#he loves like tien and goku and krillin and gohan and stuff very much too

[dragonballwish]

I really don't think Vegeta and Bulma was a great ship. It felt like it was out of nowhere and just done to justify the existence of another Super Saiyan in Trunks for the sake of the whole Terminator reference. I think Gohan x Videl is cute but that their relationship in Z was underdeveloped, which also leads me to question why so many seem to dislike the idea of Krillin and 18 for the same reason? Idk. I think it's weird that GoChi gets so much hate because Goku's "always gone training" and Chi-Chi is "always complaining about it" when we see literally the exact same stuff happen with Vegeta and Bulma and no one questions that relationship at all. I think Krillin is very shippable and think it's kind of bizarre that the guy who's the most caring, least self-focused, and most attentive s/o in the entire cast somehow is determined to be the least-deserving of any romance, even his canon one. I feel like people in the fandom really try to erase Goku and Krillin's bond, between the weird push to declare Vegeta as Goku's "real best friend" and also the weird claims I've seen lately that Vegeta's death on Namek and more recently Meerus' death in the Super manga motivated Goku more than Krillin's death did, to say nothing of seeing people think Krillin has zero skill as a fighter and no real value as a fighter (which has a very, very weird similarity to what the guys who used to abuse him at Orin used to say.) I think that Tien is asexual. Like, canonically, I think he's asexual. I think shipping Piccolo is a bit weird but mostly harmless so long as it's not the weird "cheating" context some like to use. I think we need a Krillin slice-of-life comedy spinoff.

This is a lot to unpack but legit legit I agree with most of it—

Vegebul was pretty random I agree. We saw none of the actual development. I think the fact that Toriyama had initially planned for vegeta to stay dead on namek (or so I’ve heard) might actually play into that. There are only two saiyans of age and so vegeta was really the only one that made sense to have bulma’s bb daddy be … I guess. Like I understand the logic but I agree that it was pretty random. At first it was less of a ship too and mostly like baby daddy vegeta and rich irresponsible mom bulma and they don’t interact ????? In my opinion …. Bulma is kinda a character I’m shocked doesn’t get shipped more randomly since she is the one who canonically is kinda comedically thirsty over hot guys she sees (like zarbon or uhhhh the blue guy from red ribbon army) love that about her though

Hanvi is cosmetically very cute but I won’t lie, I didn’t ship it ever like at all. As a kid I didn’t like Videl and as an adult I didn’t really have any feelings towards her. Gohan is like. I grew up next to him he is my brother.. so I want the best for him … so I don’t know I was always miffed about it but then pan in the new movie finally turned me around I like pan ….. so basically I don’t ship it but I would feel bad to erase son pan from existence in an AU (which I would do anyways sorry)

Uhh gochi haters are *weird* like Fr. I don’t get the hate ??? Like I understand thinking it’s mid and not caring for it or thinking they fit with other people more but other than that there is literally nothing to hate unless you’re jealous ??? Like jealously wish goku was with someone you self-insert better into or something. Because 1. Chichi and goku are both hot ??? 2. They clearly love each other and their temperaments fit each other and they’re both into it. … 3. Everyone complaining probably got into the series years AFTER it was already canon and gohan was born so like it’s all they know why are they so upset ? Makes no sense. The match with vegebul I feel though I can agree that the situations are different especially financially.

Uhm honestly personally I only ship krillin with 18 because they are so obviously perfect and love each other but. I agree so much … krillin is literally the perfect guy and everyone passes over him for what ???? He’s ideal man and everyone acting like he don’t exist .. logically I know it’s because he’s kinda normal in a world of really strong personalities but like. Wtf y’all he’s the perfect character and person and everything in every way.

Having seen my blog and how much I talk about krillin and goku being besties (or at least reblog and talk in tags) I’m sure you can guess my stance on this but. I am SO SICK AND TIRED OF PEOPLE SAYING VEGETA IS GOKU’S BEST FRIEND. KRILLIN IS THE BEST FRIEND ALWAYS HAS BEEN AND ALWAYS WILL BE. Y’all okay I’ve never seen people say vegeta’s death in namek meant more to goku than krillin’s but like Fr that’s the most incorrect cold turkey take I’ve ever heard of in my whole life Fr. Like ??? Goku was just kinda lookin at him and then buried him with hardly any real remorse. Like obviously he was effected but it was mostly by the “okay so suddenly this is my heritage and I am a saiyan and my whole birth family was killed by this guy huh” and the shock of watching this bastard arrogant bastard cry to his death. I love vegeta but there is no way that made goku snap or anything when goku instantly went ballistic when krillin was murdered in front of him without a trace to take back him. Absolute BS. Also anyone saying krillin has no skill as a fighter can meet me in the streets 💪🤧

Okay yeah okay I also headcanon tien as aroace, actually. I wanna say I think it feels pretty canon too considering everything about where he is in canon like … he disappears for training like a hermit right ? His worldly desires are not present methinks

Piccolo ships weird me out too but actually since they lay eggs and fertilize them too, apparently, they are canonically asexually reproductive beings and therefore I don’t think their genetics would need romance to continue populating? So I just cannot get behind namekian ships or piccolo ships. It doesn’t help that the bigger piccolo ships feel morally gray ? I don’t know

And lastly. You’re right. If I don’t get a wholesome slice of life krillin spin-off I might have to raid the toei offices.

I am so sorry this got so long thank you for the awesome super thought out ask

#unpopular opinions #dragon ball #dragon ball z #dragon ball super #wishpost #wishanswers #wishnonymous #wishrambles

[yamchaas]

complete the tag: Dragon Ball addition

tag this with the first thing to appear when you type the following into the tags:

Goku

Yamcha

Tien

Bulma

Gohan

Piccolo

Launch

Vegeta

Videl

Chichi

Krillin

#did this for my kh blog #used to do em on my old blogs all the time #theyre good fun! #dragon ball #goku is my baby and my dad at the same time. #yamcha and tien have become french #Nothin agaonst ol rad boy i just only fuck with yamtien #but its always this he cheats on bulma and is a sleaze bag that fucks everyone #LMAOO of course im ranting anyway #gohan thats my lil baby #Piccolooooooooooooo #still remember when i first said launch mai like 2 years back and everyone was like 👁👄👁 wait thats so good and i was like YEAH #ngl home g this ask was a roller coaster- like veghetha and then fuck vegeta but hes fave but yamcha but what about outfits. #videl smokin cigars.... 😏 #turns out i have strong feelings for chichi #he loves like tien and goku and krillin and gohan and stuff very much too #tag game

[duhragonball]

Dragon Ball Z 134

I’m just imagining Toriyama having this same discussion with his editor. 

