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#moon knight city of the dead
juhbebbie · 9 months
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Girl what the hell is up with your eye😭
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Variant cover by David Marquez
Moon Knight: City of the Dead (2023) #4
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tiptapricot · 10 months
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Moon Knight City of the Dead Issue 1… why…?
So. New MK side run has begun, the hyped up full on debut of Layla/new Scarlet Scarab in the comics, with a premise that most writers would twist into an epic and breathtaking journey.
We don’t get that here.
And I have a lot of thoughts on why and how I feel so frustrated with what we got. There’s pieces of something awesome, potential to go to some really fascinating places, and yet it is held back in almost every aspect, creating something messy and clunky that makes me mad to read.
(This is long btw)
First off though, some things I did enjoy!
I really love the art and coloring of this issue. The anatomy and movement and shadows, the stylization of character’s faces and costumes, the sprawling city with its deep reds and blues that feel saturated and weighty. It’s great. Besides a few moments that it comes out of left field with some bad stuff (Layla’s whole face at the end or the MK mask w teeth during the memory slideshow like whaTtt is that), it’s super solid and made for a very enjoyable looking comic.
It was also really fun to see Badr for a little. I think it would’ve been cool to get more, and the pacing of things as I’ll get to later sapped his importance in the story for me some, making him feel more like a prop or a plot device to get it going, but overall it was lovely to see him again. And it was cool to see him being a doctor as well, as we haven’t seen that as recently in MacKay! Always a joy my dear sir please come back soon.
The story in concept. Going to the underworld, detaching a headmate supernaturally to journey to a different plane of reality to save one life, and meeting a dead ally along the way is fascinating stuff, an idea that inspires me to want to explore it myself.
Because (and now it’s time to get into the stuff I didn’t like) the writing doesn’t do this idea justice at all.
This is not the worst MK comic ever rn, not their worst writing. It’s not as violently ableist or antisemitic as things like Bemis or making a joke out of MK like some others, but it’s just stupid, and what it glosses over or gets wrong is weird and uncomfortable and harmful in its own right.
To start this isn’t my Marc. His guilt is not one of punishment for penance, of believing he’s sinned and needs to be washed clean by pain. He is a man stuck in bad coping mechanisms and trying to pretend he’s not. He’s a man who hates himself and uses violence as what I would describe as a form of self harm. But it is not with the goal of erasing his past.
Yes, he runs from the person of Marc Spector, he runs from the idea and the responsibility, but Marc doesn’t try to forget. He holds onto things with a vice grip and never lets himself drop it. He believes in his own mythos and is grappling with his complicated and traumatized history to remember he can love and care and trust people again, that the work of making his life better is not solely on his shoulders. That’s what MacKay’s been dealing with.
MacKay Marc is guilty and self flagellating but in a way he tries not to think about, that he brushes over. He puts on an air of confident collectedness and has more hate for Marc as a concept then specifically his actions, and he’s still able to move forward and find a type of momentum and bravado in the MK suit.
Or in simpler terms: yes Marc has guilt. He does not have this kind of guilt.
The first few pages read so strangely, just this over dramatic spiel that feels more like daredevil than moon knight, like a rehashed dramatic intro to a moody sad 90s comic. And not in a good way. It’s not deep it’s just annoying and tedious and the prose is clunky and again, extremely off in its vibes and message. I think it could’ve been alright, if some of the talk of his guilt had been shifted and the narration hadn’t continued constantly throughout the rest of the issue (which I’ll get to later), but as is in its full context it’s just… weird.
In addition to the weird guilt vibes, there’s further issues with the Khonshu religiosity in this.
Khonshu isn’t something Marc worships, he’s something he uses for his own means. He’ll call on him or talk about being the priest of the mission, but that’s because Khonshu doesn’t have oversight, he’s a tool and form of direction and theming, and at the story’s core Marc is the priest for his mission, not this god’s.
At points in this issue he genuinely sounds dedicated though, and it shifts the flavor of earlier pieces more in line with his usual monologuing to seeming more like strange spiritual devotion. Especially calling Khonshu the greatest of great gods, or saying that him being in the underworld is Khonshu’s mission. It changes his actions from that of Marc to that of a real Khonshu follower and its…. Just weird. It’s all just weird and very ooc.
