#Men who hate women

[grison-in-space]

I am not particularly interested in a “redemption” narrative for incels. That is a question for those individuals to ponder. We do not implore the victims of other forms of terrorism to absolve and educate their tormentors. Nor do we require that other extremists be acknowledged as some kind of wounded, misunderstood victims. It is ironic that so much pressure is brought to bear on women to allow for the humanity and individuality of fallible men when it is precisely this courtesy that incels unfailingly refuse to pay to women.

But I am interested in the men in between. The boys who fall through the cracks. The “good” men who feel scared. The ones who went looking for help, because they felt frightened or sad or lonely, and haven’t been able to disentangle themselves. The ones who just haven’t heard about any of this yet. The ones who look the other way on the bus. Because we can’t change anything without those men. So how do we reach them?

Laura Bates, Men Who Hate Women (2020).

Importantly, she's just spent a lot of time talking about men-led feminist groups that do good work, both in terms of reducing domestic violence and other "traditional" feminist concerns and in terms of providing other narratives, support structures, and information about things that men, like all people, care about: how to keep yourself safe physically and emotionally; how to cope with feeling frightened or uncertain; how to communicate with other people in a world that feels zero sum and frightening.

It's a good, thoughtful discussion of what it means to respond to radicalization in an effective way: you reduce the pain points that funnel people towards radicalized groups, you provide them with positive things to do to help themselves, and you provide empathy to anyone who is willing to provide empathy back to you. But you don't immolate yourself on the altar of healing people who already hate you: you focus on the ones who are easy to help first, the ones who need only a little help, and then you expand.

It's a heavy book, but well worth reading—and not only if you're interested in online misogyny and radicalization. I would recommend the book to anyone with an interest in gender, building a better world, deradicalization, and effectively handling terrorism.

#laura bates #Men who hate women

[teawinx]

Miraculous is a show about a teenage girl Miraculous is also a show that hates teenage girls

#ml salt #They should use The Girl With The Dragon Tattoo's original title #men who hate women

[distractedpebble]

I started reading a book called "Men Who Hate Women" by Laura Bates. I'm not even q chapter through it but I can tell this is going to be one of those books that takes me a while to get through because the subject matter is making me physically ill. The part I'm reading is focusing on incels and incel forums and while I know about incels and how hateful they are, I didn't realize just how far they go on those forums.

So far it's a 10/10 book, just incredibly disturbing. Learning about "rapecels" and even a part of the community called "wristcels." Like...what the fuck is this??? Holy shit.

#men who hate women #laura bates #tw misogyny #tw rape #rape #incel #tw incel #what the fuck

[luxe-pauvre]

Incel logic seems to reveal a hopeless contradiction: women are simultaneously reviled for sleeping with men and for refusing to do so. One user, for example, describes women as 'greedy selfish evil crazed sluts, who prevent decent hard working men, from achieving their biological purpose.' But things become clearer when viewed through the lens of the most basic incel belief. At its simplest, the argument goes like this: if women's sexual autonomy has given them wicked and tyrannical control over men's lives, then women's liberation is at the root of all male suffering. Therefore, the obvious remedy is to remove women's freedom and independence, and to use specifically sexual means (like rape and sexual slavery) to do so. In other words, the problem is not women having sex, but women having the choice of whom to have sex with. [...] This worldview might sound ridiculous. But it is an ideology to which incels adhere with remarkable tenacity. This isn't just a group of websites on which men spout random profanities and abuse. It is a movement, cult-like in the loyalty and passion of its devotees. Incels are not just looking for a place to share rape fantasies and violent posts; they are invested in building and spreading an entire belief system to support and encourage such ideas. As I swim through the murky depths of these communities, disguised as Alex, I realise that it isn't even as simple as just saying that some group members are vulnerable victims and others are extreme misogynists. It is quite possible, common even, for individuals to be both.

Laura Bates, Men Who Hate Women

#Laura Bates #Men Who Hate Women

[dhaaruni]

To speak ill of masculinity—to describe it, in its current societal iteration, as something problematic—is seen as an attack on men themselves. To question why some men behave in certain ways is viewed as an assault on all men and thus unacceptable.

— Men Who Hate Women: From Incels to Pickup Artists, the Truth about Extreme Misogyny and how it Affects Us All by Laura Bates

#men who hate women #misogyny #quotes #book blogging #Bruce Springsteen and Barack Obama may be the only straight men alive who get it lol #their podcast and companion book is so good!!!

[boldlypaletraveler]

Should be interesting.

- Men Who Hate Women by Laura Bates

#books and libraries #currently reading #feminism #politics #Laura Bates #Men who hate women #literature

[argumntativantitheticldreamgirl]

#men who hate women #misogyny #laura bates #quote #book quotes #food for thought

[dlasta]

Anybody else remember Charles Saatchi choking Nigella Lawson in public and getting entirely away with it? And her assistants selling her out to cover their own stealing? 

I still can’t believe it. She was/is beloved but that still wasn’t enough. A man grabbed her by the throat, in daylight, in public, and somehow it was a-ok and they just divorced. She took a breather (deserved) and he went on with absolutely no repercussions. 