On the flip side of things, Dr. Gero is struggling to convince 17 and 18 that the Z-Fighters are a clear and present danger.    The problem is that they were never exactly loyal to Gero in the first place, which was why Gero was so reluctant to activate them.   But Vegeta destroyed Android 19 with ease, and Piccolo damaged him pretty badly, and Future Trunks is a complete mystery to him.    Also, Gero worked Krillin over pretty well on the way here, and he’s still on his feet.    Like it or not, he needs 17 and 18 now.   

Thing is, 17 and 18 don’t really need Dr. Gero.    At this point in the story, all we really know about these two is that they never fell into line with Gero’s authority.   My personal assumption is that they resent him for turning them into cyborgs against their will.   I feel like there’s lore about how they don’t remember their former lives as humans, so maybe I’m wrong.   

The point is that they only really ever got along with him because he had devices like the remote that could shut them down.   17 seemed pretty angry about that in the previous episode when he destroyed it.   They may have other beefs with Gero, but they seemed especially frustrated with the way he could just “put them to sleep” at any time, for any duration.    Now they’re finally awake again and it turns out Gero built a nineteenth androids in the meantime, and then he had 19 rebuild Gero in the twentieth android.   To Gero, that’s old news, but to 17 and 18, it only goes to show how long they’ve been out of commission.

18 wonders aloud why Gero based himself and 19 off the “older” energy absorption model, as opposed to the “eternal energy” model she and 17 are based upon.   I think she hit the nail on the head.   Gero suspected that 17 and 18 were unruly because they were too powerful.  I don’t know if he’s right, but he wouldn’t have trusted either of them to rebuild him into an android body, so he built 19 in a way that he could trust.   I’m not sure why he didn’t have himself made into an “eternal-energy” type, though.  Was he afraid he’d betray himself?    Did he think it would drive him insane?  He’s already an evil mad scientist, how much worse could it get?

So 17 and 18 tell Gero that they’ll deal with the Z-Fighters later, when they get around to it.   Without his controller, he doesn’t have much leverage over them.   Really, even if he did have the controller, he’s in no position to use it.   17 and 18 are the only thing keeping him alive right now.    If he shut them down, he’d be the first one to die.   

Instead, 18 wanders around the lab to see what’s changed since she was last active, and notices another chamber containing an Android 16.   She’s curious about this one, since he’s an unlimited energy model like herself, only he seems to be much larger, indicating a different design.   But Gero gets upset at the very idea of turning him on.    Back at the door, Trunks is just horrified to learn of a fifth android.   

While they bicker, the Z-Fighters just sort of stand at the door and watch.    Krillin suggests they retreat while they’re distracted, and Vegeta plans to stick around no matter what.   Inside, Dr. Gero tries to pull 18 away from 16, which is pretty dumb, since she’s much stronger than he is.   I mean, this is why he reactivated her in the first place, after all.   

It’s pretty fun watching Gero struggle like this.  He was so confident in his plans and backup plans when he first showed up, but now he’s trapped between Vegeta and his own misfit creations.   The funny thing is that 17 and 18 will be kicking the crap out of the Z-Fighters very soon, but not nearly soon enough to do him any good.    Right now all they want to do is screw with his stuff.

18 points out that all the Androids up to #15 aren’t present in the lab.    I suppose this is why Movie 7 introduces 13, 14, and 15 in the sub basement.   18′s point here is that it doesn’t make sense that Gero considers 16 defective.  If he were truly as dangerous as he claims, then why keep him in tact at all?    Really, you could ask the same question about 17 and 18.   They represent the high water mark of Gero’s android research, and maybe he thought he could work the bugs out of their systems, but they’re clearly not going to help him, so wouldn’t he have been better off dismantling them?

Gero starts flipping his shit, warning them that turning on 16 could get them all killed.   17 scans 16 and concludes that 17 has a higher power level, so clearly 16 isn’t a threat.    Gero keeps arguing with them,  and threatens to turn them off, but he doesn’t have the remote, so he can’t.    All he can do is threaten to build a new one, like anyone’s gonna stand back and let him do that.

Finally, as 18 pushes the button on 16′s chamber, 17 attacks Gero and kills him.   This was the big moment Trunks spoke of when he first warned Goku about the android threat.  He said they killed Gero when they were activated, and now it’s finally come to pass.    It’s not clear how things played out in Trunks’ timeline, but in this one it just took a little longer to play out.  

Krillin is shocked that 17 would kill his own creator like that, but Vegeta thinks it’s very similar to the Saiyan way of doing things, which makes the Earthlings the oddballs in the universe.

Then Trunks blows up the whole mountain because he’s been quietly freaking out over all these androids while this scene has been playing out.    I’m pretty sure he didn’t expect that blast to kill 17 and 18, since he never managed anything like that in his own time, but he probably hoped to destroy 16 at least, and any other secret weapons Gero left lying around.

But yeah, no, they’re all fine.   Vegeta scolds Trunks for wasting his energy on a pointless attack like that.    18 goes back to turning on 16 like nothing happened.

So they let him out of the chamber and he’s a big ol’ feller.   17 and 18 ask him why Dr. Gero was so uptight about activating him, but he has nothing to say.

But when they ask him if he was also created to kill Goku, he says yes, and I guess that’s enough for them to bond over.  18 says it was rude for Gero to deem 16 a failure, since he seems to be on board with the whole “kill Goku” agenda.  

As for 17 and 18, they’re not particularly inclined to folllow Gero’s instructions, but they need something to get them started, so hunting down Goku is as good an objective as any.    So they fly off together to plan their next move.  

So the reactions to this development make a pretty good lesson on characterization.   The Z-Fighters are all on the same side, but they’re not all of one mind.    So when something like this happens, it’s a good chance to show them all reacting differently.   Tien just wonders where they’re going.     He’s the practical sort.   He didn’t expect them to leave, so he wants to know why they left and what they’re up to.  

Piccolo’s more of a strategist.   He’s mostly interested in what the Androids aren’t doing, which is rampaging through the nearest populated area, which was what Trunks says they do in his timeline.    For him, the main issue is that the Androids aren’t behaving the way he anticipated, which makes it harder to plan around.   

Krillin thinks with his heart, which often leads him to make logical leaps, but he’s pretty sharp at the same time, so a lot of times he gets the right answer.    This is has been about Goku from the start, so it makes sense that they’d go after him, especially if they’re not interested in attacking the other Z-Fighters or destroying cities.    It’s the only thing left on their bucket list.

And Vegeta’s an egomaniac.    As far as he’s concerned, this is all about him, and he’s offended that he stood here, ready to fight the Androids, and they didn’t even notice.   

And Trunks is just way in over his head.   Right now all he wants to do is wait for Goku to recover from the heart virus so they can regroup and figure this mess out.  He definitely does not want to go off picking fights with 17 and 18, because they were too much for the Z-Fighters in his own history.   In this timeline, they now have backup, and he has no idea what 16 is capable of.    But Vegeta doesn’t care, and he chases after the androids anyway.

