#rhaenys's death being the reason that everything starts to fall apart?

[navree]

How can you humanize Maegor , if you will make a show about him?

It depends on how far back you're willing to go in his life, because really up until he takes the crown, you can do quite a bit to humanize him and make him someone people want to engage with, without woobifying him or trying to excuse the truly heinous things he does. Starting backstory onwards, there are lot of ways to do this. There's a lot of room to play with in his childhood and the interpersonal relationships that should be his strongest tethers to humanity, but aren't: his relationship with his brother, his relationship with his mother, and his relationship with his father.

Aenys and Maegor are a relationship that was doomed to fail since birth. For one, while the age gap isn't huge, five years is still pretty significant in terms of differences in development as children, which definitely got in the way of any bonding. For two, they also appear to have largely grown up separately, with Aenys spending most of his time by Aegon's side in King's Landing, and Maegor being raised on Dragonstone with Visenya, before the two essentially switched places with Aegon at Dragonstone and Visenya overseeing the construction of the Red Keep in King's Landing. For three, there's also the external factors, such as their incredibly different personalities and viewpoints on basically everything, as well as the fact that, when Maegor was born, Aenys was only very recently removed from the complete breakdown he had due to his trauma over his mother's sudden death, and likely still wasn't in a state to be trying to forge new bonds with anyone who wasn't Quicksilver (and Aegon, but Aegon's grandfathered in by being his literal dad). So Maegor, who we know wasn't making friends on Dragonstone and just in general was probably really isolated from kids his own age due to it being Dragonstone (not unlike how we see with Shireen Baratheon) also isn't getting any kind of connection from anyone close to his own age throughout his entire childhood.

Really, the only person Maegor is close to in any capacity is his mother, Visenya. She's the parent he grew up with, his primary caregiver and his closest relationship not just in childhood, but likely throughout his entire life. In the nature vs nurture debate on childrearing, she's the one who was providing the nurture. Nearly everything about Maegor, his personality and his view of the world and his personal philosophies and his love map in his brain, among many other things, all of that was shaped by Visenya and her influence on him and her care and devotion for him. And with no one else really around to provide him any sort of companionship that he might have needed, and with his other parent being incredibly distant and barely a parent, Maegor likely latched onto her incredibly strongly. I think, if asked, Maegor would say that, should he be found capable of love, Visenya would be the person he loved the most in his life (I'm of the opinion that his relationship with Tyanna was him trying to find a significant other that most reminded him of his beloved mother, not entirely dissimilar to the way that Henry VIII felt that an ideal wife would be one who was almost identical to Elizabeth of York). And we know that this is something that persisted long after childhood, into his adulthood Visenya was his strongest supporter and Maegor relied on her a lot early in his reign, and was publicly devastated when he learned that she had died. His mother was the only parent he ever really knew as a parent, certainly the family member he loved most, adored even, especially in such sharp distinction with Aegon as a distant father. And speaking of that distant father...

I love Aegon, he's one of my absolute favorite Targs, but he was practically just a parent in name only to his second son. And that's going to do a number on someone, no matter who they are. Maegor's father doesn't much care for his mother, certainly doesn't seem to care for him at all personally, and despite the fact that Maegor is probably far more like Aegon, and a far worthier successor, than Aenys, Aegon still dotes on his eldest while barely spending any time with Maegor. And it's not because of anything Maegor's done, or even anything Aenys has done: it's entirely because of Aenys's mother. Aenys is Aegon's favorite, his precious son, not because of anything Aenys has done to earn that, but simply because he is the son of Aegon's beloved Rhaenys, and that his very existence is a way of having Rhaenys still with him after her disappearance/death. We know that Aegon was forever incredibly affected by what happened to Rhaenys and that he never stopped loving her, given that he openly wept when he held Rhaena and was informed that she was named after her grandmother. Meanwhile, there's Maegor, whose own mother's relationship with his father was never very good (marriage of duty for them vs the Aegon/Rhaenys marriage of desire) and had become incredibly cold and distant by the time that he was born, and you can very easily see how that might ultimately affect a kid. He's watching his mother be completely ignored by his dad just for being the wrong woman, he's dealing with himself being completely ignored and passed over in love and affection just because he's the son of the wrong woman, because his mother isn't the lost ghost that Aegon loved and won't ever be able to stop loving. How much of Maegor's prowess in fighting, not to mention the unchecked aggression he showed during training, was borne of trying to impress his martially skilled father and being upset when it didn't work? How much of his continued presence in tourneys and melées was to show Aegon that he was a much better son than Aenys, that he deserved the love Aegon was freely giving his brother just as much? Was there ever a time when he resented Visenya for being his mother when that was enough to make Aegon uninterested, and did he ever hate himself for blaming the wrong person, or blaming anyone at all? How much did he internalize his own feelings about it as the relationship never got any warmer? How did he feel when Aegon finally noticed him enough to knight him himself, and make him the youngest knight in the realm at that? Did Maegor ever want to talk to him about it once he was a young man, did he ever want to try and forge a stronger relationship on his own merits as an adult, did he ever even try?

