#orestes and pyrrhus

[dilfaeneas]

Something awakening in the son of Achillies and the son of Agamemnon

#tagamemnon #greek mythology #classics #greek heroes #ancient greek mythology #post the fall of troy #the iliad #the oresteia #this is silly #pyrrhus of skyros #pyrrhus #pyrrhus of epirus #pyrrhus x orestes #orestes #Achillies #agamemnon #orestes and pyrrhus #gay #epirus gang

[notacluedo]

Teenage war criminal #2 Pyrrhus

#Too much Achilles not enough of his deranged son #He is in fact a snake nourished with poisonous herbs whos hidden all winter but has now emerged #He’s in the Aeneid for like 2.5 seconds and caused maximum damage at like the ripe age of 17 #I love that third(?) gen of heroes yknow orestes electra pyhrrus they’re just fucking shit up #This is not tsoa pyrrhus he may be a war criminal but he’s not homophobic most confusing characterisation ever #Greek myth #pyrrhus #the aeneid #the iliad #? #my art #mythology art #(This is based on a photo of Gerard way as Joan of arc btw if u even care

[sarafangirlart]

Pyrrhus … holds me

prisoner here, contrary to the laws of both gods and men ...

Deafer to [my pleas] than the sea, he dragged me into his palace,

as I tore my hair in grief and shouted your name …

When the Greeks won the war and set wealthy Troy on fire,

they didn’t maltreat Andromache as badly as this ...

Follow my father’s example of claiming back an abducted wife …

[But] don’t muster a thousand ships with swelling sails

Or an army of Greek warriors — come yourself!’

(Ovid’s Heroides translated by Paul Murgatroyd, Bridget Reeves and Sarah Parker, pp. 89–90).

Hermione to Orestes

Damn

#I should read Heroides at some point #greek mythology #ancient greek mythology #greek pantheon #hermione #andromache of troy #Andromache #Orestes #pyrrhus #neoptolemus

[neoptolemid]

Pyrrhus and Orestes, the two suitors of Hermione, having a quick nap in between all that suitor business

#my art #log's art #logs art #neoptolemus #pyrrhus #orestes #the iliad #greek mythology #tagamemnon

[greatest-greek-games]

After several false starts and doubles, I've finally created the final bracket! If you see any doubles or mistakes on this, please tell me -- I think I've included all the enemies and submitted characters, but I'm still just the one person.

Voting will begin as soon as I can source good images and summaries for all the characters -- expect it to be within the week, hopefully sooner.

Full bracket under the cut in plaintext in case you can't read my handwriting.

Starting from the top left.

Electra versus Chiron.

Menelaus versus Phineus.

Paris versus Sinope.

Helen versus Alciabades.

Clytemnestra versus Cassandra

Hegelochus versus the Vultures That Eat Prometheus's Liver.

Agamemnon versus Homer.

Iphigenia versus Hippolytus.

Achilles versus Socrates.

Danaë versus Eurydice.

Ariadne versus Minos.

Asterion (The Minotaur) versus Theseus.

Aeneas versus Orpheus.

Heracles versus Hecuba.

Jason versus Medea.

Atalanta versus Aeolus.

Starting from the top right.

Antigone versus Creon.

Orestes versus Andromache.

Psyche versus Cadmus.

Diogenes versus Oedipus.

Icarus versus Daedalus.

Narcissus versus Hyacinth.

Perseus versus Medusa.

Bellerophon versus Hippolyta.

Dolon versus Odysseus.

Asclepius versus Philoctetes.

Penthesilea versus Autolycus.

Penelope versus Arachne.

Neoptolemus (Pyrrhus) versus Ascanius (Iulus).

Hector versus Diomedes.

Sisyphus versus Telemachus.

Eurylochus versus Patroclus.

#bracket #not polls #tagamemnon

[canvas-madness-txc]

Thoughts on The Song of Achilles

Spoilers

"Achilles did not slur my name as people often did, as if in a hurry to be rid of it. Instead, he rang each syllable Pat-ro-clus." This is one of the many, many lines that broke me. It says a lot about Patroclus and Achilles in only two sentences

"What has Hector ever done to me?" Well, call me, Julius Caesar, because this line has stabbed me repeatedly. I read The Iliad first, so I had expectations, but man, does it still hurt

"Some people might have mistaken this for simplicity. But is it not a sort of genuis to always cut to the heart?" I like this line a lot . It shows how close the two of them became. Also, there is some genuis in saying what you mean, regardless of simplicity.

