#the shifting asoiaf canon conundrum

[lemonhemlock]

Alrite, gang, time for a crackpot theory. It is very possible I might be reading too much into this, but let's have fun for a hot minute.

In a previous version of the Targaryen family tree from 1998, Alysanne was Maegor's daughter with Ceryse Hightower, then George changed it to her being Aenys' and Alyssa's child.

In a previous version of the story, he had Jaehaera live as the mother of Aegon III's children, then changed his mind, killed her off and replaced her with Daenaera Velaryon.

(If someone could point out precisely in which edition of the supplemental texts this features in, I would very much appreciate it. Or if they have on hand the references to the first family tree.)

So, George basically went out of his way to remove Hightower blood from Targaryen lineage, not once, but twice. Would there be any reason why he would need to do this? Perhaps related to the main series and the final endgame?

Or was the transfer of Alysanne from Maegor to Aenys done just so Visenya's line would die out? And the removal of Jaehaera from the narrative done just so only Daemon & Rhaenyra's line continue? If so, then why?

NB. I am tagging this as team green, because I would rather not receive half-baked takes based on how evil / low-born / unworthy the Hightowers are to mingle their DNA with precious magical Valyrian blood.

Edit: Nevermind, I have already been debunked in the comments. Like Icarus, I flew too close to the sun, only to crash with melted wings!!! 😪

#asoiaf theories #house hightower #jaehaera targaryen #alysanne targaryen #ceryse hightower #alicent hightower #team green #asoiaf meta #hightower erasure theory #the shifting asoiaf canon conundrum

[lemonhemlock]

GRRM brutally killing a traumatized autistic 11 year old girl, and replacing her by a younger, happier and "prettier" girl, just to please a boy is so f******* up that I can't even explain

The political union was also a thing, but hey it's a Daemon kid so, I am pretty sure if Aegon II got pregnant by Daemon, Martin would let the kid live ☠️

In the AGOT summary, in the Targaryen line, it says that Viserys II is Aegon III's son. Why he changed that? Daeron I was 15 when he was crowded, so Martin married his father to child? Instead of changing the years of the Targaryen reign, he ratter pull Viserys II as a brother and married him to a 19 yr old? He was a father by 13? That old man is so weird sometimes. If Jaehaera was a Daenerys decent, I believe that Team Green x Team Black wouldn't be so strong and annoyingly repeatedly discussed by the fandom ☠️

I checked and you're right about Viserys II being Aegon III's (fourth!) son. Who was the third son, then?? I wonder what else he changed. It's difficult to keep track and fact-check.

If Daenerys was Jaehaera's descendant, they'd be writing fic with Jaehaera defecting to team black, don't worry. 😵

#justice for jaehaera #ask #friedanimepositivitylamp #IF AEGON II GOT PREGNANT BY DAEMON LMAO #what a cursed timeline #the shifting asoiaf canon conundrum #viserys ii targaryen #aegon iii targaryen

[lemonhemlock]

Even if it's some rumours although I doubt it , i still think Alysanne being Maegor's daughter, and Jaehaerea survive the dance and marrying Egg 3 are better for the themes of the story and it brings some sort of irony here. Like all it's left from the bloody civil war (DOD) and from the glorious Targaryen house are broken children, who have the burden of continue their house legacy despite being so traumatized. Killing Jaehaerea off and replaced her with a younger non-targaryrn girl who is all sunshine and trauma-free is lazy writing IMO. Also didn't Daenerys say in one of her chapters in AGOT that she is the blood of Aegon the conqueror, and The blood of *Maegor the cruel* and old Valeryia before them? . Why would she said that unless Visenya's line was meant to continue on before grrm decided to change it?

Even if it's some rumours although I doubt it , i still think Alysanne being Maegor's daughter, and Jaehaerea survive the dance and marrying Egg 3 are better for the themes of the story and it brings some sort of irony here.

Killing Jaehaerea off and replaced her with a younger non-targaryrn girl who is all sunshine and trauma-free is lazy writing IMO.

Honestly, I feel the same. I just keep wondering whether he has something up his sleeve we don't know about and FB II is somehow going to prove the missing piece.

Also, Alyssane escaping the destabilizing tyranny of Maegor only to be confined to the nice-guy coercion of Jaehaerys adds meat to her arc in a v unexpected way.

The blood of *Maegor the cruel* and old Valeryia before them? . Why would she said that unless Visenya's line was meant to continue on before grrm decided to change it?

She lifted her head. "And I am Daenerys Stormborn, Daenerys of House Targaryen, of the blood of Aegon the Conqueror and Maegor the Cruel and old Valyria before them. I am the dragon's daughter, and I swear to you, these men will die screaming. Now bring me to Khal Drogo."