There's also the matter of Balerion, which is as much its own relationship as a subset of anything that can be played with as it pertains to Aegon and Maegor. For one, we know that Maegor point blank refused to claim any dragon because he felt that Balerion was the only one worthy of him. And you can take that at face value, but you can also go deeper into it, into the ideas that Maegor might not be consciously aware of. Maybe he wants to try and connect with his father on some level through the dragon bond. Maybe he looks at how Aegon gives Aenys so much, his companionship and his throne and his sword and his love, Hell he even gives Aenys a Valyrian bride (Alyssa Velaryon) but demands that Maegor settle for a simple Westerosi, as if he's lesser than and not the blood of old Valyria. And still he waits to see if maybe Aegon will give him something. Maybe once Aegon is too old for dragonriding, he'll give Maegor Balerion, or at least give Maegor the opportunity to try, to prove himself as Aegon's son, to have that connection. And when Aegon doesn't, when it's still Aenys getting everything Maegor might not even realize he wants, that's just another disappointment for him.

But Maegor does get Balerion anyway, once Aegon dies. He finally gets a connection to Aegon that's his alone, and it's after Aegon is already dead and likely after Maegor was already hardening into the man he would ultimately be remembered as. Not to mention, even on its own, Balerion and Maegor's bond is a good way to show a human element to the man. I've always maintained that, when it comes to Targaryens, the most unconditionally loving and the most openly affection and emotional we should see them should really be with the dragons. With their magic and their Valyrian blood and old world roots and just everything about them, even if you don't subscribe to Targaryen exceptionalism, they are pretty far removed from the place they actually live; culturally and ethnically and socially, they are not Westerosi and certainly in Maegor's time, don't see themselves or are seen by others as Westerosi. The dragons, products of Valyria's heyday, are the closest living beings that Targaryens can relate to, and this is doubly important when it comes to Balerion, who was born during the reign of the Valyrian Freehold, who was alive before the Doom. Balerion is a living cultural heritage, and for someone as isolated as Maegor is (and, as we see in his actions re: his marriages and the Faith, as divorced from Westerosi customs and standards as he is), having that connection is probably the deepest one he'd have, bar maybe his mother, and even then, despite that closeness and love, their mutually cold personalities probably made it hard to be open in any deep affection once Maegor started growing up. Dragons and their riders are practically one being, they feel each other's pains and pleasures and angers and grudges and triumphs, and Maegor having something like that, along with the connection to a father he never really was connected to, adds a human element to the man that he was, despite the fact that he used Balerion to do terrible things.

