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gascon-en-exil · 3 years

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What were your disagreements with the Sylvanas video? Agreed with it all, but as someone who left WoW before cata I fear I might be missing context on some of the points

They’re mostly minor things, and some on account of my not having such a strong Horde bias and enjoying aspects of both factions.

The interpretation of the Horde as the Othered/marginalized faction is not a new one, although I think the longer the story goes on and the more races and subfactions get added to each side the less it holds up in all case. I also have no particular affinity for the Forsaken as a specific analogue to Otherness as the video posits, although a lot of that is because the blood elves exist and are vastly more to my taste both aesthetically and ethically.

As the video points out the Forsaken become more comically evil from Cata onward, although the seeds for their disregard for the living and dabbling in biological warfare were sown back in Vanilla and really ramped up with the Blight in Wrath. The end of Wrath also left the Forsaken without a clear purpose; they had helped deliver vengeance on Arthas, and with true death apparently an unwelcome option per Sylvanas’s suicide attempt what then would motivate sapient undead? They’re immediately repurposed for Garrosh’s aggressive expansionism, but I always thought that blaming him for the events of Silverpine and the surrounding areas was a cop-out. The Forsaken want to control all of Lordaeron and resist attempts by humans/the Alliance to reclaim the territory, so what’s the issue with a little plague-bombing and questionable experimentation on live subjects and resurrecting and then brainwashing your enemies to fight for you, really? Between them and the goblins the Cata Horde comes with this gleefully amoral side that I can’t help but find entertaining as a break from the zones that ask you to consider the serious ethical ramifications of the war you’re fighting.

I don’t really understand the point about Jaina’s redemption arc (or whatever you care to call it) in BFA hinging around the circumstances of her father’s death and not her actual war crimes and rage against the Horde. From a Watsonian perspective, why would Katherine Proudmoore and the rest of the Kul Tirans care about any of that more than Jaina apparently betraying her father, and from a Doylist perspective why would Jaina’s post-Theramore hatred of the Horde matter for an expansion that brought the faction conflict back to the forefront? There might be an opportunity to address those elements of Jaina’s character in the future, but reconciling with her estranged mother and homeland wasn’t the time or place for that.

Sylvanas burning Teldrassil - a massive war crime, yes, and blatantly intended to guarantee she’d be hated in-universe and by most of the fandom...but I kind of like it thematically? From the start Teldrassil was a monument to kaldorei arrogance, an attempt to recapture their lost immortality with a new world tree, and since Vanilla the thing’s been plagued by starter zone friendly corruption because it was never blessed by nature/the dragon aspects as such a selfish creation. WoW kind of lost that story thread after Fandral Staghelm became a raid boss in Cata, but that was always something that stuck in my mind about the night elf starting zone. I figure that if Blizzard had reached the point where they were comfortable with permanently destroying in-game capital cities to advance the plot then something would have to happen to Teldrassil, and what’s more I can sort of see it working for Sylvanas as the tree represents an attempt to transcend death - and she and the Forsaken seem to hate the concept of (non-undead) life on principle. So it’s exceptionally petty and stupidly impulsive in the moment, but the burning of Teldrassil tracks from a thematic angle.

It’s weird to think that these long bullet points constitute nitpicks where WoW is considered, but I really did agree with most of that video. There’s just always so much to work through.

#World of Warcraft #WoW

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lightandwinged · 4 years

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ALSR, Chapter Nine: Braiiiiiins

Arathi Highlands: Alleria’s Perspective!

Yay Windrunners! Makani’s art has just pushed them into a world of adoration for me, and I do adore them. I think Alleria is the current frontrunner to me because Sylvanas is just sort of being generically evil and we really don’t get a lot out of Vereesa these days. I did kind of love how, when we found Alleria last expansion, Vereesa had to break it to her that, oh yeah, by the way, our sister is a zombie now and she’s basically lost every single marble that she had because writing.

Alleria is chasing Sylvanas down somewhere, in a sickly forest, or rather she thought that she was chasing Sylvanas down, but it turns out that Sylvanas is chasing her down? Maybe? Or no, Alleria is still chasing Sylvanas, but Sylvanas feels like she owns this and stops being chased to turn around and banshee scream at Alleria, who’s like, “I should’ve listened to the Void when it told me to unload a metric fuckton of arrows in your ass.”

Sylvanas teases Alleria that she could never best her sister, and Alleria’s like man, if I just gave into the Void, I totally could do that! But then Arator and Turalyon show up annnnnd they turn into zombies and/or dust and Sylvanas giggles that this is the cost of standing against her.

But it was all a dream! Well good, because if we’d actually found Sylvanas that quickly, I’d have been very concerned about this book’s pacing. Alleria is sleeping while riding her horse next to Turalyon, and Alleria reflects on how he’s still wild about her even though it’s been a thousand years and they’re on opposite ends of the Light/Void spectrum now. Whatever, these things work sometimes.

So they’ve been riding all night and Turalyon thinks that probably they should rest? But Alleria is adamant that they ride on. Something something poetry, and a line about why everyone in this book should be gay: “when they were apart, she missed him, but now that he was near she had no idea what to do with him.” lolol useless husbands so funny amirite ladies wine wine wine

The Void Elf captain traveling with them is named, I shit you not, Celosel Nightgiver, and honestly, the nounverber names exhaust me somewhat. And he’s accompanied by a Lightforged Draenei named Senn, who does not like Void at all. They’re hunting for some Sylvanas-loving refugees, and they think they’ve found them in the hills up ahead. Alleria wants to nab them now before they figure out that they’re being chased, but Turalyon is like, “we’re exhausted, and if they have a Dark Ranger, it’s not really going to be much of a battle.”

Alleria figures, though, that a Dark Ranger would be better at not being spotted and doesn’t want to lose the chance in case Sylvanas really is That Dumb. But no, she’s not, and this is just literally a convoy of farmers and families going… somewhere. Alleria and Turalyon’s cohort got word from Danath Trollbane that these people saw a cloaked woman with red eyes traveling with this group. Turalyon’s like, “is it at all possible, dear sweet voidwife, that this is a dead end?” but Alleria thinks they know something.