The problem here is that Trunks doesn’t understand Vegeta’s attitude toward Goku.    He doesn’t see him as a valuable ally, he hates him worse than he hates the androids, and as far as he’s concerned, he wants to kill the androids first, then finish off Goku later.   So he punches Trunks and leaves.

Then Krilin reminds Trunks that if the Androids really are headed for Goku’s house, they’ll run across Gohan and Bulma along the way, since they sent them there a couple of episodes back.  So now Trunks realizes they have to intercept the Androids, or else he might lose both his parents.

Speaking of Bulma, Gohan was flying her, Baby Trunks, and Yajirobe back to Goku’s house, but in this episode they’ve stopped somewhere and built a campfire for some reason.     This is one of those weird things in the anime where some subplots seem to take much longer than the main story.    I’m pretty sure it’s only been an hour or so since the attack on Amenbo Island.  I guess it could have been longer than that, since Gero had to travel all the way from South City to North City, but he’s pretty fast.    Anyway, the idea that Gohan’s group had to land and rest long enough to build a fire seems kind of weird, like this whole saga has spanned most of the day.   

Anyway, it’s been a while since we’ve had a small boy in this series, so Toei’s gonna return to its roots and show baby weiners.  

At Goku’s house, Chi-Chi’s coping with the crisis by cooking.    She figures Goku will be hungry when he recovers from the virus, and she does this cute impression of him while she thinks about it.    I love this, because this is exactly what they did in the dub version.   Honestly, the subs and dubs match up a lot more often than they don’t.   I won’t deny that the dub got a lot of stuff very different, and some of it flat out wrong, but one of the reasons I wanted to watch the whole thing in Japanese was to see just how different it was, and it’s not that far off.  

I mean, this is a visual medium, first and foremost.    I see Team Four Star talking about the directions they want to take the characters in with the DBZ Abridged series, but the fact of the matter is that they’re pretty much confined to the footage they have to work with.   Funimation had the same constraints in the early 2000′s when they dubbed this part of the story.    The way I heard it, they didn’t have access to the original Japanese scripts, so they had to write the English version based on Spanish dubs instead.    And sometimes they would ad lib things to punch up the story or fill long pauses without any dialogue.    You can debate whether that’s a good idea or not, but the bottom line is that there’s only so many ways you can spin a scene like this.   Chi-Chi’s clearly not cooking all that food for Yamcha.    I’m sure he can have some, but that’s not what’s on her mind right now, and any dub that ignores her concern over Goku is missing the point.   

All TFS can do is try to make it funny.   I’m pretty sure they didn’t use this scene, probably because there wasn’t a good way to make it funny, but they’d still have to acknowledge the fundamental premise that Chi-Chi is cooking food because she’s worried about Goku.    You could go in an absurdist direction and have her say “hehehe im putting p00p in this food because i h8 my husband lol XD”   But that’s pretty cheap.   Any idiot could tell that joke.  

See?   

Yamcha reminds Chi-Chi that the virus might be contagious, so he tells her that they should both take some of the medicine.    I feel like that should have already happened by now, but whatever.   I seem to recall in the dub, Chi-Chi tells him he has to buy his own bottle, which is kind of petty.    Like I said, the dub does take some liberties, but it mostly sticks to the story.   

Meanwhile, Vegeta’s butthurt that everyone trusts Goku to solve this crisis, even though he’s at least as strong as Goku now.     He seems to be missing the point that he can Goku probably need to work together on this problem, but whatever.

Elsewhere, 17 leads his group to a highway, because he wants to steal a car and drive it to Goku’s house, as opposed to flying straight there.   While they wait for a car to drive by, they ask 16 if he was based on a human, like they were, and he explains that Dr. Gero constructed him from scratch.

And this is where the whole Android/Cyborg/Artificial Human thing sot of falls apart.   #20 is clearly a cyborg, because you can see Dr. Gero’s brain in the dome on op of his head.    17 and 18 are cyborgs, because, as they say, they were built from human beings.    A lot of fans just refer to them as cyborgs for that reason, but 16 is not a cyborg, because he’s purely artificial.   Since he’s a robot that closely resembles a human, that makes him an android, literally, by definition.   

I’m less sure about #19.   The dome on his head looked like it had a bunch of computer parts in it, but that could just mean Gero transferred his brainpatterns to a CPU, or he may have cut out 19′s cerebrum entirely, killing the human he was based upon, but still using organic parts in his final design.   16 might be the same deal, really.    He looks and acts a lot like the Terminator robot, and those guys were just robot endoskeletons wrapped in cloned human flesh.   The T-800′s are cyborgs, even though they don’t have human brains or human consciousness.   

Anyway, that’s why I use “android”.   It’s incorrect, and I know it’s incorrect, but it’s what the dub used, so I’m used to it, and there doesn’t seem to be a more “right” term available that covers all of these characters.   

This revelation makes 17 wonder why Gero ever bothered using humans in his experiments.  If he could build an android fighter from scratch, why did he abandon that design to make 17 and 18?   

This is something I like about the androids.   You’d expect the higher-number ones to be stronger, but instead Toriyama introduced them in reverse order.    16′s the strongest, then 17 and 18, then 19 and 20.   Movie 7 takes that idea one step further by having #13 be even stronger still.   The implication is that Dr. Gero had his perfect killing machine ready to go a long time ago, but something about #16 worried him, so he went back to the drawing board and made something weaker.   Then 17 and 18 proved too hard to control, so he went back to the drawing board again and made #19, and then he decided to turn himself into an android, which is kind of stupid seeing as he’s the lynchpin to this whole operation.  If Gero fights Goku himself and loses, there’s no one left to build the next wave.  

I don’t know if this is about Gero being a perfectionist, or realizing that power couldn’t be the only factor in his design, or what.    You’d think the ideal android would combine traits from 16 through 20, but he seems to have abandoned one idea and moved on to another.    Why not build a cyborg with unlimited energy and the power to drain people’s ki?   Well, we can’t as Gero now, because 17 killed him.

Anyway, Vegeta finds them and challenges them to a fight.  

18 asks 16 to fight Vegeta first, because she wants to see what he can do, but he refuses.  So 18 decides to take care of him herself, because fuck this guy.   I’m a Vegeta fan, but come on.   Fuck this guy.  

Seriously, when has anyone ever said this and won a fight?   Like, in Iron Man 2, Happy Hogan tries to go easy on Black Widow because she’s disguised as a secretary and he doesn’t know she can kick his ass, and she kicks his ass.     No one ever goes “Well, I’ll probably win because you’re just a dumb ol’ girl,” and actually wins.  