You can also do a lot with Maegor's actions before his own kingship, specifically the reign of his half-brother Aenys. In spite of their differences and distances, in spite of the shadow of Aegon and the relationships he had with his sisters that affected his relationship with his own sons in turn, Aenys does embrace Maegor with open arms. He gives him Blackfyre, another possession of Aegon's that Maegor must have coveted, and he promises that they'll rule together. They're both adults now, and Aenys seems emotionally sensitive enough to have realized that Maegor probably has some deep rooted issues borne out of things that were set in motion before he was even conceived. And while Visenya might have scoffed at the gestures Aenys made for Maegor, Maegor appears to have taken them really seriously. He personally crushes a rebellion against Aenys in the Vale, and makes huge showings of his loyalty by fighting really hard for his brother against his foes. When Aenys makes him his Hand, Maegor takes that responsibility really seriously and is willing to obey Aenys as his Lord and King, as well as protect him. This seems to have been loyalty that was reciprocated, since it's noted that, when Aenys exiles Maegor for his bigamy, he does it because he felt he had no other option than to be mad at Maegor for what he did, due to the huge public outcry, and even then he still offers Maegor a way out. He only exiles him because Maegor refuses to set Alys aside (another way to humanize Maegor, he takes Alys as a wife despite it being a big taboo for most Westerosi and in spite of her being from a pretty minor noble House, and he refuses to leave her even at the cost of losing his home, he keeps her by his side and he refuses to give her up when there were likely a shitton of better options to deal with his childlessness, to say nothing of women from greater Houses with more potential for him politically, but he CHOSE Alys), since Aenys felt that this was the only choice left to him. And Maegor abides by the exile. Yeah, he takes Blackfyre even though Aenys asked him to leave it, but he still goes into exile, and he stays in exile. Aenys rides Quicksilver and Maegor rides Balerion, the two dragons literally go toe to toe with each other and it's so massively onesided because Quicksilver doesn't stand a chance. If Maegor wanted to, he could have very easily repudiated his exile and decimated Aenys if he tried to enforce it. But Aenys told him to go, so he did, and he stayed gone until Visenya came to fetch him back with the news that Aenys was dead. He respected Aenys's word as king, his sovereign authority as liege lord and as the elder brother, and even if he might not have entirely thought the man worthy of what he had, that does speak to a sort of deference in spite of the complexities of their upbringing, and a willingness to obey Aenys despite everything about their personalities.

So, by the time Maegor comes back from Pentos to usurp the throne, there's a lot that can be used to humanize him and make him a compelling protagonist. A close but somewhat stilted relationship with the only parent to have ever tried with him, an unfulfilled, desperate need for approval and affection from a parent who couldn't give that to him due to circumstances entirely outside his control, a brother he didn't know well in his youth and might not have thought worthy of what he had and certainly been jealous of but that he still respected as king and fought hard to defend and that he deferred to even when he didn't have to, at least one marriage that, in spite of what little it offered him and the clusterfuck it caused, he valued enough that he refused to set aside, and an intense bond with a fearsome dragon that you can make him value more than almost anything or anyone. All of that set up can then be used for an extraordinary fall from grace, to watch the potential and nuance slowly grow darker and darker and darker as Maegor does increasingly horrible things, treats the people in his life increasingly badly, descends further and further into the tyranny and madness that will utlimately kill him. There's bright spots that can be used as well, like the fact that he does have Jaehaerys as his heir and doesn't seem to have had him or Viserys treated that badly, even though they were prisoners, and that he didn't actually set out to kill Aegon the Uncrowned at all until Aegon decided to take back his throne and amass an army. Then, as we've watched Maegor slide further and further down, we can watch with a sinking dread as he annihilates Aegon beneath God's Eye, as he turns on Alys and extinguishes her family, as he has Viserys literally tortured to death to punish Alyssa and Jaehaerys and Alysanne for their escape from Dragonstone. So that, by the time we get to shit like the completion of the Red Keep and the Black Brides, we see that Maegor is incredibly far gone, and we can only watch as all the complexities within him are swept aside by the monster he's become, so foul and loathsome that the eldritch abomination that is the Iron Throne finally kills him to stop the madness.

