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That's the main problem with chaggie's writing, it's boring. And to a certain extent I can get wanting some boring, non sexualized sapphic rep. Not in this specific hyper sexual show and universe, but in general yes. I get it. But even the parts of their relationship that should have conflict, that could be toxic if it meant being interesting, aren't? And it seems to me Charlie only sees vaggie as her girlfriend kind of when it's convenient?

Like, the angel reveal, what was the fucking point of making it something Charlie didn't know if it was going to get swept under the rug the very next episode. Something like that, finding out that someone you've been in a romantic relationship for at least 3 years and whom you've been completely open and honest with has been hiding a huge part of themselves. And it's not like Charlie would have really cared that vaggie was an exterminator; it's hell. Demons kill each other all the time! For all that it mattered to the story overall you could have had Charlie know the whole time but the audience wonder how she'd react and then have it be a joke. Viv's shows have done that before.

Also, notice she only ever introduces vaggie as her girlfriend, once, to her father. In heaven vaggie's Charlie's ambiguous partner, when venting to Alastor she's not "the person I love the most" or "my girlfriend" or "my best friend turned girlfriend" she's "the person I trust most".

And of course, the major problem with chaggie is that it's incredibly one sided. Both in terms of dynamic and character. I get it, Charlie's the protagonist, she's one of the major main characters. Obviously she's going to have a lot going on. But here's the thing, Vaggie's one sentence sum up is "Charlie's girlfriend and a former exorcist, she protects the hotel and Charlie in equal measure". There's nothing else to her, we have no idea what her interests are, we have no idea why she's going along with the hotel especially when she knows what heaven and the angels are like. We know she tries to reign Charlie's wilder ideas in, but that usually goes like this,

Charlie: I have an idea

Vaggie: I don't think that will work

Charlie: I'm gonna do it anyways

And then not one single apology is ever uttered. From either party. Let's remember that despite warning Charlie never to make a deal with Alastor vaggie does the same thing in overture to get a commercial done. And yes, she is hesitant, yes she says she's not selling her soul for a commercial. But the fact of the matter is that she still makes a deal with him, something she then attempts to chide Charlie for in hello Rosie. Every time vaggie has advice for Charlie it involves Charlie changing herself to please the people of hell instead of finding people more amenable to Charlie's way of pitching. Who did that for Charlie? Oh right! It was Alastor. And I get that he's trying to manipulate her, but we can see through the magic of visual storytelling that even if it's not romantic, Charlie is becoming his person, his one exception to every rule. They have so much in common while at the same time being completely different.

TLDR; the reasons lot of people like charlastor is in part because even the show didn't seem to care that much about chaggie. And I kind of wish more chaggie fans were mad about that.

To be honest, I agree with you about RadioBelle (or Charalastor if you’re more familiar with that). Like, if Viv didn’t want us to ship RadioBelle anymore because Chaggie is now a thing. Then why does Charlie arguably have more chemistry with Alastor than her own girlfriend?!

Also RadioBelle and RadioRose are genuinely adorable to me and I love them

vivziepop really gave Charlie more chemistry with every character OTHER than her girlfriend. Like…chaggie is just BORING. The fandom characterises more than the actual show. And yet the show is praised for “amazing lesbian rep” and as a lesbian I can confirm, no, no it is not. I do just love RadioBelle (I think RadioRose is Alastor x Rosie? Which is pretty cute, I do like their dynamic friends or lovers). Chaggie is about as interesting as unseasoned chicken with white rice. I’ve eaten it before when I had bad stomach issues, and yep same thing.

#charlastor #radiobelle #chaggie critical

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Translation: “I give permission to use this fanart as a way to respond to Charlastor haters. You get tired of trying to make others understand that it's just personal taste and I will defend my OTP with everything I have.”

#hazbin hotel #charlastor #pro charlastor #radiobelle

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I craved some casual fluff today, tee hee

#charlastor #radiobelle #hazbin hotel

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I know this is the most nitpicky of issues regarding this... "direction" but... why did they use the version of Gabriel that appears in season 5 and no other season? Like presumably that man has been rocking his stupid duck hair for the last 20 years and if they were insistent on giving him a statue I'd much have preferred it to be the gabriel with the stupid hair and perpetual scowl. At least it would have been the more honest version of gabriel

I don't think y'all fully understand how much this pissed me off.

