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#even if Byler didn’t happen
starbylers · 10 months
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*obviously Byler endgame would also mean no M!leven but it’s like an extra step up
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cringengl · 1 year
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chirpsythismorning · 3 months
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“Mike said his life started the day he found El in the woods, which was technically the following night. What he said had nothing to do with offending Will because he went missing the day before.”
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watereddownjoke · 1 year
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ONE WHEAT MARK KISS????
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It’s wild how so many people are fundamentally incapable of recognizing queer characters unless they explicitly say the words, “I’m gay” on screen
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#like season 1 and 2? sure maybe you can overlook Will’s queercoding and believe it’s just a result of the bully’s homophobia#season 3 is a huge stretch but it’s hypothetically possible to believe will is just a late-bloomer or asexual#but how on earth do you watch season 4 and still genuinely have no idea will is gay?#and this is not a rare occurrence#it’s astonishing how many people you have to literally explain the van scene to cause Will’s sexuality never crossed their mind#you didn’t see him staring longingly at his best friend the entire season?#some people’s minds are so aggressively heteronormative that they assumed will had a crush on el#and even after noah has explained that will is gay 50 million times#people still are confused and think it came out of nowhere or they quickly forget#somewhere there’s a fan who doesn’t keep up with stranger things news and doesn’t really use social media#a fan who is the exact opposite of chronically online#who hasn’t heard about NOAH coming out let alone Will’s sexuality#who will walk into season 5 and be utterly flabbergasted when Will comes out as gay (let alone when Byler happens)#and they’ll say that Will being gay is a huge plot twist they never saw coming#and they’ll be 100% sincere#and that’s truly baffling to me#do people think shows just randomly include melodramatic rain fights where ‘it’s not my fault you don’t like girls’ is said for no reason?#do people think the show went out of its way to show wills rejecting the attractive girl in his class cause they were in a silly goofy mood?#I genuinely wanna know what goes on through people’s heads when they have no gaydar or media literacy#even today there are people who still think romantic stobin should happen and think that Robin isn’t really a lesbian#will byers#byler
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booksandpaperss · 1 year
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just realized I have the entire s4 Byler bedroom scene memorized.
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I read someone say: “Mike projected his misery over his fight with Will onto the roller skate incident” and it was honestly one of the smartest things anyone has ever said. This might’ve been obvious but seeing it written down really opened my third eye. Unfortunately I can’t remember who said it ://
read the tags for a little but more elaboration and another smart thing I said lmao
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bodegacat-withboots · 2 years
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People saying byler is not popular weren’t around for earlier byler. There was zero mention of it outside of tumblr, nowadays you see people mentioning it on ship posts and even get acknowledged by show quizzes on various pages. And even if it was a marketing scheme we got acknowledged by Netflix. Before even the mention of it would make someone pull out a gun and shoot you.
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gayargyle · 2 years
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see at this point…the level of queerbaiting…there is literally no way it’s not happening
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The silly voice in my brain: Do you want to spoil yourself 4 seasons of a popular Netflix show you never watched just to find out what is the significance of a swing set to a ship that you never heard of 1 minute and 48 seconds ago before watching an animatic of them?
Me: DO I WANT TO?!?!
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notebooknonbinary · 1 year
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Byler Week, Day 1: Halloween
Happy Halloween to those who celebrate! (Happy s2 Byler to all) And happy first day of Bylerweek!
Today is Day 1: Halloween / AU / –gate. I chose to write a fic bc my drawing skills need serious brushing up skills and I can eventually stuff this fic into my other fic’s universe😌.
Edit: Also posted to Ao3:)
Halloween used to be Mike’s favorite holiday. He’s always loved dressing up as whatever his favorite character that year is. And he loves seeing what other people dress up as.
One year, before the Party started doing group costumes, he and Will had gone as Kirk and Spock. He’d even made the ultimate sacrifice and let Will be Kirk.
Tiny little seven-year-old Will had made an adorable Starship Captain (equally tiny Mike had thought he looked super cool). Mike’s fake ears had itched, but he’d liked the cool blue color of his shirt. And everyone that gave them candy that night had known they were a pair, which had thrilled them both to pieces.