Some old Forsaken guy is like, “literally these people know nothing and you’re jerks.” Alleria looks at them and the Void is like “break many bones and cause him pain and it’s fun to hurt people yayyyy!” but before she can act on that impulse, Turalyon points out that he’s not here to kill anyone, they just want information and offers the refugees whatever their cohort can spare in exchange for said information.

While he’s talking, Alleria is guided by the Void, I guess, to look at an orc woman who has children and is rocking back and forth and nervous, like of course she is? But then the woman’s son charges towards them, which makes orc!mom even MORE nervous (but omg wouldn’t that have been hilarious if Sylvanas’s agent in the camp was a four-year-old?). Turalyon gives a hearty chuckle at the kid and Alleria has a little chat with the kid, the same chat she had when Arator was a tiny baby paladin. “Whatever your elders have told you, war is not glory. War is seeing people at their very worst and choosing to protect them anyway. Go back to your mother, and do not forget what I told you.”

She sends him back to his mother who finally meets Alleria’s eyes, and the Void is like “INTERROGATE THE ORC MOM!” and, guys, I think the Void might be a jerk?

So she demands to speak with orc!mom and Turalyon’s like “...okay, but give us a second,” and asks Alleria wtf she wants to do with this obviously pathetic mass of orcmanity. Alleria asserts again that the Void Knows that orc!mom knows something, and while Turalyon is being slow to act because the Light compels him towards mercy, he agrees with her that interrogating the mom is best. Then he asks if this is the Alliance/their cohort at their worst, bless him.

Alleria talks about her Void!visions and how awful they are, and Turalyon points out that the Void has this tendency to, you know, lie. Alleria explains that she doesn’t have blind faith in the Void, that the only thread of truth she found in all of those horrible visions was that they have to actually act instead of resting on their laurels. She doesn’t want to interrogate people, but she doesn’t see another option.

They compromise by having Turalyon ask the questions, which seems to be the general way of things lately. Turalyon tries his good cop routine with orc!mom, but even when he’s plying her with food and wine and being super nice, she refuses to tell him even the most basic of things.

To her credit, Alleria politely asks Turalyon what their next steps should be instead of doing what she wants to do, which is unleash every void spell in her arsenal. Turalyon tries to suggest that they question the others, but Alleria doesn’t think that will work very well either, even as Turalyon thinks her ideas are probably evil ones. But evil or not, Sylvanas is the BBEG here, so Turalyon agrees to let Alleria use her less pleasant methods.

Gowzis, which is orc!mom’s name, doesn’t want to talk with Alleria either, even going so far as to spit at her feet, but Alleria is bad cop and proceeds to painfully comb through Gowzis’ memories, which is basically torture for her. This goes on long enough for Alleria to confirm that they did see a Dark Ranger, but then the old Forsaken from before insists that she stop, that he’ll tell them whatever they need to know, that they only didn’t talk before because the Dark Ranger made them swear their silence.

Apothecary Cotley, the old Forsaken man, explains that Visrynn, the Dark Ranger who hung out with them (whom we last saw receiving orders from Nathanos to spread the rumor that the Horde are big meanie doo doo heads) had hurt her arm, that Cotley had set it and treated her, that she traveled south afterwards to Faldir’s Cove to charter a boat.

Which is a great lead! Poor Gowzis is a disaster, left horribly scarred mentally and physically from the ordeal, which Alleria is trying to not regret but it was a dick move, so she does regret it. In the meantime, they’re sending all of the refugees except Cotley on their way, because he seems to know a lot, and they need to find out what else is in his zombie brain.

The basic takeaway from all of this is that don’t branetalk, kids.

#abby liveblogs shadows rising #warcraft #shadows rising #hey everyone from 2010 WrA turns out we weren't bending lore even a little bit #isn't that #great #:)

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ladywindrunner · 4 years

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Due to… whatever in god’s name Blizzard is doing, I’ve decided I’m officially making Sylvanas Windrunner canon-divergent. Do not get me wrong, Sylvanas will continue to be an absolute bitch and snake, but I’m no longer going to struggle to fit her into whatever unhinged supervillain Blizzard wants her to be.

From here on out, the verse The Dark Lady will follow the below historical timeline. I will of course update my page to reflect the divergence but – you’ve all been warned.

a very special thank you to @fatesblades @windrunnerrs & @lady-proudmoore for helping me sort through this clusterfuck of an expansion, and ensuring I kept the divergence accurate and straightforward.

please look under the cut for the complete rewrite ❤︎ thank you all for your patience c:

QUICK FACTS:

Sylvanas would never agree or entertain any arrangement with the Jailer. She will never serve another, and that includes some random being in the Shadowlands. Her allegiance with the Horde irks her enough, but she suffers through it out convenience and need.

The Forsaken need allies, they do not need another death-dealing master who wishes to use them as a weapon.

(the only way Blizzard could salvage that plot is if she planned on betraying the Jailer, but it’s still… tired and urgh.)

She is absolutely a treacherous bitch and you should definitely not trust her (especially if you’re alive).

Sylvanas does not, and probably will never respect Anduin as a king. He’s nothing but a child leading nations. She would absolutely use his naivety and good nature against him.

She is a manipulator, and will never brazenly attack an enemy or insinuate herself in a plot unless said person is either someone she can trust (Nathanos) or she’s about to murder them (see: everyone else).

The Forsaken are her people, and she cares about their well-being. If she didn’t it would almost be as if the last years of content and character development meant fuck all for the sake of needing a villain (i’m not bitter, you’re bitter).

THE DARK LADY // A DEADLY BARGAIN (THE DEATH OF VOL’JIN)

Following the Battle for the Broken Shore, as Vol’jin struggles against his mortal wound and the insidious taint of Fel within him… “You do not honestly believe Baine will be beneficial for the Sin’dorei.” Sylvanas’ remark strikes a painful chord within the Regent-Lord, despite his mistrust of her intentions. He watches her with obvious suspicion.

If the Windrunner he knew still lingered in the woman before him, she’d long become impossible to glimpse.

“It does not surprise me you speak of treachery,” Lor’themar counters, eyes narrowed. “Do you remember nothing of loyalty, Banshee Queen?”

Her smirk vile, as is the crimson glare of her dead eyes.

