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dramionediscussion · 9 months

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Can we talk about fic pet peeves?

I want to make it clear that this is not about a specific fic or author, but just some things I've seen in this fandom over the years. I've been reading Dramione for almost 15 years now and there are so many things that authors include that have become a pet peeve of mine.

This is not just exclusive to Dramione though, I have dabbled in other HP pairs before (e.g., Hansy, Theomione) and other fandoms (Gossip Girl, Elementary), and I have seen the same things there. I also have definitely come across some of these in published romance novels.

But this is a Dramione blog, so I will talk about them in context to this pairing.

Men being the cause of the breakup. So many times it's always Draco who messes up or says something horrible or doesn't "do enough". He is the one who has to repent and beg for forgiveness. Very rarely do you see a fic where Hermione is the one who is wrong and needs to apologize. And even when she does, it's always Draco who cuts her off and spins it around and makes him the bad guy who caused Hermione to be that way, and she doesn't actually have to work hard for forgiveness. Just a simple "I'm sorry" and he then says "no no, it's me....".

Having more than one conflict in a fic. Halfway through a story, the pair will have a major fight, which causes them to part. You then have a few chapters of them reflecting and then talking and making up. Then towards the last quarter of the fic, something comes up again and the characters react in the same way as before. You would think that they would have learned from the previous argument and not jump to conclusions and actually communicate. It feels like we are taking one step forward and 5 steps back. Why was this necessary? Why show your characters acting this way and show that they did not grow as people?

Focusing on so many other characters. I get that ensemble fics are a thing, but you need to say that in the beginning. You cannot just tag Draco and Hermione as the pairing, and then 5 chapters in, half the page is Harry and Ginny dialogue with no mention of the main pair. Let people know these things.

Speaking of other pairs, you need to tell your readers if you are gonna include scenes of Draco or Hermione having sex with other people. You need to tag these side pairings and say that we will read explicit scenes with Ron or Astoria or someone. We came for Draco and Hermione smut, not Ron or Pansy or Astoria or Viktor.

Since we are on the topic of tags. TAG ALL YOUR WARNINGS! So many times authors don't tag Rape/Non-Con!! Tag pregnancy difficulties, tag character deaths, tag the non-Dramione endings, tag violence, tag blood and gore, and tag any and all kink. Just tag things, it doesn't spoil the fic for people. Letting people know about things that may trigger them is not spoiling, it's human decency to let us know what your fic will entail.

Hermione's parents not being in the fic. Now I know Hermione sent her parents away before the war, but so many times you read about her not going back for them, not being able to retrieve their memory, then not wanting to be part of her life because of what she did. I understand it if this is a part of the fic, Hermione essentially grieving the loss of her parents. But what I have noticed is that most times author just have a throwaway line that her parents are not in her life, and it seems like it's not a big deal. Like oh well Hermione's mother is non-existent, but hey she has Molly now! Hermione's parents are not important in the HP canon, and it seems like authors feel the same, which is sad.

Molly being the matriarch of the trio. In canon, she kind of is because the stories are from Harry's perspective and he encounters the Weasleys and ingrains himself with their family, but she is always portrayed this way in fanfiction as well. As I mentioned in the previous comment, Hermione's mother isn't there so authors make Molly the mother figure for her, which is fine but authors make their relationship closer than what canon implies. But Draco also has a mother and most times we see Molly in the story more than Narcissa. I would assume that Narcissa would be the matriarch of that fic rather than Molly in a Dramione.

Harry and Ron being too involved in Hermione's life. Again this is fine, but it does get annoying to see fic after fic of them butting too much into her life and getting angry when she makes her own decisions. Friends should not try to control you, but guide and offer advice and be there if you fail.

Hermione not having friends outside of Harry and the Weasleys. I would assume that as they got older and got into the real world, they would meet new people and make new friends, not only stick to the same people they knew since they were 11. The Wizarding World is small, but we do have so many other characters in canon that you can use, it's okay to have Hermione become best friends with Padma, Luna, or Dean. You can have Draco even becoming bffs with Neville. He too is always stuck with Blaise or Theo and Pansy. Sometimes he doesn't have any friends and the fic only shows Hermione's friends.