The fact that Patroclus realizes that his father's disappointment after he is to be exiled isn't for the crime but for not being cunning enough to cover it was cruel.

Odysseus, being the smug guy he is, just in general

Achilles has the most boyish, standard teen response after Thetis tells him she wants him to be a God. It really shows the divide of human and God in him. Also the contrast is kinda funny

"There is no law that gods must be fair, Achilles." That is both the truth and probably a warning

"Name one hero who was happy. You can't."

"I can't."

"I know. They never let you be famous and happy. ... I'll tell you a secret."

"Tell me."

"I'm going to be the first. ... Because you're the reason. Swear it." Laughter morphs into uncontrollable sobbing. Oh the dramatic irony.

Patroclus saying he could identify Achilles by touch alone is just WOW

"Useless information is my curse, I'm afraid." Me too, Odysseus, me too

Odysseus talking about Penelope 🥺

Polutropos- man of many turnings is now something I'm gonna utilize more often

I have now officially scarred both myself and my friend for life with the tales of "Mighty Tydeus, King of Argos, Eater of Brains," and Tantalus' eternal torment

The banter between Odysseus and Diomedes

THE SACRIFICE OF IPHIGENIA 😭

"The goddess is appeased" CLEARLY NOT MORON

The fact that Agamemnon could anger both Apollo and Artemis is pretty impressive underneath its massive layer of stupidity (a thought that returned to me from before when I read The Iliad)

Odysseus calling Achilles "a weapon, a killer" because "you can use a spear as a walking stick, but that will not change its nature" really drives home my conflicted feeling that are true for most of the Greek heroes, but specifically Achilles this time

"I hope Hector kills you."

"Do you think I do not hope the same?" THE GRIEF MY HEART

Backtracking here, but I like how Briseis and Patroclus had a close bond with each other

"I am glad that he is dead." THAT IS CRUEL WOW. AND THE FACT THAT ITS THE LAST THING SHE SAYS BEFORE HE DIES IS WOW

Pyrrhus: *exists* Me: go back to pre-algebra you're 12

I find it ironic that Pyrrhus was killed by Agamemnon's son Orestes, considering their fathers loathed each other. The dishonoring continues among generations, but reversed this time and ending with murder

THETIS LETTING PATROCLUS AND ACHILLES BE BURIED TOGETHER, HAVING BOTH THEIR NAMES ON THE TOMB AND THE BOTH OF THEM GETTING PEACE IN THE UNDERWORLD 😭

#books & libraries #books #the song of achilles #book spoilers

[belle-keys]

Iliad Retellings, for better or worse

Today I bring you some retelling's of Homer's Iliad. Not all of these are particularly great, but I believe in a certain context, every one of these books can be enjoyable based on what you’re into. When I say “Iliad retelling”, I mainly refer to the general plot of Homer’s epic, but also as it pertains to ancient plays about the same epic by Euripides, Aeschylus, and Sophocles.

The Silence of the Girls by Pat Barker

This is a feminist retelling of Homer’s Iliad from the point of view of Briseis and Achilles which focuses on the experiences of the enslaved women of the war. Look out for rape and slavery as major topics, and know that neither Achilles or Patroclus are the good guys in this book. This is my utmost favorite retelling of Homer's epic- it's raw, engaging, and adds something new to the story. Note that it draws more on Euripides' works than Homer's.

The Women of Troy by Pat Barker

The sequel to The Silence of the Girls, which focuses on what happens to the various women after the Trojan War and is told from the point of view of Briseis and Pyrrhus. It's basically a retelling of The Trojan Women by Euripides, and it analyzes the legitimacy of Pyrrhus' slaying of King Priam. It's like a very lengthy epilogue to the first book, but it's super introspective and was a relatively quick read.

Elektra by Jennifer Saint

This is based on Orestes, Iphigenia, and Electra by Euripides and Agamemnon by Aeschylus. It's about what went down during the war between Elektra, Clytemnestra, and Cassandra (favorite woman) and how Agamemnon's actions and overall shittiness ties them all together. Multiple POV book that's told in a way where it ends semi-anticlimactically, sure, but it's a book I've been waiting for because of how much I love these specific characters. Got daddy issues? This one's for you.

