#this isn't hating on rhaenyra so i'm not tagging as anti i'm just pointing this out | Explore Tumblr Posts and Blogs

lemonhemlock · 1 year

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I don't get why any team green supporter would want the "Aemond is the father" theory to be true. It would only serve to undermine team green and shit on Alicent. I've seen many team black people that like this theory and their reasons are: "it's an good ironic twist since Alicent hated Rhaenyra's bastards", "it would highlight team green's hypocrisy, "see, the bastard argument doesn't matter, etc." Basically, they want to use it as "gotcha."

I think this theory only serves to prop up team black and will ruin team green's depiction even more. And no, I'm not a "Helaemond anti." I'm fine if they want to make it romantic instead of platonic, but I'd hate it if they make the kids Aemond's.

i don't know what to tell you anon since i already have a ton of posts in my backlog cataloging those very points so i'm going to redirect you to my helaemond tag. although some stuff might be found under the anon wars tag or inbox antagonism as i got besieged at one point

i'm just going to say that the greens being hypocritical in one regard isn't the end of the world. i don't know why people are so against this, they're not meant to be perfect angels. and they're getting much worse as the story progresses. also this changes nothing for the actual plot.

the bastardy argument absolutely does still matter, because it's a different thing entirely to have plausible bastards you can pass off as trueborn. we all know that if cersei had fathered those children with stannis (lol), we'd be having a different conversation. how would this amount to a gotcha moment for rhaenyra? she doesn't know shit and can't prove shit. meanwhile her children are looking like harwin strong's clones. aegon has got himself very properly targaryen-looking kids.

there's no DNA testing, but people aren't stupid either. those working in agriculture and animal husbandry have been manipulating genetics for thousands of years to get better crops and food without studying chromosomes under the microscope. sure, their understanding was limited, but it's reasonable to assume they would, at the very least, realise that a Rhaenyra-Laenor marriage could not produce Strong features and find it Pretty Sus

but, you know, what actually really bothers us is that no matter how often we explain these things, it gets ignored and unaddressed. so people just regurgitate the same talking points again and again. it's hard to believe people are not doing it in bad faith at this point. not saying that's your intention, anon, but go to any helaemond account and you'll see that we've been over this already. many times. it's really like talking to a wall. and we still get "i don't understand why some people like this idea" type of questions even though there's a lot of ink spilled on the topic already

and these different asks from different anons:

Anonymous asked: I think people get so riled up about Helaemond and for what 😭 it’s a shipper theory. There are minuscule hints in season one, but like you said, the show could very well never do anything with them. That’s it! Why is it always such a big thing lmao

bingo. this is what it amounts to. the show's framing is there, it's implied as a possibility, yes, it's subtext, for the millionth time, we get it. why would any green sympathizer be interested in this? because they'd find exploring those particular themes interesting in a fictional setting. whether it be angst or longing or star-crossed lovers or dreadful secrets that eat you alive and consume you from within.

there are a hundred of different flavours to any ship. you may not like every one but do you even have to? people who hate this theory talk about it more than people who actually like this theory. is that normal?

Anonymous asked: You don’t have to answer, I know you’re done with ship asks, it just confuses me how people on all ends of the spectrum cry about how others are self inserting or wildly changing a ship. F&B barely gives the main characters a ton of attention, ships even less so. Why argue over something that gets one-two pages? It doesn’t seem worthwhile to me. The show is liable to change plenty of things, as we’ve already seen. The rhaenicent dynamic is so different from the book. The idea of them changing other things is incomprehensible? And “making up characterization/personalities/etc”- doesn’t everyone do this? Isn’t this the purpose of fanfic? I feel like I’m in an alternate universe sometimes where the idea of someone developing a side character is not only normal, it’s encouraged. Fandoms do it all the time.

hey there, i'm not ~done with shipping asks, as this is my blog at the end of the day and i can be as annoying as i want. :)) i see both sides of this issue.

one the one hand, it's sometimes baffling how much of a difference there is between the actual presentation within a text / on screen and the fanon interpretations. i think like there is a conversation here and it is sometimes indicative of some other issues. it's not always just innocent, self-aware changes made for fun, sometimes it's also a question of media literacy or personal / societal prejudices at play here.

