Reading your tags about how people miss the very obvious "there's some fucked up shit boiling underneath" regarding Otto, just gave me a sudden realization. Otto is the only character I know in fiction where they act all innocent and drive up the "clumsy", "just in the side-lines" and "straight-man (heh)" persona. When. Like no one's in the EMT camp is buying it. They know he's way more capable than he let's on. Meanwhile, the tomfoolery is completely brought on by the Western audience.
Like Otto is failing miserably to make other characters believe that he's not up to mischief, Roswaal even thinks it can bring his downfall. But the audience, who even sometimes *sees* his fucked up thought process, is buying it.
*head in hands*
no u bring up so many good points bc ive been really thinking about this for a while T^T its such an interesting phenomenon in the difference in perception otto has between the japanese speaking half of the fandom vs the english speaking half which can be explained by—yeah. media illiteracy mainly. im also putting my head in my hands anon T^T
because—okay sorry wkdndn im gonna get into meta again but hear me out bc this pattern of the fandom underestimating otto is interesting bc i kind of sort of i cracked the code maybe??? o.o i think the nature of otto is a character is that youre SUPPOSED to underestimate him at first, just like what happens sometimes in universe. i mean wayyy back then i definitely wasnt expecting him to get more depth added to him in arc 4–which was a pleasant surprise—which is also the reaction the vast majority of people have to reading/watching arc 4, along with the other vast majority reaction which is being a bit endeared to ottosubas friendship and respecting otto for being a good friend. and then its easy to underestimate otto bc of 1. all the chaos going on in rezero at any given moment and 2. hes almost always overshadowed by other characters doing worse shit or being more insane than he is and 3. otto of course damn well knows hes easy to underestimate and counts on that. thats what he did against roswaal in arc 4. plus—i mean even aesthetics-wise hes 100% DESIGNED to be easy to underestimate. his outfit and physical features make him look either friendly or frazzled or soft. so i think that the point is that we were supposed to be kind of fooled—at first.
because yeah, we’re endeared to otto. we respect him for helping subaru the way he did. we think that hes a nice person and we now support his actions especially after feeling sympathetic towards him after learning his backstory. (or at least the average audience member will think this wjdndn.) but like—you dont even NEED to look at any side content at all for it to dawn on you that theres something Wrong. with him. like all you need is main route arcs 3-8 aka ottos entire screentime thus far, because at arc 4 its so easy to overlook otto unless youre thinking a bit deeper (for example—he gets violent with subaru. like yeah its entertaining, its played for laughs a bit, yeah subaru needed to be snapped out of his own head, but was it 100% necessary??? why did otto have this response??? bc if you just look at the main timeline otto really decided to beat up subaru first. and bc this tendency is now Less Funny in arc 8).
but even if youre just looking at rezero face value, when you get to arc 5 its starting to get even more clear that ottos weird in the head. like we already saw him being very good at scheming and planning in arc 4–in arc 5, we find out about otto hiding the tome for a year. we find out WHY hes been hiding the tome for a year. the tome then leads the witch cult into priestella, so like—in the sense, otto is RESPONSIBLE for arc 5. but theres STILL a tendency sometimes for the audience to continue underestimating him even though by this point we’re getting more clues and many characters around otto, like you said anon, KNOW hes very capable. i keep wondering why this is, but arc 5 is, again, FULL of chaos and different storylines happening at once, so its so easy to almost kind of forget otto there in the background until he occasionally pops up again. plus otto serves an additional role as comedic relief sometimes—he spends all of arc 5 being bitchy and whiny (i say this affectionately HAH) about his camp being full of disasters, for example, so i think the natural response from the audience tends to be “aw otto!! what a silly guy!!” sometimes. you know? so its like. i think at this point some people tend to be like “yeah fair that otto was wary of roswaal and thats why he saved the tome…. anyway ooooh whats going on with these other plot points” wobsbss. its so fascinating bc—ok this might be my own personal experience but anyone reading this pls tell me if you agree or not—i dont think ive seen a lot of people actually even MENTION otto bringing the tome into priestella attracting witch cultists. and the english speaking fandom LOVES to go into certain characters’ wrongdoings so why gloss over otto????
the only explanation i have for this is that from arcs 3-4 underestimating otto is. kind of the point of his character UNTIL you get to arc 5 and the clues in the main story start seeping in even more. and also the western audience DOES have media illiteracy a lot. theres that too. just look at rezero content on youtube or reddit or fanfic sites or other things of that sort T^T but no yeah i think ottos nature as a character exacerbates it. youre supposed to start asking questions about him. youre supposed to start connecting the dots and then SUDDENLY its now EXTREMELY obvious in arc 7-8 and even while theres so much chaos going on its basically shoved in your face. arc 7-8 is just delivering on all the leadup that was arcs 3-5.