If a fic starts off with Draco and Hermione having a relationship with another person, the breakup is always a bad one. People in real life have amicable breakups with their partners, it doesn't always have screaming and yelling and hatred. Most times this is used as a catalyst for the drama in a fic, but I would like to read a fic where Ron stays friends with Hermione and listens to her when she is talking about Draco, him offering advice or teasing her about a crush. It would be nice to see Astoria and Draco doing the same. And I say this as a huge "Ron Weasley Bashing" fan.

Hermione not knowing about fashion and makeup and having to rely on Ginny for help to get read for a date. Nowhere in canon does it claim that Hermione is like this, so how is this a common trope? I think this feeds into the "Hermione is not like other girls trope".

Hermione being the Brightest Witch of Her Age. In canon this is not a real thing, it is not an honorific that was bestowed on her by some sort of higher authority. It was something Harry and Remus said, it was their opinion. So having multiple people in a fic say this as though it is a proper title given to her annoys me honestly. Because when this happens, the fic always tends to have her being the only one who can solve the problem. So many people came before her and weren't able to do this particular thing, but Hermione somehow accomplished it without much help, with just a few books and at the ripe age of 24! These types of fics tend to have their characters fresh out of Hogwarts, so they are young but are able to become Heads of Departments! Can you imagine the 30/40-something-year-old who has been working for over 10/15 years in the ministry thinking it's only a matter of time before they get promoted to senior status, then suddenly this 20-year-old who just finished school walks in and gets the highest position without any experience or further education? I'd riot!

Draco not having a job. Many times fics have Hermione working hard in her career, but Draco is "in the family business" or "does investments". What does this mean???

Hermione being a virgin while Draco is the sex god. This trope feels sexist.

Hermione not doing anything muggle. This is similar to Harry in canon. It feels like Hermione forgot where she came from, and she doesn't care to go into the muggle world, or take Draco there.

Draco being obsessed with Hermione. Sometimes fics make his whole life revolve around her.

Luna being seen as weird. After all she has done and all she has shown to people that she is a smart, brave, very important friend to the trio, we still have scenes where Hermione and her friends make fun of Luna and her creatures. That is just rude.

This is all I can think of at the moment. I know this is a lot, but I kind of stopped reading fics for a while and as I managed Dramioneasks during this time, I would see new fics and just add them to my bookmarks. So I am now catching up on those fics and I feel like I am reading the same stuff over and over. Same tropes, same themes, same personalities, which is not a bad thing but it does give rise to pet peeves and thinking about older fics and how things haven't really changed over the last 15 years or so of my dramione life.

Again this is not from one fic or one author, but multiple fics and authors I have read over the years. Some of the fics I think are 5 stars have these pet peeves in them.

Do you guys agree with these? Do you have more to add? Leave them in the comments or send us a message. I would love to discuss and rant with you!

-Lisa

#dramione

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polarisbibliotheque · 4 months

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Hiiiii just wanted to say you're an amazing person and writer and I love your first with my whole heart, especially the nemesis one and jeshhsvejeyegehejwjj also I wanted to ask if the reader is based on being female or not? Any yea that's it love yyyaaaaaa xo

Aaaaaah thank you so much!!!! I'm always taken aback by so much love, thanks a LOT for taking the time to read my work and just be here, it's really special to me 🖤🖤 you are too kind!!

Me, whenever you guys decide to shower me with love

I always say the most precious thing we have in life is time - and the fact that you guys decide to spend that time here, reading and just enjoying ~the vibes~ holds a special place in my heart 🖤

Now, regarding reader's gender, that's a very good question!

My first language isn't English - I'm Brazilian, so BR Portuguese is my default and I've written A LOT in Portuguese. Interestingly enough, I think I spent so much time writing here, I'm currently writing better in English than in Portuguese *puts on fool hat*

In Portuguese, gender is a big deal, 'cause all our words are gendered. We don't have neutrals like "they" in English or "das" in German - so we kinda always have to pic a gender for characters.

I have some non-binary characters in other personal original stories and they are a PAIN to write in Portuguese, 'cause I don't have neutral pronouns/ways to call them T-T

When I used to write for PT-BR fanfic websites, my default has always been female reader character in 3d person - it's only when I moved to tumblr I started using "you", which was a VERY weird transition at the start, and I got hit with "oh my the person reading might not be female/identify as female".

