will be making here 😁

1. Byler get Murray'd or Argyle'd - because someone needs to address the tension in the room! Argyle would be so good though because he would make Wheeler squirm lmao

6. Painting explanation - Let the truth be told!! The boy needs to know

10. Ep 5 is called The Paladin and the Cleric - because the background of these two particular D&D characters is essential to Byler becoming endgame and I need this title

12. Mike Unsent letters signed love Mike - we need to see all the pining that he went through with Will's absence and how he poured it into every letter

16. Byler rain kiss - two people who have been in love for this long and finally realize it's mutual and reciprocated? If they don't kiss, we have been robbed!!

#ask #ask game #byler

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post-modern-prometheus · 2 years

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just thinking about vecna going after mike and them playing small town boy to save him.,

i just think this would FUCK. so i am going to use this opportunity to give you my vision for this bc narratively and from a writing perspective, having mike face vecna is just. such an amazing opportunity. he’s just got so much going on in his brain, esp things he will never say and even if he does then how are we even sure what he’s saying is true, esp with the nature of his character and issues. getting cursed by vecna SHOWS the audience what he’s struggling with in a way they can’t deny.

i’d love to see mike sitting on his own, then el walks over to him. they start talking and she leans in really close and says smth like “i know im not the one you love” as they’re being very close in an explicitly romantic way. she morphs into will, who jumps away with disgust like “what the hell is wrong with you.” this is the moment the audience realizes what this is. a vision. cur back to the others as they notice him in a trance. and so mike runs after will (the only music they can find on the other side is a little song called smalltown boy yk run away turn away et ). he busts down a door and falls to the floor of his own room, in front of his open closet door. the whole party is there, staring down at him with hate in their eyes. his family is there too, and he tries to talk to his mom, reaching for her, but she jerks her arm away, as if he were poisonous. and then vecna shows up. he does his whole i’ll put you out of your misery speech. he’s like you’re dirty, broken, they will never accept you. cut to will. “they will never love you.” and mike doesn’t scream or fight like the others. he accepts it. and vecna starts to raise his hand. cue big gay montage of all those moments with will as it cuts between that and everyone on the other side trying to save him. but instead of those memories saving him in the way they saved max, they just send him deeper and deeper down in vecna’s grasp. because he has to face what those happy memories truly were about and that terrifies him more than anything else.

and the thing is, to avoid repetition… mike doesn’t beat vecna. smth else interferes. not even in the way the music saved max, but somehow vecna just leaves him alone bc i cant see mike overcoming this yet.

(so here’s me throwing darts blindly. just as vecna is about to kill him- his body shoots into the air- vecna notices el. he starts asking mike who she is. bc peter/001 recognizes her but cant remember. and so he just lets mike go. maybe to focus on her instead? idk smth like that. i think it would be neat and by neat i mean supremely fucked up if mike gets out of this whole thing and reattaches himself to el. continues to pretend like everything’s okay. ignore the cracks. smth smth just like hawkins both physically with the upside down and the culture inside the town. he’s super clingy but now the audience Knows for sure. and it’s heartbreaking. but el ofc can Feel that and she wont let it go. so they break up and he comes out to her cuz i want that elmike moment of a mature mutual break up so badly that i have a term for it.)

ANYWAY yeah the Vision of the vision.

#st4 spoilers #mike wheeler #byler #stranger things

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stanger-things · 2 years

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I started shipping byler from season 1. It was just in the way that Mike’s love for Will shone through so hard. His connection with him, his desperation to find him, his heartbreak when he thought Will was dead. Their relationship was set apart from everyone else’s from day one. With Will missing, we didn’t really get his side of things, but there were hints (like the insane amount of drawings for Mike, and him being hinted as gay from the start). I actually thought m!leven was cute, but I really just saw it as a friendship at that time.

Season 2 was what really solidified byler for me though. Will and Mike spent nearly the entire season together. Heart eyes for days. Mike sleeping by Will’s bed, constantly checking up on him, the arm around him at the arcade and Halloween, the hand touch, the SPEECH about the day they met, “that’s my friend…Mike”, god they were so soft. I also liked m!leven in s2 but didn’t have a prob with them being separated bc my byler heart was being fed.