and i think that youve gotta be media illiterate for sure to NOT get that otto is not squeaky clean and innocent BY ARC 8. i think that ottos the deconstruction of the loyal best friend trope, and also a mirror into what subaru couldve been like if he decided to be more ruthless instead of jumping right to forgiveness and saving everyone, except sometimes that flies right over the audience’s head wkdndnd. it confuses me bc ive seen some people completely miss the point or completely agree with otto and overlook the Bad Parts of it or, you know, STILL think ottos perfectly sane—like T^T please.
and yeah so back to what you said about otto Not being underestimated In Universe—its such an interesting detail bc hes ALWAYS been simultaneously pathetic and Very Competent wjdndnd. but yeah no all of his friends have seen various hints and clues and evidence of what hes capable of. like even though he hid the tome from them successfully and even though hes hiding info now its INEVITABLE that its gonna blow up in his face one day. like you got characters like garfiel who literally saw otto punch the wall and break his hand in an unhinged fit of rage, julius who got snapped at by otto and while julius is a Bit naive definitely knows somethings off there, anastasia whos smart as hell and definitely knows not to underestimate otto, and roswaal who, like you said anon, literally went out of his way to stop otto from breaking his hand in another unhinged fit of rage and warned otto that he will literally be destroying himself if he keeps going on like this. its this fascinating dichotomy bc otto is NOT fooling anyone around him but at the same time his current schemes are mostly unnoticed—for now—which yeah i havent seen that in a lot of media!!! its an interesting balancing act bc people around him realistically know hes competent after seeing the Proof of that for the past couple arcs, but otto is still finding ways to try and Win…
which—again, the anger and violence is an extension of arc 4 otto!! this is the same guy!! hes always been like this!! ottos kind of stayed the same, deep down, this whole time and as an audience its ONLY shoved in our face with a big gigantic spotlight on it FOUR ARCS LATER, but it was hinted to all this time. and like you said anon—we LITERALLY see ottos fucked up thought processes. literally what sane person thinks any of that shit. its spelled right out for the reader HAH T^T which—yeah. media illiteracy…. and also this whole ask was a longer way of just saying that otto is VERY easy to see at surface level if youre media illiterate. but at the same time it should be very easy to figure out otto is A Bit Fucked Up bc tappei underlines it in bright red print!!! i think people sometimes just hang onto soft awkward silly otto and forget about the rest T^T either that or they dont think he cares about subaru at all. which. that phenomenon of thinking characters that do care about subaru Dont Care is also interesting to me bc why????? we’re at arc 8 and you STILL dont get it??? o.ooooo
but yeah apart from that….. i said this earlier but yeah sometimes some people agree with ottos realism in arc 8 which is. understandable, but the whole point is that he is EXTREME. with it. hes Not in the right here, but the same crowd that wants wanton revenge in rezero is gonna agree with that kind of stuff T^T ottos been lurking in the background so much so that tappei made it meta by doing the whole “walking in darkness” part of his character, so i guess people just. dont see ottos ACTUAL worst traits and instead think he would ditch subaru at the first opportunity or something. but at the point we are now, arc 8 ottos problem isnt that hed ditch subaru. his problem is that he would sacrifice the world for subaru. his problem is that he gets extremely angry at subaru for trying to do good. his problem is that hes trying to micromanage everything around him and is willing to sacrifice anything necessary to get what he wants. but sometimes people dont get that bc otto doesnt look sound or seem like a character thatd do that. the Underestimation part of his character is doing too well on. certain audiences. please T^T the soft and awkward and silly parts ARE part of his character just like all the Darker parts are!!!
additionally im also wondering if western audience perception of otto is also clouded by the fact that otto looks and sounds more feminine / androgynous and he doesnt have the appeal of Overt Power either……. he cant Really be waifu-ified… and he cant be used as a weird self insert like subaru…. and you Have to look at him closer to understand him…. and for some reason people dont tend to hate on him so aggressively, if anything people cant even see his actual canonical flaws half the time wkdndn so if youre not paying attention otto CANT be aggressively hated on bc theres nothing there if ur not looking at it….. and if youre not paying attention otto seems more “boring” compared to the others…… (not that people arent allowed to not have otto as a favorite character bc thats totally fair but im talking about the tendency to think hes Saner than he actually is.) but yeah these are just my guesses. i have no clue the western fandom is a little T^T some people unfortunately cannot read.
anyway. big thank you to the japanese fanbase for understanding ottos character more and making so much wonderful fancontent for him T^T also i think that we as a collective fanbase should stop underestimating otto in general bc its exactly what he wouldnt want and i think itd be really hilarious. <3333 make him explode with rage please
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would your stans be the type to solve disagreements with a just dance battle since theyre pacifists
yes...i support this.