The first year that the Party did group costumes, Mike and Dustin had convinced the other two to go as DC superheroes (Lucas and Will have always preferred Marvel). Lucas had been Green Arrow, and Dustin had picked the Flash (his favorite). Everyone had expected Mike to go as Superman, who was his all-time favorite. Except he’d gone as Batman instead and asked Will to be Superman. Everyone’s costumes had turned out great, but Mike’s favorite had absolutely been Will’s—handmade by Mrs. Byers as always.
(It seems obvious in retrospect, that Mike had already begun to get a crush on Will—which is why he’d wanted him to be Superman.)
(And then, of course, the Halloween—only a few days before Will would be taken by Vecna, the Party had dressed up as Star Wars characters. This time it’d been easy to convince everyone that Will as Luke was just the obvious, correct choice, and not because Luke was obviously the best character.)
But Eighth grade had been the last time any of them had dressed up (“Who you gonna call?”) —and it hadn’t exactly ended well.
(Well, technically that Halloween had ended with Mike and Will hanging out alone in the basement, watching a lighthearted movie and sitting close together to feel safer—so that part…)
Freshman year, Mike had been in the middle of being miserable and missing Will and El too much to even think about a costume—and last year, they’d been in the middle of recovering from an apocalypse (neither Will, nor Max, had even been awake yet).
So now there are multiple anniversaries right around Halloween that seem much more prevalent than going around getting candy (which they’re pretty much too old for anyway, in Mike’s unhappy opinion), or going to a Halloween party—with too many people they’re not friends with, and alcohol, which none of the Party even likes.
So yeah, Mike doesn’t really intend to broach the subject of costumes this year.
Instead it’s Will who brings it up. “If all I have to focus on this year are the shitty memories and handing out candy, I’m going to scream.” Then he grins, a little mischievous. “Plus this is the first Halloween that we’re dating. I’ll be able to tell you this time that I think you look handsome in your costume, instead of pretending that you, as Han Solo, didn't fluster me half to death.”
Mike, they’ve both learned, is much easier to tease out of the two of them—Will makes a game sometimes, out of all the easy ways he can make Mike blush. Like right now.
“You’re mean,” he grumbles, hiding his suddenly warm face in his hands. It only gets warmer at Will’s delighted laugh. “You wanna do a group costume with the Party, or a pair like we used to?”
“The Party’s a lot bigger than it was back then—it’d be too hard to coordinate on short notice. But…” Will trails off. Mike risks a look at Will, who is suddenly much closer, smile softened but eyes still bright with mirth. “I think, Michael, that in this context, it’d be a couple’s costume, not just a pair.”
Mike resists the urge to hide his face again.
“Everyone always thinks I’m the mean one of the two of us,” he grumbles, but accepts the embrace Will is silently, cheerfully, offering—nosing into the other boy’s shoulder. “I’m gonna tell your mom you were bullying me. She loves me, you’ll get in trouble.”
“Tattletale,” Will singsongs. “I’ll stop bullying you if you let me pick our costumes this year.”
Mike, who doesn’t actually want Will to ever stop bullying (aggressively flirting with) him, cocks his head. “Alright Byers, deal.” He pauses. “And you just have to lay off flustering me in front of our friends—they already think I’d let you get away with anything.”
Will snickers. “You know what? Deal. But, for the record, I think you would let me get away with anything. Which is why, one day, you’ll go with me and El to Vegas so we can use our powers to scam the slot—”
Mike interrupts this long-running (hopefully a) joke to kiss Will. Will leans into it briefly, reaching up to weave a hand into Mike’s hair. After a moment, though, he pulls back, looking thoughtful.
“Now we have to figure out what we’re doing for Halloween.”
The Halloween of Mike and Will’s Junior year of high school, the Extended Party (minus Jonathan and Nancy, away at their colleges) convene on the Byers-Hopper house, dressed to the nines in their Halloween costumes. The plan is to watch minorly scary movies, eat far too much junk, and take turns answering the door for Trick-or-Treaters.
The Original Members of the Party (including Max) show up early to help set up.
Dustin is in a full suit and tie, a gun holster (with two full water guns in it), and a fedora. The entire setup is impressive, but none of his friends can guess who he’s supposed to be. The only one who understands who his character is immediately, is—oddly—Hopper.