a personal example from my reading experiences was the fact that i used to encounter a lot of fics where alicent was depicted as this awful mother who hates her children and sees them as tools. i would get so tired of seeing this take (which i consider bullshit for a number of reasons) that it was kind of a frustrating situation, since it seemed that was the (undeserved) way she was being portrayed all over the fandom. it would bother me bc it's also something so prevailing in society today, to demonise women who are trying their best as bad mothers and place the burden of child-rearing on them. for example, people would look at the scene of a distressed alicent trying to calm a continuously crying helaena and would claim that the baby hates her because she is such a horrible mother to her. anyway. many such examples. you can look up my opinions on lucemond, for instance. :))

on the other hand, most fics imply some sort of changes somewhere, whether they're a fix-it, canon divergence, a freaking coffee shop AU, a crackship or characters acting OOC. it's completely normal AND harmless at the end of the day. so, as long as people mind their own business and are not being arseholes to each other, to each their own. the people who want to make these changes should be free to write without getting hate for it and the people who are frustrated by interpretations they dislike can rant about it in their own spaces and that should be that.

it truly becomes an issue when people don't mind others boundaries' anymore, become so hateful with others and resort to name-calling, morality high-horsing and other forms of online harassment and bullying. for example, there are many people who write fics i don't care for or have takes i strongly disagree with, but i've never in my life went to their inboxes to disparage them, send them hate, dictate what they should post, leave comments on their fics, deride their artwork, tell them to kys or any such things. at the end of the day it's about having some basic manners, you know? it's ok to not like stuff and feel frustrated about it, but do you have to make it everyone else's problem? can you not just convey your displeasure in a more considerate way?

Anonymous asked: putting aside that self inserts in fic are as old as time and will never stop being a thing so it’s silly to complain (aemond/ofc has more fic on ao3 than alysmond, helaemond, aegond and daemond combined) I think people throw around that insult the same way they used to make fun of people for even writing fic. like it’s so silly and fangirly and dumb. But what most people are doing with literally any aemond ship is finding a dynamic they enjoy/find interesting and running with it. they expand on the characters because they have to, f&b is so sparsely drawn and the show had to cram 2 decades into 10 episodes. there simply isn’t a lot of source material. so using that as a foundation and crafting more rounded characters isn’t a crime, it’s simply fandom? i don’t relate to having prophetic dreams and marrying my alcoholic brother any more than i relate to being a hot goth milf who can do blood magick. both can be expanded on and played with because that’s what you do when you enjoy media!

this was in reference to a caustic anon that was accusing me of self-inserting into helaena. :)) OP is making some fair points here, i don't have much to add but thought it interesting as a general commentary on fandom

Anonymous asked: Even if you were engaging in ship wars and stoking flames (which you really aren’t, I don’t think any of your personal discussions have been inflammatory) it’s your blog. People can block and unfollow if they dislike the content? I can’t imagine asking someone to confirm more to what I want to see on their blog, as a fan.

yes, thank you, this was sent to me because i sometimes get requests from people asking me not to post something in favour of something else. this particular instance was because i answered other helaemond asks at the time.

is it fair? idk! some of those requests are worded v politely, so i'm not upset by them or anything, but, at the same time, shouldn't this blog be something that caters to me first and foremost? not to toot my own horn, but i should be my first customer in this regard. why else would i post if i don't enjoy doing it? i don't get paid for doing this, it's my own free time involved. if i have a day where i want to post shipping asks instead of something else, why not? if i have a day when i don't want to or can't muster up a coherent answer, i feel like it should be equally fine?

another thing that people don't realise - some might not like a topic or me talking about shipping wars for the 234th time this week, but others do. otherwise i wouldn't be getting so many messages about this. so, by trying to please 1 or 2 people, i might end up displeasing others. is that a good trade-off? this is why i don't even want to start considering my blog in those terms. "pleasing" everyone is an impossible objective, so i might as well just write about things if i enjoy them and not if i don't want to.

similarly, you're never going to find an account that caters 100% to your tastes, so i feel like trying to make it so by putting pressure on other people to post what you specifically want is an endeavour doomed to failure from the start. your first reaction when seeing something you're not interested in should be to scroll past, not to feel the urge to make people aware that you experienced a minor inconvenience and should, therefore, be accommodated accordingly.