On top of that, there’s no mention or interrogation or even presence of discussing Judaism alongside all of this. I’m not Jewish myself but have had multiple convos around the topic w those who are n who have made their own posts discussing it and can add on more nuance n info to this should they like (bc more thoughts for discussion are always awesome), but just on a surface level it’s strange. It’s strange to have a plot revolving around going to another belief system’s afterlife and not at all bringing up how it clashes or relates to Jewish beliefs. Yes Marc isn’t really actively practicing anymore but I’d hazard Jake probably is, and Marc has still talked about his connection to his faith and how it’s impacted his time as moon knight and serving Khonshu.
The text treats the Egyptian pantheon belief system as the True and Accepted default here, with Marc not even discussing anything about going to an afterlife he doesn’t belong in (and shouldn’t even have) as a Jewish man, or even thinking about how Badr discussing Ka conflicts with Jewish beliefs on the soul and how Neshamah differ.
And yes, Marc works regularly with the very real Egyptian pantheon and mystical systems but it’s in a different way, and under a different context and understanding by readers of his acceptance of it.
A whole other layer of depth, conflict, and exploration could’ve been added by really digging into the theological implications of this plot, of a Jewish soul in the Egyptian afterlife, and yet it’s not brought up at all, not referenced or mentioned and it makes it all feel weirdly out of place, or like stuff is being glossed over.
That, on top of Jake and Steven (not to mention the entire rest of the main mission cast) being completely absent in mention, consultation, presence, or anything just feeds into this strange sense of Pepose wanting Marc to be the idea he has of him in his head, this guilty, sad, and violent merc serving a moon god with not a ton else. And yes again those are all aspects of Marc, but there is nuance to each of those aspects and treating him as a singlet with no thoughts on the conflicts in faith of his present is… just weird.
I don’t know if he’ll be treated as a singlet the whole run, but the fact that the body’s soul being sent into the afterlife has not already brought in any system conflict at all is an issue. Is it their collective soul? Is it just Marc’s? How does this comic understand alter soul distinction? Has it thought about it at all? I mean the answer is no but the thing is it should’ve.
That’s where so many of my issues with this come from though: choices just being… not good. Not thought out or in line with the characters and world. The writing is off and out of place and gOD THE CONSTANT NARRATION IS GRATING!!
I don’t know why it was chosen for Marc to novel write his thoughts and observations the whole issue but it’s bad. It goes past introducing plots or observations that can’t be shown in text to either:
1. Filling space that doesn’t need to be filled
2. Restating what has just been said or shown in a panel (“we have the power of the four horsemen” “wow they just got the power of the four horsemen”)
3. At worst, telling us stuff that was not indicated at all by anything else (“oh I know something is wrong here even though I have not been given enough reason to pique that suspicion” “oh I reunite with Layla and hold her and take her in but haha you don’t see that ig”)
It’s annoying and makes reading things difficult because he’s blabbering on the whole time in places he DOESNT NEED TO!! And it makes the action and emotional movement feel awkward and forced. I don’t need to know every second of Marc’s thoughts Pepose I can parse out things with my eyes I promise you that. Also can he stop talking about penance for TWO SECONDS!!!
The worst part is narration works when done well! When it highlights things that can’t be shown in art or gives some bits of exploration into feelings or exposition, but we don’t need it in every panel. It actually confused some parts of where to look for me by telling me what was about to happen before it did. Stop being like “I thought it was over but—“ JUST LET US SEE ITS NOT OVER!!
Another moment (similar ish to the start) where the narration would’ve worked for me (if it was not surrounded by just more constant narrating monologue) is when Marc first arrives in the Duat. The prose is pretty, it’s vibrant, it describes things the audience wouldn’t be able to pick up from static pictures and helps to set the scene. The only issue is that it doesn’t stand on its own, it’s not an interjection of observations and thoughts, it’s another entry in the never ending cycle of Marc just talking. And it loses some of its luster because of that.