“Elliot Ness.”
“Yes! Thank you!!”
It turns out that, having recently seen the Untouchables, Dustin had gone on a research spree about the Real-life man, and been fascinated. Thus, his choice of costume.
Lucas and Max have decided against couple costumes. Instead, Max wanted to go as Wonder Woman, so she has (and she looks every bit the Amazon warrior, sitting in her wheelchair like it’s a throne).
Lucas, on the other hand, has finally been able to be a Marvel superhero. After long deliberation between all of his favorites, he’d finally settled on Falcon—partly because he enjoyed the recent comics miniseries, but also because if he’d gone as Spider-Man (his other big choice), he’d have to keep removing the mask to eat.
“Falcon is just cool enough to date Wonder Woman,” Max tells him, mock-loftily.
He laughs, leaning across her lap to give her a kiss. “Well, Wonder Woman is more than cool enough to date Falcon.”
This being one of El’s first actual Halloweens’, she chose to go as the ghost she’d wanted to go as on her first Halloween—though the simple sheet had been switched for a white dress, pale makeup, and fake blood (with the occasional appearance of actual blood when she used her powers to get another soda, or pop Mike across the head with a pillow).
Steve and his group seem to have collectively decided to go as the Breakfast Club (or perhaps Steve is in regular clothes, it’s hard to tell). Robin, dressed as the outcast girl, is lounging across Vickie’s (dressed as Molly Ringwald’s character) lap, attempting to toss popcorn into Steve’s mouth. She’s largely just making a mess, but neither of them seem to care.
The (actual) adults of the bunch settle in the kitchen. Joyce convinced Hopper to do a couple’s costume with her (they’ve gone as Frankenstein and the Bride of Frankenstein), but Murray shows up wielding a bottle of something very strong for them to drink and wearing just a dollar store cape over his regular clothes.
(Erica, out with her other friends for one last candy-haul before high school next year, will come at eight-thirty. She’s dressed up as her DnD character, Lady Applejack. She has no plans whatsoever to share her candy—even though she knows she probably will end up doing so.)
Joyce had been overjoyed to see what costumes Mike and Will picked this year.
She hadn’t been the only one.
When Will told Mike what costumes he wanted, Mike almost cried. He is (not so) secretly a sap, and Will knows it (though Will isn’t much better on that front, honestly).
“Shall we, Mr. Spock?”
“Indeed we shall, Captain Kirk.”
It’s the best Halloween yet, in their opinions.
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emblazons · 1 year
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Thank you for this I thought I was alone
No problem lol. Honestly, as rare as a position as it can feel in a fandom this big…I am really not a hater of The Duffers or the story they’ve told. I’ve been a huge fan of ST since S1 even if I didn’t get into the fandom until 2022, and while I actually disliked most of S3 and was certainly as outdone with vol ii like everyone else at first, time and more perspective into their intentions (them “showing their cards,” as they said) has actually given me a new respect for Matt & Ross, rather than taken it away.
The Duffers are a specific kind of storyteller—one you see more in movies and film than TV, and as someone who generally appreciates film as a medium more…they just make a lot of sense to me lmao. Sure, there are moments I would have to told the story differently if it was mine, but…they haven’t done anything poorly, and I can follow their trains of thought with relative ease.
If anything, I think a lot people would be happier if they just accepted their headcanons + things they’ve hyperfixated on in this show (or ANY) are just super fun to explore & make content about without demanding it be made canon, but. Idk. Maybe that’s just me LMAO 😭
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Wait wait wait wait
Who was going to tell me that baby boy Will is a JORTS WEARER
How did I not realize-
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luckybyler · 2 months
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My observations on the VR game re: Byler, including a couple of things I haven’t seen mentioned yet
I just saw part of a game walk through on YouTube (I can’t afford VR), and hoo boy!