“Do not play as if you care for the Tauren, Lor’themar,” she chuckles, “And I am not suggesting we kill Baine, I am simply bringing a far more agreeable solution to the forefront.”

“Vol’jin will never name you,” Lor’themar scowls. He does not care for the troll, nor his obvious pick, but Sylvanas would be the very last name on the list. She was Queen of the Forsaken, a viper lurking in the tall grass.

The Sin’dorei was having trouble recalling a soul she hadn’t betrayed.

“Imagine if he were to pass with only a chosen few present,” she mused aloud, “Only those few would know which name he spoke…”

“And what benefit do you bring to the Sin’dorei?” Lor’themar nearly snarled. He had not forgotten her aid in seeing his people into the Horde, but she’d been quick to use that against him.

The comment annoys her; she gives him a piercing glare.

“We’re at war, Lor’themar,” she snaps. Her tone lacks its ordinary taunting tone – it is flat with cruel fact. “Do tell me, who do you believe would lead the Horde to victory? Baine? He treasures peace more than sense. He would give ground when he should hold. Gallywix would sell us all for a single gold coin if it’d see his own life spared, and I imagine the Legion can offer him far more.”

If Lor’themar agreed to the plan, she could sway Gallywix easily with payment. The very reason she didn’t wish for the goblin to be in charge, was also the best method of convincing the merchant lord to lie.

“And the last orc who led the Horde, led us into war, and is arguably responsible for the catastrophe we have now…” Sylvanas quirked a brow at the man, her smile returning, “So who does that leave? You?” She stifled half a chuckle, “a man who doesn’t even wish to lead his own people. You have the military sense, Lor’themar. You simply do not possess the ambition.”

He glowered at her, “I would sooner lead the Horde than trust you to remember who came to your aid.”

Windrunner said nothing for a moment, her smile growing slightly as she considered him. He’d grown wiser.

“Pray-tell then Regent-Lord, what do you want in return?”

Vol’jin’s death came swiftly, the grievous wound causing the troll untold agony before he slips away (the speed would have been surprising to the three, if they hadn’t possessed the knowledge that foreign poison masked by the demonic influence, was raging through the Warchief’s veins). Sylvanas Windrunner, Gallywix, and Lor’themar Theron witness the man’s demise together.

His last decree as Warchief was to name Baine Bloodhoof to take his place.

His final command would never reach the others, however. Their lies spun well, Sylvanas saw herself rise to become Warchief.

THE RECLUSIVE WARCHIEF // RECLAIMING THE GHOSTLANDS (POST-LEGION)

Peace is not something Sylvanas handles well. The idleness of it bothers her, but she is not foolish enough to think the Horde wishes to be dragged into another war (not one where the Horde is the aggressor). She tolerates the truce about as well as one can imagine. She is a more reclusive Warchief, she does not care for Orgrimmar, she’d rather spend her time with the Forsaken – who have extended a helping hand to the Sin’dorei in reclaiming the Ghostlands.

A kind gesture, that some see as Sylvanas attempt to placate the more concerned members of the Horde leadership. Some see it as a welcomed change to her character, while others watch her with increased suspicion.

It does help repair a fractured relationship between the Forsaken the Sin’dorei.

An unintended, but welcomed happening while Windrunner keeps her word to Lor’themar.

A GLIMPSE OF PEACE // RECONCILIATION (BEFORE THE STORM)

Sylvanas does not support the meeting between the Forsaken and their living family. Following the catastrophic meeting between she and her two sisters, the Banshee Queen is firmly under the belief that it will lead to nothing but heartbreak and undue pain. The living cannot see past undeath, no matter what they claim.

Receiving the missive from Anduin does nothing but irritate her. His good intentions are viewed by her as a form of manipulation, though she does entertain that he is simply naïve enough to believe that somehow the idea may work to heal old wounds.

She permits the meeting to take place, and is not surprised to see Forsaken turned away by the living.

She is taken aback when she witnesses other families accepting their undead companions. She watches in silence as her people find the peace that has eluded her for years.

“My Queen,” Nathanos’ voice is hushed and careful. She has said nothing for some time, her expression is something unreadable. The crimson light behind her cool eyes has fizzled out, leaving nothing but grey.

Sylvanas glances to her champion.

The gaze is different.He does not recognize at first.

Then he recalls what it is.

Hurt.

In that fleeting moment, she conveys how pained she was. The agony that reconciliation is possible, just not for her.

Sylvanas leaves the exchange, feigning disinterest.

THE SUNDERING OF GILNEAS // THE WAR OF WOLVES (POST-BTS, APPROXIMATELY WHEN TELDRASSIL BURNED)

Yet the Warchief is not without her machinations. She schemes against her closest enemy, the one who ruined her attempts at subduing Eyir, while also discovering a way to bring back into the fold her wayward Forsaken who’ve gone to their living families.

With peace looming, Sylvanas sets to work placing insurgents within Gilneas. Through them, the Banshee Queen ensures that it is Gilneas who broke the armistice. Witnesses on both sides saw Worgen soldiers attacking Forsaken troops.

She calls for the Forsaken in Stormwind to return to Lordaeron, citing concerns over their safety as the Alliance has proven they are incapable of peace with the undead.

Most return to the Horde, peace once again hanging by thread. They have no reason to believe they too have fallen prey to her cunning ruse.

The peace broken, Sylvanas needs no other reason to march on Gilneas. Undead forces wait before Greymane gate, and in response the Gilneans prepare for war.

But it is not the Forsaken who raze Gilneas. Sylvanas engages the enemy in frivolous skirmishes, biding her time until the orcish fleet reaches the shores of the enemy kingdom.

The orcs sweep across Gilneas from the sea, while the Forsaken push inwards from the borders of Lordaeron.

With nowhere to run, the stationed Alliance forces succumb to the combined might of the pincer strike. They simply cannot fight a war on two fronts, and it is not long before they collapse.

Horde soldiers are careful not to cut down any man who surrenders, a specific instruction from their Warchief. A gesture seen as a mercy (while in reality, a convenient manipulation by the Banshee Queen, further implicating Gilneas as the aggressor, and that she is trying to be a worthy leader).

Gilneas is inducted into Lordaeron and becomes Forsaken territory. Prisoners are treated with some dignity. Only a handful are executed when they attempt a desperate escape that inevitably fails.