I always used female as default because, not gonna lie, I used my name as default for 3d person, or friends names, and then I scripted/htmld the fic so in the website I posted people could change the characters names to their own names/own characters without the whole you/y/n thing.

The majority of people reading in this website I posted are women - and in my country, fanfiction has always been perceived like a female thing. So I never really thought much about that.

It's only when I moved here I found a more diverse set of readers. In English, gender isn't taken for granted, because you do have neutrals. And I kept thinking "what if people that identify with other genders want to read my work? What if they like it too?" and I decided to go as neutral as I can for the reader!

Granted, sometimes I slip up and you'll catch me referencing the reader as she/her - it's something I always have to keep an eye on because of my own language.

When I'm writing, I think more of a mature character rather than their gender, to be honest. It's a pet peeve of mine, but I'm always fuming that most female reader characters end up as damsels in distress or acting extremely childish, girly, cute or even bratty just because of their gender and I hate it.

I try to think more in a way that Dante and Vergil wouldn't be attracted to that - they're older, mature men and they want something else in a relationship. They want a partner and someone who can stand on their own, and power through hardships. Femininity is ok, but being a childish 12 y/o isn't really attractive to older men like them.

I'm turning 30 this year, hear the voice of wiseness HAHAHA

That made me have another sort of default when I'm writing. Now I'm much more focused on personality and what fits the characters rather than gender and all that - because I think sometimes we get too "blind" on what is expected from that gender rather than developing a good character.

A few examples I like:

(Below the cut, examples on female characters and my impressions, I got too excited and it turned into something huge, apologies xD)

Integra Hellsing, from the Hellsing manga and OVA, is an exceptional woman written without her gender being the first thing you get from her character. Appearance wise, she is very androginous, but her character per se, she is still a woman, feminine and all, but powerful as hell, strong-willed, with harsh decisions to make, imperfections and self-doubt, holding the most powerful vampire in the world on a leash. She has a ton of responsibilities and she doesn't have to be a sexy tomboy or a, again, sexy girlboss to pull that off. She is posh, regal and graceful even, but she smokes, swears and commands like a man... or like the woman she is. Which is brilliant. Love her absurdly.

Plus, she literally has te title of Sir Integra. Love this powerhouse of a woman.

Ellen Ripley, from Alien, was a character written primarily regardless her gender - and I think this is fabulous! They had the character done and said "ok, both a man and a woman can play this character" - when it came to casting, they decided Sigourney Weaver was the best choice. Ripley is smart, fast thinking and a survivor at heart, but she also shows fear and horror when she is put up against the alien. Her character was developed before her gender, and that makes her so amazing - by the second movie, Aliens, she is a powerhouse as well, hell-bent on saving people and not allowing anyone to get hurt by those dreadful creatures again. And we learn she had a daughter! That makes her grow attached to Newt, but not in that ~motherly overattached dependant~ way most people think women do, but in a protective "I'm gonna be your parent" way that all humans grow attached to children!

That's why the 3rd Alien movie is so awful to me. It's the only movie that puts her gender before her character: suddenly she is having sex with everyone and some guys try to rape her because suddenly she is seen as an object rather than a person.

I mean I always shipped her with Hicks and there isn't a SINGLE sexual thing between them rather than some looks of admiration from him and THAT hits harder than any of that cheap sexual thing from the 3rd movie in my ace opinion xD

Fun fact, we both share the fact we're INTPs xD

Now, another one I like, is Yennefer of Vengerberg - and she is written with everything of her gender taken into account. Why am I mentioning her, then?

I'm taking the books and games as reference here, but Yennefer is stunningly beautiful. She could be a perfect femme fatale, and she starts like that, but as you get into her character, there is a character there. And it goes so much further than just being a sexy woman who wants to girlboss and overpower men. Yen is traumatized and has traded so much of herself to become this powerhouse she is. No one likes to mess with her, and those who reduce her to being an woman-object suffer the consequences. She realized she wanted to have children when it was only too late and she is so freaking powerful she will go LENGTHS to make it happen.