1. The Mike that says El is so amazing and Will wouldn’t get it isn’t the real Mike, it’s the Mike that Vecna shows Will to terrorize him: In Chapter 3, Vecna possesses Will. Will resorts to a happy memory (Mike and him in Castle Byers), where Mike gives him a a ViewMaster. Will starts playing it, but Vecna makes every memory awful, full of spiders and particles. He distorts scenes, showing things like everyone ditching Will after calling him weird and other things that blatantly didn’t happen. Then he tells him he’ll show him suffering and shows that scene where Mike talks about El while particles fall down.
2. Will is confirmed to be a human being with wants and needs of his own: During that scene, Vecna goads him to tell Mike how he feels, and that he doesn’t want to meet El at all. At this point Will and El hadn’t met in the real world, and Will didn’t wish harm on her or anything, he just didn’t want her to be there, which is a normal and natural thing to feel about your crush’s hypothetical crush.
3. Vecna’s full of shit: In chapter four, Vecna tries to possess the four boys from the Party, and fails. He tells Dustin he puts double the effort into the friendship than the other three boys do, but Dustin turns him off with the TV remote (is Dustin’s happy memory watching tv?). Then he basically tells Lucas “you’re black and people judge you for it”, but he’s in a memory of a movie date with Max (at a drive-in theatre somehow) watching happy memories of the Party. Lucas does see the monster (so it somewhat hits?), but Max says it can’t do anything and they easily shut Vecna down. He also taunts Mike by telling him he’ll never see the most awesome person he’s ever met (El) and it’s his fault because he didn’t try hard enough, but he’s in the middle of a DnD battle with the boys and doesn’t even pay attention. A couple of dice bring Vecna down no problem.
4. Mike lovingly tends to Will’s nosebleed: Vecna does almost succeed in possessing Will, but he’s with the boys playing DnD, and Mike soon realizes Will’s nose is bleeding. He takes Nancy’s shirt and uses it to clean the blood/attempt to stop the bleeding, and admonishes Lucas and Dustin for not going to get a towel. Notice that in season 1 the boys saw El have nosebleeds and Mike was never as precious about it, unless she passed out of something and then they all helped. Lucas and Dustin are even heard in the background pointing out that nobody dies from a nosebleed. There’s a funny moment when Vecna tells Will he will always be alone right as Mike sweetly asks him if he’s ok while holding his face.
5. Brenner is training Vecna (???) and points out that he’s full of shit: I don’t know if this means anything for the show’s canon, but it’s interesting. Before Vecna tries to possess the boys, Brenner points out that they’re too young and untroubled, and afterwards he makes fun of Vecna for losing against children, again.
6. Will isn’t the weakest link, he’s the link Vecna knows best: Brenner points out to Vecna that the reason he could possess Will easier is because he already knew him (from the Upside Down) and knows the nature of his fear. When Vecna tries to possess Will, he does tell him to help him find out about Lucas’, Dustin’s and Mike’s fears, and actually asks him “what is Mike afraid of?”, indicating that he knows jack shit about them. Which leads us to:
WHERE THE LEDE IS BURIED:
7. LOSING EL ISN’T MIKE’S BIGGEST FEAR. OR SOURCE OF GUILT.
It might be a fear or regret of Mike, but it’s not THE fear.
Turns out Vecna was attacking Lucas, Dustin and Mike based on superficial knowledge, suppositions and stereotypes (Dustin’s the newest of the group, Lucas is black, Mike met El), not an actual, deep knowledge of their minds. Yes, good memories helped them keep Vecna at bay. Yes, those things Vecna told them might bother them. No, those aren’t the things that are at the core of their fear and guilt, or the right angle to drive them to either the dark side or suicide if pushed about them enough.
P.S.: At some point (that I haven’t seen yet, Max tells El that she doesn’t need to be a superhero all the time, that she’s more than fine as Jane, her friend. I think this might be literal, as in, superpowers are not the key to defeating Vecna. This is a psychological thriller disguised as supernatural horror, therefore the weapons to defeat him might be more psychological.
TL; DR: Vecna will be defeated with the power of Cognitive Behavioral TherapyLove and Friendship.