***my stans both claim they wont stop putting up peace signs in pictures until theres world peace lmaooo
i am not sure, however...that they would win many.
cue me combining the complicated answer to your simple question with some ncu dance headcannons, but i do hope they thrill you!
but alright, so i said that because...
...i am not convinced whatsoever that pep!stan has rhythm.
which musically, of course, he is very gifted. he can sing and play guitar really well, could probably pick up other instruments if he tried.
one of my favorite headstannons actually ( and i think its present across both stans ) is that he has perfect pitch...and when kyle and him are arguing and kyle is lecturing him stan gets suuuuper annoying and starts being like "a, b, e flat, wow f sharp" KYLE GETS SOOOOO MAD ITS SO DKHSDLHDS hes so annoying help
however, being musically gifted does not mean...you can dance.
and in the baggy ass, gigantic ass skater boy jeans, the gigantic slouchy metal hoodies, the big beanie, his greasy ass blonde bangs all up in his ( cute little ) face and his vans untied...its a no from me.
like dead sober he's just hella stiff, has no interest in dancing, every single prom or dance he's been to with wendy was actually hell omg
BUUUUUUUT....drunk stan ;)
he will get SOOO WEIRD!!! hes down like oh my god, like dead sober stan is like ready to die if there is dancing, drunk stan is pulling you on the dance floor, sloppy as hell, spinnin you around, kissin ur hand!
like is it good dancing? no absolutely not? is it lit? absolutely.
okay like specifically, him and kenny? TOGETHER? it goes so hard like stan learned dance moves for one reason and one reason only and was to turn up to parties and absolutely fuck! it! up!
WAIT OK THE FOOTBALL ONE WHEN STAN SHOWS UP TO THE FUNCTION LATE AS HELL STILL IN HIS FOOTBALL JERSEY??? I JUST KNOW KYLE IS SWEATING WHEN HE SMIRKS AT HIM
also i just remembered that i canonically after winning shot roulette, had extremely drunk stan get up on the kitchen counter and drop it low to im sexy and i know it and collect dollar bills like a stripper and..
u know what!!!! it was definitely a low budget strip tease at best, very messy, the man has litrally no ass, but he is FINE so u know what, he looked good, he put on a s-h-o-w and no one was complaining!!!! especially not kyle when stans shirt flew off and hit him in the face.
whEW!
....a lot of dreams abt that one, huh kyle?
( i do think that all night kyle is trying to be Responsible and is like
[ throwback pep chapter 2 to kyles stmwtp contact photo ]
i should take stan home he should not be drunk and doing hand(stan)ds breaking the keg stand record....but then stans shirt falls down, he gets football boy ab-ed and winked at so hes like...nevermind thats so crazy...he can have five more minutes this is my favorite show <3 salhds )
hooooowever! moving right along:
conversely, i do think ravenstan...can definitely Dance.
but. BUT!!!!!!!
i will say...he had to be TAUGHT!!!!!! PAINSTAKINGLY!!!!! HOW TO DANCE!!!!!! it was a Miserable process. it was so painful, oh my god. hes so awkward, god bless him. he was SOOO BAD. he was like guys i cannot do this???? i give up!!!!!! and kenny and the cd boys were like u can do this rae!!! this is ur Dream and he was like...sigh...SIGH.
and did...eventually get...honestly? kind of good? hello? excuse me???
RAVENSTAN???? HELLLLOOOOOO
okay also i do think he had a small boost like i do think that rm!sharon definitely had rhythm af and used to spin shelley and stan around the kitchen making dinner with the mexican radio station blaring. <333
( so hes got a lil bit of That going on...lets go half mexican ravenstan )
but also...if u want to be Absolutely Miserable...pre!raven!stan who was 11 was learning how to formally dance around that time because of the sadie hawkins dance, but more specifically...because of shelley's birthday...specifically...
her quinceanara.
which she never got to have...