Season 3 made me hate m!leven but I still LOVE elmike because they truly love each other so much and I want them to be best friends. At first s3 felt like it lacked byler, but then all the content we DID get was so LOUD. So angsty. They made Will’s feelings for Mike obvious, while they made Mike pull away from the way he was with Will in s1 and 2.

I didn’t think canon was in the cards until after s3 cuz I was like this has to be going somewhere. Now with the lead up and promo it feels really obvious they’re going there, but I’m still nervous and anticipating that they might just do unrequited byler.

I am freaking out about tomorrow.

#stranger things #byler #will byers #mike wheeler #stranger things s4

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11byers · 4 years

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DUFFERS GUIDE TO LOVE [1/?] — "Only love makes you that crazy, sweetheart" (pro byeler, jancy, jopper, familial elmike)

disclaimer: this is all my opinion. you're free to disagree.

so ik this is like 2-3 months overdue, and really it's not even the full thing, but i've gathered some of my thoughts into a cohesive-ish meta, and i'm finally ready to share them!! (i’m actually glad i didn’t rush myself to finish this. i actually process info very slowly, and a lot of these points i only discovered recently.)

for this lil bit, imma talk about ‘only love makes you that crazy’ - specifically the word 'crazy' and how it's used in the show. there's so much to unpack with just this one word.

for starters, although this was linked to jancy, in truth, what made jonathan go 'crazy' was when steve started dissing his family.

so while this quote and the use of the word ‘crazy’ does lend itself to a romantic context, it also lends itself to familial love. arguably more so than romantic.

the term 'crazy' is often used to describe a character as just that: crazy. it's a word that's heavily linked to joyce in st1, bc nobody really believes her when she says that will is alive. but that’s a little more self-explanatory and straight forward bc she’s not crazy, and she knows she’s not crazy. so let’s talk about... mike. and hopper. and nancy.

what makes mike seeing el different from joyce believing will is alive is that mike isn’t actively trying to find el. he doesn’t believe el is alive. joyce isn’t experiencing grief, and she says so explicitly when will’s fake body is found.

joyce fully believes will is alive. mike believes el is dead. mike is the one experiencing grief. just like how hopper experienced grief for his late daughter. just like how nancy experienced grief for barb.

what hopper, mike, and nancy are all experiencing is grief. having lost someone close to them, and helplessly clinging onto that person in their mind bc of guilt.

when mike is shouting about blaming hopper for hiding el - bc we can draw so many parallels to how mike also hid el, and wasn't able to save her like how hopper couldn't save his daughter - it's not hard to believe that mike blames himself in that situation.

hopper losing his daughter bleeds into how he treats el. in st2, he placed down ground rules so she couldn’t leave the cabin - and it was to keep her safe. (we’re not going to get into how that stunted el’s growth as an individual, but it’s important to draw the parallels to how these characters treat el, and we’ll come back to this later on.) hopper ultimately apologizes to this, recognizing that he didn’t want to lose el like he lost sarah.

this is all platonic/familial love and guilt that’s making them go ‘crazy’. they’re all grieving over their loved ones and if we go back to romantic love, there's a trend in who these characters open up to in these situations. so now let’s flip the coin and dive into more romantic implications.

so, you saw ‘pro byeler’ in the title. yes, i'm talking about romantic byeler. you know i'm talking about the use of the word 'crazy'. this is the part i really gotta prove to y'all that the duffers are 100% planning for romantic byeler (imo).

it’s interesting, bc this does point to the familial love that mike has for el. he thinks he’s going crazy bc he keeps seeing el. and will relates to that bc he keeps seeing the upside down.

mike and will aren’t going crazy tho. what they’re seeing is real - will is really seeing into the upside down and mike is really seeing el. but the word crazy isn’t used to doubt the other person, as opposed to other instances where the word crazy is used throughout the show. characters are seen as ‘crazy’ in the show when their experiences aren’t believed by the other characters. and yes, mike does question if what will’s experiencing is real or in his head, and ofc will isn't sure himself...

however, the keyword, in this case, is together. just like how jonathan and nancy go monster hunting after nancy opens up to jonathan - they don’t exactly have the answers they need, but they decide to work through things together. the characters don’t know what's real or what's fake, but they don't discount the other's experiences. there's inherent trust and honesty and vulnerability in these scenes where characters are opening up to one another and aren’t being judged.