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byerseason · 16 days
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my personal opinions on byler & mike’s character
most people believe mike is clueless or at least he just suspects will’s feelings. well, sometimes i agree with that but in general i think mike knows. actually he always knew. let’s look at everything from the beginning.
both mike and will always lived in a small town full of homophobia. we know will personally experienced homophobia from his dad and other people in hawkins. mike and will are friends since kindergarten and mike obviously witnessed all of these homophobia will went through. maybe mike experienced it too, we know ted said “see what happens?” for a reason. especially with lonnie, mike witnessed everything he did to will, we all know will shares everything with mike. so from their point of view, this thing called “homosexuality” is something really bad and all it causes is harm and hate. it’s something forbidden.
now let’s see what happened in all seasons. in season 1, a cool girl magically comes into mike’s life and shows interest in him. “you’re blind, because a girl is not grossed out by you” now mike has a chance to be normal like people expect him to be. and he’s a child, it’s not that deep. he can try. no deep feelings, no love, just be normal.
in season 2 this chance is taken away from mike leaving a trauma to him. after all, el was special and he cares for her so much. and the fact that she sacrificed herself just to save him and his friends is not something we can overlook. and adding to this trauma, something really bad is happening to will and they don’t even know what is it and how to fix it. he does his best, he never leaves his side because it’s something a good friend would do right? it wasn’t that forbidden thing the adults get angry about and it shouldn’t be. after el’s return and will being safe, mike had this chance again. el was here, she was incredible, a superhero who saved will and the world, and she was ready to be in a relationship with him. snowball scene was mike telling will “i’m moving on, you should move on too or we will get hurt by this.” because you know, these things always hurt will and nothing else.
in season 3, mike continues to this “moving on” as we can clearly see. this time a little bit grown up, or at least trying to grow up. distancing himself from will and all his friends, focusing on el all the time and for some reason not being able to maintain a friendship with will while dating el. this speaks volumes actually. it’s both him trying to be normal as expected and distancing himself from will to make sure he is normal too. to me that’s all the “it’s not my fault you don’t like girls.” scene. while mike is fighting back, will makes it harder for both of them without realizing it. i think -like everyone- the ending of season 3 was mike realizing it’s not working and it’s getting serious. he’s growing up, they’re growing up and everything is becoming clearer.
will and el moving to california was a new chance for mike. he ignored will, well at least he tried even though it’s clear he felt his absence especially in school, he didn’t reach out to him thinking maybe this is the chance for both of them to move on. and then el’s letter happened. mike thought will really did it, he moved on, he was able to move on while mike isn’t. if we think deeper, he is even working on a painting for her, something he used to do with mike. so yeah, will is normal, it worked for will, while mike is still dealing with this. when they reunite i think it was much more than just jealousy. disappointment, anger maybe? especially after he saw he brought the painting to the airport. apparently will wasn’t planning on giving all his attention to mike, who was visiting him after months, but he was planning to give the painting to the girl he likes, it was probably the reason of his excitement, not mike. so this is what makes mike want to focus on el more and ignore will during rinkomania scenes. when el mentions angela and will gives a reaction to this, mike is sure he was right and this day is about angela for will.
but he finds out he was wrong. well, the painting is still for a girl but at least he was wrong about angela. will was just upset because mike was being lied to, and he was hurt by mike being distant from him. this is what leads mike to sincerely apologize to will, as always. he always does that, if will says “where is dustin right now?” mike realizes his mistake and tries to fix it. if will says “we used to be best friends” mike realizes his mistake and offers to be best friends again. that’s all their dynamic about.
after mike and el’s fight, mike comes and explains what happened to will but it’s more like he is asking for an advice, he wants will to understand him. “it was a fight that you can’t come back from.” he wants will to agree but he doesn’t, this is when we start to understand mike’s inner struggles. he brings up this topic to will three times. none of these conversations are like two best friends giving each other relationship advices because mike never tells will what is the problem. for some reason he doesn’t want will to know he can’t tell her girlfriend that he loves her. we all know will and mike are sincere enough to tell these things to each other, they always do. but if he can’t, there must be a reason. maybe mike himself doesn’t know the answer either, maybe he doesn’t want will to understand his situation because he thinks will successfully moved on, who knows?
in the desert scene, he brings the topic up again, without mentioning what is “that thing”, but this time will seems like he understands. “sometimes, i think it’s just scary to open up like that, to say how you really feel, especially to the people you care about the most.” mike never mentioned he is struggling to say how he feels but will understand, he always did. this conversation would continue with mike opening up to will if it wasn’t interrupted, so mike brings it up once again for the third time, in the van scene.