#its 2024 and i still hate this #miraculous ladybug #miraculous #mlb #ml writers salt #gabriel agreste salt

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subdue 🔒😈

#hazbinhotel #charlastor #radiobelle

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vaguely inspired by this song

i may or may not have pulled an all-nighter to finish this, woops

experimental alt versions under the cut!

#charlastor #radiobelle #hazbin hotel

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My brain is fried but at least the gang's all here!!

#hazbin hotel #radiobelle #charlastor

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Obsessed with these two ;_;

#charlastor #radiobelle #hazbin hotel

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Office Break.

#charlastor #radiobelle #hazbin hotel

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I kind of disagree pre season 4/5, when I think most of this stuff that's a problem with Lila as a character comes into play. Like, yes I know with seasons 1 and 2 we get like... 1 episode each. But ironically, what we did get was both a lot more realistic and a lot more sympathetic than whatever they plan on doing with her now. Even if she was never redeemed and became the future hawkmoth, like at least her motivations made sense?

Season 1 Lila was a new girl in a new place, a daughter of a diplomat who even Marinette believed in until she saw Lila steal the book and fake a miraculous to try and take adrien from her. Let's be real, if Lila had tried to hit on and impress Kim? Neither Marinette nor the audience would have had any reason to doubt her, because even if her lies were a bit outlandish it did make sense for a jet setting daughter of a diplomat.

Season 2 Lila? We find out that she's been doing video check ins after refusing to come to school and intercepting any attempts made to contact her mother. The only parent of that set we see. This mother is so incredibly busy that even though she does seem to love her child she's rather neglectful for the sake of her career. Reasonable stimuli for why Lila might lie, to get the attention she's seeking but not getting from her mom, and because if she's always moving around she perceives them as not worth being open and honest with. Followers are easier to leave behind than friends. Chameleon demonstrates that she doesn't want to change, and ngl I think that if they wanted any other story arc to work on that season they should have expanded the five man band to full time holders with no more identities secret. Lila becomes the antagonist of civillian life while hawkmoth tries to target Chloe specifically to get her away from ladybug's influence. That resolves the Marinette/chloe conflict without upending their characters too much because both of them respect the work they put in as heroes. Chloe can help derail Lila's plans without any damage to her reputation because the class already hates her so what does it matter if she's the one picking on Marinette or the sweet new girl everyone loves? That's just Chloe, that's what she does! Alya being allowed to believe Marinette would be a huge help, and Chloe's resources would allow Alya unprecedented access to events that Lila would brag about but not actually be able to get into.

Introduce Felix and you have a better villain team up where both of them want something and are willing to lie and manipulate to get it. Lila might even be satisfied having Felix pose as her boyfriend under the guise of adrien and everyone has to puzzle out how to tel the difference or adrien has to accept it publicly. Gabriel is in a rock and hard place because he's never expressed connection to the graham de vanillys so stating "that's not my son it's my nephew who's his identical twin" is not gonna go over well with the pr. But if he can get to Lila, he can get to felix through her.

Idk, there's just so much interesting stuff you could do with Lila they didn't for the sake of a plot twist that functionally doesn't work.

There are very, very few Lila fics where she’s redeemed/good/chaotic. And honestly that’s fair, a lot of the people salting on her are understandably frustrated by the worst lies she tells and the sheer amount of plot armor she has

But then I see the occasional fic, where it delves into her life or her mindset, where she makes some friends, or when she learns that the people at her new school do genuinely care about her and maybe she should just indulge in it, and it always leaves me desperately wishing that canon went a different direction with her

Right now we have a living paradox where she tells the most ridiculous and obvious lies to her peers and the adults and not a single person has actually figured her out yet, her plot armor being so strong that it bends reality, and Adrien’s own friends don’t even believe him

