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lord-squiggletits · 4 months

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On the MegOP fandom trend of saying "Optimus should apologize to Megatron"

(Speaking specifically for IDW1, though it applies to a lot of MegOP especially ones that do continuity soup with heavy reference to IDW1)

I was talking to a friend in DMs and they mentioned a common headcanon/fanfic trope that I also concurred with, and both of us said it's something that bothers us: a common take in the MegOP fandom goes basically along the lines of "If Optimus had just apologized to Megatron, the war would've ended" (or other variants including "if he'd tried harder to understand Megatron/work in collaboration with him").

And firstly, this is incorrect for a number of reasons:

There were attempts at peace negotiations during the war, but they fell through. So Optimus WAS trying to work with Megatron to the point of participating in formal diplomatic meetings.

Optimus tried multiple times on page to convince Megatron to just stop fighting and work with him for peace (Autocracy, Chaos Theory) that Megatron rejected. Given that these on-page examples take place at the start of the war and at the end of the war respectively, it makes sense that Optimus asking Megatron for collaboration is something he was trying/willing to do the entire time. So again, Optimus was always willing AND ATTEMPTING to work with Megatron and find a joint solution

Even before the war when Optimus was still Orion, he was very explicitly inspired by Megatron's writing and names Megatron as one of the people who "opened his eyes" to the wrongs of Cybertronian society. So how is it that people claim "the war went on for too long because Optimus never tried to understand Megatron" when OP literally named Megatron as one of his biggest idols, thus implying that OP does understand Megatron's ideals

But the primary purpose of this post wasn't to defend Optimus, actually. Even though I personally think Optimus did plenty (dare I say, everything) to try to end the war, there are some who may still think otherwise, so instead of arguing about whether Optimus did "enough", or who should apologize to whom, or who "deserves the blame" for starting/continuing the war, I'd actually rather talk about this:

No matter who is most "to blame" for the war, it's my firm belief that neither Megatron nor Optimus would even expect/demand the other to apologize to them at all.

On Megatron's side, he would never seek to judge Optimus negatively for the decisions to the point of saying "you wronged me, apologize." Whether it's evil Megatron who doesn't care about atrocities and revels in an opportunity to expose Optimus as a hypocrite, or post-war/Autobot Megatron who knows that his own evil actions are irredeemable, the idea of Megatron judging Optimus and demanding an apology for the war specifically strikes me as out-of-character. Why would Megatron demand or even want an apology from Optimus when Megatron knows fully well that he has his own sins to bear, he prolonged the war for his own selfish/material gain, and that he is responsible for an untold amount of suffering? Demanding an apology would imply that Megatron sees himself as the wronged party and Optimus as the wrongdoer, but by the end of the war, Megatron is too aware of his own part in the war to ever demand such a thing of Optimus. Even if he DID think that Optimus was "equally to blame" for the war (which he doesn't/wouldn't, btw), Megatron's own feelings of guilt would prevent him from trying to seek the petty satisfaction of the moral high ground or making Optimus beg for his forgiveness.

Additionally, Megatron knows Optimus very well as a person: he knows that the position of leadership is full of "loneliness [and] agonizing self-doubt" for Optimus (Chaos Theory) and that "when Optimus hurts others, he hurts himself" (MTMTE). Another reason that Megatron wouldn't demand nor want an apology from Optimus is because Megatron knows Optimus so well that he already knows that being a war leader fills Optimus with immense guilt and suffering. Given that Megatron knows about Optimus' self-doubt and guilt, why would he even need an apology when he already knows how much Optimus regrets the war and desperately wishes/wished for it to end?

Then, as established in the previous paragraphs, Optimus is too full of guilt for his part in the war (both before it started and in being unable to stop it sooner) to demand an apology from Megatron. Again, demanding an apology would put Optimus in an implied position of moral superiority and/or victimhood, but Optimus doesn't see himself as morally superior or as a victim (or rather, he sees himself as being responsible for these bad things happening and internalizes this as a duty to do better/fix wrongdoings). In other words, Megatron and Optimus both share this view of themselves and each other: Their hands are so dirty, and they both feel such guilt over this, and they know each other well enough to know that the other feels this way as well. Because both of them feel blame for the war and are acutely aware of their own flaws/part in suffering, both of them feel far too responsible for the war happening for them to ever blame their archnemesis for "not trying harder" or "being responsible for the war."