Sylvanas wastes no time raising those who fought against her as Forsaken, swelling her numbers while the Horde celebrates a well fought victory.

A COLD WAR // TWO QUEENS OF A NATION (AROUND THE TIME OF THE SIEGE OF LORDAERON)

Peace returns, though in the form of a cold war. Relations between the Horde and Alliance are strained, but there is little evidence that anyone is going to break the peace. Sylvanas knows that Genn is biting at the bit for vengeance, and delights in the knowledge that eventually the old dog is going to shatter the truce on his own accord.

She is careful to ensure the Forsaken think little of Calia Menethil (who has since revealed herself). Who is she to return now and call herself queen of anyone or anything? She uses propaganda so her people see it as Alliance mind-games.

The Dark Lady watches over them, not a Menethil.

While she doesn’t care for the unforeseen irritation, at the moment she can do nothing about Calia without the assumption she is responsible for it.

Sylvanas eventually trades the Alliance prisoners for Zul and Talanji. Always seeking allies, they are inducted into the Horde, but find themselves suffering through the delicate peace.

WHISPERS FROM BEYOND // THE SEIGE OF NAZJATAR (RISE OF AZSHARA)

The Speaker of the Horde brings Sylvanas the infamous dagger Blade of the Black Empire, though they claim to have little recollection as to why. While a valuable object, it was not one that the Warchief was seeking out (and the lack of knowledge the Speaker possess, makes the Banshee Queen nervous). She was suspicious of the motivation of the individual who gave it to her, but took the offering despite the uncertainty.

The struggling peace between the Alliance and the Horde is somehow sustaining itself (much to the annoyance of Sylvanas, who cannot break the peace openly). She permits the Forsaken to visit their families, though they must return for their own safety (having ample success in convincing her people the majority of the living are notto be trusted), and she does allow limited numbers of humans into Lordaeron to see their families.

When the mysterious Empress Azshara contacts her, Sylvanas appears to cement an agreement that would see the Alliance decimated, clearing the way for the Horde to rise. Through some means Sylvanas cannot ascertain, the Queen of the Naga has become aware of her possession of Blade of the Black Empire.

She agrees to meet Azshara, and keeps the meeting secret from all but her Champion Nathanos.

Queen Azshara’s request is simple, Sylvanas gives her the dagger in exchange for something. Windrunner scoffs at the idea at first, refusing to part with such an item.

“Surely you wish to do away with the Alliance pests,” Azshara cooed, smirking as she spotted the ever so subtle shift in the Banshee Queen’s form. Of course she was already aware of the answer. She’d spent a long time observing the surface world, ensuring she’d have every advantage. “And I wish to be rid of N’Zoth...”

“I will not part with the dagger,” Sylvanas states, though she chuckles at the apparent impasse. “But perhaps there is an agreement to be made…”

The arrangement was simple.

Azshara would lure the Alliance fleet out into the ocean, and swallow it into her domain.

She would, of course, manipulate this to all appear as N’zoth’s bidding – the Old God was locked away in his failing prison. While his escape was inevitable (though potentially millennia away), he’d be none the wiser in believing Azshara discovered a method to release him.

The Hero of the Alliance would wield the Heart of Azeroth to defeat Azshara and destroy the Old God for good. N’zoth posed such a threat that the High King would not lose an opportunity to strike at the nefarious enemy.

With the Alliance none the wiser, Azshara would decimate their forces, using her imposing naga and sea-monsters to whittle away at their army.

That is when the Horde, lead by Sylvanas, sweeps in to rescue whatever’s left of the Alliance.

This would all be carefully planned of course, to ensure the Horde arrives too late to stop the Hero of the Alliance from unleashing the Heart of Azeroth’s power upon the prison.

N’zoth’s jail will be flung open, and in that moment – Sylvanas will be the one to strike at the Old God and slay it.

Azshara will feign being free of his influence, and slink away into the darkness of the sea. The Horde will appear as heroes.

Unfortunately for Sylvanas, the plan goes awry.

Azshara lures the Alliance out into the ocean and attacks. While she holds off their forces, she does not unleash her full might until the Horde arrives.

The Horde’s fleet arrives earlier then intended due to Lor’themar Theron and Thalyssra’s efforts to speed up the ships and save more lives. Sylvanas finds herself unable to sabotage their efforts without risking her deal be exposed.

Worse yet, it is only when they arrive that Azshara unleashes her full might. She absolutely decimates the Alliance and Horde, intent on slaughtering whoever stands in her way to obtain the blade.

The dagger comes to be possessed by the Naga Queen when she catches Sylvanas off-guard. The two women fight, but Sylvanas is forced to relinquish the knife when Azshara bests her with potent spells.

She’s spared, seeing herself mocked by the Empress and reminded to keep her mouth shut, otherwise everyone will know of their agreement.

Thus it becomes a hasty rush to alert the Hero of the Alliance to the truth of the Heart of Azeroth’s purpose, but Sylvanas and her agents are too late.

Her failure sees N’Zoth freed, though there is a satisfaction in seeing Azshara temporarily subdued.

THE TASTE OF FAILURE // THE PROMISE OF AN OLD GOD (VISIONS OF N’ZOTH)

With the Old God freed from his prison, it wasn’t long before N’Zoth began to corrupt the world. He sent visions into the minds of people, whispering of untold horrors that were near-to arriving.

Not even Sylvanas Windrunner was immune to his insidious powers.

The Horde’s pride, once bolstered by a number of strategic victories – is in tatters after Empress Azshara laid waste to them all.

Sylvanas withdraws to Lordaeron, locking herself away as she attempts to regain her footing after such a catastrophic failure. Her pride had seen her trust Azshara, a foolish move that cost her much of her power, despite leaders of the Horde thinking her notions of saving lives good and honourable.

With little option, the Horde and Alliance work together to fight against N’Zoth. The Banshee Queen does not enjoy being so reliant on the Alliance, but she endures the displeasure out of sheer necessity.

A Horrific Vision of Sylvanas Windrunner is present in Capital City in place of Thrall in Orgrimmar.