#ask #anon #helaemond #found some free time so compiling some asks #i don't always have the time or energy to answer straight up #so you'll have to eat what i feed you!!!!#*cackles*#shipping wars #anti hotd fandom

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finitefall · 1 year

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Are we welcome to follow if we love Rhaenyra AND Alicent? I think Rhaenyra is undeniably the rightful heir and it was a huge mistake that Alicent went to her father after hearing the King’s dying words instead of sending a raven to Rhaenyra to talk to her about it and what she’s doing is wrong, but I also have a huge amount of sympathy for her and could write essays on why I think she’s going along with putting Aegon on the throne despite knowing that he’s unfit to be king. In my eyes, it has less to do with Rhaenyra and more to do with wanting to feel like she had power. She realizes that her council has planned to crown Aegon all along. If she resists, she will certainly fail and have to confront the fact that she lacks true power here. If she goes along with it and tries to do it her way, she can maintain the more comfortable illusion that she does has power, avoiding the uncomfortable truth. It’s complex and I enjoy her for it. That said, I know she was waaaaay different in the book. I haven’t read it.

Also have to love Helaena and Rhaenys!

+add on to last ask: this is not to say Alicent is somehow “feminist.” She isn’t. I just think her actions are rooted less in wanting a man on throne and more in wanting the years she spent suffering to mean something, to actually amount to some control. The actions are sexist, but I think her motives are more complex deep down

Hi nonnie! First of all, of course you're welcome to follow and talk with me if you want to. There are plenty of people in the ASOIAF fandom I have zero interest in talking to (Daenerys haters are literally not welcomed here, for example). But you don't have to love Rhaenyra or hate Alicent. You can love both, hate both, love one more than another, I don't care as long as you're not incapable of understanding that Rhaenyra was the Heir and the Greens commited treason.

More on Rhaenyra being one of my favorites ASOIAF characters: she wasn't a good Queen and I don't like the comparison between her and Daenerys. Of course, we can make obvious parallels between those two characters, but Dany is a hero and would be a good Queen (I strongly believe in this) while Rhaenyra was a tyrant. But she's a very interesting character and I love her in a totally different way than I love Dany (I know this is off topic, I'm totally taking advantage of your message to answer to those saying we can't be both Dany stans and love Rhaenyra)

Of course, at this point on the show, I'm rooting for Rhaenyra. But I don't think you'll love her as much in the future or if you read Fire & Blood. Rhaenyra was whitewashed in the show, Alicent too (they did the opposite for male characters, like Daemon). But enough about that since you haven't read about the book characters.

About feminism: neither Alicent or Rhaenyra is a feminist. Rhaenyra isn't at all about women's rights either, except for herself. The difference between the Blacks and the Greens is that one side of this Dance commited treason, and that this treason has a direct link with the patriarchy.

Of course, you're allowed to feel for Alicent. I don't like Alicent but that doesn't mean I'm not disgusted at some things people have been saying (I'm convinced at this point that half of the ASOIAF fandom is brainless...) Also, if I tag some posts “anti x stans”, it’s because I don’t want to use the character tag. It’s not respectful for the fans who are going through their favorite character tag (I’m so tired of Dany hate showing up in the “daenerys targaryen” tag just because antis can’t be bothered to use proper tags). It’s not because I actually hate their fans.

I'm not a fan of Sansa or Alicent, and I have an amazing friend that I've known for a few years now whose favorite ASOIAF/GOT character is Sansa and whose favorite HOTD character is Alicent (she hasn't read Fire & Blood either, by the way). I would gladly read your metas about Alicent, even if we don't agree, but I feel like you could talk a lot about her with my Kitty Kat @alicentes, if you’re looking for someone who loves Alicent but isn’t at all anti Rhaenyra! 💕

This is also to say that, while I know there are people who only show respect to someone if they agree with them on every single thing, that’s just as unhealthy as all the disgusting hate we see in this fandom. So yes, you are welcome here. Of course you are. Shoot me a message off anon so I can know it's you? You can tell me if you don't want it published, although you honestly don't have to be scared of people going after you when you said nothing offensive!

Your favorites so far are Alicent, Rhaenyra, Helaena and Rhaenys? Mine are Rhaenyra (big surprise, I know), Daemon, Rhaenys, Mysaria.

#HOTD #Rhaenyra Targaryen #Alicent Hightower #answered

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