...because she died three days before her birthday. :)
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
fun!
stan still knows those moves by the way! he is haunted! Hi, PTSD!
aka Phantom There's Shelley Disorder!
but yes, raven learned how to dance because he had to learn how to dance, but that does not mean he likes doing it or that he is sober.
he also gets to coast mostly on sex appeal and being hot and looking into ur eyes, so like if he fucks up its kinda just like damn thats crazy i didnt see anything but ur very pretty eyes raven whatever u want, hansome!!!!! its a lot of powersliding and hip stuff...whew! lis...ten.
Aaaaaaaanyways!
tldr; just dance in front of every1? i think he would eat tbh its his job
BUT PRIVATELY? uhhhh...i think he would be nervous as fuck and on top of that i think jersey kyle would look at him once and he would fall in his ass and fall into something and break his arm its that unserious
so basically neither of my stans can dance, but both of them can dance way better drunk bc they are relaxed and raven was just forced at gunpoint to learn how to Move so he can...
and 2 well tbh. ;)
sahdkshdls
ALRIGHT I ADDED MY KYLE HEADCANNONS JUST FOR FUNSIES!
ok i went back and forth on this for a while.
i was like do i give kyle no rhytmn? can he dance?
my answer is that when both my kyles are dead sober theyre like so far infused into the wall that they are literally the structural integrity of the house party, like so far from the dance floor, judging literally everyone, sneering at everyone, disapproving glares...
and naturally this makes u thirsty because its hard work, u know, being a full time fucking HATER
gotta drink the haterade which, ofc, is a hard cider/seltzer for pep!kyle and is probably cheap grocery store wine for jersey
BUT WHEN HE HAS LIKE TWO OR THREE OF THOSE
ohhhhhh my god
drunk!kyle ;)))))))))))))))
DRUNK KYLE IS SO FUN!!!! HES FOR THE STREETS!!!!!!!
they gave him way too much ass and for no goddamn reason like hello???? HELLO???? like i think he does his little white mom dance moves his little taylor swift awkward bird boy sways HES VIBING!!! tbh i think hes kind of good??? like??? okay kyle???? lets go bitch!!!
ALSO IF MEGAN THEE MOTHERFUCKING STALLION COMES ON HE IS RAPPING AND THROWING SERIOUS ASSSSSSSSSSSSSS
like do not think i forgot that marjorine taught kyle how to twerk and that jerseys entire running playlist is just like Fuck Being Good Im A Bad Bitch!!!! like just iconic loud female rap for like 30 minutes skhdksskdhks IT GETS DIRTY FREAKY NAAAASTY IN THERE!!!
like stan and kyle in any ncuniverse dancing at the function is INSAAAAAAAAANE like it is an event!!! stan is like okayokayokaaay!
go white boy gooooooooo!!!!
hes really just in shock and awe, every time kyle gets loose enough to hit the dance floor its the best night of his lifeeeee i mean that omg
Heart Eyes Emoji! he is SIMPING!
( honestly i think if u specifically put raven and jersey on the dance floor turnt the fuck up it would go viral like sheeeeeeeeeeeeesh ohmygod...is it hot in here??? ravesey stan twitter Blowing Up! )
tbh my fav style at parties hc specifically like pepstyle when they start dating is that whereas stan would usually be like the last person to leave a party, when him and kyle start dating, they truly just get schwifty, makeout against the fridge and irish goodbye everyone like out of the blue, kyle is like i want to go home ;) and stan is like yEAH BYE EVERYONE SEE YOU LMAOOO KSHDLSD literally sprints out the door holding kyles hand!!! unserious!!! boys!!! down horrendous!
also to be fair jersey kyle is just such a tangle of long limbs but he took really strict and rigorous ballet courses so professionally and in refined settings he dances very beautifully...but at parties...when hes Blasted...its a mess, its so unhinged but hes REEEEALLY CUUUTE
one day i will put drunk!jersey and raven in a room and when that day comes u will all simply not be ready but im warning u anyways. <3
i did not answer your question very well, but i hope this was fun.
-uncle nina, who is...not even sure what i was trying to say?
p.s. wait i know he doesnt count technically but toolshed stan can do crazy acrobatics and shit so he can dance for Surely and would actually probably DESTROY! just dance but probably pretends to be really bad for his secret identity...human kite!kyle i want to say is an awkward alien king like learning english and strange earth customs was hard enough dancing is so weird he is not good at it...Inchresting
me in denial abt the grimy fucked up weirdly political dystopian in terms of mutants and public judgements and propaganda tfbw stan-kyle-kite-shed love square au rip oh my god dont let me do it guys
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