N’Zoth preyed on Sylvanas’ fear of death, twisting her mind until she believed only the Old God could grant her immortality. Lordaeron is a writhing, disgusting tomb of void-infused undead and ghosts, who feed off live prisoners in grisly rituals.

Occasionally the city is rocked by a deafening, bone-rattling wail.

ENDURING PEACE // AFTERMATH (POST VISIONS OF N’ZOTH)

Outwardly, the Horde enjoys its lasting peace with the Alliance. As both sides nurse their wounds, Sylvanas is distracted by a growing sensation that all is not right.

While she has no proof of manipulation, the Warchief cannot shake the notion that a new, terrible threat has been watching Azeroth for some time. She finds herself on edge, and sending scouts to all corners of the known world to attempt to find some inkling of what she may be sensing (an endeavour made easier due to the armistice, perhaps the only benefit she’s believed its had).

She also must suffer with the knowledge that Azshara is alive. Windrunner plots the empress’ downfall, though the process is slow and meticulous. She underestimated the queen’s abilities once, and it cost her both her pride, and the dagger.

Sylvanas does not know why Azshara kept their deal secret, but she imagines it is due to some sort of trick the naga will attempt later.

#✧:: the dark lady ( warcraft )#// history rewrite complete #// this took so long T-T #// rachel you're brave for reading this over #//snakevanas is alive and well #// okay im going to toddle off and maybe do replies so i never have to look at this again xD

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poetonthemoon · 5 years

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What angers me most about Battle for Azeroth

Is that it completely ignores a) the roots of the Alliance/Horde conflict, b) the themes developed in Mists of Pandaria, and c) what made the faction war interesting in the first place.

The Old Horde was created when Kil’jaeden deceived the orcs into waging war against an innocent people, then into becoming slaves to the blood of Mannoroth. While the reasons behind it have become more complex over time, the faction war is thus a conflict born of lies.

Mists of Pandaria, despite its goofy exterior, handled the game’s themes in the most mature and nuanced way I can remember seeing since Warcraft 3. Both the Alliance and the Horde have legitimate grievances against one another. The crimes committed by the likes of Garrosh and Sylvanas fuel the Alliance’s hatred, and perceived prejudice along with the many threats to survival drive the Horde’s rage. As Taran Zhu pointed out, “every reprisal is itself an act of aggression, and every act of aggression triggers immediate reprisal.” By the end of the expansion, however, both factions unite to defeat a Warchief who is symbolic of what the Horde used to be, and by extension, of the deception that created their war in the first place.

And then Warlords of Draenor happened, yanking us away from those rich themes. And then Legion, which aside from trailing threads such as Stormheim and the Broken Shore, didn’t deliver on them.

And now, we are in Battle for Azeroth, where rather than draw upon history to incite conflict, the writers have sparked it with azerite, a substance that no one has heard of before. Rather than offer complex motivations for either side, they have defaulted to “the Warchief is the enemy of all life and hope.” And then they have the audacity to claim that this is not only believable, but “morally gray.”

Everything about Battle for Azeroth’s core story thus far, from the pre-patch to the war campaign, spits on the legacy of Warcraft 3 and the depth of Mists of Pandaria.

But it could have been different.

Imagine if, after the Siege of Orgrimmar, the resentment from concessions made during Garrosh’s trial spilled over into conflicts across Draenor. Imagine if, seeing the altered reenactment of the genocide against the draenei, the Alliance’s hatred is rekindled. Imagine if the orcs of the Horde, meeting their ancestors again, long for the traditions that were erased during their time in the internment camps. Imagine if Thrall’s Mak’gora with Garrosh is seen by the Alliance as stolen justice, and the Alliance’s occupation of Ashran is seen by the Horde as stolen heritage.

Imagine if, instead of the Legion invading in full force after the expedition into Draenor ends, the Deceiver sees what has already festered and simply bides his time. Plants his agents. Quietly nurtures those seeds of hatred until they’re in full bloom.

Imagine if, long before Legion comes around, the Battle for Azeroth is already in full swing.

It begins with skirmishes: the Barrens, Azshara, Hillsbrad Foothills, Westfall. Vol’jin and Varian try to temper the aggression from their own sides, but soon, the lack of cooperation from the other end brews anger in them, too. Before long, they no longer wish to stop the war--nor could they. The warmongers of each faction prevail. Both Alliance and Horde get their moments of glory, but countless lives are lost in the process.

Of course, not everyone is enthusiastic about this bloodshed. Varok Saurfang and the other elder orcs are disturbed by this progression of events, uncomfortably reminded of the First War. Baine Bloodhoof tires of the suffering inflicted on the world, and struggles to advise a conflicted Vol’jin who fears that his rebellion against Garrosh was for nothing. Baine’s friend, Anduin Wrynn, desperately tries to convince his father Varian to try for peace, no matter how far gone it may seem, but the rift between them only deepens. At last, the Prophet Velen recognizes the influence of Kil’jaeden, his friend-turned-enemy, but his counsel is ignored--even by his own people, who are freshly reminded of the slaughter on Draenor. Meanwhile, Thrall and Khadgar heed the Prophet’s warning and work together to track down the plotting demons, but reminders of their previous failures plague them at every turn. They send warnings to the leaders of the Horde and Alliance, but traitors and mysterious forces intercept each message.

Only when the final raids are completed, only when both Teldrassil and Undercity have been razed to the ground, are the strains of demonic magic bolstering the attacks recognized by all in each faction. Confusion turns into shock; shock turns into horror. Once again, they have all been deceived. Once again, they have been weakened in preparation for the Burning Legion’s attack. And when the portal opens beneath the Tomb of Sargeras, all hope seems lost for everyone on Azeroth.

It is then that Vol’jin and Varian, both battered and betrayed, understand the nature of their war. How it masks itself as justice, but fosters atrocities that far outweigh all previous slights. How it pretends to be necessary for survival, but destroys everything caught within it. How it writhes and rages like a living thing, sustained not by bread and meat but by every act of hatred.

The Warchief realizes that the Horde he now leads is broken, more akin to the angry, wounded beast it was under Garrosh’s thumb than to the vision of family espoused by Thrall and Sen’jin. With a shudder, he remembers the warning given to him by the Loa long ago on First Home: he may be this world’s savior, or its downfall.