Hell, if you even look at the socio-political climate of Cybertron before the war started, neither Megatron nor Optimus were the ones who put this conflict into motion. The corrupt legacy of the Primes, Functionism, class issues-- all of these things existed before Megatron and Optimus did. Even once they started doing things like writing about social issues (M) or fighting against the Senate (OP), both of them were "underlings" in sense that they weren't leaders:

Megatron's writings may have inspired the Decepticon movement, but that movement existed as an independent entity with its own leaders and speakers long before Megatron became the "official" ruler of the Decepticons. He wasn't even the leader of the 'Cons until he took control of the gladiator arena and the nonviolent sections of the Decepticons were (presumably) subsumed into the underground, exploitative battle culture that Megatron created.

Optimus-as-Orion was a police officer to start, but even once he started going against the Senate, he mainly worked in collaboration with others like Senator Shockwave and Zeta (later Zeta Prime), who he either saw as his idols or who were literally superior to him in rank due to government/military structures.

So with this in mind, even from a social level, while Megatron and Optimus may have been "catalysts" of a sort that caused the war to escalate to an outright planetary/galactic level, the scenario is too complex to solely lay the blame for the war at either of their feet. I'm not confident in saying that Megatron/Optimus would explicitly think of this when talking to each other, but what I'm trying to say is that M/OP were just catalysts in a long chain of brewing tension that exploded into a war. Even if one could claim that one of them "started" or "escalated" the war, the social issues that caused the war and the positions of power that allowed them to become leaders in the first place were falling into place before either of them actually BECAME leaders.

In other words, this shared fate of being the final reaction that exploded a societal conflict into outright war... Megatron and Optimus both have that in common. And because of this, I really don't think either of them would even think to ask the other to apologize because they're both in such similar positions, with such similar feelings of guilt and responsibility, that they understand each other's feelings without words. To demand an apology would be akin to taking that shared vulnerability/guilt and stepping on it, attempting to claim that one is right/superior and the other is wrong/inferior, and that the inferior one needs to grovel and take responsibility for the bad things that happened.

#squiggposting #idw megop #idk if this'll get me hate or not but it's something i think about a lot #and verbalizing it to that friend in DMs helped me put into words why that common fanon take bothers me #also. hot take but if any 'apologies' are necessary then it's M who should be apologizing to OP #the war may be both of their faults but M is the one who explicitly did/said things just to hurt OP and break his spirit #i'm tired of ppl who don't understand (or at least don't discuss) how hurt OP is and how he deserves recogniztion of his feelings too #megop #then again this fanon take may just be a consequence of continuity soup culture #where ppl don't have to acknowledge specific things that M or OP did bc they can just selectively include or not include details from canon #so like. i guess in their continuity soup continuties their fanon is technically correct #but in terms of the source material which is the one shared experience we all have and the common language we derive fanon from #this fanon is very incorrect. or at least i hope i've managed to argue that it's incorrect #anyways the thesis of megop is that they're equals and opposites who are inextricably tied to each other #fanon that tries to place the blame on one or castigate one of them is missing the point of megop #the point is that they're equal. equally strong and charismatic and amazing. and equally culpable #even if they're not literally equally responsible for idw megop at least they at least both FEEL responsible #and i don't think idw megops are the type to mince words about who's 'more responsible'#they're both depressed old men who hate themselves and regret basically their whole lives. why would they judge each other like that

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bonebabbles · 3 months

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Bones... help me. I just read a fanfic where the author said that they find it very weird that so many people villainize Clear Sky. They deadass said "sure he's done a lot of bad things but he's always had good intentions,"

...

I don't think I need to explain why this frustrates me so much.

I could just say, "The road to hell is paved with good intentions" but that doesn't even begin to scratch the surface of how fucked up Clear Sky is. He really doesn't even have those lmao

In spite of how you can make a DOTC drinking game out of him bellowing "Im Just Trying To (insert relevant good thing here)," he only ever does this when someone is challenging him or offending him in some way. He's not doing anything out of benevolence, this character is obsessed with controlling other people.

Remove Gray Wing sniffing his armpit for the entire arc and you can see Clear Sky's "good intentions" for what they are; manipulation tactics. He only says "Im Just Trying" when he's defending his evil, fucked up choices to someone trying to challenge him.