It doesn't, but she gets Ciri in her life. Apart from that, Yen is a sorcerer and she does politics: when Geralt doesn't want that and they start disagreeing on their points of view/what kinds of life they want to lead, she is adamant on not leaving her freedom and being afraid on losing her independence to tie herself to someone else. So Yennefer remains as this mysterious, femme fatale of a woman, bewitching and breaking so many hearts because she will never abandon her freedom, her goals and her dreams for a relationship. And that, I think it's beautiful on a female character. Well done and something that ends up becoming a fatal flaw of hers - because, again, it isn't based on "I won't bow to patriarchy" it's based on "I can trust only in myself and I won't leave my fate in anyone's hands but my own", it has nothing to do with her being a woman. It has to do with her own will and who she wants to be.

She could be written as a man and it would work as well in my opinion mind you, you're welcome to disagree

HAHAHAHAHA so there you go. I'm so sorry I took your simple question and turned it into an essay about my own view on gender and female characters when I'm writing, but I saw the opportunity and I took it. I do hope you don't mind "^^

And thank you once again for the ask!! I hope to see you around more and I'm so grateful to have you here! 🖤

#polaris speaks #answered asks #asks #writing tips #writing #female characters #the witcher #yennefer of vengerberg #hellsing #integra hellsing #alien #ellen ripley #tagging the characters :3 #'cause if I ever do more ~writing tips~ or blabber about my writing #they are bound to appear once again hahahaha #but honestly one day you guys are gonna kill me with so much love #I thank you wholeheartedly #it seriously makes my day!

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taylortruther · 10 months

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re: conversation dominating people: ooh ok i've thought about this for years.

so i think some people genuinely don't notice they're doing this. i have a good friend where every convo ends up being about her because she has lots of interesting stories to tell and a lot of energy. but it's 100% not mean spirited or toxic, it's just how she is. i know and accept/love that about her. I also know if i have a big emotional issue to talk through, she's not the friend for that. and that's ok!

but also, sometimes guys do this and it's definitely because of the patriarchy, toxic masculinity, etc. i've noticed that men who do this won't let anyone get a word in edgewise. like they'll launch into a 5 minute lecture about a topic midway through a conversation--and they take it SO personally when you (a woman) interrupt them and assume YOU are the one being rude. like...sorry...i wanted to...participate? in the conversation WE were having...???

omg SO MANY MEN are like this. they're literally not taught how to have a conversation with people. granted, neither are a lot of women, but i really do think this is major part of how men are socialized. women are expected to listen, be emotionally present, etc. whereas man can just yammer on and on and they think that's what other people like?? i guess? it is so weird.

bad conversationalists are a major pet peeve of mine. i do have some friends i don't share personal/deep stuff with but if they never ask me questions about my life i cannot deal.

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artofapeach · 2 years

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I notice a lot of people tend to skip over the Robo Fizz encounter in Loo Loo Land. I've seen people say Robo Fizz as a character is completely unnecessary and we should've just seen Fizzarolli there. But I feel like Robo Fizz foreshadows how big Fizzarolli is (among other things). Like he has successful robo copies of himself who is also successful. If we saw him in person there I don't think anyone would believe he was more successful than Blitzo.

GOD YES THIS IS SUCH A MAJOR PET PEEVE OF MINE

Like okay, first of fuckall, Blitz’s relationship with robo Fizz and real Fizz are WAY different. Blitz barely blinked an eye at robo Fizz, then when robo antagonized him, he was argumentative and hostile.

With real Fizz? He hid! He literally went “No FUCKING way! Not HIM!” and hid behind a menu *cough*likeonedoeswhentheyseetheirex*cough* He was scared, nervous, maybe guilty? There wasn’t that same hostility. It’s clear that he cared for the real one compared to the robot.

I don’t even think that’s the last we’ll see if robo Fizz. He may come up again and Blitz can deal with his weird relationship with him. I’m also a fan of the headcanon that real Fizz doesn’t even like the robots, so we may also see their relationship.

Two is your point, anon! It truly shows how big Fizz is! He’s not just some upcoming stand up comedian. He’s big enough to sell out and make copies of himself. It’s like the fucking Minions, but it’s a sexy jester instead of weird bananas.