There’s also just a handful of pieces of either dialogue or thoughts that (in the context of Steven and Jake being absent at the moment despite not being absent at the point in time this should be taking place) make me feel very uncomfortable with Pepose’s vibes on their mental health. Some lines that rubbed me the wrong way in context include “The rage fills within me—and suddenly I have a plan. That said, it would help if my plan wasn’t dangerously insane.” “You know me Badr, mental discipline is my middle name.” And a few similar ones I don’t want to reread again for.
They’re just unnecessary man. We don’t need vaguely or directly ableist vibes in words with MK anymore. It works if it feels like it’s coming from Marc’s internalized ableism IE when he was talking about being called crazy during the discussion with Steven and Jake and Jake called him out for it, but when it’s obvious it’s just how the author sees things it sucks!
Stop using insane, stop using crazy, stop being like “oh I’m so good at keeping myself in check,” WE DONT NEED IT!! ALSO THEY R AT A GENERAL POINT OF SYSTEM COMMUNICATION N HARMONY RN!!
Which also just… man this feels like it’s trying to introduce MK instead of continuing an already established and well under way arc. Yea, this isn’t MacKay writing it, but it’s still in the continuity and set up for his run and like… sorry not sorry but I think you should take that context into account if you’re going to be working within it???
Instead the story props itself up by trying to introduce everything at once and Marc feels like he’s starting from the bottom of development.
And speaking of introducing everything at once! Oh boy the pacing!
No one besides Badr is consulted before Marc goes into the Duat, Badr just. Sends him there. There’s no real build up for why there’s a need go that far, for what the threat is or why Marc would go to these lengths so suddenly. Like yeah I know he wants to save a kid who’s a traveler of the night, but like… Others have died or almost died on his watch and he’s never gone to this point before, even though it seems like it’s always something they’ve had as an option. Like… ok ig if Soldier hadn’t been vamped he would just be dead lmao (though also hey! Why and how do souls end up in this afterlife? Do they have to believe in the gods? Do they have to be in some way tied to the pantheon? Is it just where souls go if they’re near moon knight lmaO? If you want to have your afterlife plot you have to do the worldbuilding for it)
And while yes, a lot of this is because This Plot Wasnt Thought Up During Earlier Parts Of Mackay, it also isn’t introduced in a way that feels natural or makes sense.
Events just Happen. Mysteries or drives are just Said without a good basis for why they’re there. Again, this cult was talked about as just kinda a sadistic gang but then they’re a big deal? And oh the kid is dying and oh he’s worth going to the afterlife for and OH WERE JUST HERE NOW and “oh there’s a conspiracy I’ve decided with no real evidence” and HEY FOUND THE GUY and—Suddenly a whole lot of what is happening. God heart full on cult horsemen of the apocalypse memory flashback and BOMBS NOW APPARENTLY and LAYLA and MK BIG PAST BADDIES BOSS FIGHT INCOMING!!
Like ohhhh my god stuff is so rushed and happens so inorganically and with no time to really understand what’s happening. It’s a type of story where my suspension of disbelief isn’t there and it fully just feels like seeing the writer trying to get to the end goal of what they want to write about (moon knight fighting old villains) as quickly as possible. And it SUCKS! Like this genuinely should’ve been more than one issue, there should’ve been at least sOme more build up to gEtting to the city of the dead in the first place, no matter additionally uncovering a plot of some sort happening and Layla turning up.
It’s just…. It’s so rushed and strange and forced and it didn’t have to be and IT MAKES ME MAD IT IS and it’s just not enjoyable to read. It all feels so shallow and stilted and weird, all while having this underlying idea with so much weight, some generally gorgeous art, some moments that could’ve been really awesome, and last but not least…. Literally a good reference to doing a Duat plot well.
This whole mini run is for MCU synergy, bringing Layla in, exploring the Duat and it’s lore, and again yes, the run isn’t done, but it just…. Compared to the MCU plot for the Duat this feels so…. GraaggHhggh. Especially when it comes to system interaction and exploring different painful memories that effect headmates in different ways.