"You exiled your disabled brother, you're a piece of shit!" "I'm just trying to be fair uwu"

"You slaughtered a random woman and want to kill her babies too?!" "I'm just trying to spare them from suffering"

"YOU BEAT A SECOND RANDOM WOMAN TO DEATH?!" "I was just trying to give her a warning, not my fault she was too weak to stay conscious"

"There's big piles of rotting meat in camp and we have a hostage who you promised to treat well" "I'm just trying to not let these dumb moor cats think that they can have more than they deserve"

It wasn't ever "good intentions." He's NOT afraid of anyone starving. It's a justification that he tells to his cats to justify his cruelty, weaponizing his sad backstory. He has an entire inner monologue in Book 3 about how they can always hunt more food, so it's fine they're killing more than they can eat, and that it takes people "months to starve" anyway because he saw it in the mountains.

Can't stand that line. "Sure he's done bad things BUT." The bad things were really fucking bad, and no, they didn't effectively write a character who legitimately tried to do the right thing. Everything he does just ends up being related to a grab at power or control.

They just wrote a child abuser who likes to hit women and start wars and decided Tall Shadow is also at fault here, somehow. lmao.

#dotc hate #For real though the way that the arc will just grab the nearest woman to equally blame is baffling #Clear can never be held accountable for his actions. If you're ever mad at him you will get dogpiled or shamed for it #'I dont get why ppl villainize him!!' Bc hes a villain.#Read the stupid books again without taking Gray's whining at face value please ffs #And like... god man. The way that so many of his victims died in the first battle is sickening

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chalkanthit · 4 months

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Aaaand the Nice guy™ on probation is down the line!

#my art #soul eater #se #fanart #ox ford #soul eater Ox #SE ox ford #the man! the legend!#the absolute moron and living proof that good grades don't equal high intelligence-#I still adore this worm tho #like a LOT lot!!#again I have a weakness for lance wielders since early childhood and I fully blame a blue lion in final fantasy for that :')#Ox had a lot of growth tho and I hate that people don't see it and still bash him for being an hormonal teenager #like he actually slowly gets over his aggresive unwanted pda and backs off from kim a good chunk like..#sure he DOES still have feelings which is realistic for someone who liked her from day 1 seemingly but it's so much more tame #also god forbid he actually might learn thar she's a lesbian and into Jackie sldbdls #Chalk doing her dumbass rambles to herself again-

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sanasanakun · 3 months

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Going through my unfinished doodles and discovered I have at least five illustrations of Henry Creel looking extremely unsettling while standing by a bathroom sink. Clearly a concept not meant to be materialized and seen by the public eye given that I’ve not finished a single one of them. Also what-

#I don’t get it #I think it’s probably the weed #I’m blaming weed and somehow the Heathrow airport for this #cause it’s always that fucking airport’s fault for anything #anyway I think I’m just intrigued by him getting dressed to start the day or something #cause that’s what most of them are while he looks terrifying #a good concept #I think I will brew up number six and leave it equally unfinished now lmao #stranger things #Henry Creel #I’ve not talked about my mans in a while this is fun lol #if only I posted art online anymore but alas my brain immediately goes into content stress farming #so I must refrain #one stranger things #vecna

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the-rogue-mockingjay · 11 months

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The Scions' opinions of important political meetings and Alliance war councils, a thread:

Estinien: if Aymeric won't be there, okeydokey, whatever 👍 but if Aymeric WILL be there, absolutely not!! being subjected to questions like "my friend! what've you been up to?" and "how are you?" is more than he feels like dealing with tbh. also if he has to suffer Aymeric bullying him about his lack of money sense one more time he's dragoon jumping out the window

Krile: politics aren't my forte but if you need me to, I'll go :)

Alisaie: UUUUGGGHHHH [bangs head on table]

Alphinaud: this is his natural habitat. it is also where he's most powerful, so beware !!

Thancred: putting that PhD in espionage to good use and helping his friends/allies in so doing is good for his health (and his self-esteem)

Y'shtola: sometimes it's a tasty problem to chew on and sometimes it's just annoying. if Garlemald is involved, it's probably the latter

Urianger: he's been invited to exactly two meetings out of like 30 and only attended one (and showed up unannounced to another). he'd rather stay home and do nerd shit or go scouting with Thancred. we stan an introverted nerd king ✌️

G'raha Tia: just happy to be brought along for the ride ❤️ no situation is unbearable so long as he's by his inspiration's side 😊

O'ravi: [doodling chibis of her friends on the back of a report and scribbling hearts around them] wydm this is "work", i'm just hanging out with my boyfriend and my besties