It's not about woobifying Maegor or excusing him. It's about providing a reason for the audience to look back on who he was as he becomes what he was always going to be, to give explanations for why he does the things that he does (how much of his initial militarism and violence and heavy-handedness, before he went doolally, was borne out of not just his martial prowess as a kid but also watching Aenys's version of ruling not work, for instance), and to get people to understand and feel his initial motivations so that the later stuff also makes sense, and so that you're watching something akin to a doomed fall when he becomes Maegor the Cruel. These are, at least to me, some of the most important and influential ways you can humanize Maegor as a character if you're planning to center him in a proper narrative story, without filing down his edges and keeping him as the kind of person he is. Extrapolate on why he is the way he is, and then show him how he is throughout his lifetime and what he does, along with the how and why of what he does.

#personal #answered #anonymous #maegor targaryen #maegor the cruel #yeah i've got a lot of thoughts about the conquerors and the dragon's peace and the sons of the dragon #anyway remember what i said about rhaenys being the glue that held the family together? #rhaenys's death being the reason that everything starts to fall apart? #rhaenys being the figure that looms large over the early reigns of the targaryens? #rhaenys being the ghost that haunts this entire family and won't ever leave them until all the people that both knew her #and were affected by her are dead? yeah i stand by all of that #it's why i'd want a sons of the dragon show to be preceded by a conquest show #so that the intense shift in dynamics and characters once she's gone makes sense #so that the very essence of the story changes when she dies #but anyway i've got Feelings #@ hbo come on guys!!!!!! #i'm right here i'm willing to work for very little money on this!!!! #(and then once i get y'all raking in cash through my correct opinions about the conquest and the sons of the dragon) #(you let me make the augustus show) #hope some of this makes sense i've been thinking about these characters a lot #so sometimes it's hard to organize it all into a cohesive essay

[backjustforberena]

Do you have any headcanons about how Corlys and Rhaenys received the news of Laena's death and their first reaction?

I do! And I've sort of spoken a little bit about it before, in terms of the mechanics. For me, it would be a letter sent from Pentos to High Tide and it goes straight to Corlys. And so Corlys knows before Rhaenys and he is the one that has to tell Rhaenys, privately.

I think this would work for the power structure within the world, and amp up the "normality" or status quo of the time prior to them knowing. I think a word from Pentos would be frequent, especially with a baby being expected any day, and Daemon would observe the formality of informing Corlys rather than addressing it to them both. I just think that's probably in character.

When building headcanons, I sort of like to build them up from what we know and with this, specifically, a lot of it is about working backwards from what we are presented in the episode; both in terms of facts but also in terms of story. So there are a few things that seem pretty important to me:

Laenor's death is the crushing blow to the marriage. And so what I take from this isn't that Laena's death was unimportant but rather that, prior to Laenor's death being the straw that broke the camel's back in terms of the distance between us, things were salvageable. They were horrible and emotional and things just kept getting worse, but Rhaenys and Corlys would have come together and moved on together, rather than what we got, which is a separation of six years wherein Corlys believed he'd lost everything. It means that, working backwards, I think that they probably came together and were comforted by one another.

I think the distance starts setting in when it comes to the funeral. When Daemon come with the girls, when they have a royal visit threatening things the refuge that Driftmark is. Essentially, a lot of the tension between these two comes from that connection to the throne, to these outside factors and to seeing the consequences of their actions. We see Rhaenys turn towards her granddaughters and Corlys continues to choose blind ignorance to the price for pride. The clarity Rhaenys has after Laena's death and the stubbornness of Corlys is slow-growing throughout the episode, so I figure that it's slow-growing from when they find out, meaning that when Rhaenys and Corlys are simply together and encircled within the domestic and without the political, they are much closer.

We have two reactions to really gather information: the reaction to the reasoning behind Laena's death, at the top of the scene they have together in front of the fire, and then their gut reactions at the shock discovery of their "son's" body burning. Whilst the two reactions are very different (Rhaenys in one is bitter and blaming whilst Corlys says nothing could be done, vs Rhaenys falling apart and Corlys being shocked and angry and violent) - the heart of them could be said to be similar. Rhaenys acts with emotion, Corlys with practicality. Rhaenys feels truths in her heart, whether that's their culpability in Laena's life/death, or the pain from seeing Laenor, whilst Corlys immediately jumps towards action and an attempt to understand.