Wicked Beauty by Katee Robert

Sigh. So, this is an extremely loose romance and erotica retelling, and it’s a ménage-à-trois between Achilles, Patroclus and, get this, Helen. The plot is juvenile, the writing is overly simplistic, and the worldbuilding is ridiculous. But! There are two redeeming qualities about this. The first is that it’s quick and indulgent if you just wanna read something that’s not serious. The second is that Patroclus has an actual personality and isn’t just there to be Achilles’ shadow, which I liked.

A Thousand Ships by Natalie Haynes

A feminist retelling of the Trojan War and its aftermath from the points-of-view of several of the women/female figures involved in the war: Briseis, Helen, Calliope, Cassandra, Hecuba, Andromache, Iphigenia, Eris, etc. The storytelling is non-linear, so each chapter feels like its own complete mini-story that details a certain aspect of the war. Of course, we get a lot of meta-commentary on Homer’s Iliad since the muse herself and some goddesses get POV chapters.

The Song of Achilles by Madeline Miller

You know this book, I know this book, we know this book. This is the story of Achilles’ life and death told from the POV of Patroclus. It’s also the story of their specific relationship, and it covers a lot of details about Patroclus and Achilles’ youth, Achilles and his relationship with his mother, all the angsty stuff that happened after Patroclus died. I have issues with this book so it’s not exactly a favorite of mine, but overall, there’s good writing here and its also very quotable.

#the iliad #homer #ancient greece #trojan war #tsoa #achilles #the song of achilles #the silence of the girls #troy #tagamemnon #greek mythology #greek retelling #cassandra of troy #book recs #book recommendations #book blog #bookblr #books and literature #classics #greek #madeline miller #helen of troy #dark olympus

[nausikaaa]

WIP Wednesday

thanks for tagging me @forabeatofadrum! i’m a little late posting, but finally found some inspiration to write again, so here’s some of a new perspective from my post-troy novel- Hermione. context below the cut as always!

All in all, I was thoroughly unimpressed with my husband, and his awkward mannerisms were beginning to grate on my already exposed nerves. And then he did something that did more than just irritate me. He stood up, walked away from me, and joined the dance.

I didn’t move a muscle, but I could feel eyes on me. This is ridiculous, I thought. Dancing was for young girls, not men such as him, small and lithe as he may have been. I wondered if he intended to humiliate me, or was he truly oblivious to the ways of the world? I knew he grew up on an island, isolated from the rest of Greece, but this was unorthodox by any standards.

He leapt and whirled with seven women from Skyros, ranging from barely his elder to just over a decade older. They all shared his ginger hair and blue eyes- his aunts, and there in the centre, his mother, Deidamia. I thought she ought to be ashamed of herself, a widow, dancing! Her skirts flew around her, her feet barely touched the ground, and she laughed and laughed as she took her son by the hand and spun him round.

I took a small sip of wine and hoped my veil would hide the red of my face. My grandfather made furious eye contact with me from across the hall, as though this shameless display was somehow my fault, while my mother had the audacity to clap along with the beat. My father didn’t even seem to notice anything amiss, deep in conversation with one of Neoptolemus’s advisors.

I cast my eyes skyward and silently prayed he would get whatever this was out of his system by the end of the song and return to my side, where I would pretend to be amused by his antics to save face and return to the silence we had been comfortable in before, but the song came to an end, a new one started, and he didn’t stop.

I downed the rest of my wine and waved a slave over for a refill.

i love writing Hermione so much, i think anyone who reads my carry on Agatha fics can tell i just really enjoy writing from the perspective of a total bitch (affectionate)

Hermione is the daughter of Helen of Sparta/Troy and her first husband, Menelaus. after the war she was married to Neoptolemus, also known as Pyrrhus, the son of the hero Achilles and a hero (or war criminal, depending on your persuasion) in his own right.