The way she’s written makes it damn near impossible to not want to salt on her, so much so that Gabriel has more fics where he’s good than her. Writing a redemption fic kind of requires a bit of an overhaul of how she’s written

I dunno what I’m yapping about here honestly, I just want more of those types of fics, cause her character is so interesting to me, just not the way she actually is in the show. The few I’ve seen where she’s just a chaotic good/neutral force are the most fun imo (maybe I should write a Lila fic)

#when it comes to lila #we are given little to no groundwork for a redemption #that redeeming her feels like we might as well have made an oc #miraculous ladybug #ml writing critical

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kissu

#radiobelle #charlastor #hazbin hotel

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That is the eyeroll of "I will bang anyone I so choose I'm several thousand years old and I will not be coddled"

And then after that thought she forgot the part she's supposed to be mad at is the implication that she and Alastor are a couples

Ok but when Rosie says "she's much too young for you!" to Alastor, why does Charlie look so offended--

#charlastor #radiobelle #hazbin hotel

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Right, that's why ladybee emulated Chloe's bee holder costume, why there's so little merch for vesperia when compared to queen bee, including her own chibi figure, a miraculous set entitled "Chloe is queen bee", why Marinette's camouflage hair comb resembles Chloe's camouflage hair comb and not Zoe's, why the queen bee doll is still for sale on the official site and not vesperia, and why the pair are bundled together but most of the merch depicts Chloe... right?

Zoe is only the true holder of the bee because she's a good little drone and doesn't question girlboss bug. Chloe and queen bee would follow ladybug's plan, but you can't tell me if she thought something was dumb she wouldn't say so. Chloe has always been the lancer to Marinette's leader and without it the leader cannot grow. Case in point, where did Marinette's character go once Chloe was removed as both ally and main civillian antagonist? Oh that's right, the Marinette is always right train and can never make a mistake due to selfishness or her own narrow worldview. Chloe in every aspect existed to challenge Marinette view and make it broader. Zoe is there to show that being a good victim is how you end up being taken in by a guy who ruined his first kid and is not even your dad.

Speaking of which, how does mr Lee feel about some random guy adopting his kid? Is the show saying all American parents are terrible?

Just saw the tag for that Guardian Nino post and you're going to hate this, but apparently, according to the leaked Bible.... the true holder thing is Canon for at least Zoe, her subsection in Chloe's section refers to her as the true holder of the bee miraculous

I've heard, I just thought it was a twitter thing but holy shit. If it's in the bible but not (yet?) in the show, then I'm just gonna count it as soft canon. For now. Never underestimate how low this show can sink with emulating the salt crowd. It's a miracle the episode Action was just a run of the mill eco episode instead of another Chloe shit fest considering now that Zoe is the True Holder of the Bee, it's been retconned to have the concept of Action instead of Subjugation... what a way to tell me she wasn't planned without actually telling me.

#asks #ml writers salt #ewwww this trope again

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It's because insisting a platonic relationship (nevermind slotting found family members into nuclear family roles that's a whole other can of worms) is familial gives them a moral high ground when they come across ships they don't like.

I've seen it a million times "oh they're father and daughter" oh, "they're creepy uncle and niece" and I side eye those the hardest because 1. They often infantilize the female to an insulting degree and 2. If they think some of these depictions are how actual irl older male/"younger" female (Charlie is technically many hundred of years older chronologically but physically maybe about five years younger) I worry for their relationships.

Nothing about Alastor and Charlie's dynamic shows them as business partners, maybe he finds her charming and mildly amusing. And maybe she enjoys having someone to fulfill her whims instead of just shooting them down for being impractical. There's no care, there's a lot of creepy touching and invading of personal space especially on alastor's end. But one important thing to note is that he makes exceptions for Charlie that he doesn't really make for anyone else. Both Mimzy and Rosie had to wait for consent from Alastor before engaging him in hugs. Charlie finds out he's alive;l, throws herself at him in a hug and he allows it even though he hasn't given any consent like normal.