The dynamic between them is distinctly masculine and feminine. And this is something that Steve and Eve have spoken about a lot and I absolutely adore it. So if we were to look and consider particular stereotypes, I think we can then use those to inform what Rhaenys and Corlys's private reactions to Laena's death would be. Rhaenys would weep and Corlys would hold her. They would lean against one another. Corlys would try and be strong and take care of the practicalities, and Rhaenys, perhaps, would take care of the more emotional and familial parts of things. Rhaenys would let it all out and then be strong enough to face the mourners. Corlys would hold it all tight so that it explodes a little, as we see with his treatment of Laenor. I think that's easily seen in the wake as Corlys is essentially playing host to the King whilst Rhaenys's sole focus is on Baela and Rhaena.

Daemon. Just, all of it, to do with Daemon. But especially Rhaenys's view of Daemon. I don't think Daemon gave her what she expected/wanted/needed from a mourning son-in-law. And whether that's to do with the initial arrival, whether it's to do with his involvement or lack of in the funeral, whether it's to do with the girls or to do with Daemon's personal interaction with Rhaenys, I couldn't say. I just have an idea that Rhaenys not only knows about Laena's life from her letters but that Daemon's behaviour only confirms that to her. It's why I think Daemon only sent a message to Corlys and Rhaenys had no direct communication with him (despite her position, not only as Laena's mother and Lady of Driftmark, but as Daemon's cousin). It's just a subtle way of feeding that in to get to a place where she's saying he only does what is best for him.

Anyway, sorry for the rambling and I'm not sure how much of that makes sense, but it's what I keep in mind when crafting headcanons surrounding this event.

#house of the dragon

[silver-wedding]

Dany and the Starks

There has been plenty of speculation on how Dany will get along with the Starks, but I figured I should weigh in as well. Too many people have gone out of their way to inject their own feelings into every member of the family, without really understanding the characters. (or not wanting to understand them)

The fact that Jon loves Dany won’t be lost on his family and like any loved one, they would want him to happy.

I’ll get into how each of the Starks would have felt, with the exception of Catelyn Stark. The unfortunate truth is that Cat never wanted Jon to be part of the family.

Anyone who believes that the Starks would turn their backs on Jon for falling in love with Dany does not understand the characters. I’ll start with the living Starks: Sansa, Arya and Bran.

Sansa

As most should rightly suspect, Sansa will have the biggest problem with Dany simply because she has grown to distrust every person in power. After the many horrors the Starks have had to endure, she intends to do whatever it takes to protect her family from any potential threat.

With that being said, Sansa remains unaware of the similar pains Dany went through. While Sansa grew up in Winterfell with a loving family, Dany spent much of her life on the run and being abused by a brother who only grew more cruel with time.

Both were treated more as tools for power rather than the young girls they once were, and could never feel safe. They had to constantly avoid people who would have ordered their executions.

Once Sansa gives her a chance she’ll see how similar their paths have been, and then begin to understand Jon’s love for Dany.

Arya

Other than Robb, Arya is the Stark that Jon has always been the closest to, due the shared situation of being treated differently than everyone else. 

Now, it should be obvious that Arya will approve of Dany. Not just because she doesn’t give a damn about politics and wants Jon to be happy, but she also showed an admiration towards Visenya and Rhaenys Targaryen. Imagine her reaction to an actual dragon rider, and the fact that her brother is dating one.

Seeing Jon and Dany arrive in Winterfell together should be enough to earn her approval. Arya will most likely be the first Northerner to support their relationship.

Bran

Bran’s story was always going to be a sad one, as he gave up much of his humanity to become the Three Eyed Raven. Given everything he’s gone through to become a weapon against the White Walkers, he will likely be far more concerned with the Great War than any feelings (that he doesn’t possess anymore) about Jon and Dany’s relationship.

Before Bran “died in that cave”, I believe he would have reacted with happiness. His relationship with Jon was that of an older and younger brother, and the last thing Jon did before leaving Winterfell was kiss the unconscious Bran’s forehead. (Despite Cat being firmly against Jon being present.) Bran also treated Theon as an older brother, despite the Ironborn invading Winterfell at the time.