Seriously, this is just ingrained in my head after a lifetime of watching pop culture stuff.    It always seemed surreal to me when I play Street Fighter II as Chun-Li and she loses, like she’s just supposed to automatically instakill her opponents.     My default assumption is that if I ever got in a fight with a woman, any woman, that she would probably win, because that’s what happens on TV.   I don’t know exactly how they’d do it.    I’m not very tough, so it’s not like I’d be hard to beat anyway, but if I saw a woman in a coma in the hospital I’d be like “Yeah, I better not mess with her, she could probably kick my ass.”    Is it a stupid way to live?  Maybe.    It’s also healthier.   

I’m just saying Vegeta should watch more TV.    He doesn’t have to learn everything the hard way. 

#dragon ball #2019dbliveblog #androids saga #vegeta #piccolo #tien #krillin #android 16 #android 17 #android 18 #android 20 #dr gero #goku #chi chi #yamcha #trunks

[aotopmha]

I kind of love this month's Dragon Ball Super chapter.

It's all basically building further on the potential cool concepts brought up in the previous chapters.

The concept of spirit manipulation is pretty interesting and fits nicely with the Yardrats to me - from what I get, it's simply a different version of Ki usage with different utilities from the usual expected applications of it (such as simple Ki blasts).

As said before, Vegeta getting something new besides his old stuff is very welcome. A few iffy details here are that what we saw of the Yardrat techniques this chapter, they are basically versions of techniques we've already seen and I'm not exactly sure how any of those could help against Moro (same with Ultra Instinct - no matter the technique, Moro could still absorb their energy, they need something against that), but since the Yardrats are known for diversity, there might be a bunch other stuff they have besides what we saw in this chapter and perhaps some of these could be useful when used in creative ways. The potential technique diversity for Vegeta is still nice.

Using both existing designs for the Yardratians is a very neat compromise, too.

As also said before, I thought the possibility of others besides Goku and Vegeta getting involved in the fighting again was a great detail in the previous chapters and in this chapter we actually got a great little confrontation between Piccolo and the goons flying to Earth. He stopped the goons before they could leave through quick thinking and reacting and through that ensured the planet being targeted wouldn't go hidden. It doesn't remove the big threat in Moro or even the other enemies, but it does give a chance to prepare for the attack (in a very typical DB way). Moro's interest in Earth was also set up in a natural way since he's just looking for planets with a lot of energy. We've got a good setup for that third act of the arc taking place on Earth right here.

Instead of just a hint of everyone besides Goku and Vegeta getting to do something, there is now basically a direct promise of Krillin, Tien and Gohan specifically all potentially getting something to do and that is, as also said before, very welcome.

I was pretty sure before (and there has been suspicion about him since pretty much the beginning), but now it's as clear as it possibly could be to me that something is up with Merus, a possibility might even still be him being an antagonist, though, I am leaning much more towards basically anything else. I think considering he knows about Ultra Instinct, he might actually be an angel (maybe even the Grand Priest, when even just going with the Grand Priest training Goku idea), even any of the gods (Kaioshin, GoDs) in disguise that might've been just staying in the mortal world for the kicks or maybe even something like an half-breed, all of which might explain his competency much more solidly, which I now definitely feel needs to be explained. This definitely goes too far when it comes to him supposedly being just a patrolman (even if a competent one).

Finally, I dig how there is another Room of Spirit and Time out there. It's just another neat, natural expansion of the story's ideas.

Focus on side characters (and a promise of focus on more of them), having interesting powers introduced and it all flowing together really well? I think this might be the first truly great Dragon Ball Super manga chapter to me.

#Dragon Ball Super #Dragon Ball #DB #DBS

[tigerlover16-uk]

So, at what point do you think it was that Krillin actually surpassed Tien? And why do so many people seem insistent that Tien has to be stronger and aggressively push that idea?

If they weren’t already even by the Piccolo Jr saga where Krillin pushed Piccolo to use his full power to defeat him, then Krillin either surpassed him during the one year of training in the Saiyan saga, or if not there definitely when he had his potential unlocked by Guru on Namek.

As for why a lot of people refuse to believe Krillin’s stronger than Tien, it’s mostly a mix of bias and the anime exaggerating Tien’s abilities.

Take the filler in the Frieza saga where Tien, Yamcha and Chiaotzu fight off most of the Ginyu force, whereas Vegeta, Krillin and Gohan had all got their buts kicked by Recoome alone. If we’re being honest that’s baloney, since Vegeta and Krillin were just as skilled if not more so than either of those 3, and with the amount of time they were on King Kai’s planet they really shouldn’t have been able to progress to the point where they were stronger, if we take into consideration Goku’s power boost from training there for a greater length of time.

The anime would also exaggerate Tien’s abilities in a few more cases, like in the scene where he pins Cell down with the Tri-beam. In the manga he didn’t spam the attack that much, and he was only just barely able to slow Cell down long enough for 18 and 16 to escape. But the anime dragged it out a lot longer to try and make Tien look a lot more impressive. And it’s a cool moment in either version don’t get me wrong, I loved it, but point is it shows a trend of the anime exaggerating Tien’s abilities, making him look more powerful than he really was supposed to be at that point in the series.

And there’s also the matter of Tien fighting Future Trunks briefly in the movie Bojack Unbound, even getting him to go super Saiyan against him, whereas Krillin at the same point in the movie was freaking out over the prospect of having to fight Piccolo.

Stuff like that kind of throws people off since not everyone actually reads the manga or watched Kai, and even if they did that sort of stuff still probably leaves an impact that subconsciously colours their perceptions of both characters skill level during Z. Also, there’s this weird perception that I think was also due to something suggested in filler that Tien constantly trains 24/7, but that’s never actually been suggested in canon and as far as we know Krillin and Tien probably train just as much and as hard.

Taking all of that aside though… well, a lot of people are just biased because Tien… basically looks more like a tough guy compared to Krillin.

Krillin is short, designed more as a non-threatening sidekick character, and is generally characterized as fairly sweet, expressive and a generally nice guy, the kind of character you want as your buddy. He’s not exactly a traditionally masculine character in a lot of ways. 

Tien though, he kind of is. He’s tall, buff (Krillin’s no slouch himself, but his musculature is often less defined), and a walking shirtless scene for many of his appearances, especially when he fights. And while he can have his comedic moments (”You can’t tuna fish!”), his personality is generally a lot more straight faced and serious, and often stoic. And there’s the fact that he’s a former assassin and thus a redeemed villain.

So in general, Tien on the surface does come off as a more traditionally macho kind of character, which a lot of DBZ fans latch onto because a sizeable portion of the traditional fandom was obsessed with raw strength and masculinity and rejected characters seen as weak or who show emotion that isn’t stern warrior male or angst at the death of a loved one (Which is probably why Tien doesn’t get mocked for his pointless sacrifice against Nappa, despite dying just one time less than Krillin and both he and Yamcha get flack for being red shirts supposedly). See the rift between people who think super Saiyan 2 was where Gohan’s character hit his peak and everything in the Buu saga beyond ruined him forever, verses more rational fans who appreciate Gohan for who he is for a classic example of this mindset.