But because they don't have the excuse of "Charlie's a lesbian" because she isn't, and even if she was to end up with Alastor in canon it wouldn't detract from either character's established queer identity, they now resort to the "they're [insert familial dynamic here]" as a way to justify their bullying. And that's what it is: bullying. It's not enough to just say "I don't like the dynamic" and move on blocking any and all appropriate tags if it squicks them that much. Modern fandom has such a moralistic element to it, if you don't like something it must therefore mean that thing is fundamentally bad/sinful/immoral and therefore anyone who does like it is a bad person irl who is allowed to be treated poorly. And you know how I know this?

Valentino cosplayers have been bullied into apologizing for liking the character. And let me be clear in my distinction, he's a bad person, but a great character. He's not on screen a lot but you get what type of person he is instantly. His va? By all accounts one of the nicest people. He literally was told once that someone was afraid of meeting him because they worried he was going to be exactly like Valentino. Clearly we have forgotten that VA stands for voice ACTOR. An actor that acts with their voice. There is no distinction in a lot of people's minds that an actor can embody a role without condoning every single action that character takes. And the moralization where the goal posts are consistently moved in fandom for ships does not help matters.

I'm also gonna say this, modern fandom is unnecessarily hostile to straight passing ships. Even though nothing about charlastor makes Charlie any less bi or any less aroace because it's a passing guy and girl couple. People insist charlastor is platonic and father/daughter but the popularity of radioapple ironically undercuts their arguments. Because controversial take; radioapple is charlastor but gay. It's enemies to lovers gay charlastor. Because alastor's aroace identity doesn't seem to get as much defensive haters in that tag, nor does the fact that Lucifer has explicitly stated he likes girls and has banged both of Adam's wives. Nope! He's gay and in love with the radio demon. Even though Alastor cannot stand men by and large and hates Lucifer especially (likely due to his issues with his own father abandoning him young). But again, they moralize everything. They don't like charlastor for whatever reason they have, and honestly good for them! No one says you have to like them! But to be mean to others that do?

In the immortal words of sonic the hedgehog; that's no good

Whats with hh fans hating on charlastor saying that they are father and daughter like 😭😭😭😭😭

I think It's bc of a "Hell's greatest dad" song, but yeah, actually they have no media litracy if they think he was serious

#charlastor #radiobelle #hazbin hotel

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Didn't they already pull that with Chloe though in the show? "Oh, her getting the miraculous was a mistake"

I would argue that Chloe fits a truer holder motif than perfect precious zoe if only because there was one statement Marinette made in regards to her "if being ladybuf helped me become a better Marinette, maybe being queen bee will help her be a better Chloe"

And she was right, how often during season 3 did we see Chloe volunteer to fight danger when season 1 Chloe would have run and hid? Of course, somehow this gets painted as a flaw, she's selfish and wants the spotlight, but aside from saying "you really should call on queen bee" at every run in with the heroes when does she bring it up? She sees a situation, wants to be of use, and asks only for the tool to help do it. We see her targeted because of her compromised identity exactly once, we see her upset people on purpose to try and get her miraculous once.

Hell, during the ladybug episode we see her actively shielding someone she cares about and keeping their morale up, even when Marinette herself nearly succumbs to hawkmoth's influence. We saw her resist akumatization, the first and ONLY character in the series over 100 episodes to do so. Not break from it after it's already happened, but stop it from happening in the first place.

Again, if zoe was the true holder of the bee why is Chloe's journey with it far more compelling? She's commanding, blunt, can be annoying, but ultimately does good when allowed to. Aka; the same qualities of most bees.

Idk, Zoe's consistent wasp imagery doesn't help with those who tout she's the "true" bee holder. If we go on what it means to have fate decide Chloe fits that bill a lot better in every possible way. But considering they couldn't let anyone get in the way of girlboss Marinette I'm not surprised her lancer was completely nerfed

True holder fics also rarely if ever address one thing: if there are consequences for wrong holders, then how is Gabriel still Hawkmoth?