Bran only ever showed love for his family, and never any sign of contempt. Before he lost his identity, he would have been glad that Jon found someone who loves him.

Now I’ll get into the Starks that are no longer present: Rickon, Ned, and Robb

Rickon

Rickon’s life is pure tragedy and the worst part is that when he finally made it home, Winterfell was occupied by the Boltons. He was never able to form a proper relationship with Jon, simply because Rickon was too young.

The last time Rickon saw Jon was during the Battle of the Bastards, and he couldn’t escape death that time.

The one shared trait I can see between them is a strong sense of loyalty towards their family, and fierce anger at the people that harmed the Starks. Jon nearly died himself trying to save Rickon, and gave up a valuable strategic position in the attempt.

If Rickon had made it out of the battle alive, I see no reason why he would ever be against Jon being with Dany.

Ned

Here’s the simple truth about Ned Stark: without him, the Targaryens would have been doomed. Despite being well known for his honor Ned kept Jon’s heritage a secret from his best friend Robert, and was the only one to speak against the assassination attempt on Dany’s life.

After the Sack of King’s Landing, Ned was the only one who spoke against the Mountain’s murder of Elia Martell, and the Targaryen children.

He treated every child in Winterfell as his own, and despite being Jon’s uncle in truth, was the father that Jon needed him to be.

Ned often rejected power for himself, and would have no problem with Jon giving up a Northern crown. He would just want him to find the happiness and life that Lyanna could not have.

Robb

Robb and Jon weren’t all that different. They grew up together, going through the same training, and built a bond that two children of a similar age often develop. Robb had a problem with his mother treating Jon with disdain, asking about her attitude with him as Jon left for the Wall.

Despite Jon being a bastard, they loved one another as brothers.

Robb was a passionate young man who always followed his heart, and was pushed into a war that he wasn’t truly prepared for. Despite all of the risks with pursuing a relationship with Talisa, he married her simply because he loved her.

Why would he ever condemn Jon for loving Dany?

Bonus - Benjen

Although not being around too often, Benjen had a clear influence on Jon. He didn’t glamorize the Night’s Watch, and warned him that he would never be able to marry or have children.

Many seasons later, he gave up his life saving Jon’s.

Does anyone really believe that he would dislike Jon for finding someone to build a family with?

All in all, do not take anyone who would inject their own feelings onto the Starks seriously. These people have no leg to stand on, and would use false versions of these characters simply to validate their opinions.

The remaining Starks had been driven apart for many years.

They would be the last people that would try to drive Jon away from the woman he loves.

#jonerys #game of thrones #jon snow #daenerys targaryen #ned stark #robb stark #rickon stark #sansa stark #arya stark #talisa stark #benjen stark #bran stark

[nooneeverlookedforagirl]

So you're saying there's literally no way at all that Prince Rhaegar of Dragonstone, future king of the Seven Kingdoms, could annul his marriage?

Well, we do have evidence of polygamy in Westeros. It was a ceremony does by Queen Visenya Targaryen because no septon would assist in a polygamaus marriage. Despite the fact that the person being married, Maegor I Targaryen, rode Balerion the Black Dread and could have burnt any septon refusing to death. He married his new wife because the old was had given him no children. Notice that despite the lack of children there was no discussion of an annulment. That marriage led to the Faith rebelling against the Targaryens in 41 AC.

We have all of one “dissolved marriage” that I can find among the Targaryens. It was that of Baelor the Blessed, who was so pious that he refused to consummate the marriage with his sister-wife Daena. In order to shame him, she chose to wear white every day after their wedding until he consummated it. He never did. After the marriage was dissolved on grounds of it being contracted before he was king and the lack of consummation Baelor locked his sisters in the Maidenvault.

So the Faith rose in war when Maegor wanted a wife who could give him heirs and the only king ever released from his marriage was literally the Faith’s favorite king ever.