The High King realizes that not only has the war let down his people, but he himself has let down his son. Prince Anduin was young, inexperienced, but ultimately kind and wiser than his years. “He will be a great ruler one day,” the King thinks with a sad smile.

The two leaders look at each other, then at the darkening sky. There is no time to hold an official peace talk, but they both instinctively know that a greater war, one that demands an end to their current conflict, lies ahead.

“What now, Warchief?” Varian asks.

Vol’jin recalls his time in a Pandaren monastery long ago. He remembers the philosophy of the monks who healed him. Then he thinks of the human hunter he fought alongside and grew to respect.

He slowly lifts Shalamayne from where it had fallen, and the High King tenses, once again prepared to fight. But then, Vol’jin tosses the sword to him. Varian catches it, their gazes lock, and understanding passes between them.

“Now,” the Warchief growls, lifting his own blade toward the Tomb of Sargeras. “We break de cycle.”

#World of Warcraft #battle for azeroth #legion #alliance #horde #varian #Vol'Jin #thrall #khadgar #Prophet Velen #anduin wrynn #baine bloodhoof #saurfang #kil'jaeden #burning legion #rewrite #wow rewrite #world of warcraft rewrite

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consequencesofargentdawn · 1 year

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Please do a hot take on Matowa's incredibly ironic and borderline tone deaf comment in the "How is Horde RP in DF?" thread.

(To the surprise of absolutely no one Matowa ended up resurfacing like a case of bad herpes in a PCU guild)

Despite being a completely reductive and false statement (and one they know is false) Magatha Matowa Grimtotem continues to highlight their complete elitism and hypocrisy they have been know for the last ten years or so on Argent Dawn.

The audacity that someone in the PCU, and someone with such a storied history as Matowa, would claim that "most" as in, the majority, of Alliance roleplayers are lorebreakers is frankly hilarious. The same PCU which is quite happy to treat players like a resource to be counted up and used like tokens, the same PCU which blatantly disregards any lore they dislike for their own "war themed" lore, despite not realising the faction war is over.

The same PCU who quietly pardoned themselves for war crimes their characters did during the poorly implemented pseudo-fascist Afrasiabi-era "Sylvanas Loyalist" while at the same time railed immensely around supposed "Alliance war crimes" in BFA and against the Mag'har/Iron Horde characters being allowed re-integration after the Garrosh saga.

We certainly suggest to avoid roleplaying with the PCU unless you want to have a black stain stuck to your name for associating with deluded and clownish hypocrites.

#Confessions of Argent Dawn #matowa #pcu

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jaina-bimoore · 5 years

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I am giving you full permission to go hog wild on how Forsaken pertain to the LGBT community. I would like that a lot in fact. One could say I'm dying to hear.

TBH this could also easily pertain to people who have chronic pain/disabilities/mental illnesses/etc. But I honestly think it best fits with the LGBTQ community.

The idea behind the Forsaken is that they wake up to this new life, where everyone they once loved now hates them and wants to rid the world of them (using the Light, which is SO heavily Christian themed). They have to fend for themselves, and only have themselves and the people around them. It's a very tight-knit community bound by one common thread: they all experience the same pain.

I mean, just the starting zone in and of itself. Lilian Voss is an incredible character, because the game shows her thought progression. She was a girl, brought up by the Light (Christianity) to believe that the undead (LGBTQ people) are unholy and evil. Suddenly she finds herself in the position of being undead (LGBTQ) and freaks out. She calls us, the players, monsters and REFUSES to believe she could ever be Forsaken. Slowly, she comes to terms with it, and is so upset that even though she's the same person, her father no longer loves her. Now in BFA, we see her guide new Forsaken into understanding who they are and helping them come to terms with it.

(Side note: I would die for Lilian Voss).

On top of all that, just the name of the Forsaken. How Sylvanas so desperately tried to reach out to her former allies, only to be hunted for sport. How the Forsaken love her because she showed them that they're not monsters, and they can live their lives (uh... unlives) as they see fit. How she turned to the Horde, who are almost entirely (if not entirely) also minority coded. How even great chunks of the Horde don't trust her and her people, and consider them to be abnormal and freaks of nature (see: Silverpine Forest questline where Sylvanas tries to show Garrosh how she's solved the plight of the Forsaken and he freaks out).

We'll be exploring this idea in EPWP :)

#my post #wow #world of warcraft #sylvanas windrunner #epwp #the forsaken

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shaureyne · 5 years

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By the moons’ glow, listen.

Beside the river, listen.

Holding those you love, listen

To the cries of the dying,

To the whisper of the wind over the silent dead,

To the song my broken heart will ever sing

Of the story of the Tree of the World

And the death of all the dreams

It once cradled in its mighty boughs.

The Memorial of Flames, or “Falo’shanah” in Darnassian, is a discreet IC gathering made to commemorate the 1st anniversary of the War of the Thorns and Burning of Teldrassil, and all those who perished or went missing amidst the chaos.

Please note that while this is an Alliance-leaning and pro-kaldorei event, neutral characters on either faction that can respect this alignment are welcome and encouraged to attend. If your character is prone to assaulting Horde races on sight, or aligns strongly with the Horde/Sylvanas Windrunner, here is our official warning to you: this is NOT an RP event for them.

Disclaimer: In-character (IC) the event will be protected by Cenarion Guardians (NPCs) with specific instructions to remove violent or inflammatory characters from the memorial service. Furthermore, we will not tolerate any level of OOC violence/harassment from either faction during this event.

Event Information

Date & Time: Saturday, August 3rd at 6:00pm (server time) on WrA Attendees: Alliance-leaning & Neutral characters Hosts: (A) @shaureyne, @priestess-nightfury, Elliistra; (H) Zatiya, @shamanofthewilds Starting Location: Lor'danel Outskirts, Old Darkshore Coordinates: (55, 22), Non-warfront zone, War Mode OFF Shareable Forum Link: tinyurl.com/MemorialOfFlames

In order to phase into Old Darkshore from Warfront Darkshore for level 110+ players, find and speak with Zidormi just south of Lor'danel at 48, 24.

Although we are hosting the event in Old Darkshore due to gameplay limitations and the desire for player inclusivity, we are effectively treating the RP as being held in present day Darkshore, post-Burning and mid-warfront. As a result, Inky Black Potions will be essential for the immersion of all participants.