Yeah. In fics salting on Adrien, they'd say its why he only has Cataclysm and couldn't evolve his powers... but Gabriel has shown he could. He created Megakumas to override the magical charms. If its not an upgrade, he has been shown to bend the rules. He abused loopholes like creating Catalyst to buff him or somehow making more than one akuma at a time by making them share an item. Like, really? Is Gabriel a true holder then? Or is this just a skill issue?

#also side eyeing the canon writers if they ever try to pull this card against chloe #miraculous ladybug #chloe bourgeois #chloe deserves better

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Commission for @megillien (ﾉ´ヮ`)ﾉ*: ･ﾟ

#hazbin hotel #charlastor #radiobelle

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Ngl, I liked season 2 nathalie the best. The moments the audience got where we know she's aware of Gabriel's motivation, and has enough sway over him that she can hug him, meanwhile adrien who likely hasn't touched his father with anything more than a hand on his shoulder since this whole issue began, has to be turned into a glitter statue and nearly obliterated to get one from him.

The moment where she berates him without saying much of anything? The moment where she says she understands but then we see her walk away and be absolutely devastated by the news? Catalyst? I'm sorry I refuse to believe Gabriel "akumatize mr pigeon 72 times and akumatize the damn baby more than once" agreste came up with a plan to figure out Lila Rossi was languishing in an apartment for several months and use targeted statements to make her ire enough to want all of paris to suffer? Gabriel Agreste figured out how to create an akuma that could bolster his own powers? I call bs on that, that was all nathalie. She's the one who risked herself to save him, even knowing the danger.

Mayura was heavily underused, especially given the fast progression of her illness in later seasons. Like what was the point of making nathalie a parallel to adrien in terms of self-sacrifice for the one they love to the point where it's really worrisome if they weren't going to do anything with it? Chat noir constantly getting hit versus mayura out in the active field wih a miraculous that glitches out on her and can render her physically unable to move for hours afterwards? What was the point of that scene in ladybug where our heroine and the villain have each others allies at their mercy and demand the other let their partner go while said partner insists they don't worry about them? That moment of temporary truce where rescuing that partner from falling off the arc is more important than getting the other's miraculous?

I feel like they were setting up a parallel between adrien and Marinette with Gabriel and nathalie, right down to the fact that everyone else but the object of the woman's crush can tell they have feelings. Adrien "she's just a friend" Agreste figured out that there was something there. If he can do it, it's too obvious. But then, somewhere along the line, something happened. That retooling took everything interesting about the dynamics and pushed it to the side. The peacock is fixed but mayura never shows up again. No more is the villain square the dark reflection of what could be with the love square, it's nothing. And it irritates me. People say "well gabriel sacrificed himself to save nathalie, that's an act of true love!"

No, it's not. It's an act of selfishness that had a benefit for someone he allegedly cared about but did nothing to help. Especially since it was never clear if that was Emilie or Amelie in the finale. It was credited as Emilie, but until the next season airs it's kind of up in the air. I just... there was so much potential and it was all wasted. I thought nathalie might be the one thing aside from his son that would make gabriel stop, make him realize this wasn't worth it. But hey, at least the movie gave us that, it gave us a gabriel who will stop if it means hurting the one remnant of emilie he has left. Can't wait for whenever the sequel comes out

Nathalie's such a frustrating character for me. As a villain bad-bitch more competent than her boss? I liked her. I mean I. Hated her but you were supposed to! Gabenath was the classic spicy villain combo. I actually *liked* her original Show-Bible motivation. She's out there to steal the wish and make Gabriel pick her over Emilie.

'But that's so disempowering!' You might say. In the abstract? Yeah. But in context? Her out there trying to get a wish to take away his choice while he's taking away other people's choices with the butterfly? Oh that's such *layers*. Him trying to reclaim his life while she tries to steal it out from under him? So good! *Especially* since we know she is more competent.

Then they flip to the uwu good mom always loved Adrien narrative and she's just such a limp wet rag. She mopes around doing the bare minimum and looking sad so we can have her return as Adrien's guardian be a good thing.

Is it a good thing? I dunno- let's ask Adrien's sister.

Oh, right.

#ml critical #miraculous ladybug #nathalie sancoeur #gabriel agreste #gabenath #Nathalie deserves better