Hermione had been engaged her entire childhood to her cousin, Orestes, but sources vary on which man she loved. whatever the case, Orestes eventually killed Pyrrhus and took Hermione by force.

the interpretation i chose to go with is that Hermione and Pyrrhus’s relationship begins very strained, Hermione has very rigid ideas about what is proper while Pyrrhus, having grown up surrounded by young women and then losing any remaining childhood wonder he may have had when he was drafted for the war at 15, likes to cut loose and buck tradition.

eventually, they manage to find common ground- the expectations they have grown up under due to their parents. Pyrrhus is the son of the greatest warrior the world had ever known, but he hates violence and can’t stand the sight of blood, for all he was forced to endure it at Troy. Hermione is the daughter of the most beautiful woman in history, but she resembles her father and has a very strained relationship with her. after this, they grow close and have a loving relationship, but Hermione struggles to conceive.

after only 4 years together, Hermione suffers a miscarriage, prompting Pyrrhus goes to Delphi to pray to Apollo, who has cursed him. Hermione also carries a family curse, but there’s nothing she can do to end it, it’s built upon generations of infanticide and cannibalism (the House Of Atreus is wack), and there he is killed by Orestes, who then goes as kidnaps Hermione.

Hermione’s POV ends there, but we see from Astyanax, the main character, that she eventually escaped Orestes and went back to Skyros, Pyrrhus’s home country, the place she was happiest, where she was accepted as the Queen by his aunts and the people. so a bittersweet ending.

and here’s what Hermione and Pyrrhus look like, in this scene and 4 years later:

fun fact: Hermione’s hair is short in the first picrew because Spartan girls would cut it short for their weddings. Spartan men and women lived very segregated lives as men were raised in military barracks since childhood, and both young men and women often had gay relationships with others their age because there just wasn’t the option to be with someone of the opposite sex. so the short hair was both a symbolisation of rebirth for women but also to ease men into heterosexuality 😂

for a late wip wednesday or next six sentence sunday, i tag @otherpeoplesheartachept-2 @ileadacharmedlife @ionlydrinkhotwater @martsonmars @confused-bi-queer @aroace-genderfluid-sheep @bazzybelle @castawaypitch @ivelovedhimthroughworse @gekkoinapeartree @erzbethluna @facewithoutheart @sillyunicorn @moodandmist @tea-brigade @whatevertheweather @stillgeekingout @wetheformidables @onepintobean @basiltonbutliketheherb @theearlgreymage and @whogaveyoupermission

#untitled post troy project #hermione #neoptolemus #pyrrhus

[ofprevioustimes]

4, 5, 25 for hermione

4. Does your muse initiate a lot of physical contact?

A LOT, definitely, and for many reasons. First of all, because it's an inherent thing for her to be physically affectionate, but even more when she married Pyrrhus and subsequently Orestes, because 1) she genuinely wants to establish a connection within her marriage(s) and this is the best way to do it, but also 2) it's a way to gain influence in a court where she's only a consort and the power lies in the hands of her husband more than hers 3) she starts to grow desperate about getting pregnant after a while so she will try to seduce them as much as possible to achieve that end.

5. Is your muse comfortable with public displays of affection?

Yes and she would love it, but it has to be appropriate for a queen/princess, these titles tend to make her more reserved before the public eye.

25. How interested is your muse in sex and sexual activity?

A healthy amount, I'd say. It's an important part of relationships for her and she wouldn't mind having it every day, or very very frequently if her partner is willing, but it won't kill her if they aren't.

#hermione: asks. #[please don't ask me a million questions about my mother!]: hermione of sparta

[13pointer]

finding out that Pyrrhus gets killed by Orestes is so funny to me. like,

#Agamemnon and Achilles watching in Hades #placing bets #I imagine them treating it like greyhound racing or some shit #classics #tagammemnon

[starsailorjannystan]

it's about orestes who loves hermione who loves pyrrhus who loves andromache who loves hector who died

#the inheritance games #out of context a very risky gamble #if you want to know #that is pretty much the plot of the fic #+ indirect kisses i guess

[gracchisuggestions]

The Vernacular Andromaque: Not the Briar Patch!

Pylades: Oh my god, you’re still hung up on Hermione? 

Orestes: C’mon, Pylades, be a bro. 

Pylades: Okay, okay. You drew the straw to come convince Pyrrhus to kill that baby, right? Just piss him off enough that he tries to fight all of Greece and then he’ll get himself killed and you can bang Hermione all you want. 

---

Orestes: Pyrrhus, I have come to tell you on behalf of all of Greece to kill that baby. 

Pyrrhus: Oh, come on, if they wanted to kill that baby they should’ve thought of that back when they were heaping up all the other war crimes. Doing it now that the dust’s settled would just be gauche. 

Orestes: They did think of it back then and you know it. It’s not their fault his mom switched him out. 