It’s just. It was an extremely frustrating read from both a technical writing standpoint and a character exploration standpoint, and it worries me and doesn’t excite me at all for future issues. Like we’ll sEe but goddamn this is not a good start no matter how it plays out and it doesn’t give me confidence if it turns out I have to read several more issues of this kind of stuff.
Petty nitpicks speed run because there wasn’t enough enjoyable padding for them to not stand out!
I don’t know if Pepose could’ve specified or not but Marc’s not drinking vodka in the opening scene, it looks more like whiskey or something similar by the bottle, again nailing home how strangely off this Marc is from the Marc he’s meant to be with how Mackay has built him up.
Why do they use Duat and City of the Dead like they’re interchangeable titles it’s just the Duat like I get calling it “the city of the dead” since it is that but like. Let that just b the run title they shouldn’t be calling it that like it’s a final name.
They misspell Dr. Alraune’s name lmao
How did the kid get… hurt..? The only point in the opening fight I can think he maybe got hit was with the gunfire but it didn’t seem like that was aimed towards him and there wasn’t any moment of having a detail in the background showing him get injured. And he wasn’t lethally injured at the start so ???
What… is the continuity between the Hydra vs Karnak Cowboys fight we see in MacKay and the flashback here. They were on an empty road there when they crashed? And now they’re in the heart of the city? AlsO bOMBS???
Anyway all I’ll wrap it up with is when the only thing I genuinely smile at is the cameo and namedrop of Apocalypse you know something is wrong with your story lmaO
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papermoonknight · 6 months
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Moon Knight: City of the Dead (2023) Issue 5
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xenonmoon · 10 months
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I can't wait to queue up all my notes from 2016 to present runs so I can shred the hell out of Pepose's writing
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fdelopera · 11 months
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Anon who asked about the comic, thanks for the info! I was already kind of suspicious when I heard about the comic, but was hoping maybe they'd get it right. I hadn't realized that was the concept they went with, and that description of Marc's "mental health" made me grimace.
Even apart from the deep ableism of refusing to write a system as a system, I think it says quite a lot about a writer's skill set that they can't manage to write three protagonists. You would think any writer would jump at the chance to write three well-rounded characters that could approach any topic from such vastly different perspectives.
The fact that they can't/won't, and don't seem to know what to do with it, says...a lot.
totally agree, Anon! any quality writer worth their salt would jump at the chance to write an engaging story about headmates in a system! authors who fixate on one headmate to the exclusion of the others demonstrate their own ableism and bias against people with DID/OSDD.
i say "quality writer" … because David Pepose has already demonstrated himself to be, well, not that.
he's written for Moon Knight before. he co-authored volume II, issue 2 of Moon Knight: Black, White and Blood, "A Hard Day's Knight".
it was .. decent. not great. certainly doesn't hold a candle to the best of Lemire or Mackay. it did feature a conversation between headmates that had a few insightful moments, especially where Marc was concerned.
but his story fell apart in the way he wrote about MK System's Judaism. these two panels in particular.
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there are a few problems with this. a couple are relatively minor, but one is egregious.
first, this is a clunky, uncanny valley way to say, "this character is Jewish". no Jewish person in the history of ever has said, "well, back in Hebrew school" as as way to measure time. i was shocked to learn in his interview that Pepose was actually proud of writing that line. there are so many better ways he could have written about their Jewishness in his comic. for instance, since Mackay in his run has established Jake as being more observant, perhaps he could have mentioned needing to clean up the blood before they go to shul.
also, in the comics, the Spector family are Orthodox, so Marc and Randall wouldn't have gone to Hebrew School, which in the US is an after school program for Reform and Conservative Jewish kids. Orthodox families usually send their kids to yeshiva. Pepose is Jewish, so he should have known this.
but the worst part of these panels is that Jake compares the "punks" he dealt with in Hebrew School (i.e. Jewish kids) to a demonic rat creature called The Vermin, that … let's just say it, commits blood libel. this creature kidnaps and eats children.
it is absolutely inexcusable for a Jewish author to have written this. not to mention, the artwork makes it even worse, since the way the Vermin is drawn echoes antisemitic caricatures of Jewish people.
so … i'll buy Pepose's series for Layla, but i'm not happy that he's the one writing it.