#domestic violence #charles saatchi #nigella lawson #intimate partner violence #she had to explain using cocaine like that was such crime considering her husband casually abused her in public #meaning he was worse in private #I'm watching her on tv right now #anyway I love her #men who hate women

[french-writer]

*disclaimer: this post talks about men and women as a whole and as parts of a system, not about the individuals. Of course there are exceptions to what you're about to read, but those exceptions are not what this is about.

When women say they hate men, they mean they don't want anything to do with men and will hold them accountable for their abusive behavior. When men say they hate women, they mean they want to rape them, abuse them, and savagely kill them. Men fear women who hate men because they think those women will treat them the way they treat women. But women who hate men want to get away from them, and they hate men for what they do to women. Men who hate women want to punish them, and their hate is rooted in the dehumanization of women and fury that women do not obey their every whim and command, that they do not satisfy all their needs. Women hate men because men harm them. Men hate women because women refuse to be treated as objects.

#feminism #men #women #men who hate women #women who hate men

[sneasler-appreciation-blog]

I am starting to read Laura Bates's Men Who Hate Women: the Extremism Nobody is Talking About from 2020 and while the premise of toxic masculinity is flawed and she's obsessed with separating white men as if men of colour don't have male power and privilege, I am interested in her research and I can see the connection between white men specifically and these online communities she talks about. Some excerpts from the intro for anyone interested:

#Laura Bates #Men who hate women #radfems please interact #Radfem safe #Radfems do touch #Radfem reading #Not saying that Laura Bates is a radfem of course #But I lean that way and I am reading it so!

[mkultrag1rl]

Who else can say that?

Gone Girl (2014)

dir. David Fincher

#gone girl #amy dunne #nick dunne #rosamund pike #ben affleck #david fincher #men who hate women #movie caps

[thebotanicalarcade]

#the girl with the dragon tattoo #stieg larsson #quote #quotation #leptospermum rubinette #desert snow #men who hate women

[voidcommascreamintothe]

People who hate cats 🤝 people who dont understand that you should care about others

“I do genuinely believe that’s true, based on nothing”

— Ethan Klein, host of the h3h3 youtube channel.

Well I believe this based on a few personal observations I have made about the human condition.

Now, a bit of housekeeping before I start my rant; I am aware that there are some studies out there about the correlation between misogynistic beliefs and the hate/dislike of cats, however I haven’t read them, and will not be discussing them and their findings. This, like everything else I write here, is based on anecdotal evidence and personal experience. Although I am writing as if I am addressing the reader of the text, I don’t actually expect this to be read by another human being, and is mostly “stream of conciseness”. Now, the rant may commence.

I also am afraid of dogs, for I have been attacked twice, and have never liked them to begin with, so this might make me biased. This is important for later in the text.

It has been a long standing belief of mine, that people who do not like, and even hate, cats, hate that cats are often very independent creatures who set firm boundaries. These people find it hard to believe that one has to actively work to gain the trust and affections of this animal, because, well, they think that animals are supposed to be obedient and grateful for the bare minimum. You know, like a dog. You feed a cat, play with it, give it treats, but that never assures loyalty. You have to be able to respect your feline friend and the very clear boundaries that they set with you. You sometimes love them from a distance and pet them once a week or risk getting smacked, and they will eventually learn to trust you. You cannot train them in the same way you train a dog. You cannot keep them away from certain rooms in your home, and at the end of the day, why should you? They live here, in this home, with you, don’t they? They might not be sentient like us humans, but they are independent creatures and deserve comfort.

A dog is an animal whose behavior you must control and train. A dog is the animal you keep away from certain rooms. A dog is the animal who you must train and control to the point of telling them when they must pee, or you risk aggression and other anti-social behaviors. A certain genre of dog people, often do not fathom that you can’t, and really shouldn’t, enjoy the fact that you control every aspect of your pet’s life.

Isn’t it strange, this level of control? It never sat right with me. Keeping animals off the couch or bed, simply because you don’t want hair there. All animals produce waste, including us humans. You cannot keep a pet, and guard yourself against the natural waste they create, pee, poo, hair, vomit, all of the above. When my cats jump on the kitchen counters, I pick them up, put them down and away from the kitchen, and wipe the counter clean. But they are never forbidden from any space in my home, because they live here too. And to be fair, dog people who generally love all animals, but just prefer to keep dogs over cats, understand this too. There are dog people who care for dogs and cats and all animals alike, and treat all the pets they might have with dignity.

The specific genre of (and I hesitate to say dog people here, for they give all the dog people a bad reputation), dog people I am talking about here, hate cats and make it their whole personality that they hate cats. I firmly believe that this is because they hate the independent creatures with boundaries. They keep dogs because you can exert a lot of control over them. Something you cant really do with cats. Or women. It is a dog whistle (ironic, I know) to me, and it signals misogyny. They clearly express this by insisting on pushing boundaries, seeing just how far they can take their behavior.