And threeeeee, which is my favorite point~

Even if robo Fizz was unnecessary as a character, too bad. It’s fiction. There’s no right way to write it. Unnecessary characters are fun and healthy even. It’s Viv’s story and she can do what she wants. I hope she adds more unnecessary characters—I’ll love them all the same :)

Really wish people would use this energy to write their own story instead of bashing Viv’s kandjsjwnjd

#hey an ask #not art #rant #long post #helluva boss #fizzarolli #robo fizz

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scripted-downfall · 1 year

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I've talked a lot in the past about how a big pet peeve of mine is the conflation of "antagonist" with "bad guy" or "villain" in a story, as opposed to just working against the protagonist, but I've just remembered a fun fact I learned a while ago that, as a result, I must now rant about. I mean, for all a lot of people I know tend to claim that STEM fields and humanities fields are starkly different, I really appreciate the fact that science --- specifically biology/neuroscience --- gets the definition of "antagonist" right from a literary standpoint.

Back during my college psychology class --- I wasn't a psych major, to be clear, but it was a general requirement --- we learned about that term in relation to neurotransmitters. In essence, while it's much more complicated at higher levels, there are antagonists --- which stop a physiological response --- and their opposites: agonists (which cause a response). We were looking at the effects of these two categories of substance on a neurotransmitter called acetylcholine or ACh, which is tied in with muscle movement, and yeah, a lot of antagonists caused problems because they blocked ACh.

But biochemical antagonists aren't always "bad", and agonists aren't always "good." The example I remember us having learned about was black widow venom, which is an agonist. It floods the cells with the neurotransmitter, which not only causes uncontrollable contraction (e.g. convulsions), but also depletes the ACh supply in general and causes paralysis. (Most of the time, it's a myth that the bite will kill you precisely for these reasons. It's still important to get healthcare, but the myths about black widows are worse than the bites actually are.)

Anyway, that was a long foray into the fun-facts-about-science-that-I'm-90%-sure-are-accurate-but-feel-free-to-correct-me side of things, but the point is... they're more accurate than most of the teachers I'd had back then, and way more accurate than a lot of the people I see dealing with media these days. And I wish more people saw the differences between antagonist and bad person --- and protagonist and good person --- because our stories would be a lot more interesting if so.

#science #personal #not fandom #ramblings #scripted downfall ramblings

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alaric-greyson · 2 years

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A Fan Review of “Rings of Power”

Rings of Power launched this week and immediately finds itself locked in a conversation that makes it hard to really get a sense of what’s real criticism and what’s a social and/or political statement about the show. I figured some folks here might appreciate a relatively focused review from a more casual fan of the source material.

The TLDR: I like the show and think it has done a good job so far, but also recognize that it’s probably easier for Lore-experts to think of it as the equivalent to Tolkien Historical Fiction rather than thinking of it as an attempt to perfectly portray what we know of the canon of the Second Age.

For lore-focused fans it would be like medieval historians watching something like Orlando Bloom’s “Kingdom of Heaven” where plenty of historical fact exists, but is in service to making a good movie rather than perfectly reflecting the events leading to the 3rd Crusade.

Since any review of this show is overshadowed by the concerns about its canonical or political relevance I figured I’d throw out my lack of qualifications to judge the review.

From a Tolkien-specific point of view, I’m a significant fan of Tolkien but not to the level of amateur or professional scholar of the material. I’ve read the Silmarillion a dozen times over the years at least, but I only ever dipped my toes into the more extended collections of writing (though I’ve gotten lost in a few wiki-dives on characters over the years). So I have a pretty extensive knowledge of the lore, but largely the surface stuff, not the deep lore.

From a political/social space I’m a left leaning cis straight white male from the US. So you won’t get any complaints about the racial or gender make-up of the show, but I almost certainly have blindspots. For example: I saw some complaints about accents being assigned to specific groups of characters, but simply don’t know enough about British regional accents and the associated social implications to recognize any controversy over it.

Casting: The casting ranges from good to fine. The Elves of Lindon feel more “real” then Elrond or Galadriel did in the movies but that’s clearly an intentional choice as they’re major characters here rather than mysterious and magical encounters. While I generally like Elrond, Galadriel, and Arondir, a lot of the supporting Elves are a tad bland. Dwarves, Harfoots, and Humans all have pretty good casting for their main characters. We haven’t seen as much of their respective supporting casts. There’s so far no one who irritates me every time they’re on screen (as a bad actor as opposed to making dumb choices).