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ladywynne · 9 months
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Finally got my copy of City of the Dead! I had so much fun reading it. Yes, Marc is an overdramatic edgelord, but I don't care. I loved the kid, Khalil, and I can't wait to read the rest of the series. 😃🌙
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thevelominati · 10 months
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I feel like I need to re-read it but my intial read was: no, thank you. Like, there are moments where Pepose seems to get the characters, but then the rest of the time it's just a total swing and a miss. The narration boxes just don't work, it's almost like Pepose is trying to lean into a Huston-esque portrayal of MK when the dramatism that Mackay's been leaning into just doesn't quite work with that. Yes, Marc is violent but that's not all there is. There are layers and depths to what he does and why he does it and Pepose just didn't really ... hit on any of those.
I'm also, like, really confused about his reading on the Badr-MK relationship. Maybe like, 10 issues or so ago in the Mackay run it'd have worked but not so much now .
Totally ignoring the existence of Greer lmfao
And I love Layla as a character but how she's been brought into the comics just doesn't quite work for me. I'm just really not sure on how we're supposed to read the importance of his relationship with Layla vs the importance of his relationships Marlene and Frenchie, and even Lisa! And the impact each of those has had on Marc and co. as a character and his personal development. It's just so weird to be told that Layla was so PIVOTAL to Marc's past and yet - for obvious reasons - that's not been shown once over the last forty-odd years of comics. There are ways to bring in a character and have them be important but, fam, this ain't it. This just ain't it.
GOD and "every night I try to forget". NO. the point is that Marc DOESN'T try to forget. he wants to make up for what he's done and that involves NOT forgetting what he's done. like, he kept hold of the files on both himself/his activities as a mercenary, his victims and the people he worked for FOR YEARS. he revisited them periodically in the Moench run, he re-visited them in the Huston/Benson run. He can't let himself forget what he's done!!
(Which is also part of why I'm not sure Layla's introduction quite works for me. The idea that her death led him to Bushman when it's always kind of been established that Marc was awful before Bushman and he didn't really need help into falling into questionable depths, and *then* his conscience was like LOL HOLD UP A MINUTE FAM.)
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superpoweredfancast · 6 months
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Moon Knight: City of the Dead #5 Review
Moon Knight: City of the Dead #5 Marvel Comics Written by David Pepose Art by Marcelo Ferreira Inks by Jay Leisten Colors by Rachelle Rosenberg Letters by Cory Petit The Rundown: Marc makes one final push to save the city of the dead. Marc and Layla find themselves facing off against Randall and the dead villains he’s gathered to take the power of Osiris. Knowing he’ll need more help to…
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feelinggood · 8 months
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New Comics Day
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My August comics came in the mail last weekend. Here’s the rundown:
Amazing Spider-man #31, #32, and Annual #1
Miles Morales Spider-man #9
Spider-man #11
Silk #4
Avengers #4
Captain America Finale #1
Invincible Iron Man #9
Daredevil #14
Daredevil & Echo #4
Black Panther #3
Moon Knight #26
Moon Knight City Of The Dead #2
Fantastic Four #10
Ultimate Invasion #3
Battle Chasers #12
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juhbebbie · 11 months
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Me uh when um me when ok um um literally me when I uh me when Layla el-Faouly
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Variant cover by Aka
Moon Knight: City of the Dead (2023) #4
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tiptapricot · 10 months
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Hey just a PSA but the writer of City of the Dead is a Jewish man who has been upfront about how uncomfortable it makes him that people keep trying to insist that he's writing catholic guilt.
I know that David Pepose is Jewish, but that doesn’t impact the criticism of his depictions.
I don’t think anyone should be attacking his identity or his authenticity as a Jewish man, but that is different from criticizing his writing and the undertones and out of character takes in his portrayal, as well as the pieces it glosses over and doesn’t include. His experience is valid and enough, but it is not the same as the system’s and it does not make him immune from creating things with harmful or inaccurate tones for them. We’ve seen this already with some inaccuracies in his Black White and Blood issue to the more orthodox childhood of the system (saying they went to Hebrew school despite that being very unlikely for them to have done).