this time he is being more open but he is still struggling to say one thing, which will completes for him “you’re scared of losing her.” well, mike was wrong. will wasn’t getting it until.. the painting scene. mike is not stupid, he knows will spent days working on it. he knows eleven doesn’t know about what this painting is about. he knows he doesn’t make el feel like “she is not a mistake at all” especially after their fight, remember that line from the script “she’s already beginning to understand she doesn’t need me, i saw it in her eyes” he knows el doesn’t need him, he knows will well enough to understand he is lying. the way he looks at will admiringly is him thinking “he didn’t move on, we’re still the same.” and also him being aware of what will is doing for him, breaking his own heart and sacrificing himself just to make mike feel better. also, he notices will is sobbing, he looks at him and even if he didn’t how could he not? he had tears in his eyes during all the monologue and he was sobbing right next to him. so is there any reason for mike to not say anything to his best friend sobbing next to him if he didn’t know the reason? the mike i know would immediately ask what was wrong if he was clueless. he knows why will is crying but he doesn’t know what to do about it. mike’s situation is pretty sad when you think about it, he probably feels like he’s stuck.
then we have the desert reunion scene. this time we clearly can see how stuck he feels between el and will, he doesn’t know how to get out of this without hurting any of them, and also himself. the way he looks at them looks like also him being afraid of damaging their bond.
then the monologue scene.. this scene may mean lots of different things, i am not sure either.
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it may be mike being aware of what will is doing, how he is sacrificing himself once again, how mike is gonna have to lie and hurt everyone in the end, how the things are gonna be way more complicated or mike realizing he was wrong about thinking will has feelings for him.
my season 5 expectation is seeing a mike wheeler who stops fighting back and embraces his feelings, without hurting both of them.
that’s my point of view that changes almost everyday lol. i don’t know if there are many people who believes mike isn’t clueless so i wanted to share my thoughts. 💛
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starbylers · 7 months
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“Will can move on and find someone else” do people not understand that this is a TV show? Of course if this were real life, there would be opportunity for Will to move on and be happy without dating Mike. But Will is a character. And the story has been set up in such a way that for Will, in the canon timeline of the show, it’s Mike or no-one. It’s Mike or rushed, under-developed, last minute/epilogue love interest. Will is in love with Mike specifically for a reason, and that was a storyline built up over years. He is not getting a fulfilling romance with some never-seen-before guy in the jam-packed finale season of the show. It’s Byler or they made a calculated decision to have the only gay main character, who is shown to be more painfully in love than any other person on that show, suffer gut-wrenching heartbreak and for what? When every other character has gotten a multi-season reciprocal romance plot.
Season 5 is the last chance they’ve got to offer him satisfying payoff for all that he’s been through, and of all characters, Will is the absolute last one who needs a “sometimes things don’t turn out the way you wanted but you'll be okay” message to conclude his story because he’s never gotten what he wants. His existence on this show has been traumatic event after traumatic event. They’ve set Mike up as the one thing Will loves and wants more than anything, and denying him that after all that he’s been through is unnecessarily cruel storytelling. (Obviously this is not at all to say that Mike is some sort of prize for Will, Byler perfectly intertwines with and completes Mike's individual character arc too, which is why it should and will (fingers crossed) happen).
Some guy called Will didn’t just randomly fall in love with his best friend and "oh it’s completely fine if Mike rejects him because there’s someone out there who’ll be right for him"—writers put him in this situation! Writers actively chose to double down on his “unrequited” feelings in the penultimate season! Writers put him through hell, physically and emotionally, and specifically relating to his sexuality. Then they slowly but surely revealed that he is pining for this one thing, this person that brings him strength and inspiration and hope, and people think him being told no that kind of happiness is not for you sorry kid, but hey at least your loved ones don't hate you for being gay, who could’ve predicted that? If you're lucky we’ll even let you smile at random cute guy in the epilogue! is acceptable let alone good storytelling? Will deserves better than a “there’s vague happiness in his future” ending, and we should absolutely expect better.
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