And then of course there’s the fact that the fandom has long been taken over by memes to the point many people insist that TFS’s portrayals of the characters in the Abridged series are a more accurate depiction of them than the actual canon, so Krillin being the fandoms biggest butt monkey for years after Yamcha has made a lot of people aggressively refuse to believe that Krillin is in any way capable of being a competent fighter and that he MUST be weaker than all the other characters that aren’t Yamcha!

So, yeah, basically a lot of fans just make really poor assumption on things out of bias. And don’t get me wrong, I love Tien. He’s one of my favourites too, and I want to see him in action a lot more in the future too… but, no. Facts are facts, Krillin is the strongest non-enhanced human being on earth. A level he earned through hard work and a lot of struggle. That doesn’t mean Tien is not also a very impressive and admirable fighter, but it’s also not an insult to acknowledge that Krillin is stronger than him, it’s just the way things are.

#Krillin #Tien #tien shinhan #dragon ball #dragon ball z #dragon ball super #dbz

[blundergato]

basilouija replied to your post: dragon ball heroes is weird man. i dunno about it...

One if my biggest issues with DBZ is how BADLY EVERYONE IS DRESSED 95% OF THE TIME. TOO MUCH ORANGE. This is an EXTREME upgrade.

toriyama has pretty terrible fashion sense.

just about every character in the show dresses terribly, at least of the main characters.

goku’s gi is iconic at this point but thats literally what he wears for a good 95% of the show and its ridiculous. the dude show have...like...actual clothes that he wears outside of his gi.

that outfit i posted works both as a gi and just kind a cool looking thing goku could wear at any time (and it has SERIOUS monkey king vibes).

vegeta is even worse. the dude is constantly in saiyan armor. he looks like an asshole. and whenever he wears normal clothes he looks like a goober.

toriyama has some sort of weird obsession with baggy ass pants because everyone has them. goku, krillin, tien, yamcha, the majins, piccolo, trunks, android 17, the supreme kais, beerus...its fuggin everywhere. also, he loves laceless boots/shoes, though i assume thats to make action scenes simpler.

its funny comparing dragon ball to the other really popular show here at the time, sailor moon. naoko takeuchi modeled a lot of the clothing after high end fashion and you can really tell. comparing the characters in sailor moon to the yokels running around in dragon ball is hilarious. same goes for yuyu hakusho as well; the character dressed snazzy as hell.

i mean, there are definitely cool/iconic clothing designs in dbz; piccolo is one such highlight, but that falls more under costume than just clothing, even if he wears it all the time. trunks still looks cool as hell, even if his pants are too goddamn baggy.

a lot of the women are much better dressed though their outfits tend to be pretty simple. chi chi always looks great, bulma’s outfits are usually pretty cool.

one of the best outfits in the entirety of dbz was gohan’s school outfit. sweet vest AND NO BAGGY F**KING PANTS.

the one good thing ill say about super is that the fashion in hte show is generally better; it leans to more traditional looking stuff which i think works really goddamn well for dragon ball.

tien in dragon ball super probably has one of my favorite outfits, though he still has the baggy pants.

yamcha also has a good costume, albeit very simple AND not as awesome as his original classic dragon ball outfit.

i sometimes like to think “dragon ball...but with yuyu hakusho’s fashion” and i truly wonder what kind of weirdness that would sprout. 

#basilouija

[kutee-boutique-fan-blog]

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You have to read the manga or input will be inaccurate. Never Understimate A Woman Who Loves Fast & Furious And Was Born In October Shirt. I know the anime looks cool but the manga literally makes sense. I didn’t understand how the hell trunks was rage mode long enough to let holy n vageta go back in time and come back. Plus it explains in detail what super saiyan blue is, how it’s not perfected yet (you see the blue aura around them) and how super saiyan God is also helpful because it doesn’t drain their stamina as quick but still uses the same godlike power. The story itself is just true in the manga.

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If you’re not a fan of the show, maybe read a little. This game looks very fun though. A real fighting game. Not like the xenoverse games that arnt really all that great at all in terms of fighting. Think about the old school dbz games. Honestly I think if they just put the Frieza and Cell saga are the only reasons why I like DB anything. Those can never be topped, and the franchise has nothing left to prove after those imo. I think it’s a matter of taste with DBZ and DBS. First off, having the “Z” name doesn’t automatically means it will only have Z characters.

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I don’t even find a moment of greatness like that in DBS, even if I don’t watch it everytimes (I’m honest), blue, pink and stuff doens’t make me crazy like back in the days. It work for others anime, look at Luffy last transform, damnit, Naruto at the end was so trash too money, and Boruto …perfect example. Edit: Thanks for those who gave me precisions about “control of the ki” and stuff, I admit it’s not “bad” but I still like the original Sayajin, rage, revenge, angry, proud, power, and also i forgot, goku vs vegeta m.

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If that was the case, games like BT3 wouldn’t have GT characters. If that wasn’t considered false adverising, then neither should this. Next, it really isn’t too much with the transformations imo. I don’t really see how it is too much. And finally, I also read the manga but I wouldn’t say it’s better. It also has it’s fair share of problems. I never knew my comment will be so popular but I agree with both of you, they try to do some “good things” but I repeat, it’s “TOO MUCH” and again so predictable, Chris Selig, I assume.

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I never read the manga but I watched the anime a bit (black goku, birus, enemies from anothers universe, ultimate gohan return, female Broly …), looks like it’s difficult for them to find the “good idea”, but again, I can understand if you like, it’s all yours, maybe I repeat so much but and excuse me for my English but DBZ was so “intense”, SSJ2 Gohan, Vegeta Suicide, Vegeta admit Goku his best friend, Futur Gohan one arm, Goku Transform vs Freeza after Krilin down, Piccolo suicide for Gohan .

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Yeah I’m long time dragonball dbz and even gt fan. But I can’t bring myself to watch super. Never Understimate A Woman Who Loves Fast & Furious And Was Born In October Shirt. Can’t stand the new transformations. Ssj4 was way cooler it’s a shame they didn’t do something similar to that imo. Gohan fights goku in blue using kio ken blue with just his mystic form he’s not a little bitch anymore and is working on becoming a god without the help of the gods or using super sayian he told goku this and his super sayian 2 and mystic form from the buu arc are bitches compared to him now he almost killed tien in a sparing match with one punch. It’s going to be awkward when some Krillin main beats somebody playing SSB Goku.

[yamchaas]

Who does Yamcha love best?