it’s super important to note that hopper only opens up to joyce about his daughter in st1 (as seen above). it’s super important to note that joyce wants hopper to believe her despite also not caring if anyone else believes her.

going back to the jancy/byeler parallel: instead of talking to steve about the issue, nancy just sneaks back to his house to look for barb. the show makes a point that endgame couples talk to each other. in the same episode, nancy goes to talk to jonathan instead about what she saw in the woods. just like how will opens up to mike about when he saw the mind flayer/the upside down.

(these scenes parallel each other a lot, so i suggest rewatching them to get the full picture.)

mike only opens up to will (despite trying to get in contact with el for almost a year, and almost getting caught by dustin and lucas). will only opens up to mike about seeing the into the upside down despite everyone else being worried about him. and yet, will believes mike is the only one who understands him.

instead of nancy telling her experience to steve - her boyfriend at the time - she tells jonathan. and it’s not like jonathan was more linked to the situation than steve. barb disappeared at steve’s house. nancy went back to steve’s house without even telling him. instead, she tells jonathan - someone she kind of has a history with because of mike and will, but otherwise it's implied that they don’t really have that much of a relationship. until nancy opens up to him.

so going back to the use of the word ‘crazy’ - what makes ‘crazy together’ so special is the lack of doubt and judgment from both parties after opening up about why they think they’re going crazy. these scenes highlight vulnerability - something that couples that aren’t endgame lack because one or both parties refuse to have full communication with one another.

alright. enough of that. let's look at another case where the word ‘crazy’ is used.

the blank makes you crazy scene.

so i just went on a huge rant talking about byeler being romantic, but what about this scene? yet another popular scene among shippers, and is very obviously a callback to 'only love makes you crazy'. but what makes this scene... not romantic? bc this is a pro byeler meta.

firstly, let's just take a step back to look at the bigger picture, and the use of the word crazy within of the context of this season. st3. the season of love. there’s one other person that’s described as crazy way more this season.

there is an endless amount of parallels you can draw between mike and hopper and how they treat we el. right off the bat, in the first episode, mike and hopper are literally butting heads bc mike just wants to make out with el all day and hopper’s just. not really a fan of that.

if we take another step back, mike and hopper are both going through the same thing in relation to el: they're both struggling to be vulnerable with her. they’re both struggling with their feelings.

hopper gets advice from joyce on how to talk to both mike and el, similar to how mike goes to lucas for advice on how to deal with el knowing he lied. the easiest solution for both of them is to be honest with her, and that's exactly what both of them struggle to do.

there are a lot of key words that parallel mike and hopper's feelings towards el. crazy. feelings. heart.

so what does it mean when mike says ‘they do say it makes you crazy?’. maybe it means the same thing as hopper's overprotective behaviour being described as ‘crazy’. maybe it means same thing as jonathan beating up steve after he insulted his family. both hopper and mike have strong familial love for el. the word crazy isn’t used a lot in st3, so i think it's safe to say these instances are meant to parallel each other. it brings a whole meaning to el asking ‘girlfriends? boyfriends’ and mike saying no. bc that’s not how they feel towards each other.

to end this off, i will admit the whole ‘only love makes you crazy’ quote is pretty much based upon flo's misunderstanding of the situation that happened with jonathan, steve, and nancy, bc familial love is what made jonathan snap. but that could easily tie into the misunderstanding between mike and el, bc what they feel for each other isn't romantic/isn't meant to be romantic. what makes joyce seem crazy in st1 is her love for her son will. what makes hopper seem crazy in st3 is his love for his daughter el.

but these feelings are hard to say out loud. and yet, hopper can open up to joyce. joyce can open up to hopper. jonathan to nancy. nancy to jonathan. mike to will. will to mike.

(i'm so sorry i didn't mention lumax at all, but they’re ALSO capable of being open and honest with each other, as seen in the conversation they had on top of the school bus in st2.)

anyways........... all hope that made sense lol

#stranger things #st meta #byeler #jancy #jopper #elmike #this is completely unedited but whatever

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