In addition to this, these people also hate all other animals. I firmly believe that they do not fathom that these creatures should be given respect and should be treated decently, even the ones we eat. I believe that they do not see, or realize, that animals are not less than us humans, just because they are not sentient in the way we are. Animals might not be self-aware like we are, but they should be cared about, and for.

Speaking in broad terms here, but I think that caring about animals, pulls a thread here or there, and makes you thing about more than one problem. Think about it. Caring about animal rights, leads to thinking about their living conditions, which leads into thinking about factory farms, and that inevitably leads to climate change, via the impact of farming industries on the greenhouse effect and global warming. If we push on this logic further, this also leads to thinking about how to feed the entire human population. Factory farming often lends way to talking about the “meat vs plant diet” debate, which is tied to human consumption and our effect on the environment. This connects to the right to food, and obviously to human rights in general, if one is intellectually curious enough to follow through on the thought pattern. The threads of human rights don’t, or at least shouldn’t end with food. They bleed into the right to healthcare, the right to education, and numerous others.

Like I said, speaking in broad terms, but wouldn’t it be possible that understanding that you should care about animals, even if they are not creatures like you, leads to understand that you should care about other people, even if they are not people like you? If you view animals as lesser than, then whats stopping you from viewing other people as less than you? Say, marginalized groups like those whose sexuality or race or gender are not your own?

Well adjusted people with empathy, who love animals but happen to prefer dogs, would understand this. People who hate cats and other animals wouldn’t. Those people I feel like, would not perceive cats as independent creatures, the same way that they would not fully understand how women are independent human beings.

Someone who is not intellectually capable, or intellectually curious enough, to follow this thought process, will not be capable of understanding that one should care and should show basic empathy towards others, animals included. They lack the capabilities to express this or even understand this, so it manifests as hate and disdain. Much how someone would hate a cat for simply asking to be loved on their terms, they would hate a woman who sets boundaries with them.

Empathy is a uniquely human trait. It may be the reason we survived as a species, as long as we did. Understanding that others deserve to be cared for, and to be cared about, is an exercise in having empathy.

The othering of people, and the subjugation of those “other” groups starts quietly and sneakily, with the disdain if animals and the disregard for their wellbeing.

#mental health #feminism #feminist #feminist discourse #lil thesis on gender #lil thesis on human rights #human rights #women #cats #cute cats #men who hate cats #are #men who hate women

[distractedpebble]

A while back I made a post about reading a book called "Men Who Hate Women." I had not picked up that book again until today because I was so physically sick from some of the things I read, but let me tell you it only gets worse.

I'm only 38 pages into the book. 38. I don't know how I'm going to make it through the rest of this, despite how interested I am in the content. I'm going to post some screenshots after the "more" button. Just know that it's some disgusting stuff.

These are just a few highlights from what I've read and I've refrained from posting the worst of it.

I know of incels, it's definitely not a new thing on the Internet, but this book highlights how it's so much more than just a couple "fringe" guys who do no harm.

#tw incel #tw rape #tw incest #men who hate women #i am physically unwell #book update

[luxe-pauvre]

The saddest and most disturbing part of my year spent wading through incel forums, disguised as lonely Alex, was how differently the threads affected me towards the end. In the early days and weeks, I frequently lay awake at night, haunted by the graphic and disgusting things I had read. I winced as I painstakingly translated those early posts, understanding the violent meaning behind the jargon I was slowly beginning to decipher. But, as time went on, I referred back to the glossary less and less. I became used to seeing women referred to as foids, barely registered the incitements to initiate misogynistic massacres, skimmed over posts about rape, because they were just so common. Finally, one day, I read a post about giving a foid the violence she deserved, in order to avoid being cucked, and I realised that I understood every word. In short, I got used to it. Or, rather, Alex did. The sense of a coherent worldview and a shared language may be deeply appealing to those who hold extreme prejudices but don't feel able to express them offline in face-to-face conversations, warns Dr Sugiura, who has studied incel and other manosphere communities. These forms of hatred, she notes, have long pre-dated the internet, but: "Online communities and virtual platforms provide the means for these ideas to take shape, take hold and spread. If people did hold these ideas and they didn't necessarily feel they could talk about them in person, they've now found a new way. Others [who] are likeminded can provide support and validation, which helps them to spread. It's just a hate movement that was previously fractured, but the technology allows them to come together, combine, flourish, find more people ... that's the recruitment and radicalisation part of it as well. These ideas have been able to take place on an exponential scale through the technology."

Laura Bates, Men Who Hate Women

#Laura Bates #Men Who Hate Women

[crowley1990]

It’s December so everyone put in the tags what your favourite book(s) you read this year is (are)

#My surprise hits were the remains of the day by Kazuo Ishiguro #the uncommon reader by Alan Bennett #And homage to Catalonia by George Orwell #The best book I read this year was probably men who hate women by Laura Bates but it was not my favourite #Really good but upsetting and disturbing #But the first three are just really well written and really surprised me with how much I enjoyed them #Especially as I picked them all up at random