Pyrrhus: Yeah, yeah. Why don’t you go say hi to your Cousin Hermione? 

---

Phoenix: You know he wants to run off with his cousin Hermione, right? 

Pyrrhus: God, if only. I’d stamp the passports myself. 

#tagamemnon #fictalk #jean racine #andromaque #orestes #pyrrhus #pylades #the vernacular series

[kashuan]

some gen 2 kids drawings :^)

#and their mother helenus #the iliad #vaguely #pyrrhus #orestes #hermione #telemachus #odysseus #and...more #art

[naehja]

TSOA and Circe’s chronology

In Circe (Madeline Miller) and in the Odyssey, Odysseus says that he has seen Patroclus with Achilles in the lands of deaths when he goes to speak with Tiresias.

- In Circe, he says that it has been 13 years since he has seen his wife and son.

- The war of Troy last 10 years. Patroclus died toward the end (or almost), followed by Achilles and Troy falls shortly after. So Odysseus was on the seas for three years (counting the months at Circe's island). 

- And he sees Patroclus. In the lands of deaths. With Achilles.

- So Thetis has wrote Patroclus name on Achilles grave very quickly, in less of three years.

- That's also mean that Pyrrhus died before his 15 years since he's dead before Thetis writes Patroclus name. 

- Well that's a good thing for Andromache, she has been captive of her baby's murderer for less of three years.

 - Well there are just a little thing:  Madeline Miller has made a little mistake in the chronology of her two books: Odysseus says that it has been three years since the fall on Troy (13 since he left his home). Considering that he has seen Patroclus, then Pyrrhus is dead (Thetis says that he’s dead before writting Patroclus name). 

And Pyrrhus is killed by Oreste for have stole his wife Hermione while Oreste was trying to escape the consequences for have killed his mother (for avenge his father) (Long story). But this event happens SEVEN years after Agamemnon's death, who is killed just after his return of Troy, so Odysseus was certainly already in Calypso's island at this point (poor guy). 

So Pyrrhus is not dead three years after Troy in the original greek myths, but if, in Circe's story, Odysseus has seen Patroclus, then Pyrrhus is dead. 

I guess that the events happened four years sooner in the chronology of Madeline Miller’s books than in the original greek myths.

And seen Pyrrrhus's attitude in The Song of Achilles, I'm not surprised

Anyway I’m happy to realise that Patroclus has only waited for almost three years. It’s already a lot for a lost soul (too much for this poor guy) but it could have been SO worse. 

#circe by madeline miller #tsoa #soa #odysseus #achilles #patroclus #pyrrhus #the song of achilles #patrochilles

[luminouslumity]

So, in my quest to find positive Helen content, I recently found out about The Private Life of Helen of Troy by John Erskine, first published in 1925 and later turned into a silent film in 1927. It's actually pretty good and surprisingly progressive for its time. It takes place just after the Trojan War, as Helen tries to readjust to her life back in Sparta while also dealing with the fact that her daughter wants to marry Orestes.

What I like about this the most is that Helen faces everything with so much grace and dignity while still being a romantic at heart, hence her reluctance to let Hermione marry Orestes since all she wants is to make sure her daughter has a good future (though specifically, she wants her daughter to marry Achilles' son Pyrrhus).

Speaking of Hermione, her relationship with her parents is really sweet, to the point where Hermione actually tried to save her mother's reputation by making up lies. Remember Euripides' Helen? Yeah, the book actually pokes fun at it by having it be one of those lies.

I also like how it interprets her feelings for Paris—that she loved him, or she thought she did, but she's also someone who's more than willing to take responsibility for the war. The book itself is also pretty comedic at times, especially where Menelaus is concerned. Here's just one example:

Sarcastic Menelaus is best Menelaus!

#homer #the iliad #paris of troy #helen of troy #helen of sparta #menelaus #hermione #greek mythology #classic literature #books

[clodiuspulcher]

I forgot Aeneas meets up with Andromache and Helenus in book 3 and I'm so emotional.... I love this Trojan reunion and I love how Aeneas is friends with the whole Priam family....

#HES SUCH A GOOD BOY #the Aeneid #also catch HELENUS and Andromache living happy peaceful lives together... #shoutout to Menelaus for fuckinf up and #making this possible by accidentally betrothing hermione to Orestes And Pyrrhus