Event hosts will have Inky Black Potions and Elixirs of Tongues on hand to give out to both Alliance and Horde players; we strongly encourage all attendees to come prepared with their own stock of both, as they are vital to immersion and being able to comprehend the opposite faction.

We also strongly recommend that all attendees download the Cross RP addon for this event! It reminds you when to refresh your Elixir of Tongues, and allows you to view TRP profiles of the opposite faction, among other helpful features.

Event Schedule

6:15PM: 🕯️ Circle of Remembrance 🕯️ To begin the memorial, event hosts will invite attendees to step forth if they wish, to share their feelings and experiences regarding the War of the Thorns and Burning of Teldrassil in the form of short speeches, songs, prayers, blessings, and other methods of emotional healing.

Prior to the event, attendees can sign-up in advance to make presentations on a first come, first serve basis! Please post on the official forum thread if you are interested, or contact Shaureyne in-game. Presentations are to be no more than 8 minutes in length so everyone can fit into the schedule.

7:30PM: 🍶 Spiritual Offerings 🍶 This memorial is not only for the sake of easing the attendees’ hearts; it is to soothe the spirits of those that were taken from them. They require coaxing to embrace the living world, and so attendees are given time to make their own spiritual offerings to these dearly departed souls.

Examples of offerings to bring include (but are not limited to) local flora, blessed rice cakes, pine nut bread, amphorae, ceremonial weapons, candles, owl figurines, charms, and personal objects.

8:00PM: 🌬️ Embrace of the Fallen 🌬️ As night falls and the veil between life and death thins, the spirits of the fallen are welcomed back to the living world for a brief time. In unison with these spirits, the attendees will perform a ritual to earn their blessing, and petition Elune for a precious gift.

Attendees are encouraged to obtain a ghostly battle pet in advance for this activity! Examples include (but are not limited to) [Nordrassil Wisp], [Hyjal Wisp], [Spirit of Summer], [Wicked Soul], [Tiny Apparition], and [Lost of Lordaeron].

8:30PM: 🔮 Falo’nor 🔮 Elune has heard us out. After receiving Her gift, when the spirits return to the heavens once more, the attendees make a final procession to Lor’danel beach to herald a new tradition of hope, light, and love.

This final activity will involve the use of [Elune Stones]! Event hosts will have many Elune Stones on hand that they pass out to attendees during the “Embrace of the Fallen” activity, but attendees are encouraged to bring their own if they wish. [Elder’s Moonstones] are also an excellent, albeit soulbound, substitute for Elune Stones.

Post by Shaureyne & Feyawen

#world of warcraft #wyrmrest accord #wra rp #events #memorial of flames #burning of teldrassil #war of the thorns #roleplay

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swampgallows · 4 years

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i wish i were writing more. i wish i had more to write about. i feel better when i write, usually, and even when i just start letting my fingers flutter over the keys i just end up ruminating over the same bullshit that i’m sick to death of having rattle around in my brain incessantly. i need the new. new love, new experiences, new tastes, new wants. i need new blood to revitalize whatever’s still clunking around. i want to get back to my fic but i feel such a disconnect from, well, everything, but WoW specifically too. i love garrosh and when i see him i still feel that draw, but not the same kind of the spark, the same enthusiasm. but that’s like with everything, lately. the fourth war has ended the story in WoW right now and everything’s kind of hanging off a precipice with only a few unsolved mysteries, and some i dont necessarily feel invested in watching play out.

so tyrande goes to get her vengeance, and the ‘undead night elves’ are displaced. do they get to go horde or alliance or something else altogether? who cares. i dont really give a shit. unless tyrande goes full feral (a word i am hesitant to use due to current connotations) i dont give a shit what elune or the elves are gonna do about teldrassil. oh no, a different elf burned the elf tree. like i give a shit.

i dont give a fuck about sylvanas. i wish she were just fucking dead. please let her bow out and die in peace. the horny squad currently propping up her puppet thrice-corpse will go necrophile on her no matter what anyway; at least let her bow out of the story with some fucking dignity intact.

basically the only plot threads i care about right now are 1. holy shit are we ever getting that sword out of azeroth’s butthole, please save the titan and 2. vol’jin’s spirit on de other side/shadowlands. MAYBE talanji will want revenge for rastakhan’s death or whatever the fuck but i am so fuckin bored to DEATH of this goddamn hashtag woke fuckin girlboss BULLSHIT, the whole fuckin rigamarole, of people saying it’s feminist or not feminist or blizz cant write women or hurr durr crazy woman goes hysterical cuz no babies or shes having emoshuns!!! or the people bitching about that or the people bitching about the people who are bitching about it or the holier than thou fucks on reddit like Um There Are Plenty of Female Characters In Warcraft. Checkmate Fellow Atheists or the people who kin or hyperfixate or project or traumabond or ship or whatever the FUCK talking about how if anything bad happens to the character then they WILL stop playing the game and how blizzard is hashtag canceled and remember hongkong and #notmywarchief and then retaliate with protests by canceling their accounts or flaming the forums or turbogenerating sfm porn and thicc hentai of these TITular characters and i am so FUCKING SICK OF IT

i want the sword out of azeroth and i want papa voljin back home and i want thrall and jaina to kiss and regret it and i want to see garrosh tortured to shit in shadowlands. this is LITCHERALLY all i am alive for right now, everythin else is fuckin garbo and hopeless. cant stand bein at my decks, im runnin out of eps of friends, and i dont have a reason to even get out of bed in the morning except to piss. i created a new file on stardew valley out of desperation. i want to do something constructive but my vessel is on a fucking backlog at this point and i want something new but the entire fuckin world is closed for repairs. jesus goddamn christ

#blathering #world of warcraft /

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renaultmograine · 4 years

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Honestly the Horde roster of characters really sucks right now, only Blood elves have a real cast. The Horde doesn't even have an elite soldier organization since the Kor'kron were clumsily retconned as evil & then killed off, whilst their rogue organization, the Shattered Hand is forgotten & has no notable characters. I wish they'd kept Kargath Horde. As a WC2 Fan, Old Lore had Kargath stranded on Azeroth & eventually joining Thrall's Horde.