Probably Puar :] that's his lil baby guy 💙

#ask #he loves like tien and goku and krillin and gohan and stuff very much too

[tigerlover16-uk]

How would you handle a sequel to Dragon ball super?

Hmm. Here’s an interesting one. Well, I don’t have a plan for a full series, but I do have a bunch of scattered ideas for one.

* It would be an EoZ follow up, taking place about 7 years after Goku left with Uub. During this time Goku resumed living at home at some point due to Chichi becoming pregnant with a now 3 or 4 year old daughter, but Uub is now capable of instant transmission so they’re still able to train together regularly regardless, and he’s more or less integrated himself into the Z fighters.

In this show, Uub and Pan would share the role of main protagonist, both striving to become as strong as Goku to protect the earth in his place someday (and so Goku can challenge them both once they’ve hit their peaks. Because Goku. Hey, don’t look at me like that, at the end of the series it’s pretty explicit that’s part of why Goku wants to train Uub).

Meanwhile, Bulla, Marron, Trunks and Goten would also be major supporting characters training alongside Uub and Pan to help defend the earth, while having their own character development and subplots going on. Goku, Vegeta, Gohan and etc would all be firmly in the role of mentors for most of the series, occasionally helping out in the case of a big threat to the universe. The rest of the Z fighters would still be around to various degrees of relevance, several of them also helping to train the next gen characters and teach them their techniques at various points, but Uub, Pan and the next gen characters are the main focus throughout.

* Majin Buu would basically follow his storyline from the Dragon ball Online/Xenoverse lore, creating himself a wife through some kind of weird magic and beginning to create a whole race of Majin’s. At the time the show starts, they would have one son who’s about 4 or 5 years old and is about the size of Kid Goku, and would be one of the next gen Z fighters, while Buu and his wife also have several dozen baby Majin’s to take care of, with help from dear uncle Satan of course.

* Pan and Bulla would become a couple at some point. Because the franchise could use some gay characters that aren’t minor one offs like Kakunsa and Vikal so far, or offensive stereotypes like General Blue. Also, because Vegeta’s reaction to his daughter dating Kakarot’s granddaughter would be HILARIOUS.

* Tien would still be teaching students at his dojo, many of whom are expert Ki users by now, while Krillin has taken over the reigns to the Turtle School of Martial Arts from Master Roshi, who left a while back on some sort of “spiritual journey” (Meaning he’s on a road trip around the world with Oolong trying to pick up chicks). He wouldn’t appear again until much later into the series, so for now Krillin is trying his hand at being a martial arts instructor, Marron being his prized student.

* Yamcha would have found a loving girlfriend and is living a happy life like he deserves already.

* Optional, but I might have Piccolo have become a father by this point with a child who has the potential to be as strong as he is, but is surprisingly meek and tranquil, to Piccolo’s awkward bemusement.

* In addition to being her personal trainer, Whis would have basically taken on the role of Bulla’s surrogate Uncle, having a surprisingly close relationship with her as they hang out on Beerus’s world all the time and Whis talks to Bulla about her personal life and helps her work through personal issues. Beerus would also have a soft spot for her, but tries very hard to hide it and pretend Bulla is a burden.

* Pan’s personality is basically a lot closer to her adorable EoZ self than her GT self. She would learn how to go super saiyan fairly early into the show, and ascend to super saiyan 2 either at the end of the first or second saga. She and Uub share a sibling like relationship, despite initially having a rocky start prior to the start of the show due to Pan being a tad jealous that Goku ran off so suddenly to train with Uub, but we get some flashback episodes at some point showing how they worked it out.

* Marron would basically be characterised as a cool big sis figure to Pan, Bulla, and other young characters like Goku and Chichi’s new daughter, Buu’s kid and Vegeta and Bulma’s new son (Oh yeah, did I forget to mention that?). She’s warm, expressive and friendly in similar ways to her father, but can be as intimidating as her mother when in a fight or when she’s in “Babysitter mode”. She starts the series off training under Krillin and 18, and has aspirations to be the first human member of the Galactic patrol, a role she acquires half way through the show after apprenticing under Jaco for a while.

* Launch by this point would be a minor recurring character married to Tien. The two of them have a young son who shares Launch’s split personality quirk.

* Uub’s family would be recurring minor characters in the show, and his village is thriving due to funding from Mr Satan.

* Gohan by this point is a successful scholar, and is also once again serving part time as the Great Saiyaman. Pan is the new Saiyagirl, and is just as much of a lovable dork as her dad when in character.

* The series would start with a number of episodes introducing and fleshing out each of the next gen cast and the current status quos of the old Z fighters and their allies, before moving into a saga that’s basically a dragon ball hunt. As a test, Goku tasks Uub, Pan and their friends (Sans Goten and Trunks, who had done a similar exercise before) with finding the Dragon Balls during summer break from school, without the use of their flying abilities so they have to hike around the world to find them by a certain date.

What they don’t know Is that Goku has set up a number of challenges along the way for the group to overcome. Nothing especially dangerous, but stuff that would give each of the new Z fighters their own difficult obstacles and opponents to overcome (part of which would involve calling in favours from some of his allies from other universes). Beerus however, who’s in on Goku’s test, decides by the end of it that his final challenge is a bit too tame (Read: Not guaranteed to get the kids brutally killed if they’re not careful enough), so basically goes behind Goku’s back and has Whis round up a group of the universes most dangerous super powered criminals to attack the young Z fighters, after making sure that Goku and the other high-tier Z fighters are off world at the time so they can’t find out quickly to deal with the situation themselves. Things work out after a huge struggle though.

This saga would mostly be a fun adventure story in the spirit of the original Dragon Ball and chock full of character building moments and interaction. Maybe some fun fanservice with the young Z fighters encountering some of the characters from the original Dragon Ball, like Suno and Android 8 (Heck, maybe throw in a Dr Slump crossover while we’re at it).

*Each saga would have a number of breather episodes between them, much like what Dragon Ball Super does, to further focus on supporting characters that don’t get as much limelight in the main sagas and also to just further flesh out our primary cast.

* The second saga would be a tournament arc, featuring another multiversal tournament. This scenario assumes all the universes that participated in the tournament of Power were revived, and that Goku convinced the Zen-oh’s to hold annual multiversal tournaments WITHOUT blinking anyone out of existence for stupid reasons.

However, the main thing to note is that there are actually TWO tournaments held annually, a Tournament of Power every two years featuring the absolute strongest fighters from each universe (Goku and friends, Toppo, Jiren and the Elite Pride Troopers, the Kamikaze Fireballs). And every year after it, there’s now another tournament meant for less experienced fighters from the various universes (Young Pride Trooper recruits and a young magical sidekick to Ribrianne in the vain of Chibiusa from Sailor Moon, for some examples).