She did, indeed, say that, although you could argue she didn't explicitly say "descendant". Theoretically she does share blood with Maegor, as well, since Aegon, Rhaenys and Visenya all had the same parents.

It is interesting that, even in AGOT, she chose to characterize herself as similar to Maegor the CRUEL, of all Targaryen kings. Now, I don't have any proof on hand if GRRM really intended Visenya's line to continue when he was writing AGOT nearly 30 years ago* or changed his mind later. OR whether he was just foreshadowing Dark!Dany ever since the first book.

*I mean, we all know his initial draft for the story looked wildly different than what he settled on, what with the Jon-Arya-Tyrion romance + Jaime killing Joffrey, blaming Tyrion for it and becoming king (???). Imagine if we lived in that alternate reality.

#ask #anon #hightower erasure theory #the shifting asoiaf canon conundrum

[lemonhemlock]

The only other reason I can think of for replacing Jaehaera with Daenaera is for giving House Velaryon some glory back. Noticably, it's Baela and Rhaena who are the ones to present Daenaera to Aegon 3, which I interpret as them doing what their mother's house could not during the war; getting Velaryon blood on the throne. It doesn't work out in the long run, since the line doesn't continue down Aegon 3, but it did give them two kings on the throne and kept the Velaryons in the spotlight before they eventually faded into the background in present times. Maybe GRRM still has plans with Aemond and Alys's child to justify killing off every other Targtower in the story, and decided to give a win to the Velaryons.

Unfortunately, my crack theory has already suffered a quick, pitiless death in the comments 😭 but it's only fair to post this answer if I received it. I gotta say, though, I'm not that big of a fan of George's choice to pull a Velaryon girl out of thin air when he already included a niece-wife in the narrative for Aegon III.

#just don't make jaehaera a character then #seems needlessly cruel to give her a disability then brutally kill her for a mary sue replacement #hightower erasure theory #ask #anon #the shifting asoiaf canon conundrum

[lemonhemlock]

Were Aegon and Rhaenyra supposed to be full siblings? And vissy 2 son of Aeg 3 or Aeg 2 ?

IDK the answer to the first question, but the answer to the second is Viserys II = son of Aegon III. We looked at the AGOT annex. + extra ask

If anyone has any originals / first editions that contain information that was modified later, it would be super interesting to know!

#ask #anon #the shifting asoiaf canon conundrum #i refuse to call aegon iii egg #here i am having beef with another fictional child

[lemonhemlock]

Also on the family tree, It mentioned that Rhaenyra was a year older than Aegon. Now somebody write a fanfiction about this!!! It will be batshit crazy.

Also if Viserys II being Aegon's fourth son and being King after Aegon III and Baelor I, that means that the storyline of him being thought dead was always going to be a storyline...which is cool.

Rhaenyra being a year older than Aegon would have been an even crazier story lol. How could that even happen? Did they have the same mother in this version? If they did, Viserys naming her heir would make no sense; why didn't he just keep trying for a son? If they're born a year apart, it means that his wife fell pregnant again three months after giving birth to Rhaenyra (!). Couldn't he have waited a little longer to see how that new pregnancy would fare?

Then again, if Rhaenyra's mother died giving birth to her or shortly after, then it means that in the span of three months or so, Viserys: 1. names her heir; 2. re-marries; 3. immediately impregnates his new wife (?? some fast swimmers there ??) Naming her heir in the first place doesn't make more sense here, if he was so quick to keep producing children.

Then again, if he doesn't even perform this ceremonial act, Rhaenyra is even more of a usurper in this version of events.

Lastly, I do wonder who Aegon III's third son was supposed to be. What did you mean about the storyline of Viserys II being thought dead? That it was added after? I mean, it wouldn't make much sense here.

#ask #notbloodraven #the shifting asoiaf canon conundrum

[lemonhemlock]

About your post with Alysanne as Maegor daughter, he nerfed it so Jaehaerys and Alysanne can do the stupid doctoring of expectionalism thing. It was to show you how messed up that family is.

Good point, although couldn't George have worked around it somehow? Move it to Rhaena/Aegon-the-uncrowned or Maegor/Rhaena? Maybe have them negotiate that with the Faith. Or, if you really want Jaehaerys involved, have him invent it in order to fulfill his initial plan to marry Daenaerys to Aemon or his later plan to marry Baelon to Alyssa.

#hightower erasure theory #hotd theories #doctrine of targaryen exceptionalism #jaehaerys i targaryen #alysanne targaryen #the shifting asoiaf canon conundrum