#this post brought to you by: how elated i am every time the msq sends me to an alliance meeting #because it's the only time i get to see aymeric outside of frigging heavensward #and every time o'ravi joins one of those meetings it's brain empy no thoughts. she's just vibing #the world may be exploding and everything might be shit but look!! so many of her friends in one room!!!!! it calms her #(and distracts her. but you can't blame a girl- ayms and hien are super cute and she so rarely gets to talk to them in person)#(and she really looks up to raubahn and respects him much as she does her father. but she only sees him when shit hits the fan :c)#also the way raha is not too bothered by things and is just happy he's alive to see it even if it's bad is equally concerning and admirable #can't explain why tho #and estinien lurking in the background arms crossed listening and saying nothing is a whole ass mood lol. me too buddy. me too #ffxiv #scions of the seventh dawn #estinien varlineau #krile baldesion #alisaie leveilleur #alphinaud leveilleur #thancred waters #y'shtola rhul #urianger augurelt #g'raha tia #o'ravi soltholia

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squipdop · 7 months

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sorry im a god gale truther btw i DO think he should get to usurp mystra and ascend to godhood and i do think that should be an absolutely awful thing to happen to him but also literally everyone else. sorry

#bg3 #not main tagging this further bc its. mad man 1:30am rambles #but listen. mh.#ok so. heres the thing.#while i do think. their relationship was absolutely fucked. and yeah we can argue for grooming and or abuse.#i also dont QUITE enjoy how ppl make gale like. the poor poor totally blameless victim. like. mh #how to phrase this so it DOESNT sound victim blame-y. but like.#from how i interpret the things he told & what the game shows.#my mans REALLY struggles with No's and rejection. and i wouldn't just put that as a Mystra Aftermath Thing #he WAS forbidden from trying to ascend/was told by her she wouldnt make him an equal. and his response basically was.#'but let me prove i am worthy of this'#which yeah. plays into the fucked up self worth. ill get back to that.#plus the uh. touch the orb scene? he just. grabs your hand and pulls it towards him because he WANTS to show you this. Now.#any rejection within the relationship? I Should Blow Myself Up #he got that gifted kid energy of everything always came easily to him and yet it wasnt ever enough and the relationship w a literal goddess.#certainly didnt help that.#so hes constantly reaching for more. and thats a fault of his because he will do that even if told not to because #at the same time he thinks of himself as smart enough to actually Get to that More.#and yknow w the orb? he literally. got So Badly Burned. is it deterring him? nnnnnnot really.#and i think. godhood would. idk i think he could do it. and i think it still wouldn't be enough.#and having an all powerful deity who ALSO a) still never is satisfied with his amount of power and control and b) thinks he know better than #anyone and could do better than anyone #sounds like its gonna fucking suck #anyways im rotating this all in my brain + ofc the delicious bloodweave combo of ascended astarion + new god gale bc thats just. ough #the mess. of this combo.

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todayisafridaynight · 7 months

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any sawashiro in prison thoughts like. did he cry sob breakdown in his cell when he found out like .. what happened in the outside also im so scared for the "so you know what happened to waka" conversation that might happen in y8 uesduesughsueshgu,,,,,,

I feel like sawashiro’s too emotionally stunted or like. Emotionally traumatized to be able to cry anymore, but i dont doubt he probably felt the world crash after hearing bout masato’s passing. I mean how could he not be devastated by that: he made it his whole life’s purpose to protect and take care of masato as much as he could, and the moment he stepped away from doing all of his bidding next thing he knows it his son’s dead, and he can’t even attend his funeral

Evidently, sawashiro seems to be doing A LITTLE better than when we last saw him in Y7, but we ain’t ever gonna fully know what’s up with him til infinite wealth comes out

UNFORTUNATELY i actually had a whole comic drafted with ichi telling sawashiro about The Incident: in another timeline i had a MUCH more elaborate answer to this… (´∀｀=)

#snap chats #if we dont get the Masato’s Dead conversation between ichi and sawashiro i’ll just have to kill someone <- myself #on the real tho i’ll prob unleash that draft LMAO BUT we’ll prob get it so. :]]]]#i often wonder how sawashiro would react to hearing about masato dying #i know for one thing is that he’d definitely blame ichi for it #but i also equally see ichi biting back because its just not fair to blame ichi for that #and of course masato was sawashiro’s son but masato was a brother to ichi so it wasn’t as though he valued him any less yk what i mean #again i had this whole thing written out in a comic but alas.. i think i was too depressed that week to wanna finish it LOL #maybe i’ll rework it into a fic idk. i have a lot of comics and sketches drafted #but i also dont wanna draw anythin til these comms are done… fic writing tho :)#cnat do it.. with my bitchass computer being chargeless for now… //scream//

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