Uub and the other next gen fighters compete as a team in this tournament, which is structured a bit more similarly to the World Tournaments from the original Dragon Ball except with whole teams competing together. This tournament would basically be a chance to introduce a bunch of new characters that’ll be more important later in the show, as well as re-introducing and catching up with established other universe characters from Super like the Universe 6 saiyans and Hit, Toppo, and the various Gods of the multiverse. It would also establish that there seems to be a feeling of discontent between the Gods of Destruction of the other universe, especially in regards to a newly appointed God for one of the universes that seems shady.

* A potential third arc would involve an invasion from the Demon Realm Dabura ruled over, possibly lead by his widowed wife who has a grudge against the Z fighters because she believes them and the Supreme Kai at least partially responsible for her husband’s death.

A notable thing that would happen during this saga is that the villain would use  a special kind of dark magic to effectively nerf most of the strongest Z fighters. Goku, Vegeta and Gohan would lose their ability to assess their super saiyan transformations and Gohan’s ultimate form for example. I suggest this mostly as a way to make sure there’s tension for later sagas so that when bigger threats start popping up, Uub, Pan and the other next gen characters can still be the main heroes of the story and Goku can’t just use his God forms to easily end all the conflicts himself.

The first half would basically be the main villain and a group of elite mooks scheming to find a way to break the barriers between realms so that an entire army of demons could invade universe 7, while the Z fighters try to stop her. But because Dabura’s wife is a chessmaster and a scheming genius, she basically plays them all to help her succeed in her goal, and the second half of the saga deals with the next gen characters and the weakened Z fighters all trying to repel the invasion and minimize damage. This saga would also feature cameos of various ally characters like Android 8, Upa and Bora, Korin and Yajirobe, Baba and her monster fighters, Jaco and the galactic patrol, namekian warriors and even minor villains like Master Shen and Tao Pai Pai fighting demons attacking various places around the earth and other parts of the universe.

The explanation for why Beerus isn’t around to deal with this situation is that he was in universe 6 challenging Champa to poker, and at some point the two ended up having a drinking contest that got them both so drunk they passed out for a month. Whis decided to hang out in universe 6 for the time being and catch up with Vados in the meantime, being unaware of what was going on in universe 7.

*At least one or more sagas would take place almost entirely in the other universes

And, that’s all I got for the time being. Might go back and add to this later for the fun of it. I just hope we get another EoZ sequel at some point for real, there’s SO MUCH potential for that era and the characters beyond that point, and I would HATE for GT to be the only show ever made taking place following this era because of how badly it screwed that all up.

#dragon ball super #dragon ball #dragon ball z #uub #dbs #dbz #end of z

[tigerlover16-uk]

If you’re open. For one, japanese polls show fans wanted Yamcha for the tournament. Super had filler mocking Yamcha as a loser who Gohan & Co try to prevent from learning of the tournament. The latest Herms translation on a Q&A for the Anime on why Yamcha wasn’t at the tournament, gave Goku's reason as he(Goku) thought little of Yamcha. I'd call that a dig, personally. If I was writing Super's I wouldn't do stuff things like that as they further divide, anger, or alienate the fandom for Super.

Hmm, okay I see your points there, and it’s understandable that Yamcha fans are upset.

Okay, for one thing though… how do you know the stuff with Yamcha in the saga isn’t Toriyama’s idea? The whole thing with him just expecting to be recruited and going home to wait seems more like an excuse to keep him out of the plot than a dig at the fans. And while I get taking issue with that idea… let’s think about it from a creative standpoint.

The tournament only has ten spots available. Extending the rosters to include more members would put a lot more work on Toriyama, Toyotaro and any other character designers at Toei to come up with that many more characters from other universes, of which this saga basically has close to a hundred new ones.

Each character is there for a reason. Goku and Vegeta can’t not be on the roster. Gohan’s been set up for his comeback for a while, and Piccolo can’t be passed up. Krillin is Goku’s best friend and the strongest earthling, so he has to be there. Android 18 is the only high tier action girl in the Z fighters, and Android 17 was brought back because he’s underdeveloped and hasn’t been seen since his cameo at the end of the Buu saga. So this was the perfect opportunity to use him, since this whole tournament setting benefits from teamwork between the warriors. Majin Buu was initially chosen to fill out a spot because he’s the most powerful non-saiyan. Master Roshi is on the roster because a running theme of this saga seems to involve experience and skill at fighting being often more valuable than raw power, and master Roshi is the wise old master character. He fits with that better than anyone else.

Tien is really the only one without a clearly definited role or reason for being here other than that he’s strong and fans love him. His role from what we’ve seen and the synopsis for the next episode seems to mainly be about supporting the other characters. A role Yamcha could have easily filled too, but then you’d have Tien fans angry that he was being excluded to service Yamcha, so either character gets the short end of the stick however that played out.

Frieza taking up Majin Buu’s spot seems to be a major plot point for the saga, because Toriyama wouldn’t bring him back again unless he has a good reason. But of course, Toei needed an excuse for why any other character couldn’t have been brought up by the Z fighters when Majin Buu started hibernating, because seriously, that’s a huge risk that’s not worth taking if there’s a better option.

Goten and Trunks were explained away because they’re too young, inexperienced and uncoordinated for this kind of tournament. Not unfounded, given how they handled fighting Majin Buu as Gotenks.

Yamcha though, he was an obvious back up choice for if one of the other characters couldn’t compete, and obviously viewers were going to notice that. And even if he wasn’t written as wanting to get back into fighting, he would never refuse such an offer knowing the universe was at stake.

So an excuse had to be made, since Toriyama wanted Frieza for some yet to be reached plot reason (Notice that character’s like Jaco weren’t even acknowledged and they skipped out on the chance to canonize Pikkon aswell, like some fans wanted).

And there was a way around it. Yamcha had already retired from fighting back at the Cell saga, Goku knows this by now and so wouldn’t expect Yamcha to still be in fighting shape by this time. Keep in mind, back in the Champa saga he initially turned down Vegeta’s suggestion to recruit Gohan, not because he thought he was a bad choice, but because he knew Gohan was rusty and not really a fighter anymore, and they needed someone who could already fight at their best for the tournament. As soon as Goku learned that Gohan had been training with Piccolo and he asked Goku if he could compete, Goku was more than okay with it until the conference thing came up.