 Rhaegar was not king, so he could not claim that the marriage shouldn’t count because he was forced into it. He could also not claim that the marriage was unconsummated, as he had two children with Elia. One was his heir to the Iron Throne and the Prince Who Was Promised. An annulment would remove Aegon, the PWWP, out of the line of succession in exchange for what Rhaegar thought would be a female child with Lyanna, a Visenya to marry Aegon.

So no, there was no reason to give him a divorce, much less an annulment, unless the Faith had turned against their god and decided they wanted the realm to go to war.

The only reasonable way I see this happening is if Aerys gets involved, decides he doesn’t want a Dornish heir, disregards Viserys for reasons, and threatens the High Septon into annulling Rhaegar’s marriage. The High Septon then does absolutely nothing with this information, despite being in a position to reveal how terrible Aerys is to everyone and possibly get revenge by having him unseated. 

Let me be perfectly clear here. Even if annulments were being handed out like candy the impossibility annulment itself is not the only problem. If it was just “Rhaegar got an annulment from his unloving unconsummated marriage” that would be one thing.

What actually happened is much worse.

Rhaegar intentionally started a war.

Rhaegar paved the way for a future civil war.

Rhaegar helped the Others.

Allow me to explain.

Rhaegar intentionally started a war

We know several things about show!Rhaegar’s intentions with Lyanna. Let us assume, as you would, the purest of intentions on his part.

Rhaegar needed a Third Head of the Dragon and Elia could not provide that child.

Rhaegar had met Lyanna at Harrenhal and respected her fighting abilities/fall in love.

Rhaegar wanted to marry Lyanna.

Rhaegar knew Lyanna was betrothed to Robert and that she didn’t want to be.

Rhaegar knew Lyanna loved her family.

Rhaegar’s marriage was loveless.

Rhaegar did his very best to prevent bad things from happening.

So Rhaegar, with all of the above in mind, decided that secretly convincing Lyanna to ride away with him to Dorne was the Best Plan Ever. We all know how that ended.

What should Rhaegar have done? 

Write a letter to Rickard offering to set aside Elia and marry Lyanna, a great honor. 

Call a Great Counsel, then do the above.

Attempt to get Robert to willingly break his betrothal by offering him gold/lands/women/literally anything. 

Call a Great Counsel, then do the above.

Steal Lyanna away, get married, and then go to Kings Landing and have Lyanna write a letter to her father/brothers saying she’s completely happy with Rhaegar and doesn’t want them to go to war.

Call a Great Counsel, then do the above.

Call a Great Counsel. 

Do exactly what he did, but take Lyanna to her father and brothers under a peace banner and let her tell them she wasn’t kidnapped.

Instead of doing literally any of the above, he decides to make off with the North’s daughter and the Storm Lord’s bride and tell no one anything. At best he’s an idiot unfit to sit the throne. At worst he was trying to start a war.

If he was going to set aside Elia anyway, he had a lot of options. Rhaegar isn’t an idiot. He knows that the Brandon/Cat marriage means an alliance between the North and Riverlands. He knows the Robert/Ned Arryn fostering means an alliance between the Stormlands/North and the Vale. He knows that the Lyanna/Robert marriage means an alliance between the Stormlands and the North. He has all of this information, he can weigh “Dorne rebelling” verses “the North/Riverlands/Stormlands/Vale rebelling.”

Yes Robert would have been furious at him taking Lyanna no matter what. But Lyanna’s kidnapping didn’t start the rebellion. Jon Arryn and Hoster Tully weren’t going to risk their own necks because Robert lost a woman. If Lyanna was happy and not missing and likely being raped, Rickard could be convinced to stay in the North. We aren’t arguing happiness here. We’re looking at a cost/benefit analysis of starting a war because the king married a woman and will make her children his heirs. Rickard wins here, because his grandchildren will be kings. Would he have been happy? No. Would he have risked his life, his son’s lives, and his daughter’s life because of this slight? Probably not.

Once Rhaegar was married to Lyanna and King of Westeros he could then have softened the blow to Dorne. Legitimize Elia’s children and promise that Aegon will still be king, and that he will marry Rhaenys and “Visenya.” He expected a girl, remember. 