My only real objection comes down to “it’s a TV series” and that’s that at times the world seems unpopulated at times. Beautiful and soaring establishing shots move into rooms with only a handful of people present.

Lore:

As I mentioned I’m a surface Lore fan. Because of this I spotted some lore inconsistencies that bugged me at times. Some could be easily explained (Galadriel monologuing about the Noldor going after Morgoth just skips right over the Kinslaying, which seems like something she’d do). Others were just off but I just made some sarcastic comments to myself. My only really big lore objection that actively bugged me was Valinor’s “modern” portrayal. You could easily explain around it if you wanted to “repair” the lore but they seemed to me to be treating it more as a magical Heaven rather than as an actual navigational destination you could go to. It’s not remotely a deal breaker...but the whole sequence sort of bugged me.

Plot:

The plot itself is only just beginning but they’re clearly trying to build out the world to tell stories in it. As much as I commented that the TV budget leaves some of the world feeling unpopulated, the same has always been a bit of a pet peeve of mine about Tolkien himself in the Silmarillion. The stories of the First and Second Ages that we know of tend to be about small numbers of named individuals, and then an indeterminate number of other people who are following them. That’s completely in line with the genre conventions he was aiming for, but it has its negatives.

The show is making sure to build out six or seven distinct communities of characters so that the plot can be built by all of them, rather than limited to a handful of Elves and Numenoreans. Because of that it’s a little disjointed at the moment, but also implies that the seven or so main characters so far are eventually going to cross paths.

The plot itself is also built on an era we know very little about, namely the time between the end of the First Age and Sauron returning. They’ve clearly decided to lean on one of the classic “Evil is dead and can never return” tropes, with our heroes being the wise ones who see the danger. I suspect they’ll be “squashing” the timeline a bit since thousands of years would likely remove some of the characters they’ve already created.

So is it good?:

It’s fine. After two episodes I have no reason to stop watching it. My lore-based pet peeves are easy enough to disregard, and I actively like a couple of the characters. We’re obviously about to get some Numenoreans in the next episode, and that will give us another set of neat establishing shots.

If you don’t want to watch it for moral or political reasons...don’t. This is a nice enough show but I don’t see it turning into the dominant fandom of the moment the way Game of Thrones or Good Omens did on their respective releases. There’s no social obligation to watch this, or to support the creators.

If you’re a lore-first fan, you’ll absolutely have to be able to check that instinct at the door before watching. There’s no question they’re modifying and messing with timelines, events, and characters. Depending on who one mysterious character is could throw things wildly out of whack. Some lore-fans will be able to appreciate what the creators are aiming for with the changes...but a lot of the others are just going to hate the adaption of the canon. If you can think of it as historical fiction for Middle Earth you might be able to enjoy it more. But as with others, there’s no obligation to watch it if you don’t want to.

#lord of the rings #rings of power #a review #it's fine

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yarnreader · 1 year

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Our Lady of the Forest by David Guterson (3/23/20)

Our Lady of the Forest is a novel about a teenage girl, who claims she was visited by the Virgin Mary. Ann is a sixteen-year-old runaway, who has been living off cash that she earns from mushroom picking and living out of a tent. She is first visited by the Virgin while out on one of her trips to pick mushrooms and after that she gets takes other out into the woods with her, one person being a woman who exploits her in the process. During Ann's growing fame, a priest, Father Collins gets charged with the job of finding out if Ann's visions are legitimate or not, while dealing with his church's own problems. One of Father Collins' flock is an out of work logger, Tom Cross Sr, a hot-head who has skeletons in his closet. The world-building of this novel was done really well. I had no problem imagining the locations the characters were in. It built the atmosphere of the small town in a realistic way. The characters were fleshed out well, making it easy to become invested in their story. That being said. I did give this a two out of five-star rating on Goodreads. (2 stars = "It's ok") And it was just that to me. It was ok. My main, and really my major issue with this book was that the author does not use quotation marks to indicate when a character speaks, who is speaking when, and when the train of thought for the current character is interrupted by someone else speaking. This is a big pet peeve of mine with books and it made it so hard to get into the book. It had actually overshadowed a lot of the story for me. I had to re-read multiple times and it really slowed me up. I wouldn't recommend it to anyone personally. So read at your own risk! 2 out of 5 stars.

#book review

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