Same thing probably would apply to Yamcha in this tournament. Goku didn’t even know who he wanted for the tenth member until Oolong told him Roshi was with Tien. He had no real reason to assume Yamcha would have wanted to join the roster, since he’d been out of fighting so long. And the only chance he would have got to recruit Yamcha was at Bulma’s place, and as soon as the tournament came up Yamcha was all like “Hey, I wanna join too!! But wait, maybe I should wait for them to ask me? Yeah, that’s it, I’ll go home and wait, then turn em down, and then make a grand entrance at the last minute”

It was silly and a bit weird since Yamcha’s not one for showboating usually (Though not necessarily above doing silly things), but it got him out of the way long enough for Goku to recruit a full team and then Frieza. It’s not clear if this whole situation was Toriyama’s or Toei’s idea, but Toriyama was definitely the one to decide the roster and who was going to do what in this saga. So he would have been responsible for Yamcha not competing anyway, so I wouldn’t put the situation above him. Heck, it feels like something he probably thought up on the spot while he was writing the outline, wrote it down real quick and didn’t too hard about it before handing it off to Toei and Toyotaro, who were stuck with it at that point. We’ll know for sure what exactly the situation is when the manga’s a bit further ahead and we see what Toyotaro’s excuse is. If it’s more or less exactly the same, then we can safely say it was Toriyama’s idea and thus not filler by Toei.

Also, where did Gohan or anyone try to hide that the tournament was happening from Yamcha or demean him over it. Goku and co mentioned the tournament was happening right in front of him, that’s what caused him to suddenly run off the way he did. No one ever said he couldn’t be in the tournament, nor did they mock him over it. They just didn’t think to ask him, because again, Goku and the others knew he was supposedly retired and thus didn’t immediately think of him as a candidate any more than they did Videl. Everyone acted pretty normally around him, the only exception being Vegeta showing annoyance when Bulla started crying, but the same thing had just happened when Mr Satan tried to make her laugh so that wasn’t anything against Yamcha. Just a throw away gag.

Oolong is the only character who tried to dance around the subject, and that was when Yamcha directly asked him if the others might recruit him after the roster had already been filled, and Oolong didn’t want to disappoint him. Otherwise, there’s no implication anybody would have turned him down or derided his fighting ability if he had just openly asked about the tournament when he had the chance. They didn’t think twice about having Yamcha play baseball with them, because they all knew he was great at that and he would have been the most useful person to help out.

It’s sad that Yamcha ended up screwing himself out of a place on the team, but that was more due to his own ego, not because any of the other characters thought badly about him. Nothing about his scenes really paints him as pathetic or a loser, just that he had gotten ahead of himself and made a silly mistake.

I don’t think this running gag was meant to deride or attack the character. Otherwise the writers would have had the characters openly mock him a lot more, turn him down when he asked, and have him end up feeling dejected. But he wasn’t especially upset at all when the others left to fight in the tournament. He was sheepish and embarrassed with himself when Puar expressed sympathy for him being left out, and he looked rightfully suspicious about Frieza, but he ultimately laughed it off as one of those things, and when everybody did leave he got serious for a moment and wished them luck, saying that they had to win. Which goes to show that Yamcha has his priorities straight and that the fate of the universe matters more than him getting a chance to strut his stuff.

This entire situation could have definitely been handled better and wasn’t a funny joke, but honestly I don’t get the feeling that Yamcha was being intentionally derided or mocked by the writers. If anything, the joke seems to be that he could have probably avoided the situation he made for himself and got what he wanted if he stopped being silly and just asked Goku directly if he could be on the team. Which, again, dumb joke. Not necessarily an attack at the character, or his fans.

The thing with the Q & A sounds suspicious, I agree, and I can’t really say too much without knowing the full context. It could be just the one person doing the interview giving it his own two cents and not really talking for Toriyama or the writing staff, in which case shame on him. Or maybe the intention was lost, and he’s just meaning that in the sense that Goku didn’t think of Yamcha because he’s been out of the game so long that he’s probably very out of shape, similar to his reasoning with Gohan for the U6 tournament. Which, that’s not too bad, though not exactly fair on Yamcha either. I dunno, feel free to be annoyed with that one.

I get being upset with how Yamcha’s been treated. I’m not really happy with it either, I’d love to see more done with Yamcha because I do love his character, I’m just not offended or angry because I don’t think there’s any intentional disrespect towards him. Just that the writers aren’t sure what to do with his character, since Toriyama clearly isn’t giving them anything for him to do in the main stories. Which, yeah that’s not a good excuse, but it’s one I can live with, and it’s what feels like the case rather than them having it out for the guy.

It’s good to hear that Japanese fans wanted more of Yamcha. Maybe that’ll encourage Toei to push Toriyama to do something with him in the future, or maybe give him his own story’s or character arc in a breather episode or two after this saga wraps up. Maybe finally give him a girlfriend that doesn’t treat him like Bulma did. For all we know, Toei and Toriyama might just not have considered that he had so much support while planning the saga.

Although, a lot of Western fans wanted Cell on the roster instead of Frieza, and that wouldn’t necessarily have been for the better in terms of the story. Sometimes what fans want isn’t always going to be in the best interests of the story. We already had two characters, Krillin and Gohan, who’s had to have character arcs developed about them wanting to pick up martial arts again and get stronger leading into and during the current saga, three if you count Master Roshi given his interaction with Ganos in today’s episode and the “secret training” he’s apparently been doing for a while for years now to be able to fight fairly in the tournament of power.

Having the last remaining character besides Videl who had given up being a martial artist and more active member of the Z fighters, and that might start feeling redundant or pushing things too far, having so many characters suddenly getting stronger again so soon to the level that they can seriously compete with the warriors from the other universes. I mean, look around at how many people are outright angry for some reason that Krillin was able to put up any kind of fight against people at all.

And none of this is to say that leaving Yamcha out and have him play so little a role in Super so far is justified or that you can’t be disappointed and annoyed over it as a fan of the character, or how it’s been handled. Feel free to do so. And you have a point being concerned that this might make the divides in the fandom even worse, though that’s more down to the idiots in the fandom being stupid and fueling their own confirmation biases than anything. Same reason I don’t truly hate TFS for the problems they’ve caused, because at least several members like Kaiserneko acknowledge their bad influence and they never meant to create such levels of toxicity in the fandom. Careless fans who can’t understand that something is a parody are responsible for that.

you have a right to be mad. But personally, I don’t think any of these things are intentionally digs at fans so much as they are ignorance on Toei’s part. Who knows, maybe Toriyama actually has a plan and this thing with Yamcha this saga is actually leading to something down the line, won’t know until we’re a lot further into Super. Things could improve, but it is frustrating the way things are going so far and I don’t blame you for being in a bad mood.

I don’t think the situation’s as bad as you do, but then again maybe I’m just not as passionate about Yamcha as you are and I see things from a different perspective. This is all I can really say on the subject, I’m sure I can’t really do much to change your mind and you do have some good points and reasons to feel the way you do.

Let’s both just hope that things start looking up for Yamcha in the future, and that Toyotaro doesn’t actually have the characters directly insult Yamcha for wanting to compete or something like that when he gets further ahead in the manga. Because honestly with his writing, I wouldn’t put it past him to do exactly what you think the anime is doing.