This isn’t an argument revolving around some guy with little to no political information running off with his One True Love. Rhaegar was supposed to be a better king than his father was. Good kings do not ignore their people, their realm, their heirs, and their insane fathers just to do whatever they want. Perhaps if Rhaegar was only a knight, a argument could be made. He was a prince meant to be a king, he knew what he was doing. That Rhaegar had options and chose none of them suggests that he would make as poor a king as his father did.

Leaving Aerys to handle the fallout from what he did got Lyanna’s brother and father killed. There’s also the matter that wolf-blooded Lyanna stayed in that tower after hearing this news. Would Arya have been ok with Ned and Robb dying because she ran off with her lover? Or would she have fought tooth and nail to get out of there and help her family? If Rhaegar lied to Lyanna to keep her in that tower, that tells us all we need to know about their relationship. Lying to keep someone with you is abuse.

Frankly, based on the information we have, it looks like Rhaegar weighed his options and chose the one most likely to cause war. “Love” is not an excuse for getting thousands of people killed when you had a dozen other options.

Rhaegar paved the way for a future civil war.

The Blackfyre rebellion began when Aegon the Unworthy littered bastards all over Westeros and legitimized them on his deathbed. Because the eldest of these bastards was so beloved by Aegon - even being given the sword Aegon the Conqueror had wielded - his claim stuck and caused war after war after war.

Previously it could be assumed that Rhaegar had avoided this because he planned to have only one child, a Visenya, with Lyanna. He could easily legitimize this girl child and she would be married to his son, causing no threat to succession. 

Assuming that Rhaegar wanted a boy with Lyanna, a Prince Who Was Promised, that means that the newly-bastard born Aegon would have a legitimate claim to the throne. After Rhaegar died he could easily have garnered the support of Dorne. If a few other kingdoms saw things how he did this could quickly snowball into a worse war than the Blackfyre wars had been. After all, Aegon VI had been born legitimate and was only a bastard because of the actions of his father. Actions that went against the Faith.

So even if everything turned out just perfect for Rhaegar and Elia agreed to shut up and return to Dorne then shortly after his death the realm would probably be caught up in yet another war. Because Doran wouldn’t have been pleased, and he would know that Aegon was the best way to see a Dornish king on the throne.

Rhaegar helped the Others

Imagine if the Others arrived the Night’s Watch was full of knights who had been warned of the danger on the other side of the Wall. Imagine if, instead of the boy Jon Snow, it was the King of Westeros who lead the fight against them. Imagine if the first time a deserter showed up in Winterfell a raven flew straight to Kings Landing and Rhaegar showed up with an army.

There would be no Queen Cersei or Queen Dany to tear the armies into pieces. No explosion of the sept. No reason that when Rhaegar called his banners that the full force of the Seven Kingdoms would not show up armed to the teeth with dragonglass and Valyrian steel. There aren’t enough wildlings Beyond the Wall to defeat the might of the Seven Kingdoms even if every single one was added to the army of the dead. 

Instead of having years to prepare for war, Westeros was torn apart by wars. Robert’s Rebellion, caused by Rhaegar leaving Aerys to deal with the fallout from Lyanna vanishing, would never have happened. The War of the Five Kings never would have happened, because Cersei’s children couldn’t inherit the Iron Throne. Balon Greyjoy’s rebellions - both of them - never would have happened. 

The only reason the Others are a threat is because no one knows how to fight them. What armies are left are tiny compared to their pre-war strength and thus the Others will be able to easily overrun them. Their only saving grace is the dragons. Dragons would not be necessary if the realm had literally decades to prepare for war.

My outrage is centered on the treatment of Elia Martell and her children, who were cast aside like they didn’t matter, yes. But it doesn’t stop there. My dislike for Rhaegar goes farther back than the last episode of Game of Thrones. He could very well have been the Prince Who Was Promised himself, but instead he made the worst possible decisions and sent the realm reeling into war. 

When your best quality as king is that you don’t burn men alive, you’re a bad king.

/rant

#game of thrones #elia martell #Lyanna Stark #Rhaegar Targaryen