I do not envy the writers’ jobs. Maintaining the personalities of a LOT of characters with consistency and growth is rough, but I feel like repeatedly killing off Horde leaders is lazy at best. There’s better ways to cause an expansion’s worth of problems than killing a warchief, figuratively or literally, off every other expansion and having the off expansions deal with the consequences.

Idk. Whenever I play the Horde I see so much story potential that should be played, so many dropped threads that if they just pushed it a little more, I’d be on their side more. Allusions to Anduin and Arthas being similar? Push it more and make that Sylvanas’ “motive” against the Alliance. Nathanos claims that the Alliance are all just a bunch of self-righteous assholes that want the forsaken eradicated for more than just war reasons? Push it more and give the Horde a reason to do what they do other than just We’re Red And They’re Blue.

This is just my opinion, but there shouldn’t be a clear right and wrong side in the faction war expansions. It’s not… fun from the position of someone following both sides.

just give me like a civil war expansion for once. give me some defias brotherhood 2.0 or actual problems between intra-faction leaders.

this got off topic a bit but yknow.

#warcraft #ask #its my blog and its MY asks ill answer them how i want to #Anonymous

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alteredphoenix · 4 years

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I'm doing some Legion raid quests that I never got around to doing back in the day (getting into raids higher than LFR has always been a bit troublesome for me), but I've always thought how strange it was that Illidan's soul was yanked from the Twisting Nether into Helheim in an apparent deal that Gul'dan made with Helya - or so Xe'ra and the Illidari believe to be.

In a questline that sheds light on Illidan's true motivations behind siding with the Burning Legion and the pains he took to shore up his power and destroy them from within, this particular tidbit has flown under the radar. The conclusion Allari comes to leaves more questions than answers, although once you deliver his soul to Light's Heart and prepare to assault the Nighthold these are ultimately left unresolved for the foreseeable future.

It makes me wonder what exactly the details were behind this deal. I'm going to assume this was made after Gul'dan coerced Elisande to lower the shield to allow the Legion into Suramar, so this means he went to the Vault of the Wardens to retrieve Illidan's body and conduct the ritual that separates the soul from the body at Black Rook Hold before or after he went to Helheim and stated his conditions for his end of the bargain.

But why would Helya want Illidan's soul in Helheim? Sure, you can easily hypothesize that Gul'dan wanted to put the soul there so Illidan - and the Champions of Azeroth - had no means to return to his body, where it would be taken to the Nighthold and be used as a vessel for Sargeras's soul to funnel into from the Twisting Nether and possess for himself so as to have a foothold in the world. However, this is just one end of the deal - Gul'dan's deal. What, exactly, would prompt Helya to want to take possession of Illidan's soul and hold it within her realm?

Unfortunately there is no possible speculation to be made that can reach a feasible conclusion without it treading into uncharted territory that is more than likely to be debunked by future canon. Helya herself is a spirit, her physical form destroyed by Odyn and her spirit twisted into becoming the first spectral val'kyr; being denied corporeality, she would have no means to possess Illidan - himself a soul at this point - and use him as a means to break free from Helheim and have her vengeance against Odyn and the Stormforged Valarjar. For all intents and purposes, Helya may have jailed Illidan's soul in Helheim so he would not be reunited with his body and continue his war against the Legion.

However, this brings up another question: How much does Illidan know is going on? Before we are sent on the quest to slay Helya in her natural realm and store his soul in the Soul Prism, he was last seen fleeing from the Burning Legion in the Twisting Nether. Was he coherent during his time in Helheim? If he was, did he learn what Helya's part of the deal with Gul'dan was? Again, this is not addressed. Once he is returned to his body, Illidan's only goal is to tear open the portal to Argus with the Sargerite Keystone after Kil’jaeden’s death and slay the Unmaker upon the Seat of the Pantheon, where he remains to this day as Sargeras's jailer - knowing full well that when he first looked upon the ruins of Argus, he knew he would not be going back to Azeroth.

(Or, at least, as far as the plot is concerned. The title of the quest "Trial of Valor: The Once and Future Lord of Shadows" implies the role he will play in the future, in a possible subplot concerning the Light-Void arc. But that is merely headcanon, and another thread for another time.)

This also brings up one more facet to this mystery that has yet to be addressed: Helya made her deal with Gul'dan to incarcerate Illidan's soul in Helheim shortly after the Alliance and Horde's loss at the Battle for the Broken Shore, presumably before the cleansing of the Emerald Nightmare and the Suramar Rebellion. This would mean that Sylvanas may have seen Illidan's soul in Helheim when she struck her bargain with Helya to subjugate Eyir with the Soulcage in Skold-Ashil at Stormheim (provided Illidan wasn't suddenly socketed away in hammer-space when this happened, but this is highly doubtful). Could it be that Illidan factored into the bargain Sylvanas and Helya made, prior to the adventurer chancing upon them, and if so, was he aware enough to hear everything that was said between them? Again, this is hard to say without delving into what-ifs and conjectures that may not be realized.

However, this does shed light on the possibility that the Twisting Nether is an extension of the Shadowlands: a demon's soul can only regenerate therein, or be dragged from it and be forcibly restored in Antorus, but it may also permanently die within the Twisting Nether. This would explain how Gul'dan was able to pull Illidan's soul from there and incarcerate it within Helheim; being in possession of the Scepter of Sargeras, the headpiece having a deep connection to the Shadowlands. This would entail that the Legion had the means to partly craft it, or perhaps had taken it - either given to them freely or stolen by force - from whomever provided them the means for it. It is possible that the denizens of Revendreth were the ones to give or inspire Sargeras to add nathrezim wings to the headpiece (and curiously, their capital is called Castle Nathria), but this has not been confirmed unless the developers give an official statement on it and only speculation.

Whatever this means, this is a plot thread that will be left untouched for the time being yet one that holds many implication for the storyline in the future. Will it be brought back in Shadowlands, or the expansion before that? Will it be intertwined with the Light-Void arc or a separate subplot? And will Sylvanas be involved, if at all?

Until then, we can only venture to guess what this deal - and that of Sylvanas’s - holds for Illidan.

#world of warcraft #legion #battle for azeroth #illidan stormrage #sylvanas windrunner #meta

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