My critiques of his depiction of their Judaism as well as others I’ve seen and discussed with people were not trying to say it was writing the system as Catholic, but saying the way Marc was written and the way his guilt was portrayed was out of character and very much lined up with the Christian/Catholic ideas of punishment and suffering to atone for wrongdoing. That’s in the text and can be easily gleaned from it.
The current context around it also doesn’t add more exploration besides “I did bad and I’m so guilty I must punish myself and that’s why I do what I do.” In fact the context that is there makes things weirder by having Marc seemingly be even more spiritually inclined/favorable to Khonshu than he has been in the past.
It’s just a mixed bag of “this is not how this character should be acting and has uncomfortable undertones” whether they were intended or not doesn’t change that. Criticizing what Pepose hs written for Marc does not mean saying his experience is less authentic, just that he wrote something off for the character and things don’t map on one to one.
As far as his responses to the critique of this handling, that’s where this gets more complicated. Besides discussions and dissections here on tumblr, the only conversations/reactions on Twitter I’m aware of are below with peoples names other than Pepose’s crossed out as to not give them further exposure past their interactions with him.
I do believe there’s been a lot of miscommunication and bad faith responses on his part. I understand wanting to clarify when something drawn from personal experience is read differently, I get that people saying he wrote guilt with a Catholic vibe when maybe he drew it from himself is uncomfortable, but again, that doesn’t impact the critique and more context is needed to change where things sit currently. But it’s just a funky and strange situation in general.
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(This following response involves a different user than the previous talking to Pepose. The original person left no more responses and said nothing else than what is shown above)
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This is all I’ve seen on him responding to the subject, and later Pepose blocked both posters in this thread from what I’ve heard. This is the extent of their interactions with him.
Overall I think saying the handling of Marc’s Judaism in this first issue is weird and off is a fair criticism/observation to make. I don’t think it was intentional or there was any malice behind it, but it does show a lack of understanding of the character of Marc Spector, and was tied to a multitude of other problems throughout this first issue (like as we see above with a misunderstanding/mishandling already of the system’s DID and plurality). And I think people can also be upset about that if they are.
Again I understand being uncomfortable, but issues are still allowed to be pointed out and there is still room to mess up when writing characters from your own community. Fair criticism to how something reads is not the same as personally attacking someone’s identity. And it shouldn’t be, but I genuinely don’t think anyone I’ve seen here so far has been doing that.
Though with all of this I am a non-Jew discussing things I’ve talked about with my Jewish friends, so please please if you want more in depth and explanatory posts on this topic, as well as how Pepose has been handling MK (most of which I am drawing from and the discussions with have informed my stuff here) you should check out @fdelopera as they’ve made many dissections on the topic as a Jewish MK fan! And they can speak on this topic much more in depth and with much more awareness and information than I can.
Some very relevant posts to this is their dissection of why Marc’s spirituality and handling so far is an issue and very funky and an examination of the Jewish themes in MacKay’s writing.
But those are my overall thoughts as well as continued clarification on my points on the topic so I hope I articulated things well!
(ID in ALT for all)
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papermoonknight · 6 months
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Moon Knight: City of the Dead (2023) Cover
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Beautiful variant cover art by Sabine Rich
Moon Knight: City of the Dead #1
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Moon Knight: City of the Dead #2 by David Pepose and Marcelo Ferreira. Cover by Rod Reis. Variant covers by (2) Alex Horley and (3) Bill Sienkiewicz. Out in August.
"Tearing through the City of the Dead on his quest to rescue a young runaway, Moon Knight must grapple with his past when he turns to an unlikely source for aid – LAYLA EL-FOULY, A.K.A. the SCARLET SCARAB! But when Marc Spector is faced with a murderers' row of dead super villains whom he helped put in the ground, can even the Fist of Khonshu defy the odds long enough to survive? Plus: Who is the JACKAL KNIGHT?"
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